Author Topic: Joe Brolly  (Read 646043 times)

Ciarrai_thuaidh

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #180 on: May 13, 2012, 01:38:04 PM »
Some remarkable comments on here.

Midlouth had him so bad it,  'felt it was necessary to roll around on the ground for a couple of minutes.'

You can't help but feel we're dealing with idiots.

Ah O'Neill it isn't like you to resort to insults, maybe it wasn't minutes but it made a lot out of nothing imo, if a soccer player did that he'd be slated. Other than that McCarthy must have the hardest hands in Ireland.

And I'm not questioning Canavan credentials, just this incident on its own, obviously was still a very good player.

Apologies Midlouth but the clip is there for everyone to see. When it's looked at and still incorrectly commented upon it beggars belief. Some people have him rolling around on the ground for ages. This has nothing to do with a player's credentials.

O'Neill, this is getting pedantic on all sides to be fair, but......
1. Whatever contact was made with Canavan's head was minimal.
2. Whatever contact was made, was made with the side of Canavan's head which can be seen clearly at 0.55 in the clip. He then goes down on the ground holding both hands on his face?
3. If you want to hit a guy a belt in the back, you hit him in the back..you don't lower your head to his side and barely glance off him. Canavan knew exactly what he was at and its quite embarassing to see it being made out to be otherwise.

I realise my opinion is no more non-partisan than yours as my county were involved, but this had no bearing whatsoever on the outcome. It was just an act of bad sportsmanship, borne out of sheer desperation to win at all costs, which is the frame of mind Tyrone were clearly in that day...which is pretty much the way any team with that much talent and no AI victory would be. It doesn't excuse it, but its fairly clearly the explanation to me anyway.
"Better to die on your feet,than live on your knees"...

Zulu

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #181 on: May 13, 2012, 01:41:53 PM »
It beggars belief that you think Canavan didn't dive or embellish the effects of what little contact did occur. That he dived and exaggerated the effects of the contact with a man that wasn't even aware he was 'dunting' him makes it all the more shameful. I don't know what brolly's agenda is nor do I care, as it's irrelevant. We will never eradicate this rubbish from the game as long as there are apologists like you spouting nonsense about 'contact', 'balance', 'ankle alignment' etc. The bottom-line is, if a man goes down or stays down unnecessarily then he should be called out. Christ it's hard to knock a grown man but some lads around here seem to think otherwise, did ye ever play the game at all?

Tony Baloney

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #182 on: May 13, 2012, 02:10:59 PM »
You are nit-picking around the technicalities of Marsden incident in particular to discredit Brolly's analysis. Simple question "Did Jordan cheat to get Marsden the line?"

ONeill

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #183 on: May 13, 2012, 02:20:37 PM »
It beggars belief that you think Canavan didn't dive or embellish the effects of what little contact did occur. That he dived and exaggerated the effects of the contact with a man that wasn't even aware he was 'dunting' him makes it all the more shameful. I don't know what brolly's agenda is nor do I care, as it's irrelevant. We will never eradicate this rubbish from the game as long as there are apologists like you spouting nonsense about 'contact', 'balance', 'ankle alignment' etc. The bottom-line is, if a man goes down or stays down unnecessarily then he should be called out. Christ it's hard to knock a grown man but some lads around here seem to think otherwise, did ye ever play the game at all?

Why would Tyrone want their best player, talisman, top scorer and captain off the field for 5 minutes at a time when they were blitzing Kerry at the start of the game?
I wanna have my kicks before the whole shithouse goes up in flames.

ONeill

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #184 on: May 13, 2012, 02:25:28 PM »
You are nit-picking around the technicalities of Marsden incident in particular to discredit Brolly's analysis. Simple question "Did Jordan cheat to get Marsden the line?"

I was correct to do so. Brolly said 'When Central Council reviewed the video footage a few weeks later they revoked the red card and cleared the Armagh man'. That infers that they saw video evidence to clear him. They did see video evidence and upheld the red card. It was later that it was rescinded on a technicality.

No, Jordan didn't cheat. Could he have gotten straight up after he fell - possibly - I don't know nor does anyone else but Phillip.
I wanna have my kicks before the whole shithouse goes up in flames.

ThroughTheLaces

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #185 on: May 13, 2012, 02:50:21 PM »
Come on O'Neill you're better than this. This has really gone beyond nit picking. Anybody that's played will have had knocks and bumps through a game. It takes one hell of a box to ground a man and keep him grounded. To say that only Jordan knows if he could get back up is simply cringe-worthy. At the absolute worst he got 'pushed' in the face. It's gettin a bit farcical for me. Might call it a day at this.
The apple never falls far from the tree.

ONeill

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #186 on: May 13, 2012, 02:59:40 PM »
Come on O'Neill you're better than this. This has really gone beyond nit picking. Anybody that's played will have had knocks and bumps through a game. It takes one hell of a box to ground a man and keep him grounded. To say that only Jordan knows if he could get back up is simply cringe-worthy. At the absolute worst he got 'pushed' in the face. It's gettin a bit farcical for me. Might call it a day at this.

A heavyweight boxer can get straight back up. What I mean is that only Jordan knows if he was hurt or not. If you got a box in the bake you'd probably stay grounded for a minute or so.
I wanna have my kicks before the whole shithouse goes up in flames.

Zulu

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #187 on: May 13, 2012, 03:42:02 PM »
It beggars belief that you think Canavan didn't dive or embellish the effects of what little contact did occur. That he dived and exaggerated the effects of the contact with a man that wasn't even aware he was 'dunting' him makes it all the more shameful. I don't know what brolly's agenda is nor do I care, as it's irrelevant. We will never eradicate this rubbish from the game as long as there are apologists like you spouting nonsense about 'contact', 'balance', 'ankle alignment' etc. The bottom-line is, if a man goes down or stays down unnecessarily then he should be called out. Christ it's hard to knock a grown man but some lads around here seem to think otherwise, did ye ever play the game at all?

Why would Tyrone want their best player, talisman, top scorer and captain off the field for 5 minutes at a time when they were blitzing Kerry at the start of the game?

Entirely irrelevant post. I don't know if he had a cut or not and it matters not a whit. The point is he dived and/or exaggerated the effect of the collision, blood or no blood. You, and one or two others, are defending this using barroom 'lawering', with statements like the above. It's pointless continuing this discussion as we have all watched the video and have made up our own minds. My problem is that there is anyone who can view that video and conclude anything other than a dive since this probably means diving will become more prevalent in our game and attempts to punish diving after the fact will flounder on appeals based on BS like 'contact', 'losing balance' etc. But obviously some are happy for the game to go that way.

ONeill

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #188 on: May 13, 2012, 03:59:14 PM »
Of course it's relevant. You claim he dived and embellished the effect of little contact. If that was the case, he would not have been removed from the field for minutes to get bandaged up. Canavan has shipped some heavy treatment in the past and played on. Therefore, the contact was a lot more telling (unintentionally) that you realise.

Again, you're being a little dramatic about the future of the game based on comments made on here.
I wanna have my kicks before the whole shithouse goes up in flames.

Zulu

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #189 on: May 13, 2012, 04:37:28 PM »
Quote
Again, you're being a little dramatic about the future of the game based on comments made on here.

No I'm not, in the space of 10 years, diving has become far more prevalent and we now have fellas defending clear dives or exaggerated reactions to contact, the trend is clear.

Quote
Of course it's relevant. You claim he dived and embellished the effect of little contact. If that was the case, he would not have been removed from the field for minutes to get bandaged up. Canavan has shipped some heavy treatment in the past and played on. Therefore, the contact was a lot more telling (unintentionally) that you realise.

Are you for real???? Once again you are using irrelevancies to defend the indefensible, what Peter endured in previous games has nothing to do with what he did in that game. And again you try to use barroom lawering by claiming the contact was so sever he had to leave the field. He left the field because he was, apparently, bleeding and therefore had to by rule, not because the injury was serious. He was sitting up shouting at the ref once he got tired of faking a facial injury so he clearly wasn't seriously hurt.

As I've said, we've all seen the clip and you have your view which it seems your happy to hold on to, therefore there is little more to be said. The incident itself was 9 years ago and didn't effect the outcome but I'm a little worried that the game I grew up with is going down a path that will lead to further embarrassing episodes like the one we're discussing if GAA men can view that clip and conclude anything other than diving.

Throw ball

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #190 on: May 14, 2012, 12:21:06 AM »
Brolly really is a tool. He should have left this article until the start of June and post a copy of it to the referee of the Armagh Tyrone game. Maybe then they would not get a free and Armagh would have a chance. ;D

Seriously though I think he is great entertainment.

haranguerer

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #191 on: May 14, 2012, 08:45:52 AM »
Quote
Again, you're being a little dramatic about the future of the game based on comments made on here.

No I'm not, in the space of 10 years, diving has become far more prevalent and we now have fellas defending clear dives or exaggerated reactions to contact, the trend is clear.

[

And theres the problem. People like you jumping in identifying everything as a dive would be much more damaging for the game than not bringing in anything at all - every time anyone fell over they'd be banned for weeks. Teams wouldnt be able to field ffs. If its to be eradicated properly, we need to be able to identify dives, and that you've identified canavan as diving from that clip, i.e throwing himself to the ground unnecessarily, means you're not the man for the job. Anyone whos ever played the game should be able to read what happened there, and it didnt include a dive.

And quit your shite about 'gaa men' would see it as diving. What makes you the voice for 'gaa men?'  ;D. As for staying down, how would you determine whether someone stayed down too long? Given that your such a great 'gaa man', have you ever been tossed, fell over, tripped, in a game and not bounced straight back up?? Never been exhausted, no?

sheamy

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #192 on: May 14, 2012, 09:08:01 AM »
Where's this slow motion replay of the Cavanagh incident which shows minimal contact? He has made that bit up.

He has not made that bit up in the slightest. The red card was rescinded after viewing said video. Still waiting for the Ulster Council to stick it on youtube. If the video showed same as I saw from the stand it was a disgusting act of playacting to get a man sent off. Probably best for Colm it's not ever made public to be honest.

ThroughTheLaces

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #193 on: May 14, 2012, 11:15:56 AM »
Quote
Again, you're being a little dramatic about the future of the game based on comments made on here.

No I'm not, in the space of 10 years, diving has become far more prevalent and we now have fellas defending clear dives or exaggerated reactions to contact, the trend is clear.

[

And theres the problem. People like you jumping in identifying everything as a dive would be much more damaging for the game than not bringing in anything at all - every time anyone fell over they'd be banned for weeks. Teams wouldnt be able to field ffs. If its to be eradicated properly, we need to be able to identify dives, and that you've identified canavan as diving from that clip, i.e throwing himself to the ground unnecessarily, means you're not the man for the job. Anyone whos ever played the game should be able to read what happened there, and it didnt include a dive.

And quit your shite about 'gaa men' would see it as diving. What makes you the voice for 'gaa men?'  ;D. As for staying down, how would you determine whether someone stayed down too long? Given that your such a great 'gaa man', have you ever been tossed, fell over, tripped, in a game and not bounced straight back up?? Never been exhausted, no?

Too exhausted yes, would have probably made it to the knees though.  Can't figure where I'd get the extra energy to hold my face and writhe about on the ground. In all honesty I think Zulu would speak for a larger section of the GAA than yourself or O'Neill. I have never seen such denial. Canavans incident may not have been a dive, as contact, albeit minimal, was made. He may have genuinely lost his balance (I don't believe so). But even if he did there is no excuse for his behaviour on the deck. Things like this, O'Mahony, etc are making this a part of our game. I've never personally had a manager that encouraged it but you can be sure there are a lot about.

Out of curiosity, I wonder how Canavan would have reacted to Paidi's classic box back in the day.
The apple never falls far from the tree.

ballymac

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #194 on: May 14, 2012, 11:50:28 AM »
Someone earlier in this thread mentioned the Meath team that stood up and kicked their way to success, and not just kicking the ball over the bar. I remember a game against Mayo and the big basketballer they had getting sent off when 20 men were fighting, ref probably spotted him easier. A certain Coyle kicked and punched a player in front of a linesman (he nearly kicked him as well) and was not even booked, field fights and off the ball incidents. Is that what we want to go back to?

People say that Tyrone were divers etc, but another slant on it is that they played to their strengths ( or lack of them) by making sure they got their frees, they helped the ref make the decision. They played a faster more athletic game which other teams quickly caught on to. The game itself and the way it is refereed also moved in that direction. Meath style teams did not survive, the big physical player who threw his weight around had to develop to be a more agile player. There is still a physical element to the game but certainly not in the way it was in the 80's and 90's. The game is faster and with quick frees and sidelines, the order of the day is to avoid contact. Players tackle better now and it is a more technical game.

I am not defending any form of play acting whether from a Tyrone player or any other. This needs to be eradicated from the game. If your team wins games and gets to finals and win all irelands then you will forgive them things.
 All teams play to their own strengths which produce different styles of football, look at Cork Dublin And Donegal. But the one thing that will have an influence on all styles is the way in which games are officiated. I read an article that Kildare had their homework done on the ref for the league final. They knew what his style was and what he would allow. If refs allow more physical contact in tackles etc it will influence how teams will play, the physical make up of players etc. A recent article about a certain Down player who is featuring more in the Down setup had to look at his own body shape and altered his training to get himself more athletic.