Paddy O'Rourke Out!

[Donnellys Hollow]

Once again, I'm fairly perplexed as to why anyone thinks the Kildare squad is limited.

It might sink in some day that they actually have a better team than Armagh, but I'm not holding my breath.

Even more bizarre is the comparison with Tyrone. The Red Hands are getting on a bit, but as a simple measure, none of Armagh's half forwards would even be considered for the Tyrone squad. Tyrone have a slight edge in class and a huge edge in depth.

The Kildare panel is made up of twenty nine donkeys rounded up from the depths of the Kildare junior championship and Johnny Doyle. Sure that McGeeney is an absolute miracle worker. He'd have three All-Irelands won with Armagh since 2008 if Syl Merrins hadn't lured him to the Shortgrass with promises of K-Club membership and shares in thoroughbred racehorses.

[mackers]

I don't understand some Armagh posters' attitude to Kildare's quality. Grossly unfair. Don't want to sound patronising DH but I really hope ye boys win it and if you do it won't be solely down to Geezer, he has an excellent panel of players.

[onefaircounty]

Don't think anyone who has watched football closely could say that Kildare don't have a great bunch of players, even the curse of the cruciate has failed to stop them, thus far.

Always had the forwards and they kick some great tallies in the second half of games, but even more impressive has been the fact that their defence has tightened up - something they haven't been famed for.

[BerfArmagh]

Kildare absolutely hammered Armagh in a challenge match before the DOwn game

[maddog]

Dont know who doesnt rate Kildares players, i rate them seriously as a team and potential finalists. Hopefully they wont have to play the ref as well if they come up against the dubs again.

[David McKeown]

I think Kildare have a serious group of players but I think Armagh do as well. The problem though is that under POR I don't think the Armagh players have been able to perform at 100% and people are using these performances to say the Armagh players aren't as good as myself and TYP make out. I don't want to speak for TYP but for me there is a serious amount of talent in the Armagh squad and on paper I'd go as far as to say a top 6 side in terms of raw talent but under POR we have been no where near top 6 and that's why I'd like to see a new man in charge. For me if a player like Charlie Vernon and hes only the first example that came to mind were in Tyrone, Mickey Harte would have found a way to play him suited to his skills that would have turned him into a much better player. POR so far has been unable to do so

[whitegoodman]

Dont want to be turning this into a thread about Kildare but IMO Kildare are a decent side, not a great side.  They have beaten the likes of Antrim, Liatrom, Derry, Meath and Laois over the last 3 years in qualifers and failed against teams like louth and wicklow.  More to the point until the can beat one of the "big 4", they can never be called a great side.

A structured defence, hunger and fitness can take u so far but u wont win anything without star forwards.  Johnny Doyle was a great footballer and is still playing well and Kavanagh when given room can do damage but can struggle on the big days. Other than that I am struggling, the big fella at full foward wouldnt last a shot against Joe McMahon or Michael Shields.

To get to the point Armagh and Kildare would have a similar level of player imo, so yes McGeeny deserves credit for getting them to where they are but then again he hasnt met Dublin or Tyrone in qualifers whereas POR has.  The luck of the draw can do alot for a managers CV, just ask James McCartan!!!

[screenexile]

I think Kildare have a serious group of players but I think Armagh do as well. The problem though is that under POR I don't think the Armagh players have been able to perform at 100% and people are using these performances to say the Armagh players aren't as good as myself and TYP make out. I don't want to speak for TYP but for me there is a serious amount of talent in the Armagh squad and on paper I'd go as far as to say a top 6 side in terms of raw talent but under POR we have been no where near top 6 and that's why I'd like to see a new man in charge. For me if a player like Charlie Vernon and hes only the first example that came to mind were in Tyrone, Mickey Harte would have found a way to play him suited to his skills that would have turned him into a much better player. POR so far has been unable to do so

I really don't think so. Down performed way above themselves last year and they are playing to their potential this year which isn't fantastic. Armagh have a decent bunch of players who playing at the top of their game could probably squeeze an All Ireland Semi Final out of their game but that would be the height of it I imagine.

[stew]

Armagh have a decent bunch of players who playing at the top of their game could probably squeeze an All Ireland Semi Final out of their game but that would be the height of it I imagine.

That's my point, a semi final would be a great achievement but not an expectation every year>

A semi final, there is not  a man in the country could coach this current squad to an AI semi final not one.

[Armaghgael]

Armagh have a decent bunch of players who playing at the top of their game could probably squeeze an All Ireland Semi Final out of their game but that would be the height of it I imagine.

That's my point, a semi final would be a great achievement but not an expectation every year>

A semi final, there is not  a man in the country could coach this current squad to an AI semi final not one.

Catch a grip if the structure is in place and the players all playing for each other and the mangement their is no reason why they cant get to a semi final no matter who the manager is!! As we have the players at our disposal

[David McKeown]

I think Kildare have a serious group of players but I think Armagh do as well. The problem though is that under POR I don't think the Armagh players have been able to perform at 100% and people are using these performances to say the Armagh players aren't as good as myself and TYP make out. I don't want to speak for TYP but for me there is a serious amount of talent in the Armagh squad and on paper I'd go as far as to say a top 6 side in terms of raw talent but under POR we have been no where near top 6 and that's why I'd like to see a new man in charge. For me if a player like Charlie Vernon and hes only the first example that came to mind were in Tyrone, Mickey Harte would have found a way to play him suited to his skills that would have turned him into a much better player. POR so far has been unable to do so

I really don't think so. Down performed way above themselves last year and they are playing to their potential this year which isn't fantastic. Armagh have a decent bunch of players who playing at the top of their game could probably squeeze an All Ireland Semi Final out of their game but that would be the height of it I imagine.

Surely that's the definition of a top 6 side. Making AI quarters and with a kind draw maybe a semi?

[Orangemac]

Although POR seems like a decent fella and has undoubtedly done his best it would be better all round if Armagh start with a clean slate next year.

Despite what some think we are not overflowing with top class players. We have a few of these but there are a few who are living off former glories and a few who have had more than enough chances.

There needs to be some new thinking next year with hopefully a few of the minors from the last few years brought through.

With the right manager and structure in place we could be a top 8 side on a consistent basis. Someone mentioned how fluid Tyrone looked going forward but it is only a few weeks since Derry looked the same against Armagh (not to mention Monaghan last year).

[orchard 8195]

Although POR seems like a decent fella and has undoubtedly done his best it would be better all round if Armagh start with a clean slate next year.

Despite what some think we are not overflowing with top class players. We have a few of these but there are a few who are living off former glories and a few who have had more than enough chances.

There needs to be some new thinking next year with hopefully a few of the minors from the last few years brought through.

With the right manager and structure in place we could be a top 8 side on a consistent basis. Someone mentioned how fluid Tyrone looked going forward but it is only a few weeks since Derry looked the same against Armagh (not to mention Monaghan last year).

Best post ive seen on the matter yet!!

[maddog]

I'd certainly like to see 5 or 6 of that minor team being introduced and given a chance in the league under new management preferably. We aren't in transition we are in stagnation.

[PAULD123]

A semi final, there is not  a man in the country could coach this current squad to an AI semi final not one.

For goodness sake, an over hyped and generally ordinary Down team managed to work its way to an AI final last year on the basis of surprise, a good draw in the qualifiers and their share of good fortune.

That's just bitterness. Down were better than over-hyped and ordinary last year. Down played some lovely flowing football and deserved to be in the final. Don't forget we had to beat the All-Ireland champions to get there. But yes the draw worked out well, only having to play Kerry and Kildare to get to the final and with such a draw Armagh could easily attain similar results

It is true that Armagh have enough talent to make a team that would be capable of getting to a semi-final or even a final with a good draw. Instead of Tyrone, Armagh could easily have faced Leitrim, then maybe Derry (who were now depleted by Bradley's loss). That would have put you in an All-Ireland quarter final, which could well have been against a Mayo team you have already beaten. So yes it is silly to say that no one could get Armagh to a semi-final.

But it is hard to see Armagh beating Cork or Kerry. They are currently ahead by a measure of all other teams in the country and it would take a very lucky day for someone to beat them.