Sigerson should be resiricted to undergraduates and 4 years play ?

[orangeman]

Moyna calls for stricter Sigerson regulations
08 August 2010

DCU Sports Academy Director Niall Moyna believes the Sigerson Cup competition should be confined to undergraduate students.

Speaking to the Sunday Independent ahead of the registration deadline for the new semester, the manager of the reigning Sigerson Cup champions said: "Sigerson Cup should be for undergraduates only. There should only be four years of eligibility because that was what the competition was meant to be about.

"We have lost the run of ourselves and I would like to see it going back to what it was originally about. If you're doing medicine or a law programme, well that's too bad, you can't play for your last three years. Right now, we have 19-year-olds playing against 26-year-olds and that's not fair."
Revealing that a number of inter-county stars have contacted him to inquire about the possibility of studying at DCU, Moyna stressed that education takes precedence over football at the Glasnevin campus.

"In all my correspondence with those students, I didn't mention football just the courses that they wanted to do," he said.

"That's my priority first and foremost. My view would be that Cork IT is becoming the academy for Cork County Board and they have stated that.

"All the good young players in Cork are going to Cork IT. I don't have a problem with that if they want to put up a structure that affords young kids the opportunity to play our national sport and go to a third-level institution, that's fine."

[DuffleKing]

The first thing they need to do is get rid of apprentices, which is ruining the competition. Lads at ITs are playing 3 years of Sigerson by way of a half day a week (at best) off the site and in a class. Cork and Dublin ITs are the biggest culprits.

On the other hand, Moyna would want to be careful of what he stirs up. If Croke Park started examining eligibility criteria closely and the rules that govern entry requirements for courses there could be other institutions under the microscope...

[cogito]

Mr Moyna would want to look a little closer to home before he starts mouthing off about eligibility.

I doubt 40% of their Sigerson winning panel was legit last year.

What is the only college on the Republic of Ireland that uses an elite entry scheme for athletes? It basically allows DCU to hand-pick whatever players they want from the country. Half the lads on their panel last year probably didn't have 450 points between them

He claims Cork IT has become an academy for the Cork County Board. DCU has been an academy for the rest of the country for the last five years.

I am not naming names but, have a look at the panel below. How many of them do you honestly think got the required CAO points for the course they are studying.


M Boyle (Donegal); P McMahon (Dublin), K Gavin (Westmeath), K Nolan (Dublin); J Cooper (Dublin), B Cullen (Dublin), D Mooney (Monaghan); D Sheridan (Monaghan), H McGrillen (Kildare); R Flanagan (Cavan), P Flynn (Dublin), C Cregg (Roscommon); P Andrews (Dublin), B Sheridan (Meath), D Kelly (Sligo). Subs: H Gill (Dublin) for Cooper (43), M Lyng (Cavan) for Cregg (54).

In my opinion, to play Sigerson you should have to be younger than 25 and submit a copy of your leaving cert to the registration committee in Croke Park or wherever it gets looked after. If you don't have the right points you shouldn't be allowed play. Simple as.

[orangeman]

Is it not a good thing when you can get lads in to play a very high standard of football and as long as they don't discriminating lads from smaller counties, then surely there benefits accruing from their involvement ?.

USA and other places grant sports scholarships - why not Ireland ?.

[cogito]

Is it not a good thing when you can get lads in to play a very high standard of football and as long as they don't discriminating lads from smaller counties, then surely there benefits accruing from their involvement ?.

USA and other places grant sports scholarships - why not Ireland ?.

The fact is DCU has that many older-players that have come through this 'elite' system it is badly effecting the developments of younger players coming out of Fresher football. In 2009, DCU won the All-Ireland Fresher title. Do you know how many of them played in 2010 for the Sigerson Final? None. I think two made the panel of 40. That means you had twenty or so U21/Minor IC players twiddling their thumbs because certain players are back doing their third degree or so. I think there should be a age-cap anyway.

Most colleges offer scholarships orangeman and there is no problem with that what so ever, but DCU is the only one, in the south anyway, with a public system in place that allows lads to enter courses without the standard requirements.

How is that helping the young IC players?

[orangeman]

Is it not a good thing when you can get lads in to play a very high standard of football and as long as they don't discriminating lads from smaller counties, then surely there benefits accruing from their involvement ?.

USA and other places grant sports scholarships - why not Ireland ?.

The fact is DCU has that many older-players that have come through this 'elite' system it is badly effecting the developments of younger players coming out of Fresher football. In 2009, DCU won the All-Ireland Fresher title. Do you know how many of them played in 2010 for the Sigerson Final? None. I think two made the panel of 40. That means you had twenty or so U21/Minor IC players twiddling their thumbs because certain players are back doing their third degree or so. I think there should be a age-cap anyway.

Most colleges offer scholarships orangeman and there is no problem with that what so ever, but DCU is the only one, in the south anyway, with a public system in place that allows lads to enter courses without the standard requirements.

How is that helping the young IC players?

Put in a 2nd team then if they've so many players. And if there are going to be academies developed, then let these places do the same - that way they'll all get football ( or hurling ).

[blanketattack]

"That's my priority first and foremost. My view would be that Cork IT is becoming the academy for Cork County Board and they have stated that.

"All the good young players in Cork are going to Cork IT. I don't have a problem with that if they want to put up a structure that affords young kids the opportunity to play our national sport and go to a third-level institution, that's fine."

If CIT is an academy for the Cork County boards why would they allow Kerry lads on the team then?

[Logan]

Mr Moyna would want to look a little closer to home before he starts mouthing off about eligibility.

I doubt 40% of their Sigerson winning panel was legit last year.

What is the only college on the Republic of Ireland that uses an elite entry scheme for athletes? It basically allows DCU to hand-pick whatever players they want from the country. Half the lads on their panel last year probably didn't have 450 points between them

He claims Cork IT has become an academy for the Cork County Board. DCU has been an academy for the rest of the country for the last five years.

I am not naming names but, have a look at the panel below. How many of them do you honestly think got the required CAO points for the course they are studying.


M Boyle (Donegal); P McMahon (Dublin), K Gavin (Westmeath), K Nolan (Dublin); J Cooper (Dublin), B Cullen (Dublin), D Mooney (Monaghan); D Sheridan (Monaghan), H McGrillen (Kildare); R Flanagan (Cavan), P Flynn (Dublin), C Cregg (Roscommon); P Andrews (Dublin), B Sheridan (Meath), D Kelly (Sligo). Subs: H Gill (Dublin) for Cooper (43), M Lyng (Cavan) for Cregg (54).

In my opinion, to play Sigerson you should have to be younger than 25 and submit a copy of your leaving cert to the registration committee in Croke Park or wherever it gets looked after. If you don't have the right points you shouldn't be allowed play. Simple as.

Great Post

[upmonaghansayswe]

In my opinion, to play Sigerson you should have to be younger than 25 and submit a copy of your leaving cert to the registration committee in Croke Park or wherever it gets looked after. If you don’t have the right points you shouldn’t be allowed play. Simple as.

Bit too generalised of a comment..

I agree it should only be for undergraduates but i assume you wouldn't restrict students who do an add-on programme for an Honours Degree, from an IT to either another IT or University?? On paper they wouldn't have the points for the course they would be entering in to but, if they have their Ordinary Degree and pass any further exams that the college require of them then surely they are legit..

[mjg]

Heard mortimer is doing a post grad in Quantum physics

[muppet]

Heard mortimer is doing a post grad in Quantum physics

Phantam Quysics actually.

[ross4life]

Quantum leap maybe with the help of ziggy he'll go back to 1996 to help Mayo win the All Ireland

[Logan]

It's a bit ironic this statement coming out with this considering the recruitment application process for DCU.

All this started with Tralee 20 years ago, when it was an IT and the respected Kerry Trainer Pat Flanagan made his mark with Val Andrews training a Harlem Globetrotters team that included such luminaries as the current Donegal manager Jimmy McGuinness.
They more or less over powered teams by getting inter-county or just below inter-county standard players to play for them.
While they were accused of 'tempting' players they did put in place a very professional program and produced some wonderful footballers.

It was never a wing of the Cork County Board, though since there was obviously a big Cork attendance some Cork players benefitted from the experience. But to suggest this is the case now is idiotic!

In the North back then the competition for players was huge, but there were far less accusations of irregularities in the application system. They were helped by the complete lack of competition from an academic sense and free 3rd level education. Jordanstown and Queens were the only two GAA powerhouses in the north or near that region, (DKIT would have been next closest back then and DKIT weren't even in the Sigerson!)


But this all changed a few years ago when DCU took it on seriously to win a Sigerson.

DCU brought in players to do 'Post-Graduate' courses and between all of this accusations of improper conduct were whispered. As Cogito has listed there - it's pretty obvious what is still happening.

When that was very publicly stopped they had to find another way and this involved offering places to people without offering Post Grad courses.
So the next things was to offer Scholarship places on some courses to players students if they got within X marks of the course and the college would compensate the extra ones needed as they were an athlete (allegedly).
The fact that you can gain attendance to courses and get extra points (up to 100 points too!!!!) because you 'excel' in sport and get awarded a scholarship is ... well whatever...

It's always been done to some degree, it's just in the past 10 years some Uni's have taken it to a completely new level.

[Maiden1]

It's a bit ironic this statement coming out with this considering the recruitment application process for DCU.

All this started with Tralee 20 years ago, when it was an IT and the respected Kerry Trainer Pat Flanagan made his mark with Val Andrews training a Harlem Globetrotters team that included such luminaries as the current Donegal manager Jimmy McGuinness.They more or less over powered teams by getting inter-county or just below inter-county standard players to play for them.
While they were accused of 'tempting' players they did put in place a very professional program and produced some wonderful footballers.

It was never a wing of the Cork County Board, though since there was obviously a big Cork attendance some Cork players benefitted from the experience. But to suggest this is the case now is idiotic!

In the North back then the competition for players was huge, but there were far less accusations of irregularities in the application system. They were helped by the complete lack of competition from an academic sense and free 3rd level education. Jordanstown and Queens were the only two GAA powerhouses in the north or near that region, (DKIT would have been next closest back then and DKIT weren't even in the Sigerson!)


But this all changed a few years ago when DCU took it on seriously to win a Sigerson.

DCU brought in players to do 'Post-Graduate' courses and between all of this accusations of improper conduct were whispered. As Cogito has listed there - it's pretty obvious what is still happening.

When that was very publicly stopped they had to find another way and this involved offering places to people without offering Post Grad courses.
So the next things was to offer Scholarship places on some courses to players students if they got within X marks of the course and the college would compensate the extra ones needed as they were an athlete (allegedly).
The fact that you can gain attendance to courses and get extra points (up to 100 points too!!!!) because you 'excel' in sport and get awarded a scholarship is ... well whatever...

It's always been done to some degree, it's just in the past 10 years some Uni's have taken it to a completely new level.

Jimmy must be the most educated man in Ireland.  He has more Sigerson medals than most people have loose change.

[JMohan]

How many has he?