Tyone Responds To GPA Regonition

[ONeill]

I think Sean and his Tyrone GPA cohorts are afraid of missing out on any potential windfall if the GPA were to believe Darcy's initial claims!

I think all and sundry can understand the existence of a Players' Union and the recent McGuigan issue (whether it's accurate or not) just magnifies the need for one. However, the GPA would need to repackage itself. Farrell's style of leadership and cloudy dialogue has left Joe Public rather suspicious of its ultimate aims and raison d'etre.

[magpie seanie]

Exactly O'Neill. This grants thing for instance - do the membership not get to have a say about this? What exactly are we talking about? No-one seems to know. If there's nothing to hide then out with the details. Lets see how paying grants to elite players "underpins the amateur ethos" Donal.

[winghalfun]

I remember posting this response to this discussion a while back and in particular to Uladh's assertion that you can support county player "welfare" (my words) and be a hard working club worker.
The sentiments haven't changed and apologies Uladh for regurgitating it. It is not an attack on your beliefs (everyone is entitled to opionions) but was merely an opinion also.
It was also writen in response to the amazing statistic that only 1.2% of the GAA may benefit from such a fundamental change to the way the organisation operates. 

Uladh your current cv once stated that you were:

currently an underage manager
assistant on another underage team
assistant on a reserve team
full committee member
finance committee member
voluntary bar shifts
registrar.

and a piss poor player.


Having read this and examining the set up within my own club I am drawn towards a comparison between the current GPA saga and George Orwell's Animal Farm.

What you and the vast majority of our volunteers are potentially turning into are the old work horses, Boxer and Clover while the GPA, and in particular Mr Farrell, are turning into the pigs and in particular Napolean.

The GPA is quite good at convincing each other that collectivism is a good idea.
Orwell also supported this contention when he said, "Their (pigs) most faithful disciples were the two carthorses, Boxer and Clover.  Those two had great difficulty in thinking anything out for themselves, but having once accepted the pigs as their teachers, they absorbed everything that they were told, and passed it on to the other animals by simple arguments."

Dessie and his comrades are attempting to take over the farm and while they may argue they have the collective interests of their members at heart, I cannot but help recall the initial 7 commandments being abridged for the last time to simply read, "All animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others."

And that is the whole crux of the matter. Are some people in the GAA more equal than others?
To say yes, in my opinion is so wrong and so dangerous.

Dessie Farrell would try and convince you otherwise but as Squealer the other pig enthusiastically pointed out, "Do not imagine, comrades, that leadership is a pleasure.   On the contrary, it is a deep and heavy responsibility.  No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal.  He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves.    But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"

I'll tell you where we will be. We will be in the situation whereby the U-14 player, the senior player, the youth manager, the man who cuts the crass, the lady who makes the tea, the 98.8% of us who keep the farm working will be looking in through the window of the farm house at the more equal 1.2% and thinking, "that can't be right"

And if the rest of us mere mortal animals, not blessed with the extra special skills and cunning of the pigs, look in through that window and do not like what we see are we going to be naïve enough to keep working.
I know what I will be doing.

And if this sounds hysterical then just remember that the importance of the proletariat is shown when Boxer suddenly falls and there is suddenly a drastic decrease in work productivity.  But still he is taken for granted by the pigs, who send him away in a glue truck. 
I listen to the demands and arguments put forward by Napoleon, sorry Farrell and while I agree that the farm may not be perfect and that the animals could be treated better, the underlying motive of the leaders of the revolt is greed and self-interest.

Yes, they may get a hearing because their aims and motives may sound reasonable and yes they may better the lot of their 1.2% of members but I will leave the last word to Orwell himself who writes

"Somehow it seemed as though the farm had grown richer without making the animals themselves any richer— except, of course, for the pigs and the dogs."

[winghalfun]

Oh, and another thing. I read with interest Sean Cavanagh's daming criticism of the Tyrone County board's stance and it led me to wonder, outside of their footballing contribution to the county, how much do these players put back into their own clubs.
And before anyone suggests that I am accusing Sean of doing nothing for the Moy, I am not because I genuinely don't know.
I would be interested though for some of our Moy posters to enlighten me.

In fact of the current Tyrone squad, it would be interesting to do a little research here and find out how many players are actively involved in any small or big way with promoting or working within their clubs (apart from playing of course).
Of the top of my head, I am aware of the good work that high profile players such as Ryan McMenamin, Brian Dooher and Stephen O'Neill do. But what about the rest?

[ONeill]

Off on a further tangent, I hear Stephen O'Neill is now preaching from the pulpit. A Clonoe mass-goer told me he was hired to lecture the youth of the parish on clean-living.

[loughshore lad]

Oh, and another thing. I read with interest Sean Cavanagh's daming criticism of the Tyrone County board's stance and it led me to wonder, outside of their footballing contribution to the county, how much do these players put back into their own clubs.
And before anyone suggests that I am accusing Sean of doing nothing for the Moy, I am not because I genuinely don't know.
I would be interested though for some of our Moy posters to enlighten me.

In fact of the current Tyrone squad, it would be interesting to do a little research here and find out how many players are actively involved in any small or big way with promoting or working within their clubs (apart from playing of course).
Of the top of my head, I am aware of the good work that high profile players such as Ryan McMenamin, Brian Dooher and Stephen O'Neill do. But what about the rest?

Brian McGuigan plays a very active role in our club and gives as much time as physically possible. Never misses training or games (of any type including challenge) and trains one of the underage teams.

[believebelive]

When the GPA was first formed there was a need. Players were not getting looked very well and I think the vast majority of us will agree that they needed better treatment. They are now alot better treated and I believe that most would say that with regards gear, medical treatment and meals after training most would be happy.
However over recent times the GPA has morphed into a completely different organisation. They continue to push for monetary reward for the players and while they dress it up as compensation or tax incentives or so on it certainly appears to the average joe public that they want complete pay for play. It always baffled me that the GPA have not demanded a shorter inter county season for their 'hard done by over trained players' - perhaps it is because if the season was shorter their argument for financially rewarding players would lose some of its clout.
It appears to me that there is a small percentage of players - mostly past players - who are driving the agenda of the GPA. I think that most of the inter county players are a little apathetic towards the whole thing.

On another point I find it difficult to comprehend the head the sand approach taken by some posters. They accuse the GPA of chipping away at the amatuer ethos but I would contend that they were not the first to take the chisel in hand. I wonder how many posters on here have sat in a committee room and agreed to the payment - above expenses - for a manager. If you have then I venture that you too have chipped away at the amatuer ethos.
Once the principal was conceded and poeple turned a blind eye to payment of managers it was the slippery slope. I would say that at least 75% of counties and clubs have paid a manager at some stage. The argument that players should not get paid because it cannot be sustained should not be used. Players should not be paid because we are amatuer. This should extend to managers and trainers who are making second incomes from the GAA.

[muppet]

It is also very naive of you to think that grant scheme would keep the GPA happy for long. It will set a legal precedent of players getting financially rewarded for representing their couinty and leave the door open for them to the gain even more in the future.  

Skull that is merely your opinion, not a fact so don't present it as absolute.

You're also implying that you would be for "pay for play" IF the GAA could afford it? I'm assuming you're talking solely about the financial price rather than the cultural price. I find this an unbelieveable stance when you consider the points Hardy has just made.

I didn't imply the former, your middle assumption is wrong and therefore it is not so difficult to see why you find it unbelievable.

To say I am against pay for play because the Gaa couldn't afford it and it would destroy the game does not imply that I would be for it if they could afford it.  

[full back]

me he was hired to lecture the youth of the parish on clean-living.

Hired!! Did this involve some financial reward?

[phpearse]

Expect to see Winghalfun post in the Independent or the likes in the near future

[theskull1]

It is also very naive of you to think that grant scheme would keep the GPA happy for long. It will set a legal precedent of players getting financially rewarded for representing their couinty and leave the door open for them to the gain even more in the future.  

Skull that is merely your opinion, not a fact so don't present it as absolute.

Well you cannot blame me for holding such an opinion muppet when the GPA is as clandestine as it is. I can only read between the lines. I don't think I'm far off the mark  

You're also implying that you would be for "pay for play" IF the GAA could afford it? I'm assuming you're talking solely about the financial price rather than the cultural price. I find this an unbelieveable stance when you consider the points Hardy has just made.

I didn't imply the former, your middle assumption is wrong and therefore it is not so difficult to see why you find it unbelievable.

To say I am against pay for play because the Gaa couldn't afford it and it would destroy the game does not imply that I would be for it if they could afford it.  

Would you mind clarifying it me me then? Hardy as you said yourself eloquently put forward the deep seated ethical reasoning as to why we should not be supporting "pay for play". You then stated.....

Firstlly I will declare as I have done before that I am not for 'pay for play', not for the reasons that Hardy so eloquently outlined above, but because the Gaa could never sustain it and the game as we know it would be destroyed.

What other way am I meant to interpret what you have said when I take into consideration that your reason for not supporting pay for play doesn't line up with Hardy's view?

[realredhandfan]

agreed , a post of supreme quality.

[muppet]

Well you cannot blame me for holding such an opinion muppet when the GPA is as clandestine as it is.

Skull we are all entitled to our opinions. Its this that I object to ' It will set a legal precedent of players getting financially rewarded ' . That is not a fact but merely opinion. I don't see how at all it will set a legal precedent seeing as the Gaa wouldn't be paying them. Like I said before the Gaa/Government can write whatever they want into the agreement which might end this sorry mess.

Skull the game would be destroyed because the counties with the most money would 'buy' the best players. In a few years we would end up with maybe 6-8 tops teams and a competiton where they would play each other all the time as demanded by those paying the bills, i.e. TV and sponsors. That is why I am against pay for play, it would destroy the game regardless of whether the Gaa can pay or not.

My problem is thus. If the members want an amateur association that is fine. Let's have a vote and if Amateurism is the outcome then we give the paid managers, paid players and paid officers 6 months to wean themselves of the money. All expenses should cease. At the moment we are a long way from being amateur and the romantic notions of our association in the posts above, while tear jerking, are just blinkered.

Of the top of my head, I am aware of the good work that high profile players such as Ryan McMenamin, Brian Dooher and Stephen O'Neill do. But what about the rest?

Are you serious? Do you think Sean Kavanagh is one of the finest footballers in the country by chance? I'd wager the man eats drinks and sleeps Gaa as do most county players. Considering the physical abuse they go through not to mention the verbal abuse from two-faced supporters, I wonder why they bother.

[Fionntamhnach]

Fionntamhnach,if the Tyrone County Board had sent a letter to Croke Park in support of the GPA,would you think that the procedures followed were acceptable?

If they were followed correctly, then yes. I have only ever been to one county meeting (and what a county meeting it was!) but there are matters that are brought up at the time and are then decided on if they don't require direct consultation with clubs set on in the regulations. It happens quite often. In your scenario, I wouldn't like it, but I'd recognise that it was a body made up from the membership in Tyrone that would sanction it. I wasn't terribly pleased to see the football leagues revert back to 3x16 but I accept that's democracy. It's a bitch, eh? But we can't pick and choose what we like, you have to take the rough with the smooth.

[Fionntamhnach]

But the GPA lashed back last night, saying "perhaps the letter was an attempt to divert attention from a number of on-going player welfare issues in their own county."

Maybe the GPA can expand on what these issues are? The Brian McGuigan case excluded, just what are they? Or is it a fancy soundbite?

I can safely say that as someone who was formerly involved in the Vocational Schools setup, anything that was needed from the county board was pretty much taken care of, though nothing over the top was asked for.