The Political History of Northern Ireland

[charlieTully]

So Harp esentially what you are implying is that we should just forget about Irish Unity because it is too risky, too long term a goal and too hard to achieve, and that we should all just become Post-Nationalists?

As someone who like yourself, has studied, and worked abroad I would have to say a big No thanks. to that. Thankfully the people gave the SDLP the correct reaction to it's Post Nationalism ever since they came out of the closet on it back in 2001.

As for

Pretending Northern Ireland does not exist, avoiding the use of the term, and indulging in crass rhetoric such as "a United Ireland by 2016" is a blind strategy that takes no account of political realities as they really stand.

I am someone who refuses to refer to these six counties as anything other than "the six counties". I don't see myself as being blind by doing so. I see myself as being true to my feelings/opinions.

where do you stand on the twelth parade through ardoyne, will you backing up your sf psni colleagues?

[Tony Baloney]

No doubt the village was Moneyslane....

The flag of old South africa would have been up to commerate those 'brave gunrunners' who supplied the weapons to the chosen race here. A lot of loyalist guns came in from there, suppose it's a nod to them

Indeed it is. Just passed thru on the way to Castlewellan and it is sporting all the favourites - the old SA flag, Israeli flag plus the usual suspects.

[Hardy]

any island which is under the jurisdication of a larger land mass then refers to that larger land mass as the mainland.

What did I miss while I was asleep?

[Banana Man]

the 'bonfire defenders' on the donegall road must have been asleep too, i see in the irish news that someone lobbed a petrol bomb into it and burnt it to the ground

the loyalists have now attached a sign saying ''God made the world in 6 days we will build our bonfire in 5''

i suppose you argue that McCausland shouldn't be writing signs but what shocked me the most was there was someone fit to tell them they had made a spelling mistake and they then painted over the letter 'E' they had included in Bonfire 

[lynchbhoy]

any island which is under the jurisdication of a larger land mass then refers to that larger land mass as the mainland.

What did I miss while I was asleep?

you beat me to it Hardy !!!

by the same token, as britain /uk is in the EU - this means that they should refer to Europe as the 'mainland' as per delboys definition ! 
but I suspect that this will lead to a bit of double standards as per usual !

delboy- I dont have any problems with anyone calling britain/uk the 'mainland' - its just that I find it amusing when you and the likes of you wont see that this is the same precedent in relation to 'mainland' europe !
Double standards indeed !

[lynchbhoy]

Unlike you i am able to use the word mainland without out having to tie myself up in ideological conundrums, any island which is under the jurisdication of a larger land mass then refers to that larger land mass as the mainland.

MOPERY of the highest order, i said before why hold back why not call yourselves the rwandians of europe or some other such nonsense, sure who cares about belittling a much greater human injustice as long as you can score your cheap points.

Remind me again when cameron said they want to jettison the financial burden that the north of Ireland is - they dont want to continue to pay for what doesnt belong to them! (odd that he didn't even call an area under his jurisdication by its correct name).
Oh thats right in your head wasn't it.

You think the yanks are going to pay for a UI, yeah that great peace dividend we got speaks volumes, an all expenses paid junket, sorry conference for american businessmen, you live in cloud republican cuckoo land.

So the UK government don't want to pay for us but you think they are going to pay the irish to pay for us, you've got a lot to learn. The EU, news flash, europeans don't give a tuppeny f*ck about irish reunification, you think the french, spanish etc are going to stump up to pay for your ideological wetdream, you're delusional.
Good luck shouldering that burden with a economy in the shitter and a  population of 4.5 million about 6 if you throw us into the mix when a country over ten times the size supposedly couldn't hack it.

Sticking your head above the parapet and spouting shit wouldn't make it happen you know 

we've already dealt with the 'mainland' item - above !

your 'rwandan' tangents are not even good barbs , subliminaly spiteful as they are - but maybe care to answer the question of bloody instead rather than dodge the issue !!

read back on what a lot of politicians said before the english election. Maybe take your head out of the sand and find out yourself. Sorry , its going to upset you !


if you actually read what was said - Irish reunification can only happen in a period of positive economic growth times ! No matter how hard the british gov will look to offload the money pit, they wont be able to do so until the world economic climate is right.

As for your jibe about the USA - well it shows you dont know much about economic history (as well as all the other things !!) - after WW2 germany was rebuilt along with moneies from...you guessed it - the USA.
Japan after the WW2 was rebuilt from financial aid from the USA.
Hong Kong was given back to the chinese and while no money may have changed hands, effectively it did as the british gave over rights to various financially lucrative money making rights to resources etc etc
There are other precedents where the USA have invested cash into countries that they have been to war with - Vietnam, grenada etc etc.
So after being involved in the peace process and pledging to invest in the country at the time of reunification, if they were financially able to do so then, I am sure that the Irish lobbyists in US senate etc would insist they follow this up.
Similarly being prt of the EU would qualify grants and financial aid from them.

dont let your bigotry trip you up !
Take off the blinkers and take the head out of the sand !
There are world precedents for so many other places when it comes to reunification and finacing! you and folk like you just dont want to see it.
The only other obstacle is that people of the south of Ireland wont actually want yous - but again money (investment, jobs and lucrative return to booming economy) will make them change their minds !

[delboy]

any island which is under the jurisdication of a larger land mass then refers to that larger land mass as the mainland.

What did I miss while I was asleep?

you beat me to it Hardy !!!

by the same token, as britain /uk is in the EU - this means that they should refer to Europe as the 'mainland' as per delboys definition ! 
but I suspect that this will lead to a bit of double standards as per usual !

delboy- I dont have any problems with anyone calling britain/uk the 'mainland' - its just that I find it amusing when you and the likes of you wont see that this is the same precedent in relation to 'mainland' europe !
Double standards indeed !

You've been imagaining things in that little brain box of yours again haven't you where did i say anything about europe, once again you are wrong, about the likes of me (whatever that means) for the record i do call it Mainland europe, its the big land mass to the right of the UK and of which the UK is one of the jurisdications, simply really, imaginary double standards indeed.

Geographically of course its also the european mainland since its forms the bulk of the contential shelf, to call it anything other than the european mainland would be daft.

[A Quinn Martin Production]

any island which is under the jurisdication of a larger land mass then refers to that larger land mass as the mainland.

What did I miss while I was asleep?

Hardy, there had to be some retribution for tanking the Dubs!!

[delboy]

Unlike you i am able to use the word mainland without out having to tie myself up in ideological conundrums, any island which is under the jurisdication of a larger land mass then refers to that larger land mass as the mainland.

MOPERY of the highest order, i said before why hold back why not call yourselves the rwandians of europe or some other such nonsense, sure who cares about belittling a much greater human injustice as long as you can score your cheap points.

Remind me again when cameron said they want to jettison the financial burden that the north of Ireland is - they dont want to continue to pay for what doesnt belong to them! (odd that he didn't even call an area under his jurisdication by its correct name).
Oh thats right in your head wasn't it.

You think the yanks are going to pay for a UI, yeah that great peace dividend we got speaks volumes, an all expenses paid junket, sorry conference for american businessmen, you live in cloud republican cuckoo land.

So the UK government don't want to pay for us but you think they are going to pay the irish to pay for us, you've got a lot to learn. The EU, news flash, europeans don't give a tuppeny f*ck about irish reunification, you think the french, spanish etc are going to stump up to pay for your ideological wetdream, you're delusional.
Good luck shouldering that burden with a economy in the shitter and a  population of 4.5 million about 6 if you throw us into the mix when a country over ten times the size supposedly couldn't hack it.

Sticking your head above the parapet and spouting shit wouldn't make it happen you know 

we've already dealt with the 'mainland' item - above !

your 'rwandan' tangents are not even good barbs , subliminaly spiteful as they are - but maybe care to answer the question of bloody instead rather than dodge the issue !!

read back on what a lot of politicians said before the english election. Maybe take your head out of the sand and find out yourself. Sorry , its going to upset you !


if you actually read what was said - Irish reunification can only happen in a period of positive economic growth times ! No matter how hard the british gov will look to offload the money pit, they wont be able to do so until the world economic climate is right.

As for your jibe about the USA - well it shows you dont know much about economic history (as well as all the other things !!) - after WW2 germany was rebuilt along with moneies from...you guessed it - the USA.
Japan after the WW2 was rebuilt from financial aid from the USA.
Hong Kong was given back to the chinese and while no money may have changed hands, effectively it did as the british gave over rights to various financially lucrative money making rights to resources etc etc
There are other precedents where the USA have invested cash into countries that they have been to war with - Vietnam, grenada etc etc.
So after being involved in the peace process and pledging to invest in the country at the time of reunification, if they were financially able to do so then, I am sure that the Irish lobbyists in US senate etc would insist they follow this up.
Similarly being prt of the EU would qualify grants and financial aid from them.

dont let your bigotry trip you up !
Take off the blinkers and take the head out of the sand !
There are world precedents for so many other places when it comes to reunification and finacing! you and folk like you just dont want to see it.
The only other obstacle is that people of the south of Ireland wont actually want yous - but again money (investment, jobs and lucrative return to booming economy) will make them change their minds !

Dealt with the mainland, i think not what you did was make something up, nothing unusal there then.

Show me all these comments (ok even some) were politicans talked about ditching the 'north of ireland', if you make claims at least have the decency to back them up with evidence, otherwise you are just spouting shit, nothing unusual there then.

What are you waffling about we were at war with the americans or something  You really are deluded, nothing unsual there then.

Accusing me of being a bigot, show me one bigoted remark i've made to back those claims, i bet you can't, nothing unsual there then.

Yes Yes a booming economy with 4.5 million people will of course be able to afford the basket case economy of northern ireland that you all keep banging on about, i suggest you don't leave your day job to become an economic analyst.

[Banana Man]

Tell me this Delboy, if you were on Rathlin Island for argument's sake what or where would the mainland be?

If you told whoever was driving the boat to go the mainland I odubt they would set off for Campbelltown

[deiseach]

Even if eventually Nationalists somehow obtain a 50%+1 majority in a referendum, we can be sure that the hard-core loyalist population will not take this lying down, and will unleash a campaign of the most violent, thuggish and sectarian barbarism, making any nascent 32 county Republic impossible to govern and putting the lives of the Northern Catholic population in general at severe risk. 

+1

[delboy]

Tell me this Delboy, if you were on Rathlin Island for argument's sake what or where would the mainland be?

If you told whoever was driving the boat to go the mainland I odubt they would set off for Campbelltown

Well the ownership of it was contested between ireland and scotland so in the 17th century it would have been a toss up, but ireland won out in the end and its now part of N. Ireland, so in the context of rathlin the mainland would be Northern Ireland, whats the issue.

[Banana Man]

My point is you refer to England, Scotland and Wales as the UK mainland, so how can you stand on Rathlin Island, which whether we like it or not is under the jurisdiction of the UK and talkabout the north of Ireland (Northern Ireland) being the mainland, that totally contradicts your point - that's the issue

[delboy]

My point is you refer to England, Scotland and Wales as the UK mainland, so how can you stand on Rathlin Island, which whether we like it or not is under the jurisdiction of the UK and talkabout the north of Ireland (Northern Ireland) being the mainland, that totally contradicts your point - that's the issue

No it doesn't rathlin is owned and under the jurisdication of northern ireland therefore the mainland is Northern Ireland.
Northern ireland is under the jurisdication of the UK the largest peice of which is to the right of us, that is the United Kingdom mainland.
The UK is part of the jurisdication of the EU the largest peice of which is to the right of them and is known as the european mainland.

Wheres the problem, where is the contradiction  Under your example the boat would have to head for France FFS.

Just because you boys tie yourselves up in all sorts of verbal knots just to deny the existence of a place doesn't mean everyone else has to.

[Banana Man]

we'll agree to disagree Delboy because if we go by the letter of the law it is owned by the Queen who is the head of the UK state. 'Northern Ireland' doesn't own anything. It may govern it on certain laws, we can agree on that but it is owned by the UK.