Get ready to wave them flegs - Lily Windsor's coming

[Geoff Tipps]

Not sure were to post this but it made me laugh - from RTE tracker on visit of the Queen:

1054 One of the top stallions at the National Stud in Kildare was killed in an accident yesterday, just two days before the visit there by Queen Elizabeth.

17-year-old Verglas, who was with the stud since 2005, was one of the top ten Irish-based sires of 2010.

The Chief Executive of the National Stud, John Osborne said the horse died following a tragic accident during the normal course of business yesterday afternoon.

Kinky sex games gone wrong in the stud world?

Sad...but what a way to go!

To borrow a Richard Pryor joke - He came and went at the same time!!

[magpie seanie]

I actually took it another way. Those men died for a 32 county republic, and a 32 county republic will be achieved someday, as soon as the majority of people in both jurisdictions on this island want it.

I think that in itself is a huge step forward compared to what those men fought against.

For now, I believe that the british monarch visiting, and being respectful, at a monument to those who fought so hard and so desperately against her predecessors' forces on this island, is a hugely significant gesture, and shows to the world that britain acknowledges the legitimacy of the nation of Ireland to have fought for it's freedom, and indeed to be free.

When both parts of the island are ready to reunite, I don't think Britain will stand in it's way, and I think the gesture yesterday affirms that which is basically agreed in the GFA.

Well said AZ and I agree entirely. When I read about GSTQ being played at the Garden yesterday and before I was uneasy about it. When I saw it last night on TV and the way the whole ceremony was conducted I came away with the same viewpoint as yourself. Nothing in these events happens spontaneously and I thought the very deliberate, respectful and humble bow by the Queen of England to our dead patriots was actually quite moving. There was no insult, quite the opposite in my view.

[Hardy]

Spot on lads. Bad news only for those who will search obsessively for the negative in every situation. I can't think of a more powerful symbol than the previously unimaginable image of the British queen bowing her head in tribute to Pearse, Connolly, MacSwiney etc.

If it makes "republicans" feel better, I suggest they look at it as a capitulation - the leader of the defeated side being paraded in the capital of the victors in the Roman tradition. There's something in  it for everybody.

[ross matt]

I think the whole thing is a distraction from the real work the recently elected government should be doing. There is a huge expense involved security wise. There is considerable cost to businesses with closed streets and diversions etc. As a self employed person holding on financially by my fingernails i resent this. I dont for a moment believe we will get the return in tourist revenue that's been randomnly thrown out by the media.

I think the whole concept of royalty is a joke. The coverage of the royal wedding and the ensuing love in from over hee was an insult to the intelligence of our nation. Not to mention to the people in Ireland and England who are losing or will nevr own their own homes due a global economic recession. People have their priorities up their holes.

Of course this visit and the sensitive handling of it from both sides is most welcome and does help the healing. The queen herself seems to have been doing her bit in this regard. The scum that were on the street throwing stones and lighting wheelie bins are just that... scum.  But I dont think this trip was needed right now. It will make little difference in the greater scheme of things re NI etc and it certainly wont help in any way to tackle the most important problems facing this country.

The same goes for Obama. I like him and respect him more because he is a democratically elected leader of his country and all that etc... but we will have most of our cops on stand by again... most of the country on shut down... politicians jumping in front of cameras trying to be pictured beside him when he sups a pint of guinness. Once again no real work done. Once again will it really mean american tourists watching whatever coverage it gets on US tv will be infleunced in to deciding to come here on holidays? Would the yanks that come here in the next year not be coming here anyway?

Then next week there will be this smug self satisfied coverage in our media about how much the world loves us (aka Jedward "capturing the hearts of europe last week"). But the world wont give a shit and wont even be looking. But we'll still have the bail out loans... NAMA.... bad banks... high unemployment/emigration. 

[winsamsoon]

when i heard that the Queen was coming to visit i had mixed emotions on the issue and in many ways i was thinking what AZ was saying but at the same time asking myself is this too soon for such a visit. I sort of came round to the idea that it was being done to improve relations between the two nations and although not ideal i was willing to bite my lip. However watching the visit yesterday i must say i was appalled that ' God save the queen' was played at the garden of remembrance. I have no doubt this was a political move instigated by the Irish government to provoke a reaction from Sinn Fein and to try and quell their increasing support. To date SF have remained tight lipped on the matter. I have now changed my opinion of the visit and think the whole thing is being used for political gains and the greater political process in the North has taken a back seat. I see it as a kick in the teeth to SF who IMO are under the most pressure over this visit, they are literally caught between a rock and a hard place.
On the issue of the protesters, i acknowledge that there are elements that would'nt;t know their ass from their elbow and are intent on violence. But there are sections there protesting that have legitimate reasons for doing so. These issue are clearly close tho their hearts and the divisiveness of this visit has reopened old wounds. If my grandfather or family members would have been lying in the garden of remembrance i wouldn't have wanted the national anthem of the nation playing over them that was responsible for their death. This was an insult and should not have happened. The laying of the wreath as a mark of respect was acceptable this should have been followed by a few poems, and the Irish anthem.

On another note the cost of the security was a complete joke in a nation that is clearly in the worst financial disaster it has ever been. has they can justify this to voters in beyond me. PS what was the crowds like actually supporting the visit? From what i could see they weren't too high.

[Declan]

People have their priorities up their holes

+10000

[Hardy]

However watching the visit yesterday i must say i was appalled that ' God save the queen' was played at the garden of remembrance. I have no doubt this was a political move instigated by the Irish government to provoke a reaction from Sinn Fein and to try and quell their increasing support. To date SF have remained tight lipped on the matter. I have now changed my opinion of the visit and think the whole thing is being used for political gains and the greater political process in the North has taken a back seat. I see it as a kick in the teeth to SF who IMO are under the most pressure over this visit, they are literally caught between a rock and a hard place.

Yes - it's all about SF

Obama took out OBL just to stick it to SF. Ireland hammered England in the cricket as a homage to SF. The British queen is here just to piss off SF.

[Hardy]

There's a dacent hoult on Mrs Kenny!

[Tubberman]

when i heard that the Queen was coming to visit i had mixed emotions on the issue and in many ways i was thinking what AZ was saying but at the same time asking myself is this too soon for such a visit. I sort of came round to the idea that it was being done to improve relations between the two nations and although not ideal i was willing to bite my lip. However watching the visit yesterday i must say i was appalled that ' God save the queen' was played at the garden of remembrance. I have no doubt this was a political move instigated by the Irish government to provoke a reaction from Sinn Fein and to try and quell their increasing support. To date SF have remained tight lipped on the matter. I have now changed my opinion of the visit and think the whole thing is being used for political gains and the greater political process in the North has taken a back seat. I see it as a kick in the teeth to SF who IMO are under the most pressure over this visit, they are literally caught between a rock and a hard place.
On the issue of the protesters, i acknowledge that there are elements that would'nt;t know their ass from their elbow and are intent on violence. But there are sections there protesting that have legitimate reasons for doing so. These issue are clearly close tho their hearts and the divisiveness of this visit has reopened old wounds. If my grandfather or family members would have been lying in the garden of remembrance i wouldn't have wanted the national anthem of the nation playing over them that was responsible for their death. This was an insult and should not have happened. The laying of the wreath as a mark of respect was acceptable this should have been followed by a few poems, and the Irish anthem.

On another note the cost of the security was a complete joke in a nation that is clearly in the worst financial disaster it has ever been. has they can justify this to voters in beyond me. PS what was the crowds like actually supporting the visit? From what i could see they weren't too high.

You think the FG/Lab govt arranged the playing of GSTQ to have a dig at SF??
Delusions of importance there I'm afraid. I'm sure they had enough to be concerned about with this visit, without trying to score points against the 4th most popular party in the state.

[AQMP]

I have to say I don't think this visit is about SF.  Sure SF were put in a difficult position by the visit but I think they'd played it pretty well so far.  Personally I'm largely indifferent to the visit.  I do think the media have blown the importance of the visit out of proportion a bit.  Paul Clarke of UTV will not make the weekend before spontaneously combusting in a ball of deference and fawning.  Not often that I agree with Kevin Myers and Malachi O'Doherty but their analysis on Radio Ulster yesterday was spot on.  Since the late 80s Britain and Ireland have had a fairly cordial relationship at a governmental level.  Both governments played a central role in the negotiation of the GFA.  Sure, I found GSTQ yesterday a little uncomfortable...but only for a minute and taken in the round with the recitation of An Aisling and the playing of the National Anthem it was moving.  What will be the hardest part of the visit to stomach for me, will not even be the visit to Croke Pk, but having had relatives involved in both world wars (one of whom, a Nationalist, died) it will be the presence of UDA terrorists at Island Bridge.  But once I've shouted at the telly a few times tonight over a glass of red I'll get over that too.

Actually I get the feeling from speaking to some Northern Unionists that they don't know quite how to react to the visit either (once again what we have in common is greater than what divides us? )  One woman I spoke to this morning said she found the Garden of Remembrance uncomfortable because she had been brought up to believe that Pearse et al were terrorists.

[AZOffaly]

I have to say I don't think this visit is about SF.  Sure SF were put in a difficult position by the visit but I think they'd played it pretty well so far.  Personally I'm largely indifferent to the visit.  I do think the media have blown the importance of the visit out of proportion a bit.  Paul Clarke of UTV will not make the weekend before spontaneously combusting in a ball of deference and fawning.  Not often that I agree with Kevin Myers and Malachi O'Doherty but their analysis on Radio Ulster yesterday was spot on.  Since the late 80s Britain and Ireland have had a fairly cordial relationship at a governmental level.  Both governments played a central role in the negotiation of the GFA.  Sure, I found GSTQ yesterday a little uncomfortable...but only for a minute and taken in the round with the recitation of An Aisling and the playing of the National Anthem it was moving.  What will be the hardest part of the visit to stomach for me, will not even be the visit to Croke Pk, but having had relatives involved in both world wars (one of whom, a Nationalist, died) it will be the presence of UDA terrorists at Island Bridge.  But once I've shouted at the telly a few times tonight over a glass of red I'll get over that too.

Actually I get the feeling from speaking to some Northern Unionists that they don't know quite how to react to the visit either (once again what we have in common is greater than what divides us? )  One woman I spoke to this morning said she found the Garden of Remembrance uncomfortable because she had been brought up to believe that Pearse et al were terrorists.

I can imagine that must be very confusing alright. Suddenly the monarch of the UK is paying homage to these people, in the same way she would have paid homage to George Washington et al.

[Hardy]

I hope she's looking forward to the highlight of the week this afternoon when she gets to meet Joe Sheridan.

[AQMP]

I hope she's looking forward to the highlight of the week this afternoon when she gets to meet Joe Sheridan.

Queen:  "So Joe, I believe one is allowed to throw the ball into the net, is that right?"

[Hardy]

"Only us Royals, Mrs."

[brokencrossbar1]

I have felt ill at ease about the visit, and particularly the tour of CP, for many reasons.  One of the main reasons is I am anti Royalist and anti-Privilege at heart and I don't agree with the whole concept.  I feel that given the money they have at their disposal they should have contributed handsomely to the cost of it.  Maybe they did but that is not my main issue with it. 

As Nally Stand said above this is being viewed as the Final Piece of the Jigsaw, that it is the end of the Peace Process as such.  It was said a number of times on UTV live by Ken Reid and a few others.  The thing is I see it simply as the first piece of the jigsaw. I believe we are in end game times and that we are moving towards the final withdrawal of the British Government from the North.  We are in a very important decade in terms of anniversaries and also in terms of what is going to happen to the North.  I know the usual arguments will be run out that there will only be withdrawal with full consent and that is a fair point to make under the current situation.  The thing is though that sometimes things change.  There are an awful lot of Republicans who agree with Peace but don't agree with the Peace Process.  They are men and woman who fought and did time, and some of them did a lot of time, to re-unifiy this island.  I have spoken to a few and been at talks by one or two and they feel "lost" for want of a better word.  They ask the question what have we been doing for the last 30 years of our life if we are no further on.  They have every right to feel like that as some look at the leadership of main stream Republicanism who haven't had a fraction of the disruption to their lives now wining and dining with the best while they struggle to get by in life.  There are the same types of characters in the loyalist side of things too.  These people do not necessarily want to lift a gun(some have done obviously) but they are asking the questions which no one seems to answer. 

I have set this narrative up to put in in the context of the Queen's visit.  There has to be movement to satisfy people that their battles were not in vain.  I believe that the visit of the Queen and her bowing her head to acknowledge the graves of the "terrorists" or "freedom fighters" whatever your viewpoint is a major concession by the British Government.  She may be an old dear in a funny hat but she is still the Titular head of the Government and the single unifying factor that British people have.  Governments come and go but the Royal family will always be there for the British and the majority do have great grá for them as the recent Wedding showed.  By British  too I specifically refer to Ulster British who probably love them more than there English, Scottish, Welsh or Jackeen counterparts( ).  By having her in Dublin and visiting two of the most striking symbols of Irish republicanism and Irish culture, and being accepted there by the vast majority, then the Unionists can see the country as a whole has moved on.  This will pave the way, in my view, for more cross border co-operation in terms of economies, schooling and Health care and before you know it there will be a de facto re-unification without any votes or referendums.  Consensus by working together.  This will appease the more hardline Republicans in the long term but the short term reality may not be seen.