James Horan Appointed Mayo Manager 2011

[IolarCoisCuain]

I'm not saying Micko is the best in Ireland.
He's better than anyone else mentioned.

You brought up the M&M's. Everyone knows that Brady and Co. were driving that far more than the management were, so don't try and tell me they were the reason for them getting to an AI. And they're not available so it's a mute point.

Micko turned poor counties around in Laois, Kildare and Wicklow and gave them more success than anyone else could have done, by keeping things simple and leading them. Mayo are different in that they have some decent footballers but no leadership. They, players, management and CB are like hens in a storm.

Mayo need a strong leader to refocus them and get them playing simple straightforward football.
There's no one else I've seen named better suited than Micko.

We understand that you love Micko. Fair enough.

If he gets the job I'll be giving him every chance but he is not the solution to our problems in my opinion. Our players can compete with any team on any given day. They have been doing that underage and at senior for years. Our problem is putting a full season together, believing that we can do it and then actually going on and delivering.

It'd be no harm to define what we mean by delivering before the fact. We reacted incorrectly to those All-Ireland defeats. We reacted as if we'd been beaten by Sligo and Longford at the start of the summer instead of being the second-best team in the country. Now that we have been beaten by Sligo and Longford at the start of the summer maybe it's time to re-evaluate. Losing an All-Ireland final doesn't mean that a year was worthless.

[rosnarun]

I'm not saying Micko is the best in Ireland.
He's better than anyone else mentioned.

You brought up the M&M's. Everyone knows that Brady and Co. were driving that far more than the management were, so don't try and tell me they were the reason for them getting to an AI. And they're not available so it's a mute point.

Micko turned poor counties around in Laois, Kildare and Wicklow and gave them more success than anyone else could have done, by keeping things simple and leading them. Mayo are different in that they have some decent footballers but no leadership. They, players, management and CB are like hens in a storm.

Mayo need a strong leader to refocus them and get them playing simple straightforward football.
There's no one else I've seen named better suited than Micko.

We understand that you love Micko. Fair enough.

If he gets the job I'll be giving him every chance but he is not the solution to our problems in my opinion. Our players can compete with any team on any given day. They have been doing that underage and at senior for years. Our problem is putting a full season together, believing that we can do it and then actually going on and delivering.

It'd be no harm to define what we mean by delivering before the fact. We reacted incorrectly to those All-Ireland defeats. We reacted as if we'd been beaten by Sligo and Longford at the start of the summer instead of being the second-best team in the country. Now that we have been beaten by Sligo and Longford at the start of the summer maybe it's time to re-evaluate. Losing an All-Ireland final doesn't mean that a year was worthless.

a bit of sense at last.
This year was a disaster like 3 years ago when we lost to derry.
losing an AIF is a noble thing but for some of  the Cowards that populate the mayo fan base they would much rather lose on a quiet saturday  to lonford and 'Not be  Embarrassed ' by the team losing when every one is watching

[moysider]

I m not happy about the anti- Micko stuff. He has nothing to prove. He was a Cody. Football has changed but the man is as vital as likes of Trappatoni or Robson was in later years. He s a fit elderly man but he's not senile. For God s sake we just threw away 4 years on a shadow of Micko and people are jittery about giving Micko one or two years. I m surprised that  some people that should know better are looking for a local for a four year rebuilding process. Will we ever learn? We ve wasted 4 years listening to people bullshitting about rebuilding to give ourselves a chance of winning an AI. Instead of being competitive we ended up a laughing stock. Every year takes care of itself. The aim each year is to progress as far as possible with the best players available. You lose a ccouple and get a few new players each year and when you hit a rich seam of talent you have a team.  We haven't being doing that. How many championship games won in 4 years because management couldn't pick a team for any year never mind develop a team from year to year. Was the team left in a better state than 06?  As a result we 've ended up in a shit place and the guys that landed us there just walked away without having to explain the mess they created. The board that appointed them devised a ruse - a review-  to take the heat off. I ve seen decades of false dawns and floundering in Mayo. Last 4 years unquestionably being the worst. After all that wastefullness I dont think an appointment of Micko would be something to whinge about. To be honest I d have him before anybody else on the list above. We ve nothing to lose now anyway. If we get a chance to appoint him and see ........ well lets see what happens. We can always give the House of Pain flagellants the platefull of mortal sins in a couple of years.

[IolarCoisCuain]

With all the money the Board have lost on McHale Park, could they afford Micko even if they wanted him?

[Zulu]

I m not happy about the anti- Micko stuff. He has nothing to prove. He was a Cody. Football has changed but the man is as vital as likes of Trappatoni or Robson was in later years. He s a fit elderly man but he's not senile. For God s sake we just threw away 4 years on a shadow of Micko and people are jittery about giving Micko one or two years. I m surprised that  some people that should know better are looking for a local for a four year rebuilding process. Will we ever learn? We ve wasted 4 years listening to people bullshitting about rebuilding to give ourselves a chance of winning an AI. Instead of being competitive we ended up a laughing stock. Every year takes care of itself. The aim each year is to progress as far as possible with the best players available. You lose a ccouple and get a few new players each year and when you hit a rich seam of talent you have a team.  We haven't being doing that. How many championship games won in 4 years because management couldn't pick a team for any year never mind develop a team from year to year. Was the team left in a better state than 06?  As a result we 've ended up in a shit place and the guys that landed us there just walked away without having to explain the mess they created. The board that appointed them devised a ruse - a review-  to take the heat off. I ve seen decades of false dawns and floundering in Mayo. Last 4 years unquestionably being the worst. After all that wastefullness I dont think an appointment of Micko would be something to whinge about. To be honest I d have him before anybody else on the list above. We ve nothing to lose now anyway. If we get a chance to appoint him and see ........ well lets see what happens. We can always give the House of Pain flagellants the platefull of mortal sins in a couple of years.

I can't see what Micko would bring to the table. For the record I'm not anti-Micko and nobody can take away what the man has achieved over the years. But, like me, you questioned the conditioning techniques employed by Kilty, well I don't see how doing 25 laps of a field would be an improvement on that.

I also don't think having a guy drive to and from an outside county is what Mayo needs right now. The manager doesn't need to be local but he does need to spend a bit of time in Mayo watching club football and he does need to be tactically astute. Look what Dublin, Kildare and Down have achieved by addressing some of their tactical weaknesses and developing a clear style of play. They are all managed by young men who are well versed in the modern game and I think it is a factor in their success.

Micko would still be a fine appointment for many division 3 or 4 teams that are trying to climb the ladder a bit but IMO he has no business being involved with a top team like Mayo.

[moysider]

With all the money the Board have lost on McHale Park, could they afford Micko even if they wanted him?

Not our problem. Better chance of sponsership or a sugardaddy if Micko is on board. It s all about interest and bums on seats. At the moment Mayo is a taker for sponsership but are giving nothing back. Putting money into Mayo now is waste. Nobody cares.
  I don't care about McHale Park. I don't care about talk about low key rebuilding. It doesn't work. Mayo needs a manager that gets the last drop of sweat out of the team next year. You mentioned Micko running fellas hard over the winter. That might not be a bad thing.

[moysider]

I m not happy about the anti- Micko stuff. He has nothing to prove. He was a Cody. Football has changed but the man is as vital as likes of Trappatoni or Robson was in later years. He s a fit elderly man but he's not senile. For God s sake we just threw away 4 years on a shadow of Micko and people are jittery about giving Micko one or two years. I m surprised that  some people that should know better are looking for a local for a four year rebuilding process. Will we ever learn? We ve wasted 4 years listening to people bullshitting about rebuilding to give ourselves a chance of winning an AI. Instead of being competitive we ended up a laughing stock. Every year takes care of itself. The aim each year is to progress as far as possible with the best players available. You lose a ccouple and get a few new players each year and when you hit a rich seam of talent you have a team.  We haven't being doing that. How many championship games won in 4 years because management couldn't pick a team for any year never mind develop a team from year to year. Was the team left in a better state than 06?  As a result we 've ended up in a shit place and the guys that landed us there just walked away without having to explain the mess they created. The board that appointed them devised a ruse - a review-  to take the heat off. I ve seen decades of false dawns and floundering in Mayo. Last 4 years unquestionably being the worst. After all that wastefullness I dont think an appointment of Micko would be something to whinge about. To be honest I d have him before anybody else on the list above. We ve nothing to lose now anyway. If we get a chance to appoint him and see ........ well lets see what happens. We can always give the House of Pain flagellants the platefull of mortal sins in a couple of years.

I can't see what Micko would bring to the table. For the record I'm not anti-Micko and nobody can take away what the man has achieved over the years. But, like me, you questioned the conditioning techniques employed by Kilty, well I don't see how doing 25 laps of a field would be an improvement on that.

I also don't think having a guy drive to and from an outside county is what Mayo needs right now. The manager doesn't need to be local but he does need to spend a bit of time in Mayo watching club football and he does need to be tactically astute. Look what Dublin, Kildare and Down have achieved by addressing some of their tactical weaknesses and developing a clear style of play. They are all managed by young men who are well versed in the modern game and I think it is a factor in their success.

Micko would still be a fine appointment for many division 3 or 4 teams that are trying to climb the ladder a bit but IMO he has no business being involved with a top team like Mayo.

We got knocked out of the championship by division 3 and 4 teams. Laps of the pitch would be better than what we have had. I suspect that there is more to Micko than just running laps. That s just an means to an end. We had nothing this year.I couldn't have imagined supporting Micko as a manager for Mayo but the alternatives are far, ar worse.

No problem with a manager not in situ. A proper football man can pick out a player at the far end of a ten acre field. Better a man without any preconceptions. 

[Zulu]

A proper football man can pick out a player at the far end of a ten acre field.

I wouldn't agree with that Moysider. Recognizing a guy is a decent footballer is one thing but you have to look at lads a good few times and ion different situations to be sure of their capabilities. It is one thing knowing a guy can play IC but it is another thing knowing where he might be able to play and how effective he will be against the likes of Kerry.

I agree, the names mentioned don't inspire but I think Micko would be a mistake. I have no direct knowledge of the guy but he doesn't strike me as a man that will out-think the better managers and I'm not sure he could coach the younger players either.

He wouldn't be the direction I would go in but as you say the alternatives aren't great. If he got it he would probably bring back a bit excitement but I just couldn't see it working out and I don't think the players would like his style of training either.

[ballinaman]

I'd be of the same thinking as Zulu.

Yes, sure it would bring back excitement and interest in the county team which has been seriously diminished in the last 4 years but i can't help but see a Micko appointment as merely papering over the cracks for a year or two.

[Beard]

Mick O'Dwyer might have been an ideal appointment for Mayo 10 years ago but not now. His methods are stone age.

[JMohan]

I don't have any feelings either way towards Micko (or Mayo for that matter).

Look at the list of candidates that you have ... not one of them is any better than Micko.

One of the biggest problems with May football is they actually think they are at a greater level than they are. Mayo have a lot of work to do and need one person to focus the mind. Some Mayo person said they are as good as anyone on there day - absolute rubbish. Look at who have beaten you over the past few years - Div 3 and 4 teams!

People think 20 laps is stone age - sure from a physical point of view, but I promise you after a winter of Micko's training and a winter of Micko's psychology you'd be left with a group of very motivated, toughened winners.
Look beyond the naivety of '20 laps'.
For every lap the man is talking to you, brain washing you, for weeks you suffer together building a toughness, never die attitude and steel that far too many Mayo teams haven't had.

There is a huge myth too about tactical cuteness. Look at Gaelic games today - how many geniuses are there? Micky Harte? Jack O'Connor? then who? Grimley ... it's a myth. Harte is good but there is a very large body of opinion that argues Harte is blessed with players who on the field adapt to what is happening. In other words, don't over estimate tactical nous.

Mayo won't go with Micko anyway. They obviously think he's below them or not good enough. But mark my words, 12 months with Micko would mean losing a few men, produce a tougher bunch of players, with one single focus and a far mentally tougher team. 
Again, I could care less about either - but if I were a Mayo man after suffering some poor performances over the past 5 years I think I'd take that over the past few.

[muppet]

I don't have any feelings either way towards Micko (or Mayo for that matter).

Look at the list of candidates that you have ... not one of them is any better than Micko.

One of the biggest problems with May football is they actually think they are at a greater level than they are. Mayo have a lot of work to do and need one person to focus the mind. Some Mayo person said they are as good as anyone on there day - absolute rubbish. Look at who have beaten you over the past few years - Div 3 and 4 teams!

People think 20 laps is stone age - sure from a physical point of view, but I promise you after a winter of Micko's training and a winter of Micko's psychology you'd be left with a group of very motivated, toughened winners.
Look beyond the naivety of '20 laps'.
For every lap the man is talking to you, brain washing you, for weeks you suffer together building a toughness, never die attitude and steel that far too many Mayo teams haven't had.

There is a huge myth too about tactical cuteness. Look at Gaelic games today - how many geniuses are there? Micky Harte? Jack O'Connor? then who? Grimley ... it's a myth. Harte is good but there is a very large body of opinion that argues Harte is blessed with players who on the field adapt to what is happening. In other words, don't over estimate tactical nous.

Mayo won't go with Micko anyway. They obviously think he's below them or not good enough. But mark my words, 12 months with Micko would mean losing a few men, produce a tougher bunch of players, with one single focus and a far mentally tougher team. 
Again, I could care less about either - but if I were a Mayo man after suffering some poor performances over the past 5 years I think I'd take that over the past few.

I said it. If it's ok by you we might choose our own manager.

Galway are division 1 and we beat them in last year's Championship but of course you don't rate anything in Connacht. Mayo beat most top teams every year in the league which is Division 1. Yea I know it's only the league but you're the one calling them division 3 & 4 teams.

BTW what Division were Down in this year?

O'Dwyer is a dinosaur and you can keep him and spare us the patronising cliched lecture about toughness and 'never say die'.

[Beard]

There is a huge myth too about tactical cuteness. Look at Gaelic games today - how many geniuses are there? Micky Harte? Jack O'Connor? then who? Grimley ... it's a myth. Harte is good but there is a very large body of opinion that argues Harte is blessed with players who on the field adapt to what is happening. In other words, don't over estimate tactical nous.

Waffle......and plain wrong on so many levels it's ridiculous.

Just one of what could be 2 million examples to disprove that statement would be Fergal O'Donnell getting his tactics spot on in the Connacht Final, which was the winning of the game.

[moysider]

There is a huge myth too about tactical cuteness. Look at Gaelic games today - how many geniuses are there? Micky Harte? Jack O'Connor? then who? Grimley ... it's a myth. Harte is good but there is a very large body of opinion that argues Harte is blessed with players who on the field adapt to what is happening. In other words, don't over estimate tactical nous.

Waffle......and plain wrong on so many levels it's ridiculous.

Just one of what could be 2 million examples to disprove that statement would be Fergal O'Donnell getting his tactics spot on in the Connacht Final, which was the winning of the game.

I think that s a bit severe Beard. Ok, Ros got tactics right for the game. But what about Kevin Walsh? He was touted as a master tactician after Mayo but didn't look too hot against Ros. Sometimes managers pull strokes and they work but their success is often down to the cop of coach and players on the other side. Mayo had no cop or fight this year and made Walsh look good. How good he is remains to be seen. I think he ran out of players v Ros. The true worth of Fergal O Donnell remains to be seen as well.

[Zulu]

I don't think there are tactical geniuses out there that always get it right, if you have the better players you will win more often than not. But there is still a degree of tactical awareness required, look at Kildare for example who looked a very well organised and well drilled team. In contrast i would say that Counihan isn't using his players as well as he should in Cork.

IMO Micko's biggest asset is his personality and while I think his enthusiasm and status can still benefit lower level teams trying to get from division 4 to 2 and would regard a championship win or two as success. I don't think he can bring a team like Mayo, who are a team that would be ranked somewhere from 4th to 12th in the country, to an AI win. Which is the only thing that a manger would be rated on.