James Horan Appointed Mayo Manager 2011

[An Gaeilgoir]

I like the comment about the local radio's open forum and how not all the comments were for the good of Mayo football. They have a f**king cheek, people care about Mayo football, pay the "expenses" for these clowns and their opinion isn't  worth a shit. What they mean is the comments don't suit our board. Well f**k them and the horses they rode in on. It's time for each and every one of them to hit the road for the good of Mayo football. End of Rant.

[diehard]

I welcome a review of football in Mayo and I hope it brings about some good. Now what is important is who carries out the review, how it is done and how it is acted upon. 
I hope the County Board have the humility and honesty to engage a reputable team of independant people to do this very important work. They themselves can have no role in this except to set it in motion and act on the findings and recommendations. 
If the Board have had the foresight and courage to subject themselves to this review then they are to be highly commended.  On the other hand........................have they actually thought about this angle?

[ross4life]

Well the new manager is gonna get off to winning start in the Connacht Championship next year as you play London

[Farrandeelin]

Well the new manager is gonna get off to winning start in the Connacht Championship next year as you play London

Well if he doesn't!

PS, Gaeilgoir, is it tomorrow morning's poll you're on about? I personally think it is wrong as all kinds of names will be bandied about by some people who go to matches once or twice a year. That's my own view on the thing.

[moysider]

Ha, Ha. Prenty on local radio here bemoaning the lack of interest in the minor match. What de f**k do they expect. I would have gone to all these minor matches but last weeks game coincided with the senior match in Longford. This game has been moved to 3 o clock on Saturday which clashes with something I enter in months ago on that date.

While this review is to be welcomed I ll wait and see what will come under the microscope. Already I fear the scrutiny may focus on easy targets. Even before this new initiative was proposed a few coaches I spoke to were raging that likes of McStay seemed to be laying the blame on development squads and underage teams to account for the collapse of the the O Mahoney senior team. Maybe that is a ploy to take the heat off the big man - something he has been working overtime to do himself since he quit with soft interviews on Midwest and Newstalk.
If this review is to have any credibility it needs to focus on the substantive issue, ie, What the f**k happened the last few years and how was it allowed to happen? Will the fact that Johnno had to reschedule training between Sligo and Longford because ot the Battle for Enda be examined?  Will the McDonald mess be called for what it was? Or will the axe fall on the small fry that actually produce good raw material year in year out.

[Zulu]

Or will the axe fall on the small fry that actually produce good raw material year in year out.

I don't think you do Moysider. Although I agree that everything must be scrutinised but I would also question why Mayo are no longer producing big strong quality footballers or really good scoring forwards. The very best players are born more than made but you can develop better players who are more flexible and play to a system. Are young players being played in different positions, being taught how to play different systems and are their weaknesses being tackled? Everything should be on the table and whatever faults JOM made focusing on things you can't change shouldn't be the focus of this review.

[stephenite]

Mayo haven't won an All Ireland since 1951 - everything should be on the table with a view to fixing that. Whether or not certain players played under JOM is small beer in comparison to what needs to be fixed, and whatever any gripes people have with JOM is small beer also.

I don't agree that what happened over the last few years is the substantive issue-there are more serious underlying issues relating to our culture, our club scene, coaching, administrative structures etc. that all need to be taken into account

The last thing Mayo football needs is some petty blame game, everyone from the County board down to over-expectant supporters need to take some share of the blame if we are to move on in and fix what needs to be fixed.

[TheMadMicky100]

Maybe Mick O dwyer Is the option???


With his blessings,


MM100

[moysider]

Or will the axe fall on the small fry that actually produce good raw material year in year out.

I don't think you do Moysider. Although I agree that everything must be scrutinised but I would also question why Mayo are no longer producing big strong quality footballers or really good scoring forwards. The very best players are born more than made but you can develop better players who are more flexible and play to a system. Are young players being played in different positions, being taught how to play different systems and are their weaknesses being tackled? Everything should be on the table and whatever faults JOM made focusing on things you can't change shouldn't be the focus of this review.

I knew this would get a reaction. As regards the highlighted bit, well we had some big strong lads in the past. Maher, TJ, Colm Mac etc but it was hardly coaching that produced them - there were no structures at all then. As regards scoring forwards... well y'know the story there yourself. However some very good players do still come through. It s haphazard I know but I suspect every county is at the mercy of the gene pool and chance. We ve had more raw material than most but we ve handled it poorly at senior level. And in fairness not alone in the Johnno era.
My problem with the last few years is that players have gone backward in their adult years. Trevor, Parsons etc. All a player has at 17/18/19 is potential. We produce enough of those. They go nowhere after that. Kirby and O Connor are as good as there is anywhere now at their age I would suspect. Will they in 3 years time is the question?

As regards the italics/underlined bit. I m not a county board coach, nor have I anything to do with development squads in the county. But I have sympathy for those that are/have. The scrutiny now seems to be falling on them. IMO they produced players that were among the best year in year out at minor and at times U21. If anything it was the subsequent mismanagement that was the problem. Does nobody remember the carnage between the Kean and Dempsey managements at minor level!?

[moysider]

Mayo haven't won an All Ireland since 1951 - everything should be on the table with a view to fixing that. Whether or not certain players played under JOM is small beer in comparison to what needs to be fixed, and whatever any gripes people have with JOM is small beer also.

I don't agree that what happened over the last few years is the substantive issue-there are more serious underlying issues relating to our culture, our club scene, coaching, administrative structures etc. that all need to be taken into account

The last thing Mayo football needs is some petty blame game, everyone from the County board down to over-expectant supporters need to take some share of the blame if we are to move on in and fix what needs to be fixed.

I don't think the concerns that some people had with the Johnno administration should be brushed aside as small beer and gripes. In fairness some of us could have come on here crowing ' told ye so', the last week, but we didn't. And some of us so have being crying stop for a few years now. The Johnno backers are now few on the ground and those that are seem anxious to move on and turn the microscope elsewhere. That s understandable. Problem is we ve seen this all before. 'No point looking back, time to move on'. Only by confronting and then dealing with the failings of the past can we move on. I for one want answers. I believe Johnno should attend a review of a committee of the board to explain the more bizzare aspects of his tenure. Resignation should not get him off the hook. Soft radio interviews with a few spiky replies to anything searching is not good enough.
Yeah the club scene is not great now but is anything being done differently than when it was great a few years ago. I have kids that are being coached underage and I m very grateful to the guys that give it so much effort, and texting 30 odd parents a few times a week and organising sessions, transport etc is a huge commitment. They re doing a great job imo. Do we really want to change our culture much? By admin. structures do you mean the board? Yeah can do better. However it is the performance of the senior team that should be the focus of this review.

[stephenite]

Mayo haven't won an All Ireland since 1951 - everything should be on the table with a view to fixing that. Whether or not certain players played under JOM is small beer in comparison to what needs to be fixed, and whatever any gripes people have with JOM is small beer also.

I don't agree that what happened over the last few years is the substantive issue-there are more serious underlying issues relating to our culture, our club scene, coaching, administrative structures etc. that all need to be taken into account

The last thing Mayo football needs is some petty blame game, everyone from the County board down to over-expectant supporters need to take some share of the blame if we are to move on in and fix what needs to be fixed.

I don't think the concerns that some people had with the Johnno administration should be brushed aside as small beer and gripes. In fairness some of us could have come on here crowing ' told ye so', the last week, but we didn't. And some of us so have being crying stop for a few years now. The Johnno backers are now few on the ground and those that are seem anxious to move on and turn the microscope elsewhere. That s understandable. Problem is we ve seen this all before. 'No point looking back, time to move on'. Only by confronting and then dealing with the failings of the past can we move on. I for one want answers. I believe Johnno should attend a review of a committee of the board to explain the more bizzare aspects of his tenure. Resignation should not get him off the hook. Soft radio interviews with a few spiky replies to anything searching is not good enough.
Yeah the club scene is not great now but is anything being done differently than when it was great a few years ago. I have kids that are being coached underage and I m very grateful to the guys that give it so much effort, and texting 30 odd parents a few times a week and organising sessions, transport etc is a huge commitment. They re doing a great job imo. Do we really want to change our culture much? By admin. structures do you mean the board? Yeah can do better. However it is the performance of the senior team that should be the focus of this review.

You also have to be realistic - and Johnno ain't going to attend and say I was wrong about Mac, and I was wrong to try and be a politician at the same time as trying to get re-elected. To all appearances he is an amateur volunteer so he can't be forced to attend a meeting.

I'm not trying to brush aside your concerns, but I can't for the life of me understand why people think they deserve to hear explanations about why certain players weren't picked? What are really trying to achieve here? You're right, it has been going on for years, but I'm not sure what you're hoping to achieve by having more spin and double speak being given to a committee about why Ciaran Mac didn't feature - just a waste of everyones time. You're also right in that easy platitudes shouldn't be dished out about movning forward - there needs to be a close examination of what has gone wrong at every level of the game and what can be done to make improvments.

This senior team should not be the focus - that's just typical 'small picture' rubbish, you're original post wants to focus on the last few years, with all the greatest respect (and you were right all along about JOM and his failings) but I cannot agree with that either, I think it would be the greatest mistake that could be made with a review of this sort. The last few years are the result of a general malaise within the county.

Moysider - have you talked to the club delegate about having your concers addressed at this review?

[rosnarun]

Lets forget about JOM , he was a blight on mayo football the last few years. and we should metaphorically shake the dust off your feet and leave that town . And we have a right to be angry at the county board for 1st appointing him and secondly leaving him there in fact i think last year was the only year he shouldn't have been sacked . even this year after the sligo game it was obvious he had lost the dressing room and  was clueless as what to do.
but lets not throw the baby out with the bath water m Mayo's structures compare very well with all other counties . we continusly produce competitive under age teams and our clubs routinely do well in the club championships and up untill JOM our problems was an inability to finish out winning an All ireland final nor losing to f**king longford and sligo. untill firther evidence is seen we have to take this as a JOM Fueled abberation. there is huge talent on the may senior team , which is being added to each year S o SE and Alan freeman this year for example.
Lets keep doing the right thing support our players and get the right man appointed for the right reasons not some big name gimmick manager like paudi or micko who will take the pressure off the county board.

[moysider]

Mayo haven't won an All Ireland since 1951 - everything should be on the table with a view to fixing that. Whether or not certain players played under JOM is small beer in comparison to what needs to be fixed, and whatever any gripes people have with JOM is small beer also.

I don't agree that what happened over the last few years is the substantive issue-there are more serious underlying issues relating to our culture, our club scene, coaching, administrative structures etc. that all need to be taken into account

The last thing Mayo football needs is some petty blame game, everyone from the County board down to over-expectant supporters need to take some share of the blame if we are to move on in and fix what needs to be fixed.

I don't think the concerns that some people had with the Johnno administration should be brushed aside as small beer and gripes. In fairness some of us could have come on here crowing ' told ye so', the last week, but we didn't. And some of us so have being crying stop for a few years now. The Johnno backers are now few on the ground and those that are seem anxious to move on and turn the microscope elsewhere. That s understandable. Problem is we ve seen this all before. 'No point looking back, time to move on'. Only by confronting and then dealing with the failings of the past can we move on. I for one want answers. I believe Johnno should attend a review of a committee of the board to explain the more bizzare aspects of his tenure. Resignation should not get him off the hook. Soft radio interviews with a few spiky replies to anything searching is not good enough.
Yeah the club scene is not great now but is anything being done differently than when it was great a few years ago. I have kids that are being coached underage and I m very grateful to the guys that give it so much effort, and texting 30 odd parents a few times a week and organising sessions, transport etc is a huge commitment. They re doing a great job imo. Do we really want to change our culture much? By admin. structures do you mean the board? Yeah can do better. However it is the performance of the senior team that should be the focus of this review.

You also have to be realistic - and Johnno ain't going to attend and say I was wrong about Mac, and I was wrong to try and be a politician at the same time as trying to get re-elected. To all appearances he is an amateur volunteer so he can't be forced to attend a meeting.

I'm not trying to brush aside your concerns, but I can't for the life of me understand why people think they deserve to hear explanations about why certain players weren't picked? What are really trying to achieve here? You're right, it has been going on for years, but I'm not sure what you're hoping to achieve by having more spin and double speak being given to a committee about why Ciaran Mac didn't feature - just a waste of everyones time. You're also right in that easy platitudes shouldn't be dished out about movning forward - there needs to be a close examination of what has gone wrong at every level of the game and what can be done to make improvments.

This senior team should not be the focus - that's just typical 'small picture' rubbish, you're original post wants to focus on the last few years, with all the greatest respect (and you were right all along about JOM and his failings) but I cannot agree with that either, I think it would be the greatest mistake that could be made with a review of this sort. The last few years are the result of a general malaise within the county.
Moysider - have you talked to the club delegate about having your concers addressed at this review?

So this review is going to put the real amateur volunteer under the microscope. Who would want to be a coach of an underage team anymore? Hell, even ambitious parents might think twice. And we all know that ambitious parents make up the majority of underage coaches. I m sure the review will nail that as a failure in the system. We all await their recommendation.

it s not just about players picked. It was about the lack of science in the background team. He was made aware of this. He didn't change anything in 4 years. Nobody knew anything. That Jack O Connor bit showed what real management is about. Training is a science now and he has made sure he has guys that knows their stuff. Jack doesn't need to know the science but you can be sure Pat Flanagan does and Jack knows he does too. Thing was a lot of the time Johnno s trainer was cooking somebody else s recipe. Not so bad but in this day and age the recipe was short an ingredient or two.

The malaise within the county is about the senior team. It doesn't mean football has stopped. Club players see it as a nusiance anyway and are glad rid of it as it upsets their year. Bigger clubs are struggling to cope with underage numbers. The problem there is keeping the slower developing kids involved. Believe me the biggest malaise is the county senior team. The worst thing I could say about Johnno and his team was they lost the kids. You could nt bribe kids to go to games the last few years. Whoever came up with the idea that over-expectant supporters and hype was the problem in Mayo got it all very wrong.  But the kids still are showing up for the training and games with their clubs. The Mayo team is of no relevance to them apart from being a vague embarrassement somehow.

Yeah, my club delegate knows about my concerns, even though this review was only signposted today. Not the only club delegate either and others too but I ve said enough.

[Foreverhopeful]

There are 2 major flaws in Mayo football
1.
At all underage teams for mayo the strongest or the quickest or the fittest or the tallest lads are being picked. Not the player with the most potential for the future. They pick these players because of immediate impact in that underage year. Managers often pick on reputation as well as geographical location. The players with most potential are not being spotted and they are lost to Mayo football from a young age. Coaches at underage level for Mayo don't spot the talent that players may possess but needs work. They just pick the easier option and have ready-to-order footballers. These footballers are then on Mayo panels from U-14 up. Lads who may not be the fit or have developed physically are lost to Mayo football. They go off to college, start drinking, put on weight etc. If they had made a Mayo panel and were coached they would have a different mindset and look after themselves better. We only take early bloomers in Mayo. There is very little provision for late bloomers. We need to able to spot the talent better - not just pick the flashy bleached haired corner forward who has pace to burn and does all the flicks. We need to find the lads who do the basics right consistently - who have good positional sense, who can kick pass a ball accurately. They might not be super athletes but you can change easily. This change must come from the county board. They should be outlining this approach to managers and coaches.

2.
The players who do shine at underage level because they are stronger etc. that do go onto the senior panel don't seem to be coached. Some other poster used the example of Mayo and Sligo recently on this issue. Sligo don't have a great pick so they have to coach alot of players to improve them. Mayo has such a good pick that we have footballers who need very little coaching at underage level. However theses players reach a level that they never push on from. Tom parsons is an example. He doesn't seem to have improved at all. Is he being coached. Was coaching him neglected at underage level because his natural athleticism made him stand out already?

Gooch cooper coached donaghy on how to be a full-forward. Amazing! Does that stuff happen in Mayo. David heaney should have been teaching lads on the panel stuff, James Nallen aswell. Were they used?

I believe we need a straight talker like David Brady involved in a management team. That would sort out the hunger and desire and toughness aspect that we lack. That is our biggest weakness.
James Horan, a methodical thinker is needed. Good knowledge on tactics and how to negate opponents tactics. A natural player so knows the game.
James Nallen - up to date with current tactics being used in todays game. JOM, Lyons and Gallagher weren't. Well respected defender. Doesnt say a lot but when he talks people listen.
These 3 as selectors with a manager of Paidi O'Se. We need someone to bring the crowds back into Mayo football. He has fire in the belly. He is passionate and he wouldn't come up here for the craic. He would boost Mayo football undoubtedly. He is loved and hated equally but i admire the way that it annoyed him how Mayo were underachievers and he'd love to manage them. That sparked something in me. I couldnt imagine Paidi leaving out an aidan higgins or a james kilcullen

[stephenite]

Mayo haven't won an All Ireland since 1951 - everything should be on the table with a view to fixing that. Whether or not certain players played under JOM is small beer in comparison to what needs to be fixed, and whatever any gripes people have with JOM is small beer also.

I don't agree that what happened over the last few years is the substantive issue-there are more serious underlying issues relating to our culture, our club scene, coaching, administrative structures etc. that all need to be taken into account

The last thing Mayo football needs is some petty blame game, everyone from the County board down to over-expectant supporters need to take some share of the blame if we are to move on in and fix what needs to be fixed.

I don't think the concerns that some people had with the Johnno administration should be brushed aside as small beer and gripes. In fairness some of us could have come on here crowing ' told ye so', the last week, but we didn't. And some of us so have being crying stop for a few years now. The Johnno backers are now few on the ground and those that are seem anxious to move on and turn the microscope elsewhere. That s understandable. Problem is we ve seen this all before. 'No point looking back, time to move on'. Only by confronting and then dealing with the failings of the past can we move on. I for one want answers. I believe Johnno should attend a review of a committee of the board to explain the more bizzare aspects of his tenure. Resignation should not get him off the hook. Soft radio interviews with a few spiky replies to anything searching is not good enough.
Yeah the club scene is not great now but is anything being done differently than when it was great a few years ago. I have kids that are being coached underage and I m very grateful to the guys that give it so much effort, and texting 30 odd parents a few times a week and organising sessions, transport etc is a huge commitment. They re doing a great job imo. Do we really want to change our culture much? By admin. structures do you mean the board? Yeah can do better. However it is the performance of the senior team that should be the focus of this review.

You also have to be realistic - and Johnno ain't going to attend and say I was wrong about Mac, and I was wrong to try and be a politician at the same time as trying to get re-elected. To all appearances he is an amateur volunteer so he can't be forced to attend a meeting.

I'm not trying to brush aside your concerns, but I can't for the life of me understand why people think they deserve to hear explanations about why certain players weren't picked? What are really trying to achieve here? You're right, it has been going on for years, but I'm not sure what you're hoping to achieve by having more spin and double speak being given to a committee about why Ciaran Mac didn't feature - just a waste of everyones time. You're also right in that easy platitudes shouldn't be dished out about movning forward - there needs to be a close examination of what has gone wrong at every level of the game and what can be done to make improvments.

This senior team should not be the focus - that's just typical 'small picture' rubbish, you're original post wants to focus on the last few years, with all the greatest respect (and you were right all along about JOM and his failings) but I cannot agree with that either, I think it would be the greatest mistake that could be made with a review of this sort. The last few years are the result of a general malaise within the county.
Moysider - have you talked to the club delegate about having your concers addressed at this review?

So this review is going to put the real amateur volunteer under the microscope. Who would want to be a coach of an underage team anymore? Hell, even ambitious parents might think twice. And we all know that ambitious parents make up the majority of underage coaches. I m sure the review will nail that as a failure in the system. We all await their recommendation.

it s not just about players picked. It was about the lack of science in the background team. He was made aware of this. He didn't change anything in 4 years. Nobody knew anything. That Jack O Connor bit showed what real management is about. Training is a science now and he has made sure he has guys that knows their stuff. Jack doesn't need to know the science but you can be sure Pat Flanagan does and Jack knows he does  too.

The malaise within the county is about the senior team. It doesn't mean football has stopped. Club players see it as a nusiance anyway and are glad rid of it as it upsets their year. Bigger clubs are struggling to cope with underage numbers. The problem there is keeping the slower developing kids involved. Believe me the biggest malaise is the county senior team. The worst thing I could say about Johnno and his team was they lost the kids. You could nt bribe kids to go to games the last few years. Whoever came up with the idea that over-expectant supporters and hype was the problem in Mayo got it all very wrong.  But the kids still are showing up for the training and games with their clubs. The Mayo team is of no relevance to them apart from being a vague embarrassement somehow.

Yeah, my club delegate knows about my concerns, even though this review was only signposted today. Not the only club delegate either and others too but I ve said enough.

No, the review I'd envisage is not putting the real amatuer volunteer under a microscope - I can't see anything I've written suggesting that we put amatuer volunteers under the micriscope, but is there anything wrong with making sure the basic fundamentals of the game are being taught at grassroots. There is a marked difference between putting the amateur volunteers under the microscope and giving them some guidance and assistance.

It's the great work that's been done with the underage representative underage teams that should be looked at as well - ditto the development squads - there is great work being done here but it does not mean that it can't be improved upon. The elite should be coaching the elite - and they're all still amateur.

I've no problem with science, but Kerry were winning All Irelands before Jack O'Connor and Pat Flannagan came along, of course it's something that can be looked at but it's so far down the scale of what is actually important in this review, that it doesn't warrant much time. How many scientists do Mickey Harte or Brian Cody have, I'm not trying to denigrate your point but do all successful teams employ this and is it why they're successful?

The culture of the club and the local championship can be viewed in 2 ways - our greatest strength or our biggest weakness. Club players don't give a fiddlers about their county team in most counties, why would they?

We're down to won't someone think of the children now, are we? The children will fall into line behind any semi successful team - sure they're a hugely important part of the future, but again, a proper review (devoid of that kind knee jerk emotional shit) will do more to make them fall back into line again