James Horan Appointed Mayo Manager 2011

[spectator]

Thanks for that info moysider. Hadn't heard some of that analysis before.

Iolar, of course the editor of the Western is entitled to his opinion. I was sort of playing devil's advocate with that comment & will argue it out with him any day that Ros were much the better team and deserving winners  in '91

There's been some amount of skullduggery going on behind the scenes in Mayo from what ye're saying here.

[moysider]

Thanks for that info moysider. Hadn't heard some of that analysis before.

Iolar, of course the editor of the Western is entitled to his opinion. I was sort of playing devil's advocate with that comment & will argue it out with him any day that Ros were much the better team and deserving winners  in '91

There's been some amount of skullduggery going on behind the scenes in Mayo from what ye're saying here.

Ye were good but already we were in some bad twist. Mayo then had a better team than the ones that Maughan ( esp 06) and M&M had that lost AIs. Big men and classy players all over the field. Blew it. And it still goes on.

[rosnarun]

jeez lads some awful shit being spoken here
the only era that should end here is johnnos.
there is ample evidence from the league this year and the championship last year that the players are plenty good enough with proper direction.
any talk of becoming another Roscommon is self defeatist nonsense . besides i expect the Rossie to rise any time soon due  to continous quality at under age level someting mayo have had for the last 15 years.
never confuse class with form . MAyo form is poor at the moment but but class wil show itself despite JOM's best efforts


I think James horan should be the new manager . My Firnds on the county board have devised an elaborate scheme involving mick o dwyer John maughan and would you believe Tommy lyons ... Just to make people grateful to get an untried untested newby!!!!!   

[stephenite]

I think it is a bit cheap to take pot shots at the manager without looking at the whole picture.  Since I can remember Mayo football teams have always been lacking in bottle when things were put up to them.  They may talk that they have it but in the last 20 years I have seen so many different Mayo team capitulate at different times.  They are there or thereabouts until a certain point and then they seem to disappear, nearly like they are afraid to win because if they won then they would have nothing to complain about!  I recall an incident I was involved in where there was a bit of "trash talking" going on betwene myself, a team mate and a prominent Mayo footballer at the time.  This man physically shrank as we kept reminding him how Mayo teams always lose big games, it was a strange sight but the same man didin't go for the next few balls.  This seems like an ingrained inferiority complex that has been fed by the media and players have become used to hearing "Will Mayo ever make the breakthrough?"  and they cannot get away from it.  I cannot see an answer for this apart from banning media in Mayo for 10 years, and that may be a flippant comment but the reality is that I believe that deep down there is a sense of failure and a willingness to find a scapegoat before a ball has been kicked.

I've a fair idea who you're on about - but 1 player in a club game cannot equate to the psyche of a whole county - and if I'm right about who you're referring to, well that's a lazy enough analysis BC, no offense to you.

Like ICC says, this whole notion of Mayo lacking bottle doesn't stack up - we were unlucky in 1996, but really that's about it. In 1989, 1997, 2004 & 2006 we were just beaten by better teams. In fact I still think we were relatively lucky to get to the finals in 2004 and 2006 - people talk about the famous victory over the Dubs in 2006 but I'm still firmly of the belief that Pillar won us that game, any other county would have closed that game off. It's not lack of bottle or belief-and it's a fairly lazy and easy thing to throw out every now and then.

Nice to see the heroes from Ros coming out to give us a good kick while we're down, any wonder Andy Moran decided to play for Mayo

[ballinaman]

jeez lads some awful shit being spoken here
the only era that should end here is johnnos.
there is ample evidence from the league this year and the championship las year that the players are plenty good enough with proper direction.
any talk of becoming another Roscommon is self defeatist nonsense . besides i expect the Rossie to rise any time soon due  to continous quality at under age level someting mayo have had for the last 15 years.
never confuse class with form . MAyo form is poor at the moment but but class wil show itself despite JOM's best efforts

League form and what division you are in doesn't matter a flying f**k, that has been clearly shown. Championship last year??Is that supposed to be a joke? We beat a Rossie team who didn't know a sheep's arse from a football and did everything we could to collapse against Galway, and i won't even start on about the Meath shambles.

Article by Ray Silke.....

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/blog/post/2010/06/07/Can-John-OMahony-continue-to-fulfill-this-dual-mandate.aspx


IN June 1998, my fiancé was bridesmaid at a wedding in the Station House in Clifden on a Friday. There was plenty of entertainment and a barbeque organised for the Saturday night and everyone was due to stay around.

In an effort to keep peace in the house I wanted to pass up Galway training in Ballinasloe on the Saturday evening. I phoned John O'Mahony Saturday morning;

"John, Ray Silke here. How are things? I have to stay in Clifden on Saturday night and cannot make training."

"Why?" was his curt reply.

"My car is in the garage and I have no way of getting to Ballinasloe and back to Clifden and I have to be back tonight."

There was a moments silence and then he said;

"Sound. Sure if that's how it is Ray. I'll drive to Clifden. Bring you to Ballinasloe. And then bring you back to Clifden after training. We need you to be at training."

Check mate.
John was a secondary teacher in St. Nathy's college in Ballaghdereen back then, and come the summer he focused totally and exclusively on maximising the potential of the panel at his disposal. And he did that with spectacular success.

However, fast forward twelve years and John is no longer a secondary teacher settling into eleven weeks holidays, free to fine tune a county's preparations for championship.

Now as a TD for Mayo he has to spend a large part of his week on Dáil business in Dublin. Presumably, when he is home, there must be a phenomenal amount of constituency work to be done, press releases to be drafted, funerals to go to, etc, etc,  before even beginning to focus on foot-balling matters.

Serving two masters is never easy and having a full time role as a TD does not sit easily with the demands of being a county manager with a county that has high aspirations on an annual basis. Inter-county management is getting more time consuming and professional by the year, not less.

O'Mahony is in his fourth year as Mayo manager with the highlight of that tenure, a narrow victory over Galway in last year's Connacht final courtesy of a magnificent late point from Peadar Gardiner.

After Saturday's loss to Sligo there will be even more questioning of any individual's ability to satisfy two very diverse job descriptions.

Most inter-county managers will easily acknowledge that they have to invest a minimum of 25/30 hours a week to do the job right  and the last sitting TD I spoke to in Galway told me his day job took up about 80 hours a week. He suggested that fifteen hour days including travel during the week would not be unusual.

Hence Mayo's dilemma;

Their manager has to try and combine two massive roles.  Is that possible?
Based on the attitude and body language of many of the players who took the field in Markievicz Park last Saturday evening they would appear not to have bought into the current status quo.
The talk among Mayo supporters on the terraces at half time was that Johnno should at a minimum have changed his backroom team last year after their limp exit at the hands of Meath. He did not do so.
John now finds himself in a position whereby the very role in the county that may have helped to get him elected, that of county manager, seems to be imploding.

The Mayo players appeared to lack the collective will or desire, or game plan to play themselves into a position to challenge the home team.

Whose fault it that? A combination of those inside the white lines and those outside, but the buck stops with the man in the Bainisteoir bib and O'Mahony will know that.

Tony Dempsey combined being Wexford manager and a T.D. a few years ago and he subsequently pointed out that the dual mandate was not possible to do. One job had to suffer.

Based on Mayo's experience over the past few years, Dempsey seems to have spoken the truth.

And if that is so, where do Mayo and O'Mahony go?

An inter-county career is a very short window and there are significant rumblings that some players are not happy with things as they stand.

Cork have proven in the past that genuine player dissatisfaction can come to the fore quickly and effectively. Unless there is a few changes in Mayo then the possibility of some action is a possibility.

That is assuming of course, that there are men on the panel brave enough to voice their concerns and based on what they produced last Saturday evening that is debatable too.

One thing is certain, the current arrangement  is not working. The league final against Cork and last Saturday evening's lethargic and listless performance confirmed as much. With the most earnest effort and will in the world, no-one can be all things to all men.

[mannix]

At last it has happened, I have agreed with ray silke about something. How can we really expect a man working as a politician to direct and focus 30 plus footballers into a team capable of doing something great?
And some of the decisions on players dropped, and great players left out when older than them are still cutting mustard around the country.
A good pasting by someone in the qualifiers is needed, if we get a few handy wins and lose to a middling team by a point then the management will survive even though they know they should walk away.
I think if half of whats being said is true the players will not try in games and the pasting will come quickly.

[Zapatista]

At last it has happened, I have agreed with ray silke about something. How can we really expect a man working as a politician to direct and focus 30 plus footballers into a team capable of doing something great?
And some of the decisions on players dropped, and great players left out when older than them are still cutting mustard around the country.
A good pasting by someone in the qualifiers is needed, if we get a few handy wins and lose to a middling team by a point then the management will survive even though they know they should walk away.
I think if half of whats being said is true the players will not try in games and the pasting will come quickly.

He has feck all else to do.

[brokencrossbar1]

I think it is a bit cheap to take pot shots at the manager without looking at the whole picture.  Since I can remember Mayo football teams have always been lacking in bottle when things were put up to them.  They may talk that they have it but in the last 20 years I have seen so many different Mayo team capitulate at different times.  They are there or thereabouts until a certain point and then they seem to disappear, nearly like they are afraid to win because if they won then they would have nothing to complain about!  I recall an incident I was involved in where there was a bit of "trash talking" going on betwene myself, a team mate and a prominent Mayo footballer at the time.  This man physically shrank as we kept reminding him how Mayo teams always lose big games, it was a strange sight but the same man didin't go for the next few balls.  This seems like an ingrained inferiority complex that has been fed by the media and players have become used to hearing "Will Mayo ever make the breakthrough?"  and they cannot get away from it.  I cannot see an answer for this apart from banning media in Mayo for 10 years, and that may be a flippant comment but the reality is that I believe that deep down there is a sense of failure and a willingness to find a scapegoat before a ball has been kicked.

I've a fair idea who you're on about - but 1 player in a club game cannot equate to the psyche of a whole county - and if I'm right about who you're referring to, well that's a lazy enough analysis BC, no offense to you.

Like ICC says, this whole notion of Mayo lacking bottle doesn't stack up - we were unlucky in 1996, but really that's about it. In 1989, 1997, 2004 & 2006 we were just beaten by better teams. In fact I still think we were relatively lucky to get to the finals in 2004 and 2006 - people talk about the famous victory over the Dubs in 2006 but I'm still firmly of the belief that Pillar won us that game, any other county would have closed that game off. It's not lack of bottle or belief-and it's a fairly lazy and easy thing to throw out every now and then.

Nice to see the heroes from Ros coming out to give us a good kick while we're down, any wonder Andy Moran decided to play for Mayo

Stephenite, you do know who I am talking about but to me he epitomises why it doesn't happen.  Talent to burn, like many footballers in Mayo but I believe there is an underlying belief that they simply cannot do it.  I don't think it is a lack of "bottle" simply a confidence thing and the managers that have been in place have not been able to do anything about it and the players themselves seem to look at each other when push comes to shove.  Alwasy looking for the Messiah, be it Ciaran Mac or the manager and when one doesn't come riding over the horizon, what then???

As for saying you were unlucky in one and lucky to get to 2 AI Finals I can't agree.  In 1996 there were multiple chances to win the games and the poor shooting let you down.  that is not bad luck that is one of 2 things, poor preparation physically(shooting practice) or poor prepartion mentally(confidence).  They got the "bounce of the ball" in some respects but the difference in that Meath team and Mayo was that Meath never believed they could lose and I don't think Mayo ever believed they could win.  As regards being lucky to get to 2 AI finals that is horseshit.  You don't get to a Final on the back of luck.  You may get a lucky break in a game that can influence the result but luck to my mind is an easy escape to cover up cracks that are repeatedly being shown up. 

There seems to be serious administrative problems in respect of the County Board.  John O'Mahony is not a bad manager he is just not the right man at this time.  If I were the Mayo CB I would be breaking down the door to Sean Boylan's Herbal Shop to get him in as it needs someone like him to take it on to the next step.

[Lar Naparka]

League form and what division you are in doesn't matter a flying f**k, that has been clearly shown. Championship last year??Is that supposed to be a joke? We beat a Rossie team who didn't know a sheep's arse from a football and did everything we could to collapse against Galway, and i won't even start on about the Meath shambles.

I think Ray Silke is always worth a read.
Okay; I tend to agree with the general view that he wasn't a good footballer but he had to have the essential leadership qualities needed to captain Galway to All Ireland success.
Foremost amongst them must be the ability to tap into the thinking of those around him- to grasp their psyche, as it were.
Ray Silke just has to know John O'Mahony's inner self better than John himself.
For that reason alone, I tend to pay very close attention to what he writes, and has written in the past, about Johnno, the manager of Mayo.
I have no problem in saying I feel a lot of compassion for the same Johnno; it must have been dog rough for him to walk out and face the media on Saturday evening and try an put some sort of positive spin on what had just happened on the field of play.
It must be hard on Silke to see the man who worked miracles for himself and his Galway colleagues now reduced to talking through his ass on an increasingly regular basis.
If Comical Ali were to re-invent himself as an IC manager and go looking for a job, John O'Mahony should start to worry big-time. Until then, he leads the list of reality dodgers by a dozen lengths or more.
Still, I feel for him as he goes about like a dead man walking. If only wishes were horses, Johnno would ride on to glory but they aren't, so he won't.
But I feel considerably sorrier for the players on his panel. It is gut bursting to see the Mortimers, Dillon, Moran and the rest of our former top class players being reduced to parodies of their former selves.
It is even worse to see the O'Sheas, Parsons and the rest of the long line of promising youngsters failing to develop their potential.
I was sorry that the trip to Portugal was scrapped or postponed. (I'm not getting involved in that spat. Keep 'er lit, boys!)
Kevin McStay says: " ...the training they're getting – in terms of preparation, analysis and critique the management have provided – is top class."
Well, fair play to Johnno for that but it wasn't extra physical conditioning that the boys needed. Quite seriously, I think the call for the trip was a desperate plea for help as the players saw the fruits of their fine league run going to waste. The players and the management team needed a break away form the publicity to try and figure out what was going horribly wrong and threshing out what steps they should take to get out of the tailspin. . I just couldn't see any of them, including Johnno, thinking that they deserved a holiday in the sun.
No, the poor devil can't be held accountable for everything tghat has gone wrong, but as Ray Silke puts it:
"Whose fault it that? A combination of those inside the white lines and those outside, but the buck stops with the man in the Bainisteoir bib and O'Mahony will know that."
The question is, does he?

BTW, ballinaman, I think you got the sentiment right but the metaphor wrong in what you wrote about the Rossies, sheeps' arses and footballs.
I suspect that most of that ungodly shower to the east of us know considerably more about a sheep's arse that they would own up to in public but all of then know sweet damn all about footballs!

[ballinaman]

Spot on Lar again, wasn't the best wording alright! That Ross team that turned up that day was a joke.

[INDIANA]

Interesting thread. My take on it is Mayo are short some top players in key positions on the park. I think the whole bottle thing is a bit of an anachronism these days for any team that loses a game. When Mayo are in trouble in games they lack the 5/6 leaders to dig them out. Players like that are born and not made in my opinion. Kildare and Armagh had precious few leaders as well last weekend.
Mayo is a football mad county and as a result gets over analysed. Might have only played one championship game but if Mayo can find 3/4 more Alan Freemans they'll be right up there again. Rarely have I been as impressed by a player on the championship debut.

[muppet]

In fairness Spectator that post, while well written, is patronising tripe.

A county waits 38 years to get to an AIF and then enjoys it. So what. I was in the Grand Hotel after that match and the most disappointed man in the building was Johnno. While some were patting him on the back he couldn't hide his pain. There were tears in his eyes all night.

[shaund10]

First off, while I think JO'M is a very good manager, talks of him being some sort of messiah and working miricales with Galway are off the mark. I could have won an All Ireland with the group of players he had around that time. In fact, there is grounds to say that he should have won more with that team, especially thinking back to the poor 99, 02, 03 years.

But that is exactly what Mayo would have needed over the past 4 years to win something, a messiah. None of Mickey Harte, Boylan, O Dywer, or even dear old Paidi would have got Mayo within an asses roar of winning an All Ireland in the past 4 years. You simply haven't had the players.

2006 was a false dawn. Tyrone were decimated with injuries. Kerry knocked out Cork, and Dublin did a complete bottling job against Mayo in the semi's. Mayo were probably the 5th best team in the country that year and they got found out in the final. But even back then you simply had better individuals than you have now. Nallen/ Heaney were younger, McGarrity was pre sickness, Mort looked sharper and you had one truly class player in McDonald.

Fast forward that to last Saturday. Look at the team, and name me one proper class player Mayo had in their ranks? Someone who could change a game like McDonald could? There was nobody. Even so, that team was good enough to win Connacht last year. What has happened since is that Mayo have lost the last of their leaders in Nallen and Heaney. There is nobody left to stand up and take command. Can O'Mahony be blamed for this? Yes to a very small degree. But he cant go out and phyically make players. The players arent there, and no matter what manager was in control the results would have been largely the same. The only player who could make a difference is living the dream in OZ.

[GBXII]

Even though we haven't got the class players we had 4 years ago like McDonald, Brady, Heaney and Nallen, we still should be playing way better than we should at the weekend. I know we were missing some important forwards like Dillon, Kilcoyne, B Moran and Harte but we had enough both on the pitch and on the bench to beat Sligo but we were only competitive up until half way through the second half. You could see the lack of drive and hunger from the players and in my opinion and experience that comes from the management. On top of this the management have not, in my opinion, developed one of the younger players and it could be argued that they have regressed as well. For those reasons O'Mahony and his colleagues should go...

[IolarCoisCuain]

Football people at the time were disappointed and annoyed at a golden opportunity let slip. Johnno got a lot of blame for the loss to be honest and those same people have never really trusted him since.

How was he blamed moysider & what did he not do which caused the defeat? Who has never really trusted him since as a result?

What was more annoying over the following 2 years was how the team was allowed to disintegrate without any success at introducing new players. It took 4 years to recover from Johnno s term the last time.

Not disagreeing with what you've said there, but according to the editor of The Western People Mayo were well set up to be All-Ireland champs in 1991 ...


"John O'Mahony's first period in charge came a cropper in 1991 when Derek Duggan's long range free-kick effectively dumped Mayo out of the championship. I have always believed that had Mayo emerged from Connacht that year they might have been genuine contenders in an All-Ireland semi-final against an aging Meath team exhausted after their epic struggle with Dublin. At any rate,Mayo bowed out and John O'Mahony fell foul of the county board (or was it the other way around?), thus inaugurating a ten-year period that saw five different managers at the helm."

http://www.westernpeople.ie/news/story/?trs=eygbeyidgb


Has the 1991 row ever been gone into in any detail? Wasn't it effectively a power struggle between Johnno & the county board over whether Johnno would be allowed to pick his own selectors, iirc?

Who trusted him? I trusted him. I don't think I was alone. I listened to Radio Johnno, I bought the whole Messiah stuff. Maybe that makes me a fool. I don't know. When I trusted him I thought he was getting the job to take a fine team the extra yard, rather than destroy it and leave nothing in its place. Maybe that makes me a fool. God help me, he's not the only wrong horse I backed.

BTW - I'm sure even the editor of the Western People would never claim to speak for the county, and would be the first man to point out that the views he expresses are purely his own.

It doesn't make you a fool Iolar. Most people bought into it that I can see. Why  did you though ?

God Moysider, there were lots of reasons to believe in him.

Mayo are in a heap now, but in 2006 we had been in two All-Ireland finals in three years. I believed then, and still believe now, that management was bad in both those All-Irelands. I don't buy into that Mayo-were-lucky-to-be-there-at-all guff. It doesn't stand up to scrutiny for a minute.

Maughan fell out with players, and while I know people are taking up Moran and Morrison now, it struck me at the time that they got more out of Mayo than Mayo got out of them. I think the 2006 team could nearly have managed itself, with or without the star full-forward line – anybody remember that? Debate for another day, maybe.

Anyway. O'Mahony looked like the missing link at the time. His time with Galway, the resolution of the Donnellan situation there, and his very public view on the Brady v Maughan fight suggested that he was above getting into personal disputes with players the way John Maughan had, and the two All-Irelands with Galway suggested that he wouldn't be starstruck on the big day the way Moran and Morrison were.

The man had relative success with Mayo, Leitrim and Galway. It can't all have been a coincidence. The stories I was hearing was that senior players wanted John O'Mahony to bring them the final step.

And they're the reasons I believed in the Second Coming at the time. The past four years have proved me wrong. I would have thought about calling time in 2008, and definitely after the Meath game last year. The Board gave him another two years instead. And here we are.