Author Topic: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.  (Read 288292 times)

ardmhachaabu

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #15 on: January 18, 2010, 09:40:10 PM »
A lot of you boys are in the North and may not be fully aware of what is happening SF in the south. The honeymoon is over, people want some ideas from SF and are tired of constant blathering about the peace process. Adams has become a liability as he is completely out of touch with what  is going on in the South. O Caolain should have been let me SF's main spokesman for the last general election but instead we got Gerry Adams getting obliterated on national tv debates. SF should be making hay in these times as a left wing party but are not positioned to do so and I fear for them in the south big time.
Unless something drastically changes I can see them getting wiped out in the next set of elections in the south
Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something

Nally Stand

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #16 on: January 18, 2010, 10:44:44 PM »
I never said it would harm aspirations for a united ireland but it would b a problem for achieving it without republicans having a political party to mandate. And SF still at local level made gains and only had their growth slowed by a huge FG vote which was in protest at FFs handling of the recession. This trend of main opposition parties making gains was repeated around the world mid recession. And pints SF is activist based dont forget. Every party has activists it cud do without, SF no more than others.
"The island of saints & scholars...and gombeens & fuckin' arselickers" Christy Moore

pintsofguinness

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #17 on: January 18, 2010, 11:03:23 PM »
I never said it would harm aspirations for a united ireland but it would b a problem for achieving it without republicans having a political party to mandate. And SF still at local level made gains and only had their growth slowed by a huge FG vote which was in protest at FFs handling of the recession. This trend of main opposition parties making gains was repeated around the world mid recession. And pints SF is activist based dont forget. Every party has activists it cud do without, SF no more than others.
Oh they do! I dont know any other party who has the w**kers they have.
Which one of you bitches wants to dance?

Hardy

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #18 on: January 18, 2010, 11:25:16 PM »
SF the only republican party? In what way is SF more republican than - well, choose any party you like for comparison? And explain any criterion by which you consider the other parties non-republican. Are they all monarchist?
I studied deeply in the philosophies and religions, but cheerfulness kept breaking through - L.Cohen

Nally Stand

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #19 on: January 18, 2010, 11:41:27 PM »
Irish Republicans are anti partitionist. How about i take as an example FF which has the the gall to call itself "the republican party". Last year one FF td condemned people from the south as being unpatriotic for spending their money in shops north of the border. At a debate last year in UCD argued in a debate in favour of Ireland rejoining the british commonwealth. They are a party which continually refuses to stand candidates in the 6 counties. I could go on.
"The island of saints & scholars...and gombeens & fuckin' arselickers" Christy Moore

Hardy

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #20 on: January 18, 2010, 11:47:06 PM »
Policy on partition is a woefully narrow definition of republicanism. But even under that definition, in what way is SF less partitionist than FF? I see FF in government on this side of the partition and SF in government on the other side (which I applaud, of course). And the difference is?
I studied deeply in the philosophies and religions, but cheerfulness kept breaking through - L.Cohen

Pangurban

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #21 on: January 19, 2010, 12:04:20 AM »
They are both Hibernian nationalist parties who have long touch with their Republican roots, so as you say Hardy, their is little real difference

Nally Stand

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #22 on: January 19, 2010, 12:36:27 AM »
It's the central core of modern Irish Republicanism. And your post makes no sense. The diff is that while FF only run for gov south of the border, SF run for gov on both sides of the border.
"The island of saints & scholars...and gombeens & fuckin' arselickers" Christy Moore

Zapatista

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #23 on: January 19, 2010, 07:34:34 AM »
A lot of you boys are in the North and may not be fully aware of what is happening SF in the south. The honeymoon is over, people want some ideas from SF and are tired of constant blathering about the peace process. Adams has become a liability as he is completely out of touch with what  is going on in the South. O Caolain should have been let me SF's main spokesman for the last general election but instead we got Gerry Adams getting obliterated on national tv debates. SF should be making hay in these times as a left wing party but are not positioned to do so and I fear for them in the south big time.

I don't think you are aware what is happening SF in the South. That's the sort of spin that's coming from the opening post.

They are a small party in the South and have always been. They've been sitting on about 10% for the last 15 years. SF rarely talk about the peace process re southern politics unless it's relevant. Adams was nowhere to be seen in the last election or during the referendum. You are thinking of 07 when he made the balls of that one TV debate (it turns out none of the other three on the panel had a clue about economics either). The country did take a swing to the left from the centre in the last election. They ended up supporting labour who are one step to the left of centre and went no further (it was more of a shimmy than a swing). SF could move futher to the centre and cash in on this swing but then they would become irrelevant.


Declan

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #24 on: January 19, 2010, 07:50:26 AM »

Zapatista

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #25 on: January 19, 2010, 08:47:04 AM »
Interesting opinion piece in todays Times

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2010/0119/1224262632210.html

There is no evidence in that article to back up the opinion. SF hae been stale in the South since 99-04. This isn't 'freefall' or 'crisis' or any of the other doomsday buzz words. It's nothing. It's not going back and not going forward. If SF have peaked they are still relevant with 4 TD's and 50 plus cllrs.

Ferris had her best ever election and just missed out on an EU seat. Dotherty will probably win the byelection. Even if he doesn't win it I'd say his vote will increase. Mary Lou McD secured more votes last year in the Euro than she did in 04 when she got elected.

Ferris' and Forde's comments in AP were constructive. They were part of any election review which all partys do and are an important part of any democratic party.There are quotes in the article from Ferris and Forde taken out of context. Both were positive. Forde claimed that his was ignored and this was part of the reason he left. If he had have been listened to the quotes would still be there and they would proably still have been used to back up that opinion anyway.

ardmhachaabu

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #26 on: January 19, 2010, 08:49:04 AM »
I never said it would harm aspirations for a united ireland but it would b a problem for achieving it without republicans having a political party to mandate. And SF still at local level made gains and only had their growth slowed by a huge FG vote which was in protest at FFs handling of the recession. This trend of main opposition parties making gains was repeated around the world mid recession. And pints SF is activist based dont forget. Every party has activists it cud do without, SF no more than others.
With respect, you are not making any sense on this.  SDLP have as many republicans in it as SF do, same with FF in the south.  SF are not the only party which attracts republican support.  SF don't speak for all republicans and never have.

I now fully expect you to come back with more pro SF nonsense, which of course you are entitled to do.  Just don't expect to be allowed to get away with it
Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something

Nally Stand

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #27 on: January 19, 2010, 10:21:44 AM »
If I an entitled to, why then say "don't think you will be allowed" to get away with spouting pro SF "nonsense". Any why come up with points to counter an argument i didn't make. Not once did i suggest that all republicans support SF. However your claim that the SDLP and FF have as many republicans as SF is laughable. It wasn't I who nicknamed the SDLP the stoop down low party. A label it earnt for itself for its willingness to bend the knee to unionism. As for FF, my earlier post covered its partitionism
« Last Edit: January 19, 2010, 10:24:37 AM by Nally Stand »
"The island of saints & scholars...and gombeens & fuckin' arselickers" Christy Moore

Ulick

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #28 on: January 19, 2010, 10:44:26 AM »
With respect, you are not making any sense on this.  SDLP have as many republicans in it as SF do, same with FF in the south. 

Eh? How could they if they take an oath to a monarch?  ??? Surely that is the complete antithesis of republicanism i.e. the British monarch is not a citizen and therefore not equal before the law.

Hardy

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Re: Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.
« Reply #29 on: January 19, 2010, 11:11:29 AM »
That's well covered - the "empty formula" formula.

Nally Stand - would you not take my hint and get out a dictionary and look up "republican".
I studied deeply in the philosophies and religions, but cheerfulness kept breaking through - L.Cohen