You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain

[ONeill]

From today, 1 January 2010, the new Irish blasphemy law becomes operational, and we begin our campaign to have it repealed. Blasphemy is now a crime punishable by a €25,000 fine. The new law defines blasphemy as publishing or uttering matter that is grossly abusive or insulting in relation to matters held sacred by any religion, thereby intentionally causing outrage among a substantial number of adherents of that religion, with some defences permitted.

This new law is both silly and dangerous. It is silly because medieval religious laws have no place in a modern secular republic, where the criminal law should protect people and not ideas. And it is dangerous because it incentives religious outrage, and because Islamic States led by Pakistan are already using the wording of this Irish law to promote new blasphemy laws at UN level.

We believe in the golden rule: that we have a right to be treated justly, and that we have a responsibility to treat other people justly. Blasphemy laws are unjust: they silence people in order to protect ideas. In a civilised society, people have a right to to express and to hear ideas about religion even if other people find those ideas to be outrageous.

Publication of 25 blasphemous quotes

In this context we now publish a list of 25 blasphemous quotes, which have previously been published by or uttered by or attributed to Jesus Christ, Muhammad, Mark Twain, Tom Lehrer, Randy Newman, James Kirkup, Monty Python, Rev Ian Paisley, Conor Cruise O'Brien, Frank Zappa, Salman Rushdie, Bjork, Amanda Donohoe, George Carlin, Paul Woodfull, Jerry Springer the Opera, Tim Minchin, Richard Dawkins, Pope Benedict XVI, Christopher Hitchens, PZ Myers, Ian O'Doherty, Cardinal Cormac Murphy-O'Connor and Dermot Ahern.

Despite these quotes being abusive and insulting in relation to matters held sacred by various religions, we unreservedly support the right of these people to have published or uttered them, and we unreservedly support the right of any Irish citizen to make comparable statements about matters held sacred by any religion without fear of being criminalised, and without having to prove to a court that a reasonable person would find any particular value in the statement.

Campaign begins to repeal the Irish blasphemy law

We ask Fianna Fail and the Green Party to repeal their anachronistic blasphemy law, as part of the revision of the Defamation Act that is included within the Act. We ask them to hold a referendum to remove the reference to blasphemy from the Irish Constitution.

We also ask all TDs and Senators to support a referendum to remove references to God from the Irish Constitution, including the clauses that prevent atheists from being appointed as President of Ireland or as a Judge without swearing a religious oath asking God to direct them in their work.

If you run a website, blog or other media publication, please feel free to republish this statement and the list of quotes yourself, in order to show your support for the campaign to repeal the Irish blasphemy law and to promote a rational, ethical, secular Ireland.

List of 25 Blasphemous Quotes Published by Atheist Ireland

1. Jesus Christ, when asked if he was the son of God, in Matthew 26:64: "Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven." According to the Christian Bible, the Jewish chief priests and elders and council deemed this statement by Jesus to be blasphemous, and they sentenced Jesus to death for saying it.

2. Jesus Christ, talking to Jews about their God, in John 8:44: "Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him." This is one of several chapters in the Christian Bible that can give a scriptural foundation to Christian anti-Semitism. The first part of John 8, the story of "whoever is without sin cast the first stone", was not in the original version, but was added centuries later. The original John 8 is a debate between Jesus and some Jews. In brief, Jesus calls the Jews who disbelieve him sons of the Devil, the Jews try to stone him, and Jesus runs away and hides.

3. Muhammad, quoted in Hadith of Bukhari, Vol 1 Book 8 Hadith 427: "May Allah curse the Jews and Christians for they built the places of worship at the graves of their prophets." This quote is attributed to Muhammad on his death-bed as a warning to Muslims not to copy this practice of the Jews and Christians. It is one of several passages in the Koran and in Hadith that can give a scriptural foundation to Islamic anti-Semitism, including the assertion in Sura 5:60 that Allah cursed Jews and turned some of them into apes and swine.

4. Mark Twain, describing the Christian Bible in Letters from the Earth, 1909: "Also it has another name - The Word of God. For the Christian thinks every word of it was dictated by God. It is full of interest. It has noble poetry in it; and some clever fables; and some blood-drenched history; and some good morals; and a wealth of obscenity; and upwards of a thousand lies... But you notice that when the Lord God of Heaven and Earth, adored Father of Man, goes to war, there is no limit. He is totally without mercy - he, who is called the Fountain of Mercy. He slays, slays, slays! All the men, all the beasts, all the boys, all the babies; also all the women and all the girls, except those that have not been deflowered. He makes no distinction between innocent and guilty... What the insane Father required was blood and misery; he was indifferent as to who furnished it." Twain's book was published posthumously in 1939. His daughter, Clara Clemens, at first objected to it being published, but later changed her mind in 1960 when she believed that public opinion had grown more tolerant of the expression of such ideas. That was half a century before Fianna Fail and the Green Party imposed a new blasphemy law on the people of Ireland.

5. Tom Lehrer, The Vatican Rag, 1963: "Get in line in that processional, step into that small confessional. There, the guy who's got religion'll tell you if your sin's original. If it is, try playing it safer, drink the wine and chew the wafer. Two, four, six, eight, time to transubstantiate!"

6. Randy Newman, God's Song, 1972: "And the Lord said: I burn down your cities - how blind you must be. I take from you your children, and you say how blessed are we. You all must be crazy to put your faith in me. That's why I love mankind."

7. James Kirkup, The Love That Dares to Speak its Name, 1976: "While they prepared the tomb I kept guard over him. His mother and the Magdalen had gone to fetch clean linen to shroud his nakedness. I was alone with him... I laid my lips around the tip of that great c**k, the instrument of our salvation, our eternal joy. The shaft, still throbbed, anointed with death's final ejaculation." This extract is from a poem that led to the last successful blasphemy prosecution in Britain, when Denis Lemon was given a suspended prison sentence after he published it in the now-defunct magazine Gay News. In 2002, a public reading of the poem, on the steps of St. Martin-in-the-Fields church in Trafalgar Square, failed to lead to any prosecution. In 2008, the British Parliament abolished the common law offences of blasphemy and blasphemous libel.

8. Matthias, son of Deuteronomy of Gath, in Monty Python's Life of Brian, 1979: "Look, I had a lovely supper, and all I said to my wife was that piece of halibut was good enough for Jehovah."

9. Rev Ian Paisley MEP to the Pope in the European Parliament, 1988: "I denounce you as the Antichrist." Paisley's website describes the Antichrist as being "a liar, the true son of the father of lies, the original liar from the beginning... he will imitate Christ, a diabolical imitation, Satan transformed into an angel of light, which will deceive the world."

10. Conor Cruise O'Brien, 1989: "In the last century the Arab thinker Jamal al-Afghani wrote: 'Every Muslim is sick and his only remedy is in the Koran.' Unfortunately the sickness gets worse the more the remedy is taken."

11. Frank Zappa, 1989: "If you want to get together in any exclusive situation and have people love you, fine - but to hang all this desperate sociology on the idea of The Cloud-Guy who has The Big Book, who knows if you've been bad or good - and cares about any of it - to hang it all on that, folks, is the chimpanzee part of the brain working."

12. Salman Rushdie, 1990: "The idea of the sacred is quite simply one of the most conservative notions in any culture, because it seeks to turn other ideas - uncertainty, progress, change - into crimes." In 1989, Ayatollah Khomeini of Iran issued a fatwa ordering Muslims to kill Rushdie because of blasphemous passages in Rushdie's novel The Satanic Verses.

13. Bjork, 1995: "I do not believe in religion, but if I had to choose one it would be Buddhism. It seems more livable, closer to men... I've been reading about reincarnation, and the Buddhists say we come back as animals and they refer to them as lesser beings. Well, animals aren't lesser beings, they're just like us. So I say f**k the Buddhists."

14. Amanda Donohoe on her role in the Ken Russell movie Lair of the White Worm, 1995: "Spitting on Christ was a great deal of fun. I can't embrace a male god who has persecuted female sexuality throughout the ages, and that persecution still goes on today all over the world."

15. George Carlin, 1999: "Religion easily has the greatest bullshit story ever told. Think about it. Religion has actually convinced people that there's an invisible man living in the sky who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever 'til the end of time! But He loves you. He loves you, and He needs money! He always needs money! He's all-powerful, all-perfect, all-knowing, and all-wise, somehow just can't handle money! Religion takes in billions of dollars, they pay no taxes, and they always need a little more. Now, talk about a good bullshit story. Holy Shit!"

16. Paul Woodfull as Ding Dong Denny O'Reilly, The Ballad of Jaysus Christ, 2000: "He said me ma's a virgin and sure no one disagreed, Cause they knew a lad who walks on water's handy with his feet... Jaysus oh Jaysus, as cool as bleedin' ice, With all the scrubbers in Israel he could not be enticed, Jaysus oh Jaysus, it's funny you never rode, Cause it's you I do be shoutin' for each time I shoot me load."

17. Jesus Christ, in Jerry Springer The Opera, 2003: "Actually, I'm a bit gay." In 2005, the Christian Institute tried to bring a prosecution against the BBC for screening Jerry Springer the Opera, but the UK courts refused to issue a summons.

18. Tim Minchin, Ten-foot c**k and a Few Hundred Virgins, 2005: "So you're gonna live in paradise, With a ten-foot c**k and a few hundred virgins, So you're gonna sacrifice your life, For a shot at the greener grass, And when the Lord comes down with his shiny rod of judgment, He's gonna kick my heathen ass."

19. Richard Dawkins in The God Delusion, 2006: "The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully." In 2007 Turkish publisher Erol Karaaslan was charged with the crime of insulting believers for publishing a Turkish translation of The God Delusion. He was acquitted in 2008, but another charge was brought in 2009. Karaaslan told the court that "it is a right to criticise religions and beliefs as part of the freedom of thought and expression."

20. Pope Benedict XVI quoting a 14th century Byzantine emperor, 2006: "Show me just what Muhammad brought that was new and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." This statement has already led to both outrage and condemnation of the outrage. The Organisation of the Islamic Conference, the world's largest Muslim body, said it was a "character assassination of the prophet Muhammad". The Malaysian Prime Minister said that "the Pope must not take lightly the spread of outrage that has been created." Pakistan's foreign Ministry spokesperson said that "anyone who describes Islam as a religion as intolerant encourages violence". The European Commission said that "reactions which are disproportionate and which are tantamount to rejecting freedom of speech are unacceptable."

21. Christopher Hitchens in God is not Great, 2007: "There is some question as to whether Islam is a separate religion at all... Islam when examined is not much more than a rather obvious and ill-arranged set of plagiarisms, helping itself from earlier books and traditions as occasion appeared to require... It makes immense claims for itself, invokes prostrate submission or 'surrender' as a maxim to its adherents, and demands deference and respect from nonbelievers into the bargain. There is nothing-absolutely nothing-in its teachings that can even begin to justify such arrogance and presumption."

22. PZ Myers, on the Roman Catholic communion host, 2008: "You would not believe how many people are writing to me, insisting that these horrible little crackers (they look like flattened bits of styrofoam) are literally pieces of their god, and that this omnipotent being who created the universe can actually be seriously harmed by some third-rate liberal intellectual at a third-rate university... However, inspired by an old woodcut of Jews stabbing the host, I thought of a simple, quick thing to do: I pierced it with a rusty nail (I hope Jesus's tetanus shots are up to date). And then I simply threw it in the trash, followed by the classic, decorative items of trash cans everywhere, old coffeegrounds and a banana peel."

23. Ian O'Doherty, 2009: "(If defamation of religion was illegal) it would be a crime for me to say that the notion of transubstantiation is so ridiculous that even a small child should be able to see the insanity and utter physical impossibility of a piece of bread and some wine somehow taking on corporeal form. It would be a crime for me to say that Islam is a backward desert superstition that has no place in modern, enlightened Europe and it would be a crime to point out that Jewish settlers in Israel who believe they have a God given right to take the land are, frankly, mad. All the above assertions will, no doubt, offend someone or other."

24. Cardinal Cormac Murphy-O'Connor, 2009: "Whether a person is atheist or any other, there is in fact in my view something not totally human if they leave out the transcendent... we call it God... I think that if you leave that out you are not fully human." Because atheism is not a religion, the Irish blasphemy law does not protect atheists from abusive and insulting statements about their fundamental beliefs. While atheists are not seeking such protection, we include the statement here to point out that it is discriminatory that this law does not hold all citizens equal.

25. Dermot Ahern, Irish Minister for Justice, introducing his blasphemy law at an Oireachtas Justice Committee meeting, 2009, and referring to comments made about him personally: "They are blasphemous." Deputy Pat Rabbitte replied: "Given the Minister's self-image, it could very well be that we are blaspheming," and Minister Ahern replied: "Deputy Rabbitte says that I am close to the baby Jesus, I am so pure." So here we have an Irish Justice Minister joking about himself being blasphemed, at a parliamentary Justice Committee discussing his own blasphemy law, that could make his own jokes illegal.

Finally, as a bonus, Micheal Martin, Irish Minister for Foreign Affairs, opposing attempts by Islamic States to make defamation of religion a crime at UN level, 2009: "We believe that the concept of defamation of religion is not consistent with the promotion and protection of human rights. It can be used to justify arbitrary limitations on, or the denial of, freedom of expression. Indeed, Ireland considers that freedom of expression is a key and inherent element in the manifestation of freedom of thought and conscience and as such is complementary to freedom of religion or belief." Just months after Minister Martin made this comment, his colleague Dermot Ahern introduced Ireland's new blasphemy law.

http://blasphemy.ie/2010/01/01/atheist-ireland-publishes-25-blasphemous-quotes/

[J70]

Does this mean they're going to have to censor the likes of the Blues Brothers when its shown on RTE?

"Jesus H tapdancing christ, I have seen the light!"

Can Richard Dawkins or Christopher Hitchens still go on the Late Late Show and say that there is no god, but that if such a god did exist, he'd only be a dysfunctional bollocks anyway given his behaviour in the old testament?

[ONeill]

Well, it'll be interesting to see if this is implemented at all.

[Tony Baloney]

I would say Ireland tops the table for breaking this particular Commandment. Of all the issues affecting Ireland at the minute this really should have been way way way down the list of bills to be passed. A farce in a nation of farces.

[ONeill]

Irish atheists challenge new blasphemy laws

Secular campaigners publish series of anti-religious quotes and say they will challenge law if charged with blasphemy

Secular campaigners in the Irish Republic defied a strict new blasphemy law which came into force today by publishing a series of anti-religious quotations online and promising to fight the legislation in court.

The new law, which was passed in July, means that blasphemy in Ireland is now a crime punishable with a fine of up to €25,000 (£22,000).

It defines blasphemy as "publishing or uttering matter that is grossly abusive or insulting in relation to matters sacred by any religion, thereby intentionally causing outrage among a substantial number of adherents of that religion, with some defences permitted".

The justice minister, Dermot Ahern, said that the law was necessary because while immigration had brought a growing diversity of religious faiths, the 1936 constitution extended the protection of belief only to Christians.

But Atheist Ireland, a group that claims to represent the rights of atheists, responded to the new law by publishing 25 anti-religious quotations on its website, from figures including Richard Dawkins, Björk, Frank Zappa and the former Observer editor and Irish ex-minister Conor Cruise O'Brien.

Michael Nugent, the group's chair, said that it would challenge the law through the courts if it were charged with blasphemy.

Nugent said: "This new law is both silly and dangerous. It is silly because medieval religious laws have no place in a modern secular republic, where the criminal law should protect people and not ideas. And it is dangerous because it incentives religious outrage, and because Islamic states led by Pakistan are already using the wording of this Irish law to promote new blasphemy laws at UN level.

"We believe in the golden rule: that we have a right to be treated justly, and that we have a responsibility to treat other people justly. Blasphemy laws are unjust: they silence people in order to protect ideas. In a civilised society, people have a right to express and to hear ideas about religion even if other people find those ideas to be outrageous."

He said that despite the published quotations being abusive and insulting in relation to matters held sacred by various religions, Atheist Ireland "unreservedly support the right of these people to have published or uttered them, and we unreservedly support the right of any Irish citizen to make comparable statements about matters held sacred by any religion without fear of being criminalised, and without having to prove to a court that a reasonable person would find any particular value in the statement".

Nugent said that the group would be prepared to take on the state if anyone complained about the quotes and that the campaign to repeal the law was part of a wider battle to create a more secular republic.

"You would think that after all the scandals the Catholic church endured in 2009 the introduction of a blasphemy law would be the last thing that the Irish state would be considering in terms of defending religion and its place in society.

"We ask Fianna Fáil and the Green party to repeal their anachronistic blasphemy law, as part of the revision of the defamation act that is included within the act. We ask them to hold a referendum to remove the reference to blasphemy from the Irish constitution.""We also ask all TDs and senators to support a referendum to remove references to God from the Irish constitution, including the clauses that prevent atheists from being appointed as president of Ireland or as a judge without swearing a religious oath asking God to direct them in their work."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/jan/01/irish-atheists-challenge-blasphemy-law

[ONeill]

Can we still call Canavan God?

[IolarCoisCuain]

I'm sure nobody really cares, but there's only six actual blasphemies on that list of twenty-five, going by the definition of blasphemy that's in the legislation. I don't know why they bothered.

[muppet]

Can we still call Canavan God?

That's baldphemy.

[dillinger]

Can we still call Canavan God?

That's baldphemy.
[/quote

Glad i didnt type all that]

[JUst retired]

Muppet, Thats a cracker.

[leenie]

JES&S CHR*&t, for the love of G$D....... i'm fooked then!

phew, glenroe is no longer running miley would be screwed!

[Evil Genius]

I wasn't sure whether to post this in the Clerical Abuse thread, or the Gerry Adams' Brother thread, the Christmas 2009 Highlight/Lowlight thread, or even start up a separate Caption thread, Ziggy-style.

But for some reason, I was moved to link it to this particular topic...

[Declan]

Letter in Todays Times

Madam, – In relation to Atheist Ireland's condemnation of the blasphemy laws (Breaking News, January 2nd), I am appalled by the organisation's lack of humanity. While I find such a law outdated and out of place in a modern Ireland, with research I appreciate its place, and feel morally obliged to extend the same respect to other religions as our Constitution already extends to Roman Catholicism.

While highlighting the contradictions of this law, Atheist Ireland's publication of blasphemous statements has proven that it has little respect for the many different believers in this country, regardless of their religion, nor for their own cause. In quotation, they hide behind the words of others rather than face the law themselves, and I find such a petty challenge to the law offensive to anyone capable of researching the law.

The most tiresome of any religious zeal is that which attempts to force its own creed upon all, with no thought or respect for what they already believe.

By desiring Ireland to be a country of blaspheming atheists, it would appear that Atheist Ireland has proven this applies with its own beliefs as it does to the staunchest of any religious missionary. – Yours, etc,

KEN MOONEY,

Park Crescent,

Kimmage, Dublin 12.

[Billys Boots]

Hmmm, now that's ironic. 

[theskull1]

This thread will have to do for this ...

Just out in the car there listening to the very entertaining Michael Nugent of the Irish
Atheist Association, or whatever it's called, talking to Seán Moncrieff.

He was telling a story about an atheist who died in Donegal and the family couldn't
get a place to bury her because all the cemeteries are owned by the churches up
there, apparently. Eventually, they got a municipal graveyard in Derry and the job
was done. Somebody following up the story, finding out the graveyard is actually
segregated into catholic and protestant sections, asked did they have an atheist
section as well.  "No", they said, "we just put her in with the protestants".

He was also recalling Marge trying to get Homer to go to church. "But Marge", he
says, "what if we've chosen the wrong religion? We're just making God madder
and madder every week".  Must say that always used to bother me as well.

If you didn't want to be buried in a graveyard, what other options are available. Is cremation the only option (never heard of a catholic never mind an athiest catholic being cremated when I think about that one)