Author Topic: The IRISH RUGBY thread  (Read 663034 times)

andoireabu

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 731
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8040 on: May 12, 2019, 04:01:40 AM »
I'm no Leinster fan but a few points OB.

- Leinster arguably missing 3 starters in Leavy, Van Der Flier and you could say Carbery. That would have made a fair difference. bollocks. They have the squad they have and they have advantages over the the other 3 provinces. You don't see many moving from the other three provinces to leinster. One way traffic.

- Leinster reached the European final playing in 3rd gear all season. so what? If they coast to the final but can't lift themselves for the final, that is their problem. Nobody else's

- Saracens brought a fair few of those lads through the academy - Farrell, George, Kruis, Itoje to name a few. 2 Vunipolas joined as young lads.

Few points bolded above.

Saracens were the better team. Ijote probably should have got the line but even so, Leinster never looked the better team. Garces was poor is certain aspects but he didnt lose leinster that game.

Walter, you are a decent poster on the rugby threads but i think you are wrong here. Leinster wouldn't have won if van der flier, leavy and carbery had started. Saracens were just better
Private Cowboy: Don't shit me, man!
Private Joker: I wouldn't shit you. You're my favorite turd!

Walter Cronc

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3484
  • UTW!
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8041 on: May 12, 2019, 06:49:35 AM »
Not saying they would have won, but certainly Leavy is a massive loss. Most physical loose forward in Irish rugby.

IMO its a testament to their squad the fact they have played in 3rd gear all season that they reached a final.

Regarding Garces, yeah he was sloppy but we all knew that coming into the game. Leinster knew Saracens have a rush defence yet didn't vary it. Even a few grubbers, cross field kicks to Lowe would have made them think.

The two turning points were Ringrose failing to exploit the 5 on 3 and McGrath. Is it any wonder they tried to poach Casey from Munster  ;D

The worry for me was it all looked very similar to Ireland and is what we could see if we meet the Saffas in Japan unless Schmidt varies it.

Tony Baloney

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14329
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8042 on: May 12, 2019, 08:33:28 AM »
I'm no Leinster fan but a few points OB.

- Leinster arguably missing 3 starters in Leavy, Van Der Flier and you could say Carbery. That would have made a fair difference.

- Leinster reached the European final playing in 3rd gear all season.

- Saracens brought a fair few of those lads through the academy - Farrell, George, Kruis, Itoje to name a few. 2 Vunipolas joined as young lads.

I don’t think you can say Carbery to be fair!

What were the thoughts on Garces? I didn’t get to give the game my full attention but he seemed to still be very slack on the offside/coming in from the side/supporting your body weight particularly in Sarries favour?

Did any of you more knowledgeable rugby heads think this??
It was known before the game that Garces doesn't give a shit about refereeing the breakdown. That's the way he referees. French refs should never be allowed near these big finals.

Falcao

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 17
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8043 on: May 12, 2019, 10:19:03 AM »
Wasn't McGrath's call to keep the ball in play just before half time

Walter Cronc

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3484
  • UTW!
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8044 on: May 12, 2019, 10:53:32 AM »
Wasn't McGrath's call to keep the ball in play just before half time

Who's was it then? Surely a 9 has to take some element of responsibility as a key player. Just like a pre set move where a back sees a gap and go. There's a framework and you play what's in front of you.

David McKeown

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2188
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8045 on: May 12, 2019, 12:48:21 PM »
I wouldn’t claim to be a rugby expert but I thought Saracens came out on the right side of a lot of key decisions. For their yellow card there were three separate penalty offences in the one attack. For Leinster’s it was one. Vunipola got away with a pretty clear to me deliberate knock on and the taking out of Kearney could easily have been yellow. In the build up to the last penalty and yellow card Williams clearly spilled the ball forward when collecting the high ball. Similarly before the last try a Saracens player dropped the ball forward in a tackle. All those went Saracens way. Not saying they weren’t deserved victors but on such decisions games can change. I think had Leinster got those decisions they may have gone on to win. That’s the nature of top level sports I suppose. Does go strengthen my belief for me at least that if video replay isn’t used for everything it shouldn’t be used for anything.

Owen Brannigan

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1697
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8046 on: May 12, 2019, 02:19:18 PM »
I'm no Leinster fan but a few points OB.

- Leinster arguably missing 3 starters in Leavy, Van Der Flier and you could say Carbery. That would have made a fair difference.

- Leinster reached the European final playing in 3rd gear all season.

- Saracens brought a fair few of those lads through the academy - Farrell, George, Kruis, Itoje to name a few. 2 Vunipolas joined as young lads.

No doubt that Leinster missed out in not having Leavy in place of O'Brien and Van de Flier to strengthen the defence. Carberry would have made no difference because Sexton was never coming off the field but he would have been better on the wing in full back position than Larmour who was not near the game. Ireland in the World Cup will find the same problem in not having enough players of size and strength and too many just past their peak like O'Brien, Kearney, etc.

It looks now that Leinster were actually playing at the best they could throughout the competition. This 3rd gear theory was blown away in the knockout rounds where their invincibility was in doubt. The IRFU player protection scheme and then injuries on return makes it hard to develop the core team that Saracens have in the Premiership.

They do have some of their own players who are overpaid through all sorts of schemes to keep them from going elsewhere. The Vunipolas were hardly 2 lads who turned up but were brought to Saracens already known for being top men. Billy wanted to join Mako as he didn't want to play against him. Skelton had a huge influence on the game and between him and B Vunipola, Lenister had no answer to their physicality and strength. No one coming on for Leinster was anywhere near as good as those they would replace whereas every man on the Saracens bench made an impact. The addition of Williams and Maitland has given Saracens an edge in attack that few can match.

Walter Cronc

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3484
  • UTW!
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8047 on: May 12, 2019, 03:44:45 PM »
Elliott Daly joining the party next year as well. Only hope of bearing them is catching them cold in the 1/4 final after a tough 6 nations!

seafoid

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23177
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8048 on: May 13, 2019, 07:36:11 AM »

There seems to be a structural problem,

https://www.newstalk.com/sport/joe-schmidt-andy-dunne-838374

"I'd nearly absolve all the players of blame," Dunne stated in conversation with Off the Ball, "I think the coaching staff are far too oppressive, and far too dictatorial about the style of play."
"Schmidt seems to want to control 12 to 15 phases from the stand at all times, and he needs to reverse out of that fast.
"There are too much rucks, and I've said this for a long period of time.
"It seems all the international coaches, or certainly those in the Six Nations, went away and analysed what we did in 2018 and worked out pretty quickly that if you match us physically we don't have much else in the locker.
"Once we've been matched physically in the England game and the Wales game, we've been unmercifully hammered on both days.

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/billy-vunipola-delivers-special-performance-to-find-salvation-1.3889588

And so we witnessed a replay of England destroying Joe Schmidt’s Ireland last February in Dublin. That victory showcased power and pressure – Itoje and Kruis – mixed with Owen Farrell’s accuracy. This victory brought the very same heat mixed with Vunipola climbing inside Sexton’s tactical mind.
Twice the 20-stoner cast his shadow over the Irish playmaker, daring him to fling pre-ordained passes.
“The intercepts for me are fun because [Sexton] kept doing them,” said Vunipola. “He’s amazing at those plays. If you let them unfold he can pick you apart. That’s what he did in the first half. He uses those little plays to give them momentum and to get in behind you. I just saw it as an opportunity to get in his eye line to see if he was smart enough not to play those balls. Not saying he is not smart. I just kept putting myself in that channel. He kept throwing them. Luckily I did catch it because I think it would have been a penalty. I enjoyed it as much as scoring the try.”

Lookit

Insane Bolt

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 875
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8049 on: May 13, 2019, 08:53:21 AM »
Saracens deserving winners.....they are a super side. Leinster should have gone in at ht 10-3 up, but they failed to score in second half....so can have no complaints really. Keith Wood summed up Itoje.....the type of player you hated playing against.....but would love on your own team. Saracens will be very hard to stop over next 3-5 years.

GetOverTheBar

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 899
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8050 on: May 13, 2019, 09:52:27 AM »
Saracens deserving winners.....they are a super side. Leinster should have gone in at ht 10-3 up, but they failed to score in second half....so can have no complaints really. Keith Wood summed up Itoje.....the type of player you hated playing against.....but would love on your own team. Saracens will be very hard to stop over next 3-5 years.

Have to agree with this - Leinster will long rue shipping that try just before HT. If they got in ahead at that stage who knows but Saracens are extremely well drilled, extremely fit and extremely methodical. I had in my head it was like fighting quicksand during a bit of the 2nd half, they loved the battle.

Tony Baloney

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14329
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8051 on: May 14, 2019, 08:05:44 PM »
Did anyone else follow Alex Goode's session on Instagram and Twitter?!  ;D

 https://www.ruck.co.uk/timelined-the-full-story-of-alex-goodes-incredible-drinking-session/

screenexile

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10448
  • Up The Screen!
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8052 on: May 17, 2019, 10:55:14 PM »
Jesus Ulster took some tanking this evening...

michaelg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1029
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8053 on: May 17, 2019, 11:06:12 PM »
Jesus Ulster took some tanking this evening...
Was very poor.  You would think Best would have learnt how to throw it in to the line-out by now.  Still not convinced by Burns at 10.

Tony Baloney

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14329
    • View Profile
Re: The IRISH RUGBY thread
« Reply #8054 on: May 17, 2019, 11:21:29 PM »
Didn't see it but that's a serious humping at that level in the last 4 of a competition. Shit one for Best and Cave to go out on.