All Ireland Hurling Final Kilkenny v Tipp - 4 in a row for Kilkenny ?

[EddieMerx]

Indy you go on about the dirty challenges made by KK players but forget to mention that one of the dirtiest strokes witnessed in an AI final was made by Dunne a Tipp man... you make out like the poor young innocent Tipp team were bullied by the KK players.

[bottlethrower7]

Indiana - what about the free the ref gave Callinan for simply running for a ball with Brian Hogan?

What about what John O'Brien did to Richie Power just before half time.

Or Conor O'Mahony hanging out of Eoin Larkin's neck about 15 minutes into the game just before one of Eddie Brennan's points?

Or the passage of play immediately prior to Derek Lyng's point and the 'rough' play of the Tipp backs in those incidents (particularly on Richie Hogan).

Do you agree with how the ref handled either of those incidents?

[gallsman]

It was a major turning point of the game and a rank bad decision. The fact remains at the 62nd minute of the game Tipp were 2 points up, after a bad decision they were a point down. If thats not a turning point obviously then the Battle of Stalingrad in the 2nd World War was just a footnote!

We'll never know now who would have won even if BT is arrogant enough to think he's a fortune teller now. Have you got the lotto numbers at the weekend by any chance?

It was a turning point. My point is that it was an irrelevance because the balance of play shifted in Kilkenny's favour and would have regardless of the penalty.

gallman, again, well said.

If the play had shifted in their favour. Why had Noel Mc Grath scored a point to put  Tipp 2 up less than 20 seconds earlier. By the way thats a fact, not conjecture or opinion.

Like I said because there was a load of confusion over a man lying on the ground down the field! Now you're going to tell me Noel McGrath was having a significant influence on the outcome of the match.

[bottlethrower7]

It was a major turning point of the game and a rank bad decision. The fact remains at the 62nd minute of the game Tipp were 2 points up, after a bad decision they were a point down. If thats not a turning point obviously then the Battle of Stalingrad in the 2nd World War was just a footnote!

We'll never know now who would have won even if BT is arrogant enough to think he's a fortune teller now. Have you got the lotto numbers at the weekend by any chance?

It was a turning point. My point is that it was an irrelevance because the balance of play shifted in Kilkenny's favour and would have regardless of the penalty.

gallman, again, well said.

If the play had shifted in their favour. Why had Noel Mc Grath scored a point to put  Tipp 2 up less than 20 seconds earlier. By the way thats a fact, not conjecture or opinion.

because Micheal Kavanagh dropped a ball that should have been bread and butter to him.

or do you mean the one where Cummins pucked the ball out and no one was marking him? If so, because no one was marking him.

[INDIANA]

INDIANA- Shoulders to the head my arse. Like I said, if you dip your body and head towards an oncoming challenge you're always likely to get it and can have no complaints. As for the challenge on Power, Mickey Kavanagh did the exact same thing to Kelly. Legitimate challenge, Kelly took a bundle of steps and ended up with Kavanagh's arm over his shoulder, winning a free. Did you see Kelly's reaction? He threw a haymaker and was lucky it didn't connect, but I don't hear you being up in arms over that one. As for your comment about there being no advantage rule, refs in both football and hurling have been playing advantage for years without a word said about it. You can't suddenly complain when it hurts your team.

Ok tell me then aidan fogarty didn't shoulder someone in the head shortly before he went off? Tell me Pat kerwick wasn't laid low by a shoulder to the head in the 2nd half. You show me the video evidence that says I'm wrong and I'll agree with you 100%. Callinan got a full frontal charge from Tyrell in the first half-thats a free.

We''ll even for arguments sake let all the above go right and call it fair game. He then after allowing the above contact go scot free, gives a penalty for the sort of contact we'd see in an u10's game at a crucial point in the game. Now are you seriously going to suggest to me that is consistent  refereeing. If he was consistent it was a free out. Thats not good refereeing. In anybody's book.

Hang on now= I've already agreed by with the Tyrell incident. Fogarty? Was that the on on Padraig Maher? No, Maher dipped and getting hit was his own fault, as Duignan pointed out. Kerwick, not at all.

It still a yellow card offence. watch it -48mins in. Just because someone dips a few inches doesn't give you the legitimacy to shoulder someone in the head. But if you're going to let that go in terms fo cards and award a penalty for no contact whatsoever. That doesn't strike me as consistent refereeing. I even think Curran got a yellow for the penalty, can't quite recall.

It was a major turning point of the game and a rank bad decision. The fact remains at the 62nd minute of the game Tipp were 2 points up, after a bad decision they were a point down. If thats not a turning point obviously then the Battle of Stalingrad in the 2nd World War was just a footnote!

We'll never know now who would have won even if BT is arrogant enough to think he's a fortune teller now. Have you got the lotto numbers at the weekend by any chance?

It was a turning point. My point is that it was an irrelevance because the balance of play shifted in Kilkenny's favour and would have regardless of the penalty.

gallman, again, well said.

If the play had shifted in their favour. Why had Noel Mc Grath scored a point to put  Tipp 2 up less than 20 seconds earlier. By the way thats a fact, not conjecture or opinion.

because Micheal Kavanagh dropped a ball that should have been bread and butter to him.

or do you mean the one where Cummins pucked the ball out and no one was marking him? If so, because no one was marking him.

Sorry you claimed kilkenny were in the ascendency. I'm asking what evidence there is to support that. Check out the score when the Tipp man was sent off and check it out again in the 62nd minute. And then please show me some concrete evidence where you can definitively say Kilkenny were in the ascendency rather than opinion.

[INDIANA]

It was a major turning point of the game and a rank bad decision. The fact remains at the 62nd minute of the game Tipp were 2 points up, after a bad decision they were a point down. If thats not a turning point obviously then the Battle of Stalingrad in the 2nd World War was just a footnote!

We'll never know now who would have won even if BT is arrogant enough to think he's a fortune teller now. Have you got the lotto numbers at the weekend by any chance?

It was a turning point. My point is that it was an irrelevance because the balance of play shifted in Kilkenny's favour and would have regardless of the penalty.

gallman, again, well said.

If the play had shifted in their favour. Why had Noel Mc Grath scored a point to put  Tipp 2 up less than 20 seconds earlier. By the way thats a fact, not conjecture or opinion.

Like I said because there was a load of confusion over a man lying on the ground down the field! Now you're going to tell me Noel McGrath was having a significant influence on the outcome of the match.

No I'm simply stating the facts that Tipp were 2 up at the time of the penalty when allegedly kilkenny were in the ascendency.

[INDIANA]

Indy you go on about the dirty challenges made by KK players but forget to mention that one of the dirtiest strokes witnessed in an AI final was made by Dunne a Tipp man... you make out like the poor young innocent Tipp team were bullied by the KK players.

Never said Dunne hadn't to walk anywhere. I think I did comment on the irony on Sunday but he had to go no question. Never said Tipp were bullied by anyone, I'm just commenting on the inconsistent refereeing and asking questions as to why video evidence isn't used.

[bottlethrower7]

INDIANA- Shoulders to the head my arse. Like I said, if you dip your body and head towards an oncoming challenge you're always likely to get it and can have no complaints. As for the challenge on Power, Mickey Kavanagh did the exact same thing to Kelly. Legitimate challenge, Kelly took a bundle of steps and ended up with Kavanagh's arm over his shoulder, winning a free. Did you see Kelly's reaction? He threw a haymaker and was lucky it didn't connect, but I don't hear you being up in arms over that one. As for your comment about there being no advantage rule, refs in both football and hurling have been playing advantage for years without a word said about it. You can't suddenly complain when it hurts your team.

Ok tell me then aidan fogarty didn't shoulder someone in the head shortly before he went off? Tell me Pat kerwick wasn't laid low by a shoulder to the head in the 2nd half. You show me the video evidence that says I'm wrong and I'll agree with you 100%. Callinan got a full frontal charge from Tyrell in the first half-thats a free.

We''ll even for arguments sake let all the above go right and call it fair game. He then after allowing the above contact go scot free, gives a penalty for the sort of contact we'd see in an u10's game at a crucial point in the game. Now are you seriously going to suggest to me that is consistent  refereeing. If he was consistent it was a free out. Thats not good refereeing. In anybody's book.

Hang on now= I've already agreed by with the Tyrell incident. Fogarty? Was that the on on Padraig Maher? No, Maher dipped and getting hit was his own fault, as Duignan pointed out. Kerwick, not at all.

It still a yellow card offence. watch it -48mins in. Just because someone dips a few inches doesn't give you the legitimacy to shoulder someone in the head. But if you're going to let that go in terms fo cards and award a penalty for no contact whatsoever. That doesn't strike me as consistent refereeing. I even think Curran got a yellow for the penalty, can't quite recall.

It was a major turning point of the game and a rank bad decision. The fact remains at the 62nd minute of the game Tipp were 2 points up, after a bad decision they were a point down. If thats not a turning point obviously then the Battle of Stalingrad in the 2nd World War was just a footnote!

We'll never know now who would have won even if BT is arrogant enough to think he's a fortune teller now. Have you got the lotto numbers at the weekend by any chance?

It was a turning point. My point is that it was an irrelevance because the balance of play shifted in Kilkenny's favour and would have regardless of the penalty.

gallman, again, well said.

If the play had shifted in their favour. Why had Noel Mc Grath scored a point to put  Tipp 2 up less than 20 seconds earlier. By the way thats a fact, not conjecture or opinion.

because Micheal Kavanagh dropped a ball that should have been bread and butter to him.

or do you mean the one where Cummins pucked the ball out and no one was marking him? If so, because no one was marking him.

Sorry you claimed kilkenny were in the ascendency. I'm asking what evidence there is to support that. Check out the score when the Tipp man was sent off and check it out again in the 62nd minute. And then please show me some concrete evidence where you can definitively say Kilkenny were in the ascendency rather than opinion.

check it again in the 70th minute. As Brian Cody rightly says, the only time the scoreboard matters.

[gallsman]

It was a major turning point of the game and a rank bad decision. The fact remains at the 62nd minute of the game Tipp were 2 points up, after a bad decision they were a point down. If thats not a turning point obviously then the Battle of Stalingrad in the 2nd World War was just a footnote!

We'll never know now who would have won even if BT is arrogant enough to think he's a fortune teller now. Have you got the lotto numbers at the weekend by any chance?

It was a turning point. My point is that it was an irrelevance because the balance of play shifted in Kilkenny's favour and would have regardless of the penalty.

gallman, again, well said.

If the play had shifted in their favour. Why had Noel Mc Grath scored a point to put  Tipp 2 up less than 20 seconds earlier. By the way thats a fact, not conjecture or opinion.

Like I said because there was a load of confusion over a man lying on the ground down the field! Now you're going to tell me Noel McGrath was having a significant influence on the outcome of the match.

No I'm simply stating the facts that Tipp were 2 up at the time of the penalty when allegedly kilkenny were in the ascendency.

Grand, so they're two points up and Kilkenny score a point from a 21 yard free. This leaves them a point behind with an extra man with ten minutes to go. The notion that Tipp were nailed on certs to win until the penalty is ridiculous.

[SuperMac]

Well teh Cats used one of their nine lives on Sunday. Great game though, best final in a few years. Looks like a Tipp V Kilkenny repeat next year - and Tipp to do it.

[INDIANA]

INDIANA- Shoulders to the head my arse. Like I said, if you dip your body and head towards an oncoming challenge you're always likely to get it and can have no complaints. As for the challenge on Power, Mickey Kavanagh did the exact same thing to Kelly. Legitimate challenge, Kelly took a bundle of steps and ended up with Kavanagh's arm over his shoulder, winning a free. Did you see Kelly's reaction? He threw a haymaker and was lucky it didn't connect, but I don't hear you being up in arms over that one. As for your comment about there being no advantage rule, refs in both football and hurling have been playing advantage for years without a word said about it. You can't suddenly complain when it hurts your team.

Ok tell me then aidan fogarty didn't shoulder someone in the head shortly before he went off? Tell me Pat kerwick wasn't laid low by a shoulder to the head in the 2nd half. You show me the video evidence that says I'm wrong and I'll agree with you 100%. Callinan got a full frontal charge from Tyrell in the first half-thats a free.

We''ll even for arguments sake let all the above go right and call it fair game. He then after allowing the above contact go scot free, gives a penalty for the sort of contact we'd see in an u10's game at a crucial point in the game. Now are you seriously going to suggest to me that is consistent  refereeing. If he was consistent it was a free out. Thats not good refereeing. In anybody's book.

Hang on now= I've already agreed by with the Tyrell incident. Fogarty? Was that the on on Padraig Maher? No, Maher dipped and getting hit was his own fault, as Duignan pointed out. Kerwick, not at all.

It still a yellow card offence. watch it -48mins in. Just because someone dips a few inches doesn't give you the legitimacy to shoulder someone in the head. But if you're going to let that go in terms fo cards and award a penalty for no contact whatsoever. That doesn't strike me as consistent refereeing. I even think Curran got a yellow for the penalty, can't quite recall.

It was a major turning point of the game and a rank bad decision. The fact remains at the 62nd minute of the game Tipp were 2 points up, after a bad decision they were a point down. If thats not a turning point obviously then the Battle of Stalingrad in the 2nd World War was just a footnote!

We'll never know now who would have won even if BT is arrogant enough to think he's a fortune teller now. Have you got the lotto numbers at the weekend by any chance?

It was a turning point. My point is that it was an irrelevance because the balance of play shifted in Kilkenny's favour and would have regardless of the penalty.

gallman, again, well said.

If the play had shifted in their favour. Why had Noel Mc Grath scored a point to put  Tipp 2 up less than 20 seconds earlier. By the way thats a fact, not conjecture or opinion.

because Micheal Kavanagh dropped a ball that should have been bread and butter to him.

or do you mean the one where Cummins pucked the ball out and no one was marking him? If so, because no one was marking him.

Sorry you claimed kilkenny were in the ascendency. I'm asking what evidence there is to support that. Check out the score when the Tipp man was sent off and check it out again in the 62nd minute. And then please show me some concrete evidence where you can definitively say Kilkenny were in the ascendency rather than opinion.

check it again in the 70th minute. As Brian Cody rightly says, the only time the scoreboard matters.

Disappointing response really. Nothing to offer.

[INDIANA]

It was a major turning point of the game and a rank bad decision. The fact remains at the 62nd minute of the game Tipp were 2 points up, after a bad decision they were a point down. If thats not a turning point obviously then the Battle of Stalingrad in the 2nd World War was just a footnote!

We'll never know now who would have won even if BT is arrogant enough to think he's a fortune teller now. Have you got the lotto numbers at the weekend by any chance?

It was a turning point. My point is that it was an irrelevance because the balance of play shifted in Kilkenny's favour and would have regardless of the penalty.

gallman, again, well said.

If the play had shifted in their favour. Why had Noel Mc Grath scored a point to put  Tipp 2 up less than 20 seconds earlier. By the way thats a fact, not conjecture or opinion.

Like I said because there was a load of confusion over a man lying on the ground down the field! Now you're going to tell me Noel McGrath was having a significant influence on the outcome of the match.

No I'm simply stating the facts that Tipp were 2 up at the time of the penalty when allegedly kilkenny were in the ascendency.

Grand, so they're two points up and Kilkenny score a point from a 21 yard free. This leaves them a point behind with an extra man with ten minutes to go. The notion that Tipp were nailed on certs to win until the penalty is ridiculous.

Sorry it was a free out. How is that a 21 yard free? Have you got the lotto numbers for the weekend?

[bottlethrower7]

INDIANA- Shoulders to the head my arse. Like I said, if you dip your body and head towards an oncoming challenge you're always likely to get it and can have no complaints. As for the challenge on Power, Mickey Kavanagh did the exact same thing to Kelly. Legitimate challenge, Kelly took a bundle of steps and ended up with Kavanagh's arm over his shoulder, winning a free. Did you see Kelly's reaction? He threw a haymaker and was lucky it didn't connect, but I don't hear you being up in arms over that one. As for your comment about there being no advantage rule, refs in both football and hurling have been playing advantage for years without a word said about it. You can't suddenly complain when it hurts your team.

Ok tell me then aidan fogarty didn't shoulder someone in the head shortly before he went off? Tell me Pat kerwick wasn't laid low by a shoulder to the head in the 2nd half. You show me the video evidence that says I'm wrong and I'll agree with you 100%. Callinan got a full frontal charge from Tyrell in the first half-thats a free.

We''ll even for arguments sake let all the above go right and call it fair game. He then after allowing the above contact go scot free, gives a penalty for the sort of contact we'd see in an u10's game at a crucial point in the game. Now are you seriously going to suggest to me that is consistent  refereeing. If he was consistent it was a free out. Thats not good refereeing. In anybody's book.

Hang on now= I've already agreed by with the Tyrell incident. Fogarty? Was that the on on Padraig Maher? No, Maher dipped and getting hit was his own fault, as Duignan pointed out. Kerwick, not at all.

It still a yellow card offence. watch it -48mins in. Just because someone dips a few inches doesn't give you the legitimacy to shoulder someone in the head. But if you're going to let that go in terms fo cards and award a penalty for no contact whatsoever. That doesn't strike me as consistent refereeing. I even think Curran got a yellow for the penalty, can't quite recall.

It was a major turning point of the game and a rank bad decision. The fact remains at the 62nd minute of the game Tipp were 2 points up, after a bad decision they were a point down. If thats not a turning point obviously then the Battle of Stalingrad in the 2nd World War was just a footnote!

We'll never know now who would have won even if BT is arrogant enough to think he's a fortune teller now. Have you got the lotto numbers at the weekend by any chance?

It was a turning point. My point is that it was an irrelevance because the balance of play shifted in Kilkenny's favour and would have regardless of the penalty.

gallman, again, well said.

If the play had shifted in their favour. Why had Noel Mc Grath scored a point to put  Tipp 2 up less than 20 seconds earlier. By the way thats a fact, not conjecture or opinion.

because Micheal Kavanagh dropped a ball that should have been bread and butter to him.

or do you mean the one where Cummins pucked the ball out and no one was marking him? If so, because no one was marking him.

Sorry you claimed kilkenny were in the ascendency. I'm asking what evidence there is to support that. Check out the score when the Tipp man was sent off and check it out again in the 62nd minute. And then please show me some concrete evidence where you can definitively say Kilkenny were in the ascendency rather than opinion.

check it again in the 70th minute. As Brian Cody rightly says, the only time the scoreboard matters.

Disappointing response really. Nothing to offer.

agreed

[gallsman]

It was a major turning point of the game and a rank bad decision. The fact remains at the 62nd minute of the game Tipp were 2 points up, after a bad decision they were a point down. If thats not a turning point obviously then the Battle of Stalingrad in the 2nd World War was just a footnote!

We'll never know now who would have won even if BT is arrogant enough to think he's a fortune teller now. Have you got the lotto numbers at the weekend by any chance?

It was a turning point. My point is that it was an irrelevance because the balance of play shifted in Kilkenny's favour and would have regardless of the penalty.

gallman, again, well said.

If the play had shifted in their favour. Why had Noel Mc Grath scored a point to put  Tipp 2 up less than 20 seconds earlier. By the way thats a fact, not conjecture or opinion.

Like I said because there was a load of confusion over a man lying on the ground down the field! Now you're going to tell me Noel McGrath was having a significant influence on the outcome of the match.

No I'm simply stating the facts that Tipp were 2 up at the time of the penalty when allegedly kilkenny were in the ascendency.

Grand, so they're two points up and Kilkenny score a point from a 21 yard free. This leaves them a point behind with an extra man with ten minutes to go. The notion that Tipp were nailed on certs to win until the penalty is ridiculous.

Sorry it was a free out. How is that a 21 yard free? Have you got the lotto numbers for the weekend?

Fine, then Kelly's point for the "foul" by Kavanagh doesn't count either. Nor does the one from the free Kelly got after the "foul" on Corbett by Hogan. See where I'm going here???

[theskull1]

Indiana you can jump on the bandwagon all you like and focus solely on the referees mistakes which suit your argument

But what about Callinans & Eoin Kelly's "mistakes"? Benny Dunnes "mistake"? What about the wides when they went 3 up going into the last quarter? The game was there to be won and Tipp people would be better to focus on there own failings which cost them the game rather than hone in on what was an excellent refereeing performance overall, and focus on one poor decision. If they work on those they'll be all the better next year and that I look forward to. They played their part in a fantastic game and for what is a young team, they can take great heart from that.

Of course that won't get you your money back