RIRA Checkpoints

[Cúig huaire]

I see in true GAA board fashion we have gone off topic and started what is really a completely different subject.
The old saying "lies, damned lies and statistics" could well have been written about the RUC/PSNI. Its all well and good taking on Catholics, but where exactly are these new recruits coming from? I can assure you that they aren't coming from Crossmaglen, the Falls Rd or the Bogside. Until the police in NI is able to attract recruits from these areas then it wont be a truly representative force. No true Nationalist would join the PSNI today, despite the assurances of Spin Fein. Its all well and good re-branding the force and taking them out of their quasi military uniforms, but many of the people who were in charge of the RUC are still in those jobs with the PSNI and special branch still seems to control frontline policing.
Who do you think sent the riot squads in to deal with unruly students on St Patricks Day, while sending officers in to protect Loyalists erecting flags for their marching season or removing flags in Banbridge or Ballymena. As Sinn Fein used to say before they changed sides, RUC + PSNI = Same Difference.

[orangeman]

The murder of Kevin Mc Daid, will if properly investigated will show that notihng has changed with regard to the attitude of the police force in the North towards the nationalist / republican people.

Watch out for this case. Can of worms. Can they keep the lid on it (again ) ?

[Cúig huaire]

The murder of Kevin Mc Daid, will if properly investigated will show that notihng has changed with regard to the attitude of the police force in the North towards the nationalist / republican people.

Watch out for this case. Can of worms. Can they keep the lid on it (again ) ?

They seem to be keeping the lid on the Robert Hamill case at the minute. Mysteriously the star witness who up until now had refused to testify, has completely changed her story, allowing her ex boyfriend and many RUC men off the hook.

[stew]

The murder of Kevin Mc Daid, will if properly investigated will show that notihng has changed with regard to the attitude of the police force in the North towards the nationalist / republican people.

Watch out for this case. Can of worms. Can they keep the lid on it (again ) ?

They seem to be keeping the lid on the Robert Hamill case at the minute. Mysteriously the star witness who up until now had refused to testify, has completely changed her story, allowing her ex boyfriend and many RUC men off the hook.

Shocker there,  I am sure no pressure whatsoever was brouhgt to bear on her. 

[Maguire01]

I think you'll find that the police are still not made welcome in many nationalist/ republican parts of the North.

And yet people complain when they're not effective.

There might be more RC recruits but they're a very nervous bunch. They don't know really what is going to happen. It's still not a nice job for a catholic.

I know one Catholic who joined. They love their job. No problems.

[Maguire01]

IIts all well and good taking on Catholics, but where exactly are these new recruits coming from? I can assure you that they aren't coming from Crossmaglen, the Falls Rd or the Bogside. Until the police in NI is able to attract recruits from these areas then it wont be a truly representative force.

And that will require a change in culture in these areas as well as in the PSNI. Maybe the PSNI will attract more such recruits when people from those areas feel comfortable that their community will accept their decision to apply.

No true Nationalist would join the PSNI today, despite the assurances of Spin Fein.

Who made you the judge of what constitutes a 'true' Nationalist?

[Maguire01]

The murder of Kevin Mc Daid, will if properly investigated will show that notihng has changed with regard to the attitude of the police force in the North towards the nationalist / republican people.

Watch out for this case. Can of worms. Can they keep the lid on it (again ) ?

They seem to be keeping the lid on the Robert Hamill case at the minute. Mysteriously the star witness who up until now had refused to testify, has completely changed her story, allowing her ex boyfriend and many RUC men off the hook.

Shocker there,  I am sure no pressure whatsoever was brouhgt to bear on her. 

There's no denying that this case stinks.

But could it not also be possible that this witness has changed her story to try and get her ex-husband and father of her 2 children off the hook, rather than giving a damn as to what happens to the RUC officers?

[lynchbhoy]

IIts all well and good taking on Catholics, but where exactly are these new recruits coming from? I can assure you that they aren't coming from Crossmaglen, the Falls Rd or the Bogside. Until the police in NI is able to attract recruits from these areas then it wont be a truly representative force.

And that will require a change in culture in these areas as well as in the PSNI. Maybe the PSNI will attract more such recruits when people from those areas feel comfortable that their community will accept their decision to apply.

jup to the psni to prove they have changed before people will believe it - as in derry city nothing much has changed according to my sources. you have to earn respect and trust. In DC they are not even bothering it would seem.
If the psni did bother there (and I presume its likewise in other areas) they would garner support and potentially recruits.

Also hear that the atrition rate amongst nationalist/Irish in the psni is higher than desired. Dont know how true this is.

[Maguire01]

IIts all well and good taking on Catholics, but where exactly are these new recruits coming from? I can assure you that they aren't coming from Crossmaglen, the Falls Rd or the Bogside. Until the police in NI is able to attract recruits from these areas then it wont be a truly representative force.

And that will require a change in culture in these areas as well as in the PSNI. Maybe the PSNI will attract more such recruits when people from those areas feel comfortable that their community will accept their decision to apply.

jup to the psni to prove they have changed before people will believe it - as in derry city nothing much has changed according to my sources. you have to earn respect and trust. In DC they are not even bothering it would seem.
If the psni did bother there (and I presume its likewise in other areas) they would garner support and potentially recruits.

Surely the communities have a part to play in effecting this change? Maybe the PSNI need Catholic recruits to help them change, or to facilitate the process of change.

[Cúig huaire]

Surely the communities have a part to play in effecting this change? Maybe the PSNI need Catholic recruits to help them change, or to facilitate the process of change.

The Nationalist community will only play its part in effecting this change when the police force has shown that it has truly changed. A new name and uniform is useless when its the same people wearing those uniforms. Recent events, be they in Derry, Ballymena or any other part of the North has shown that its the same old same old. 
At the minute the only Catholics joining up are either from the South or what The Gael refers to as "Castle Catholics." Maguire you stated that you knew someone who joined up, where were they from?

[Maguire01]

Surely the communities have a part to play in effecting this change? Maybe the PSNI need Catholic recruits to help them change, or to facilitate the process of change.

The Nationalist community will only play its part in effecting this change when the police force has shown that it has truly changed. A new name and uniform is useless when its the same people wearing those uniforms. Recent events, be they in Derry, Ballymena or any other part of the North has shown that its the same old same old. 

My point is that it's very easy to stand outside and criticise. You're not going to change things from the outside. Engagement is a two way street. Why should the Nationalist community wait until the police force has shown that it has "truly changed". Why should the Nationalists not help to truly change it?

At the minute the only Catholics joining up are either from the South or what The Gael refers to as "Castle Catholics." Maguire you stated that you knew someone who joined up, where were they from?

From the south as it happens.

But regardless of what 'type' of Catholics they are, or where they're from, their proportion has gone from 8% in 1998 to 26% by July 2009.

Some Republicans will never join or consider joining, simply on principle. Some won't join because of what their families or neighbours would say/think. And some may join over the next few years, now that Gerry and Martin have said it's okay.
At the end of the day, it's not just as simple as the PSNI making themselves attractive as employers to people in West Belfast, Derry City or South Armagh. It would be naive to thank it was.

[Cúig huaire]

At the end of the day, it's not just as simple as the PSNI making themselves attractive as employers to people in West Belfast, Derry City or South Armagh. It would be naive to thank it was.

Thats were you and the PSNI are wrong. Until someone from Silverbridge (pints?) or Shantallow or St James`s sees the police as a career where they will feel comfortable, be accepted for what they are and not have to hide it from family and friends, then people like you have to accept that the police are still unacceptable to the majority in these areas and that they have to do something about attracting these people into their ranks. Like it or not, the police is still seen as a protestant force for a protestant people. You cannot expect young people from these areas to join up to the police just because Gerry and Martin say everything is ok. Gerry and Martin would not let their kids join up and are only endorsing the police because they have to, otherwise the British government will take away their salaries and the jobs for the boys.

[Myles Na G.]

At the end of the day, it's not just as simple as the PSNI making themselves attractive as employers to people in West Belfast, Derry City or South Armagh. It would be naive to thank it was.

Thats were you and the PSNI are wrong. Until someone from Silverbridge (pints?) or Shantallow or St James`s sees the police as a career where they will feel comfortable, be accepted for what they are and not have to hide it from family and friends, then people like you have to accept that the police are still unacceptable to the majority in these areas and that they have to do something about attracting these people into their ranks. Like it or not, the police is still seen as a protestant force for a protestant people. You cannot expect young people from these areas to join up to the police just because Gerry and Martin say everything is ok. Gerry and Martin would not let their kids join up and are only endorsing the police because they have to, otherwise the British government will take away their salaries and the jobs for the boys.

Complete crap, as was your earlier comment about only 'Castle Catholics' joining. In the first place, the very fact that you use that term shows that you're an arrogant p***k who thinks he has the right to decide what 'proper' Catholics should think or feel or do. In the second place, if you think young lads and girls from the areas you mention aren't applying to join, then you're so out of touch that your opinion is useless. People from these areas may still need to hide their membership of PSNI from families and friends, but only in case begrudging arseholes like you are still about the place.

[glens abu]

At the end of the day, it's not just as simple as the PSNI making themselves attractive as employers to people in West Belfast, Derry City or South Armagh. It would be naive to thank it was.

Thats were you and the PSNI are wrong. Until someone from Silverbridge (pints?) or Shantallow or St James`s sees the police as a career where they will feel comfortable, be accepted for what they are and not have to hide it from family and friends, then people like you have to accept that the police are still unacceptable to the majority in these areas and that they have to do something about attracting these people into their ranks. Like it or not, the police is still seen as a protestant force for a protestant people. You cannot expect young people from these areas to join up to the police just because Gerry and Martin say everything is ok. Gerry and Martin would not let their kids join up and are only endorsing the police because they have to, otherwise the British government will take away their salaries and the jobs for the boys.

Complete crap, as was your earlier comment about only 'Castle Catholics' joining. In the first place, the very fact that you use that term shows that you're an arrogant p***k who thinks he has the right to decide what 'proper' Catholics should think or feel or do. In the second place, if you think young lads and girls from the areas you mention aren't applying to join, then you're so out of touch that your opinion is useless. People from these areas may still need to hide their membership of PSNI from families and friends, but only in case begrudging arseholes like you are still about the place.

agree 100%

[dillinger]

their proportion has gone from 8% in 1998 to 26% by July 2009.

On a slightly diff point,i believe at 2006 there were 14 prods in the Garda.Out of a force of i think 12,000?  Quite a low % Wonder why