Antrim Hurling

[Minder]

Quote from: Tony Baloney on Today at 01:39:54 PM
Minder what is your problem with the Antrim team? Are you jealous of Karl McKeegan?


I am jealous of your avatar......

Some pups!

I am gonna have to ask you to return to the Neighbours thread NRico......

[Guillem2]

Back to club issues. When will the league proposals be put to the clubs?

[nrico2006]

Is the Dunloy match still in Clones, or has it been switched to Breffni?

[milltown row]

i think this was the CCC's ideas:

Antrim League Proposals  2008

Purpose of Proposals

At the end of last season C C C began a process of examination of the current league and championship structures within the County.   Recognising of course that our clubs and County Committee are the final decision makers regarding the competition structures we nonetheless felt that based on our experience of administering the competitions during the season past that there are areas were improvement could be made.  Based on our deliberations and discussions we wish to put the following proposals to County Committee.   We realise that in some aspects we are calling for brave decisions to be made which in the short term will affect the status of some clubs in league and championships.  We ask County Committee to give serious consideration to each of the proposals.  We acknowledge of course that there are other proposals out there which deserve equal consideration.  We feel that an early meeting of the clubs with the sole purpose of discussing these and any other proposals would be of great benefit.  Again in studying and discussing these proposals we would ask the clubs to see the greater picture.  Example tables within the proposals are based on league positions last season.   We realise that some clubs will wish to make a case for either staying where they are or indeed being included at a higher or lower level of competition in league or championship.  This will be considered.


Hurling Proposals.
Leagues

It is fairly well accepted by the majority of hurling clubs that the leagues need revamped.   Last years format of one round leagues clearly did not give the required number of games at a competitive standard. In Division 1 this was particularly so, with too many predictable results.  Also the lack of home and away leads to an uneven distribution of much needed gate revenue.   While competition was tight in Division 2 the number of games provided was not satisfactory and again there was the problem of loss of revenue.

We propose
Four Divisions of two round leagues on a home and away basis.  We would consider promotion and relegation on any of the following.
One up     One down
Two up     Two Down
Second place relegation /promotion playoff.

Based on last years finishing positions the leagues would be as follows.

Division 1   Ten Teams     Division 2   8 Teams          Division 3   8 Teams
Dunloy                                Rossa                                Tir na nOg
Loughgiel                            Lamh Dearg                           Cushendun
Portaferry                           Sarsfields                                St Pauls
Ballycastle                          Shane O Neills                       Rasharkin
Cushendall                         Gort na Mona                         Armoy
Ballygalget                        Clooney Gaels                         Cloughmills
St Johns                               Glenravel                              St Agnes
St Galls                               Carey Faughs                         St Teresas
Ballycran
Glenariff


Division 4    8 Teams
Ballymena
Ardoyne
St. Endas
Davitts
Larne
Breedagh
Sarsfields 2
O Mitchell Og


Football Leagues

By and large the football leagues worked quite well particularly in the first four divisions  .Areas of concern would have been largely around teams finishing second in their leagues having to wait longer than they wished to have relegation issues resolved in the leagues above.     Some of the smaller clubs felt aggrieved at having to play against second and third teams from larger clubs.  They felt that at times these reserve teams were loaded with first team players and were too strong.  These issues particularly arose in divisions 4,5 and 6.   Divisions 5 and 6 where the majority of the teams are second or third teams were most problematic.  These two leagues, nominally two sections of the one league but split on geographic lines caused problems in terms of the number of teams in each section and the subsequent wait by the winners of Division 6 to see who they played in the play off.       C C C are of the view that for efficiency there should be a maximum of ten teams in any league with two rounds home and away.

In addressing these problems C C C have come up with a number of proposals.
The first issue is easily dealt with.  We propose a straight forward two up and two down in divisions 1,2 and three, doing away with promotion relegation play offs.
The bottom two in Division 4 would go down and be replaced by the winners of Division 5 and 6 if these are to stay as they are.
C C C looked long and hard at the situation regarding reserve sides.    At first glance there appeared to be a case for reserve leagues. The advantages to the clubs were obvious. If Division 1. reserve sides played before their first teams the first team managers would get a chance to look at the  players. Expenses would be reduced and gate receipts would probably increase.  .Some of the smaller clubs would obviously be happy not have to play against reserve teams.  So far so good.   However having looked closely at the teams who will make up Division 1. next year problems became apparent. 
The reserve teams of the ten participating clubs in last years division 1. played in divisions 3,4,5 and 6 .  The highest placing obtained was St Johns 2. 3rd in Division three and the lowest placing was Moneyglass 9th in Division 6.  As one of the primary aims of C C C would be to make the leagues more competitive we decided against this      . We considered proposals for reserve leagues from Eire Og but would not be in favour of these as if adopted they greatly reduced the number of games reserve teams would be scheduled and would defeat another of the aims of C C C.
We do feel that the new competition entry forms which will contain space for the fifteen graded players and which on completion will be placed on E Sport and which we will be asking the clubs to ratify should ease some of the fears of the smaller clubs.       As both of the bottom teams dropping from Division 4. are South Antrim clubs and under the present format would be destined for Division 5 we feel that this league becomes too large and if that was repeated next year would be unworkable.
This year twenty or twenty one teams are scheduled to play in these two divisions and it is now time to look again at how they are divided between the two leagues.  As only six of the teams are from one team only clubs five of which play in division 5 it makes it a hard one to solve .but the geographic solution of previous years may soon not be viable.



Championship Proposals

We feel that it is taken as read that the steps needed to improve the Hurling Championship would not necessarily be the same as those for football so again we will deal with them seperately.   There is however one area of concern common to both . How best do we decide what championship a club enters. Broadly speaking it is possible for a club  under the present conditions and regulations to enter whatever championship it wishes   .A club may enter a higher or lower grade of championship than it would be expected to play at.     C C C feel that championship entry must be better regulated and more simply determined    The fairest way we feel is that entry to any championship be determined by league and championship performance in the previous year.  We also feel that there should be a seeding of the top four clubs in each championship.

Hurling
C C C proposes to do away with the present system of  preliminary league sections  for the Hurling championships.    Although the thinking behind this format (to give clubs more championship hurling) was good the fact is that many of the games were meaningless and unwanted by clubs .  Dates saved will be better used in competitive league games.
We propose that Senior Championship consist of a maximum ten teams which would entail two preliminary games to produce four teams to play the four seeded teams.
These teams would be drawn from the hat with the first team drawn playing the fourth seed, the second drawn playing the second seed etc.
Based on league and championship performance last season the four seeded teams would be   1. Dunloy   2. Loughgiel   3. Ballycastle   4. Cushendall
The six teams competing to play them would be  St Johns St Galls Rossa Glenariff Lamh Dearg and Cushendun/Sarsfields

Intermediate championship
Seeded teams  1.Cushendun/Sarsfields  2.Glenarm  3. St Pauls  4. Gort na Mona
One preliminary game    then the same procedure as in Senior
Teams competing      Clooney Gaels  Glenravel  Carey Faughs  Tir na nOg  Armoy
Junior Championship
Seeded Teams    1.  Rasharkin  2. Cloughmills  3.St Agnes 4 St Teresas
Teams to play prelims.   Ballymena   Ardoyne   St Endas   Davitts    Larne   O Mitchel Og  with possibly Creggan Gaels and/or Na Fuiseoig
Proceed as in Snior and Intermediate.


Football Championship

Football Championship is at present played on an open draw basis.  We would see no need to change this but again would advocate seeding based on the previous seasons League and Championship with the top four teams seeded.  Again we would propose a maximum of ten teams in the Senior championship.    Championship status to be determined by performance in previous years league and championship.

Based on last years league and championship, adding 5 points for winning the championship, 3 points for reaching the final, two points for reaching the semi finals and one for reaching the quarter final and in this case then the four seeded teams would be , in order, St Galls, Cargin,Portglenone and Creggan.


We would advocate the same system in Intermediate and Junior Championship.
As a guide to determining status we would recommend that the previous years league points be added to a set number of points awarded for Championship performance
We would recommend a sliding scale of points starting with Winner  Finalists  Semi Finalists   Quarter Finalists  with the level of competition taken into consideration with a set number of points given,  this to be applied in Hurling and Football.
We believe that linking leagues and championships in this manner will enhance the status of the leagues and increase the importance of gaining league points.

While most of what we propose will be easily accepted we know that some of it will require an unselfish over view of the situation on the part of the clubs.  We hope you give the proposals careful consideration.  We realise that there are other proposals to be discussed.  We as always will do our best to administer whatever you decide.

[slow corner back]

There are also proposals in from Cushendun and Lamh dearg. They are on the county website if you look hard enough. Cushenduns proposal mirrors the CCC proposal for hurling but whats it instigated in 2009 after everyone plays for position this year. Lamh dearg want Div 1A and Div1B with 8 teams in them. For my money I would go with Cushenduns proposal as everyone knows what they are playing for this season rather than moving the goalposts in the closed season.

[Fairhead]

Dont see much mention of it anywhere else SCB but best of luck to Armoy on Sunday in Dundalk.

[Glensman]

Agree with Cushendun's proposal and agree with the good luck wishes to Armoy.

One big game and there might be a trip to croke.

[Guillem2]

The CCC proposals look OK and are very close to what I posted here & on the Antrim site last month. Disappointed about Rossa in Div 2 but we can live with it.

[milltown row]

it's tough on any team being relagated. but it happens. my only change on that would be the championship being a straight knock out. no seeding as lamhs have proved over the years you can take these teams in one offs but not in group or qualifiers

[slow corner back]

Dont see much mention of it anywhere else SCB but best of luck to Armoy on Sunday in Dundalk.

Cheers Fairead will I see you at it?

[podge]

it's tough on any team being relagated. but it happens. my only change on that would be the championship being a straight knock out. no seeding as lamhs have proved over the years you can take these teams in one offs but not in group or qualifiers

Its tough indeed.  What a lot of people don;t realise is that what is finally agreed is actually very unlikely to exactly mirror any of the proposals that are on the Antrim website.  I am hearing there is a school of thought that 8 team leagues, home and away, is the way to go.  and in the current climate of change/why waste a year thats where we might end up this season.

By my reckoning that means that St Galls and Ballycran could join Rossa LD and Sarsfields in Div 2.  (the tables in document posted by Milltown are wrong I think as Glenariff were ahead of these teams?).  It also means that Carey and Glenravel could join St Pauls, R'town,C'dun, R sharkin,Armoy in Div 3..etc etc...

so milltown, is it still your view that 'it's tough on any team being relegated. but it happens' ?

maybe a few more clubs will need to reconsider what they think is best for the long term future of antrim hurling when their own short term future is in jeopardy

I think long term this is the way to go but it should be done in a way to allow the teams to play their way into a particular league.

On C'ship, keep it simple.  Open draw, no seeding, straight knock out.

[milltown row]

 if thats the proposals then so be it. we are never going to win the league but if it was a competitive div 2 then so be it. we have beaten all the teams below us in the league. should have beaten Ballycastle up there as well but sure no worries.

[Fairhead]

Dont see much mention of it anywhere else SCB but best of luck to Armoy on Sunday in Dundalk.

Cheers Fairead will I see you at it?

I was planning to to go to Dundalk but Antrim's expected win  over the Cats last week has changed my plans so going to Belfield for the UCD match. Its a pity theres a clash. I see in the paper today it says if Conaghy Shamrocks are in trouble they will throw on Canice Brennan from the bench. Id say Armoy will be up against it but if they show the spirit that Clooney did in the final last year against, what has to be said was a much superior team, then hopefully they will put in a good show.

[Baile an tuaigh]

Antrim do it again. I would say that was a decent UCD team they played. Congratulations lads.

Antrim through to Walsh Cup final 

Sambo McNaughton's side beat Kilkenny last week
Antrim will face Offaly in next Sunday's Walsh Cup final at Casement Park thanks to a 3-14 to 1-16 win over UCD in Sunday's semi-final at Belfield.
Michael Magill found the net after three minutes and the Saffrons enjoyed a 1-10 to 0-10 lead at half-time.

Tommy Fitzgerald's 39th-minute goal gave the students hope but a further Magill goal and a Liam Watson penalty paved the way for Antrim's victory.

Watson scored a total of 1-5 and Magill contributed 2-2 to the scoreline.

The other Antrim points scorers were Paddy Magill, 0-2, and a point apiece for Ciaran Herron, Neil McManus, Eddie McCluskey, Simon McCoy and Cormac Donnelly.

Stephen Nolan top-scored for UCD with 0-7, Michael McGarry adding 0-6, Tommy Fitzgerald 1-1 and James Walsh 0-2.

The hosts kept in touch with frees from McGarry and Nolan in the first half and piled on the pressure after the break but 10 second-half wides did not help their cause.

Offaly defeated Laois 1-12 to 0-11 in the day's other last four clash.

[Minder]

i take it that report is from the bbc? As it is full of their usual lazy bastard journalism,simon mc coy? Michael magill? I take it they meant paddy