South Belfast North of Ireland Supporters Club

[A Quinn Martin Production]

What is wrong with a private members club being made of mainly of those from the loyalist community???  

I would say...absolutely nothing...neither is there anything wrong with a membership based sporting and cultural association being made of people mainly from the nationalist community.  Not saying you have a problem with this Roger but some people on the board do.

[Roger]

There's nothing sectarian about being a loyalist? Er, explain...

There is nothing sectarian in a bad way about being a loyalist.
By definition we are all sectarian, I suppose, if we identify ourselves as being from a section of the community, and therefore in such a manner there is nothing wrong with being sectarian.  It is intolerance of others from a different section of the community that makes the definition of sectarianism a derogatory term. Sometimes this would be termed as sectarian bigotry.  There is only one person on this thread that is displaying that.

[Roger]

What is wrong with a private members club being made of mainly of those from the loyalist community???  

I would say...absolutely nothing...neither is there anything wrong with a membership based sporting and cultural association being made of people mainly from the nationalist community.  Not saying you have a problem with this Roger but some people on the board do.

I don't have any problem whatsoever with any organisation being predominantly made up from one community or the other.

[red hander]

There's nothing sectarian about being a loyalist? Er, explain...

There is nothing sectarian in a bad way about being a loyalist.
By definition we are all sectarian, I suppose, if we identify ourselves as being from a section of the community, and therefore in such a manner there is nothing wrong with being sectarian.  It is intolerance of others from a different section of the community that makes the definition of sectarianism a derogatory term. Sometimes this would be termed as sectarian bigotry.  There is only one person on this thread that is displaying that.

Who?

[Evil Genius]

whats a Celtic sectarian flag look like?

I find it rather ironic, though by no means surprising, that Fearon can castigate the supporters of one team for flying flags which he finds objectionable, but doesn't mind supporting another team himself, some of whose supporters go out of their way to get their own (ahem) provocative flags professionally printed.

[Evil Genius]

The IFA is a racist sectarian and bigoted organisation for inviting the murderous state of Israhell to play.
And the same goes for any other country for inviting them to play in a friendly.

I trust you are similarly outraged by this "racist sectarian and bigoted organisation" then, too:

http://www.soccerscene.ie/sssenior/matchdetails.php?id=206
http://www.soccerscene.ie/sssenior/matchdetails.php?id=214
http://www.soccerscene.ie/sssenior/matchdetails.php?id=236

Unless, of course, Israhell [sic] only acquired "the worst human rights record of any country playing international football" in the years since 1987...

[stibhan]

whats a Celtic sectarian flag look like?

I find it rather ironic, though by no means surprising, that Fearon can castigate the supporters of one team for flying flags which he finds objectionable, but doesn't mind supporting another team himself, some of whose supporters go out of their way to get their own (ahem) provocative flags professionally printed.

I have never seen the flag in question at a Celtic bar or a Celtic game. Nor have I seen one at an Ireland game. The games are well stewarded in this regard with the apparent exception of North of Ireland games.

[Evil Genius]

whats a Celtic sectarian flag look like?

I find it rather ironic, though by no means surprising, that Fearon can castigate the supporters of one team for flying flags which he finds objectionable, but doesn't mind supporting another team himself, some of whose supporters go out of their way to get their own (ahem) provocative flags professionally printed.

I have never seen the flag in question at a Celtic bar or a Celtic game. Nor have I seen one at an Ireland game.

Someone, presumably a Celtic fan, went to the trouble and expense of getting the flag made.

I don't see how it is any different for a Celtic fan to fly that flag, than it is for NI fans in the SBNISC to fly eg the Union Flag, except of course, that the IRA is/was an illegal organisation, whereas the Union Flag is the universally legally recognised flag of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

The games are well stewarded in this regard with the apparent exception of North of Ireland games.

What similarly provocative flags have you ever seen at a "North of Ireland" [sic] game?

[give her dixie]

And the same goes for any other country for inviting them to play in a friendly.

Evil, I think my statement covers each and every country that plays a friendly with Israhell.
I make no exceptions at all.

[Tony Baloney]

How do the neo-Nazi/C18 branch of the Norn Iron supporters club square the apparent close ties with Israel?

[stibhan]

whats a Celtic sectarian flag look like?

I find it rather ironic, though by no means surprising, that Fearon can castigate the supporters of one team for flying flags which he finds objectionable, but doesn't mind supporting another team himself, some of whose supporters go out of their way to get their own (ahem) provocative flags professionally printed.

I have never seen the flag in question at a Celtic bar or a Celtic game. Nor have I seen one at an Ireland game.

Someone, presumably a Celtic fan, went to the trouble and expense of getting the flag made.

I don't see how it is any different for a Celtic fan to fly that flag, than it is for NI fans in the SBNISC to fly eg the Union Flag, except of course, that the IRA is/was an illegal organisation, whereas the Union Flag is the universally legally recognised flag of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

The games are well stewarded in this regard with the apparent exception of North of Ireland games.

What similarly provocative flags have you ever seen at a "North of Ireland" [sic] game?

Firstly I have never seen a Celtic fan fly that flag, and would suggest that it is misleading to put this up in a thread. No more that I can pin the murder of Kevin McDaid on Rangers FC is it morally acceptable to blame Celtic or their fans for that flag being made. In any case, it is a republican flag and not an IRA one because the slogan is republican rather than physical force republican.

See here from the Celtic 'TAL' (guess what it stands for) fanzine:

"When TAL was founded the term 'Tiocfaidh Ar La' (Our Day Will Come) seemed to sum up our hopes for our football club which was going through one of the most barren and trophyless periods of its history. The Irish phrase is one coined by republicans and expresses their desire for freedom and their struggle to establish a united 32 County democratic socialist republic in Ireland."

In this sense it may be a political phrase but it is not one which aids, abets or apologises for terrorists. It has been used by non violent republicans for years as well. Therefore by definition, and given that this phrase in itself is not an excuse for nor a glorification of terrorism, it is merely republican in the same way that the union flag is unionist. Despite this strictly political aspect of the flag, it is not allowed in Celtic games. Why then is the union flag and the (outdated) ulster banner permitted to be brought into what is supposedly a neutral ground?

[Evil Genius]

And the same goes for any other country for inviting them to play in a friendly.

Evil, I think my statement covers each and every country that plays a friendly with Israhell.
I make no exceptions at all.

Fair enough. And I assume you would say the same about clubs who sign Israeli players like eg Eyal Berkovic? (Btw, I am not assuming you are a Celtic fan, this is more for the benefit of that fearless opponent of prejudice in whatever form it takes, or wherever it resides, Tony Fearon...)

http://kerrydalestreet.co.uk/topic/8045392/175/

"Celtic was a big mistake for me, that's for sure. Celtic never understood me , and I for sure never understood them. It was a club with an image which was full of its own self importance and role in the world. The club was going through a troubled time and when manager John Barnes got the sack, my days there were numbered. It's hard to say this but I feel that I have to point out that Celtic, certainly at that time did not react well to people who they did not consider were 'one of them". I am Jewish and proud of my religion and background, Barnes and Ian Wright felt the same as me, and they were quickly ostracised when results went against us. After one midweek game which we lost, Wright and Barnes were subject to really disgraceful racial abuse in the car park. It was at that point I knew I had to get out. I found it really disconcerting having to play in front of a huge crowd where many fans had PLO flags and celebrated terrorist actions. They were backing an organization which, after all, wanted the destruction of the State of Israel. How could I give one hundred percent for such a club with an ethos like that?
The Celtic Rangers games were utter madness, and I had to remind myself for which club I was playing! I always stood up for the sovereignty of the nation and the right of law. Celtic seemed to be going for the opposite, by supporting terrorist groups from Spain, Ireland, the Middle East and Africa. It was crazy!"

[Evil Genius]

How do the neo-Nazi/C18 branch of the Norn Iron supporters club square the apparent close ties with Israel?

If you can supply me details of this "neo-Nazi/C18 branch of the Norn Iron supporters club", I'm sure I would be happy to supply you with an answer in return.

For I must confess, in my decades of following Norn Iron, I've never come across such an organisation.

[nifan]

How do the neo-Nazi/C18 branch of the Norn Iron supporters club square the apparent close ties with Israel?

I dont know of such  a branch of the supporters clubs, but i dare say some of the knuckleheads about dont realise that israelis arent prods....

[stibhan]

And the same goes for any other country for inviting them to play in a friendly.

Evil, I think my statement covers each and every country that plays a friendly with Israhell.
I make no exceptions at all.

Fair enough. And I assume you would say the same about clubs who sign Israeli players like eg Eyal Berkovic? (Btw, I am not assuming you are a Celtic fan, this is more for the benefit of that fearless opponent of prejudice in whatever form it takes, or wherever it resides, Tony Fearon...)

http://kerrydalestreet.co.uk/topic/8045392/175/

"Celtic was a big mistake for me, that's for sure. Celtic never understood me , and I for sure never understood them. It was a club with an image which was full of its own self importance and role in the world. The club was going through a troubled time and when manager John Barnes got the sack, my days there were numbered. It's hard to say this but I feel that I have to point out that Celtic, certainly at that time did not react well to people who they did not consider were 'one of them". I am Jewish and proud of my religion and background, Barnes and Ian Wright felt the same as me, and they were quickly ostracised when results went against us. After one midweek game which we lost, Wright and Barnes were subject to really disgraceful racial abuse in the car park. It was at that point I knew I had to get out. I found it really disconcerting having to play in front of a huge crowd where many fans had PLO flags and celebrated terrorist actions. They were backing an organization which, after all, wanted the destruction of the State of Israel. How could I give one hundred percent for such a club with an ethos like that?
The Celtic Rangers games were utter madness, and I had to remind myself for which club I was playing! I always stood up for the sovereignty of the nation and the right of law. Celtic seemed to be going for the opposite, by supporting terrorist groups from Spain, Ireland, the Middle East and Africa. It was crazy!"

Absolutely nothing to do with the club at all. I'm not shying away from responsibility but if you're going to level racist charges at Celtic because their fans allegedly abused Berkovic, Wright and Barnes then we could be here all day calling the IFA out on the actions of their fans. Considering that Bertie Peacock was captain of Celtic, and that many Protestants played for the club, it's a very strange accusation to level at Celtic to suggest that they, as a club, were discriminating against individuals and 'supporting terrorist groups'. The desire for the 'destruction of Israel' is nowhere to be found in the ethos of Celtic, shockingly.