More Double Standards from Irish Republicans

[ardmhachaabu]

Actually it's occurred to me that the main sectarian shibboleth that gets handed down to some on the nationalist side of the fence could be that themmuns are shower of evil supremacist bigots who are bred to be such.

Where did you get this idea from?

Various things including (to pick one relveant example) comments on message boards such as these. For example, the posts single transferable posts of lynchbhoy ("oo/dup/loyalist bigotted mentality you've been brainwashed into", blah, blah), or for example when pintsofguinness throws out the "bigot" word (="Protestant I disagree with" - c.f. Tony Fearon) (one classic example, when I said the PIRA had take some of the responsibility for sustaining the Troubles, and I was accused of being a bigot whot thought "it was all the Taigs' fault". To read these, or the various outpourings of bile on for example, Slugger (sort of sub-Brian Feeney style demonisation) does put that though in my head - and I've been called a "bigot" or similar too many times for daring to have a contrary opinion to dismiss this thought as groundless.

So you base your opinion on what a few people say on the internerd without knowing how they were raised?  Good for you. 

[Rossfan]

The OO doesn't support terrorists. 

No it gets the terrorists to support them.
Remeber one of the first Drumcree stand offs ....Orange Order leaders taking Billy Wright on a tour of the "field" .
Then lo and behold the cowardly sectarian murder of Ml McGoldrick.
And of course there was the 3 Quinn children.

[Myles Na G.]

I think you're right about that. Attitudes on Protestant/unionist side that perpetuate would include things like that - it's somewhat ironic that on the "other side" one of the main sectarian sibboleths is that 'themmuns', unlike 'ussuns', are supremacist bigots who are in-bred with sectarian shibboleths and attitudes, whereas ussuns are generally superior when it comes to all that.

I don't see that written anywhere, but how do you explain the intolerance and sectarianism within unionism i.e., why are the sectarian murders not repeated within nationalism/republicanism?, the racist attacks?, where is the equivalent of the orange and black men?, where are the politicians in the same intolerant model as Wilson?, Paisley, McCausland etc?, why are racist groups such as C18, BNP and NF only accepted within unionist areas?

You're being tongue in cheek here, right? Darkley...Kingsmill...Enniskillen...etc, etc, ad nauseam. Not sectarian and / or racist? Dead on.

[red hander]

I think you're right about that. Attitudes on Protestant/unionist side that perpetuate would include things like that - it's somewhat ironic that on the "other side" one of the main sectarian sibboleths is that 'themmuns', unlike 'ussuns', are supremacist bigots who are in-bred with sectarian shibboleths and attitudes, whereas ussuns are generally superior when it comes to all that.

I don't see that written anywhere, but how do you explain the intolerance and sectarianism within unionism i.e., why are the sectarian murders not repeated within nationalism/republicanism?, the racist attacks?, where is the equivalent of the orange and black men?, where are the politicians in the same intolerant model as Wilson?, Paisley, McCausland etc?, why are racist groups such as C18, BNP and NF only accepted within unionist areas?

You're being tongue in cheek here, right? Darkley...Kingsmill...Enniskillen...etc, etc, ad nauseam. Not sectarian and / or racist? Dead on.

As regards to the murders and racist attacks, it should be fairly obvious to even you that Donagh is talking about post-ceasefire, so throwing in Darkley, Kingsmill and Enniskillen - as disgraceful as they were - is just another example of your pathetic grasping at straws default mode ... where is the equivalent post-ceasefire?

[Evil Genius]

EG what is your problem with people who want a United Ireland? ffs.

Er, you've answered* your own question!  

* - They are "people who want a United Ireland", in case you still don't get it...

You clearly have...       ... [an] agenda against Republicans.

Must be something to do with being a Unionist.

Oh and btw, if you're not sure what a "Unionist" is, there are around a million Unionists to the North and East of Sligo; I daresay if there ever should be a United Ireland, you'll have to get plenty used to us then, so why not make an early start?

You had to be. The most bitter and evil races of people on the planet.

Dear oh Dear. You asked me what my problem is with Irish Republicans, when it should be entirely evident i.e. they want a United Ireland, when I do not. Plus you seem surprised that a Unionsit should have an anti-Republican "agenda".
What next, Republicans pursuing an anti-Unionist agenda?
Perish the thought...

You know i class myself Irish Republican but I dont class my RC. I believe more in Buddhaism than RC beliefs. Some people take Religion too seriously, ffs has anyone in there life experience come across any proof to back up anythng we were told from birth. i guess what im saying I dont give a feck that yer protestants.

Next you start banging on about Religion, completely out of context...

(Btw, I'm not actually a Protestant)

If Unionists are so loyal to the UK why dont ye f**k off back where ye came from across the water if ye dont like it herer? The invisible border 30 miles North of me i do not recognise or ackonowledge it. Ye were never wanted here and im sick of us having to facilitate ye. We'd have way more peace if ye werent here. All ye do is cause trouble and heartache.

Shouldn't you be up in Belfast shouting that at Romanians etc?  

Btw, as someone born and brought up in Ireland, who now lives in GB, does that mean I've already ""f**ked off back where I came from", or have still to do so?  

The last thing I would do is go on a OO discussion forum btw, what the point you being on here EG? You a GAA fan or just a bitter evil trouble maker like most of your kind?

Thank you for that kind welcome. I think I'm getting the hang of this "GAA For All" mullarkey...

[lynchbhoy]

What next, Republicans pursuing an anti-Unionist agenda?
Perish the thought...

LOL
thats just it - they dont !

[Evil Genius]

Some things never change no matter how many holidays I take - death, taxes and Eg spinning lies on GaaBoard. There are no million unionists in Ireland or anywhere else, never have been and never will - a point you conceded to me some time ago.

OK, how about you tell me how many Unionists you think there are in Ireland?
I'm saying there are "around a million"; if you think that is incorrect, then you presumably have some idea what the correct figure is.
(And btw, do you care to quote exactly where/when I "conceded" the point earlier? For if I did do so, I'm sure it was only in order to draw from you your estimate of the true figure)

I'd go for the amount that vote for unionist parties but as it's you that are putting the claim forward the onus in on you to produce the supporting evidence.

Ah, so the only way one can be a "Unionist" is if one votes for a Unionist party in an election?
Does that mean if eg Ian Paisley were suddenly taken sick on the morning of the next election and physically could not get to the Polling Station, he would no longer count as a "Unionist"? And are we to assume that any 16 or 17 year old we saw out marching on the Twelfth etc is not a Unionist either?

Fair enough, for the sake of argument, I'll accept that (or "concede", in your lexicon  ).
In which case, can you tell me how many Nationalists there are in the Six Counties?
For I'm very curious to know, seeing as how there were only 6,463 of them in NI in 1971:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/march/9/newsid_2516000/2516477.stm
I'm sure there are many, many more now, so perhaps they really have all been breeding like the proverbial in the meantime...  

And what's all this "get plenty used to us then" - sure you don't even have a vote here never mind live in Ireland. Whatever future has in store for Ireland, north or south, will have absolutely nothing to do with you have you'll have absolutely no say in it. Ireland's future will be decided by those that live here, not interfering Brits from outside.  

In referring to "us", I meant Irish Unionists. Where I presently  live or vote* etc does not alter my status.
As for "whatever future has in store for Ireland", how do you know where I'll be living next?
Mind you, when it comes to "interfering Brits from outside" not determining Ireland's future, I'll certainly give you that - it'll be around a million Brits, "interfering" or otherwise, from inside Ireland who will decide!  

P.S. When other posters who live outside Ireland, such as (Aussie) Aerlik or (Yankee) Stew etc comment on matters Irish in personal terms, do you ever take them up on it? No?


* - As a British citizen, I am happy to have exercised my vote in elections to the British Parliament ever since I turned 18. Assuming you are an Irish citizen, may I ask how many elections to the Irish Parliament you have voted in?  

You can comment all you like, I'm just saying neither you or they will have any say in the future of this country (Ireland). That privilege is left to those of us who choose to stay when the going was tough.

Wow - "when the going was tough" - your medal's in the post!  
Still, I'd like to know how you are so certain that I will "never" have any say in the future of Ireland - or the 6 northern counties of it, at any rate.
And quite honestly, I don't even have to move to an NI constituency to be able to vote for a Party which forms the next British Government. You know, the one which exercises ultimate jurisdiction over NI.
Frankly, I'm more than satisfied with that, for I would hate to be/want to be a citizen of a country which doesn't even give me a right to vote for that country's Government.
Speaking of which, do you care to remind me of how many times you've exercised your vote to the Irish Parliament...

* - reread the first part of my original reply again maybe a litter slower and you might find the answer - you know the bit that actually addresses and completely refutes your point for starting this thread in the first place and the bit you conveniently choose to ignore.

I did read it, but it does not "completely refute" my point for Irish Republicans generally, only for those sad, die-hards like you, who still cannot bring themselves to face reality and recognise the Irish Republic, never mind Northern Ireland.

P.S. The above was an example of addressing a challenge directly. Any chance you might respond in kind? You know, how many Nationalists there are in NI? How many times you've voted in an Irish General Election? Whether Aerlik and Stew etc are entitled to comment personally on matters Irish etc?  

[Evil Genius]

Roger they [the OO] would be irrevelent to most people if they chose not to walk in areas they are not wanted,

No doubt that would help. And in Ardoyne, at any rate, there seems little doubt that the trouble was caused by people coming in from outside, whom the local people didn't want there.

However.

Not all of these "trouble-making outsiders" may be exactly the people you are thinking of...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/8149203.stm

Father Gerry Donegan, Ardoyne Priest:
"Myself and many people were looking at people last night that we'd never seen in the area before in our lives.

"It was as if people had been bussed into the area for this very purpose and that this was being very much orchestrated.

"What do they bring to the area? Nothing, because when they're all gone those residents who live there, day in day out, still are there to pick up the pieces." 

Gerry Kelly, Sinn Fein:
"The Real IRA, or whatever they may call themselves and some other splinter organisations, sent people over here with the sole aim to cause riots, to bring this further down into sectarianism.

"They had no concern for the people of this area or their safety.

"A lot of these people, the vast majority of these people, they've not come from this area, have nothing here to offer except grief to the people of this area."

Themmuns, eh? 

[Farrandeelin]

Good man Sligonian , I've disagreed with ya on many GAA matters, but on this one, you've got it spot on. Why don't the hoors all go back across the water where they came from??

[Evil Genius]

Good man Sligonian , I've disagreed with ya on many GAA matters, but on this one, you've got it spot on. Why don't the hoors all go back across the water where they came from??

Seeing as Sligonian has so far failed to answer the question I put to him earlier on this very issue, maybe you can solve my conundrum.

You see, I was born and brought up in Ireland, but now live in Great Britain. Does that mean I have already done so or that I have still to do so? 

P.S. Should it be the latter, perhaps I could arrange to swap with one of those Romanians in Belfast we were hearing about a wee while back. You know, those "foreigners" in Ireland who were told by the "locals" to go back where they came from...

[mylestheslasher]

Good man Sligonian , I've disagreed with ya on many GAA matters, but on this one, you've got it spot on. Why don't the hoors all go back across the water where they came from??

Sorry lads but that is not the type of talk a real republican comes out with.

[Myles Na G.]

'As regards to the murders and racist attacks, it should be fairly obvious to even you that Donagh is talking about post-ceasefire, so throwing in Darkley, Kingsmill and Enniskillen - as disgraceful as they were - is just another example of your pathetic grasping at straws default mode ... where is the equivalent post-ceasefire?'

So what Donagh meant to say was that prior to the ceasefires, republicans were every bit as sectarian and racist as the loyalists, but that since the ceasefires republicans have cleaned up their act, whereas loyalists haven't?
He'll be so pleased you've cleared that up for him.

[red hander]

'As regards to the murders and racist attacks, it should be fairly obvious to even you that Donagh is talking about post-ceasefire, so throwing in Darkley, Kingsmill and Enniskillen - as disgraceful as they were - is just another example of your pathetic grasping at straws default mode ... where is the equivalent post-ceasefire?'

So what Donagh meant to say was that prior to the ceasefires, republicans were every bit as sectarian and racist as the loyalists, but that since the ceasefires republicans have cleaned up their act, whereas loyalists haven't?
He'll be so pleased you've cleared that up for him.

There you go again, patronisingly misrepresenting what posters say and twisting it to suit your own blue shirt anti-republican agenda ... answer the question for a change (also give us examples of republican racism pre-ceasefire ... Was Gerry the bass player in a neo-Nazi thrash metal band, perhaps?  Maybe Bobby Storey was grand wizard of the KKK in Turf Lodge?  Or Marty McGuinness moonlighted as a gunner in a Liebstandarte Tiger tank?)

[carribbear]

Loyalists are sectarian.
He'll be so pleased you've cleared that up for him.

aw miles, still trying to put forward the nationalist agenda. Good lad.
Hows the GAA season going with you? Bet you're excited about the Ulster final.
Wouldnt it be great if the Antrim OO went (or marched) to Clones on Sunday to give the lads some support, just to show they're not a sectarian organisation.

[Myles Na G.]

'There you go again, patronisingly misrepresenting what posters say...

I think if you check - big ask for you, I know - you'll find it was your man who sought to qualify and launder what another poster had written.