Author Topic: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling  (Read 7056908 times)

Degrassi Hi

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41880 on: October 28, 2019, 09:03:01 AM »
What will happen in Division 2 if there are more than 2 clubs on 15 points after the last round of fixtures? More playoffs to make playoffs? Aghyaran guaranteed to be on 15 points anyway as Urney have packed up for the year after yesterday. Be interesting to see how the others on 13 fair out. We only have another fortnight to wait to find out!!

WT4E

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41881 on: October 28, 2019, 09:12:37 AM »
Reserve football is dying a slow death - Change is needed ASAP. We will have to break from tradition and split senior & reserve link. Expecting reserves to still be playing football in November is ridiculous.

20 out of 24 reserve games conceded yesterday. Have all 3 reserve championships even been completed? I know the intermediate was on last week but donít think senior has been played and not sure about junior?

Junior reserve championship final still not played. Which is frustrating from our clubs point of view. We where forced by county board to play (tried to get other club to agree change but didn't work for them) semi final 2 days before a senior championship game and with the new rules on player eligibilty our managers obviously had to make a call and prioritised the senior game understandably. We had 4 seniors on the bench. We had thought at the time county board must want to get it wrapped up but still hasn't been played. More BS from county fixtures comm.

clarshack

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41882 on: October 28, 2019, 09:17:38 AM »
Think the reason playoffs were introduced was to stop teams from throwing games a lot earlier in the season. Massive overhaul is needed for club football. Something really needs sorted for Reserve football as it is effectively dead.

Always thought it was a compromise to allow club games to be played on without involvement of county players?

Agree that a major overhaul is needed for club football. The current system isn't sustainable.

Edit: Any word on the proposed Dregish/Newtownstewart amalgamation? No mention of it on either of their FB pages, and Dregish are even advertising a Bazzar fundraiser for 1st December.

Yes that was another big reason for the playoffs as well.

Agree with other poster about decoupling the Reserve League from Senior League.

Goals_Will_Come

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41883 on: October 28, 2019, 09:19:14 AM »
Think the reason playoffs were introduced was to stop teams from throwing games a lot earlier in the season. Massive overhaul is needed for club football. Something really needs sorted for Reserve football as it is effectively dead.

Always thought it was a compromise to allow club games to be played on without involvement of county players?

Agree that a major overhaul is needed for club football. The current system isn't sustainable.

Edit: Any word on the proposed Dregish/Newtownstewart amalgamation? No mention of it on either of their FB pages, and Dregish are even advertising a Bazzar fundraiser for 1st December.
They will be playing next year under the name Naomh Eoghan.

square_ball

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41884 on: October 28, 2019, 09:24:58 AM »
If Newtownstewart stay up I assume this new amalgamation will stay in division 2? I remember when Clan na Gael formed they started life in division 3. Though maybe those clubs that joined were already in division 3? One for Fionntamhnach to answer maybe.

Fionntamhnach

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41885 on: October 28, 2019, 09:32:45 AM »
What will happen in Division 2 if there are more than 2 clubs on 15 points after the last round of fixtures? More playoffs to make playoffs? Aghyaran guaranteed to be on 15 points anyway as Urney have packed up for the year after yesterday. Be interesting to see how the others on 13 fair out. We only have another fortnight to wait to find out!!

Probably. When three or more clubs are involved, score difference comes into play. However if any of the teams in question either conceded or were given a walkover in any league game then they must play-off for the final league position if it concerns relegation or promotion. So if Augher is among any of those whom finish on say 15pts on a three-way or bigger tie, then play-off matches will be required to determine who finishes sixth in the final league table for the promotion play-offs.

If you were to "freeze" the Division 2 table as it stands, Galbally would win the league, Loughmacrory would take automatic promotion, Pomeroy, Clogher & Owen Roes would enter the promotion play-offs, while there would be a five-way play-off for the final spot between Augher, Greencastle, Gortin, Aghyaran & Moortown due to Augher giving Owen Roes a w/o. This would involve three "rounds" of games, with the eventual winner meeting Pomeroy in the promotion play-offs, while Clogher & Owen Roes would face each other in the other game.

Talk about grim. 😧
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Pearse Blue

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41886 on: October 28, 2019, 09:35:15 AM »
What will happen in Division 2 if there are more than 2 clubs on 15 points after the last round of fixtures? More playoffs to make playoffs? Aghyaran guaranteed to be on 15 points anyway as Urney have packed up for the year after yesterday. Be interesting to see how the others on 13 fair out. We only have another fortnight to wait to find out!!

Probably. When three or more clubs are involved, score difference comes into play. However if any of the teams in question either conceded or were given a walkover in any league game then they must play-off for the final league position if it concerns relegation or promotion. So if Augher is among any of those whom finish on say 15pts on a three-way or bigger tie, then play-off matches will be required to determine who finishes sixth in the final league table for the promotion play-offs.

If you were to "freeze" the Division 2 table as it stands, Galbally would win the league, Loughmacrory would take automatic promotion, Pomeroy, Clogher & Owen Roes would enter the promotion play-offs, while there would be a five-way play-off for the final spot between Augher, Greencastle, Gortin, Aghyaran & Moortown due to Augher giving Owen Roes a w/o. This would involve three "rounds" of games, with the eventual winner meeting Pomeroy in the promotion play-offs, while Clogher & Owen Roes would face each other in the other game.

Talk about grim. 😧
I didn't think it went into a play off for a play off spot? I thought it went to Head to Head and point difference

Fionntamhnach

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41887 on: October 28, 2019, 09:43:27 AM »
If Newtownstewart stay up I assume this new amalgamation will stay in division 2? I remember when Clan na Gael formed they started life in division 3. Though maybe those clubs that joined were already in division 3? One for Fionntamhnach to answer maybe.

First, thanks GWC.

Secondly IIRC both Dunnamanagh & Aughabrack were playing at Junior level when they amalgamated to become Clann na nGael, so there was never any debate as to what division or grade they would start in. Usually in most cases concerning sports competitions, if an amalgamation between two or more clubs or teams occur where said clubs would otherwise compete in different leagues or grades the following season, the newly amalgamated side would compete in the highest league or grade one of those teams would have competed in that season, essentially as a "successor" team as that team has not effectively withdrawn from competition. So if NTS were to be in a position to remain in Division 2 & Intermediate for 2020, I'd be 99% certain the new "Naomh Eoghain" would simply take their place, while Division 3 & Junior would be reduced to 16 teams (assuming the inclusion of EC3).
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clarshack

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41888 on: October 28, 2019, 09:46:24 AM »
I didn't think it went into a play off for a play off spot? I thought it went to Head to Head and point difference

In an ideal world there wouldn't be playoffs to decide playoffs, but score difference can't be used if any games involving those teams have been conceded during the season.
Think there needs to be a big deterrent in the way of a huge fine for those teams that do concede games at Senior level.

Whatever the truth is about the Loughmacrory/Strabane game, there's something badly wrong when a team concedes a game even though they need points to stay out of the relegation zone.

« Last Edit: October 28, 2019, 09:51:37 AM by clarshack »

GetOverTheBar

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41889 on: October 28, 2019, 09:53:29 AM »
What will happen in Division 2 if there are more than 2 clubs on 15 points after the last round of fixtures? More playoffs to make playoffs? Aghyaran guaranteed to be on 15 points anyway as Urney have packed up for the year after yesterday. Be interesting to see how the others on 13 fair out. We only have another fortnight to wait to find out!!

Probably. When three or more clubs are involved, score difference comes into play. However if any of the teams in question either conceded or were given a walkover in any league game then they must play-off for the final league position if it concerns relegation or promotion. So if Augher is among any of those whom finish on say 15pts on a three-way or bigger tie, then play-off matches will be required to determine who finishes sixth in the final league table for the promotion play-offs.

If you were to "freeze" the Division 2 table as it stands, Galbally would win the league, Loughmacrory would take automatic promotion, Pomeroy, Clogher & Owen Roes would enter the promotion play-offs, while there would be a five-way play-off for the final spot between Augher, Greencastle, Gortin, Aghyaran & Moortown due to Augher giving Owen Roes a w/o. This would involve three "rounds" of games, with the eventual winner meeting Pomeroy in the promotion play-offs, while Clogher & Owen Roes would face each other in the other game.

Talk about grim. 😧
I didn't think it went into a play off for a play off spot? I thought it went to Head to Head and point difference

No playoffs for a playoff spot as I understand, only to decide a league title?

LeoMc

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41890 on: October 28, 2019, 09:54:57 AM »
What will happen in Division 2 if there are more than 2 clubs on 15 points after the last round of fixtures? More playoffs to make playoffs? Aghyaran guaranteed to be on 15 points anyway as Urney have packed up for the year after yesterday. Be interesting to see how the others on 13 fair out. We only have another fortnight to wait to find out!!

Probably. When three or more clubs are involved, score difference comes into play. However if any of the teams in question either conceded or were given a walkover in any league game then they must play-off for the final league position if it concerns relegation or promotion. So if Augher is among any of those whom finish on say 15pts on a three-way or bigger tie, then play-off matches will be required to determine who finishes sixth in the final league table for the promotion play-offs.

If you were to "freeze" the Division 2 table as it stands, Galbally would win the league, Loughmacrory would take automatic promotion, Pomeroy, Clogher & Owen Roes would enter the promotion play-offs, while there would be a five-way play-off for the final spot between Augher, Greencastle, Gortin, Aghyaran & Moortown due to Augher giving Owen Roes a w/o. This would involve three "rounds" of games, with the eventual winner meeting Pomeroy in the promotion play-offs, while Clogher & Owen Roes would face each other in the other game.

Talk about grim. 😧
I didn't think it went into a play off for a play off spot? I thought it went to Head to Head and point difference
Those are higher ranked criteria but with 5 teams you cant use Head to Head and with games being conceded you cant use point difference.

Fionntamhnach

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41891 on: October 28, 2019, 10:05:05 AM »
2019 Tyrone CCC Regulations

http://tyronegaa.ie/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/2019-Tyrone-CCC-Regulations.pdf

Paragraph 23

Quote
When teams finish with equal points for qualification for the concluding staged, or for promotion or relegation, the tie shall be decided by the following means and in the order specified:

i) The outcome of the meeting(s) of the teams in the previous game(s) in the competition
ii) The largest scoring difference (subtracting the total scores against from the total scores for) in the meetings of the teams in the previous game(s)
iii) The highest total scores for, in the meeting(s) of the teams in the previous game(s)
iv) Largest overall league scoring difference (subtracting the total scores against from total scores for)
v) The highest overall league total score for
vi) A playoff

Exceptions:
a) In relation to means outlined in (ii), (iii), (iv) and (v) above, if the accumulated scores of a team, so involved, are affected by a disqualification, loss of game on a proven objection, retirement or walk over, the tie shall be decided by playoff.
b) Regulations (i), (ii), (iii), (iv) and (v) shall not apply to Under16 or younger age grade  competitions

The above rules are derived from those in the 2019 GAA Official Guide, Part One, 6.21 (4) and 6.38 (a).

https://www.gaa.ie/news/2019-official-gaa-guide/
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Fionntamhnach

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41892 on: October 28, 2019, 10:15:48 AM »
In an ideal world there wouldn't be playoffs to decide playoffs, but score difference can't be used if any games involving those teams have been conceded during the season.
Think there needs to be a big deterrent in the way of a huge fine for those teams that do concede games at Senior level.

Whatever the truth is about the Loughmacrory/Strabane game, there's something badly wrong when a team concedes a game even though they need points to stay out of the relegation zone.

There are two, non-monetary ways in dealing with this that are done in some other Ulster counties...

1. A team failing to field or have a tie awarded against them on a proven objection etc. is subject to being deducted one or two league points for that fixture.

2. Every team is awarded one league point for completing a fixture, with an additional four points for the winners and two points for a draw in each fixture played. So essentially it is 5pts for a win, 3pts for a draw & 1pt for a loss. If a team fails to field, concedes a walkover etc. they receive no league points, whilst the other team gets five league points as it would be assumed  that they would have fielded. In an event of a fixture being scratched or a (rare) double walkover, no points are awarded to either team.
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Onthe40

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41893 on: October 28, 2019, 10:20:42 AM »
What will happen in Division 2 if there are more than 2 clubs on 15 points after the last round of fixtures? More playoffs to make playoffs? Aghyaran guaranteed to be on 15 points anyway as Urney have packed up for the year after yesterday. Be interesting to see how the others on 13 fair out. We only have another fortnight to wait to find out!!

Is that Urney in junior?

Weren't they senior 2 years ago?

GetOverTheBar

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Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #41894 on: October 28, 2019, 10:35:35 AM »
What will happen in Division 2 if there are more than 2 clubs on 15 points after the last round of fixtures? More playoffs to make playoffs? Aghyaran guaranteed to be on 15 points anyway as Urney have packed up for the year after yesterday. Be interesting to see how the others on 13 fair out. We only have another fortnight to wait to find out!!

Is that Urney in junior?

Weren't they senior 2 years ago?

Back to back relegations. Urney are a great club, but they are stuggling badly with numbers as most clubs outside the big 5/6.