Author Topic: The Many Faces of US Politics...  (Read 288359 times)

vallankumous

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7095 on: January 11, 2017, 02:37:43 PM »

Donald Trump's twitter account is verified as his own and he has confirmed it is his own so it is an extremely valid source of information to that end!!!

It's an extremely valuable tool for Trump beating lots of nails in 40 characters or less.

vallankumous

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7096 on: January 11, 2017, 02:41:16 PM »


How do you know?

I've no way of knowing either way, but the intelligence agencies were supposedly concerned enough to tell him and Obama they were looking into it.

Like I said, a bit of transparency from Trump would go a long way. They've previously acknowledged a lot of business entanglements with the Russians.

I don't know really i'm just forming an opinion from the info i've seen.

I suppose that's their job. Potential scandal for the President and President elect and they inform them. I'd say it's common.
Business men do business. What the issue there?

screenexile

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7097 on: January 11, 2017, 02:45:21 PM »


How do you know?

I've no way of knowing either way, but the intelligence agencies were supposedly concerned enough to tell him and Obama they were looking into it.

Like I said, a bit of transparency from Trump would go a long way. They've previously acknowledged a lot of business entanglements with the Russians.

I don't know really i'm just forming an opinion from the info i've seen.

I suppose that's their job. Potential scandal for the President and President elect and they inform them. I'd say it's common.
Business men do business. What the issue there?

He's not a business man anymore... at least he's not supposed to be!!!

Gabriel_Hurl

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7098 on: January 11, 2017, 03:05:52 PM »
He's not a business man anymore... at least he's not supposed to be!!!

He's in the business of Making American Great Again  :P

screenexile

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7099 on: January 11, 2017, 03:35:39 PM »
He's not a business man anymore... at least he's not supposed to be!!!

He's in the business of Making American Great Again  :P

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J70

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7100 on: January 11, 2017, 04:28:09 PM »


How do you know?

I've no way of knowing either way, but the intelligence agencies were supposedly concerned enough to tell him and Obama they were looking into it.

Like I said, a bit of transparency from Trump would go a long way. They've previously acknowledged a lot of business entanglements with the Russians.

I don't know really i'm just forming an opinion from the info i've seen.

I suppose that's their job. Potential scandal for the President and President elect and they inform them. I'd say it's common.
Business men do business. What the issue there?

Seriously?

Conflicts of interest.

What happens if he has to make a decision which is influenced by one of his or his family's business interests?

vallankumous

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7101 on: January 11, 2017, 05:05:13 PM »

Seriously?

Conflicts of interest.

What happens if he has to make a decision which is influenced by one of his or his family's business interests?

He's not the President.

So what if he's influenced. It happens all the time. That's why we have lobbyists and why we have systems of accountability and separation of powers.

J70

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7102 on: January 11, 2017, 05:47:08 PM »

Seriously?

Conflicts of interest.

What happens if he has to make a decision which is influenced by one of his or his family's business interests?

He's not the President.

So what if he's influenced. It happens all the time. That's why we have lobbyists and why we have systems of accountability and separation of powers.

So you're ok with a country's leader potentially placing the needs of his personal fortune and finances above what is best for the country?

You have trust in the GOP-controlled congress as watchdogs?

There's a reason why past presidents have placed their business interests into blind trusts. Trumps refuses to do this and to cut any ties, beyond turning the management over to his kids (reconfirmed mere minutes ago).

This all from a man who was campaigned on corruption and "draining the swamp" (yes, I know it was cynicism on his part).


vallankumous

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7103 on: January 11, 2017, 05:58:32 PM »

So you're ok with a country's leader potentially placing the needs of his personal fortune and finances above what is best for the country?

You have trust in the GOP-controlled congress as watchdogs?

There's a reason why past presidents have placed their business interests into blind trusts. Trumps refuses to do this and to cut any ties, beyond turning the management over to his kids (reconfirmed mere minutes ago).

This all from a man who was campaigned on corruption and "draining the swamp" (yes, I know it was cynicism on his part).

I'm not happy or sad about it. I don't assume he will do that. I respect the outcome of the vote and the political institutions in the USA. I understand the possibility there is for corruption. There is nothing new here. Every leader of ever Country has the potential to put the needs of their personal wealth first.
There is nothing new in friends and family of Presidents having private interests. There is nothing new in Presidents working after they retire from the White House. And there's certainly nothing new in someone campaigning on one thing and doing another.

J70

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7104 on: January 11, 2017, 06:25:28 PM »

So you're ok with a country's leader potentially placing the needs of his personal fortune and finances above what is best for the country?

You have trust in the GOP-controlled congress as watchdogs?

There's a reason why past presidents have placed their business interests into blind trusts. Trumps refuses to do this and to cut any ties, beyond turning the management over to his kids (reconfirmed mere minutes ago).

This all from a man who was campaigned on corruption and "draining the swamp" (yes, I know it was cynicism on his part).

I'm not happy or sad about it. I don't assume he will do that. I respect the outcome of the vote and the political institutions in the USA. I understand the possibility there is for corruption. There is nothing new here. Every leader of ever Country has the potential to put the needs of their personal wealth first.
There is nothing new in friends and family of Presidents having private interests. There is nothing new in Presidents working after they retire from the White House. And there's certainly nothing new in someone campaigning on one thing and doing another.

What is new is the refusal of the president to put his direct personal financial interests off the table. What is fairly new is the deep and bitter partisanship in DC and the country in general. Sure, lone GOP voices like McCain or Graham might raise concerns about something Trump is doing, but if you think Trump is going to be subject to even a small fraction of the oversight that the GOP gave to, say, Hillary Clinton, you're deluded.

vallankumous

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7105 on: January 11, 2017, 06:38:23 PM »


What is new is the refusal of the president to put his direct personal financial interests off the table. What is fairly new is the deep and bitter partisanship in DC and the country in general. Sure, lone GOP voices like McCain or Graham might raise concerns about something Trump is doing, but if you think Trump is going to be subject to even a small fraction of the oversight that the GOP gave to, say, Hillary Clinton, you're deluded.

Meh, that's the new birth certificate scandal as far as I care.

Oversight? It's a fecking democracy. That's how it works. Same as was here. We have a massive FG LB Gov and they also controlled the councils and the senate. FG had also the support of the richest man in Ireland. I hated that but I put up with it as that's how it was. We had our choice and we made it.

I've no time for Donald Trump, same as the next man. But I do think he is held to a different standard by the international community.
Maybe I am deluded, I don't know how to counter that.
« Last Edit: January 11, 2017, 06:41:31 PM by vallankumous »

J70

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7106 on: January 11, 2017, 06:57:52 PM »


What is new is the refusal of the president to put his direct personal financial interests off the table. What is fairly new is the deep and bitter partisanship in DC and the country in general. Sure, lone GOP voices like McCain or Graham might raise concerns about something Trump is doing, but if you think Trump is going to be subject to even a small fraction of the oversight that the GOP gave to, say, Hillary Clinton, you're deluded.

Meh, that's the new birth certificate scandal as far as I care.

Oversight? It's a fecking democracy. That's how it works. Same as was here. We have a massive FG LB Gov and they also controlled the councils and the senate. FG had also the support of the richest man in Ireland. I hated that but I put up with it as that's how it was. We had our choice and we made it.

I've no time for Donald Trump, same as the next man. But I do think he is held to a different standard by the international community.

Just because YOU don't care doesn't mean it's not a concern. And what standard is he being held to that his predecessors have not?

And I'm not arguing against the GOP controlling congress and the White House. I'm saying that Trump is refusing to take the normal measures that presidents do to avoid ethical problems and conflicts of interest, and that because of the GOP control, the checks and balances to counter or examine any issues may not exist. Which makes what he is doing even more of a concern.

The birth certificate was a baseless, paranoid, conspiracy theory. This issue is merely asking that Trump do what his predecessors did and leave his personal financial and business considerations outside the door when he has to make decisions on behalf of his constituents.

J70

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7107 on: January 11, 2017, 07:14:45 PM »
I do see, however, where someone might dismiss this due to cynicism about money and influence in the entire American political process, especially in the aftermath of Citizens United. Basically, if they're going to line the pockets or look after the interests of donors, then why does themselves and their family matter?

Eamonnca1

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7108 on: January 11, 2017, 07:37:52 PM »
Meh, that's the new birth certificate scandal as far as I care.

Sweet Jesus.

whitey

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Re: The Many Faces of US Politics...
« Reply #7109 on: January 11, 2017, 08:42:17 PM »


What is new is the refusal of the president to put his direct personal financial interests off the table. What is fairly new is the deep and bitter partisanship in DC and the country in general. Sure, lone GOP voices like McCain or Graham might raise concerns about something Trump is doing, but if you think Trump is going to be subject to even a small fraction of the oversight that the GOP gave to, say, Hillary Clinton, you're deluded.

Meh, that's the new birth certificate scandal as far as I care.

Oversight? It's a fecking democracy. That's how it works. Same as was here. We have a massive FG LB Gov and they also controlled the councils and the senate. FG had also the support of the richest man in Ireland. I hated that but I put up with it as that's how it was. We had our choice and we made it.

I've no time for Donald Trump, same as the next man. But I do think he is held to a different standard by the international community.

Just because YOU don't care doesn't mean it's not a concern. And what standard is he being held to that his predecessors have not?

And I'm not arguing against the GOP controlling congress and the White House. I'm saying that Trump is refusing to take the normal measures that presidents do to avoid ethical problems and conflicts of interest, and that because of the GOP control, the checks and balances to counter or examine any issues may not exist. Which makes what he is doing even more of a concern.

The birth certificate was a baseless, paranoid, conspiracy theory. This issue is merely asking that Trump do what his predecessors did and leave his personal financial and business considerations outside the door when he has to make decisions on behalf of his constituents.

I love the new found fascination with ethics and conflicts of interests........where was that same concern when the Clintons were lining their pockets?

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2016/10/27/memo-shows-bill-clintons-wealth-tied-clinton-foundation/92842822/


Band wrote. I could add 500 different examples of things like this.