Closing off county panels

[the Deel Rover]

Good post ICC, we also got to The Ai club semi in 2000 which would have ruled him out of most of that campaign as well . At the end of the day Mc Loves playing football for either for club and county jesus the man has played over 60 championship games for cross alone never mind league games i actually doubt there have been many players in mayo that have played more games than him the past 15 years . Stephenite comment is thrown a lot at Mc that he doesn't bother with the league and that he is only interested in championship  however at the end of the day people have also to realise work came into it as well the nature of his work brings him all over the country and previous managers knew this and worked around this at the end of the dayas stephenite said he won't be drafted in to playing for mayo however  i'm glad that he can still do his stuff for cross. 

[Sligoper]

I have always been in suport of the grant but now this is where things are gunna get sticky! In my own county, there was a rake of lads brought in to the panel after the u21s lost! Apparently what Jordan does is pick 30 lads and bring them to the game and leaves 6 or 7 behind? Now what happnes with the grant? How are they going to pick 30 players out of the 36? Every county needs more than thirty on a panel because there are always a majority of lads away for training. This Grants is going to cause rows. Watch it here.
Its not fair on the other lads who have been trainin just as hard as their teammates, made the same sacrifices and then miss out! Its just wrong and i cant see how teh problem will be fixed? I doubt there is any county with just 30 players?

[the Deel Rover]

I have always been in suport of the grant but now this is where things are gunna get sticky! In my own county, there was a rake of lads brought in to the panel after the u21s lost! Apparently what Jordan does is pick 30 lads and bring them to the game and leaves 6 or 7 behind? Now what happnes with the grant? How are they going to pick 30 players out of the 36? Every county needs more than thirty on a panel because there are always a majority of lads away for training. This Grants is going to cause rows. Watch it here.
Its not fair on the other lads who have been trainin just as hard as their teammates, made the same sacrifices and then miss out! Its just wrong and i cant see how teh problem will be fixed? I doubt there is any county with just 30 players?

Well i think thats what Lar was asking this question nothing to do with Ciaran Mc , for e.g are we just working with a panel of 25 -26 when we are carring a few injuries on the county boards say so because of the Grants or is it John o' Decision ? i can't imagine that he worked with a smaller panel of 30 when he won the Ai's with galway i could be wrong bit i doubt it.

[Sligoper]

I rememeber reading on hoganstand how two players can't remember their names had been ommited from Loais's championship panel. So i presume Mayo arn't the county. Surely it is going to cause hassle, lads wont stick around just to train with the county! Previously they would have but now that the Grant has came in you can be sure they won't? And do you blame them? I know it's a good experince, can improve you etc but if one lad is getting at least 1500euro and the other isn't then you can be sure things won't go down well!

[ildanach]

I have always been in suport of the grant but now this is where things are gunna get sticky! In my own county, there was a rake of lads brought in to the panel after the u21s lost! Apparently what Jordan does is pick 30 lads and bring them to the game and leaves 6 or 7 behind? Now what happnes with the grant? How are they going to pick 30 players out of the 36? Every county needs more than thirty on a panel because there are always a majority of lads away for training. This Grants is going to cause rows. Watch it here.
Its not fair on the other lads who have been trainin just as hard as their teammates, made the same sacrifices and then miss out! Its just wrong and i cant see how teh problem will be fixed? I doubt there is any county with just 30 players?

If C McD was to come back i don't think he would give a shit about money. In the interview in the paper he said he didn't claim expenses during his inter county career. I don't think money motivates him.

McDonald not being on the panel is the reason Johnno was not at the Crossmolina game, and I doubt if he'll attend any Cross games this year. You are correct in that I am away but it doesn't change my opinions, which are something along these lines.

Johnno has seen him play i heard him on midwest the day after the mcd interview in the paper saying he had seen him play Ballaghadreen and that anyone performing well would not be overlooked.

I think that after the sligo game (should we win!!) we could see him back in the panel. Johnno is in a win win situation if he brings him back. McD plays well , we win a connacht title and Johnno is a hero. If he brings hime back and we loose and mcd  plays shit,johnno goes well it was pressure from within the county to bring him back that forced his hand!
For my two cent worth i would like to see him back as he seems to be playing very well at the minute and god knows none of our other forwards seem to be setting the world on fire.

[Sligoper]

Yes im sure Ciaran wont but to be hoenst I dont give a f**k about McDonald and whether he takes the money or not. All im saying is that the grant will cause hassle when 30 cheques will be given out to 36 people?

As i Sligoman i i wouldnt like to see him anywhere near the Mayo team before June 22nd, after that though i would, a joy yo watch.
Anyway the grants has fucked things up.

[stephenite]

I have always felt that Ciaran Mac had some reservations playing for certain Mayo managers and his lack of appearances in the majority of league campaigns over the years back up this theory, coupled with the notion that he doesn't need to play in a trial game

The diligence of the marvellous Willie Joe in keeping statistics for Mayo's games for the past fourteen years lets us finally put this one to bed once and for all.

Here are Willie's stats: http://mayogaablog.com/?page_id=222

95 league games since Ciarán McDonald made his debut in November 1994 (or near enough - some of the stats are missing). McDonald played in 37 of them, which is an appearance rate of 38% of all possible games played.

All possible games played. Crossmolina got to two All-Ireland Finals, in 2001 and 03, which clashed with league fixtures. Rule McDonald out of selection for these. That brings him up to 45%.

Allow for time in the States in 1996, and his retirement after that infamous game against Fermanagh - 53% per cent appearance rate.

Allow for the fact that we have his own manager's word for it that he wasn't considered for selection for the league in 2007 and 2008 due to a back injury, and that brings his appearance rate to 67%.

67% of league games isn't bad, especially when you consider that we don't have stats for games when he may have sat on the bench, or mightn't even have been selected. Crossmolina duty would have ruled him out for more games than I've allowed also.

Stephenite makes a sweeping and unfortunate statement about "his lack of appearances in the majority of league campaigns." Campaigns is an unfortunate word to use here. Looking at Willie Joe's stats, Ciarán McDonald played in 10 of 14 league campaigns since he's come on the scene. Allowing for club commitments and being out of the country the only league campaign that he missed and for which we have no evidence that he should or shouldn't have been there is 2004, when he missed all seven games in the league. Mayo got to the All-Ireland final that year.

Case closed?

Case closed indeed ICC. I'll hold the hands up and thanks for the correction, a sweeping statement indeed. Apologies to Mr Ciaran Mac.

I'm now wondering what it is that left me with that impression in the first place, I'd be of a similair age to Ciaran and thought I would have attended a fair sprinkling of league games during his playing days - apparently not

[Lar Naparka]

I think it really is amazing that no county board or manager either, has seen fit to spell out publicly what the grant scheme entails and how it will apply to any county panel.

Shark did write in one of the first posts on this topic that Westmeath seem to be operating with a panel of 34 or so and Sligoper's account of how Jordan is playing fast and loose with his panel in Sligo would seem to suggest that a panel of only 30 named players will be eligible for grant money when the divvy-out occurs.
Going by those posts and by some sketchy publicity when the grants scheme was first set up, I think that each county must submit a named panel of 30 players for grant purposes.
What happens when other lads are added to a county panel is unclear; the supernumeraries can certainly play but whether they can avail of any grant money or not has never been confirmed or denied by anyone in a position to do so.
With regard to Mayo, O'Mahony seems to have been correct at the outset in saying he wanted to finalise a panel of 30. However, his subsequent 'clarification' of the position on MWR appears to be causing a degree of unrest and uncertainty amongst his chosen flock.
He does not appear to have followed up on this with either his players or with the public; will the addition of anyone else mean that such a player will participate without being included on the grants list or will his addition mean that someone already on this list will drop off it?
It's fair to say there may be trouble ahead in other counties as well.
In the words of Sligoper:

Anyway the grants has fucked things up.

[Sligoper]

Well said Lar Naparka!
Finally people see where i'm coming from! Great point about how its strange that no county official has pointed this problem out and also i found it difficult to beleive that the crowd who were against the grants didnt use this a major point? I would love to see a flustered Dessie explain how 6 lads or seven lads are not entitled to the grant!
It will all turn messy at the end of the playing year when players are looking for cheques and not getting them. My guess is that these extra players in county panels are probably young lads or u21s and will be filled with shite talk to get around the problem.

[moysider]

It still brings us around to the vexed question whether Johnno use the grants as an excuse to force the MacDonald move through? Or did he genuinely believe he had to leave him off if he did not declare his intentions to be involved at by a certain date? I dont care much about the grants but I do care if this initiative by the GPA has even contributed to the situation where our best footballer will not be playing for us this Summer or probably never again.

[Hound]

Or did he genuinely believe he had to leave him off if he did not declare his intentions to be involved at by a certain date? I dont care much about the grants but I do care if this initiative by the GPA has even contributed to the situation where our best footballer will not be playing for us this Summer or probably never again.

Fair play to Johnno. I thought there wouldnt be any naive enough to be fooled by his strategy. But I was wrong...

[moysider]

Not fooled at all as my earlier posts on the Mac controversy would show but I have to be seen to be fair to the man anyway.

[Lar Naparka]

Fair play to Johnno. I thought there wouldnt be any naive enough to be fooled by his strategy. But I was wrong...

Good man Hound, I think you are bang on here.
I don’t really want to go back over old ground, what’s done is done, but those who question Mac’s number of league appearances for Mayo should remember that he was sidelined throughout the 2006 league run with a long-standing back injury and there was considerable speculation as to whether we’d see him at the start o f the championships or not.
At any rate, Mickey and Beefer certainly seemed to accept that his problem was genuine and we know the part he played in the run to the All-Ireland Final.
Last year, sometime around Christmas, he suffered a serious hand injury at work and there was genuine concern that he might not recover full use of the hand again. That was also widely reported in the media.
He was on the bench for the championship game in Salthill and was sent on when the cause was well and truly lost, with his hand heavily strapped and in obvious discomfort.
People tend to say that the row between Mac and the Messiah was about him being sent on against Derry when the player thought he was fit enough to start but I’m told it really happened after the Galway match.
Mac did a rare up because he was obviously unfit to play and was shoved on in a last, desperate attempt to save the day.
O’Mahony does not take kindly to being told what he should do with himself and decided there and then that he would have no more guff from Mac or anyone else. I’m told that’s the reason why McDonald was confined to the bench for the Derry game and was only sent on, once more, when the cause was lost.
It’s a case of having only one bull in any field at a time and O’Mahony was going to be that bull on his patch of ground.
I don’t think he ever intended playing Mac again.