Why do these fraudsters keep getting re-elected?

[Eamonnca1]

What is it with this "he fixed the road" syndrome? Why do crooks and fraudsters like Michael Lowry keep topping the polls instead of being hounded out of office in disgrace?  Is there something in the voters' mentality that sympathises with them? Is it the anti-establishment mentality? The idea that people in authority are not to be trusted, and anyone who games the system is admired for it no matter how much damage they end up doing to the country as a whole? I mean, in a "nation of begrudgers" there's no reason why the working man would go out and support someone who helped a big shot like Denis O'Brien to become the second richest man in Ireland. But that seems to be what's happening, people are led to vote for something that ends up actually working against their own interest.

Boggles the mind.

[AZOffaly]

What is it with this "he fixed the road" syndrome? Why do crooks and fraudsters like Michael Lowry keep topping the polls instead of being hounded out of office in disgrace?  Is there something in the voters' mentality that sympathises with them? Is it the anti-establishment mentality? The idea that people in authority are not to be trusted, and anyone who games the system is admired for it no matter how much damage they end up doing to the country as a whole? I mean, in a "nation of begrudgers" there's no reason why the working man would go out and support someone who helped a big shot like Denis O'Brien to become the second richest man in Ireland. But that seems to be what's happening, people are led to vote for something that ends up actually working against their own interest.

Boggles the mind.

The irony of someone in the States finding this 'boggling' is quite amusing. What do you think if the various lobby groups and vested interests in the States Eamonn? And the people then voting for the politicians who have auctioned their congress/senate vote? Are they ' led to vote for something that ends up actually working against their own interest. '

The urge to bash Ireland, as if it's the only nation in the world with these issues, is quite annoying, and navel gazing at it's worst.

[Eamonnca1]

Detour:

It's a complete change of subject but I happen to think the US is a lot worse, actually. The voters of North Tipperary are like PhDs compared to the people who vote for idiots like Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachman and the like. To win a GOP nomination you have to proclaim your ignorance and superstition at the top of your lungs and denounce educated people as "elitist". If you want me to start another thread on US politics I'll be happy to, but I already have a good understanding of why these people get so many votes. The voters are as thick as champ and the right wing has become very good at tapping into the base instincts of ignorant people.

End of detour.

But my question was about people like Michael Lowry and it's a genuine question. If there's anybody out there who goes on voting for these people after they've been exposed as fraudsters I'd be really interested in hearing how your mind works. I want to know why you do it. Is it because you support political parties the same way people support football teams? Is it tradition? What?

[AZOffaly]

Fair enough, and it's a good question. Just not confined to Ireland. Let's be honest, it's human nature to look out for yourself, and if Lowry, and his ilk, can convince people that he will 'do things' for them, from planning, to bending ears to get a new road etc etc, then he will benefit. Some people cannot see the greater good, and everyone wants their snout in the trough.

Everyone wants honest politicians, just as long as they look after me.

It's like the famous saying, 'Lord make me chaste, but not yet'.

[Eamonnca1]

Fair enough, and it's a good question. Just not confined to Ireland. Let's be honest, it's human nature to look out for yourself, and if Lowry, and his ilk, can convince people that he will 'do things' for them, from planning, to bending ears to get a new road etc etc, then he will benefit. Some people cannot see the greater good, and everyone wants their snout in the trough.

Everyone wants honest politicians, just as long as they look after me.

It's like the famous saying, 'Lord make me chaste, but not yet'.

I think you might have nailed it there. We have a similar problem here but for different reasons.  In the US there's an inherent distrust of government that I find completely baffling (it's not exactly communist China here) but it's a very strong meme. I think they've inherited it from their colonial days when there were keen to make sure that nobody could become king and they put all sorts of measures in place to stop that from happening. They also didn't want a very centralised system in the early days of the union, so they've inherited a lot of practices that made sense for 13 small colonies but don't make much sense for 50 states, many of which are bigger than the original 13 colonies combined. (To wit, the electoral college AKA affirmative action for rednecks.) Hence it can be very hard to get things done at the federal level.

In Ireland there's an inherent hostility to authority which I think is a hangover from British rule.  Look at the way people talked about seat belts when they were made mandatory, then the smoking ban more recently. It was all about how the big bad government is picking on us and never about why these things were actually needed. I remember getting in the car years ago and my brother didn't put his seat belt on, so I reminded him. He said there was no need because there wasn't likely to be a police checkpoint where we were going. The possibility of the seat belt saving his life in an accident didn't cross his mind, to him it was all about scoring another little victory over the evil authorities.

Hostility to authority may have had its place when the place was ruled by the British, but it's outgrown its usefulness and it's become our undoing.  People like Denis O'Brien and Michael Lowry seem to think it's okay to pull a few strings and help out their mates, and then the voters don't seem to realise how that kind of skullduggery undermines the country as a whole and can end up costing taxpayers more in the end.

It's as if people don't understand how things work. Roads, schools, hospitals, airports, railways, it all just appears by magic. They don't seem to realise that it's all there because we all throw a bit of money into the pot and use it to provide these things. If shady people sneakily dip their hands into that pot and help themselves then they're celebrated as if they're "sticking it to the man" when in reality they're sticking it to the people.

[All of a Sludden]

Why do crooks and fraudsters like Michael Lowry keep topping the polls instead of being hounded out of office in disgrace?

The home of Independent TD Michael Lowry in Holycross, Co Tipperary, has been raided by the Revenue Commissioners.

A spokesperson for Revenue Commissioners declined to comment.

More to follow.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/0725/464620-michael-lowry/

[Bord na Mona man]

Why do crooks and fraudsters like Michael Lowry keep topping the polls instead of being hounded out of office in disgrace?

The home of Independent TD Michael Lowry in Holycross, Co Tipperary, has been raided by the Revenue Commissioners.

A spokesperson for Revenue Commissioners declined to comment.

More to follow.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/0725/464620-michael-lowry/

Another 1,000 extra first preference votes for Lowry.
At this stage Lowry's best vote catcher is probably that his presence drives a snooty set of Irish Times letter writers nuts.
He hasn't delivered anything of note to the area in years.
I've no time for him, but I can see why preaching down to the folks in his heartland is more likely to have the opposite effect.

[muppet]

Another 1,000 extra first preference votes for Lowry.
At this stage Lowry's best vote catcher is probably that his presence drives a snooty set of Irish Times letter writers nuts.
He hasn't delivered anything of note to the area in years.
I've no time for him, but I can see why preaching down to the folks in his heartland is more likely to have the opposite effect.

In fairness in Ireland a politician is innocent until proven guilty...




at least 10 times.