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Jesus benny you are on one man crusade against Harte. Christ get a life. Do something productive with your time instead stalking the board
The religious stuff is disgusting carry-on by Harte.
Complete abuse of his position.
Do you genuinely believe all the Tyrone players want to go to mass and say the rosary etc.?
And if the answer is 'No', then do you think any individual player would feel free to opt out?
I went to mass every Sunday when I was a child.
NEVER wanted to be there and when I said it to my parents later in life they said, "Sure no one was forcing you to go".
Technically that's true, but if the assumption has always been that you will go and everyone else is going too, are you likely to turn around to your parents and say, "Actually, I don't fancy this religion stuff at all".
There is an implicit power imbalance here.
All the power resides with Mickey Harte in this equation.
If you made the panel after slogging your guts out and you're desperately trying to break into the first XV, are you going to turn around to Mickey and say, "Count me out of this stuff"?
Mickey may well be fine with that, but that's not the point.
You're presenting the player with a difficult choice he should never have to make about something that has absolutely nothing to do with sport.
Would you take the risk that opting out of mass, the rosary etc. will put a black mark against your name?
That's funny. Sean Boylan did exactly the same with Meath and won 4 All Irelands doing it. They've won nothing since he was ousted.
https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-football/many-of-the-meath-team-had-gyms-then-they-were-called-farms-26212721.htmlQuoteOne big advantage we had at the time was that the routine changed little for many years. We had a kick around on Saturday evenings before all big games, attended Mass and went home to our own beds. Most of our matches were in Croke Park so Sunday was basically the same, whether the game was an early championship outing or the final.
a) I'd imagine all of those players were regular mass-goers, as most of the country was back then.
b) Regardless of that, I still don't agree with it.
'What we used to do' doesn't really cut the mustard as an argument.
The Captains don't kiss the bishops ring before games anymore and the mere idea that they ever did is laughable in this day and age.
Times change, attitudes change.
Would be some craic if the next Tyrone senior mens football manager after Mickey Harte is a Jehovas Witness where all members of the playing panel get free monthly copies of The Watchtower and are asked from time to time to accompany him (or her) going around knocking on people's doors.
Apparently he fell to the ground and when he was on the ground an opposition player "dropped the 2 knees" on him.
I know this was nothing new, but the stuff on Mass and the Rosary for me is something that the Tyrone CB should be looking very strongly at. Totally inappropriate given the message it sends out to those with other faiths and none, that have an interest in playing Gaelic Football.Noticed an reference to this elsewhere, so took a quick look to see what the reaction was on this forum.
Frankly, I'm shocked - though not surprised - that this particular aspect of Cavanagh's book doesn't merit a thread of its own (or at least some comment from more than one or two individuals).
I mean, is no-one else astonished, even outraged, that a team manager could get away with imposing his personal religious leanings on an entire team, to the exclusion of those who may feel differently?
i read a lot of stuff about sledging and foul play etc, but there is at least some possible redress (referee) or comeback (retaliation) to those things, but what can someone on the Tyrone panel who doesn't agree say or do to this? Speak out and never play for the county again?
And all that's BEFORE you get to the context of sport and society in NI.
Could you imagine the shitstorm if eg the Linfield manager required his players eg to take part in some sort of Orange Order parade, or British armed forces commemoration, or attend a Free Presbyterian service?
It would be roundly and publicly condemned, with the governing body clamping down immediately, and QUITE RIGHTLY too, imo. In fact, it's unthinkable. (And I say that as someone who pretty much despises Linfield, btw).
"GAA For All (Protestants need not apply)"
I don't think your comparisons to OO are correct. But in general your point is. Harte should not be forcing his players to attend mass or say the Rosary or anything like that. But Harte is a bully and unfortunately a successful Bully which means his methods are beyond question from many in Tyrone. Do Tyrone have any protestants playing for them? Probably unlikely they will if this is what is going on. I think Ulster GAA or national GAA should put some sort of ban or at least a statement out saying this is not acceptable.
That was my thinking. If a promising Protestant player was called up for Tyrone, would he be put off by hearing about the rosary thing? I suspect he might be. And who would blame him?
That's it Benny - but its not just Tyrone that would be affected. It is the whole of the GAA in Ulster that derives this image from Harte's actions.
I know this was nothing new, but the stuff on Mass and the Rosary for me is something that the Tyrone CB should be looking very strongly at. Totally inappropriate given the message it sends out to those with other faiths and none, that have an interest in playing Gaelic Football.Noticed an reference to this elsewhere, so took a quick look to see what the reaction was on this forum.
Frankly, I'm shocked - though not surprised - that this particular aspect of Cavanagh's book doesn't merit a thread of its own (or at least some comment from more than one or two individuals).
I mean, is no-one else astonished, even outraged, that a team manager could get away with imposing his personal religious leanings on an entire team, to the exclusion of those who may feel differently?
i read a lot of stuff about sledging and foul play etc, but there is at least some possible redress (referee) or comeback (retaliation) to those things, but what can someone on the Tyrone panel who doesn't agree say or do to this? Speak out and never play for the county again?
And all that's BEFORE you get to the context of sport and society in NI.
Could you imagine the shitstorm if eg the Linfield manager required his players eg to take part in some sort of Orange Order parade, or British armed forces commemoration, or attend a Free Presbyterian service?
It would be roundly and publicly condemned, with the governing body clamping down immediately, and QUITE RIGHTLY too, imo. In fact, it's unthinkable. (And I say that as someone who pretty much despises Linfield, btw).
"GAA For All (Protestants need not apply)"
I don't think your comparisons to OO are correct. But in general your point is. Harte should not be forcing his players to attend mass or say the Rosary or anything like that. But Harte is a bully and unfortunately a successful Bully which means his methods are beyond question from many in Tyrone. Do Tyrone have any protestants playing for them? Probably unlikely they will if this is what is going on. I think Ulster GAA or national GAA should put some sort of ban or at least a statement out saying this is not acceptable.
Building 7 was not hit by any plane.
The Fire commander leading the fight on the day, said that "the fires in WTC 7 were under control and only needed 2 teams to put it out". He called for the area command to assign the teams to fight the fire. They started to put the fires out, only to be told after half an hour to abandon their positions, and evacuate the building. They argued with the commanders that the fires were almost out, but the commanders radioed they had to evacuate immediately as the building was going to collapse and trap them in it. They radioed back saying they (The commanders) were talking rubbish as there was very little damage to the building and there was no way a collapse was imminent. They were then told not to argue but to evacuate immediately. Leave everything, run. About 5 minutes after evacuating the building it collapsed symmetrically to the ground into it's own footprint.
There are dozens of videos on YTube where firemen talk about what they heard and saw, as they evacuated the building. They describe hearing dozens of explosions from the top of the building on every floor all the way to the bottom. They also describe these explosions as exactly like a demolition.
None of this was ever mentioned in the NIST reports, where they completely ignored any and all testimony regarding explosions, not just in building seven but WTC 1 and 2.
As for the assertion that multiple structural steel support beams were sheered by an Aluminum can, I guess we will never know because the evidence of what happened to the steel was never gathered due to the steel being removed immediately from the scene of the crime. Removal of evidence from a crime scene is a capital offence btw. Coverup anyone....
Building 7 was hit by debris from the collapse of the north tower and the cause of its collapse is well documented and understood.
Your crazy description makes it sound like even commanders in the NY fire department were in on the conspiracy. It'd be easier for you tinfoil hat-wearing people to list who you think is not involved.
There is no comparison between allegations of collusion in the wee six and the 9/11 conspiracy theories.You can’t compare 9/11 to collusion in the north as the British are well capable of such atrocities against Irish nationalists
And yet the fact remains that in the early years of the conflict, the notion that the British state was colluding in the assassinations of Irish citizens WAS deemed a conspiracy theory. It's very easy to say now, purely with the benefit of hindsight, that it's not a fair comparison with contemporary conspiracy theories. But to my mind the real reason you lads are saying it's not a 'fair' comparison is because the collusion one was proven to have been true - possibly to a greater extent that anyone even anticipated - and that makes it hard to square it with what are regarded today as outlandish theories surrounding other events, due to the outlandish nature of them. But that's the essence of conspiracy theories. They are generally outlandish. That the collusion one has since been vindicated doesn't mean it was any less of a sneered at as an outlandish conspiracy theory in the early days. Hindsight should show that some previously termed 'outlandish conspiracy theories' can, occasionally, turn out to be true.
P.S. My initial post was not necessarily intended as a comparison with 9/11. It was in response to 'Trailer' who asked for an example of a conspiracy theory which turned out to be true, since he didn't appear to believe there was such any such examples.
Translation - there are no outlandish conspiracy theories that have ever turned out to be proven true, but here's the time the British colluded and if you argue against this as a conspiracy theory you're siding with them.
I was really hoping for something like the Illuminate rigging the All Stars in 1984.
Don't think it's that far-fetched myselfBuilding 7 was not hit by any plane.
The Fire commander leading the fight on the day, said that "the fires in WTC 7 were under control and only needed 2 teams to put it out". He called for the area command to assign the teams to fight the fire. They started to put the fires out, only to be told after half an hour to abandon their positions, and evacuate the building. They argued with the commanders that the fires were almost out, but the commanders radioed they had to evacuate immediately as the building was going to collapse and trap them in it. They radioed back saying they (The commanders) were talking rubbish as there was very little damage to the building and there was no way a collapse was imminent. They were then told not to argue but to evacuate immediately. Leave everything, run. About 5 minutes after evacuating the building it collapsed symmetrically to the ground into it's own footprint.
There are dozens of videos on YTube where firemen talk about what they heard and saw, as they evacuated the building. They describe hearing dozens of explosions from the top of the building on every floor all the way to the bottom. They also describe these explosions as exactly like a demolition.
None of this was ever mentioned in the NIST reports, where they completely ignored any and all testimony regarding explosions, not just in building seven but WTC 1 and 2.
As for the assertion that multiple structural steel support beams were sheered by an Aluminum can, I guess we will never know because the evidence of what happened to the steel was never gathered due to the steel being removed immediately from the scene of the crime. Removal of evidence from a crime scene is a capital offence btw. Coverup anyone....
This is just f**king bananas. Take a break from the internet lad.
Saying that the American government blew up Building 7 is not far fetched? You're on a level with Willie Frazier and Jim Corr. Good company.
Worth noting that Willie Frazer (among plenty of others) maintained that state collusion was a conspiracy theory. There are still those who would accuse you of mad conspiracy theories for suggesting that the British State orchestrated the slaughter of innocent civilians in Dublin & Monaghan in May 1974, for instance.
I'm not suggesting I necessarily believe the 9/11 conspiracy theories, but if the world was made up solely of people who sneered at every seemingly outlandish conspiracy theory, it would be a dangerous world where states could get away with a lot more than what we already now know they have been up to.
