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Messages - Lar Naparka

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1
GAA Discussion / Re: Why are Posters obsessed about Dublin GAA??
« on: September 21, 2018, 07:26:41 PM »
Because hard work and talent has nothing to do with it

54 titles since 2005 in all grades and levels. 14 in the previous 13 years. And it just so happened that the enormous funding disparity begun 13 years ago. Some sort of freak coincidence or instringently linked? Let's get real here. It's all bought. I haven't even added in the club titles for clubs in Dublin, it's gone up from 4 to 17 in the past 13 years compared to the 13 before.
I'd like a good laugh so can anyone come up with a reasonable explanation for the huge increase in titles since 2005 which coincided with the huge increase in funding for Dublin GAA?

So you think hard work and talent have no bearing on this at all? And cut the bought titles shite will ye
I have no problem whatever with your question but you follow up is a bit iffy. It takes hard work and training to win titles of any sort and having talented young players helps a lot too. But all that is not the full story, as some Dubs claim.
I mean why does a side full of talented players need to train harder than any other county when there are plenty of talented players available?  A second string Dub side would probably beat any other team in the country.
Is the reason why they can train harder and  for longer because they don’t have to travel long distance to their training grounds?
That’s the usual answer you’ll get from Dublin supporters here. However, that’s not the full story.  The Dublin clubs are structured in a way that’s biased towards the gifted players.
The way they operate can be compared to a pyramid- scores, maybe hundreds, of young players but only be one senior side at the top.
All sorts of field sports have a wastage rate when players drop out as they get older but the bigger the club, the more that leave is because there are no places for them as they move up the age levels.
In other words, some leave because they want to but many leave because they have to.
As Hound pointed out, the standard of Dublin club football is very high. It couldn’t be otherwise as only the better ones are kept as the players move up a grade.
As well as that they have an excellent scouting system where gifted players are spotted at an early stage of their careers are discovered and get extra coaching to develop their talent long before they get to player in adult competitions.
No wonder Dublin has so many youngsters pressing inclusion on the senior panel. That means in turn that those already on the team are always in fear of losing their places if they don’t train hard.
While their operate the megaclub system, Dublin will never be short of players who work hard and of talented younger ones trying to knock them out of their way.

The point of my follow up is that Procey seemingly discounts hard work and talent from contributing to the success of this Dublin team. Do I think the money they get is unfair? I do. Does money automatically guarantee success ? It doesn’t. Is it the sole reason for Dublin’s success? Certainly not

You make good points regarding travel and what not and Dublin undoubtedly have other natural advantages over other counties. We can’t be blaming them for that tho can we?
have no problem whatever with what you say. But as an old says goes, the devil is in the detail.
I accept that Dublin footballers have an incredible work ethos and train harder and longer than any other team in the land. I’d do the same if I was a Dublin panellist, knowing damn well that my next game could be my last.
Like I  said, the Dublin club structure is designed to discover and develop the more talented players from an early age up to the highest level they can possibly get to. It’s like sifting wheat from chaff as their country cousins might put it. The chaff, the less talented players, get cast aside.
That means that there are plenty of top class club players who’d get a place on most other intercounty teams but will never get close to a place on the Dub panel.
It’s alright saying that Dublin panellists train very hard but the impression that they do all their hoofing about at the Fingallians club grounds is wide of the mark.
About a fortnight ago, a controversy erupted when the Dublin team management announced it was removing s the “advanced training machinery” that that had been left with the National Sports Complex in Abbotstown. What bugs me a little is this: the machinery was taken back when the Dubs couldn’t use it any time they wanted to.
They have hardly moved this gear out to Fingallians so where is it now and what use is it to the Dub footballers? Their training regime is a bit more complicated that you might think from what Dub fans here are saying.
I say, deal with a full deck or put the cards away.There’s no point in half telling the truth.
My main gripe with the Dubs is that their club  system is totally unsuited when it comes to widening their playing and support base.
If you were to take a typical Dublin club and split it in two, one immediate advantage is that twice as many players could make it to the highest level possible - senior team for many.  Twice as many players would stay on until they would be assets to the club- volunteer work, fundraising socialising etc.
The massive subventions of funds those clubs need to stay in operation is an indication that all is not well at club level and never will be as long as you have, say, one club to cater for a population the entire size of some other counties.
THe irony is that much of the money GAA HQ does out to counties for development come for the gate receipts the Dubs generate every time they play.
They are attractive to watch and the association needs the Dubs for the colour and excitement that follows them and the money they earn for th association.
So, I know we need the Dubs in top order for the good of the entire association. But the downside is that you also need a few other teams capable of holding their own with the Dubs.
Few people would be prepared to pay premium prices to go see the Dubs wipe the floor with the opposition.
All present indications would show that this isn’t going to happen. It’s way of avoiding meltdown by ignoring it and that can only be a short term measure.

2
GAA Discussion / Re: Why are Posters obsessed about Dublin GAA??
« on: September 21, 2018, 01:15:05 PM »
Because hard work and talent has nothing to do with it

54 titles since 2005 in all grades and levels. 14 in the previous 13 years. And it just so happened that the enormous funding disparity begun 13 years ago. Some sort of freak coincidence or instringently linked? Let's get real here. It's all bought. I haven't even added in the club titles for clubs in Dublin, it's gone up from 4 to 17 in the past 13 years compared to the 13 before.
I'd like a good laugh so can anyone come up with a reasonable explanation for the huge increase in titles since 2005 which coincided with the huge increase in funding for Dublin GAA?

So you think hard work and talent have no bearing on this at all? And cut the bought titles shite will ye
I have no problem whatever with your question but you follow up is a bit iffy. It takes hard work and training to win titles of any sort and having talented young players helps a lot too. But all that is not the full story, as some Dubs claim.
I mean why does a side full of talented players need to train harder than any other county when there are plenty of talented players available?  A second string Dub side would probably beat any other team in the country.
Is the reason why they can train harder and  for longer because they don’t have to travel long distance to their training grounds?
That’s the usual answer you’ll get from Dublin supporters here. However, that’s not the full story.  The Dublin clubs are structured in a way that’s biased towards the gifted players.
The way they operate can be compared to a pyramid- scores, maybe hundreds, of young players but only be one senior side at the top.
All sorts of field sports have a wastage rate when players drop out as they get older but the bigger the club, the more that leave is because there are no places for them as they move up the age levels.
In other words, some leave because they want to but many leave because they have to.
As Hound pointed out, the standard of Dublin club football is very high. It couldn’t be otherwise as only the better ones are kept as the players move up a grade.
As well as that they have an excellent scouting system where gifted players are spotted at an early stage of their careers are discovered and get extra coaching to develop their talent long before they get to player in adult competitions.
No wonder Dublin has so many youngsters pressing inclusion on the senior panel. That means in turn that those already on the team are always in fear of losing their places if they don’t train hard.
While their operate the megaclub system, Dublin will never be short of players who work hard and of talented younger ones trying to knock them out of their way.

3
Mayo / Re: Best Man to Manage the Intercounty Senior Team?
« on: September 19, 2018, 11:05:06 PM »
Touché!
That's what a storm does to you! ;D

4
Mayo / Best Man to Manage the Intercounty Senior Team?
« on: September 19, 2018, 10:44:16 PM »
Okay, it's official, only Horan and Solan nominated.
Which of them is the one you would prefer to see in charge?

Touché!
That's what a storm does to you! ;D

5
GAA Discussion / Re: Mayo manager resigns - for defo.
« on: September 19, 2018, 09:04:55 PM »
Any chance the selection committee would go out on a limb and ask Tommy C if he's interested?  :P
He's gone with Tanman to the Biffos  ;D
Both Horan and Solan have been nominated for selection and since the deadline for nominations has now passed, they are the only individuals in the running.
Just saw this on RTE News Now.

6
GAA Discussion / Re: Time to Split Dublin
« on: September 19, 2018, 06:32:04 PM »
The basic point here is that an increasing population requires the State to sub divide counties in Dublin.  Are those who defend Dublin arguing that the GAA should simply ignore an increasing population imbalance, no matter how great it becomes?

How about amalgamating counties who feel they can’t compete?
If the only reason for amalgamating a number of counties would be to field the strongest senior team for the new entity, then the move would probably be a positive one.

But if that’s the only reason to do so, there are many others than that would damage the best interests of the GAA and that's putting it mildly.
For starters, if, say, three counties come together there would then be just one county board where there were three before the amalgamation.
A lot of  intercounty players would lose out as there would now be only one intercounty panel instead of three. The numbers playing at club level in any grade would also be dramatically reduced for the same reason.
Clubs would also have to amalgamate in order to survive and to do so, would cause other problems. In most rural areas, there is a strong bond between a club and the local community. The Parish Rule is very important for those clubs.
This rule has its own drawbacks but, on the whole, it’s the main reason for the existence of those clubs in the first place.
If clubs are forced to amalgamate in order to survive, the bond between each club and it main support base would no longer exist. Boys (or girls also) would be less willing to join any club if it’s located in another parish and they know few if any those already there.
And to cap it all, there's another snag that most Jackeens probably never have heard of.
There’s usually a lot of animosity between adjoining parishes and that has been the ways for generations, certainly long before the GAA was founded.

7
GAA Discussion / Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« on: September 19, 2018, 05:30:39 PM »
Firstly he mentions bricks and mortar but conveniently skips over why Dublin don't do this. Secondly everyone here is acutely aware of the benefit of GDOs.

Quote
t
Their work within schools and clubs, although unheralded, has also helped funnel elite younger players towards their development squads where they start to focus on playing together in the Dublin jersey

So since you think this is a wonderful article then you agree with this point about how the millions of GAA has helped the Dublin Senior football team!
Simply incorrect.
The team managers, almost always a parent, select the best 6 or 8 lads to go to the trials. The one time I went along it was run by Stephen O'Shaughnessy, with a number of other ex-Dub volunteers helping him. Numbers are then whittled down every time a subsequent trial is run, until a certain number is reached that will play games.
No involvement from the GDOs.
I’d be careful here to differentiate between the elite and the run of the mill  kids who play the game for pure enjoyment and are not talented enough to play at senior level or are not prepared to put in the work needed to get on to the top team in any grade they play in.
There are a lot of kids who will ever get near intercounty standard at any level but who could could be valuable club members as they grow older and move up the various grades. It’s a case of prioritising your objectives.
Regardless of which way you want to go, it’s always a wise ideas to have parents involved and just as important, kids are more inclined to join a club of any sort if some of their pals are joining up also.
Sending GDOs into primary schools to persuade kids to join the local club can be a waste of time and money and I am saying this from personal experience. Of course, it helps if they know some boys already there, like brothers or pals or if parents encourage them to join. Sure, school boys may show an initial interest and may even sign up but they won’t hang around for long.
For decades, primary teachers promoted Gaelic games in the school where they taught. I was one of those for almost 30 years. There was no need for GDOs as long as there were male teachers, lay or religious, working in a boys’ school.
 Nowadays, the number of men involved in teaching has fallen dramatically, and clubs are forced to go looking for new members.
Sending GDOs into schools is a proactive move alright but unless those sent in are already known to the kids or if there are no pals prepared to join also, be prepared for an underwhelming response.

8
GAA Discussion / Re: Time to Split Dublin
« on: September 18, 2018, 11:28:04 AM »
I was arguing with syferus over his claim that Dublin was an amalgamation of four different counties- which is neither factually or grammatically correct.

The article quoted gave the date of the creation of those 4 LAUs in Dublin, which was i used it. The fact that it correctly labels them as county councils than erroneously labels them as counties is not my problem. Everyone with half a brain knows the difference between a LAU and an actual county. Google local government in Ireland and see what you find.

And now you are back tracking because you realise how stupid equating LAUs and actual counties are. You did tell us that the oireachtas had made them counties didn't you?

Good jaysis. Argue all you want about Dublin's funding but when i see morons saying Dublin should be split because Dublin is an amalgamation of 4 counties, i'll call it and them out for the stupidity it is.

You jumped on the wrong bandwagon Lar. There are a lot of thicks on this board
Now that you have chosen to drop the petty insults, I have a better idea of what you mean.
In deciding to argue a point with Rossfan, (not always a wise idea) you cited a source to back up your point of view. You linked to a Wikipedia article. Fair enough so far?
You then fundamentally disagreed with what you found there and followed with a reply to me by stating, “the fact that it correctly labels them as county councils than erroneously labels them as counties is not my problem.”
Why use a source to back your case when you disagree with the main premise?
Yes, I have searched for “Local Government in Ireland, “ where I found this:
“Apart from the local authorities in the counties of Dun Laoghaire, Fingal and South Dublin” and the cities of Dublin, Cork and Galway, all counties and cities and counties have been divided into municipal districts with councillors representing simultaneously the municipal district and the local authority. In total, there are 95 municipal districts in the country.
This was lifted from the website of The Local Government Management Agency
So, my friend, you now disagree with the statutory body charged with overseeing the work of al LAUs and County Councils, amongst others, as well.
No personal offence intended but hubris screams at me when I read your posts. ;D ;D
Incidentally, none of this has anything to do with Dublin GAA’s affairs and is neither a case for dividing Dublin not for leaving it as it is.

9
GAA Discussion / Re: Mayo manager resigns - for defo.
« on: September 17, 2018, 09:56:21 PM »
According to the Western People Horan, Solan and Enda Gilvarry are allowing their names be put forward by the clubs. No other candidates are expected.

Would have to think that Solan is in pole position, as he person in situ.

I just can't see the Mayo County Board giving it to Horan again, too much bad blood still there.
I can't either, going by what Stephen Rochford has said about board members trying to influence his decisions on who should be selected.
Horan had a long-running fight with the county board from start to finish as it tried to curtail expenses and he was having none of this. I can't see any there rushing to welcome anyone back so he can tell them to take a running jump for themselves once again.
Still, he has widespread support from players and the public alike and both parties have had enough of the board's wheelings and dealings to last them some time.

10
GAA Discussion / Re: Time to Split Dublin
« on: September 17, 2018, 06:28:44 PM »
"In 1994, Dublin was further subdivided with Dún Laoghaire–Rathdown, Fingal and South Dublin, constituted as local government units."

You lads are making an absolute show of yourselves.
You still don't get the message.
Counties are local government units.
God between us and small farms!
I’d get more return for my efforts if I tried to push a bullock uphill with a rope.
As far as the real world is concerned there are now 28 counties in the republic.
That’s according to the article you referenced to backup your original claims.
Here is the relevant excerpt one more time.
“In 1994 Dublin County Council was abolished and replaced with three separate county councils: Dún Laoghaire–Rathdown, Fingal and South Dublin.
And it gets better, the further you go:
“The total population of the three aforementioned counties and Dublin city was 1,345,402 according to the census of 2016.”
My last shot at it is this, The GAA is perfectly entitled to disregard any or all of the above but that doesn’t alter the fact that Rossfan was right in the first place.
Now, if you have anything constructive to ass to the argument, I’ll be happy to consider it but if you persist in throwing your rattle out of your pram and resorting to cheap personal insults, I won’t pamper you any further.


Good jaysis.

In the Republic of Ireland there are
26 County Councils
3 City Councils
2 City and County Councils

Which adds up to 31 LAUs (Local Authority Units) for 26 Counties.

I look forward to the case you make for splitting Galway and Cork based on their local government arrangements.

This is really embarrassing stuff lads.

There are issues for Dublin and the other 31 (that's 31 counties folks) with regard to fair funding (and what counties should be doing with that funding). But the reason Dubs fans aren't engaging with you is not because of your devastating rhetoric, but because ye constantly, constantly, undermine yourselves with transparent lies and ignorance. 31 counties in the Republic! Lord jaysis.

As I said earlier, idiocy does not deserve to be coddled.
God between us and small farms!  :D :D :D
I’d get more return for my efforts if I tried to push a bullock uphill with a rope.
As far as the real world is concerned there are now 28 counties in the republic.
That’s according to the article you referenced to backup your original claims.
Here is the relevant excerpt one more time.
“In 1994 Dublin County Council was abolished and replaced with three separate county councils: Dún Laoghaire–Rathdown, Fingal and South Dublin.
And it gets better, the further you go:
“The total population of the three aforementioned counties and Dublin city was 1,345,402 according to the census of 2016.”
My last shot at it is this, The GAA is perfectly entitled to disregard any or all of the above but that doesn’t alter the fact that Rossfan was right in the first place.
Now, if you have anything constructive to ass to the argument, I’ll be happy to consider it but if you persist in throwing your rattle out of your pram and resorting to cheap personal insults, I won’t pamper you any further.

11
GAA Discussion / Re: Time to Split Dublin
« on: September 17, 2018, 06:11:05 PM »
"In 1994, Dublin was further subdivided with Dún Laoghaire–Rathdown, Fingal and South Dublin, constituted as local government units."

You lads are making an absolute show of yourselves.


Don’t feed the trolls. Dublin-hating has been a way of life since Kevin Heffernan was a boy. Let them stew in their own bile.
You are way off the mark here.
As far as GAA affairs are concerned, there has been no radical change to what was regarded as “County Dublin” when the GAA was founded and I never inferred that there had been any. The local government areas, Dublin city and county as it was then are still “Dublin” according to the rules and regulations of the GAA - and as far as I am concerned also.
GIven demographic and political changes taking place in our country, I cannot see Dublin remaining as one unit , if the GAA is to survive.
However, that is a separate issue and it has nothing to do with what we are discussing here.
The GAA is not obliged to observe political boundaries for any reason, including local government administration. Take Ballaghadereen as an example.
According to the law of the land, it is in County Roscommmon but for GAA purposes it is a Mayo club.
The GAA is not obliged to recognise ecclesiastical boundaries either. The Parish Rule that applies to the rest of the country is not observed in Dublin and this doesn’t change Dublin’s status in any way.
Now, what your supercilious buddy claimed when he rubbished Rossfan’s post is not true What was once Dublin County, as far as local and national administration affairs are concerned, has been split into three separate counties but this has no bearing on what the GAA as a body thinks.
If he bothered to read the article he used as a reference for his erudite contribution to the discussion, he’d find that rural county Dublin, as it was pre-1994, has indeed been split into three distinct local government regions, each with its own COUNTY council.
Now, if it walks like a duck and it quacks like a duck, ergo, it’s a duck!
And using language best suited to a schoolyard doesn’t change the fact that Dún Laoghaire–Rathdown, Fingal and South Dublin meet the legal requirement to merit county status.
This doesn’t bother the GAA nor should it but if one wanted to use sarcasm as a way of making your points, they try at least to get their facts right.

12
GAA Discussion / Re: Time to Split Dublin
« on: September 17, 2018, 02:25:52 PM »
"In 1994, Dublin was further subdivided with Dún Laoghaire–Rathdown, Fingal and South Dublin, constituted as local government units."

You lads are making an absolute show of yourselves.
You still don't get the message.
Counties are local government units.

13
GAA Discussion / Re: Time to Split Dublin
« on: September 17, 2018, 01:18:51 PM »
Calls to split Dublin are bullshit and thats from a Mayo supporter.In all honesty who wants to beat Fingal or North Dublin??? Yes Dublin have too many advantages that need to be looked at but splitting Dublin shouldnt be the answer.Having to play their all ireland quarter and semi finals away from croker would be a start IMO.

I want to beat Fingal or South Dublin, y’know actual existing counties in an inter-county sport. That’s natural.

Not the rigged game that is fûcking rural counties like Roscommon or Mayo lining up to the take their next flaking from an amalgamation of four counties with a population greater than our province.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_Dublin

We're not an amalgamation, those "counties" were created as administrative areas. In the 90s. Not 1890s. 1990s.

Lot of thicks on the board about Dublin these days. Apparently, pointing that out means you are a financial doper, cheat, one-eyed etc.
I don't quite follow you here.I don't really want to spoil the fun and would prefer to let the pair of you at it. But, looking at the Wikipedia article you referenced, I find Dublin refereed to as a former county.
Furthermore, "Prior to 1994 County Dublin was also an administrative unit covering the whole county outside of Dublin City Council." By my reckoniing there was, in effect two local adminstration units before 1994.
Further on, this is part of what you'll find:
"The total population of the three aforementioned counties and Dublin city was 1,345,402 according to the census of 2016."
All counties were created to simplify the process of facilitating local administration and Dublin was no exception, beginning with those created by Kiing John after the Norman invasion with the western ones, "THe Composition of Connaught," in the late 1500s.
All that's heavy going but the fact is the division of Dublin County into three separate local administration units by the legal authority of the day, makes each of them a county. I mean they were created by the same process that created County Dublin in the first place.
(Maybe I'm missing something but I don't think so.)

Dublin County and Dublin County Football team existed before the creation of these administrative areas. So neither can be considered an amalgamation 4 counties and it is moronic and/or intellectually dishonest to say that they are.

Like I said, a lot of thicks on this thread
There sure are a lot of thickos on this board and by any reasonable criterion, you are best qualified to act as grand marshal if they were ever to parade their ignorance.

You referenced a Wikipedia article which begins with the following sentence:
“County Dublin (Irish: Contae Bhaile Átha Cliath or Contae Átha Cliath) is a former county in Ireland.”
Why refer to an article from anywhere if you choose to ignore the opening statement?
Sarcasm, it is said, is the lowest form of wit and when you mix in a big dollop of wilful ignorance, you get a pretty toxic combination.
Over a period of time, Ireland was shired or divided into counties for local administration purposes and Dublin was no exception. In 1994, Dublin was further subdivided with Dún Laoghaire–Rathdown, Fingal and South Dublin, constituted as local government units. Unless you choose to defy the authority of Oireachtas na h-Eireann, they are therefore counties.
In case this hasn’t sunk in yet, you could read another sentence from the Wikipedia article. Here it is, in case you can’t find it:
In 1994 Dublin County Council was abolished and replaced with three separate county councils: Dún Laoghaire–Rathdown, Fingal and South Dublin.”
All that should be clear to anyone whose first language is English but, just in case you are not one of those, the following excerpt may drive the point home that you are spouting nonsense. “The total population of the three aforementioned counties and Dublin city was 1,345,402 according to the census of 2016.”

Like you say there are a lot of thicks on the board and you sure are best qualified to state this.

14
Hurling Discussion / Re: hurler of the year so far anyone?
« on: September 14, 2018, 08:10:12 PM »
https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/hurling/revealed-limerick-lead-the-way-with-15-allstar-nominations-as-two-tribesmen-are-shortlisted-for-top-gong-37311032.html


The Hurler of the Year award, which will be voted on by inter-county players, is also likely to go the wire. Joe Canning is nominated with team-mate Pádraic Mannion and Limerick's Cian Lynch.
Has to be Joe for me.

15
GAA Discussion / Re: Time to Split Dublin
« on: September 14, 2018, 07:25:32 PM »
Calls to split Dublin are bullshit and thats from a Mayo supporter.In all honesty who wants to beat Fingal or North Dublin??? Yes Dublin have too many advantages that need to be looked at but splitting Dublin shouldnt be the answer.Having to play their all ireland quarter and semi finals away from croker would be a start IMO.

I want to beat Fingal or South Dublin, y’know actual existing counties in an inter-county sport. That’s natural.

Not the rigged game that is fûcking rural counties like Roscommon or Mayo lining up to the take their next flaking from an amalgamation of four counties with a population greater than our province.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_Dublin

We're not an amalgamation, those "counties" were created as administrative areas. In the 90s. Not 1890s. 1990s.

Lot of thicks on the board about Dublin these days. Apparently, pointing that out means you are a financial doper, cheat, one-eyed etc.
I don't quite follow you here.I don't really want to spoil the fun and would prefer to let the pair of you at it. But, looking at the Wikipedia article you referenced, I find Dublin refereed to as a former county.
Furthermore, "Prior to 1994 County Dublin was also an administrative unit covering the whole county outside of Dublin City Council." By my reckoniing there was, in effect two local adminstration units before 1994.
Further on, this is part of what you'll find:
"The total population of the three aforementioned counties and Dublin city was 1,345,402 according to the census of 2016."
All counties were created to simplify the process of facilitating local administration and Dublin was no exception, beginning with those created by Kiing John after the Norman invasion with the western ones, "THe Composition of Connaught," in the late 1500s.
All that's heavy going but the fact is the division of Dublin County into three separate local administration units by the legal authority of the day, makes each of them a county. I mean they were created by the same process that created County Dublin in the first place.
(Maybe I'm missing something but I don't think so.)

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