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Messages - GetOverTheBar

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1
GAA Discussion / Re: Attendances
« on: Today at 03:46:26 PM »
With Antrim and Tyrone on TV....The result widely expected to be one sided. It'll be interesting to see just how many go to Armagh on Saturday. Can't see there being many at this one.

2
Tyrone / Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« on: Today at 12:36:56 PM »
Everyone to their own I guess, what I know if I got hit in the way it has been described on this discussion board, yip I would have returned the compliment. I have no qualm in saying that. What if he had of retaliated and got sent off, big deal, one game suspension. Its called self defence. I appreciate everyone sees these things differently and everyone is different, I think its called ‘fight or flight’ in relation to how people instinctively react.

Not a great post lad. I hope my thinking is correct and you are about 17 or 18. Plenty of time to grow up - always remember, no matter how hard you are or think you are, you'll find someone harder.

3
General discussion / Re: Boxing Thread
« on: May 23, 2019, 09:56:15 AM »
About time something was done to sort that sport out.  Just got reminded yesterday of what a farce amateur boxing has become when I saw Callum Smiths next opponent, Hassan Ndam Njikam.  I had clean forgot about him and other professionals being allowed to compete at the Rio Olympics.

Funny I've no issue with professionals being allowed to compete, I mean they are pretty much all professionals anyway aren't they with regards to full time training / various levels of funding.

It's the judges that need rooted out. Horrible, horrible decisions games after games that cost people massively.

4
General discussion / Re: Man Utd Thread:
« on: May 22, 2019, 02:56:05 PM »
The most important day of the year today, the shareholder's conference call, 1PM Irish time

https://services.choruscall.com/links/manchester1905163IwPSAkZ.html

It will contain this line Net debt as of 31 March 2019 was £301.7 million, an increase of £0.4 million over the year. The gross USD debt principal remains unchanged.

Who gives a f**k about the debt. It not as if it's coming out of your pocket. What's 300 million nowadays anyway? Couple of tours of China and that be covered.

Not much point in some of the lads in here crying about City and their financial outlay when Utd have been in debt for a decade. Both just as bad if we are being honest - just one is seen as acceptable.


You don't really understand how this works do you? I'll give a small explainer.

United have consistently been one of if the ther most profitable soccer clubs in the world. When the Glazers took over the club in the mid 2000's United were highly profitbale and had zero debt. Once the deal was completed (club value at time of takeover £790M), they brought the loans they used to buy the club onto the clubs books (5 years after the takeover in 2010 this totalled over £700M). This meant that the club went from having zero debt to a dangerously high level of debt (for its size) in a short space of time. Most profits generated were needed to pay down debt (over £60M each year) and the "consultancy/management fees" to the Glazer family and weren't available to buy players. Ronaldo was sold for £70M and replaced by Valencia and Michael Owen for example. Luckily the greatest soccer manager of all time was still at the helm and somehow managed to continue winning titles despite not being able to compete for the top young players in the world. The club's revenues kept growing and the debt has been reduced significantly to the point where it's not an issue any more (it has reduced and the value of the club overall in now more than £3 Billion). From a position of the debt almost being equal to the vlaue of the club it's now about a tenth of the value. This has meant United have has cash in the last few years but as we've seen it has been largely wasted on short termism and quick fixes which haven't worked.

So clearly anyone can see the Glazer ownership has meant something in the region of a billion pounds sterling has left the club since 2005. Around the amount of money City have been given to spend in that time from their owners.

Well aware of the above, the question is, why is one, for want of a better phrase morally acceptable and the other not? I'm not doubting your facts, I'm merely asking what is the problem with City pushing the cash in, if they have it when in contrast the United owners take the widely accepted much better generated revenue out. Sounds like the issue is more one of annoyance or jealousy as opposed to any moral principal to me.

For a start they are not meeting UEFA's FFP requirements. These rules whether you agree with them or not were put in place to stop clubs spending more than they are generating. United have for as long as we can remember, been generating huge profits. They have always complied with this. City have used a whole array of questionable methods to circumvent these rules. Does anyone seriously believe the sponsorship they get reflects market value. They're a small club compared to Liverpool, United, Real, Barca and Bayern yet able to attract sponsors willing to pay comparable amounts. Coincidentally all these sponsors are Abu Dhabi based  ;D


Nail on the head. Themselves and PSG need to be dealt with, they're ripping the p1ss in relation to FFP rules.

What do you suggest? They were found guilty of these prior....the punishment? Fines....Not exactly off putting for me.

5
General discussion / Re: Man Utd Thread:
« on: May 22, 2019, 12:55:26 PM »
The most important day of the year today, the shareholder's conference call, 1PM Irish time

https://services.choruscall.com/links/manchester1905163IwPSAkZ.html

It will contain this line Net debt as of 31 March 2019 was £301.7 million, an increase of £0.4 million over the year. The gross USD debt principal remains unchanged.

Who gives a f**k about the debt. It not as if it's coming out of your pocket. What's 300 million nowadays anyway? Couple of tours of China and that be covered.

Not much point in some of the lads in here crying about City and their financial outlay when Utd have been in debt for a decade. Both just as bad if we are being honest - just one is seen as acceptable.


You don't really understand how this works do you? I'll give a small explainer.

United have consistently been one of if the ther most profitable soccer clubs in the world. When the Glazers took over the club in the mid 2000's United were highly profitbale and had zero debt. Once the deal was completed (club value at time of takeover £790M), they brought the loans they used to buy the club onto the clubs books (5 years after the takeover in 2010 this totalled over £700M). This meant that the club went from having zero debt to a dangerously high level of debt (for its size) in a short space of time. Most profits generated were needed to pay down debt (over £60M each year) and the "consultancy/management fees" to the Glazer family and weren't available to buy players. Ronaldo was sold for £70M and replaced by Valencia and Michael Owen for example. Luckily the greatest soccer manager of all time was still at the helm and somehow managed to continue winning titles despite not being able to compete for the top young players in the world. The club's revenues kept growing and the debt has been reduced significantly to the point where it's not an issue any more (it has reduced and the value of the club overall in now more than £3 Billion). From a position of the debt almost being equal to the vlaue of the club it's now about a tenth of the value. This has meant United have has cash in the last few years but as we've seen it has been largely wasted on short termism and quick fixes which haven't worked.

So clearly anyone can see the Glazer ownership has meant something in the region of a billion pounds sterling has left the club since 2005. Around the amount of money City have been given to spend in that time from their owners.

Well aware of the above, the question is, why is one, for want of a better phrase morally acceptable and the other not? I'm not doubting your facts, I'm merely asking what is the problem with City pushing the cash in, if they have it when in contrast the United owners take the widely accepted much better generated revenue out. Sounds like the issue is more one of annoyance or jealousy as opposed to any moral principal to me.

6
Tyrone / Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« on: May 22, 2019, 12:48:15 PM »
Is this the same fella got himself into trouble last year with a similar act by chance?

7
General discussion / Re: Man Utd Thread:
« on: May 22, 2019, 10:07:37 AM »
The most important day of the year today, the shareholder's conference call, 1PM Irish time

https://services.choruscall.com/links/manchester1905163IwPSAkZ.html

It will contain this line Net debt as of 31 March 2019 was £301.7 million, an increase of £0.4 million over the year. The gross USD debt principal remains unchanged.

Who gives a f**k about the debt. It not as if it's coming out of your pocket. What's 300 million nowadays anyway? Couple of tours of China and that be covered.

Not much point in some of the lads in here crying about City and their financial outlay when Utd have been in debt for a decade. Both just as bad if we are being honest - just one is seen as acceptable.

8
Tyrone / Re: Tyrone County Football and Hurling
« on: May 22, 2019, 09:44:00 AM »
Is Conan Grugan still involved?

Is Harry Loughran still about also?

https://www.sportsfile.com/more-images/775334797/5000/

From the squad protraits, it looks like Grugan and Loughran were still involved at the end of the April anyway.

There's a few lads there that haven't seen a match day squad for some time - (Grugan, McClure, Loughran, Mulgrew, McNabb, B Burns and McHugh).

I had thought McNabb had left as he hasn't featured in any match day squad at all this year, has he been injured? I know Burns is not long back from an ACL and McHugh had a big injury at the start of this year.

I didn’t think McNabb was part of things either. Mulgrew has been injured this months, McHugh done the knee in a play off game at the tail end of last season so he’s gone for the year I’d imagine and Burns is still to feature for Pomeroy this season. .

Not sure what the story is with McClure and particularly Loughran. He seemed to one of the first subs on last season thought he would have pushed on this season. The squad is probably it’s lightest in terms of numbers for a few years now.

Yeah, it's 34 (including Brendan Burns and McHugh who are unlikely to feature this year) from my reckoning as Lee Brennan has dropped off and Murnaghan has been released to the u20s. I'd imagine Harte might bring in a few lads going well on the club scene for training in the next few weeks - particularly forwards.

Who would be the likely candidates for this? I think a couple of new faces could be required as we wouldn't even have enough for a 15 v 15 in house game when you exclude the likes of Burns, McHugh, McNabb, Loughran and Mulgrew who haven't been fit to play any club football this year.

It's mainly forwards that we are light in at the minute. Ryan Coleman did well for Mary's at FF in the Sigerson this year, Emmet McNabb and Paul Donaghy were decent for the u20s last year.

Michael O'Neill from Ardboe is a player I've liked the look of when I've seen him, Nathan Donnelly Killyclogher and Eoghan Murray from Tattyreagh also.

Could be worth a look at in any case just for the training games.

USA Bound

9
Tyrone / Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« on: May 21, 2019, 07:34:58 PM »
If 2 clubs are in agreement can fixtures be moved back to the original timings?

Just checked the fixtures page on the Tyrone website and Kildress v Rock is now throwing in at 5pm. So a compromise/change is possible.

That's so they can clear the field fight up before the sun goes down presumably.

Wasn't too far off the mark with this one then.

10
Tyrone / Re: Tyrone County Football and Hurling
« on: May 15, 2019, 09:55:22 AM »
There is a lot made these days of 'peaking' and the likes training wise. This isn't like the club where they run the shite out of you for 2 months. Go straight into 5 games....then back into another pre season camp if you haven't won 3 of the 5.

At any county, training is tailored accordingly to both individual and position. They'll have been doing their gym programmes over the last X amount of months - to get to the county you need to be of obviously above the norm physical excellence anyway so very little 'peaking' needs to be done, it's more a refinement process bearing in mind you are dealing with the best of the best anyway.

Obviously some lads will need to work on certain aspects to improve their game, but they don't go up to Garvaghy and run sprint after sprint until they are sick - there is a time and place for that obviously but by and large, lots of Tyrone training time is spent on patterns of play / defensive structure etc. I'd imagine if you pick any night to go and watch Tyrone train over the next few months you'd be surprised how little they do. It's more keeping the dog on the leash right now.

I would say the main difference is, if you go and watch their tackling drills etc - the intensity will catch the eye more than anything. The pressure exerted will be up a level to anything at the club and that's really one of the major differences between club and county - there isn't any amount of sprints you can do that will match the sheer empty feeling of tackling drills especially at that level, I'm sure.

11
Tyrone / Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« on: May 14, 2019, 09:44:00 PM »
If 2 clubs are in agreement can fixtures be moved back to the original timings?

Just checked the fixtures page on the Tyrone website and Kildress v Rock is now throwing in at 5pm. So a compromise/change is possible.

That's so they can clear the field fight up before the sun goes down presumably.

12
General discussion / Re: European Leagues.
« on: May 14, 2019, 12:39:41 PM »
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/13/sports/manchester-city-champions-league-uefa.html

They were found guilty of an FFP breach previously, widely accepted as one of, if not the richest club in the world. They were fined.

Get the house of them being found guilty here and being asked to take part in the UCL qualification stages.

13
Tyrone / Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« on: May 14, 2019, 12:33:22 PM »
I'm not usually one to complain but this is a slap in the face for clubs again. To call off senior club matches because kids (who are ineligable to play senior football anyway) have a match is ridiculous. So we potentially have a summer in front of us that means adult footballers can't play when Tyrone seniors have a match but they also have to play second fiddle to kids, I repeat, who are ineligable anyway. Whats next? Tyrone U16 development squad have a match so ACL league matches have to move?

They're not just 'kids'. They're representing our County in the Ulster Championship. Having gone undefeated all season until last Saturday the least we could do is give them the respect they deserve.

Get over yourself.

I'm sorry to tell you but they are just 'kids'. Our county is represented by a lot of age groups in Ulster Championships, should we just put everything on hold until they play as well? No one wants them to win more than me but to hold up games for approx 1000 adult players is quite frankly, ridiculous. If you can't see this and feel the need for me to 'get over myself' then there isn't much more I can say to you. I will ask you one question though, should U17's continue to play on alternate weeks from Tyrone seniors should the ACL be shifted about all summer to accommodate U17 players who aren't allowed to play in the senior matches anyway?

Yes

How to ruin your credibility in one post.

Obviously you are in some way linked to the u17s. Fair play to you if your a player and good luck on Sunday but what you are asking for is absolute nonsense.

14
Tyrone / Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« on: May 14, 2019, 10:21:51 AM »
Sundays games all moved to 6& 7.30pm?

Sure us players have nothing better to be at than waiting around all weekend until the very last minute to play.

Embarrassing. Any wonder players are turning their back on the game.

When do you want them to play the games? To be fair they were left with little choice.

Are you being serious? Every other county can put in fixtures for Friday or Saturday. What makes us the exception?

Eventually this mistreatment will end in the demise of a club  - I'll imagine X amount of reserve games will not be fulfilled this weekend, especially those longer trips.

I'm talking short term. They only found out on Monday that the Minors have their qualifier on Sunday.

They couldn't move them to Saturday because it was too short notice for players to get off work etc. They couldn't leave them at the original time because of the clash. They had no other option.

What about those who come home for games on flights or leave on flights to go to work for the Monday? Even those living in Dublin etc....It's a farce.

How many will even be at this minor game? They do this every year though so I'm not even sure why I'm surprised.

15
Tyrone / Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« on: May 14, 2019, 10:10:24 AM »
Sundays games all moved to 6& 7.30pm?

Sure us players have nothing better to be at than waiting around all weekend until the very last minute to play.

Embarrassing. Any wonder players are turning their back on the game.

When do you want them to play the games? To be fair they were left with little choice.

Are you being serious? Every other county can put in fixtures for Friday or Saturday. What makes us the exception?

Eventually this mistreatment will end in the demise of a club  - I'll imagine X amount of reserve games will not be fulfilled this weekend, especially those longer trips.

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