Messages

1- Reilly - Cavan
2- Hanley- Galway
3- Donaghy - Armagh
4- K. Lacy - Donegal
5- Gardiner- Mayo
6- Canty - Cork
7- Loughery- Antrim
8- Gavin - Limerick
9- Earley- Kildare
10- A. Brogan- Dublin
11-T.Keneally - Kerry
12- S.Bray - Meath
13- T. Freeman- Monaghan
14- P.Bradley - Derry
15- O'Neill- Tyrone

[nationalists which stretched the security forces]

Roger, I would never regard your opinions as offensive or personally vindictive in any way to anyone but you have your perspective and I have mine.
So what? After all, this is a discussion board, isn't it?
Bearing this in mind, I have no disagreement with your analysis above. I agree that you have summed up what happened accurately but I'd be concerned about the reasons for this being so.
Certainly, the nationalists challenged the forces of law and order but that was because they perceived them to be neither lawful nor orderly. I need only refer back to the (then) recent events at Burntollet to say that their reaction was quite in order.
When St Matthew's Church and Bombay Street were burnt down, there was little or no sign of police protection and in fact there were widespread suspicions that the large sections of the security forces were acting in collusion with the loyalist extremists.
The IRA in the area at the time were taunted by nationalists for their inability to protect their areas and were told that IRA = I Ran Away. They were to set about rectifying this, probably with help from the hawks in the Irish cabinet.
I would respectfully suggest that the prime reason for the major upswing of support for 'the boys' was that there was no one else the nationalists could turn to for protection.
The calls for army intervention came, first and foremost, from nationalist spokespeople and it was damn slow in arriving. When it did, they first arrivals were welcomed with open arms by the nationalist community in the areas under threat.

Well apparently what I wrote was offensive, insulting, has no credibility and in fact I am like the KKK in the 50s / 60s in the deep south of USA. There seems no basis for this other than bigotry and prejudice because I have a different opinion on the future of our country.

Leaving that aside, I see where you are coming from regarding the reasons for demanding civil rights.  Fair enough, but this thread has focussed on the mobilisation of troops which put NI on alert.  I think your analysis does not regard the sequence of events.  For example I always though that Bombay Street occurred after Lynch's mobilisation of the Republic's army and the perceived invasion threat never mind the orchestrated violence by nationalists which stretched the security forces to breaking point? Loyalists across the country perceived rightly or wrongly that there was a threat to the state and HMG believed the region was in serious danger of descending into anarchy.  Hence the intervention that Jim Murphy asked about.  Any intervention by the ROI would have been bad for both main communities in NI and possibly for the ROI too.  It's hard to call what the result might have been.

And of course all this trouble & mayhem had nothing to do with housing issues, gerrymandering,voting rights which were
denied time & time again to the Nationalist Community by what we shall laughingly refer to as the Government of Northern Ireland? Keep taking the happy pills Roger

[but we couldnt do a thing about it]

Great Night SB, although as somebody else said the room was so warm to be almost uncomfortable. Ricey &
Mulcahy were the pick of the bunch. Thought Joe B was slightly subdued, but definately worth the time & money.

the room was a tad warm, but we couldnt do a thing about it, open the doors and it was too noisy!! Lynett Fay she held her own, and also fair play to the Rossa mum for having a go a Joe.

Yeah understood, just an observation. A great night, looking forward to next year!

[fuckin]

Same band he had on the last show.... shite!

Didn't get to see much of it but I can't fuckin stand that fuckin band he has with him...

too much of a copy cat of Letterman and those annoying pricks he has with him

Easy CM, take a deep breath, count to ten

Not too bad so far. At least he's giving the guests time to answer, without cutting across them, unlike the previous two
presenters

Great Night SB, although as somebody else said the room was so warm to be almost uncomfortable. Ricey &
Mulcahy were the pick of the bunch. Thought Joe B was slightly subdued, but definately worth the time & money.

Still get up every Monday to Friday & head off to work, & in these particular times, you gotta be happy with that!

...surely its a tad (if not very) insulting to say that the nationalists brought it upon themselves?
I am pretty sure he knows this too and has continued to back up this insensitivity rather than apologise for its crassness.
no one is insulting roger - people are having a go at his very inflammatory and insulting comment.
It does give insight into the perspective of loyalist/unionists on this matter (and all other connected matters) ie the nationalists/taigs etc 'got what they were looking for' !

Try reading my post instead of reading into it what you want followed by your usual insults and hysterical rants.

maybe read your own posts to realise the idiotic insulting rubbish - that is historically incorrect - you have written !

Did the nationalists challenge the security forces?  Did this challenge, subsequent reaction and resultant security situation require and justify the intervention by the army? For me both answers are yes.  At the time the this was considered to be a good result by nationalists and seemingly claimed as such.

Roger, the only reason that the so called security forces at the time may or may not have been challenged was due to
the fact that these security forces (paramilitary forces, some would say)  were only there to try to keep a faltering and
at best out of date & out of touch, at worst a bigotted Stormont Regime clinging on to power.

['cant give back what you never owned']

Collatoral damage

Describing the murder of innocent people in terrorist attacks as "collatoral damage" is a pretty good example of why even now Sinn Fein has such small political support in the south.

the majority of sf'ers - esp in the south - are nothing to do with the IRA

however your statement goes to show that the old unionist line of 'sf/ira' has stuck in the minds of many !

had to laugh at rogers attemt to wind up there - 'cant give back what you never owned'.
So Ireland existed only upon the arrival of cromwell then !

Sure Britain's never been at that divide & conquer craic. Weren't India & Pakistan always two seperate countries as well

[On a slightly diff point,i believe at 2006 there were 14 prods in the Garda.Out of a force of i think 12,000? Quite a low % Wonder why]

their proportion has gone from 8% in 1998 to 26% by July 2009.

On a slightly diff point,i believe at 2006 there were 14 prods in the Garda.Out of a force of i think 12,000?  Quite a low % Wonder why

Not doubting your word, but where did you get this figure? Father-in-law & 2 brothers in law are Guards, so would
be interested to get their view on this.

2 Tyrone men in there.

[Shows a lack of respect for the other candidates]

Why doesn't he come out and tell us what the terms and conditions were that he needed in eriting before he "accepted" the job.


Shows a lack of respect for the other candidates IMO.

Never mind a lack of respect for Armagh.

Anyone consider that maybe Grimley doesn't want to be number one and is waiting for Mc Geeney to get it so he can be number 2.

Why bother moving from Kildare then?

Grimley is the new Armagh Manager - just heard in on the vine.

A good move by Armagh, if true.

[mainly]

I have no problem condemning indiscriminate killing, whether its carried out by private armies like the IRA or by armies of states. The victims end up just as dead.

But discriminate killing is okay?

I believe that in some circumstances - self defence, mainly - killing is justified. If you want to call that discriminate killing, fair enough.

You say self defence killing, in the main could be justified. What other circumstances could be justified, in your opinion?