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The cynic in me agrees with Il Bomber Destro, he made the same point I believe about Paul O'Connell and I would have argued against, although I can see the point Ballinaman is making as well. The pressure on players to succeed even at amateur level is ridiculous, from Joe Brolly public questioning a player's manliness to social media abuse (including this forum), the AFL has a doping problem, rugby has a doping problem (currently 15 lower league (effectively amateur) Welsh players suspended). So is it that inconceivable that ex-professionals were doping and that current amateurs in the GAA are doping, we could all probably sit down and draw up examples of players that have bulked up pretty quickly over a short period of time, and you have to ask how did you do that?

There have already been doping cases in the GAA.

Much as it breaks my heart to agree with you I have to say that I do in this case. The world is besotted by famous people. Prince dying? So what. Now if he was a heart surgeon who had the potential to save 100 lives each year, now there's a tragedy

Cormac McAnallen dying? So what?

Utterly dreadful club final fare in both football and hurling for the second year in a row, played in front of a poor crowd with no atmosphere.

A disgrace that these matches were played in such good conditions - time to relegate them back to provincial pitches, and muck, wind and rain in December where they belong.

Sorry, but I didn't know whether to put this in here or in the WTF thread.

Meath County Board vice-chairman Peter O'Halloran said he was "caught off guard" after rock icon David Bowie was included in the county's votes of sympathy on Monday night as a prank.
It was announced that legendary artist Bowie passed away in the early hours of Monday morning to a global outpouring of grief and tributes, which extended to the Meath County Board meeting.
O'Halloran's inclusion of "the Bowie family in London on the death of David" in the votes of sympathy was met with laughter, but the vice-chairman apologised for the incident afterwards.
"I was caught off guard and unwittingly read it out," he told hoganstand.com.
"I was caught off guard and unwittingly read it out"
"It drew a short bout of laughing from the delegates before everyone realised it was a prank and the seriousness and reverance that is normally given to this part of a county committee meeting.
"This is an item reserved for deceased Meath gaels who have given different levels of service to the GAA in Meath and is always given the respect it deserves.
"I am sure Mr Bowie is entitled to a vote of sympathy but by the correct body and the correct manner.
"I will do my best to ensure that something like this doesn't happen again and I am disappointed that a delegate took this action.
"I have to admit that in the cold light of day I can't understand why someone would do this. It shows a deep lack of respect to Meath gaels and, indeed, to Mr Bowie also."

Surely a Cork County Board meeting would have been more appropriate for this, given that Bowie sang "Rebel Rebel"?

Or perhaps Tyrone, given they used to have Hunky Dory on their jerseys?

[Decluttering the room, decluttering the mind]

Decluttering the room, decluttering the mind

Life coach, Feng Shui advisor to the All-Ireland-winning Dublin football team and face of the BBC TV show "Changing Rooms", Dr. Diarmuid Couch, and renowned sports psychologist and Thinkfulness expert Enda McNulty speak to me about CUSHION, the revolutionary new seven step feng shui programme for the brain which they have developed

A love of Gaelic football unites Dr. Diarmuid Couch and Enda McNulty. Both the Dublin football feng shui guru and the former Armagh corner back, Thinkfulness expert and sports psychologist have tasted All-Ireland success in their respective roles. Now they have teamed up to throw a CUSHION at us.

In the the two months since the CUSHION concept was launched, it has taken Ireland by storm. Celebrity advocates include Cork camogie captain Ashling Thompson, fitness guru Pat Divilly and former Blizzards frontman and mental health advocate "Bressie".

The initial idea came from McNulty as a complementary philosophy to his existing "Flying High" concept.

"I spoke to Jim Gavin a couple of years ago when we were watching the same Sigerson Cup match in UCD. At half-time I asked Jim about his job as an Air Corps pilot. It was at that point that the concept of "Flying High" entered my head, a concept I've since utilised to much success with clients.

"But, however much we'd like to, we can't fly high all the time. I needed a complementary philosophy for those more down to earth moments, for the everyday."

"When we fly high, we need to land safely. If we fall, we need something to cushion our fall. Failure is merely an opportunity to start again more intelligently. Thus the concept of CUSHION was born. Jim never stopped talking about Diarmuid and what a difference the introduction of feng shui principles had made to the Dublin team. Diarmuid was the obvious man to bounce my ideas off. He's an innovator. We've been exchanging ideas now for over a year and the programme came out of that."

Couch is currently basking in the afterglow of helping Dublin to another All-Ireland, His now famous pre-match speech was credited by several players for the victory.

"The best dreams happen when you're awake. I stood on the team bus and spoke from the heart. I told the lads "It's going to be wet out there today, very wet. What you must do is believe that the water that will pour from the sky today is with you. Water gives life. But in the wrong circumstances, water can also take away life. We must use it to our advantage and Kerry's disadvantage. As soon as we reach the dressing room, I want every member of this team to go straight to the showers, stand under one of them in the clothes you are wearing now, turn it on to full power, and wait until you are thoroughly soaked."

"I told them, "That shower you will stand under, think of it as a "shower of power", transmitting positive, life giving, life affirming positive energy to you.""

"They thought I was mad. I got some strange looks, alright, even from Jim Gavin", says Couch, grinning. "But each and every player did it. In fact, when all the players had returned to the main dressing room area and dried themselves off, several players said to me what a beneficial experience it had been for them in terms of clearing their heads for the task at hand. It was at that moment that I knew we were going to win the All-Ireland."

"I've learned that people will forget what you said, what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel."

The CUSHION philosophy

CUSHION is based on seven key principles. These are
1. Competing
2. Understanding
3. Soldiering
4. Helping
5. Innovating
6. Optimising
7. Nourishing

"I see CUSHION as not just something that can benefit elite sportspeople, it's something that everybody can live by and benefit from", says Couch.

Principle 1: Competing:
Couch is clear that "We all compete, be it in the sporting arena or in the arena of everyday life. We compete for jobs, we compete in love, we compete in who can have the most expensive car, the nicest house or the most money. Competition is what drives us as humans. This is natural and as it should be. Principle 1 of CUSHION recognises this fact."

Principle 2: Understanding:
McNulty: "Understanding is key, as we recognise in Principle 2. Understanding ourselves, understanding our limits, understanding that the only limits are those we set ourselves, understanding that by understanding ourselves better there need be no limits to what we can all achieve."

Principle 3: Soldiering:
"Through all of this process we need to work, graft and fight. We call this "Soldiering"", says McNulty.

"Nothing worth having comes easy. By "soldiering", you commit to fight for the cause, whatever that cause may be. By committing to fight for whatever it is you want, you have already won. In the knowledge that you are already a winner, victory is inevitable."

Principle 4: Helping:
"We are a social species", says Couch. "We all need help. No man is an island. He must reach out. He must engage. Pooling our collective talents harmoniously to make a greater whole is what both football and life are about. We all have weaknesses. The night before Dublin's All-Ireland semi-final replay against Mayo, I got the whole team to gather around and listen to that great old classic by The Hollies, "He Ain't Heavy, He's My Brother". Although Alan and Bernard Brogan initially thought I was playing a joke on them, I assured them I wasn't, that this was for the whole team (although unfortunately Diarmuid Connolly, who was at that time at a DRA hearing, didn't hear it.). By the end of the song, they understood. They knew. They knew they were all brothers and that they were there to help each other on the pitch. And that's what they did."

Principle 5: Innovating
Always moving forward is very important for any person, says McNulty. "Innovation never sleeps. We're constantly moving forward. Steve Jobs knew the value of innovation, so did Alexander Graham Bell, so did Johan Sebastian Bach, so did the man who invented the concept of having a rubber on top of a pencil.

What worked today may not work tomorrow. I tell my clients to think of themselves as a shark. If you don't keep moving forward, you'll die. When you're finished changing, you're finished. Innovation never sleeps."

Principle 6: Optimising
"Optimising is may favourite word", says Couch. "It doesn't mean anything, and that's the beauty of it. It can mean whatever you want it to mean. You're the boss. You're in control. With control comes power, with power comes self-confidence. With self-confidence comes the flowering of the human ability to its fullest."

Principle 7: Nourishing
"Nouishing doesn't just refer to food, although obviously that's part of it too", says McNulty. "Nourishing your mind and your soul with positivity is even more important, though. They complement each other. Nourishing promotes growth. Growth in mind, spirit, body. I like to nourish my clients with positive motivational thoughts and memes at every oppurtunity, and as a public service I have made these powerful tools of the mind available to the general public on my Twitter page, @Enda_McNulty.

Dr. Diarmuid Couch and Enda McNulty will join Bressie for a nationwide tour of Thinkfulness workshops in February 2016, where they will speak about the CUSHION concept in practice.

Bookings available at www.cushionIRL.ie

I thought today's match was exciting due to its closeness but, although there were a couple of very good scores towards the end, I felt it was somewhat lacking in quality overall, certainly compared to the Ulster final. Some of the defending was awful. Both teams were frequently wide open.

Boden will have enough to take care of Clonmel but I don't think they'll have enough to beat Crossmaglen or Castlebar.

Explanation of 11 changes could be - 6 subs used during normal time - at the beginning of extra time you can change as many players as you want as long as the players name is on the team sheet - cross made two changes to the team that started extra time and then made a further three subs during extra time hence the 11 changes

I've been having a look at the rule book.

http://www.gaa.ie/content/documents/publications/official_guides/2015%20Official%20Guide%20-%20Part%202.pdf

2.4 (i) The maximum number of substitutions
permitted during the playing of Normal Time
shall be Six in Football and Five in Hurling.
(ii) A maximum of three Substitutions shall be
allowed during the playing of Extra Time

2.6 Players in Extra Time
(a) Any fifteen players may start Extra Time,
except as provided for in (b) and (d) below.

(b) In an Inter-County Game, any fifteen players
on the List submitted to the Referee prior to the
game, except as provided for in (d) below, may
start Extra Time.

(d) A player ordered off in any circumstance in
Normal Time, may not play in Extra Time but
may be replaced.

It would seem to me that the two changes Crossmaglen made at the break between the end of normal time and the start of extra-time were not counted as substitutions under Rule 2.6(a). If so, theoretically, you can make 11 changes to your team (26 is the maximum number allowed on an official matchday panel) in the break between normal time and extra-time and not have them counted as substitutions.

Then you're allowed a further three substitutions during extra-time.

So, theoretically, a team can make 20 changes (substitutions), excluding blood substitutions, during an 80 minute match - 6 substitutions in normal time, 11 at the break between normal time and extra-time, and three during extra-time. That, in my view, makes a mockery of the game.

Yet the black card rule does carry over to extra-time - you're allowed a maximum of three black cards with replacement substitutes in normal-time, but no extra allowance is made for extra-time as a "new game" where black cards are concerned - it's still a maximum of three, even including extra-time.

The way the rules are written is confusing. Why does 2.6 (b) specifically refer to an inter-county game? Is there a difference between the substitution rules in inter-county football and club football? That's the implication.

Anyway, I think being allowed to make that many changes is farcical and clearly hugely favours strong panels.

I would reduce it back to five subs in normal time, and three in extra-time (including the break between normal time and extra-time). And replacing a player who has been red carded in normal-time is a rule I've always disliked.

Can somebody explain to me how Crossmaglen were allowed make 11 sustitutions?

I don't remember any black cards or blood injuries. 11 seems a particularly high number, even with extra-time. Scotstown made just three substitutions over the whole game.

From: http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2015/1129/750082-crossmaglen-come-out-on-top-after-epic-battle/

Subs: D McKenna (0-01) for Hanratty (HT), S Finnegan for Rushe (35), J Clarke for O'Neill (40), C Cumiskey (0-01) for Kelly (45), D O'Callaghan for Aherne (51), A Cunningham for McNamee (54), G Carragher for O'Callaghan (61), P Stuttard (0-01) for Cunningham (61), K Brennan for Murtagh (71) D McConville for S Kernan (75), A Cunningham for K Carragher (76)

The GAA's rules appear to state quite clearly that Kerry's decision to nominate Killarney Legion for the Munster Club Football championship is illegal.

Rule 6.24 of the GAA's Official Guide 2015 states, and I quote: "In the event of a County or Provincial Championship not being completed, the respective Provincial or All-Ireland Championship shall continue without a representative of the County or Province concerned." (Note: not "Club Championship", ie that covers the Dingle angle of the story too).

Now, Kerry themselves have a rule which states that if their County Championship has not been completed by the date of the Kerry representative's first Munster championship tie, that the longest standing club in the County Championship (ie, in this case, Legion) will be nominated to represent Kerry in the Munster club championship.

The point is that this contravenes the GAA's Rule 6.24 which I quoted above. And Kerry cannot have any authority over a competition outside their county jurisdiction, so the GAA's rule 6.24 is the one that should hold.

If the Kerry County Championship has not been completed by Sunday's scheduled Munster club SFC tie between a Kerry team and Nemo Rangers, Nemo Rangers should be awarded the match by walkover.

In previous years other counties have had no representative in provincial club championships because they didn't finish their county championship on time. Tipperary are the most recent example - they had no representation in the 2014 Munster Club Football Championship. Several counties have been forced to play county finals on one day, with the winner playing in the provincial championship the following day. Only this weekend Stradbally won the Waterford football final on Friday night, before playing and losing against Nemo Rangers on Saturday.

So, I ask, why should the rules be different for Kerry?

It's clear - Kerry should have NO representative - unless they replay their county final before Sunday.

Different strokes for different folks, it would appear.

I come from the 26 counties but support the original Ireland team (the IFA team) as I consider them the truer representation of an all-island ideal, given that the IFA is the original governing body for association football on the whole island and the FAI is a partitionist, breakaway organisation.

Ultimately I'd like to see both teams re-united under the auspices of the IFA, playing under a new flag and standing for a new anthem, with home matches at Lansdowne Road.

[Second comings don't usually work either.]

Ros were missing Diarmuid Murtagh, Senan Kilbride, Cathal Shine and a couple more in Enniskillen....Back to the Mayo Civil War. How long will it take for H/C To step down? The players may have grievances, but imo, the heave has been motivated by a desire to see James Horan back as manager. It's his job, if he wants it.

Perhaps, seeing as nobody is saying anything we don't know. Horan coming back wouldn't be ths answer. His tactical flaws were there for all to see. Second comings don't usually work either.

The majority I can think of have been successful.

Jack O'Connor won an All-Ireland when he came back.
Billy Morgan woke Cork football out of its slumber when he came back.
John Maughan's return was a relative success in that he got a very average Mayo team back to an All-Ireland final.
Kevin Heffernan left the Dublin team for nearly two years between 1976 and 1978 and went on to win another All-Ireland in 1983.
Art McRory has had several spells in charge of Tyrone and achieved success in each.
Eamon Coleman and Brian McEniff both achieved reasonable success when they came back to manage Derry and Donegal respectively.
Jimmy Barry-Murphy overall had a pretty successful return in Cork even if things went off the rails a bit this year.

Other returns, like John O'Mahony, Babs Keating, Cyril Farrell and Michael Bond, have not been a success. In most of those cases the game had simply passed those managers by and they had not evolved their thinking on the game. That would hardly be the case with Horan given that he's only been gone a year.

But there's nothing to say that a returning manager shouldn't have success merely because he's managed a team previously.

The thing about doing the job the first time is you are full of excitement, energy and focus. These get lost in a second coming. You know the pitfalls and the work ahead. And this can take a lot away from you including being adventurous and daring.

You don't need time away from a job to know that, though. Any manager who has been in a job for two or three years will have that.

[Second comings don't usually work either.]

Ros were missing Diarmuid Murtagh, Senan Kilbride, Cathal Shine and a couple more in Enniskillen....Back to the Mayo Civil War. How long will it take for H/C To step down? The players may have grievances, but imo, the heave has been motivated by a desire to see James Horan back as manager. It's his job, if he wants it.

Perhaps, seeing as nobody is saying anything we don't know. Horan coming back wouldn't be ths answer. His tactical flaws were there for all to see. Second comings don't usually work either.

The majority I can think of have been successful.

Jack O'Connor won an All-Ireland when he came back.
Billy Morgan woke Cork football out of its slumber when he came back.
John Maughan's return was a relative success in that he got a very average Mayo team back to an All-Ireland final.
Kevin Heffernan left the Dublin team for nearly two years between 1976 and 1978 and went on to win another All-Ireland in 1983.
Art McRory has had several spells in charge of Tyrone and achieved success in each.
Eamon Coleman and Brian McEniff both achieved reasonable success when they came back to manage Derry and Donegal respectively.
Jimmy Barry-Murphy overall had a pretty successful return in Cork even if things went off the rails a bit this year.

Other returns, like John O'Mahony, Babs Keating, Cyril Farrell and Michael Bond, have not been a success. In most of those cases the game had simply passed those managers by and they had not evolved their thinking on the game. That would hardly be the case with Horan given that he's only been gone a year.

But there's nothing to say that a returning manager shouldn't have success merely because he's managed a team previously.

The main problems I have are:
i) It makes the National League even more meaningless than it already is. The "oh but the teams will have seedings to play for" spin is nonsense.
ii) It makes a total mockery of the provincial championships and gives them quasi-O'Byrne Cup status. Obviously they've been "retained" in the proposal purely to increase the chance of it getting passed but if passed, they would likely be abolished within a decade when it becomes obvious they're not being taken seriously - and that's the real plan - to neuter them and abolish them by the back door. The provincial finals, which are marquee occasions, are effectively abolished as we know them and the chance of a provincial title for players is gone.
iii) A load of dead rubber round robin games are introduced. The overall championship is not slimmed down, it's expanded from 60 games to 71 games. The All-Ireland final will supposedly move to the first Sunday in September. Good luck with that.
iv) It takes no cognisance of the fact that there is also a hurling championship.
v) It will give even more of an advantage to stronger panels than is already there.
vi) It does nothing for the club player, drives a deeper wedge between county and club activity and and actually worsens the situation of the club player as it will close the window in April and May when club championship fixtures can take place.

The one good thing about the proposal is that it does away with the notion of a two-tier championship.

The proposed format is a considerable disimprovement on the current system, in my view.

James Horan returning is surely the only tenable outcome of this?

Barring McStay backing out of the Roscommon job at the last minute, there don't look to be any other realistic candidates?