Messages

[Outside of unionism I don't think that analysis is widely shared.]

No doubt a lot of Unionists/Loyalists have fallen for myth and inaccuracy when assessing Eire's record in The Emergency.
I hope that I am not one of them.

EG,

I have no desire to go into a Lynchboy-style parsing line by line.

My main point is that I think that Unionism/Loyalism paint a blacker than black picture of Eire's neutrality in WW11. 

I never stated anyone should be grateful  for any particular actions by Eire but to state that acknowledging these actions (however small) they were doesn't fit with the "right" view.  Reading some unionist views (even on your own parish of OWC before the locks went on) I see Eire's neutrality painted more as pro-Nazi. (anchored around DeValera's famous visit to the German ambassador).

Outside of unionism I don't think that analysis is widely shared. 

/Jim.

I have come across this in England.

I had a row with an Australian about this on a crowded Melbourne Connex train.

They Myth is alive and well in the former British Empire, where the Irish are often percieved as the traitors to the crown and we deserved all the hardship dished upon us by our neighbours.

I'd rather be a traitor to the crown than a lickspittle.

Aaah we should by pass Down and go straight to the first round qualifiers, sure there is no point in showing up.

  I can't believe any bona fide Down fan would even contemplate choosing another sporting fixture over this one, I just can't understand the reasoning behind it.

The ridicule and abuse we had to listen to leaving Clones in 99 has never quite left me.  I know we have the qualifiers now but losing this one doesn't bear thinking about.  The thought of Ciaran McKeever celebrating at the final whistle is making me feel quite sick.

  I hope wobbler is wrong but I can see where he is coming from.

  Down by a point, Coulter scoring a major with the last kick to secure victory!

Prepare to be sick, POR is bringing back McGeeny and Houlie I hear.

Wayne Rooney comes from a clan of knackers in Clare

Thats a slur on knackers...take it back.

Haven't seen much Sinn Fein posters up and around Omagh yet. Plenty of SDLP, DUP and UUP.

armagh plastered in stoops not many shinners

Banbridge had a right few SF posters up on Saturday, not too many about on Sunday, typical, they'll be sitting on top of the bonfire on 11th July along with numerous Down flags that were liberated by those brave loyal sons of ulster 

Is that not what Down flags are for? Burning?

FFs lads lets not loose the run of ourselves and call for the mods every 5 secs whne there is something you don't like. I am not on here criticising the person i am speaking about his performance as  a ref. what he does in everyday life is his own business but i am entitled to comment on the performance of a ref just as i am the performance of a player. Surely we won't get jail for that.

Assessing and giving an opinion on a ref is one thing, calling him a cheat and some of the personal abuse that has been posted is not imo acceptable.

[any Irishman]

4000 is a "record" number. I wonder when the record keeping began. 

My nephew was one of the officer cadets who made it to the three day assessment. He was saying most of the boys in the barracks were intending to join up with the Brits if they weren't successful. IMO they should be stripped of their citizenship.

I don't really understand why someone would want to join the british army, but that's just ridiculous.
This isn't a dictatorship, free will exists.

In a dictatorship they'd be shot. I agree 100% with Ulick on this one. Why the hell should any Irishman be permitted to join an army that has shot and murdered Irish citizens for 100's of years right up to the present. They have the free will to do so if they so wish, Ireland should have the free will to tell them to leave their passports at the ferry when they leave.

"Any Irishman"?

You seem to forget that there are one million Irishmen and women on the island for whom joining the British Armed Forces is entirely natural, like these two, for example:
http://www.4ni.co.uk/northern_ireland_news.asp?id=124709
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/rir-soldier-becomes-afghan-hero-after-saving-eightyearold-girl-15065346.html

P.S. On the subject of correct nomenclature which has hijacked this thread, I always find it amusing that those posters who are most insistent on the use of the correct [sic] term "Ireland" etc, are invariably the same ones who are completely incapable of typing "Northern Ireland"! Indeed they will resorting to "the Six Counties" or "the North" etc, even ]when a simple "NI" is quicker, more accurate and pretty much unmistakeable... 

I think you'll find 'Northern Ireland' is not more accurate, Donegal is the most northern part of the main landmass of the island and yet it is in the 'south' / '26 counties', therefore 'Northern' is entirely incorrect

Further to MnG's reply above, Donegal is not in Northern Ireland (NI), it is in northern Ireland.

Though these days, it probably wishes it was in both...

At least the South has only had one bailout your "wee country" would have long since sank if it wasn't for the British (as opposed to Uk) tax payer.

Actually, I thinkl you'll find that from 1920 to 1980 (approx), NI was inherently much more wealthy/self-sustaining than the Republic was, by just about any marker you care to choose.

This changed essentially due to four factors:
1. The de-industrialisation which hit the UK (and other Western economies) from the 80's on (shipbuilding, engineering, aircraft etc);
2. The onset of 30 years of civil strife in NI;
3. The EEC pouring (net) billions into the ROI, whilst simultaneously taking it from the UK;
4. More progressive economic policies eventually being introduced in the Republic.

Meanwhile, if NI is one of several UK regions which is currently heavily dependant upon central Whitehall subsidy in order to pay the bills etc, that's how things work in a Union, you take the Rough with the Smooth.

Indeed, this point was never more pertinent than this week, what with it being the anniversary of the Belfast Blitz*, when NI had to bear its share of the Nazi assault, whilst simultaneously the Free state was essentially being spared starvation and complete economic collapse, due to the efforts of the British Navies**, both Royal and Merchant.


* - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belfast_Blitz
** - Read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cruel_Sea_(novel)

I note the British Navy, not NI Navy. Also whilst some sections of the population of the north may have been wealthy the majority were on the bread line. but hey your type of revisionist drivel would deny discrimination against Catholics or qualify it by "sure Protestants were just as badly off". I stand by my original statement only Briitish subvention kept the NI Statlet with its Protestant Parliament for a Protestant people afloat.

You did say - any Irishman.

I can happily confirm I was talking about any Irishman in the 26 counties as per the thread title.

Blueshirt!!

[any Irishman]

4000 is a "record" number. I wonder when the record keeping began. 

My nephew was one of the officer cadets who made it to the three day assessment. He was saying most of the boys in the barracks were intending to join up with the Brits if they weren't successful. IMO they should be stripped of their citizenship.

I don't really understand why someone would want to join the british army, but that's just ridiculous.
This isn't a dictatorship, free will exists.

In a dictatorship they'd be shot. I agree 100% with Ulick on this one. Why the hell should any Irishman be permitted to join an army that has shot and murdered Irish citizens for 100's of years right up to the present. They have the free will to do so if they so wish, Ireland should have the free will to tell them to leave their passports at the ferry when they leave.

"Any Irishman"?

You seem to forget that there are one million Irishmen and women on the island for whom joining the British Armed Forces is entirely natural, like these two, for example:
http://www.4ni.co.uk/northern_ireland_news.asp?id=124709
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/rir-soldier-becomes-afghan-hero-after-saving-eightyearold-girl-15065346.html

P.S. On the subject of correct nomenclature which has hijacked this thread, I always find it amusing that those posters who are most insistent on the use of the correct [sic] term "Ireland" etc, are invariably the same ones who are completely incapable of typing "Northern Ireland"! Indeed they will resorting to "the Six Counties" or "the North" etc, even ]when a simple "NI" is quicker, more accurate and pretty much unmistakeable... 

I think you'll find 'Northern Ireland' is not more accurate, Donegal is the most northern part of the main landmass of the island and yet it is in the 'south' / '26 counties', therefore 'Northern' is entirely incorrect

Further to MnG's reply above, Donegal is not in Northern Ireland (NI), it is in northern Ireland.

Though these days, it probably wishes it was in both...

At least the South has only had one bailout your "wee country" would have long since sank if it wasn't for the British (as opposed to Uk) tax payer.

[Are there no moderators here? some of this stuff is libelous.]

Are there no moderators here? some of this stuff is libelous.

And some of the spelling is atrocious.

Missed anl but blame the spell check...and it is still libellous.

[Are there no moderators here? some of this stuff is libelous.]

Are there no moderators here? some of this stuff is libelous.

It's a digrace isn't it Paudie.

Typical Tyrone man barking up the wrong tree.

Did I hear correctly?  UKIP are running for seats in Stormant. Will  people vote for them?  Hoping to be real opposition in the chamber.

So are The BNP!!!

[Are there no moderators here? some of this stuff is libelous.]

Are there no moderators here? some of this stuff is libelous.

He seems like a bit off an ass to be fair..  Surely the sign of a good ref is that no one talks about them after a game. But again the GAA top brass seem to pick the more harsh refs for big games and this takes away from the spectacle usually.  I wonder did he ever play himself?

At the start of the championship last year the refs were told to referee the handpass really tightly. The Derry Armagh game was the first one to be reffed like this and it was a farce. From then on all the other championship games were reffed less and less tightly with regard to the handpass rules. Most refs now apply common senese to allow the game to flow. At the moment Hughes is the only ref who refs this rule really tightly and he is way over the top. He has almost completely destroyed every game i've seen him ref.

In fairness to him it's not his fault if he applies the rules. In the Cork Armagh game on Sunday a number of players fouled the ball when passing and the Ref ignored it...Who is applying the rules? Paudie is a good ref who can be a little fussy at times and doesn't deserve the crap being peddled about him here. No Ref no Games. And if we are all honest we all wear tinted glasses when watching games.

How about throwing Kieran Toner in at full forward? He would of thrived on those high balls that Armagh were hoofing into the forwards in the second half versus Cork. Jamie and Stevie would have done the rest.

Also whats the story with Stephen Kernan? Surely he should be tried out at centre half forward? with Dyas left half forward and Swift on the right side. I think this combination would be Armagh's strongest half forward line available.

How about throwing POR to the wolves?

Kidding, the SK situation is ridiculous if Donal Murtagh is allowing his alleged issues with him to keep him of the panel. In relation to Tony, Armagh have thrown him in when the game is starting to go away from us and expecting miracles. He needs a run in the side.