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Here's last year's Div 1 top 6 in order
1)Creggan
2)NG
3)Cargin
4)NEoin
5)LD
6)PG1

anyone think NEanna will break into this and at who's expense?

Don't see it. Perhaps PG1 if their trajectory has been stunted somehow.  NEanna were very fit last year and came out of the blocks quickly, expect the same in the league this year but suspect they are way off a senior championship tilt.

ps love Bannside's Antrim optimism, got to give it to the guy, we're bottom of Div 4 and he can still see the bright side. Supporter of the year already!

It's an odd one though isn't it. The bare minimum between two of the better teams and then a bit in it against Wexford who got turned over themselves by London (not as a disservice to London).

Think it's highlighting the inexperience of the squad at the minute. If we were looking at players on the team who would have 20/30+ senior matches under their belt etc?

You're failing to grasp 3 things:

1- that Dublin have the biggest access to commercial revenue hence they already have revenue streams no other county comes close to so shouldn't need massive cash injections from HQ

2- Cork the second biggest county is not even getting 10% of the development grants Dublin have over the past 13 years.

3- Dublin have received the most development every year for at least the last 13 years. That is arguably straight up financial doping to an already very successful county.

By what metric are you defining Cork as the second largest county?

Is the st endas game on anywhere?

I would suspect the other hurling match was on at that time though not sure?

Only streaming via TG4 online I think.

I believe the antrim team yesterday had 5/6 maximum of the best footballers in county , two johnstones , fitzy ( who didn't start ?) , McBride , murray and delargy. Fine margins it came down to in the derry and yesterdays wexford game hitting the woodwork doesn't help things. Lennie's time has to be up we need something new to get us out of the basement. Seasons over unless we get a good draw in the qualifiers.

We can't keep going with this managerial roundabout when it's clearly not the issue.
There is no grade where Antrim are competitive in football. They might get the odd year where they catch someone on the bounce at minor, but as a whole it's not something to be relied on.

Starting with the senior team is treating the symptoms rather than the cause.

3rd of feb and county footballers year is as good as over barring a win or two in the qualifiers.

What would the general feeling be for a two tiered championship in Antrim?

Read the article the other day where Declan Lynch was saying the League is the main part of Antrim's season as they aren't going to win Ulster/Sam, it's a sad reality that any ambitions for Antrims season is over already.

To put it in perspective, I don't think we'd won a championship match for about 4-5 years previous to 2009 and then we got to the ulster final. So I'd disagree with the idea of a two tiered championship.

On the other hand, teams seem to have actually progressed in the interim years whereas we've stood still. Some teams have actually regressed, reformed and climbed back up in that time as well.

Is there something we aren't doing? This Gaelfast program can't come fast enough.

The league format was agreed last night. Championship draws next  Monday 4th feb

What was agreed on?

Indeed Dec....chapter 5 of particular interest. A terrific read it must be said. MC himself "lent" me the book when our paths crossed with the county under 21s in 2005 and 2006.

On which point Ned, I will contest that the team of 06 could have matched the achievements of 69. We had players like both Mc Canns, Loughrey, Niblock, Andy Mc Clean, Paddy Cunningham, Pollock, and  more than a few other very capable players (at that time Conor Mc Goldrick and David Mc Alernon were as good as any of the above mentioned) who went on to play senior level. Those 6 above were on the field against Kerry's all Ireland winning team in 09, when we put them to the pin of their collar. I will contend till my dying day that the availability of CJ and Crozier (let's not get started on that)  would have been sufficient to get by against Tyrone who beat us by 2 points in Omagh.

We don't need reminding that Tyrone lost by a point to Mayo in extra time, and a lot of that Mayo team have contested 4 or 5 All Ireland finals.

Definitely a very possible All Ireland title where we contrived to beat ourselves off the pitch!!

Not a chance. We might have taken the scalp off of Kerry in the back door, but that final against Tyrone was won by them at a canter. They'd so much take the foot off the gas than they stuck her in neutral and coasted to the end of the match.

[But a strong club scene in say, Tyrone, a junior team there might be at the same standard as senior teams in say, Louth.]

The provincial/All Ireland club is skewed no matter what you do. People say Kerry teams are at an advantage. But a strong club scene in say, Tyrone, a junior team there might be at the same standard as senior teams in say, Louth.

A club team is only rated as high/low depending on the rest of the teams in that county.

I'd have serious doubts that senior club football in Louth is at that poor of a standard.

The issue of Kerry clubs is a reoccouring talking point year after year. The club system they have down there appears to work very well but it arguably does put their clubs at Intermediate & Junior football levels at an advantage at provincial/All-Ireland with so few clubs playing at senior football level so I'd propose a rule to help partly standardise such entrants across the board.

Namely that a county's senior football championship must have a minimum amount of club teams in its competition, set at either at least one quarter of clubs in that county who entered at least one team in an adult championship (excluding U20/21 comps) in the previous competition year, or 16 clubs - whichever figure is lower for the county concerned. Then at Intermediate level a similar rule would apply, again either one quarter of clubs or 16 whichever is lower, all of whom do not have a team also competing in the county senior championship that same competition year (i.e. club second/reserve teams don't county towards the minimum figure).

Beyond that at Junior (A)/B/C/D/E/Reserve etc. the county CCC are free to make their own arrangements. Counties would still be free to allow amalgamations, divisional teams (and for Intermediate championships, second string teams) to compete in these championships - albeit still with the restriction of such teams not able to compete at provincial & All-Ireland levels - but they would have to meet the criteria of a minimum amount of clubs competing in their competitions above. Failure to do so would see the county forfeit its right to send club teams into the provincial competitions at all three levels that competition year.

Also, state that the top tier club football championship in the county means their winners (or the best eligible team if the winners can't go forward to provincial competition) play in the Senior club championship at provincial level. Then regardless of what they call their second tier championship, those winners go forward to play in the Intermediate provincial championship, with the third tier championship winners playing in the Junior provincial championship with a proviso that Intermediate entrants cannot have played a championship game at senior level (tier 1) in the county that year, nor the Junior entrants played at Senior or Intermediate (Tiers 1 & 2). An exemption would be granted to Kilkenny where at present their Senior football champions enter the Leinster club IFC and their Intermediate football champions enter the Leinster club JFC - the exemption to be reviewed should the Kilkenny SFC winners go on to win the Leinster club IFC.

If the above spins yer head, I'll try and give practical examples. So for example in Tyrone there are 48 football clubs - one quarter of that is 12 teams, so they would be mandated to have at least 12 clubs in their senior & intermediate football championships (currently it's 16 each with the JFC containing 16 first teams & one "thirds" team that is not eligible to progress to Ulster should they win the Junior championship). Meanwhile in Fermanagh there is just 20 football clubs, so would be required to have at least five club teams competing in their senior & intermediate club championship (currently 8 each, with 4 junior clubs). And if my sums are right, Monaghan has 29 football clubs, so they would need at least 8 club teams at senior & intermediate. For counties with more than 64 clubs playing adult football, the minimum amount of club sides required to compete in their senior & intermediate championships would be capped at 16, though of course they are free to have more than this involved.

The provincial & All-Ireland club hurling Intermediate & Junior competitions would need a different approach given the much wider difference in clubs, participation levels and abilities across Ireland compared to that for football, but there doesn't seem to be the same concern of one county semi-dominating either provincial or All-Ireland Intermediate & Junior club championships so I don't think they would need to be a noticeable amount of tweaking.

End of my €0.02

This is a well thought out example of how to allow for a fairer provincial series but it's a non-starter because the GAA will value county autonomy over the fairness of the competition. And if I'm being honest, while it looks good on paper I reckon it'd be hard to find a one size fits all solution for every county.

It was fantastic to see an Antrim football team playing with such abandon

No fear, scowls or head down accepting 2nd best.

We need to have respect for ourselves and each other. Other counties dont let anyone say a bad word about anything to do with their County, let alone their football or hurling teams

Slabbering and doing our own and ourselves down continues that spiral of rubbish.

I think there's a difference between slabbering and pointing out that Endas looked comfortably ahead of the competition. You'd see most other matches at this stage have maybe a point or two in it. Frankly, they took their foot of the gas from my perspective and the ref maybe gave them Galway lads a few decisions they probably wouldn't have gotten elsewhere. Sure the 14 should have been off with a black card in the first half when he dragged down 3.

All in all, we can celebrate a title if it comes to it and nobody will begrudge them with other counties known for gaming the system in the same way (Kerry are the worst culprits) but when it comes down to it it's not a competition they should have been in.

[Take a chance we cant get relegated from division 4!!]

Made the trip over to Jtown last night to watch the seniors in a friendly v jtown. Jtown weren't far off full strength with McHugh Karl McK lee Brennan mckinless and a few other notable county players all featuring. However after what I seen last night it might be a long year in division 4. This is what I took from the game:

1. A few players are not upto the standard not naming names but a few players from aghagallon and Ballymena.

2. James Smith from St bridgets was excellent chipping in with 1.4/5 from play and that's with playing a tough ulster match yesterday - we will need him this year.

3. Ricky  J needs to be the county full back

4. Paddy Nugent needs to be number 1

5. We are really struggling at midfield and I feel in a few weeks time Chrissy McK and Bradley could dominate us.

6. Despite setting up defensively still leaked goals and let Jtown walk through the defence. I have no issue with setting up defensively however when attacking antrim did not commit enough players to the attack still holding 2/3 spare men in defence.

Take a chance we cant get relegated from division 4!!   

What was the starting team? Or what sort of strength were we fielding?

At the u21 final the other night a big lad got carried off after landing on the 4g. Is there any research on grass v artificial surfaces injury wise?

How'd he come down?

There'd be a lot of boys complaining if you're doing preseason on that surface. There's no give compared to sod.

Do we forget Michael Mc Cann was the recipient of a replacement All Star award and a couple of Ulster's.....and he is still in his prime...
[/quote]

When was this?

What is all this 1a/b/2a/b nonsense?  Call it what it is Div 1,2,3,4.
Teams have earned the right to be where they are next year.  I agree with a previous poster, any new proposals should take place the following year, or at least should not affect rightly promoted teams.

I don't understand all this stuff about top tier. They're still moving up in effect as they'll be playing with 2 teams better than them and frankly relegated/promoted teams are usually close enough in ability. But by that logic we can't ever change the leagues because then someone will lose out getting to the "top tier". The league structures are broken and need to be addressed. Like I said previously, St Pauls are doing the right thing for the wrong reasons but the new proposed div 1 with those teams is about right.

The real problem is that St Pauls proposal is a good one, but done for the wrong reasons. I think if it were implemented this year coming they'd have to be some sort of playoff so the likes of St Pats aren't shafted. But who wants to play a crucial game to define their year before anythings started.

It could be implemented but taken into account the finishing positions with promotion/relegation taking place before being applied.
Rossa/Glenavy swapped with Gort na Mona/St Brigids
St Paul's/O'Donnell's swapped with Glenravel/Lisburn

St Paul's would still be in the bottom league which they wouldn't like but it is the only fair place to take with the teams in the promotion/relegation places. Tough suppose it has no impact on the current Div 1/Div 2 as they would be in St Paul's new proposed 1B.

Well it wouldn't affect Rossa/Glenavy as the top 3 leagues would look like this.

1A
Creggan
Galls
Cargin   
Johnnies
LD
PG1
Ednas
AG

1B
Ahoghill
T's
Rossa
Glenavy
Gort
Brigids
Randalstown
Aldergrove

2A
Moneyglass
Dunloy
Ballymena
Sarsfields
Davitts
Rasharkin
Pauls
O'D's


The only teams it affects are Lisburn and Glenravel

The real problem is that St Pauls proposal is a good one, but done for the wrong reasons. I think if it were implemented this year coming they'd have to be some sort of playoff so the likes of St Pats aren't shafted. But who wants to play a crucial game to define their year before anythings started.