gaaboard.com

GAA Discussion => Local GAA Discussion => Laois => Topic started by: Junior Ex Laoistalk on November 07, 2020, 12:17:35 PM

Title: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Junior Ex Laoistalk on November 07, 2020, 12:17:35 PM



Best of luck lads....
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Junior Ex Laoistalk on November 07, 2020, 12:18:28 PM
Is Brody gone from the panel..?
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: on the hop on November 07, 2020, 08:14:45 PM
Is Brody gone from the panel..?

I think since one of the challenge gamesmanship
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Silkyskillssunshinee on November 08, 2020, 02:13:56 PM
Not a great start. Longford look well organised. I still fancy us to turn it around in the second-half though.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Junior Ex Laoistalk on November 08, 2020, 02:36:04 PM
Sound on GAA GO way out of sync, what a shitty service..
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Helix. on November 08, 2020, 02:53:42 PM
Listening on midlands 103 seem to be getting going. 2 points up with 8 mins left!
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 08, 2020, 04:44:38 PM
Happy with that. Division 2 status retained and beating Longford or Louth was all we could hope for this year. Playing Dublin is of no interest to me personally, but I'm sure the players enjoy the challenge.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: recyclebin on November 08, 2020, 08:23:40 PM
GAAGO actually worked fine for me. First time in three Laois games this year that it wasn't jittery. Still waiting on my refund for the Fermanagh game though!

Staying up in division 2 and winning a Leinster quarter final would have met most peoples expectations for the year. We made it hard for ourselves but never gave up and pulled it out of the bag which is a always a good sign to see. Laois teams a few years ago would not have done that.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: blueandwhite1 on November 09, 2020, 09:54:16 AM
It was great to win the match. No matter what way you look at it and what comes next it was still a championship match that needed to be won.

Honestly, I was surprised we won watching how the game developed. Our side-to-side attack is painfully inept and toothless. The occasional cross ball to the full forward line worked at times but the scoring return wasn't great. Longford and Fermanagh found it fairly easy to defend against us. Hard to see where scores will come from against the Dubs. Similarly, Longford and Fermanagh were able to make better inroads into our disorganized defence. Our tackling and pressure was mostly dreadful. It got better in the second half when the tracking back was better. I thought we were probably fitter than Longford and Fermanagh. They seemed to drift out of the game badly in the last quarter where we got better.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: on the hop on November 09, 2020, 10:56:15 AM
fair points, it was a battling performance much like the Fermanagh game and they seemed to have run out of steam near the end. Again the scoring rate wasn't the highest by us but bar a few wild shots the conversion rate is not bad. Once again blighted by a very slow start. it appeared that we started with the usual formation of an inside two , with Kingston junior floating and both lowry and barry occupying the wings. After that we seemed to be flooding the middle third with both Dillon and byrne following their men. for long periods, this structure was a mess between loosing kickouts and what appeared to be a real lack of pace down the sides. the space in front of our full back line was exploited by this and we were under pressure there for long periods. Timmons got on top but we still were giving up chances which Corbett saved the game with.

the substitutions made a big difference. o Flynn made a big difference on his wing and it looked like Piggott moved back towards the middle when o Sullivan came on, but the half back line with Dillon providing cover finished far better. Felt sorry for Lacey as his man was dropping off and stuck with neither an option to follower him or drop off. his man was on a lot of ball. Keogh again made a difference on the wing when he came on, this might have been made easier with the game breaking up but he was far better than both lowry and barry who were very poor.

you would hope the next day that lillis comes back in to try get some ball around midfield. reilly is a willing runner and will probably go to the wing. the foot passing will have to be better, there were some shocking efforts which gave up possession at times. its hard enough playing in a two man forward line with out horrible passes going in. on that, we didn't get gary into the game and evan served up his usual fare of been sublime, dangerous and then ridiculous. while he will always be a target of hits, but he will have to stop this rolling around. if he was 100 percent on the game he could do damage. I would love to see them have a cut next week in that they play to get some goals. anything is a bonus now.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: blueandwhite1 on November 09, 2020, 11:26:58 AM
We seem determined to slow the ball down in attack. The top teams deal with blanket defences by relentless running and attempting to break tackles. We just stop. You can't try to run through a blanket but you can at least get a little closer, draw them in and create space. The running from deep and the forward movement is fairly non existent and it seems that even if there isn't a blanket defence we give the opposition time to organize one by passing side to side. Not going to be fixed in the next week but needs to be a focus for 2021 if we want to stay in Div. 2. We don't have many marquee players these days but the way we play can compensate for that in some way.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: on the hop on November 09, 2020, 11:56:38 AM
We seem determined to slow the ball down in attack. The top teams deal with blanket defences by relentless running and attempting to break tackles. We just stop. You can't try to run through a blanket but you can at least get a little closer, draw them in and create space. The running from deep and the forward movement is fairly non existent and it seems that even if there isn't a blanket defence we give the opposition time to organize one by passing side to side. Not going to be fixed in the next week but needs to be a focus for 2021 if we want to stay in Div. 2. We don't have many marquee players these days but the way we play can compensate for that in some way.

its a killer seeing some one with pace like Dillon turning back with the ball when he has a ten yards on a defender. we probably lack a genuine mobile midfielder to get ahead of the play in the forward line. the foot passing is also a big problem, bar paul Kingston. as for forward movement hopefully sean moore gets a run next year.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: redsetanta on November 09, 2020, 12:08:52 PM
What would lads hopes be for the Dublin game? Or better still the expectations?

It's a bit of a bonus game as nobody would expect anything from it bar an easy win for the Dubs and by how much. PP odds for Dublin are 1/500.

Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Laois Rising on November 09, 2020, 12:51:54 PM
Being realistic if we manage to give Dublin a game similar to what Westmeath did at weekend it would be a job well done. Be nice to end season with something to build upon for next year. I also Sean O'Flynn put his hand up for a starting spot the next day with his performance when coming on. Be interesting to see who goes on Kieran Kilkenny-if we can curtail his influence it would go along way from letting Dublin pull out of sight. I guessing Timmons will be tasked with marking Con O Callaghan-Mike Quirke strong in his praise of Timmons at weekend and rightly so-as good as any full back on the intercounty scene this last decade with little or no recognition outside of the county.   
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 09, 2020, 01:05:14 PM
What would lads hopes be for the Dublin game? Or better still the expectations?

It's a bit of a bonus game as nobody would expect anything from it bar an easy win for the Dubs and by how much. PP odds for Dublin are 1/500.

You'd be hard pressed to find odds like that in any competitive sport. I'd say you'd get similar odds on Michael D taking on Conor Mcgregor. It really is a sham of a competition now in my opinion. The only good thing to come from this year is straight knock out. For over half the teams in the country, it at least gets the misery out the door quicker.

In sumary, I'd be happy under 15. What a thing to say.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Chrimtain on November 09, 2020, 02:14:15 PM
It's a monumental task, but I hope Laois can come through the Dublin match with our heads held high. I hope the Dubs don't play in top gear from throw in to the final whistle. I would take a 12 point defeat.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: SCFC on November 09, 2020, 04:51:43 PM
We simply have to set up defensively. I presume we have Lillis back and also agree O'Flynn should start. He brings a lot of energy. O'Sullivan might be another defensive guy we could play as a wing forward.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: blueandwhite1 on November 09, 2020, 05:36:22 PM
Can we bring back Zach like Cork did with Mark Keane!!
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: The Boy Wonder on November 09, 2020, 05:47:49 PM
Dublin are like a well oiled machine and with ready replacements for any player below par. Their no-expense spared setup is streets ahead of any other county and you can see the totally integrated development system and coaching structure they have from underage to senior. Not a level playing field !

No pressure of expectations on the lads next Sunday anyway. It's a pity the game is not in O'Moore Park - tighter confines might have helped a little.
We have lads nearing the end of their careers and younger lads lacking experience. Hopefully they can lift their game like the hurlers did last Saturday.

Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Butch Cassidy on November 11, 2020, 04:01:25 PM
Very quiet on the football front which is understandable considering what happened on the hurling front.

On Sunday I can see Lilis come in for Lowry and maybe O'Flynn for Lacey. I'd put Piggot on Kilkenny and ask him to follow him wherever he comes. I just hope we give a good account of ourselves Sunday. Jim McGuinness made some good points re Westmeath. They had everyone behind the ball but didnt lay a hand on Dublin so hope we have a plan for both kickous. Our biggest problem is tracking runners and tackling so hopefully Quirke has them switched on for a Dublin onslaught.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Chrimtain on November 11, 2020, 10:12:03 PM
Seems crazy that Laois have played Dublin in the championship on 34 occasions and not once in a Laois venue. I'm not claiming that it would make any difference to the result on this occasion, but surely, given that no supporters are allowed, our county board could have looked for this match to be played in Portlaoise. I saw where someone has suggested elsewhere, that this unfairness would never happen in any other sport.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: recyclebin on November 11, 2020, 11:05:57 PM
There should be a home and away arrangement up to the Leinster Final. It's unbelievable that Dublin have never had to play Laois in Laois for a championship game. I think we should leave Leinster and join Munster in protest! There are too many teams in Leinster anyway. A few others could also move to Munster and another few to Connacht.

Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: redsetanta on November 12, 2020, 09:46:30 AM
Is it not the case that we have had the opportunity to play Dublin in Portlaoise but the gate receipts are worth more to Laois if played in Croke Park? It's more about money than fairness.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Chrimtain on November 12, 2020, 11:41:48 AM
When did we have the opportunity to play Dublin in Portlaoise and turn it down?
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 12, 2020, 12:32:51 PM
The game in Kilkenny a few years ago should have been played in Portlaoise. The CB put up no resistance to that at all. It was inexcusable in my opinion not to give us that opportunity. It turned out to be nothing more than a 1940s type Pathe clip. Ooh look at these Dublin people stepping off the train into the great city of Kilkenny.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: redsetanta on November 12, 2020, 12:47:06 PM
That would be one high profile game but other years we would have drawn Dublin but then Leinster council would meet and agree that the game be played in Croke Park. Laois delegates were happy to go along with this for the additional revenue
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Chrimtain on November 12, 2020, 01:44:58 PM
Apart from the recent match in Kilkenny when GAA HQ decided that the match was going ahead there, I don't recall instances when we turned down the opportunity to have Dublin matches in Portlaoise. I'd imagine that the Laois CB would be under huge pressure from local businesses to have the Dubs come down to Portlaoise if they had the opportunity.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 12, 2020, 03:03:05 PM
As I remember, that pressure was evident for that match a few years ago. Wasn't there a local hotelier asking for it? Didn't seem to stir much of a response. We do what we are told to do in Laois. It was definitely one of those occasions when we should have stood up for ourselves. Even the Flourbags got to hold a match in that hay barn they call their county grounds.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Unlaoised on November 13, 2020, 11:58:42 AM
Dublin will play a good few fringe players this weekend they will be keeping their bit hitters till  Meath Donegal Mayo games i think we might keep it tighter than people think .
I'm going for a respectable 9 points defeat .

Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 13, 2020, 02:13:11 PM
Good luck to the team against Dublin. They have done everything that could realistically have been expected of them this year. Go out and enjoy yourself and play with no fear
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: The PRO on November 13, 2020, 04:58:52 PM
Dublin will play a good few fringe players this weekend they will be keeping their bit hitters till  Meath Donegal Mayo games i think we might keep it tighter than people think .
I'm going for a respectable 9 points defeat .
In a way, fringe players looking to impress could mean more punishment for us than a full strength Dubs team. Lads looking to bury a goal or 2 to catch Dessie's eye!
Anyway, hope we give it a good lash.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Heshs Umpire on November 14, 2020, 12:55:00 PM
Best of luck to the lads tomorrow. I'm sure they have their own targets to hit and I hope they do that. A win just isn't realistic but it'd be great to see a performance with plenty of character.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Junior Ex Laoistalk on November 14, 2020, 06:54:12 PM
Laois team to play Dublin tomorrow.



                                                   Niall Corbet (Clonaslee)

Trevor Collins (Graiguecullen), Mark Timmons (Graiguecullen), Robbie Pigott (Portarlington)
    Sean O’Flynn (Courtwood), Paddy O’Sullivan (Portarlington), Eoin Buggie (Stradbally)

                      Danny O’Reilly (Graiguecullen), John O’Loughlin (Rosenallis)

    Gareth Dillon (Portlaoise), Paul Kingston (Arles-Killeen), Brian Byrne (Graiguecullen)
         Evan O’Carroll (Crettyard), Kieran Lillis (Portlaoise), Gary Walsh (Ballylinan)

Subs: Matthew Byron (Courtwood), Mark Barry (O’Dempsey’s), Ross Munnelly (Arles-Kilcruise), Michael Keogh (St Joseph’s), Diarmuid Whelan (Ballyroan-Abbey), Alan Farrell (Ballylinan), Shane Bolger (Killeshin), Brian Daly (St Joseph’s), David Seale (Portlaoise), Denis Booth (The Heath), James Kelly (St Joseph’s)


https://www.laoistoday.ie/2020/11/14/laois-senior-football-team-and-panel-named-for-leinster-semi-final-with-dublin/
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Chrimtain on November 15, 2020, 06:51:39 AM
The very best of luck to Laois today. Come off that field with your heads held high.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Silkyskillssunshinee on November 15, 2020, 04:13:50 PM
Good effort in that first half. If O’Carroll had got that goal in the first minute it would have been a real boost.

I expect the floodgates to open in this second-half with Dublin bringing on their strong bench. Plenty of encouragement to build on in Division 2 for next year though.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Chrimtain on November 15, 2020, 04:17:00 PM
Doing some foolish things like losing a free out through stupidity.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: BallyroanAbu on November 15, 2020, 04:24:53 PM
What did JOL get yellow for ?
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: mountrath1 on November 15, 2020, 07:30:53 PM
22pts..A dual county?? County board need to look closely with respect to how the county moves forward from a developmental perspective to be a dual one..
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 15, 2020, 07:43:59 PM
To be fair Mountrath, that's just the size of the gap between us and Dublin. I think this one is more a GAA wide problem. It's quite possible that the All Ireland Championship is no more than a glorified FA Cup. I certainly cannot justify sending a team out to get that sort of mauling. It's not even sport in my opinion, and no fault of Dublin's either. They're in the business of winning football matches.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Butch Cassidy on November 15, 2020, 07:59:02 PM
I agree High Fielder. Unfortunately it's just the gap between Dublin and Leinster and if anything its widening. Laois spent 800k preparing country teams last year yet they are miles ahead from the top table in both codes. You wonder is it sustainable.

On the game itself I thought Timmons was very good. When he goes he'll leave a big gap at #3. We kept running into blind alleys that lead to turnovers, very frustrating. Laois could really do with a full time S&C coach that works with all teams from u14 up. The difference in pace and power is crazy especially with the younger members of the panel.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: town1980 on November 15, 2020, 11:47:13 PM
Butch we were beaten by 22 points and you think Timmons was good,, he is 34  h has been brilliant but time is up bringing on Ross the same it’s time to pass the baton on,, we are light years away everyone take there heads outa the sands paying both managers the money there on for absolutely nothing is ludicrous I think when there is Laois people that will do the same ie get beat by 21 points in  football and yee can shite on all yee like it’s not gonna change who we have ,, we don’t av the pick players simple as ,2 portlaoise men after 13 in a row playing ffs it all makes sense
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: on the hop on November 16, 2020, 12:25:29 AM
The facts make awful reading, 3-2 before the water break and 2-20 to 0-5 for the rest of the game. 1-16 alone in the second half and Dublin not even at full steam.  An absolute tanking. Would have thought we might some sort of plan or maybe we did.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 16, 2020, 07:20:14 AM
Dublin don't mess about. This is a proper indication of the gap that exists between the likes of us and them. League matches and to a large extent, games against other teams, do not give us a proper idea of the chasm. Nobody is at fault here. Our players can only be as good as they are able to be. I've been saying this for a long time. The GAA has a problem. This isn't sport.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Laois Rising on November 16, 2020, 11:00:44 AM
Tell me what other Portlaoise players should be starting for Laois Town1980? Ridiculous statement. For years I have been sick of watching Portlaoise players half commiting to playing for Laois or if they don't make starting fifteen get a hump and drop themselves off the panel. Portlaoise representation is an indictment of your current standing in Laois GAA in 2020 and looking at what is coming through in your club it will be a long time before a Laois senior team is backboned by Portlaoise players.

I know Laois got a tanking yesterday but that is the nature of a team like Dublin being so professional in set up in this modern era. Every individual on their team is that bit better than on Laois team. No shame in that. Over the course of 70 minutes it is inevitable that they will keep a scoreline ticking over and ultimately stretch out of sight. Lets be honest, even our golden generation team of 2003-2006 would probably struggle to get within 10 points of that current Dublin team.   

High Fielder is right the GAA has a problem. The sooner the league is switched to the summer and becomes the priority competition for the 20-25 or so counties that will never get in an asses roar of winning an Ireland the better.  Play the league and championship in tandem but at least have a serious competition for counties to compete in come end of the inter-county season. It's farcial to have teams training for and spending a  fortune on a competition that they are canon folder and simply making up the numbers.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: blueandwhite1 on November 16, 2020, 12:18:44 PM
Laois have been somewhere between the 20th and 16th best football team in Ireland for a number of years now. We rarely beat anyone in the top 10 these days and usually beat teams in the bottom 10. The gap between us and Dublin is not just a Laois problem. Most counties are miles behind. Dublin changed the game in the last 10 years and have become a professional outfit in terms of their fitness, athleticism, playing structure and skills. This is driven by many things - population, organization, leadership and importantly - money. Money buys you coaches in schools, marketing teams, fitness centres, a pile of physios, etc. etc. The GAA pumped money into Dublin in the late 90s and 2000s as it was on the decline. However, Dublin is now self financing at levels that the GAA could never afford.

Sad to say but we can only realistically expect to be as good as maybe Monaghan or Armagh. Even with a rare group of talented footballers like we had with the minors you can only go so far. Kildare are proof of that and they have alot more resources than us. Football has changed utterly and can't see it ever going backwards. Mayo, Donegal, Kerry, Tyrone, Cork, Galway and Dublin have disproportionate resources in terms of finance and playing populations. Other counties are likely to pass us out too unless we have a big benefactor or the GAA start spending on weaker counties to a much greater extent. They will only do this when it is too little too late as they really don't give a damn about small counties. We don't generate revenue or headlines.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 16, 2020, 12:32:51 PM
Excellent post blueandwhite. It seems Brennan and Quirke have to hold their hand out for the very basics
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Chrimtain on November 21, 2020, 07:42:52 PM
I know it's only half time in the Leinster final, but it's hard to see things getting much better for Meath.

Surely the GAA must see now, how big a problem they have in Leinster.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: yellowcard on November 21, 2020, 08:08:41 PM
Hopes were raised with Donegal’s last 2 performances that they had emerged as genuine contenders to Dublin. Unfortunately on tonight’s performance I think Dublin are in a different League. That said I think Donegal are the only hope left of providing Dublin with a competitive game.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Butch Cassidy on November 21, 2020, 08:16:17 PM
The only solution to the Leinster problem is splitting Dublin. Until the inevitable 10 All Irelands in a row, nothing will change for the forseeable
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Downtheroad on November 21, 2020, 11:04:48 PM
I think the empty stadium tonight may well be a sign for the future. No neutral in their right mind will watch this on TV never mind go to matches. I agree it will be at least a 10 in a row before the powers to be realise that they have a problem.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 22, 2020, 12:28:52 AM
Talk of splitting Dublin is pointless. Never going to happen, or nor in my opinion should it. Dublin are semi professional these days, so that's what it's going to take to compete with them. Even allowing for the same resources and incentives, most counties would never be able to compete. It will take professionalism of sorts, and the dismantling of the inter county system, to make Gaelic football in any way interesting again. You can't keep entering a race you are never going to win
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: RedHand88 on November 22, 2020, 08:43:40 AM
Did that game really need to be in Croke Park?
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Tubberman on November 22, 2020, 08:54:34 AM
Talk of splitting Dublin is pointless. Never going to happen, or nor in my opinion should it. Dublin are semi professional these days, so that's what it's going to take to compete with them. Even allowing for the same resources and incentives, most counties would never be able to compete. It will take professionalism of sorts, and the dismantling of the inter county system, to make Gaelic football in any way interesting again. You can't keep entering a race you are never going to win

So rather than split dublin, the intercounty game should be dismantled and replaced by a small number of professional teams?
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: clonadmad on November 22, 2020, 09:31:56 AM
Splitting Dublin in two would only mean Dublin 1 plays Dublin 2 in every Leinster final
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: imtommygunn on November 22, 2020, 09:45:24 AM
There is absolutely no chance Dublin will be split in two. I don’t know why it is talked about like it is a possibility.

Games with no fans aren’t even taken out of their home stadium.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 22, 2020, 10:29:03 AM
Talk of splitting Dublin is pointless. Never going to happen, or nor in my opinion should it. Dublin are semi professional these days, so that's what it's going to take to compete with them. Even allowing for the same resources and incentives, most counties would never be able to compete. It will take professionalism of sorts, and the dismantling of the inter county system, to make Gaelic football in any way interesting again. You can't keep entering a race you are never going to win

So rather than split dublin, the intercounty game should be dismantled and replaced by a small number of professional teams?

In al probability, yes. There has always been a need to ensure the best players in every county have a platform for their talent. That doesn't exist right now, and never will as long as intercounty is in place. The level of a person's progression in any sport should not be prescribed by their birthplace. The whole thing needs a rethink in my opinion. It is quite boring mostly
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Keyser Söze on November 22, 2020, 10:55:15 AM
I think just dump the provincials? I’d have always been in favour of keeping them. But in reality now what’s the point. In industry you’d use times of serious disruption to evaluate your systems and make brave changes that you’d probably never have broached in times of smooth operations.
In both the GAA and society in general this time is now. There is talk of a changing calendar etc. If making serious structural changes like that you’d be mad not to address the problem areas like the uncompetitive provincial championships.
Play the provincials as the O Byrne Cup is played now.
Use the summer months for our 8 team Divisions.
Dublin playing the other top 7 (Tyrone, Mayo, Cork, Kerry, Donegal, Galway, plus another) home or away over 10-12 weeks with the top 4 making the semis may not dominate forever more.
Dublin, being able to sleepwalk through Leinster and peak for a few games in August probably will.

This is not like the 60s/70s/80s or even 90s when you a Dublin/Kerry/Cork/Galway were delighted to get a good team together, picked it, left it as it was unless a fella retired or died, thanked the Lord for their current riches and roundly accepted that it wouldn’t last forever.
Things are a hell of a lot more scientific now.
The top teams are constantly evolving in terms of both personnel and approach.
There is huge energy and resource going into ensuring that there is a constant supply line coming behind.
They are there to stay.

To remain an attractive proposition the GAA must change.
Laois be better off trying to win a Division 2 championship. If able to do so, you’d fear for the following year in Division 1, but that’s another days work.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 22, 2020, 11:03:52 AM
Great proposals as ever Keyser. Would it be enough to keep players interested though? And guarantee the all important revenue. I personally think intercounty is largely dead. A few hurling games in Munster is not the tide that lifts all boats. We play this thing every year, and for the reasons you outlined, it's getting more uncompetitive. Scrap it and be done. Give every player a chance to be in the big time. Somehow
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Keyser Söze on November 22, 2020, 02:17:14 PM
Nothing in the least bit new in what I said (others have suggested it a thousand times). Would have always wanted to preserve the provincials, but sure there really is no point.
The biggest stumbling block could be those with ambitions to scale the heights of the provincial councils at admin level. Turkeys don’t vote for Christmas.
And like the resistance to merging from the Camogie & LGFA I’d say it’s primarily from those not too far away from the top in the succession game.
If you had worked diligently for 20 years scaling the heights and were within touching distance of Leinster chairmanship would you support a major downgrading in the role, importance & profile of the Leinster Council? Ultimately that’s the kind of thing that decides what changes happen in the GAA (and other organizations!)
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 22, 2020, 02:23:22 PM
You're probably right there. Wouldn't be for me so. I'd be the sort that would always want more for Laois than myself.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Keyser Söze on November 22, 2020, 07:34:16 PM
On mature recollection, I probably could have picked a better day to start arguing for the abolition of the Provincials  :D
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: G@@ on November 22, 2020, 07:47:48 PM
In al probability, yes. There has always been a need to ensure the best players in every county have a platform for their talent. That doesn't exist right now, and never will as long as intercounty is in place. The level of a person's progression in any sport should not be prescribed by their birthplace. The whole thing needs a rethink in my opinion. It is quite boring mostly

The Premiershit is about 200 miles east of here if that is what you want. Ask them nicely to allow kicks over the bar to count as points.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: ohara on November 22, 2020, 08:15:38 PM
Completely disagree...simple solution is split Dublin. Just to big population wise to play counties like Laois and Offaly.

The GAA correctly pumped money into Dublin, to grow participation rates....(Laois offaly and Carlow already had good participation rates so money not needed)

A byproduct of this was Dublin intercounty team becoming too strong ( but still worthwhile exercise to grow playing numbers, (the true goal of gaa)

So it's now time to split Dublin...This idea of young laois players being excluded from top competion is a disgrace...I think your idea  disgrace. Just split the 1.5m population county in 2...simple as

quote author=Keyser Söze link=topic=29763.msg2010850#msg2010850 date=1606042515]
I think just dump the provincials? I’d have always been in favour of keeping them. But in reality now what’s the point. In industry you’d use times of serious disruption to evaluate your systems and make brave changes that you’d probably never have broached in times of smooth operations.
In both the GAA and society in general this time is now. There is talk of a changing calendar etc. If making serious structural changes like that you’d be mad not to address the problem areas like the uncompetitive provincial championships.
Play the provincials as the O Byrne Cup is played now.
Use the summer months for our 8 team Divisions.
Dublin playing the other top 7 (Tyrone, Mayo, Cork, Kerry, Donegal, Galway, plus another) home or away over 10-12 weeks with the top 4 making the semis may not dominate forever more.
Dublin, being able to sleepwalk through Leinster and peak for a few games in August probably will.

This is not like the 60s/70s/80s or even 90s when you a Dublin/Kerry/Cork/Galway were delighted to get a good team together, picked it, left it as it was unless a fella retired or died, thanked the Lord for their current riches and roundly accepted that it wouldn’t last forever.
Things are a hell of a lot more scientific now.
The top teams are constantly evolving in terms of both personnel and approach.
There is huge energy and resource going into ensuring that there is a constant supply line coming behind.
They are there to stay.

To remain an attractive proposition the GAA must change.
Laois be better off trying to win a Division 2 championship. If able to do so, you’d fear for the following year in Division 1, but that’s another days work.
[/quote]
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Keyser Söze on November 22, 2020, 09:03:43 PM
Entitled to your opinion.
I don’t think splitting Dublin would help the Leinster Championship.
I felt the same about the hurling format and felt Laois should have automatic access to the Leinster championship, but in hindsight, having to qualify for it on merit has been a positive development.

Is it comparable to wanting all clubs in the county be allowed enter the Laois SFC? Just a thought!
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: recyclebin on November 22, 2020, 09:05:00 PM
Dublin would probably need to be split into four instead of two and they still would have the biggest pick in the country. They could split it into the four councils.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 22, 2020, 09:20:05 PM
In al probability, yes. There has always been a need to ensure the best players in every county have a platform for their talent. That doesn't exist right now, and never will as long as intercounty is in place. The level of a person's progression in any sport should not be prescribed by their birthplace. The whole thing needs a rethink in my opinion. It is quite boring mostly

The Premiershit is about 200 miles east of here if that is what you want. Ask them nicely to allow kicks over the bar to count as points.

Ever wondered why lads don't commit to Laois panels? I can give you one reason. Not really worth the hassle. Most players who participate in any sport want to win things. We don't win very much and we probably never will. How grim is that forecast? But sure look it's grand. Let's keep putting the hamster on the wheel.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 22, 2020, 09:30:53 PM
Split Dublin as many times as you like. Ballymun would probably give Laois a proper rattle. In fact I wouldn't be one bit confident about beating them. Ballymun and Vincents combined would surely beat Laois, and definitely most Division 3 and 4 clubs. So what are we trying to achieve exactly by splitting Dublin when two clubs only would still be better than most counties? Stop it lads. Just stop it. It's a problem that can't be fixed. Either accept it for what it is, and what we are, or keep dreaming about what could be
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Laois Rising on November 23, 2020, 12:01:03 PM
By splitting Dublin into four you'd have some great games to enjoy in Leinster. Could you imagine the rivalry that would build up over a couple of years between a Dublin North side v Dublin South side meeting in Leinster semi-finals, finals. The numbers that are playing GAA in Dublin now are astronomical in comparison to twenty years ago. From looking at the division 1 scene in Dublin every single player playing at that level would easily hold their own at inter-county level. Clubs like Kilmacud, Boden, Ballymun, Na Fianna have subs who would make the starting team of intercounty panels in smaller counties. Dublin is never going to revert back to the GAA landscape it was in 90s/early 00s where the actually GAA playing population wasn't that much ahead of other counties. If Dublin is left as a singular entity they will continue to hoover up 10/10 provincial titles and perhaps 7 to 8 out 10 All-Irelands for the next decade. If traditionalists want to keep the county structure as it currently is that's fine but they then can't then complain of uncompetitive championships. 

Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: blueandwhite1 on November 23, 2020, 03:49:35 PM
And if you split Mayo in two and Kerry in 3 we would be flying......  ;)

I agree that football is in huge trouble but can't see a split. What would happen if one of the Dublin teams were to become weak? The clamour to put them back together would start.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Chrimtain on November 23, 2020, 04:15:20 PM
I wonder if the county system in football is not at breaking point? Another year or two of beatings like Dublin handed out to Meath and Laois in Leinster  and it will be impossible to motivate players to represent their counties.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 23, 2020, 04:22:39 PM
Splits only happen if there's an appetite for them; not a need. It is absolutely necessary for Portlaoise to have 2 clubs, but there's no appetite for it. That has to be respected, and the same applies to Dublin. The supply lines ran dry in Portlaoise for many different reasons, but I can't see that happening the way things have evolved in Dublin. They have an infinite well of resources these days. So the choices are threefold here. Accept what it is and try to compete. Other counties amalgamate. Or just scrap intercounty.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: blueandwhite1 on November 23, 2020, 04:31:31 PM
Football in the future will be same as hurling is these days. The idea that a small county can make a breakthrough will disappear. Multiple tiers not just in terms of leagues but also standards and aspirations. And what care have the GAA ever given to the fate of hurling in Leitrim, Cavan, Monaghan or Mayo? (or Laois for that matter. Imagine what a €500k annual coaching investment would do to hurling in Laois, Westmeath, Carlow, Antrim etc. where there is no shortage of appetite but no resources).

Not Dublin's fault; they are so good it is an embarrassment to the GAA. A joy to watch but they have no competition. It's a bit like having the All-Blacks in the AIL, Liverpool in the league of Ireland or Celtic in the Scottish premiership. I would guess that Meath would put it up to Tipp, Cavan or Mayo and look what happened to them on Saturday.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: clonadmad on November 23, 2020, 06:05:25 PM
Football in the future will be same as hurling is these days. The idea that a small county can make a breakthrough will disappear. Multiple tiers not just in terms of leagues but also standards and aspirations. And what care have the GAA ever given to the fate of hurling in Leitrim, Cavan, Monaghan or Mayo? (or Laois for that matter. Imagine what a €500k annual coaching investment would do to hurling in Laois, Westmeath, Carlow, Antrim etc. where there is no shortage of appetite but no resources).

Not Dublin's fault; they are so good it is an embarrassment to the GAA. A joy to watch but they have no competition. It's a bit like having the All-Blacks in the AIL, Liverpool in the league of Ireland or Celtic in the Scottish premiership. I would guess that Meath would put it up to Tipp, Cavan or Mayo and look what happened to them on Saturday.

Laois cant even spend the budget allocated to coaching in the county by croke park at the minute

Maybe if we started there first before we go looking for more funds 

Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Keyser Söze on November 23, 2020, 10:20:16 PM
Just out of curiosity ClonadMad, is it that they are not drawing down the full allocation of funds?
Funds they’d have to match?
So basically are saving money but not doing so?

For example that there is funding there for a GDA. Croke Park would pay €18k as long as Laois pay the other €18k to pay their wages.
Is this the kind of situation you’re describing?
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: clonadmad on November 23, 2020, 10:29:47 PM
Just out of curiosity ClonadMad, is it that they are not drawing down the full allocation of funds?
Funds they’d have to match?
So basically are saving money but not doing so?

For example that there is funding there for a GDA. Croke Park would pay €18k as long as Laois pay the other €18k to pay their wages.
Is this the kind of situation you’re describing?

Just one clear cut example and I could give 2 more stark examples

There’s a budget ring fenced and in place for 4 GDA’s  and a games manager since beginning of 2018.

Those positions have never been fully filled at any point in the last 3 years.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Keyser Söze on November 23, 2020, 10:32:00 PM
So just to be clear, it’s money that LCB would have to match that isn’t been drawn down?
Or is there other “free money” also?
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: clonadmad on November 23, 2020, 11:16:59 PM
So just to be clear, it’s money that LCB would have to match that isn’t been drawn down?
Or is there other “free money” also?

It’s money that they could draw down but haven’t,they don’t have to match it.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Junior Ex Laoistalk on November 24, 2020, 12:27:56 AM
Meanwhile the draw for the Senior Championship semi finals has taken place.

Ballyfin v Portarlington
Emo v Graiguecullen


https://www.laoistoday.ie/2020/11/23/laois-senior-football-championship-semi-final-draw-made/
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 24, 2020, 07:29:47 AM
So just to be clear, it’s money that LCB would have to match that isn’t been drawn down?
Or is there other “free money” also?

It’s money that they could draw down but haven’t,they don’t have to match it.

Jesus. Compete with Dublin? I don't think we could compete with Dublin clubs at that rate. It becomes more obvious with each passing day that we're wasting our time here. I wonder what CB delegate has the balls to stand up at Convention and say that this intercounty system is bolloxed. I see poor old Louth decided to burn some good money too. The innocence of it. Jesus turned water into wine and Mickey Harte turned a Division 3 team into All Ireland contenders
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: clonadmad on November 24, 2020, 08:20:20 AM
So just to be clear, it’s money that LCB would have to match that isn’t been drawn down?
Or is there other “free money” also?

It’s money that they could draw down but haven’t,they don’t have to match it.

Jesus. Compete with Dublin? I don't think we could compete with Dublin clubs at that rate. It becomes more obvious with each passing day that we're wasting our time here. I wonder what CB delegate has the balls to stand up at Convention and say that this intercounty system is bolloxed. I see poor old Louth decided to burn some good money too. The innocence of it. Jesus turned water into wine and Mickey Harte turned a Division 3 team into All Ireland contenders

Where did I say compete with Dublin?
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: High Fielder on November 24, 2020, 09:44:31 AM
No I was just drawing a comparison. I'd say some of the bigger clubs in Dublin have at least 1 GDA. I have long since been of the opinion that a Games Development Officer is needed for the Portlaoise area. It looks like we're determined to run this on a very thin budget without any room to manoeuvre. Zero innovation with little emphasis on development
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Silkyskillssunshinee on November 24, 2020, 11:13:17 AM
Meanwhile the draw for the Senior Championship semi finals has taken place.

Ballyfin v Portarlington
Emo v Graiguecullen


https://www.laoistoday.ie/2020/11/23/laois-senior-football-championship-semi-final-draw-made/

Should be two cracking semi-finals. The club championship is miles more entertaining than this inter-county craic. I think Ballyfin could surprise Port. Some of the football they’ve played this season has been quality.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: redsetanta on November 24, 2020, 11:18:22 AM
It's a very open championship and all teams would fancy their chances of winning the title.
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: Laois Rising on November 24, 2020, 11:39:48 AM
So just to be clear, it’s money that LCB would have to match that isn’t been drawn down?
Or is there other “free money” also?

It’s money that they could draw down but haven’t,they don’t have to match it.

It baffles me with the huge number of girls and lads leaving college with degrees in sports management and the likes that these positions cannot be filled. Dublin recruit young enthusiastic female and male coaches who will move on after a couple of years but they bring an energy, drive with them for the time that they are in the position.   
Title: Re: Leinster Senior Football Championship 2020
Post by: clonadmad on November 24, 2020, 11:53:47 AM
No I was just drawing a comparison. I'd say some of the bigger clubs in Dublin have at least 1 GDA. I have long since been of the opinion that a Games Development Officer is needed for the Portlaoise area. It looks like we're determined to run this on a very thin budget without any room to manoeuvre. Zero innovation with little emphasis on development

The Strategic Plan recommended a GDA for Portlaoise Parish,Which HQ were favorably disposed towards funding

That was 2 years ago

One of many recommendations,many of them revenue neutral which weren’t acted upon