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GAA Discussion => GAA Discussion => Topic started by: Evil Genius on August 16, 2020, 07:21:25 PM

Title: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on August 16, 2020, 07:21:25 PM
"An Ulster Unionist MLA has called for equality of funding to sports bodies after official figures revealed Ulster GAA received almost five times more from Stormont in the past three years compared to the Irish Football Association.

Rosemary Barton said Department for Communities figures show that Ulster GAA received over £3m from the department and Sport NI, with the IFA receiving £648,888 and Ulster Rugby £701,289.

"This means that Ulster GAA received almost 2.5 times more than the other two sporting bodies together and almost five times more than that of either Ulster Rugby or the Irish Football Association," she said."

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/ulster-unionist-mla-rosemary-barton-queries-gaas-larger-slice-of-sport-funding-pie-39445089.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/ulster-unionist-mla-rosemary-barton-queries-gaas-larger-slice-of-sport-funding-pie-39445089.html)

Discuss.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: JoG2 on August 16, 2020, 07:29:34 PM
"An Ulster Unionist MLA has called for equality"

 ;D

The times they are a changing
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Rois on August 16, 2020, 08:06:35 PM
What was the proportion of applied for funding versus funding granted?
You can’t give funding to people who don’t ask for it.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Rossfan on August 16, 2020, 08:12:28 PM
Seeing as the GAA got nothing from 1922 to the mid 1990s.....
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on August 16, 2020, 08:32:49 PM
What was the proportion of applied for funding versus funding granted?
You can’t give funding to people who don’t ask for it.
I could maybe see one or other of the two sports being disorganised when it comes to applying etc, but both?

Doesn't seem very likely to me, esp since Ulster Rugby, at least, should be getting prompting from HQ (Dublin), to make sure their funding applications are up-to-date in NI.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Rois on August 16, 2020, 08:59:36 PM
What was the proportion of applied for funding versus funding granted?
You can’t give funding to people who don’t ask for it.
I could maybe see one or other of the two sports being disorganised when it comes to applying etc, but both?

Doesn't seem very likely to me, esp since Ulster Rugby, at least, should be getting prompting from HQ (Dublin), to make sure their funding applications are up-to-date in NI.
So are you  implying that there is a bias within Sport NI  towards the GAA in allocating the funding at the expense of the other organisations? I just can’t see that being allowed to fly. GAA clubs are very VERY good at applying for grant funding, and always have projects in the pipeline, they learn from each other.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on August 16, 2020, 09:08:10 PM
Every sporting organisation has an entitlement to apply for funding. A better question would be whether or not funding was denied to one sporting organisation over another? 

Also it would be interesting to see where the funding was going to?  I would imagine that the GAA would have a lot of capital investment funding for grounds development etc. That has generally higher levels of money involved and also requires that the club/county applying for the funding matches a significant amount of the funding, or actually has the money in the bank and the funding is released in retrospect.

I would doubt that there is an uneven approach to funding being granted, rather that GAA clubs are better at it and looking for higher amounts.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: 6th sam on August 16, 2020, 10:02:05 PM
Every sporting organisation has an entitlement to apply for funding. A better question would be whether or not funding was denied to one sporting organisation over another? 

Also it would be interesting to see where the funding was going to?  I would imagine that the GAA would have a lot of capital investment funding for grounds development etc. That has generally higher levels of money involved and also requires that the club/county applying for the funding matches a significant amount of the funding, or actually has the money in the bank and the funding is released in retrospect.

I would doubt that there is an uneven approach to funding being granted, rather that GAA clubs are better at it and looking for higher amounts.

Also , Gaa clubs are almost unique in that they are community organisations  as well as sporting ones . A lot of the funding they receive is for community halls, gyms, play areas. There are very few rugby clubs by comparison , and like soccer , rugby don’t draw their players from one locality , and therefore are not steeped in the community. GAA clubs tend to contribute heavily to their local community compared to soccer/rugby. Their hunger for voluntary work for their community also results in them investing heavily in applying for funding and in organising match funding.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: delgany on August 16, 2020, 10:09:33 PM
GAA, IFA & Ulster Rugby, usually collaborate on Funding seminars with respect to funding streams via SPORT NI,  across the North.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: imtommygunn on August 17, 2020, 09:32:27 AM
Yeah I very much doubt there is anything to see here other than a headline
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: RadioGAAGAA on August 17, 2020, 09:51:39 AM
The IFA couldn't organise a piss up in James' gate, so disregard soccer. Sure most of them play on council pitches and have little more than jerseys to their name.

There aren't the same number of rugby clubs as GAA clubs, so while they are organised, they are never going to have the same throughput of funding.

Rois statement is correct - You can’t give funding to people who don’t ask for it.

Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: 6th sam on August 17, 2020, 11:53:53 AM
Orange or Community halls in unionist areas receive funding in the same way as GAA community halls.
Comparing soccer, rugby or indeed basketball or netball funding with GAA funding doesn’t give the full picture
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Rossfan on August 17, 2020, 12:53:33 PM
No but it's a great excuse for a Sectarian whinge ;)
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on August 17, 2020, 02:13:05 PM
No but it's a great excuse for a Sectarian whinge ;)
How could anyone bring Sectarianism into it?

Sure isn't the GAA in the north [sic] entirely cross-community?

I mean, you can hardly move in your local GAA club these days for Ghanaian Fishermen and Linda Ervine....
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on August 17, 2020, 03:40:25 PM
No but it's a great excuse for a Sectarian whinge ;)
How could anyone bring Sectarianism into it?

Sure isn't the GAA in the north [sic] entirely cross-community?

I mean, you can hardly move in your local GAA club these days for Ghanaian Fishermen and Linda Ervine....

What are your opinions on the funding?
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Rossfan on August 17, 2020, 03:59:27 PM
No but it's a great excuse for a Sectarian whinge ;)
How could anyone bring Sectarianism into it?

Seeing the source of the whinge.....
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: johnnycool on August 18, 2020, 12:31:45 PM
No but it's a great excuse for a Sectarian whinge ;)
How could anyone bring Sectarianism into it?

Seeing the source of the whinge.....

It depends on the criteria for each particular grant.

We've availed of DAERA grants of considerable amounts of funding and met all the requirements as we own our own grounds, a funding model in place. Sport NI and even our "friends" in North Down and Ards BC had to row in..

Most soccer clubs don't own their own grounds and are heavily reliant on the use of council property and the ones I know with one exception are overly well run on the admin side of things.

Rugby, I haven't had any dealings with in a long time but even back in the 00's most outside the Greater Belfast area and not in the AI leagues were teetering from one year to the next, paying coaches and maybe the odd "star" player and reliant on the odd big sponsor to keep things above board. Revenue from gate receipts wasn't a thing back then for the ones I knew off.


Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: North Man on August 18, 2020, 02:06:37 PM
I too have been involved in SportNI and DAERA funding applications.
They are far from straight-forward processes and will take alot of patience and commitment to suceed.
Before you even apply to such funds you need to be 'spade' ready, ie have planning permission in place at least.
I know of urban GAA clubs that have been able to secure Dept of Communities funding for capital projects.
GAA clubs generally discuss projects, they visit each other and discuss the pit-falls.
I have met up with a couple of soccer clubs to go through potential programmes and whilst they have genunine eager people involved they are not up for the work-load or dont have volunteer skill sets in-house , projects could run from 3 to 5 years from inception to completion.
GAA clubs are in a stronger position day 1, they generally own their grounds, they cater from the cradle to the grave and alot of clubs offer more activities on their premises than their traditional field games.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: naka on August 18, 2020, 02:12:08 PM
I too have been involved in SportNI and DAERA funding applications.
They are far from straight-forward processes and will take a lot of patience and commitment to succeed.
Before you even apply to such funds you need to be 'spade' ready, ie have planning permission in place at least.
I know of urban GAA clubs that have been able to secure Dept of Communities funding for capital projects.
GAA clubs generally discuss projects, they visit each other and discuss the pit-falls.
I have met up with a couple of soccer clubs to go through potential programmes and whilst they have genuine eager people involved they are not up for the work-load or don`t have volunteer skill sets in-house , projects could run from 3 to 5 years from inception to completion.
GAA clubs are in a stronger position day 1, they generally own their grounds, they cater from the cradle to the grave and a lot of clubs offer more activities on their premises than their traditional field games.
agree with this wholeheartedly, my own club have been involved in  various applications and the sub committee contained two accountants and a lawyer.
the Gaa clubs have a lot more volunteers who have the skill set to deliver the funding.
until the IFA/IRFU centrally start helping out their smaller clubs this will continue.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Itchy on August 27, 2020, 01:27:22 PM
Looks like unionists will have to expedite the path to a 32 county Irish Republic so that they can get fair play now for grants and the like. They will get no fair play from the UK or Stormont government it seems.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: smelmoth on August 27, 2020, 08:13:27 PM
Looks like unionists will have to expedite the path to a 32 county Irish Republic so that they can get fair play now for grants and the like. They will get no fair play from the UK or Stormont government it seems.

I’m not too sure unionists can be lumped together on this one. There was no surge of unionist opinion rolling in behind her
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on August 31, 2020, 02:40:46 PM
No but it's a great excuse for a Sectarian whinge ;)
How could anyone bring Sectarianism into it?

Sure isn't the GAA in the north [sic] entirely cross-community?

I mean, you can hardly move in your local GAA club these days for Ghanaian Fishermen and Linda Ervine....

What are your opinions on the funding?
I think it's strange.

That is, if the difference wasn't so marked; or f t were only for one particular year; or if only one of the IFA or Ulster Rugby was lagging behind but not both, then it might not be so unusual.

I wonder whether it is significant that the period in question basically coincided with the suspension of Stormont? That is, with the resulting lack of scrutiny, and whether it was by accident or design, this was allowed to slip through unnoticed.

Someone suggested that "Casement" money might account for the disparity, but I'd have thought that was a separate budget.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Rossfan on August 31, 2020, 03:29:23 PM
I'd refer you to Northman's post of 18th August rather than conspiracy theories.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on August 31, 2020, 03:44:20 PM
I too have been involved in SportNI and DAERA funding applications.
They are far from straight-forward processes and will take alot of patience and commitment to suceed.
Before you even apply to such funds you need to be 'spade' ready, ie have planning permission in place at least.
I know of urban GAA clubs that have been able to secure Dept of Communities funding for capital projects.
GAA clubs generally discuss projects, they visit each other and discuss the pit-falls.
I have met up with a couple of soccer clubs to go through potential programmes and whilst they have genunine eager people involved they are not up for the work-load or dont have volunteer skill sets in-house , projects could run from 3 to 5 years from inception to completion.
GAA clubs are in a stronger position day 1, they generally own their grounds, they cater from the cradle to the grave and alot of clubs offer more activities on their premises than their traditional field games.

No but it's a great excuse for a Sectarian whinge ;)
How could anyone bring Sectarianism into it?

Sure isn't the GAA in the north [sic] entirely cross-community?

I mean, you can hardly move in your local GAA club these days for Ghanaian Fishermen and Linda Ervine....

What are your opinions on the funding?
I think it's strange.

That is, if the difference wasn't so marked; or f t were only for one particular year; or if only one of the IFA or Ulster Rugby was lagging behind but not both, then it might not be so unusual.

I wonder whether it is significant that the period in question basically coincided with the suspension of Stormont? That is, with the resulting lack of scrutiny, and whether it was by accident or design, this was allowed to slip through unnoticed.

Someone suggested that "Casement" money might account for the disparity, but I'd have thought that was a separate budget.

A better answer than I could ever give and blows the notion of your conspiracy shite out the door.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Downtothewire on August 31, 2020, 06:17:17 PM
Seeing as the GAA got nothing from 1922 to the mid 1990s.....

Club I played for as a juvenile applied for funding to build a pitch in the early 90’s. Only money available at the time was Dept. of Education. Catch was they had a hold on the pitch and wanted to hire it out to anyone to use ie local soccer clubs hence grounds couldn’t be vested by GAA so no championship games etc. This was the policy for years to discourage GAA clubs of availing of funding. We decided to build pitch on our own and raise money ourselves.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on August 31, 2020, 06:28:36 PM
I too have been involved in SportNI and DAERA funding applications.
They are far from straight-forward processes and will take alot of patience and commitment to suceed.
Before you even apply to such funds you need to be 'spade' ready, ie have planning permission in place at least.
I know of urban GAA clubs that have been able to secure Dept of Communities funding for capital projects.
GAA clubs generally discuss projects, they visit each other and discuss the pit-falls.
I have met up with a couple of soccer clubs to go through potential programmes and whilst they have genunine eager people involved they are not up for the work-load or dont have volunteer skill sets in-house , projects could run from 3 to 5 years from inception to completion.
GAA clubs are in a stronger position day 1, they generally own their grounds, they cater from the cradle to the grave and alot of clubs offer more activities on their premises than their traditional field games.

No but it's a great excuse for a Sectarian whinge ;)
How could anyone bring Sectarianism into it?

Sure isn't the GAA in the north [sic] entirely cross-community?

I mean, you can hardly move in your local GAA club these days for Ghanaian Fishermen and Linda Ervine....

What are your opinions on the funding?
I think it's strange.

That is, if the difference wasn't so marked; or f t were only for one particular year; or if only one of the IFA or Ulster Rugby was lagging behind but not both, then it might not be so unusual.

I wonder whether it is significant that the period in question basically coincided with the suspension of Stormont? That is, with the resulting lack of scrutiny, and whether it was by accident or design, this was allowed to slip through unnoticed.

Someone suggested that "Casement" money might account for the disparity, but I'd have thought that was a separate budget.

A better answer than I could ever give and blows the notion of your conspiracy shite out the door.
Except that there are companies/consultants whch exist specifically to assist clubs in accessing funding (in reTurn for a fee obviously), which to my certain knowledge have football clubs as their clients.

And in any case Rugby's pretty professional in this respect - in ROI at least so why not in NI?
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on August 31, 2020, 06:33:13 PM
Seeing as the GAA got nothing from 1922 to the mid 1990s.....

Club I played for as a juvenile applied for funding to build a pitch in the early 90’s. Only money available at the time was Dept. of Education. Catch was they had a hold on the pitch and wanted to hire it out to anyone to use ie local soccer clubs hence grounds couldn’t be vested by GAA so no championship games etc. This was the policy for years to discourage GAA clubs of availing of funding. We decided to build pitch on our own and raise money ourselves.
1. It was GAA policy not to share facilities with (certain) other sports thereby excluding them from accessing public money, which comes from everyone. No-one forced the GAA effectively to exclude themselves;
2. Your experience was a quarter of a century ago and not relevant to the matter under discussion.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on August 31, 2020, 06:39:46 PM
EG I’d estimate there’s 300 GAA clubs in the wee six.

There would be maybe 40-45 rugby clubs in same position. I’d harbour a guess there’s at most twice that in soccer (who have their own grounds, not a council arrangement).

So there should be roughly 3 GAA applications for every soccer and rugby combined. And all things considered, a grant award ratio of 3:1.

But that doesn’t take into account how embedded GAA clubs are in their communities. Soccer and rugby just don’t have the same foothold on local volunteers as the GAA does. To undertake any infrastructure project - even if it’s all grant funded - you need a group of members who are absolutely driven to make it succeed. This is where the raw statistical bias is firmly again bumped up by culture.

Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Rossfan on August 31, 2020, 06:54:54 PM
Soccer and rugger no doubt have volunteers too.

If 10 Rugby , 20 Soccer and 30 GAA Clubs apply for grants should only 10 of each get a grant?
That seems to be the logic behind that Unionist MLA's complaint.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on August 31, 2020, 06:57:48 PM
Soccer and rugger no doubt have volunteers too.

If 10 Rugby , 20 Soccer and 30 GAA Clubs apply for grants should only 10 of each get a grant?
That seems to be the logic behind that Unionist MLA's complaint.

They definitely do, and some of the rugby complexes are absolutely outstanding. But there’s not many rugby/soccer teams have programmes going right through from u6 to adult, in multiple sports.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on August 31, 2020, 07:51:12 PM
If 10 Rugby , 20 Soccer and 30 GAA Clubs apply for grants should only 10 of each get a grant?
No, of course not.

But you simply don't know that eg twice as many GAA clubs applied as football clubs. Or for that matter that they were applying for greater sums or that a higher percentage of their applications met the criteria etc.

And that the same applied vis-a-vis rugby clubs.

That seems to be the logic behind that Unionist MLA's complaint
No it isn't - see above.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Rossfan on August 31, 2020, 08:17:39 PM
See Northmans post.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on August 31, 2020, 08:50:32 PM
See Northmans post.
You refer to it as though it's now "Case closed".

But while it offers interesting insight it still doesn't constitute conclusive proof - see eg my post of 18.26 today.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Rossfan on August 31, 2020, 09:12:28 PM
It's not a Court case.
But Northman's detailed post makes a stronger case than your suspicion that biased Officials in the Dept of Sport shovelled money to the GAA with no (Unionist) MLAs there to stop them?
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 31, 2020, 10:17:36 PM
If 10 Rugby , 20 Soccer and 30 GAA Clubs apply for grants should only 10 of each get a grant?
No, of course not.

But you simply don't know that eg twice as many GAA clubs applied as football clubs. Or for that matter that they were applying for greater sums or that a higher percentage of their applications met the criteria etc.

And that the same applied vis-a-vis rugby clubs.

That seems to be the logic behind that Unionist MLA's complaint
No it isn't - see above.

Your point seem to be that it "seems strange" and you've repeated it often enough to make it clear. Until we get a complete picture of how many clubs from each code applied for grants, it "seems strange" is as close as you're likely to get to proving the kind of conspiracy being peddled by Barton.

Speaking of which, here's the full text of the article you've posted:

Quote
An Ulster Unionist MLA has called for equality of funding to sports bodies after official figures revealed Ulster GAA received almost five times more from Stormont in the past three years compared to the Irish Football Association.

Rosemary Barton said Department for Communities figures show that Ulster GAA received over £3m from the department and Sport NI, with the IFA receiving £648,888 and Ulster Rugby £701,289.

"This means that Ulster GAA received almost 2.5 times more than the other two sporting bodies together and almost five times more than that of either Ulster Rugby or the Irish Football Association," she said.

"While I accept the sporting credentials of the GAA, senior people within the organisation accept that they are not just a sporting organisation. Their own constitution also reflects this reality."

Ms Barton said "there is a need for more equality and fairness".

The article doesn't say anything about how much was applied for either, but Barton seems convinced that the current funding is unfair. Do you agree with her claim?
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 31, 2020, 10:21:41 PM
More whinging:

Quote
DUP MLA expresses ‘considerable concern' over sports hardship fund going to GAA (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/05/19/news/dup-mla-expresses-considerable-concern-over-sports-hardship-fund-going-to-gaa-1944991/)

A DUP MLA has expressed concern over a reported 40% of a hardship fund for sports clubs going to the GAA.

The Hardship Fund for Sport was launched by the Department for Communities to support sports clubs and organisations amid the coronavirus pandemic.

The £500,000 fund distributes grants of up to £2,000 to help organisations meet essential overheads and maintain their facilities during lockdown.

However high demand saw the fund close to new applications within days.

DUP MLA Jonathan Buckley said he had “considerable concern” with allocations so far, claiming that 40% of the funding has been awarded to the GAA.

He claimed this “is grossly weighted”, and asked what consultation had been held with sports organisations and what consideration had been given to equality across sporting sectors.

Communities minister Deirdre Hargey responded, saying the demand had been unprecedented.

“It’s not enough money to meet the need and obviously we don’t have enough money to meet all of the need that is out there, but we did move quick with Sport NI and also the Sports Forum, which represents a variety of sports organisations in terms of the delivery of this fund,” she said.

“That scheme was launched, everyone got the same information at the same time… obviously the demand has been unprecedented, we had to suspend it because we just need to look at assessing the applications that are in and we will see what money can be made available.

“I take no role in terms of the assessments of applications.”

In response to a question from Alliance MLA Chris Lyttle, Ms Hargey added she would like to get the hardship fund “started again as soon as possible if I can get the money available to me”.

40% going to the GAA sounds about right to me. Unionists just have a hard time understanding how popular the GAA is. Maybe they think GAA matches are like those Irish League matches that are attended by two men and a dog.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: screenexile on August 31, 2020, 10:23:28 PM
More whinging:

Quote
DUP MLA expresses ‘considerable concern' over sports hardship fund going to GAA (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/05/19/news/dup-mla-expresses-considerable-concern-over-sports-hardship-fund-going-to-gaa-1944991/)

A DUP MLA has expressed concern over a reported 40% of a hardship fund for sports clubs going to the GAA.

The Hardship Fund for Sport was launched by the Department for Communities to support sports clubs and organisations amid the coronavirus pandemic.

The £500,000 fund distributes grants of up to £2,000 to help organisations meet essential overheads and maintain their facilities during lockdown.

However high demand saw the fund close to new applications within days.

DUP MLA Jonathan Buckley said he had “considerable concern” with allocations so far, claiming that 40% of the funding has been awarded to the GAA.

He claimed this “is grossly weighted”, and asked what consultation had been held with sports organisations and what consideration had been given to equality across sporting sectors.

Communities minister Deirdre Hargey responded, saying the demand had been unprecedented.

“It’s not enough money to meet the need and obviously we don’t have enough money to meet all of the need that is out there, but we did move quick with Sport NI and also the Sports Forum, which represents a variety of sports organisations in terms of the delivery of this fund,” she said.

“That scheme was launched, everyone got the same information at the same time… obviously the demand has been unprecedented, we had to suspend it because we just need to look at assessing the applications that are in and we will see what money can be made available.

“I take no role in terms of the assessments of applications.”

In response to a question from Alliance MLA Chris Lyttle, Ms Hargey added she would like to get the hardship fund “started again as soon as possible if I can get the money available to me”.

40% going to the GAA sounds about right to me. Unionists just have a hard time understanding how popular the GAA is. Maybe they think GAA matches are like those Irish League matches that are attended by two men and a dog.

Well if you judged it based on media coverage from the national broadcaster you’d be forgiven for thinking that!!!
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Eamonnca1 on August 31, 2020, 10:51:38 PM
More whinging:

Quote
DUP MLA expresses ‘considerable concern' over sports hardship fund going to GAA (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/05/19/news/dup-mla-expresses-considerable-concern-over-sports-hardship-fund-going-to-gaa-1944991/)

A DUP MLA has expressed concern over a reported 40% of a hardship fund for sports clubs going to the GAA.

The Hardship Fund for Sport was launched by the Department for Communities to support sports clubs and organisations amid the coronavirus pandemic.

The £500,000 fund distributes grants of up to £2,000 to help organisations meet essential overheads and maintain their facilities during lockdown.

However high demand saw the fund close to new applications within days.

DUP MLA Jonathan Buckley said he had “considerable concern” with allocations so far, claiming that 40% of the funding has been awarded to the GAA.

He claimed this “is grossly weighted”, and asked what consultation had been held with sports organisations and what consideration had been given to equality across sporting sectors.

Communities minister Deirdre Hargey responded, saying the demand had been unprecedented.

“It’s not enough money to meet the need and obviously we don’t have enough money to meet all of the need that is out there, but we did move quick with Sport NI and also the Sports Forum, which represents a variety of sports organisations in terms of the delivery of this fund,” she said.

“That scheme was launched, everyone got the same information at the same time… obviously the demand has been unprecedented, we had to suspend it because we just need to look at assessing the applications that are in and we will see what money can be made available.

“I take no role in terms of the assessments of applications.”

In response to a question from Alliance MLA Chris Lyttle, Ms Hargey added she would like to get the hardship fund “started again as soon as possible if I can get the money available to me”.

40% going to the GAA sounds about right to me. Unionists just have a hard time understanding how popular the GAA is. Maybe they think GAA matches are like those Irish League matches that are attended by two men and a dog.

Well if you judged it based on media coverage from the national broadcaster you’d be forgiven for thinking that!!!

Exactly.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on September 01, 2020, 08:04:20 AM
‘Ballinamallard 0 .....Harldand and Wolfe Welders 0.....another good game down in Fermanagh....’
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Farrandeelin on September 01, 2020, 08:38:17 AM
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fjEkjeVzL34
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on September 01, 2020, 08:43:26 AM
More whinging:

Quote
DUP MLA expresses ‘considerable concern' over sports hardship fund going to GAA (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/05/19/news/dup-mla-expresses-considerable-concern-over-sports-hardship-fund-going-to-gaa-1944991/)

A DUP MLA has expressed concern over a reported 40% of a hardship fund for sports clubs going to the GAA.

The Hardship Fund for Sport was launched by the Department for Communities to support sports clubs and organisations amid the coronavirus pandemic.

The £500,000 fund distributes grants of up to £2,000 to help organisations meet essential overheads and maintain their facilities during lockdown.

However high demand saw the fund close to new applications within days.

DUP MLA Jonathan Buckley said he had “considerable concern” with allocations so far, claiming that 40% of the funding has been awarded to the GAA.

He claimed this “is grossly weighted”, and asked what consultation had been held with sports organisations and what consideration had been given to equality across sporting sectors.

Communities minister Deirdre Hargey responded, saying the demand had been unprecedented.

“It’s not enough money to meet the need and obviously we don’t have enough money to meet all of the need that is out there, but we did move quick with Sport NI and also the Sports Forum, which represents a variety of sports organisations in terms of the delivery of this fund,” she said.

“That scheme was launched, everyone got the same information at the same time… obviously the demand has been unprecedented, we had to suspend it because we just need to look at assessing the applications that are in and we will see what money can be made available.

“I take no role in terms of the assessments of applications.”

In response to a question from Alliance MLA Chris Lyttle, Ms Hargey added she would like to get the hardship fund “started again as soon as possible if I can get the money available to me”.

40% going to the GAA sounds about right to me. Unionists just have a hard time understanding how popular the GAA is. Maybe they think GAA matches are like those Irish League matches that are attended by two men and a dog.

The hardship fund is to cover overheads and maintain facilities. Given that most average soccer club has no facilities then they are unlikely to be entitled. These figures as stand alone are worthless. Look at the amount of applications, look at the requirements for the funding, I think you’ll find that the GAA clubs are simply more attuned to getting the grants. Cheap political point scoring by parties trying to play to their base support without actually doing what their base support need and going to their grassroots sports clubs and helping them apply for the grants and promote their clubs. Let’s just give off about Themmuns.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on September 01, 2020, 08:43:59 AM
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fjEkjeVzL34

That’s what I was thinking off just couldn’t remember who did it
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on September 01, 2020, 01:05:57 PM
Your point seem to be that it "seems strange" and you've repeated it often enough to make it clear. Until we get a complete picture of how many clubs from each code applied for grants, it "seems strange" is as close as you're likely to get to proving the kind of conspiracy being peddled by Barton.
On the face of it, it is strange (I prefer "unusual").

I am prepared to accept there may be a reasonable explanation but until one is provided, I remain open to the possibility of an unreasonable one.

Whereas no-one on here is prepared to entertain the latter.

Either way, it merits further investigation, since it is surely the function of the legislature to scrutinise the actions of civil servants, especially during a period when when the Executive wasn't sitting.

Meaning that if everything was above board, then the GAA will have nothing to fear.

The article doesn't say anything about how much was applied for either, but Barton seems convinced that the current funding is unfair. Do you agree with her claim?
See above.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on September 01, 2020, 01:18:24 PM
More whinging:

Quote
DUP MLA expresses ‘considerable concern' over sports hardship fund going to GAA (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/05/19/news/dup-mla-expresses-considerable-concern-over-sports-hardship-fund-going-to-gaa-1944991/)

A DUP MLA has expressed concern over a reported 40% of a hardship fund for sports clubs going to the GAA.

The Hardship Fund for Sport was launched by the Department for Communities to support sports clubs and organisations amid the coronavirus pandemic.


DUP MLA Jonathan Buckley said he had “considerable concern” with allocations so far, claiming that 40% of the funding has been awarded to the GAA.

He claimed this “is grossly weighted”, and asked what consultation had been held with sports organisations and what consideration had been given to equality across sporting sectors.


40% going to the GAA sounds about right to me. Unionists just have a hard time understanding how popular the GAA is. Maybe they think GAA matches are like those Irish League matches that are attended by two men and a dog.
Er, IL matches don't reflect the entirety of football in NI, or anything like it.

More to the point, as well as GAA, Football and Rugby, "sports clubs and organisations" encompasses hockey, athletics, boxing, swimming, golf, tennis, badminton, bowls, cricket, motor sports, netball, gymnastics, equestrian, cycling, basketball, disabled sports and any number of others which I can't bring immediately to mind.

Are you claiming that GAA encompasses 40% of ALL sport in NI?
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: tyrone86 on September 01, 2020, 01:55:36 PM
Er, IL matches don't reflect the entirety of football in NI, or anything like it.

More to the point, as well as GAA, Football and Rugby, "sports clubs and organisations" encompasses hockey, athletics, boxing, swimming, golf, tennis, badminton, bowls, cricket, motor sports, netball, gymnastics, equestrian, cycling, basketball, disabled sports and any number of others which I can't bring immediately to mind.

Are you claiming that GAA encompasses 40% of ALL sport in NI?

I don't think anyone is claiming that or anything close to it but I find it interesting that you're quoting everything except the substantive point.

The hardship fund is to cover overheads and maintain facilities. Given that most average soccer club has no facilities then they are unlikely to be entitled. These figures as stand alone are worthless. Look at the amount of applications, look at the requirements for the funding, I think you’ll find that the GAA clubs are simply more attuned to getting the grants. Cheap political point scoring by parties trying to play to their base support without actually doing what their base support need and going to their grassroots sports clubs and helping them apply for the grants and promote their clubs. Let’s just give off about Themmuns.

Personally, I have no idea if GAA units own 40% of the facilities that aren't owned by the local councils or hired from Universities, schools or elsewhere but it's fair to say, with the exception of Golf clubs, that a much higher percentage of GAA clubs own their own facilities than those organisations you mention.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on September 01, 2020, 02:38:30 PM
Er, IL matches don't reflect the entirety of football in NI, or anything like it.

More to the point, as well as GAA, Football and Rugby, "sports clubs and organisations" encompasses hockey, athletics, boxing, swimming, golf, tennis, badminton, bowls, cricket, motor sports, netball, gymnastics, equestrian, cycling, basketball, disabled sports and any number of others which I can't bring immediately to mind.

Are you claiming that GAA encompasses 40% of ALL sport in NI?

I don't think anyone is claiming that or anything close to it but I find it interesting that you're quoting everything except the substantive point.


Personally, I have no idea if GAA units own 40% of the facilities that aren't owned by the local councils or hired from Universities, schools or elsewhere but it's fair to say, with the exception of Golf clubs, that a much higher percentage of GAA clubs own their own facilities than those organisations you mention.

I genuinely, hand on heart, do not know of a single GAA club that doesn’t own its own field apart from the newer clubs in Belfast. I am sure there are some but outside of east Belfast GAA and Greencastle Wolfe Tones I know of none. The continuity of the GAA within a community, the generational family connections and the actual structure of the organisation as a whole has meant that it has organically evolved into the strongest sporting structure on the island. This is something which cannot be understood by navel gazing unionists
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on September 01, 2020, 02:43:30 PM
Er, IL matches don't reflect the entirety of football in NI, or anything like it.

More to the point, as well as GAA, Football and Rugby, "sports clubs and organisations" encompasses hockey, athletics, boxing, swimming, golf, tennis, badminton, bowls, cricket, motor sports, netball, gymnastics, equestrian, cycling, basketball, disabled sports and any number of others which I can't bring immediately to mind.

Are you claiming that GAA encompasses 40% of ALL sport in NI?

I don't think anyone is claiming that or anything close to it but I find it interesting that you're quoting everything except the substantive point.
That was the clear implication of Eammonca's post, both with his IL dig, and the overall tone of this thread, which is comparing GAA, Football and Rugby.

The hardship fund is to cover overheads and maintain facilities.

Personally, I have no idea if GAA units own 40% of the facilities that aren't owned by the local councils or hired from Universities, schools or elsewhere but it's fair to say, with the exception of Golf clubs, that a much higher percentage of GAA clubs own their own facilities than those organisations you mention.
Except that the fund is not intended only for sports organisations which own their own premises, or even weighted towards them.

As I pointed out, it is for the benefit of literally thousands of clubs and organisations, covering dozens of sports and activities, with numbers of participants who must reach six figures (when you count people who play more than one sport).

To claim that GAA's "share", whether measured by clubs or membership, amounts to 40%  of the overall, is quite simply ludicrous.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on September 01, 2020, 02:59:04 PM
The key question is how does the grants awarded compare to the grants applied for across the board, what are the comparators?  If the amount of applications were higher by GAA clubs than the others then there would be an automatic higher percentage of the grants paid out to GAA clubs. These figures are bare and not contextualised. For simple maths, 100 grants available, GAA clubs apply for 60, soccer  Clubs 30, rugby clubs 10. 70% of all grants are funded. GAA get 42 grants, soccer 14, rugby 7. GAA will undoubtedly get more money even though the terms of the grant making process is the same. That’s how it works.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: tyrone86 on September 01, 2020, 02:59:14 PM
Er, IL matches don't reflect the entirety of football in NI, or anything like it.

More to the point, as well as GAA, Football and Rugby, "sports clubs and organisations" encompasses hockey, athletics, boxing, swimming, golf, tennis, badminton, bowls, cricket, motor sports, netball, gymnastics, equestrian, cycling, basketball, disabled sports and any number of others which I can't bring immediately to mind.

Are you claiming that GAA encompasses 40% of ALL sport in NI?

I don't think anyone is claiming that or anything close to it but I find it interesting that you're quoting everything except the substantive point.
That was the clear implication of Eammonca's post, both with his IL dig, and the overall tone of this thread, which is comparing GAA, Football and Rugby.

The hardship fund is to cover overheads and maintain facilities.

Personally, I have no idea if GAA units own 40% of the facilities that aren't owned by the local councils or hired from Universities, schools or elsewhere but it's fair to say, with the exception of Golf clubs, that a much higher percentage of GAA clubs own their own facilities than those organisations you mention.
Except that the fund is not intended only for sports organisations which own their own premises, or even weighted towards them.

As I pointed out, it is for the benefit of literally thousands of clubs and organisations, covering dozens of sports and activities, with numbers of participants who must reach six figures (when you count people who play more than one sport).

To claim that GAA's "share", whether measured by clubs or membership, amounts to 40%  of the overall, is quite simply ludicrous.

http://www.sportni.net/funding/our-funding-programmes/sports-hardship-fund-2/

What we’ll fund

The fund has been developed to help sport and physical recreation organisations meet their obligations, in particular fixed costs, which are no longer supported with revenue as a result of coronavirus. This might cover expenditure on:

Rent/Lease
Heat
Light
Utilities
Water Rates
Essential grounds/facility maintenance (to maintain a state of readiness)
Some Insurance (essential building/contents insurance, public liability, pro-rata)



Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Franko on September 01, 2020, 03:17:01 PM
See Northmans post.
You refer to it as though it's now "Case closed".

But while it offers interesting insight it still doesn't constitute conclusive proof - see eg my post of 18.26 today.

You got to love the desperation of this.  He picks up a couple of second hand headline figures, offers no context, strongly implies that there has been impropriety going on... and then demands that the other side provide "conclusive proof" that it hasn't.   ;D ;D

This is a wind up and should be treated as such.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: imtommygunn on September 01, 2020, 03:48:01 PM
Yeah it's really poor to be honest. Nolan wouldn't be in it.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: the colonel on September 01, 2020, 03:57:23 PM
Further detail below.... The original programme was vastly oversubscribed and closed after a couple of days. It was then re-opened. Who was succesful in the first tranche was more likely down to who got their application earliest. There was no deadline on the second tranche and I don't think a report on succesful applicants has been produced yet.

http://www.sportni.net/funding/our-funding-programmes/sports-hardship-fund-2/

http://www.sportni.net/sportni/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/SHF-Summary-10.08.20.pdf

Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on September 01, 2020, 04:13:39 PM
Further detail below.... The original programme was vastly oversubscribed and closed after a couple of days. It was then re-opened. Who was succesful in the first tranche was more likely down to who got their application earliest. There was no deadline on the second tranche and I don't think a report on succesful applicants has been produced yet.

http://www.sportni.net/funding/our-funding-programmes/sports-hardship-fund-2/

http://www.sportni.net/sportni/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/SHF-Summary-10.08.20.pdf

So Gaelic sports made you 26% of the applications and got 30% of the payments with a 51% success ratio application to payment, soccer made up 22% and got 24% of the funds with a 48% ratio of success. Non story here.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on September 01, 2020, 10:02:06 PM
More whinging:

Quote
DUP MLA expresses ‘considerable concern' over sports hardship fund going to GAA (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/05/19/news/dup-mla-expresses-considerable-concern-over-sports-hardship-fund-going-to-gaa-1944991/)

A DUP MLA has expressed concern over a reported 40% of a hardship fund for sports clubs going to the GAA.

The Hardship Fund for Sport was launched by the Department for Communities to support sports clubs and organisations amid the coronavirus pandemic.

The £500,000 fund distributes grants of up to £2,000 to help organisations meet essential overheads and maintain their facilities during lockdown.

However high demand saw the fund close to new applications within days.

DUP MLA Jonathan Buckley said he had “considerable concern” with allocations so far, claiming that 40% of the funding has been awarded to the GAA.

He claimed this “is grossly weighted”, and asked what consultation had been held with sports organisations and what consideration had been given to equality across sporting sectors.

Communities minister Deirdre Hargey responded, saying the demand had been unprecedented.

“It’s not enough money to meet the need and obviously we don’t have enough money to meet all of the need that is out there, but we did move quick with Sport NI and also the Sports Forum, which represents a variety of sports organisations in terms of the delivery of this fund,” she said.

“That scheme was launched, everyone got the same information at the same time… obviously the demand has been unprecedented, we had to suspend it because we just need to look at assessing the applications that are in and we will see what money can be made available.

“I take no role in terms of the assessments of applications.”

In response to a question from Alliance MLA Chris Lyttle, Ms Hargey added she would like to get the hardship fund “started again as soon as possible if I can get the money available to me”.

40% going to the GAA sounds about right to me. Unionists just have a hard time understanding how popular the GAA is. Maybe they think GAA matches are like those Irish League matches that are attended by two men and a dog.

Now look at participation numbers...
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: oakleaflad on September 02, 2020, 12:00:14 PM
More whinging:

Quote
DUP MLA expresses ‘considerable concern' over sports hardship fund going to GAA (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/05/19/news/dup-mla-expresses-considerable-concern-over-sports-hardship-fund-going-to-gaa-1944991/)

A DUP MLA has expressed concern over a reported 40% of a hardship fund for sports clubs going to the GAA.

The Hardship Fund for Sport was launched by the Department for Communities to support sports clubs and organisations amid the coronavirus pandemic.

The £500,000 fund distributes grants of up to £2,000 to help organisations meet essential overheads and maintain their facilities during lockdown.

However high demand saw the fund close to new applications within days.

DUP MLA Jonathan Buckley said he had “considerable concern” with allocations so far, claiming that 40% of the funding has been awarded to the GAA.

He claimed this “is grossly weighted”, and asked what consultation had been held with sports organisations and what consideration had been given to equality across sporting sectors.

Communities minister Deirdre Hargey responded, saying the demand had been unprecedented.

“It’s not enough money to meet the need and obviously we don’t have enough money to meet all of the need that is out there, but we did move quick with Sport NI and also the Sports Forum, which represents a variety of sports organisations in terms of the delivery of this fund,” she said.

“That scheme was launched, everyone got the same information at the same time… obviously the demand has been unprecedented, we had to suspend it because we just need to look at assessing the applications that are in and we will see what money can be made available.

“I take no role in terms of the assessments of applications.”

In response to a question from Alliance MLA Chris Lyttle, Ms Hargey added she would like to get the hardship fund “started again as soon as possible if I can get the money available to me”.

40% going to the GAA sounds about right to me. Unionists just have a hard time understanding how popular the GAA is. Maybe they think GAA matches are like those Irish League matches that are attended by two men and a dog.

Now look at participation numbers...
They would be the wrong numbers to look at. Walking/running would be extremely popular but the vast majority aren't in actual clubs with premises. I'd be surprised if many grants were applied for from walking clubs. 5-a-side counts as participating in soccer etc.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Main Street on September 02, 2020, 08:33:10 PM
More whinging:

Quote
DUP MLA expresses ‘considerable concern' over sports hardship fund going to GAA (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/05/19/news/dup-mla-expresses-considerable-concern-over-sports-hardship-fund-going-to-gaa-1944991/)

A DUP MLA has expressed concern over a reported 40% of a hardship fund for sports clubs going to the GAA.

The Hardship Fund for Sport was launched by the Department for Communities to support sports clubs and organisations amid the coronavirus pandemic.

The £500,000 fund distributes grants of up to £2,000 to help organisations meet essential overheads and maintain their facilities during lockdown.

However high demand saw the fund close to new applications within days.

DUP MLA Jonathan Buckley said he had “considerable concern” with allocations so far, claiming that 40% of the funding has been awarded to the GAA.

He claimed this “is grossly weighted”, and asked what consultation had been held with sports organisations and what consideration had been given to equality across sporting sectors.

Communities minister Deirdre Hargey responded, saying the demand had been unprecedented.

“It’s not enough money to meet the need and obviously we don’t have enough money to meet all of the need that is out there, but we did move quick with Sport NI and also the Sports Forum, which represents a variety of sports organisations in terms of the delivery of this fund,” she said.

“That scheme was launched, everyone got the same information at the same time… obviously the demand has been unprecedented, we had to suspend it because we just need to look at assessing the applications that are in and we will see what money can be made available.

“I take no role in terms of the assessments of applications.”

In response to a question from Alliance MLA Chris Lyttle, Ms Hargey added she would like to get the hardship fund “started again as soon as possible if I can get the money available to me”.

40% going to the GAA sounds about right to me. Unionists just have a hard time understanding how popular the GAA is. Maybe they think GAA matches are like those Irish League matches that are attended by two men and a dog.

Now look at participation numbers...
They would be the wrong numbers to look at. Walking/running would be extremely popular but the vast majority aren't in actual clubs with premises. I'd be surprised if many grants were applied for from walking clubs. 5-a-side counts as participating in soccer etc.
Baile Brigin has already been informed on numerous occasions that when it comes to  state support for sport,  participation in organised sports is the premium,  sport organised in a  membership club based scenario that is constituted. If this germane information does manage to enter into one ear, it exits the other immediately. BB then resorts to repeating the default mantra with Animal Farm gusto , 'what about the participation figures ' as he/she parrots the old 5 a side participation argument, the lunchtime kickabouts with jumpers for goal posts.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 07, 2020, 11:22:49 AM
More whinging:

Quote
DUP MLA expresses ‘considerable concern' over sports hardship fund going to GAA (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/05/19/news/dup-mla-expresses-considerable-concern-over-sports-hardship-fund-going-to-gaa-1944991/)

A DUP MLA has expressed concern over a reported 40% of a hardship fund for sports clubs going to the GAA.

The Hardship Fund for Sport was launched by the Department for Communities to support sports clubs and organisations amid the coronavirus pandemic.

The £500,000 fund distributes grants of up to £2,000 to help organisations meet essential overheads and maintain their facilities during lockdown.

However high demand saw the fund close to new applications within days.

DUP MLA Jonathan Buckley said he had “considerable concern” with allocations so far, claiming that 40% of the funding has been awarded to the GAA.

He claimed this “is grossly weighted”, and asked what consultation had been held with sports organisations and what consideration had been given to equality across sporting sectors.

Communities minister Deirdre Hargey responded, saying the demand had been unprecedented.

“It’s not enough money to meet the need and obviously we don’t have enough money to meet all of the need that is out there, but we did move quick with Sport NI and also the Sports Forum, which represents a variety of sports organisations in terms of the delivery of this fund,” she said.

“That scheme was launched, everyone got the same information at the same time… obviously the demand has been unprecedented, we had to suspend it because we just need to look at assessing the applications that are in and we will see what money can be made available.

“I take no role in terms of the assessments of applications.”

In response to a question from Alliance MLA Chris Lyttle, Ms Hargey added she would like to get the hardship fund “started again as soon as possible if I can get the money available to me”.

40% going to the GAA sounds about right to me. Unionists just have a hard time understanding how popular the GAA is. Maybe they think GAA matches are like those Irish League matches that are attended by two men and a dog.

Now look at participation numbers...
They would be the wrong numbers to look at. Walking/running would be extremely popular but the vast majority aren't in actual clubs with premises. I'd be surprised if many grants were applied for from walking clubs. 5-a-side counts as participating in soccer etc.
Baile Brigin has already been informed on numerous occasions that when it comes to  state support for sport,  participation in organised sports is the premium,  sport organised in a  membership club based scenario that is constituted. If this germane information does manage to enter into one ear, it exits the other immediately. BB then resorts to repeating the default mantra with Animal Farm gusto , 'what about the participation figures ' as he/she parrots the old 5 a side participation argument, the lunchtime kickabouts with jumpers for goal posts.

Have you a point here? If the only soccer mentioned is the IL, then the only GAA in question should be the championship.

Its a very moot point to simy ignore that more people play soccer, both formally and informally than gaelic games. Club  membership numbers are just one metric, and don't regularly translate into playing numbers.

In this instance there is no story as roughly the same application success rate was seen across all sports.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: oakleaflad on October 07, 2020, 11:38:53 AM
More whinging:

Quote
DUP MLA expresses ‘considerable concern' over sports hardship fund going to GAA (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/05/19/news/dup-mla-expresses-considerable-concern-over-sports-hardship-fund-going-to-gaa-1944991/)

A DUP MLA has expressed concern over a reported 40% of a hardship fund for sports clubs going to the GAA.

The Hardship Fund for Sport was launched by the Department for Communities to support sports clubs and organisations amid the coronavirus pandemic.

The £500,000 fund distributes grants of up to £2,000 to help organisations meet essential overheads and maintain their facilities during lockdown.

However high demand saw the fund close to new applications within days.

DUP MLA Jonathan Buckley said he had “considerable concern” with allocations so far, claiming that 40% of the funding has been awarded to the GAA.

He claimed this “is grossly weighted”, and asked what consultation had been held with sports organisations and what consideration had been given to equality across sporting sectors.

Communities minister Deirdre Hargey responded, saying the demand had been unprecedented.

“It’s not enough money to meet the need and obviously we don’t have enough money to meet all of the need that is out there, but we did move quick with Sport NI and also the Sports Forum, which represents a variety of sports organisations in terms of the delivery of this fund,” she said.

“That scheme was launched, everyone got the same information at the same time… obviously the demand has been unprecedented, we had to suspend it because we just need to look at assessing the applications that are in and we will see what money can be made available.

“I take no role in terms of the assessments of applications.”

In response to a question from Alliance MLA Chris Lyttle, Ms Hargey added she would like to get the hardship fund “started again as soon as possible if I can get the money available to me”.

40% going to the GAA sounds about right to me. Unionists just have a hard time understanding how popular the GAA is. Maybe they think GAA matches are like those Irish League matches that are attended by two men and a dog.

Now look at participation numbers...
They would be the wrong numbers to look at. Walking/running would be extremely popular but the vast majority aren't in actual clubs with premises. I'd be surprised if many grants were applied for from walking clubs. 5-a-side counts as participating in soccer etc.
Baile Brigin has already been informed on numerous occasions that when it comes to  state support for sport,  participation in organised sports is the premium,  sport organised in a  membership club based scenario that is constituted. If this germane information does manage to enter into one ear, it exits the other immediately. BB then resorts to repeating the default mantra with Animal Farm gusto , 'what about the participation figures ' as he/she parrots the old 5 a side participation argument, the lunchtime kickabouts with jumpers for goal posts.

Have you a point here? If the only soccer mentioned is the IL, then the only GAA in question should be the championship.

Its a very moot point to simy ignore that more people play soccer, both formally and informally than gaelic games. Club  membership numbers are just one metric, and don't regularly translate into playing numbers.

In this instance there is no story as roughly the same application success rate was seen across all sports.
It has zero relevance to this discussion.

Example:
If my GAA club (with their own premises) submit a request for funding, the likelihood is that of those on the committee 0 play/participate in Gaelic games any longer, 3 or 4 of them might play indoor soccer or go walking/running (neither with a club owning premises) and therefore count towards participation numbers for those sports. 
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 07, 2020, 12:18:48 PM
More whinging:

Quote
DUP MLA expresses ‘considerable concern' over sports hardship fund going to GAA (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/05/19/news/dup-mla-expresses-considerable-concern-over-sports-hardship-fund-going-to-gaa-1944991/)

A DUP MLA has expressed concern over a reported 40% of a hardship fund for sports clubs going to the GAA.

The Hardship Fund for Sport was launched by the Department for Communities to support sports clubs and organisations amid the coronavirus pandemic.

The £500,000 fund distributes grants of up to £2,000 to help organisations meet essential overheads and maintain their facilities during lockdown.

However high demand saw the fund close to new applications within days.

DUP MLA Jonathan Buckley said he had “considerable concern” with allocations so far, claiming that 40% of the funding has been awarded to the GAA.

He claimed this “is grossly weighted”, and asked what consultation had been held with sports organisations and what consideration had been given to equality across sporting sectors.

Communities minister Deirdre Hargey responded, saying the demand had been unprecedented.

“It’s not enough money to meet the need and obviously we don’t have enough money to meet all of the need that is out there, but we did move quick with Sport NI and also the Sports Forum, which represents a variety of sports organisations in terms of the delivery of this fund,” she said.

“That scheme was launched, everyone got the same information at the same time… obviously the demand has been unprecedented, we had to suspend it because we just need to look at assessing the applications that are in and we will see what money can be made available.

“I take no role in terms of the assessments of applications.”

In response to a question from Alliance MLA Chris Lyttle, Ms Hargey added she would like to get the hardship fund “started again as soon as possible if I can get the money available to me”.

40% going to the GAA sounds about right to me. Unionists just have a hard time understanding how popular the GAA is. Maybe they think GAA matches are like those Irish League matches that are attended by two men and a dog.

Now look at participation numbers...
They would be the wrong numbers to look at. Walking/running would be extremely popular but the vast majority aren't in actual clubs with premises. I'd be surprised if many grants were applied for from walking clubs. 5-a-side counts as participating in soccer etc.
Baile Brigin has already been informed on numerous occasions that when it comes to  state support for sport,  participation in organised sports is the premium,  sport organised in a  membership club based scenario that is constituted. If this germane information does manage to enter into one ear, it exits the other immediately. BB then resorts to repeating the default mantra with Animal Farm gusto , 'what about the participation figures ' as he/she parrots the old 5 a side participation argument, the lunchtime kickabouts with jumpers for goal posts.

Have you a point here? If the only soccer mentioned is the IL, then the only GAA in question should be the championship.

Its a very moot point to simy ignore that more people play soccer, both formally and informally than gaelic games. Club  membership numbers are just one metric, and don't regularly translate into playing numbers.

In this instance there is no story as roughly the same application success rate was seen across all sports.
It has zero relevance to this discussion.

Example:
If my GAA club (with their own premises) submit a request for funding, the likelihood is that of those on the committee 0 play/participate in Gaelic games any longer, 3 or 4 of them might play indoor soccer or go walking/running (neither with a club owning premises) and therefore count towards participation numbers for those sports.

But they participate in those sports. They don't participate in gaelic games in terms of playing. So how else do you count them?

But you are right in this specific funding round.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: oakleaflad on October 07, 2020, 01:36:00 PM
More whinging:

Quote
DUP MLA expresses ‘considerable concern' over sports hardship fund going to GAA (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/05/19/news/dup-mla-expresses-considerable-concern-over-sports-hardship-fund-going-to-gaa-1944991/)

A DUP MLA has expressed concern over a reported 40% of a hardship fund for sports clubs going to the GAA.

The Hardship Fund for Sport was launched by the Department for Communities to support sports clubs and organisations amid the coronavirus pandemic.

The £500,000 fund distributes grants of up to £2,000 to help organisations meet essential overheads and maintain their facilities during lockdown.

However high demand saw the fund close to new applications within days.

DUP MLA Jonathan Buckley said he had “considerable concern” with allocations so far, claiming that 40% of the funding has been awarded to the GAA.

He claimed this “is grossly weighted”, and asked what consultation had been held with sports organisations and what consideration had been given to equality across sporting sectors.

Communities minister Deirdre Hargey responded, saying the demand had been unprecedented.

“It’s not enough money to meet the need and obviously we don’t have enough money to meet all of the need that is out there, but we did move quick with Sport NI and also the Sports Forum, which represents a variety of sports organisations in terms of the delivery of this fund,” she said.

“That scheme was launched, everyone got the same information at the same time… obviously the demand has been unprecedented, we had to suspend it because we just need to look at assessing the applications that are in and we will see what money can be made available.

“I take no role in terms of the assessments of applications.”

In response to a question from Alliance MLA Chris Lyttle, Ms Hargey added she would like to get the hardship fund “started again as soon as possible if I can get the money available to me”.

40% going to the GAA sounds about right to me. Unionists just have a hard time understanding how popular the GAA is. Maybe they think GAA matches are like those Irish League matches that are attended by two men and a dog.

Now look at participation numbers...
They would be the wrong numbers to look at. Walking/running would be extremely popular but the vast majority aren't in actual clubs with premises. I'd be surprised if many grants were applied for from walking clubs. 5-a-side counts as participating in soccer etc.
Baile Brigin has already been informed on numerous occasions that when it comes to  state support for sport,  participation in organised sports is the premium,  sport organised in a  membership club based scenario that is constituted. If this germane information does manage to enter into one ear, it exits the other immediately. BB then resorts to repeating the default mantra with Animal Farm gusto , 'what about the participation figures ' as he/she parrots the old 5 a side participation argument, the lunchtime kickabouts with jumpers for goal posts.

Have you a point here? If the only soccer mentioned is the IL, then the only GAA in question should be the championship.

Its a very moot point to simy ignore that more people play soccer, both formally and informally than gaelic games. Club  membership numbers are just one metric, and don't regularly translate into playing numbers.

In this instance there is no story as roughly the same application success rate was seen across all sports.
It has zero relevance to this discussion.

Example:
If my GAA club (with their own premises) submit a request for funding, the likelihood is that of those on the committee 0 play/participate in Gaelic games any longer, 3 or 4 of them might play indoor soccer or go walking/running (neither with a club owning premises) and therefore count towards participation numbers for those sports.

But they participate in those sports. They don't participate in gaelic games in terms of playing. So how else do you count them?

But you are right in this specific funding round.
I haven't mentioned counting participation in any other way. Only that it's irrelevant when it comes to funding, which you seem to have accepted.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 07, 2020, 03:04:14 PM
More whinging:

Quote
DUP MLA expresses ‘considerable concern' over sports hardship fund going to GAA (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/05/19/news/dup-mla-expresses-considerable-concern-over-sports-hardship-fund-going-to-gaa-1944991/)

A DUP MLA has expressed concern over a reported 40% of a hardship fund for sports clubs going to the GAA.

The Hardship Fund for Sport was launched by the Department for Communities to support sports clubs and organisations amid the coronavirus pandemic.

The £500,000 fund distributes grants of up to £2,000 to help organisations meet essential overheads and maintain their facilities during lockdown.

However high demand saw the fund close to new applications within days.

DUP MLA Jonathan Buckley said he had “considerable concern” with allocations so far, claiming that 40% of the funding has been awarded to the GAA.

He claimed this “is grossly weighted”, and asked what consultation had been held with sports organisations and what consideration had been given to equality across sporting sectors.

Communities minister Deirdre Hargey responded, saying the demand had been unprecedented.

“It’s not enough money to meet the need and obviously we don’t have enough money to meet all of the need that is out there, but we did move quick with Sport NI and also the Sports Forum, which represents a variety of sports organisations in terms of the delivery of this fund,” she said.

“That scheme was launched, everyone got the same information at the same time… obviously the demand has been unprecedented, we had to suspend it because we just need to look at assessing the applications that are in and we will see what money can be made available.

“I take no role in terms of the assessments of applications.”

In response to a question from Alliance MLA Chris Lyttle, Ms Hargey added she would like to get the hardship fund “started again as soon as possible if I can get the money available to me”.

40% going to the GAA sounds about right to me. Unionists just have a hard time understanding how popular the GAA is. Maybe they think GAA matches are like those Irish League matches that are attended by two men and a dog.

Now look at participation numbers...
They would be the wrong numbers to look at. Walking/running would be extremely popular but the vast majority aren't in actual clubs with premises. I'd be surprised if many grants were applied for from walking clubs. 5-a-side counts as participating in soccer etc.
Baile Brigin has already been informed on numerous occasions that when it comes to  state support for sport,  participation in organised sports is the premium,  sport organised in a  membership club based scenario that is constituted. If this germane information does manage to enter into one ear, it exits the other immediately. BB then resorts to repeating the default mantra with Animal Farm gusto , 'what about the participation figures ' as he/she parrots the old 5 a side participation argument, the lunchtime kickabouts with jumpers for goal posts.

Have you a point here? If the only soccer mentioned is the IL, then the only GAA in question should be the championship.

Its a very moot point to simy ignore that more people play soccer, both formally and informally than gaelic games. Club  membership numbers are just one metric, and don't regularly translate into playing numbers.

In this instance there is no story as roughly the same application success rate was seen across all sports.
It has zero relevance to this discussion.

Example:
If my GAA club (with their own premises) submit a request for funding, the likelihood is that of those on the committee 0 play/participate in Gaelic games any longer, 3 or 4 of them might play indoor soccer or go walking/running (neither with a club owning premises) and therefore count towards participation numbers for those sports.

But they participate in those sports. They don't participate in gaelic games in terms of playing. So how else do you count them?

But you are right in this specific funding round.
I haven't mentioned counting participation in any other way. Only that it's irrelevant when it comes to funding, which you seem to have accepted.

Its not irrelevant to funding. Quite the opposite.

I bet your formula for funding will ensure the GAA get most of it...
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: oakleaflad on October 07, 2020, 03:42:51 PM
More whinging:

Quote
DUP MLA expresses ‘considerable concern' over sports hardship fund going to GAA (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/05/19/news/dup-mla-expresses-considerable-concern-over-sports-hardship-fund-going-to-gaa-1944991/)

A DUP MLA has expressed concern over a reported 40% of a hardship fund for sports clubs going to the GAA.

The Hardship Fund for Sport was launched by the Department for Communities to support sports clubs and organisations amid the coronavirus pandemic.

The £500,000 fund distributes grants of up to £2,000 to help organisations meet essential overheads and maintain their facilities during lockdown.

However high demand saw the fund close to new applications within days.

DUP MLA Jonathan Buckley said he had “considerable concern” with allocations so far, claiming that 40% of the funding has been awarded to the GAA.

He claimed this “is grossly weighted”, and asked what consultation had been held with sports organisations and what consideration had been given to equality across sporting sectors.

Communities minister Deirdre Hargey responded, saying the demand had been unprecedented.

“It’s not enough money to meet the need and obviously we don’t have enough money to meet all of the need that is out there, but we did move quick with Sport NI and also the Sports Forum, which represents a variety of sports organisations in terms of the delivery of this fund,” she said.

“That scheme was launched, everyone got the same information at the same time… obviously the demand has been unprecedented, we had to suspend it because we just need to look at assessing the applications that are in and we will see what money can be made available.

“I take no role in terms of the assessments of applications.”

In response to a question from Alliance MLA Chris Lyttle, Ms Hargey added she would like to get the hardship fund “started again as soon as possible if I can get the money available to me”.

40% going to the GAA sounds about right to me. Unionists just have a hard time understanding how popular the GAA is. Maybe they think GAA matches are like those Irish League matches that are attended by two men and a dog.

Now look at participation numbers...
They would be the wrong numbers to look at. Walking/running would be extremely popular but the vast majority aren't in actual clubs with premises. I'd be surprised if many grants were applied for from walking clubs. 5-a-side counts as participating in soccer etc.
Baile Brigin has already been informed on numerous occasions that when it comes to  state support for sport,  participation in organised sports is the premium,  sport organised in a  membership club based scenario that is constituted. If this germane information does manage to enter into one ear, it exits the other immediately. BB then resorts to repeating the default mantra with Animal Farm gusto , 'what about the participation figures ' as he/she parrots the old 5 a side participation argument, the lunchtime kickabouts with jumpers for goal posts.

Have you a point here? If the only soccer mentioned is the IL, then the only GAA in question should be the championship.

Its a very moot point to simy ignore that more people play soccer, both formally and informally than gaelic games. Club  membership numbers are just one metric, and don't regularly translate into playing numbers.

In this instance there is no story as roughly the same application success rate was seen across all sports.
It has zero relevance to this discussion.

Example:
If my GAA club (with their own premises) submit a request for funding, the likelihood is that of those on the committee 0 play/participate in Gaelic games any longer, 3 or 4 of them might play indoor soccer or go walking/running (neither with a club owning premises) and therefore count towards participation numbers for those sports.

But they participate in those sports. They don't participate in gaelic games in terms of playing. So how else do you count them?

But you are right in this specific funding round.
I haven't mentioned counting participation in any other way. Only that it's irrelevant when it comes to funding, which you seem to have accepted.

Its not irrelevant to funding. Quite the opposite.

I bet your formula for funding will ensure the GAA get most of it...
You're going off on tangents here. I don't have a formula. I don't have an alternative way of counting people. There are specific rules regarding funding and participation numbers are irrelevant when it comes to these requests. I've already given a perfectly valid example as to how.

What is this highlighted statement about too? You're making huge presumptions about me for some reason. I really don't get it. I've played multiple sports by the way, not that it should matter.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 07, 2020, 04:15:10 PM
He refuses to accept that the majority of soccer teams in NI are unconstituted, have no grounds, no members, and in a lot of cases, no bank account.  Which means that these ones are ineligible for any public grant.

He is is also unwilling to accept that unless a club owns property (or has a long term lease) then it is immediately ruled out of all capital grants (which is obviously where the majority of funding lies).

All in all there’s only 40-odd soccer clubs in NI that can qualify for a capital grant, only 40-odd rugby clubs in NI that can qualify for a capital grant, but some 400-odd GAA clubs that can legally qualify for a capital grant.

The disparity should, if an  uh hung, be greater
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 07, 2020, 04:22:05 PM
He refuses to accept that the majority of soccer teams in NI are unconstituted, have no grounds, no members, and in a lot of cases, no bank account.  Which means that these ones are ineligible for any public grant.

He is is also unwilling to accept that unless a club owns property (or has a long term lease) then it is immediately ruled out of all capital grants (which is obviously where the majority of funding lies).

All in all there’s only 40-odd soccer clubs in NI that can qualify for a capital grant, only 40-odd rugby clubs in NI that can qualify for a capital grant, but some 400-odd GAA clubs that can legally qualify for a capital grant.

The disparity should, if an  uh hung, be greater

This is headbanger stuff. There are 35 clubs in the semi pro leagues. So only 5 other clubs in the whole of the north?

The majority? I won't waste bandwith asking for backup on this nonsense.

Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 07, 2020, 06:22:23 PM
My apologies I meant to write 90-odd for soccer clubs with a ground. A typo.

Which means there are over 3 times as many GAA clubs eligible for capital grants than rugby and soccer combined.

——

The majority of soccer teams in NI are junior soccer teams and are not constituted. They are pub teams, so to speak, and rely on council facilities to host their games. It’s a perfectly good hobby in my book. But these teams will never be eligible for grants unless they do the due diligence.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Main Street on October 07, 2020, 10:43:47 PM
My apologies I meant to write 90-odd for soccer clubs with a ground. A typo.

Which means there are over 3 times as many GAA clubs eligible for capital grants than rugby and soccer combined.

——

The majority of soccer teams in NI are junior soccer teams and are not constituted. They are pub teams, so to speak, and rely on council facilities to host their games. It’s a perfectly good hobby in my book. But these teams will never be eligible for grants unless they do the due diligence.

It's useless,  BB2 hasn't the mental capacity to tell the difference between  a 5-a-side-soccer kickabout in the park (defined in his head as sporting participants)  and a properly constituted sports club with club infrastructure,  members, organised coaching and competition.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Rossfan on October 07, 2020, 11:52:42 PM
BB starts ends and middles with "Soccer good Gah bad"
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 08, 2020, 12:42:40 AM
My apologies I meant to write 90-odd for soccer clubs with a ground. A typo.

Which means there are over 3 times as many GAA clubs eligible for capital grants than rugby and soccer combined.

——

The majority of soccer teams in NI are junior soccer teams and are not constituted. They are pub teams, so to speak, and rely on council facilities to host their games. It’s a perfectly good hobby in my book. But these teams will never be eligible for grants unless they do the due diligence.

It wasn't a typo. It was a lie.

What on earth does 'non constituted' mean?
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 08, 2020, 08:06:43 AM
EG I’d estimate there’s 300 GAA clubs in the wee six.

There would be maybe 40-45 rugby clubs in same position. I’d harbour a guess there’s at most twice that in soccer (who have their own grounds, not a council arrangement).

So there should be roughly 3 GAA applications for every soccer and rugby combined. And all things considered, a grant award ratio of 3:1.

But that doesn’t take into account how embedded GAA clubs are in their communities. Soccer and rugby just don’t have the same foothold on local volunteers as the GAA does. To undertake any infrastructure project - even if it’s all grant funded - you need a group of members who are absolutely driven to make it succeed. This is where the raw statistical bias is firmly again bumped up by culture.


Yeah BB you’re right. I suggested 90 a few weeks ago. But this time couldn’t have been a typo.

—-

A constituted club is one that sets the basic rules in place that then require the appointment of a committee, setting of membership fees and levels, management of a bank account, publication of annual accounts, and any peculiars related to the sport(s) they compete in.

It stops Johnny taking his ball and going home.

And being a constituted organisation with a few years of bank accounts is the first step in every grant application, to stop same Johnny pocketing the cash and going home early.

Surely surely surely this makes sense to you?

Actually I’m guessing it doesn’t. It’s clear from your posts on this forum that you’ve never volunteered for anything in your life. You’re one of those lads that believes great things happen by shaking fairy trees.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Main Street on October 08, 2020, 09:35:22 AM
My apologies I meant to write 90-odd for soccer clubs with a ground. A typo.

Which means there are over 3 times as many GAA clubs eligible for capital grants than rugby and soccer combined.

——

The majority of soccer teams in NI are junior soccer teams and are not constituted. They are pub teams, so to speak, and rely on council facilities to host their games. It’s a perfectly good hobby in my book. But these teams will never be eligible for grants unless they do the due diligence.

It wasn't a typo. It was a lie.

What on earth does 'non constituted' mean?
Wilful stupidity persistance,
 little doubt - enhanced by a serious alcohol abuse issue.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 08, 2020, 09:58:08 AM
EG I’d estimate there’s 300 GAA clubs in the wee six.

There would be maybe 40-45 rugby clubs in same position. I’d harbour a guess there’s at most twice that in soccer (who have their own grounds, not a council arrangement).

So there should be roughly 3 GAA applications for every soccer and rugby combined. And all things considered, a grant award ratio of 3:1.

But that doesn’t take into account how embedded GAA clubs are in their communities. Soccer and rugby just don’t have the same foothold on local volunteers as the GAA does. To undertake any infrastructure project - even if it’s all grant funded - you need a group of members who are absolutely driven to make it succeed. This is where the raw statistical bias is firmly again bumped up by culture.


Yeah BB you’re right. I suggested 90 a few weeks ago. But this time couldn’t have been a typo.

—-

A constituted club is one that sets the basic rules in place that then require the appointment of a committee, setting of membership fees and levels, management of a bank account, publication of annual accounts, and any peculiars related to the sport(s) they compete in.

It stops Johnny taking his ball and going home.

And being a constituted organisation with a few years of bank accounts is the first step in every grant application, to stop same Johnny pocketing the cash and going home early.

Surely surely surely this makes sense to you?

Actually I’m guessing it doesn’t. It’s clear from your posts on this forum that you’ve never volunteered for anything in your life. You’re one of those lads that believes great things happen by shaking fairy trees.

And yoi are suggesting the majority of soccer clubs on the 6 have none of the above?

The sad thing is you bkelieve this
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: johnnycool on October 08, 2020, 10:07:11 AM
EG I’d estimate there’s 300 GAA clubs in the wee six.

There would be maybe 40-45 rugby clubs in same position. I’d harbour a guess there’s at most twice that in soccer (who have their own grounds, not a council arrangement).

So there should be roughly 3 GAA applications for every soccer and rugby combined. And all things considered, a grant award ratio of 3:1.

But that doesn’t take into account how embedded GAA clubs are in their communities. Soccer and rugby just don’t have the same foothold on local volunteers as the GAA does. To undertake any infrastructure project - even if it’s all grant funded - you need a group of members who are absolutely driven to make it succeed. This is where the raw statistical bias is firmly again bumped up by culture.


Yeah BB you’re right. I suggested 90 a few weeks ago. But this time couldn’t have been a typo.

—-

A constituted club is one that sets the basic rules in place that then require the appointment of a committee, setting of membership fees and levels, management of a bank account, publication of annual accounts, and any peculiars related to the sport(s) they compete in.

It stops Johnny taking his ball and going home.

And being a constituted organisation with a few years of bank accounts is the first step in every grant application, to stop same Johnny pocketing the cash and going home early.

Surely surely surely this makes sense to you?

Actually I’m guessing it doesn’t. It’s clear from your posts on this forum that you’ve never volunteered for anything in your life. You’re one of those lads that believes great things happen by shaking fairy trees.

And yoi are suggesting the majority of soccer clubs on the 6 have none of the above?

The sad thing is you bkelieve this

they might have some form of organised committee, affiliated to the IFA or whoever but when it comes to Capital Grants a very large amount of them won't have the deeds to a property they can call their own.

The kindness of the local councils and us rates payers has taken that burden from them so they can't complain when the very system that keeps them viable works against them for various other funding sources.

One of our ballscreens blew down two winters ago, do you think North Down and Ard Borough Council arrived the following morning to fix it?
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 08, 2020, 10:50:28 AM
EG I’d estimate there’s 300 GAA clubs in the wee six.

There would be maybe 40-45 rugby clubs in same position. I’d harbour a guess there’s at most twice that in soccer (who have their own grounds, not a council arrangement).

So there should be roughly 3 GAA applications for every soccer and rugby combined. And all things considered, a grant award ratio of 3:1.

But that doesn’t take into account how embedded GAA clubs are in their communities. Soccer and rugby just don’t have the same foothold on local volunteers as the GAA does. To undertake any infrastructure project - even if it’s all grant funded - you need a group of members who are absolutely driven to make it succeed. This is where the raw statistical bias is firmly again bumped up by culture.


Yeah BB you’re right. I suggested 90 a few weeks ago. But this time couldn’t have been a typo.

—-

A constituted club is one that sets the basic rules in place that then require the appointment of a committee, setting of membership fees and levels, management of a bank account, publication of annual accounts, and any peculiars related to the sport(s) they compete in.

It stops Johnny taking his ball and going home.

And being a constituted organisation with a few years of bank accounts is the first step in every grant application, to stop same Johnny pocketing the cash and going home early.

Surely surely surely this makes sense to you?

Actually I’m guessing it doesn’t. It’s clear from your posts on this forum that you’ve never volunteered for anything in your life. You’re one of those lads that believes great things happen by shaking fairy trees.

And yoi are suggesting the majority of soccer clubs on the 6 have none of the above?

The sad thing is you bkelieve this

they might have some form of organised committee, affiliated to the IFA or whoever but when it comes to Capital Grants a very large amount of them won't have the deeds to a property they can call their own.

The kindness of the local councils and us rates payers has taken that burden from them so they can't complain when the very system that keeps them viable works against them for various other funding sources.

One of our ballscreens blew down two winters ago, do you think North Down and Ard Borough Council arrived the following morning to fix it?

Thats not what he said. He claimed the majority of soccer clubs in the 6 aren't affiliated to leagues, don't register players, aren't insured and whatnot. Thats bigoted bollocks.

I repeat, I agree that the GAA getting the lions share of this funding process is correct. But claiming only 40 soccer clubs own their own premises is bonkers and its interesting that pulling that blatent lie marks one as a hun.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 08, 2020, 11:05:27 AM
I’ve clarified 90 twice.

And now you’re continuing to make suppositions about what I’m saying.

——/

1. Junior soccer clubs do not need a constitution or even a bank account to join a local soccer league.

2. They do need to appoint a chairman, secretary and a first team manager for matters of correspondence and discipline, but there is no requirement for these appointments to be made by consistent or transparent means.

3. It is the actual regional junior soccer league that requires a constitution, before they can be IFA affiliated.

4. As a result, when you move past intermediate and well-established top junior leagues, teams literally come and go; close and reform, close forever, rebadge, relocate on an annual basis. There is no need to “dissolve” a club that doesn’t have a bank account, a constitution, property or trustees, so it happens at the drop of a hat.

5. Well-established clubs with their own juvenile programmes tend to have their own grounds, or a defined agreement with local councils for designated use of facilities. These would number less than 100 in the six counties.


Players are of course registered - but that’s not the same thing as being a paid-up member of a constituted club.

As for insurance. If you really believe that a club without a bank balance is willing or capable of insuring players who represent them, then you’ve lost it. Many junior players have their own personal insurance. Many of the more established junior clubs will have some insurance in place. 

Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 08, 2020, 11:31:39 AM
This is quite literally the most contradictory self serving nonsense I have ever seen.

You are more confused than scoobie doo. They do but they don't but they do.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 08, 2020, 11:45:21 AM
I’m not even slightly confused. We are on a thread discussing sports funding in the six counties and I’ve explained very clearly why the overwhelming majority of GAA clubs are eligible to apply for funding, but the vast majority of soccer teams are not.

You might have your own very liberal definition of what is a constitution. That’s your choice. But funding agencies do not. Enjoy your funding free existence all the same.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 08, 2020, 11:59:04 AM
I’m not even slightly confused. We are on a thread discussing sports funding in the six counties and I’ve explained very clearly why the overwhelming majority of GAA clubs are eligible to apply for funding, but the vast majority of soccer teams are not.

You might have your own very liberal definition of what is a constitution. That’s your choice. But funding agencies do not. Enjoy your funding free existence all the same.

He repeats, and has had to too many times, that I agree that the GAA fairly got this finding. However if you make braindead statements like there are only 40  soccer clubs in the 6 that own their own land or that 'most' soccer clubs aren't registered with leagues or have structues, then clarify to directly contradict yourself you will get pulled up. To then throw a strop that the only reason someone would tell you to cop on is because they are a soccer plant is beyond childish

You have taken a shit with your trousers on here.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 08, 2020, 12:02:39 PM
I’m also going to take a guess that’s you’ve never been in the six counties. As well as never having volunteered for anything in your life, or completed a grant form in your history, you are probably the least qualified person one could find to contribute to this thread.

But just keep clinging to that typo, if it make you happy. That’ll pay the bills for whatever team you move your armchair support to this year.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 08, 2020, 01:48:06 PM
I’m also going to take a guess that’s you’ve never been in the six counties. As well as never having volunteered for anything in your life, or completed a grant form in your history, you are probably the least qualified person one could find to contribute to this thread.

But just keep clinging to that typo, if it make you happy. That’ll pay the bills for whatever team you move your armchair support to this year.

You guess wrong and you guessed bigoted.

This is absolutely pathetic
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Godsown on October 08, 2020, 10:41:38 PM
I’m also going to take a guess that’s you’ve never been in the six counties. As well as never having volunteered for anything in your life, or completed a grant form in your history, you are probably the least qualified person one could find to contribute to this thread.

But just keep clinging to that typo, if it make you happy. That’ll pay the bills for whatever team you move your armchair support to this year.

Spot on Wobbler. You are wasting your time with this one.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: restorepride on October 08, 2020, 11:51:47 PM
I’m also going to take a guess that’s you’ve never been in the six counties. As well as never having volunteered for anything in your life, or completed a grant form in your history, you are probably the least qualified person one could find to contribute to this thread.

But just keep clinging to that typo, if it make you happy. That’ll pay the bills for whatever team you move your armchair support to this year.

You guess wrong and you guessed bigoted.

This is absolutely pathetic
Please tell the board about your experience in the six counties - enjoyable?  Where did you visit?
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Rossfan on October 09, 2020, 12:03:39 AM
Not a fan of BB ( soccer good Gah bad) but a lot of playing the man instead of the ball .
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 09, 2020, 11:29:17 AM
I’m also going to take a guess that’s you’ve never been in the six counties. As well as never having volunteered for anything in your life, or completed a grant form in your history, you are probably the least qualified person one could find to contribute to this thread.

But just keep clinging to that typo, if it make you happy. That’ll pay the bills for whatever team you move your armchair support to this year.

You guess wrong and you guessed bigoted.

This is absolutely pathetic
Please tell the board about your experience in the six counties - enjoyable?  Where did you visit?

You live there and you haven't a f**king clue, so not sure how long I spend up north is pertinent

You are trolling now
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Main Street on October 14, 2020, 12:35:20 AM
BB2 is not just your average gobshite but is here under false pretenses, vainly trying to hide under a veil of some GAA affiliation. The use of the gaelic of Balbriggan is just trying too hard to look authentic. Same with that fakir  from some years ago, Myles na gCopaleen and his byline "a pint of plain is your only man".
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Taylor on October 14, 2020, 08:05:30 AM
BB2 is not just your average gobshite but is here under false pretenses, vainly trying to hide under a veil of some GAA affiliation. The use of the gaelic of Balbriggan is just trying too hard to look authentic. Same with that fakir  from some years ago, Myles na gCopaleen and his byline "a pint of plain is your only man".

+1
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: oakleaflad on October 14, 2020, 10:08:15 AM
I’m also going to take a guess that’s you’ve never been in the six counties. As well as never having volunteered for anything in your life, or completed a grant form in your history, you are probably the least qualified person one could find to contribute to this thread.

But just keep clinging to that typo, if it make you happy. That’ll pay the bills for whatever team you move your armchair support to this year.

You guess wrong and you guessed bigoted.

This is absolutely pathetic
You absolute hypocrite. I see you didn't bother responding to my last post. You guessed wrong and you guessed bigoted.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on October 14, 2020, 07:35:28 PM
BB2 is not just your average gobshite but is here under false pretenses, vainly trying to hide under a veil of some GAA affiliation. The use of the gaelic of Balbriggan is just trying too hard to look authentic. Same with that fakir  from some years ago, Myles na gCopaleen and his byline "a pint of plain is your only man".

+1

Have always had my suspicions about him and who he is. He is a journalist of some description that’s for certain.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Rossfan on October 14, 2020, 07:52:06 PM
He has often denied that he's Paul Kimmage.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on October 14, 2020, 08:18:43 PM
He has often denied that he's Paul Kimmage.

Was my suspicion on the back of his knowledge of the Balbriggan club scandal a few years back ...
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on October 15, 2020, 11:23:20 PM
Er, IL matches don't reflect the entirety of football in NI, or anything like it.

More to the point, as well as GAA, Football and Rugby, "sports clubs and organisations" encompasses hockey, athletics, boxing, swimming, golf, tennis, badminton, bowls, cricket, motor sports, netball, gymnastics, equestrian, cycling, basketball, disabled sports and any number of others which I can't bring immediately to mind.

Are you claiming that GAA encompasses 40% of ALL sport in NI?

I don't think anyone is claiming that or anything close to it but I find it interesting that you're quoting everything except the substantive point.
That was the clear implication of Eammonca's post, both with his IL dig, and the overall tone of this thread, which is comparing GAA, Football and Rugby.

The hardship fund is to cover overheads and maintain facilities.

Personally, I have no idea if GAA units own 40% of the facilities that aren't owned by the local councils or hired from Universities, schools or elsewhere but it's fair to say, with the exception of Golf clubs, that a much higher percentage of GAA clubs own their own facilities than those organisations you mention.
Except that the fund is not intended only for sports organisations which own their own premises, or even weighted towards them.

As I pointed out, it is for the benefit of literally thousands of clubs and organisations, covering dozens of sports and activities, with numbers of participants who must reach six figures (when you count people who play more than one sport).

To claim that GAA's "share", whether measured by clubs or membership, amounts to 40%  of the overall, is quite simply ludicrous.

http://www.sportni.net/funding/our-funding-programmes/sports-hardship-fund-2/

What we’ll fund

The fund has been developed to help sport and physical recreation organisations meet their obligations, in particular fixed costs, which are no longer supported with revenue as a result of coronavirus. This might cover expenditure on:

Rent/Lease
Heat
Light
Utilities
Water Rates
Essential grounds/facility maintenance (to maintain a state of readiness)
Some Insurance (essential building/contents insurance, public liability, pro-rata)

Evening all.

Just taken a quick scan of how this thread has developed since my last visit and this contributiuon from 'Tyrone86' caught my eye.

And I have to say it is not at all relevant to the original matter which caused me to open this thread.

That is, I was referring to general funding for 3 years from 2016 to 2109, where there was a big disparity between funding for the 3 codes.

Whereas 'Tyrone86' refers to the emergency Covid funding first announced in April and since augmented by a second tranche. With the emphasis on Fixed Costs listed, you might expect sports which own more of their own premises to benefit more, no problem from me with that.

But the original BT article referred to funding across the board, where the effect of Fixed Costs etc must inevitably be diluted.

Which brings us back to my original query, which has still to be explained adequately to my satisfaction, at least. 
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on October 16, 2020, 12:03:27 AM
He refuses to accept that the majority of soccer teams in NI are unconstituted, have no grounds, no members, and in a lot of cases, no bank account.  Which means that these ones are ineligible for any public grant.

He is is also unwilling to accept that unless a club owns property (or has a long term lease) then it is immediately ruled out of all capital grants (which is obviously where the majority of funding lies).

All in all there’s only 40-odd soccer clubs in NI that can qualify for a capital grant, only 40-odd rugby clubs in NI that can qualify for a capital grant, but some 400-odd GAA clubs that can legally qualify for a capital grant.

The disparity should, if an  uh hung, be greater
That is nonsense.

(Off the top of my head) Clubs have to pay Affiliation Fees to whatever league they're in. Fines and Competition Entry Fees also need to be paid. The players usually have to pay a subscription to their club. Kits and other equipment need to be purchased. Where a club doesn't own its own ground, it needs to pay rent to the Council (or whoever owns it). Ditto where they rent training facilities at their local leisure centre etc.
They have to pay referees and linesmen and sometimes managers. Coaches sometimes get paid, if only expenses and they need to pay to take their badges.
Kits need to be washed, coaches (buses) have to be hired, or petrol expenses reimbursed. Even at Junior level, players sometimes receive a few quid.
Some clubs charge admission to games, which needs to be accounted for, while most clubs have local sponsors and advertisers, who are paying money into the club. Some clubs run lotteries or other fund raising activities.
Websites need to be designed and maintained.
Where clubs have youth teams, Child Protection procedures need to be in place.
Any club which applies for funding clearly has to have proper accounting procedures in place, and/or employ a specialist fund raiser.
And, of course, many clubs own their grounds, with all the extra expense which that entails, including bookkeeping and accountants fees.

How do you imagine clubs handle all this without a bank account? Fivers and tenners in a biscuit tin?
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on October 16, 2020, 12:57:59 AM
The majority of soccer teams in NI are junior soccer teams and are not constituted. They are pub teams, so to speak,
More nonsense.

There are 24 Senior and 12 Premier Intermediate clubs in NI in the pyramid. The IFA currently has plans to expand the the Intermediate tier by re-constituting another 117 clubs at Intermediate 2 level, in four leagues with 8 divisions:
https://www.irishfa.com/media/24670/intermediate-football-restructure.pdf (https://www.irishfa.com/media/24670/intermediate-football-restructure.pdf)

And that's before you get to Junior Football. As far as I can quickly ascertain, there are another 16 Junior Leagues, each with multiple teams, most with more than one division.
To take one example, the Fermanagh & Western Football League has 3 Divisions, comprising 30 separate clubs. They also run three Reserve Leagues (30 clubs) and a Youth League.
Six of these clubs are in Enniskillen alone, which I believe has one GAA club (maybe two?).
Of course each season you may get occasional clubs which fold or dissolve etc, but these are invariably replaced, since overall club numbers are holding up.
http://www.fermanaghandwestern.com/ (http://www.fermanaghandwestern.com/)

Schools football is also played widely in NI. For example, the annual Danske Bank Schools Cup receives 100+ entries, from schools in every part of NI, and including grammar, secondary and comprehensive; State, Catholic and Integrated. There's even a couple of Irish Language schools.
https://nisfa.co.uk/index.php/schools/inspiresport-u18-cup-and-plate/inspiresport-u18-cup-results (https://nisfa.co.uk/index.php/schools/inspiresport-u18-cup-and-plate/inspiresport-u18-cup-results)
Run by the NISFA, this is played throughout the season, with the Final on St.Patricks Day. By contrast, the GAA equivalent, MacRory Cup has 16 regular entrants, and the Ulster Schools Rugby Cup 24(?), in both cases these are drawn from very narrow sectors.
(I am aware that GAA and Rugby both have other organised, under-age competitions, but then again, so does Football)

And all of the above is separate from IFA-organised Youth Football eg:
https://www.irishfa.com/ifa-domestic/cup-competitions/harry-cavan-youth-cup-sponsored-by-dale-farm-protein-milk/youth-cup-2019-20 (https://www.irishfa.com/ifa-domestic/cup-competitions/harry-cavan-youth-cup-sponsored-by-dale-farm-protein-milk/youth-cup-2019-20)

Then there's Womens and Girls football, and a few (organised, regular) outliers, like Churches Leagues.

All of these are reliant upon volunteers to keep going.

Meanwhile, I think you greatly underestimate the participation levels in the above.
This 2019 survey indicates that 3 times as many people (9%) "participate" in Football as participate in Gaelic Football (3%):
https://www.statista.com/statistics/535202/most-participated-sports-physical-activities-north-ireland-uk/ (https://www.statista.com/statistics/535202/most-participated-sports-physical-activities-north-ireland-uk/)

Obviously "participation" in football involves more than just organised football such as I listed above (5-a-side, Leisure Centres, Youth Clubs etc), and you can't really play Gaelic sports on a "kickabout" basis. Nonetheless, they don't all fall within that category, by any means.

That's quite a few "Pub Teams", eh?  ::)




Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 16, 2020, 09:00:34 AM
EG you’re making too many assumptions (as I might be too, in fairness).

Enniskillen might have 6 soccer teams to one GAA. Newry is a similar story: about 12 soccer teams to 4 GAA. But here’s the thing, 10 years ago it was about 20:4. And 3-4 of the current soccer teams didn’t exist 10 years ago.

What this tells me is that when it’s that easy to create or fold a team, that the majority are unconstituted: and that without a constitution or a physical address, getting a bank account might be more trouble than it’s worth. A good club man will use his credit card where necessary and claim it back in fivers and tenners.

The basic reality is that as you need neither a constitution nor a bank account to register in a junior soccer league in NI, these then become “down the line” things when forming a club.

Of course longer established clubs with youth schemes need these things. But as has been my point for some time on this thread, GAA clubs swamp soccer clubs in this regard. Hence the GAA is more grant ready.

Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: tyrone86 on October 16, 2020, 09:46:52 AM
Er, IL matches don't reflect the entirety of football in NI, or anything like it.

More to the point, as well as GAA, Football and Rugby, "sports clubs and organisations" encompasses hockey, athletics, boxing, swimming, golf, tennis, badminton, bowls, cricket, motor sports, netball, gymnastics, equestrian, cycling, basketball, disabled sports and any number of others which I can't bring immediately to mind.

Are you claiming that GAA encompasses 40% of ALL sport in NI?

I don't think anyone is claiming that or anything close to it but I find it interesting that you're quoting everything except the substantive point.
That was the clear implication of Eammonca's post, both with his IL dig, and the overall tone of this thread, which is comparing GAA, Football and Rugby.

The hardship fund is to cover overheads and maintain facilities.

Personally, I have no idea if GAA units own 40% of the facilities that aren't owned by the local councils or hired from Universities, schools or elsewhere but it's fair to say, with the exception of Golf clubs, that a much higher percentage of GAA clubs own their own facilities than those organisations you mention.
Except that the fund is not intended only for sports organisations which own their own premises, or even weighted towards them.

As I pointed out, it is for the benefit of literally thousands of clubs and organisations, covering dozens of sports and activities, with numbers of participants who must reach six figures (when you count people who play more than one sport).

To claim that GAA's "share", whether measured by clubs or membership, amounts to 40%  of the overall, is quite simply ludicrous.

http://www.sportni.net/funding/our-funding-programmes/sports-hardship-fund-2/

What we’ll fund

The fund has been developed to help sport and physical recreation organisations meet their obligations, in particular fixed costs, which are no longer supported with revenue as a result of coronavirus. This might cover expenditure on:

Rent/Lease
Heat
Light
Utilities
Water Rates
Essential grounds/facility maintenance (to maintain a state of readiness)
Some Insurance (essential building/contents insurance, public liability, pro-rata)

Evening all.

Just taken a quick scan of how this thread has developed since my last visit and this contributiuon from 'Tyrone86' caught my eye.

And I have to say it is not at all relevant to the original matter which caused me to open this thread.

That is, I was referring to general funding for 3 years from 2016 to 2109, where there was a big disparity between funding for the 3 codes.

Whereas 'Tyrone86' refers to the emergency Covid funding first announced in April and since augmented by a second tranche. With the emphasis on Fixed Costs listed, you might expect sports which own more of their own premises to benefit more, no problem from me with that.

But the original BT article referred to funding across the board, where the effect of Fixed Costs etc must inevitably be diluted.

Which brings us back to my original query, which has still to be explained adequately to my satisfaction, at least.

I don't think anyone here will be able to answer it to your satisfaction because, maybe I'm wrong, I suspect no-one sits on the board providing the funding. If you FOI the department of communities I'm sure they'll give you the necessary breakdowns and maybe an overarching view of what applications were accepted and what was rejected and what the funding was requested for at a granular level.

Similarly, it might be interesting to break down what local councils are providing in terms of full time and casual coaches, facilities, the upkeep of said facilities and other funding to sporting bodies / clubs to see if there's any huge disparity? IIRC a large chunk of the money for the redevelopment of the Brandywell came from the local council as well as from Stormont.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Cluborcountywhynotboth on October 16, 2020, 10:46:30 AM
Not to answer the OP but to contribute to the other posts on here. I am involved in the committee of both my local GAA club and local junior league soccer club, i also regularly attend the league meetings of the soccer league we are in. We have approx 35 teams in our league structure and from my knowledge it’s only those very few who are also affiliated with intermediate clubs who have any form of constitution or bank accounts, I’d hazard a guess at about 30 out of them, including ourselves, very much still work ‘out of the biscuit tin’. We lift £3 a man every week and do one draw a year and this covers everything the club has to pay, off the top of my head I’d say between pitch, referee, washing rigs etc... a full year you could probably run a local junior soccer club on about £1500-£2000. In contrast my local GAA club can take between £70k-£90 a year in running costs alone, before you go into any thing over and above, we HAVE to have a constitution and we have to have audited bank accounts etc... to equate a local GAA club to a junior soccer club in regards to viability for funding is ridiculous. A standard GAA club would be more akin to a IL soccer club and hence the reason they can apply for funding while the large majority of soccer clubs cannot.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 16, 2020, 01:25:12 PM
He has often denied that he's Paul Kimmage.
Have some self respect
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Evil Genius on October 16, 2020, 04:07:36 PM
According to this, there are just over 400 GAA clubs in NI:
https://www.joe.ie/sport/infographic-the-number-of-gaa-clubs-in-every-county-in-ireland-and-every-continent-around-the-world-420318 (https://www.joe.ie/sport/infographic-the-number-of-gaa-clubs-in-every-county-in-ireland-and-every-continent-around-the-world-420318)

There are just under 1,000 clubs registered with the IFA:
https://www.irishfa.com/irish-football-association/about-the-ifa (https://www.irishfa.com/irish-football-association/about-the-ifa)

They're not all Pub Teams, run by some bloke with a biscuit tin of fivers.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: johnnycool on October 16, 2020, 04:13:08 PM
According to this, there are just over 400 GAA clubs in NI:
https://www.joe.ie/sport/infographic-the-number-of-gaa-clubs-in-every-county-in-ireland-and-every-continent-around-the-world-420318 (https://www.joe.ie/sport/infographic-the-number-of-gaa-clubs-in-every-county-in-ireland-and-every-continent-around-the-world-420318)

There are just under 1,000 clubs registered with the IFA:
https://www.irishfa.com/irish-football-association/about-the-ifa (https://www.irishfa.com/irish-football-association/about-the-ifa)

They're not all Pub Teams, run by some bloke with a biscuit tin of fivers.

Are Red Star Bangor in there?
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 16, 2020, 04:26:40 PM
According to this, there are just over 400 GAA clubs in NI:
https://www.joe.ie/sport/infographic-the-number-of-gaa-clubs-in-every-county-in-ireland-and-every-continent-around-the-world-420318 (https://www.joe.ie/sport/infographic-the-number-of-gaa-clubs-in-every-county-in-ireland-and-every-continent-around-the-world-420318)

There are just under 1,000 clubs registered with the IFA:
https://www.irishfa.com/irish-football-association/about-the-ifa (https://www.irishfa.com/irish-football-association/about-the-ifa)

They're not all Pub Teams, run by some bloke with a biscuit tin of fivers.


You keep finding trees instead of the woods here.

Every single last one of those 400 GAA clubs will be constituted up to the eyeballs and will have a lifetime of bank statements, and upwards on 90% of them will own and maintain their own grounds.



There may well be 1000 teams affiliated to the IFA, but once you get past the 40-odd senior/intermediate ** club sides, and the 60-100 easily recognisable/long-established intermediate/junior clubs **, you’ll be lucky to have a handful of clubs with their own grounds, and/or youth teams, and therefore capable of applying for a coaching or capital grant.

The thing is, if you don’t have coaches and don’t have facilities, then you don’t really need a bank account. The only expense of note is a kit every couple of seasons, which is covered by a sponsor. What makes you think the raft of junior clubs (which must number 700-800 according to your figures) *** would have one?


** there is promotion and relegation in place across the tiers but facilities regulations mean there are only around 40 clubs in NI with any potential to play senior grade, and only another (I’d estimate) 100 or so capable of playing intermediate grade.

*** I’d assume that once you remove seconds and thirds teams from this equation the number would quickly dwindle from 700 again, and it’s those teams who are basically transient in nature. They could win a junior title in their first season and never be seen again.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 16, 2020, 08:58:56 PM
They don't have coaches?
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 16, 2020, 09:08:10 PM
They don't have coaches?

When the sporadic training session consists of 12-15 lads doing the crossbar challenge followed by 6 a side into the one net, there’s not much need for coaching.

——

EG was thinking about this earlier. The number of affiliated darts teams in the wee six would also dwarf the number of GAA clubs.

I’ve played darts for the past decade in a Newry league. Before that I played junior soccer for the best part of a decade in Newry. Throughout that time I’ve been a GAA club member and committee person.

Hand in heart, local soccer is closer to darts in terms of its structures than it is to GAA.

Newry is obviously not fully representative of the North. But i played soccer in enough random venues across the wee six to learn it’s definitely not an outlier.

Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: marty34 on October 16, 2020, 10:28:37 PM
According to this, there are just over 400 GAA clubs in NI:
https://www.joe.ie/sport/infographic-the-number-of-gaa-clubs-in-every-county-in-ireland-and-every-continent-around-the-world-420318 (https://www.joe.ie/sport/infographic-the-number-of-gaa-clubs-in-every-county-in-ireland-and-every-continent-around-the-world-420318)

There are just under 1,000 clubs registered with the IFA:
https://www.irishfa.com/irish-football-association/about-the-ifa (https://www.irishfa.com/irish-football-association/about-the-ifa)

They're not all Pub Teams, run by some bloke with a biscuit tin of fivers.

For them 400 clubs, not teams i.e. there are seniors, reserves, U18, U16, U14, U12, U10, U8 and U6s.  Huge numbers.

Never mind add in hurling and camogie teams and they're huge numbers.

Soccer, apart from a few leagues, is really just junior stuff.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 17, 2020, 11:58:56 AM
They don't have coaches?

When the sporadic training session consists of 12-15 lads doing the crossbar challenge followed by 6 a side into the one net, there’s not much need for coaching.

——

EG was thinking about this earlier. The number of affiliated darts teams in the wee six would also dwarf the number of GAA clubs.

I’ve played darts for the past decade in a Newry league. Before that I played junior soccer for the best part of a decade in Newry. Throughout that time I’ve been a GAA club member and committee person.

Hand in heart, local soccer is closer to darts in terms of its structures than it is to GAA.

Newry is obviously not fully representative of the North. But i played soccer in enough random venues across the wee six to learn it’s definitely not an outlier.

Pure bigotry.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 17, 2020, 02:37:43 PM
Don’t think so BB. I’m happy to report that I’m a soccer fan and former player. I don’t have any bones to grind with the sport, not even close.

The difference between me and you is that I can objectively recognise that soccer in NI isn’t even remotely as entrenched in communities as Gaelic Games is. My own club’s turnover and expenditure per annum would be equivalent of 20 junior soccer clubs in Newry.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 18, 2020, 08:31:52 AM
Don’t think so BB. I’m happy to report that I’m a soccer fan and former player. I don’t have any bones to grind with the sport, not even close.

The difference between me and you is that I can objectively recognise that soccer in NI isn’t even remotely as entrenched in communities as Gaelic Games is. My own club’s turnover and expenditure per annum would be equivalent of 20 junior soccer clubs in Newry.

And a senior soccer club has the turnover of 20 GAA clubs. So what?
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 18, 2020, 11:23:33 AM
The point is BB, and has been since the start of this thread, that when the question is raised as to why Gaelic Games receives more capital funding than other sports in NI, it’s because a significantly greater number of GAA clubs are eligible to apply for funding, than soccer clubs.

Eligibility criteria is based around the likelihood of a grant recipient subsequently fulfilling a suitable project or programme. Which fundamentally boils down to proof of pudding.

This is not bigotry. It’s a fact.

 
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Rossfan on October 18, 2020, 11:41:49 AM
With BB anything that's not "Soccer good Gah bad" is in his view "bigotry".
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 18, 2020, 01:47:24 PM
The point is BB, and has been since the start of this thread, that when the question is raised as to why Gaelic Games receives more capital funding than other sports in NI, it’s because a significantly greater number of GAA clubs are eligible to apply for funding, than soccer clubs.

Eligibility criteria is based around the likelihood of a grant recipient subsequently fulfilling a suitable project or programme. Which fundamentally boils down to proof of pudding.

This is not bigotry. It’s a fact.

And we all agreed on that. Then you went into zoomer mode. You claimed that 99.9% of soccer clubs in the 6 have no coaches, don't register with leagues, have no bank accounts, no officers and so on. That is an astounding amount of shite talk.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 18, 2020, 01:53:29 PM
The point is BB, and has been since the start of this thread, that when the question is raised as to why Gaelic Games receives more capital funding than other sports in NI, it’s because a significantly greater number of GAA clubs are eligible to apply for funding, than soccer clubs.

Eligibility criteria is based around the likelihood of a grant recipient subsequently fulfilling a suitable project or programme. Which fundamentally boils down to proof of pudding.

This is not bigotry. It’s a fact.


And we all agreed on that. Then you went into zoomer mode. You claimed that 99.9% of soccer clubs in the 6 have no coaches, don't register with leagues, have no bank accounts, no officers and so on. That is an astounding amount of shite talk.

I never said anything remotely close to that.

You want so much to be offended that you are prepared to exaggerate anything and everything .

Listen we are not in the pub, where I can’t prove what I said an hour ago. We are on a forum of dated posts. Go back through this relatively short thread for 2 minutes and it’s clear who the “zoomer” (whatever the f**k that is) is.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 18, 2020, 02:18:09 PM
The point is BB, and has been since the start of this thread, that when the question is raised as to why Gaelic Games receives more capital funding than other sports in NI, it’s because a significantly greater number of GAA clubs are eligible to apply for funding, than soccer clubs.

Eligibility criteria is based around the likelihood of a grant recipient subsequently fulfilling a suitable project or programme. Which fundamentally boils down to proof of pudding.

This is not bigotry. It’s a fact.


And we all agreed on that. Then you went into zoomer mode. You claimed that 99.9% of soccer clubs in the 6 have no coaches, don't register with leagues, have no bank accounts, no officers and so on. That is an astounding amount of shite talk.

I never said anything remotely close to that.

You want so much to be offended that you are prepared to exaggerate anything and everything .

Listen we are not in the pub, where I can’t prove what I said an hour ago. We are on a forum of dated posts. Go back through this relatively short thread for 2 minutes and it’s clear who the “zoomer” (whatever the f**k that is) is.

He refuses to accept that the majority of soccer teams in NI are unconstituted, have no grounds, no members, and in a lot of cases, no bank account.  Which means that these ones are ineligible for any public grant.

He is is also unwilling to accept that unless a club owns property (or has a long term lease) then it is immediately ruled out of all capital grants (which is obviously where the majority of funding lies).

All in all there’s only 40-odd soccer clubs in NI that can qualify for a capital grant, only 40-odd rugby clubs in NI that can qualify for a capital grant, but some 400-odd GAA clubs that can legally qualify for a capital grant.

The disparity should, if an  uh hung, be greater

Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 18, 2020, 03:30:19 PM
So your understanding of the “majority” is 99.9%?

Away and take a break you mad man.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 18, 2020, 04:38:39 PM
So your understanding of the “majority” is 99.9%?

Away and take a break you mad man.

You said 40 clubs. There are 1,000+. Thats 99.99%.

You are a bluffer snd bullshitter
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 18, 2020, 04:44:05 PM
So your understanding of the “majority” is 99.9%?

Away and take a break you mad man.

You said 40 clubs. There are 1,000+. Thats 99.99%.

You are a bluffer snd bullshitter

I immediately retracted that as a mistake and alluded to the previous post I made where I said 90.

—-

You have said 99.9%.



You’re a very bitter human being.

—-

Hold on: edit.

You are now trying to declare that I said there were 40 soccer clubs in NI. I said there were circa 90 clubs with their own facilities.

This is short thread. It’s remarkably easy to follow.

You don’t get to rewrite what I said.

—-


You’re not just bitter. There’s a sadness in how you write that’s hard to describe. You are not well.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 18, 2020, 05:06:55 PM
So your understanding of the “majority” is 99.9%?

Away and take a break you mad man.

You said 40 clubs. There are 1,000+. Thats 99.99%.

You are a bluffer snd bullshitter

I immediately retracted that as a mistake and alluded to the previous post I made where I said 90.

—-

You have said 99.9%.



You’re a very bitter human being.

—-

Hold on: edit.

You are now trying to declare that I said there were 40 soccer clubs in NI. I said there were circa 90 clubs with their own facilities.

This is short thread. It’s remarkably easy to follow.

You don’t get to rewrite what I said.

—-


You’re not just bitter. There’s a sadness in how you write that’s hard to describe. You are not well.

You said there were 40/90 clubs in tbe 6 eligible for grants as the rest didn't have officers, bank accounts and whatnot. There are over 1000 soccer clubs in the north. Do your sums.

This is demeaning beyond belief
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 18, 2020, 05:15:08 PM
1. There is nowhere near 1000 soccer clubs in NI. One article without sources that made absolutely no effort to different between teams (Ballymena, Ballymena 2nds, Ballymena 3rds, Ballymena 4ths) and clubs (Ballymena) is not a factual record.

2. There are around 90 clubs in NI who have their own grounds and therefore would be eligible for a capital grant.

3. Why are these two things so hard for you to understand?

4. Why do you continually try to twist everything I’m saying?

5. Please please please try to understand that although you might prefer association football, you do not have to jump into every thread that mentions this sport, and start swinging punches before understanding why soccer is being discussed.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Champion The Wonder Horse on October 18, 2020, 06:07:05 PM
I played for three soccer clubs in different junior leagues in the north.

Two of the three owned one kit each; the third owned two. Along with a few balls and water bottles, that was their entire inventory. This appeared to be the same for every club in each of the leagues, given that all the games we played every week were on council pitches.

None of the three I played for had a bank account.

thewobbler's figure may not be 100% accurate, but it is a much more accurate representation than anything BB2 has come up with.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: tiempo on October 18, 2020, 06:23:44 PM
I played for three soccer clubs in different junior leagues in the north.

Two of the three owned one kit each; the third owned two. Along with a few balls and water bottles, that was their entire inventory. This appeared to be the same for every club in each of the leagues, given that all the games we played every week were on council pitches.

None of the three I played for had a bank account.

thewobbler's figure may not be 100% accurate, but it is a much more accurate representation than anything BB2 has come up with.

Wobs figure is 99.9% accurate, BB2 ge yer head a wobble
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Godsown on October 18, 2020, 06:37:58 PM
I played for three soccer clubs in different junior leagues in the north.

Two of the three owned one kit each; the third owned two. Along with a few balls and water bottles, that was their entire inventory. This appeared to be the same for every club in each of the leagues, given that all the games we played every week were on council pitches.

None of the three I played for had a bank account.

thewobbler's figure may not be 100% accurate, but it is a much more accurate representation than anything BB2 has come up with.

Wobs figure is 99.9% accurate, BB2 ge yer head a wobble

Not sure why Wobbler even bothers engaging these eejits. If truth be told a significant number of GAA clubs not only own their own grounds but would have 2/3 pitches and all maintained to high standard
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Rossfan on October 18, 2020, 07:34:58 PM
No no no.
Soccer good Gah bad.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 19, 2020, 11:09:02 AM
No no no.
Soccer good Gah bad.

You are a child.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on October 19, 2020, 03:13:01 PM
It is a major bug bearer of soccer only heads that the GAA actually has a more coherent and structure infrastructure in terms of the club scene. I would say it wouldn’t be an unreasonable guesstimate that 90% of GAA clubs own their own playing fields and club houses. I’d say it is the polar opposite with soccer clubs. They are generally based around council owned facilities and their ‘clubhouse’ is the local bar that they meet at before and after the games. That is not a criticism by the way but many clubs that I know from the Carnbane league would operate that way, wobbler can back me up there.

When you go above that level to the clubs that compete at the likes of the Mid Ulster League level then it is becoming more serious but still most clubs do not own their own facilities. As wobbler has stated approximately 90 clubs own their own grounds. As a consequence of that less clubs will be entitled to capital grants that GAA clubs will be entitled to. They do not fit the criterion. Also the reality is that the more established and consistent settled infrastructure means that the GAA clubs have a level of continuity of knowledge and understanding of club management that is not necessarily there on a soccer club.

In Crossmaglen the soccer team was set up in a local pub and named after it. It was run by the owner for years. He stepped away but the club retained the name. They used the school field as their playing pitch and would put soccer goals on the GAA pitch. Eventually the council set up a municipal facility that had a soccer pitch and a GAA pitch. It was left to rack and ruin. It was built beside our home grounds and we had an arrangement with the council which saw us eventually take it over and redevelop it. The soccer pitch is still there but it is now rented off the club by the soccer team. The soccer team still operates, and are half decent, but they are still a pub team.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 19, 2020, 08:20:12 PM
Nobody is arguing that soccer clubs are structured differently and aren't eligible for this round of funding in the same way.

What I am taking issue with is the claim that the majority that is 99% by numbers given, don't have any structure, constitution, officers, bank accounts, coaches or aren't affiliated with leagues.

The fact calling this patent bullshit out makes you a 'soccer only head' gives shit echo chambers a bad name.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 19, 2020, 08:27:48 PM
Nobody is arguing that soccer clubs are structured differently and aren't eligible for this round of funding in the same way.

What I am taking issue with is the claim that the majority that is 99% by numbers given, don't have any structure, constitution, officers, bank accounts, coaches or aren't affiliated with leagues.

The fact calling this patent bullshit out makes you a 'soccer only head' gives shit echo chambers a bad name.

You didn’t listen very much in maths class.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 19, 2020, 09:01:24 PM
Nobody is arguing that soccer clubs are structured differently and aren't eligible for this round of funding in the same way.

What I am taking issue with is the claim that the majority that is 99% by numbers given, don't have any structure, constitution, officers, bank accounts, coaches or aren't affiliated with leagues.

The fact calling this patent bullshit out makes you a 'soccer only head' gives shit echo chambers a bad name.

You didn’t listen very much in maths class.

You claimed there were 40, then 90 clubs, that owned their own land. Maybe. Maybe not. You then claimed they were the only clubs with coaches, officers, members of leagues or had bank accounts. There was a claim that there are 1,000 soccer clubs in the 6c, which seems low considering there are 6,000 in the south. 40 or 90 is <1% of 1,000.

Your problem is you can't keep track of your daft claims.

This shite might fly in your clubhouse, but in the real world you will be pulled on it.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: hardstation on October 19, 2020, 09:03:20 PM
Lol. What?
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 19, 2020, 09:34:28 PM
What you’re doing here BB is wrong.

The entire thread is 8 and a half pages.

Anyone with just 10 minutes on their hands can read every single message. They can also see how few I’ve edited and when I edited them.

And your version of events is about as close to the truth as James McClean is to to world class.

——

On a side note, what kind of a national sporting association cannot do better than a four-figure guess for the number of clubs actively affiliated to it?
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: hardstation on October 19, 2020, 09:47:13 PM
So your understanding of the “majority” is 99.9%?

Away and take a break you mad man.

You said 40 clubs. There are 1,000+. Thats 99.99%.

You are a bluffer snd bullshitter
This just here. I like this.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 19, 2020, 09:59:02 PM
What you’re doing here BB is wrong.

The entire thread is 8 and a half pages.

Anyone with just 10 minutes on their hands can read every single message. They can also see how few I’ve edited and when I edited them.

And your version of events is about as close to the truth as James McClean is to to world class.

——

On a side note, what kind of a national sporting association cannot do better than a four-figure guess for the number of clubs actively affiliated to it?

Feel free to clarify any misinterpretation taken from direct quotes.

I'm not defending the IFA, far from it. But your claims are ludicrous
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: hardstation on October 19, 2020, 10:06:41 PM
Can I ask where you are pulling 99/99.9/99.99% out of in relation to the figures thewobbler & EvilGenius have given?

My maths;
40 out of 1000 = 4%. Therefore, the rest is 96%.
90 out of 1000 = 9%. Therefore, the rest is 91%.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 19, 2020, 10:43:47 PM
Nobody is arguing that soccer clubs are structured differently and aren't eligible for this round of funding in the same way.

What I am taking issue with is the claim that the majority that is 99% by numbers given, don't have any structure, constitution, officers, bank accounts, coaches or aren't affiliated with leagues.

The fact calling this patent bullshit out makes you a 'soccer only head' gives shit echo chambers a bad name.

You didn’t listen very much in maths class.

You claimed there were 40, then 90 clubs, that owned their own land. Maybe. Maybe not. You then claimed they were the only clubs with coaches, officers, members of leagues or had bank accounts. There was a claim that there are 1,000 soccer clubs in the 6c, which seems low considering there are 6,000 in the south. 40 or 90 is <1% of 1,000.

Your problem is you can't keep track of your daft claims.

This shite might fly in your clubhouse, but in the real world you will be pulled on it.

1. I claimed there were circa 90 clubs in NI with their own facilities. I later went with this figure again and mistaken typed in 40, which is what it roughly is for rugby. I came to that figure of 90 by counting up the senior and intermediate registered teams in NI (roughly 120-130), removing the reserve league and any other obvious seconds teams, then scanning through the remaining for sides that obviously co-share, use council facilities, or use school facilities. I don’t think I’m going to be too far off the mark. I’d be absolutely shocked if it tops 100.

2. In a very, very separate post I advised that the majority of soccer clubs in NI are unconstituted and unlikely to have a bank account. My back of a few packet calculations would have 600-700 soccer clubs in NI. Yours (from one source, with no references) was for 1,000+. Either way, that’s somewhere between 500 and 900 clubs that don’t have their own grounds, which means they are ineligible for any form of capital grant.

3. I would follow through on point 2 with the observations on coaching and youth systems. Almost every junior soccer team will do some form of training between 2 and 100 times a year. But unless they run a youth programme, they won’t be eligible for anything other than the rarest of coaching grants. The thing you clearly don’t  understand is that it’s very difficult to run a youth programme without your own facilities, for the cost of renting facilities for through-the-line (u8 to u18) coaching is a daunting prospect, the kind of prospect that can only be appealing to well-run, constituted club with a strong foothold in its area, and a loyal base of volunteers. This is the ultimate catch 22 though. Without a “home” it’s so, so difficult to gain a foothold. Almost every club in every sport on the world can identify with a location. If your location is a pub, then it’s not like a youth system is part of the offering.

4. At no stage have my numbers been daft.

5. If your annual turnover is less than £2k, a bank account is an expense a club can do without, and an absolute pain in the backside to deposit and withdraw nominal sums of money from. This is why most junior clubs do not bother.

6. The IFA has absolutely no idea how many clubs come under its affiliation, even though in a province this size, one man with a charged phone could define this in a couple of hours.

7. I’ve made it clear that I’m a former junior soccer player who really enjoys the game.


You’re just determined to argue. Which is why you’ve clung to my typo for a fortnight. It’s all you have.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 19, 2020, 11:28:55 PM
I never disagreed on 1.

2 and 3 are absolutely and patently bollocks. What does 'unconstituted' even mean?

4. They are if you are working off the basis that most soccer clubs dont have underage teams or a bank account.

5. Complete bollocks. Clubs have to pay league affilations, insurance, rent and so on.

6. So you say.

7. You may enjoy the game, but your arguments are patronising in the extreme. The idea that soccer is less valid because of a line of insulting, illogical bullshit. In my town the GAA club are a farce and are being forced to sell up and move to a council facility. They are way behind the soccer and rugby clubs. Thats not typical, but the idea that all GAA clubs are better run than all soccer clubs is utter tosh.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 19, 2020, 11:34:43 PM
2. Unconstituted.

To go back over old ground, we’ve covered already on this thread. As you’re unwilling to learn / accept the difference between a constituted club and an unconstituted one, then you’ve obviously never even looked at a grant application form for a sporting club, let alone completed one. It’s literally question 2 on every form, right after the one about a having a bank account.

You have no business discussing the allocation of sporting grants. Even less so for a different jurisdiction.

Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 19, 2020, 11:41:49 PM
7. There is no attempt by me to patronise. The purpose of this thread was to discuss was GAA clubs are more successful at gaining capital funding than other sporting bodies in NI. The answer to this is as clear as the clearest thing in transparent land. But then off you go into participation levels and other things that aren’t relevant. If you feel patronised it’s because you refuse to listen.
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 19, 2020, 11:45:58 PM
7. There is no attempt by me to patronise. The purpose of this thread was to discuss was GAA clubs are more successful at gaining capital funding than other sporting bodies in NI. The answer to this is as clear as the clearest thing in transparent land. But then off you go into participation levels and other things that aren’t relevant. If you feel patronised it’s because you refuse to listen.

We all agreed why GAA clubs got more in this particular round of funding. Then you went into fuckwit mode and became the sporting wing of Gemma O'Doherty
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 19, 2020, 11:47:07 PM
2. Unconstituted.

To go back over old ground, we’ve covered already on this thread. As you’re unwilling to learn / accept the difference between a constituted club and an unconstituted one, then you’ve obviously never even looked at a grant application form for a sporting club, let alone completed one. It’s literally question 2 on every form, right after the one about a having a bank account.

You have no business discussing the allocation of sporting grants. Even less so for a different jurisdiction.

I know what it means. I'm trying to establish do you and do you understand what you are talking about.

Because every single sports club is constituted. Its absolutely irrelevant to grants
Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: thewobbler on October 20, 2020, 06:12:12 AM
2. Unconstituted.

To go back over old ground, we’ve covered already on this thread. As you’re unwilling to learn / accept the difference between a constituted club and an unconstituted one, then you’ve obviously never even looked at a grant application form for a sporting club, let alone completed one. It’s literally question 2 on every form, right after the one about a having a bank account.

You have no business discussing the allocation of sporting grants. Even less so for a different jurisdiction.

I know what it means. I'm trying to establish do you and do you understand what you are talking about.

Because every single sports club is constituted. Its absolutely irrelevant to grants

Every. Single. Sports. Club.

Extraordinarily implausible, yet stated with such conviction. How can you be so oblivious to the fact that when you make such impossibly grandiose claims, it weakens your argument?


Absolutely. Irrelevant. To. Grants.

If you actually genuinely believe this to be true, it’s only because you’ve never looked at a grant application form.

——

The sheer insanity of these statements, when compounded with the “99.9%” calculation earlier, makes thoroughly clear that I’m not dealing with a lucid human being here. So it’s over and out from me. Somewhere in between reviewing the (clearly meaningless) constitutions of “every single sports club”, I hope you enjoy your celebratory riposte BB. I won’t be replying.


Title: Re: Sports Funding in NI
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on October 20, 2020, 09:30:55 AM
So you don't know what the phrase means. My gast is flabbered.