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GAA Discussion => GAA Discussion => Topic started by: DownFanatic on September 30, 2019, 11:26:39 AM

Title: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: DownFanatic on September 30, 2019, 11:26:39 AM
Ulster JFC

Preliminary Round - 13/10/19
St Patrick's, Lisburn (Antrim) v Collegeland (Armagh)

Quarter Finals - 19/10/19 and 20/10/19

(Donegal) v (Antrim)/(Armagh)
Drum/Glack (Derry) v Kildress/Rock (Tyrone)
Drumhowan/Blackhill (Monaghan) v Maguiresbridge (Fermanagh)
Killinkere (Cavan) v Aughlisnafin/Bright (Down)

Ulster IFC

Preliminary Round - 19/10/19

Grange/Shane O'Neill's (Armagh) v Galbally/Pomeroy (Tyrone)

Quarter Finals - 2/11/19 and 3/11/19

Kinawley (Fermanagh) v Glenn/Shamrocks (Down)
Donaghmoyne/Corduff/Magheracloone (Monaghan) v Castledawson/Foreglen/Drumsurn/Claudy (Derry)
(Antrim) v (Donegal)
(Cavan) v (Armagh)/(Tyrone)
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: timmyot501 on September 30, 2019, 12:46:09 PM
Monaghan Junior Football Final - 6th October 2019
Drumhowan v Blackhill

Monaghan Intermediate Semi Final - Thurs 3rd Oct
Donaghmoyne v Corduff

Winners play Magheracloone in the Final on 13th Oct 2019
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Gaagaagaa20 on September 30, 2019, 01:00:31 PM
Going to put an early prediction for Tyrone Intermediate winners to coast through Ulster at a snails pace. Galbally and Pomeroy both very strong from what i can hear, with Galbally especially racking up huge scores so far. Cant see any major opposition coming from my own county especially
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: general_lee on September 30, 2019, 01:12:55 PM
Armagh either Grange or Shane OíNeillís
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: DownFanatic on September 30, 2019, 01:23:47 PM
The winners of the Down JFC are unlikely to cause any ripples in Ulster.
Glenn are fancied to win the Down IFC. They have three county players unavailable to them though namely Shay Millar, Ronan Millar and Niall McParland.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: The Bearded One on September 30, 2019, 02:09:41 PM
Going to put an early prediction for Tyrone Intermediate winners to coast through Ulster at a snails pace. Galbally and Pomeroy both very strong from what i can hear, with Galbally especially racking up huge scores so far. Cant see any major opposition coming from my own county especially

Kinawley are Fermanagh intermediate champions and have a decent side.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: oakleaflad on October 02, 2019, 10:45:31 AM
Derry

Intermediate
Foreglen/Castledawson/Drumsurn/Claudy

Junior
Drum/Glack


In all honesty I can't see us challenging in either. Our junior winners won't make it past the Tyrone winners.
Intermediate have the Monaghan winners up first and they are usually strong at Intermediate too. Possibly if Claudy win they could give it a run.

Derry haven't had an Intermediate finalist since Craigbane won it in 2011 and have never won Junior although Faughanvale and Limavady were beaten finalists in recent times.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: timmyot501 on October 07, 2019, 10:18:26 AM
Blackhill are the Monaghan Junior champions for 2019

Intermediate final next Sunday between Magheracloone and Donaghmoyne
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Owenmoresider on October 07, 2019, 10:28:50 AM
Donegal intermediate final - St Nauls v Aodh Ruadh or Cloughaneely
Junior - Letterkenny Gaels v Buncrana
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: DownFanatic on October 07, 2019, 11:02:02 AM
Bright won their first ever Down JFC title yesterday after a two point win over Aughlisnafin. They had lost 6 finals since 1995.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: oakleaflad on October 07, 2019, 11:04:12 AM
Glack won the Derry Junior title

Foreglen and Claudy in the Intermediate final.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: DownFanatic on October 07, 2019, 11:05:07 AM
Ulster JFC

Preliminary Round - 13/10/19
St Patrick's, Lisburn (Antrim) v Collegeland (Armagh)

Quarter Finals - 19/10/19 and 20/10/19

Buncrana/Letterkenny Gaels (Donegal) v (Antrim)/(Armagh)
Glack (Derry) v Rock (Tyrone)
Blackhill (Monaghan) v Maguiresbridge (Fermanagh)
Killinkere (Cavan) v Bright (Down)

Ulster IFC

Preliminary Round - 19/10/19

Grange (Armagh) v Galbally (Tyrone)

Quarter Finals - 2/11/19 and 3/11/19

Kinawley (Fermanagh) v Glenn/Shamrocks (Down)
Donaghmoyne/Magheracloone (Monaghan) v Foreglen/Claudy (Derry)
Aldergrove (Antrim) v St Naul's/Aodh Ruadh/Cloughaneely (Donegal)
Laragh United (Cavan) v (Armagh)/(Tyrone)
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: MK on October 13, 2019, 06:48:13 PM
The winners of the Down JFC are unlikely to cause any ripples in Ulster.
Glenn are fancied to win the Down IFC. They have three county players unavailable to them though namely Shay Millar, Ronan Millar and Niall McParland.

Glenn win Down IFC today-good to see Niall Mc Parland back playing
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Owenmoresider on October 13, 2019, 08:47:15 PM
Ulster JFC

Preliminary Round - 13/10/19
St Patrick's, Lisburn (Antrim) v Collegeland (Armagh)

Quarter Finals - 19/10/19 and 20/10/19

Buncrana/Letterkenny Gaels (Donegal) v (Antrim)/(Armagh)
Glack (Derry) v Rock (Tyrone)
Blackhill (Monaghan) v Maguiresbridge (Fermanagh)
Killinkere (Cavan) v Bright (Down)

Ulster IFC

Preliminary Round - 19/10/19

Grange (Armagh) v Galbally (Tyrone)

Quarter Finals - 2/11/19 and 3/11/19

Kinawley (Fermanagh) v Glenn/Shamrocks (Down)
Donaghmoyne/Magheracloone (Monaghan) v Foreglen/Claudy (Derry)
Aldergrove (Antrim) v St Naul's/Aodh Ruadh/Cloughaneely (Donegal)
Laragh United (Cavan) v (Armagh)/(Tyrone)
St. Nauls and Buncrana won in Donegal.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: DownFanatic on October 14, 2019, 08:57:55 AM
Ulster JFC

Preliminary Round - 13/10/19
St Patrick's, Lisburn (Antrim) 1-06 v Collegeland (Armagh) 0-13

Quarter Finals - 19/10/19 and 20/10/19

Buncrana (Donegal) v Collegeland (Armagh)
Glack (Derry) v Rock (Tyrone)
Blackhill (Monaghan) v Maguiresbridge (Fermanagh)
Killinkere (Cavan) v Bright (Down)

Ulster IFC

Preliminary Round - 19/10/19

Grange (Armagh) v Galbally (Tyrone)

Quarter Finals - 2/11/19 and 3/11/19

Kinawley (Fermanagh) v Glenn (Down)
Magheracloone (Monaghan) v Foreglen/Claudy (Derry)
Aldergrove (Antrim) v St Naul's (Donegal)
Laragh United (Cavan) v (Armagh)/(Tyrone)
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: DownFanatic on October 14, 2019, 11:26:29 AM
Who would be strong in each of these competitions?
Rock have serious experience at Junior level in the past and should be there or thereabouts. Donegal teams have come good at Junior in recent times. Would Buncrana be able to make an impact?
Intermediate seems quite strong this year. Could make a case for most of the teams left in it.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: GetOverTheBar on October 14, 2019, 02:54:50 PM
Galbally from Tyrone shouldn't be far away from Ulster but it will depend on how hard they have celebrated. They lost their first game all year at the weekend there so who knows.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: tintin25 on October 14, 2019, 03:22:45 PM
Galbally probably favourites for Intermediate but Kinawley would be my dark horses.  Think Buncrana play in a high enough division in Donegal, so they prob strong enough for Junior?  Rock will be there or thereabouts.  What is it with Rock anyway?  Always seem to move between Junior and Intermediate.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: GetOverTheBar on October 14, 2019, 03:27:58 PM
Galbally probably favourites for Intermediate but Kinawley would be my dark horses.  Think Buncrana play in a high enough division in Donegal, so they prob strong enough for Junior?  Rock will be there or thereabouts.  What is it with Rock anyway?  Always seem to move between Junior and Intermediate.

They are a small club, they have a small enough pick - they also don't try a leg when they get to Intermediate. It'll be the same this year. But it wasn't that long ago they lost a play off to go to Senior Football either. 
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Schkite on October 14, 2019, 03:31:26 PM
I'd hazard a guess that Magheracloone will do quite well in Intermediate. After a long senior stint they were relegated last year, but most thought they were too good for intermediate, and so it turned out as they won the championship and finished top of the league. They were only in the senior county final a couple of years ago so it was surprising to see them down last year. I'd say they'd be one of the better and more experienced teams in the Ulster intermediate.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: J70 on October 14, 2019, 05:48:21 PM
Who would be strong in each of these competitions?
Rock have serious experience at Junior level in the past and should be there or thereabouts. Donegal teams have come good at Junior in recent times. Would Buncrana be able to make an impact?
Intermediate seems quite strong this year. Could make a case for most of the teams left in it.

St Nauls have a couple of county men, but no first choice at that level. Brendan McCole played the league last year when Neil McGee was out, but Mickey Newman gave him a harsh lesson in the Div 2 final and that was more or less it for the season.

Young Mogan impressed greatly on county minor and U-21 teams and is hopefully one for the future.

Stephen Griffin was in and around the senior squad for a number of seasons, but with the likes of Murphy, McFadden, McBrearty etc ahead of him, he never got much of a look in. Scored a goal against Cork in the 2009 AI quarter final (they hammered us, but Murphy, at 18 or 19, was immense) and he once got an equalizing point in the last minute of a league game down in Castlebar.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: square_ball on October 14, 2019, 07:51:48 PM
Galbally probably favourites for Intermediate but Kinawley would be my dark horses.  Think Buncrana play in a high enough division in Donegal, so they prob strong enough for Junior?  Rock will be there or thereabouts.  What is it with Rock anyway?  Always seem to move between Junior and Intermediate.

They are a small club, they have a small enough pick - they also don't try a leg when they get to Intermediate. It'll be the same this year. But it wasn't that long ago they lost a play off to go to Senior Football either.

Well obviously thatís not true. Bit of an urban myth that one in Tyrone circles.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: GetOverTheBar on October 15, 2019, 09:09:23 AM
Galbally probably favourites for Intermediate but Kinawley would be my dark horses.  Think Buncrana play in a high enough division in Donegal, so they prob strong enough for Junior?  Rock will be there or thereabouts.  What is it with Rock anyway?  Always seem to move between Junior and Intermediate.

They are a small club, they have a small enough pick - they also don't try a leg when they get to Intermediate. It'll be the same this year. But it wasn't that long ago they lost a play off to go to Senior Football either.

Well obviously thatís not true. Bit of an urban myth that one in Tyrone circles.

They get relegated every single time they go up. I don't know what more evidence is required on that one really to be honest with you.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: square_ball on October 15, 2019, 10:10:06 AM
No you literally said they donít try a leg when they go up. Theyíve been beat in a few relegation play offs the last few years theyíve been promoted. What do they say at the start of the year here lads weíll get relegated this year? 6th smallest club in Tyrone in terms of members. As usual itís easy to criticise on this board. Theyíre doing alright.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: giveherlong on October 15, 2019, 01:32:49 PM
Who would be strong in each of these competitions?
Rock have serious experience at Junior level in the past and should be there or thereabouts. Donegal teams have come good at Junior in recent times. Would Buncrana be able to make an impact?
Intermediate seems quite strong this year. Could make a case for most of the teams left in it.

Ryan Bradley former county midfielder is Buncrana, is he playing? What about the jigger Oíconnor - didnít he start the 2014 all Ireland final?
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Angelo on October 19, 2019, 08:45:30 PM
Good wins for Rock and Galbally.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Itchy on October 20, 2019, 08:42:09 PM
Killinkere beat Bright by 5 pts today too.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Targetman on October 20, 2019, 09:08:12 PM
Itchy, did Killinkere get promoted to Div1 and if so how do they play in the Junior championship?
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: mrdeeds on October 20, 2019, 10:39:56 PM
Itchy, did Killinkere get promoted to Div1 and if so how do they play in the Junior championship?

League and championship seperate in Cavan. They got promoted in league a couple months ago. Last year promoted from division 3 to 2 and lost junior final. This year 2 to 1 and now up to intermediate.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: marty34 on October 20, 2019, 10:54:39 PM
Itchy, did Killinkere get promoted to Div1 and if so how do they play in the Junior championship?

League and championship seperate in Cavan. They got promoted in league a couple months ago. Last year promoted from division 3 to 2 and lost junior final. This year 2 to 1 and now up to intermediate.

How can a team in Div. 1 play in a Junior championship??

Surely that's totall unfair? - would Cavan clubs not to pissed off at that?
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: hardstation on October 20, 2019, 10:56:56 PM
Itchy, did Killinkere get promoted to Div1 and if so how do they play in the Junior championship?

League and championship seperate in Cavan. They got promoted in league a couple months ago. Last year promoted from division 3 to 2 and lost junior final. This year 2 to 1 and now up to intermediate.

How can a team in Div. 1 play in a Junior championship??

Surely that's totall unfair? - would Cavan clubs not to pissed off at that?
By his description, they were Division 2.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: mrdeeds on October 20, 2019, 11:19:40 PM
Clubs in Cavan fine about it. They were division 2 is right this year. It's very rare the above happens but if they lost junior final they would have been a junior  club next year in division 1. Sure league and championship are two seperate competitions.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: marty34 on October 20, 2019, 11:36:45 PM
Clubs in Cavan fine about it. They were division 2 is right this year. It's very rare the above happens but if they lost junior final they would have been a junior  club next year in division 1. Sure league and championship are two seperate competitions.

So in 2020, they'll be in Div. 1 league team and when that league starts, they could be All Ireland Jnr. Champions.

How does that work out? 
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: mrdeeds on October 21, 2019, 08:08:50 AM
Clubs in Cavan fine about it. They were division 2 is right this year. It's very rare the above happens but if they lost junior final they would have been a junior  club next year in division 1. Sure league and championship are two seperate competitions.

So in 2020, they'll be in Div. 1 league team and when that league starts, they could be All Ireland Jnr. Champions.

How does that work out?

Because they are two different competitions. Promotion and relegation are seperate for both.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Hedgehunter on October 21, 2019, 09:18:27 AM
Clubs in Cavan fine about it. They were division 2 is right this year. It's very rare the above happens but if they lost junior final they would have been a junior  club next year in division 1. Sure league and championship are two seperate competitions.

So in 2020, they'll be in Div. 1 league team and when that league starts, they could be All Ireland Jnr. Champions.

How does that work out?

Because they are two different competitions. Promotion and relegation are seperate for both.

How does one get relegated to junior then?
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: DownFanatic on October 21, 2019, 09:23:34 AM
Ulster JFC

Preliminary Round - 13/10/19
St Patrick's, Lisburn (Antrim) 1-06 v Collegeland (Armagh) 0-13

Quarter Finals - 19/10/19 and 20/10/19

Buncrana (Donegal) 1-14 v Collegeland (Armagh) 0-09
Glack (Derry) 0-06 v Rock (Tyrone) 2-15
Blackhill (Monaghan) 1-16 v Maguiresbridge (Fermanagh) 0-09
Killinkere (Cavan) 1-15 v Bright (Down) 1-10

Ulster IFC

Preliminary Round - 19/10/19

Grange (Armagh) 1-05 v Galbally (Tyrone) 0-16

Quarter Finals - 2/11/19 and 3/11/19

Kinawley (Fermanagh) v Glenn (Down)
Magheracloone (Monaghan) v Foreglen (Derry)
Aldergrove (Antrim) v St Naul's (Donegal)
Laragh United (Cavan) v Galbally (Tyrone)
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: marty34 on October 21, 2019, 09:34:22 AM
Clubs in Cavan fine about it. They were division 2 is right this year. It's very rare the above happens but if they lost junior final they would have been a junior  club next year in division 1. Sure league and championship are two seperate competitions.

So in 2020, they'll be in Div. 1 league team and when that league starts, they could be All Ireland Jnr. Champions.

How does that work out?

Because they are two different competitions. Promotion and relegation are seperate for both.

That's an odd set up in my opinion.

So in league, you could be playing at a higher standard on a regular basis, then go into a chsmpionship game against a team who are 1 league above or below you?

As an aside, heard recently that Gearoid Mc Kernian is going to Cavan Gaels - they seem to hoover up some amount of players from other clubs.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: nrico2006 on October 21, 2019, 09:46:54 AM
Is there not a few counties still set up like Cavan?  I think Donegal still is and I remember the Antrim Hurling Championship being that way not too long ago either.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: rodney trotter on October 21, 2019, 09:51:32 AM
It's not that odd at all.  And they would get relegated to Junior by being Relegated from Intermediate Championship.
Killenkere reached Intermediate final in 2016 but struggled in 2017 Championship and relegated to Junior

Look at the Inter County scene. There is 4 divisions In league, and  in championip a Division 4 team could play a Division 1 team in a Provincial championship game

Yet people cry about disregarding the weaker counties
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: general_lee on October 21, 2019, 10:04:55 AM
It's not that odd at all.  And they would get relegated to Junior by being Relegated from Intermediate Championship.
Killenkere reached Intermediate final in 2016 but struggled in 2017 Championship and relegated to Junior

Look at the Inter County scene. There is 4 divisions In league, and  in championip a Division 4 team could play a Division 1 team in a Provincial championship game

Yet people cry about disregarding the weaker counties
This is club football. It becomes odd when counties with differing ďinterpretationsĒ of what constitutes a junior club meet each other in club competition. Kerry are the prime example. They have Division 1 clubs play junior and intermediate all the time
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: oakleaflad on October 21, 2019, 10:11:53 AM
It's not that odd at all.  And they would get relegated to Junior by being Relegated from Intermediate Championship.
Killenkere reached Intermediate final in 2016 but struggled in 2017 Championship and relegated to Junior

Look at the Inter County scene. There is 4 divisions In league, and  in championip a Division 4 team could play a Division 1 team in a Provincial championship game

Yet people cry about disregarding the weaker counties
Genuinely curious as to how this happens. Is it just 1 club relegated each year? Is there a playoff between all losers of the first round or something like that?
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: five points on October 21, 2019, 10:32:18 AM
It becomes odd when counties with differing ďinterpretationsĒ of what constitutes a junior club meet each other in club competition. Kerry are the prime example. They have Division 1 clubs play junior and intermediate all the time

This makes the All Ireland Intermediates and Juniors a farce, in my opinion.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: rodney trotter on October 21, 2019, 10:34:28 AM
Yeah 1 Club. They go into a play off against other 3 clubs who were beaten. The Cavan Championship isn't knock out like most other Ulster Counties. Group stages with teams who didn't advance going into relegation

In 2017 3 clubs went Down as the Cavan Club championship was lob sided, with too many teams in Senior and Intermediate. The aim wss of Clubs doing better in Ulster Club
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: DownFanatic on October 21, 2019, 11:18:52 AM
As far as I am aware all counties have the right to decide how many teams they want in their respective championships and how these championships operate. It makes for serious inequalities across the board. Some counties have absolutely no correlation between their leagues and championships either.
My own county Down have a very honest system whereby league standings determine your gradings. It means clubs that are of proper intermediate and junior standard are playing in their proper championship.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: five points on October 21, 2019, 11:50:24 AM
My own county Down have a very honest system whereby league standings determine your gradings. It means clubs that are of proper intermediate and junior standard are playing in their proper championship.

Do Down clubs agree to play league matches without county players?
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: general_lee on October 21, 2019, 12:11:24 PM
As far as I am aware all counties have the right to decide how many teams they want in their respective championships and how these championships operate. It makes for serious inequalities across the board. Some counties have absolutely no correlation between their leagues and championships either.
My own county Down have a very honest system whereby league standings determine your gradings. It means clubs that are of proper intermediate and junior standard are playing in their proper championship.
Armagh is the same, although previously under the old set up we have had Division 1 teams complete at intermediate and a division 2 team compete at junior. Now we have three leagues that correspond with the three respective  championship grades. Never in a million years could I see a team be considered good enough to play Crossmaglen in the league but only fit to play junior championship  :o
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: DownFanatic on October 21, 2019, 12:29:39 PM
My own county Down have a very honest system whereby league standings determine your gradings. It means clubs that are of proper intermediate and junior standard are playing in their proper championship.

Do Down clubs agree to play league matches without county players?

Yes.
We have a 'Starred System' whereby there are certain games throughout the season that are starred in which county players can't play in.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: mrdeeds on October 21, 2019, 12:38:59 PM
Clubs in Cavan play a lot of league games without county players so would be unfair to grade championship based on that. Killinkere are in the position where they have no county players so played teams missing players in the league. Crosserlough for example have 7 county players. Lavey are a strong senior team but in division 2 because missing county lads for league.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Itchy on October 21, 2019, 12:49:58 PM
Itchy, did Killinkere get promoted to Div1 and if so how do they play in the Junior championship?

League and championship seperate in Cavan. They got promoted in league a couple months ago. Last year promoted from division 3 to 2 and lost junior final. This year 2 to 1 and now up to intermediate.

How can a team in Div. 1 play in a Junior championship??

Surely that's totall unfair? - would Cavan clubs not to pissed off at that?

Dont think people see it like that, league and championship is separate in most counties isn't it?
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: marty34 on October 21, 2019, 12:52:07 PM
Itchy, did Killinkere get promoted to Div1 and if so how do they play in the Junior championship?

League and championship seperate in Cavan. They got promoted in league a couple months ago. Last year promoted from division 3 to 2 and lost junior final. This year 2 to 1 and now up to intermediate.

How can a team in Div. 1 play in a Junior championship??

Surely that's totall unfair? - would Cavan clubs not to pissed off at that?

Dont think people see it like that, league and championship is separate in most counties isn't it?

But most team say, play Div.1 league football and then play senior championship..Div.2 league and Intermediate championship etc. etc.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: marty34 on October 21, 2019, 12:55:44 PM
It's not that odd at all.  And they would get relegated to Junior by being Relegated from Intermediate Championship.
Killenkere reached Intermediate final in 2016 but struggled in 2017 Championship and relegated to Junior

Look at the Inter County scene. There is 4 divisions In league, and  in championip a Division 4 team could play a Division 1 team in a Provincial championship game

Yet people cry about disregarding the weaker counties

But that's why now Rodney, there's a clamour for a tiered system...or at least 2 tiers.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: marty34 on October 21, 2019, 01:00:34 PM
It's not that odd at all.  And they would get relegated to Junior by being Relegated from Intermediate Championship.
Killenkere reached Intermediate final in 2016 but struggled in 2017 Championship and relegated to Junior

Look at the Inter County scene. There is 4 divisions In league, and  in championip a Division 4 team could play a Division 1 team in a Provincial championship game

Yet people cry about disregarding the weaker counties
This is club football. It becomes odd when counties with differing ďinterpretationsĒ of what constitutes a junior club meet each other in club competition. Kerry are the prime example. They have Division 1 clubs play junior and intermediate all the time

True, there should be no divisional sides or amalgamations moving on into the provincial set up - not fair on other teams.

I remember reading somewhere, last year or year before where Cavan Gaels were joining with a club beside them for minor championship!!!  A big town like that merging a minor level.  Not sure who went on to the St. Paul's minor tournament in Belfast though.

On that, in the years ahead, there will be issues regarding depopulation and fielding teams especially in rural areas.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Targetman on October 21, 2019, 01:29:17 PM
Having asked the initial question regarding Killerkere I still donít think its a level playing field when it comes to the Intermediate and Junior, Bright will l play in Div 4 next year and Killenkere in Div 1
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: five points on October 21, 2019, 01:41:39 PM
]True, there should be no divisional sides or amalgamations moving on into the provincial set up - not fair on other teams.

I remember reading somewhere, last year or year before where Cavan Gaels were joining with a club beside them for minor championship!!!  A big town like that merging a minor level.  Not sure who went on to the St. Paul's minor tournament in Belfast though.

No divisional sides or amalgamations are allowed into provincial clubs championships.

St Pauls' is a tournament though, not an official competition. They can set their own rules if they wish.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: tintin25 on October 21, 2019, 01:47:20 PM
Having asked the initial question regarding Killerkere I still donít think its a level playing field when it comes to the Intermediate and Junior, Bright will l play in Div 4 next year and Killenkere in Div 1

It probably does seem like that, but they were in Division 3 last year and hadn't won the Junior Championship.  Why should promotion automatically mean that you have to go a grade higher in the championship?  Would there have been this argument had Killenkere finished bottom of Division 2?  Think the problem with Down is that they have too many divisions.  Lisburn played in Division 2 this year and won the Antrim Junior championship by a couple of points, they wouldn't have got past the first round in Intermediate.  Also, a 5 points victory is hardly justification that it's unbalanced.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Fionntamhnach on October 21, 2019, 04:00:06 PM
This issue gets brought up every year. It's a mostly Ulster thing about linking championship status with final league positions - IIRC the only non-Ulster County I'm aware of that does the same is Dublin.

Fermanagh no longer ties its club championship gradings to league finishes either, though the small amount of clubs in the county means that with just two league divisions, Intermediate clubs still played in Division 1 and Senior clubs played in Division 2 long before the new format was introduced. This year, Derrygonnelly won Senior having finished third in D1 (though went on to win the league final vs. Ederney), Intermediate winners Kinawley finished 7th out of 10 in D1 and avoided relegation, while Junior winners Maguiresbridge finished 7th out of 10 in D2. Altogether D1 had 6 senior and 4 intermediate teams, while D2 had 2 senior, 4 intermediate & 4 junior sides.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: marty34 on October 21, 2019, 04:26:35 PM
]True, there should be no divisional sides or amalgamations moving on into the provincial set up - not fair on other teams.

I remember reading somewhere, last year or year before where Cavan Gaels were joining with a club beside them for minor championship!!!  A big town like that merging a minor level.  Not sure who went on to the St. Paul's minor tournament in Belfast though.

No divisional sides or amalgamations are allowed into provincial clubs championships.

St Pauls' is a tournament though, not an official competition. They can set their own rules if they wish.

Thanks for that FPs.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: twohands!!! on October 21, 2019, 06:38:39 PM
As far as I am aware all counties have the right to decide how many teams they want in their respective championships and how these championships operate. It makes for serious inequalities across the board. Some counties have absolutely no correlation between their leagues and championships either.
My own county Down have a very honest system whereby league standings determine your gradings. It means clubs that are of proper intermediate and junior standard are playing in their proper championship.

What I can't understand is why more footballing counties don't adopt Kerry's system.
I think their divisional structure and club competitions is a huge part of why Kerry are so strong at intercounty.
Everything I've ever heard about the Kerry club structures, lead me to believe that there's a serious volume of competitive games at all levels year-in year-out.
They cast their net wide and in terms of being selected for intercounty it doesn't seem to matter if you come from one of the big clubs or one of the minnows.
I can understand why hurling/dual counties might have difficulties with it from a fixtures point of view, but a whole raft of footballing counties should have copied them years ago.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: rodney trotter on October 21, 2019, 07:24:05 PM
It's not that odd at all.  And they would get relegated to Junior by being Relegated from Intermediate Championship.
Killenkere reached Intermediate final in 2016 but struggled in 2017 Championship and relegated to Junior

Look at the Inter County scene. There is 4 divisions In league, and  in championip a Division 4 team could play a Division 1 team in a Provincial championship game

Yet people cry about disregarding the weaker counties

But that's why now Rodney, there's a clamour for a tiered system...or at least 2 tiers.

Of course... They complain that a tierd system is disregarding counties.  A hammering in a Provincial and qualifier game isn't any benefit.
Leitrim and Wicklow proposed the idea. Some of the others objected. Thery could have a chance of playing the final at Croke Park. That wasn't going to happen through the qualifiers

As regards the club scene. Trillick in Tyrone I read were beaten in a Intermeduate final a few years ago but wee promoted in Division 2 and played Senior football the following year. That's just devaluing the Intermediate Championship
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: marty34 on October 21, 2019, 07:34:14 PM
It's not that odd at all.  And they would get relegated to Junior by being Relegated from Intermediate Championship.
Killenkere reached Intermediate final in 2016 but struggled in 2017 Championship and relegated to Junior

Look at the Inter County scene. There is 4 divisions In league, and  in championip a Division 4 team could play a Division 1 team in a Provincial championship game

Yet people cry about disregarding the weaker counties

But that's why now Rodney, there's a clamour for a tiered system...or at least 2 tiers.

Of course... They complain that a tierd system is disregarding counties.  A hammering in a Provincial and qualifier game isn't any benefit.
Leitrim and Wicklow proposed the idea. Some of the others objected. Thery could have a chance of playing the final at Croke Park. That wasn't going to happen through the qualifiers

As regards the club scene. Trillick in Tyrone I read were beaten in a Intermeduate final a few years ago but wee promoted in Division 2 and played Senior football the following year. That's just devaluing the Intermediate Championship

I just think that leagues and championships be tied and that you play the same teams in both.

Was checking Cavan league earlier - KK won Div. 2 league but they've won Junior championship.

Is that correct Rodney?
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: barelegs on October 21, 2019, 07:44:13 PM
It's not that odd at all.  And they would get relegated to Junior by being Relegated from Intermediate Championship.
Killenkere reached Intermediate final in 2016 but struggled in 2017 Championship and relegated to Junior

Look at the Inter County scene. There is 4 divisions In league, and  in championip a Division 4 team could play a Division 1 team in a Provincial championship game

Yet people cry about disregarding the weaker counties

But that's why now Rodney, there's a clamour for a tiered system...or at least 2 tiers.

Of course... They complain that a tierd system is disregarding counties.  A hammering in a Provincial and qualifier game isn't any benefit.
Leitrim and Wicklow proposed the idea. Some of the others objected. Thery could have a chance of playing the final at Croke Park. That wasn't going to happen through the qualifiers

As regards the club scene. Trillick in Tyrone I read were beaten in a Intermeduate final a few years ago but wee promoted in Division 2 and played Senior football the following year. That's just devaluing the Intermediate Championship

Trillick won the Senior Championship the next year. They only went up through the league play-offs too having come second in the league. So it definitely didn't devalue the Intermediate Championship. If anything it proves the point that teams in the top division should be playing in the Senior Championship.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Minus15 on October 21, 2019, 10:59:07 PM
Teams such as Kilinkere can just effectively throw a championship to get downgraded to maximise chances of success in Junior. Not saying it can't happen in counties such as Down but due to league placings and championship being connected it is counterproductive to do so. Div 4 in Down is not really the place for any team with serious ambition for any sort of success.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: John Martin on October 22, 2019, 03:49:21 AM
Teams in division 2 in down can purposely lose a few meaningless end of season league games to be eligible to play intermediate championship the following year. I've also heard of 1 team in tyrone who discussed purposely losing a relegation playoff to intermediate in order to have a go for a ulster title.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: clarshack on October 22, 2019, 09:29:54 AM
Are the Rock not taking the piss going up and down every couple of years? they seem hell bent on winning this holy grail of a Junior All-Ireland.
Probably should bring in some sort of timeframe based rule to stop this carry on for the provincial championships.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Pearse Blue on October 22, 2019, 09:41:14 AM
Are the Rock not taking the piss going up and down every couple of years? they seem hell bent on winning this holy grail of a Junior All-Ireland.
Probably should bring in some sort of timeframe based rule to stop this carry on for the provincial championships.
Don't know if they are intentionally going up and down, I think the last time they went up it was just after the All Ireland campaign and its hard to keep at a top level for two years. In the hurling there is a five year rule, IE win an ulster intermediate you have to play senior the next 5 years   
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: marty34 on October 22, 2019, 10:31:12 AM
Are the Rock not taking the piss going up and down every couple of years? they seem hell bent on winning this holy grail of a Junior All-Ireland.
Probably should bring in some sort of timeframe based rule to stop this carry on for the provincial championships.
Don't know if they are intentionally going up and down, I think the last time they went up it was just after the All Ireland campaign and its hard to keep at a top level for two years. In the hurling there is a five year rule, IE win an ulster intermediate you have to play senior the next 5 years

Is that rule in hurling not changed now to two years - the 5 year rule was far too long for clubs.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: nrico2006 on October 22, 2019, 10:37:20 AM
Are the Rock not taking the piss going up and down every couple of years? they seem hell bent on winning this holy grail of a Junior All-Ireland.
Probably should bring in some sort of timeframe based rule to stop this carry on for the provincial championships.
Don't know if they are intentionally going up and down, I think the last time they went up it was just after the All Ireland campaign and its hard to keep at a top level for two years. In the hurling there is a five year rule, IE win an ulster intermediate you have to play senior the next 5 years

Think it might be three years, two years would be better though.

Is that rule in hurling not changed now to two years - the 5 year rule was far too long for clubs.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: square_ball on October 22, 2019, 10:37:46 AM
Are the Rock not taking the piss going up and down every couple of years? they seem hell bent on winning this holy grail of a Junior All-Ireland.
Probably should bring in some sort of timeframe based rule to stop this carry on for the provincial championships.

I know Iíve called this BS out before. Come on Clarshack you donít really believe that do you? They are not intentionally going down just to win a junior all ireland championship. Theyíve been beat in a few relegation play offs over the years. How come if they were looking relegated why donít they just lose every game? They have lost various players over the years and have a relatively small pick as it is.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: The Bearded One on October 22, 2019, 10:42:15 AM
Hurling clubs who win Ulster at Junior and Intermediate level are not allowed to enter the provincial championship at that same level for either 3 or 5 years, someone can confirm that?
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: marty34 on October 22, 2019, 10:44:02 AM
Are the Rock not taking the piss going up and down every couple of years? they seem hell bent on winning this holy grail of a Junior All-Ireland.
Probably should bring in some sort of timeframe based rule to stop this carry on for the provincial championships.

I know Iíve called this BS out before. Come on Clarshack you donít really believe that do you? They are not intentionally going down just to win a junior all ireland championship. Theyíve been beat in a few relegation play offs over the years. How come if they were looking relegated why donít they just lose every game? They have lost various players over the years and have a relatively small pick as it is.

Would Cookstown be like this also? - in the intermediate a few years ago, then up and down to the first division, then down to Div. 2 again etc. 

They should have no problem with numbers.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Pearse Blue on October 22, 2019, 10:45:38 AM
Hurling clubs who win Ulster at Junior and Intermediate level are not allowed to enter the provincial championship at that same level for either 3 or 5 years, someone can confirm that?
I thought it was five, possibly three but there definitely is some sort of rule. Middletown won Armagh this year and had to enter the senior championship as they have won it previously and Keady have been put into the intermediate
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: square_ball on October 22, 2019, 11:02:07 AM
Are the Rock not taking the piss going up and down every couple of years? they seem hell bent on winning this holy grail of a Junior All-Ireland.
Probably should bring in some sort of timeframe based rule to stop this carry on for the provincial championships.

I know Iíve called this BS out before. Come on Clarshack you donít really believe that do you? They are not intentionally going down just to win a junior all ireland championship. Theyíve been beat in a few relegation play offs over the years. How come if they were looking relegated why donít they just lose every game? They have lost various players over the years and have a relatively small pick as it is.

Would Cookstown be like this also? - in the intermediate a few years ago, then up and down to the first division, then down to Div. 2 again etc. 

They should have no problem with numbers.

Again i would sat with 100% certainty that Cookstown didnt decide to get relegated one year so they could go back and win the intermediate all ireland the following year. Relegation happens. You can get a bad run of results that means you are chasing your tale and you end up going down.

Those Cookstown intermediate teams were backboned by excellent underage teams who were winning grade one titles at u16 and minor as well as a few very good older players. Their youth teams now have been pretty poor this past 10 years and have been playing at grade 2 and 3 level. Of course they have the numbers but they just donít have the quality of player coming through as demonstrated by being close to relegation this year.  Iím sure thereís another debate there to see why that is. Unless people are suggesting they have decided at the start of the year that they want to give the junior all Ireland a rattle next year. Thatís certainly what posters are saying the Rock do.

Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Hedgehunter on November 04, 2019, 12:18:59 PM
Whatís everyoneís opinions now after the weekends results?
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: yellowcard on November 04, 2019, 12:52:03 PM
Kilcoo should make the final now and I'd expect them to face Glenties. They will never get a better chance to win it since they are the most experienced team left in the competition but they have failed to get over the line in the past. Them and Glenties are 2 dogged sides who suit winter football so I would make them joint favourites at this stage.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Fear Bun Na Sceilpe on November 04, 2019, 02:38:51 PM
Hurling clubs who win Ulster at Junior and Intermediate level are not allowed to enter the provincial championship at that same level for either 3 or 5 years, someone can confirm that?
I thought it was five, possibly three but there definitely is some sort of rule. Middletown won Armagh this year and had to enter the senior championship as they have won it previously and Keady have been put into the intermediate

It was 5 years until this year. Reduced to 3 now
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: DownFanatic on November 05, 2019, 10:18:52 AM
Ulster JFC

Preliminary Round - 13/10/19
St Patrick's, Lisburn (Antrim) 1-06 v Collegeland (Armagh) 0-13

Quarter Finals - 19/10/19 and 20/10/19

Buncrana (Donegal) 1-14 v Collegeland (Armagh) 0-09
Glack (Derry) 0-06 v Rock (Tyrone) 2-15
Blackhill (Monaghan) 1-16 v Maguiresbridge (Fermanagh) 0-09
Killinkere (Cavan) 1-15 v Bright (Down) 1-10

Semi Finals

Buncrana v Rock
Blackhill v Killinkere

Final

Buncrana v Blackhill


Ulster IFC

Preliminary Round - 19/10/19

Grange (Armagh) 1-05 v Galbally (Tyrone) 0-16

Quarter Finals - 2/11/19 and 3/11/19

Kinawley (Fermanagh) v Glenn (Down)
Magheracloone (Monaghan) v Foreglen (Derry)
Aldergrove (Antrim) v St Naul's (Donegal)
Laragh United (Cavan) v Galbally (Tyrone)

Semi Finals

Glenn v Magheracloone
St Naul's v Galbally
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: DownFanatic on November 05, 2019, 10:34:16 AM
Glenn's victory over Kinawley in the IFC shouldn't be underestimated. All season they haven't had Denis Murtagh, Shea Millar or Ronan Millar. All three away on their travels. All three are county seniors. They also didn't have Niall McParland for this game, former county senior captain, who is now based in Qatar. Another former county senior, Mattie Bagnall, didn't start the game.
Be interesting to see how they go against Magheracloone but Glenn have done amazingly well to get this far considering the personnel they are missing.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Minus15 on November 05, 2019, 11:29:25 PM
Not sure if Matty ever got called up to county seniors. Denis was in and around squad shortly after his U21 days under wee James I think but wouldn't have got game time in league or championship. The other three were all Senior players who figured for Down last season. Throw Liam Bagnall into the mix there too and that is a lot of talent to be doing without.

Coping without Matty, who has been their top scorer for 11 years for three quarters of Sunday's game, just shows the resilience of that team. Full of admiration  for the work of Tony Bagnall and his management team. A first ever win in Ulster is a great achievement.
Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: general on November 07, 2019, 09:04:42 PM
Not sure if Matty ever got called up to county seniors. Denis was in and around squad shortly after his U21 days under wee James I think but wouldn't have got game time in league or championship. The other three were all Senior players who figured for Down last season. Throw Liam Bagnall into the mix there too and that is a lot of talent to be doing without.

Coping without Matty, who has been their top scorer for 11 years for three quarters of Sunday's game, just shows the resilience of that team. Full of admiration  for the work of Tony Bagnall and his management team. A first ever win in Ulster is a great achievement.

I'll second that minus 15. Remember the last time me and you ventured into ulster championship football 😂 we can meet in Armagh next Sunday and reminisce about it

Title: Re: Ulster Club JFC/IFC 2019
Post by: Minus15 on November 08, 2019, 08:30:17 PM
Not sure if Matty ever got called up to county seniors. Denis was in and around squad shortly after his U21 days under wee James I think but wouldn't have got game time in league or championship. The other three were all Senior players who figured for Down last season. Throw Liam Bagnall into the mix there too and that is a lot of talent to be doing without.

Coping without Matty, who has been their top scorer for 11 years for three quarters of Sunday's game, just shows the resilience of that team. Full of admiration  for the work of Tony Bagnall and his management team. A first ever win in Ulster is a great achievement.

I'll second that minus 15. Remember the last time me and you ventured into ulster championship football 😂 we can meet in Armagh next Sunday and reminisce about it

I have been back since with similar results