gaaboard.com

GAA Discussion => GAA Discussion => Topic started by: Il Bomber Destro on January 06, 2018, 12:02:28 PM

Title: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 06, 2018, 12:02:28 PM
Not sure if there is a thread on this.

http://www.hoganstand.com/Article/Index/279567

I think this is disgraceful if I'm honest.

It's an amateur game and no player is being forced to play, they do it because they want to. Elite players do very well out of the game as it is, the likes of Joe Canning, Aidan O'Shea, Bernard Brogan, Lee Keegan, Ciaran Kilkenny etc all profit handsomely from it through sponsored cars, free equipment, money for endorsments, no-show jobs.

Playing intercounty football and the commitment involved should simply be about a will and a want to play the game, not about how much you can make out of it. I don't feel sorry for intercounty footballers and hurlers, it should be an honour to pull on their county's jersey and if they feel it effects their personal life then by all means step away and put your work/family and life balance first.

That FG yokel down in Kerry crying about people losing money due to their personal pursuits. Join the f**king club, every man and woman have choices to make in life, an interest and hobby that can affect work and earnings is not unique to intercounty GAA footballers so why should they get preferential treatment. What about the volunteers who give up their own personal time every week coaching underage and ladies teams (not just in GAA but other local community sporting clubs) - where are their tax breaks?

Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 06, 2018, 01:45:10 PM
You know economically GAA players are probably one of the most valuable sections of people in Ireland.

Programme sellers, match officials, Ground staff, Police, vintners, medical personnel/physiotherapists, journalists and their employers whether print radio or online, Bus/train Drivers, hotels, car park operators, shop owners, burger van operators and on and on...they all get their pockets filled by the intercounty game

So tax wise the government absolutely makes out like bandits from the GAA.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Captain Scarlet on January 06, 2018, 02:04:58 PM
I have no issue with a certain tax band of say 15-20% for all inter-county lads. The player's grant would have to be taken off the table if it came in mind. That would be key. Then that money from the Govt could be used in other aspects of the GAA. It would sit better with me tbh than lads getting money for being a county player.
That is worse in my mind. Lads are getting money in their account for being a county player. The tax break way means they are keeping more of what they earn.

If you look at the amount of money the big matches bring to Dublin over the summer. If you look at the fact most villages have a defacto community centre in the form of a GAA clubhouse then why not?

NB
I would want the player's grant gone if that came in.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Rossfan on January 06, 2018, 02:09:04 PM
What about the poor oul 6 Cos lads?
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Captain Scarlet on January 06, 2018, 02:24:09 PM
I actually forgot about Arlene and trying to get something done with them...
Artist style tax exemptions the way to go. Any Ulster tax experts here?
Actually, how does the grant work when Sport Ireland is based in ROI?

Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 06, 2018, 03:09:54 PM
I have no issue with a certain tax band of say 15-20% for all inter-county lads. The player's grant would have to be taken off the table if it came in mind. That would be key. Then that money from the Govt could be used in other aspects of the GAA. It would sit better with me tbh than lads getting money for being a county player.
That is worse in my mind. Lads are getting money in their account for being a county player. The tax break way means they are keeping more of what they earn.

If you look at the amount of money the big matches bring to Dublin over the summer. If you look at the fact most villages have a defacto community centre in the form of a GAA clubhouse then why not?

NB
I would want the player's grant gone if that came in.

Playing for your county should not be about the money you can make from it and that is what it say.

Intercounty players have to make a lot of sacrifices but not really any more than any amateur sportsman. That they get preferential treatment does not sit well with me at all. I think it would be more apt for them to be taxed on their earnings, those lads with the sponsored cars should be paying tax on them, if you had it in a job it'd be taxed as a BIK. This myth that intercounty players, particularly with the big counties, are not well looked after is a bunch of nonsense.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 06, 2018, 03:26:40 PM
I have no issue with a certain tax band of say 15-20% for all inter-county lads. The player's grant would have to be taken off the table if it came in mind. That would be key. Then that money from the Govt could be used in other aspects of the GAA. It would sit better with me tbh than lads getting money for being a county player.
That is worse in my mind. Lads are getting money in their account for being a county player. The tax break way means they are keeping more of what they earn.

If you look at the amount of money the big matches bring to Dublin over the summer. If you look at the fact most villages have a defacto community centre in the form of a GAA clubhouse then why not?

NB
I would want the player's grant gone if that came in.

Playing for your county should not be about the money you can make from it and that is what it say.

Intercounty players have to make a lot of sacrifices but not really any more than any amateur sportsman. That they get preferential treatment does not sit well with me at all. I think it would be more apt for them to be taxed on their earnings, those lads with the sponsored cars should be paying tax on them, if you had it in a job it'd be taxed as a BIK. This myth that intercounty players, particularly with the big counties, are not well looked after is a bunch of nonsense.

It isnít, itís just a recognition of the value they have to the economy.

If GAA county games stopped it wouldnít just be a GAA issue it would be a national government issue as it would damage businesses and hence harm the economy.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 06, 2018, 04:12:01 PM
I have no issue with a certain tax band of say 15-20% for all inter-county lads. The player's grant would have to be taken off the table if it came in mind. That would be key. Then that money from the Govt could be used in other aspects of the GAA. It would sit better with me tbh than lads getting money for being a county player.
That is worse in my mind. Lads are getting money in their account for being a county player. The tax break way means they are keeping more of what they earn.

If you look at the amount of money the big matches bring to Dublin over the summer. If you look at the fact most villages have a defacto community centre in the form of a GAA clubhouse then why not?

NB
I would want the player's grant gone if that came in.

Playing for your county should not be about the money you can make from it and that is what it say.

Intercounty players have to make a lot of sacrifices but not really any more than any amateur sportsman. That they get preferential treatment does not sit well with me at all. I think it would be more apt for them to be taxed on their earnings, those lads with the sponsored cars should be paying tax on them, if you had it in a job it'd be taxed as a BIK. This myth that intercounty players, particularly with the big counties, are not well looked after is a bunch of nonsense.

It isnít, itís just a recognition of the value they have to the economy.

If GAA county games stopped it wouldnít just be a GAA issue it would be a national government issue as it would damage businesses and hence harm the economy.

Good man, you managed to contradict yourself there in a few words.

If it's not about earning money, it shouldn't be about earning money and that's exactly what tax breaks for players is about.  When the free state has such huge social issues in health and housing then it really does baffle the minfd that they are calling for lads in their early-mid 20s with free cars, university scolarships, no-show jobs, loads of untaxed earnings and freebies to get even more tax breaks.

What about the value club players bring to the economy or volunteers who ensure that games go ahead, what about the value the people who give up their own time free of charge to make sure underage teams and competitions can run their course, what about their value to the economy? The GAA would not exist without these people, neither would grassroots in other sports like football etc.

Why don't they evict working class families out of their homes and give them free houses while they're at it?
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 06, 2018, 04:38:29 PM
I have no issue with a certain tax band of say 15-20% for all inter-county lads. The player's grant would have to be taken off the table if it came in mind. That would be key. Then that money from the Govt could be used in other aspects of the GAA. It would sit better with me tbh than lads getting money for being a county player.
That is worse in my mind. Lads are getting money in their account for being a county player. The tax break way means they are keeping more of what they earn.

If you look at the amount of money the big matches bring to Dublin over the summer. If you look at the fact most villages have a defacto community centre in the form of a GAA clubhouse then why not?

NB
I would want the player's grant gone if that came in.

Playing for your county should not be about the money you can make from it and that is what it say.

Intercounty players have to make a lot of sacrifices but not really any more than any amateur sportsman. That they get preferential treatment does not sit well with me at all. I think it would be more apt for them to be taxed on their earnings, those lads with the sponsored cars should be paying tax on them, if you had it in a job it'd be taxed as a BIK. This myth that intercounty players, particularly with the big counties, are not well looked after is a bunch of nonsense.

It isnít, itís just a recognition of the value they have to the economy.

If GAA county games stopped it wouldnít just be a GAA issue it would be a national government issue as it would damage businesses and hence harm the economy.

Good man, you managed to contradict yourself there in a few words.

If it's not about earning money, it shouldn't be about earning money and that's exactly what tax breaks for players is about.  When the free state has such huge social issues in health and housing then it really does baffle the minfd that they are calling for lads in their early-mid 20s with free cars, university scolarships, no-show jobs, loads of untaxed earnings and freebies to get even more tax breaks.

What about the value club players bring to the economy or volunteers who ensure that games go ahead, what about the value the people who give up their own time free of charge to make sure underage teams and competitions can run their course, what about their value to the economy? The GAA would not exist without these people, neither would grassroots in other sports like football etc.

Why don't they evict working class families out of their homes and give them free houses while they're at it?

The way the economy works is people have jobs maybe in hotels or shops or petrol stations or driving a bus or taxi and those people get paid money for the work they do. They spend that money on many things including accommodation so they arenít homeless or medical care/insurance for when they are sick so they donít die .

Inter county players are a big part of the economy by the numbers they attract to games or indirectly say by getting people buying newspapers for example. Hence the intercounty players are high value not only to the GAA but to the government.

Therefore tax breaks for intercounty players is in the governments interest.

That is the counter to your argument in your initial post. You can talk about grassroots volunteers and their value to the economy  and I could disagree or agree or have no opinion but  if you want to know why the government are willing to grant tax exemptions to intercounty players I have explained that to you and it is up to you whether you want to accept that or continue arguing.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Captain Scarlet on January 06, 2018, 06:10:36 PM
As it stands all those social issues are not going away and yet the GPA distributed Ä1.7m last year, and will distribute Ä2.3m in 2018 and Ä3m to inter-county players. That is money from the Govt and tax-payers GIVEN to lads who are playing inter-county.

That difference is already there between club and county and some of those millions could go towards other parts of the GAA and trickle down to the clubs with all their volunteers.
The tax system no longer just GIVES money to players, but just takes less from their pay.

Or we could just get rid of the player's grant and leave them their mileage like pre-GPA times.

NB NB NB NB NB

With the Tax option, I would expect the player's grant to be abolished and any benefits to be known to Revenue.


Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Syferus on January 06, 2018, 06:54:06 PM
What a daft thread.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 06, 2018, 08:29:50 PM
I have no issue with a certain tax band of say 15-20% for all inter-county lads. The player's grant would have to be taken off the table if it came in mind. That would be key. Then that money from the Govt could be used in other aspects of the GAA. It would sit better with me tbh than lads getting money for being a county player.
That is worse in my mind. Lads are getting money in their account for being a county player. The tax break way means they are keeping more of what they earn.

If you look at the amount of money the big matches bring to Dublin over the summer. If you look at the fact most villages have a defacto community centre in the form of a GAA clubhouse then why not?

NB
I would want the player's grant gone if that came in.

Playing for your county should not be about the money you can make from it and that is what it say.

Intercounty players have to make a lot of sacrifices but not really any more than any amateur sportsman. That they get preferential treatment does not sit well with me at all. I think it would be more apt for them to be taxed on their earnings, those lads with the sponsored cars should be paying tax on them, if you had it in a job it'd be taxed as a BIK. This myth that intercounty players, particularly with the big counties, are not well looked after is a bunch of nonsense.

It isnít, itís just a recognition of the value they have to the economy.

If GAA county games stopped it wouldnít just be a GAA issue it would be a national government issue as it would damage businesses and hence harm the economy.

Good man, you managed to contradict yourself there in a few words.

If it's not about earning money, it shouldn't be about earning money and that's exactly what tax breaks for players is about.  When the free state has such huge social issues in health and housing then it really does baffle the minfd that they are calling for lads in their early-mid 20s with free cars, university scolarships, no-show jobs, loads of untaxed earnings and freebies to get even more tax breaks.

What about the value club players bring to the economy or volunteers who ensure that games go ahead, what about the value the people who give up their own time free of charge to make sure underage teams and competitions can run their course, what about their value to the economy? The GAA would not exist without these people, neither would grassroots in other sports like football etc.

Why don't they evict working class families out of their homes and give them free houses while they're at it?

The way the economy works is people have jobs maybe in hotels or shops or petrol stations or driving a bus or taxi and those people get paid money for the work they do. They spend that money on many things including accommodation so they arenít homeless or medical care/insurance for when they are sick so they donít die .

Inter county players are a big part of the economy by the numbers they attract to games or indirectly say by getting people buying newspapers for example. Hence the intercounty players are high value not only to the GAA but to the government.

Therefore tax breaks for intercounty players is in the governments interest.

That is the counter to your argument in your initial post. You can talk about grassroots volunteers and their value to the economy  and I could disagree or agree or have no opinion but  if you want to know why the government are willing to grant tax exemptions to intercounty players I have explained that to you and it is up to you whether you want to accept that or continue arguing.

Tax breaks for intercounty players is solely in the interest of intercounty players. People who already milk enough tax free cash and benefits. It matters not a jot the the value of the players, this has been created in your head. It doesn't matter if Mick The Savage from Ballymacshit plays for his county or Joe Canning, people will turn up and pay. There is no justification for intercounty players to get further compensated for their hobby and life choices.

Intercounty players are not a big part of the economy, they should not be compensated by the state for pursuing a hobby - that is the be all and end all. If they find the commitment too much, fair enough, walk away, there will be plenty of others who will take their place.

Fair enough if the GAA want to pay them out of their own pocket but under no circumstances should the state be giving further tax breaks to one group of people who want to pursue a hobby and gain a lot of untaxed money and untaxed benefits as it is.

It's the other way it should be going.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 06, 2018, 08:49:38 PM
I have no issue with a certain tax band of say 15-20% for all inter-county lads. The player's grant would have to be taken off the table if it came in mind. That would be key. Then that money from the Govt could be used in other aspects of the GAA. It would sit better with me tbh than lads getting money for being a county player.
That is worse in my mind. Lads are getting money in their account for being a county player. The tax break way means they are keeping more of what they earn.

If you look at the amount of money the big matches bring to Dublin over the summer. If you look at the fact most villages have a defacto community centre in the form of a GAA clubhouse then why not?

NB
I would want the player's grant gone if that came in.

Playing for your county should not be about the money you can make from it and that is what it say.

Intercounty players have to make a lot of sacrifices but not really any more than any amateur sportsman. That they get preferential treatment does not sit well with me at all. I think it would be more apt for them to be taxed on their earnings, those lads with the sponsored cars should be paying tax on them, if you had it in a job it'd be taxed as a BIK. This myth that intercounty players, particularly with the big counties, are not well looked after is a bunch of nonsense.

It isnít, itís just a recognition of the value they have to the economy.

If GAA county games stopped it wouldnít just be a GAA issue it would be a national government issue as it would damage businesses and hence harm the economy.

Good man, you managed to contradict yourself there in a few words.

If it's not about earning money, it shouldn't be about earning money and that's exactly what tax breaks for players is about.  When the free state has such huge social issues in health and housing then it really does baffle the minfd that they are calling for lads in their early-mid 20s with free cars, university scolarships, no-show jobs, loads of untaxed earnings and freebies to get even more tax breaks.

What about the value club players bring to the economy or volunteers who ensure that games go ahead, what about the value the people who give up their own time free of charge to make sure underage teams and competitions can run their course, what about their value to the economy? The GAA would not exist without these people, neither would grassroots in other sports like football etc.

Why don't they evict working class families out of their homes and give them free houses while they're at it?

The way the economy works is people have jobs maybe in hotels or shops or petrol stations or driving a bus or taxi and those people get paid money for the work they do. They spend that money on many things including accommodation so they arenít homeless or medical care/insurance for when they are sick so they donít die .

Inter county players are a big part of the economy by the numbers they attract to games or indirectly say by getting people buying newspapers for example. Hence the intercounty players are high value not only to the GAA but to the government.


a) And people pay tax, but now some blueshirt yokel from Kerry thinks guys who already get plenty of untaxed benefits and cash in hand should not get further tax breaks because they choose to pursue a hobby that has plenty of financial and lifestyle benefits.

b) The GAA is an amateur organisation, without all the volunteers who work with clubs etc, who give up their own time, free of charge or for frivilous compensation, these games and competitions would not go ahead. So those people are every bit as important to the economy as the players that are put on a pedestal.

Further to intercounty players being invaluable to the Government. What exactly do they give back? The GAA don't pay any tax, the state issues massive grants to the GAA, clubs and county boards every year. Do the GAA even help out with policing costs for big games? Like it or not the GAA is more of a drain on the state than it is a money generator.

The GAA is a very rich organisation, I think it reflects very poorly on it when it's still trying to milk as much out of the state when it should be taking the burden on itself, particularly with some of the social issues around right now but that's politics I suppose.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: From the Bunker on January 06, 2018, 08:59:18 PM
I think there should be tax breaks for Volunteers! Volunteers are the whole reason we have sports people! Volunteers are the whole reasons we have community halls. Volunteers are the whole reason we have local plays and dramas! Volunteers are the whole reason we have communities. They give of their free time for the good of the community.

This is a can of worms!

GAA are up their own holes with trying to have Butter on both sides!

Government should stick to more important issues like housing People!

Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 06, 2018, 09:51:38 PM
Be realistic, you canít offer a tax break for every volunteer, there are too many and the system would be abused.

If tax breaks were only of interest to the elite players they wouldnít get them. The reason they could is because it is in the interest of the government to have a strong GAA intercounty game because it generates millions to the bottom line of various different businesses around the country.

I explained it and gave examples, I canít draw you a picture, you donít want it explained, you just want to rant.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: From the Bunker on January 06, 2018, 10:19:24 PM
Be realistic, you canít offer a tax break for every volunteer, there are too many and the system would be abused.

If tax breaks were only of interest to the elite players they wouldnít get them. The reason they could is because it is in the interest of the government to have a strong GAA intercounty game because it generates millions to the bottom line of various different businesses around the country.

I explained it and gave examples, I canít draw you a picture, you donít want it explained, you just want to rant.

Of course I'm being realistic! And I know you can't offer every volunteer a tax break! It's a devil advocate moment. But you are asking athletic, Soccer, Rugby, Basketball, Cricket (etc) people to subsidise  the money laden organistation such as the GAA. Why? Why do we need to do this? Should Irish Soccer clubs be included in this? Why not? Oh yeah, they are not a money spinner for the Country! This is your premise!

Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 06, 2018, 10:22:02 PM
Be realistic, you canít offer a tax break for every volunteer, there are too many and the system would be abused.

If tax breaks were only of interest to the elite players they wouldnít get them. The reason they could is because it is in the interest of the government to have a strong GAA intercounty game because it generates millions to the bottom line of various different businesses around the country.

I explained it and gave examples, I canít draw you a picture, you donít want it explained, you just want to rant.

Of course I'm being realistic! And I know you can't offer every volunteer a tax break! It's a devil advocate moment. But you are asking athletic, Soccer, Rugby, Basketball, Cricket (etc) people to subsidise  the money laden organistation such as the GAA. Why? Why do we need to do this? Should Irish Soccer clubs be included in this? Why not? Oh yeah, they are not a money spinner for the Country! This is your premise!

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/tax-breaks-helped-to-keep-our-biggest-stars-at-home-29297107.html

Epic fail.   
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 06, 2018, 10:25:42 PM
Be realistic, you canít offer a tax break for every volunteer, there are too many and the system would be abused.

If tax breaks were only of interest to the elite players they wouldnít get them. The reason they could is because it is in the interest of the government to have a strong GAA intercounty game because it generates millions to the bottom line of various different businesses around the country.

I explained it and gave examples, I canít draw you a picture, you donít want it explained, you just want to rant.

What you "explained" is pie in the sky stuff.

There is zero need to offer tax breaks. It's elitism, these lads with their no-show jobs, sponsored cars, sponsorship deals and endorsements already make enough out of their status as intercounty fooballers. They don't need further tax breaks but it's in line with the way the game is going, professionals in all but name. I'd imagine guys like Bernard Brogan, O'Shea and Joe Canning make more in a year than any professional League of Ireland player and probably as much as some rugby internationals.

You keep rabbitting on about it generating millions, you completely overstate the revenue the GAA makes for the economy, it probably drains more out of the state than it generates. How many times does Croke Park fill up a year? 5/6 times tops. You might get Thurles full once a year and Clones full once a year and that's really about the height of it.

The GAA are the benefactors of this, not the state.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 06, 2018, 10:27:00 PM
Be realistic, you canít offer a tax break for every volunteer, there are too many and the system would be abused.

If tax breaks were only of interest to the elite players they wouldnít get them. The reason they could is because it is in the interest of the government to have a strong GAA intercounty game because it generates millions to the bottom line of various different businesses around the country.

I explained it and gave examples, I canít draw you a picture, you donít want it explained, you just want to rant.

What you "explained" is pie in the sky stuff.

There is zero need to offer tax breaks. It's elitism, these lads with their no-show jobs, sponsored cars, sponsorship deals and endorsements already make enough out of their status as intercounty fooballers. They don't need further tax breaks but it's in line with the way the game is going, professionals in all but name. I'd imagine guys like Bernard Brogan, O'Shea and Joe Canning make more in a year than any professional League of Ireland player and probably as much as some rugby internationals.

You keep rabbitting on about it generating millions, you completely overstate the revenue the GAA makes for the economy, it probably drains more out of the state than it generates. How many times does Croke Park fill up a year? 5/6 times tops. You might get Thurles full once a year and Clones full once a year and that's really about the height of it.

The GAA are the benefactors of this, not the state.

Ok, I tried.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 06, 2018, 10:31:07 PM
Be realistic, you canít offer a tax break for every volunteer, there are too many and the system would be abused.

If tax breaks were only of interest to the elite players they wouldnít get them. The reason they could is because it is in the interest of the government to have a strong GAA intercounty game because it generates millions to the bottom line of various different businesses around the country.

I explained it and gave examples, I canít draw you a picture, you donít want it explained, you just want to rant.

Of course I'm being realistic! And I know you can't offer every volunteer a tax break! It's a devil advocate moment. But you are asking athletic, Soccer, Rugby, Basketball, Cricket (etc) people to subsidise  the money laden organistation such as the GAA. Why? Why do we need to do this? Should Irish Soccer clubs be included in this? Why not? Oh yeah, they are not a money spinner for the Country! This is your premise!

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/tax-breaks-helped-to-keep-our-biggest-stars-at-home-29297107.html

Epic fail.

That is utterly wrong too.

People who pursue a sporting career, the very best of luck to them but it's a life choice, I don't think a safety net or retirement pot should be burdened on tax payers for these people to pursue hobbies as a career. If their own clubs or sporting organisations choose to do it with their own funds then it's perfectly acceptable but it should not come at a cost to the ordinary citizen.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 06, 2018, 10:32:43 PM
Be realistic, you canít offer a tax break for every volunteer, there are too many and the system would be abused.

If tax breaks were only of interest to the elite players they wouldnít get them. The reason they could is because it is in the interest of the government to have a strong GAA intercounty game because it generates millions to the bottom line of various different businesses around the country.

I explained it and gave examples, I canít draw you a picture, you donít want it explained, you just want to rant.

What you "explained" is pie in the sky stuff.

There is zero need to offer tax breaks. It's elitism, these lads with their no-show jobs, sponsored cars, sponsorship deals and endorsements already make enough out of their status as intercounty fooballers. They don't need further tax breaks but it's in line with the way the game is going, professionals in all but name. I'd imagine guys like Bernard Brogan, O'Shea and Joe Canning make more in a year than any professional League of Ireland player and probably as much as some rugby internationals.

You keep rabbitting on about it generating millions, you completely overstate the revenue the GAA makes for the economy, it probably drains more out of the state than it generates. How many times does Croke Park fill up a year? 5/6 times tops. You might get Thurles full once a year and Clones full once a year and that's really about the height of it.

The GAA are the benefactors of this, not the state.

Ok, I tried.

You tried and offered nothing substantive.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 06, 2018, 10:42:58 PM
Be realistic, you canít offer a tax break for every volunteer, there are too many and the system would be abused.

If tax breaks were only of interest to the elite players they wouldnít get them. The reason they could is because it is in the interest of the government to have a strong GAA intercounty game because it generates millions to the bottom line of various different businesses around the country.

I explained it and gave examples, I canít draw you a picture, you donít want it explained, you just want to rant.

Of course I'm being realistic! And I know you can't offer every volunteer a tax break! It's a devil advocate moment. But you are asking athletic, Soccer, Rugby, Basketball, Cricket (etc) people to subsidise  the money laden organistation such as the GAA. Why? Why do we need to do this? Should Irish Soccer clubs be included in this? Why not? Oh yeah, they are not a money spinner for the Country! This is your premise!

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/tax-breaks-helped-to-keep-our-biggest-stars-at-home-29297107.html

Epic fail.

That is utterly wrong too.

People who pursue a sporting career, the very best of luck to them but it's a life choice, I don't think a safety net or retirement pot should be burdened on tax payers for these people to pursue hobbies as a career. If their own clubs or sporting organisations choose to do it with their own funds then it's perfectly acceptable but it should not come at a cost to the ordinary citizen.

So if itís wrong why do you think the government offer tax breaks to pro sports men who stay in Ireland?

They are just sound like that?
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 06, 2018, 10:49:03 PM
Be realistic, you canít offer a tax break for every volunteer, there are too many and the system would be abused.

If tax breaks were only of interest to the elite players they wouldnít get them. The reason they could is because it is in the interest of the government to have a strong GAA intercounty game because it generates millions to the bottom line of various different businesses around the country.

I explained it and gave examples, I canít draw you a picture, you donít want it explained, you just want to rant.

Of course I'm being realistic! And I know you can't offer every volunteer a tax break! It's a devil advocate moment. But you are asking athletic, Soccer, Rugby, Basketball, Cricket (etc) people to subsidise  the money laden organistation such as the GAA. Why? Why do we need to do this? Should Irish Soccer clubs be included in this? Why not? Oh yeah, they are not a money spinner for the Country! This is your premise!

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/tax-breaks-helped-to-keep-our-biggest-stars-at-home-29297107.html

Epic fail.

That is utterly wrong too.

People who pursue a sporting career, the very best of luck to them but it's a life choice, I don't think a safety net or retirement pot should be burdened on tax payers for these people to pursue hobbies as a career. If their own clubs or sporting organisations choose to do it with their own funds then it's perfectly acceptable but it should not come at a cost to the ordinary citizen.

So if itís wrong why do you think the government offer tax breaks to pro sports men who stay in Ireland?

They are just sound like that?

Politics. The GAA carry an enormous amount of political clout in Ireland.

You seem to be suggesting that the government only make decisions in the national interest. How naive are you? Did you miss where the Free State government put the burden of the debts of bondholders on ordinary citizens? Why do you think the government did that?
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 06, 2018, 10:57:00 PM
Be realistic, you canít offer a tax break for every volunteer, there are too many and the system would be abused.

If tax breaks were only of interest to the elite players they wouldnít get them. The reason they could is because it is in the interest of the government to have a strong GAA intercounty game because it generates millions to the bottom line of various different businesses around the country.

I explained it and gave examples, I canít draw you a picture, you donít want it explained, you just want to rant.

Of course I'm being realistic! And I know you can't offer every volunteer a tax break! It's a devil advocate moment. But you are asking athletic, Soccer, Rugby, Basketball, Cricket (etc) people to subsidise  the money laden organistation such as the GAA. Why? Why do we need to do this? Should Irish Soccer clubs be included in this? Why not? Oh yeah, they are not a money spinner for the Country! This is your premise!

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/tax-breaks-helped-to-keep-our-biggest-stars-at-home-29297107.html

Epic fail.

That is utterly wrong too.

People who pursue a sporting career, the very best of luck to them but it's a life choice, I don't think a safety net or retirement pot should be burdened on tax payers for these people to pursue hobbies as a career. If their own clubs or sporting organisations choose to do it with their own funds then it's perfectly acceptable but it should not come at a cost to the ordinary citizen.

So if itís wrong why do you think the government offer tax breaks to pro sports men who stay in Ireland?

They are just sound like that?

Politics. The GAA carry an enormous amount of political clout in Ireland.


youíre going to have to explain that, I donít know what you mean.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 06, 2018, 10:59:30 PM
Do the IRFU also have a great amount of political clout in Ireland that their elite players were awarded a tax break?
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 06, 2018, 11:09:28 PM
I think we have spoken enough. Iíll cut to the chase.

Iím sure youíre an educated person but to be intelligent you have to be flexible enough to have your opinion changed when something is explained to you. You can think that tax breaks are wrong... thatís fair enough...but it is clear they have a value to the government because they donít just offer tax breaks randomly to rugby players, they do it because they think itís for the greater good. It shouldnít take you 4 or 5 times to have it explained.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 06, 2018, 11:09:44 PM
Be realistic, you canít offer a tax break for every volunteer, there are too many and the system would be abused.

If tax breaks were only of interest to the elite players they wouldnít get them. The reason they could is because it is in the interest of the government to have a strong GAA intercounty game because it generates millions to the bottom line of various different businesses around the country.

I explained it and gave examples, I canít draw you a picture, you donít want it explained, you just want to rant.

Of course I'm being realistic! And I know you can't offer every volunteer a tax break! It's a devil advocate moment. But you are asking athletic, Soccer, Rugby, Basketball, Cricket (etc) people to subsidise  the money laden organistation such as the GAA. Why? Why do we need to do this? Should Irish Soccer clubs be included in this? Why not? Oh yeah, they are not a money spinner for the Country! This is your premise!

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/tax-breaks-helped-to-keep-our-biggest-stars-at-home-29297107.html

Epic fail.

That is utterly wrong too.

People who pursue a sporting career, the very best of luck to them but it's a life choice, I don't think a safety net or retirement pot should be burdened on tax payers for these people to pursue hobbies as a career. If their own clubs or sporting organisations choose to do it with their own funds then it's perfectly acceptable but it should not come at a cost to the ordinary citizen.

So if itís wrong why do you think the government offer tax breaks to pro sports men who stay in Ireland?

They are just sound like that?

Politics. The GAA carry an enormous amount of political clout in Ireland.


youíre going to have to explain that, I donít know what you mean.

The GAA carry a massive amount of political influence in the country. The government generally doesn't make decisions with national interest in mind, they makes decisions that are self serving and are good for powerful organisations and people. We all know the influence the likes of the Catholic Church have had in the Free State since its inception, similarly its dealings and blind eye to big business men like Denis O'Brien.

The fundamental base of your arguments seems to be that the government wouldn't do this unless it made sense which is prepostrous given some of the recent government decisions - Apple Tax bill etc.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 06, 2018, 11:10:42 PM
Do the IRFU also have a great amount of political clout in Ireland that their elite players were awarded a tax break?

Most definitely. How much did the State pump into the failed Rugby World Cup bid which would have had a huge net burden for the state?
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 06, 2018, 11:17:40 PM
I think we have spoken enough. Iíll cut to the chase.

Iím sure youíre an educated person but to be intelligent you have to be flexible enough to have your opinion changed when something is explained to you. You can think that tax breaks are wrong... thatís fair enough...but it is clear they have a value to the government because they donít just offer tax breaks randomly to rugby players, they do it because they think itís for the greater good. It shouldnít take you 4 or 5 times to have it explained.

I really can't get over how naive you are. The free state has been run by gangsters since it's inception, how many tribunals have been set up now investigating all the corruption and dodgy dealings of ministers and you think they make decisions for the greater good?

Deary me.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Rossfan on January 07, 2018, 12:18:47 AM
A thread started by Bomber.
12 posts by Bomber in 2 pages
Last few are attacks on the "Free State Government "

Agenda or  what by one of the most narrow minded posters on GAABOARD.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 07, 2018, 10:00:49 AM
A thread started by Bomber.
12 posts by Bomber in 2 pages
Last few are attacks on the "Free State Government "

Agenda or  what by one of the most narrow minded posters on GAABOARD.

The last thing I would consider myself is narrow minded. I've articulated why I think this is wrong, I have substantiated those claims. One line of response has been that the Free State government would not make decisions that were not in the national interest, all I've merely done is point how risible that point of view is when there are countless examples alone in the past year that contradict that.

I think it's ironic for you to call anyone narrow minded when you can't take any sort of relevant criticism.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Rossfan on January 07, 2018, 10:54:52 AM
You don't consider yourself narrow minded!!!!????
Was it Robbie Burns who longed for the gift to see ourselves as others see us 😀
You don't think it's right that grants/tax breaks should be given to elite GAA players.
Fair enough.
But then you go on a rant about a Government which you despise of a State you despise and I take it don't live in but want to join.
Your continuous "Free State" jibes and "Kerry FG yokel" comments betrays your one dimensional narrow view of the world.
Maybe you and Mr McElduff could do a double act sometime 😆😆
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: stew on January 07, 2018, 11:03:10 AM
You don't consider yourself narrow minded!!!!????
Was it Robbie Burns who longed for the gift to see ourselves as others see us 😀
You don't think it's right that grants/tax breaks should be given to elite GAA players.
Fair enough.
But then you go on a rant about a Government which you despise of a State you despise and I take it don't live in but want to join.
Your continuous "Free State" jibes and "Kerry FG yokel" comments betrays your one dimensional narrow view of the world.
Maybe you and Mr McElduff could do a double act sometime 😆😆

Who exactly are you to tell people they are narrow minded again?

You are clueless, as am I about Bombers mindset, I think I will take his word over yours on this thread, thanks.

If you are not a screaming liberal you are a bigot, racist arsehole! Is that about the height of it hi?

Tube.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Rossfan on January 07, 2018, 11:14:51 AM
Jasus Stew poor Bomber is in the halfpenny place compared to to Yankee right wing nut job Stew😁.
Just wondering where I was bigoted or racist?
And anyone calling someone an "arsehole"  ......enuf said about that individual.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 07, 2018, 11:19:55 AM
You don't consider yourself narrow minded!!!!????
Was it Robbie Burns who longed for the gift to see ourselves as others see us 😀
You don't think it's right that grants/tax breaks should be given to elite GAA players.
Fair enough.
But then you go on a rant about a Government which you despise of a State you despise and I take it don't live in but want to join.
Your continuous "Free State" jibes and "Kerry FG yokel" comments betrays your one dimensional narrow view of the world.
Maybe you and Mr McElduff could do a double act sometime 😆😆

I don't, you're the one who can't accept any sort of valid and justifiable criticism. I have already pointed out that bringing the Free State Government's corruption and self serving nature only entered the debate when one poster defended the move by saying the Government would not make a decision unless it was in the interest of its people.

That's the bit you can't get your head around - valid and justifiable criticism.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Rossfan on January 07, 2018, 12:39:00 PM
Your very 1st post had "that FG yokel down in Kerry".
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 07, 2018, 12:43:54 PM
Your very 1st post had "that FG yokel down in Kerry".

Yes, that's the person who is advocating tax breaks for GAA players?

Did you even read the article?
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Rossfan on January 07, 2018, 12:46:38 PM
How about giving the man the respect of using his name and designation? Instead of the gratuitous insult.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 07, 2018, 12:51:34 PM
How about giving the man the respect of using his name and designation? Instead of the gratuitous insult.

Why does he deserve respect? He's paid a monster salary in a dysfunctional Government and his proposal is to give the likes of people, who already do extremely well financially out of a hobby they pursue, who already have plenty of untaxed financial benefits and cash, even more breaks.

This is in the face of the state his party presides over having major social crises in housing and health, where poverty levels are rising and where wealth inequality is growing and growing.

So, no, I don't think he deserves any respect.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Itchy on January 07, 2018, 02:50:32 PM
I have no issue with a certain tax band of say 15-20% for all inter-county lads. The player's grant would have to be taken off the table if it came in mind. That would be key. Then that money from the Govt could be used in other aspects of the GAA. It would sit better with me tbh than lads getting money for being a county player.
That is worse in my mind. Lads are getting money in their account for being a county player. The tax break way means they are keeping more of what they earn.

If you look at the amount of money the big matches bring to Dublin over the summer. If you look at the fact most villages have a defacto community centre in the form of a GAA clubhouse then why not?

NB
I would want the player's grant gone if that came in.

Playing for your county should not be about the money you can make from it and that is what it say.

Intercounty players have to make a lot of sacrifices but not really any more than any amateur sportsman. That they get preferential treatment does not sit well with me at all. I think it would be more apt for them to be taxed on their earnings, those lads with the sponsored cars should be paying tax on them, if you had it in a job it'd be taxed as a BIK. This myth that intercounty players, particularly with the big counties, are not well looked after is a bunch of nonsense.

It isnít, itís just a recognition of the value they have to the economy.

If GAA county games stopped it wouldnít just be a GAA issue it would be a national government issue as it would damage businesses and hence harm the economy.

Good man, you managed to contradict yourself there in a few words.

If it's not about earning money, it shouldn't be about earning money and that's exactly what tax breaks for players is about.  When the free state has such huge social issues in health and housing then it really does baffle the minfd that they are calling for lads in their early-mid 20s with free cars, university scolarships, no-show jobs, loads of untaxed earnings and freebies to get even more tax breaks.

What about the value club players bring to the economy or volunteers who ensure that games go ahead, what about the value the people who give up their own time free of charge to make sure underage teams and competitions can run their course, what about their value to the economy? The GAA would not exist without these people, neither would grassroots in other sports like football etc.

Why don't they evict working class families out of their homes and give them free houses while they're at it?

Tax breaks are about incentives to areas that can improve the economy. Typically done if their is a return on investment. I've personally no propen with this.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 07, 2018, 03:01:15 PM
I have no issue with a certain tax band of say 15-20% for all inter-county lads. The player's grant would have to be taken off the table if it came in mind. That would be key. Then that money from the Govt could be used in other aspects of the GAA. It would sit better with me tbh than lads getting money for being a county player.
That is worse in my mind. Lads are getting money in their account for being a county player. The tax break way means they are keeping more of what they earn.

If you look at the amount of money the big matches bring to Dublin over the summer. If you look at the fact most villages have a defacto community centre in the form of a GAA clubhouse then why not?

NB
I would want the player's grant gone if that came in.

Playing for your county should not be about the money you can make from it and that is what it say.

Intercounty players have to make a lot of sacrifices but not really any more than any amateur sportsman. That they get preferential treatment does not sit well with me at all. I think it would be more apt for them to be taxed on their earnings, those lads with the sponsored cars should be paying tax on them, if you had it in a job it'd be taxed as a BIK. This myth that intercounty players, particularly with the big counties, are not well looked after is a bunch of nonsense.

It isnít, itís just a recognition of the value they have to the economy.

If GAA county games stopped it wouldnít just be a GAA issue it would be a national government issue as it would damage businesses and hence harm the economy.

Good man, you managed to contradict yourself there in a few words.

If it's not about earning money, it shouldn't be about earning money and that's exactly what tax breaks for players is about.  When the free state has such huge social issues in health and housing then it really does baffle the minfd that they are calling for lads in their early-mid 20s with free cars, university scolarships, no-show jobs, loads of untaxed earnings and freebies to get even more tax breaks.

What about the value club players bring to the economy or volunteers who ensure that games go ahead, what about the value the people who give up their own time free of charge to make sure underage teams and competitions can run their course, what about their value to the economy? The GAA would not exist without these people, neither would grassroots in other sports like football etc.

Why don't they evict working class families out of their homes and give them free houses while they're at it?

Tax breaks are about incentives to areas that can improve the economy. Typically done if their is a return on investment. I've personally no propen with this.

How does giving intercounty players tax breaks boost the economy?
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Avondhu star on January 07, 2018, 09:50:38 PM
I have no issue with a certain tax band of say 15-20% for all inter-county lads. The player's grant would have to be taken off the table if it came in mind. That would be key. Then that money from the Govt could be used in other aspects of the GAA. It would sit better with me tbh than lads getting money for being a county player.
That is worse in my mind. Lads are getting money in their account for being a county player. The tax break way means they are keeping more of what they earn.

If you look at the amount of money the big matches bring to Dublin over the summer. If you look at the fact most villages have a defacto community centre in the form of a GAA clubhouse then why not?

NB
I would want the player's grant gone if that came in.

Playing for your county should not be about the money you can make from it and that is what it say.

Intercounty players have to make a lot of sacrifices but not really any more than any amateur sportsman. That they get preferential treatment does not sit well with me at all. I think it would be more apt for them to be taxed on their earnings, those lads with the sponsored cars should be paying tax on them, if you had it in a job it'd be taxed as a BIK. This myth that intercounty players, particularly with the big counties, are not well looked after is a bunch of nonsense.

It isnít, itís just a recognition of the value they have to the economy.

If GAA county games stopped it wouldnít just be a GAA issue it would be a national government issue as it would damage businesses and hence harm the economy.

Good man, you managed to contradict yourself there in a few words.

If it's not about earning money, it shouldn't be about earning money and that's exactly what tax breaks for players is about.  When the free state has such huge social issues in health and housing then it really does baffle the minfd that they are calling for lads in their early-mid 20s with free cars, university scolarships, no-show jobs, loads of untaxed earnings and freebies to get even more tax breaks.

What about the value club players bring to the economy or volunteers who ensure that games go ahead, what about the value the people who give up their own time free of charge to make sure underage teams and competitions can run their course, what about their value to the economy? The GAA would not exist without these people, neither would grassroots in other sports like football etc.

Why don't they evict working class families out of their homes and give them free houses while they're at it?

Tax breaks are about incentives to areas that can improve the economy. Typically done if their is a return on investment. I've personally no propen with this.

How does giving intercounty players tax breaks boost the economy?

Exactly. If people didnt spend money going to GAA matches they will spend it elsewhere.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 07, 2018, 09:53:55 PM
I have no issue with a certain tax band of say 15-20% for all inter-county lads. The player's grant would have to be taken off the table if it came in mind. That would be key. Then that money from the Govt could be used in other aspects of the GAA. It would sit better with me tbh than lads getting money for being a county player.
That is worse in my mind. Lads are getting money in their account for being a county player. The tax break way means they are keeping more of what they earn.

If you look at the amount of money the big matches bring to Dublin over the summer. If you look at the fact most villages have a defacto community centre in the form of a GAA clubhouse then why not?

NB
I would want the player's grant gone if that came in.

Playing for your county should not be about the money you can make from it and that is what it say.

Intercounty players have to make a lot of sacrifices but not really any more than any amateur sportsman. That they get preferential treatment does not sit well with me at all. I think it would be more apt for them to be taxed on their earnings, those lads with the sponsored cars should be paying tax on them, if you had it in a job it'd be taxed as a BIK. This myth that intercounty players, particularly with the big counties, are not well looked after is a bunch of nonsense.

It isnít, itís just a recognition of the value they have to the economy.

If GAA county games stopped it wouldnít just be a GAA issue it would be a national government issue as it would damage businesses and hence harm the economy.

Good man, you managed to contradict yourself there in a few words.

If it's not about earning money, it shouldn't be about earning money and that's exactly what tax breaks for players is about.  When the free state has such huge social issues in health and housing then it really does baffle the minfd that they are calling for lads in their early-mid 20s with free cars, university scolarships, no-show jobs, loads of untaxed earnings and freebies to get even more tax breaks.

What about the value club players bring to the economy or volunteers who ensure that games go ahead, what about the value the people who give up their own time free of charge to make sure underage teams and competitions can run their course, what about their value to the economy? The GAA would not exist without these people, neither would grassroots in other sports like football etc.

Why don't they evict working class families out of their homes and give them free houses while they're at it?

Tax breaks are about incentives to areas that can improve the economy. Typically done if their is a return on investment. I've personally no propen with this.

How does giving intercounty players tax breaks boost the economy?

Exactly. If people didnt spend money going to GAA matches they will spend it elsewhere.

Perhaps on a holiday in Spain or a Japanese made TV?
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Itchy on January 07, 2018, 10:40:54 PM
I have no issue with a certain tax band of say 15-20% for all inter-county lads. The player's grant would have to be taken off the table if it came in mind. That would be key. Then that money from the Govt could be used in other aspects of the GAA. It would sit better with me tbh than lads getting money for being a county player.
That is worse in my mind. Lads are getting money in their account for being a county player. The tax break way means they are keeping more of what they earn.

If you look at the amount of money the big matches bring to Dublin over the summer. If you look at the fact most villages have a defacto community centre in the form of a GAA clubhouse then why not?

NB
I would want the player's grant gone if that came in.

Playing for your county should not be about the money you can make from it and that is what it say.

Intercounty players have to make a lot of sacrifices but not really any more than any amateur sportsman. That they get preferential treatment does not sit well with me at all. I think it would be more apt for them to be taxed on their earnings, those lads with the sponsored cars should be paying tax on them, if you had it in a job it'd be taxed as a BIK. This myth that intercounty players, particularly with the big counties, are not well looked after is a bunch of nonsense.

It isnít, itís just a recognition of the value they have to the economy.

If GAA county games stopped it wouldnít just be a GAA issue it would be a national government issue as it would damage businesses and hence harm the economy.

Good man, you managed to contradict yourself there in a few words.

If it's not about earning money, it shouldn't be about earning money and that's exactly what tax breaks for players is about.  When the free state has such huge social issues in health and housing then it really does baffle the minfd that they are calling for lads in their early-mid 20s with free cars, university scolarships, no-show jobs, loads of untaxed earnings and freebies to get even more tax breaks.

What about the value club players bring to the economy or volunteers who ensure that games go ahead, what about the value the people who give up their own time free of charge to make sure underage teams and competitions can run their course, what about their value to the economy? The GAA would not exist without these people, neither would grassroots in other sports like football etc.

Why don't they evict working class families out of their homes and give them free houses while they're at it?

Tax breaks are about incentives to areas that can improve the economy. Typically done if their is a return on investment. I've personally no propen with this.

How does giving intercounty players tax breaks boost the economy?

More players stay playing, better standard, bigger crowds, more money spent by supporters and by tv companies and advertisers, more tax taken in. Alternative money spent on something else, possibly not irish.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Lar Naparka on January 07, 2018, 10:49:41 PM
Be realistic, you canít offer a tax break for every volunteer, there are too many and the system would be abused.

If tax breaks were only of interest to the elite players they wouldnít get them. The reason they could is because it is in the interest of the government to have a strong GAA intercounty game because it generates millions to the bottom line of various different businesses around the country.

I explained it and gave examples, I canít draw you a picture, you donít want it explained, you just want to rant.

What you "explained" is pie in the sky stuff.

There is zero need to offer tax breaks. It's elitism, these lads with their no-show jobs, sponsored cars, sponsorship deals and endorsements already make enough out of their status as intercounty fooballers. They don't need further tax breaks but it's in line with the way the game is going, professionals in all but name. I'd imagine guys like Bernard Brogan, O'Shea and Joe Canning make more in a year than any professional League of Ireland player and probably as much as some rugby internationals.

You keep rabbitting on about it generating millions, you completely overstate the revenue the GAA makes for the economy, it probably drains more out of the state than it generates. How many times does Croke Park fill up a year? 5/6 times tops. You might get Thurles full once a year and Clones full once a year and that's really about the height of it.

The GAA are the benefactors of this, not the state.
What a monumental load of shite!
Who are the lads with the no-show jobs, sponsorship deals and endorsements?
How many intercounty players get any, never mind all, of these?  You can imagine what you like but your imagination is a bit overworked to put it mildly.
What Brogan, Canning, OíShea etc. may get is not coming from the GAA or the government . They deliver bang for their bucks for their sponsors and they wouldnít be getting anything if the sponsors werenít profiting from the arrangement.
Ten of the Mayo panel live in Dublin; some work and others are at college. A round trip three times a week to Ballyhaunis or wherever the squad may be training will come to close on 1,000 km a week.
That involves waiting until work or lectures are finished, piling three or four into a car, booting down for training and arriving back at maybe three in the morning and then having to be bright-eyed and bushy tailed for the following dayís work/study.
Is that the glamorous lifestyle you say they enjoy?
How the hell do you know what any Irish professional soccer player is earning? ďAnyĒ be a small words but a helluva big word in meaning. Just how many Gaelic players earn more than ďanyĒ of their soccer counterparts?
Probably as much as some rugby internationals, sez you. Where did you get the ďprobablyĒ from?
So you think Gaelic intercounty players are part of an elite group and they can shag off if they are not prepared to play as you want them to? According to you, they can all clear off and there will be plenty more to take their places if they do.
Where will they come from? Is it a case of the next in line taking over and then getting the same abuse from you and others who think intercounty players live a life of luxury .
Jaysus, Iíve just made up my mind about a unification referendum, if there ever is one.
Keep yer shite north of the border, where it belongs.  ;D
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: From the Bunker on January 07, 2018, 11:08:34 PM
I have no issue with a certain tax band of say 15-20% for all inter-county lads. The player's grant would have to be taken off the table if it came in mind. That would be key. Then that money from the Govt could be used in other aspects of the GAA. It would sit better with me tbh than lads getting money for being a county player.
That is worse in my mind. Lads are getting money in their account for being a county player. The tax break way means they are keeping more of what they earn.

If you look at the amount of money the big matches bring to Dublin over the summer. If you look at the fact most villages have a defacto community centre in the form of a GAA clubhouse then why not?

NB
I would want the player's grant gone if that came in.

Playing for your county should not be about the money you can make from it and that is what it say.

Intercounty players have to make a lot of sacrifices but not really any more than any amateur sportsman. That they get preferential treatment does not sit well with me at all. I think it would be more apt for them to be taxed on their earnings, those lads with the sponsored cars should be paying tax on them, if you had it in a job it'd be taxed as a BIK. This myth that intercounty players, particularly with the big counties, are not well looked after is a bunch of nonsense.

It isnít, itís just a recognition of the value they have to the economy.

If GAA county games stopped it wouldnít just be a GAA issue it would be a national government issue as it would damage businesses and hence harm the economy.

Good man, you managed to contradict yourself there in a few words.

If it's not about earning money, it shouldn't be about earning money and that's exactly what tax breaks for players is about.  When the free state has such huge social issues in health and housing then it really does baffle the minfd that they are calling for lads in their early-mid 20s with free cars, university scolarships, no-show jobs, loads of untaxed earnings and freebies to get even more tax breaks.

What about the value club players bring to the economy or volunteers who ensure that games go ahead, what about the value the people who give up their own time free of charge to make sure underage teams and competitions can run their course, what about their value to the economy? The GAA would not exist without these people, neither would grassroots in other sports like football etc.

Why don't they evict working class families out of their homes and give them free houses while they're at it?

Tax breaks are about incentives to areas that can improve the economy. Typically done if their is a return on investment. I've personally no propen with this.

How does giving intercounty players tax breaks boost the economy?

More players stay playing, better standard, bigger crowds, more money spent by supporters and by tv companies and advertisers, more tax taken in. Alternative money spent on something else, possibly not irish.

Do you believe that? I don't get this subsidising a cash rich organisation such as the GAA! They already took a big lump of money from the Tax payer to complete Croke Park as well as Berties idea to subsidise the Dublin coaching structure.

Then you have the Scenario of a Player from Waterford who are out of the Championship on the 17th of June to Derry in front of 1, 067! Not much revenue generated there. Nine games in 5 months - serious revenue there from the National League Division 4 campaign!




Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 08, 2018, 08:17:41 AM
Be realistic, you canít offer a tax break for every volunteer, there are too many and the system would be abused.

If tax breaks were only of interest to the elite players they wouldnít get them. The reason they could is because it is in the interest of the government to have a strong GAA intercounty game because it generates millions to the bottom line of various different businesses around the country.

I explained it and gave examples, I canít draw you a picture, you donít want it explained, you just want to rant.

What you "explained" is pie in the sky stuff.

There is zero need to offer tax breaks. It's elitism, these lads with their no-show jobs, sponsored cars, sponsorship deals and endorsements already make enough out of their status as intercounty fooballers. They don't need further tax breaks but it's in line with the way the game is going, professionals in all but name. I'd imagine guys like Bernard Brogan, O'Shea and Joe Canning make more in a year than any professional League of Ireland player and probably as much as some rugby internationals.

You keep rabbitting on about it generating millions, you completely overstate the revenue the GAA makes for the economy, it probably drains more out of the state than it generates. How many times does Croke Park fill up a year? 5/6 times tops. You might get Thurles full once a year and Clones full once a year and that's really about the height of it.

The GAA are the benefactors of this, not the state.
What a monumental load of shite!
Who are the lads with the no-show jobs, sponsorship deals and endorsements?
How many intercounty players get any, never mind all, of these?  You can imagine what you like but your imagination is a bit overworked to put it mildly.
What Brogan, Canning, OíShea etc. may get is not coming from the GAA or the government . They deliver bang for their bucks for their sponsors and they wouldnít be getting anything if the sponsors werenít profiting from the arrangement.
Ten of the Mayo panel live in Dublin; some work and others are at college. A round trip three times a week to Ballyhaunis or wherever the squad may be training will come to close on 1,000 km a week.
That involves waiting until work or lectures are finished, piling three or four into a car, booting down for training and arriving back at maybe three in the morning and then having to be bright-eyed and bushy tailed for the following dayís work/study.
Is that the glamorous lifestyle you say they enjoy?
How the hell do you know what any Irish professional soccer player is earning? ďAnyĒ be a small words but a helluva big word in meaning. Just how many Gaelic players earn more than ďanyĒ of their soccer counterparts?
Probably as much as some rugby internationals, sez you. Where did you get the ďprobablyĒ from?
So you think Gaelic intercounty players are part of an elite group and they can shag off if they are not prepared to play as you want them to? According to you, they can all clear off and there will be plenty more to take their places if they do.
Where will they come from? Is it a case of the next in line taking over and then getting the same abuse from you and others who think intercounty players live a life of luxury .
Jaysus, Iíve just made up my mind about a unification referendum, if there ever is one.
Keep yer shite north of the border, where it belongs.  ;D

To borrow your phrase, what a monumental load of shit.

These lads do not deliver bang for their buck, they don't pay any tax on their free cars and freebies. If you got a brand new Audi A5 at work you would have your taxable salary increased on the basis of the value of that car. These guys don't pay tax on that, they get handed massive freebies and endorsements that are not taxed. Why are they exempt from this? They have made a choice to pursue a hobby, they are making an awful lot of money out of this hobby, they are not paying any tax on earnings that would be taxable for the common man. And now we have a blueshirt yokel down in Kerry telling us that these lads pursuing their hobby need even more tax breaks?

From what I gather half the Mayo team all have free cars - Keegan, Diarmuid and Cillian O'Connor, Aidan O'Shea, Andy Moran, Stephen Coen are those that I understand have benefited from sponsored cars.

I think the majority of Dublin players have received sponsored cars from Subaru. I know a Mayo man who says that Allergan in Wesport employ 4/5 Mayo players who are hardly ever at work. They'll show their face for a few hours each week and that's all it requires.

If you have any sort of profile in the GAA and play for one of the top counties there is no way you won't have a brand new free car to be driving around in sponsored by your local garage. If you check out those players social media accounts they'll be plugging all the car garages who are giving them their free cars and all the other shops where they get their freebies. Kitted out in designer clothes free of charge etc.

These guys do very well out of the game, they do not need more tax breaks, it actually needs to go the other way, Revenue should be clamping down heavily on GAA players and their undeclared earnings and benefits. They won't though, the GAA has too much political clout for this to happen.

At the end of the day, it's a choice, the same as most people are confronted with in life, pursue your professional endeavors and sacrifice your hobby or pursue your hobby and make sacrifices to your professional endeavors. I don't see why intercounty players should be granted special exemptions when a lot of them are probably cheating the ordinary tax payer as it is.

Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 08, 2018, 08:36:23 AM
I have no issue with a certain tax band of say 15-20% for all inter-county lads. The player's grant would have to be taken off the table if it came in mind. That would be key. Then that money from the Govt could be used in other aspects of the GAA. It would sit better with me tbh than lads getting money for being a county player.
That is worse in my mind. Lads are getting money in their account for being a county player. The tax break way means they are keeping more of what they earn.

If you look at the amount of money the big matches bring to Dublin over the summer. If you look at the fact most villages have a defacto community centre in the form of a GAA clubhouse then why not?

NB
I would want the player's grant gone if that came in.

Playing for your county should not be about the money you can make from it and that is what it say.

Intercounty players have to make a lot of sacrifices but not really any more than any amateur sportsman. That they get preferential treatment does not sit well with me at all. I think it would be more apt for them to be taxed on their earnings, those lads with the sponsored cars should be paying tax on them, if you had it in a job it'd be taxed as a BIK. This myth that intercounty players, particularly with the big counties, are not well looked after is a bunch of nonsense.

It isnít, itís just a recognition of the value they have to the economy.

If GAA county games stopped it wouldnít just be a GAA issue it would be a national government issue as it would damage businesses and hence harm the economy.

Good man, you managed to contradict yourself there in a few words.

If it's not about earning money, it shouldn't be about earning money and that's exactly what tax breaks for players is about.  When the free state has such huge social issues in health and housing then it really does baffle the minfd that they are calling for lads in their early-mid 20s with free cars, university scolarships, no-show jobs, loads of untaxed earnings and freebies to get even more tax breaks.

What about the value club players bring to the economy or volunteers who ensure that games go ahead, what about the value the people who give up their own time free of charge to make sure underage teams and competitions can run their course, what about their value to the economy? The GAA would not exist without these people, neither would grassroots in other sports like football etc.

Why don't they evict working class families out of their homes and give them free houses while they're at it?

Tax breaks are about incentives to areas that can improve the economy. Typically done if their is a return on investment. I've personally no propen with this.

How does giving intercounty players tax breaks boost the economy?

More players stay playing, better standard, bigger crowds, more money spent by supporters and by tv companies and advertisers, more tax taken in. Alternative money spent on something else, possibly not irish.

Do you believe that? I don't get this subsidising a cash rich organisation such as the GAA! They already took a big lump of money from the Tax payer to complete Croke Park as well as Berties idea to subsidise the Dublin coaching structure.

Then you have the Scenario of a Player from Waterford who are out of the Championship on the 17th of June to Derry in front of 1, 067! Not much revenue generated there. Nine games in 5 months - serious revenue there from the National League Division 4 campaign!

Precisely, the premise that the GAA generates a lot of revenue for the economy is laughable when you look at how much the GAA retain of that money for themselves and then the millions upon millions they extract from the state every year. Ä56m of sports grants were handed out in 2017, in the 26 counties, 18 of the highest sports grants went to GAA clubs. In Meath alone, Ä1.4m went to GAA clubs. I haven't seen any figure relating to how much of the sports grants went to each sport but I could say you could ball park the GAA as getting around Ä30m of them given those stats.

Contrary to any myth, Association Football is still the most popular sport in the Free State on the basis of registered players and no of clubs but it doesn't seem to get anywhere near the same funding that the GAA does. An awful lot of football teams play on municipal pitches in comparison to GAA clubs which usually have their own grounds and pitches. Municipal pitches should be the way to go forward as after all these are local community sporting clubs with lots of people devoting their time free of charge in order to give something back to the community.

Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: magpie seanie on January 08, 2018, 08:50:56 AM
This is getting hot and a little off topic but my tuppence worth.....

1. The "grants" or "additional expenses" or whatever angle of the fudge you want to take are a disgrace. They clearly breach GAA rules on being amateur for a start. Secondly, the supposed cultural and heritage benefits - clearly every volunteer in the GAA contributes to this so singling out elite players - who are looked after pretty well by the association and certainly benefit in their personal lives from their profiles as intercounty players - is grossly inappropriate. There are many other aspects of Irish culture and heritage that are ignored for similar grants, traditional music, the Irish language etc. It's completely wrong. I was there in Sligo the day this Trojan horse was welcomed into the Association and I mark it as the worst day in GAA history.

2. As above, tax breaks for elite GAA players as the original article suggests would again be wrong. The same reasons apply - a lack of equity across the board. I'd be more inclined to give tax breaks to folk who go out after work helping the homeless or sick/old. Trouble is if you get a picture with them no one will retweet it.

3. Bombers observances on the crooks and liars that have run the Republic since the foundation of the State are very difficult to argue. To be fair, I'd say it was more incompetence up to the 60's/70's but a healthy does of corruption and self serving since then. We refuse to break the cycle and hence we have huge and worsening inequality in our society.

Thanks.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Itchy on January 08, 2018, 03:27:46 PM
This is getting hot and a little off topic but my tuppence worth.....

1. The "grants" or "additional expenses" or whatever angle of the fudge you want to take are a disgrace. They clearly breach GAA rules on being amateur for a start. Secondly, the supposed cultural and heritage benefits - clearly every volunteer in the GAA contributes to this so singling out elite players - who are looked after pretty well by the association and certainly benefit in their personal lives from their profiles as intercounty players - is grossly inappropriate. There are many other aspects of Irish culture and heritage that are ignored for similar grants, traditional music, the Irish language etc. It's completely wrong. I was there in Sligo the day this Trojan horse was welcomed into the Association and I mark it as the worst day in GAA history.

2. As above, tax breaks for elite GAA players as the original article suggests would again be wrong. The same reasons apply - a lack of equity across the board. I'd be more inclined to give tax breaks to folk who go out after work helping the homeless or sick/old. Trouble is if you get a picture with them no one will retweet it.

3. Bombers observances on the crooks and liars that have run the Republic since the foundation of the State are very difficult to argue. To be fair, I'd say it was more incompetence up to the 60's/70's but a healthy does of corruption and self serving since then. We refuse to break the cycle and hence we have huge and worsening inequality in our society.

Thanks.

They are neither of these things. This is an agreement between the government and the players. It is a tax incentive meaning you get some tax relief if you are classed as a high performance athlete. The same will apply to amateur runners, high jumpers, boxers etc. You will need to have another job to benefit as you must be paying taxes to get relief on them. I see no issue with the idea in general. These tax incentives exist in all walks of life - buy a house in rural ireland, mortgage relief etc etc.

I see someone earlier having a moan about the government helping the GAA with Croke park. What the government invested in that they got back 10 fold since in concerts, people coming into the city and revenue generated. Its a great example of how it should work.  Really don't understand all the negativity.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 08, 2018, 03:33:30 PM
This is getting hot and a little off topic but my tuppence worth.....

1. The "grants" or "additional expenses" or whatever angle of the fudge you want to take are a disgrace. They clearly breach GAA rules on being amateur for a start. Secondly, the supposed cultural and heritage benefits - clearly every volunteer in the GAA contributes to this so singling out elite players - who are looked after pretty well by the association and certainly benefit in their personal lives from their profiles as intercounty players - is grossly inappropriate. There are many other aspects of Irish culture and heritage that are ignored for similar grants, traditional music, the Irish language etc. It's completely wrong. I was there in Sligo the day this Trojan horse was welcomed into the Association and I mark it as the worst day in GAA history.

2. As above, tax breaks for elite GAA players as the original article suggests would again be wrong. The same reasons apply - a lack of equity across the board. I'd be more inclined to give tax breaks to folk who go out after work helping the homeless or sick/old. Trouble is if you get a picture with them no one will retweet it.

3. Bombers observances on the crooks and liars that have run the Republic since the foundation of the State are very difficult to argue. To be fair, I'd say it was more incompetence up to the 60's/70's but a healthy does of corruption and self serving since then. We refuse to break the cycle and hence we have huge and worsening inequality in our society.

Thanks.

They are neither of these things. This is an agreement between the government and the players. It is a tax incentive meaning you get some tax relief if you are classed as a high performance athlete. The same will apply to amateur runners, high jumpers, boxers etc. You will need to have another job to benefit as you must be paying taxes to get relief on them. I see no issue with the idea in general. These tax incentives exist in all walks of life - buy a house in rural ireland, mortgage relief etc etc.

I see someone earlier having a moan about the government helping the GAA with Croke park. What the government invested in that they got back 10 fold since in concerts, people coming into the city and revenue generated. Its a great example of how it should work.  Really don't understand all the negativity.

Those tax incentives you list exist for all people.

The ones being put forward now will only exist for a select group of people who already benefit hugely from their profile as GAA players and don't pay any tax on much of their earnings and benefits. That is where the problem lies and why this stinks to the high heavens.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Itchy on January 08, 2018, 04:04:17 PM
This is getting hot and a little off topic but my tuppence worth.....

1. The "grants" or "additional expenses" or whatever angle of the fudge you want to take are a disgrace. They clearly breach GAA rules on being amateur for a start. Secondly, the supposed cultural and heritage benefits - clearly every volunteer in the GAA contributes to this so singling out elite players - who are looked after pretty well by the association and certainly benefit in their personal lives from their profiles as intercounty players - is grossly inappropriate. There are many other aspects of Irish culture and heritage that are ignored for similar grants, traditional music, the Irish language etc. It's completely wrong. I was there in Sligo the day this Trojan horse was welcomed into the Association and I mark it as the worst day in GAA history.

2. As above, tax breaks for elite GAA players as the original article suggests would again be wrong. The same reasons apply - a lack of equity across the board. I'd be more inclined to give tax breaks to folk who go out after work helping the homeless or sick/old. Trouble is if you get a picture with them no one will retweet it.

3. Bombers observances on the crooks and liars that have run the Republic since the foundation of the State are very difficult to argue. To be fair, I'd say it was more incompetence up to the 60's/70's but a healthy does of corruption and self serving since then. We refuse to break the cycle and hence we have huge and worsening inequality in our society.

Thanks.

They are neither of these things. This is an agreement between the government and the players. It is a tax incentive meaning you get some tax relief if you are classed as a high performance athlete. The same will apply to amateur runners, high jumpers, boxers etc. You will need to have another job to benefit as you must be paying taxes to get relief on them. I see no issue with the idea in general. These tax incentives exist in all walks of life - buy a house in rural ireland, mortgage relief etc etc.

I see someone earlier having a moan about the government helping the GAA with Croke park. What the government invested in that they got back 10 fold since in concerts, people coming into the city and revenue generated. Its a great example of how it should work.  Really don't understand all the negativity.

Those tax incentives you list exist for all people.

The ones being put forward now will only exist for a select group of people who already benefit hugely from their profile as GAA players and don't pay any tax on much of their earnings and benefits. That is where the problem lies and why this stinks to the high heavens.

I'd really love to know who these GAA players are that are benefiting to the levels you suggest and paying no tax. The lads I know work ordinary jobs, drive their own cars and the most they get is some training gear and a meal after training/matches. I would wager that is the vast majority of them. This is not only for GAA players either it is for all sports people at a certain level.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 08, 2018, 04:12:47 PM
This is getting hot and a little off topic but my tuppence worth.....

1. The "grants" or "additional expenses" or whatever angle of the fudge you want to take are a disgrace. They clearly breach GAA rules on being amateur for a start. Secondly, the supposed cultural and heritage benefits - clearly every volunteer in the GAA contributes to this so singling out elite players - who are looked after pretty well by the association and certainly benefit in their personal lives from their profiles as intercounty players - is grossly inappropriate. There are many other aspects of Irish culture and heritage that are ignored for similar grants, traditional music, the Irish language etc. It's completely wrong. I was there in Sligo the day this Trojan horse was welcomed into the Association and I mark it as the worst day in GAA history.

2. As above, tax breaks for elite GAA players as the original article suggests would again be wrong. The same reasons apply - a lack of equity across the board. I'd be more inclined to give tax breaks to folk who go out after work helping the homeless or sick/old. Trouble is if you get a picture with them no one will retweet it.

3. Bombers observances on the crooks and liars that have run the Republic since the foundation of the State are very difficult to argue. To be fair, I'd say it was more incompetence up to the 60's/70's but a healthy does of corruption and self serving since then. We refuse to break the cycle and hence we have huge and worsening inequality in our society.

Thanks.

They are neither of these things. This is an agreement between the government and the players. It is a tax incentive meaning you get some tax relief if you are classed as a high performance athlete. The same will apply to amateur runners, high jumpers, boxers etc. You will need to have another job to benefit as you must be paying taxes to get relief on them. I see no issue with the idea in general. These tax incentives exist in all walks of life - buy a house in rural ireland, mortgage relief etc etc.

I see someone earlier having a moan about the government helping the GAA with Croke park. What the government invested in that they got back 10 fold since in concerts, people coming into the city and revenue generated. Its a great example of how it should work.  Really don't understand all the negativity.

Those tax incentives you list exist for all people.

The ones being put forward now will only exist for a select group of people who already benefit hugely from their profile as GAA players and don't pay any tax on much of their earnings and benefits. That is where the problem lies and why this stinks to the high heavens.

I'd really love to know who these GAA players are that are benefiting to the levels you suggest and paying no tax. The lads I know work ordinary jobs, drive their own cars and the most they get is some training gear and a meal after training/matches. I would wager that is the vast majority of them. This is not only for GAA players either it is for all sports people at a certain level.

Look at all the perks the likes of the Dublin and Mayo teams have. How many pies has Joe Canning his fingers in. Free cars etc.

At the end of the day, these people have choices like any man or woman has, some people sacrifice their hours free of charge to train underage teams. Intercounty players do quite well out of their profile as intercounty players, they can be set up with handy jobs, flexible hours, they can get sponsorship and endorsements, mileage expenses, player holidays, player grants and other benefits.

What does a volunteer who could give up 8/10 hrs of his week in aiding his club get? Usually zip, so it begs the questions why do intercounty players deserve even more breaks when they already get enough. They make a choice, many people have to pack in their hobbies for their work and families. Apparently not only should GAA players not have to, on top of all the benefits and incentives they already receive, they should get more. That stinks.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: magpie seanie on January 08, 2018, 04:18:29 PM
This is getting hot and a little off topic but my tuppence worth.....

1. The "grants" or "additional expenses" or whatever angle of the fudge you want to take are a disgrace. They clearly breach GAA rules on being amateur for a start. Secondly, the supposed cultural and heritage benefits - clearly every volunteer in the GAA contributes to this so singling out elite players - who are looked after pretty well by the association and certainly benefit in their personal lives from their profiles as intercounty players - is grossly inappropriate. There are many other aspects of Irish culture and heritage that are ignored for similar grants, traditional music, the Irish language etc. It's completely wrong. I was there in Sligo the day this Trojan horse was welcomed into the Association and I mark it as the worst day in GAA history.

2. As above, tax breaks for elite GAA players as the original article suggests would again be wrong. The same reasons apply - a lack of equity across the board. I'd be more inclined to give tax breaks to folk who go out after work helping the homeless or sick/old. Trouble is if you get a picture with them no one will retweet it.

3. Bombers observances on the crooks and liars that have run the Republic since the foundation of the State are very difficult to argue. To be fair, I'd say it was more incompetence up to the 60's/70's but a healthy does of corruption and self serving since then. We refuse to break the cycle and hence we have huge and worsening inequality in our society.

Thanks.

They are neither of these things. This is an agreement between the government and the players. It is a tax incentive meaning you get some tax relief if you are classed as a high performance athlete. The same will apply to amateur runners, high jumpers, boxers etc. You will need to have another job to benefit as you must be paying taxes to get relief on them. I see no issue with the idea in general. These tax incentives exist in all walks of life - buy a house in rural ireland, mortgage relief etc etc.

I see someone earlier having a moan about the government helping the GAA with Croke park. What the government invested in that they got back 10 fold since in concerts, people coming into the city and revenue generated. Its a great example of how it should work.  Really don't understand all the negativity.


I'm sorry to say this but you clearly don't understand how the Sports Council grants work or what they are. They're a handout for playing intercounty football or hurling and the amount is based on how far your team progresses in the championship.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Premier Emperor on January 08, 2018, 05:22:47 PM
Look at all the perks the likes of the Dublin and Mayo teams have. How many pies has Joe Canning his fingers in. Free cars etc.
At least Joe managed to lay off the pies in recent years.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Itchy on January 08, 2018, 06:46:26 PM
This is getting hot and a little off topic but my tuppence worth.....

1. The "grants" or "additional expenses" or whatever angle of the fudge you want to take are a disgrace. They clearly breach GAA rules on being amateur for a start. Secondly, the supposed cultural and heritage benefits - clearly every volunteer in the GAA contributes to this so singling out elite players - who are looked after pretty well by the association and certainly benefit in their personal lives from their profiles as intercounty players - is grossly inappropriate. There are many other aspects of Irish culture and heritage that are ignored for similar grants, traditional music, the Irish language etc. It's completely wrong. I was there in Sligo the day this Trojan horse was welcomed into the Association and I mark it as the worst day in GAA history.

2. As above, tax breaks for elite GAA players as the original article suggests would again be wrong. The same reasons apply - a lack of equity across the board. I'd be more inclined to give tax breaks to folk who go out after work helping the homeless or sick/old. Trouble is if you get a picture with them no one will retweet it.

3. Bombers observances on the crooks and liars that have run the Republic since the foundation of the State are very difficult to argue. To be fair, I'd say it was more incompetence up to the 60's/70's but a healthy does of corruption and self serving since then. We refuse to break the cycle and hence we have huge and worsening inequality in our society.

Thanks.

They are neither of these things. This is an agreement between the government and the players. It is a tax incentive meaning you get some tax relief if you are classed as a high performance athlete. The same will apply to amateur runners, high jumpers, boxers etc. You will need to have another job to benefit as you must be paying taxes to get relief on them. I see no issue with the idea in general. These tax incentives exist in all walks of life - buy a house in rural ireland, mortgage relief etc etc.

I see someone earlier having a moan about the government helping the GAA with Croke park. What the government invested in that they got back 10 fold since in concerts, people coming into the city and revenue generated. Its a great example of how it should work.  Really don't understand all the negativity.


I'm sorry to say this but you clearly don't understand how the Sports Council grants work or what they are. They're a handout for playing intercounty football or hurling and the amount is based on how far your team progresses in the championship.

I am referring to tax incentives for amateur sports people as mentioned in recent media speculation. Not to sports council grants
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 08, 2018, 07:07:31 PM
This is getting hot and a little off topic but my tuppence worth.....

1. The "grants" or "additional expenses" or whatever angle of the fudge you want to take are a disgrace. They clearly breach GAA rules on being amateur for a start. Secondly, the supposed cultural and heritage benefits - clearly every volunteer in the GAA contributes to this so singling out elite players - who are looked after pretty well by the association and certainly benefit in their personal lives from their profiles as intercounty players - is grossly inappropriate. There are many other aspects of Irish culture and heritage that are ignored for similar grants, traditional music, the Irish language etc. It's completely wrong. I was there in Sligo the day this Trojan horse was welcomed into the Association and I mark it as the worst day in GAA history.

2. As above, tax breaks for elite GAA players as the original article suggests would again be wrong. The same reasons apply - a lack of equity across the board. I'd be more inclined to give tax breaks to folk who go out after work helping the homeless or sick/old. Trouble is if you get a picture with them no one will retweet it.

3. Bombers observances on the crooks and liars that have run the Republic since the foundation of the State are very difficult to argue. To be fair, I'd say it was more incompetence up to the 60's/70's but a healthy does of corruption and self serving since then. We refuse to break the cycle and hence we have huge and worsening inequality in our society.

Thanks.

They are neither of these things. This is an agreement between the government and the players. It is a tax incentive meaning you get some tax relief if you are classed as a high performance athlete. The same will apply to amateur runners, high jumpers, boxers etc. You will need to have another job to benefit as you must be paying taxes to get relief on them. I see no issue with the idea in general. These tax incentives exist in all walks of life - buy a house in rural ireland, mortgage relief etc etc.

I see someone earlier having a moan about the government helping the GAA with Croke park. What the government invested in that they got back 10 fold since in concerts, people coming into the city and revenue generated. Its a great example of how it should work.  Really don't understand all the negativity.


I'm sorry to say this but you clearly don't understand how the Sports Council grants work or what they are. They're a handout for playing intercounty football or hurling and the amount is based on how far your team progresses in the championship.

I am referring to tax incentives for amateur sports people as mentioned in recent media speculation. Not to sports council grants

Thanks for clarifying that the people who will benefit from these tax breaks also benefit from a whole array of other financial benefits from pursuing their hobby.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: seafoid on January 08, 2018, 07:26:25 PM
Look at all the perks the likes of the Dublin and Mayo teams have. How many pies has Joe Canning his fingers in. Free cars etc.
At least Joe managed to lay off the pies in recent years.
He had 3 Tipp lads throwing themselves at him in the last minute of the semi last year.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: From the Bunker on January 08, 2018, 07:47:58 PM
This is getting hot and a little off topic but my tuppence worth.....

1. The "grants" or "additional expenses" or whatever angle of the fudge you want to take are a disgrace. They clearly breach GAA rules on being amateur for a start. Secondly, the supposed cultural and heritage benefits - clearly every volunteer in the GAA contributes to this so singling out elite players - who are looked after pretty well by the association and certainly benefit in their personal lives from their profiles as intercounty players - is grossly inappropriate. There are many other aspects of Irish culture and heritage that are ignored for similar grants, traditional music, the Irish language etc. It's completely wrong. I was there in Sligo the day this Trojan horse was welcomed into the Association and I mark it as the worst day in GAA history.

2. As above, tax breaks for elite GAA players as the original article suggests would again be wrong. The same reasons apply - a lack of equity across the board. I'd be more inclined to give tax breaks to folk who go out after work helping the homeless or sick/old. Trouble is if you get a picture with them no one will retweet it.

3. Bombers observances on the crooks and liars that have run the Republic since the foundation of the State are very difficult to argue. To be fair, I'd say it was more incompetence up to the 60's/70's but a healthy does of corruption and self serving since then. We refuse to break the cycle and hence we have huge and worsening inequality in our society.

Thanks.

They are neither of these things. This is an agreement between the government and the players. It is a tax incentive meaning you get some tax relief if you are classed as a high performance athlete. The same will apply to amateur runners, high jumpers, boxers etc. You will need to have another job to benefit as you must be paying taxes to get relief on them. I see no issue with the idea in general. These tax incentives exist in all walks of life - buy a house in rural ireland, mortgage relief etc etc.

I see someone earlier having a moan about the government helping the GAA with Croke park. What the government invested in that they got back 10 fold since in concerts, people coming into the city and revenue generated. Its a great example of how it should work.  Really don't understand all the negativity.

The government invested in Croke Park! Did they get Shares? from what i remember Croke Park received a series of government grants worth around Ä108m in total!
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Rossfan on January 08, 2018, 08:15:02 PM
And Ä30m to an PhŠirc
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Itchy on January 09, 2018, 09:58:44 AM
This is getting hot and a little off topic but my tuppence worth.....

1. The "grants" or "additional expenses" or whatever angle of the fudge you want to take are a disgrace. They clearly breach GAA rules on being amateur for a start. Secondly, the supposed cultural and heritage benefits - clearly every volunteer in the GAA contributes to this so singling out elite players - who are looked after pretty well by the association and certainly benefit in their personal lives from their profiles as intercounty players - is grossly inappropriate. There are many other aspects of Irish culture and heritage that are ignored for similar grants, traditional music, the Irish language etc. It's completely wrong. I was there in Sligo the day this Trojan horse was welcomed into the Association and I mark it as the worst day in GAA history.

2. As above, tax breaks for elite GAA players as the original article suggests would again be wrong. The same reasons apply - a lack of equity across the board. I'd be more inclined to give tax breaks to folk who go out after work helping the homeless or sick/old. Trouble is if you get a picture with them no one will retweet it.

3. Bombers observances on the crooks and liars that have run the Republic since the foundation of the State are very difficult to argue. To be fair, I'd say it was more incompetence up to the 60's/70's but a healthy does of corruption and self serving since then. We refuse to break the cycle and hence we have huge and worsening inequality in our society.

Thanks.

They are neither of these things. This is an agreement between the government and the players. It is a tax incentive meaning you get some tax relief if you are classed as a high performance athlete. The same will apply to amateur runners, high jumpers, boxers etc. You will need to have another job to benefit as you must be paying taxes to get relief on them. I see no issue with the idea in general. These tax incentives exist in all walks of life - buy a house in rural ireland, mortgage relief etc etc.

I see someone earlier having a moan about the government helping the GAA with Croke park. What the government invested in that they got back 10 fold since in concerts, people coming into the city and revenue generated. Its a great example of how it should work.  Really don't understand all the negativity.

The government invested in Croke Park! Did they get Shares? from what i remember Croke Park received a series of government grants worth around Ä108m in total!

No they didnt get shares. They got an increased tax take for their investment.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 09, 2018, 10:08:28 AM
This is getting hot and a little off topic but my tuppence worth.....

1. The "grants" or "additional expenses" or whatever angle of the fudge you want to take are a disgrace. They clearly breach GAA rules on being amateur for a start. Secondly, the supposed cultural and heritage benefits - clearly every volunteer in the GAA contributes to this so singling out elite players - who are looked after pretty well by the association and certainly benefit in their personal lives from their profiles as intercounty players - is grossly inappropriate. There are many other aspects of Irish culture and heritage that are ignored for similar grants, traditional music, the Irish language etc. It's completely wrong. I was there in Sligo the day this Trojan horse was welcomed into the Association and I mark it as the worst day in GAA history.

2. As above, tax breaks for elite GAA players as the original article suggests would again be wrong. The same reasons apply - a lack of equity across the board. I'd be more inclined to give tax breaks to folk who go out after work helping the homeless or sick/old. Trouble is if you get a picture with them no one will retweet it.

3. Bombers observances on the crooks and liars that have run the Republic since the foundation of the State are very difficult to argue. To be fair, I'd say it was more incompetence up to the 60's/70's but a healthy does of corruption and self serving since then. We refuse to break the cycle and hence we have huge and worsening inequality in our society.

Thanks.

They are neither of these things. This is an agreement between the government and the players. It is a tax incentive meaning you get some tax relief if you are classed as a high performance athlete. The same will apply to amateur runners, high jumpers, boxers etc. You will need to have another job to benefit as you must be paying taxes to get relief on them. I see no issue with the idea in general. These tax incentives exist in all walks of life - buy a house in rural ireland, mortgage relief etc etc.

I see someone earlier having a moan about the government helping the GAA with Croke park. What the government invested in that they got back 10 fold since in concerts, people coming into the city and revenue generated. Its a great example of how it should work.  Really don't understand all the negativity.

The government invested in Croke Park! Did they get Shares? from what i remember Croke Park received a series of government grants worth around Ä108m in total!

No they didnt get shares. They got an increased tax take for their investment.

The GAA don't pay tax.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Shamrock Shore on January 09, 2018, 10:19:06 AM
Quote
The GAA don't pay tax.

It certainly does - ever hear of VAT?

So if grounds are being redeveloped or a new stand being built it pays over 13.5%/23% or 20% VAT.
A club/county cannot recover this.

GAA would also pay ER PRSI/NI or its salaried staff.
GAA clubs/counties would also pay CGT if it made a profit on the sale of property.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 09, 2018, 10:44:35 AM
Quote
The GAA don't pay tax.

It certainly does - ever hear of VAT?

So if grounds are being redeveloped or a new stand being built it pays over 13.5%/23% or 20% VAT.
A club/county cannot recover this.

GAA would also pay ER PRSI/NI or its salaried staff.
GAA clubs/counties would also pay CGT if it made a profit on the sale of property.

The GAA don't pay Income Tax, any profit they earn is completely untaxed.

The GAA don't pay VAT on their income. I think you fail to understand VAT. If they pay a VAT registered supplier, it is up to that supplier to file their VAT returns and pay Revenue their VAT liability. The GAA don't actually pay VAT, their VAT registered suppliers do. The GAA are not VAT registered so are not entitled to reclaim any VAT paid to their suppliers.

The GAA get big tax breaks on CGT.

The GAA is a very rich and debt free organisation that get plenty of tax breaks and aid and assistance from the state, which is why I find the level of funding they receive from State every year a disgrace in the light of massive social issues.

I'd hazard a guess that around Ä30m of Ä56m in Sports Grants this year went to GAA clubs.

Ä3m in player grants out as well yearly.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Shamrock Shore on January 09, 2018, 10:56:38 AM
Bomber

Are you an accountant in practice? Just asking, like.

Can you let me know of these CGT breaks available to GAA clubs.

Also please brush up on VAT. The builder keeps the net profit of the stand cost (for example) and pays over the VAT on this net profit to Revenue collected from the GAA. If that's not a contribution to the State's coffers (i.e. a tax) on the GAA then I am not sure what a tax is anymore.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Lar Naparka on January 09, 2018, 11:00:25 AM
Bomber

Are you an accountant in practice? Just asking, like.

Can you let me know of these CGT breaks available to GAA clubs.

Also please brush up on VAT. The builder keeps the net of the stand cost (for example) and pays over the VAT to Revenue collected from the GAA. If that's not a contribution to the State's coffers (i.e. a tax) on the GAA then I am not sure what a tax is anymore.
Do you not have  more to do than trying  to have a logical discussion with that bucko? ;D ;D
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Shamrock Shore on January 09, 2018, 11:04:27 AM
Yeah Lar. I should have more sense  :-X
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 09, 2018, 11:26:50 AM
Bomber

Are you an accountant in practice? Just asking, like.

Can you let me know of these CGT breaks available to GAA clubs.

Also please brush up on VAT. The builder keeps the net profit of the stand cost (for example) and pays over the VAT on this net profit to Revenue collected from the GAA. If that's not a contribution to the State's coffers (i.e. a tax) on the GAA then I am not sure what a tax is anymore.

I don't think you know what you are trying to say there. The GAA are not registered for VAT, in a lot of cases the people who the GAA hire for services or products are registered for VAT and therefore those suppliers the GAA hire or purchase off will have to pay VAT over. That is not the GAA paying VAT, that is the supplier paying VAT carrying out the course of their business. To repeat for you again, the GAA are not VAT registered, they do not have to pay VAT on any income they receive. Normal businesses do.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Rossfan on January 09, 2018, 11:35:38 AM
FFS will you stop ruining another thread.
Builder charges GAA Ä1m plus Ä135k VAT.
GAA gives builder Ä1,135,000.00.
Builder eventually pay the Ä135k to Revenue.

Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 09, 2018, 12:07:11 PM
FFS will you stop ruining another thread.
Builder charges GAA Ä1m plus Ä135k VAT.
GAA gives builder Ä1,135,000.00.
Builder eventually pay the Ä135k to Revenue.

Maybe threads wouldn't be ruined if you had any backbone, as much as you'd like to blame me for that....
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Mike Tyson on January 09, 2018, 12:49:54 PM
What way is it going to work? Would it be tax breaks for every member of a county panel? Just the championship panel? A select few players? Minimum of say 2 consecutive years on a panel?
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Itchy on January 09, 2018, 01:14:38 PM
What way is it going to work? Would it be tax breaks for every member of a county panel? Just the championship panel? A select few players? Minimum of say 2 consecutive years on a panel?

Don't think it has been decided. The idea was just floated out there. I expect it will be all county panelist but a modest tax relief of some sort. I wouldnt be in favour of giving it to only the top 10 in a county as each is putting in the same work in theory.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Itchy on January 09, 2018, 01:16:32 PM
FFS will you stop ruining another thread.
Builder charges GAA Ä1m plus Ä135k VAT.
GAA gives builder Ä1,135,000.00.
Builder eventually pay the Ä135k to Revenue.

Indeed and when you stay in a hotel for a night going to Croke park you pay VAT on the room. If you buy a sandwich in Croke park you pay VAT on that and so on. If the old stadium took 60k and the new one 80k, that 20k more people buying and paying VAT. That is how the investment is justified.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Rossfan on January 09, 2018, 01:23:14 PM
FFS will you stop ruining another thread.
Builder charges GAA Ä1m plus Ä135k VAT.
GAA gives builder Ä1,135,000.00.
Builder eventually pay the Ä135k to Revenue.

Maybe threads wouldn't be ruined if you had any backbone, as much as you'd like to blame me for that....
???????
Maybe you need a loaf on your head 😀😁😂😃
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: From the Bunker on January 09, 2018, 01:32:58 PM
FFS will you stop ruining another thread.
Builder charges GAA Ä1m plus Ä135k VAT.
GAA gives builder Ä1,135,000.00.
Builder eventually pay the Ä135k to Revenue.

Indeed and when you stay in a hotel for a night going to Croke park you pay VAT on the room. If you buy a sandwich in Croke park you pay VAT on that and so on. If the old stadium took 60k and the new one 80k, that 20k more people buying and paying VAT. That is how the investment is justified.

What a load of horse sh1te! Investment or not from the government. Croke Park would have been finished. It might have taken 10 years longer. But it would have got there. Most frequent visitors that I know, know better than to spend money on food in Croke Park. They may do it once. But when they see the rip-off, they are a lot shyer reaching into their pockets on return visits. As for the 20k extra people that fit into the stadium. Their has not been much need for this capacity the last couple of year.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Itchy on January 09, 2018, 02:02:10 PM
FFS will you stop ruining another thread.
Builder charges GAA Ä1m plus Ä135k VAT.
GAA gives builder Ä1,135,000.00.
Builder eventually pay the Ä135k to Revenue.

Indeed and when you stay in a hotel for a night going to Croke park you pay VAT on the room. If you buy a sandwich in Croke park you pay VAT on that and so on. If the old stadium took 60k and the new one 80k, that 20k more people buying and paying VAT. That is how the investment is justified.

What a load of horse sh1te! Investment or not from the government. Croke Park would have been finished. It might have taken 10 years longer. But it would have got there. Most frequent visitors that I know, know better than to spend money on food in Croke Park. They may do it once. But when they see the rip-off, they are a lot shyer reaching into their pockets on return visits. As for the 20k extra people that fit into the stadium. Their has not been much need for this capacity the last couple of year.

No need to get so worked up about this. There is a saving associated with implementing the investment 10 years quicker. 10 years x 20k people extra  x extra pub/hotel/meal income x VAT is the rough formula.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 09, 2018, 03:54:19 PM
FFS will you stop ruining another thread.
Builder charges GAA Ä1m plus Ä135k VAT.
GAA gives builder Ä1,135,000.00.
Builder eventually pay the Ä135k to Revenue.

Indeed and when you stay in a hotel for a night going to Croke park you pay VAT on the room. If you buy a sandwich in Croke park you pay VAT on that and so on. If the old stadium took 60k and the new one 80k, that 20k more people buying and paying VAT. That is how the investment is justified.

What a load of horse sh1te! Investment or not from the government. Croke Park would have been finished. It might have taken 10 years longer. But it would have got there. Most frequent visitors that I know, know better than to spend money on food in Croke Park. They may do it once. But when they see the rip-off, they are a lot shyer reaching into their pockets on return visits. As for the 20k extra people that fit into the stadium. Their has not been much need for this capacity the last couple of year.

No need to get so worked up about this. There is a saving associated with implementing the investment 10 years quicker. 10 years x 20k people extra  x extra pub/hotel/meal income x VAT is the rough formula.


It's a stupid argument and you are grossly exaggerating the benefit of Croke Park to the economy. This money would likely be spent within the economy anyway and rather than funding a cash rich organisation like the GAA which has received investment from the government to the tune of hundreds of millions in the last decade, it would be best served if the GAA funded an awful lot more of these projects themselves - particularly with the social issues out there.

If the Government is investing in sports projects they should be investing in municipal facilities around the country which will give the community full value for the investment but given the political clout the GAA have they continually get grants and money they neither need or deserve.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Itchy on January 09, 2018, 06:14:55 PM
FFS will you stop ruining another thread.
Builder charges GAA Ä1m plus Ä135k VAT.
GAA gives builder Ä1,135,000.00.
Builder eventually pay the Ä135k to Revenue.

Indeed and when you stay in a hotel for a night going to Croke park you pay VAT on the room. If you buy a sandwich in Croke park you pay VAT on that and so on. If the old stadium took 60k and the new one 80k, that 20k more people buying and paying VAT. That is how the investment is justified.

What a load of horse sh1te! Investment or not from the government. Croke Park would have been finished. It might have taken 10 years longer. But it would have got there. Most frequent visitors that I know, know better than to spend money on food in Croke Park. They may do it once. But when they see the rip-off, they are a lot shyer reaching into their pockets on return visits. As for the 20k extra people that fit into the stadium. Their has not been much need for this capacity the last couple of year.

No need to get so worked up about this. There is a saving associated with implementing the investment 10 years quicker. 10 years x 20k people extra  x extra pub/hotel/meal income x VAT is the rough formula.


It's a stupid argument and you are grossly exaggerating the benefit of Croke Park to the economy. This money would likely be spent within the economy anyway and rather than funding a cash rich organisation like the GAA which has received investment from the government to the tune of hundreds of millions in the last decade, it would be best served if the GAA funded an awful lot more of these projects themselves - particularly with the social issues out there.

If the Government is investing in sports projects they should be investing in municipal facilities around the country which will give the community full value for the investment but given the political clout the GAA have they continually get grants and money they neither need or deserve.

They do invest in communities around the country, it's called the sports capital grant scheme.  I'm sure a genius like you on all things "freestate" knew that already.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 09, 2018, 06:27:55 PM
FFS will you stop ruining another thread.
Builder charges GAA Ä1m plus Ä135k VAT.
GAA gives builder Ä1,135,000.00.
Builder eventually pay the Ä135k to Revenue.

Indeed and when you stay in a hotel for a night going to Croke park you pay VAT on the room. If you buy a sandwich in Croke park you pay VAT on that and so on. If the old stadium took 60k and the new one 80k, that 20k more people buying and paying VAT. That is how the investment is justified.

What a load of horse sh1te! Investment or not from the government. Croke Park would have been finished. It might have taken 10 years longer. But it would have got there. Most frequent visitors that I know, know better than to spend money on food in Croke Park. They may do it once. But when they see the rip-off, they are a lot shyer reaching into their pockets on return visits. As for the 20k extra people that fit into the stadium. Their has not been much need for this capacity the last couple of year.

No need to get so worked up about this. There is a saving associated with implementing the investment 10 years quicker. 10 years x 20k people extra  x extra pub/hotel/meal income x VAT is the rough formula.


It's a stupid argument and you are grossly exaggerating the benefit of Croke Park to the economy. This money would likely be spent within the economy anyway and rather than funding a cash rich organisation like the GAA which has received investment from the government to the tune of hundreds of millions in the last decade, it would be best served if the GAA funded an awful lot more of these projects themselves - particularly with the social issues out there.

If the Government is investing in sports projects they should be investing in municipal facilities around the country which will give the community full value for the investment but given the political clout the GAA have they continually get grants and money they neither need or deserve.

They do invest in communities around the country, it's called the sports capital grant scheme.  I'm sure a genius like you on all things "freestate" knew that already.

Yes and the vast, vast amount of money of those sports grants goes to GAA clubs. The biggest grants awarded went to GAA clubs in 18 of 26 counties. There are actually more association football clubs and registered players in the 26 counties than GAA clubs and registered GAA players by comparison.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Itchy on January 09, 2018, 07:00:56 PM
FFS will you stop ruining another thread.
Builder charges GAA Ä1m plus Ä135k VAT.
GAA gives builder Ä1,135,000.00.
Builder eventually pay the Ä135k to Revenue.

Indeed and when you stay in a hotel for a night going to Croke park you pay VAT on the room. If you buy a sandwich in Croke park you pay VAT on that and so on. If the old stadium took 60k and the new one 80k, that 20k more people buying and paying VAT. That is how the investment is justified.

What a load of horse sh1te! Investment or not from the government. Croke Park would have been finished. It might have taken 10 years longer. But it would have got there. Most frequent visitors that I know, know better than to spend money on food in Croke Park. They may do it once. But when they see the rip-off, they are a lot shyer reaching into their pockets on return visits. As for the 20k extra people that fit into the stadium. Their has not been much need for this capacity the last couple of year.

No need to get so worked up about this. There is a saving associated with implementing the investment 10 years quicker. 10 years x 20k people extra  x extra pub/hotel/meal income x VAT is the rough formula.


It's a stupid argument and you are grossly exaggerating the benefit of Croke Park to the economy. This money would likely be spent within the economy anyway and rather than funding a cash rich organisation like the GAA which has received investment from the government to the tune of hundreds of millions in the last decade, it would be best served if the GAA funded an awful lot more of these projects themselves - particularly with the social issues out there.

If the Government is investing in sports projects they should be investing in municipal facilities around the country which will give the community full value for the investment but given the political clout the GAA have they continually get grants and money they neither need or deserve.

They do invest in communities around the country, it's called the sports capital grant scheme.  I'm sure a genius like you on all things "freestate" knew that already.

Yes and the vast, vast amount of money of those sports grants goes to GAA clubs. The biggest grants awarded went to GAA clubs in 18 of 26 counties. There are actually more association football clubs and registered players in the 26 counties than GAA clubs and registered GAA players by comparison.

If you say so. One reason is an awful lot if soccer clubs play on council grounds and if you don't own your ground or have a long term lease you can't get money for developing it. Vast majority of gaa clubs own their grounds. Are you saying grant applications are being purposely biased to gaa? It's nonsense if you do. I belong to a soccer and gaa club and this year soccer club got way more funding than gaa club and reason was they submitted a better proposal. Don't be so cynical about everything.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on January 09, 2018, 08:01:00 PM
FFS will you stop ruining another thread.
Builder charges GAA Ä1m plus Ä135k VAT.
GAA gives builder Ä1,135,000.00.
Builder eventually pay the Ä135k to Revenue.

Indeed and when you stay in a hotel for a night going to Croke park you pay VAT on the room. If you buy a sandwich in Croke park you pay VAT on that and so on. If the old stadium took 60k and the new one 80k, that 20k more people buying and paying VAT. That is how the investment is justified.

What a load of horse sh1te! Investment or not from the government. Croke Park would have been finished. It might have taken 10 years longer. But it would have got there. Most frequent visitors that I know, know better than to spend money on food in Croke Park. They may do it once. But when they see the rip-off, they are a lot shyer reaching into their pockets on return visits. As for the 20k extra people that fit into the stadium. Their has not been much need for this capacity the last couple of year.

No need to get so worked up about this. There is a saving associated with implementing the investment 10 years quicker. 10 years x 20k people extra  x extra pub/hotel/meal income x VAT is the rough formula.


It's a stupid argument and you are grossly exaggerating the benefit of Croke Park to the economy. This money would likely be spent within the economy anyway and rather than funding a cash rich organisation like the GAA which has received investment from the government to the tune of hundreds of millions in the last decade, it would be best served if the GAA funded an awful lot more of these projects themselves - particularly with the social issues out there.

If the Government is investing in sports projects they should be investing in municipal facilities around the country which will give the community full value for the investment but given the political clout the GAA have they continually get grants and money they neither need or deserve.

They do invest in communities around the country, it's called the sports capital grant scheme.  I'm sure a genius like you on all things "freestate" knew that already.

Yes and the vast, vast amount of money of those sports grants goes to GAA clubs. The biggest grants awarded went to GAA clubs in 18 of 26 counties. There are actually more association football clubs and registered players in the 26 counties than GAA clubs and registered GAA players by comparison.

If you say so. One reason is an awful lot if soccer clubs play on council grounds and if you don't own your ground or have a long term lease you can't get money for developing it. Vast majority of gaa clubs own their grounds. Are you saying grant applications are being purposely biased to gaa? It's nonsense if you do. I belong to a soccer and gaa club and this year soccer club got way more funding than gaa club and reason was they submitted a better proposal. Don't be so cynical about everything.

Yes, the GAA have massive political pull.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 09, 2018, 09:27:09 PM
From lads who think Ireland could be playing classy successful football under a different manager, to lads who think Ireland would have being a great choice to host a rugby World Cup to the nonsense on this thread.

The more i look on Internet forums the more i think most irish people have no concept or understanding of global sport.

Going to be funny to see the reaction in a few years when elite GAA goes pro.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Real Talk on January 09, 2018, 09:30:59 PM
From lads who think Ireland could be playing classy successful football under a different manager, to lads who think Ireland would have being a great choice to host a rugby World Cup to the nonsense on this thread.

The more i look on Internet forums the more i think most irish people have no concept or understanding of global sport.

Going to be funny to see the reaction in a few years when elite GAA goes pro.

Will Jim McGuinnes be the first Official Gaelic Professional Football manager ?
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: bannside on January 09, 2018, 09:32:29 PM
Caprea, you come across as a pretty elite sort of guy yourself! Are you to tell us something?
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: johnneycool on January 11, 2018, 09:10:22 AM
From lads who think Ireland could be playing classy successful football under a different manager, to lads who think Ireland would have being a great choice to host a rugby World Cup to the nonsense on this thread.

The more i look on Internet forums the more i think most irish people have no concept or understanding of global sport.

Going to be funny to see the reaction in a few years when elite GAA goes pro.

How would Kildare fund a pro gaelic football team?

I know Down haven't the nails to scratch our own arses as like 90% of CB's in Ireland!
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Rossfan on January 11, 2018, 04:11:22 PM
In the highly unlikely event that Football (and what about the hurley bucks?) gets a full time professional layer it won't be possible to have County teams other than Dublin.
If such an eventuality ever came to pass you'd probably have 2 Dublin teams and at most 8 Regional teams.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: magpie seanie on January 12, 2018, 10:35:54 AM
In the highly unlikely event that Football (and what about the hurley bucks?) gets a full time professional layer it won't be possible to have County teams other than Dublin.
If such an eventuality ever came to pass you'd probably have 2 Dublin teams and at most 8 Regional teams.


It's going to happen unless there's a serious stance taken. I can't see anyone being able to stop it. Get used to it. It might mean the rest of us can go about our lives in peace and run club games in peace for the 99% of players not involved in county panels.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Rossfan on January 12, 2018, 10:46:55 AM
County panels will not be full time professional.
30 players, management and back up say 45 people at Ä65k each -nearly Ä3m x32
Add in 10 or 12 hurling Counties -- and your up to about  Ä125m.
And that's just wages.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Itchy on January 12, 2018, 11:39:46 AM
If it did go pro it would probably end up being 8 teams or so. Dublin, Kerry, cork maybe and the rest amalgamation of some sort. Hard to see where the draw for supporters would be.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: magpie seanie on January 12, 2018, 12:01:37 PM
Yes....it will be in the region of 8-12 for football and 6-8 for hurling I'd guess. It will happen though unless we get a President who radically changes course and someone who would do that will find it impossible to get elected.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Zulu on January 12, 2018, 01:05:12 PM
It wonít happen and anyone arguing it will are scaremongering in a Trumplike fashion - Make an outlandish claim with no supporters facts.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: magpie seanie on January 12, 2018, 01:11:03 PM
It wonít happen and anyone arguing it will are scaremongering in a Trumplike fashion - Make an outlandish claim with no supporters facts.


Whatever
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Zulu on January 12, 2018, 01:13:24 PM
Exactly, not a single supporting fact.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: magpie seanie on January 12, 2018, 01:19:43 PM
No - just the field I grow my f**ks in is barren dude.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Zulu on January 12, 2018, 01:33:18 PM
Do you wear your red baseball cap with the slogan ĎMake the GAA Great Againí in that field?
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: magpie seanie on January 12, 2018, 01:36:31 PM
I'm just stating an opinion of something I believe will happen. I'm not alone in that belief. Frankly I'm not too concerned what a GPA apologist like you thinks of my opinion. I understand why you want to deny it's happening. Like when lads are getting payment for playing intercounty - it's not payment for playing intercounty. It's really preserving the amateur ethos. I get it. These are not the droids you're looking for..... ::)
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Zulu on January 12, 2018, 01:41:34 PM
We can all try predict the future but to be taken seriously it needs to be based in some reality. Even a brief consideration of the issues would lead any sane person to the conclusion that a professional GAA would be highly unlikely. Nobody has ever been able to provide a detailed plan for how a professional GAA would be sustainable. So rant away if you want to but donít be surprised when your BS is called out.

GPA apologist, Jesus wept.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: johnneycool on January 12, 2018, 01:44:57 PM
Dublin aside I just don't see how the numbers could stack up.

Interpro rugby is held afloat by the international dimension that the GAA doesn't have and they're only supporting four teams.

Could Clare hurlers, Limerick hurlers, even Cork or Tipp hurlers with big fan bases go pro? I doubt it.



Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Kickham csc on January 12, 2018, 01:45:15 PM
Yes....it will be in the region of 8-12 for football and 6-8 for hurling I'd guess. It will happen though unless we get a President who radically changes course and someone who would do that will find it impossible to get elected.

If it was 8-12 counties going pro, why would anyone go to see the match who are from a county not playing?

The Antrim football community still attend the Ulster final, because Antrim are involved, but if Antrim were not a professional team, and not playing in a competition, what vested interest would I have in attending other games. I'll focus on the club scene.

If that happens then revenue would fall, which would hurt the ability of the GAA to maintain professional clubs.

Also, if the gaa goes professional, they can't stop players joining other counties. So Dublin would more than likely dominate.

If 1 or 2 teams dominate in a league, attendances will fall, again hurting the ability to support. So going pro will need 4-8 teams being competitive.

Lastly, diverting money to players means diverting money away from clubs and coaching initiatives. People loyal to clubs might boycott attending professional games if there is a sense that the games no longer benefit my community (as opposed to 90% of revenue reinvested into the GAA)

Lastly, if we go professional, is the GAA no longer a Tax exempt organization, if so, substantial money will again be diverted away.

So anyone who things that going professional is going to happen, need to consider the complexities and difficulties that going professional will present to the organization.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: magpie seanie on January 12, 2018, 02:12:25 PM
Yes....it will be in the region of 8-12 for football and 6-8 for hurling I'd guess. It will happen though unless we get a President who radically changes course and someone who would do that will find it impossible to get elected.

If it was 8-12 counties going pro, why would anyone go to see the match who are from a county not playing?

The Antrim football community still attend the Ulster final, because Antrim are involved, but if Antrim were not a professional team, and not playing in a competition, what vested interest would I have in attending other games. I'll focus on the club scene.

If that happens then revenue would fall, which would hurt the ability of the GAA to maintain professional clubs.

Also, if the gaa goes professional, they can't stop players joining other counties. So Dublin would more than likely dominate.

If 1 or 2 teams dominate in a league, attendances will fall, again hurting the ability to support. So going pro will need 4-8 teams being competitive.

Lastly, diverting money to players means diverting money away from clubs and coaching initiatives. People loyal to clubs might boycott attending professional games if there is a sense that the games no longer benefit my community (as opposed to 90% of revenue reinvested into the GAA)

Lastly, if we go professional, is the GAA no longer a Tax exempt organization, if so, substantial money will again be diverted away.

So anyone who things that going professional is going to happen, need to consider the complexities and difficulties that going professional will present to the organization.


Millions are being spent on preparing county teams each year......it's already happening. You'd have to estimate somewhere north of Ä40-50M a year spent by county boards alone annually on county teams.

I do concede though that the popularity of the pro game might wane after the initial years when the event junkies decide to go elsewhere. Which wouldn't bother me either. We could start afresh and run the association correctly.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Zulu on January 12, 2018, 02:24:02 PM
Fantasy stuff. If Ä40 million is being spent on IC teams at the moment then the money for preparation alone would double (at least) for full time squads. Add in wages for players and staff, upgrading home venues and maintaining training facilities etc. and the annual cost of maintaining a professional game would be astronomical. You donít care about reality though as you just want to rant and rave about the sky falling in. We canít address our real issues when people focus on imaginary boogeymen.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: magpie seanie on January 12, 2018, 02:39:04 PM
Fantasy stuff. If Ä40 million is being spent on IC teams at the moment then the money for preparation alone would double (at least) for full time squads. Add in wages for players and staff, upgrading home venues and maintaining training facilities etc. and the annual cost of maintaining a professional game would be astronomical. You donít care about reality though as you just want to rant and rave about the sky falling in. We canít address our real issues when people focus on imaginary boogeymen.


Sligo spent over Ä1m on county teams last year. That's on record, in their financial results. There are 32 counties. Most are bigger than Sligo. Some have very high level teams in both codes. It's a fair assumption that most counties spend more than Sligo. So I'd say Ä40M is a very conservative estimate and that's based on what's paid officially through the books.

To me this wouldn't be the sky falling in. I'd welcome it as it would be much more honest and workable than the shite and lies that goes on presently. So I'm not sure what you're on about with boogeymen. I couldn't care less if it's financially viable....I just want it to be up front and honest with everything on the table. What's happening nowadays is not viable and that's for certain sure. I'm more concerned about the 99%, rather than the privileged elite that the entire association is being run for.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Itchy on January 12, 2018, 03:14:14 PM
It could happen. Not that long ago large crowds used to attend Railway cup games, with the right promotion who knows what could happen. Big money partner with SKY who have form for this sort of thing.

I wouldnt like to see professionalism as it will kill the game just like it has killed rugby at every level except the elite.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Rossfan on January 12, 2018, 03:31:19 PM
Not a big enough population to sustain 32 professional football teams so you'd end up with 8 or 10 max regional teams.
They'd end up playing each other 3 or 4 times in a long boring League series which would end up flopping IMHO especially with no international outlet.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Zulu on January 12, 2018, 05:59:02 PM
Fantasy stuff. If Ä40 million is being spent on IC teams at the moment then the money for preparation alone would double (at least) for full time squads. Add in wages for players and staff, upgrading home venues and maintaining training facilities etc. and the annual cost of maintaining a professional game would be astronomical. You donít care about reality though as you just want to rant and rave about the sky falling in. We canít address our real issues when people focus on imaginary boogeymen.


Sligo spent over Ä1m on county teams last year. That's on record, in their financial results. There are 32 counties. Most are bigger than Sligo. Some have very high level teams in both codes. It's a fair assumption that most counties spend more than Sligo. So I'd say Ä40M is a very conservative estimate and that's based on what's paid officially through the books.

To me this wouldn't be the sky falling in. I'd welcome it as it would be much more honest and workable than the shite and lies that goes on presently. So I'm not sure what you're on about with boogeymen. I couldn't care less if it's financially viable....I just want it to be up front and honest with everything on the table. What's happening nowadays is not viable and that's for certain sure. I'm more concerned about the 99%, rather than the privileged elite that the entire association is being run for.

You've lost me now, so your not saying we are going professional? What's not up front, you've just quoted the figures for Sligo so what's been hidden. If you don't like what's going on then fine but there's no logic in claiming we are going professional when it would be a massively difficult transition.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 12, 2018, 06:54:49 PM
Can we assume firstly that if the game goes pro then the county format is gone?

I donít think anyone arguing for professionalism is saying there will be 32 pro teams. They are saying there will be about 10.

I wrote about one possible format and argued for professional here if anyone wants to read https://wp.me/p3MsvZ-14
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: lenny on January 12, 2018, 07:28:53 PM
Can we assume firstly that if the game goes pro then the county format is gone?

I donít think anyone arguing for professionalism is saying there will be 32 pro teams. They are saying there will be about 10.

I wrote about one possible format and argued for professional here if anyone wants to read https://wp.me/p3MsvZ-14

lol, you actually wasted time writing that? Ridiculous ideas.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Rossfan on January 12, 2018, 07:33:56 PM
We'd still be in a low population entity.
I want Ros and Kerry to form one team -sure haven't we 38 or 39 AIs between us.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 12, 2018, 07:35:02 PM
Can we assume firstly that if the game goes pro then the county format is gone?

I donít think anyone arguing for professionalism is saying there will be 32 pro teams. They are saying there will be about 10.

I wrote about one possible format and argued for professional here if anyone wants to read https://wp.me/p3MsvZ-14

lol, you actually wasted time writing that? Ridiculous ideas.

Well itís already happened to a large extent with rugby in this country in the 90s  but suit yourself
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: Syferus on January 12, 2018, 07:35:42 PM
We'd still be in a low population entity.
I want Ros and Kerry to form one team -sure haven't we 38 or 39 AIs between us.

They have no forwards thatíd get a start anyways.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: lenny on January 12, 2018, 09:42:39 PM
Can we assume firstly that if the game goes pro then the county format is gone?

I donít think anyone arguing for professionalism is saying there will be 32 pro teams. They are saying there will be about 10.

I wrote about one possible format and argued for professional here if anyone wants to read https://wp.me/p3MsvZ-14

lol, you actually wasted time writing that? Ridiculous ideas.

Well itís already happened to a large extent with rugby in this country in the 90s  but suit yourself

Everything that makes the gaa great is lost with your ideas. I have no interest whatsoever in watching some sort of regional team. I have a very strong allegiance to my club and county and I am happy to watch them regularly. Dublin would retain their support but none of the other regions would have a support base.
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: From the Bunker on January 13, 2018, 02:48:40 AM
Can we assume firstly that if the game goes pro then the county format is gone?

I donít think anyone arguing for professionalism is saying there will be 32 pro teams. They are saying there will be about 10.

I wrote about one possible format and argued for professional here if anyone wants to read https://wp.me/p3MsvZ-14

lol, you actually wasted time writing that? Ridiculous ideas.

Well itís already happened to a large extent with rugby in this country in the 90s  but suit yourself

Rugby is a minority sport in Ireland and had to create the Province/Club system.

Rugby historically had/has a natural allegiance to the Provinces.

Rugby has a international element, which its 4 clubs Piggyback on!

 
Title: Re: Tax breaks for intercounty footballers
Post by: caprea on January 13, 2018, 09:21:46 AM
Can we assume firstly that if the game goes pro then the county format is gone?

I donít think anyone arguing for professionalism is saying there will be 32 pro teams. They are saying there will be about 10.

I wrote about one possible format and argued for professional here if anyone wants to read https://wp.me/p3MsvZ-14

lol, you actually wasted time writing that? Ridiculous ideas.

Well itís already happened to a large extent with rugby in this country in the 90s  but suit yourself

Everything that makes the gaa great is lost with your ideas. I have no interest whatsoever in watching some sort of regional team. I have a very strong allegiance to my club and county and I am happy to watch them regularly. Dublin would retain their support but none of the other regions would have a support base.

You should tell that to all the Liverpool & Man U supporters in Ireland.