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GAA Discussion => Local GAA Discussion => Laois => Topic started by: The Monument Road on December 02, 2016, 01:18:10 PM

Title: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on December 02, 2016, 01:18:10 PM
Lots of club general meetings over the coming weeks. Was wondering is their any news/rumours regarding Gaels amalgamations for the coming year(football). I hear Kileen aproached Timahoe to join with them. Joe's /Barrowhouse is back on the agenda again.Cretty/Spink/Ballinakill is also being talked about. On the management front i hear P Clancy is with Graigue and Higgins is with Ballyroan although Kileshin are also interested in him. I also hear that Martin Murphy is gone from Stradbally(silly season talk IMO).
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on December 02, 2016, 03:44:57 PM
Joes/Barrowhouse should happen. The contribution from Barrowhouse would probably be small enough, so I'm sure Josephs are wondering if it would be worthwhile when you factor in a name change too. In many ways it wouldn't, but it does at least have method in its thinking because they play underage together.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: El Jefe on December 02, 2016, 04:20:21 PM
Fergal Byron not with Courtwood next year I hear. Eddie Kinsella's name mentioned to take over
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 06, 2016, 10:13:11 PM
Heard alot of these in the last few days, in football joesphs/barrowhouse together with the kingstons going back to barrowhouse, killen/timahoe going together, mountmellick/emo, cretty and spink back in with each other, in the hurling slieve bloom would prefer to go with castletown than ballinakill, ballyfin and mountmellick back together, colt and trumera going with each other, ballypickas and timahoe joining together and going to play with shanahoe as a gales team, im aware that many of these are probably nonsense just wondering if anyone else had heard of more
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: BallyroanAbu on December 06, 2016, 11:27:40 PM
Barrowhouse & Josephs I have heard.  Timahoe Heath thats all so far I have heard and I think Timahoe and Heath are looking seriously at it.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 07, 2016, 10:53:07 AM
Heard alot of these in the last few days, in football joesphs/barrowhouse together with the kingstons going back to barrowhouse, killen/timahoe going together, mountmellick/emo, cretty and spink back in with each other, in the hurling slieve bloom would prefer to go with castletown than ballinakill, ballyfin and mountmellick back together, colt and trumera going with each other, ballypickas and timahoe joining together and going to play with shanahoe as a gales team, im aware that many of these are probably nonsense just wondering if anyone else had heard of more

Sat here in work with a timahoe lad, its talk and difficult as the hurling/football divide is coming to a head, and heard that colt are reluctant to join with trumera as everyone else who joined with them ran a mile, apparently they wouldn't train in Kyle and play guys that don't train although that was only talk from a castletown man, could be fairytales
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 07, 2016, 11:28:32 AM
Sat here in work with a timahoe lad, its talk and difficult as the hurling/football divide is coming to a head, and heard that colt are reluctant to join with trumera as everyone else who joined with them ran a mile, apparently they wouldn't train in Kyle and play guys that don't train although that was only talk from a castletown man, could be fairytales
[/quote]

I was told by one of the colt selectors from last year that it was happening, i suppose the differences between trumera/kyle and the colt/trumera partnership are that colt is the senior partner and trumera wont be able to dictate terms like they did with kyle, essentially the shoe is on the other foot, also the fact they are neighbouring clubs and play together at underage should work favourbly for them, dont suppose the castlefown man mentioned a gales team with slieve bloom.

Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 07, 2016, 12:02:18 PM
Sat here in work with a timahoe lad, its talk and difficult as the hurling/football divide is coming to a head, and heard that colt are reluctant to join with trumera as everyone else who joined with them ran a mile, apparently they wouldn't train in Kyle and play guys that don't train although that was only talk from a castletown man, could be fairytales

I was told by one of the colt selectors from last year that it was happening, i suppose the differences between trumera/kyle and the colt/trumera partnership are that colt is the senior partner and trumera wont be able to dictate terms like they did with kyle, essentially the shoe is on the other foot, also the fact they are neighbouring clubs and play together at underage should work favourbly for them, dont suppose the castlefown man mentioned a gales team with slieve bloom.

That sounds more like it anyway, geographically it makes sense, and yeah he said ballinakill even offered to put slieve bloom crest on jerseys, but the players aka ben Conroy would rather hurl with castletown ad he hurled all the way up along with the same lads his age, either way he wants senior club hurling
[/quote]
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: oneflewoverthecuckoonest on December 07, 2016, 12:42:48 PM
I would think the chances of colt-trumera or castletown-slieve bloom linking up are the same as portlaoise-clonad linking up, slim or nil... too much bad blood between the clubs or individuals within the clubs.

the only real hurling case to resolved will be what if anything happens with timahoe hurlers.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on December 07, 2016, 12:54:44 PM
I would think the chances of colt-trumera or castletown-slieve bloom linking up are the same as portlaoise-clonad linking up, slim or nil... too much bad blood between the clubs or individuals within the clubs.

the only real hurling case to resolved will be what if anything happens with timahoe hurlers.
+1. There hasn't been a word of truth spoken on this entire subject. Laughable stuff being posted.

Have Timahoe held an AGM yet?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 07, 2016, 01:12:43 PM
In fairness i think its far more likely for a colt/trumera and castletown/slieve bloom gales than portlaoise/clonad. From what i was told there are around 7 lads in timahoe who want to hurl with ballypickas (believe alot of the players are quite friendly with each other) and that ballypickas are quite receptive to this happening so it is basically coming down to the timahoe committee, don like i said in the first post alot of this could be bullshit, im just relaying what ive heard
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 07, 2016, 01:19:00 PM
I would think the chances of colt-trumera or castletown-slieve bloom linking up are the same as portlaoise-clonad linking up, slim or nil... too much bad blood between the clubs or individuals within the clubs.

the only real hurling case to resolved will be what if anything happens with timahoe hurlers.
+1. There hasn't been a word of truth spoken on this entire subject. Laughable stuff being posted.

Have Timahoe held an AGM yet?
I'm not claiming its fact, as I stated it was just what I heard
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 07, 2016, 05:34:31 PM
I would think the chances of colt-trumera or castletown-slieve bloom linking up are the same as portlaoise-clonad linking up, slim or nil... too much bad blood between the clubs or individuals within the clubs.

the only real hurling case to resolved will be what if anything happens with timahoe hurlers.

Come out from under that rock will you.
I assume you are not privy to the inner workings of Colt, Trumera, Castletown, Slieve Bloom and all other hurling clubs in Laois.

Also, I don't see Timahoe hurlers as more "in-demand" than those from any of the clubs above.
IMO- the splitting of a club into hurling and football factions is a dangerous road to be going down!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 07, 2016, 05:50:05 PM
This is a thread that keeps on giving....

Lads with axes to grind and agendas to push posing baseless rumours as fact or "hearsay".

I know of one timahoe hurler who on reading this said he didnt realise they were in such demand.

let the bidding commence........



Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 07, 2016, 07:25:34 PM
This is a thread that keeps on giving....

Lads with axes to grind and agendas to push posing baseless rumours as fact or "hearsay".

I know of one timahoe hurler who on reading this said he didnt realise they were in such demand.

let the bidding commence........

Pub talk lol if a club has the numbers they shouldn't be let join by the county board in my opinion and transfers are given out too easily, trumera,Kyle,slieve bloom,colt can only stay going so long on the hurling front, I haven't a clue about football clubs and couldn't name the Laois starting 15 without Google
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 07, 2016, 09:17:11 PM
Colt and slieve bloom have numbers and a juvenile system so cant see how they can be compared with kyle and trumera which in fairness are tiny areas, especially trumera
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballygowen on December 07, 2016, 09:35:31 PM
Colt, Shanahoe, Clonad and part of Trumera are all in the same Parish. why they dont all join together is beyond me. Probably too much bad blood between them all. But they are struggling for numbers on their own, they should look into a amalgamation. it worked for Rathdowney Erill, Borriss Kilcotten, Clough Ballacolla and the Harps (Culahill and Durrow) who were a competitive senior team for years.

Ballypicass and Ballinakill you'd think could join too as some of them would play together for spink football plus geographically there are side by side, let timahooe come in with them too.

i would be in favour for gaels and or amalgamations as there is too many small clubs in laois where the population isnt high, it would have to make for a stronger standard.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 07, 2016, 09:43:00 PM
Colt, Shanahoe, Clonad and part of Trumera are all in the same Parish. why they dont all join together is beyond me. Probably too much bad blood between them all. But they are struggling for numbers on their own, they should look into a amalgamation. it worked for Rathdowney Erill, Borriss Kilcotten, Clough Ballacolla and the Harps (Culahill and Durrow) who were a competitive senior team for years.

Ballypicass and Ballinakill you'd think could join too as some of them would play together for spink football plus geographically there are side by side, let timahooe come in with them too.

i would be in favour for gaels and or amalgamations as there is too many small clubs in laois where the population isnt high, it would have to make for a stronger standard.

All very good points, and you are right in hindsight regarding Kyle and trumera with no underage, Kyle young lads can play with camross,roscrea or b/k and in a couple of cases the players have choose to stay with those clubs altogether,e.g arien Delaney,Darren Gilmartin, Conor Quinlan is going this year and trumera have had a phenomenal run in the last 10-12 years with players representing county and winning their respective championships when stuck for numbers, clonad,trumera,colt would be good for all clubs involved but one would argue the"giving away identity" argument, does Chris Murray still hurl?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 07, 2016, 10:16:42 PM
Colt, Shanahoe, Clonad and part of Trumera are all in the same Parish. why they dont all join together is beyond me. Probably too much bad blood between them all. But they are struggling for numbers on their own, they should look into a amalgamation. it worked for Rathdowney Erill, Borriss Kilcotten, Clough Ballacolla and the Harps (Culahill and Durrow) who were a competitive senior team for years.

Ballypicass and Ballinakill you'd think could join too as some of them would play together for spink football plus geographically there are side by side, let timahooe come in with them too.

i would be in favour for gaels and or amalgamations as there is too many small clubs in laois where the population isnt high, it would have to make for a stronger standard.

All very good points, and you are right in hindsight regarding Kyle and trumera with no underage, Kyle young lads can play with camross,roscrea or b/k and in a couple of cases the players have choose to stay with those clubs altogether,e.g arien Delaney,Darren Gilmartin, Conor Quinlan is going this year and trumera have had a phenomenal run in the last 10-12 years with players representing county and winning their respective championships when stuck for numbers, clonad,trumera,colt would be good for all clubs involved but one would argue the"giving away identity" argument, does Chris Murray still hurl?

I dont actually see having small clubs as a problem as long as they have an outlet available to them to play at a higher level, quinlan and gilmartin are proof that there is talent at smaller clubs, unfortunately bar you play for a senior club these players are flat out ignored, would ben conroy have played for laois if he hadnt played senior? Highly unlikely. Even this year we saw how the gales link up between ballyfin and mountmellick showed how good donnacha harnett is and there  are more like him, MJ Lalor and Robbie Foyle spring to mind. Unfortunately any promising young hurler feels necessary to go play for a senior club to be recognised at county level, as for your question about chris murray yes he still plays
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 08, 2016, 08:24:51 AM
Colt, Shanahoe, Clonad and part of Trumera are all in the same Parish. why they dont all join together is beyond me. Probably too much bad blood between them all. But they are struggling for numbers on their own, they should look into a amalgamation. it worked for Rathdowney Erill, Borriss Kilcotten, Clough Ballacolla and the Harps (Culahill and Durrow) who were a competitive senior team for years.

Ballypicass and Ballinakill you'd think could join too as some of them would play together for spink football plus geographically there are side by side, let timahooe come in with them too.

i would be in favour for gaels and or amalgamations as there is too many small clubs in laois where the population isnt high, it would have to make for a stronger standard.

All very good points, and you are right in hindsight regarding Kyle and trumera with no underage, Kyle young lads can play with camross,roscrea or b/k and in a couple of cases the players have choose to stay with those clubs altogether,e.g arien Delaney,Darren Gilmartin, Conor Quinlan is going this year and trumera have had a phenomenal run in the last 10-12 years with players representing county and winning their respective championships when stuck for numbers, clonad,trumera,colt would be good for all clubs involved but one would argue the"giving away identity" argument, does Chris Murray still hurl?

I dont actually see having small clubs as a problem as long as they have an outlet available to them to play at a higher level, quinlan and gilmartin are proof that there is talent at smaller clubs, unfortunately bar you play for a senior club these players are flat out ignored, would ben conroy have played for laois if he hadnt played senior? Highly unlikely. Even this year we saw how the gales link up between ballyfin and mountmellick showed how good donnacha harnett is and there  are more like him, MJ Lalor and Robbie Foyle spring to mind. Unfortunately any promising young hurler feels necessary to go play for a senior club to be recognised at county level, as for your question about chris murray yes he still plays

Yeah the foyles are good hurlers in timahoe and Dylan lawlor of trumeta is one to watch
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballygowen on December 08, 2016, 09:03:24 AM
Yeah they are good hurlers in the grade they are playing, but in order for them to excel it's important for the like of those hurlers to be hurling at a higher standard. But in some cases they won't get the chance as their club isn't good enough to play at higher standards, hence why I would be in favour of Gaels or amalgamation teams. Gives them young lads a better chance.

Tcrilly you're right in that some clubs won't want to lose the identity of their club which stops them from joining with others.

With the club amalgamations mentioned do any of you think they could play in the senior championship straight away and be competitive? Personally I don't think so, they would have to play in senior B championship first. I wouldn't think in their first year they would be good enough for senior champs.!!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 08, 2016, 10:07:33 AM
Yeah they are good hurlers in the grade they are playing, but in order for them to excel it's important for the like of those hurlers to be hurling at a higher standard. But in some cases they won't get the chance as their club isn't good enough to play at higher standards, hence why I would be in favour of Gaels or amalgamation teams. Gives them young lads a better chance.

Tcrilly you're right in that some clubs won't want to lose the identity of their club which stops them from joining with others.

With the club amalgamations mentioned do any of you think they could play in the senior championship straight away and be competitive? Personally I don't think so, they would have to play in senior B championship first. I wouldn't think in their first year they would be good enough for senior champs.!!
Yeah I agree, I play for roscrea but live in Laois, we wouldn't win the Laois championship or come close, I agree with amalgamations and gaels for smaller clubs with poor numbers but not for clubs with 2 teams That have the numbers
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on December 08, 2016, 11:17:09 AM
The parish rule should apply to these amalgamations. Nothing outside, because in truth it's just messy. We should be looking to put something long term in place, not just prostituting players and clubs to the highest bidder. If you play for a Junior or Intermediate club, and there's a Senior club in your Parish, you should have access to that level. If there is no Senior Club in the Parish, then the remaining clubs should be allowed to enter a Gaels team at Senior level. Clubs joining together from across the Parish divide is a short term and glory hunting solution that does nothing for the future, because there probably won't be a future. The Laois County Board need to step up here. I am sick reading about these potential short term marriages of convenience. Keep it simple and pass a very simple rule that ensures every lad has access to Senior grade.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 08, 2016, 11:32:41 AM
The parish rule should apply to these amalgamations. Nothing outside, because in truth it's just messy. We should be looking to put something long term in place, not just prostituting players and clubs to the highest bidder. If you play for a Junior or Intermediate club, and there's a Senior club in your Parish, you should have access to that level. If there is no Senior Club in the Parish, then the remaining clubs should be allowed to enter a Gaels team at Senior level. Clubs joining together from across the Parish divide is a short term and glory hunting solution that does nothing for the future, because there probably won't be a future. The Laois County Board need to step up here. I am sick reading about these potential short term marriages of convenience. Keep it simple and pass a very simple rule that ensures every lad has access to Senior grade.

First pint is on me, couldn't disagree with one word
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 08, 2016, 04:55:49 PM
Playing god here lads and i fully expect to be torn apart and told why this couldnt work,but my overiding aim is to expose as many lads as possible that want to play hurling at the highest level in the county while also broadening the hurling base available to the Inter County set up.

14 Teams

Roinn 1

Borris Kilcotton Kyle
Camross
Rathdowney Erril
Abbeyleix
Clough Ballacolla
Portlaoise
The Harps

Roinn 2
Shanahoe/Colt/Clonad/Trumera (Raheen Parish Gaels)
Castletown/Slieve Bloom
Ballyfin
Clonaslee
Mountrath
Rosenallis
Ballinakill/Ballypickas/Park/Timahoe

All non fully amalgamated outfits would have the option of fielding their own club teams in the intermediate.



Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: HURLING1 on December 08, 2016, 06:00:57 PM
If Laois  are serious about improving the county team every  young player needs access to Senior Hurling.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 08, 2016, 07:53:55 PM
The parish rule should apply to these amalgamations. Nothing outside, because in truth it's just messy. We should be looking to put something long term in place, not just prostituting players and clubs to the highest bidder. If you play for a Junior or Intermediate club, and there's a Senior club in your Parish, you should have access to that level. If there is no Senior Club in the Parish, then the remaining clubs should be allowed to enter a Gaels team at Senior level. Clubs joining together from across the Parish divide is a short term and glory hunting solution that does nothing for the future, because there probably won't be a future. The Laois County Board need to step up here. I am sick reading about these potential short term marriages of convenience. Keep it simple and pass a very simple rule that ensures every lad has access to Senior grade.

100%. In Hurling there is no future for Ballyfin Gaels etc. Like there was no future for Tinnahinch.

Borris Kilcotton, Rathdowney Errill have worked. As would St Fintan's Raheen and Castletown Slieve Bloom, Mountrath Trumera etc. They are logical and workable arrangements that make sense.
County Board have their hands tied to some degree by the Official Guide. But I think they could be alot more proactive and edge clubs towards the Parish Club scenario.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 08, 2016, 07:55:44 PM
Playing god here lads and i fully expect to be torn apart and told why this couldnt work,but my overiding aim is to expose as many lads as possible that want to play hurling at the highest level in the county while also broadening the hurling base available to the Inter County set up.

14 Teams

Roinn 1

Borris Kilcotton Kyle
Camross
Rathdowney Erril
Abbeyleix
Clough Ballacolla
Portlaoise
The Harps

Roinn 2
Shanahoe/Colt/Clonad/Trumera (Raheen Parish Gaels)
Castletown/Slieve Bloom
Ballyfin
Clonaslee
Mountrath
Rosenallis
Ballinakill/Ballypickas/Park/Timahoe

All non fully amalgamated outfits would have the option of fielding their own club teams in the intermediate.

Interesting. Just wondering how Portlaoise and The Harps (relegated this year) get into Roinn 1 ahead of Ballinakill (semi this year) and Castletown SB (promoted this year)?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Heshs Umpire on December 08, 2016, 07:59:12 PM
Playing god here lads and i fully expect to be torn apart and told why this couldnt work,but my overiding aim is to expose as many lads as possible that want to play hurling at the highest level in the county while also broadening the hurling base available to the Inter County set up.

14 Teams

Roinn 1

Borris Kilcotton Kyle
Camross
Rathdowney Erril
Abbeyleix
Clough Ballacolla
Portlaoise
The Harps

Roinn 2
Shanahoe/Colt/Clonad/Trumera (Raheen Parish Gaels)
Castletown/Slieve Bloom
Ballyfin
Clonaslee
Mountrath
Rosenallis
Ballinakill/Ballypickas/Park/Timahoe

All non fully amalgamated outfits would have the option of fielding their own club teams in the intermediate.

I've seen worse ideas. That's not a bad template at all. I presume Ballyfin would have Mountmellick on board?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballygowen on December 08, 2016, 08:59:08 PM
I too have seen worse ideas, i get what you're saying  Keyser Söze in regards to Balinakill. with all the amalgamations listed below they may have big areas but the population in them areas would be very low. theres probably more people in on of the housing estates in Abbeyliex than there would be in all of Trumera!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 08, 2016, 09:24:31 PM
Just a stab at it lads,done on the back of an envelope

Apologies to Mountrath for omitting them ,Ballyfin would  be an option for them

As regards the make up of the 2 Roinns,I've no doubt cases could be made for a few teams to be moved up or down.

My aim wasn't to disrespect or insult anyone,just a bit of daydreaming on my part.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 13, 2016, 10:00:21 PM
Just a stab at it lads,done on the back of an envelope

Apologies to Mountrath for omitting them ,Ballyfin would  be an option for them

As regards the make up of the 2 Roinns,I've no doubt cases could be made for a few teams to be moved up or down.

My aim wasn't to disrespect or insult anyone,just a bit of daydreaming on my part.

Same as myself, hurling mad we are for a small hurling county :)
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Uisce on December 14, 2016, 10:46:24 AM
The Heath and Timahoe amalgamation seems to be almost done. That will be a very strong senior team if they can work together. Heard a another Gaels is almost done too, ( a strange combination in terms of geography!! ) Most lads who want senior football will get exposure now anyway.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: El Jefe on December 14, 2016, 11:11:33 AM
The Heath and Timahoe amalgamation seems to be almost done. That will be a very strong senior team if they can work together. Heard a another Gaels is almost done too, ( a strange combination in terms of geography!! ) Most lads who want senior football will get exposure now anyway.
How does something like this actually work can someone explain? I mean with regards to where they train and play, who manages, what happens the extra players that wouldn't make the new panel etc
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on December 14, 2016, 11:26:48 AM
The Heath and Timahoe amalgamation seems to be almost done. That will be a very strong senior team if they can work together. Heard a another Gaels is almost done too, ( a strange combination in terms of geography!! ) Most lads who want senior football will get exposure now anyway.
How does something like this actually work can someone explain? I mean with regards to where they train and play, who manages, what happens the extra players that wouldn't make the new panel etc
Picture it as an entirely new club, that only the elite players will have access to. I don't mean that in a snobby way, but its best that everyone view it thusly and that way both clubs can continue to perform and slipstream with the new entity. Neither club should expect immediate success, but inevitably they will and generally thats why these fall flat on their arses.

I still don't see this making it by one of the clubs EGM's.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: BallyroanAbu on December 14, 2016, 11:46:49 AM
Whats wrong with Timahoe & the Heath joining up,  I would prefer clubs geographically better located but this makes our club championship harder and everyone up's their game accordingly.  Player get the opportunity to play at the highest level while maintaining links to their old club this is good for everyone.  How good would Josephs be if they join Barrowhouse.  It is all dependent on your aspirations as a club,  both clubs into the future will struggle for numbers why not join together form a stronger unit and see where that takes you.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Laoiseabu on December 14, 2016, 11:48:47 AM
Mountmellick and Emo ? Mountmellick have put up a big news announcement coming soon on their Facebook/Twitter page
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on December 14, 2016, 12:00:51 PM
Whats wrong with Timahoe & the Heath joining up,  I would prefer clubs geographically better located but this makes our club championship harder and everyone up's their game accordingly.  Player get the opportunity to play at the highest level while maintaining links to their old club this is good for everyone.  How good would Josephs be if they join Barrowhouse.  It is all dependent on your aspirations as a club,  both clubs into the future will struggle for numbers why not join together form a stronger unit and see where that takes you.
Timahoe were a senior outfit only a year or two ago. Its not like Donal Miller in Annanough where he was blackguarded by the system. I doubt we're exposing a huge amount of players in Timahoe to Senior ball that haven't already had it, or wouldn't have it again if they got their shit together.

Barrowhouse is a different situation and better befits the benefits of a Junior club forming a gaels with a Senior one. Albeit its a big step for Barrowhouse because they could easily be swallowed whole by Josephs.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on December 14, 2016, 12:03:28 PM
Mountmellick and Emo ? Mountmellick have put up a big news announcement coming soon on their Facebook/Twitter page
With a Today FM logo?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Uisce on December 14, 2016, 12:13:51 PM
I would imagine that the Timahoe lads main focus will still be on getting promotion from intermediate, which will probably be the biggest issue in this amalgamation. Intermediate and Senior championship is usually on the same weekend, will the CB be sympathetic on this front and change fixtures based on this?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on December 14, 2016, 12:32:08 PM
No go for Josephs Barrowhouse. Josephs voted it down again. It appears to be an aggressive environment out there at the moment and standing still could probably mean being left behind.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: El Jefe on December 14, 2016, 12:47:46 PM
So say Timahoe and The Heath do join, they'll play as a Gaels team in the Senior Championship. Timahoe will still have their team in the Intermediate and The Heaths non-selected players will have to make do with playing in the Junior. Then next year if Timahoe happened to win the Intermediate the amalgamation would break up and The Heath would have to go calling on the lads that they didn't want to come back and play Senior again - is this right?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on December 14, 2016, 12:59:50 PM
So say Timahoe and The Heath do join, they'll play as a Gaels team in the Senior Championship. Timahoe will still have their team in the Intermediate and The Heaths non-selected players will have to make do with playing in the Junior. Then next year if Timahoe happened to win the Intermediate the amalgamation would break up and The Heath would have to go calling on the lads that they didn't want to come back and play Senior again - is this right?
As every captain says, the subs are as important as the players. So they are.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on December 14, 2016, 01:36:22 PM
No go for Josephs Barrowhouse. Josephs voted it down again. It appears to be an aggressive environment out there at the moment and standing still could probably mean being left behind.
Opens the door for Kileen/Barrowhouse Gaels. Mind you quite a few in Barrowhouse would prefer tha as some of them are very much against the Josephs Gaels. I can also understand Josephs view point as they are doing massive work with their juveiles and in reality the Gaels proposal was to accomodate one player......it seems some Barrowhouse players would rather the Kileen option
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 14, 2016, 02:10:44 PM
So say Timahoe and The Heath do join, they'll play as a Gaels team in the Senior Championship. Timahoe will still have their team in the Intermediate and The Heaths non-selected players will have to make do with playing in the Junior. Then next year if Timahoe happened to win the Intermediate the amalgamation would break up and The Heath would have to go calling on the lads that they didn't want to come back and play Senior again - is this right?

The Agreement will be only a year in duration?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: El Jefe on December 14, 2016, 02:19:54 PM
So say Timahoe and The Heath do join, they'll play as a Gaels team in the Senior Championship. Timahoe will still have their team in the Intermediate and The Heaths non-selected players will have to make do with playing in the Junior. Then next year if Timahoe happened to win the Intermediate the amalgamation would break up and The Heath would have to go calling on the lads that they didn't want to come back and play Senior again - is this right?

The Agreement will be only a year in duration?
No I mean if Timahoe win Intermediate and go back Senior does it end then or what happens?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 14, 2016, 02:28:26 PM
So say Timahoe and The Heath do join, they'll play as a Gaels team in the Senior Championship. Timahoe will still have their team in the Intermediate and The Heaths non-selected players will have to make do with playing in the Junior. Then next year if Timahoe happened to win the Intermediate the amalgamation would break up and The Heath would have to go calling on the lads that they didn't want to come back and play Senior again - is this right?

The Agreement will be only a year in duration?
No I mean if Timahoe win Intermediate and go back Senior does it end then or what happens?

im sure that contingency would be addressed in their agreement.

also does it have to be passed by a 2/3 majority at each clubs EGM?.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: BallyroanAbu on December 14, 2016, 03:08:02 PM
If you want a serious Laois Senior Championship then let's see how this goes.  If it does not work I am sure we can revert back to type.  I think it's going to be brilliant no standing still for anyone, we will all have to up our game and to be honest we have but I think we are going have to find another gear.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Unlaoised on December 14, 2016, 03:51:14 PM
Timahoe and the Heath together doesn't make any sort of Sense to me......
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on December 14, 2016, 04:17:21 PM
No go for Josephs Barrowhouse. Josephs voted it down again. It appears to be an aggressive environment out there at the moment and standing still could probably mean being left behind.
Opens the door for Kileen/Barrowhouse Gaels. Mind you quite a few in Barrowhouse would prefer tha as some of them are very much against the Josephs Gaels. I can also understand Josephs view point as they are doing massive work with their juveiles and in reality the Gaels proposal was to accomodate one player......it seems some Barrowhouse players would rather the Kileen option

Have they short memories in Barrowhouse?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Helix on December 14, 2016, 05:33:10 PM
Mountmellick and Emo ? Mountmellick have put up a big news announcement coming soon on their Facebook/Twitter page

Hardly John O Loughlin coming back to Mountmellick? If it is it's a serious boost for them.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on December 14, 2016, 05:45:36 PM
Mountmellick and Emo ? Mountmellick have put up a big news announcement coming soon on their Facebook/Twitter page

Hardly John O Loughlin coming back to Mountmellick? If it is it's a serious boost for them.
A recent post on Instagram would suggest so
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Laois fan on December 15, 2016, 03:46:32 PM
Timahoe and the Heath seems strange to me,the Heath won the league this year and because of a near relegation experience they now decide they need to join.While joes voted down joining up with barrow house it looks like they are going to poach their best player which will surely destroy this small club.To me all these amalgamations are a quick fix with no long term benefit ,maybe clubs should follow the stradbally mould and just put in a big effort next year
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: El Jefe on December 15, 2016, 04:18:27 PM
The Heath are losing a serious amount of players that are heading abroad apparently
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Helix on December 15, 2016, 04:29:06 PM
The Heath are losing a serious amount of players that are heading abroad apparently

Knee jerk reaction to lads going abroad. At least 4 gone off it so I believe. Can't see timahoe thing happening. Emo would be a better option of a gaels route if ever a gaels were to happen.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on December 15, 2016, 05:00:25 PM
Timahoe and the Heath seems strange to me,the Heath won the league this year and because of a near relegation experience they now decide they need to join.While joes voted down joining up with barrow house it looks like they are going to poach their best player which will surely destroy this small club.To me all these amalgamations are a quick fix with no long term benefit ,maybe clubs should follow the stradbally mould and just put in a big effort next year

it's a crazy system which tells a lad at 21 that he must walk away from the set up he grew up playing in and go back to his Junior/Intermediate club. There may not be anywhere near the level of training that he knew at underage and so he loses out. Maybe the answer to all this is a draft system for players outside of Senior grade. It would probably work easier than amalgamating clubs for short periods of time
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on December 15, 2016, 06:21:51 PM
Timahoe and the Heath seems strange to me,the Heath won the league this year and because of a near relegation experience they now decide they need to join.While joes voted down joining up with barrow house it looks like they are going to poach their best player which will surely destroy this small club.To me all these amalgamations are a quick fix with no long term benefit ,maybe clubs should follow the stradbally mould and just put in a big effort next year

it's a crazy system which tells a lad at 21 that he must walk away from the set up he grew up playing in and go back to his Junior/Intermediate club. There may not be anywhere near the level of training that he knew at underage and so he loses out. Maybe the answer to all this is a draft system for players outside of Senior grade. It would probably work easier than amalgamating clubs for short periods of time

So if you're a Senior club there should be draft system of best non senior players ?
This is a ridiculous idea. Clubs aren't clubs anymore if this is the case. I've said it many times but senior clubs should not be allowed form a gaels team. However if a group of intermediate/Junior clubs got together preferably in the same region. Examples in other counties would be South Kerry, West Kerry , Kenmare district etc. Clubs who are Senior on merit shouldn't need "gaels" players.  It is a farce in my opinion. However if the county board was truly bothered by  the plight of the "intermediate/junior" footballer then they would be setting up regional teams . I'd suggest two (seeing as we are a small county). Set up district boards to run these teams , possibly run district competitions as well. Sadly I know the county board will not do this but one can dream. The benefits I believe will vastly outweigh the initial struggle to get it off the ground.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on December 15, 2016, 07:17:00 PM
A draft based on an existing relationship. Parish or underage amalgamation being two examples. Not just a draft to the highest bidder. As mentioned above, it appears as if Barrowhouse are about to lose their biggest asset - again. We have to find ways of keeping lads in their home club, but at the same time giving them access to Senior football/hurling. If the draft is underpinned by an existing relationship, then we can avoid unnecessary and damaging transfers.

I think we need to look beyond amalgamations that won't last pissing time. They assume, wrongly in my opinion, that all players in both clubs will be in favour of joining up. This should be about an individual's decision to play or not play Senior, and where he wants to, we need to facilitate that as best we can
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on December 15, 2016, 09:51:42 PM
A draft based on an existing relationship. Parish or underage amalgamation being two examples. Not just a draft to the highest bidder. As mentioned above, it appears as if Barrowhouse are about to lose their biggest asset - again. We have to find ways of keeping lads in their home club, but at the same time giving them access to Senior football/hurling. If the draft is underpinned by an existing relationship, then we can avoid unnecessary and damaging transfers.

I think we need to look beyond amalgamations that won't last pissing time. They assume, wrongly in my opinion, that all players in both clubs will be in favour of joining up. This should be about an individual's decision to play or not play Senior, and where he wants to, we need to facilitate that as best we can

If this transfer does go through the Josephs / Barrowhouse underage  partnership could be resigned to to the history books. I think the stumbling block for the gaels/draft situation is the barring from Leinster championship if a team can win a championship. Josephs would believe (rightly or wrongly) that they would be at least on a par with stradbally and could therefore win a championship and do well in Leinster.  By taking on one possibly more from Barrowhouse they jeopardise this.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 16, 2016, 01:47:38 AM
Surely the county board shouldnt allow a transfer of a barrowhouse player to josephs to happen, they literely just turned down the oppurtunity to have the player play for them
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: From the Terrace on December 16, 2016, 09:43:49 AM
agree this transfer is a disgrace & should be turned down, presume this is daly. Josephs are pulling a dirty one there.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on December 16, 2016, 10:08:32 AM
Dirty probably isn't the right word. Cute may be a better description.  It's not necessary in any case. He has played there all his young life and he should be allowed to play on, and still represent Barrowhouse. It has happened before, looks like happening again and will become more of an issue in the future.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on December 16, 2016, 10:21:34 AM
A draft based on an existing relationship. Parish or underage amalgamation being two examples. Not just a draft to the highest bidder. As mentioned above, it appears as if Barrowhouse are about to lose their biggest asset - again. We have to find ways of keeping lads in their home club, but at the same time giving them access to Senior football/hurling. If the draft is underpinned by an existing relationship, then we can avoid unnecessary and damaging transfers.

I think we need to look beyond amalgamations that won't last pissing time. They assume, wrongly in my opinion, that all players in both clubs will be in favour of joining up. This should be about an individual's decision to play or not play Senior, and where he wants to, we need to facilitate that as best we can

If this transfer does go through the Josephs / Barrowhouse underage  partnership could be resigned to to the history books. I think the stumbling block for the gaels/draft situation is the barring from Leinster championship if a team can win a championship. Josephs would believe (rightly or wrongly) that they would be at least on a par with stradbally and could therefore win a championship and do well in Leinster.  By taking on one possibly more from Barrowhouse they jeopardise this.

A simple bye law would change all that.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Unlaoised on December 16, 2016, 03:23:02 PM
agree this transfer is a disgrace & should be turned down, presume this is daly. Josephs are pulling a dirty one there.

This stinks..... >:(
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: From the Terrace on December 16, 2016, 04:07:17 PM
an opinion everyone is entitled to one.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 16, 2016, 09:59:04 PM
Timahoe Egm called for next Monday night
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on December 16, 2016, 10:36:20 PM
Timahoe having to stomach the prospect of tossing both their football and hurling teams in the space of a month. Strange times.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: town1980 on December 17, 2016, 09:52:05 AM
A farce really joining teams that aren't parish related Timahoe should take a look at themselves ,, they have always produced great footballers but looks like the club is in a right mess,,there players officials and all associated with the club should take a hard look at themselves,,, if u join you join with your Parish if not leave it be
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: BallyroanAbu on December 17, 2016, 10:32:52 AM
Timahoe asked a few clubs would they be interested they said no the Heath said maybe, nothing disgraceful in that.   Timahoe not giving up their Football & Junior C Hurling is hardly the end of the world.  We are having to give up Junior C Football as lads are not interested in traipsing all over Laois on a Wednesday night.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on December 17, 2016, 10:42:19 AM
agree this transfer is a disgrace & should be turned down, presume this is daly. Josephs are pulling a dirty one there.

This stinks..... >:(

It's not pretty, that's for sure. Josephs rejected the amalgamation at their AGM, but Barrowhouse approved it. Now if Barrowhouse are happy to let him play, and come back to them to play Intermediate, you can only assume that Josephs don't fancy changing their name, which is odd because they have won so much at underage with the Josephs/Barrowhouse banner. So it appears as if Josephs are sitting back and forcing the lad's hand, which doesn't seem fair on the lad himself. Talk about not competing in Leinster is pie in the sky in my opinion.

My argument is that where there is an existing relationship (parish or underage amalgamation), the rite of passage should be automatic for Junior and Intermediate players. There is too much upheaval patching together teams from across the divide when it could be as simple as Brendan Quigley walking down the road to play with Stradbally or Timahoe joining with Annanough. Above all, the CB need to protect the individual that actually wants to better himself, rather than singling him out and/or subjecting him to potential abuse
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 17, 2016, 05:19:48 PM
We are having to give up Junior C Football as lads are not interested in traipsing all over Laois on a Wednesday night.
[/quote

I know that thiz doesnt have much to do with gales teams but i feel that the way the county board restructured the leagues have been an absolute disaster really, and is damaging alot of club due to so many matches been forfeited,especially when you get past 1a and 1b. Why they couldnt just follow the hurling structure ill never know, there was 58 teams in the leagues last year, have 6 divisions of 8 teams with the 7th (junior c) division been split into two groups of 5 based on geography because as abu said lads playing junior c dont want be travelling to the far side of the county to play junior c, and have every team play each other once in proper competitive games (maybe allow division 1 teams keep home and away if they wish) because asking 2nd and 3rd teams to play 10/12 games is unrealistic. Its proven to be fairly succesful in yhe hurling so i think it could be in the football too
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: burdizzo on December 17, 2016, 06:01:00 PM
I don't know what you mean by successful: Division 5A in the hurling last year, there were more walk-overs than matches played. A farce, if you ask me.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 17, 2016, 10:47:03 PM
Well if you look  at Division 3a in football stradbally and portlaoise pulled out before it began, spink only played when the ballinakill lads wanted a break from the hurling and even then they only had a scrap team, port not much better, leaving barrowhouse and kilcavan (2 intermediate teams) with only proper matches against each other. And if you look at 5a in the hurling majority of walkovers were by teams who pulled out from the start. In general throughout all leagues there was less walkovers and more competitive matches in the hurling than the football
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on December 18, 2016, 08:36:03 AM
Following a meeting in coppers last night The Heath have pulled out of the deal. Something about a vodka and Coke not being paid for.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on December 18, 2016, 09:27:15 AM
This transfer of a player from B/House to St Josephs will not happen or may not even reach the request stage. For a start the player does not live in the St Josephs catchment area (Ballyadams Parish). I believe he actually lives in the catchment area of Kileen,Ballylinan or Arles and plays with B House because of long held family connections.I also believe the transfer is being persued by the player himself and not by the St Josephs club.
The only way i could see it happening is because of previous precedent(s). i.e the Kingstons transfers to Kileen and other transfers from Park/Rath to stradbally. I do know that the transfers of the Kingstons was objected to and placed on the record (reasons for the transfers being allowed set a precedent).The main reason for those transfers going through was proof of place of resident. Interesting times ahead fro the CCC
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on December 18, 2016, 09:52:30 AM
A false address is all that's needed Monument. The Kingstons still live in Barrowhouse. Everyone knows that. Their papers over in the County Board might say otherwise, but they live in Barrowhouse. Up to what point do you fight a transfer when a lad has his head elsewhere?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on December 18, 2016, 11:18:01 AM
This transfer of a player from B/House to St Josephs will not happen or may not even reach the request stage. For a start the player does not live in the St Josephs catchment area (Ballyadams Parish). I believe he actually lives in the catchment area of Kileen,Ballylinan or Arles and plays with B House because of long held family connections.I also believe the transfer is being persued by the player himself and not by the St Josephs club.
The only way i could see it happening is because of previous precedent(s). i.e the Kingstons transfers to Kileen and other transfers from Park/Rath to stradbally. I do know that the transfers of the Kingstons was objected to and placed on the record (reasons for the transfers being allowed set a precedent).The main reason for those transfers going through was proof of place of resident. Interesting times ahead fro the CCC

Factually incorrect. The player lives in the Athy parish and therefore in the Barrowhouse catchment area.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on December 18, 2016, 05:33:04 PM
This transfer of a player from B/House to St Josephs will not happen or may not even reach the request stage. For a start the player does not live in the St Josephs catchment area (Ballyadams Parish). I believe he actually lives in the catchment area of Kileen,Ballylinan or Arles and plays with B House because of long held family connections.I also believe the transfer is being persued by the player himself and not by the St Josephs club.
The only way i could see it happening is because of previous precedent(s). i.e the Kingstons transfers to Kileen and other transfers from Park/Rath to stradbally. I do know that the transfers of the Kingstons was objected to and placed on the record (reasons for the transfers being allowed set a precedent).The main reason for those transfers going through was proof of place of resident. Interesting times ahead fro the CCC

Factually incorrect. The player lives in the Athy parish and therefore in the Barrowhouse catchment area.
Forgive me on that one so but i thought i knew the geography of the  area and i thought the residence was in the Arles parish. Here is a good one though, at least 4 or 5 present Barrowhouse players actually live the the parish of Ballyadams but for historical reasons St Josephs never claim them....
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on December 18, 2016, 08:11:52 PM
A false address is all that's needed Monument. The Kingstons still live in Barrowhouse. Everyone knows that. Their papers over in the County Board might say otherwise, but they live in Barrowhouse. Up to what point do you fight a transfer when a lad has his head elsewhere?
Unfortunately you are correct on that one. All County Board want is a fig leaf to allow a transfer. The Kingston transfers were plain wrong and in many ways have undermined the credibility of the whole system.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: redsetanta on December 18, 2016, 09:33:40 PM
I wonder if the fact that a prominant official from Killeen is no longer there that transfers similar to the Kingstons will not get the same support in the future. He was very prominant in Laois GAA.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on December 18, 2016, 10:04:45 PM
A false address is all that's needed Monument. The Kingstons still live in Barrowhouse. Everyone knows that. Their papers over in the County Board might say otherwise, but they live in Barrowhouse. Up to what point do you fight a transfer when a lad has his head elsewhere?
Unfortunately you are correct on that one. All County Board want is a fig leaf to allow a transfer. The Kingston transfers were plain wrong and in many ways have undermined the credibility of the whole system.
Those transfers were very wrong but a precedent has been set. Could this new transfer be allowed because of that precedent i dont know but it creates a very big problem for the CCC. If it is refused it may go to a higher forum such as the DRA and they have a legal imput. Legal science sometimes uses precedents. Its B/House who are the biggest losers as St josephs will still be intact one way or the other.The player looking for the transfer is in no mans land now. If he gets it fine but if not it will be very awkward on him to continue to play for B/House.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 18, 2016, 11:06:18 PM
Just wondering what lads think the CB should be doing?
If I apply for a transfer to Abbeyleix and I go to the transfer meeting armed with a phone bill and a bank statement with an address in Abbeyleix, what steps do ye think the CB should take from there?
Are we talking private detectives?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 18, 2016, 11:58:16 PM
Just wondering what lads think the CB should be doing?
If I apply for a transfer to Abbeyleix and I go to the transfer meeting armed with a phone bill and a bank statement with an address in Abbeyleix, what steps do ye think the CB should take from there?
Are we talking private detectives?

Like what camross did for darren gilmartin lol
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on December 19, 2016, 01:17:11 AM
This transfer of a player from B/House to St Josephs will not happen or may not even reach the request stage. For a start the player does not live in the St Josephs catchment area (Ballyadams Parish). I believe he actually lives in the catchment area of Kileen,Ballylinan or Arles and plays with B House because of long held family connections.I also believe the transfer is being persued by the player himself and not by the St Josephs club.
The only way i could see it happening is because of previous precedent(s). i.e the Kingstons transfers to Kileen and other transfers from Park/Rath to stradbally. I do know that the transfers of the Kingstons was objected to and placed on the record (reasons for the transfers being allowed set a precedent).The main reason for those transfers going through was proof of place of resident. Interesting times ahead fro the CCC

Factually incorrect. The player lives in the Athy parish and therefore in the Barrowhouse catchment area.
Forgive me on that one so but i thought i knew the geography of the  area and i thought the residence was in the Arles parish. Here is a good one though, at least 4 or 5 present Barrowhouse players actually live the the parish of Ballyadams but for historical reasons St Josephs never claim them....

Definitely not in the Arles Parish. Close but not in it. I believe Barrowhouse had to draw up their catchment area many years ago  due to them being mostly a corner of the parish of Athy with a small portion being in the Ballyadams parish. As a result this portion of the Ballyadams parish falls into Barrowhouse's catchment area. It's a pity that Josephs wouldn't extend the policy you have been talking about and for historical reasons not entertain the transfer.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 19, 2016, 07:02:52 AM
Catchment area cant cover 2 parishes if there's one thing that the ranting of tom cahill established down through the years it was that
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Laois fan on December 19, 2016, 09:33:37 AM
Well if you look  at Division 3a in football stradbally and portlaoise pulled out before it began, spink only played when the ballinakill lads wanted a break from the hurling and even then they only had a scrap team, port not much better, leaving barrowhouse and kilcavan (2 intermediate teams) with only proper matches against each other. And if you look at 5a in the hurling majority of walkovers were by teams who pulled out from the start. In general throughout all leagues there was less walkovers and more competitive matches in the hurling than the football
. In fairness port only conceded one game ,beat barrow house at home and just lost out on promotion
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on December 19, 2016, 11:44:48 AM
Just wondering what lads think the CB should be doing?
If I apply for a transfer to Abbeyleix and I go to the transfer meeting armed with a phone bill and a bank statement with an address in Abbeyleix, what steps do ye think the CB should take from there?
Are we talking private detectives?

They could and should introduce a bye law that gives lads in this situation au automatic right to play senior football. Not just with anyone; only with their Senior partner at juvenile level, or, with the Parish Senior club. Think of the doors that would open up. For instance, I think it's inevitable that one of the Arles sides will be relegated in the next few years, but with such a rule, their players could play with Ballylinan. Lads in Timahoe or Annanough could play for Stradbally and so on. They would be doing no more than what they already do at underage; a natural and logical progression
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 19, 2016, 04:43:40 PM

They could and should introduce a bye law that gives lads in this situation au automatic right to play senior football. Not just with anyone; only with their Senior partner at juvenile level, or, with the Parish Senior club. Think of the doors that would open up. For instance, I think it's inevitable that one of the Arles sides will be relegated in the next few years, but with such a rule, their players could play with Ballylinan. Lads in Timahoe or Annanough could play for Stradbally and so on. They would be doing no more than what they already do at underage; a natural and logical progression

Byelaws can't contravene the Official Guide. We have problems with that sort of thing in the past!

Laois cannot just decide that it is ok for a Timahoe player to line out with Stradbally at Senior and Timahoe at junior.

And that's not what I'm asking here!

Like what camross did for darren gilmartin lol

It does look like that is what happened. But how do you stop that?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on December 19, 2016, 05:53:37 PM

They could and should introduce a bye law that gives lads in this situation au automatic right to play senior football. Not just with anyone; only with their Senior partner at juvenile level, or, with the Parish Senior club. Think of the doors that would open up. For instance, I think it's inevitable that one of the Arles sides will be relegated in the next few years, but with such a rule, their players could play with Ballylinan. Lads in Timahoe or Annanough could play for Stradbally and so on. They would be doing no more than what they already do at underage; a natural and logical progression

Byelaws can't contravene the Official Guide. We have problems with that sort of thing in the past!

Laois cannot just decide that it is ok for a Timahoe player to line out with Stradbally at Senior and Timahoe at junior.

And that's not what I'm asking here!

Like what camross did for darren gilmartin lol

It does look like that is what happened. But how do you stop that?

I see your point and you're right. However, surely it's cleaner and more pragmatic than pie in the sky amalgamations that will have no longevity, or worse still, "illegal" transfers that cause bad blood. Maybe instead of targeting the bye law, it is the rule book itself that needs updating. I can't see any negative aspect to it
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 25, 2016, 09:10:12 PM

They could and should introduce a bye law that gives lads in this situation au automatic right to play senior football. Not just with anyone; only with their Senior partner at juvenile level, or, with the Parish Senior club. Think of the doors that would open up. For instance, I think it's inevitable that one of the Arles sides will be relegated in the next few years, but with such a rule, their players could play with Ballylinan. Lads in Timahoe or Annanough could play for Stradbally and so on. They would be doing no more than what they already do at underage; a natural and logical progression

Byelaws can't contravene the Official Guide. We have problems with that sort of thing in the past!

Laois cannot just decide that it is ok for a Timahoe player to line out with Stradbally at Senior and Timahoe at junior.

And that's not what I'm asking here!

Like what camross did for darren gilmartin lol

It does look like that is what happened. But how do you stop that?

Literally not possible to stop off the top of my head as once the paperwork is gone through its old news to everyone involved, Joey Coogan had similar difficulty getting a transfer from Trumera to Mountrath years ago as too as Trumera would not sanction the transfer, but he eventually returned to Trumera, Small clubs face troubling times as can be seen with all these gaels and failed amalgamations...happy christmas by the way
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 27, 2016, 01:47:02 PM
Heard leigh bergin was looking to go to ballacolla and kevin bergin from clonad to colt (which ironically because he lives in clonad he is in raheen parish which is colts area and not clonads), also 2 lads from colt coming to play football with us this year
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Laoiseabu on December 27, 2016, 02:55:59 PM
Hu are the two Colt guys ? Out of curiosity
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 27, 2016, 03:30:31 PM
Any updates on the Timahoe/Heath amalgamation?

The Timahoe EGM too place the week before Christmas,I believe a vote was deferred.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 27, 2016, 04:03:03 PM
Right so we have had

Clonad/Colt/Shanahoe Juvenile
The Heath/Emo
The Heath/Timahoe
Timahoe/Ballypickas
Emo/Mountmellick
Slieve Bloom/Ballinakill
Slieve Bloom/Castletown

I've probably missed a few too.
Have any of these happened or look like happening?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Laoiseabu on December 27, 2016, 04:13:54 PM
St Joseph's / barrow house               Kileen/barrow house              Courtwood/Emo.            Odempseys/ Annanough
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 27, 2016, 04:52:34 PM
Shanahoe/ballypickas is done for gales apparently,timahoe deals in both codes shot down by committee, josephs/barrowhouse was rejected by josephs, they are the ones ive heard anyway, im assuming with the exception of ballinakill and slieve margy all other gales teams areremaining from last year
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 27, 2016, 06:57:43 PM
Right so we have had

Clonad/Colt/Shanahoe Juvenile
The Heath/Emo
The Heath/Timahoe
Timahoe/Ballypickas
Emo/Mountmellick
Slieve Bloom/Ballinakill
Slieve Bloom/Castletown

I've probably missed a few too.
Have any of these happened or look like happening?

Colt/trumera was another high stool story as was kyle/knock with kyle to hurl in tipp which didnt happen but was discussed at meetigs on both sides



Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 27, 2016, 07:42:49 PM
Kyle/knock was going on for a few years now, came close a few years ago apparently but they were going to hurl in laois because they reckoned they would make a bigger impact, wonder is a cross county amalgamation been done or even possible?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 27, 2016, 08:00:51 PM
Kyle/knock was going on for a few years now, came close a few years ago apparently but they were going to hurl in laois because they reckoned they would make a bigger impact, wonder is a cross county amalgamation been done or even possible?

I would say that whichever club was moving would have to disband. The other club would then have to change their name to incorporate the other club. The players would then need to get intercounty transfers from the disbanded club to the newly renamed club!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: HURLING1 on December 27, 2016, 08:02:32 PM
Kyle/Knock  actually  won a laois senior title is 1951 or 52, so were  together before.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 27, 2016, 08:04:30 PM
Shanahoe/ballypickas is done for gales apparently

I have a problem with this. If this is true,
Ballypickas will play on their own in JHC, with Shanahoe in SHC A, with St Fintan's in U14 & U16, with Abbeyleix in Minor & U21.
This all getting too messy for my liking.

Same with mooted arrangements like Ballinakill & Slieve Bloom and Na Fianna underage which at some age extends to Mountmellick, Ballyfin, Emo, Courtwood & Clonaslee.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 27, 2016, 08:28:25 PM
Kyle/knock was going on for a few years now, came close a few years ago apparently but they were going to hurl in laois because they reckoned they would make a bigger impact, wonder is a cross county amalgamation been done or even possible?

Carrig/Riverstown
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: SCFC on December 27, 2016, 09:04:16 PM
Kyle/knock was going on for a few years now, came close a few years ago apparently but they were going to hurl in laois because they reckoned they would make a bigger impact, wonder is a cross county amalgamation been done or even possible?

Carrig/Riverstown

Moneygall? A cross border club in Tipp/Offaly.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 27, 2016, 09:07:52 PM
Kyle/knock was going on for a few years now, came close a few years ago apparently but they were going to hurl in laois because they reckoned they would make a bigger impact, wonder is a cross county amalgamation been done or even possible?

Carrig/Riverstown

Moneygall? A cross border club in Tipp/Offaly.

Moneygall's Grounds are in Tipperary
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 27, 2016, 09:10:27 PM
Did Carrig and Riverstown once play separately in two different counties?
If not, it is not the same thing. Moneygall certainly isnt.

AFAIK there is no way for Kyle and Knock to link up without at least one of the clubs being disbanded.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 27, 2016, 09:12:13 PM
Kyle/knock was going on for a few years now, came close a few years ago apparently but they were going to hurl in laois because they reckoned they would make a bigger impact, wonder is a cross county amalgamation been done or even possible?

Carrig/Riverstown

Moneygall? A cross border club in Tipp/Offaly.

Moneygall's Grounds are in Tipperary,as is a fair amount of the parish
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 27, 2016, 09:17:58 PM
Did Carrig and Riverstown once play separately in two different counties?
If not, it is not the same thing. Moneygall certainly isnt.

AFAIK there is no way for Kyle and Knock to link up without at least one of the clubs being disbanded.

Carrig at one time played in Tipp
Riverstown played in Offaly and then with Lorrha,before going back into Offaly and amalgamating with carrig who are situated in Tipperary

Moneygall played in Offaly then amalgamated with Toome and finally split and then went out  on their own in Tipp.

So they are valid examples
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 27, 2016, 09:33:32 PM
Did Carrig and Riverstown once play separately in two different counties?
If not, it is not the same thing. Moneygall certainly isnt.

AFAIK there is no way for Kyle and Knock to link up without at least one of the clubs being disbanded.

Carrig at one time played in Tipp
Riverstown played in Offaly and then with Lorrha,before going back into Offaly and amalgamating with carrig who are situated in Tipperary

Moneygall played in Offaly then amalgamated with Toome and finally split and then went out  on their own in Tipp.

So they are valid examples

Firstly, I asked a question.

Secondly, Moneygall moving from Tipp to Offaly and back is different to Knock or Kyle moving one way or the other. There is a much bigger crossover with the two counties in Moneygall. Is the present Moneygall club a result of two clubs(one Offaly and one Tipperary) who at some stage amalgamated and decided to play in Tipperary? No, I didn't think so.

Finally, as I said, there is no way for it to happen without at least one of the clubs disbanding  ::)
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 27, 2016, 10:04:50 PM
Shanahoe/ballypickas is done for gales apparently

I have a problem with this. If this is true,
Ballypickas will play on their own in JHC, with Shanahoe in SHC A, with St Fintan's in U14 & U16, with Abbeyleix in Minor & U21.
This all getting too messy for my liking.

Think they are basically going all in with fintans and cutting ties with abbeyleix, in which case there is a link as shanahoe also play with fintans, and both are on the outskirts of abbeyleix, whereas ballinakill and slieve bloom there is no link/arguement, basically being done to benefit conroy playing senior and ballinakill needing another forward to win a championship
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 27, 2016, 10:12:53 PM

Fair enough if they are going all in with Fintan's I suppose.
I wonder how they chose Shanahoe over Colt?!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 27, 2016, 10:16:19 PM
Shanahoe approached them
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 27, 2016, 10:17:14 PM
Did Carrig and Riverstown once play separately in two different counties?
If not, it is not the same thing. Moneygall certainly isnt.

AFAIK there is no way for Kyle and Knock to link up without at least one of the clubs being disbanded.

Carrig at one time played in Tipp
Riverstown played in Offaly and then with Lorrha,before going back into Offaly and amalgamating with carrig who are situated in Tipperary

Moneygall played in Offaly then amalgamated with Toome and finally split and then went out  on their own in Tipp.

So they are valid examples

Firstly, I asked a question.

Secondly, Moneygall moving from Tipp to Offaly and back is different to Knock or Kyle moving one way or the other. There is a much bigger crossover with the two counties in Moneygall. Is the present Moneygall club a result of two clubs(one Offaly and one Tipperary) who at some stage amalgamated and decided to play in Tipperary? No, I didn't think so.

Finally, as I said, there is no way for it to happen without at least one of the clubs disbanding  ::)

The original question to which I answered was if a cross county amalgamation had taken place.

It has and it is possible
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 27, 2016, 10:23:01 PM
Kyle/knock was going on for a few years now, came close a few years ago apparently but they were going to hurl in laois because they reckoned they would make a bigger impact, wonder is a cross county amalgamation been done or even possible?

I would say that whichever club was moving would have to disband. The other club would then have to change their name to incorporate the other club. The players would then need to get intercounty transfers from the disbanded club to the newly renamed club!

Apparently it came really close last year and i would of thought the same as yourself keyser but according to the knock secretary i spoke to he said it was fairly straight forward and the tipp county board said they could use kyle pitch for home games as knock didnt have their own field, when they won a senior in 52 there was a stricter parish rule at the time and the knock guys living in tipp had to play with kyle. As for moneygall as someone else mentioned i never realised that they played in offaly before but never researched their history, all i knew was moneygall has both offaly and tipp borders
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 27, 2016, 10:31:55 PM
Kyle/knock was going on for a few years now, came close a few years ago apparently but they were going to hurl in laois because they reckoned they would make a bigger impact, wonder is a cross county amalgamation been done or even possible?

The biggest impact they could hope for is being a good junior a team as kyle were never too bad but never had enough "good" hurlers, remember playing against them about 15 years ago and we were all thinking how gearoid walsh was wasting his talent there
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: O moore parklife on December 27, 2016, 10:48:51 PM
Few Annanough footballers of high enough ability looking to step up senior in a gaels format for the 2017 senior championship. Reliable source
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 27, 2016, 10:51:18 PM
Did Carrig and Riverstown once play separately in two different counties?
If not, it is not the same thing. Moneygall certainly isnt.

AFAIK there is no way for Kyle and Knock to link up without at least one of the clubs being disbanded.

Carrig at one time played in Tipp
Riverstown played in Offaly and then with Lorrha,before going back into Offaly and amalgamating with carrig who are situated in Tipperary

Moneygall played in Offaly then amalgamated with Toome and finally split and then went out  on their own in Tipp.

So they are valid examples

Firstly, I asked a question.

Secondly, Moneygall moving from Tipp to Offaly and back is different to Knock or Kyle moving one way or the other. There is a much bigger crossover with the two counties in Moneygall. Is the present Moneygall club a result of two clubs(one Offaly and one Tipperary) who at some stage amalgamated and decided to play in Tipperary? No, I didn't think so.

Finally, as I said, there is no way for it to happen without at least one of the clubs disbanding  ::)

The original question to which I answered was if a cross county amalgamation had taken place.

It has and it is possible

As i said (but I'll repeat for the special cases among us!), that was a question! Nobody said it was impossible to start with. What Moneygall did is not a relevant example. Entirely different thing.

How is your juvenile realignment coming on?!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on December 27, 2016, 10:59:52 PM
Kyle/knock was going on for a few years now, came close a few years ago apparently but they were going to hurl in laois because they reckoned they would make a bigger impact, wonder is a cross county amalgamation been done or even possible?

The biggest impact they could hope for is being a good junior a team as kyle were never too bad but never had enough "good" hurlers, remember playing against them about 15 years ago and we were all thinking how gearoid walsh was wasting his talent there

I wasnt thinking senior challengers, but stable inter team a ratheniska clonad type, again i know very little about knock team
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 27, 2016, 11:09:27 PM
Kyle/knock was going on for a few years now, came close a few years ago apparently but they were going to hurl in laois because they reckoned they would make a bigger impact, wonder is a cross county amalgamation been done or even possible?

The biggest impact they could hope for is being a good junior a team as kyle were never too bad but never had enough "good" hurlers, remember playing against them about 15 years ago and we were all thinking how gearoid walsh was wasting his talent there

I wasnt thinking senior challengers, but stable inter team a ratheniska clonad type, again i know very little about knock team

Yeah i understand, in small rural parishs the main thing should be securing the hurling clubs at whatever level because its sure gettig harder to compete at their own respective levels, rosenallis have bounced back great and with a young team
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: HURLING1 on December 28, 2016, 06:19:21 AM
Knock always have had a good few very serious hurlers such as John Carroll and his brother's and the Flynns.  They allow them hurl senior with Roscrea without a row in the club and  most of them return to Knock  at the end of their Senior Hurling.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: tcrilly on December 28, 2016, 08:00:56 AM
Knock always have had a good few very serious hurlers such as John Carroll and his brother's and the Flynns.  They allow them hurl senior with Roscrea without a row in the club and  most of them return to Knock  at the end of their Senior Hurling.
Yeah they have a bloody huge catchment area and never stop anyone going to or from the club which is decent
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 28, 2016, 11:30:45 AM
Did Carrig and Riverstown once play separately in two different counties?
If not, it is not the same thing. Moneygall certainly isnt.

AFAIK there is no way for Kyle and Knock to link up without at least one of the clubs being disbanded.

Carrig at one time played in Tipp
Riverstown played in Offaly and then with Lorrha,before going back into Offaly and amalgamating with carrig who are situated in Tipperary

Moneygall played in Offaly then amalgamated with Toome and finally split and then went out  on their own in Tipp.

So they are valid examples

Firstly, I asked a question.

Secondly, Moneygall moving from Tipp to Offaly and back is different to Knock or Kyle moving one way or the other. There is a much bigger crossover with the two counties in Moneygall. Is the present Moneygall club a result of two clubs(one Offaly and one Tipperary) who at some stage amalgamated and decided to play in Tipperary? No, I didn't think so.

Finally, as I said, there is no way for it to happen without at least one of the clubs disbanding  ::)

The original question to which I answered was if a cross county amalgamation had taken place.

It has and it is possible

As i said (but I'll repeat for the special cases among us!), that was a question! Nobody said it was impossible to start with. What Moneygall did is not a relevant example. Entirely different thing.

How is your juvenile realignment coming on?!

It's coming along very well  Keyser,you might lay off the insults,your not the only one around here with hurling knowledge.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 28, 2016, 11:33:32 AM

It's coming along very well  Keyser,you might lay off the insults,your not the only one around here with hurling knowledge.

Don't remember making that claim, but thanks for the compliment.

Good to hear, I look forward to all of those Colt, Shanahoe (and presumably Ballypickas) men going to battle in Clonad jerseys!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 28, 2016, 11:50:19 AM

It's coming along very well  Keyser,you might lay off the insults,your not the only one around here with hurling knowledge.

Don't remember making that claim, but thanks for the compliment.

Good to hear, I look forward to all of those Colt, Shanahoe (and presumably Ballypickas) men going to battle in Clonad jerseys!

Yeah that "compliment" went right over your head Keyser,special case indeed.


"presumably Ballypickas" ?

You keep presuming there,son

"men" its a juvenile amalgamation,do keep up....

looking forward to seeing all Clond/Fintans gaels juvenile hurlers on the one team in 2017.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 28, 2016, 12:04:15 PM

"presumably Ballypickas" ?

You keep presuming there,son

"men" its a juvenile amalgamation,do keep up....

looking forward to seeing all Clond/Fintans gaels juvenile hurlers on the one team in 2017.

You say St Fintan's Gaels- Colt and Shanahoe are just St Fintan's - so is it Trumera or Ballypickas you are also planning to get into the sash?

looking forward to seeing all Clond/Fintans gaels juvenile hurlers on the one team in 2017.

That is some climb down  ;)
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: burdizzo on December 28, 2016, 04:42:46 PM
Includes Ballypickas. There may be an isolated player or two from Trumera at some age groups, but certainly not all.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 29, 2016, 03:42:44 PM
Includes Ballypickas. There may be an isolated player or two from Trumera at some age groups, but certainly not all.

So you could have Na Fianna playing Clonad St Fintan's Gaels
Potentially Mountmellick/Ballyfin/Clonaslee/Courtwood/Emo v Colt/Shanahoe/Clonad/Trumera/Ballypickas?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: burdizzo on December 29, 2016, 04:32:53 PM
Potentially.
However, as you well know, some of the clubs you mention are not hurling clubs at all (Emo, Courtwood), and others are very small rural clubs struggling for numbers at adult level, never mind at juvenile level. It would be preferable if all these could field on their own at underage, but the reality is they can't. Not one of them. So, probably better joining up, and giving lads access to top level (Division 1) hurling, than allowing them to struggle away as smaller amalgamations in Divisions 2 or 3. Probably better, I say, as I realise some fringe players will drift away. But that'd happen anyway.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 29, 2016, 05:14:52 PM
Potentially.
However, as you well know, some of the clubs you mention are not hurling clubs at all (Emo, Courtwood), and others are very small rural clubs struggling for numbers at adult level, never mind at juvenile level. It would be preferable if all these could field on their own at underage, but the reality is they can't. Not one of them. So, probably better joining up, and giving lads access to top level (Division 1) hurling, than allowing them to struggle away as smaller amalgamations in Divisions 2 or 3. Probably better, I say, as I realise some fringe players will drift away. But that'd happen anyway.

I dispute this.
Mountmellick should be fielding on their own at this stage. Probably Ballyfin too.
I understand that they may have needed to join up as a short term solution to years of neglect. But that excuse cannot be used anymore.

A bit of effort and organisation and there is no reason that Mountmellick and Ballyfin couldn't each field a team on their own.

Primary School Enrollment numbers back this up;

Ballyfin -129 , Barnashrone- 29 (158)
Mountmellick- 272
The Rock- 107
Clonaslee- 59 Castlecuffe- 39 (98)
Emo- 128
That comes to a total of 763 boys or an average of 95 per class. Underage grades generally cater for two classes. That's about 190 kids. We get one hurling team out of that.

Compare these figures to
Camross- 69 Kilanure- 19 (88)
Borris- 58 Kiladooly- 57 (115)
Castletown- 75 Paddock- 37 Rushall- 20  (132)
Ballacolla-12 Clough- 62 (74)
Rosenallis- 46 Derrylamogue- 56 (102)
Shanahoe- 38 Raheen- 52 (90) + Trumera- 20 (110)


The above figures are boys only.
That means in Ballyfin parish for example there are about 20 boys in every year.
Thats 40 u8s, 40 u10s, 40 u12s, 40 u14s and 40 u16s.
No club achieves 100% uptake. Surely 50% is possible. Thats 20. And that is before you include "playing up" with for example u12s playing u14 also.

I am not against clubs trying to expose their players to A grade hurling. I am also not against players from football clubs being accomodated by clubs to play hurling. But there has to be some control over. We cannot afford the wastage involved in fielding some of these heavily amalgamated juvenile clubs.
But I have argued this before- Laois cannot afford for one juvenile hurling club to be catering for a primary school population of 763 boys.

You can say that there isn't a strong tradition of hurling in Mountmellick.
7 and 8 year olds don't care about tradition. They will play anything.
Mountmellick have produced some excellent underage teams in the past when they had interested and hardworking people like Gerry O Flaherty putting teams together.

Na Fianna is covering for a lazy approach to underage development.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: burdizzo on December 29, 2016, 06:30:53 PM
Yes, I accept Ballyfin and Mountmellick SHOULD be fielding on their own, and I know they have a lot of subs, so there will be lads falling away. But, as I say, this will happen anyway. In a way, though, I agree - this doesn't reflect that well on the clubs involved.
However, you can't dismiss the importance of tradition. Seven and eight year olds might play anything, but in the end it's the parents who encourage, coax, and carry them to matches. If they're wishy-washy about it, then the child will probably be, too. Also, Mountmellick is primarily football, and I presume the better lads will be filtered into playing football first. So, culture in a club, and tradition ARE important.
As for the Clonad/ St. Fintan's thing: Trumera and Ballypickas have very few players; Clonad cannot field on their own w/out Ratheniska, and St. Fintan's are struggling at the younger age groups. That's the unfortunate reality. What's the problem?

Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 29, 2016, 07:01:17 PM
What's the problem?

You ask, what's the problem?

I didn't once say there was a single problem with Clonad, St Fintan's, Ballypickas or Trumera being involved in any sort of amalgamation.
I think it is messy, but I don't object, and haven't. If the original post implied this, well then I correct myself here.

Also I didn't say tradition wasn't important, I said it doesn't stop kids from participating when presented with opportunities to do so. Those opportunities should come from proactive intervention by those with a vested interest- i.e. Laois GAA and their local GAA Club. You mention that Mountmellick has a tradition of football, yet they cannot manage to draw underage football teams on their own from those numbers.
Therefore, IMO, it is not tradition or a tradition of football that is stopping them from fielding their own underage teams, rather it's a culture of inactivity and taking the handy way out.
Similarly Ballyfin have history here. Various allegiances with Castletown, Slieve Bloom, or both were previously in existence.

Some smaller clubs are forced into creatively operating from year to year in order to maintain a juvenile presence, that is fine. But where there is evidence that numbers exist to allow them compete on their own, it shouldn't be accepted as the long term solution, by either club or county board. That doesn't apply to the likes of Trumera, Ballypickas, Kyle etc.
St Fintan's in fairness have always tried to do things the right way. Clonad also appear to have good people involved and certainly do their bit to promote hurling.

Na Fianna started as Mountmellick and Ballyfin. It has spread since, taking in more clubs. Clonaslee a few years ago. I hear that Camross are going with them at some grade/grades next year.
Conveniently expanding arrangements like Na Fianna inevitably claim some success (eg Minor Hurling Final 2014), keep the stronger players and their parent's happy, get decent representation on county panels and will often be held up as an example of "doing things right" and an argument for "mass amalgamations".
The bottom line is that huge numbers are being totally uncatered for. I would imagine that no other club in the county, bar Portlaoise, has such a low level of participation. There is the world of difference between players falling off as they get older, for all of the age old reasons, and those players not been catered for in the first place.

It is lazy, short sighted and self serving for those who drive it.

We are a small county and cannot afford that level of wastage, that's the problem.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on December 29, 2016, 07:10:35 PM
Well said Keyser
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: redsetanta on December 29, 2016, 07:31:07 PM
Good point and very well made Keyser.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Heshs Umpire on December 29, 2016, 08:43:43 PM
Includes Ballypickas. There may be an isolated player or two from Trumera at some age groups, but certainly not all.

So you could have Na Fianna playing Clonad St Fintan's Gaels
Potentially Mountmellick/Ballyfin/Clonaslee/Courtwood/Emo v Colt/Shanahoe/Clonad/Trumera/Ballypickas?
I'm not going to dispute the thrust of your argument. But it's a bit disingenuous to give Courtwood equal billing with the other clubs in Na Fianna. I think either one or two players hurled this year from our club. One under 14 and possibly one minor.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on December 29, 2016, 08:47:39 PM
Includes Ballypickas. There may be an isolated player or two from Trumera at some age groups, but certainly not all.

So you could have Na Fianna playing Clonad St Fintan's Gaels
Potentially Mountmellick/Ballyfin/Clonaslee/Courtwood/Emo v Colt/Shanahoe/Clonad/Trumera/Ballypickas?
I'm not going to dispute the thrust of your argument. But it's a bit disingenuous to give Courtwood equal billing with the other clubs in Na Fianna. I think either one or two players hurled this year from our club. One under 14 and possibly one minor.

At the same time I wouldn't underestimate the impact an "extra" player or two, particularly those up to the age, can make to a juvenile team.
The point is the availability of players like this heightens this amalgamations ability to be even lazier about player development.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 30, 2016, 10:25:01 AM
You can quote all the school numbers you want Keyser ,the reality is based on what comes through the local clubs gates and then those who prefer or want to play hurling.

There must be over 200 boys in each national school class.in Portlaoise parish schools,would 30% be playing any form of Gaelic games?.

I know from talking to teachers,it's a lot lower than that.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on December 30, 2016, 10:30:49 AM
There must be over 200 boys in each national school class.in Portlaoise parish schools,would 30% be playing any form of Gaelic games?.
Whose fault is that?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on December 30, 2016, 11:01:55 AM
Don

 Im sure it doesnt take a genius to work that one out.Another GDA is badly needed to even get the kids interested in playing Gaelic Games,the days of expecting Teachers to do it are long gone.

The smaller rural clubs always seem to make better use of their juvenile numbers,to paraphrase the Marines "no man is left behind"

Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on December 30, 2016, 11:14:51 AM
Don

 Im sure it doesnt take a genius to work that one out.Another GDA is badly needed to even get the kids interested in playing Gaelic Games,the days of expecting Teachers to do it are long gone.

The smaller rural clubs always seem to make better use of their juvenile numbers,to paraphrase the Marines "no man is left behind"
Can the clubs themselves not go into the schools?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: BallyroanAbu on December 30, 2016, 02:34:37 PM
Hi

You have to pay for a GDO to go into School's not every club wants to do this.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on December 30, 2016, 02:46:40 PM
Hi

You have to pay for a GDO to go into School's not every club wants to do this.
Jackpot. We have a winner. If you don't sow, you won't reap.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on December 30, 2016, 05:49:41 PM
Don

 Im sure it doesnt take a genius to work that one out.Another GDA is badly needed to even get the kids interested in playing Gaelic Games,the days of expecting Teachers to do it are long gone.

The smaller rural clubs always seem to make better use of their juvenile numbers,to paraphrase the Marines "no man is left behind"
Can the clubs themselves not go into the schools?

Some schools are not that keen on clubs coming in. A teacher friend of mine once said she was running an educational establishment and not a sport academy.  She has a point.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: BallyroanAbu on December 30, 2016, 07:02:40 PM
She has a point, but with obesity and mental health at the forefront of our health problems, sports have a huge part to play.   The benefit of sports aside from actually been good at it  are enormous.  There are plenty of examples of schools where education and sport flourish.   To be honest I am not worried what sport goes on but I actually think organized sport should be at least an hour a day in all schools. 
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on December 30, 2016, 07:43:01 PM
She sounds like a ****
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: O moore parklife on December 31, 2016, 07:31:51 AM
Let's be very honest here as well the couple of development officers in the county well for football anyway are pretty dismal at there jobs hopfully colm begley will be worth his salt and it's not just yet another wink wink job for the boys. It's also a fact that the 2 previous coaches haven't completed the level 2 standard in coaching. One is disorganised I witnessed this at under 14 county games and the other has more interest in getting an odd picture on twitter to justify his yearly wage ill leave ye decide which one is which.
If you don't expect high standards things will remain backward and stagnant 5 years max in these development rolls before getting fresh and interested people in
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Helix on December 31, 2016, 10:51:09 AM
Sticking to the topic the heath gaels becoming more likely for 2017. Timahoe voted for it the other night. Didn't believe the rumour in the beginning but becoming all the more likely. Ball in Heath's court now.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: SCFC on December 31, 2016, 08:19:14 PM
It's also a fact that the 2 previous coaches haven't completed the level 2 standard in coaching.

If the above is true it's a disgrace.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 01, 2017, 04:02:52 AM
Clonadmad not everything posted here is an attack on you or your club. Please take note.

I did mention that Portlaoise has the lowest/one of the lowest participation rates in the county. Rightly or wrongly they don't need everyone.

The bottom line is that huge numbers are being totally uncatered for. I would imagine that no other club in the county, bar Portlaoise, has such a low level of participation. There is the world of difference between players falling off as they get older, for all of the age old reasons, and those players not been catered for in the first place.


I didn't knock the effort of clubs like Clonad and Shanahoe to keep a juvenile set up running, and being "creative" when the numbers are tight.

What I clearly stated was that clubs who HAVE NUMBERS should not be facilitated in taking the handy way out and amalgamating.
I will not accept that Mountmellick and Ballyfin don't have the numbers.

And yes, I can and will quote primary school numbers. Is there a better indicator of your target audience than the number of boys attending primary school in your parish? I don't know of another.

The smaller rural clubs always seem to make better use of their juvenile numbers,to paraphrase the Marines "no man is left behind"
Agreed. But it doesn't excuse the larger clubs inactivity.

Some schools are not that keen on clubs coming in. A teacher friend of mine once said she was running an educational establishment and not a sport academy.  She has a point.
No doubt there will be some teachers against everything (as with all professions), but I would be confident in saying that very few (if any) Principals would block the local GAA club sending in qualified, vetted and suitable people to coach in the school.

You can quote all the school numbers you want Keyser ,the reality is based on what comes through the local clubs gates and then those who prefer or want to play hurling.
Ultimately it does come down to this. But each club needs to examine what THEY are doing to get them in the gate between the ages of 6 & 10. There is no magic solution that allows Camross and Clough Ballacolla to produce teams with tight numbers.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on January 01, 2017, 12:33:40 PM
So what Juvenile clubs need to up their game Keyser,given that you have the breakdown on national school numbers?

Ballyfin and Mountmellick, you have already mentioned,who else?

Portlaoise?
Mountrath?
Portarlington?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 01, 2017, 12:43:42 PM
So what Juvenile clubs need to up their game Keyser,given that you have the breakdown on national school numbers?

Ballyfin and Mountmellick, you have already mentioned,who else?

Portlaoise?
Mountrath?
Portarlington?

Those figures are not mine. They are freely available here (http://www.education.ie/en/Find-a-School/School-Search-Results/?level=Primary&geo=Laois&ethos=-1&lang=-1&gender=-1)

As I said, each club needs to examine for themselves whether they are doing enough. Some do stand out, however, where numbers point overwhelmingly in one direction or the other.

I would have said Mountrath, but the school numbers there are surprisingly low.
I didn't post figures for Portarlington. Also have no idea about their juvenile set up. Haven't a clue!
Portlaoise needs more than one club. Hard to see that happening. Until they have competition for those numbers they will never maximise what's available. Right or wrong.

On second thoughts, I'll expand a bit further.
I think the numbers show that the following clubs are doing very well based on the numbers available to them;
Camross,
Clough Ballacolla,
Castletown Slieve Bloom,
Borris Kilcotton,
I didn't bother looking up anymore. I was merely trying to make comparisons.
I haven't knowledge to comment on juvenile football clubs.

And yourself? Do you agree with the idea of a sprawling Na Fianna?
Do you not think Mountmellick and Ballyfin have the numbers to compete on their own?
Do you not think primary school numbers are relevant?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 01, 2017, 12:49:03 PM
Having just looked up Portarlington the numbers are very odd.
One school with 723 pupils, but with a breakdown of 159 boys and 564 girls. Jaysus that's most unusually uneven!
The only other school showing up is a Church of Ireland school with less than 100!

Is there a selective breeding programme in Port or what's going on?!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: beano on January 01, 2017, 01:34:34 PM
Very interesting discussion, here is my worth! I'm a primary school teacher outside Laois and to say that any teacher would refuse a GAA club coming in is plainly wrong, yes you'll get exceptions but most will take in an outside coach. There is also a direction link between coaches coming into schools and recruitment into clubs ! To say otherwise shows a complete lack of understanding of how to run a modern Gaa club and maybe it's the reason why clubs are struggling if that's what officers in the clubs are thinking. Take dublin for example, two clubs Castleknock and cuala both very successful now abd with large memberships, both were in non traditional areas however with full time coaches going into local schools they built up large juvenile sections and hence why they are successful, there's no reason why "urban" clubs/town in Laois cannot do the same such as mountrath, Mountmellick , durrow cannot do the same. The era of expecting kids just to turn up is long gone, you need to be willing to fight to get them to join your club.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: beano on January 01, 2017, 01:35:59 PM
On the Portarlington boys numbers , the boys school is in county Offaly and the school figures quote are for schools in Laois that end got boys after senior infants.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: SCFC on January 01, 2017, 03:45:27 PM
Having just looked up Portarlington the numbers are very odd.
One school with 723 pupils, but with a breakdown of 159 boys and 564 girls. Jaysus that's most unusually uneven!
The only other school showing up is a Church of Ireland school with less than 100!

Is there a selective breeding programme in Port or what's going on?!
The boys from first to sixth class go to school in Offaly.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on January 01, 2017, 04:24:56 PM
Having just looked up Portarlington the numbers are very odd.
One school with 723 pupils, but with a breakdown of 159 boys and 564 girls. Jaysus that's most unusually uneven!
The only other school showing up is a Church of Ireland school with less than 100!

Is there a selective breeding programme in Port or what's going on?!
The main Boys school in Port is located in Offaly. I think there are some mixed classes in the Laois School for boys up to 1st or 2nd class.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on January 01, 2017, 04:51:17 PM
Very interesting discussion, here is my worth! I'm a primary school teacher outside Laois and to say that any teacher would refuse a GAA club coming in is plainly wrong, yes you'll get exceptions but most will take in an outside coach. There is also a direction link between coaches coming into schools and recruitment into clubs ! To say otherwise shows a complete lack of understanding of how to run a modern Gaa club and maybe it's the reason why clubs are struggling if that's what officers in the clubs are thinking. Take dublin for example, two clubs Castleknock and cuala both very successful now abd with large memberships, both were in non traditional areas however with full time coaches going into local schools they built up large juvenile sections and hence why they are successful, there's no reason why "urban" clubs/town in Laois cannot do the same such as mountrath, Mountmellick , durrow cannot do the same. The era of expecting kids just to turn up is long gone, you need to be willing to fight to get them to join your club.

It's hard to compare what is happening in affluent middle class suburbs and fairly depressed Laois towns. The places you mentioned have catchment area greater than half of Laois. Serious money has been pumped in with full time coaches. No club in Laois has that  type of resources available. 
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 02, 2017, 01:09:12 AM
Very interesting discussion, here is my worth! I'm a primary school teacher outside Laois and to say that any teacher would refuse a GAA club coming in is plainly wrong, yes you'll get exceptions but most will take in an outside coach. There is also a direction link between coaches coming into schools and recruitment into clubs ! To say otherwise shows a complete lack of understanding of how to run a modern Gaa club and maybe it's the reason why clubs are struggling if that's what officers in the clubs are thinking. Take dublin for example, two clubs Castleknock and cuala both very successful now abd with large memberships, both were in non traditional areas however with full time coaches going into local schools they built up large juvenile sections and hence why they are successful, there's no reason why "urban" clubs/town in Laois cannot do the same such as mountrath, Mountmellick , durrow cannot do the same. The era of expecting kids just to turn up is long gone, you need to be willing to fight to get them to join your club.

It's hard to compare what is happening in affluent middle class suburbs and fairly depressed Laois towns. The places you mentioned have catchment area greater than half of Laois. Serious money has been pumped in with full time coaches. No club in Laois has that  type of resources available.

You have a point.
But on the other side you could argue that there are a hell of a lot fewer distractions in depressed Laois towns. Soccer is the only big rival, and the seasons don't cross over hugely.
It doesn't have to cost the club huge money IMO.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: beano on January 02, 2017, 11:48:34 AM
It doesn't take that much money to hire a GAA coach , maybe cuala and Castleknock are bad examples but ballymun have a coach and St perigrenes in hartstown have one in an area where soccer is king and money are not plentiful , if they can do any club can do it. One thing that frustrates me about Laois Gaa in general is the excuses , "oh we can't do this " , it's the can do attitude that has different counties and clubs succesfull!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on January 02, 2017, 02:09:15 PM
It doesn't take that much money to hire a GAA coach , maybe cuala and Castleknock are bad examples but ballymun have a coach and St perigrenes in hartstown have one in an area where soccer is king and money are not plentiful , if they can do any club can do it. One thing that frustrates me about Laois Gaa in general is the excuses , "oh we can't do this " , it's the can do attitude that has different counties and clubs succesfull!

Its my understanding that the Dublin County Board fund half the overall cost of hiring in a full time club GDA.

It would be interesting to see the Laois County Board reaction if 2/3 clubs here banded together and did similar and then went looking for half the total cost.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: beano on January 02, 2017, 05:38:02 PM
Yeh three clubs going together would be the Ideal scenario, given that a coaches wages are approx €30,000 it would body the three clubs 15,000 about €5,000 each club, but factor in extra membership they would generate plus a well organised club summer camp it would actually cost the club very little. The benefits are obvious !!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 02, 2017, 05:53:09 PM
Laois GAA do half fund a scheme where a club coach does a certain amount of hours in the primary school.
Its half paid for by the club & half by the county board. I think you are talking around about €3-4k per year. Half and Half.
Be interesting to first of all find out how many clubs are taking this option up before we talk about giving somebody a full time job out of it.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: beano on January 02, 2017, 06:06:45 PM
Yeh I'm aware of it but I think they only "coach" in schools , the full time coach would ontop of recruiting players would train mentors and run courses !!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 02, 2017, 08:03:59 PM
Yeh I'm aware of it but I think they only "coach" in schools , the full time coach would ontop of recruiting players would train mentors and run courses !!

Don't want to be pessimistic but for a county Laois' size I think this would basically just mean increasing the number of GDAs we have. I think we are a long way off a situation where the clubs of Laois are employing someone full time.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on January 03, 2017, 06:25:19 AM
Laois GAA do half fund a scheme where a club coach does a certain amount of hours in the primary school.
Its half paid for by the club & half by the county board. I think you are talking around about €3-4k per year. Half and Half.
Be interesting to first of all find out how many clubs are taking this option up before we talk about giving somebody a full time job out of it.
Nailed it again Keyser, you're on fire my friend. Some fellas on here, want Laois GAA to take them by the hands and run their clubs for them. The successful clubs in Laois get off their holes and go get shit done, well the ones that don't transfer in other clubs talent that is.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: les Antiques on January 03, 2017, 11:42:20 AM
I agree thoroughly with the above , only so much the county board can do and if they put a structure in place its up to the clubs to follow through . A club  such as Park/Rath are a fine example and there are more like them but unfortunately there  clubs for various reasons in this county who are not half as innovative and can use excuses all day long .
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on January 03, 2017, 03:55:30 PM
I agree thoroughly with the above , only so much the county board can do and if they put a structure in place its up to the clubs to follow through . A club  such as Park/Rath are a fine example and there are more like them but unfortunately there  clubs for various reasons in this county who are not half as innovative and can use excuses all day long .

Yes Park/Rath are the model alright. Lovely grounds but a Junior A football club with a poor Intermediate Hurling (3rd Tier) outfit complemented by been one of the worst  clubs for putting teams in the "B" at underage.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: SCFC on January 03, 2017, 08:00:05 PM

I dispute this.
Mountmellick should be fielding on their own at this stage. Probably Ballyfin too.
I understand that they may have needed to join up as a short term solution to years of neglect.


I hear you're about to get your wish. The divorce between Ballyfin and Mountmellick is confirmed.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on January 03, 2017, 09:15:56 PM

I dispute this.
Mountmellick should be fielding on their own at this stage. Probably Ballyfin too.
I understand that they may have needed to join up as a short term solution to years of neglect.


I hear you're about to get your wish. The divorce between Ballyfin and Mountmellick is confirmed.
Is it true or another one of those rumours that does the rounds at this time of year.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on January 03, 2017, 09:17:00 PM
I agree thoroughly with the above , only so much the county board can do and if they put a structure in place its up to the clubs to follow through . A club  such as Park/Rath are a fine example and there are more like them but unfortunately there  clubs for various reasons in this county who are not half as innovative and can use excuses all day long .
I doubt even Park would hold themselves up as a model for anyone. They acted the shite for years with amalgamations, but to be fair they're rectifying that in both hurling and football now, but have a long way to go to be held up for anyone.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on January 03, 2017, 10:03:46 PM
I agree thoroughly with the above , only so much the county board can do and if they put a structure in place its up to the clubs to follow through . A club  such as Park/Rath are a fine example and there are more like them but unfortunately there  clubs for various reasons in this county who are not half as innovative and can use excuses all day long .
I doubt even Park would hold themselves up as a model for anyone. They acted the shite for years with amalgamations, but to be fair they're rectifying that in both hurling and football now, but have a long way to go to be held up for anyone.

The vast majority of those involved in the juvenile section over there now are from outside the county,different mentality with a lot of them.

Whether they can walk the walk remains to be seen
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: SCFC on January 03, 2017, 10:25:01 PM

I dispute this.
Mountmellick should be fielding on their own at this stage. Probably Ballyfin too.
I understand that they may have needed to join up as a short term solution to years of neglect.


I hear you're about to get your wish. The divorce between Ballyfin and Mountmellick is confirmed.
Is it true or another one of those rumours that does the rounds at this time of year.
100% true. All football teams are seperating and they are possibly staying together for under 14 or 12 hurling at most.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on January 03, 2017, 10:37:46 PM
I agree thoroughly with the above , only so much the county board can do and if they put a structure in place its up to the clubs to follow through . A club  such as Park/Rath are a fine example and there are more like them but unfortunately there  clubs for various reasons in this county who are not half as innovative and can use excuses all day long .
I doubt even Park would hold themselves up as a model for anyone. They acted the shite for years with amalgamations, but to be fair they're rectifying that in both hurling and football now, but have a long way to go to be held up for anyone.

The vast majority of those involved in the juvenile section over there now are from outside the county,different mentality with a lot of them.

Whether they can walk the walk remains to be seen
There's no love lost it seems from your posts about them. I neither know nor care.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 04, 2017, 01:23:46 AM

I dispute this.
Mountmellick should be fielding on their own at this stage. Probably Ballyfin too.
I understand that they may have needed to join up as a short term solution to years of neglect.


I hear you're about to get your wish. The divorce between Ballyfin and Mountmellick is confirmed.
Is it true or another one of those rumours that does the rounds at this time of year.
100% true. All football teams are seperating and they are possibly staying together for under 14 or 12 hurling at most.

They hardly fielded last year at U16 and minor hurling. How can they feasibly separate 12 months?!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 04, 2017, 01:28:16 AM

I dispute this.
Mountmellick should be fielding on their own at this stage. Probably Ballyfin too.
I understand that they may have needed to join up as a short term solution to years of neglect.


I hear you're about to get your wish. The divorce between Ballyfin and Mountmellick is confirmed.

And just to be clear. My reasons for wanting this are very pure!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: les Antiques on January 04, 2017, 08:40:41 AM

I doubt even Park would hold themselves up as a model for anyone. They acted the shite for years with amalgamations, but to be fair they're rectifying that in both hurling and football now, but have a long way to go to be held up for anyone.
[/quote]

The vast majority of those involved in the juvenile section over there now are from outside the county,different mentality with a lot of them.

Whether they can walk the walk remains to be seen
[/quote]
There's no love lost it seems from your posts about them. I neither know nor care.


Ditto .Time to move on clonadman  ;)
[/quote]
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: El Jefe on January 04, 2017, 09:15:24 AM
Heard The Heath voted through the amalgamation with Timahoe last night but afterwards got word that there's now some problem with it from the Timahoe end?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on January 04, 2017, 11:44:27 AM

I dispute this.
Mountmellick should be fielding on their own at this stage. Probably Ballyfin too.
I understand that they may have needed to join up as a short term solution to years of neglect.


I hear you're about to get your wish. The divorce between Ballyfin and Mountmellick is confirmed.
Is it true or another one of those rumours that does the rounds at this time of year.
100% true. All football teams are seperating and they are possibly staying together for under 14 or 12 hurling at most.

They hardly fielded last year at U16 and minor hurling. How can they feasibly separate 12 months?!
  SCFC is at least part right if not 100%. The word is that Mountmellick pulled the plug at under 14 football level even though Ballyfin were keen to keep the thing going. It's the usual rubbish of parents worrying about their Johnny getting a game.  Don't know what the story is with hurling.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on January 04, 2017, 11:48:44 AM

I dispute this.
Mountmellick should be fielding on their own at this stage. Probably Ballyfin too.
I understand that they may have needed to join up as a short term solution to years of neglect.


I hear you're about to get your wish. The divorce between Ballyfin and Mountmellick is confirmed.
Is it true or another one of those rumours that does the rounds at this time of year.
100% true. All football teams are seperating and they are possibly staying together for under 14 or 12 hurling at most.

They hardly fielded last year at U16 and minor hurling. How can they feasibly separate 12 months?!
  SCFC is at least part right if not 100%. The word is that Mountmellick pulled the plug at under 14 football level even though Ballyfin were keen to keep the thing going. It's the usual rubbish of parents worrying about their Johnny getting a game.  Don't know what the story is with hurling.
Is Johnny not entitled to get a game? Instead of being one of  15 subs sitting on a sideline?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on January 04, 2017, 12:27:37 PM
Heard The Heath voted through the amalgamation with Timahoe last night but afterwards got word that there's now some problem with it from the Timahoe end?

Heard there was an issue with lads who prefer hurling looking to leave, weather thats the issue with timahoe i dont know, but i couldnt imagine them being happy about the footballers being granted a gales team and the hurlers not
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 04, 2017, 12:28:50 PM
Is Johnny not entitled to get a game? Instead of being one of  15 subs sitting on a sideline?
[/quote]

Johnny should have got regular games from 6/7 years old. Did he?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on January 04, 2017, 12:51:27 PM

Johnny should have got regular games from 6/7 years old. Did he?
If he didn't, he's long gone by now.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: les Antiques on January 04, 2017, 01:01:42 PM
Heard The Heath voted through the amalgamation with Timahoe last night but afterwards got word that there's now some problem with it from the Timahoe end?

Heard there was an issue with lads who prefer hurling looking to leave, weather thats the issue with timahoe i dont know, but i couldnt imagine them being happy about the footballers being granted a gales team and the hurlers not


Correct , unlikely now the amalgamation will happen before the deadline date for clubs  to register .
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: border on January 04, 2017, 02:41:11 PM
Did anybody else hear about clonad looking to join with colt at adult level now as well as juvenile.I hear there is a lot of discontent with the idea in colt.has shanahoe and ballypickas definitely joined up or is it only pub talk.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on January 04, 2017, 02:52:58 PM
Heard The Heath voted through the amalgamation with Timahoe last night but afterwards got word that there's now some problem with it from the Timahoe end?

Heard there was an issue with lads who prefer hurling looking to leave, weather thats the issue with timahoe i dont know, but i couldnt imagine them being happy about the footballers being granted a gales team and the hurlers not


Correct , unlikely now the amalgamation will happen before the deadline date for clubs  to register .
Surely they can sort it over the next 2 weeks.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on January 04, 2017, 06:41:57 PM
Heard that clonad put in the application alright, could be a way of pleasing young bergin maybe, genuinely cant see colt allowing it happen, shanahoe and ballypickas is a done deal, they are going with one trainer for both clubs and training together by all accounts
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: hurlingmad on January 04, 2017, 07:39:15 PM

Johnny should have got regular games from 6/7 years old. Did he?
If he didn't, he's long gone by now.
lol poor little johnny
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: hurlingmad on January 04, 2017, 07:44:50 PM
Heard that clonad put in the application alright, could be a way of pleasing young bergin maybe, genuinely cant see colt allowing it happen, shanahoe and ballypickas is a done deal, they are going with one trainer for both clubs and training together by all accounts

Is this for the Senior A championship or will they field teams at junior a or b level also? Anybody hear anything on the castletown gaels or castletown/slieve bloom merger that was in talks?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 04, 2017, 08:26:35 PM
Heard that clonad put in the application alright, could be a way of pleasing young bergin maybe, genuinely cant see colt allowing it happen, shanahoe and ballypickas is a done deal, they are going with one trainer for both clubs and training together by all accounts

Is this for the Senior A championship or will they field teams at junior a or b level also? Anybody hear anything on the castletown gaels or castletown/slieve bloom merger that was in talks?

Welcome back T. Crilly!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: hurlingmad on January 04, 2017, 08:54:22 PM
Heard that clonad put in the application alright, could be a way of pleasing young bergin maybe, genuinely cant see colt allowing it happen, shanahoe and ballypickas is a done deal, they are going with one trainer for both clubs and training together by all accounts

Is this for the Senior A championship or will they field teams at junior a or b level also? Anybody hear anything on the castletown gaels or castletown/slieve bloom merger that was in talks?

Welcome back T. Crilly!
Cup of tea father? I dont get you sorry?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: hurlingmad on January 04, 2017, 08:59:27 PM
Heard that clonad put in the application alright, could be a way of pleasing young bergin maybe, genuinely cant see colt allowing it happen, shanahoe and ballypickas is a done deal, they are going with one trainer for both clubs and training together by all accounts

Is this for the Senior A championship or will they field teams at junior a or b level also? Anybody hear anything on the castletown gaels or castletown/slieve bloom merger that was in talks?

Welcome back T. Crilly!
i see now, dont worry im not T crilly
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: burdizzo on January 04, 2017, 10:12:41 PM
Anybody hear anything on the castletown gaels or castletown/slieve bloom merger that was in talks?
[/quote]

Heard about it, all right, but I heard it's not happening now.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: hurlingmad on January 05, 2017, 09:29:05 PM
thank you for the reply, probably no point as ben conroy is the only one they would most likely benefit from and he wouldnt he able to get it all his own way at senior level just yet

Oh now, I'm not sure T Crilly would agree with this!
Didn't you , I mean he, have him in the Top 3 players in the county?
Where did that thread ever go to?!
What on earth is your problem? 2 replys now where i wasnt interacting with you and you saying im t crilly, please stop so i can enjoy the thread like everyone else
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on January 05, 2017, 10:14:46 PM

I though that alright, just from what i heard from the shanahoe/ballypickas thing they were going with the first option which wouldnt have been done before, also heard abbeyleix still havnt found a trainer yet

It's a novel way of doing it, but it makes sense if true.
I'd imagine both teams would have small numbers. It would share the burden of paying for a trainer and training costs, would increase camaraderie and it would give those from the smaller club an excellent chance at making the Gaels team.

What happened with the Tyrell fella from last year?

Left of his own accord, believe there was a money issue
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Helix on January 06, 2017, 10:40:39 AM
Clonaslee and Annanough was in the pipeline but has fallen through and The Heath and Timahoe has gone too at the last minute! Is there any Gaels teams actually going ahead??

There's talk Colt and clonad at senior b hurling as a gaels possibly. Would be a good one considering they're in same parish. Did barrowhouse and Kileen talk mount to anything about a gaels team?

Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on January 06, 2017, 03:06:40 PM
Heath/Timahoe death in the water

Despite both sets of players and Heath committee on board
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: El Jefe on January 06, 2017, 03:25:45 PM
What happened?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: BallyroanAbbey on January 06, 2017, 06:15:28 PM
Heard that Timahoe's committee threw away the idea meaning that they have managed to piss off both sides of the club if true. The long distance/lack of juvenile link gales teams seem to be failing to get off the ground. The only one that seems to be happening is crettyard and spink which was always likely given the success they had last year. Also seems to be a higher chance in hurling. From the gales teams ive heard proposed.
The Heath Gales (Timahoe) No
Mountmellick Gales (Emo) No
St Josephs Gales (Barrowhouse) No
Crettyard Gales (Spink) Yes
Arles Killen Gales (Barrowhouse) N/A
O'Dempseys Gales (Annanough) No
Castletown Gales (Slieve Bloom) N/A
Ballinakill Gales (Slieve Bloom) No
Colt Gales (Clonad) Yes
Ballyfin Gales (Mountmellick) Yes
Shanahoe Gales (Ballypickas) Yes

Ive heard that some of the bigger clubs, hurling ones in particular have been complaining about these gales teams and how it is an unfair advantage but the reality is that a colt/clonad or a shanahoe/ballypickas combination still wouldnt have 2/3rds the pick of a borris/kilcotton or a camross.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 06, 2017, 06:23:13 PM
Heard that Timahoe's committee threw away the idea meaning that they have managed to piss off both sides of the club if true. The long distance/lack of juvenile link gales teams seem to be failing to get off the ground. The only one that seems to be happening is crettyard and spink which was always likely given the success they had last year. Also seems to be a higher chance in hurling. From the gales teams ive heard proposed.
The Heath Gales (Timahoe) No
Mountmellick Gales (Emo) No
St Josephs Gales (Barrowhouse) No
Crettyard Gales (Spink) Yes
Arles Killen Gales (Barrowhouse) N/A
O'Dempseys Gales (Annanough) No
Castletown Gales (Slieve Bloom) N/A
Ballinakill Gales (Slieve Bloom) No
Colt Gales (Clonad) Yes
Ballyfin Gales (Mountmellick) Yes
Shanahoe Gales (Ballypickas) Yes

Ive heard that some of the bigger clubs, hurling ones in particular have been complaining about these gales teams and how it is an unfair advantage but the reality is that a colt/clonad or a shanahoe/ballypickas combination still wouldnt have 2/3rds the pick of a borris/kilcotton or a camross.

Thanks for putting that together.
Are you 100% on the yes and nos?
And are N/As still on the table or what?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on January 06, 2017, 06:37:03 PM
The Kileen gaels is almost agreed although it may cause one or two defections from B/House.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: oneflewoverthecuckoonest on January 06, 2017, 08:02:57 PM
the only ones I heard

trumera colt  dead in the water...a capital NO
castletown slieve bloom dead in the water..NO
ballinakill slieve bloom...grey area...likely no but not dead
shanahoe pickas....YES.


Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on January 07, 2017, 01:04:30 PM
The Kileen gaels is almost agreed although it may cause one or two defections from B/House.

Is there really any need for Barrowhouse to exist on their own anyway.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Heshs Umpire on January 07, 2017, 01:40:28 PM
The Kileen gaels is almost agreed although it may cause one or two defections from B/House.

Is there really any need for Barrowhouse to exist on their own anyway.

Barrowhouse were in existence long before Killeen.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 07, 2017, 03:05:46 PM
The Kileen gaels is almost agreed although it may cause one or two defections from B/House.

Is there really any need for Barrowhouse to exist on their own anyway.

Is there really any need for anyone or any one club to exist?
A club exists while it has a committee of people to run it, a community to sustain it, and players to field a team (irregardless of the level).
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: haze on January 07, 2017, 07:46:27 PM
The Kileen gaels is almost agreed although it may cause one or two defections from B/House.

Is there really any need for Barrowhouse to exist on their own anyway.

I'm not from Barrowhouse but I'm offended for them despite no offence I assume meant. Rural clubs are the essence of the GAA and where at all possible these clubs should be encouraged to continue to plough their lone proud furrow. Sure why should Leitrim, Louth or Laois exist on the intercounty scene.

In my view amalgamtions should be last resort only. We should look to maximise the numbers of young people playing GAA, not taking away avenues for them to play in the local community regardless of what that level may be. Of course ideally structures are in place to ensure ambitious and talented players have as some outlet to pit themselves against their peers but in any case the vibrancy of many rural communities throughout Ireland is underpinned by GAA activity and once sight is lost of that I think the GAA becomes a much different organisation.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: hurlingmad on January 07, 2017, 09:18:23 PM
The Kileen gaels is almost agreed although it may cause one or two defections from B/House.

Is there really any need for Barrowhouse to exist on their own anyway.

I'm not from Barrowhouse but I'm offended for them despite no offence I assume meant. Rural clubs are the essence of the GAA and where at all possible these clubs should be encouraged to continue to plough their lone proud furrow. Sure why should Leitrim, Louth or Laois exist on the intercounty scene.

In my view amalgamtions should be last resort only. We should look to maximise the numbers of young people playing GAA, not taking away avenues for them to play in the local community regardless of what that level may be. Of course ideally structures are in place to ensure ambitious and talented players have as some outlet to pit themselves against their peers but in any case the vibrancy of many rural communities throughout Ireland is underpinned by GAA activity and once sight is lost of that I think the GAA becomes a much different organisation.

Interesting post Haze
Its a tough one really, the talk over the years of Rathdowney and Errill and Borris and Kilcotton joining was shot down many times over the years and it has brought unity in the community instead of a firm "us vs them" mentality, when Errill reached the county final in 86 i think it was Sheamus Bracken was training them and wanted to use the rathdownry foeld to train one evening for whatever reason and Rathdowney refused, so to say we have come a long way is an understatement but I think underage amalgamations are vital to compete in A championships and develop young players but then there is the arguement that clubs that can put out 2 teams at junior and senior they have sufficent numbers to stay on their own
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on January 08, 2017, 12:08:23 PM
The Kileen gaels is almost agreed although it may cause one or two defections from B/House.

Is there really any need for Barrowhouse to exist on their own anyway.

Even though you're clearly on a wind up, you make a valid point. There's a case for saying that clubs like Barrowhouse, Killeen and Kilcruise are fighting a losing battle. It will only ever be hard graft for small clubs to keep their ship afloat. The enjoyment that is gleaned from being part of a bigger set up is all but taken away when a small group of people are having to fund raise, train, organise , administrate and do the countless other tasks. I'm all for pooling resources when it has become so obvious that everything is a struggle. The GAA love this idea of volunteers giving up their time, but I don't think they have the first notion what that actually means
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: haze on January 08, 2017, 06:08:37 PM
The Kileen gaels is almost agreed although it may cause one or two defections from B/House.

Is there really any need for Barrowhouse to exist on their own anyway.

Even though you're clearly on a wind up, you make a valid point. There's a case for saying that clubs like Barrowhouse, Killeen and Kilcruise are fighting a losing battle. It will only ever be hard graft for small clubs to keep their ship afloat. The enjoyment that is gleaned from being part of a bigger set up is all but taken away when a small group of people are having to fund raise, train, organise , administrate and do the countless other tasks. I'm all for pooling resources when it has become so obvious that everything is a struggle. The GAA love this idea of volunteers giving up their time, but I don't think they have the first notion what that actually means

Anything that is worth anything is hard graft. I think if the basis for amalgamtions is that it's too hard to sustain a rural club because volunteers are no longer willing to give up and be generous with their very precious spare time then the backbone of the GAA is under threat. I think the frustration for me is when outsiders make judgements about certain clubs (more often than not rural ones) and wonder what is their point because they perceive it to be struggle. But sure it is a struggle but success sustains and success for rural clubs is much wider concept  for me than simply counting senior or even intermediate titles
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on January 08, 2017, 06:55:21 PM
I agree. It goes deeper than how many medals or trophies there are in pockets and cabinets. Sometimes, standing still and being able to fly the flag is success in some small clubs.

But let's not duck the issue here. The GAA is a very imbalanced and sometimes unreasonable organization that condones unequal opportunity. There is no way that some small clubs can ever compete with the bigger ones, and the same applies at county level too. The GAA has no remedy for this. Simply redoubling your efforts and/or getting more out of people will never be enough when resources and numbers are not on your side. In those situations, it is not fair to expect those not as well off to keep doing the same things over and over without reward. At the very least, every player who plays the sport should have access to the highest level. It's not a hard thing to ensure at local level, particularly with parish boundaries and borders being what they are. If something is not done soon, small clubs (intermediate and junior clubs in particular) will just become poaching grounds for Senior clubs. We're seeing far too much of that already in Laois and not a thing being done to stop it. An absolute scandal
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on January 09, 2017, 12:07:51 AM
I agree. It goes deeper than how many medals or trophies there are in pockets and cabinets. Sometimes, standing still and being able to fly the flag is success in some small clubs.

But let's not duck the issue here. The GAA is a very imbalanced and sometimes unreasonable organization that condones unequal opportunity. There is no way that some small clubs can ever compete with the bigger ones, and the same applies at county level too. The GAA has no remedy for this. Simply redoubling your efforts and/or getting more out of people will never be enough when resources and numbers are not on your side. In those situations, it is not fair to expect those not as well off to keep doing the same things over and over without reward. At the very least, every player who plays the sport should have access to the highest level. It's not a hard thing to ensure at local level, particularly with parish boundaries and borders being what they are. If something is not done soon, small clubs (intermediate and junior clubs in particular) will just become poaching grounds for Senior clubs. We're seeing far too much of that already in Laois and not a thing being done to stop it. An absolute scandal
The size of a club is often not the issue. Many small clubs are well run and know what they are about. From my own experience very few clubs here in Laois have plenty of "workers" with Rosenallis been one of the exceptions. For most clubs in the county, it's the same few faces that you associate with doing everything whether it's under 12 or adult. The model of the volunteer led community organisation will be severely tested in the coming years particularly in towns.  This is why clubs such as Mountrath, Mountmellick, Portarlington and Graigcullen will be under pressure as there is very little loyalty to GAA in urban areas. Kids will play the sport that is in fashion or often play nothing at all.  What I'm trying to say in a roundabout way is that it may be necessary for the so called bigger urban clubs to need to amalgamate in order to survive as much as it may be necessary for the so called minnows.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: beano on January 09, 2017, 03:47:48 PM
I disagree with u down the road, they're many examples of urban clubs doing very well without the need to almagamate.  The two newbridge clubs in Kildare, any dublin club. IF the club is well run and it has a good set up, the kids will always be attracted to it. That goes in any code.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on January 09, 2017, 07:38:24 PM
I disagree with u down the road, they're many examples of urban clubs doing very well without the need to almagamate.  The two newbridge clubs in Kildare, any dublin club. IF the club is well run and it has a good set up, the kids will always be attracted to it. That goes in any code.
The clubs you reference are "super" clubs with a significant middle class base.   In fact, the type of officer who runs these clubs are in nature almost undistinguishable from the chaps down in the local rugby club.  Naas is another classic example of the well run GAA club.  The urban clubs, I have in mind are much poorer and poverty is not just money but in ideas and ambition. The reality is that GAA is in trouble in working class areas as can be seen most clearly in Cork city.  Years ago, the local garda, teacher, banker moved to the small  town they got work in but nowadays, they head for the county town as in the case of Portlaoise.  If they decide to settle down, they either live in an upmarket part of Portlaoise or move out the country. This is why rural clubs wind up with a better class of punter running their clubs. This is exasperated even further with town folk with notions bringing the kids out to rural schools which denudes the talent and the ambition within the urban community even further. Most small town based clubs which are successful tend to have a rural hinterland. Even in Kilkenny City . the 3  principal city clubs have a rural base eg O'Loughlin Gaels the catchment area of which comes out to the Dunmore caves.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Dave like the tv channel on January 10, 2017, 11:08:24 AM
I disagree with u down the road, they're many examples of urban clubs doing very well without the need to almagamate.  The two newbridge clubs in Kildare, any dublin club. IF the club is well run and it has a good set up, the kids will always be attracted to it. That goes in any code.

Dublin clubs with a catchment area of c.60,000 hardly compare to Mountmellick or Portarlington, pop c.5,000, both of whom are split three ways. Laois only has a population of about 85,000.

St Vincents has a membership totalling 25,000. BBSE is the largest sports club in Europe.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on January 11, 2017, 08:49:33 AM
I've been thinking it for a long time now. The GAA is fundamentally flawed, and badly needs redesigning. There is nothing fair about the All Ireland series, and if I'm being honest, save for a few games here and there, it isn't even entertaining anymore. Right now, and maybe for the rest of time, there will be nothing Carlow or maybe even ourselves can do to win an All Ireland. It would take a freakish set of players to luckily appear at the one time. The chances are almost nil.

At a local level, the GAA is a hard sell. For some clubs, there's a sense of duty attached to it and not much enjoyment. Young lads time would be better spent living a life instead of being fed charters and getting texts from an over enthusiastic coach. Look, it has its place, and it's ok if you're potentially going to win something. But it's tedious and time consuming when you're ploughing the same furrow year after year without success. This do it for the love of your community bullshit has no place in a world where mortgages and debts are king. There is an ocean of work out there for the GAA to do, but they largely don't give a f**k. They think everything in the garden is rosy, but I believe there is a lot of unrest in smaller clubs who are getting fed up. There has to be a carrot on the end of the stick for every player who plays the game, and if that continues to be ignored, the game will die out. Has that process already begun?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on January 11, 2017, 12:53:26 PM
I've been thinking it for a long time now. The GAA is fundamentally flawed, and badly needs redesigning. There is nothing fair about the All Ireland series, and if I'm being honest, save for a few games here and there, it isn't even entertaining anymore. Right now, and maybe for the rest of time, there will be nothing Carlow or maybe even ourselves can do to win an All Ireland. It would take a freakish set of players to luckily appear at the one time. The chances are almost nil.

At a local level, the GAA is a hard sell. For some clubs, there's a sense of duty attached to it and not much enjoyment. Young lads time would be better spent living a life instead of being fed charters and getting texts from an over enthusiastic coach. Look, it has its place, and it's ok if you're potentially going to win something. But it's tedious and time consuming when you're ploughing the same furrow year after year without success. This do it for the love of your community bullshit has no place in a world where mortgages and debts are king. There is an ocean of work out there for the GAA to do, but they largely don't give a f**k. They think everything in the garden is rosy, but I believe there is a lot of unrest in smaller clubs who are getting fed up. There has to be a carrot on the end of the stick for every player who plays the game, and if that continues to be ignored, the game will die out. Has that process already begun?
The irony is that Laois got a freakish  set of players and we just didn't get enough out of them. On the more general point, there is nothing more debilitating than been from an unsuccessful club from an unsuccessful county. Over the past decade, there has been a major transformation in the support base of rugby in counties where there was no previous tradition apart from the local doctor/Solicitor who probably boarded at some rugby establishment. As far as I can see the GAA is going like the church and the traditional political parties in that the support base is both shrinking and aging particularly outside Dublin. Years ago, clubs organised social trips around National league games. You don't see it that much anymore which is an indication of a changing society.

Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on January 11, 2017, 02:02:26 PM
I believe that a lot of clubs are straddling the line at the moment, and that is why we're seeing all this talk about amalgamations. Amalgamations only mask the obvious reality. A lot of these clubs can't motivate players to train and are wholesale reliant on them to commit. There are no other options. Truth be told, it's a dead horse that is gone way past the point of being flogged. For comfort's sake, some clubs would be better served taking a walk down the road and joining up with the neighbour. You have some sort of chance when you have numbers. At the moment, a lot of clubs seem happy to look at the neighbour and say did you know I'm dying; well at least you'll be dead before me. The race to the bottom is well underway for some Laois clubs.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: hurlingmad on January 11, 2017, 02:58:22 PM
I believe that a lot of clubs are straddling the line at the moment, and that is why we're seeing all this talk about amalgamations. Amalgamations only mask the obvious reality. A lot of these clubs can't motivate players to train and are wholesale reliant on them to commit. There are no other options. Truth be told, it's a dead horse that is gone way past the point of being flogged. For comfort's sake, some clubs would be better served taking a walk down the road and joining up with the neighbour. You have some sort of chance when you have numbers. At the moment, a lot of clubs seem happy to look at the neighbour and say did you know I'm dying; well at least you'll be dead before me. The race to the bottom is well underway for some Laois clubs.

I agree with a lot of this, and another reason i would add is that rural ireland is changing, people arent having big familys anymore, in the 80s you had 4 bourke brothers playing for errill, god knows how many brothers playing for camross etc, castletown are in a rebuildig stage and its hard to see them achieve the heights thwy once did, emigration has the harps hammered, mountrath is in rapid decline underage and senior b, clonad never came back from their last senior win, trumera,shanahoe,colt, kyle simply cannot sustain themselves for another 10 years on their own, i hope i am wrong but its looming that way
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: maccer on January 11, 2017, 04:40:46 PM
Is it time for the co board to get meaningfully involved with amalgamations? I know it may be similar to govt staying away from industrial disputes etc. but perhaps some order should be brought to these arrangements rather than the haphazard approach we've seen over the winter. If a special convention was called where the whole situation was properly debated and guidelines set down it could help. It seems to be gone beyond a club issue at the moment and the whole county set up is under serious threat. It needs leadership. Clubs either don't have the numbers or else do and don't seem to have the drive to flourish alone. It's pointless meandering along until it's suddenly too late to act
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: SCFC on January 17, 2017, 07:50:36 PM
Clonaslee/Annanough is going ahead.  :o
As is Crettyard/Spink, Ballyfin/Slieve Bloom/Camross and Mountmellick/Kilcavan/Castletown.
Don't know the hurling ones.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on January 17, 2017, 08:33:04 PM
Raheen Parish Gaels hurling together from u6 to minor
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on January 17, 2017, 09:01:04 PM
Was wondering if camross would be picked up alright, they seem to have a few at minor level well capable of playing at a higher level and although camross are now a junior a team the likelyhood of them training or putting much of an effort into the football is minimal
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: hurlingmad on January 17, 2017, 09:40:00 PM
Was wondering if camross would be picked up alright, they seem to have a few at minor level well capable of playing at a higher level and although camross are now a junior a team the likelyhood of them training or putting much of an effort into the football is minimal

Never thought i would see the day, fair play to camross opening the door for their younger members to have access to higher level football, what level will this gaels team be playing?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: town1980 on January 17, 2017, 10:52:47 PM
Any outside bets on the 2017 Laois championship ???with all these amalgamations will they put in a shift to hit semi quarter finals?? Portlaoise the only real guaranteed semi finalists,,, predictions??
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on January 17, 2017, 10:55:35 PM
Was wondering if camross would be picked up alright, they seem to have a few at minor level well capable of playing at a higher level and although camross are now a junior a team the likelyhood of them training or putting much of an effort into the football is minimal

Never thought i would see the day, fair play to camross opening the door for their younger members to have access to higher level football, what level will this gaels team be playing?
Senior with Ballyfin
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Laois fan on January 18, 2017, 09:42:51 AM
Can understand most of these clubs joining up but not mountmellick they usually have a strong panel and will prob lose a lot of their fringe players now.wouldnt be the greatest fan of these amalgamations anyway,seem to be a quick fix to a much bigger problem,clubs should concentrate more on improving their juvenile standards .Also maybe I'm mistaken but I taught clonaslee and annonough didn't get on
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: SCFC on January 18, 2017, 10:12:28 AM
Also maybe I'm mistaken but I taught clonaslee and annonough didn't get on
I think it's a very odd one. They played a league game last year and i think it was abandoned because of fighting!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on January 18, 2017, 10:34:20 AM
Can understand most of these clubs joining up but not mountmellick they usually have a strong panel and will prob lose a lot of their fringe players now.wouldnt be the greatest fan of these amalgamations anyway,seem to be a quick fix to a much bigger problem,clubs should concentrate more on improving their juvenile standards .Also maybe I'm mistaken but I taught clonaslee and annonough didn't get on

It's not that simple. Most clubs are existing with threadbare resources and it is very hard to motivate "fringe" players to put their shoulder to the wheel. The ones who do want to do the thing right deserve better than that. So we're not just talking about access to senior football here, but also a player's wish to be part of something credible. I agree that it is a short term solution to a long term problem, but let's be honest here, the Championship needs as much of a jolt as it can get. A lot of clubs need to think seriously about their place in the world
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: the sash on January 18, 2017, 01:19:33 PM
While i do agree that amalgamations are the way forward in the laois senior football championship. Think there should be a limit or so on the areas that are amalgamating. I mean clonaslee is a good half hour n the rest away from vicarstown. These ones don't make sense to me.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: les Antiques on January 18, 2017, 01:34:06 PM
Amalgamations make sense in some ways if the clubs are somewhat nearby each . Clonaslee and Annanough does not make since . I'd love to know the logic behind this one .. I was at the match last year when they tore lumps out of each and the game had to be stopped . So what's stopping Graigue joining up with Emo just for hearsay .?! There has to be certain rules and stipulations to how clubs amalgamate .
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on January 18, 2017, 01:42:57 PM
I don't begrudge Donal Miller senior football at this stage of his career. He's been incredibly loyal to Annanough, and has been blackguarded by the system. That its come to an amalgamation with Clonaslee to give him senior football is an indictment of Laois GAA. It shouldn't have had to be like this. But it is, and people shouldn't be trying to put rules in place to stop it. Perhaps rules to make this thing easier would be more apt.

I wish him and the rest all the best.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: les Antiques on January 18, 2017, 01:53:01 PM
Well if the sole reason for this amalgamation is to give Donal Miller senior football it's a sad indictment of how the club scene is run in Laois . I concur that he  deserves to be playing Senior football and has showed tremendous loyalty to his club which sadly has lacked with some players in this county particualary neighbouring clubs to Annanough . But there are many other lads in Donals position also who should be looked after and they system in place has undoubtedly prevented this .
It's just a pity this didn't happen for Miller 8-9 years ago but alas better late than ever . The rules don't make this easy .
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on January 18, 2017, 01:56:14 PM
Well if the sole reason for this amalgamation is to give Donal Miller senior football it's a sad indictment of how the club scene is run in Laois . I concur that he  deserves to be playing Senior football and has showed tremendous loyalty to his club which sadly has lacked with some players in this county particualary neighbouring clubs to Annanough . But there are many other lads in Donals position also who should be looked after and they system in place has undoubtedly prevented this .
It's just a pity this didn't happen for Miller 8-9 years ago but alas better late than ever . The rules don't make this easy .
The club scene is in a sad state. Thats pretty obvious. Annanough lost a good one to their neighbours in recent years, I don't blame them for trying to give an outlet to prevent it happening again. But it shouldn't be up to them or other clubs to do this, there should be some outlet there. Sadly there isnt.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: les Antiques on January 18, 2017, 02:01:01 PM
The reality is that clubs are been forced to act whereas in ideal or somewhat ideal circumstances the county board should grab the  bull by the horns and create a more accessible policy for clubs and players to achieve and or play at the level they deserve .
Anyway best of luck to Miller always had time for him ! Pure as they say
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: O moore parklife on January 18, 2017, 02:16:30 PM
Best of luck to all the teams who go down this road. One of the many negatives I see with this is the club's who try and go alone senior heath o dempseys portarlington etc and could get beaten by these hybrid teams and find themselves in a relegation situation because they backed there own club players. Plenty of players from other counties stick with there teams and try and get them up to a higher level. It's a vicious cycle
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Uisce on January 18, 2017, 02:26:19 PM
Best of luck to all the teams who go down this road. One of the many negatives I see with this is the club's who try and go alone senior heath o dempseys portarlington etc and could get beaten by these hybrid teams and find themselves in a relegation situation because they backed there own club players. Plenty of players from other counties stick with there teams and try and get them up to a higher level. It's a vicious cycle

To be fair, on the teams you mentioned, O'Dempseys were relegated 2 years ago without any of these 'hybrid' teams. The Heath were desperate to become a 'hybrid' team with Timahoe and Port should have enough resources in their town to not become involved in a relegation fight.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: SCFC on January 18, 2017, 02:59:51 PM
Was wondering if camross would be picked up alright, they seem to have a few at minor level well capable of playing at a higher level and although camross are now a junior a team the likelyhood of them training or putting much of an effort into the football is minimal
I'd say it's just young Tyrell. Doubt if anyone else from Camross would go about playing senior football.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 18, 2017, 07:26:26 PM
Clonaslee-Annanough should not be allowed, I hear Ballinakill & Slieve Bloom is also going ahead. Have they dropped Slieve Margy then?
Neither of these involve "connected" clubs and I don't know how this fits in with the GAA ethos.
Baffled to be honest.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on January 18, 2017, 07:52:48 PM
I'm hearing that Ballinakill are taking in Slieve Margey and Ratheniska Juvenile  Hurlers and that Spink and Ratheniska are amalgamating at Juvenile Football level.

When's the deadline for all these amalgamations?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: SpeculativeEffort on January 18, 2017, 07:57:29 PM
I used to think certain amalgamations like Ballyfin and Mountmellick at juvenile level etc were a bit unseemly as they are in different parishes. Well 2017 is proving that same parish, neighbouring clubs etc means nothing when it comes to joining up. The county board loosened rules to allow players access to higher level. Its a good idea but needs regulation. TG4 used to have a Western season on saturday nights well Laois GAA are running their own cowboys and indians season for 2017. A pure farce.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 18, 2017, 08:11:54 PM
I'm hearing that Ballinakill are taking in Slieve Margey and Ratheniska Juvenile  Hurlers and that Spink and Ratheniska are amalgamating at Juvenile Football level.

When's the deadline for all these amalgamations?

They better call it soon or the County Secretary will end up in St Fintan's trying to sort out fixture and competition clashes.
O' Neills might do well out of this!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 18, 2017, 08:19:58 PM
I used to think certain amalgamations like Ballyfin and Mountmellick at juvenile level etc were a bit unseemly as they are in different parishes. Well 2017 is proving that same parish, neighbouring clubs etc means nothing when it comes to joining up. The county board loosened rules to allow players access to higher level. Its a good idea but needs regulation. TG4 used to have a Western season on saturday nights well Laois GAA are running their own cowboys and indians season for 2017. A pure farce.

I believe that CCC has the right to reject any proposed "merger" that it feels is not appropriate.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on January 18, 2017, 08:34:47 PM
I used to think certain amalgamations like Ballyfin and Mountmellick at juvenile level etc were a bit unseemly as they are in different parishes. Well 2017 is proving that same parish, neighbouring clubs etc means nothing when it comes to joining up. The county board loosened rules to allow players access to higher level. Its a good idea but needs regulation. TG4 used to have a Western season on saturday nights well Laois GAA are running their own cowboys and indians season for 2017. A pure farce.

I believe that CCC has the right to reject any proposed "merger" that it feels is not appropriate.

I presume this can be appealed as well.

No doubt there will some fun with regrading all juvenile amalgamations also,I expect to see the A grades packed for the coming year
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 18, 2017, 08:47:45 PM
I used to think certain amalgamations like Ballyfin and Mountmellick at juvenile level etc were a bit unseemly as they are in different parishes. Well 2017 is proving that same parish, neighbouring clubs etc means nothing when it comes to joining up. The county board loosened rules to allow players access to higher level. Its a good idea but needs regulation. TG4 used to have a Western season on saturday nights well Laois GAA are running their own cowboys and indians season for 2017. A pure farce.

I believe that CCC has the right to reject any proposed "merger" that it feels is not appropriate.

I presume this can be appealed as well.

No doubt there will some fun with regrading all juvenile amalgamations also,I expect to see the A grades packed for the coming year

Everything can be appealed. But surely those in charge taking a stance in the first regard has some place in our association.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Neiska Man on January 18, 2017, 08:59:49 PM
I'm hearing that Ballinakill are taking in Slieve Margey and Ratheniska Juvenile  Hurlers and that Spink and Ratheniska are amalgamating at Juvenile Football level.
You hear wrong. With respect, I ask that you concentrate on your own matters and stop spreading rumors.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on January 18, 2017, 09:08:34 PM
I'm hearing that Ballinakill are taking in Slieve Margey and Ratheniska Juvenile  Hurlers and that Spink and Ratheniska are amalgamating at Juvenile Football level.
You hear wrong. With respect, I ask that you concentrate on your own matters and stop spreading rumors.

Which ones am I wrong with then?.

Are some of your hurling teams not playing with Ballinakill?,are some of your football teams not amalgamating with Spink?.

Maybe you can clear it up for us?.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: INTJ on January 19, 2017, 10:17:35 AM
Hi surely there is a simple way to sort out all this gaels/transfer nonsense by introducing 4 divisional teams north, south, east and west made up of junior and intermediate players. Rule it now before the year kicks off properly that the bottom 4 teams + the winners of this years intermediate go into a 5 team group at the end of the season in which all teams play each other once with the winning team being promoted to senior and the rest to intermediate (should teams be level on points it goes to score difference, still level after tat teams get drawn from a hat and play off winner takes all) This serves 3 purposes 1: To reduce senior teams to 12, 2: the extra numbers in intermediate will increase the divisional team strength and 3: I creates a competitive atmosphere (which i think has been lost in Laois football for a long time).
Now 2018 would see the senior c/ship with 12 senior teams + 4 divisional, 4 groups of 4 with one divisional team in each group all teams playing  playing twice, top 2 teams go through to quarters etc, third place teams going into a shield semi final. This ensures all teams get a minimum of 7 games at senior for their players to be seen.
Relegation then divisional teams cant be relegated (this ensures all the counties top players are playing senior every year which is the why all the transfers/amalgamation are happening) and the lowest placed senior team plays off against intermediate winners.

The reason for all  the playoffs/senior relegation is to fuel competitiveness. There will then be only 12 "official" senior teams who have to battle every year to keep there name against a intermediate side thats chomping at the bit to move itself up a division. You have 4 large groups of individuals in the divisional that are out to prove why they deserve a chance to play senior football and a better prospect of playing county giving us a total of 240 of  our best players playing first team senior football. Senior teams will have to fight to keep their place and the intermediate championship will be properly competitive.
Thats just my take on it anyway, in my opinion it would create a more competitive platform, stop all this amalgamation/transfer crap and give all our best players a chance to prove themselves.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: SCFC on January 19, 2017, 10:34:11 AM
Hi surely there is a simple way to sort out all this gaels/transfer nonsense by introducing 4 divisional teams north, south, east and west made up of junior and intermediate players. Rule it now before the year kicks off properly that the bottom 4 teams + the winners of this years intermediate go into a 5 team group at the end of the season in which all teams play each other once with the winning team being promoted to senior and the rest to intermediate (should teams be level on points it goes to score difference, still level after tat teams get drawn from a hat and play off winner takes all) This serves 3 purposes 1: To reduce senior teams to 12, 2: the extra numbers in intermediate will increase the divisional team strength and 3: I creates a competitive atmosphere (which i think has been lost in Laois football for a long time).
Now 2018 would see the senior c/ship with 12 senior teams + 4 divisional, 4 groups of 4 with one divisional team in each group all teams playing  playing twice, top 2 teams go through to quarters etc, third place teams going into a shield semi final. This ensures all teams get a minimum of 7 games at senior for their players to be seen.
Relegation then divisional teams cant be relegated (this ensures all the counties top players are playing senior every year which is the why all the transfers/amalgamation are happening) and the lowest placed senior team plays off against intermediate winners.

The reason for all  the playoffs/senior relegation is to fuel competitiveness. There will then be only 12 "official" senior teams who have to battle every year to keep there name against a intermediate side thats chomping at the bit to move itself up a division. You have 4 large groups of individuals in the divisional that are out to prove why they deserve a chance to play senior football and a better prospect of playing county giving us a total of 240 of  our best players playing first team senior football. Senior teams will have to fight to keep their place and the intermediate championship will be properly competitive.
Thats just my take on it anyway, in my opinion it would create a more competitive platform, stop all this amalgamation/transfer crap and give all our best players a chance to prove themselves.
That's actually a brilliant idea.
For 2018, they are relegating 8 teams to senior B football and it will mirror the hurling but that still won't solve what we'll call the "Donal Miller problem"!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on January 19, 2017, 10:41:40 AM
Hi surely there is a simple way to sort out all this gaels/transfer nonsense by introducing 4 divisional teams north, south, east and west made up of junior and intermediate players. Rule it now before the year kicks off properly that the bottom 4 teams + the winners of this years intermediate go into a 5 team group at the end of the season in which all teams play each other once with the winning team being promoted to senior and the rest to intermediate (should teams be level on points it goes to score difference, still level after tat teams get drawn from a hat and play off winner takes all) This serves 3 purposes 1: To reduce senior teams to 12, 2: the extra numbers in intermediate will increase the divisional team strength and 3: I creates a competitive atmosphere (which i think has been lost in Laois football for a long time).
Now 2018 would see the senior c/ship with 12 senior teams + 4 divisional, 4 groups of 4 with one divisional team in each group all teams playing  playing twice, top 2 teams go through to quarters etc, third place teams going into a shield semi final. This ensures all teams get a minimum of 7 games at senior for their players to be seen.
Relegation then divisional teams cant be relegated (this ensures all the counties top players are playing senior every year which is the why all the transfers/amalgamation are happening) and the lowest placed senior team plays off against intermediate winners.

The reason for all  the playoffs/senior relegation is to fuel competitiveness. There will then be only 12 "official" senior teams who have to battle every year to keep there name against a intermediate side thats chomping at the bit to move itself up a division. You have 4 large groups of individuals in the divisional that are out to prove why they deserve a chance to play senior football and a better prospect of playing county giving us a total of 240 of  our best players playing first team senior football. Senior teams will have to fight to keep their place and the intermediate championship will be properly competitive.
Thats just my take on it anyway, in my opinion it would create a more competitive platform, stop all this amalgamation/transfer crap and give all our best players a chance to prove themselves.
That's actually a brilliant idea.
For 2018, they are relegating 8 teams to senior B football and it will mirror the hurling but that still won't solve what we'll call the "Donal Miller problem"!
I feel like I've made Donal a poster child for this, my apologies Donal.

And it is a brilliant idea. I would question the 7 games thing, it could lead to dead rubber, even with the spectre of relegation, but on the whole, it deserves to go forward for debate at club and county board level.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: SCFC on January 19, 2017, 10:56:22 AM
Fair enough, from now it shall henceforth be known as the "Derek O'Connell issue".  ;)
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on January 19, 2017, 11:00:46 AM
Fair enough, from now it shall henceforth be known as the "Derek O'Connell issue".  ;)
Brian Keville?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on January 19, 2017, 11:10:24 AM
How would you split it considering that around the tipp/kilkenny borders there's virtually no football, and there is about 8 football clubs, 7 of which are senior lumped into one corner of the county, you could argue for a north/south split like they do in tipp for football but 4 is too much for the moment at least, as for the senior being split its a good thing i reckon long term, all you have to do is look at the hurling championship which hasnt had a back to back winner in 14/15 years, you will also be creating an unbelievably competitive intermediate championship(which is what it is seeing as the winners play leinster intermediate), ill take my own club as an example probably one of the best up and coming football teams in laois going by underage success etc. If westayed in the top 8 they will be exposed to the absolute top level in the county kind of a sink or swim thing, if they are in the new inter championship they are probably at a level closer to their own but they would have a real chance of winning something. What im saying in a roundabout way is that every club should now have a championship to aim for instead of 9/10 senior teams going through the motions
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ogie on January 19, 2017, 11:48:22 AM
Looks like the Ballinakill Slieve Bloom Gaels hurling is going ahead for senior, I think this is absolutely ridiculous, similar to the Trumera/Kyle last year these amalgamations have taken a bad turn,
Clubs with no connection, geographically or otherwise linking up so the likes of Ballinakill can use Ben Conroy or other clubs cherry picking players,
I also think it's a bad move for Ballinakill who are a very progressive club in their own right with a lot of development going on with their club grounds & their underage set up why get involved with this rubbish
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on January 19, 2017, 12:01:11 PM
How would you split it considering that around the tipp/kilkenny borders there's virtually no football, and there is about 8 football clubs, 7 of which are senior lumped into one corner of the county, you could argue for a north/south split like they do in tipp for football but 4 is too much for the moment at least, as for the senior being split its a good thing i reckon long term, all you have to do is look at the hurling championship which hasnt had a back to back winner in 14/15 years, you will also be creating an unbelievably competitive intermediate championship(which is what it is seeing as the winners play leinster intermediate), ill take my own club as an example probably one of the best up and coming football teams in laois going by underage success etc. If westayed in the top 8 they will be exposed to the absolute top level in the county kind of a sink or swim thing, if they are in the new inter championship they are probably at a level closer to their own but they would have a real chance of winning something. What im saying in a roundabout way is that every club should now have a championship to aim for instead of 9/10 senior teams going through the motions

What they have done in Tipp is interesting in relation to football,Football would be strong to various degrees in the South,West and Mid Divisions,what they have done with the North which would be all Hurling is put in a 9 nine team amalgamation called Thomas McDonoghs which gives the likes of Philip Austin,George Hannigan and Kevin o Halloran the opportunity to play senior club football,when they would be playing junior A at best with their clubs.

From talking to a work colleague in Tipp,there was a strategic football plan put in place by the Tipp county board 15 years ago with the aim of Tipp winning an All Ireland by 2020,their 100th Anniversary of their last win,the county board over there drove that amalgamation and player pathways in the likes of the north division.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: INTJ on January 19, 2017, 12:24:04 PM
I actually wasn't considering Donal Miller in that it im my view he is one of the post dedicated and passionate annaghnough men there is was the other teams and players like Barrowhouse for example, I only recently read about the Daly talk and if a little club like that can lose the 2 kingstons and Daly it shows how well they are set up. If im not mistaken with them if they had all players available their team would consist of 2 kingstons, daly,  malone, (dont know first name) brennan, joe murphy and the twin chaps who would of all played minor or u21 and senoir for laois and i think the oldest being 28ish? I know you can still argue that only 3 of the 9 would of left but altogether that would be the bones of some outfit. They also used to have dom whelans son who was a great  talant that never had a chance to play above junior. If im not mistaken however he was a stand out performer for one of the american club teams recently so is obviously over there.

regarding the division dont think as north/s/e/w. think NE/SE/SW/NW google maps laois draw a rough line straight through portlaoise from just to the right of MM to just right of ballinakill to divide east west. then from roughly from athy to the N77 to divide NE and SE and from portlaoise straight across between mountrath and ballyfin. That would leave the hurling parts quite large with lots to draw from and football side smaller with more traditional clubs. for instance NE would then consist of annanough, O'D's, the rock, courtwood and emo and whoever else, SE would be barrowhouse park, timmahoe, spink an SW then would be ballynakill, durrow, rathdowny, errill borris, castletown and mountrath and NW rosenallis, kilcavan and dont forget bout senior teams coming down.
 
Anyway what im saying is a club like that and other clubs around should have the ability to let there players play senior ball in a proper format. We need our best players playing competitive HARD football. Its the county board that are confusing things by once again being to afraid/old fashioned to make changes and causing club officials all kinds of headaches just to be either shot down or made fun of.

also agrees with the 7 matches being to much, just make it one game each in the group that leaves a min of 4 games.

Intermediate and junior should also be restructured to accomodate these changes to make their championship more competitive. Firstly to avoid players playing eeach weekend for divisional and junior/intermediate teams play off junior c/ship between mid may and finish in july again same format as above in groups all teams play the same weekend  sunny weather good football. Thats 10 weeks to play 6 games max. Players that are out then have all august to go on holidays/EP and relax and the div teams holding onto players from august to end of c/chip.
The problem i feel with splitting the senior into 2 is that you still have 4 teams to many calling themselves senior.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: TP Ashe on January 19, 2017, 12:32:48 PM
So clubs who invest in their juvenile clubs are going to be disadvantaged because other clubs can cobble together teams from the pick of available players; irregardless of parish rule or basic geographical logic?

Sounds like utter bull to me!

Over the last 20 years, we've had relatively small clubs (purely in terms of population) like Castletown and Clough/Ballacolla contest and win Senior championships.
Both clubs are probably pulling from primary school numbers of less than 200 kids total.

I get the 'Donal Miller' conundrum but I'm perplexed by this notion that the good of the Laois County Team should supersede the good of the basic club unit. The club is the lifeblood of the gaa. Penalising the clubs who are trying to do the right thing doesn't sit well with me.

Area teams have been welcome in the Palmer/Kelly Cup for years but there has been no uptake. Now, certain clubs and individuals are seeing their remaining chances of winning a championship ebbing away and amalgamations are seen as the answer.

I'm not sure this is a positive development. I have no problem with parish teams a la Raheen Parish Gaels, The Harps, Borris/Kilcotton etc but this Ballinakill/Slieve Bloom amalgamation is ridiculous.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on January 19, 2017, 12:41:17 PM
Area teams have been welcome in the Palmer/Kelly Cup for years but there has been no uptake. Now, certain clubs and individuals are seeing their remaining chances of winning a championship ebbing away and amalgamations are seen as the answer.
No one gives a flying fup about the Palmer and Kelly Cups. Offering area teams spaces in them was lip service.

People assume area teams will walk the competition are way off the mark as well.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on January 19, 2017, 12:45:30 PM
Intermediate and junior should also be restructured to accomodate these changes to make their championship more competitive. Firstly to avoid players playing eeach weekend for divisional and junior/intermediate teams play off junior c/ship between mid may and finish in july again same format as above in groups all teams play the same weekend  sunny weather good football. Thats 10 weeks to play 6 games max. Players that are out then have all august to go on holidays/EP and relax and the div teams holding onto players from august to end of c/chip
[/quote]

Not half insulting to junior players, just f**k them out of the way thats your solution basically, there would also be the issue of senior teams leaving their better lads off the 17 so they could go win a junior championship, if you pick out a weekend llets say have senior matches on a friday, senior b and inter matches on a sqturday and junior games on a sunday, you could maybe pick out the marquee game from each grade and play them in o'moore park to keep it active and play the rest of the games elsewhere, theres enough high quality club grounds to cater senior clubs(ex make more sense to have st josephs vs graigue in crettyard or ballyroan vs o'dempseys in stradbally/portarlington), for the senior the junior b and c usually start early july and is played midweek so there should be an issue with them
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: INTJ on January 19, 2017, 01:55:07 PM
No not a tall, I played junior for a country team most of my adult life and trying to assemble a team of lads in August between holidays and barley was next to impossible. you cant tell a farmer to stop cutting corn at 6 go home to eat dinner and be at training at half 7 with rain expected the following day. Or alternatively like what happened on more than one occasion you play your first match the second week of august and because of senior and inter being played your match get postponed for a month so you play a meangingless challenge match against a club somewhere and either win big, lose big or get inevitably your best player injured. There is nothing to stop the junior and inter league playing 4-5 games in march-april, and the rest in august on.
To stop bigger doing that is easy the top 19 lads that played the most amount c/ship the previous year are automatically your first panel, any player from that 19 can be regraded but cant go back up to senior the same year

Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Unlaoised on January 19, 2017, 03:26:11 PM
I think this is an argument that goes on in most counties and there is no simple solution but one things for certain we have to many senior teams in football and that should be looked at.

Amalgamations are difficult from both sides of the fence ....It's so hard to get the balance right.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: INTJ on January 19, 2017, 07:29:04 PM
Yeah it's a bit of situation alright but it works in other counties and could possibly be integrated here. I truly believe the old buzz words of passion and competitiveness have long been missing from senior football. And wanted to fit in the prospect of all players having the chance to experience senior football while making all c/ships more competitive. Football is currently mundane and that has to change somehow.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 19, 2017, 08:11:32 PM
Do other clubs get any say in these amalgamations?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: hurlingmad on January 19, 2017, 09:35:11 PM
Do other clubs get any say in these amalgamations?

Im not so sure about Laois but in 2004 Golden/Anacarthy and kilfeacle amalgamated in Tipperary and reached a county final only to be narrowly defeated by Toomevara and just about every team they beat along the way objected to them playing as a unit and they ceased to exist as a combo as they were dubbed. If this was a result of objections, I dont know but clubs can object with good reason from what iv been told over the years
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: TP Ashe on January 19, 2017, 10:00:25 PM
Ballinakill Gaels - Senior Hurling Championship – Ballinakill with players from Slieve Bloom and Slieve Margy

Ballyfin Gaels –Senior Hurling “A” Championship –Ballyfin with players from Mountmellick
Ballyfin Gaels - Senior Football Championship –Ballyfin  with players from Slieve Bloom  and Camross

Clonaslee St Manmans Gaels – Senior Football Championship – Clonaslee St Manmans with players from Annanough

Crettyard Gaels – Senior Football Championship – Crettyard with players from Spink

Colt Gaels – Senior Hurling “A” Championship –Colt with players from Clonad

Mountmellick Gaels – Senior Football Championship - Mountmellick with players from Kilcavan and Castletown

Shanahoe Gaels - Senior Hurling “A” Championship – Shanahoe with players from Ballypickas

*All the above have been recommended by the County Executive.

Will be discussed and voted-on next Monday.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 20, 2017, 12:22:02 AM
Ballinakill Gaels - Senior Hurling Championship – Ballinakill with players from Slieve Bloom and Slieve Margy

Ballyfin Gaels –Senior Hurling “A” Championship –Ballyfin with players from Mountmellick
Ballyfin Gaels - Senior Football Championship –Ballyfin  with players from Slieve Bloom  and Camross

Clonaslee St Manmans Gaels – Senior Football Championship – Clonaslee St Manmans with players from Annanough

Crettyard Gaels – Senior Football Championship – Crettyard with players from Spink

Colt Gaels – Senior Hurling “A” Championship –Colt with players from Clonad

Mountmellick Gaels – Senior Football Championship - Mountmellick with players[/i] from Kilcavan and Castletown

Shanahoe Gaels - Senior Hurling “A” Championship – Shanahoe with players from Ballypickas

*All the above have been recommended by the County Executive.

Will be discussed and voted-on next Monday.

The above in bold and italics should not be entertained!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: O moore parklife on January 20, 2017, 12:24:29 AM
I 100% agree with the above.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: TP Ashe on January 20, 2017, 01:07:20 AM
I 100% agree with the above.

100% agree.
Clubs will have been informed about these proposals on Tuesday. County Board Delegates should be mandated by their clubs to reject these proposals but I really doubt that will happen.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: BallyroanAbbey on January 20, 2017, 01:10:22 AM
The Castletown one is specifically for ben reddin who has always played football for mountmellick and hurling for castletown to be fair to him
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: les Antiques on January 20, 2017, 09:58:09 AM
The Heath / Timahoe amalgamation is obviously a non runner then .
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on January 20, 2017, 10:05:23 AM
Ballinakill Gaels - Senior Hurling Championship – Ballinakill with players from Slieve Bloom and Slieve Margy

Ballyfin Gaels –Senior Hurling “A” Championship –Ballyfin with players from Mountmellick
Ballyfin Gaels - Senior Football Championship –Ballyfin  with players from Slieve Bloom  and Camross

Clonaslee St Manmans Gaels – Senior Football Championship – Clonaslee St Manmans with players from Annanough

Crettyard Gaels – Senior Football Championship – Crettyard with players from Spink

Colt Gaels – Senior Hurling “A” Championship –Colt with players from Clonad

Mountmellick Gaels – Senior Football Championship - Mountmellick with players from Kilcavan and Castletown

Shanahoe Gaels - Senior Hurling “A” Championship – Shanahoe with players from Ballypickas

*All the above have been recommended by the County Executive.

Will be discussed and voted-on next Monday.
Did they reject any?

Clonaslee and Annanough is almost like a social experiment of sorts.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on January 20, 2017, 10:59:58 AM
Ballinakill Gaels - Senior Hurling Championship – Ballinakill with players from Slieve Bloom and Slieve Margy

Ballyfin Gaels –Senior Hurling “A” Championship –Ballyfin with players from Mountmellick
Ballyfin Gaels - Senior Football Championship –Ballyfin  with players from Slieve Bloom  and Camross

Clonaslee St Manmans Gaels – Senior Football Championship – Clonaslee St Manmans with players from Annanough

Crettyard Gaels – Senior Football Championship – Crettyard with players from Spink

Colt Gaels – Senior Hurling “A” Championship –Colt with players from Clonad

Mountmellick Gaels – Senior Football Championship - Mountmellick with players from Kilcavan and Castletown

Shanahoe Gaels - Senior Hurling “A” Championship – Shanahoe with players from Ballypickas

*All the above have been recommended by the County Executive.

Will be discussed and voted-on next Monday.
Did they reject any?

Clonaslee and Annanough is almost like a social experiment of sorts.
There is no rule in the book to stop amalgamations such as Clonaslee/ Annanough. It can be stopped at the discretion of the County Committee which includes the club delegates. Here's a unusual one from Kilkenny. The only amalgamated set up in Kilkenny that I can think of is Galmoy/Windgap (underage) who are at least 30 miles apart. Don't know whether it is still going. 
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: TP Ashe on January 20, 2017, 11:12:17 AM
Ballinakill Gaels - Senior Hurling Championship – Ballinakill with players from Slieve Bloom and Slieve Margy

Ballyfin Gaels –Senior Hurling “A” Championship –Ballyfin with players from Mountmellick
Ballyfin Gaels - Senior Football Championship –Ballyfin  with players from Slieve Bloom  and Camross

Clonaslee St Manmans Gaels – Senior Football Championship – Clonaslee St Manmans with players from Annanough

Crettyard Gaels – Senior Football Championship – Crettyard with players from Spink

Colt Gaels – Senior Hurling “A” Championship –Colt with players from Clonad

Mountmellick Gaels – Senior Football Championship - Mountmellick with players from Kilcavan and Castletown

Shanahoe Gaels - Senior Hurling “A” Championship – Shanahoe with players from Ballypickas

*All the above have been recommended by the County Executive.

Will be discussed and voted-on next Monday.
Did they reject any?

Clonaslee and Annanough is almost like a social experiment of sorts.

I didn't see the correspondence or anything but I believe none were refused outright.

There was mention of some of these amalgamations being against the 'spirit of the rule' but that might only be hearsay.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Unlaoised on January 20, 2017, 11:55:12 AM
Ballyfin Gaels - Senior Football Championship –Ballyfin  with players from Slieve Bloom  and Camross



??????????????Camross lads hurling with Ballyfin??
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on January 20, 2017, 12:05:52 PM
Crettyard Gaels – Senior Football Championship – Crettyard with players from Spink

That should be Crettyard with Spink & Ballinakill players
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: BallyroanAbbey on January 20, 2017, 01:05:31 PM
Crettyard Gaels – Senior Football Championship – Crettyard with players from Spink

That should be Crettyard with Spink & Ballinakill players

Spink caters for the football side of ballinakill and knock parish and ballinakill caters for the hurling so it is only players from spink club
Preferably you would like to see a link between clubs weather that be underage amalgamations or parish neighbours but sometimes the senior club wont allow this, Joesphs and Barrowhouse being a prime example, so if the oppurtunity comes up elsewhere to play at the top grade you cant exactly blame a junior club for taking it
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Target Man on January 21, 2017, 02:38:45 AM
Crettyard Gaels – Senior Football Championship – Crettyard with players from Spink

That should be Crettyard with Spink & Ballinakill players

Ballinakill a hurling only club. I wold think that description of Crettyard Gaels is accurate
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Target Man on January 21, 2017, 02:42:18 AM
Ballyfin Gaels - Senior Football Championship –Ballyfin  with players from Slieve Bloom  and Camross



??????????????Camross lads hurling with Ballyfin??


No
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: SCFC on January 21, 2017, 09:57:53 AM
I can see some clubs voting against these football amalgamations Monday night.
Some of the weaker senior clubs might not want Clonaslee for example being strengthened as it could threaten their own chances of not getting relegated. And some of the intermediate teams might prefer the weakest senior team being relegated instead of the likes of Graiugue or The Heath or even Stradbally who were all in the relegation mix in the last two years.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Laois fan on January 21, 2017, 03:57:21 PM
What's the story with Arles Killeen and barrow house is it not happening now
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: SCFC on January 21, 2017, 06:35:45 PM
What's the story with Arles Killeen and barrow house is it not happening now

No - in fairness to Barrowhouse, Killeen took two of their best players - why should they prop up an aging Killeen outfit?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: the sash on January 21, 2017, 08:12:08 PM
Alot of decisions you might think would get shot down,often pass through because the huling clubs have a vote in football matters n vice vearsa.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Heshs Umpire on January 22, 2017, 09:20:57 AM
Alot of decisions you might think would get shot down,often pass through because the huling clubs have a vote in football matters n vice vearsa.
If it doesn't affect a club their delegate should possibly abstain.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 22, 2017, 03:53:44 PM
Alot of decisions you might think would get shot down,often pass through because the huling clubs have a vote in football matters n vice vearsa.
If it doesn't affect a club their delegate should possibly abstain.

I disagree.
Most items that come to a vote can have future consequences, with setting of precedent etc.
Also, it is Laois GAA, not Laois Hurling or Laois Football. All delegates and clubs are entitled to comment and vote on issues affecting Laois GAA as a whole.
Items such as grading, regrading, amalgamations as a whole might only ever affect a handful of clubs directly. However, they often lead to future scenarios that will affect many others.
For example, Ballinakill Gaels will only really affect the other 7 senior clubs. Does this mean that only those clubs should be allowed vote on it?
Similarly with Clonaslee Gaels.

The fact is that if those two pass then (IMO) the system is being abused and barring a change to rule at congress, it will be hard for Laois GAA to refuse any suggested amalgamations into the future.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Heshs Umpire on January 23, 2017, 12:23:34 AM
Alot of decisions you might think would get shot down,often pass through because the huling clubs have a vote in football matters n vice vearsa.
If it doesn't affect a club their delegate should possibly abstain.

I disagree.
Most items that come to a vote can have future consequences, with setting of precedent etc.
Also, it is Laois GAA, not Laois Hurling or Laois Football. All delegates and clubs are entitled to comment and vote on issues affecting Laois GAA as a whole.
Items such as grading, regrading, amalgamations as a whole might only ever affect a handful of clubs directly. However, they often lead to future scenarios that will affect many others.
For example, Ballinakill Gaels will only really affect the other 7 senior clubs. Does this mean that only those clubs should be allowed vote on it?
Similarly with Clonaslee Gaels.

The fact is that if those two pass then (IMO) the system is being abused and barring a change to rule at congress, it will be hard for Laois GAA to refuse any suggested amalgamations into the future.
I did say "possibly abstain".
And to be fair for the likes of Ballinakill Gaels it could affect far more than the other seven senior clubs so I don't think it should mean every other club should abstain.
However, I think if a delegate from Portarlington or Graigue for instance hasn't been mandated by his club to vote on a particular all hurling amalgamation I would think abstaining an acceptable option.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: redsetanta on January 23, 2017, 10:35:16 AM
It's all well and good for delegates to not bother voting because something doesn't affect them directly but they don't know when a similar situation will occur that DOES affect their club.
If you are not happy with the principle of the argument then you should vote against it whether it affects you directly or not. Ultimately all the decisions that are made at county board level will have an affect at some stage sooner or later.
So the 'it doesn't bother me so I don't care' attitude is wrong and detrimental in the long term to all GAA clubs.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballygowen on January 23, 2017, 10:18:59 PM
So what amalgamations have been passed at tonight's meeting? anyone any updates?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 23, 2017, 11:06:42 PM
It's all well and good for delegates to not bother voting because something doesn't affect them directly but they don't know when a similar situation will occur that DOES affect their club.
If you are not happy with the principle of the argument then you should vote against it whether it affects you directly or not. Ultimately all the decisions that are made at county board level will have an affect at some stage sooner or later.
So the 'it doesn't bother me so I don't care' attitude is wrong and detrimental in the long term to all GAA clubs.

I might not have been clear, but this is exactly what I meant.

I have no idea what happened/is happening tonight, but for any delegate to sit on their hands because these potential amalgams don't directly hinder their own clubs' championship ambitions is not right.
There is a need to be cognisant of the bigger picture, and Laois GAA is taking a turn for the worse with some of these "proposed" alliances.

"......Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me"
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Helix on January 24, 2017, 05:34:47 PM
See on new Laois today online media the gaels for 2017:
Hurling:
Ballinakill and Slieve Margy (Senior) No Slieve bloom so.
Ballyfin and Mountmellick (Senior A)
Colt and Clonad (Senior A)
Shanahoe and Ballypickas (Senior A)

Football:
Crettyard and Spink (Senior)
Ballyfin Slieve Bloom & Camross (Senior)
Mountmellick Castletown & Kilcavan (Senior)
Clonaslee and Annanough (Senior)
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 24, 2017, 05:43:06 PM
See on new Laois today online media the gaels for 2017:
Hurling:
Ballinakill and Slieve Margy (Senior) No Slieve bloom so.

Good. Does anyone know why?

Clonaslee and Annanough (Senior)

Shocking. Wonder was there much debate on this?
I personally hope it fails miserably.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on January 24, 2017, 06:01:21 PM
See on new Laois today online media the gaels for 2017:
Hurling:
Ballinakill and Slieve Margy (Senior) No Slieve bloom so.

Good. Does anyone know why?

Clonaslee and Annanough (Senior)

Shocking. Wonder was there much debate on this?
I personally hope it fails miserably.
From what I hear on the grapevine Slieve bloom club  were not in favour of the Ballinakill amalgamation.   
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 24, 2017, 06:27:53 PM
See on new Laois today online media the gaels for 2017:
Hurling:
Ballinakill and Slieve Margy (Senior) No Slieve bloom so.

Good. Does anyone know why?

Clonaslee and Annanough (Senior)

Shocking. Wonder was there much debate on this?
I personally hope it fails miserably.
From what I hear on the grapevine Slieve bloom club  were not in favour of the Ballinakill amalgamation.

That seems very dysfunctional! How would it get as far as a proposal to the county board?!
I have since seen on Laois Today that the Clonaslee- Annanough one went to a vote. Sickening that delegates allowed it to pass through. In fairness there is nothing the County Board can do about that.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on January 24, 2017, 06:40:26 PM
Look its happened now they were screwed over a few years ago when they tried to form a team with park and courtwood so let them have their oppurtunity
Anyway i heard that from next year only gales teams with some sort of  link (juvenile, parish, etc) will be accepted from next year
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballygowen on January 24, 2017, 09:07:14 PM
Just reading the above posts, and some people reacting to Slieve Bloom - Ballinakill amalgamation (before it didn't go ahead) and Clonaslee and Annanough amalgamation. Realistaclly its no worse than the Shanahoe and Ballypickass amalgamation, they have no links with each other at under age, they are not in the same parish and geographically they aren't the closest to each other! So why is it ok for them but some people are complaining about the other two? also i see Colt and Clonad have joined. Why in gods name would Colt, Clonad and Shanahoe not join together as they are all in the same parish! they must have serious issues with each other. ridiculous really.

Anyway that's just my opinion on it. maybe some of you have a different one.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on January 24, 2017, 09:46:31 PM
Agree with you completely

The quicker heads are knocked together in Raheen Parish the better for hurling in the parish,hopefully our new juvenile combination will be the start of it
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: BallyroanAbbey on January 24, 2017, 09:49:15 PM
Shanahoe and Ballypickas play together underage and have done so for the past few years, this year there's an amalgamation underage of colt, shanahoe, clonad, ballypickas and trumera. As for colt, clonad and shanahoe realistically whats the difference between them having 6 teams between them and having 4 if they amalgamated, they seem to be happy enough to go solo in their areas. At the end of the day playing senior isn't the be all and end all for them. Like ive said before if some people had their way there would only be around 12 clubs in the county, in 10 years people would be looking for the likes of ballinakill/the harps join.

Amalgamations in the main are ultimately for short-term gains and over time lead to less people playing the games. At the moment ballyroan and abbeyleix are the 2 most dominant teams in underage gaa in this county. Realsitically take one of our juvenile teams, on average half wont be playing gaa by the time they hit u21 largely due to the fact that we have the numbers to not miss them, off the 8 left 4 will pick hurling over football and out of those 4 left only 2 will probably be good enough for the first team.

GAA at the end of the day is a past time, there is probably as many lads who get a kick out of representing their area as there is that are ultra competitive and probably just as many who go for the craic.

Basically i feel that you will get a short term boost in standard from amalgamations but long term numbers will dwindle thus resulting in standards slipping again
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 24, 2017, 11:34:04 PM
Just reading the above posts, and some people reacting to Slieve Bloom - Ballinakill amalgamation (before it didn't go ahead) and Clonaslee and Annanough amalgamation. Realistaclly its no worse than the Shanahoe and Ballypickass amalgamation, they have no links with each other at under age, they are not in the same parish and geographically they aren't the closest to each other! So why is it ok for them but some people are complaining about the other two? also i see Colt and Clonad have joined. Why in gods name would Colt, Clonad and Shanahoe not join together as they are all in the same parish! they must have serious issues with each other. ridiculous really.

Anyway that's just my opinion on it. maybe some of you have a different one.

There is a difference, in fairness. As mentioned above, they play together at certain underage grades.
Also the following are the distances involved;

Shanahoe GAA- Ballypickas GAA 9.5km
Ballinakill GAA- Slieve Bloom GAA 23km
Clonaslee GAA- Annanough GAA 35km

So first of all Shanahoe and Ballypickas have an underage history, while the others are the opposite. Annanough and Slieve Bloom both have well established juvenile relationships with others.
Secondly in terms of geography there is a big difference. Shanahoe and Ballypickas are both on the outskirts of Abbeyleix town. The other two have no connection at all.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballygowen on January 25, 2017, 12:07:11 AM
Fair enough, valid points above. It just seems strange that 2 of the 3 clubs within the same parish amalgamate with each and the other team in the same parish amalgamate with a team outside their parish.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on January 25, 2017, 12:33:48 AM
Fair enough, valid points above. It just seems strange that 2 of the 3 clubs within the same parish amalgamate with each and the other team in the same parish amalgamate with a team outside their parish.

Ye I'd have to say that I thought Shanahoe and Colt had built up sufficient links over the last number of years and that they would be the ones to join.
Perhaps the fact that they are both at the same level contributed to the lack of willingness. Who "joins" who and what is called etc!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on January 25, 2017, 07:21:59 AM
Fair enough, valid points above. It just seems strange that 2 of the 3 clubs within the same parish amalgamate with each and the other team in the same parish amalgamate with a team outside their parish.

Ye I'd have to say that I thought Shanahoe and Colt had built up sufficient links over the last number of years and that they would be the ones to join.
Perhaps the fact that they are both at the same level contributed to the lack of willingness. Who "joins" who and what is called etc!
Familiarity can breed contempt.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Junior Ex Laoistalk on January 25, 2017, 03:38:48 PM
Report on Laois GAA County Committee Meeting, 23rd January 2016  
http://laoisgaa.ie/news/10018107/Report_on_Laois_GAA_County_Committee_Meeting_23_January_2016 (http://laoisgaa.ie/news/10018107/Report_on_Laois_GAA_County_Committee_Meeting_23_January_2016)
 
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 01, 2017, 03:49:25 PM
I see that Arles/Killeen, Arles /Kilcruise and Barrowhouse have joined forces at underage level up to under 21. A very interesting development.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on February 01, 2017, 06:37:43 PM
I see that Arles/Killeen, Arles /Kilcruise and Barrowhouse have joined forces at underage level up to under 21. A very interesting development.
Its the first step in the re-establishment of the old Arles Club(about time) but I cannot see how they will field teams in all age groups. Maybe up to u14 but where will they get their minor and u21 players from. I also hear that an objection from the Ballylinan/Gleanmore set up is on the cards as this was one of the conditions set out by Croke Park during the Arles split to ensure under age players in the parish were catered for. I also hear that some B/house players do not want to play with this new set up and want to play with St Josephs.  A very very interesting time ahead I think.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on February 01, 2017, 06:41:23 PM
I see that Arles/Killeen, Arles /Kilcruise and Barrowhouse have joined forces at underage level up to under 21. A very interesting development.
Its the first step in the re-establishment of the old Arles Club(about time) but I cannot see how they will field teams in all age groups. Maybe up to u14 but where will they get their minor and u21 players from. I also hear that an objection from the Ballylinan/Gleanmore set up is on the cards as this was one of the conditions set out by Croke Park during the Arles split to ensure under age players in the parish were catered for. I also hear that some B/house players do not want to play with this new set up and want to play with St Josephs.  A very very interesting time ahead I think.

Does that mean that as it currently stands both Ballylinan and St Josephs would be left on their own at juvenile level?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on February 01, 2017, 06:52:00 PM
I see that Arles/Killeen, Arles /Kilcruise and Barrowhouse have joined forces at underage level up to under 21. A very interesting development.
Its the first step in the re-establishment of the old Arles Club(about time) but I cannot see how they will field teams in all age groups. Maybe up to u14 but where will they get their minor and u21 players from. I also hear that an objection from the Ballylinan/Gleanmore set up is on the cards as this was one of the conditions set out by Croke Park during the Arles split to ensure under age players in the parish were catered for. I also hear that some B/house players do not want to play with this new set up and want to play with St Josephs.  A very very interesting time ahead I think.

Does that mean that as it currently stands both Ballylinan and St Josephs would be left on their own at juvenile level?
Looks like it. I can see a new Arles club being formed soon with B/house as a feeder club. 8) 8) ;D ;D
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 01, 2017, 09:49:11 PM
I see that Arles/Killeen, Arles /Kilcruise and Barrowhouse have joined forces at underage level up to under 21. A very interesting development.
Its the first step in the re-establishment of the old Arles Club(about time) but I cannot see how they will field teams in all age groups. Maybe up to u14 but where will they get their minor and u21 players from. I also hear that an objection from the Ballylinan/Gleanmore set up is on the cards as this was one of the conditions set out by Croke Park during the Arles split to ensure under age players in the parish were catered for. I also hear that some B/house players do not want to play with this new set up and want to play with St Josephs.  A very very interesting time ahead I think.

Interesting times ahead . Probably puts the death nail in the 3 in a row attempt for Joes under 21s. I heard this was player driven. It's mad how you often get contradictory reports. Joes definitely have enough to compete at a reasonable level but I'm unsure about Ballylinan.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on February 01, 2017, 11:50:09 PM
I see that Arles/Killeen, Arles /Kilcruise and Barrowhouse have joined forces at underage level up to under 21. A very interesting development.
Its the first step in the re-establishment of the old Arles Club(about time) but I cannot see how they will field teams in all age groups. Maybe up to u14 but where will they get their minor and u21 players from. I also hear that an objection from the Ballylinan/Gleanmore set up is on the cards as this was one of the conditions set out by Croke Park during the Arles split to ensure under age players in the parish were catered for. I also hear that some B/house players do not want to play with this new set up and want to play with St Josephs.  A very very interesting time ahead I think.

Interesting times ahead . Probably puts the death nail in the 3 in a row attempt for Joes under 21s. I heard this was player driven. It's mad how you often get contradictory reports. Joes definitely have enough to compete at a reasonable level but I'm unsure about Ballylinan.
Interesting times for sure. Player driven seems a strange one after the success of that Joes/B/H combination. I believe myself its a consequence  of Brian Daly's wish to play with St Josephs. Madness at its best   
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on February 02, 2017, 07:14:02 AM
Why is it madness?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Laois fan on February 02, 2017, 09:42:46 AM
Hardly madness think it's the best possible move for barrow house if the three clubs eventually do join up,I presume they will be weak enough at underage level but it's a start.Think ballylinan will suffer but maybe they have enough numbers and wanted to go by themselves, Joseph's get what they deserve...
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: redsetanta on February 02, 2017, 09:58:57 AM
Ballylynan have wanted to do their own thing for a while. There has been an increase in population in Ballylynan over the past few years so they would have the numbers. The fact that numbers are so poor from with the Arles clubs probably influenced this. There is very few from 12yrs up to U21 in the parish but there are numbers(for now) under the 12 age group. Geographically Barrowhouse would be close particularly to Killeen. It could well see a joining of the clubs again in the coming years.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on February 02, 2017, 10:00:37 AM
Raheen Parish Gaels u14 A U16 A u17A Minor A and U21A Hurling

Ballyfin u14 A,Ballyfin Gaels U16 A,Football

Ballinakill u14B,Ballinakill/Ratheniska Gaels U16 A,Ballinakill Gaels Minor B,Ballinakill Gaels u21 B,Hurling

Na Fianna Og u14 B and C,u16B,u21A,Football

Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on February 02, 2017, 10:04:04 AM
Ballylinan U14A,U16A,U17A,U21A

Ballylinan Gleanmor Gaels Minor A

Football
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on February 02, 2017, 10:09:03 AM
Hardly madness think it's the best possible move for barrow house if the three clubs eventually do join up,I presume they will be weak enough at underage level but it's a start.Think ballylinan will suffer but maybe they have enough numbers and wanted to go by themselves, Joseph's get what they deserve...
Whole sale madness at its best. B/house will be swallowed up by the Arles group, that will cause splits( already surfacing with certain players looking and wanting  to join St Josephs.) and at the end only St Josephs benefit. The combination helped B/house enormously as seen by their recent success....the last combination between Kileen and themselves almost destroyed the club. Arles should be as was in the original Arles club. One team, one club, and one colour (Maroon) with a parish juvenile combination under the old umbrella of St Michaels
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on February 02, 2017, 10:15:22 AM
Ballylinan U14A,U16A,U17A,U21A

Ballylinan Gleanmor Gaels Minor A

Football
interesting. Where can you get information on affiliations in Laois  for 2017
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on February 02, 2017, 01:16:11 PM
Ballylinan U14A,U16A,U17A,U21A

Ballylinan Gleanmor Gaels Minor A

Football
interesting. Where can you get information on affiliations in Laois  for 2017

Juvenile committee in your club would have it at the  minute
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on February 02, 2017, 02:52:20 PM
Hardly madness think it's the best possible move for barrow house if the three clubs eventually do join up,I presume they will be weak enough at underage level but it's a start.Think ballylinan will suffer but maybe they have enough numbers and wanted to go by themselves, Joseph's get what they deserve...
Whole sale madness at its best. B/house will be swallowed up by the Arles group, that will cause splits( already surfacing with certain players looking and wanting  to join St Josephs.) and at the end only St Josephs benefit. The combination helped B/house enormously as seen by their recent success....the last combination between Kileen and themselves almost destroyed the club. Arles should be as was in the original Arles club. One team, one club, and one colour (Maroon) with a parish juvenile combination under the old umbrella of St Michaels

Only 1 player looking to join St Josephs as far as I can gather
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 02, 2017, 06:34:59 PM
Hardly madness think it's the best possible move for barrow house if the three clubs eventually do join up,I presume they will be weak enough at underage level but it's a start.Think ballylinan will suffer but maybe they have enough numbers and wanted to go by themselves, Joseph's get what they deserve...
Whole sale madness at its best. B/house will be swallowed up by the Arles group, that will cause splits( already surfacing with certain players looking and wanting  to join St Josephs.) and at the end only St Josephs benefit. The combination helped B/house enormously as seen by their recent success....the last combination between Kileen and themselves almost destroyed the club. Arles should be as was in the original Arles club. One team, one club, and one colour (Maroon) with a parish juvenile combination under the old umbrella of St Michaels



It seems Barrowhouse joining the Arles' has annoyed you greatly . If they didn't start pursuing their players then more than likely the amalgamation would have remained. Barrowhouse like Kyle, Ballypickas etc are now having to fight harder and harder for their existence. They more than likely felt under threat that Josephs would pick their talented youth. Unlike other clubs the house never had much of a history of outward transfers the Kingstons being a notable exception. This would suggest a loyalty and love of their club. But they were definitely not born and bred Barrowhouse men. The amalgamation with the Arles makes sense . 3 clubs with similar playing pools. Geographically tight  and all with the same motive to develop every single juvenile player. Josephs in reality never needed Barrowhouse to compete but they did need them to win. I'd imagine countless youngsters in the Arles' and Barrowhouse have been lost to game because they weren't getting the game time necessary and therefore unable to develop. Don't be annoyed monumental road. You may not win as much as you did but at least countless more Josephs youngsters will get games now that the Barrowhouse lads are gone .

The previous amalgamation with Killeen nearly destroyed the club. This is news to me. Care to enlighten us?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 02, 2017, 06:46:03 PM
Ballylinan U14A,U16A,U17A,U21A

Ballylinan Gleanmor Gaels Minor A

Football

Am I correct in assuming that the gaels would indiacate Barrowhouse?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on February 02, 2017, 10:38:47 PM
Hardly madness think it's the best possible move for barrow house if the three clubs eventually do join up,I presume they will be weak enough at underage level but it's a start.Think ballylinan will suffer but maybe they have enough numbers and wanted to go by themselves, Joseph's get what they deserve...
Whole sale madness at its best. B/house will be swallowed up by the Arles group, that will cause splits( already surfacing with certain players looking and wanting  to join St Josephs.) and at the end only St Josephs benefit. The combination helped B/house enormously as seen by their recent success....the last combination between Kileen and themselves almost destroyed the club. Arles should be as was in the original Arles club. One team, one club, and one colour (Maroon) with a parish juvenile combination under the old umbrella of St Michaels



It seems Barrowhouse joining the Arles' has annoyed you greatly . If they didn't start pursuing their players then more than likely the amalgamation would have remained. Barrowhouse like Kyle, Ballypickas etc are now having to fight harder and harder for their existence. They more than likely felt under threat that Josephs would pick their talented youth. Unlike other clubs the house never had much of a history of outward transfers the Kingstons being a notable exception. This would suggest a loyalty and love of their club. But they were definitely not born and bred Barrowhouse men. The amalgamation with the Arles makes sense . 3 clubs with similar playing pools. Geographically tight  and all with the same motive to develop every single juvenile player. Josephs in reality never needed Barrowhouse to compete but they did need them to win. I'd imagine countless youngsters in the Arles' and Barrowhouse have been lost to game because they weren't getting the game time necessary and therefore unable to develop. Don't be annoyed monumental road. You may not win as much as you did but at least countless more Josephs youngsters will get games now that the Barrowhouse lads are gone .

The previous amalgamation with Killeen nearly destroyed the club. This is news to me. Care to enlighten us?
Firstly i'm most certainly not annoyed as I don't have any connection with St Josephs although I do admire them greatly and have good friends from up there.
I do agree with a lot of what you say but  I do remember in the past when B/House played with the Arles parish teams at juvenile level and it done nothing for them. The first 15 always came from that parish and Barrow house players were left sitting on the side lines. Why they decided to leave the Joes/B/house combination beggars belief as they actually benefited greatly from that agreement and always got a fair deal.

Pursuing players Pablo, are you sure of this. As far as i'm aware and i'm fairly sure of this, St Josephs never chased any player from Barrow house and never pursued some of their present players who can legally play with St josephs as they live in Ballyadams parish.

The case involving Brian Daly is a personal decision by the player himself. Nothing to do with St josephs.

At the end of the day if Daly is refused his request, St Josephs will march on anyway. Barrow House will be at the beck and call of the Arles clubs and when they do join up Barrow house will be left to fend for themselves. Pity 
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 02, 2017, 11:32:03 PM
Hardly madness think it's the best possible move for barrow house if the three clubs eventually do join up,I presume they will be weak enough at underage level but it's a start.Think ballylinan will suffer but maybe they have enough numbers and wanted to go by themselves, Joseph's get what they deserve...
Whole sale madness at its best. B/house will be swallowed up by the Arles group, that will cause splits( already surfacing with certain players looking and wanting  to join St Josephs.) and at the end only St Josephs benefit. The combination helped B/house enormously as seen by their recent success....the last combination between Kileen and themselves almost destroyed the club. Arles should be as was in the original Arles club. One team, one club, and one colour (Maroon) with a parish juvenile combination under the old umbrella of St Michaels



It seems Barrowhouse joining the Arles' has annoyed you greatly . If they didn't start pursuing their players then more than likely the amalgamation would have remained. Barrowhouse like Kyle, Ballypickas etc are now having to fight harder and harder for their existence. They more than likely felt under threat that Josephs would pick their talented youth. Unlike other clubs the house never had much of a history of outward transfers the Kingstons being a notable exception. This would suggest a loyalty and love of their club. But they were definitely not born and bred Barrowhouse men. The amalgamation with the Arles makes sense . 3 clubs with similar playing pools. Geographically tight  and all with the same motive to develop every single juvenile player. Josephs in reality never needed Barrowhouse to compete but they did need them to win. I'd imagine countless youngsters in the Arles' and Barrowhouse have been lost to game because they weren't getting the game time necessary and therefore unable to develop. Don't be annoyed monumental road. You may not win as much as you did but at least countless more Josephs youngsters will get games now that the Barrowhouse lads are gone .

The previous amalgamation with Killeen nearly destroyed the club. This is news to me. Care to enlighten us?
Firstly i'm most certainly not annoyed as I don't have any connection with St Josephs although I do admire them greatly and have good friends from up there.
I do agree with a lot of what you say but  I do remember in the past when B/House played with the Arles parish teams at juvenile level and it done nothing for them. The first 15 always came from that parish and Barrow house players were left sitting on the side lines. Why they decided to leave the Joes/B/house combination beggars belief as they actually benefited greatly from that agreement and always got a fair deal.

Pursuing players Pablo, are you sure of this. As far as i'm aware and i'm fairly sure of this, St Josephs never chased any player from Barrow house and never pursued some of their present players who can legally play with St josephs as they live in Ballyadams parish.

The case involving Brian Daly is a personal decision by the player himself. Nothing to do with St josephs.

At the end of the day if Daly is refused his request, St Josephs will march on anyway. Barrow House will be at the beck and call of the Arles clubs and when they do join up Barrow house will be left to fend for themselves. Pity

Firstly I'm glad we cleared up that you are not a Josephs man 😂. Secondly Barrowhouse should be thanking Josephs for not poaching more of their players .  If Joseph's were the club I thought they were then they would have told Daly to F off with his transfer (if there is even a transfer, you seem to know more than most). I know it's not universally popular within the club you admire. By entertaining the transfer they have disbanded the almalgamation. I hope you can realise that.

I always thought Josephs did things the right way but ever since the whole relegation debacle I've begun to lose respect. This just adds to it.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on February 03, 2017, 12:04:32 AM
Hardly madness think it's the best possible move for barrow house if the three clubs eventually do join up,I presume they will be weak enough at underage level but it's a start.Think ballylinan will suffer but maybe they have enough numbers and wanted to go by themselves, Joseph's get what they deserve...
Whole sale madness at its best. B/house will be swallowed up by the Arles group, that will cause splits( already surfacing with certain players looking and wanting  to join St Josephs.) and at the end only St Josephs benefit. The combination helped B/house enormously as seen by their recent success....the last combination between Kileen and themselves almost destroyed the club. Arles should be as was in the original Arles club. One team, one club, and one colour (Maroon) with a parish juvenile combination under the old umbrella of St Michaels



It seems Barrowhouse joining the Arles' has annoyed you greatly . If they didn't start pursuing their players then more than likely the amalgamation would have remained. Barrowhouse like Kyle, Ballypickas etc are now having to fight harder and harder for their existence. They more than likely felt under threat that Josephs would pick their talented youth. Unlike other clubs the house never had much of a history of outward transfers the Kingstons being a notable exception. This would suggest a loyalty and love of their club. But they were definitely not born and bred Barrowhouse men. The amalgamation with the Arles makes sense . 3 clubs with similar playing pools. Geographically tight  and all with the same motive to develop every single juvenile player. Josephs in reality never needed Barrowhouse to compete but they did need them to win. I'd imagine countless youngsters in the Arles' and Barrowhouse have been lost to game because they weren't getting the game time necessary and therefore unable to develop. Don't be annoyed monumental road. You may not win as much as you did but at least countless more Josephs youngsters will get games now that the Barrowhouse lads are gone .

The previous amalgamation with Killeen nearly destroyed the club. This is news to me. Care to enlighten us?
Firstly i'm most certainly not annoyed as I don't have any connection with St Josephs although I do admire them greatly and have good friends from up there.
I do agree with a lot of what you say but  I do remember in the past when B/House played with the Arles parish teams at juvenile level and it done nothing for them. The first 15 always came from that parish and Barrow house players were left sitting on the side lines. Why they decided to leave the Joes/B/house combination beggars belief as they actually benefited greatly from that agreement and always got a fair deal.

Pursuing players Pablo, are you sure of this. As far as i'm aware and i'm fairly sure of this, St Josephs never chased any player from Barrow house and never pursued some of their present players who can legally play with St josephs as they live in Ballyadams parish.

The case involving Brian Daly is a personal decision by the player himself. Nothing to do with St josephs.

At the end of the day if Daly is refused his request, St Josephs will march on anyway. Barrow House will be at the beck and call of the Arles clubs and when they do join up Barrow house will be left to fend for themselves. Pity

Firstly I'm glad we cleared up that you are not a Josephs man 😂. Secondly Barrowhouse should be thanking Josephs for not poaching more of their players .  If Joseph's were the club I thought they were then they would have told Daly to F off with his transfer (if there is even a transfer, you seem to know more than most). I know it's not universally popular within the club you admire. By entertaining the transfer they have disbanded the almalgamation. I hope you can realise that.

I always thought Josephs did things the right way but ever since the whole relegation debacle I've begun to lose respect. This just adds to it.
You have your opinion and I have mine. I respect everything I read hear and I respect peoples opinions. Where people are from and who they support is irrelevant. I just voice my opinion but I do talk to people from all clubs ...its part of being interested in all  matters GAA so I can tell you a transfer has been submitted and has been instigated by the individual alone with no poaching or coaxing involved. As Ripley used to say believe it or believe it not. That's for you to decide Pablo. I also have an opinion on the relegation saga a few years back Involving St Josephs AND Stradbally AND Arles and what they done was only natural. If you see a loop hole you use it. Analogy  I once used a loop hole to avoid a traffic offence where I produced my dads driver licence in a garda station  when I didn't have one of my own, that was back in the day when licences didn't have Photo ID. If you have a gripe Pablo about that relegation saga you should voice your dissatisfaction at the powers that be who messed it up...I have a flight to catch in a few hours so I cannot continue this conversation tonight but I look forward to a continuation tomorrow. cheers.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 03, 2017, 12:24:47 AM
I look forward to it .👍
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on February 03, 2017, 07:59:40 AM
Just because a loophole exists doesn't mean you always have to take it.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on February 03, 2017, 12:39:52 PM
Just because a loophole exists doesn't mean you always have to take it.
true but when you get a choice it's only natural to take advant of he choice that suits you.....
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on February 03, 2017, 12:59:45 PM
As far as I can gather, this is Daly's wish. There is no issue with regards to poaching. He is giving a lot of commitment to football and doesn't feel Barrowhouse are similarly committed. Having asked about, it seems as if Barrowhouse's training numbers are poor, and were very bad last year despite winning a Junior. So you can see both sides, even if you mightn't agree with one or both.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on February 03, 2017, 01:07:22 PM
As far as I can gather, this is Daly's wish. There is no issue with regards to poaching. He is giving a lot of commitment to football and doesn't feel Barrowhouse are similarly committed. Having asked about, it seems as if Barrowhouse's training numbers are poor, and were very bad last year despite winning a Junior. So you can see both sides, even if you mightn't agree with one or both.
The club don't have to take the player, regardless of it being his wish.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on February 03, 2017, 01:21:24 PM
True, but it's a little bit more than principle on the line here. He has probably played more in the Josephs jersey than the Barrowhouse one. He has good friendships there, has enjoyed a fair bit of success, and arguably has more of an affiliation with Josephs. It's tricky. I can see why lads might say it isn't, but I think it's a mess, and I feel sorry for the lad himself. It's As for Josephs, what is their crime?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on February 03, 2017, 01:23:32 PM
As far as I can gather, this is Daly's wish. There is no issue with regards to poaching. He is giving a lot of commitment to football and doesn't feel Barrowhouse are similarly committed. Having asked about, it seems as if Barrowhouse's training numbers are poor, and were very bad last year despite winning a Junior. So you can see both sides, even if you mightn't agree with one or both.
The club don't have to take the player, regardless of it being his wish.
correct they don't have to but have you ever heard of that happening....let's be real here. If a player is looking to transfer why would you try stop him/her...
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on February 03, 2017, 01:29:03 PM
True, but it's a little bit more than principle on the line here. He has probably played more in the Josephs jersey than the Barrowhouse one. He has good friendships there, has enjoyed a fair bit of success, and arguably has more of an affiliation with Josephs. It's tricky. I can see why lads might say it isn't, but I think it's a mess, and I feel sorry for the lad himself. It's As for Josephs, what is their crime?
This is the danger for junior club joining at underage with senior clubs. Identity. In this instance though, the player has played 4 or so year in the Barrowhouse jersey, so I don't buy this. As for Josephs crime, its taking another clubs player.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on February 03, 2017, 01:30:08 PM
As far as I can gather, this is Daly's wish. There is no issue with regards to poaching. He is giving a lot of commitment to football and doesn't feel Barrowhouse are similarly committed. Having asked about, it seems as if Barrowhouse's training numbers are poor, and were very bad last year despite winning a Junior. So you can see both sides, even if you mightn't agree with one or both.
The club don't have to take the player, regardless of it being his wish.
correct they don't have to but have you ever heard of that happening....let's be real here. If a player is looking to transfer why would you try stop him/her...
Doesn't make it right. We have morals or we have nothing. Josephs have plenty of their own to compete and win, this will stain any subsequent win.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on February 03, 2017, 01:47:47 PM
The majority will agree with you Don but it's not as black and white as all that in my mind. Certainly not from the player's point of view. He's trying to get on in a club that might have limited ambition. From what I have heard, there were training sessions down there with 6 or 7 turning up.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on February 03, 2017, 01:52:42 PM
As far as I can gather, this is Daly's wish. There is no issue with regards to poaching. He is giving a lot of commitment to football and doesn't feel Barrowhouse are similarly committed. Having asked about, it seems as if Barrowhouse's training numbers are poor, and were very bad last year despite winning a Junior. So you can see both sides, even if you mightn't agree with one or both.
The club don't have to take the player, regardless of it being his wish.
correct they don't have to but have you ever heard of that happening....let's be real here. If a player is looking to transfer why would you try stop him/her...
Doesn't make it right. We have morals or we have nothing. Josephs have plenty of their own to compete and win, this will stain any subsequent win.
I very much doubt that it would stain anything...bar some people's prejudice.Did similar transfers stain  Stradballys win last year. A CLUB right next to barrow house are full of transferred players and their success isn't stained. What's the difference with this one ...
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on February 03, 2017, 01:56:07 PM
As far as I can gather, this is Daly's wish. There is no issue with regards to poaching. He is giving a lot of commitment to football and doesn't feel Barrowhouse are similarly committed. Having asked about, it seems as if Barrowhouse's training numbers are poor, and were very bad last year despite winning a Junior. So you can see both sides, even if you mightn't agree with one or both.
The club don't have to take the player, regardless of it being his wish.
correct they don't have to but have you ever heard of that happening....let's be real here. If a player is looking to transfer why would you try stop him/her...
Doesn't make it right. We have morals or we have nothing. Josephs have plenty of their own to compete and win, this will stain any subsequent win.
I very much doubt that it would stain anything...bar some people's prejudice.Did similar transfers stain  Stradballys win last year. A CLUB right next to barrow house are full of transferred players and their success isn't stained. What's the difference with this one ...
Of course they were stained.

I understand it may seem like I have an issue with Joes, but I don't. I just don't agree with this.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on February 03, 2017, 02:06:40 PM
In principle, and wearing the GAA hat, nobody could agree with it. But this is the result of professional type training and different expectations nowadays. I've been arguing for a long time that this situation needs to be addressed, but who gives a shite about Barrowhouse? Nobody in Croke Park and nobody in the County Board
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 03, 2017, 05:05:26 PM
As far as I can gather, this is Daly's wish. There is no issue with regards to poaching. He is giving a lot of commitment to football and doesn't feel Barrowhouse are similarly committed. Having asked about, it seems as if Barrowhouse's training numbers are poor, and were very bad last year despite winning a Junior. So you can see both sides, even if you mightn't agree with one or both.
The club don't have to take the player, regardless of it being his wish.
correct they don't have to but have you ever heard of that happening....let's be real here. If a player is looking to transfer why would you try stop him/her...
Doesn't make it right. We have morals or we have nothing. Josephs have plenty of their own to compete and win, this will stain any subsequent win.

Correct Don. I know of players who have tried to transfer to my own club and we refused them out of respect for our neighbours. This bull shit about training numbers being a legitimate excuse is a load of shite. Numbers can vary due to work, college commitments etc. Josephs might not have  "poached" but I know for a fact this has been actively encouraged by the very top guys in the club. Josephs had morals one time but this has obviously evaporated. Should have looked to fight relegation on the pitch rather than the board room and then this . If this is the way we are going on Laois then we are fucked.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 03, 2017, 05:09:15 PM
True, but it's a little bit more than principle on the line here. He has probably played more in the Josephs jersey than the Barrowhouse one. He has good friendships there, has enjoyed a fair bit of success, and arguably has more of an affiliation with Josephs. It's tricky. I can see why lads might say it isn't, but I think it's a mess, and I feel sorry for the lad himself. It's As for Josephs, what is their crime?

Are you an idiot? He has never played for Josephs he represented his club in an amalgamation with Josephs .
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on February 03, 2017, 05:27:12 PM
You might have noticed I said in the jersey. I didn't see he played for Josephs per se. By all accounts, he has more in common with Josephs. Calling me an idiot won't change that.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 03, 2017, 05:38:20 PM
You might have noticed I said in the jersey. I didn't see he played for Josephs per se. By all accounts, he has more in common with Josephs. Calling me an idiot won't change that.

I apologise if I hurt your feelings. You all but implied that he'd be nothing without Josephs quite an insult to the hard working juvenile coaches in Barrowhouse. Where does this inflated confidence come from? Ye haven't won a senior title of any consequence since the millennium. You can point at your under 21s but to be brutally honest if you take the grade seriously at all you'll be in a county final. Stradbally PG couldn't field a team a couple of years ago. My own parish amalgamation barely ever train for it.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on February 03, 2017, 05:53:51 PM
You should be proud to make that statement, and you are. Fair play. I'm not part of the Jospehs club and I implied nothing. I would say the majority (note the word majority) of his coaching would have been done in Kellyville. f**k it I'll declare that as fact. Come back to me when you can disprove that.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 03, 2017, 06:04:01 PM
You should be proud to make that statement, and you are. Fair play. I'm not part of the Jospehs club and I implied nothing. I would say the majority (note the word majority) of his coaching would have been done in Kellyville. f**k it I'll declare that as fact. Come back to me when you can disprove that.

You really haven't a clue buddy.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on February 03, 2017, 06:05:07 PM
And you do?

The lad himself wants to leave. Remember that.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 03, 2017, 06:40:47 PM
And you do?

The lad himself wants to leave. Remember that.

Does he? As I said you haven't a clue.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on February 03, 2017, 06:42:09 PM
Now I really know you don't know anything about this.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on February 03, 2017, 06:53:06 PM
As far as I can gather, this is Daly's wish. There is no issue with regards to poaching. He is giving a lot of commitment to football and doesn't feel Barrowhouse are similarly committed. Having asked about, it seems as if Barrowhouse's training numbers are poor, and were very bad last year despite winning a Junior. So you can see both sides, even if you mightn't agree with one or both.
The club don't have to take the player, regardless of it being his wish.
correct they don't have to but have you ever heard of that happening....let's be real here. If a player is looking to transfer why would you try stop him/her...
Doesn't make it right. We have morals or we have nothing. Josephs have plenty of their own to compete and win, this will stain any subsequent win.
I very much doubt that it would stain anything...bar some people's prejudice.Did similar transfers stain  Stradballys win last year. A CLUB right next to barrow house are full of transferred players and their success isn't stained. What's the difference with this one ...
Of course they were stained.

I understand it may seem like I have an issue with Joes, but I don't. I just don't agree with this.
I don't agree with what you say regarding stained but I also respect your opinion. We both have a different view that's all
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on February 03, 2017, 07:04:24 PM
And you do?

The lad himself wants to leave. Remember that.

Does he? As I said you haven't a clue.
I wouldn't think anyone from St Josephs forged his signature on his application, or anyone from ST josephs insists he wears the St Josephs gear ALL of the time both in public and on social media.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 03, 2017, 07:28:32 PM
And you do?

The lad himself wants to leave. Remember that.

Does he? As I said you haven't a clue.
I wouldn't think anyone from St Josephs forged his signature on his application, or anyone from ST josephs insists he wears the St Josephs gear ALL of the time both in public and on social media.

I know men like Paddy Doyle and Paddy Barry wouldn't have let this happen . They were absolute gentlemen and morally upright . This current Josephs executive and yeer (monument road and high fielder)behaviour is not befitting those two Josephs legends.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on February 03, 2017, 10:08:13 PM
To be honest lads I disagree with those slagging St Josephs.

If a talented young hurler/footballer who had played underage with your club requested to transfer in to your club.........
How many club committees would take the moral high ground?

There is a legitimate connection here. He played as part of the parish juvenile amalgamation.

Clubs like Portlaoise, Camross and Stadbally have benefitted much more dubiously from transfers in over the past 20-30 years, and went on to win county finals with some of these players.
This is without mentioning a certain senior football club where some of the transfers in were clearly not out of a genuine desire to join this club.

People can pontificate about morals, but I don't think any committee in Laois would refuse to accept this transfer in.

Some of the posters going back and forward on this are clearly St Josephs and/or Barrowhouse. I have one important question.
When Josephs and Barrowhouse seemingly discussed a Gaels amalgamation last year at lenght. What stopped it from happening.
Was it Barrowhouse with unrealistic demands or Josephs refusing to bend?
I think it is an important question. If it was the former, then Barrowhouse have really cut their nose off to spite their face.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on February 03, 2017, 11:15:08 PM
Good post Keyser. I would say that it is possible to know what's going on and not be a part of either club. It's Laois after all. It's a small place.

My understanding was that Joes didn't want to go down the Gaels route because they believed, rightly or wrongly, that Daly was all they would get. They also didn't want to affect the status of the club, maybe with an eye on Leinster, although I'd be speculating on that last point.

As for the rest, I think you summarised it perfectly. It's a sad state of affairs, particularly for Barrowhouse, but this won't be the last time we hear of such a transfer. Small rural clubs need protection, so the rules need to reflect that. We all want to see small clubs and counties flourish, but leaving them to fend for themselves is just negligence on the GAA's part
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on February 03, 2017, 11:31:41 PM
Some of the posters going back and forward on this are clearly St Josephs and/or Barrowhouse. I have one important question.
When Josephs and Barrowhouse seemingly discussed a Gaels amalgamation last year at lenght. What stopped it from happening.
Was it Barrowhouse with unrealistic demands or Josephs refusing to bend?
I think it is an important question. If it was the former, then Barrowhouse have really cut their nose off to spite their face.

What I was specifically hinting at was that somebody once suggested here that St Josephs and Barrowhouse had been in negotiations to play together in 2016. And that it didn't happen because of an issue around changing the jersey. I don't know if this was an educated guess or a factual summary of what happened.

Anyways IF St Joseph's Gaels was an option for 2016 and it didn't happen because Barrowhouse wanted a combined jersey then Barrowhouse have been foolish. They could have had their better players wearing a Joseph's jersey at senior and a Barrowhouse one at intermediate. Now they will probably end up with one of their better players wearing a Joseph's jersey at senior full stop.
NOTE: I don't know that this actually happened!!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 04, 2017, 10:39:51 AM

Some of the posters going back and forward on this are clearly St Josephs and/or Barrowhouse. I have one important question.
When Josephs and Barrowhouse seemingly discussed a Gaels amalgamation last year at lenght. What stopped it from happening.
Was it Barrowhouse with unrealistic demands or Josephs refusing to bend?
I think it is an important question. If it was the former, then Barrowhouse have really cut their nose off to spite their face.

No demands were ever made about changing a jersey. This is pure speculation and wholly inaccurate. This is being confused with the juvenile amalgamation who were laughed at when Barrowhouse asked for a change of jersey to reflect the amalgamation. There has been an ill feeling from the majority of the Barrowhouse players about playing with Josephs even at Juvenile level for some time. The Daly situation reinforces this further. The amalgamation was going to kill Barrowhouse. Countless lads left on the line and starting to drift away from the game . Yes the elite prospered but the average player didn't get a run even if he was on a par of his Josephs counterparts. There is no room for development.

Josephs rejected the gaels team. Why only they can answer. Barrowhouse in my opinion didn't really care that it was rejected. There was no real appetite for it.They tried their best to facilitate Brian Daly.
The new amalgamation is a more equal footing. Barrowhouse having a lot of players from under 16 down. They need to be getting games which they were not in Josephs. In reality I know people will argue it suited Barrowhouse (Success etc etc) but it didn't they were the junior party and were treated as such.

Josephs have forced Barrowhouse's hand and they have acted.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on February 04, 2017, 11:31:58 AM
No demands were ever made about changing a jersey. This is pure speculation and wholly inaccurate. This is being confused with the juvenile amalgamation who were laughed at when Barrowhouse asked for a change of jersey to reflect the amalgamation. There has been an ill feeling from the majority of the Barrowhouse players about playing with Josephs even at Juvenile level for some time. The Daly situation reinforces this further. The amalgamation was going to kill Barrowhouse. Countless lads left on the line and starting to drift away from the game . Yes the elite prospered but the average player didn't get a run even if he was on a par of his Josephs counterparts. There is no room for development.

Josephs rejected the gaels team. Why only they can answer. Barrowhouse in my opinion didn't really care that it was rejected. There was no real appetite for it.They tried their best to facilitate Brian Daly.
The new amalgamation is a more equal footing. Barrowhouse having a lot of players from under 16 down. They need to be getting games which they were not in Josephs. In reality I know people will argue it suited Barrowhouse (Success etc etc) but it didn't they were the junior party and were treated as such.

Josephs have forced Barrowhouse's hand and they have acted.

Thank you.
That answers the questions.
Surely some accommodation could have been made in the juvenile jersey.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Don Draper on February 04, 2017, 01:41:26 PM
No demands were ever made about changing a jersey. This is pure speculation and wholly inaccurate. This is being confused with the juvenile amalgamation who were laughed at when Barrowhouse asked for a change of jersey to reflect the amalgamation. There has been an ill feeling from the majority of the Barrowhouse players about playing with Josephs even at Juvenile level for some time. The Daly situation reinforces this further. The amalgamation was going to kill Barrowhouse. Countless lads left on the line and starting to drift away from the game . Yes the elite prospered but the average player didn't get a run even if he was on a par of his Josephs counterparts. There is no room for development.

Josephs rejected the gaels team. Why only they can answer. Barrowhouse in my opinion didn't really care that it was rejected. There was no real appetite for it.They tried their best to facilitate Brian Daly.
The new amalgamation is a more equal footing. Barrowhouse having a lot of players from under 16 down. They need to be getting games which they were not in Josephs. In reality I know people will argue it suited Barrowhouse (Success etc etc) but it didn't they were the junior party and were treated as such.

Josephs have forced Barrowhouse's hand and they have acted.
.
That answers the questions.
Surely some accommodation could have been made in the juvenile jersey.

Just another example of how a junior partner gets treated in a juvenile amalgamation. Go in on equal footing with a compromise jersey or suffer down the line.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on February 04, 2017, 02:24:01 PM
It's simply not true to say that the majority of Barrowhouse lads resented playing with Joseph's. Those that were good enough got their game and won medals. I think someone on here is talking for a disgruntled one or two.

The issue with the jersey is an aside, and I would fully expect Barrowhouse to feel wronged if they weren't represented on the kit. But let's not get lost here. It is Dalys decision to request the move. He hasn't been coerced in any way. That is the fact of the matter as much as some people can't swallow it
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 04, 2017, 02:49:44 PM
It's simply not true to say that the majority of Barrowhouse lads resented playing with Joseph's. Those that were good enough got their game and won medals. I think someone on here is talking for a disgruntled one or two.

The issue with the jersey is an aside, and I would fully expect Barrowhouse to feel wronged if they weren't represented on the kit. But let's not get lost here. It is Dalys decision to request the move. He hasn't been coerced in any way. That is the fact of the matter as much as some people can't swallow it

Exactly the Elite prospered the rest were left behind. You have answered my question exactly the move happened as many youngsters were not getting games. Daly the Baldwins would have been Laois under 21s/ seniors with or without Josephs. The Daly thing just brought the debate to a head. You can be blinded by success at underage level. When it is really about developing players so that they can contribute to the clubs adult team.

Josephs have caused this by not treating Barrowhouse as an equal partner. The coercion or otherwise of Daly was the straw that broke the camels back.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: High Fielder on February 04, 2017, 04:07:09 PM
More than those 3 lads played with Josephs. Go back a few years and Barrowhouse had at least a third of another winning Under 21 team. They too were good enough and got their game. You're being very economical with your facts and the biggest lie you are telling, the biggest lie of all, is that Josephs went after him. That is simply not true. Brian Daly wants to play for St Josephs.

I'm sure, very sure in fact, that not all Josephs lads got the desired game time. Yes Barrowhouse were the junior partner, but there were no injustices. I think whoever is fuelling your fire has an axe to grind, and that's fair enough, but there is more than a hint of sour grapes about your posts. Still, if there is a silver lining, it is that Barrowhouse by all accounts are now training in numbers. And, they have not only joined with Killeen, but also got Killeen to play with Kilcruise. Good luck to all I say. Quare times in that part of the world.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on February 04, 2017, 05:06:42 PM
More than those 3 lads played with Josephs. Go back a few years and Barrowhouse had at least a third of another winning Under 21 team. They too were good enough and got their game. You're being very economical with your facts and the biggest lie you are telling, the biggest lie of all, is that Josephs went after him. That is simply not true. Brian Daly wants to play for St Josephs.

I'm sure, very sure in fact, that not all Josephs lads got the desired game time. Yes Barrowhouse were the junior partner, but there were no injustices. I think whoever is fuelling your fire has an axe to grind, and that's fair enough, but there is more than a hint of sour grapes about your posts. Still, if there is a silver lining, it is that Barrowhouse by all accounts are now training in numbers. And, they have not only joined with Killeen, but also got Killeen to play with Kilcruise. Good luck to all I say. Quare times in that part of the world.
Wait until Kileen start POACHING THE Baldwin boys. :'( :-X
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Pablo Escobar on February 04, 2017, 05:30:09 PM
 I hear they resisted your attempts Monument Road but then again Killeen are a more talented outfit 😉
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: The Monument Road on February 04, 2017, 10:20:51 PM
I hear they resisted your attempts Monument Road but then again Killeen are a more talented outfit 😉
love it... 8)
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on February 12, 2017, 08:36:51 PM
Under age fixtures due out next Friday
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on February 15, 2017, 10:10:46 PM
The following is the Laois Under-14 Football Panel for 2017. Congratulations to all the players who were successful in the trials.

The Laois Under-14 management would like to thank everyone who turned up for the trials.



Eoin Connolly (Ballyfin)

Josh Kelly (Crettyard)

Sam Krebs (St Paul’s)

Daragh Brennan (St Joseph’s)

Thomas Byrne (St Joseph’s)

Tiernan Cahill (Ballyroan Abbey)

Adam Delaney (St Joseph’s)

Simon Fingleton (Park Ratheniska)

Iarlaith Galvin (Portarlington)

Lochlann Kelleher (Barrowhouse)

Conor Kelly (Graiguecullen)

Ben Lalor (The Heath)

Daire McDonald (Stradbally)

Conor McWey (Ballyroan Abbey)

Davin McEvoy (Ballyroan Abbey)

Joseph Morrin (St Joseph’s)

David O’Brien (The Heath)

Dillon Payne (Mountmellick)

Jamie Preston (Portlaoise)

Ben Reddin (Portlaoise)

Darragh Scully (Clonaslee St Manman’s)

Jack Tobin (Portlaoise)

Michael Wall (Arles-Killeen)

Dan Daly (The Heath)

Lee Day (Barrowhouse)

Odhran Delaney (Ballyroan Abbey)

Ben Dempsey (Portlaoise)

Michael Downey (Ballylinan)

Colin Dunne (Arles-Killeen)

Shaun Fitzpatrick (Ballyroan Abbey)

Oisin Hooney (St Joseph’s)

Luke Kelly (Stradbally)

Alan McWey (Ballyroan Abbey)

Dylan Murphy (Portarlington)

Michael O’Connor (Ballyroan Abbey)

Aaron O’Connor (Portarlington)

Brian Smith (Portlaoise)

Adrian Tynan (St Paul’s)

Bryan Walsh (Ballyfin)

PJ Ward (Portarlington)

DJ White (Portlaoise)
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Ballyroan Abbey on February 15, 2017, 11:23:23 PM
No athletic spink lads robbing places off the bigger clubs on this panel no sir
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on February 15, 2017, 11:36:26 PM
At least the football is in place no sign of similar happening with the hurling
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on February 16, 2017, 03:45:24 PM

Laois Under-15 Hurling Panel has been announced.

The coaches would like to thank everyone who attended the trials.

Aaron
Brennan
Abbeyleix

Adam
Broady
Abbeyleix

Robert
Corkish
Abbeyleix

Eoghan
Dunne
Abbeyleix

Eamon
Fitzpatrick
Abbeyleix

Lee
Maher
Abbeyleix

Fionan
Mahony
Abbeyleix

David
Sheeran
Abbeyleix

Cathal
O'Shaughnessy
Ballinakill

Cian
O'Shaughnessy
Ballinakill

Aaron
O'Dea
Ballypickas

Niall
Coss
Borris in Ossory/Kilcotton

Jack
Foyle
Borris in Ossory/Kilcotton

Keelan
Kelly
Borris in Ossory/Kilcotton

Tomas
Keyes
Camross

Jamie
Gill
Castletown/Slieve Bloom

Tadhg
Cuddy
Castletown/Slieve Bloom

Darragh
Tobin
Castletown/Slieve Bloom

DJ
Callaghan
Clonaslee St Manmans

Darragh
Hogan
Clough/Ballacolla

Kevin
Mulhall
Clough/Ballacolla

Adam
Kirwan
Mountrath

Brian
Bredin
Mountrath

Paddy
Hosey
Na Fianna

Darragh
Lyons
Na Fianna

Danny
Brennan
Park/Ratheniska

Mark
Ramsbottom
Park/Ratheniska

Eoin
Naughton
Portlaoise

Eamon
Delaney
Raheen Parish Gaels

Conor
Goode
Raheen Parish Gaels

James
Whelan
Raheen Parish Gaels

Aaron
Costigan
Rathdowney/Errill

Cian
Bourke
Rathdowney/Errill

Ian
Shanahan
Slieve Margy

Conor
Delaney
The Harps

James
Duggan
The Harps

Michael
Monahan
The Harps

Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: OTF on February 16, 2017, 05:16:03 PM
No athletic spink lads robbing places off the bigger clubs on this panel no sir

We better keep our council  this time less we offend anyone. :-X
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: redsetanta on February 21, 2017, 02:04:06 PM
http://www.leinsterexpress.ie/news/gaelic-games/236334/merits-of-underage-amalgamations-debated-at-february-county-board-meeting.html (http://www.leinsterexpress.ie/news/gaelic-games/236334/merits-of-underage-amalgamations-debated-at-february-county-board-meeting.html)
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on February 21, 2017, 02:19:00 PM
http://www.leinsterexpress.ie/news/gaelic-games/236334/merits-of-underage-amalgamations-debated-at-february-county-board-meeting.html (http://www.leinsterexpress.ie/news/gaelic-games/236334/merits-of-underage-amalgamations-debated-at-february-county-board-meeting.html)

I have been saying what the Portarlington delegate said for a long time on here.
Laois GAA should not be facilitating the random join ups that the likes of Ballyfin, Mountmellick, Camross, Mountrath etc have been engaging in for the last number of years.

What Borris in Ossory Kilcotton and others seem to be doing is the correct way. Hurl as a parish. and as a last resort (when necessary), drop down into the B at a particular grade.

The County Board have a duty to control this in some way. Proper all in underage amalgamations (such as Raheen Parish Gaels) are what should be encouraged.
There have been crazy one grade join ups permitted over the past 3-4 years and it needs to stop.
I see in the juvenile leagues online that Clough Ballacolla-Mountrath is now a thing at U16 level. This seems to be the only grade they are playing together at.
Clough Ballacolla played with Abbeyleix last year U16. They had an U14 team on their own for the past two years, won the U13 and were in the minor final last year. It's nothing personal against them, but there is no way that they haven't the numbers to play U16 on their own.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: honest hurler on February 21, 2017, 05:49:45 PM
For god sake stop talking about parish you do not have to play with your parish you can if you want and I think if Gaa players we told that they had to play by the parish well half of all players would drop out some parishes don't work as we have seen in this county and it is because the senior end are bullies so let players play the game without telling them who to play with bk were lucky that they won as I think it was otherwise coming to an end
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: clonadmad on February 21, 2017, 06:05:30 PM
A few simple rules which I think would sort a lot of these juvenile amalgamations

1.your first option should be always to amalgamate with a team from within your parish

2.if that option isn't feasible your final option then should be to amalgamate with a club bordering your club.

3.all amalgamations should be from u12 up to u21,no picking or choosing of age grades,all in.

4. All amalgamations should play in A,unless a very good case can be argued otherwise for a particular age group.

Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: oneflewoverthecuckoonest on February 21, 2017, 07:08:21 PM
can you PRO-PARISH militia please get it into your skulls that Croke Park, CLG headquarters, will not acknowledge the term PARISH, because per the assumption of most, PARISH = CATHOLIC PARISH, CLG will not and cannot condone sectarianism, and to underpin a sport on the geographic boundaries of one religion will not happen in an era when liberal/multicultural snowflakes are calling the shots in Ireland. Individual counties locking themselves into catholic parishes is a dead duck.

perhaps sometimes in the future(Ireland is always  a slow learner and usually ten years behind other countries), the Brexit/Trump style nationalism will sweep Ireland, and Christian conservatism will rise again and political correctness, whereby the liberals walk all over the conservatives may be arrested. at the moment, Ireland is media controlled by the liberal-multiculturalist promoters, and many aspects of nationhood, such as the GAA are being chipped away at.


If you do want to ignore the above, then you must accept that Catholic Dioceses are steadily re-drawing parishes, Ballyfin and Mountrath is now all the one parish, I have not seen one post on this long discussion thread urging an all Ballyfin/Mountrath parish team, why?

Certain posters like Keyser, who I guess is from Borris/Kilc. or other merged new club, love the idea of amalgams and the inevitable wipe out of the smaller entities, his underlying  logic, the smaller clubs are at nothing and better to strengthen the general area through merging clubs.............if we follow this logic, that these smaller clubs(and some not so small) are at nothing because they rarely win.....then why not examine the intercounty scene......

...Laois hurlers in all intercounty grades have zero chance of all Ireland success for the foreseeable future, the footballers ditto.........if someone suggested that laois hurlers merge with offaly and Westmeath, 90% of people would resist the idea and prefer to maintain our(unsuccessful) individual presence/identity rather than join up with others.

That last example is the reason small clubs continue to exist, many expect little bar an odd title once in a generation, these smaller clubs are the focus for a tiny local community, and in an area such as Trumera it binds a small community, delete the club and you diminish the area.

You can whinge all you want about numbers, the secret of success is long term hard work. Rosenallis is the example to hurling clubs to follow, they went back to the juvenile base ten years ago and a decade of graft and good coaching reaped rewards in 2016. Compare with the likes of a basket cases such as Mountrath in the same period.
The lazy, easy solution is to merge, merging will not tackle the lack of groundwork.

if you are a promoter of the idea of reducing the number of adult hurling clubs to 12, and adult football clubs to 16, you should then be agreeable to the idea of the Laois at intercounty level being merged with the likes of Offaly in hurling and football. The idea is not for me on either count, but you can be described as two faced if you want one element and not the other. I suspect the likes of Keyser would want aspect 1 but not the intercounty one.

To give you one example of the potential pitfalls of merging all.  Ten years ago, eight clubs competed in the Sligo Senior Hurling Championship.  Most of the clubs were also competing at senior level in the football code with the same groups of players. Four of the 8 clubs then decided to stop hurling, and the general idea was the players from the 4 withdrawing clubs would join up with the remaining 4 senior hurling clubs.
The theory looked good, in practice out of the 60 odd hurlers who had played senior club hurling with the now defunct  hurling clubs, the following year only 2 transferred and the rest stopped playing. One could expect a symmetry here in laois if the smaller clubs went by the wayside, the majority of their playing pool would no longer be involved in the sport.

In summary, if GAA sport is all about winning, then merge away in hurling and football until you have only 4 or 5 clubs in each code in the county, a long term recipe for disaster.  If the GAA is about far more than winning, then smaller clubs have every right to continue their tradition and they can happily survive on the odd scrap of success. Some mock the idea of club guards of honour at funerals, that is part of the community aspect of the GAA, and if you don't respect that, then you are not a real GAA man/woman.





Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on February 21, 2017, 07:38:23 PM
For god sake stop talking about parish you do not have to play with your parish you can if you want and I think if Gaa players we told that they had to play by the parish well half of all players would drop out some parishes don't work as we have seen in this county and it is because the senior end are bullies so let players play the game without telling them who to play with bk were lucky that they won as I think it was otherwise coming to an end

You are providing no valid reason or argument to allow this- other than the notion that "players don't want to".
First of all I never said anything about parish rule at adult level. But to say "some parishes don't work" is an idle statement that can't be backed up. I'd rephrase that as "some clubs can't agree to work as a parish". And btw, no juvenile player in Ireland is free to simply play for whoever he wants in the GAA. So to say "you can if you want" is not true. We are talking about juvenile players here remember.

The idea that juvenile units can hop into bed with anyone at various grades is no way to run an association. It is first of all to the detriment of the long  term future of any club involved.
Secondly it contributes massively to player drop out. To have a team at U12 and U14 and then decide to join with somebody else (who also had a team at u12 and u14) when this group reaches U16 or minor simply reduces our tiny playing pool even further.
This reduces the playing pool available to these clubs into the future and therefore the playing pool available to our counties.
Allowing this idea of joining up with whoever you want is not a sustainable way to run clubs.


can you PRO-PARISH militia please get it into your skulls that Croke Park, CLG headquarters, will not acknowledge the term PARISH, because per the assumption of most, PARISH = CATHOLIC PARISH, CLG will not and cannot condone sectarianism,


Certain posters like Keyser, who I guess is from Borris/Kilc. or other merged new club, love the idea of amalgams and the inevitable wipe out of the smaller entities, his underlying  logic, the smaller clubs are at nothing and better to strengthen the general area through merging clubs.


You can whinge all you want about numbers, the secret of success is long term hard work. Rosenallis is the example to hurling clubs to follow, they went back to the juvenile base ten years ago and a decade of graft and good coaching reaped rewards in 2016. Compare with the likes of a basket cases such as Mountrath in the same period.
The lazy, easy solution is to merge, merging will not tackle the lack of groundwork.

if you are a promoter of the idea of reducing the number of adult hurling clubs to 12, and adult football clubs to 16, you should then be agreeable to the idea of the Laois at intercounty level being merged with the likes of Offaly in hurling and football. The idea is not for me on either count, but you can be described as two faced if you want one element and not the other. I suspect the likes of Keyser would want aspect 1 but not the intercounty one.

If the GAA is about far more than winning, then smaller clubs have every right to continue their tradition and they can happily survive on the odd scrap of success. Some mock the idea of club guards of honour at funerals, that is part of the community aspect of the GAA, and if you don't respect that, then you are not a real GAA man/woman.

Sorry now, but
1) I am not from Borris/Kilcotton
2) I have never promoted the idea that all smaller clubs should be forced to amalgamate- I have never even hinted at anything like this. Don't assume what my logic is.
3) I have been one of the most vocal on here in praising and highlighting what Rosenallis have done and what the likes of Mountrath, Mountmellick etc have not done.
4) I have said over and over here how it is up to the clubs to use their primary schools to get numbers in.
5) I never suggested that clubs ALL play as a PARISH or that all clubs in each PARISH join up to form one club. But there has to be some structure on juvenile amalgams. You shouldn't be able to hop around the county from one club to the next. The GAA structure works around catchment area, so effectively you are restricted to the club in your area at juvenile level anyways. So substitute the phrase "parish" for "local club" and we are still talking about the same thing.

You have gone on an almighty rant here, but I will give you the benefit of the doubt in that you are mixing me up with another poster.
I have never even hinted at any of the above, and I have regularly posted the exact opposite of what you are saying.

A few simple rules which I think would sort a lot of these juvenile amalgamations

1.your first option should be always to amalgamate with a team from within your parish

2.if that option isn't feasible your final option then should be to amalgamate with a club bordering your club.

3.all amalgamations should be from u12 up to u21,no picking or choosing of age grades,all in.

4. All amalgamations should play in A,unless a very good case can be argued otherwise for a particular age group.

It wouldn't be a bad start, particularly number 3.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: honest hurler on February 21, 2017, 08:28:11 PM
valid points fromboth of you but take for example castletown and slieve bloom what a complete mess that pairing was and still the underage stay together is it only for numbers as we have been told that there will never be slieve bloom and castletown together again at senior level gaels is the option and if i am right these two clubs tried to go together as a gaels and castletown i am told would not change colours so now where do we go with parishes any one with some idea on this one
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on February 21, 2017, 08:36:18 PM
valid points fromboth of you but take for example castletown and slieve bloom what a complete mess that pairing was and still the underage stay together is it only for numbers as we have been told that there will never be slieve bloom and castletown together again at senior level gaels is the option and if i am right these two clubs tried to go together as a gaels and castletown i am told would not change colours so now where do we go with parishes any one with some idea on this one

No idea what has gone on or is going on between the two, but are you suggesting that the solution would be for Castletown and Slieve Bloom to divide into separate juvenile clubs and join up with anyone else they feel like joining up with at different grades?
I don't see what this would do for Castletown, Slieve Bloom or Laois hurling.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: honest hurler on February 21, 2017, 09:03:06 PM
no im not saying that they divide at juvenile level but if what i hear about colours going on then i think that its just to make up numbers at juvenile level they both have some great players but  they dont bond at all this is just an example of parish at gaa standards
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on February 21, 2017, 09:21:47 PM
no im not saying that they divide at juvenile level but if what i hear about colours going on then i think that its just to make up numbers at juvenile level they both have some great players but  they dont bond at all this is just an example of parish at gaa standards

That's up to your club and the other club to resolve. But the failures here shouldn't dictate overall policy at CB level.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: hurlingmad on March 09, 2017, 10:08:37 AM
Guy in work after coming over and telling me that slieve bloom and ballinakill have agreed to gaels team...any truth to this? Is it not too late to join up?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Helix on March 09, 2017, 10:20:19 AM
Ballinakill are already affiliated as a gaels so it would be easier to be slotted in if this is true. Could well be possible.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: hurlingmad on March 09, 2017, 10:22:36 AM
Ballinakill are already affiliated as a gaels so it would be easier to be slotted in if this is true. Could well be possible.
iv no idea now but a late solution to a near car crash if true
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: redsetanta on March 09, 2017, 10:44:42 AM
Between the U21's winning and this potential outcome there's nothing but good news in here today.................................so far!
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Unlaoised on March 09, 2017, 02:12:05 PM
Annanough going in with Clonaslee is a strange one but it should mean a strong team for Clonaslee
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: blueandwhite1 on March 09, 2017, 03:41:06 PM
Guy in work after coming over and telling me that slieve bloom and ballinakill have agreed to gaels team...any truth to this? Is it not too late to join up?

Juvenile? Hardly senior at this late stage?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: hurlingmad on March 09, 2017, 03:45:51 PM
Guy in work after coming over and telling me that slieve bloom and ballinakill have agreed to gaels team...any truth to this? Is it not too late to join up?

Juvenile? Hardly senior at this late stage?
Was told it was to accomadate conroy but god knows how they are allowes if this is true
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on March 09, 2017, 05:00:45 PM
Guy in work after coming over and telling me that slieve bloom and ballinakill have agreed to gaels team...any truth to this? Is it not too late to join up?

Juvenile? Hardly senior at this late stage?
Was told it was to accomadate conroy but god knows how they are allowes if this is true
Heard it as well. It can be facilitated if County committee vote for it.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on March 09, 2017, 05:27:31 PM
Guy in work after coming over and telling me that slieve bloom and ballinakill have agreed to gaels team...any truth to this? Is it not too late to join up?

Juvenile? Hardly senior at this late stage?
Was told it was to accomadate conroy but god knows how they are allowes if this is true
Heard it as well. It can be facilitated if County committee vote for it.

Why were there deadlines then?
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: hurlingmad on March 09, 2017, 05:54:55 PM
Guy in work after coming over and telling me that slieve bloom and ballinakill have agreed to gaels team...any truth to this? Is it not too late to join up?

Juvenile? Hardly senior at this late stage?
Was told it was to accomadate conroy but god knows how they are allowes if this is true
Heard it as well. It can be facilitated if County committee vote for it.

Why were there deadlines then?

Thats what i was wondering
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: TP Ashe on March 09, 2017, 06:09:22 PM
Apologies about my ignorance but is the County Committee made up of club delegates or is it the County Officers as elected at convention?

I'd hope all clubs would vote against this to be honest. These marriages of convenience are bullshit and an insult to other clubs who try and do things the right way...
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Downtheroad on March 09, 2017, 06:13:48 PM
Apologies about my ignorance but is the County Committee made up of club delegates or is it the County Officers as elected at convention?

I'd hope all clubs would vote against this to be honest. These marriages of convenience are bullshit and an insult to other clubs who try and do things the right way...
It's a combination of those elected at Convention and representatives of the clubs. Yes clubs can knock this on the head if the majority see fit.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: Keyser Söze on March 09, 2017, 06:31:38 PM
Apologies about my ignorance but is the County Committee made up of club delegates or is it the County Officers as elected at convention?

I'd hope all clubs would vote against this to be honest. These marriages of convenience are bullshit and an insult to other clubs who try and do things the right way...
It's a combination of those elected at Convention and representatives of the clubs. Yes clubs can knock this on the head if the majority see fit.

They shouldn't have to.
In my opinion it is order to even present this option to County Committee.
Title: Re: Gaels amalgamations
Post by: CluainABU on March 24, 2017, 03:22:53 PM
Are all the gaels resolved now? who did Balinakill end up with in the end?