The following was published in the Roscommon Herald in a column by a Mr T Kenoy, who is apparently the Roscommon rep on Central Council.
"WHAT'S THE SCORE
Anniversary of a Memorable Occasion
Attending Ireland's Six Nations game against Wales in Croke Park recently was disappointing from a sporting perspective. But it also brought back memories of a historic occasion exactly one year earlier when the 'Auld Enemy' ventured onto Croker's sacred sod and got kicked off the pitch by Eddie O'Sullivan's heroes.
How times can change in a short period. ...Some believed that there would be a riot on Jones' Road...
But the opposite happened. It was a day of peace, tranquility and triumph when Ireland declared her independence, when we all started singing from the same hymn sheet. It was a day when all creeds and classes united on a sporting occasion and showed dignified respect for each other, a quality that had previously been absent for hundreds of years.
And no the sky didn't fall. Indeed that day was the cornerstore of a new Ireland, an Ireland that has matured beyond recognition, has moved on to a new all-embracing and more tolerant mode.
A year later and there was hardly a word written or spoken anywhere about the fact that a foreign game was being played in Croke Park. There are still a few of the "no change brigade" around but then in any democracy they are fully entitled to their opinion, different though it may be from the vast majority.
Ireland's history, as my generation learned it, reflected generations of ideological bigotry. The new history is little over than a year old, written on a day when a new generation marched unshackled through the debris of centuries of racial and religious intolerance. It was a proud day for Ireland, a proud day also for the GAA as a historic moment was played out on the history laden sod of its headquarters.
A year later foreign games on Croker are no longer news worthy. How times move on.
Sean Kelly won't be happy.
Quote from: Jinxy on April 09, 2008, 07:38:50 PM
Sean Kelly won't be happy.
The pair are well met anyway.
Kenoy's a bigger joke than their footballers are these days. Is he meant to be promoting the GAA or socce/rugby? Oh and yes, he is fully behind the GPA too. >:(
QuoteKenoy's a bigger joke than their footballers are these days
True Owenmoresider and thats saying something. He also had a go at those who oppose grants. A man seriously in love wih himself and his media image.
A total prat, who will soon be a media darling, they will use him for their own ends. Not worth bothering about, idiots like him come and go, they leave no mark
A total arse - who does he think he is ? God almighty ??? Loves himself no doubt about it !
QuoteHe also had a go at those who oppose grants.
I was so astounded by his comments about Croke Park that I neglected to focus on his comments on Of One Belief.
Here is what he had to say about them:
"Of One Belief - who are they, how were they formed, what mandate do they have and from whom and how did this unelected, unaffiliated group manage to get hearings from the DRA?
In summary, the answers are as follows.
They are an unelected unaffiliated body formed by objectors to the Players Grant Scheme who have no mandate from anybody. Unfortunately the rule establishing the DRA is ambiguous enough to allow a window for such groups.
By granting them a hearing, the DRA is legitimising a group who have no official standing in the GAA. Indeed, they are creating a precedent that means any
group with a bee in its bonnet can attempt to undermine democratically reached decisions.
The level of hypocrisy in this group is mind-boggling. Many of its adherents are members of clubs who are paying huge sums of money to team managers. Their chief organiser has been involved for years in a fundraising group in Tyrone whose income is used to look after the "needs" of allegedly amateur inter-county players.Now they want to block a scheme that will recognise the special place of Gaelic games in our society...
This group simply demonstrates again that there will always be
whiter than white mavericks out there who want to undermine legitimately reached democratic decisions. Thankfully, democracy allows them a voice. Thankfully, the majority also rules."
Now that I look at these statements, they look quite libellous. Unless Mr Kenoy can magic up some proof of his allegiations. What do the Tyrone people think?
Jesus. That's some load of shite for one pen/keyboard/crayon. Is this fellow related to Willie Hegarty? Is he Willie Hegarty?
Looks like this guy is starting his campaign to be GAA President in 2012. You have been warned!!!.
What a load of w**k!
In fairness to the man, I dont see anything wrong with his article. Opening up Croker (for a certain amount of time) to Rugby/Soccer did not cause the end of the world or cause any damage to GAA that we know about. England came to town and everyone behaved impeccably. And he is right the media or most GAA supporters did not make any big deal of Wales playing in Croker...
Quote from: quidnunc on April 09, 2008, 11:14:02 PM
Now that I look at these statements, they look quite libellous.
They certainly appear libellous. Which is odd given Mr. Kenoy's occupational background.
Heineken on tap - if you don't see anythnig wrong with his article I'd have grave worries about you! I know he's a fellow county man but you cannot defend the indefensible.
QuoteIt was a day of peace, tranquility and triumph when Ireland declared her independence
What a load of absolute horseshit. What a f**king idiot.
I'd like to think there's no way he'd get near the presidency. If he did well we'd have to pack up the tent.
Quote from: cornafean on April 10, 2008, 12:51:14 PM
Quote from: quidnunc on April 09, 2008, 11:14:02 PM
Now that I look at these statements, they look quite libellous.
They certainly appear libellous. Which is odd given Mr. Kenoy's occupational background.
Its not libelous if its true.
What a total tool.
"It was a day of peace, tranquility and triumph when Ireland declared her independence"
This has to be one of the stupidest statements I have ever read.
Jesus the day went well, which was good, but to say it was the first day of our nations new history?
What a plank.
Quote from: magpie seanie on April 10, 2008, 12:52:28 PM
Heineken on tap - if you don't see anythnig wrong with his article I'd have grave worries about you! I know he's a fellow county man but you cannot defend the indefensible.
QuoteIt was a day of peace, tranquility and triumph when Ireland declared her independence
What a load of absolute horseshit. What a f**king idiot.
I'd like to think there's no way he'd get near the presidency. If he did well we'd have to pack up the tent.
Ok Seanie I agree with you he is going over board in his language and sentiments, however he is right IMO it was a good day for the GAA and for Irish people in general. I think he got his language all wrong in the article but if you look his two basic points.
1)England match was a great day that signified as a country we have moved on.
2)This year there was hardly anything made of rugby teams coming into croker,
then I dont think he is that far off the mark. And yes he is a fellow county man but over the years I have disagreed with him over alot his beliefs.
Quote from: heineken_on_tap on April 10, 2008, 02:18:21 PM
Quote from: magpie seanie on April 10, 2008, 12:52:28 PM
Heineken on tap - if you don't see anythnig wrong with his article I'd have grave worries about you! I know he's a fellow county man but you cannot defend the indefensible.
QuoteIt was a day of peace, tranquility and triumph when Ireland declared her independence
What a load of absolute horseshit. What a f**king idiot.
I'd like to think there's no way he'd get near the presidency. If he did well we'd have to pack up the tent.
Ok Seanie I agree with you he is going over board in his language and sentiments, however he is right IMO it was a good day for the GAA and for Irish people in general. I think he got his language all wrong in the article but if you look his two basic points.
1)England match was a great day that signified as a country we have moved on.
2)This year there was hardly anything made of rugby teams coming into croker,
then I dont think he is that far off the mark. And yes he is a fellow county man but over the years I have disagreed with him over alot his beliefs.
Indeed.
He's right in most of what he said, but his metaphors were just ridiculous. I'd imagine he knew fine well his language would wind up some people, which is probably why he did it. And it made it easier to make his points about paying managers and Club Tyrone.
With greatest respect Heineken on Tap there oceans of shite in that article that you would have to wade through to get to those two points. I personally think the whole thing has been hammed up by the media as something greater than it was. I didn't change my opinion and I didn't need the media to tell me we'd moved on as a nation. I knew that myself. I can live with it but I find the whole thing fairly condescending.
The case of the "No" side wasn't based on not wanting to hear GSTQ in Croker but it was painted as if that was the only argument of us dyed in the wool republican backwoodsmen. Even in victory the "Yes" side (I mean here the media and dickheads like Kenoy and Kelly) couldn't treat the rest of us with a bit of respect.
The fact that there was little made of it this year is of no consequence either. What point is he trying to make? Its another sly dig.
Kenoy should remember that self-praise is no praise.
QuoteHe's right in most of what he said, but his metaphors were just ridiculous. I'd imagine he knew fine well his language would wind up some people, which is probably why he did it. And it made it easier to make his points about paying managers and Club Tyrone.
That's a rather bizarre analysis of it all. I posted this because:
1 - It has to go down as one of the most self-serving set of comments ever made - ie, I changed Irish history.
2 - Do I really need to point out how factually wrong it is? It was a significant development for the GAA, but it's a mere drop in the ocean of Irish history.
3 - It implies that everything that happened in Croke Park before rugby was played there was reflective of bigotry, and we needed rugby to be played there to be freed from it.
4 - If this is what Kenoy believes, what is he doing on Central Council? Should he not be a rugby official if he thinks it represents a more all-embracing Ireland?
5 - He seems to be complaining that there's no controversy about Croke Park at the moment. He seems to want to be at the centre of controversy, just for the sake of it. Otherwise, why write the article? (His massive ego aside...)
6 - His comments about the Tyrone County Board seem quite libellous, unless he has some proof. It's the first time I've heard this allegation.
7 - Seeing as he was very prominent in Roscommon County Board while it plunged into unprecedented levels of debt for any county board, he should know to be careful about accusations of financial impropriety against other boards.
8 - Even if he were right about 6, which I doubt, what about the popular rumour that Mr Kenoy himself is being healthily reimbursed with "expenses" to manage the Tulsk club?
Kenoy must be doing something right if he's upsetting the GAAboard's resident neanderthal flat earthers . ;D ;D
Mind you there's some overthe top crap in the article alright - esp the bit about Ireland declaring independence in February 2007 :o ::)
By the way I can't bloody stand rugby so I suppose I'm a bigot too.
Ah well ... :-\
Quote from: quidnunc on April 09, 2008, 11:14:02 PM
The level of hypocrisy in this group is mind-boggling. Many of its adherents are members of clubs who are paying huge sums of money to team managers. Their chief organiser has been involved for years in a fundraising group in Tyrone whose income is used to look after the "needs" of allegedly amateur inter-county players.
In a topic where it is dangerous to read between the lines, I would like to know what exactly he is implying regarding Club Tyrone. Is the allegation coming from the same Roscommon herald article or another source?
and do ye want to know the best bit of all?????......He wrote that shite in the Herald when the following matters were going on in Ros Gaa.......John Maughan had just abdicated, our Seniors had just been hammered by Dublin, and our Under 21's had an upcoming Connacht final.
He calls himself a Gaa man, yet he chose to write that article, and never mentioned one word about the events.
Quote from: heineken_on_tap on April 10, 2008, 12:43:02 PM
In fairness to the man, I dont see anything wrong with his article. Opening up Croker (for a certain amount of time) to Rugby/Soccer did not cause the end of the world or cause any damage to GAA that we know about. England came to town and everyone behaved impeccably. And he is right the media or most GAA supporters did not make any big deal of Wales playing in Croker...
It will interesting to see how long this 'certain amount of time' will be. Will the FAI and IRFU be looking to play every important international game in Croke Park now that they've got their noses in? And Rossfan, it seems we're all bigots cos rugby is the darling sport of RTÉ. >:(
QuoteThey are an unelected unaffiliated body
What the f**k were the GPA when they started??!!
Ireland declared her independance 92 years ago, not when some "golden generation yet never won a thing" rugby players kicked an oval ball around Croke Park against some Englishmen, it's f**king shite talk like that from our own members that rankles more than the crap you read from clueless, rent-a-quote anti-GAA columnists in any Independant Newspapers publication.
If he ran and got it, he'd be the worst thing to happen to the presidency of the GAA ever, worse than Seán Kelly even, surely we couldn't make the same mistake twice?
Quote from: quidnunc on April 10, 2008, 02:54:30 PM
That's a rather bizarre analysis of it all. I posted this because:
1 - It has to go down as one of the most self-serving set of comments ever made - ie, I changed Irish history.
Do you think he really meant he himself changed Irish history ;D
Quote2 - Do I really need to point out how factually wrong it is? It was a significant development for the GAA, but it's a mere drop in the ocean of Irish history.
FFS, do you really think anyone in Ireland, including Kenoy, would disagree with that???
Quote
3 - It implies that everything that happened in Croke Park before rugby was played there was reflective of bigotry, and we needed rugby to be played there to be freed from it.
No it doesnt. But as he said, Kenoy knew some would get annoyed with his metaphors and take them literally.
Quote4 - If this is what Kenoy believes, what is he doing on Central Council? Should he not be a rugby official if he thinks it represents a more all-embracing Ireland?
Yes, very funny.
Quote
5 - He seems to be complaining that there's no controversy about Croke Park at the moment. He seems to want to be at the centre of controversy, just for the sake of it. Otherwise, why write the article? (His massive ego aside...)
Spot on, apart from ignoring his ego!
Quote
6 - His comments about the Tyrone County Board seem quite libellous, unless he has some proof. It's the first time I've heard this allegation.
Have you been living under a rock? Club Tyrone are a superbly run organisation (BTW - they are 100% independent of the Tyrone County Board). They collect tens of thousands of pounds from Tyrone business interests to assist Tyrone. Where does their money go? No idea, they are under no obligation to disclose, they are a private organisation who can spend their money whatever way they want. I do know they managed to persuade one player to continue playing rather than head off for something else, and I'm sure they've helped plenty of "good causes". I can guarantee there will be no libel action taken against Mr Kenoy!!
Quote7 - Seeing as he was very prominent in Roscommon County Board while it plunged into unprecedented levels of debt for any county board, he should know to be careful about accusations of financial impropriety against other boards.
Agreed, but it wasnt the Tyrone County Board he was referring to
Quote
8 - Even if he were right about 6, which I doubt, what about the popular rumour that Mr Kenoy himself is being healthily reimbursed with "expenses" to manage the Tulsk club?
Fair play to you for having the neck to give out about Kenoy, and then yourself spoute rumours about his expenses! Pot, kettle etc. ;D
Kenoy's a pure feckin yahoo, but very entertaining!
Quote from: Hound on April 11, 2008, 09:20:41 AM
6 - His comments about the Tyrone County Board seem quite libellous, unless he has some proof. It's the first time I've heard this allegation.
Have you been living under a rock? Club Tyrone are a superbly run organisation 1.
(BTW - they are 100% independent of the Tyrone County Board). They collect tens of thousands of pounds from Tyrone business interests to assist Tyrone. 2.
Where does their money go? No idea, they are under no obligation to disclose, they are a private organisation who can spend their money whatever way they want. I do know they managed to persuade one player to continue playing rather than head off for something else, and I'm sure they've helped plenty of "good causes". I can guarantee there will be no libel action taken against Mr Kenoy!!
[/quote]
1. Wrong. Every brass penny earned by club Tyrone is under the control of the county committee.
2. Amongst other things;
Coaching and Games Development - Club Tyrone fund the football summer camp in the county as it was the benchmark nationally before this VHI sponsored one came about.
Physical Development - The bulk of the Club Tyrone money raised for the next 5 years will go toward the physical development of County Offices, pitches, Handball and Hurling Alleys and training facilities in the county.
Culture - They also provide assistance for any club in the County competing in a Scor All-Ireland at both Senior and Junior levels
Quote from: tyrone86 on April 11, 2008, 09:36:54 AM
Culture - They also provide assistance for any club in the County competing in a Scor All-Ireland at both Senior and Junior levels
Which is one of the reasons why the hoors keep winning in Scór :)
The whole England playing in Croke Park thing was I think for most GAA people not such a big issue, most people who love our games were more concerned with issues around games promotion and competition between the various codes. They were concerned with the media and politicians portrayal of the organisation as anti national and backwards and the damage to the GAA's image in the wider community.
Now the doors are open, while it still hurts a little and makes Croke Park a little less special the 10's of millions do soften the blow. When we have full time coaches working with our young players and spreading the gospel of our games all paid for by renting Corke Park to soccer and rugby, well it seems a good use of an asset to me. Those of you involved in fund rasing know how hard it is to rasie €10,000 euros and turning our noises up at millions seems crazy in this context.
The principle was conceded and I'd suggest milking it for all its worth now and if the IFRU want Croke Park for big games let them have it at a hefty price. (FAI really hate us and so I can never see them coming back to us – I'd be with Ross O'Carroll Kelly on this one "tough on soccer, tough on the causes of soccer"
I think hype about the England game was a media driven storm but it was also that it touched Irish people on a deeper level, it was for many at a base level (GAA and non-GAA people) as if they were playing GSTQ in the GPO. I think many people have a strange relationship with the GAA (like with the Irish language) they may dislike many aspects of each (administrators, how the language is taught etc...) but deep down they feel a pride an ownership. I think they realise that we are guardians of something special, that we are close to the soul of the nation. I think Soccer and Rugby wanted our endorsement too.
Anyone else think that England playing in Croke Park didnt change anything or show we've "moved on". I dont know, I still look around and still see the same old attitudes in same old places. A good sporting occasion but didnt have an impact on anything beyond the realm of sport.
Quote from: thejuice on April 11, 2008, 10:52:47 AM
Anyone else think that England playing in Croke Park didnt change anything or show we've "moved on". I dont know, I still look around and still see the same old attitudes in same old places. A good sporting occasion but didnt have an impact on anything beyond the realm of sport.
Spot on, England played in Landsdowne every second year with no hassle.
This game was in a different stadium, but with the same fans.
What did they expect to happen, Rugby fans to be offended at the playing of GSTQ in Croke park??
The way they go on you would thing Croke park was full of GAA fans for this rugby match ::)
Quote from: his holiness nb on April 11, 2008, 01:27:32 PM
Quote from: thejuice on April 11, 2008, 10:52:47 AM
Anyone else think that England playing in Croke Park didnt change anything or show we've "moved on". I dont know, I still look around and still see the same old attitudes in same old places. A good sporting occasion but didnt have an impact on anything beyond the realm of sport.
The way they go on you would thing Croke park was full of GAA fans for this rugby match ::)
Is it not possible to be a GAA AND Rugby supporter?? I know alot of GAA people who also love their rugby as well and enjoyed the day out.
Quote from: heineken_on_tap on April 11, 2008, 01:42:33 PM
Is it not possible to be a GAA AND Rugby supporter?? I know alot of GAA people who also love their rugby as well and enjoyed the day out.
Of course it is. My point is that people who support both sports would have been in Landsdowne previously too and there was never any hassle there, so why would there be hassle with the same set of fans as before?
Quote from: heineken_on_tap on April 11, 2008, 01:42:33 PM
Quote from: his holiness nb on April 11, 2008, 01:27:32 PM
Quote from: thejuice on April 11, 2008, 10:52:47 AM
Anyone else think that England playing in Croke Park didnt change anything or show we've "moved on". I dont know, I still look around and still see the same old attitudes in same old places. A good sporting occasion but didnt have an impact on anything beyond the realm of sport.
The way they go on you would thing Croke park was full of GAA fans for this rugby match ::)
Is it not possible to be a GAA AND Rugby supporter?? I know alot of GAA people who also love their rugby as well and enjoyed the day out.
Sure I follow rugby as well, but Croke park was probably not FULL of GAA fans and I doubt many of the No-crowd were in attendance either.
*********What he said above
Quote from: his holiness nb on April 11, 2008, 01:55:04 PM
Quote from: heineken_on_tap on April 11, 2008, 01:42:33 PM
Is it not possible to be a GAA AND Rugby supporter?? I know alot of GAA people who also love their rugby as well and enjoyed the day out.
Of course it is. My point is that people who support both sports would have been in Landsdowne previously too and there was never any hassle there, so why would there be hassle with the same set of fans as before?
Fair enough lads, but lets not forget alot of the grass root GAA people(obviously not all) had no problem with Rugby/Soccer using croker for a period of time. I dont think had the stadium been full of GAA people it would of been much different. Are'nt we GAA supporters just as decent as any rugby supporter ? Are you implying a stadium full of GAA people would boo their antem, cause hassle etc. I think most decent GAA people would not.
most likely not but not to go off the track from my original point I dont think England playing Ireland in rugby changed anything really and didnt signify us moving on or anything like that. The hyperbole that people are coming up with about that game is ridiculous.
Quote from: heineken_on_tap on April 11, 2008, 02:08:43 PM
Fair enough lads, but lets not forget alot of the grass root GAA people(obviously not all) had no problem with Rugby/Soccer using croker for a period of time. I dont think had the stadium been full of GAA people it would of been much different. Are'nt we GAA supporters just as decent as any rugby supporter ? Are you implying a stadium full of GAA people would boo their antem, cause hassle etc. I think most decent GAA people would not.
So do I Heineken, the only point I am making is that its not really that suprising that the team and anthems were respected as it was the same people who have respected them for years at that game. Some people made out it was a groundbreaking moment in Irish history due to this, it wasnt. It was the same fans, same respect, different stadium. No big deal.
I certainly wouldnt say it was the day we "declared our independance" ;)