If the cynical tactics used by Kerry to win this afternoons game with Cork had been employed by any other county all of the headlines would be about the death of football and how shocking the game has become.
Kerry cheated, stalled, fouled, dived and goaded their way through the second half of that game to buy themselves another Munster championship, and there won't be a word about it in the press tomorrow.
Disgraceful display.
Totallly agree, while I have a lot of respect for many of the Kerry greats the level of cynicism in their style of football is unreal. Fouling is something all of the big team are prone too including Armagh, Tyrone and Kerry but really gets my goat about Kerry is that they get away with it from the commentators. In an Ulster match what is described as 'the death of football' or in the unbelievably biased Martin Carneys case 'a total disgrace', is described in the Munster Final as two players getting to know one another. As for incident replays, why do RTE seem reluctant to replay a fouling incident in a Munster game but we see replays of the one incident till the cows come home in Ulster matches. Masters played well today and the pull of the shirt in front of the Kerry goalmouth should have at least been a free if not a penlalty. Another meaningless title for Kerry, I hope they enjoy it. :-\
I for one do not buy too much into this anti- Ulster biased attitude, and I enjoy whatever hint of it their is. Kerry being described as playing the game the way it should be gets on my nerves, they are as cynical as Armagh or Tyrone .
QuoteKerry being described as playing the game the way it should be gets on my nerves, they are as cynical as Armagh or Tyrone .
Completelly disagree Corn 02. They are much more cynical. :D
Corn02- this isn't an anti-ulster issue, I'm just pointing out that Kerry get a free pass, which you seem to agree with
Its not so much the kerry display that bothers me, but the acceptance or desire to ignore it by the media - and indeed some of the less impartial kingdom fans. This bought notion of puke football reigning supreme in ulster is complete trash, infact, the cynicysm displayed by kerry today could almost be deemed worse than the swarming defensive intensity pioneered up north (IMHO). Tomas O'Se's blatant foul as cork broke in the 66th minute, when the scores were level, was a prime example. Did the RTE guys get worked up about it? Absolutely not, but you can bet your ass that if it was an ulster team, there would be some thoughtless comment about the detriment of the beautiful game. Why cant these people wake up, all we want is a removal of the anti ulster bias, we are no saints, but theres a bunch of "cute hoors" getting away with allsorts up and down the country!
Kerry have been at it for years, as were the dubs when they were in their heyday, the fact is that Kerry got the win and that is all they will concern themselves with however the lack tactics they employed today to stall the ball and the sheer knavery displayed at times really shows kerry in their true light, they are just like everybody else and when they are getting it put up to them they are worse!
Someone in the media needs to highlight Kerry's antics, they are the greatest footballing county ever but they should not be above being held accountable for the negative tactics they employ from time to time.
What a bunch of whingers
Heganboy,
Marty Morrissey completely disagrees with you. He twice in his match report describes the game as
Quotea really good game of football
http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2007/0701/kerry.html?gaa (http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2007/0701/kerry.html?gaa)
This is obviously another case of Ulster paranoia sure Kerry are the connaisseurs of gaelic football in contrast to the hatchet men from the north with their puke football. The sad fact is most people really believe this to be true.
Its only a game lads. Nothing worth getting so worked up about.
Good teams are cynical - end of story.
Spangler- just to clarify- I have no issues with doing what it takes to win- I am from Armagh after all, and we waited a long time to win and had no cmp. My issue is with the fact that Kerry employ the same tactics that caused an absolute outcry and yet are given a free pass in most of the media.
Its the free pass I'm complaining about, not the tactics...
Cork were robbed, and that Kerry display today will cause no alarm amongst the other contenders, on form to date Tyrone are in pole position
Look - you do whatever you need to - Kerry are champs - no point crying about it - if you can't beat them, join them !
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on July 01, 2007, 07:26:15 PM
Its only a game lads. Nothing worth getting so worked up about.
OK, who's been handing out the happy pills, after that foregoing attack on Kerry's very manhood? ;)
Star Spangler hit the nail on the head!
Hegan Boy please provide examples if you can so we can eliminate it at once
This craving for media acceptance shows a shocking lack of self esteem. Pull ye'reselves together for christs sakes.
Quote from: Pangurban on July 01, 2007, 09:05:03 PM
Cork were robbed, and that Kerry display today will cause no alarm amongst the other contenders, on form to date Tyrone are in pole position
On the basis of one decent performance in the last 18 months and that against a team who totally imploded!!!!!
Reading some of this stuff about the Tyrone performance against Donegal reminds me of 2004 when we stuffed Donegal in the Ulster final, a lot of the media had us nailed on as All-Ireland champs, and we all know what happened next!
Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on July 02, 2007, 01:43:58 PM
Quote from: Pangurban on July 01, 2007, 09:05:03 PM
Cork were robbed, and that Kerry display today will cause no alarm amongst the other contenders, on form to date Tyrone are in pole position
On the basis of one decent performance in the last 18 months and that against a team who totally imploded!!!!!
Doh!! Stick with the program. ;)
Tyrone are unbeatable. Give them Sam now. ;)
Cork kerry was a proper game of football between 2 very commited teams. there was no feigning no 'knees in the back ' all belts were given faces to face and had a very high level of skill under pressure through out . how this can be confused with the muck we see in Ulster amazes me. Apart from Preter canavans 2 all ireland and Armaghs inexplicable physical rapid growth Ulster teams have had nothing to offer and these attempts to sully the good name of kerry football is beneath contempt but that is the cynicism we have grown to expect from the Axis of Ugly
Quote from: haveaharp on July 02, 2007, 02:58:05 PM
Quote from: DUBSFORSAM1 on July 02, 2007, 01:43:58 PM
Quote from: Pangurban on July 01, 2007, 09:05:03 PM
Cork were robbed, and that Kerry display today will cause no alarm amongst the other contenders, on form to date Tyrone are in pole position
On the basis of one decent performance in the last 18 months and that against a team who totally imploded!!!!!
Doh!! Stick with the program. ;)
Tyrone are unbeatable. Give them Sam now. ;)
Well without Peter Canavan how are Tyrone going to win Sam..... ;D
Good man rosnarun - all belts were given face to face, u joking? What about O'Leary on Galvin. Kerry dont play the game any different to Tyrone, in fact they arent as good to watch as Tyrone when they are on form. People are right about Tyrone though, I hope to much isnt being read into the last game. Teams who win the all ireland rarily play the best football in June.
Quote from: rosnarun on July 02, 2007, 03:17:21 PM
Cork kerry was a proper game of football between 2 very commited teams. there was no feigning no 'knees in the back ' all belts were given faces to face and had a very high level of skill under pressure through out . how this can be confused with the muck we see in Ulster amazes me. Apart from Preter canavans 2 all ireland and Armaghs inexplicable physical rapid growth Ulster teams have had nothing to offer and these attempts to sully the good name of kerry football is beneath contempt but that is the cynicism we have grown to expect from the Axis of Ugly
Apologies, I used to think you were serious in your contributions.
Ros you are in some form these days!
galvin was looking straight at o leary and the two of them were in volved in a tussle fair fight as afar as im concerned. beside the 'kick ' was exactly intended to harm or maim was it . there is a line and that far from crossed it . a stamp or dropping the knee would have . I would consider that far less harmfull to the game than shirt pulling and bad referring .
Every one like to see a good physical battle but to avod anarchy its the unwritten rules that are important and a little less Cany and Po faced hppocricy on the subject would be refreshing
Luder are looking art me?? :-*
Quote from: rosnarun on July 02, 2007, 04:08:21 PM
galvin was looking straight at o leary and the two of them were in volved in a tussle fair fight as afar as im concerned. beside the 'kick ' was exactly intended to harm or maim was it . there is a line and that far from crossed it . a stamp or dropping the knee would have . I would consider that far less harmfull to the game than shirt pulling and bad referring .
Every one like to see a good physical battle but to avod anarchy its the unwritten rules that are important and a little less Cany and Po faced hppocricy on the subject would be refreshing
Not sure what that's all about, but it looks like a classic case of the GAA Stockholm Syndrome (where Kerry is your captor), get help!
Sorry,I entered this thread thinking it referred to Kerry getting a free-pass into the All-Ireland QF(previously SF).Again they have secured a Munster title against Cork,who are primarily a Hurling county,with patchy Gaelic football achievement.
Quote from: 6th sam on July 02, 2007, 04:38:32 PM
Sorry,I entered this thread thinking it referred to Kerry getting a free-pass into the All-Ireland QF(previously SF).Again they have secured a Munster title against Cork,who are primarily a Hurling county,with patchy Gaelic football achievement.
It must be embarrassing for Ulster counties that a Hurling county with a patchy Gaelic Football achievement have won more All-Irelands than any single Ulster county and twice as many as the footballing dynasty's of Armagh and Tyrone
Quotethan any single Ulster county and twice as many as the footballing dynasty's of Armagh and Tyrone
Cork has more people than Armagh, Tyrone and Monaghan put together, unlike Dublin they do have success reflecting their large population, not much cause for embarrassment there, unless Dublin are embarrassed that Cork with one third of their population are much more successful.
Dubs for Sam,it's ironic that your insatiable desire to get the boot in to "The Nordies",has blinded you to the fact that Ulster and Leinster counties are all disadvantaged by the current system.I only have interest in the raw facts,and have no interest in getting in to petty jealousies.My questioning of the current system is not due to any antagonism towards Kerry as such,and most of the points below could also relate to Kilkenny in Hurling,and I admire the way both these counties have taken advantage of a system that favours them.
Fact:success breeds success-and Kerry's long record of All-Ireland's gives them an ongoing advantage over all other counties.
Fact:They do not have a significant pull from other sports,compared to most other counties.
Fact:The likelihood of easy matches until July allows them the luxury of structuring their preparation accordingly-to allow them to peak for 3-4 matches in the summer.
Fact:Their compressed summer intercounty fixture list allows their club fixtures to be easier structured.
Fact:Similar bias of the provincial system at minor and u21 level,ensures their youth are reared on success.
Fact:Their main rivals(includind Dublin) are disadvantaged by the current system,and are therefore are less likely to have sustained success.
Quote from: sunny on July 01, 2007, 03:56:24 PM
Totallly agree, while I have a lot of respect for many of the Kerry greats the level of cynicism in their style of football is unreal. Fouling is something all of the big team are prone too including Armagh, Tyrone and Kerry but really gets my goat about Kerry is that they get away with it from the commentators. In an Ulster match what is described as 'the death of football' or in the unbelievably biased Martin Carneys case 'a total disgrace', is described in the Munster Final as two players getting to know one another. As for incident replays, why do RTE seem reluctant to replay a fouling incident in a Munster game but we see replays of the one incident till the cows come home in Ulster matches. Masters played well today and the pull of the shirt in front of the Kerry goalmouth should have at least been a free if not a penlalty. Another meaningless title for Kerry, I hope they enjoy it. :-\
Given that Martin Carney is from Ballyshannon and has a couple of Ulster medals, I doubt very much that he's "unbelievably biased" against Ulster football.
Maybe its just an anti-Tyrone thing... like Martin McHugh. :P
Quote from: J70 on July 02, 2007, 06:50:31 PM
Given that Martin Carney is from Ballyshannon and has a couple of Ulster medals...
Such was his devotion to Donegal and Ulster he seemed not to have a problem switching to Mayo! :P
this thread makes me want to scream, the two best teams in the country by a long shot met yesterday played a hard (not dirty) game which had some great skill and this shit is yere reply. kerry get a free pass? the truth of the matter is there isnt a decent team in leinster or connaught and maybe armagh deserve a bit of respect in ulster....
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 02, 2007, 07:06:35 PM
Quote from: J70 on July 02, 2007, 06:50:31 PM
Given that Martin Carney is from Ballyshannon and has a couple of Ulster medals...
Such was his devotion to Donegal and Ulster he seemed not to have a problem switching to Mayo! :P
Of course you have driven from Swinford to Ballybofey several times a week in a 1970s car on 1970s Irish roads, all on top of being a young teacher! :P
Quote from: J70 on July 02, 2007, 07:17:19 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 02, 2007, 07:06:35 PM
Quote from: J70 on July 02, 2007, 06:50:31 PM
Given that Martin Carney is from Ballyshannon and has a couple of Ulster medals...
Such was his devotion to Donegal and Ulster he seemed not to have a problem switching to Mayo! :P
Of course you have driven from Swinford to Ballybofey several times a week in a 1970s car on 1970s Irish roads, all on top of being a young teacher! :P
Yeah, yeah, ways and means, but only if you
really wanted to ::)
Anyway, good to see rosnarun has taken a lie-down after that feed of poitín! ;)
I did my best to avoid this poisons thread but enough is enough - lets answer some of the 'facts'
Fact:success breeds success-and Kerry's long record of All-Ireland's gives them an ongoing advantage over all other counties.
We are now penalized for being successful - Jesus sorry for winning last year guys.....
Fact:They do not have a significant pull from other sports,compared to most other counties.
Soccer & Rugby are extensively played in Kerry, Indeed Tralee has had very little representation at under age on Kerry teams due to soccer
Oige Moran son Brian (Star of the Minor side in '04) has a professional rugby contact with Munster
Fact:The likelihood of easy matches until July allows them the luxury of structuring their preparation accordingly-to allow them to peak for 3-4 matches in the summer.
Tyrone won the All-Ireland in '05 'cos of their hard year, so where is the advantage to Kerry this year one 'easy' game against Cork before a difficult QF. Shite we only the All-Ireland last year 'cos we got knocked out and had the benefit of back door games - looks like with some people Kerry are dammed if we do and dammed if we don't.
Fact:Their compressed summer intercounty fixture list allows their club fixtures to be easier structured.
What ..... no club games played in Kerry during the summer, county league games occur w/o county players. Club games will happen now due to the shambolic 6 week break. County final regularly happen in November but you would know this due to your extensive research on this topic.
Fact:Similar bias of the provincial system at minor and u21 level,ensures their youth are reared on success.
Kerry have not won a minor all-Ireland since 1994 and an u-21 since '98 again you would know this due to your extensive research on this topic.
Fact:Their main rivals(includind Dublin) are disadvantaged by the current system,and are therefore are less likely to have sustained success.
You having a bitter go at Kerry and you want support from the Dubs.....Kerry's main rival have and always will be Cork.
The stench of bitterness and jealously seep right through this whole thread.
I dread to think what would have been said if the incident with Galvin happened the other way round.
QuoteFact:They do not have a significant pull from other sports,compared to most other counties.
Back that up. What extra competition do, for example, Tyrone and Armagh face in terms of competing sports ? I expect to see statistics from you comparing Hurling clubs, soccer clubs an rugby clubs in these three counties.
Quote from: magickingdom on July 02, 2007, 07:14:58 PM
this thread makes me want to scream, the two best teams in the country by a long shot met yesterday played a hard (not dirty) game which had some great skill and this shit is yere reply. kerry get a free pass? the truth of the matter is there isnt a decent team in leinster or connaught and maybe armagh deserve a bit of respect in ulster....
Scream away, for the blindly tendentious nature of that comment isn't worth a direct reply.
QuoteWhat extra competition do, for example, Tyrone and Armagh face in terms of competing sports ?
1. Road Bowls
2. Bog-Snorkling
3. Tractor-Reversing
4. Midget-Throwing
5. Dog-Throwing
6. c**k-Fighting
7. Cricket
8. Hockey
9. Rounders
10. Handball
11. Running
12. Sprinting
13. Pipe-Smoking
14. Dog-Fighting
15. Bum-Fighting
16. Joy-Riding
17. Horse-Riding
18. Gate-Robbing
19. Sheep-Stealing
20. Rugby
21. Soccer
QuoteScream away, for the blindly tendentious nature of that comment isn't worth a direct reply.
what a windbag !
Quote
1. Diving
2. whinging about Kerry
3. Tractor-Reversing
4. Midget-Throwing
5. Dog-Throwing
6. c**k-Fighting
7. Cricket
8. Hockey
9. Rounders
10. Handball
11. Running
12. Sprinting
13. Pipe-Smoking
14. Dog-Fighting
15. Bum-Fighting
16. Joy-Riding
17. Horse-Riding
18. Gate-Robbing
19. Sheep-Stealing
20. Rugby
21. Soccer
good list, just made a few minor edits
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on July 02, 2007, 08:10:02 PM
QuoteScream away, for the blindly tendentious nature of that comment isn't worth a direct reply.
what a windbag !
What an ars*hole, doesn't surprise me that you'd defend the indefensible. Though please forgive us for not prostrating ourselves in adulation after that masterful display of yesterday... NOT.
BTW, you're a prime example of why
some Kerry folk are known all over as the greatest moaners and sorest losers of all.
Quotethe two best teams in the country by a long shot
::) ::) ::)
QuoteWhat an ars*hole, doesn't surprise me that you'd defend the indefensible. Though please forgive us for not prostrating ourselves in adulation after that masterful display of yesterday... NOT.
BTW, you're a prime example of why some Kerry folk are known all over as the greatest moaners and sorest losers of all
Somebody shut that door..its still very windy in here !
6 th sam Corks record at football is a lot better than your lot
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on July 02, 2007, 08:36:34 PM
QuoteWhat an ars*hole, doesn't surprise me that you'd defend the indefensible. Though please forgive us for not prostrating ourselves in adulation after that masterful display of yesterday... NOT.
BTW, you're a prime example of why some Kerry folk are known all over as the greatest moaners and sorest losers of all
Somebody shut that door..its still very windy in here !
And it'll be an ever chillier wind blowing your way this year.
I thought yesterday's match was great entertainment. I didn't see the Derry/Monaghan match on tv because unfortunately I was at it. It must have been a terrible game for a neutral to watch whereas yesterday's game was very enjoyable. If Derry had acquitted themselves half as well as Cork I would have been happy.
well said buzz. there is a nasty element of if its not from my county its shit on these pages good to see some one can see beyond their own borders.
Funny Ive never noticed kerry to be bad losers ive always found its people from the eaker counties who seem to take it worst the leitrim westmeaths and tyrones althought they were very pleasant when years ago they won a match in castlebar
Quote from: SuperDooperCooper on July 02, 2007, 07:41:14 PM
APOLOGIES FOR CONTINUING THIS GAME OF DISCUSSIONBOARD TENNIS,BUT SINCE YOU OBVIOUSLY DESERVE A REPLY SUPERDOOPERCOOPER ,I'LL OBLIGE
I did my best to avoid this poisons thread ...................what was poisonous about my argument?
We are now penalized for being successful ............who is proposing that you be penalised--just treated the same as every other county
Fact:They do not have a significant pull from other sports,compared to most other counties......................Armagh/Down/Tyrone have a number of top professional soccer clubs,and top Rugby clubs-Kerry don't.
Fact:The likelihood of easy matches until July allows them the luxury of structuring their preparation accordingly-to allow them to peak for 3-4 matches in the summer.
Tyrone won the All-Ireland in '05 'cos of their hard year, so where is the advantage to Kerry this year one 'easy' game against Cork before a difficult QF. Shite we only the All-Ireland last year 'cos we got knocked out and had the benefit of back door games - looks like with some people Kerry are dammed if we do and dammed if we don't......................I admire your effective use of the system.My argument is that other counties find it more difficult to sustain a challenge due to the volume of competitive matches they have to play.For example,it is well documented that competitive matches result in a higher injury rate etc{look at Tyrone's injury list).
Fact:Their compressed summer intercounty fixture list allows their club fixtures to be easier structured.
What ..... no club games played in Kerry during the summer, county league games occur w/o county players. Club games will happen now due to the shambolic 6 week break............You seem to be contradicting yourself here.
Fact:Similar bias of the provincial system at minor and u21 level,ensures their youth are reared on success.
Kerry have not won a minor all-Ireland since 1994 and an u-21 since '98 again you would know this due to your extensive research on this topic.................Almost every county in Ireland would be jealous of Kerry's provincial success at underage level.
Fact:Their main rivals(including Dublin) are disadvantaged by the current system,and are therefore are less likely to have sustained success.
You having a bitter(........?????) go at Kerry and you want support from the Dubs..........I respect the Dubs-they bring a glamour to the GAA which few counties can match.
Kerry's main rival have and always will be Cork................I'm talking about genuine footballing rivals ,not your nearest neighbours ,who you tend to beat every year.
The stench of bitterness and jealously seep right through this whole thread...............I have absolutely no bitterness towards Kerry or Cork -but I admit to being jealous of their success.It's just that the current system isn't fair--and no poster has yet given any arguments to the contrary!
My interest in this subject is not born out of jealousy however,rather just a desire to have more competitive games packing out Croke park etc. to further strenghten the GAA.
I dread to think what would have been said if the incident with Galvin happened the other way round. .....Galvin great player,but crosses the line a bit too often to be appreciated by all.
QuoteFact:They do not have a significant pull from other sports,compared to most other counties......................Armagh/Down/Tyrone have a number of top professional soccer clubs,and top Rugby clubs-Kerry don't.
"Top professional soccer clubs"....are you having a laugh ? ...who are these top clubs...? anyway, it is simplistic to say that the presence of a professional club in a county necessarily means soccer is more popular among the youth in that county. Even if I were to accept that soccer is more popular among the youth in Armagh/Tyrone compared to Kerry (and I wont until I see statistics) you are talking complete shite to say that the pull of soccer is not "significant" in Kerry. Now, onto Rugby....hmmm, I dont want to bring politics into this but I'd imagine
most (note the qualifier) players who play Rugby in the North would probably not be predisposed to Gaelic anyway. I'm open to correction on this but I'd like to see some numbers before you go blindly saying that Rugby is more popular in Tyrone or Armagh.Now, onto the other major Gaelic sport (which you conveniently left out I see), hurling. Hurling is strongest in parts of North Kerry but is played in other parts of the county as well. Again, without statistics, its very hard to say that hurling is stronger in one county over another and there is no doubt that Hurling is "weak" in Kerry however, I'd say I'm on pretty safe ground in saying that hurling is much more of a "pull" in Kerry than Armagh and Tyrone. Down would probably be similar to Kerry with the game at its strongest in certain parts of the County.
Quote from: rosnarun on July 02, 2007, 09:25:31 PM
Funny Ive never noticed kerry to be bad losers
That's hardly surprising since you never beat them?
Anyway, while I'd in general agree with subject of the thread, I didn't see any evidence to further that case in yesterday's game. It was a pretty clean and decent game.
QuoteFact:The likelihood of easy matches until July allows them the luxury of structuring their preparation accordingly-to allow them to peak for 3-4 matches in the summer.
Tyrone won the All-Ireland in '05 'cos of their hard year, so where is the advantage to Kerry this year one 'easy' game against Cork before a difficult QF. Shite we only the All-Ireland last year 'cos we got knocked out and had the benefit of back door games - looks like with some people Kerry are dammed if we do and dammed if we don't......................I admire your effective use of the system.My argument is that other counties find it more difficult to sustain a challenge due to the volume of competitive matches they have to play.For example,it is well documented that competitive matches result in a higher injury rate etc{look at Tyrone's injury list).
You completely ignored the competing argument that was put to you. A very strong and credible argument can be made that, for example, Tyrone held the advantage in the 2005 AI due to the battle hardening effects of having played all those games. Also, as was pointed out to you, you seem to (conveniently) forget our backdoor win last year where the extra games were crucial. If we had beaten Cork, Donaghy would probably never have moved to Full forward. Likewise, while we didnt win the 2002 AI we improved steadliy with the extra games. Finally, since it was brought up, could everyone please quit the "Tyrones marathon 2005 run" crap. They played 10 games because they bloody well drew 3 games !! Since when is an inability to put away teams that you are (supposedly) better than seen as a good thing ?
QuoteFact:Their compressed summer intercounty fixture list allows their club fixtures to be easier structured.
What ..... no club games played in Kerry during the summer, county league games occur w/o county players. Club games will happen now due to the shambolic 6 week break............You seem to be contradicting yourself here
How is he contradicting himself ?
What do you mean by "compressed summer intercounty fixture list" ? There is the same club v county conflict in Kerry as elsewhere. ffs are you blind, deaf or Dumb ? Sure hasn't a former Kerry manager just had a go at the current Kerry manager over just such a matter ?
Anyway, even if County v Club relations went smoothly what kind of moronic argument is it to say that that is somehow an unfair advantage. What next ? Those sneaky Kerry bastards..how dare they do things properly !!! its unfair...they should be incompetent !! its just not cricket old chap
QuoteFact:Similar bias of the provincial system at minor and u21 level,ensures their youth are reared on success.
Kerry have not won a minor all-Ireland since 1994 and an u-21 since '98 again you would know this due to your extensive research on this topic.................Almost every county in Ireland would be jealous of Kerry's provincial success at underage level.
Again, you ignore the counter argument put to you. If we have such advantages then why have we not had more success at this level ?
Well, here is a shocking answer...its because we havent been good enough. Yes, I know.....you are feeling faint....have a seat....I'm sure this concept of not blaming somebody else for your own lack of success is hard to absorb. Just think about it a bit, though, and you might see merit in it.
QuoteYou having a bitter(........??) go at Kerry and you want support from the Dubs..........I respect the Dubs-they bring a glamour to the GAA which few counties can match.
Kerry's main rival have and always will be Cork................I'm talking about genuine footballing rivals ,not your nearest neighbours ,who you tend to beat every year.
Jesus wept, what kind of idiot would describe Cork and Kerry as not being genuine football rivals. What age are you at all sonny ? ..Who do you see as your "genuine" football rivals up there in Down ? ..as for "tend to beat every year"....what the hell is it with you lads..?.Cork beat us last year and gave us our toughest two games. They almost beat us lthis year. They have knocked us out of the AI over 40 times.
Heres the way Northern logic works.
Cork in the Munster Championship = They are shite, weak as piss
Cork as soon as they might play an Ulster team = jaysus lads, Cork are dark horses for the AI. Christ, they have some great players, that Anthony Lynch is a great player. He was blackgaurded by those Kerry hoors. I have a lot of time for Cork etc, etc
Stop rising to it lads, the initial post on this thread was an extremely valid one,
some of ye might want to read it again slowly this time.
Kerry are indeed above any real criticism from the media, they can do no wrong!
Stop giving the Kerry men the soap box from which they get to quickly mention that golden # 34
when their backs are against the wall.
The rest of the country watched ye rob Cork of the 2 in a row yesterday whether or not you care
to admit it.
Rosnarun, lie down for jaysus sake, you know, the same as ye do in Croke park on the big day ;)
Sheehy, glad to see that Tyrone remain a fear and a major thorn in the Kingdom's side :D
And no, I'll not be biting like some of them, your not good enough 8)
6th Sam I was never one to shy away from a game of tennis that game is quite big in Kerry too.
APOLOGIES FOR CONTINUING THIS GAME OF DISCUSSIONBOARD TENNIS,BUT SINCE YOU OBVIOUSLY DESERVE A REPLY SUPERDOOPERCOOPER ,I'LL OBLIGE
I did my best to avoid this poisons thread ...................what was poisonous about my argument?
What is poisonous is that you single out Kerry for special attention ignoring Cork (who play in Munster too you know), Mayo & Galway, Dublin, Tryrone and Armagh who also get relatively free rides in their proviences. In Munster Limerick were there for a few years (02, 03, 04 & 05), Tipp drew a final in '02 and Clare have appeared in a number of finals since '92. This year they was a dramatic fall off in the standard but that happens. Derry & Down are off the standard in Ulster at the moment.
We are now penalized for being successful ............who is proposing that you be penalised--just treated the same as every other county.
How exactly are we being treated the same as every other county when you only mention Kerry getting a free ride? Seems some are just more equal than other under your system.
Fact:They do not have a significant pull from other sports,compared to most other counties......................Armagh/Down/Tyrone have a number of top professional soccer clubs,and top Rugby clubs-Kerry don't.
True there is no professional club in Kerry but amazingly Kerry players go to Cork and Limerick to play at a higher standard in other codes indeed my next door neighbour and member of our local club had a small bit of success at rugby, Mick Galway, despite no professional club in Kerry.
Fact:The likelihood of easy matches until July allows them the luxury of structuring their preparation accordingly-to allow them to peak for 3-4 matches in the summer.
Tyrone won the All-Ireland in '05 'cos of their hard year, so where is the advantage to Kerry this year one 'easy' game against Cork before a difficult QF. Shite we only the All-Ireland last year 'cos we got knocked out and had the benefit of back door games - looks like with some people Kerry are dammed if we do and dammed if we don't......................I admire your effective use of the system.My argument is that other counties find it more difficult to sustain a challenge due to the volume of competitive matches they have to play.For example,it is well documented that competitive matches result in a higher injury rate etc{look at Tyrone's injury list).
What Tyrone players got injured playing for Tyrone? Is it not true most got injured in training or playing for their clubs. You can't have it both ways either the 'easy ride' is an advantage or a disadvantage, my point illustrated that no matter what we do you will find fault.
Fact:Their compressed summer intercounty fixture list allows their club fixtures to be easier structured.
What ..... no club games played in Kerry during the summer, county league games occur w/o county players. Club games will happen now due to the shambolic 6 week break............You seem to be contradicting yourself here.
This year is a exception at there is a unbelievable 6 week break between matches in the summer so the club programme will be advanced. Normally the club programme will not be advanced because the breaks will be much shorter. However if Kerry lost the 6 week break would not be there and the club programme would be in tatters so how exactly is your 'fact' relevant.
Fact:Similar bias of the provincial system at minor and u21 level,ensures their youth are reared on success.
Kerry have not won a minor all-Ireland since 1994 and an u-21 since '98 again you would know this due to your extensive research on this topic.................Almost every county in Ireland would be jealous of Kerry's provincial success at underage level.
I'm on the board 3 years and this is the first time I've heard a Tyrone poster use the word jealous in relation to Kerry. We have a breakthrough Mr Freud. Acknowledging your problem was the first step you are now on the road to recovery.
Fact:Their main rivals(including Dublin) are disadvantaged by the current system,and are therefore are less likely to have sustained success.
You having a bitter(........??) go at Kerry and you want support from the Dubs..........I respect the Dubs-they bring a glamour to the GAA which few counties can match.
Kerry's main rival have and always will be Cork................I'm talking about genuine footballing rivals ,not your nearest neighbours ,who you tend to beat every year.
Cork have more All-Ireland than Tyrone, they have appeared in more All-Ireland semi finals than Tyrone this decade and have the same number of provincial title as Tyrone this decade. Granted Tyrone have won more All-Ireland this decade but Cork are far from bit part players.
The stench of bitterness and jealously seep right through this whole thread...............I have absolutely no bitterness towards Kerry or Cork -but I admit to being jealous of their success.It's just that the current system isn't fair--and no poster has yet given any arguments to the contrary!
The word jealous again --real breakthrough now. And you even mention Cork possibly getting a free ride....Tell me who else in Ulster would win the Munster championship (outside Tyrone/Armagh), who else in Leinster would (outside Dublin), who else in Connaught would (Outside Mayo/Galway). Kerry and Cork are two of the teams that will challenge for Sam. Has everyone forgotten what happened last August when Munster and Ulster met in Croke Park?
My interest in this subject is not born out of jealousy however,rather just a desire to have more competitive games packing out Croke park etc. to further strenghten the GAA. How the hell does your argument advance more competitive games in Croke Park all you are saying is that Kerry have a free ride, how does that pack Croke park????
Damb after all the progress on the jealousy topic you ruin your advances by denying it at the last, shame you showed progress for a bit.
I dread to think what would have been said if the incident with Galvin happened the other way round. .....Galvin great player,but crosses the line a bit too often to be appreciated by all.
If it was the other way round would you seriously be saying O'Leary great player but crosses the line or would you be doing a half page rant on Galvin? be honest now.....
The saddest line in this thread is about Rasnarun, how dare he go against Ulster and Tyrone - obviously he must be weak and afraid to stand up to the Kerry bogey men. That line of thinking is the saddest during my time on the board. You may disagree with the sentiments but to resort to comments like Stockholm syndrome shows the fragility of the argument.
I'm on the board 3 years and this is the first time I've heard a Tyrone poster use the word jealous in relation to Kerry. We have a breakthrough Mr Freud. Acknowledging your problem was the first step you are now on the road to recovery
Ere I would hazard a guess that 6th Sam ain't from Tyrone, Super. Just a guess mind you.
just to try and bring ye tyrone/armagh/down boys up to speed cork have a football tradition that overshadows the lot of ye put together. if anyone should gripe its cork, they have to contend with kerry every year DESPITE the fact that they have been the second best team in the country for long periods of time including now and most of the 80's. just look at their record in the club championships. yet one poster here dosent even consider them kerrys main foorball rivals ffs which goes to show what he knows about kerry football. wasnt it joe lennon in the 60's who said kerry football was finished (it was one of the down players). when armagh and tyrone start to dominate football for long periods (not 1 and 2 ai) then ye can talk.
ps i hearly fell off my chair - competing against top professional soccer clubs in armagh and tyrone? who the fock are they?? there are plenty other sports in kerry too you know competing for players..
Do Kerry get a free ride from the press for their cynical tactics?
Taking this question and applying it to last Sundays game you can look at a few incidents.
When Cork were chasing the game Kerry seemed to pull down their men out the field rather than let the play develop. This was best shown by Quirke pulling down Pearse O'Neill with what call only be called a rugby tackle. This cynical play but hardly enough to label the team as cynical. the rules are there to cover this and no supporter of any county would thank one of their players for letting the opposition walk up the field.
When Pearse O'Neill was going to collect the ball close to goal he was kicked into the air by a sliding tackle from the goalkeeper. This kind of tackle can break a players leg. What would have been the reaction if Kieran O'Connor had slid in and kicked the legs from the gooch before his goal. As it was the incident wasn't deemed worthy of a replay.
After this incident, said goalkeeper rounded on the umpire and intimidated him into putting down the flag he was raising. If I was the umpire I'd have stuck up the flag and then reported the verbals to the ref. (But I may be biased :-) )
Tomas O'Sè pulling back Kavanagh? What defender wouldn't have made a last ditch effort. I wouldn't put this on the same level as their goalie's wreckless lunge.
With time running out Noel O'Leary was seen receiving attention for a blow to the stomach. Soon after Paul Galvin was substituted. Thumping a player off the ball goes into my book as cynical. Does Pat O'Shea taking him off, indicate a worrying sign of civility from a Kerry manager.
So overall Kerry did what they had to do, to get the win.
Everyone is going to make up their own opinions on it.
Well, almost everyone.... but I wouldn't get too worried about the likes of Morrissey, Canning, and Colm O'Rourke labelling them as superstars after coming through a tight game by playing every card they know, while closely contested games up north are blanket covered by the terms poor game or dour struggles. The media do play Kerry up and struggle to analyse games on their own merits. They are as cynical as any other team.
QuoteWhat would have been the reaction if Kieran O'Connor had slid in and kicked the legs from the gooch before his goal.
Hang on now, Declan O'Sullivan was 'cleaned out' by a very similar foot-tackle down the other end in the second half.
"Hang on now, Declan O'Sullivan was 'cleaned out' by a very similar foot-tackle down the other end in the second half"
No he wasn't.
In the Declan O'Sullivan incident Canty slid in and kicked the ball.
It cannoned off O'Sullivan. Canty made no Contact with O'Sullivan.
The ball broke and O'Sullivan and another Cork player pulled on it.
The ball rebounded off the Cork player for a sideline.
Both the Cork player and O'Sullivan went down fter this but it was in no way similar to the Pearse O'Neill incident.
In the Pearse O'Neill incident he had knocked the ball on when Murphy slid in late and made sure to catch him on the leg.
Quoteit was in no way similar to the Pearse O'Neill incident
You're joking, right. The only difference was that Murphy was a split-second late with his 'foot-tackle' - O'Sullivan was bending to pick the ball, O'Neill wasn't in possession either. O'Neill got a free, O'Sullivan didn't; it was probably the right call made, but I would say that there was an equal amount of cynicism applied by both Murphy and Canty, it was just more successfully applied by the Cork player.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not painting Kerry as saints, they're not. But, in the teams that are likely to win Sam this year, they're not especially cynical - but cynicism has (probably) always been a necessity for success in sport. What's probably wrong, from a sporting perspective, is that the lesser (and upcoming) teams are less likely to get away with it, or as the initial posts on this thread would put it, get a free pass.
QuoteSheehy, glad to see that Tyrone remain a fear and a major thorn in the Kingdom's side
And no, I'll not be biting like some of them, your not good enough
You'll not "bite" because you are a lightweight who has nothing worthwhile to contribute to the debate. As for fear, you are the lads starting threads wondering if ye'll get to avoid Kerry till the final !!
Face it Tyrone bies, you got your arses well and truly kicked on this thread !
You Kerry whingers every year someone else wins the all ireland come up with some reason as to why the game is being ruined, particularily when its Ulster teams. You even moaned at Antrim many years ago. In more recent times after the Ulster dominance in the early 90's it was to much use of the handpass by Donegal - you's even moaned enough to get an experimental rule in to try and reduce it. In 2003 it was the turn of the blalnket defense (which happened to take place in your half most of the time - if your players had have kicked the ball long like you's moan at other teams for not doing many of the situations wouldnt have arose!). Another criticism after the Tyrone and Armagh wins was the lack of scoring in the half forward line. Just out of interest maybe you should sit down and compare the last 2 matches played by Kerry and Tyrone. Who's half forward line scored 1-6 from play? Tyrone also kicked the ball (and with accuracy) time and time again over distance. There's no doubt that Kerry were and are a great team but you's dont do yourselves any favours by trying to belittle other teams who are succesful. And although you's wont admit it there's no other team in Ireland Kerry would rather beat in Ireland than Tyrone. Barring 1 league victory in 05' against a severely weakened Tyrone team Tyrone have held the upper hand throughout the decade, including at under age level. It would be great if we meet again this year!
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on July 03, 2007, 07:16:36 PM
QuoteSheehy, glad to see that Tyrone remain a fear and a major thorn in the Kingdom's side
And no, I'll not be biting like some of them, your not good enough
You'll not "bite" because you are a lightweight who has nothing worthwhile to contribute to the debate. As for fear, you are the lads starting threads wondering if ye'll get to avoid Kerry till the final !!
Face it Tyrone bies, you got your arses well and truly kicked on this thread !
You'll find that your debate was actually with a
Down individual, d'oh! But good to see you're at least debating the points, not descending into
ad hominem attacks, welcome!
I thought you Tyrone ones loved bitin' Kerry men?
Quote from: MacCruiskeen on July 03, 2007, 09:24:14 PM
I thought you Tyrone ones loved bitin' Kerry men?
"Bitin'"?!... Nah, thumpin', thumpin' (on the park that is)! ;)
QuoteYou'll find that your debate was actually with a Down individual, d'oh!
Down, Tyrone, Armagh...who cares....you all come out with the same excuses about why you have only won 15 AI in the last 120 years.
QuoteBut good to see you're at least debating the points, not descending into ad hominem attacks, welcome!
I'm no saint, however I never instigate slagging at the personal level unless someone first has a go at me.
Quote from: timmykelleher on July 03, 2007, 12:05:29 PM
Do Kerry get a free ride from the press for their cynical tactics?
Taking this question and applying it to last Sundays game you can look at a few incidents.
When Cork were chasing the game Kerry seemed to pull down their men out the field rather than let the play develop. This was best shown by Quirke pulling down Pearse O'Neill with what call only be called a rugby tackle. This cynical play but hardly enough to label the team as cynical. the rules are there to cover this and no supporter of any county would thank one of their players for letting the opposition walk up the field.
When Pearse O'Neill was going to collect the ball close to goal he was kicked into the air by a sliding tackle from the goalkeeper. This kind of tackle can break a players leg. What would have been the reaction if Kieran O'Connor had slid in and kicked the legs from the gooch before his goal. As it was the incident wasn't deemed worthy of a replay.
After this incident, said goalkeeper rounded on the umpire and intimidated him into putting down the flag he was raising. If I was the umpire I'd have stuck up the flag and then reported the verbals to the ref. (But I may be biased :-) )
Tomas O'Sè pulling back Kavanagh? What defender wouldn't have made a last ditch effort. I wouldn't put this on the same level as their goalie's wreckless lunge.
With time running out Noel O'Leary was seen receiving attention for a blow to the stomach. Soon after Paul Galvin was substituted. Thumping a player off the ball goes into my book as cynical. Does Pat O'Shea taking him off, indicate a worrying sign of civility from a Kerry manager.
So overall Kerry did what they had to do, to get the win.
Everyone is going to make up their own opinions on it.
Well, almost everyone.... but I wouldn't get too worried about the likes of Morrissey, Canning, and Colm O'Rourke labelling them as superstars after coming through a tight game by playing every card they know, while closely contested games up north are blanket covered by the terms poor game or dour struggles. The media do play Kerry up and struggle to analyse games on their own merits. They are as cynical as any other team.
Don't ever put the legend Colm O'Rourke in the same sentence as the words "Morrissey" and "Canning" again. >:(
QuoteFace it Tyrone bies, you got your arses well and truly kicked on this thread !
Yerra FFS, untill ye can do something about getting your asses well and truly kicked in HQ by Tyrone, i believe
the light weight tag is very much where it belongs, its becoming of ye :-*