https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-56367223
A lot of talk on social media surrounding women's safety in the wake of the tragic kidnap and murder of Sarah Everard. The usual "not all men" nonsense is going about and this being a male-dominated forum it would be useful to discuss this (apologies if there is already a thread).
Probably something I didn't pay too much heed to when I was younger but something I've become more acutely aware of in recent years, having had female relatives in tears needing lifted and female friends wanting a lift or to talk on the phone because they don't feel safe walking at night. Probably something more common in bigger cities and this specific case is thankfully rare; but the general culture of men giving unwanted attention to lone women is often overlooked, no matter how benign it might appear to be.
Some of the stories I've read in the last 24 hours have been pretty horrific. As have many of the responses. From men
Quote from: general_lee on March 11, 2021, 07:21:32 PM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-56367223
A lot of talk on social media surrounding women's safety in the wake of the tragic kidnap and murder of Sarah Everard. The usual "not all men" nonsense is going about and this being a male-dominated forum it would be useful to discuss this (apologies if there is already a thread).
Probably something I didn't pay too much heed to when I was younger but something I've become more acutely aware of in recent years, having had female relatives in tears needing lifted and female friends wanting a lift or to talk on the phone because they don't feel safe walking at night. Probably something more common in bigger cities and this specific case is thankfully rare; but the general culture of men giving unwanted attention to lone women is often overlooked, no matter how benign it might appear to be.
As men, we have no idea what its like to be a woman, and the casual, ignorant verbal abuse and objectification they are subjected to on a daily basis.
And that's before you even get into the issues of domestic abuse, stalking, sexual assault and murder.
I asked the missus about this last night and she said when she was at Queen's she had a fella follow her home on a bike and knock the door to ask her out, a different fella sat beside her in Botanic Gardens bench and started saying how he loved her shoes and feet. She moved and he sat beside her again. She had fellas on 2 separate occasions follow her and ask her out on a date. This is all in daylight!
https://twitter.com/kate_taylor/status/1369931323448688640?s=19
Gary Lineker retweeted that earlier, I thought it insightful...
Quote from: Boycey on March 11, 2021, 08:02:26 PM
https://twitter.com/kate_taylor/status/1369931323448688640?s=19
Gary Lineker retweeted that earlier, I thought it insightful...
Wow. That is powerfully put.
I heard a woman talk on the radio one night about the worst single thing about being a woman and she said not being able to pull on a set of earphones and explore a new city alone either late at night or early morning... As part of a couple who have done myriad city breaks over the years, I've done that umpteen times myself while my partner slept. You see a different side of a city as it goes to sleep or wakes up.
It never struck me til then that it was a joy that's probably not available to my partner. Strange auld world...
Quote from: Boycey on March 11, 2021, 08:25:43 PM
I heard a woman talk on the radio one night about the worst single thing about being a woman and she said not being able to pull on a set of earphones and explore a new city alone either late at night or early morning... As part of a couple who have done myriad city breaks over the years, I've done that umpteen times myself while my partner slept. You see a different side of a city as it goes to sleep or wakes up.
It never struck me til then that it was a joy that's probably not available to my partner. Strange auld world...
Women never get harrassed or cat-called when they're with a lad.
So most men are never going to be a witness to their wife or girlfriend or sister or daughter getting abuse off another man.
But we've all witnessed, laughed along (whether sincerely or not), and I'm sure in some cases, have been the instigators of other women getting unwanted attention, in whatever form, from men.
There's a disconnect there somewhere.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on March 11, 2021, 07:58:20 PM
I asked the missus about this last night and she said when she was at Queen's she had a fella follow her home on a bike and knock the door to ask her out, a different fella sat beside her in Botanic Gardens bench and started saying how he loved her shoes and feet. She moved and he sat beside her again. She had fellas on 2 separate occasions follow her and ask her out on a date. This is all in daylight!
Bet you still have the bike!
Some of it is feminist hysteria too & are using this to further and enhance their own profile, some doll on the news today suggesting a 6pm curfew for men. The fella that killed Sarah Everard was obviously a bad 'un. Not sure how you prevent something as terrible as that.
A problem with how people behave themselves means you have to be wary if you see a woman on her own struggling. Myself and a friend were walking home past queens about 1-2 am on a sunday morning years ago from a night out. There was a women lying face first in the bushes absolutely plastered and you are wary of what to do but we managed to help her and get an ambulance for her but you get very paranoid that people would think you're taking advantage or she would get upset and scared. (She was grand but then when the ambulance came we waited to see if she was ok and she smacked the ambulance man!!). Then in newcastle on a stag me and a boy walked past this girl on a pavement who was the drunkest I have ever seen covered in more vomit than I have ever seen. We tried to help her and get an ambulance then woman saw us and thought we were going to take advantage of her when all we were doing was helping.
In summary because women have to be so fearful then if you are a normal non predatory person you end up needing to be very wary due to the weirdos out there.
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 12, 2021, 09:16:32 AM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on March 11, 2021, 07:58:20 PM
I asked the missus about this last night and she said when she was at Queen's she had a fella follow her home on a bike and knock the door to ask her out, a different fella sat beside her in Botanic Gardens bench and started saying how he loved her shoes and feet. She moved and he sat beside her again. She had fellas on 2 separate occasions follow her and ask her out on a date. This is all in daylight!
Bet you still have the bike!
;D Very rude nrico! I keep it stored in my secure lockup.
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 12, 2021, 09:16:32 AM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on March 11, 2021, 07:58:20 PM
I asked the missus about this last night and she said when she was at Queen's she had a fella follow her home on a bike and knock the door to ask her out, a different fella sat beside her in Botanic Gardens bench and started saying how he loved her shoes and feet. She moved and he sat beside her again. She had fellas on 2 separate occasions follow her and ask her out on a date. This is all in daylight!
Bet you still have the bike!
;D
Of course in this case a 6pm curfew for men would not have worked as the attacker was a police officer.
Most murderers of women know the victim. The murder of Sarah Everard was a sort of "bogeyman" scenario - very rare but one that resonated with a huge audience.
That can't be a serious suggestion.
Quote from: seafoid on March 12, 2021, 10:17:14 AM
Most murderers of women know the victim. The murder of Sarah Everard was a sort of "bogeyman" scenario - very rare but one that resonated with a huge audience.
Do we know she didn't know him? Details quite sketchy at this stage
Quote from: Tony Baloney on March 11, 2021, 07:58:20 PM
I asked the missus about this last night and she said when she was at Queen's she had a fella follow her home on a bike and knock the door to ask her out, a different fella sat beside her in Botanic Gardens bench and started saying how he loved her shoes and feet. She moved and he sat beside her again. She had fellas on 2 separate occasions follow her and ask her out on a date. This is all in daylight!
But yet she still married you
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 10:32:10 AM
Quote from: seafoid on March 12, 2021, 10:17:14 AM
Most murderers of women know the victim. The murder of Sarah Everard was a sort of "bogeyman" scenario - very rare but one that resonated with a huge audience.
Do we know she didn't know him? Details quite sketchy at this stage
Did he not expose himself a few days before this as well?
not that anyone could have foresaw this escalation, the lad was disturbed and he was working for the Met Parliamentary and Diplomatic Protection Command unit.
Lots of rumours of very poor behaviour towards women up to and including rape in the House of Commons and some "seem" to have gotten away with it.
Hardly a good example are they?
A woman was arrested with him for aiding a crime. I wonder who
His wife
What's the obsession with peoples occupations in episodes like this, at every turn she was a "marketing executive", I actually read something in the Times and we were told both her parents occupations too
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 01:32:19 PM
What's the obsession with peoples occupations in episodes like this, at every turn she was a "marketing executive", I actually read something in the Times and we were told both her parents occupations too
It's to tell the community that she was not
'a lady of the night'.
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 01:32:19 PM
What's the obsession with peoples occupations in episodes like this, at every turn she was a "marketing executive", I actually read something in the Times and we were told both her parents occupations too
I saw an article that listed his Ukranian mother in-laws occupation too.
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2021, 01:37:09 PM
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 01:32:19 PM
What's the obsession with peoples occupations in episodes like this, at every turn she was a "marketing executive", I actually read something in the Times and we were told both her parents occupations too
It's to tell the community that she was not 'a lady of the night'.
Christ. I was wondering about that occupation thing myself and the constant reference to it.
Quote from: grounded on March 12, 2021, 02:15:49 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2021, 01:37:09 PM
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 01:32:19 PM
What's the obsession with peoples occupations in episodes like this, at every turn she was a "marketing executive", I actually read something in the Times and we were told both her parents occupations too
It's to tell the community that she was not 'a lady of the night'.
Christ. I was wondering about that occupation thing myself and the constant reference to it.
Whether they admit it or not, people want to know.
Normal, functional, successful middle-class woman, going about her business, as opposed to lost or dysfunctional or overstretched woman from a troubled or poverty-stricken background.
The latter is part of the ambient, background violence of society, the former is not.
Same thing in the US.
There is sensationalist, blanket news coverage when some young, fit white woman goes missing or is murdered. Poor woman of colour... forget it. A statistic.
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2021, 01:37:09 PM
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 01:32:19 PM
What's the obsession with peoples occupations in episodes like this, at every turn she was a "marketing executive", I actually read something in the Times and we were told both her parents occupations too
It's to tell the community that she was not 'a lady of the night'.
And their parents occupations ?
And for transparency the father was a lecturer I think
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 03:25:29 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2021, 01:37:09 PM
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 01:32:19 PM
What's the obsession with peoples occupations in episodes like this, at every turn she was a "marketing executive", I actually read something in the Times and we were told both her parents occupations too
It's to tell the community that she was not 'a lady of the night'.
And their parents occupations ?
And for transparency the father was a lecturer I think
That's to condition us to think he's from a "good" family
Quote from: J70 on March 12, 2021, 02:42:23 PM
Quote from: grounded on March 12, 2021, 02:15:49 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2021, 01:37:09 PM
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 01:32:19 PM
What's the obsession with peoples occupations in episodes like this, at every turn she was a "marketing executive", I actually read something in the Times and we were told both her parents occupations too
It's to tell the community that she was not 'a lady of the night'.
Christ. I was wondering about that occupation thing myself and the constant reference to it.
Whether they admit it or not, people want to know.
Normal, functional, successful middle-class woman, going about her business, as opposed to lost or dysfunctional or overstretched woman from a troubled or poverty-stricken background.
The latter is part of the ambient, background violence of society, the former is not.
Same thing in the US.
There is sensationalist, blanket news coverage when some young, fit white woman goes missing or is murdered. Poor woman of colour... forget it. A statistic.
100% correct.
This is what it is all about.
Would a kid that disappeared on holiday many years ago still have an ongoing investigation if they had been from a lower income family?
I doubt it
Quote from: J70 on March 12, 2021, 02:42:23 PM
Quote from: grounded on March 12, 2021, 02:15:49 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2021, 01:37:09 PM
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 01:32:19 PM
What's the obsession with peoples occupations in episodes like this, at every turn she was a "marketing executive", I actually read something in the Times and we were told both her parents occupations too
It's to tell the community that she was not 'a lady of the night'.
Christ. I was wondering about that occupation thing myself and the constant reference to it.
Whether they admit it or not, people want to know.
Normal, functional, successful middle-class woman, going about her business, as opposed to lost or dysfunctional or overstretched woman from a troubled or poverty-stricken background.
The latter is part of the ambient, background violence of society, the former is not.
Same thing in the US.
There is sensationalist, blanket news coverage when some young, fit white woman goes missing or is murdered. Poor woman of colour... forget it. A statistic.
Joanna Yeates was another high profile murder case back in 2010 as she fitted the profile you just described. And I remember the media went to the town on her landlord just because he looked a bit different when it was actually her engineer neighbour that was proven in the end to be her murderer.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 12, 2021, 03:28:12 PM
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 03:25:29 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2021, 01:37:09 PM
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 01:32:19 PM
What's the obsession with peoples occupations in episodes like this, at every turn she was a "marketing executive", I actually read something in the Times and we were told both her parents occupations too
It's to tell the community that she was not 'a lady of the night'.
And their parents occupations ?
And for transparency the father was a lecturer I think
That's to condition us to think he's from a "good" family
Sorry that was the victims parents not the cop
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/life/case-sarah-everard-has-fuelled-rage-should-keep-red-hot/
For things to change we have to talk to our young boys about how to make girls feel safe. We have to say the urge to have sex is not some uncontrollable force. We have to say sex without consent is always rape and we have to send men to prison for it. We have to have phone lines for men who feel they cannot cope with their feelings. Men have to convict men and men have to tell other men that hitting a woman is the lowest of the low.
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 03:25:29 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2021, 01:37:09 PM
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 01:32:19 PM
What's the obsession with peoples occupations in episodes like this, at every turn she was a "marketing executive", I actually read something in the Times and we were told both her parents occupations too
It's to tell the community that she was not 'a lady of the night'.
And their parents occupations ?
And for transparency the father was a lecturer I think
What did he lecture?
Quote from: seafoid on March 12, 2021, 06:04:51 PM
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/life/case-sarah-everard-has-fuelled-rage-should-keep-red-hot/
For things to change we have to talk to our young boys about how to make girls feel safe. We have to say the urge to have sex is not some uncontrollable force. We have to say sex without consent is always rape and we have to send men to prison for it. We have to have phone lines for men who feel they cannot cope with their feelings. Men have to convict men and men have to tell other men that hitting a woman is the lowest of the low.
And drum into boys that women are people, not objects with a pleasing shape whose main purpose and obligation is men's pleasure and satisfaction.
Quote from: seafoid on March 12, 2021, 06:04:51 PM
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/life/case-sarah-everard-has-fuelled-rage-should-keep-red-hot/
For things to change we have to talk to our young boys about how to make girls feel safe. We have to say the urge to have sex is not some uncontrollable force. We have to say sex without consent is always rape and we have to send men to prison for it. We have to have phone lines for men who feel they cannot cope with their feelings. Men have to convict men and men have to tell other men that hitting a woman is the lowest of the low.
The fact that womens underwear is paraded in the court in rape trials is unbelievable. Shit like that needs to stop.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 12, 2021, 08:03:27 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 12, 2021, 06:04:51 PM
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/life/case-sarah-everard-has-fuelled-rage-should-keep-red-hot/
For things to change we have to talk to our young boys about how to make girls feel safe. We have to say the urge to have sex is not some uncontrollable force. We have to say sex without consent is always rape and we have to send men to prison for it. We have to have phone lines for men who feel they cannot cope with their feelings. Men have to convict men and men have to tell other men that hitting a woman is the lowest of the low.
The fact that womens underwear is paraded in the court in rape trials is unbelievable. Shit like that needs to stop.
Absolutely.
It is a terrifying case because we think of the times when we can relate to that feeling of being afraid. Just a few weeks ago I went for a walk around 8pm-when kids were in bed. It turned out to be much shorter than planned and when I came in my husband asked me why I was back so soon.
The reason? Fear.
It's that sense of unease you have by yourself at night.
I told him that I was afraid to walk by myself. He just thought I was crazy (and said but sure it's all well lit)
The street lights aren't the issue though. When you have experienced that heart pounding (half running the last part of the way) and breathing a sigh of relief when you get in and close the door behind you -you dread to think of what it must have been like for Sarah.
There were 80 women killed by a partner or ex in the year to March 2019, the Office for National Statistics (ONS) said, an increase of 27% from the previous year.
Though most deaths (nearly double 429) are men most years. Women around 230
Wayne Couzens is the name of the cop charged with kidnap and murder. From his appearance in photos you wouldn't think he was capable of such a crime.
Telegraph
The Metropolitan Police said on Friday night that Mr Couzens was taken to hospital for a second time in 48 hours for treatment to a fresh head injury sustained in custody, before being discharged and returned to a police station.
Quote from: Taylor on March 12, 2021, 03:51:54 PM
Quote from: J70 on March 12, 2021, 02:42:23 PM
Quote from: grounded on March 12, 2021, 02:15:49 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2021, 01:37:09 PM
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 12, 2021, 01:32:19 PM
What's the obsession with peoples occupations in episodes like this, at every turn she was a "marketing executive", I actually read something in the Times and we were told both her parents occupations too
It's to tell the community that she was not 'a lady of the night'.
Christ. I was wondering about that occupation thing myself and the constant reference to it.
Whether they admit it or not, people want to know.
Normal, functional, successful middle-class woman, going about her business, as opposed to lost or dysfunctional or overstretched woman from a troubled or poverty-stricken background.
The latter is part of the ambient, background violence of society, the former is not.
Same thing in the US.
There is sensationalist, blanket news coverage when some young, fit white woman goes missing or is murdered. Poor woman of colour... forget it. A statistic.
100% correct.
This is what it is all about.
Would a kid that disappeared on holiday many years ago still have an ongoing investigation if they had been from a lower income family?
I doubt it
There was a good comparison in the book Chavs between he disappearance of Maddie McCann and Shannon Matthews, the sympathy for the well to do McCanns and the immediate castigation of useless neglectful mother of the Shannon.
The irony that it turned out Karen Matthews and her BF did turn out to be tramps wasn't lost on me but still it was an interesting comparison of stereotypes.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/03/13/police-officer-charged-sarah-everard-murder-appears-court/
The body of Sarah Everard was identified through her dental records after her remains were found inside a builder's bag, it emerged in court.
Quote from: seafoid on March 13, 2021, 05:51:08 PM
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/03/13/police-officer-charged-sarah-everard-murder-appears-court/
The body of Sarah Everard was identified through her dental records after her remains were found inside a builder's bag, it emerged in court.
Grim.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on March 13, 2021, 06:12:35 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 13, 2021, 05:51:08 PM
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/03/13/police-officer-charged-sarah-everard-murder-appears-court/
The body of Sarah Everard was identified through her dental records after her remains were found inside a builder's bag, it emerged in court.
Grim.
Had he burnt the body to hinder identification? Why the need to use dental records?
Quote from: Capt Pat on March 13, 2021, 06:44:42 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on March 13, 2021, 06:12:35 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 13, 2021, 05:51:08 PM
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/03/13/police-officer-charged-sarah-everard-murder-appears-court/
The body of Sarah Everard was identified through her dental records after her remains were found inside a builder's bag, it emerged in court.
Grim.
Had he burnt the body to hinder identification? Why the need to use dental records?
Was wondering what happened the body myself. To carry out a murder is going to get harder and harder with the advances of technology - everybody has mobile phones, all cars will eventually have dash cams, doorbells have cameras and CCTV coverage is increasing. Add in the fact that your phone and car both potentially have GPS, means that you are going to have to be very smart or very lucky to get away with murder. I heard that the key evidence that led the police to Couzens was the CCTV of a bus I never even thought of as having a camera.
It does make you wonder how they haven't been able to find more in that Noah Donohue case.
This case is horrendous >:(
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 13, 2021, 08:30:22 PM
Quote from: Capt Pat on March 13, 2021, 06:44:42 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on March 13, 2021, 06:12:35 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 13, 2021, 05:51:08 PM
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/03/13/police-officer-charged-sarah-everard-murder-appears-court/
The body of Sarah Everard was identified through her dental records after her remains were found inside a builder's bag, it emerged in court.
Grim.
Had he burnt the body to hinder identification? Why the need to use dental records?
Was wondering what happened the body myself. To carry out a murder is going to get harder and harder with the advances of technology - everybody has mobile phones, all cars will eventually have dash cams, doorbells have cameras and CCTV coverage is increasing. Add in the fact that your phone and car both potentially have GPS, means that you are going to have to be very smart or very lucky to get away with murder. I heard that the key evidence that led the police to Couzens was the CCTV of a bus I never even thought of as having a camera.
Good call. Saw headline of article on the twitter, didnt overly read it, about how the serial killer is a thing of the past, due to all the above, and although im sure theyre still about its def gettin harder for them as you say.
Be interesting to see if yer man Couzens was one....
Yet man Couzens was obviously off the rails, didn't he indecently expose himself in a McDonalds a few days before abducting Sarah Everard?
Think when it's in them they aren't too concerned about CCTV and getting caught
Disgusting scenes last night. I've said it before and I'll say it again- police are the absolute lowest of the low.
How do you police a banned gathering?
Before you jump in, how this police force dealt with it was atrocious.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 14, 2021, 11:52:09 AM
How do you police a banned gathering?
Before you jump in, how this police force dealt with it was atrocious.
True, that's the narrative that will come to the fore in the coming days as well after the initial disgust at the Police subsides. You're in lockdown or you're not, exceptionalism creates mixed messages.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 14, 2021, 11:52:09 AM
How do you police a banned gathering?
Before you jump in, how this police force dealt with it was atrocious.
Ideally the same way they 'policed' the Shankill/George Sq in Glasgow ie an escort or in the case of the Shankill road just pretend it's happening altogether
It's a bit like the psni mess up on the ormeau road. Difference being that was friends and family of the victims. Don't know who all these people in London are.
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 13, 2021, 09:16:46 PM
Yet man Couzens was obviously off the rails, didn't he indecently expose himself in a McDonalds a few days before abducting Sarah Everard?
Think when it's in them they aren't too concerned about CCTV and getting caught
Chatting to my sister yesterday about this case, she's in the psychology business. While by no means trying to make any excuses for this murder she was pointing out if Couzen's had 20+ years police service with no issues and no criminal record should the MET not have taken the indecent exposure case a lot more serious, has this guy went completely off the rails and if proper psychological assessment been carried out would he have been getting the help needed instead of committing murder. Will be a lot of questions when his trial comes up.
Quote from: pbat on March 14, 2021, 01:39:37 PM
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 13, 2021, 09:16:46 PM
Yet man Couzens was obviously off the rails, didn't he indecently expose himself in a McDonalds a few days before abducting Sarah Everard?
Think when it's in them they aren't too concerned about CCTV and getting caught
Chatting to my sister yesterday about this case, she's in the psychology business. While by no means trying to make any excuses for this murder she was pointing out if Couzen's had 20+ years police service with no issues and no criminal record should the MET not have taken the indecent exposure case a lot more serious, has this guy went completely off the rails and if proper psychological assessment been carried out would he have been getting the help needed instead of committing murder. Will be a lot of questions when his trial comes up.
Don't think he was in the police that long, he was a mechanic until joining the police around 10 years ago.
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 14, 2021, 07:45:20 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 14, 2021, 01:39:37 PM
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 13, 2021, 09:16:46 PM
Yet man Couzens was obviously off the rails, didn't he indecently expose himself in a McDonalds a few days before abducting Sarah Everard?
Think when it's in them they aren't too concerned about CCTV and getting caught
Chatting to my sister yesterday about this case, she's in the psychology business. While by no means trying to make any excuses for this murder she was pointing out if Couzen's had 20+ years police service with no issues and no criminal record should the MET not have taken the indecent exposure case a lot more serious, has this guy went completely off the rails and if proper psychological assessment been carried out would he have been getting the help needed instead of committing murder. Will be a lot of questions when his trial comes up.
Don't think he was in the police that long, he was a mechanic until joining the police around 10 years ago.
he only joined the met police in 2018
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 14, 2021, 11:17:32 AM
Disgusting scenes last night. I've said it before and I'll say it again- police are the absolute lowest of the low.
I'd say rapists, murderers, thieves, and many more would be much lower. You know, criminals like...
That vigil was stupid in the circumstances. The police response even more stupid.
Quote from: SHEEDY on March 14, 2021, 08:44:54 PM
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 14, 2021, 07:45:20 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 14, 2021, 01:39:37 PM
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 13, 2021, 09:16:46 PM
Yet man Couzens was obviously off the rails, didn't he indecently expose himself in a McDonalds a few days before abducting Sarah Everard?
Think when it's in them they aren't too concerned about CCTV and getting caught
Chatting to my sister yesterday about this case, she's in the psychology business. While by no means trying to make any excuses for this murder she was pointing out if Couzen's had 20+ years police service with no issues and no criminal record should the MET not have taken the indecent exposure case a lot more serious, has this guy went completely off the rails and if proper psychological assessment been carried out would he have been getting the help needed instead of committing murder. Will be a lot of questions when his trial comes up.
Don't think he was in the police that long, he was a mechanic until joining the police around 10 years ago.
he only joined the met police in 2018
Aye, think he was only a cop for ten years in total.
What is really striking about this apart from the murder is the female reaction. The police are on the back foot following Saturday's heavy handedness. The politicians are trying to keep up with the public.
The mistake the women at the vigil made was that they were women, peaceful, masked up, socially distanced and genuinely concerned with a matter of the utmost importance for society
If they had been violent anti-mask loons, EDL thugs, or drunk Rangers hooligans, they would have been treated with kid gloves
The reaction of the cops would sort of remind you of Sinn Fein supporters here - ignore the big crimes of your mates, focus on the tiny misdemeanours of others
Quote from: sid waddell on March 15, 2021, 12:54:46 PM
The mistake the women at the vigil made was that they were women, peaceful, masked up, socially distanced and genuinely concerned with a matter of the utmost importance for society
If they had been violent anti-mask loons, EDL thugs, or drunk Rangers hooligans, they would have been treated with kid gloves
The reaction of the cops would sort of remind you of Sinn Fein supporters here - ignore the big crimes of your mates, focus on the tiny misdemeanours of others
Oh I think there were a few loons there too if you have seen all the footage
I see the chick who was handcuffed is an "actor" and has opened a Twitter account after the vigil, must be going for the full 15mins of fame
Quote from: sid waddell on March 15, 2021, 12:54:46 PM
The mistake the women at the vigil made was that they were women, peaceful, masked up, socially distanced and genuinely concerned with a matter of the utmost importance for society
If they had been violent anti-mask loons, EDL thugs, or drunk Rangers hooligans, they would have been treated with kid gloves
The reaction of the cops would sort of remind you of Sinn Fein supporters here - ignore the big crimes of your mates, focus on the tiny misdemeanours of others
The police response was (as always in these cases) over the top and ridiculous.
How do you manage a banned gathering of people due to public health reasons? If you just turn a blind eye will that open it up for others?
Also for what's it worth there were nearly 30 arrested at the Rangers thing in Glasgow.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 15, 2021, 12:59:13 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on March 15, 2021, 12:54:46 PM
The mistake the women at the vigil made was that they were women, peaceful, masked up, socially distanced and genuinely concerned with a matter of the utmost importance for society
If they had been violent anti-mask loons, EDL thugs, or drunk Rangers hooligans, they would have been treated with kid gloves
The reaction of the cops would sort of remind you of Sinn Fein supporters here - ignore the big crimes of your mates, focus on the tiny misdemeanours of others
The police response was (as always in these cases) over the top and ridiculous.
How do you manage a banned gathering of people due to public health reasons? If you just turn a blind eye will that open it up for others?
In the past, the way the Brits managed banned gatherings was to shoot 14 people dead
That wasn't a very good idea for a host of reasons
Quote from: sid waddell on March 15, 2021, 01:01:47 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 15, 2021, 12:59:13 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on March 15, 2021, 12:54:46 PM
The mistake the women at the vigil made was that they were women, peaceful, masked up, socially distanced and genuinely concerned with a matter of the utmost importance for society
If they had been violent anti-mask loons, EDL thugs, or drunk Rangers hooligans, they would have been treated with kid gloves
The reaction of the cops would sort of remind you of Sinn Fein supporters here - ignore the big crimes of your mates, focus on the tiny misdemeanours of others
The police response was (as always in these cases) over the top and ridiculous.
How do you manage a banned gathering of people due to public health reasons? If you just turn a blind eye will that open it up for others?
In the past, the way the Brits managed banned gatherings was to shoot 14 people dead
That wasn't a very good idea for a host of reasons
When you were away for ten days, did you reflect on why they banned you? Lets deal with the Met first and then start a thread on Bloody Sunday
On Friday the Daily Telegraph was telling women not to join the vigil
Today it has 2 op eds called How on earth did the Met get it so wrong? and This country does not take violence against women seriously enough
This is #seniorhurling
The Police response was absolutely baffling. Failing to engage with the organisers initially was the first mistake but to compound it with what we saw on Saturday is just mind boggling. Like all the mass gathering the response has been either criticised for being too heavy handed (Sarah Everard vigil) or not heavy handed enough (Storey Funeral / Pritt Park)
What should happen is quite simple and honestly the PSNI should already know this from illegal parades and riots. You make people aware that it is and illegal gathering and it's being filmed. And that while no action will take place on the night you can expect a visit from the fuzz in the weeks following. You follow up with fines. I think that is a pretty fair and balanced response to what is a public health issue and not a public order one.
Quote from: Kidder81 on March 15, 2021, 12:57:49 PM
I see the chick who was handcuffed is an "actor" and has opened a Twitter account after the vigil, must be going for the full 15mins of fame
Stay classy Kidder.
Quote from: sid waddell on March 15, 2021, 12:54:46 PM
The mistake the women at the vigil made was that they were women, peaceful, masked up, socially distanced and genuinely concerned with a matter of the utmost importance for society
If they had been violent anti-mask loons, EDL thugs, or drunk Rangers hooligans, they would have been treated with kid gloves
The reaction of the cops would sort of remind you of Sinn Fein supporters here - ignore the big crimes of your mates, focus on the tiny misdemeanours of others
Back and just can't resist a dig. Typical and sad
The momentum seems to be with the women.
https://youtu.be/oUuNjq5ECEo