Okay...this should be interesting, Armagh have a few players back from injury which will obviously strengthen them but Fermanagh have a bit of momentum going into the game plus Armagh's home record is abysmal. McGeeny said in Irish News today he fully expects Armagh to stay in Div 2...either he's unaware of the first two defeats or he's about to unleash the beast for the rest of the league and we've only been messing about so far...
Quote from: illdecide on February 19, 2016, 09:30:39 AM
McGeeny said in Irish News today he fully expects Armagh to stay in Div 2...either he's unaware of the first two defeats or he's about to unleash the beast for the rest of the league and we've only been messing about so far...
Perhaps he is aware of a proposal to restructure the league!
Quote from: armaghniac on February 19, 2016, 10:52:43 AM
Quote from: illdecide on February 19, 2016, 09:30:39 AM
McGeeny said in Irish News today he fully expects Armagh to stay in Div 2...either he's unaware of the first two defeats or he's about to unleash the beast for the rest of the league and we've only been messing about so far...
Perhaps he is aware of a proposal to restructure the league!
That could be our best chance of staying up alright! Fermanagh are favourites for this one for sure.
McGrath v McGeeney
Insight vs gym bunny
I was going to head down early and watch the Ireland rugby game in the bar before the GAA, any good spots to watch it near the ground, pub grub would be a bonus?
Pearse Og social club is in the grounds but don't think they do food. Maybe the hotel?
Quote from: general_lee on February 19, 2016, 02:17:36 PM
Pearse Og social club is in the grounds but don't think they do food. Maybe the hotel?
Who was Pearse Óg?
Quote from: seafoid on February 19, 2016, 02:36:08 PM
Quote from: general_lee on February 19, 2016, 02:17:36 PM
Pearse Og social club is in the grounds but don't think they do food. Maybe the hotel?
Who was Pearse Óg?
ORIGINS OF THE CLUB NAME?
Na Piarsaigh Óga translates as the Young Pearses, proudly take their name from the 1916 Irish Republicans Padraig and Willie Pearse. The Club's crest features 'The Flaming Sword', the symbol generally associated with Pearse and his newspaper, surrounded with the Club colours green and gold, with an outline of Armagh City.
Quote from: seafoid on February 19, 2016, 02:36:08 PM
Quote from: general_lee on February 19, 2016, 02:17:36 PM
Pearse Og social club is in the grounds but don't think they do food. Maybe the hotel?
Who was Pearse Óg?
That actually didn't even deserve a response...
Just read Mallon, Grugan & Murnin are back with the squad. With McKeever and Murray nearing return.
Throw in a few Cross lads and we will be a much better team by the end of the national league v Derry then when we were at the start.
Quote from: JP on February 19, 2016, 03:26:40 PM
Just read Mallon, Grugan & Murnin are back with the squad. With McKeever and Murray nearing return.
Throw in a few Cross lads and we will be a much better team by the end of the national league v Derry then when we were at the start.
Hopefully gives the team a lift but I'm not getting my hopes up. Derry had as many if not more men missing and they've been fine so far.
I'll be backing Armagh -2 or whatever enticing handicaps are on offer, think we'll win 4+
Fermanagh have been missing about 6 of the team who started in last year's all Ireland quarter final due to injury
As far as i know they are all expected back for the Armagh game and McCluskey is also expected back as he had been given a bit of extra time off.
Apart from the second half of he Derry game we have been very good defensively.
It will not be pretty.
A repeat of last year's result would do the best
Even with the players returning, Armagh will not have forwards who you can depend on for scores. Fermanagh by 4
Quote from: illdecide on February 19, 2016, 03:17:45 PM
Quote from: seafoid on February 19, 2016, 02:36:08 PM
Quote from: general_lee on February 19, 2016, 02:17:36 PM
Pearse Og social club is in the grounds but don't think they do food. Maybe the hotel?
Who was Pearse Óg?
That actually didn't even deserve a response...
it must have been a unionist translation
This Is a must lose match for the Apple munchers
To Armagh people.. Are yee loosing patience with McGeeney? Or is he untouchable?
We recognise the talent isn't there,don't expect too much,having said that we have the Indian sign over Fermanagh,who apart from the disaster in 2004,can't seem to beat us,no matter how good a team they have.They failed twice in the league last season against us.
Need points from Fermanagh and Cavan then a win against Galway at home to survive.
Quote from: T Fearon on February 21, 2016, 12:12:34 PM
We recognise the talent isn't there,don't expect too much,having said that we have the Indian sign over Fermanagh,who apart from the disaster in 2004,can't seem to beat us,no matter how good a team they have.They failed twice in the league last season against us.
Need points from Fermanagh and Cavan then a win against Galway at home to survive.
No chance we beat Galway, that said I am hoping we can Nick a win next weekend against a decent Fermanagh outfit.
Armagh 2 12 Femanagh 1 11.
Armagh ladies would give Armagh a game at the min ;D
Quote from: Over the Bar on February 21, 2016, 02:52:46 PM
Armagh ladies would give Armagh a game at the min ;D
Isn't the fixtures calendar congested enough?!
I am hoping by the time the Galway fixture comes around that it will be a dead rubber as far as they are concerned.
Quote from: ck on February 21, 2016, 09:18:12 AM
To Armagh people.. Are yee loosing patience with McGeeney? Or is he untouchable?
don't want to speak for everyone but yes, I am losing patience. I know we don't have the most talented squad in Ireland nut there is some talent there and it is not being utilised properly. Plus, the football we play is dire
Quote from: T Fearon on February 21, 2016, 07:39:23 PM
I am hoping by the time the Galway fixture comes around that it will be a dead rubber as far as they are concerned.
Last match v Derry might be a dead rubber. Don't see how the fifth match would be a dead rubber. We'd ned to win 2 game to have any chance. I can't see where those wins are going to come from.
No matter who we play last we'll know after this weekend if we're going back to Div 3, a win on Sat nite will change things but a loss and we're back to where we came from.
Quote from: illdecide on February 22, 2016, 12:09:28 PM
No matter who we play last we'll know after this weekend if we're going back to Div 3, a win on Sat nite will delay things but a loss and we're back to where we came from.
Fixed that for you.
McGeeney is intense and he is industrious but he is not up to much as a manager based on results to date
Ronan Clarke doing a magnificent job with Armagh Senior ladies
Quote from: seafoid on February 22, 2016, 09:02:50 PM
McGeeney is intense and he is industrious but he is not up to much as a manager based on results to date
Excellent coach, excellent motivator of men.
Piss poor game day tactician and strategist.
You men are some craic, the wind up merchants who come on here trying to get people to slag McGeeney off...some of you wouldn't know what to do with an O'Neills ball and then the Armagh men slagging him off too, do you really think we have the players to be competing at the top table because if you do then you're mad in the head. When Armagh get their strongest 15 out they'd be a match for most teams but we don't have the talent in the squad to compete without our best players and other counties do. We are where we are and one positive result this week and i believe we'll get enough Pt's on board to stay in Div 2.
McGeeney even when he was with Kildare was the man people loved to hate for some reason and was always under scrutiny and now he's back with Armagh it has followed him, no-one on here knows anything about the man or his ways so why give him a hard time not that he will give 2 f**ks what some di*k behind a keyboard is typing about him.
I think Armagh will beat Fermanagh this weekend.
The McRory semi final between Beesbrook and Lurgan is on before this match.
Quote from: illdecide on February 23, 2016, 09:25:18 AM
You men are some craic, the wind up merchants who come on here trying to get people to slag McGeeney off...McGeeney even when he was with Kildare was the man people loved to hate for some reason ...
The problem had with Kieran McGeeney was the rumored income he was getting from Kildare. I say rumored because obviously nothing is official, but I am sure pretty much everyone would believe he was being quite well rewarded. So there was probably a bit of jealousy.
the second problem would be the representation of his results. McGeeney was lauded continuously by the media as achieving great things at Kildare.
NFLHe took over a team that had reached the league semi-finals but he was relegated from Division one in his first year and it took him 5 years to get them back.
LeinsterHe was put out the Leinster championship in 2008 by division 4 Wicklow, 2009 by Dublin in the final, in 2010 by division 3 Louth, in 2011 by Dublin, in 2012 by Division 2 Meath, in 2013 by Dublin.
So he never beat Dublin, Never won Leinster, and only made one final.
QualfiersHe made his name really through qualifier success but that also isn't a great record in scrutiny:
2008 - Beat Div 2 Cavan, Beat Div 2 Limerick, Beat Div 3 Fermanagh, Lost to Div 2 Cork
2009 - Beat Div 4 Wicklow, Lost to Div 1 Tyrone
2010 - Beat Div 3 Antrim, Beat Div 4 Leitrim, Beat Derry (relegated from Div 1), Beat Div 1 Monaghan, Beat Div 2 Meath, lost to Div 2 Down
2011 - Beat Div 2 Laois, Beat Div 2 Derry, Lost to Div 2 Donegal
2012 - Beat Div 3 Cavan, Beat Div 3 Sligo, Lost to Div 1 Cork
2013 - Beat Div 2 Louth, Lost to Div 1 Tyrone
In the championship in 6 years Kildare managed in 2010 to beat Division 1 Monaghan and a relegated Division 1 Derry. But never beat a top side in any other match or any other year
in 2010 & 2011 Kildare were a team on the brink of the top table but there was a huge investment in time and money and they never quite made it. This is not a personal attack on McGeeney just on his record. These are just the facts not me calling him names or discrediting his personality. But just perhaps an explanation of why he hasn't performed a miracle at Armagh and why one may not come.
As I said before jealousy is probably a key factor why people like to knock him now but that is partly fueled by the belief he was paid better than the results above deserved.
No doubt he hasn't had the best of results but did he get the best out of what he had or did he send them backwards? How much money was/is he really on if any? There's not too many knows the truth (and it's none of anybody's business), I believe he'd have you motivated and ready to go to battle alright as regards tactics i'll reserve that thought to the summer time when he has had a full squad to pick from...
I suppose when K McGeeney is getting it in the neck they're leaving someone else alone...
Quote from: PAULD123 on February 23, 2016, 11:27:40 AM
Quote from: illdecide on February 23, 2016, 09:25:18 AM
You men are some craic, the wind up merchants who come on here trying to get people to slag McGeeney off...McGeeney even when he was with Kildare was the man people loved to hate for some reason ...
The problem had with Kieran McGeeney was the rumored income he was getting from Kildare. I say rumored because obviously nothing is official, but I am sure pretty much everyone would believe he was being quite well rewarded. So there was probably a bit of jealousy.
the second problem would be the representation of his results. McGeeney was lauded continuously by the media as achieving great things at Kildare.
NFL
He took over a team that had reached the league semi-finals but he was relegated from Division one in his first year and it took him 5 years to get them back.
Leinster
He was put out the Leinster championship in 2008 by division 4 Wicklow, 2009 by Dublin in the final, in 2010 by division 3 Louth, in 2011 by Dublin, in 2012 by Division 2 Meath, in 2013 by Dublin.
So he never beat Dublin, Never won Leinster, and only made one final.
Qualfiers
He made his name really through qualifier success but that also isn't a great record in scrutiny:
2008 - Beat Div 2 Cavan, Beat Div 2 Limerick, Beat Div 3 Fermanagh, Lost to Div 2 Cork
2009 - Beat Div 4 Wicklow, Lost to Div 1 Tyrone
2010 - Beat Div 3 Antrim, Beat Div 4 Leitrim, Beat Derry (relegated from Div 1), Beat Div 1 Monaghan, Beat Div 2 Meath, lost to Div 2 Down
2011 - Beat Div 2 Laois, Beat Div 2 Derry, Lost to Div 2 Donegal
2012 - Beat Div 3 Cavan, Beat Div 3 Sligo, Lost to Div 1 Cork
2013 - Beat Div 2 Louth, Lost to Div 1 Tyrone
In the championship in 6 years Kildare managed in 2010 to beat Division 1 Monaghan and a relegated Division 1 Derry. But never beat a top side in any other match or any other year
in 2010 & 2011 Kildare were a team on the brink of the top table but there was a huge investment in time and money and they never quite made it. This is not a personal attack on McGeeney just on his record. These are just the facts not me calling him names or discrediting his personality. But just perhaps an explanation of why he hasn't performed a miracle at Armagh and why one may not come.
As I said before jealousy is probably a key factor why people like to knock him now but that is partly fueled by the belief he was paid better than the results above deserved.
Just what we need. The Down village idiot posting on Armagh subject matter.
Quote from: DuffleKing on February 23, 2016, 01:03:29 PM
Quote from: PAULD123 on February 23, 2016, 11:27:40 AM
Quote from: illdecide on February 23, 2016, 09:25:18 AM
You men are some craic, the wind up merchants who come on here trying to get people to slag McGeeney off...McGeeney even when he was with Kildare was the man people loved to hate for some reason ...
The problem had with Kieran McGeeney was the rumored income he was getting from Kildare. I say rumored because obviously nothing is official, but I am sure pretty much everyone would believe he was being quite well rewarded. So there was probably a bit of jealousy.
the second problem would be the representation of his results. McGeeney was lauded continuously by the media as achieving great things at Kildare.
NFL
He took over a team that had reached the league semi-finals but he was relegated from Division one in his first year and it took him 5 years to get them back.
Leinster
He was put out the Leinster championship in 2008 by division 4 Wicklow, 2009 by Dublin in the final, in 2010 by division 3 Louth, in 2011 by Dublin, in 2012 by Division 2 Meath, in 2013 by Dublin.
So he never beat Dublin, Never won Leinster, and only made one final.
Qualfiers
He made his name really through qualifier success but that also isn't a great record in scrutiny:
2008 - Beat Div 2 Cavan, Beat Div 2 Limerick, Beat Div 3 Fermanagh, Lost to Div 2 Cork
2009 - Beat Div 4 Wicklow, Lost to Div 1 Tyrone
2010 - Beat Div 3 Antrim, Beat Div 4 Leitrim, Beat Derry (relegated from Div 1), Beat Div 1 Monaghan, Beat Div 2 Meath, lost to Div 2 Down
2011 - Beat Div 2 Laois, Beat Div 2 Derry, Lost to Div 2 Donegal
2012 - Beat Div 3 Cavan, Beat Div 3 Sligo, Lost to Div 1 Cork
2013 - Beat Div 2 Louth, Lost to Div 1 Tyrone
In the championship in 6 years Kildare managed in 2010 to beat Division 1 Monaghan and a relegated Division 1 Derry. But never beat a top side in any other match or any other year
in 2010 & 2011 Kildare were a team on the brink of the top table but there was a huge investment in time and money and they never quite made it. This is not a personal attack on McGeeney just on his record. These are just the facts not me calling him names or discrediting his personality. But just perhaps an explanation of why he hasn't performed a miracle at Armagh and why one may not come.
As I said before jealousy is probably a key factor why people like to knock him now but that is partly fueled by the belief he was paid better than the results above deserved.
Just what we need. The Down village idiot posting on Armagh subject matter.
I know, we have our own village idiots thank you very much!
Jamies back lads ?
Tony will be happy
Quote from: FermGael on February 23, 2016, 04:49:27 PM
Jamies back lads ?
Tony will be happy
Have you heard something different to him going away?
I know nothing but I am surprised you don't
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on February 23, 2016, 01:27:40 PM
Quote from: DuffleKing on February 23, 2016, 01:03:29 PM
Quote from: PAULD123 on February 23, 2016, 11:27:40 AM
Quote from: illdecide on February 23, 2016, 09:25:18 AM
You men are some craic, the wind up merchants who come on here trying to get people to slag McGeeney off...McGeeney even when he was with Kildare was the man people loved to hate for some reason ...
The problem had with Kieran McGeeney was the rumored income he was getting from Kildare. I say rumored because obviously nothing is official, but I am sure pretty much everyone would believe he was being quite well rewarded. So there was probably a bit of jealousy.
the second problem would be the representation of his results. McGeeney was lauded continuously by the media as achieving great things at Kildare.
NFL
He took over a team that had reached the league semi-finals but he was relegated from Division one in his first year and it took him 5 years to get them back.
Leinster
He was put out the Leinster championship in 2008 by division 4 Wicklow, 2009 by Dublin in the final, in 2010 by division 3 Louth, in 2011 by Dublin, in 2012 by Division 2 Meath, in 2013 by Dublin.
So he never beat Dublin, Never won Leinster, and only made one final.
Qualfiers
He made his name really through qualifier success but that also isn't a great record in scrutiny:
2008 - Beat Div 2 Cavan, Beat Div 2 Limerick, Beat Div 3 Fermanagh, Lost to Div 2 Cork
2009 - Beat Div 4 Wicklow, Lost to Div 1 Tyrone
2010 - Beat Div 3 Antrim, Beat Div 4 Leitrim, Beat Derry (relegated from Div 1), Beat Div 1 Monaghan, Beat Div 2 Meath, lost to Div 2 Down
2011 - Beat Div 2 Laois, Beat Div 2 Derry, Lost to Div 2 Donegal
2012 - Beat Div 3 Cavan, Beat Div 3 Sligo, Lost to Div 1 Cork
2013 - Beat Div 2 Louth, Lost to Div 1 Tyrone
In the championship in 6 years Kildare managed in 2010 to beat Division 1 Monaghan and a relegated Division 1 Derry. But never beat a top side in any other match or any other year
in 2010 & 2011 Kildare were a team on the brink of the top table but there was a huge investment in time and money and they never quite made it. This is not a personal attack on McGeeney just on his record. These are just the facts not me calling him names or discrediting his personality. But just perhaps an explanation of why he hasn't performed a miracle at Armagh and why one may not come.
As I said before jealousy is probably a key factor why people like to knock him now but that is partly fueled by the belief he was paid better than the results above deserved.
Just what we need. The Down village idiot posting on Armagh subject matter.
I know, we have our own village idiots thank you very much!
Did someone call me?
It will be a quick return to division three if Armagh don't win this game.
Quote from: DuffleKing on February 23, 2016, 01:03:29 PM
.....Just what we need. The Down village idiot posting on Armagh subject matter.
I didn't say one personally insulting thing about McGeeney and you have no justification for insulting me. I was careful to only present the facts. What part of that is idiocy? I would have expected some reasonably intelligent comment on the facts not just some small minded childish insult.
Quote from: PAULD123 on February 24, 2016, 08:13:54 AM
Quote from: DuffleKing on February 23, 2016, 01:03:29 PM
.....Just what we need. The Down village idiot posting on Armagh subject matter.
I didn't say one personally insulting thing about McGeeney and you have no justification for insulting me. I was careful to only present the facts. What part of that is idiocy? I would have expected some reasonably intelligent comment on the facts not just some small minded childish insult.
But with you replying you're admitting you're the village idiot...lol :) :) :)
Quote from: illdecide on February 24, 2016, 08:53:24 AM
But with you replying you're admitting you're the village idiot...lol :) :) :)
not really sure how you make that out. I admit I am the person he was calling an idiot, but how does that in anyway say I agree with him. Because it doesn't and I don't. In fact my post above made it clear that I do not consider anything idiotic in my comments at all.
I would rather have a sensible discussion on what is expected from managers by supporters and Armagh is a very interesting case. You have a manager that has frequently been lauded as a great manager. Yet for Armagh so far has not produced great results. Down have a manager who was expected by the supporters to produce bad results and has produced bad results, so that is not interesting.
What's interesting is reputation, McGeeney developed a great reputation but I was pointing out that his actual results don't seem to back that up. So do Armagh supporters still think he is a great manager and the team is a disaster or when looking at his record does it make you think again about what should really have been expected from McGeeney?
As I said, in Down we have a poor team and a manager we expect little from. We expect relegation and are heading that way. So there is little of interest to discuss in comparing our expectations with our results.
First of all i don't believe KMcG has built up a reputation i believe that was done thru media & keyboard know it alls. What he has built up is a bond with his players who would run thru walls for the man and i don't recall any past players from Kildare or Armagh bad mouthing him so he seems to have the players on his side and for that he can possibly get average players over achieving/punching above their weight.
What happened Kildare the year or two after he left? had he average players in Kildare punching above their weight (I believe so), in fairness to him i don't think it has fallen into place for him yet with Armagh due to Cross(and rightly so), injuries and players just not available to him. He may not be the best tactician in Ireland (or we may be underestimating him...i dunno) but he'll certainly have them all pulling in the one direction which is a big help but one thing is he'll always have plenty of people happy to see him fail no matter where's he at ???
Quote from: PAULD123 on February 24, 2016, 08:13:54 AM
Quote from: DuffleKing on February 23, 2016, 01:03:29 PM
.....Just what we need. The Down village idiot posting on Armagh subject matter.
I didn't say one personally insulting thing about McGeeney and you have no justification for insulting me. I was careful to only present the facts. What part of that is idiocy? I would have expected some reasonably intelligent comment on the facts not just some small minded childish insult.
I'm referring to your well established reputation posting on Down issues. I'm simply rolling my eyes at the prospect of being subjected to your ramblings in an Armagh thread.
PaulD123's post about McGeeney's career with Kildare was both intelligent and fair. It doesn't deserve cheap digs. Unfortunately, some people are either unable or willing to separate the 2002 McGeeney, legendary leader & player as he was, from McGeeney, the manager in 2016. His playing career & the cult of personality that has grown up around the man, has blinded some people to his limitations as a game day tactician, strategist and decision maker. Helped in no small part by the media, who love an "interesting character" they can hang their hat on. (Paper never refuses ink, as they say.) The quality of the players he has available to him, is only one side of the coin imo.
Quote from: Beffs on February 24, 2016, 03:27:41 PM
PaulD123's post about McGeeney's career with Kildare was both intelligent and fair. It doesn't deserve cheap digs. Unfortunately, some people are either unable or willing to separate the 2002 McGeeney, legendary leader & player as he was, from McGeeney, the manager in 2016. His playing career & the cult of personality that has grown up around the man, has blinded some people to his limitations as a game day tactician, strategist and decision maker. Helped in no small part by the media, who love an "interesting character" they can hang their hat on. (Paper never refuses ink, as they say.) The quality of the players he has available to him, is only one side of the coin imo.
Well I'm glad u shared that great knowledge of KMcG with us...
Quote from: Beffs on February 24, 2016, 03:27:41 PM
PaulD123's post about McGeeney's career with Kildare was both intelligent and fair. It doesn't deserve cheap digs. Unfortunately, some people are either unable or willing to separate the 2002 McGeeney, legendary leader & player as he was, from McGeeney, the manager in 2016. His playing career & the cult of personality that has grown up around the man, has blinded some people to his limitations as a game day tactician, strategist and decision maker. Helped in no small part by the media, who love an "interesting character" they can hang their hat on. (Paper never refuses ink, as they say.) The quality of the players he has available to him, is only one side of the coin imo.
Spot on, the man put up facts and figures that were accurate and took time, he did not deserve the dogs for what he posted on fairness.
Quote from: illdecide on February 24, 2016, 06:16:46 PM
Quote from: Beffs on February 24, 2016, 03:27:41 PM
PaulD123's post about McGeeney's career with Kildare was both intelligent and fair. It doesn't deserve cheap digs. Unfortunately, some people are either unable or willing to separate the 2002 McGeeney, legendary leader & player as he was, from McGeeney, the manager in 2016. His playing career & the cult of personality that has grown up around the man, has blinded some people to his limitations as a game day tactician, strategist and decision maker. Helped in no small part by the media, who love an "interesting character" they can hang their hat on. (Paper never refuses ink, as they say.) The quality of the players he has available to him, is only one side of the coin imo.
Well I'm glad u shared that great knowledge of KMcG with us...
There are none so blind as those who refuse to see. 8)
DuffleKing still goes to bed in his Kieran McGeeney PJs, so don't burst his bubble that K is gonna lead Armagh to glory once again!! ;)
Nothing to do with the content of his post... It's just that I've read his previous posts.
Quote from: DuffleKing on February 24, 2016, 10:30:08 PM
Nothing to do with the content of his post... It's just that I've read his previous posts.
So in replying to someones post about a very specific subject, you ignore the contents of that post entirely & rely on the contents of other posts, that have nothing to do with what is being discussed?
And PaulD is the idiot here?
Okey dokey then ! ::)
when will the team be named?
Armagh 4/7 Draw 15/2 Fermanagh 7/4
Quote from: FermGael on February 26, 2016, 10:07:00 AM
Armagh 4/7 Draw 15/2 Fermanagh 7/4
If I wasn't from Armagh I would be taking those odds on Fermanagh.
I sincerely hope Armagh can get a result tomorrow night. McGeeney may not have the most talented squad but they are not as bad as results suggest. He did ok in Kildare with a panel that wasn't really much better. As a fan the big disappointment from me is the absence of more Cross players in the panel. They are the best team in the county by a country mile and whilst not all of them are up to county standard more than 2 are. At the end of the day McGeeney really owes Armagh nothing from his contribution as a player, as a manager he must stand or fall on results. The essence of good management is recognising your own shortcomings as a coach, tactician or trainer and bringing people with those skills in. I don't know the answer to these issues for Armagh but as a fan it is frustrating. One thing is for certain Mcgeeney will always give his all for Armagh.
Handicap betting is prob the way to go...Fermanagh were actually 2/1 last week so Bookies are cutting the odds, they were also +3pts on the Handicap and that has been cut to 2pts. TBH if i was setting the odds i'd have both teams at evens. Armagh are under big pressure to win this, they know a defeat and they're fecked so this could be a juicy match with plenty of bite in it.
Fermanagh were 11/4 with a bookmaker at the start of the week.
I decided that was value
Quote from: FermGael on February 26, 2016, 11:59:25 AM
Fermanagh were 11/4 with a bookmaker at the start of the week.
I decided that was value
Hey u...illdecide...lol.
QuoteAt the end of the day McGeeney really owes Armagh nothing from his contribution as a player, as a manager he must stand or fall on results. The essence of good management is recognising your own shortcomings as a coach, tactician or trainer and bringing people with those skills in. I don't know the answer to these issues for Armagh but as a fan it is frustrating. One thing is for certain Mcgeeney will always give his all for Armagh.
One thing is for certain, you aren't quite sure what you're saying!
Quote from: ck on February 21, 2016, 09:18:12 AM
To Armagh people.. Are yee loosing patience with McGeeney? Or is he untouchable?
Its a fair question. The reverence in which he is held in some quarters means it is appropriate to use the word "untouchable". But he is not untouchable in all quarters.
Quote from: tonto1888 on February 22, 2016, 07:57:44 AM
don't want to speak for everyone but yes, I am losing patience. I know we don't have the most talented squad in Ireland nut there is some talent there and it is not being utilised properly. Plus, the football we play is dire
This in an entirely fair response but it triggers nonsense like this
Quote from: illdecide on February 23, 2016, 09:25:18 AM
You men are some craic, the wind up merchants who come on here trying to get people to slag McGeeney off...some of you wouldn't know what to do with an O'Neills ball and then the Armagh men slagging him off too, do you really think we have the players to be competing at the top table because if you do then you're mad in the head. When Armagh get their strongest 15 out they'd be a match for most teams but we don't have the talent in the squad to compete without our best players and other counties do.
Who excatly is saying that we do have the players to compete at the top
Quote from: illdecide on February 23, 2016, 09:25:18 AM
McGeeney even when he was with Kildare was the man people loved to hate for some reason and was always under scrutiny and now he's back with Armagh it has followed him, no-one on here knows anything about the man or his ways so why give him a hard time not that he will give 2 f**ks what some di*k behind a keyboard is typing about him.
So what do you think McGeeney picks the right team, makes the correct game time changes, chooses the right tactics and prepares a team to actually implement those tactics? Is it worth watching? Is it the best we can do?
Personally I think we do not have the players to compete at the top table and would be destroyed in Division 1. We do however have the players to out perform both the results and the performances under McGeeney. The football is puke to watch. The natural abilities of many players are being wasted. Something within the system is not appealing to too many players who could make a big contribution to Armagh. The tactic book is outdated. We could be doing better.
What do you think?
Only one win in all competitions this year for Armagh. I cannot see that trend changing tomorrow.
Quote from: Orior on February 27, 2016, 12:32:51 AM
Only one win in all competitions this year for Armagh. I cannot see that trend changing tomorrow.
I have a feeling Armagh might nick the win.
Fermanagh have one change from the Meath game with Kane Conor replacing Ryan Hannah.
We have a very strong bench as well which is good to see.
I think we will do well around he middle as Eoin, IMO, has been one of the best midfielders in ulster over the last 3 years.
The small nature of the athletic grounds will suit our counter attacking style.
Hopefully McGenney makes the same mistake as last year and concentrates on Quigley which will free up he two Corrigans .
We have nothing to fear from this current Armagh team and I think we are good enough to take 2 points tonight
Despite Armagh being pathetic all year I actually fancy them to win. Gut feeling nothing else. On paper fermanagh should probably edge it. Armagh don't have a Quigley type player. No word on the team?
Quote from: general_lee on February 27, 2016, 09:28:06 AM
Despite Armagh being pathetic all year I actually fancy them to win. Gut feeling nothing else. On paper fermanagh should probably edge it. Armagh don't have a Quigley type player. No word on the team?
Team for programme same as last day out. There will be changes though. A number of fitness tests to be undertaken according to county forum admin.
Armagh had their chances against Laois, they'd need to take these opportunities against Fermanagh.
Good scuffle in the tunnel there.
Shite. Tackling outlawed? Refs are getting worse.
That is a frustrating game to watch (TV). Armagh are getting cleaned in MF. Findon is away to f**k, I had thought at one stage he was gonna fill McGrane's boots - not looking likely if the past year is anything to go by.
Armagh very fortunate to win. Looked as if they had never seem a smothering defense before. Soloed into the right corner and then got bottled up. Campbell's game-winner was terrific when it looked like a draw was on a cards, a draw that would have been almost as bad as a defeat.
Frustrating that.
We should have won that.
Great call from reilly in the first minute that cost us the game.
Exciting finish to a shite game. Armagh not working very well as a unit but some great individual performances, Campbell & Mckenna excellent up front, but I thought Andy Mallon and CV really drove Armagh on in the 2nd. Some dire individual performances too.
Our Break ball win percentage must be brutal, something we used to excel at.
Went to match, poor enough game, just 2 bad teams. But does anyone know where fermanagh get their arrogance from? Their fans are very hard to listen to, they continuously throwing 2004 at armagh fans around me! WTF like! Also between Quigley prowling around trying to intimidate players, to corrigan waving to the crowd when he scored his free which would only have got them a draw! Then no4 at the end decided to make a beeline for mckeever and stood throwing punches at him and mckeever stood and took it! Looking forward to putting manners in them!
Awful game
Thought Fermanagh very cynical in buying frees Armagh very naive
Draw would have been a fair result but it was done score to win it
Referees this year have been very mediocre
Best point of the game to win it. Armagh not great but deserved 2 points from the last game and this one, although both might have been draws.
Armagh really struggle against a packed defence though.
Armagh deserved the win, lost count of the times they should have had frees and didn't, ref was very poor. Step forth a Clans man to save the day, been a while since that happened.
Two very poor teams producing a very poor game refereed very poorly by a very poor referee.Last year's encounters between these two in Division 3 had more quality.
Home now and have to say I am a bit disappointed with that result
The game was there to be won in the last 20 but we made some very poor decisions which cost us the 2 points.
Giving Armagh a 5 point lead was also a poor idea.
We just didn't start in the first 20 minutes although Armagh first point from a free for picking up the ball from he ground has to be one of the worst decisions by a referee I can ever remember.
Armagh can have no complaints about the 2 black cards given either.
After that first 20 minutes we totally dominated the midfield. Armagh were very poor in this sector and Eoin Donnelly really dominated the Fermanagh and Armagh kickouts.
Quigley played deeper and did a lot of selfless work leaving space for the two corrigans. Aidan Breen also played very well at whb and kicked a nice few points.
When we moved the ball quickly and at pace we were hard to stop.
The Armagh tacking was very poor throughout the game and Fermanagh were very niave for Armaghs winner but it was a fine score.
Massive game for us next week against Laois at home and very much 2 points dropped.
Referee was that bad I doubt even Fr Brian D'Arcy would officiate at his funeral😂
Very disappointed with Armagh. McGeeny's tactics were to play the simple ball, which meant sideways. I thought it was gonna be another one of those nights when we missed a simple free after about 10 mins or so.
Kick-outs were just too slow. And when the ball did come out the Fermanagh number 8 lorded the midfield - surely we must have someone in the county who can actually catch the ball and run for 70 minutes?
Tony Kernan must have had a rush of blood to the head - after loosing the ball he stuck out his foot in frustration.
On the bright side, Andy Mallon, Mark Shields, Charlie Vernon and obviously Soupy Campbell were all good.
Despite all the other Armagh men around me I thought that the referee did well considering all that was happening. For example there was no need for McKeever to get involved after the final whistle.
Fermgael it was a lift ball for armaghs first free
It was right in front of me
I checked the TV replay.
It wasn't. Clearly bounced
I also thought eoin donnelly was fouled when he was disposed for the Armagh goal but wasn't sure.
He had his arm pulled back me.
Reilly gifted Armagh 1-1
I agree about Mckeever .
Had no business getting involved.
Quote from: T Fearon on February 27, 2016, 10:45:49 PM
Referee was that bad I doubt even Fr Brian D'Arcy would officiate at his funeral😂
Probably a 'close friend'
I thought the game was won on the sidelines. The right man making the judgement call.
McGeeney for me now has the foundation to push on for trophies.
Fermgael I will have to disagree with you on the 2 black cards. The Tony Kernan one was I assume given for a trip. From my view he lost the ball and then tried to kick it tripping Quigley in the process. I am not convinced it was a deliberate trip which it needs to be to be black. In the end only Kernan knows the answer to that. From what I saw on the second black card the Fermanagh no. 4 and Watters were at the usual macho crap and as the Fermanagh player ran Watters pulled him back. Cynical? Quite probably. However, it did not use a deliberate pull down motion nor did I see a deliberate body collide. For me it was a yellow card going by the rules as they stand.
On the other hand I do not know how Forker did not get booked in the second half for what looked like black card offences. Quigley was also lucky not to see red red for striking just before half time.
I would also agree with Quigley's tweet after the game. Considering what the Grugan family are going through at the minute the football is really put into perspective.
None of the new players are making any impression for Armagh.
Reflecting on the match I thought how I feel Cormac Reilly is normally one of the better referees. However, media coverage of the match will probably highlight 'unsavoury incidents' that took place. Now neither team can feel proud of their part but personally I feel that Reilly needs to explain to players before the game how he is going to referee the blanket tackle. There were numerous incidents last night were he gave decisions one way and then when a similar incident happened shortly after he gave it another way. This led to frustration among the players and more confrontation. I know at this time of the year the heavy pitches lead to more such incidents but it is unsightly. Blowing the whistle a bit earlier might calm things down a bit.
Did some of the Armagh players change their studs at half time?
I thought we deserved the points, I was warned before I got there the the standard of refereeing was atrocious and that was proven correct, he was worth about four points to Fermanagh and took plenty of stick for being brutal.
Charlie Vernon was immense in the second half, I would have preferred to have him play further up the park but himself and Campbell were the pick of the bunch.
Findon was awful, lazy as sin and should have been yanked 20 minutes in.
I was shocked that neither side used the width of the park much, everything was tight and Fermanagh have a tendency to throw the ball not fist it, strange.
Quote from: FermGael on February 27, 2016, 11:05:29 PM
I agree about Mckeever .
Had no business getting involved.
It'll say that on his gravestone.
All McKeever done was hit the Fermanagh number 4's fist with his face.
Anyway, vital win and with the division being so tight now, it's all to play for.
Quote from: jp2020 on February 27, 2016, 09:35:47 PM
to corrigan waving to the crowd when he scored his free which would only have got them a draw!
He's probably too young to remember Mark Gallagher giving it some back in 93, but it was the first thing I thought of when he did it!
Poor game in terms of quality but plenty of excitement especially towards the end.
We have huge problems and it seems obvious to me that McGeeney is front an centre of these problems. Last year was pure shite and there was a need to to get the ball forward more quickly. This revelation to McHeeney has only served to reveal a new fact - he hasn't the first clue of how to go about an attack strategy.
Fermanagh predictably played with a packed defense. Packed enough to deter Armagh from hitting anything forward early. This cannot have been a surprise to Armagh so whatever played out was going to be whatever we see as our best chance of unpicking this basic defensive set up. Our plan was to turn side ways, fanny about, allow Fermanagh to get even more back and the look up to find a pass and attempt to hit 30 seconds after we had declined to hit it in more favourable conditions. When has this tactic ever worked?
Serious question. The thing any set of fans cannot tolerate is players not trying. Well can someone explain why management persisting with tactics that don't not work, and will not beat anybody decent is any better than players not giving their all??
We get all this guff about McGeeney is a born leader and will get players "running through walls". Its absolute drivel. The reality is he is getting the basics wrong. Findon is a big lad and has the ability to win primary ball in midfield. But the only clean catch he won in the entire game was a hop ball and he threw that down resulting in a free against (maybe he thinks he is Devon Toner). The reason for this this is that he continues to try to break ball instead of trying to win it clean. Armagh's return from breaking ball was close to zero. Yet we kept kicking it at him (no short kick out even though Fermanagh dropped off on numerous occasions), he kept trying to break it and we kept losing it out. The side line are not generating variation, are not getting Findon to make the obvious change and then substitute Findon's midfield partner (who was one of out better performers).
Its very clear where are playing limitations should leave us but its equally clear that we are not performing at that level. We have yet to play a decent side this year in the league. 6 points was achievable. I accept that there are tougher tasks ahead
As a fermanagh man one of the things I noticed was how quick the Armagh crowd were to get on their teams back even when they were well in control in the first 20 minutes.
Quote from: FermGael on February 28, 2016, 10:08:07 PM
As a fermanagh man one of the things I noticed was how quick the Armagh crowd were to get on their teams back even when they were well in control in the first 20 minutes.
Any wonder?
Honestly don't think it is directed at the players. There is one or two there that most would not think are at the required level or the best available but that aside the frustration is with the tactics not the players. Last night was a case in point in that the player's dug in and the crowd were with them to the end but its hard to watch some of the stuff we are at
Think the fans are being hard on McGeeney.
He is working with a limited panel imo that is not a patch on the Armagh team of 10 years ago.
You talk about your midfielder but imo if he went to compete for clean ball with Fermanaghs Eoin Donnelly he wouldn't have a chance. He's one of the best in ulster
Armagh were patient at times and it worked especially in the first 20 minutes.
When they kicked aimless ball they were turned over with ease.
If you have watched the game back the majority of Armagh scores came when they were patient, kept the ball and worked it around until they got an opening.
The winner came from that
Could Andrew Murnin not do a job in midfield for Armagh?
Quote from: Orior on February 28, 2016, 11:47:00 PM
Could Andrew Murnin not do a job in midfield for Armagh?
would he not be a bit small for midfield?
Quote from: Over the Bar on February 26, 2016, 07:58:26 PM
QuoteAt the end of the day McGeeney really owes Armagh nothing from his contribution as a player, as a manager he must stand or fall on results. The essence of good management is recognising your own shortcomings as a coach, tactician or trainer and bringing people with those skills in. I don't know the answer to these issues for Armagh but as a fan it is frustrating. One thing is for certain Mcgeeney will always give his all for Armagh.
One thing is for certain, you aren't quite sure what you're saying!
What I'm saying is whilst McGeeney owes us nothing he still has to be held responsible for results, he needs to recognise his own strengths and weaknesses and address the weakness through his back room team. When it comes to management past glory's count for nothing. Having said that he is doing his best and should not have to take some of the stick being handed out.
Quote from: Throw ball on February 28, 2016, 09:59:22 AM
Reflecting on the match I thought how I feel Cormac Reilly is normally one of the better referees. However, media coverage of the match will probably highlight 'unsavoury incidents' that took place. Now neither team can feel proud of their part but personally I feel that Reilly needs to explain to players before the game how he is going to referee the blanket tackle. There were numerous incidents last night were he gave decisions one way and then when a similar incident happened shortly after he gave it another way. This led to frustration among the players and more confrontation. I know at this time of the year the heavy pitches lead to more such incidents but it is unsightly. Blowing the whistle a bit earlier might calm things down a bit.
You've summed it up perfectly he was very inconsistent.
Quote from: tonto1888 on February 29, 2016, 07:19:21 AM
Quote from: Orior on February 28, 2016, 11:47:00 PM
Could Andrew Murnin not do a job in midfield for Armagh?
would he not be a bit small for midfield?
he's too injury prone
Quote from: smelmoth on February 28, 2016, 10:01:54 PM
. Findon is a big lad and has the ability to win primary ball in midfield. But the only clean catch he won in the entire game was a hop ball and he threw that down resulting in a free against (maybe he thinks he is Devon Toner). The reason for this this is that he continues to try to break ball instead of trying to win it clean.
Findon has never, ever been regarded as someone who can win his own primary ball. Maybe because he's a big lad you have thought that, but at no stage has he ever been regarded as someone who is well equipped to do it.
Right on break ball though, we have been getting hammered on that front for years now.
Eh?? That is some ridiculous statement to make. He didn't become an IC Midfielder at 19/20 yrs of age because he was a good spoiler, he's more than capable of winning his own ball.
Are Morgan and Kernan the only Cross players to have joined the panel?
Quote from: Il Bomber Destro on February 29, 2016, 09:23:05 PM
Are Morgan and Kernan the only Cross players to have joined the panel?
For now anyway. A couple are with under 21s and could join later.
Quote from: FermGael on February 28, 2016, 10:28:28 PM
Think the fans are being hard on McGeeney.
He is working with a limited panel imo that is not a patch on the Armagh team of 10 years ago.
The panel is limited but in judging McGeeney nobody is comparing results/performances with those of 10-15 years ago. By the same token the fact that the players are not as good as that era is no defence to current performances.
Quote from: FermGael on February 28, 2016, 10:28:28 PM
You talk about your midfielder but imo if he went to compete for clean ball with Fermanaghs Eoin Donnelly he wouldn't have a chance. He's one of the best in ulster
I agree re Donnelly but the issue with Findon predates the latest game
Quote from: FermGael on February 28, 2016, 10:28:28 PM
Armagh were patient at times and it worked especially in the first 20 minutes.
When they kicked aimless ball they were turned over with ease.
If you have watched the game back the majority of Armagh scores came when they were patient, kept the ball and worked it around until they got an opening.
The winner came from that
By all means be patient when you have possession in the scoring area but can't get a quality shot away,
But patience is less of a virtue if you are fannying around in your defensive half while fermanagh are filtering even more men back
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 29, 2016, 10:25:35 AM
Having said that he is doing his best and should not have to take some of the stick being handed out.
What stick is being handed out and why is it unfair?
Quote from: onefaircounty on February 29, 2016, 07:07:07 PM
Quote from: smelmoth on February 28, 2016, 10:01:54 PM
. Findon is a big lad and has the ability to win primary ball in midfield. But the only clean catch he won in the entire game was a hop ball and he threw that down resulting in a free against (maybe he thinks he is Devon Toner). The reason for this this is that he continues to try to break ball instead of trying to win it clean.
Findon has never, ever been regarded as someone who can win his own primary ball. Maybe because he's a big lad you have thought that, but at no stage has he ever been regarded as someone who is well equipped to do it.
Right on break ball though, we have been getting hammered on that front for years now.
Roll the clock back 20 months and he was winning his fair share of ball
The question is how we have declined so rapidly since an All Ireland Quarter Final appearance a mere 18 months ago? Too many players retired too soon,could they not have been persuaded to stay on.
Quote from: T Fearon on February 29, 2016, 11:06:51 PM
The question is how we have declined so rapidly since an All Ireland Quarter Final appearance a mere 18 months ago? Too many players retired too soon,could they not have been persuaded to stay on.
We played nobody of note in 2014. People expected too much since. Mid table/struggling in div 2 is our level now. That's the reality.
Quote from: bennydorano on February 29, 2016, 08:49:38 PM
Eh?? That is some ridiculous statement to make. He didn't become an IC Midfielder at 19/20 yrs of age because he was a good spoiler, he's more than capable of winning his own ball.
He has never been regarded as a top fielder, and that is because he has never been a top fielder.
His best season came in 2014 when he dove-tailed with someone who was a good fielder, Stephen Harold.
Findon has great qualities. He can win secondary ball, his strong as an ox, speedy, direct, and can chip in with scores.
Fielding isn't, nor has it ever, been viewed as one of his strong points.
Armagh were far the better team in the opening twenty minutes when there was parity of possession around the middle but Fermanagh (Donnelly fetching and the rest with breaks) took over from there and Armagh struggled to maintain the attacking threat. Seems a pretty simple equation - they have to win more ball. Not sure how easy that's going to be at the weekend with Cavan's big men.
Quote from: smelmoth on February 29, 2016, 10:22:34 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 29, 2016, 10:25:35 AM
Having said that he is doing his best and should not have to take some of the stick being handed out.
What stick is being handed out and why is it unfair?
Plenty on his ability, their style of play etc...
Quote from: onefaircounty on March 01, 2016, 09:44:06 AM
Quote from: bennydorano on February 29, 2016, 08:49:38 PM
Eh?? That is some ridiculous statement to make. He didn't become an IC Midfielder at 19/20 yrs of age because he was a good spoiler, he's more than capable of winning his own ball.
He has never been regarded as a top fielder, and that is because he has never been a top fielder.
His best season came in 2014 when he dove-tailed with someone who was a good fielder, Stephen Harold.
Findon has great qualities. He can win secondary ball, his strong as an ox, speedy, direct, and can chip in with scores.
Fielding isn't, nor has it ever, been viewed as one of his strong points.
Nonsense. You're trying to palm off personal opinion as fact - unless you can produce some actual stats or evidence to back up your claims?
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 01, 2016, 11:40:20 AM
Quote from: smelmoth on February 29, 2016, 10:22:34 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 29, 2016, 10:25:35 AM
Having said that he is doing his best and should not have to take some of the stick being handed out.
What stick is being handed out and why is it unfair?
Plenty on his ability, their style of play etc...
elaborate - is his ability beyond question and the style of play beyond reproach?
Or is it just a case that fans should not express their dissatisfaction?
Benny in the 2014 Championship we drew with Monaghan,beat Cavan,Meath,Tyrone,Roscommon and ran Donegal to a point.
Quote from: T Fearon on March 01, 2016, 09:59:07 PM
Benny in the 2014 Championship we drew with Monaghan,beat Cavan,Meath,Tyrone,Roscommon and ran Donegal to a point.
We lost Monaghan replay heavily. Performed well against a team who had one eye on Dublin. Other 4 teams were no big shakes.
A handy qualifier route can mask a lot of weaknesses.
Armagh and Fermanagh have been hit with €5,000 fines following last weekend's National League meeting which saw a bust-up in the tunnel at half-time.
The Belfast Telegraph reports that both counties are considering their option after being handed down the fines by the Central Competitions Control Committee.
The punishments will also see Fermanagh without star forward Sean Quigley for Sunday's league clash with Laois in Enniskillen after the Roslea man was given a one-game suspension for an offence which occurred during play
Quigley got a one match ban for turning off a light switch ??? ??? ???
Switching a light off in a tunnel full of 30+ players wrestling is serious enough in fairness.
Serious enough to warrant a one match ban?
Anyway sure he turned it back on again as well
He was also caught punching Aaron Findon on camera and went down the tunnel before the Armagh team arguing with Geezer when he was to wait until after they went in so I'd say they wanted to nail him on something.
But according to the Irish news he was given the ban for putting the light off.
I could understand a match ban for the punch but for the light switch.
Surely if we had went to the DRA it would have been thrown out
Don't believe all you read in the Irish News.....we have past experience of that! >:(
I see the Irish News have issued an apology in today's paper saying that Quigley was not suspended for switching a light off as previously reported. No surprise there then!
He was suspended for punching Aaron Findon and cited after use of video analysis.
Quote from: mackers on March 10, 2016, 10:59:24 AM
I see the Irish News have issued an apology in today's paper saying that Quigley was not suspended for switching a light off as previously reported. No surprise there then!
He was suspended for punching Aaron Findon and cited after use of video analysis.
Perhaps he wanted to put Aaron Findon's lights out.