I suppose a lot of people would have predicted this fixture at the start of the year and by all accounts Galway threw it away in the dying minutes.
Tyrone have made it 12 out of 12 wins in 2012 and will 13 be unlucky?
Will Geezer finally get a win over Mickey Harte or will it be the same story for the Red hands against the Lily Whites?
I must say I'm looking forward to it. I wonder who will be in the other game, the Div 1 final?
The Kildare lads are off to Portugal on the beer the week before this, it will only be a blow-out for them, Tyrone to win handy enough.
I predict that following a decade of harte-break geezer will finally overcome his nemisis.
Quote from: Rossfan on April 08, 2012, 09:53:38 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on April 08, 2012, 07:53:55 PM
Galway through it away
Oh dear :'(
:D threw perhaps.....................ala big joe threw it over the line
Quote from: Dinny Breen on April 08, 2012, 09:28:17 PM
The Kildare lads are off to Portugal on the beer the week before this, it will only be a blow-out for them, Tyrone to win handy enough.
Go way outta that..........................not a drop of the poison will touch their lips, geezer has them brain washed in the right way ;)
Make sure ye have the sunblock, few lads off that panel of yours need lashings of it across the oul scalp, and tell johnny doyle not to be crying if someone knocks over his sand castle ;)
In my (drunken) eyes Kildare outplayed for the large part of the 1st league game and looked the better team. Now obviously both teams are a lot fitter and further on with their progress for the year so it will be interesting to see.
It's the only game I've saw off Tyrone this year but I was pleased to read in the Monaghan game that they were able to beat the Monaghan sweeper tactics. That was my major concern last year v the Dubs that we went man to man and paid for it.
Kildare couldn't beat Galway, FFS.
Tyrone have to be favourites.
Will RTE/TnaG show Tyrone actually playing. Now I know we are 'only' a division 2 team not worthy of much air time but us poor wee Tyrone supporters could feel victimised when Meath and Louth Meath and Derry ( I think) and to a lesser extent Kildare v Galway were shown ahead of Tyrone. And this is only highlights on the League Show.
Someone will correct me, I am not sure whether Setanta Sports hadany Tyrone games on their schedule as I don't subscribe to them. Would it have been too much for Tyrone to have got a minute or two of air time or is this a north/south thing. Was it the thought of diving, handbags or puke football that put 'the powers that be' off showing Tyrone.
Anyhow Tyrone have continued to improve and learn from last year, its just a pity that they have not had sterner tests, although they can only play what is in front of them. The second Sunday in June will be a proper test and I look forward to it.
I wonder is the Cavanman going to Portugal?
We were on for the first NFL game on Sebanta v Kildare and again against WestMeade
http://www.setanta.com/ie/Articles/2012/01/25/Setanta-launch-GAA-coverage/gnid-127725/ (http://www.setanta.com/ie/Articles/2012/01/25/Setanta-launch-GAA-coverage/gnid-127725/)
Sure after the debacles the last few years about using video evidence from matches to punish those teams that are on TV more, I for one am happy to take a back seat. Not like me for sure
Armagh will happy retire now for a few months out of the limelight in the long grass with their orange camoflage.
(http://www.tabletwallpapers.net/thumbs/tiger_in_the_long_grass-t2.jpg)
Quote from: ballymac on April 10, 2012, 02:22:52 PM
Someone will correct me, I am not sure whether Setanta Sports hadany Tyrone games on their schedule as I don't subscribe to them.
Setanta showed three live division 2 games and Tyrone featured in two of them...put the chip down now lad :)
Quote from: ballymac on April 10, 2012, 02:22:52 PM
Will RTE/TnaG show Tyrone actually playing. Now I know we are 'only' a division 2 team not worthy of much air time but us poor wee Tyrone supporters could feel victimised when Meath and Louth Meath and Derry ( I think) and to a lesser extent Kildare v Galway were shown ahead of Tyrone. And this is only highlights on the League Show.
Someone will correct me, I am not sure whether Setanta Sports hadany Tyrone games on their schedule as I don't subscribe to them. Would it have been too much for Tyrone to have got a minute or two of air time or is this a north/south thing. Was it the thought of diving, handbags or puke football that put 'the powers that be' off showing Tyrone.
Anyhow Tyrone have continued to improve and learn from last year, its just a pity that they have not had sterner tests, although they can only play what is in front of them. The second Sunday in June will be a proper test and I look forward to it.
Unless your out of the country you could maybe try going to a game?
Quote from: sheamy on April 10, 2012, 04:03:46 PM
Quote from: ballymac on April 10, 2012, 02:22:52 PM
Someone will correct me, I am not sure whether Setanta Sports hadany Tyrone games on their schedule as I don't subscribe to them.
Setanta showed three live division 2 games and Tyrone featured in two of them...put the chip down now lad :)
A good return from 8 rounds of matches, plenty of teams got less air time.
I was talking about RTE/TnaG not showing Tyrone. Setanta are trying their best to sell their product and showed Tyrone who were worth watching and would in hteir opinion attract a viewing audience, why did Rte/tnag not?
I have been to all the games that I could make. And if I put the chip down if would leave me unbalanced as I have one on the other shoulder :P
Kyle Coney a major doubt after a groin injury during today's game between Ardboe and Greencastle.
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on April 15, 2012, 10:25:25 PM
Kyle Coney a major doubt after a groin injury during today's game between Ardboe and Greencastle.
Heard there were a few knocks today regarding county players. Derrytresk didn't play so that's always an option.
Well f**k it anyway!...
Coney Out For The Rest Of The Season?
In a week when it was confirmed that up and coming star forward Ronan O'Neill would undergo surgery for his cruciate ligament injury next Tuesday the news on the injury front for Tyrone does not get any better. Kyle Coney who has been the star attacker for the O'Neill County during this year's National League campaign has effectively been ruled out for the remainder of the season. The Ardboe Ace suffered a serious groin injury in the second half of his club's opening league fixture on Sunday last against Greencastle. Coney appeared to hurt himself quite badly when hitting a free kick off the ground and had to be helped from the field in considerable pain.
An MRI scan on Tuesday revealed a very nasty injury which will require surgery as soon as possible and will mean the All Ireland minor winner with The Red Hands in 2008 will play no further part this season for his club or county. Coney had been in outstanding form with Tyrone throughout the league and had formed quite a partnership with Owen Mulligan and team captain Stephen O'Neill. He was expected to figure prominently in Mickey Harte's Championship side but will now, along with Ronan O'Neill, have to content himself with coming to terms with his injury and getting fully fit for the start of the 2013 season.
http://www.teamtalkmag.com/archives/14450
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on April 18, 2012, 10:50:15 PM
Well f**k it anyway!...
Coney Out For The Rest Of The Season?
In a week when it was confirmed that up and coming star forward Ronan O'Neill would undergo surgery for his cruciate ligament injury next Tuesday the news on the injury front for Tyrone does not get any better. Kyle Coney who has been the star attacker for the O'Neill County during this year's National League campaign has effectively been ruled out for the remainder of the season. The Ardboe Ace suffered a serious groin injury in the second half of his club's opening league fixture on Sunday last against Greencastle. Coney appeared to hurt himself quite badly when hitting a free kick off the ground and had to be helped from the field in considerable pain.
An MRI scan on Tuesday revealed a very nasty injury which will require surgery as soon as possible and will mean the All Ireland minor winner with The Red Hands in 2008 will play no further part this season for his club or county. Coney had been in outstanding form with Tyrone throughout the league and had formed quite a partnership with Owen Mulligan and team captain Stephen O'Neill. He was expected to figure prominently in Mickey Harte's Championship side but will now, along with Ronan O'Neill, have to content himself with coming to terms with his injury and getting fully fit for the start of the 2013 season.
http://www.teamtalkmag.com/archives/14450
F*ck that is right. After waiting patiently for his chance Kyle really was showing his full potential this year. What a kick in the balls for the lad and Tyrone. Best of luck in the recovery.
Quote from: omagh_gael on April 18, 2012, 11:00:13 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on April 18, 2012, 10:50:15 PM
Well f**k it anyway!...
Coney Out For The Rest Of The Season?
In a week when it was confirmed that up and coming star forward Ronan O'Neill would undergo surgery for his cruciate ligament injury next Tuesday the news on the injury front for Tyrone does not get any better. Kyle Coney who has been the star attacker for the O'Neill County during this year's National League campaign has effectively been ruled out for the remainder of the season. The Ardboe Ace suffered a serious groin injury in the second half of his club's opening league fixture on Sunday last against Greencastle. Coney appeared to hurt himself quite badly when hitting a free kick off the ground and had to be helped from the field in considerable pain.
An MRI scan on Tuesday revealed a very nasty injury which will require surgery as soon as possible and will mean the All Ireland minor winner with The Red Hands in 2008 will play no further part this season for his club or county. Coney had been in outstanding form with Tyrone throughout the league and had formed quite a partnership with Owen Mulligan and team captain Stephen O'Neill. He was expected to figure prominently in Mickey Harte's Championship side but will now, along with Ronan O'Neill, have to content himself with coming to terms with his injury and getting fully fit for the start of the 2013 season.
http://www.teamtalkmag.com/archives/14450
F*ck that is right. After waiting patiently for his chance Kyle really was showing his full potential this year. What a kick in the balls for the lad and Tyrone. Best of luck in the recovery.
Pity as he was starting to show well. Massive loss to ardboe.
I read somewhere the other day that Coney was expected back for the championship.
Tyrone might be able to cope without Kyle but he will be a massive loss for Ardboe.It's a real pity for the lad as he was in great form.Hopefully he will make a full recovery and be back playing in the not to distant future.
Ahh bugger that anyway. I was really looking forward to a summer seeing how good young Coney can really be. He sounds a real confidence type player to me and with the run of matches he's got lately he really seemed to be reaping the rewards of that.
Is it a tear in his groin?
I'm surprised that he'd be out for the whole year
There always seems to be something like this every few years where the clubs hope to get their players for a few games before championship starts and then a few get injured.
I hope to God SoN can stay fit for the summer.
Cassidy is another one that seems to never be fit to field to games in a row.
I hope the team that has stood by the ethos of the GAA wins this one.
Yes that is Tyrone.
Are the kildare buckos in portugal as we speak?
Quote from: squire_in_navy_slacks on April 20, 2012, 09:48:54 AM
Are the kildare buckos in portugal as we speak?
Yea not due back till next week.
What's the feeling in Kildare lads about the final?
Will it be yer springboard into a winning run to win Leinster or are ye not too hopeful?
I wonder will Geezer continue to mess about with Johnny Doyle moving him around.
I know he did well for ye in MF but he's always yer top scorer and to me should always be in around the square or at least on the 40.
Will be interesting to see how Harte lines out his charges this time?
Will Gormley, Ricey & Joey continue to be "rested"
Ricey started the last match in Omagh and Conor Gormley has featured a few times during the league.
Mickey will be attending a North Tyrone Club Tyrone event next Wednesday in Strabane so we should get a few tips from him there (Pascal McConnell, Stevie and Johnny Lafferty should also be there).
Any North Tyronies on here are welcome to come, just let me know if interested. Fuzzman, if you know anyone around your parts who'd be interested in a Club Tyrone night, please pass on details. We've contacted a few of them.
Quote from: Fuzzman on April 20, 2012, 02:48:57 PM
What's the feeling in Kildare lads about the final?
Will it be yer springboard into a winning run to win Leinster or are ye not too hopeful?
I wonder will Geezer continue to mess about with Johnny Doyle moving him around.
I know he did well for ye in MF but he's always yer top scorer and to me should always be in around the square or at least on the 40.
Will be interesting to see how Harte lines out his charges this time?
Will Gormley, Ricey & Joey continue to be "rested"
Wouldn't be at all hopeful. We were abysmal in the second half in Salthill apart from the last five minutes when Dermot Earley and Emmet Bolton somehow managed to pull it out of the fire for us. Nice to get a dry run in Croke Park before the Leinster Championship but it's no more than a glorified challenge match really.
Quote from: Donnellys Hollow on April 20, 2012, 04:06:03 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on April 20, 2012, 02:48:57 PM
What's the feeling in Kildare lads about the final?
Will it be yer springboard into a winning run to win Leinster or are ye not too hopeful?
I wonder will Geezer continue to mess about with Johnny Doyle moving him around.
I know he did well for ye in MF but he's always yer top scorer and to me should always be in around the square or at least on the 40.
Will be interesting to see how Harte lines out his charges this time?
Will Gormley, Ricey & Joey continue to be "rested"
Wouldn't be at all hopeful. We were abysmal in the second half in Salthill apart from the last five minutes when Dermot Earley and Emmet Bolton somehow managed to pull it out of the fire for us. Nice to get a dry run in Croke Park before the Leinster Championship but it's no more than a glorified challenge match really.
Very little interest in this game if we're honest, promotion was the target and that has been achieved, €25 a ticket as well is not impressing people and nobody really wants to see Cork hammer Mayo.
Midfield is an issue so expect to see JD there, the Portugal break will probably mean the team will be up for it, more so than Tyrone so a Kildare win wouldn't surprise me but wouldn't excite me either.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on April 20, 2012, 05:00:06 PM
Quote from: Donnellys Hollow on April 20, 2012, 04:06:03 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on April 20, 2012, 02:48:57 PM
What's the feeling in Kildare lads about the final?
Will it be yer springboard into a winning run to win Leinster or are ye not too hopeful?
I wonder will Geezer continue to mess about with Johnny Doyle moving him around.
I know he did well for ye in MF but he's always yer top scorer and to me should always be in around the square or at least on the 40.
Will be interesting to see how Harte lines out his charges this time?
Will Gormley, Ricey & Joey continue to be "rested"
Wouldn't be at all hopeful. We were abysmal in the second half in Salthill apart from the last five minutes when Dermot Earley and Emmet Bolton somehow managed to pull it out of the fire for us. Nice to get a dry run in Croke Park before the Leinster Championship but it's no more than a glorified challenge match really.
Very little interest in this game if we're honest, promotion was the target and that has been achieved, €25 a ticket as well is not impressing people and nobody really wants to see Cork hammer Mayo.
Midfield is an issue so expect to see JD there, the Portugal break will probably mean the team will be up for it, more so than Tyrone so a Kildare win wouldn't surprise me but wouldn't excite me either.
This game is ideal for giving Dermot a run out in the middle of the field against a good team and seeing how he goes. Foley is needed at full-back so hopefully Flynn will be back to full fitness which he clearly wasn't at when he came on against Galway. Johnny has really got motoring on the wing in the past two months so it would be a shame to move him back. I wouldn't be a huge fan of Paudie out there either. Hughie Lynch can't be too far away from a comeback but it's strange that both Chalky and Rob Kelly seem to have fallen down the pecking order. Either of those two would have been worth a try alongside Flynn during the league.
I've given up second guessing McGeeney, can only assume Dermot is be gradually introduced so might get the second half against Tyrone. Flynn if fit is a certainty, like you don't like to see JD or O'Neill there and I'd add Foley and Sweeney to that list. Is Lynch fit yet? Crying out for Feeley!!
As for Rob Kelly and Gary White, is it a sign of our strength in dept or that they just lack form?
I know Rob had a few niggling injuries but he was togged out in the last few games of the league and didn't see any action from the bench. I find it amazing that Chalky has never managed to nail down a position on the team considering how good he was as an u21 but he'll only be 25 this summer so he still has time on his side. It really is impossible to predict McGeeney and he really does come out with some selections from left-field (like the introduction of Eoin Doyle the other day which no one saw coming). Some have worked brilliantly while others have gone the other way.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on April 20, 2012, 05:13:30 PM
Is Lynch fit yet?
He was back in full contact training around the same time as Dermot but I heard that he picked up another small injury unconnected to the knee. He could feature at some stage against Tyrone or in the upcoming challenge matches.
Rob Kelly did well at midfield against Donegal last year. Chalky is good but to say hes prone to the occasional lapse in concentration is putting it mildly. Feely would be a good option at half forward but hes not available this year.
Will head to Croker extra early for this cracker!! Bloody hell the 2 best teams in the land. Tyrone unbeaten and Kildare are Kildare!! Can't wait. It'll be better than the 2nd game I'd say.
Does anybody actually know if Coney is out for 6 weeks or 6 months?
Quote from: Dinny Breen on April 20, 2012, 05:00:06 PM
Quote from: Donnellys Hollow on April 20, 2012, 04:06:03 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on April 20, 2012, 02:48:57 PM
What's the feeling in Kildare lads about the final?
Will it be yer springboard into a winning run to win Leinster or are ye not too hopeful?
I wonder will Geezer continue to mess about with Johnny Doyle moving him around.
I know he did well for ye in MF but he's always yer top scorer and to me should always be in around the square or at least on the 40.
Will be interesting to see how Harte lines out his charges this time?
Will Gormley, Ricey & Joey continue to be "rested"
Wouldn't be at all hopeful. We were abysmal in the second half in Salthill apart from the last five minutes when Dermot Earley and Emmet Bolton somehow managed to pull it out of the fire for us. Nice to get a dry run in Croke Park before the Leinster Championship but it's no more than a glorified challenge match really.
Very little interest in this game if we're honest, promotion was the target and that has been achieved, €25 a ticket as well is not impressing people and nobody really wants to see Cork hammer Mayo.
Midfield is an issue so expect to see JD there, the Portugal break will probably mean the team will be up for it, more so than Tyrone so a Kildare win wouldn't surprise me but wouldn't excite me either.
We'll try not to ruin your day!
Quote from: Tubberman on April 24, 2012, 09:34:33 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on April 20, 2012, 05:00:06 PM
Quote from: Donnellys Hollow on April 20, 2012, 04:06:03 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on April 20, 2012, 02:48:57 PM
What's the feeling in Kildare lads about the final?
Will it be yer springboard into a winning run to win Leinster or are ye not too hopeful?
I wonder will Geezer continue to mess about with Johnny Doyle moving him around.
I know he did well for ye in MF but he's always yer top scorer and to me should always be in around the square or at least on the 40.
Will be interesting to see how Harte lines out his charges this time?
Will Gormley, Ricey & Joey continue to be "rested"
Wouldn't be at all hopeful. We were abysmal in the second half in Salthill apart from the last five minutes when Dermot Earley and Emmet Bolton somehow managed to pull it out of the fire for us. Nice to get a dry run in Croke Park before the Leinster Championship but it's no more than a glorified challenge match really.
Very little interest in this game if we're honest, promotion was the target and that has been achieved, €25 a ticket as well is not impressing people and nobody really wants to see Cork hammer Mayo.
Midfield is an issue so expect to see JD there, the Portugal break will probably mean the team will be up for it, more so than Tyrone so a Kildare win wouldn't surprise me but wouldn't excite me either.
We'll try not to ruin your day!
:)
4 days to get a bite...
We've all gone very quiet lads the last year or so.
You'd imagine they'd be a bit of excitement that we're in a national league final, even if it only is Div 2.
Are there many of ye coming down for the game?
I hope we're not becoming too complacent and thinking ah sure we'll probably get loads of trips down to Dublin later in the year.
I see Stevie and Cassidy got sent off at the weekend. What is the rule again? Does it not apply to county games any more if you get sent off in a club game?
Besides Coney, does Mickey have a full panel to pick from?
You'd imagine he'd pick the team that he'd like to start v Armagh if all fit by then
If it was me picking I'd go for
Packie
Conor
Justin
PJ Quinn
McCarron
Joey (could swap to Petey on and off as usual)
Ricey
Colm Cav
Cassidy
Sean Cav
Peter Harte
Peter Mark Donnelly
Penrose (is he injured?) Then Mattie Donnelly
SoNeill
Mulligan
That leaves
Carlin, McCaul, McCrory as 1st choice defenders to get a call in
Murphy & Mckenna back up midfielders with Sean & Joey also options there
Matthew Donnelly, McNabb Gervin, McNeice and not much else now with Coney out and Tommy gone.
Has Davey retired as well or is it not decided?
When does Red Sean come back?
When does this new square ball rule come into effect?
Surely it would be worth playing someone like big Sean or even Cass in on top of the keeper
I'd say a lot of teams will go this route this year to counteract the swarm defences.
Can you imagine Joey at the edge of the square?
Peter Donnelly at HF?? Have i missed something ;)
Oops sorry I meant Mark Donnelly though wonder would Peter do a job there.
Am I missing any other forwards as we suddenly seem light on forward again.
Has anyone confirmed how long Kyle is out for?
Quote from: Farrandeelin on April 23, 2012, 07:08:04 PM
Will head to Croker extra early for this cracker!! Bloody hell the 2 best teams in the land. Tyrone unbeaten and Kildare are Kildare!! Can't wait. It'll be better than the 2nd game I'd say.
Too right.
The best team in the country vs. the 4th best team in the country.
Should be some game..
Quote from: Jinxy on April 24, 2012, 12:34:21 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on April 23, 2012, 07:08:04 PM
Will head to Croker extra early for this cracker!! Bloody hell the 2 best teams in the land. Tyrone unbeaten and Kildare are Kildare!! Can't wait. It'll be better than the 2nd game I'd say.
Too right.
The best team in the country vs. the 4th best team in the country.
Should be some game..
Tyrone are better than 4th surely..
Quote from: nrico2006 on April 24, 2012, 09:28:57 AM
Does anybody actually know if Coney is out for 6 weeks or 6 months?
Out for at least 6 months, getting an operation this week by all accounts.
Sure it's only a matter of just toggin out
It's going to be tough for our lads to concentrate with all those Kildare buckos prancing about with their fresh tan on show. We need Mugsy to sleep on a sun bed every night until Sunday, tuck his collar inside his shirt and wear his best chain just to have at least one man looking the part.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on April 20, 2012, 05:00:06 PM
Quote from: Donnellys Hollow on April 20, 2012, 04:06:03 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on April 20, 2012, 02:48:57 PM
What's the feeling in Kildare lads about the final?
Will it be yer springboard into a winning run to win Leinster or are ye not too hopeful?
I wonder will Geezer continue to mess about with Johnny Doyle moving him around.
I know he did well for ye in MF but he's always yer top scorer and to me should always be in around the square or at least on the 40.
Will be interesting to see how Harte lines out his charges this time?
Will Gormley, Ricey & Joey continue to be "rested"
Wouldn't be at all hopeful. We were abysmal in the second half in Salthill apart from the last five minutes when Dermot Earley and Emmet Bolton somehow managed to pull it out of the fire for us. Nice to get a dry run in Croke Park before the Leinster Championship but it's no more than a glorified challenge match really.
Very little interest in this game if we're honest, promotion was the target and that has been achieved, €25 a ticket as well is not impressing people and nobody really wants to see Cork hammer Mayo.
Midfield is an issue so expect to see JD there, the Portugal break will probably mean the team will be up for it, more so than Tyrone so a Kildare win wouldn't surprise me but wouldn't excite me either.
Must be a bast**d to motivate the lillywhite supporters for a final when so used to winning silverware.
Quote from: omagh_gael on April 24, 2012, 02:25:25 PM
It's going to be tough for our lads to concentrate with all those Kildare buckos prancing about with their fresh tan on show. We need Mugsy to sleep on a sun bed every night until Sunday, tuck his collar inside his shirt and wear his best chain just to have at least one man looking the part.
Fresh tan? Sure them lads didn't leave the local Portuguese watering holes for the last week. They even left Alan Smith at the bar in Dublin Airport because he was having such a good time:
(https://p.twimg.com/AqmwUPZCAAQIWvP.jpg)
Mugsy is a changed man folks
He knows this could well be his last year and so he wants to give it a big shout and not be just remembered for that lucky goal that all the Arma wans say he fouled the ball
He's gone back to his original hair colour and all.
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_VezUbgtAF0c/TBYES1ia-yI/AAAAAAAAC34/fvlNUW6uCoo/s1600/head%25252525252525252525252BFunny_tattoos%25252525252525252525252Bart.jpg)
I have now realised why the media love in with Kildare is so apparent. The shower of gobshites have got so confused by the steady stream of yerrah coming from the flourbags that they've you mixed up with Kerry!
Prediction time boys. Tyrone by 4 or 5 and never under any real pressure. ;)
Hard to tell what the result will be in games like these when there is no real meaning to it, however, with the winning run we have going at the minute, and Mickey will surely want that to continue, I'm going for a three point win after fighting off a late Kildare surge.
My team would be:
Packy
McCrory
Justy
PJ
Gormley
Harte
McCarron
Cassidy
S Cavanagh
Joe
Mattie Donnelly
Mark Donnelly
Penrose
SoN
Mugsy
Changes I could see would be Gormley/Ricey taking a corner back jersey and McCaul coming in at 5. If JD doesn't play midfield will Gormley pick him up? Midfield nearly impossible to call with Murphy, C Cav and young McKenna pushing hard. In the forwards McNabb could push hard for a start but i'd be pretty sure of that FF line starting. Fuzz mentioned red cards earlier, SoN's was two yellows so he'll definitely be there not sure about Cass.
Kildare by 3
I see Justy's out now too and Penrose highly doubtful.
Kildare by 10-14.
Based on injuries could see a team something like this:
Devine (can't remember who is due in nets)
McCrory
Clarke (or maybe Gormley)
PJ
McCarron
Harte
McMenamin
C Cavanagh
Murphy
McNabb
Mark Donnelly
Joe McMahon
S O'Neill
S Cav
Mugsy
If Joe McMahon isn't fit enough he may keep Cavanagh in half forwards and go with McKenna or Mattie Donnelly in full forward. Only other change could be Cassidy for Murphy or McCaul at half back.
Teams don't lose after a training camp in the sun. Kildare's first cup in the Hogan Stand since 98.
Tyrone probably have a better side (despite the injuries) and if it was championship, I think they'd win well.
Being just a Div 2 final though, Tyrone mightn't be fully focussed and the silverware might mean a bit more to Kildare........
Still find it hard to go against MH and the Tyronies, them to win by 2 following a late comeback.
2 months ago I was as optimistic as I have been in years with the panel of players Tyrone had playing and going well. Now I feel like its 2006 all over again with the injury situation.
1 Jonathan Curran – Oileán a'Ghuail
2 Aidan McCrory – Aireagal Chiaráin
3 Conor Gormley – An Charraig Mhór
4 PJ Quinn – Baile na Móna
5 Cathal McCarron – An Droim Mór
6 Peter Harte – Aireagal Chiaráin
7 Damian McCaul – Domhnach Mór
8 Aidan Cassidy - Eochar
9 Colm Cavanagh - An Mhaigh
10 Ronan McNabb - An Droim Mhór
11 Mark Donnelly – An Charraig Mhór
12 Sean Cavanagh – An Mhaigh
13 Owen Mulligan – An Chorra Chríochach
14 Niall McKenna – Domhnach Mór
15 Stephen O'Neill – Clann na nGael
16 Pascal McConnell – An Baile Nua
17 Conor Clarke - An Omaigh
18 Ciaran Gervin – Doire Locháin
19 Peter Hughes - Eiscreach
20 Jonathan Lafferty – Urnaí
21 Joe McMahon – An Omaigh
22 Ryan McMenamin – An Droim Mhór
23 Stephen McNally – Oileán a'Ghuail
24 Patrick McNiece – Oileán a'Ghuail
25 Stephen McNulty – Cluain Eo
26 Michael Murphy – An Gallbhaile
I'm looking forward at getting a look at McKenna and McNabb.
I wonder if Block is Mickey's No 2 choice for FB for the year. I expected to see Joey or even Clarke there
As I said before there's not a lot of exciting forwards on that bench though I suppose Penrose, Coney and Ronan O'Neill are all missing or is Penfold in the subs lower down?
Penfold probably is lower down.
Not overly confident thought that'd be normal enough.
Mattie Donnelly?
Donaghmores strongest ever representation on a starting Tyrone team In Croke park. Good team
Mattie must have picked up a knock as the form he was showing before his last injury surely would have had him in with a big shout for a starting jersey. Still a strong team and hopefully mugsy, SoN and Petey Harte show the same scoring form as the did at the start of the league in Croker.
Kildare 5-14 Tyrone 1-14
Who you banking on scoring all the goals for the lillies? Seanie?
Some handsomely tanned midlander.
Will be like the opening league game where Kildare will be lucky to get within 6 points of Tyrone.
A lot of cute hoorism going on here lads.
Personally I'm very optimistic we'll win with a few to spare.
We've been putting up big scores all year and whilst the opposition might not have been Div 1 standard we still looked (sounded ;D) very impressive.
I know Kildare will be a changed team from when we met them back in Feb but still we have progressed even better I think and there is a freshness and hunger back there which hasn't been there for some time.
Pace is the main ingredient we seem to have recaptured and even though we've lost 2 excellent young forwards for the year, we should still have the makings of a good team for the months ahead.
We win a lot of those matches without the likes of Sean & Colm Cavanagh, Joey and Justy near the start, Ricey and Gormley.
How many people here have watched every league game involving Tyrone? What is the best half back line - McCarron, Harte and Mc Caul or McCarron, Harte and O'Neill? As mentioned, the pace injected throughout the team has been a big plus and I think it has alot to do with these players I have mentioned.
Must be hard for red Sean to have waited so long to get his chance and then to have missed out on the last 3 months. Then to watch his clubmate McNabb become almost a regular now yet he has to perhaps wait until someone in that half back line get injured or lose out again.
There has been a lot of positives from this league campaign, especially Petey and McCarron.
I'd like to see Cassidy get a run of games now without injury and nail down a MF jersey
We always seem to be chopping and changing MF as often as we do goalkeeper.
A wee article in today Irish Indo. Yes I know some people love that paper
http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-football/mickey-hartes-rebuilding-project-3093678.html (http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-football/mickey-hartes-rebuilding-project-3093678.html)
SOME 20 minutes had elapsed in their All-Ireland quarter-final against Dublin last August when Tyrone's Martin Penrose repositioned himself in a much deeper position to where the number on his back suggested he should be.
It was the general area of Croke Park from where Diarmuid Connolly had already wreaked havoc and Penrose, whether by instruction from the sideline or his own natural instinct, had dropped back to prevent further leakage.
Connolly was already on his fourth point at that stage and threatening to do to Sean O'Neill, now in his slipstream, as he had done to Joe McMahon in the early exchanges.
At that point Tyrone were submerging just about everywhere, and the generation that had overhauled football and pointed it in a different direction was coming to a shuddering halt.
Mickey Harte retained his usual demeanour on the sideline, arms folded and eyes fixed studiously on what was unfolding before him.
That was the public front at least. Inside Harte must have sensed that the nine-year odyssey was at an end. If he was to stay at the helm, he himself would have to change and old loyalties would have to be set aside.
His 2003 team had changed the landscape with the ferocity and structure of their approach; now Harte and Tyrone found themselves victims of a modification of that approach.
Earlier this year, Sean Cavanagh acknowledged as much in an interview when he confessed that Dublin had "changed the face of the GAA".
Tyrone had, in essence, been 'out-Tyroned' on that August evening. The original hunters were now being hunted out of existence.
One by one, familiar faces began falling away, with Brian McGuigan, Brian Dooher, Philip Jordan, Ciaran Gourley and Enda McGinley all retiring.
Kevin Hughes dabbled with thoughts of retirement and sought a break from the early season training to consider it. He was advised to think about it as he trained. The same request might not have been turned down 12 months earlier. By the end of January, he was gone too. Medals on the chest were no longer a passport.
The overhaul may take a season to complete, and with long-term injuries ruling Ronan O'Neill and Kyle Coney out for the season, the advance of the last three months may stutter. Coney was the star of the 2008 All-Ireland winning minor team who flirted with AFL, suffered and then briefly threatened not to fulfil his vast potential.
He scored liberally and magnificently in Tyrone's last five league matches -- he has amassed a total of 0-24 -- to rekindle the belief that he can become one of the forwards of this decade.
O'Neill appeared fleetingly in the league but his promise is immense.
The need for an injection of pace has been the basis for most change. Most of those who have been introduced throughout the league are relatively seasoned. Aidan McRory, PJ Quinn, Ronan McNabb and Cathal McCarron have all been on the fringes for the last couple of years.
In overhauling his team, Harte has recognised the need for ball players with a high cruising speed.
Tactically they have also tailored their style significantly and the return of a more defensive-orientated game should be an ominous sign to their rivals.
Peter Harte has been central to their game plan. Nominally the team's centre-back, he has been given licence to boot forward at any opportunity in the knowledge that the space he leaves behind will be filled by McNabb or other covering players from the half-forward line and midfield.
In last year's championship, Harte struggled as a half-forward in the two key games against the most physical of Tyrone's opponents, Donegal in the Ulster semi-final and Dublin in that All-Ireland quarter-final.
But giving him the free role has released the quality footballer in him and so far this season, Harte has scored 5-5 (three of the goals have been penalties).
In all, Tyrone's half-backs have been responsible for 3-11 in the league, which amounts to just less than one sixth of the team's total. Cathal McCarron's 1-6, Damien McCaul's 1-1 and Harte 2-4 from play reflect a much more fluid system being encouraged.
It was significant to hear Harte speak this week of greater early-season urgency in training, how one size now fitted all and that tailoring sessions to suit the legs and age-profile of some of the squad was no longer a policy.
cornerstone
The one session a week that was a cornerstone of their 2003 approach has long since been dispensed with.
Harte has had his own personal difficulties to deal with, but football is always something that he has immersed himself in, now more than ever it seems.
Most of the great managers of the past in Gaelic football have had the capacity to overhaul when they had to. Kevin Heffernan did it with Dublin in 1983, Mick O'Dwyer to a lesser extent with Kerry in '84 and Sean Boylan dramatically so with Meath in '96.
In each case, they had the players to make the swift transformation.
Harte has that luxury too. The spin-offs from the last two All-Ireland winning minor teams (2008 and 2010) will be greater than the previous two ('01 and '04).
So far the rebuild is right on course with 12 wins from 12 games at senior level aligned neatly with the statistic that Tyrone representative teams (minor, U-21 and senior) have lost just one of the 24 games they have played in 2012 -- the Ulster U-21 final against Cavan.
That's an ominous sign for the rest of the country. As ominous as Mickey Harte bringing his team back to the basics that made them great in the first place.
Cill Dara (v Tír Eoghain)
1 Shane Connolly - Naomh Lorcan
2 Peter Kelly - Teach Dhá Míle
3 Hugh McGrillen - Cill Droichid
4 Ollie Lyons - Cill Droichid
5 Emmet Bolton - Baile Éide
6 Morgan O'Flaherty - Cairbre
7 Gary White - Na Sairséalaigh
8 Mick Foley - Áth Í
9 Pádraig O'Neill - Naomh Lorcan
10 Eoghan O'Flaherty - Cairbre
11 Mikey Conway - An Urnaí
12 Johnny Doyle - Fíodh Alúine
13 Alan Smith - Na Sairséalaigh
14 Tomás O'Connor - Claonadh
15 James Kavanagh - Baile Mór
I can't see Kildare winning this match without Flynn and Leper starting. Don't think we'll win enough ball around the middle without those two. Interesting that Chalky is recalled. I think it's his first start since the Derry match last July.
Six changes from the 1st round game with McGrillen, Foley, Doyle, White, O'Flaherty and Bolton all starting, that gives Kildare a much stronger middle 8 than the last time. McGeeney has kept his squad fresh and only Flynn and Leper will be really missed but I'm happy with Kildare's squad development and am not convinced by the hype around Tyrone's rejuvenation. Both teams will struggle to raise intensity levels but Kildare have the added incentive believe or not of a first national senior football title since 1928.
Why do ye all think there will be such a lack of intensity?
There is HUGE competition for places in this Tyrone team especially from 1-9 and with it being the last chance to impress Mickey before the championship as we don't do challenge games then I'd say they'll all be out to stake their claim.
I'm particular interested in watching the half forward line to see how often they tuck in to half back and allow the HB line to push forward to get scores.
That seems a strong enough FF line for Kildare so personally I'm expecting a great game with Kildare keen to win a national title to kick start their summer
Quote from: Fuzzman on April 28, 2012, 08:49:41 AM
Why do ye all think there will be such a lack of intensity?
Because when both teams listed their goals for the season, you'd find they'd be All-Ireland, Provincial, Promotion in that order. Winning a Division 2 title was probably never even discussed. As for the competition for places, it's a moot point and with most teams there is probably at least 10 nailed on starters on both teams, in 15 a side games it can be quite hard to really generate competition for places as most players are adaptable and can be played in a number of positions.
The game will be competitive and could take a life of it's own but there is nothing at stake so just can't see players putting their bodies on the line, it's a lose lose situation for Kildare. Lose it and they'll be hammered for losing yet another "Big" game, even though we know it's not. Win and it will "only" be a Division 2 title against a dis-interested Tyrone who had both eyes on Armagh. Alas the narrative for Kildare is already written, I'd like to win and think we will but won't be getting too excited.
Kildare people are right, they won't get within 2 points of tyrone.
No need to downplay this, the championship doesnt start for another while yet, so no reason for either team not to want to win it. Its got nothing to do with targets set at the start of the year, of course every team wants to win an all ireland, but this is a chance of a good game in croker to get stuck in. Actually just remembered kildare wer away for a training week so maybe they will be primed for this alright
Would be nice to win it but I don't think either side will lose any sleep if they're beaten. Kildare would probably take more from winning it but it's not going to make or break the season. Promotion has been achieved for both teams and this is no more than a glorified challenge match really.
I'd be surprised to see either of our starting midfielders being part of the midfield pairing come the Leinster Championship and Callaghan will have to be accomodated somewhere in the forward line, possibly at the expense of Tom Connor who for all his positive qualities isn't contributing enough on the scoreboard. I'd be happy tomorrow if our backs are tighter than they were for all of the round robin games and if Jimmers and Smithy continue their recent good form. Getting twenty minutes out around the middle of the field into Dermot Earley would be a bonus.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on April 27, 2012, 11:44:05 PM
and am not convinced by the hype around Tyrone's rejuvenation.
Mickey has that post pinned to the back of the bus driver's head.
I've a funny feeling Joey will start instead of somebody. Mad blustery cold day here in Dublin.
Sean Cavanagh shocking bad so far, brother bear not far behind him! :o
awful match. If Kildare would just lump it in on O'Connor they'd be home and hosed.
Very blustery in Dublin.
Not likely to get a great game in those conditions.
Mc Kenna needs the curly finger!
47 mins too long for A.Smith..never touched leather
Mon over here colm and have a seat..not at the races!
Colm Cavanagh is f**king brutal..........jesus christ!
Mark Donnelly Tyrones stand out performer so far.
Quote from: cadhlancian on April 29, 2012, 03:17:45 PM
Mc Kenna needs the curly finger!
What does taht mean? ???
Todays games will be held up as being indicative of the evils of short hand-passing but you can't kick the ball accurately in those conditions.
Ref not giving Tyrone a whole pile either! Some blatant fouls on Tyrone coming forward not called!
Lilies looking good
Quote from: cadhlancian on April 29, 2012, 03:42:20 PM
Ref not giving Tyrone a whole pile either! Some blatant fouls on Tyrone coming forward not called!
Not the referee that beat Tyrone. seems like Tyrone never won that game cause they never went to Portugal. some strange calls on the sideline. take nothing away from Kildare they deserved it. Mark Donnelly played shirt of his back was tyrones best player by a mile. Sean Cavanagh never got two kicks of it. would have finished in the 2nd row of the sub bench if he didnt high profile name he has. Tyrone do well to get out of athletic grounds in the championship. stephen oneills 25 metre free kick woulda have put daylight between the teams with 15 minutes to go but dropped short and Kildare never looked back.probably the wake up call Tyrone needed ahead of th championship they thought they were untouchable.
Ref gave Tyrone nothing but they were brutal in that second half anyway. When O'Neill is having an off day they have nobody else to play the ball into.
kildare seemed to be a lot fitter in the last 10 mins.
a lot for tyrone to work on.
not the worst result in the world as there'll be no hype/talk about unbeaten records going into the athletic grounds.
Kildare better team when it mattered, took control of midfield.
J Curran dropped a ball over the sideline that was going wide, Kildare scored an excellent 45 from it. Then Stephen O'Neill misses the handy free.
Fitter better conditioned team won which tyrone won't be happy about given the amount of training we hear they are doing. That's first team Tyrone have met who have been as fit as they are this year. McGeeney will be delighted with that outing.
Fitness was always going to play a huge role on a day like that.
Conditions didn't suit foot-passing and Tyrone weren't able to isolate O'Neill and Mulligan.
Tyrone looked a bit off the pace for the entire match today. They never moved with the same fluency they did during the league proper. The opposition might have something to do with that but there wasn't the same sharpness with Tyrone's attack play.
I'd rather get beat by Kildare today than by Armagh in the Athletic Grounds. A defeat once in a while mightn't be the worst thing. It'll give Mickey Harte plenty to work on. I'd rather of had that than a 10 point win that taught you nothing. Tyrone's aim isn't Division 2 league titles.
Apart from Mark Donnelly today I'm not sure anybody else really performed like they can
No touching Kildare now.........................unstoppable ;)
V Good display in fairness, worked the conditions really well, very sharp and at an alarming fitness rate already................................. johnny doyle is near untouchable now though, handy frees ;)
Quote from: squire_in_navy_slacks on April 29, 2012, 06:16:06 PM
No touching Kildare now.........................unstoppable ;)
V Good display in fairness, worked the conditions really well, very sharp and at an alarming fitness rate already................................. johnny doyle is near untouchable now though, handy frees ;)
[/b]
Sure it's non contact now isn't it ?
Well done Kildare, a good scalp in a moderately competitive game. There is no where to hide this summer! Sh1te or get off the pot! I mean that in a positive sense.
10 Observations on the game:
1. Referee was shocking. As bad a performance as I have seen in a long while. Allowed Kildare to foul at will when Tyrone on attack and gave Kildare the softest of scorable frees in the Tyrone half.
2. Tyrone tried to carry the ball EVERY SINGLE TIME. The FF line had nothing to work with; no early ball in at all.
3. Sean Cav is a pale shadow of what he used to be. Would be better suited in FF or MF. Half forward doing nothing for him.
4. McCrory will be a big loss.
5. With Coney out shooting from 35+ was virtually non existent. Kildare
closed the game out well doing just that.
6. Fitness wise we looked 2nd best.
7. No plan B
8. Referees need to stop the 3rd man tackle from Kildare. Every time it happens.
9. Hopefully the result pulls some heads back down from clouds and we can give the Armagh fixture the respect it most certainly warrants.
10. Did I mention how bad Coldrick was.
Great to get the win against one of the better teams in the country but it was only a Div 2 final so it has to be kept in perspective.
Positives were that the backs were much tighter than at any other stage this year. The management got the match ups spot on. I wouldn't have picked Emmet Bolton to mark Mulligan but it worked a treat. McGrillen also gave Cavanagh nothing all day. I thought Peter Kelly had his best match since his return and Connolly was safe as houses under the high ball. His kickouts were a vast improvement from Salthill.
Both the corner forwards were disappointing but space was at a premium with Tyrone dropping their half-back line so deep. Tom Connor showed well but we still aren't getting enough men running off him around the D. Young Podge Fogarty showed what he is capable of and he will have Jimmers and Smithy sweating over their starting places against Offaly. Disappointing that Earley didn't get any game time but good to see Leper and Flynn are getting over their knocks.
Kildare's shortcomings are still clear for all to see but we appear to be in decent enough shape facing into the Championship. It has probably been the most positive League campaign during McGeeney's tenure and we should be more competitive this year with Kelly, Conway and Earley back in the fold. Hopefully the likes of Flynn can stay injury free. With a bit of luck we might be capable of taking a big scalp this summer.
Enjoyable enough game. Terrible reffing. Thought he was equally bad for both teams in the first half and then bad for Tyrone in the second. Wouldn't be too disappointed. I thought that Tyrone looked physically sharper and faster to the ball all over the pitch in the first half-just seemed to break down by trying to burst through the middle all the time. Sean should've been hauled off at half time. In fairness to Stevie he never got any ball put into him and Mugsy looks sharp enough. Bar one terrible pass, I thought Colm Cav put himself about well enough. Disappointing game by McCarron.
On another day, Tyrone could've been out of sight at half time.
Our game seemed to fall apart when the ref lost the plot while Kildare took their chances well. Won't do Tyrone a bit of harm to lose this one-they have the basis of a decent championship team on this showing but need to start picking of long distance scores.
Quote from: Whishtup on April 29, 2012, 08:07:35 PM
Enjoyable enough game. Terrible reffing. Thought he was equally bad for both teams in the first half and then bad for Tyrone in the second. Wouldn't be too disappointed. I thought that Tyrone looked physically sharper and faster to the ball all over the pitch in the first half-just seemed to break down by trying to burst through the middle all the time. Sean should've been hauled off at half time. In fairness to Stevie he never got any ball put into him and Mugsy looks sharp enough. Bar one terrible pass, I thought Colm Cav put himself about well enough. Disappointing game by McCarron.
On another day, Tyrone could've been out of sight at half time.
Our game seemed to fall apart when the ref lost the plot while Kildare took their chances well. Won't do Tyrone a bit of harm to lose this one-they have the basis of a decent championship team on this showing but need to start picking of long distance scores.
On another day, a sniper on the roof of the nally stand could take out half the Kildare players.
Any word what exactly happened McRory and how he is?
That was nice to win but not unexpected too much emphasis was put on the first game played almost 3 months ago in the middle of Kildare's heavy training, Kildare had a much stronger team out today and with the Portugal training camp under the belt they were always going to finish stronger.
Kildare are very familiar with McGoldrick and is no friend of Kildare, he was consistent today and the conditions ensured a lot slow build up which meant lots of tackles and Kildare know from experience how he referee's the tackle and he doesn't often blow for soft/dive frees.
Anyhow good result and beating a side of Tyrone's calibre can only help with confidence levels. Delighted to see Fogarty do so well and his progression could be vital, Conway must be the sweetest foot passer in Leinster, now if only we had some natural forwards.
I'm sorry if this post sounds too critical as I know its only April and it was only a Div 2 final but that was hard to watch.
Maybe it was just the bitter cold weather or the cutting wind but I couldn't help but feel aggrieved at our style of play. I've missed most games in the NFL bar the 1st one so I was expecting to see quite a free flowing match with lots of pace and exciting attack play.
Now I know ye can only play as well as yer let play but lets face it, I'm fed up to the back teeth of seeing the tactic of leaving a 2 man FF line that has 2 men marking them and then a sweeper 20 yards in front of them.
Then nobody else as the rest of the team are back in their own 40.
I was so annoyed back in 2009 v Cork, when time after time we just kept running into tackle after tackle, trying to pass under pressure with 3 men around ye and of course it being intercepted or not reaching it's desired destination.
Here we are 3 years later seeming to be making the same mistakes again.
Stevie O'Neill never touched the ball for the 1st 20 mins. On 23rd min he won a 45. No it wasn't one of Stevie's better days I agree but they lack of quality ball into him was appalling.
Mugsy got a few better passes into him and in all I thought he played quite well.
Sparky was by far the only player in red showing any fire in his belly in my eyes and those around me.
The middle third was a complete washout with Cassidy especially having a nightmare first half.
Yes conditions were poor and yes the ref in the second half didn't give us much (Esp a tackle near the end on Sparky) but I'm really becoming disillusioned with Mickey's tactics the last while.
He was preaching last week about how we're all bad mouthing our own game and saying how negative we make it sound. To me and a lot around me, why would you drive all the way down to Dublin and back on such a miserable day to watch such a dire game.
To me this tactic of playing a running game to counteract the swarm defence is playing into other teams hands. We are not a team to win possession around from kickouts so any possession we get is bloody hard earned.
Therefore it's crucial that we stop running into the brick wall most teams put up now around their own 40 and then getting caught with our defenders out of position.
Maybe it was just another bad day in Croker but when's the last day you can say we played well in headquarters?
With this new square ball rule, I can't see why we persist so much with this run run run game. I'd say Donegal and the Dubs will be glad to see us continue playing this way.
At least Armagh won't be the ones to break our unbeaten run now. ;D
Dose of reality boys, the glory days are over & aint coming back anytime soon. Q/F at best
Quote from: bennydorano on April 29, 2012, 09:30:29 PM
Dose of reality boys, the glory days are over & aint coming back anytime soon. Q/F at best
It was a bit daft of some people to be talking up Tyrone as All-Ireland contenders on the back of coasting through the McKenna Cup and Division 2 of the league. Equally daft to be writing them off altogether on the back of one game. This team is still a work in progress and overall it's coming on pretty well. Disappointing today but I would say Mickey will have taken a few lesssons from it, no doubt he learned more about his team today than from several easy wins over the past couple of months. I think the loss of Coney is a real blow but still hopeful that Tyrone can have a decent championship.
What do ye think lads of our style of play?
Of our tactics on how to break down the sweeper in front of our forwards?
I think we've still got a descent if not top 5 team there but I just think we play into teams hands with this 1 dimensional style of game. Jim McGuinness was sitting close-by and I'd say he was happy with what he saw.
I don't want to go OTT now with my criticism and Mickey knows a lot more about football than most of us but I can't see the point of having top quality forwards standing up in the FF line and never getting descent ball into them.
Quote from: cadhlancian on April 29, 2012, 03:17:45 PM
Mc Kenna needs the curly finger!
That happened it didn't make one ball of blue, because he done better than 2 cavanaghs, 1 Cassidy, 1 Harte, 1 full back line etc. you and Mickey must be on the same wavelength. Our big players were caught out badly today, and thats why we lost yet it's easy to pick out the fringe players. Stork
Quote from: Dinny Breen on April 27, 2012, 11:44:05 PM
Kildare have the added incentive believe or not of a first national senior football title since 1928.
Heard tonight that it's our first national title since we beat Dublin in a Division 2 final in 1974.
you will win nothing important with 3 forwards
and fellas running down blind alleys loosing the ball
if mickey went 6 on 6 they would fair alot better
best form of defence is ATTACK ATTACK
Tyroneman and Fuzz , I agree wholeheartedly! David Coldrick was simply put, not good. Tyrone made it easy for him by continually carrying the ball into the tackle. Sean Cavanagh is seems to have lost a considerable amount of pace, and seems to struggle to blow by players they way he used to , after dropping his shoulder. Bottom line, you wont be winning any All irelands with Colm Cav in the middle of the field, I strongly believe , that if he wasn't Sean's Brother, he wouldnt even be on the panel! Aidan Cassidy is average, as is Cathal McCarron. Mark Donnelly as stated was the standout performer, for the most part ploughing a lone furrow. Curran in goals hardly inspires confidence either. Young McKenna was also very average and for all the hype its games like today that he should be showing in.......should have been gone a lot earlier. Freetaking is at best sketchey! We are probably a coin toss everytime we get a free , whether we will score it or miss! The pace that had been evident throughout the league was not on show today, perhaps we got our pace a little earlier than most teams this year? Only positive....a good kick in the whole before the applemunchers! :o
Quote from: rrhf on April 29, 2012, 10:27:53 PM
Quote from: cadhlancian on April 29, 2012, 03:17:45 PM
Mc Kenna needs the curly finger!
That happened it didn't make one ball of blue, because he done better than 2 cavanaghs, 1 Cassidy, 1 Harte, 1 full back line etc. you and Mickey must be on the same wavelength. Our big players were caught out badly today, and thats why we lost yet it's easy to pick out the fringe players. Stork
McKenna was equally as bad as any you have mentioned. He was taken off with 5 mins to go, have yet to really see him shine. You talk about the bigger names, maybe he is getting on because of his own name??
As Fuzz pointed out - you keep thinking back to Cork '09, Dublin '10 and Donegal/Dublin '11. I know Tyrone could easily have won a couple of those but the point remains.
Tyrone play a running game and have talented enough players to do to and beat 27-28 of the other counties on form. However, Kildare, Dublin, Donegal and Cork are big physical sides who'll soak that up all day long. There HAS to be a plan B. Late in the second half, after the umpteenth example of not being able to pass through the busy half back line of Kildare, Mugsy came out and played (footpass) a clinker on top of O'Neill which should have resulted in a goal. He showed the way. No one followed. He can't play it to himself. Last year v Donegal, everything Tyrone hit from distance went over in the first 20 mins. That'll rarely happen.
We don't have the players who can hit something from distance outside of Sean Cavanagh who'll never be afforded that space. Dooher was another who'd have a crack. Coney's a bit of a loss in that regard. He was the something new we needed from previous squads even though the jury hasn't delivered a verdict yet. That means when Tyrone come up against the brick wall, O'Neill and whoever else is in there needs to be used. Stephen was scratching his hole for the first 35.
Tyrone aren't far away and with a few more sessions in the tank I think they'd have handled Kildare ok. They can blitz teams with that passing game - Harte, Penrose, McCarron, Donnelly, the Cavanaghs etc are all capable of breaking the tackle and delivering a quality finish. When that's not working though we appear clueless - it is happening earlier every year now.
Colm Cavanagh gets a lot of stick and he can be frustrating with turnovers. His first three possessions in the second half ended with the ball in Kildare hands. I'd still persevere with him. He does a lot of simple good work too and when the team's flying he's a great man for providing an outlet. Cassidy had a mare but is better than that. Silly errors today cost Tyrone - misplaced passes from Colm, PJ and Curran stand out.
If Mickey can bring something different to the table when things aren't working out, Tyrone will not be far away at all. It'll be hard to stomach all the old frailties being played out against a good, physically strong team again this year in Croker. There are 4-5 better sides than Kildare who'll soak up the current style.
Well done to Kildare - fitness told and there must've been little SuperBock consumed. Some excellent point taking at the end but that was simply down to the state of the challenge, late on.
Shane a very generous assessment I would say! Sean Cavanagh was poor and looked uninterested, perhaps thats why, in his 10th year now on the Senior team , he has never been made captain , lacks leadership and when things are not going well , disappears! Honest question..........would Colm be on the team if Sean wasn't? You say Aidan Cassidy is better than that, why? here and when has he produced the type of performance that would justify overlooking that display today??
Quote from: Jinxy on April 29, 2012, 08:17:10 PM
Quote from: Whishtup on April 29, 2012, 08:07:35 PM
Enjoyable enough game. Terrible reffing. Thought he was equally bad for both teams in the first half and then bad for Tyrone in the second. Wouldn't be too disappointed. I thought that Tyrone looked physically sharper and faster to the ball all over the pitch in the first half-just seemed to break down by trying to burst through the middle all the time. Sean should've been hauled off at half time. In fairness to Stevie he never got any ball put into him and Mugsy looks sharp enough. Bar one terrible pass, I thought Colm Cav put himself about well enough. Disappointing game by McCarron.
On another day, Tyrone could've been out of sight at half time.
Our game seemed to fall apart when the ref lost the plot while Kildare took their chances well. Won't do Tyrone a bit of harm to lose this one-they have the basis of a decent championship team on this showing but need to start picking of long distance scores.
On another day, a sniper on the roof of the nally stand could take out half the Kildare players.
'Pale' humour?
Seriously, lads, I wouldn't be too worried about that performance. A couple of poor final passes denied us goal chances in the first half. Some things didn't go our way, including McCrory's injury and a lot of decisions in the second half. Just would like to see more runs being made up the wings instead of right through the middle. Why was Sean's 'shimmy' point disallowed?
Quote from: cadhlancian on April 29, 2012, 11:25:05 PM
Shane a very generous assessment I would say! Sean Cavanagh was poor and looked uninterested, perhaps thats why, in his 10th year now on the Senior team , he has never been made captain , lacks leadership and when things are not going well , disappears! Honest question..........would Colm be on the team if Sean wasn't? You say Aidan Cassidy is better than that, why? here and when has he produced the type of performance that would justify overlooking that display today??
Sometimes we overlook the good done. Cassidy beat a couple of tackles and set up Mugsy for Tyrone's first score. He started the move by picking up the breaking ball and driving forward for Tyrone's third score (Donnelly). His next run saw him swallowed up by 4 Kildare men when he possibly could have released it earlier. The same happened soon after. His confidence dropped a little after that but wasn't the only culprit. I thought he had an OK second half as he kept it simple.
Bottom line is that with12 minutes to go, Tyrone were a point up - with 8 minutes left on the clock, it was a draw. The wheels came off after that.
So Kildare owned the ball in the last few minutes of the match - Kildare finished much the stronger. It's far too simplistic in my opinion to say that Kildare were fitter than Tyrone. What is certain is that Kildare played the better football when the game was in the melting pot at the end.
Young Fogarty had a blinder and gave the full back line plenty to think about.
We can all over react - with 12 games won out of 12 Tyrone were back in the big time and Sam was being openly talked about. With this defeat, people are still over reacting and talking about going nowhere this year.
That's the fickle nature of supporters. Tyrone still not a bad team but as someone else said earlier, the glory days are behind us - they'll not win an All Ireland with this team. Kerry, Cork and Dublin are well ahead.
Quote from: orangeman on April 29, 2012, 11:55:28 PM
Bottom line is that with12 minutes to go, Tyrone were a point up - with 8 minutes left on the clock, Tyrone it was a draw.
So Kildare owned the ball in the last few minutes of the match - Kildare finished much the stronger. It's far too simplistic in my opinion to say that Kildare were fitter than Tyrone. What is certain is that Kildare played the better football when the game was in the melting pot at the end.
I think it's beyond doubt that fitness was a major factor for the simple reasons you stated. 10-12 minutes to go men were racing away from Tyrone players whereas earlier in the game they weren't. Kildare kicked points at the end unchallenged. Before that they had to scrap like a terrier for every half chance.
If anyone was talking about Tyrone and Sam (I didn't see or hear any) before now they needed their head tested.
Quote from: ONeill on April 30, 2012, 12:00:07 AM
Quote from: orangeman on April 29, 2012, 11:55:28 PM
Bottom line is that with12 minutes to go, Tyrone were a point up - with 8 minutes left on the clock, Tyrone it was a draw.
So Kildare owned the ball in the last few minutes of the match - Kildare finished much the stronger. It's far too simplistic in my opinion to say that Kildare were fitter than Tyrone. What is certain is that Kildare played the better football when the game was in the melting pot at the end.
I think it's beyond doubt that fitness was a major factor for the simple reasons you stated. 10-12 minutes to go men were racing away from Tyrone players whereas earlier in the game they weren't. Kildare kicked points at the end unchallenged. Before that they had to scrap like a terrier for every half chance.
Momentum swung in Kildare's favour at this stage and their tails were up. People were saying that the benefits of the training trip to Portugal paid dividends. I don't buy that - if anything the bodies would have been tired as a result of a week's training away. But the psyhological benefit of a week away would have stood Kildare in great stead today. But you could be right - if Tyrone are up to playing for 60 minutes, all they have to do now is play for another 10.
Just sat down and watched the game for the second time and they lost it as well ! Bottom line is that you will win nothing with no midfield. Kildare totally dominated that third of the field. Curran didn't help by kicking it down their throats every time . This is were Dooher is and will be sorely missed.
I agree with someone before asking what Cassidy has done at any stage in a Tyrone jersey to merit a place. I have watched a lot of games he has been involved in and never once has he stood out or even impressed, at least the young Cavanagh has had a decent game here and there.
Sean cavanagh should be played full forward with Mugsy and Stephen ONeill each side. Totally lost at wing forward.
I agree wholeheartedly. Sean won player of the year and an AI medal playing at FF. He's someone who looks like he needs to be the pivot of the team and just doesn't seem interested at WHF.
Midfield is a concern. A good day is breaking even. At one stage yesterday we lost 9 KO in a row.
The first half against Donegal we moved the ball into the wide areas at pace and swung it over the bar from distance. This needs to be added to the mix again.
As many have already said - ploughing up the centre will only work if there are 1 or 2 other approaches being used to keep the opposition guessing. Kildare sat with 2 sweepers at one point just waiting to turn us over cos they knew exactly what we would do.
It also seems very much apparant that stopping Harte = stopping Tyrone.
Was at the game yesterday - was very tempted to go to the top deck off the cusack to get away from the so called 'supporters' behind me. Not a clue - players just crossing the half way line and shouts of "put that ball over the bar" - another classic "is that wee brian dooher down injured" - never heard worse. From reading some of the comments on hear either its nearly as bad as the supporters or else we have some unreal ex players here who have never made mistakes playing games.
Fair enough Tyrone had a poor last 10 mins or so and wasn't the best game to watch y.day but gives them plenty of work on and I think I defeat could be more beneficial - brings the players back down to earth a bit and also stops any media talk before we enter the championship about this unbeaten all year Tyrone team. I cant agree with most of the criticism off the players on here either - Cassidy for example - yes made a few silly errors but as another poster mentioned - was involved in at least 5/6 of Tyrone scores - do people just forget about the good work done and just focus on the negatives all the time - he won at least 2/3 frees directly in front of goals that were scored from breaking through the middle. And on other occasions running through and laid the ball off simply and it was tapped over. Also to the posters saying he's never had a good game for Tyrone - he was outstanding in a few qualifier games last year before getting injured - including against Longford (I think from memory) - were he caught at least 8/9 kick outs clean. Also in the league games a few years ago before picking up nasty ankle injury was Tyrones best player throughout the league having great games against Monaghan/Cork, etc.
Echoing the sentiments of others on here, but from what I saw:
- nothing has changed since Cork in 2009, Dublin in 2010 or Dublin last year. Same one dimensional game plan where players try and run the ball at every opporunity. When I watch some of the other top teams play they are constantly 20/30 yard kick passes or hitting long diagonal balls frequently
- why do we lack players that can shoot from 30/40 yards and score. Its similar to the point above in that we seem to have to run the ball as close to goal as we can and recycle it 5 yards to a free standing shooter
- Mark Donnelly got through a mountain of work but again the use of the boot would have caused more damage, why not try Mulligan at 11 as he seems to be the only player that looks to give a pass
- I remember the criticism Mark Harte took when he played about only being a free taker, but he barely ever missed and I think it was taken for granted that there is an abundance of top notch free takers floating about. SON has been poor at them over the past few years and we seem to also concede 45s as most of them are missed too
- Is it just accepted, as it has been for years now, that its ok to play every game with a midfield that we know will lose when it comes to winning first phase possession? Why has some of the big fielders within the county never really been given a chance?
- Haven't seen much of Cassidy but don't see the hype after yesterdays game, very one paced player. McCarron didn't stand out either and as for the McKenna he was playing in a forward line that didn't get much supply
- The one big thing that I noticed is that there is no width to out game, everything is played down the middle. When watching the game every player is sucked right into the middle of the pitch and there is acres of space in the wings which could be exploited.
- Coney and O'Neill are big losses but from looking at the team we are still relying on the veterans to win us games, but they have aged and the last few years have shown that they are past their best and we need something new.
- Sean Cavanagh is not a wing forward, has had his best days at midfield. Why not put him back there?
Positives:
1 Mark Donnelly was excellent as has been mentioned here - but I also thought that Ronan McNabb had a very good game & would take him as a big plus from this league campaign. I think he finished the game in the full back line where he struggled, but up until that point he hoovered up alot of break ball & distributed it well and is most certainly a great option in the half back / half forward line. He will come on for that game as well.
2 Honestly delighted to have shaken off that "unbeaten" tag. It wouldnt have done us any good at all ahead of the ulster championship.
Concerns:
1. You dont win championships without a decent free taker. Tyrone dont have one. I know Petey Harte had a mare at the free's v Donegal last year but I would suggest he has another go at them (I remember watching a young Oisin McConville do the same against Tyrone when he was just starting out, think it was 1998 - and look how he came on)
2. Midfield was cleaned out, again. I would persist with Aidan Cassidy. He was poor yesterday but he's still finding his way back from injury. If fully fit and back in form he is a very formidable midfielder. Should be partnered in my opinion with one of the McMahon's
3. Sean Cavanagh. Tyrone need Cavanagh fit and on form if they are to have any sort of summer at all. Completely wasted on the wing. How many times yesterday did I want him to do the trademan drop shoulder and run - but each time he chequed his run and came back inside his man. It looks more like a psychological thing to me, he doesnt have the confidence to take his man on. Sean must be deployed at FF where he is a target for the likes of Mugsy & P Harte to vary the attack and hit the occasional direct ball in. A run at FF would also benefit his confidence.
Yesterday was a real reality check for alot of us. I would never really thought of Tyrone being AI contenders this year, but I suppose winning 12 outta 12 games, at least in the back of your mind I think most Tyrone fans will admit myself included, we got ahead of ourselves a bit.
I said back in January that considering the overhaul of the squad this year - that promotion & an Ulster Championship would constitute a very good year. I think thats still on.
Still think we have the bones of a decent side, my starting 15 for the championship for what its worth would look like:
1. Devine
2. McCrory 3. Joe McMahon 4. Gormley
5. McCarron 6. P Harte 7. Conor Clarke
8. Cassidy & 9 Justin McMahon
10 McNabb 11. Mulligan 12. Mark Donnelly
13. Mattie Donnelly 14. Sean Cavanagh 15 SON
If we're honest, Kildare were the best team for large parts of the opening league game back in February. The two goals there were decisive and Kildare set up yesterday not to concede goals.
We were too lateral and predictable. O'Neill went 25 minutes before he touched the ball in the first half. I'm surprised nobody has mentioned his name, but the player we are clearly lacking, if only as a game changer, is Brian McGuigan. I remember in 2009, we faced the same problems with Kildare in the QF and he came on and transformed the game. He would have been the go to man yesterday. I looked at the options on the bench and there was nobody that could have done that. Dublin last year showed he doesn't have the legs for 70 mins of that intensity, but he may have for 20 mins, like Canavan in 2005. If it's too late to bring him back, then Peter Harte needs to be moved to 11. He should be doing his best work up the field now and with his goal threat there is little point having him in his own half as teams are now man marking him.
Coney's loss is massive. Our inside men showed well, but are now too easy bottled up and are predictable. Most of their scores will come from frees. Coney can run in behind and is dynamic. Ronan O'Neill could have been the same. Any chance of contending this year is gone with their injuries.
Defensively, we are still struggling with the early ball in, even with the sweeper.
Cavan U-21's and Kildare yesterday have shown how the game is going. Unheralded, powerful players who are tactically aware and hungry. Tyrone are being out thought and out fought
Quote from: Whishtup on April 29, 2012, 11:38:24 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on April 29, 2012, 08:17:10 PM
Quote from: Whishtup on April 29, 2012, 08:07:35 PM
Enjoyable enough game. Terrible reffing. Thought he was equally bad for both teams in the first half and then bad for Tyrone in the second. Wouldn't be too disappointed. I thought that Tyrone looked physically sharper and faster to the ball all over the pitch in the first half-just seemed to break down by trying to burst through the middle all the time. Sean should've been hauled off at half time. In fairness to Stevie he never got any ball put into him and Mugsy looks sharp enough. Bar one terrible pass, I thought Colm Cav put himself about well enough. Disappointing game by McCarron.
On another day, Tyrone could've been out of sight at half time.
Our game seemed to fall apart when the ref lost the plot while Kildare took their chances well. Won't do Tyrone a bit of harm to lose this one-they have the basis of a decent championship team on this showing but need to start picking of long distance scores.
On another day, a sniper on the roof of the nally stand could take out half the Kildare players.
'Pale' humour?
That's what it would have taken for Tyrone to be out of sight by half-time on 'another day'.
Quote from: cadhlancian on April 29, 2012, 10:54:25 PM
Quote from: rrhf on April 29, 2012, 10:27:53 PM
Quote from: cadhlancian on April 29, 2012, 03:17:45 PM
Mc Kenna needs the curly finger!
That happened it didn't make one ball of blue, because he done better than 2 cavanaghs, 1 Cassidy, 1 Harte, 1 full back line etc. you and Mickey must be on the same wavelength. Our big players were caught out badly today, and thats why we lost yet it's easy to pick out the fringe players. Stork
McKenna was equally as bad as any you have mentioned. He was taken off with 5 mins to go, have yet to really see him shine. You talk about the bigger names, maybe he is getting on because of his own name??
Interesting perspective. It was you naming players and calling for curly fingers for just the one one player but you mentioned he was equally as bad as others. We won 2 balls in the second half in midfield and he won one. In the firts half he was involved in most scoring moves.An when other vaunted stars were sauntering around giving the ball away repetively for scores, you still singled out Mc Kenna. I really think you believe that because of his name he was selected, thats going to be hard to argue with.
Tyrone won something like 12 games on the bounce this year so things can't be all that bad based on one game - they were due to lose one. You'se had the same midfield personnel i'd presume for the games you won fairly easily throughout the league?
Is Davy Harte injured or retired?
Think there's a lot of over-reaction on here re: the defeat yesterday... I would agree that the loss mightn't do anyone (supporters included) any harm in advance of a difficult Championship opener.
Sean Cavanagh is definitely not a WHF and should be played at FF - whether he likes it or not. I remember when he won player of the year at FF he was complaining that he preferred Midfield, however his best performances have always been at FF.
Someone mentioned above that if you stop Peter Harte you stop Tyrone - I'm not sure if I agree but what I would say is that it is a measure of the player that something like that is even being thought at such a young age.
Some posters also being very harsh on Aidan Cassidy - I remeber seeing him make a few appearances before he had that leg-break playing for Augher... Cassidy is a good player. Would have no worries about him - although who's winning the breaking ball from the half forward line? As someone pointed out, Dooher is (as he was always going to be) a massive loss in this regard.
One final thing - are people on here really saying that Tyrone's chances are gone becasue Ronan O'Neill and Kyle Coney are injured? Two young, relatively inexprienced players who weren't even guaranteed a stating place come championship????
Jesus wept....
Quote from: Jinxy on April 30, 2012, 09:44:42 AM
Quote from: Whishtup on April 29, 2012, 11:38:24 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on April 29, 2012, 08:17:10 PM
Quote from: Whishtup on April 29, 2012, 08:07:35 PM
Enjoyable enough game. Terrible reffing. Thought he was equally bad for both teams in the first half and then bad for Tyrone in the second. Wouldn't be too disappointed. I thought that Tyrone looked physically sharper and faster to the ball all over the pitch in the first half-just seemed to break down by trying to burst through the middle all the time. Sean should've been hauled off at half time. In fairness to Stevie he never got any ball put into him and Mugsy looks sharp enough. Bar one terrible pass, I thought Colm Cav put himself about well enough. Disappointing game by McCarron.
On another day, Tyrone could've been out of sight at half time.
Our game seemed to fall apart when the ref lost the plot while Kildare took their chances well. Won't do Tyrone a bit of harm to lose this one-they have the basis of a decent championship team on this showing but need to start picking of long distance scores.
On another day, a sniper on the roof of the nally stand could take out half the Kildare players.
'Pale' humour?
That's what it would have taken for Tyrone to be out of sight by half-time on 'another day'.
...'tis no wonder Meath are fecked these days...
Quote from: Paddy1804 on April 30, 2012, 11:33:55 AM
Think there's a lot of over-reaction on here re: the defeat yesterday... I would agree that the loss mightn't do anyone (supporters included) any harm in advance of a difficult Championship opener.
Sean Cavanagh is definitely not a WHF and should be played at FF - whether he likes it or not. I remember when he won player of the year at FF he was complaining that he preferred Midfield, however his best performances have always been at FF.
Someone mentioned above that if you stop Peter Harte you stop Tyrone - I'm not sure if I agree but what I would say is that it is a measure of the player that something like that is even being thought at such a young age.
Some posters also being very harsh on Aidan Cassidy - I remeber seeing him make a few appearances before he had that leg-break playing for Augher... Cassidy is a good player. Would have no worries about him - although who's winning the breaking ball from the half forward line? As someone pointed out, Dooher is (as he was always going to be) a massive loss in this regard.
One final thing - are people on here really saying that Tyrone's chances are gone becasue Ronan O'Neill and Kyle Coney are injured? Two young, relatively inexprienced players who weren't even guaranteed a stating place come championship????
Jesus wept....
Cavanaghs best performances have come from midfield. He did well at full forward in 2008, but he when on form at midfield he was untouchable.
IMHO and a lot of fellow Tyrone supporters they (Tyrone) were not thought to be All Ireland contenders, there are a few who like to stir the pot. Tyrone dominated div 2 a fairly ordinary div 2. That does not make you a contender for much. At the moment Tyrone are in the top 10 teams and maybe one of the better options outside of the big teams. That is all, Mayo, Down, Kildare and Donegal are all in as strong if not stronger position to be called all ireland contenders.
But Tyrone have to call the changes and Mickey seems to be doing his best to bring in fresh players, but it is upto these guys to push the older players and make the competition for positions tighter. Come the championship I think Tyrone will have a different look to them, I don't expect Sean to play at whf nor do I expect Harte to play at chb. Sean is only back from injury and come June will be in better shape. Hopefully Cassidy can stay injury free and get a bit of game time behind him. Tyrone can improve but a different game plan is now required.
Will the change in the square ball rule result in quick high ball being played in by every team to the tallest man they can find in the county?
Kildares subs in the last 10-15 mins seemed to make all the difference. Conor Gormley was badly exposed by no. 22.
I've put together a tactics piece on this for anyone interested http://action81.com/blog/?p=5760
Quote from: emmetryan on April 30, 2012, 12:47:01 PM
I've put together a tactics piece on this for anyone interested http://action81.com/blog/?p=5760
Quotebut the questions about their ability to create scores remain.
Kildare have no problem creating chances, at times they look they have trouble with execution but that is partly down to the simple tactic that a wide is better than a turn-over as a wide allows you organise your defence.
Quote from: cadhlancian on April 29, 2012, 10:50:11 PM
Tyroneman and Fuzz , I agree wholeheartedly! David Coldrick was simply put, not good. Tyrone made it easy for him by continually carrying the ball into the tackle. Sean Cavanagh is seems to have lost a considerable amount of pace, and seems to struggle to blow by players they way he used to , after dropping his shoulder. Bottom line, you wont be winning any All irelands with Colm Cav in the middle of the field, I strongly believe , that if he wasn't Sean's Brother, he wouldnt even be on the panel! Aidan Cassidy is average, as is Cathal McCarron. Mark Donnelly as stated was the standout performer, for the most part ploughing a lone furrow. Curran in goals hardly inspires confidence either. Young McKenna was also very average and for all the hype its games like today that he should be showing in.......should have been gone a lot earlier. Freetaking is at best sketchey! We are probably a coin toss everytime we get a free , whether we will score it or miss! The pace that had been evident throughout the league was not on show today, perhaps we got our pace a little earlier than most teams this year? Only positive....a good kick in the whole before the applemunchers! :o
Your typical a section of Tyrone supporters. Don't remember much chat from you when they won 12 games in a row and as soon as they lose one everyone is in for serious abuse. I don't even think you bothered going to the game? The lads put a lot of effort in and our the best in the county and don't deserve crap like that.
Colm Cavanagh played in a minor All Ireland winning team, played midfield for the u21s, played for Jordanstown and came on in the 2008 All Ireland final scoring the last point. So this is all down to him being Seans brother? He's had plenty of decent games this year when you didn't comment on him them. Despite being prone to errors he puts in a lot of work around the middle and is more than worth his place on the panel.
Niall McKenna starred on an All Ireland winning minor team a few years ago. But again he's picked cause of his name?
Anyone who thinks Mickey Harte picks players cause of their surname doesn't have a clue. Tyrone won't win every game they play and currently haven't got the best team in Ireland. So there's no point in these over the top reactions every time we lose a match.
Interesting tactical analysis there Emmet which I would strongly agree with
Your line below sums up Tyrone now for a number of years.
The theme for Tyrone's attack for most of the game was one of arduous effort with little reward
Whilst I used to see us (through rose-tinted glasses of course) as a great talented team that also worked our asses off, we now seem to work hard but not get as much return. Part of this is because other teams have tightened up defensively and put more focus on getting extra men into defence.
As so many have said we are too one dimensional with no plan B. Back in 2008 I think Harte was reluctant at first to copy Kerry and put a big man at the edge of the square. We know Mickey is a great manager but he can also be fierce stubborn and set in his ways. To me, yesterday, it would have been the ideal time to put Sean or even Cassidy into a 3 man FF line and so when we got possession around our own 40 or MF we kick it in long, right into the square the odd time. At least this change of pattern would mean the kildare sweepers would have to guess would it come low and short or over the top.
Ballymac I agree with a lot of what you said though I don't think Tyrone are as far back as top 10 just yet. The Armagh lads would love to believe so and keep telling us we're in denial about ourselves like they were after 2005.
I think players like Cassidy, both Cavanaghs are still great footballers and have shown that on other days but I think when we get into this tight swamped defensive type games where we don't adapt then these guys lose the ball a lot more and look bad.
Being able to lift your head up and see both a short pass is on or you know you can lay it in long to a big man in FF gives you so many more options.
As we often here the last few years. we were out Tyroned.
Well I'm tired of hearing that phrase as teams have moved on and passed us out with defensive strategies and we're still trying to play a possession game were all scores are hard earned.
Stevie and Mugsy can come running out, catch, turn and shoot as well as anyone still and ye can see MUgsy knows that and tries it often. He doesn't try to be beating men or to be giving passes to someone 1 yard away from him knowing a stray hand can come in and lose it.
I think we've still got the players to be there in the last 8 or even 4 but we definitely need to look at how we play and adapt to this new square ball rule change. My worry is though that Mickey will not change so readily and be out to prove those critics wrong that it is still a positive game to watch.
I was reading an article in our local paper before the game which included an interview with Emmet Bolton, in it he talked about their trip to Portugal. In total they had 20 training sessions over the 10 days. It was clear yesterday that this had a significant impact on their fitness as we were chasing shadows for the last 10 minutes and young Fogerty made hay and ran our FB line ragged when he came on. He looks like a great prospect (who needs Seanie?)
However, in my opinion the most significant impact of that training camp would have been the benefit to team morale and more importantly tactics. Kildare had our game plan sussed and when our bodies began to wilt we couldn’t break through to take our scores and nobody seemed willing to have a pop from 35 yards and when they did they didn’t come close. I don’t buy this crap about us not being near Sam, and similarly before Sunday, being up there with Dublin/Kerry etc. We are clearly not in the leading pack but we are definitely towards the front of the peloton
We have been playing some of our best football for years so far and had a bad day at the office yesterday. As someone already said it would have done no favours to have gone into the Athletic grounds with the tag of 13 wins out of 13 and being huge favourites. Hopefully this will provide the kick up the hole that we need to develop and real plan B, as when our running game is stopped we look lost. Every team in the country will have cottoned on to this and will be clogging up the ‘D’ when they meet us. On League Sunday Brolly highlighted the wall put up around the 30 and pointed out where the corner men had pulled out to the wings. Surely we should be mixing it up a bit more and using the decoy runs made by SoN etc. more often.
I think a few ideas (some already suggested) would be:
1. Use Mugsy around the 40. Although he is putting up some big scores he has got great vision and is looking for that killer foot pass all the time. SoN was completely isolated yesterday and, as he is such a confidence player, when he did get the ball he didn’t look on top form. See his simple free kick miss yesterday. We need to be giving him the ammo to cause damage.
2. Sean Cavanagh needs to move to either FF or MF. He is being completely bypassed at the minute and really looks a pale shadow of the player he was pre 2009. He needs a lot of space to run into or being close to goal where he can cause panic, win ball and bring others into play. He doesn’t really seem to be doing either at the minute.
Quote from: rrhf on April 30, 2012, 10:39:46 AM
Quote from: cadhlancian on April 29, 2012, 10:54:25 PM
Quote from: rrhf on April 29, 2012, 10:27:53 PM
Quote from: cadhlancian on April 29, 2012, 03:17:45 PM
Mc Kenna needs the curly finger!
That happened it didn't make one ball of blue, because he done better than 2 cavanaghs, 1 Cassidy, 1 Harte, 1 full back line etc. you and Mickey must be on the same wavelength. Our big players were caught out badly today, and thats why we lost yet it's easy to pick out the fringe players. Stork
McKenna was equally as bad as any you have mentioned. He was taken off with 5 mins to go, have yet to really see him shine. You talk about the bigger names, maybe he is getting on because of his own name??
Interesting perspective. It was you naming players and calling for curly fingers for just the one one player but you mentioned he was equally as bad as others. We won 2 balls in the second half in midfield and he won one. In the firts half he was involved in most scoring moves.An when other vaunted stars were sauntering around giving the ball away repetively for scores, you still singled out Mc Kenna. I really think you believe that because of his name he was selected, thats going to be hard to argue with.
Actually , I dont think that at all, it was yourself who said that others got to stay on because of who they were? Just making a point!
Quote from: Redhand Santa on April 30, 2012, 01:33:15 PM
Quote from: cadhlancian on April 29, 2012, 10:50:11 PM
Tyroneman and Fuzz , I agree wholeheartedly! David Coldrick was simply put, not good. Tyrone made it easy for him by continually carrying the ball into the tackle. Sean Cavanagh is seems to have lost a considerable amount of pace, and seems to struggle to blow by players they way he used to , after dropping his shoulder. Bottom line, you wont be winning any All irelands with Colm Cav in the middle of the field, I strongly believe , that if he wasn't Sean's Brother, he wouldnt even be on the panel! Aidan Cassidy is average, as is Cathal McCarron. Mark Donnelly as stated was the standout performer, for the most part ploughing a lone furrow. Curran in goals hardly inspires confidence either. Young McKenna was also very average and for all the hype its games like today that he should be showing in.......should have been gone a lot earlier. Freetaking is at best sketchey! We are probably a coin toss everytime we get a free , whether we will score it or miss! The pace that had been evident throughout the league was not on show today, perhaps we got our pace a little earlier than most teams this year? Only positive....a good kick in the whole before the applemunchers! :o
Your typical a section of Tyrone supporters. Don't remember much chat from you when they won 12 games in a row and as soon as they lose one everyone is in for serious abuse. I don't even think you bothered going to the game? The lads put a lot of effort in and our the best in the county and don't deserve crap like that.
Colm Cavanagh played in a minor All Ireland winning team, played midfield for the u21s, played for Jordanstown and came on in the 2008 All Ireland final scoring the last point. So this is all down to him being Seans brother? He's had plenty of decent games this year when you didn't comment on him them. Despite being prone to errors he puts in a lot of work around the middle and is more than worth his place on the panel.
Niall McKenna starred on an All Ireland winning minor team a few years ago. But again he's picked cause of his name?
Anyone who thinks Mickey Harte picks players cause of their surname doesn't have a clue. Tyrone won't win every game they play and currently haven't got the best team in Ireland. So there's no point in these over the top reactions every time we lose a match.
[/quoteYes you are correct, I didnt get to the match, watched it on the box ( due to the fact I live 6000 miles from home now ::)) You miss the point about Colm and McKenna. By the time Colm came on the minor scene, Sean was Irelands youngest rising star, " the new Jack O'Shea?". So everybody had this anticipation about this younger brother that was coming along as well. As for McKenna, umm but did you know he had a slightly famous daddy? One of Tyrones greatest ever players. What I am NOT saying is that they cant play football, what I AM saying is that perhaps they had a slight leg up versus A.N Other form Clonoe or Aghaloo etc??
I'd say it's more a case of his name leaving him open to more stick. As for your comments about Colum living off Sean, in the past 2 years he has been twice the footballer Sean is.
The amount of over reaction here is ridiculous. Look things just didn't fall for Tyrone yesterday. Everything just seemed a little out in terms of timing. Better it happened here than against Armagh.
I'd have been impatient over the last couple of years looking changes to the side but now they've been made I'm more than happy to have a bit of patience with the team. There's still 2-3 players to come back into that team that'll strengthen Tyrone before the championship.
The one thing I would say and I've seen 11 of the 13 games Tyrone have played this year is that the team have a much greater fluency without Sean Cavanagh than they have had with him in the team. I know he's one of the best players in the country on his day but I don't think he's had a position he can call his own on the team for a couple of years. I don't think he does enough defensive work for midfield and he's not a natural enough finisher for full forward. Bit harsh I know. Wouldn't mind seeing him at centre half forward. Would offer a very different threat there.
Form is temporary, class is permanent.
S Cav, S O'Neill, E Mulligan etc etc have still got it. One bad day and all yous think is doom and gloom.
Get yer heads out of yer arses, Tyrone will have more of a say than Kildare this year come business end of the season. Would Kerry, Dublin, Cork rather face Tyrone or Kildare? Division 2 finals mean nothing, Tyrone are still the most feared team in Ireland. Mickey Harte has more management skill in his little finger than any other manager full-stop. We'll walk Ulster and Sam is ours if we get the breaks.
some tyrone players living on reputations...............only as good as your last game......
Jaysus ck have you lost the plot altogether? We are now the most feared team in Ireland? I think you may find a few people that would disagree there.
McConnell
Gormley - Justy - McCrory
Joe - Harte - McNabb
Cassidy - Murphy
Donnelly - Colm Cavanagh - Penrose
O'Neill - Sean - Mugsy
Quote from: ONeill on April 30, 2012, 11:51:13 PM
McConnell
Gormley - Justy - McCrory
Joe - Harte - McNabb
Cassidy - Murphy
Donnelly - Colm Cavanagh - Penrose
O'Neill - Sean - Mugsy
mc mahon lads dont play enough football they in the last 12 months or so look so rusty
Four players played every league game this year. McCrory, McCarron, Harte and Donnelly. Can see Mickey picking something more like this.
McConnell
McCrory - Justy - Gormley
Red Sean - Harte - McCarron
Sean - Joe
McNabb - Donnelly - Colm
O'Neill - Penrose - Mulligan
McCaul or Quinn could just as easily be picked at 5. McNabb has done enough to hold down his place. He'll play around the 45 anyway.
I think Justy has been a bit sharper this year than he was last, which mightn't be hard. Couple of club games before Armagh and hopefully he'll be ready to go. I'm a big Cassidy fan but I just think Mickey will want to accomodate Sean somewhere, where he can influence the game.
Petie had his off day hoPefully on Sunday, was totally anonymous, he will be better the next day, the clambouring to accommodate Sean at the teams expense is frightening. We all know he hasn't been himself for 3 seasons.
Tyrone buckos......................experience counts for alot I know but surely conor gormley should be an impact sub at best.............. consistent fouling, and has lost his pace at this level
Quote from: CK_Redhand on April 30, 2012, 11:27:47 PM
Form is temporary, class is permanent.
S Cav, S O'Neill, E Mulligan etc etc have still got it. One bad day and all yous think is doom and gloom.
Get yer heads out of yer arses, Tyrone will have more of a say than Kildare this year come business end of the season. Would Kerry, Dublin, Cork rather face Tyrone or Kildare? Division 2 finals mean nothing, Tyrone are still the most feared team in Ireland. Mickey Harte has more management skill in his little finger than any other manager full-stop. We'll walk Ulster and Sam is ours if we get the breaks.
and youre telling others to get their head out their arses? Agood team yes, potentially very good. The most feared team in Irealnd? Not by a long shot
Thinks Gromely is past it at this level, exposed for pace to often in the in the past 15 months. On another point, this game could have gone Tyrones way. When Tyrone were one point up with 10 mins left approx, I think the score was 10/9, O'Neill missed a seriously easy free to go two up, followed by a brutal decesion by the ref not to award Donnelly a foul when he was pulled down (wtached this about 10 times on sky+ and couldn't believe the decesion)for another tap over free to go 3 up. The result of not awarding a free was Kildare countered and scored a point, bringing the game level. These are the small inches that decide a teams momentum in the winning phase of the game.
I was sittin in croker on sunday gettin me ballix friz and had the same prescient feeling that i had in 2002 in the sligo game. then as on sunday Tyrone were ahead on the score board but looked like they were losing.
we all know what happened the following year.
can we say that big sean n gormley etc etc are anywhere near match fit?
my thinking would be similar to yourself Oneill
1.McConnell
2.McCrory/Quinn - both quite sinilar and either could do a job for you in the corner
3.Joe- tyrones best full back IMO. could possibly offer something out the field aswell, but gave one of the best displays at full back i have seen against armagh last year
4.Gormley -still top class, despite what people are saying. sunday was his first intercounty game in quite a while. big game player
5. mccarron - has done enough over league campaign to have nailled down a spot
6. Harte- class act and will be iven that 'free' role from deep
7.Justy - out of sorts lately, but still a class footballer and could give us that extra drive from WHB now that jordan has gone
8&9. 2 from Cassidy /Murphy/colly cav. All 3 have played well at different periods this year & very little between them
10.mcnabb- will play as the second CHB to accommodate hartes licence to roam
11.mugsy- one of tyrones best foot passers of the ball, and could be a creative spark at CHF
12.Donnelly - one of tyrones best performers of late
13.O'Neill - forming a very dangerous FF paring with sean. get it in early to them with mugsy helping to provide the quality ball needed
14. Sean Cav - poor on sunday, and hasnt been at his best since playing at FF in 2008. i would put him back there
15.Penrose- playing out ithe WHF position vacated by mc nabb
I'd be happy with that team blewuporstuffed but I'd still prefer to have a 3 man FF line or at least stop all this mindless running into traffic tactic. I've seen too much of it now and its sore on the eyes
I was watching the game on Sunday and I saw Penrose coming on I couldn't help but think that we needed something different. I would love to have seen Johnny Lafferty get a chance, big fella with great speed and feet and can take scores from distance.
Quote from: rrhf on May 01, 2012, 06:44:12 AM
Petie had his off day hoPefully on Sunday, was totally anonymous, he will be better the next day, the clambouring to accommodate Sean at the teams expense is frightening. We all know he hasn't been himself for 3 seasons.
No doubt you'd start McKenna before him lol. Listen if Tyrone are going to do compete with the top teams this year they're going to need Cavanagh back playing well. I thought he showed signs of improvement in the second half on Sunday. He hasn't reached the heights of 2008 in the last few years but the potential is still there. I've no doubt if he stays injury free he'll improve as the year goes on. I also think people were very harsh on Gormley - he was poor on Sunday but we seen last year it can take him a while to get into things after a break.
I have no doubt Tyrone will be better prepared come the championship. A few players like Cassidy, Gormley and Cavanagh got much needed game time. I think a change in nets will definitely happen come championship and should improve things a bit. Would also be hopeful of a fit Justin McMahon. Not to concerned about losing a division 2 final though certain performances and the way the team played were worrying.
Are people forgetting about Mattie Donnelly or just not rating him? He had a great start to the year and I think he can not be far away from a start again when fit.
I wouldn't have minded seeing Donnelly playing the full forward role that McKenna did. He must have been injured on Sunday though cause wasn't named on the bench. Thought he did very well against Derry in the league.
Any word on Aiden McCrory?
Quote from: omagh_gael on May 01, 2012, 10:12:28 PM
Any word on Aiden McCrory?
Ok. Returned on the team bus.
Quote from: Redhand Santa on May 01, 2012, 09:12:55 PM
Quote from: rrhf on May 01, 2012, 06:44:12 AM
Petie had his off day hoPefully on Sunday, was totally anonymous, he will be better the next day, the clambouring to accommodate Sean at the teams expense is frightening. We all know he hasn't been himself for 3 seasons.
No doubt you'd start McKenna before him lol. Listen if Tyrone are going to do compete with the top teams this year they're going to need Cavanagh back playing well. I thought he showed signs of improvement in the second half on Sunday. He hasn't reached the heights of 2008 in the last few years but the potential is still there. I've no doubt if he stays injury free he'll improve as the year goes on. I also think people were very harsh on Gormley - he was poor on Sunday but we seen last year it can take him a while to get into things after a break.
I have no doubt Tyrone will be better prepared come the championship. A few players like Cassidy, Gormley and Cavanagh got much needed game time. I think a change in nets will definitely happen come championship and should improve things a bit. Would also be hopeful of a fit Justin McMahon. Not to concerned about losing a division 2 final though certain performances and the way the team played were worrying.
LOL ironically Mc Kenna had a much better game than both on Sunday - his marker didnt do the damage that theirs did and was involved in play much more, but its childish to play the guys off against each other to win your point. Id agree with you totally that Tyrone need a strong competitive Sean Cavanagh on the field to have any hope of winning anything this year, and if you think thats likely to be the case then Ill take that. Even if a player goes off the boil and has poor luck and the efforts still there ye must give the time. Unfortunately there was a few saying after Sunday that the body language wasnt indicating huge interest.
Quote from: CK_Redhand on April 30, 2012, 11:27:47 PM
Form is temporary, class is permanent.
S Cav, S O'Neill, E Mulligan etc etc have still got it. One bad day and all yous think is doom and gloom.
Get yer heads out of yer arses, Tyrone will have more of a say than Kildare this year come business end of the season. Would Kerry, Dublin, Cork rather face Tyrone or Kildare? Division 2 finals mean nothing, Tyrone are still the most feared team in Ireland. Mickey Harte has more management skill in his little finger than any other manager full-stop. We'll walk Ulster and Sam is ours if we get the breaks.
WOW, ive never read such bullshit in my life. Talk about sweeping a poor performance under the carpet, that ought to fix the issues right out ???
Quote from: Fuzzman on May 01, 2012, 01:30:03 PM
I'd be happy with that team blewuporstuffed but I'd still prefer to have a 3 man FF line or at least stop all this mindless running into traffic tactic. I've seen too much of it now and its sore on the eyes
Think the 2 man FF line can work, would like to see Seany C up there will O'Neill. You would imagine on their day, they would take a bit marking. I would agree with BUOS FF line and let Penrose roam as he usually does.
Mickey signs on for another 3 years.