Gerry Adams hurls tribute at unionist icon Edward Carson with GAA trophy (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/gerry-adams-hurls-tribute-at-unionist-icon-edward-carson-with-gaa-trophy-14880948.html)
A new GAA trophy has been named after the founding father of unionism.
Competitors in the first hurling event in the Stormont estate in Belfast will be playing for the Edward Carson trophy.
On face value, the Dubliner who led the campaign against Irish independence a century ago is an unusual choice for anyone looking to christen a prize for the nationalist sport.
But Sinn Fein MP Gerry Adams, who has helped organise the inaugural 'Poc ar an Cnoc' (Puck on the Hill) which will take place below Carson's famous statue in Stormont next month, thought otherwise.
"I discovered, much to my surprise, that Carson was a hurler in his days at Trinity College (Dublin)," he explained at Parliament Buildings yesterday.
He added: "He got an honourable mention in the Irish Sportsman (journal of the day) as having distinguished himself on the field, so we thought it would be a great idea to have an Edward Carson trophy."
The Poc Fada (long puck) will see hurlers hitting sliotars (hurling balls) up the mile-long Prince of Wales Avenue.
Boys a boys ............ ::)
A historian and Gerry were both on Radio Ulster this morning and the historian basically said that Gerry was wrong, that Carson in fact played "hurley" which was a forerunner to the hockey club in Trinity, not hurling.
Poor Gerry - but he recovered well enough from it.
Is it not also said that Carson played (in his youth) hurling in Athenry. Whatever about the club in Trinity, the Athenry version (before founding of GAA and codification) was hurling. The Trinity club version really being hockey, but called Hurley sounds a bit revisionist to me. More likely that the game was proto hurling but when the nationalist GAA codified the rules, TCD redirected towards the Hockey rules.
Quote from: armaghniac on July 20, 2010, 02:53:26 PM
Is it not also said that Carson played (in his youth) hurling in Athenry. Whatever about the club in Trinity, the Athenry version (before founding of GAA and codification) was hurling. The Trinity club version really being hockey, but called Hurley sounds a bit revisionist to me. More likely that the game was proto hurling but when the nationalist GAA codified the rules, TCD redirected towards the Hockey rules.
Sounds about right. The rugby club in Trinity is called Dublin University FC. By the historian's logic, they played 'football' yet I don't think anyone would suggest today that they played anything other than rugby union
A GAA trophy?
Gerry names a trophy for hurling and it becomes a "GAA Trophy?"
How does that happen?
Good question Pints, obviously nothing to do with GAA
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 20, 2010, 07:09:25 PM
A GAA trophy?
Gerry names a trophy for hurling and it becomes a "GAA Trophy?"
How does that happen?
SF Publicity Stunt
Quote from: Rois on July 20, 2010, 02:18:30 PM
A historian and Gerry were both on Radio Ulster this morning and the historian basically said that Gerry was wrong, that Carson in fact played "hurley" which was a forerunner to the hockey club in Trinity, not hurling.
Poor Gerry - but he recovered well enough from it.
I thought that the historian was disagreeing with the content of the Trinity Hockey club website, not with G Adams.
By the way Rois, when are we going to see you on the New and Improved Hot Ladies Thread?
Quote from: Orior on July 20, 2010, 09:33:59 PM
Quote from: Rois on July 20, 2010, 02:18:30 PM
A historian and Gerry were both on Radio Ulster this morning and the historian basically said that Gerry was wrong, that Carson in fact played "hurley" which was a forerunner to the hockey club in Trinity, not hurling.
Poor Gerry - but he recovered well enough from it.
I thought that the historian was disagreeing with the content of the Trinity Hockey club website, not with G Adams.
By the way Rois, when are we going to see you on the New and Improved Hot Ladies Thread?
have to agree with rois, gerry was told it had more in common with hockey and came to dublin from the uper crust english. it would be nice for sammy wilson to win it though
From the TCD site
http://www.gaa.tcdlife.ie/Hurling/history.html (http://www.gaa.tcdlife.ie/Hurling/history.html)
Cumann Iománaíochta Coláiste na Tríonóide is one of the oldest clubs in the history of GAA. Trinity College Hurley Club predates the G.A.A and their activities and attitudes in that time were important factors in stimulating Michael Cusack to initiate the establishment of An Cumann Lúthchleas Gael in 1884.
In 1879, the first meeting of the Irish Hurling Union was held in House 17 of Botany Bay in Trinity College. The college Hurling Club had played hurling in College Park as early as 1810. The club colours were originally green and black. Trinity College Hockey Club was founded out of the hurling club, and they continue to wear green and black. The original Hurling Club counted amongst its members one Edward Carson, later to make his name in an entirely different field.
There was also reference to this in The GAA: A People's History – Mike Cronin, Mark Duncan and Paul Rouse (Collins Press). I cant find my copy (borrowed by little brother) right now but the Trinity Hockey connection is covered.
Quote from: ardmhachaabu on July 20, 2010, 09:22:08 PM
Quote from: pintsofguinness on July 20, 2010, 07:09:25 PM
A GAA trophy?
Gerry names a trophy for hurling and it becomes a "GAA Trophy?"
How does that happen?
SF Publicity Stunt
If any other party did that you would be praising it as a "wonderful step forward" or some other waffle! Me thinks you wouldn't even be happy with a SF press release if you were allowed write it yourself.
Edward Carson was prosecuting counsel in the trial of Oscar Wilde that ultimately brought about his demise.
He doesn't deserve to have shit named after him, whatever about the other stuff he was involved with.
Quote from: dec on July 20, 2010, 02:13:36 PM
Gerry Adams hurls tribute at unionist icon Edward Carson with GAA trophy (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/gerry-adams-hurls-tribute-at-unionist-icon-edward-carson-with-gaa-trophy-14880948.html)
A new GAA trophy has been named after the founding father of unionism.
Competitors in the first hurling event in the Stormont estate in Belfast will be playing for the Edward Carson trophy.
On face value, the Dubliner who led the campaign against Irish independence a century ago is an unusual choice for anyone looking to christen a prize for the nationalist sport.
But Sinn Fein MP Gerry Adams, who has helped organise the inaugural 'Poc ar an Cnoc' (Puck on the Hill) which will take place below Carson's famous statue in Stormont next month, thought otherwise.
"I discovered, much to my surprise, that Carson was a hurler in his days at Trinity College (Dublin)," he explained at Parliament Buildings yesterday.
He added: "He got an honourable mention in the Irish Sportsman (journal of the day) as having distinguished himself on the field, so we thought it would be a great idea to have an Edward Carson trophy."
The Poc Fada (long puck) will see hurlers hitting sliotars (hurling balls) up the mile-long Prince of Wales Avenue.
Point of order; This will not be the first hurling competition played on the estate grounds of Stormont.
There was a 7 aside interfirms tournament played in 2000 I think between Northern firms. There was also a gaelic football tournament played at the same time..
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on July 22, 2010, 10:04:24 AM
Edward Carson was prosecuting counsel in the trial of Oscar Wilde that ultimately brought about his demise.
He doesn't deserve to have shit named after him, whatever about the other stuff he was involved with.
Well said.
The legend goes that Setanta as a young boy wanted more than anything else to become a warrior and join the Red Branch Knights of Ulster.
These were renowned warriors who defended Ireland. Their leader was Conor Mac Nessa the High King.
When he was 10 Setanta told his anxious parents that he was going off to Eamhain Macha (near Armagh) to join the Red Branch Knights. They tried to dissuade him but he was determined. And one sunny morning in May he headed off with his sliothar (ball) and his caman (stick).
As he made his way across the Cooley mountains he would strike his sliothar with his caman and then chase after it catching it before it hit the ground.
Eventually he reached Eamhain Macha. He joined in a game of hurley with the Kings son and others much older than himself and impressed everyone with his skill; slayed the hound of Cullan, the Kings blacksmith, by hitting his sliothar down its throat as it attacked him; and earned himself the name by which he is best remembered - Cuchullain – the Hound of Cullan.
50 years ago a Catholic priest Fr. Pól Mac Sheáin and the Naomh Moninne club in the Cooley's used this story as the basis for the first Poc Fada – long puck. The purpose was simple – to test the mettle of hurlers by mapping out a set distance in which hurlers hit their sliothar as hard and a s far as they could. The winner is the person who covers the course in the least number of pucks.
Some years ago this blog persuaded Féile an Phobail to hold the west Belfast equivalent of the Poc Fada. It is very popular and it has been run every year since then by Rossa GAC.
It has been held in GAA grounds, the Falls Park and on the Black Mountain above the city.
Its great craic and all of the participants enjoy the camaraderie and the competition.
Last November this blog hosted a tree dedication ceremony in the grounds of the Stormont estate to mark 125 years of An Cumann Luthchleas Gael.
That event was to celebrate the positive impact the GAA has had on society in Ireland.
In the course of it I pointed across to the statue of Edward Carson who is identified with militant unionism, but who as a student at Trinity College in Dublin was a member of their hurling team.
In Montgomery Hyde's biography of Carson it is recorded that 'on one occasion he was mentioned by a local sporting journal, The Irish Sportsman, as having distinguished himself on the field.'
Many other leading protestant figures were also involved in gaelic games.
They include Roger Casement, who was executed in 1916 by the British; Douglas Hyde who was the first President of Ireland and a founder of Conradh na Gaeilge and Sam Maguire, a leading GAA figure after whom the all-Ireland Senior Mens football trophy is named.
So, when we came to discuss this years programme for Féile and the arrangements for the Poc Fada, I suggested that this blog would host the Poc Fada in the grounds of the Stormont estate. Hence the Poc ar an Chnoc – the Puck on the Hill.
And from that came the idea of a celebrity Poc Fada and trophy to commemorate the fact that Carson was a hurley player. And that was agreed.
So August 7th will see a full day of events on the grounds of the Stormont estate. A day in which young and old, all stars and first timers can exhibit their sporting prowess.
Gerry Adams Blog
As well as the Carson competition and trophy the Poc Fada will also include senior men and women's competitions and an under 10 camogie and hurling Blitz which will be held on the top lawn in front of Parliament Buildings.
The senior women's and men's competition will have invited competitors.
What money is raised will be given to the 'The City of the Angels Foundation'.
This Foundation is run by Fr Pat Clarke, originally from Co. Clare. A month ago he visited Parliament Buildings and we talked for an hour about his work. The Foundation does amazing work in very difficult and dangerous conditions. It comprises a Centre for Art and Culture in a major shanty town (favela) in the Brazilian City of Sao Paulo, as well as a Centre for Art, Ecology and Spirituality situated in the Atlantic Forest two hours distant from the City.
Through the medium of the arts, the Foundation tries to prevent children of the shanty towns from falling victim to the drug culture, to violence and organized crime. Their website is www.cityoftheangelsfoundation.org
A worthy cause. So if you want to help good people trying to save children from the scourge of drugs and crime, or if you just want a great day out – then come along to the Stormont estate on August 7th.
Finally, a word of thanks to all of those who have helped make this possible: Maire Grogan, Catherine Murphy, Pat Maginn, Niall Maginn, Gerry McClory, Sean McGuinness, Denis Rocks, , Mary Herald, Bridgeen Heenan, and Martin Donnelly from M Donnelly & Co Ltd Dublin, specialising in Power tools and Accessories who are the main sponsor for the event.
Poor Gerry doesn't know whether he's coming or going these days. Still desperately trying to cling to the mantles of Gaelic and Republican, yet committed to a partitionist settlement. It can't be easy trying to steer two ships.
Quote from: TransitVanMan on July 22, 2010, 11:59:00 AM
Poor Gerry doesn't know whether he's coming or going these days. Still desperately trying to cling to the mantles of Gaelic and Republican, yet committed to a partitionist settlement. It can't be easy trying to steer two ships.
Don't you worry your wee head about him ,he will be OK has plenty of support in the community for his stance as the elections keep showing.
Quote from: glens abu on July 22, 2010, 12:03:43 PM
Quote from: TransitVanMan on July 22, 2010, 11:59:00 AM
Poor Gerry doesn't know whether he's coming or going these days. Still desperately trying to cling to the mantles of Gaelic and Republican, yet committed to a partitionist settlement. It can't be easy trying to steer two ships.
Don't you worry your wee head about him ,he will be OK has plenty of support in the community for his stance as the elections keep showing.
Would that be the occupied six county elections? Certainly not the elections in the south. And does that mean he had no support when he wasn't doing well in the elctions.
Quote from: TransitVanMan on July 22, 2010, 02:38:23 PM
Quote from: glens abu on July 22, 2010, 12:03:43 PM
Quote from: TransitVanMan on July 22, 2010, 11:59:00 AM
Poor Gerry doesn't know whether he's coming or going these days. Still desperately trying to cling to the mantles of Gaelic and Republican, yet committed to a partitionist settlement. It can't be easy trying to steer two ships.
Don't you worry your wee head about him ,he will be OK has plenty of support in the community for his stance as the elections keep showing.
Would that be the occupied six county elections? Certainly not the elections in the south. And does that mean he had no support when he wasn't doing well in the elctions.
Of course its the elections in the occupied six as thats were his constituency is[West Belfast].Has only ever lost one election since he 1st stood in 1983 and he still got 17,000 votes in that one so to answer your second question yes he still had big support within his own community even when he lost. :P
Quote from: glens abu on July 23, 2010, 12:25:12 PM
Quote from: TransitVanMan on July 22, 2010, 02:38:23 PM
Quote from: glens abu on July 22, 2010, 12:03:43 PM
Quote from: TransitVanMan on July 22, 2010, 11:59:00 AM
Poor Gerry doesn't know whether he's coming or going these days. Still desperately trying to cling to the mantles of Gaelic and Republican, yet committed to a partitionist settlement. It can't be easy trying to steer two ships.
Don't you worry your wee head about him ,he will be OK has plenty of support in the community for his stance as the elections keep showing.
Would that be the occupied six county elections? Certainly not the elections in the south. And does that mean he had no support when he wasn't doing well in the elctions.
Of course its the elections in the occupied six as thats were his constituency is[West Belfast].Has only ever lost one election since he 1st stood in 1983 and he still got 17,000 votes in that one so to answer your second question yes he still had big support within his own community even when he lost. :P
Ah yes indeed, it's not about unity or 32 anymore is it, just being the big fish in the little pool is enough now it seems to subdue some unruly upstarts. For how long will the sheep blindly follow the forked tongued leader?
Quote from: johnneycool on July 22, 2010, 10:31:21 AM
Quote from: dec on July 20, 2010, 02:13:36 PM
Gerry Adams hurls tribute at unionist icon Edward Carson with GAA trophy (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/gerry-adams-hurls-tribute-at-unionist-icon-edward-carson-with-gaa-trophy-14880948.html)
A new GAA trophy has been named after the founding father of unionism.
Competitors in the first hurling event in the Stormont estate in Belfast will be playing for the Edward Carson trophy.
On face value, the Dubliner who led the campaign against Irish independence a century ago is an unusual choice for anyone looking to christen a prize for the nationalist sport.
But Sinn Fein MP Gerry Adams, who has helped organise the inaugural 'Poc ar an Cnoc' (Puck on the Hill) which will take place below Carson's famous statue in Stormont next month, thought otherwise.
"I discovered, much to my surprise, that Carson was a hurler in his days at Trinity College (Dublin)," he explained at Parliament Buildings yesterday.
He added: "He got an honourable mention in the Irish Sportsman (journal of the day) as having distinguished himself on the field, so we thought it would be a great idea to have an Edward Carson trophy."
The Poc Fada (long puck) will see hurlers hitting sliotars (hurling balls) up the mile-long Prince of Wales Avenue.
Point of order; This will not be the first hurling competition played on the estate grounds of Stormont.
There was a 7 aside interfirms tournament played in 2000 I think between Northern firms. There was also a gaelic football tournament played at the same time..
In the 1990s the Irish Civil Service played the NI Civil Service at Stormont in both hurling and football.
QuoteEdward Carson was prosecuting counsel in the trial of Oscar Wilde that ultimately brought about his demise.
Not correct. Be defended Lord Queensbury in a libel action take by Wilde that ultimately brought about his demise.
I see the Transit Driver is from Londonderry, does that mean they get two goes at Sam or are they like Fingal and South Down only a National League Team?
It's good to see SF making Stormont more receptive to Gaelic Culture, it can only be done from with in.
Yes Londonderry,as in the new UK city of culture. The bid to become COCUK :D was strongly supported by Gerry's co-pilot, Gerry Fitt Martin McGuinness.
Gota hand it to you that was a bit of a sellout. At least there's no London in Armagh!!
Quote from: Applesisapples on July 27, 2010, 01:01:44 PM
Gota hand it to you that was a bit of a sellout. At least there's no London in Armagh!!
your right apples it was a massive sell out ok :o it will take us some time to get over it but sure the super Republicans in watties will sort it all out for us with all their hard work towards the republic
Quote from: Lecale2 on July 23, 2010, 06:15:44 PM
QuoteEdward Carson was prosecuting counsel in the trial of Oscar Wilde that ultimately brought about his demise.
Not correct. Be defended Lord Queensbury in a libel action take by Wilde that ultimately brought about his demise.
yep, you're right. And the p***k wouldn't take the case initially, until some henchmen of Queensbury had bribed and blackmailed a load of young lads to agree to testify against him. He gave that evidence to Carson and then and only then, when he was sure he couldn't lose, did he take the case. So, yes, initially (and technically) he was acting as defense for Queensbury, but the entire context of the trial changed around and he was acting more as prosecution, despite being in defense. Either way, f**k him.
double post
Quote from: glens abu on July 27, 2010, 01:18:09 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on July 27, 2010, 01:01:44 PM
Gota hand it to you that was a bit of a sellout. At least there's no London in Armagh!!
your right apples it was a massive sell out ok :o it will take us some time to get over it but sure the super Republicans in watties will sort it all out for us with all their hard work towards the republic
Quote from: TransitVanMan on July 30, 2010, 09:55:37 AM
Quote from: glens abu on July 27, 2010, 01:18:09 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on July 27, 2010, 01:01:44 PM
Gota hand it to you that was a bit of a sellout. At least there's no London in Armagh!!
your right apples it was a massive sell out ok :o it will take us some time to get over it but sure the super Republicans in watties will sort it all out for us with all their hard work towards the republic
:D :D I knew that would be lost on you,its called sarcasm ;)
No actually it wasn't. Maybe the smiley was a clue. But read again and you see that all I was doing was emphasizing my original point. I knew that would be lost on you and your ilk, it's called sincerity. ;)
Quote from: TransitVanMan on July 30, 2010, 11:47:29 AM
No actually it wasn't. Maybe the smiley was a clue. But read again and you see that all I was doing was emphasizing my original point. I knew that would be lost on you and your ilk, it's called sincerity. ;)
yeah sure you keystone cop Republicans from L'Derry would know a lot about that. :o
Seems you don't know as much about sarcasm as you think but that not surprise me. Fools like you need to be fed a line. Try thinking for yourself for a change.
Glens Abu should be finished his An Phoblacht paper round about now. Won't be long until we have a united Ireland with his ilk pulling the strings.
Quote from: Trout on July 30, 2010, 10:57:57 PM
Glens Abu should be finished his An Phoblacht paper round about now. Won't be long until we have a united Ireland with his ilk pulling the strings.
;D No I wasn't out selling An Phoblacht although I have done many times and have been proud to do so,as a great man once said"Everyone Republican or otherwise,has their own particular part to play.No part is too great or too small;no one is too old or too young to do something" but I wouldn't expect you Mickey Mouse Republicans to practice that as you are too busy fighting with each other and writing hate mail.So away off ,call for Transitvanman collect your toy guns and play war games. ;)
I take it that you and your ilk now file in under the banner of "otherwise", now that you've jettisoned all Republican ideals.
Quote from: TransitVanMan on August 04, 2010, 03:52:55 PM
I take it that you and your ilk now file in under the banner of "otherwise", now that you've jettisoned all Republican ideals.
:D Great reply,see you boys have another splinter group ;D Real Sinn Fein,how many is that now 8 Super Republican groupings.
Quote from: glens abu on August 05, 2010, 10:09:01 AM
Quote from: TransitVanMan on August 04, 2010, 03:52:55 PM
I take it that you and your ilk now file in under the banner of "otherwise", now that you've jettisoned all Republican ideals.
:D Great reply,see you boys have another splinter group ;D Real Sinn Fein,how many is that now 8 Super Republican groupings.
I don't follow any group, I'll leave that up to you. You've just pointed out how dis-jointed (defeated) Republicanism is now since the SF surrender. Thanks anyway for proving my point that you can't think for yourself.
Lads, wtf has this to do with Hurling anymore? Ye've moved way on from the Gerry Adams Puckathon.
Quote from: TransitVanMan on August 05, 2010, 02:38:15 PM
Quote from: glens abu on August 05, 2010, 10:09:01 AM
Quote from: TransitVanMan on August 04, 2010, 03:52:55 PM
I take it that you and your ilk now file in under the banner of "otherwise", now that you've jettisoned all Republican ideals.
:D Great reply,see you boys have another splinter group ;D Real Sinn Fein,how many is that now 8 Super Republican groupings.
I don't follow any group, I'll leave that up to you. You've just pointed out how dis-jointed (defeated) Republicanism is now since the SF surrender. Thanks anyway for proving my point that you can't think for yourself.
Jumped ship ;D that doesn't surprise me.You might think Republicanism is defeated but not me,will always believe in the Republic and always work towards it.When the going gets tough and all that but sure defeatists like you would know nothing about that.Sinn e.
Quote from: glens abu on August 06, 2010, 09:23:03 AM
will always believe in the Republic and always work towards it.
More party speak. ::)
So you don't believe that there is a fundamental contradiction between accepting the legitimacy of a state, of its laws and institutions, the constitutional system and the rules of parliamentarism and agreeing to operate within their framework; and working towards a Republic.
Quote from: TransitVanMan on August 06, 2010, 12:30:18 PM
Quote from: glens abu on August 06, 2010, 09:23:03 AM
will always believe in the Republic and always work towards it.
More party speak. ::)
So you don't believe that there is a fundamental contradiction between accepting the legitimacy of a state, of its laws and institutions, the constitutional system and the rules of parliamentarism and agreeing to operate within their framework; and working towards a Republic.
Not in the least sure we all have to work within the laws and institutions of the state but that doesn't stop you trying to change that state and work towards Irish unity.Do you believe that once the war was over we all should just except what we have got and not try and change it.
Edwdard Carson was a founder member of the UVF and all through his kept the connection with Britain his number one priority. He may have sampled hurling for a bit , does this mean we name trophies after him.
SF yet again throw away their culture, after Derry being voted 'UK city of Culture' with big marty's backing, does this come as a surprise.
IN DERRY CITY THERE ARE 3 CITY COUNCIL GAA PITCHES (WITH SOCCER PITCHES ACROSS THEM WHICH OF COURSE SOCCER GET FIRST USEAGES), AND YOU HAVE TO BOOK THE GAA PITCHES 4 DAYS IN ADVANCE. AND INSTEAD SINN FEIN IN THE TOWN PROMOTING THEIR OWN CULTURE THEY ARE TOO FUCKED UP WITH THE BRITISH IDENTITY!
Quote from: glens abu on August 06, 2010, 02:35:24 PM
Not in the least sure we all have to work within the laws and institutions of the state but that doesn't stop you trying to change that state and work towards Irish unity.Do you believe that once the war was over we all should just except what we have got and not try and change it.
But SF did exactly that, they have accepted all that the Brits have given them,down to the last penny. Is the war over then?.
so who won the Poc Fada then?
Graham Clarke with Mark Sidearse winning the celeb event.