Sorry if this is here already, I couldn't find it.
http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/mhsneymhidau/ (http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/mhsneymhidau/)
13/01/2009 - 19:08:45
A senior Sinn Féin politician today compared Ireland's only Jewish TD and the Israeli ambassador to a notorious Nazi propagandist.
Aengus Ó Snodaigh launched the outspoken attack on the pair during a parliamentary committee hearing into the conflict in Gaza.
The Sinn Féin justice, equality and international affairs spokesman accused Ambassador Zion Evrony and Fine Gael's Alan Shatter of indefensible attempts to justify the Israeli bombing campaign.
And, in a remarkable outburst, he likened their defence of the invasion to the arguments of Adolf Hitler's propaganda minister Joseph Goebbels.
"Goebbels would have been proud of the twisted logic and half-truths," he said.
Ambassador Evrony branded the remarks despicable and demanded an apology.
"What I think overshadows the discussion was this despicable analogy of the deputy of Sinn Féin," the ambassador said.
"I think that... (there is a need) for members here to educate themselves and for this distinguished deputy to apologise."
Mr Evrony was called before the Oireachtas Foreign Affairs Committee hearing with Ireland's most senior Palestinian representative Hikmat Ajjuri, to answer questions about the continuing violence.
Mr Evrony and Mr Shatter claimed the conflict would not have occurred if Hamas had not indiscriminately fired rockets at Israeli civilians.
The ambassador hit out at comments from some committee members criticising the proportionality of the Israeli response, claiming they had been spouting misinformation about Jewish history.
It is the second time the notorious Goebbels has been used as a slight against a Fine Gael TD in Leinster House.
Former justice minister Michael McDowell used the Nazi slur against the party's mild-mannered deputy leader Richard Bruton in 2006 in a row over Garda numbers.
You have to admire the sheer audacity of some of the Shinners and their extremely short, selective memories !
Far be it from me to defend Aengus Ó Snodaigh but using the name of Goebbels is relatively common in describing someone who is spinning a political line. Maybe not in the best judgement though in using it to describe an Israeli diplomat.
It's f**king ridiculous that anyone could complain at that. Yes, a bad choice of words but making having propaganda likened to propaganda isn't necessarily the worst thing in the world. The Israelis are performing nothing less than ethnic cleansing on Gaza. No more, no less. Acting as if the most important thing in the world is a flippant comment when people are dying at the hands of murderous state terrorists is making a f**king mockery of people's misery. The term 'Grammar-Nazi' has came about pretty inoffensively for the most part, and yet this bastard is picking holes in something said as an aside.
As offensive as that may have been to a Semite I'd venture as far as to suggest that the wanton destruction of Palestine is a little bit more galling to its inhabitants.
Fair play to him. The numbers of dead children should be of concern for the ambassador rather than anything Ó Snodaigh said.
Fair play to Aengus - he's one of the few politicians who has a good knowledge of what's going on over there:
20 November, 2008
Sinn Féin TD Aengus Ó Snodaigh visits 'the biggest concentration camp in the world' - the Gaza Strip
CHILDREN OF CONFLICT: Aengus with the families of Palestinian prisoners jailed by Israel
FOR the third time in recent months, the Israeli blockade of Gaza was broken a fortnight ago by the Free Gaza movement's vessel, SS Dignity. On board this time were 11 parliamentarians, including Sinn Féin TD Aengus Ó Snodaigh. Having been informed by the Egyptian authorities that they would be refused entry through the Rafah border crossing between Egypt and Palestine, the original delegation, though reduced from 53 to 11 parliamentarians, put to sea from Larnaca in Cyprus.
Israel occupied the Gaza Strip from 1967-2005 and in 2005 they withdrew their military personnel and settlers. They claimed this amounted to "disengagement" aimed at allowing the Palestinian Authority to 'administer' Gaza. In fact, Israel controls the strip's airspace and territorial water as well as Israel's border with Gaza. Egypt, which occupied Gaza from 1948 to 1967, controls the southern border between the Gaza Strip and the Sinai Desert, but in effect Israel decides when and if the borders around Gaza are opened, which is rarely.
The prolonged siege is part of a campaign by Israeli forces to divide the Palestinian state, to make it economically unviable and to isolate the Palestinian government elected in 2006.
CAMPAIGN TO END THE SIEGE
This month's trip was organised by the European Campaign to End the Siege of Gaza and included Chris Andrews TD, three members of the Scottish Assembly, a Welsh Assembly member, two from the English House of Lords, a Westminster Labour MP, and former Foreign Minister Claire Short, along with Swiss and Italian members of parliament.
Fearful of adverse publicity if they intercepted the ship (there were also journalists on board), the Israeli Navy shadowed Ó Snodaigh and his colleagues. The ship carried vital medical supplies needed for hospitals in Gaza.
A huge welcome greeted the delegation when they made land in Gaza on Friday morning, with fishing boats crammed with people escorting the SS Dignity the last few miles.
Later that day, the delegation addressed the Palestinian Legislative Council, 38 members of whom are in Israeli jails and which cannot meet as a full parliament, due to the siege, because half of its membership is in the West Bank. Pictures of the jailed parliamentarians mark their designated places in council chamber.
The following day, Saturday, 8 November, Aengus Ó Snodaigh and the delegation met with the Prime Minister of the Palestinian National Authority, Ismail Haniyeh, who briefed them on the current political situation. He called for the International community to put pressure on Israel to lift the siege.
The rest of the weekend was spent visiting refugee camps, food distribution centres, UN-run schools, visiting stalled water-treatment and flood works, the only power station in Gaza, touring hospitals, the Rafah crossing, meeting with civic society, the families of POWs and the fishing community as well as farmers and seeing the results of Israel's bombing campaign before they withdrew two years ago.
HEAVY TOLL
Ó Snodaigh was disturbed by what he saw in Gaza.
"You can't help feeling angry the more you see of the place. It is quite clear just from looking around the place that Israel's blockade is taking a heavy toll on the people of Gaza.
"Since arriving here I have visited two hospitals including Al Nasr Children's Hospital. Both hospitals are under huge pressure due to a lack of supplies and equipment or even spare parts to repair their machines. The equipment is dilapidated and much of it is basically held together from bits and pieces cannibalised from older equipment. They are forced to send patients to Egypt or Israel for treatment but the sick often languish at the border crossing waiting to be let through but to no avail and have to return home to try again next day or suffer without the treatment. The most modern part of the Al Shifa Hospital lies uncompleted due to supplies being held at the Israeli border and no building material being allowed across."
When the delegation left on Monday, it was with sadness, but a determination to highlight and campaign to end the siege of Gaza and the denial of Palestinian national rights that they left with. The SS Dignity had extra passengers on its 15-hour outward journey: sick patients needing vital operations and several students who couldn't get back to Europe to continue their university courses interrupted by the blockade. Aengus Ó Snodaigh said afterwards that:
"It is quite clear that Israel's blockade of Gaza is the cause of a major humanitarian crisis and must be lifted. The people here are facing a major food, fuel and medical shortage and are in dire need of help. The suspension of the EU's preferential trade agreement with Israel and a boycott of Israeli goods is what must happen if Israel doesn't lift the siege.
"There's a million and a half people living in Gaza – no wonder they call it the biggest concentration camp in the world. I would encourage people to donate to the Free Gaza movement to help fund other siege-breaking boat journeys with medical and other supplies getting through to the Palestinian people."
GAZA AIRPORT: The Israeli blockade prevents rebuilding of essential infrastructure
Let me be clear. Aengus is 100% correct. At least the great Irony of Israel acting like brutal dictators and cleansing the unwanted masses is not lost on all our politicans. I'd like to see some of our ministers making similar more strong statements on the matter. As for Shatter - he is a disgrace and a puppet liar. I hope his constituents give him what he deserves.
Much and all as I dislike Ó Snodaigh I think he has achieved his ends here. Obviously the media were going to pick up on the language he used so it generates more publicity for his viewpoint. The comparison with the Nazi's might actually have some weight too.
No-one with any sense thinks its ok for rockets to be fired into Israel but their response indicates to me that they definitely see the Palestinians as a lower form of life - how else could you justify the inhumane treatment they are meting out to them? Where did we hear that sort of talk before?
There was no direct link stated with Goebbels and Shatter anyway, and has been pointed out it is a common phrase when mentioning spin and political bullshit, fair play to Aengus as this campaign of genocide is in danger of slipping off the front pages now, the press are almost blase about reporting of this at this stage. Almost 1000 Gazans killed now and the international community are doing f**k all about it as the Americans are pandering to Israels every move , the Israelis will still not allow the foreign press into Gaza you would wonder what they don't want reported.
The focus should be on the murder of at least 400 women and children and not the feelings of Shatter and the Deputy ambassador to long the Holocaust has used to give Israel and bye ball-no more. Can anybody not see the same thing happened in Bosnia-the world took action. The UN needs to act or it will rightly be seen as the puppet of the US
"Goebbels would have been proud of the twisted logic and half-truths," he said.
where in that does it make such a comparison to goebbels
comparison to something he would have said alright
Magpie seanie - I think you are crediting osnodaigh with way too much strategic intelligence
the point I suppose is that the ambassador and shatter tried to use the pronounced ploy of pretending to be offended to distract the focus of the debate from the killng of innocents to a perceived minor insult.
(Cant say I think the palistinians are completely innocent parties in this either - though that was the cause of this, the subsequent massacre is most obv not their fault and they are the terrible victims of a gov that are trying to win votes for this springs election by heavy handed tactics and attacking the palis).
Quote from: lynchbhoy on January 14, 2009, 11:37:46 AM
"Goebbels would have been proud of the twisted logic and half-truths," he said.
where in that does it make such a comparison to goebbels
comparison to something he would have said alright
Magpie seanie - I think you are crediting osnodaigh with way too much strategic intelligence
the point I suppose is that the ambassador and shatter tried to use the pronounced ploy of pretending to be offended to distract the focus of the debate from the killng of innocents to a perceived minor insult.
(Cant say I think the palistinians are completely innocent parties in this either - though that was the cause of this, the subsequent massacre is most obv not their fault and they are the terrible victims of a gov that are trying to win votes for this springs election by heavy handed tactics and attacking the palis).
See the thread "Israelis send in the ground troops". The palestinians, or more accurately Hamas, have been blamed with starting this period of conflict. This is a lie. The Israelis were 1st to break a ceasfire and have also been blocking aid, medicine, food getting into Gaza for months - also a breech of the ceasefire. I would argue this was all done intentionally to force Hamas to act (i.e Fire rockets) so that they could justify, in their twisted minds, their invasion of Gaza to the outside world. The idea behind this invasion is most likely the topple of Hamas (Democratic elections are only good for Israel when their guy wins), the reinstatement of Fatah and a bit of land grabbing for old time sake.
Quote from: Donagh on January 14, 2009, 08:19:38 AM
Fair play to Aengus - he's one of the few politicians who has a good knowledge of what's going on over there:
20 November, 2008
Sinn Féin TD Aengus Ó Snodaigh visits 'the biggest concentration camp in the world' - the Gaza Strip
CHILDREN OF CONFLICT: Aengus with the families of Palestinian prisoners jailed by Israel
FOR the third time in recent months, the Israeli blockade of Gaza was broken a fortnight ago by the Free Gaza movement's vessel, SS Dignity. On board this time were 11 parliamentarians, including Sinn Féin TD Aengus Ó Snodaigh. Having been informed by the Egyptian authorities that they would be refused entry through the Rafah border crossing between Egypt and Palestine, the original delegation, though reduced from 53 to 11 parliamentarians, put to sea from Larnaca in Cyprus.
Israel occupied the Gaza Strip from 1967-2005 and in 2005 they withdrew their military personnel and settlers. They claimed this amounted to "disengagement" aimed at allowing the Palestinian Authority to 'administer' Gaza. In fact, Israel controls the strip's airspace and territorial water as well as Israel's border with Gaza. Egypt, which occupied Gaza from 1948 to 1967, controls the southern border between the Gaza Strip and the Sinai Desert, but in effect Israel decides when and if the borders around Gaza are opened, which is rarely.
The prolonged siege is part of a campaign by Israeli forces to divide the Palestinian state, to make it economically unviable and to isolate the Palestinian government elected in 2006.
CAMPAIGN TO END THE SIEGE
This month's trip was organised by the European Campaign to End the Siege of Gaza and included Chris Andrews TD, three members of the Scottish Assembly, a Welsh Assembly member, two from the English House of Lords, a Westminster Labour MP, and former Foreign Minister Claire Short, along with Swiss and Italian members of parliament.
Fearful of adverse publicity if they intercepted the ship (there were also journalists on board), the Israeli Navy shadowed Ó Snodaigh and his colleagues. The ship carried vital medical supplies needed for hospitals in Gaza.
A huge welcome greeted the delegation when they made land in Gaza on Friday morning, with fishing boats crammed with people escorting the SS Dignity the last few miles.
Later that day, the delegation addressed the Palestinian Legislative Council, 38 members of whom are in Israeli jails and which cannot meet as a full parliament, due to the siege, because half of its membership is in the West Bank. Pictures of the jailed parliamentarians mark their designated places in council chamber.
The following day, Saturday, 8 November, Aengus Ó Snodaigh and the delegation met with the Prime Minister of the Palestinian National Authority, Ismail Haniyeh, who briefed them on the current political situation. He called for the International community to put pressure on Israel to lift the siege.
The rest of the weekend was spent visiting refugee camps, food distribution centres, UN-run schools, visiting stalled water-treatment and flood works, the only power station in Gaza, touring hospitals, the Rafah crossing, meeting with civic society, the families of POWs and the fishing community as well as farmers and seeing the results of Israel's bombing campaign before they withdrew two years ago.
HEAVY TOLL
Ó Snodaigh was disturbed by what he saw in Gaza.
"You can't help feeling angry the more you see of the place. It is quite clear just from looking around the place that Israel's blockade is taking a heavy toll on the people of Gaza.
"Since arriving here I have visited two hospitals including Al Nasr Children's Hospital. Both hospitals are under huge pressure due to a lack of supplies and equipment or even spare parts to repair their machines. The equipment is dilapidated and much of it is basically held together from bits and pieces cannibalised from older equipment. They are forced to send patients to Egypt or Israel for treatment but the sick often languish at the border crossing waiting to be let through but to no avail and have to return home to try again next day or suffer without the treatment. The most modern part of the Al Shifa Hospital lies uncompleted due to supplies being held at the Israeli border and no building material being allowed across."
When the delegation left on Monday, it was with sadness, but a determination to highlight and campaign to end the siege of Gaza and the denial of Palestinian national rights that they left with. The SS Dignity had extra passengers on its 15-hour outward journey: sick patients needing vital operations and several students who couldn't get back to Europe to continue their university courses interrupted by the blockade. Aengus Ó Snodaigh said afterwards that:
"It is quite clear that Israel's blockade of Gaza is the cause of a major humanitarian crisis and must be lifted. The people here are facing a major food, fuel and medical shortage and are in dire need of help. The suspension of the EU's preferential trade agreement with Israel and a boycott of Israeli goods is what must happen if Israel doesn't lift the siege.
"There's a million and a half people living in Gaza – no wonder they call it the biggest concentration camp in the world. I would encourage people to donate to the Free Gaza movement to help fund other siege-breaking boat journeys with medical and other supplies getting through to the Palestinian people."
GAZA AIRPORT: The Israeli blockade prevents rebuilding of essential infrastructure
You want to 'fess up where you got that story from Donagh? It'd never be An Phoblacht, by any chance? ;D
Quote from: IolarCoisCuain on January 14, 2009, 12:03:17 PM
You want to 'fess up where you got that story from Donagh? It'd never be An Phoblacht, by any chance? ;D
No it wasn't. Not that it matters but from a free newsletter that came through my door on the Upper Ormeau Rd before Christmas. Why, are you trying to say that Aengus wasn't over in Gaza/Gazza/Ghazzah/غزة/עַזָּה ?
So then you painstakingly typed it all out for us.
Anyway, it doesn't matter an iota where the witness account was published.
Quote from: Main Street on January 14, 2009, 03:09:38 PM
So then you painstakingly typed it all out for us.
What am I, the f**king plagiarism police? No I didn't, as it's also available online.
Quote from: Main Street on January 14, 2009, 03:09:38 PM
Anyway, it doesn't matter an iota where the witness account was published.
Exactly
According to the EUMC (European Monitoring Centre on Racism and Xenophobia), an agency of the EU, "drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis" is a manifestation of anti-semitism. So there y'are. I had a look at their website. They don't seem to consider comparing the policy of any other state to that of the Nazis to be problematic at all.
sinn fein wouldnt normally bring a smile to my face but they did today, fair play to Ó Snodaigh he was spot on..
I see no difference to what the IDF are doing in Gaza to what the SS did in the Warsaw ghetto ... the Israelis can't complain about being compared to Nazis when that is the way they behave ... yer woman, the Israeli Foreign Minister, has come out with some odious shite that I'm sure Goebbels would have been proud of...
PS ... who's taking the piss with that advert on page 1 of this thread?
Quote from: Donagh on January 14, 2009, 12:48:14 PM
Quote from: IolarCoisCuain on January 14, 2009, 12:03:17 PM
You want to 'fess up where you got that story from Donagh? It'd never be An Phoblacht, by any chance? ;D
No it wasn't...
Quote from: Donagh on January 14, 2009, 03:25:41 PM
What am I, the f**king plagiarism police? No I didn't, as it's also available online.
It is available on line here www.
anphoblacht.com/news/detail/36263 (http://www.anphoblacht.com/news/detail/36263)
Quote from: dec on January 14, 2009, 07:02:24 PM
It is available on line here www.anphoblacht.com/news/detail/36263 (http://www.anphoblacht.com/news/detail/36263)
That's not where I got it from though.
Quote from: Donagh on January 14, 2009, 07:38:07 PM
Quote from: dec on January 14, 2009, 07:02:24 PM
It is available on line here www.anphoblacht.com/news/detail/36263 (http://www.anphoblacht.com/news/detail/36263)
That's not where I got it from though.
On a side issue there is a fella that calls to our door every Thursday evening selling An Phoblacht and he is always royally plastered.
Quote from: Minder on January 15, 2009, 10:11:15 AM
On a side issue there is a fella that calls to our door every Thursday evening selling An Phoblacht and he is always royally plastered.
I take it you buy it then?
Quote from: Donagh on January 15, 2009, 11:00:36 AM
Quote from: Minder on January 15, 2009, 10:11:15 AM
On a side issue there is a fella that calls to our door every Thursday evening selling An Phoblacht and he is always royally plastered.
I take it you buy it then?
I usually buy it and put it straight in the bin, the fella seems a decent chap. In fairness he puts it through the letterbox whether there is anyone in or not..........