Antrim Football Thread

[Flanker]

The Management had virtually everyone of the top 40 odd players in Antrim available to them. There was virtually no one who made themselves unavailable from the outset. Some weren't selected, some after year 1 retired, some didn't make themselves available, some were dropped & some dropped out throughout the year. Part of management is to mould what you have into a cohesive unit greater than the sum of the parts. Get buy into your philosophy and systems of play. Improve and develop players. Out of the 40 odd we ended up with around 20 plus 5 or 6 under 20's for the final game.

How did we end up with around 20 out of the 40/45 that were originally available or drafted in @ the start of year 2.
Can anyone name 3 or 4 players who you would say developed a reasonable amount over the 2 years?
Can anyone identify an area of our play that showed marked improvement?
From what I could see we had most of our better players available at the begining (not always the case for Antrim managers) got fitter and beat the teams around us and a few above. There isn't a huge difference between the top half of division 4 and the bottom half of Div 3. We played most of the weaker Div 3 teams at the start of the league and picked up points. When we hit the slightly stronger teams it really exposed our setup. We basically didn't have one and didn't know how to deal with teams who were well setup.
Credit for getting out of Div 4 and staying in Div 3. However there was no sign of the building blocks and basics being put in place to move on.
At the end we ended up with half a squad who looked like they were rounded up on the morning of the game

[EOC1923]

Football can be harsh, tough decisions made and managers cannot please everyone. No one denies that ITG but there's a way of doing it. PG got badly treated, there's no nice way of dressing that up.

Most of the players who toiled with him over the years for the county will attest to that. It wasn't new managements finest moment, let's put it that way.

What did you want them to do, have a wee going away party for him? Wise up BS, you are actually doing PG a disservice yourself substituting him in for what your real gripe is, shame on you!

[BrendanAntrim]

The outgoing management team deserve acknowledgment and respect for what they achieved, promotion from 4 and comfortably retaining place in Div 3, I don't but into the 'luck' theory but also totally respect Bannside's view; he saw that team more than any of us over the last two seasons and more.

But the Cavan championship match was a real low point, it was irredeemable and inexcusable. And on championship outings managers will ultimately be judged. We knew we weren't going to win Ulster but we were entitled to think we would be competitive against Cavan.

It's a hard job, almost thankless, and no one sets out to get it wrong. Good luck, goodbye Enda and co.

[imtommygunn]

Yeah I would share a lot of those views Brendan. It didn't work out in the end and we have to move on and that's it really. We at least are in division three at the end of it and that really puts us in make or break position because it will be tough to stay up with Cavan and tipp coming up.

[EOC1923]

Tougher gig this incoming season for the next man with harder teams in Div 3, but if staying up the only expectation they could hit the ground running early hopefully pick up points. Likes of Cavan will have the advantage of continuity whereas as we will be starting from scratch. All the best to whoever it is and thanks to outgoing management. Now for the club season.

[country bumpkin]

The Management had virtually everyone of the top 40 odd players in Antrim available to them. There was virtually no one who made themselves unavailable from the outset. Some weren't selected, some after year 1 retired, some didn't make themselves available, some were dropped & some dropped out throughout the year. Part of management is to mould what you have into a cohesive unit greater than the sum of the parts. Get buy into your philosophy and systems of play. Improve and develop players. Out of the 40 odd we ended up with around 20 plus 5 or 6 under 20's for the final game.

How did we end up with around 20 out of the 40/45 that were originally available or drafted in @ the start of year 2.
Can anyone name 3 or 4 players who you would say developed a reasonable amount over the 2 years?
Can anyone identify an area of our play that showed marked improvement?
From what I could see we had most of our better players available at the begining (not always the case for Antrim managers) got fitter and beat the teams around us and a few above. There isn't a huge difference between the top half of division 4 and the bottom half of Div 3. We played most of the weaker Div 3 teams at the start of the league and picked up points. When we hit the slightly stronger teams it really exposed our setup. We basically didn't have one and didn't know how to deal with teams who were well setup.
Credit for getting out of Div 4 and staying in Div 3. However there was no sign of the building blocks and basics being put in place to move on.
At the end we ended up with half a squad who looked like they were rounded up on the morning of the game

A damning piece Flanker but I am afraid you build your argument on a less than stable foundation.
Your argument is based on the fundamental that we do have a thriving club scene within.
Cannot see that within most units and wish you would reveal such evidence.

With the notable exception of a few other is absolutely no evidence of visible green shoots of growth within.
Of course there are a few excellent under age sides at under 13/15:but it is folly to state a big future awaits.
Only a few teams look potential challengers for the minor/u17 title.

So from where are the potential new management to recruit those 'building blocks' required to build a better future.

Will the next man in charge expected to teach the recruits to Saffron the basics.

A player asked to don the county jersey should be fully aware of the basics and well prepared within the club/college scene.
Ask yourself are clubs in our county all on that journey which is a fundamental requirement for one who will embark on a journey at the higher level.
As a friend of mine used to say "lose the fundamental, lose the argument".

[bannside]

"Flankers post is based on the fundamental that we have a thriving club scene ". It's not based on that at all. How the hell could anybody read his post and possibly come to that conclusion??

Flanker makes plenty of valid points, but apologists for the outgoing either can't see or don't want to see - therefore avoid the content and jump on a different (diversory tactic alert) topic - like under 13s or something random.

If CB is to be believed we have no players now and no manager will want us. Jesus Wept! This is getting tiresome (and I am to blame for this too) so I'm moving on from this topic.

Some good club games on this weekend?

[country bumpkin]

So the problem I see within all those hugely well equipped posters on this board in tactical awareness combined with a huge wealth of coaching experience can look within their own club and excuse the lack of silverware within.
And indeed, in most cases no glimpse of such on the horizon.

Jesus does indeed weep....

[bannside]

I can only assume this is pointed at my direction and at Portglenone. Your point has been noted and filed for future reference. Your contempt and condescension does your club no favours.

As I said before, Cargin is the template. Have a nice weekend.

[Milltown Row2]

I can only assume this is pointed at my direction and at Portglenone. Your point has been noted and filed for future reference. Your contempt and condescension does your club no favours.

As I said before, Cargin is the template. Have a nice weekend.

For what?

[bannside]

Consistently over a long period, bringing two or three quality players through each year and accumulating silverware on a regular basis. About to launch new facilities and lots of good stuff going on around Erin's Own. Some great Gaels too.

Hard to question that MR.

The challenge is to attempt to match and/or surpass. For what it's worth I like what is now going on around PG1, and have no doubt this club will only get stronger.

If all club's could even find 10% improvement year in year it's amazing the difference it would make.

[Milltown Row2]

Consistently over a long period, bringing two or three quality players through each year and accumulating silverware on a regular basis. About to launch new facilities and lots of good stuff going on around Erin's Own. Some great Gaels too.

Hard to question that MR.

The challenge is to attempt to match and/or surpass. For what it's worth I like what is now going on around PG1, and have no doubt this club will only get stronger.

If all club's could even find 10% improvement year in year it's amazing the difference it would make.

So you think the standard in Antrim club football has dropped or getting better?

[bannside]

Definitely dropped, without a doubt. But it's more about a top 4 or top 6 now, games much more interesting, but no team atm would get close to the St Galls or Cargin of a decade ago

[Flanker]

So the problem I see within all those hugely well equipped posters on this board in tactical awareness combined with a huge wealth of coaching experience can look within their own club and excuse the lack of silverware within.
And indeed, in most cases no glimpse of such on the horizon.

Jesus does indeed weep....

CB if you measure everything in silverware then the vast majority of teams will be failures most of the time.

As a county we are unlikely to see silverware anytime soon.

Nobody said we had a thriving club scene

It doesn't mean we shouldn't have an expectation of maximising the potential of what we have.

You watch and report on plenty of games. You will see setups that are maximising potential and plenty that aren't.

I'm sure you can see the difference.

There was a clear coaching deficit in the setup which highlights the importance of the full management team.

It is over now but it may draw attention to the importance of the backroom teams and supporting cast in future management teams as well

Time to move on

[Spike]

Yes time to draw a line under this folks.   Some will feel progress was made over the past 2 years culminating in comfortable survival in Div 3 with anyone of talent in Antrim on the squad (one i agree with), others will feel it ended as a shambles with many leaving the panel and an inept performance in the Tailteann cup summarising the lack of progress.

Agree to disagree but its over now and we move on......together,

My hope is the county board go for the best man for the job and not the cheap option.  The hurlers get managers from munster and other strongholds so why are we not afforded the same?  It is hard to know who is seriously in for the antrim job, and while we obviously don't have the budget of other counties we should still be aiming high. I like the sound of people of the calibre of Paddy Tally, Peter Canavan or Steven Poacher etc but how realistic that is is another thing.

In regard to the senior panel, these players have only so much more learning they can do due to their age and no superstars are upcoming so they need a system to work to and a massive upsurge in physicality to counteract their limitations of decision making.

After that it is a massive investment in nursery to minors, particularly u12s and below.  Difficult i know but more coaches with a suitable knowledge level (usually attained through courses) as opposed to the lone but hopeful parent, with little football knowledge  who got landed with the u12s team because no one else wanted the job.

We are at that juncture where standing still or just doing enough to get by will leave us having this same conversation in 20 years time (Note we have had this  same conversation for the past 20 years!).  We think we are doing enough but we are really just getting by.  We are doing no more than anyone else in any other county and that is simply not enough.                   If players acquire the core skills early, the physicality programme from u14s upwards will put them on par with the tyrones of this world by the time they are u17.         A new County-wide Antrim-Specific system developed with full club buy in, aided by our primary schools, assisted heavily by Gaelfast funding  / coaching presence is needed urgently.  A development plan that every club must follow (to the best they can).         it'll take time but will be worth it. Have we in Antrim the patience for that?