Author Topic: UK General Election 2017  (Read 48314 times)

Tony Baloney

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #90 on: April 20, 2017, 07:29:30 PM »
You're not comparing like with like. Had your wife not got the extra point she'd have seen her pay go down.

Nope just asked her again and it's not went down, no pay rise but the wages haven't dropped!
Inflation.

imtommygunn

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #91 on: April 20, 2017, 07:32:07 PM »
You're not comparing like with like. Had your wife not got the extra point she'd have seen her pay go down.

Nope just asked her again and it's not went down, no pay rise but the wages haven't dropped!

It is an effective pay decrease.

You completely changing career path for a higher paying one may mask that for you but it is an effective pay decrease and a lot of households would struggle on the back of it.


Milltown Row2

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #92 on: April 20, 2017, 07:47:15 PM »
I didn't bring inflation into it as that wasn't asked, so the pay drop didn't happen but clearly with inflation yes then that would be the case...

Either way we have tighten, like most household the purse strings based on earnings, public sector jobs have far greater benefits than private.. great pensions and holidays sick schemes to help with hangovers  ;)

Anything I post is not the view of the County Board!! Nobody died in the making of this post ;-)

imtommygunn

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #93 on: April 20, 2017, 09:36:52 PM »
Not really with the absence of final salary pensions though. Health care, dental care, bonus schemes, life insurance, insurance on prolonged sick absences etc. You can easily outweigh the public sector benefits in the right private job. Key difference security in my view which isn't what it was.

A lot of private places have the "sick" issue too...

Owen Brannigan

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #94 on: April 20, 2017, 11:57:42 PM »
I didn't bring inflation into it as that wasn't asked, so the pay drop didn't happen but clearly with inflation yes then that would be the case...

Either way we have tighten, like most household the purse strings based on earnings, public sector jobs have far greater benefits than private.. great pensions and holidays sick schemes to help with hangovers  ;)

Any teacher who has not been in receipt of a pay increase via incremental progression or via an additional teaching allowance for other responsibilities has experienced the following decrease in pay and all teachers are affected by pension changes:

1. A pay freeze during 3/5 out of the last 5 years and then only a 1% pay increase against official inflation at a higher rate so a considerable effective pay decrease in real terms.

2. An increase in National Insurance payments since April 2016 as a 'contracted in' charge replaced the old 'contracted out' rate to take account of the serious decrease in future pension payments.

3. An increase in the percentage of pay taken for pension contributions which increases as your salary increases.  % of pay taken for pension payments has increased from 6% to almost 7% for lower earners up to nearly 12% of gross salary payment for the highest paid teachers.

4. An increase in the National Pension Age to 67 from 60 for the vast majority of teachers which means that they cannot access their pensions without an actuarial reduction of 5% per year for every year it is taken below 67.

5. A removal from the final salary pension scheme and transfer to the average salary scheme which greatly reduces the pension available even when supplemented by the state pension as available by contracted in National Insurance payments. affects all teacher who were younger than 50 on 1st April 2012.

6. No tax free lump sum along with the pension at retirement unless you commute a significant part of the annual pension.

So, every teacher has had a significant actual pay reduction, a significant real pay reduction and a major erosion of their expected pension payments when they can retire as 67 year olds, although that will increase over the next 20 years.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2017, 12:02:03 AM by Owen Brannigan »

Owen Brannigan

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #95 on: April 21, 2017, 12:10:38 AM »
Listen to this spokesperson for Corbyn, Dawn Butler, to understand why Corbyn and his inexperienced shadow cabinet in the Labour party are so unfit for government that the Conservatives and the right wing media will tr**p all over them.

Later in the day Butler had to apologise to Costa Coffee for wrongly accusing them of not paying taxes in the UK.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p050mzc6

Milltown Row2

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #96 on: April 21, 2017, 12:15:29 AM »
I didn't bring inflation into it as that wasn't asked, so the pay drop didn't happen but clearly with inflation yes then that would be the case...

Either way we have tighten, like most household the purse strings based on earnings, public sector jobs have far greater benefits than private.. great pensions and holidays sick schemes to help with hangovers  ;)

Any teacher who has not been in receipt of a pay increase via incremental progression or via an additional teaching allowance for other responsibilities has experienced the following:

1. A pay freeze during three out of the last five years and then only a 1% pay increase against official inflation at a higher rate so a considerable effective pay decrease in real terms.

2. An increase in National Insurance payments since April 2016 as a contracted in charge replaced the old contracted out rate to take account of the serious decrease in future pension payments.

3. An increase in the percentage of pay taken for pension contributions which increases as your salary increases.  % of pay taken for pension payments has increased from 6% to almost 7% for lower earners up to nearly 12% of gross salary payment for the highest paid teachers.

4. An increase in the National Pension Age to 67 from 60 for the vast majority of teachers which means that they cannot access their pensions without an actuarial reduction of 5% per year for every year below 67.

5. A removal from the final salary pension scheme and transfer to the average salary scheme which greatly reduces the pension available even when supplemented by the state pension as available by contracted in National Insurance payments.

6. No tax free lump sum along with the pension at retirement unless you commute a significant part of the annual pension.

So, every teacher has had a significant actual pay reduction, a significant real pay reduction  and a major erosion of their expected pension payments when they can retire as 67 year olds, although that will increase over the next 20 years.

Everyone's tax or insurance has changed but you basic pay salary had not been deducted, paying more taxes or more into your pension has not changed your annual wage just your take home pay.

I'm paying more tax and my retirement won't be till I'm 67 so why would it be any different for the public sector and private sector? My pension will be a state pension plus the various jobs I've been in, which are small pensions I paid into are frozen currently.. 10 years in one company 3 in another 2 in another and one I'm currently on which is very basic..

teachers will have a far better pension than anyone in the private sector will ever have so overall they aren't doing too bad
Anything I post is not the view of the County Board!! Nobody died in the making of this post ;-)

Owen Brannigan

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #97 on: April 21, 2017, 12:30:20 AM »
The point that Dougal Maguire was making was that the amount of money taken home each month has been reduced or eroded both in real terms and actual terms and I have shown you how it has been reduced due to increased NIC and pension payments for teachers.

Teachers no longer have the gilt edged pensions of those who left the profession aged 50 or more after 2012.  The average salary scheme will be worth even less than the reduction faced by those who were move from the 1/80 scheme with a lump sum to 1/60 scheme with no lump sum when they became teachers from 2007 onwards.  The average salary scheme will not pay an amount that will be considered a living wage by the time these teachers begin to access it.  It will have to be supplemented by the state pension scheme when the teacher reaches the NPA to give a meagre payment.  Also the pay freezes and 1% pay rises experienced to date and going into the future will further reduce the average salary pensions.

Anyone who is not a superannuated public sector worker can now access their pension pot and reject the corrupt but guaranteed annuity scheme.  They can then manage their own pension pot from age 55.  Teachers and other public sector workers are now tied into average salary schemes which depend on other similar workers paying in ever increasing amounts to pay the pensions of those retired ahead of them and living ever longer.  No pension pots to access.

Use this app to see how little your wife will get when she retires:

http://apps.education-ni.gov.uk/appPenCalc/pencalc.aspx

Dougal Maguire

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #98 on: April 21, 2017, 12:35:39 AM »
Owen, I wish you luck trying to get that message home to him. He's playing with semantics to mask the fact that yet again he's speaking from the hip with no evidence to support what he's saying
Careful now

Tony Baloney

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #99 on: April 21, 2017, 12:55:34 AM »
Not bad for working 195 days a year  ;D

Owen Brannigan

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #100 on: April 21, 2017, 01:24:53 AM »
Not bad for working 195 days a year  ;D

And only 1265 hours.

seafoid

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #101 on: April 21, 2017, 06:08:47 AM »
Listen to this spokesperson for Corbyn, Dawn Butler, to understand why Corbyn and his inexperienced shadow cabinet in the Labour party are so unfit for government that the Conservatives and the right wing media will tr**p all over them.

Later in the day Butler had to apologise to Costa Coffee for wrongly accusing them of not paying taxes in the UK.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p050mzc6
The election will depend on whether or not Labour can convince voters of what is actually happening. . It is psychological. The cupboard is bare and the Tories are saying it is great.
"you can try and intimidate us, but f**k youse, we're going to win an All-Ireland anyway"

yellowcard

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #102 on: April 21, 2017, 07:47:41 AM »
Too many West Wing watchers talking about empty chair debates!

May would absolutely steamroll through Corbyn in a debate anyway. Labour should be delighted to get away from the prospect.

Have you watched both of them in debates or how exactly could you draw that conclusion?

Theresa May struggles to think on her feet when veering away from pre rehearsed answers. She is a poor debater and wants to avoid such a contest for that reason. I can however see her agreeing to some watered down version of a debate purely to avoid the cowardly accusations being fired at her by opponents.

Milltown Row2

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #103 on: April 21, 2017, 07:59:45 AM »
Not bad for working 195 days a year  ;D

And only 1265 hours.

So with over 20 years service she's doing alright, obviously had she been older or longer in service then she be better off but she's still got 15 plus years to work, not going to be millionaires but that's the public sector, teaching is a vocation, you're not doing it for the money  ;D
Anything I post is not the view of the County Board!! Nobody died in the making of this post ;-)

johnneycool

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Re: UK General Election 2017
« Reply #104 on: April 21, 2017, 08:29:50 AM »
Too many West Wing watchers talking about empty chair debates!

May would absolutely steamroll through Corbyn in a debate anyway. Labour should be delighted to get away from the prospect.

Have you watched both of them in debates or how exactly could you draw that conclusion?

Theresa May struggles to think on her feet when veering away from pre rehearsed answers. She is a poor debater and wants to avoid such a contest for that reason. I can however see her agreeing to some watered down version of a debate purely to avoid the cowardly accusations being fired at her by opponents.

Corbyn would probably get the better of her alright as May comes across as very wooden and intransigent, but Mary Doll would wipe the floor with all off them, she's a serious operator that Sturgeon one.