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GAA Discussion => GAA Discussion => Topic started by: theticklemister on February 19, 2017, 10:55:16 PM

Title: Super 8s
Post by: theticklemister on February 19, 2017, 10:55:16 PM
New catchphrase lads... big dick said so
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Tubberman on February 19, 2017, 10:59:35 PM
Big Dickie must have had a good chat with his fellow farney man,he sang the tune he was taught!
I can't help feeling the super 8 will widen the gap between the haves and have nots. It will be great viewing for a couple of years, but then people will get sick of seeing the same teams coming out of it year after year.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: theticklemister on February 19, 2017, 11:02:07 PM
I agree tubberman.

Big dick said as he was told
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on February 19, 2017, 11:56:53 PM
People are already sick of the same teams year on year.

Open draw is the only way to go. Will never happen though
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: moysider on February 20, 2017, 12:18:49 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on February 19, 2017, 11:56:53 PM
People are already sick of the same teams year on year.

Open draw is the only way to go. Will never happen though

It will never happen because it would be a disaster.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on February 20, 2017, 02:16:28 AM
Quote from: Tubberman on February 19, 2017, 10:59:35 PM
Big Dickie must have had a good chat with his fellow farney man,he sang the tune he was taught!
I can't help feeling the super 8 will widen the gap between the haves and have nots. It will be great viewing for a couple of years, but then people will get sick of seeing the same teams coming out of it year after year.

But will it be great viewing? Dragging out an already too long championship just to make a few bucks and cover for the fall in attendances, without really addressing why people are turning away from the game.

I can't believe any county board would be so base as to support this motion just in the vain hope of a few extra Euro.

Oh wait. I can.

It's everyone that's not in the Super Nth that need the extra games..
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on February 20, 2017, 07:29:45 AM
Quote from: moysider on February 20, 2017, 12:18:49 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on February 19, 2017, 11:56:53 PM
People are already sick of the same teams year on year.

Open draw is the only way to go. Will never happen though

It will never happen because it would be a disaster.

In an ideal world it would not, but as has been said numerous times here, (using my own county as an exsmple) Mayo v Wexford wouldn't have the same appeal to it as Mayo v Galway in the first round.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on February 20, 2017, 09:57:28 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on February 20, 2017, 07:29:45 AM
Quote from: moysider on February 20, 2017, 12:18:49 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on February 19, 2017, 11:56:53 PM
People are already sick of the same teams year on year.

Open draw is the only way to go. Will never happen though

It will never happen because it would be a disaster.

In an ideal world it would not, but as has been said numerous times here, (using my own county as an exsmple) Mayo v Wexford wouldn't have the same appeal to it as Mayo v Galway in the first round.

But Mayo Galway never play in the first round. And is Mayo Wexford any less appealing than Kerry Waterford or Dublin Carlow?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 20, 2017, 09:58:45 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on February 20, 2017, 07:29:45 AM
Quote from: moysider on February 20, 2017, 12:18:49 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on February 19, 2017, 11:56:53 PM
People are already sick of the same teams year on year.

Open draw is the only way to go. Will never happen though

It will never happen because it would be a disaster.

In an ideal world it would not, but as has been said numerous times here, (using my own county as an exsmple) Mayo v Wexford wouldn't have the same appeal to it as Mayo v Galway in the first round.

Why would it be a disaster? And Mayo v Dublin would be far more attractive than Mayo v Galway. There is very little to recommend the current system so a change is urgently required. The issue should be what the new system is not whether the current one should be changed.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on February 20, 2017, 10:14:53 AM
If super 8s is passed, it'll be 3 competitions in one. Provincial c'ships are pointless and devalued, time to get rid. Back door is boring. Even Ulster, the most competitive is boring and pointless. The whole c'ship doesn't get remotely interesting until August. The c'ship needs woken up with a bang in May/June, with a humdinger weekend of games like Kerry Mayo or Dublin Tyrone. Straight knock out, no second chance. People would go mental for tickets.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on February 20, 2017, 10:19:52 AM
I did say in an ideal world. The point I'm trying to make is that there would be more tension in a Mayo Galway match than Mayo Wexford, Carlow. Even in the Mayo/Tipp semi last year, the butterflies never really surfaced because there is no real rivalry there. But it is worth trying as you said Benny.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 20, 2017, 10:23:30 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on February 20, 2017, 10:19:52 AM
I did say in an ideal world. The point I'm trying to make is that there would be more tension in a Mayo Galway match than Mayo Wexford, Carlow. Even in the Mayo/Tipp semi last year, the butterflies never really surfaced because there is no real rivalry there. But it is worth trying as you said Benny.

But Farr you compared the biggest Connacht rivalry against a non-event. Leitrim Mayo would hardly get many Mayo fans nervous, in contrast Mayo against Tyrone, Monaghan, Donegal, Cork, Kerry, Dublin and maybe a few more would.

The bottom line is what we have doesn't work so lets try something else.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 20, 2017, 11:04:07 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on February 20, 2017, 10:14:53 AM
If super 8s is passed, it'll be 3 competitions in one. Provincial c'ships are pointless and devalued, time to get rid. Back door is boring. Even Ulster, the most competitive is boring and pointless. The whole c'ship doesn't get remotely interesting until August. The c'ship needs woken up with a bang in May/June, with a humdinger weekend of games like Kerry Mayo or Dublin Tyrone. Straight knock out, no second chance. People would go mental for tickets.
Benny, I don't quite follow. Is it an open draw you're suggesting? So the chances of Dublin v Tyrone coming out are the same as Dublin v Carlow. What would be the point in that. And if you did somehow get Kerry v Mayo and Dublin v Tyrone in the first round, and all that goes with it, surely the subsequent rounds would be weaker with these teams eliminated?

When is congress by the way?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 20, 2017, 11:10:07 AM
I mentioned the phrase Super 8 the day the proposal was announced.
I think it's the other 24 that need round Robin games which would help teams with potential to improve and be competitive with the big 8.

Can't believe that some people are still promoting the 32 County open draw lottery.
At least the Semis and most quarter finals are competitive under the present system but if good teams were knocking each other out along the way we'll be back to the kind of semi final massacres we used to have in the 70s, 80's and early 90s.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on February 20, 2017, 11:15:37 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 20, 2017, 11:04:07 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on February 20, 2017, 10:14:53 AM
If super 8s is passed, it'll be 3 competitions in one. Provincial c'ships are pointless and devalued, time to get rid. Back door is boring. Even Ulster, the most competitive is boring and pointless. The whole c'ship doesn't get remotely interesting until August. The c'ship needs woken up with a bang in May/June, with a humdinger weekend of games like Kerry Mayo or Dublin Tyrone. Straight knock out, no second chance. People would go mental for tickets.
Benny, I don't quite follow. Is it an open draw you're suggesting? So the chances of Dublin v Tyrone coming out are the same as Dublin v Carlow. What would be the point in that. And if you did somehow get Kerry v Mayo and Dublin v Tyrone in the first round, and all that goes with it, surely the subsequent rounds would be weaker with these teams eliminated?

When is congress by the way?

Yes chances are low of Krry Dublin say but not impossible. Even if we had no big games in the first round, odds are we would in second. So really we could see Kerry, Dublin or Mayo go out after 2 games. It would mean teams play at same time, same amount of games, fixed calendar etc.

And yes, if we had Kerry Mayo, Dub Tyrone in first round, that would mean we maybe had Carlow Leitrim Antrim etc progressing further but you say that like it's a bad thing. Why shouldn't the weaker teams get to an AI semi, and afforded the opportunity because of the luck of the draw? Think of what a Carlow Antrim AI semi would do for those counties. Everyone moans because they're sick of Kerry Dublin Mayo in last 4 yet moan too of the possibility of a Leitrim or Louth getting there!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 20, 2017, 11:21:09 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 20, 2017, 11:10:07 AM
I mentioned the phrase Super 8 the day the proposal was announced.
I think it's the other 24 that need round Robin games which would help teams with potential to improve and be competitive with the big 8.

Can't believe that some people are still promoting the 32 County open draw lottery.
At least the Semis and most quarter finals are competitive under the present system but if good teams were knocking each other out along the way we'll be back to the kind of semi final massacres we used to have in the 70s, 80's and early 90s.

I wouldn't support a strict open draw. The answer is staring everyone in the face, link the league to championship and seed the championship. The league is finally catching on with crowds in excess of 10K not uncommon in division 1. Until we make the league a central part of our season then we will have a poor system.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sambostar on February 20, 2017, 11:31:18 AM
I think the solution for the GAA is to go back a version of the way the league was run in the late 80's/early 90's. Then is you won Div3 you got a shot at one of the Div1 teams in the QF's. It would need to be adapted to maybe have knock-out starting at last-16 stage, so you'd have say 6 spots for Div1, 5 for Div2, 3 for Div3, 2 for Div4. You would keep promotion/relegation as is.

You would play provincial championships & any team making the provincial final is guaranteed a place in the last 16 also - so this keeps them meaningful for teams. Provincial winners could be guaranteed a home draw in the last 16 too to keep it worth winning for the big teams who are likely going to be in Div1 top 6.

You could organise fixtures by playing 4 rounds of the league over 6-7 weeks say in March/April. Then break for 5-6 weeks for club football. Then back in July to play provincial championships. August & September you finish off the remaining league games & AI series.

Do you think this would get through congress?  ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 20, 2017, 11:34:46 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on February 20, 2017, 11:15:37 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 20, 2017, 11:04:07 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on February 20, 2017, 10:14:53 AM
If super 8s is passed, it'll be 3 competitions in one. Provincial c'ships are pointless and devalued, time to get rid. Back door is boring. Even Ulster, the most competitive is boring and pointless. The whole c'ship doesn't get remotely interesting until August. The c'ship needs woken up with a bang in May/June, with a humdinger weekend of games like Kerry Mayo or Dublin Tyrone. Straight knock out, no second chance. People would go mental for tickets.
Benny, I don't quite follow. Is it an open draw you're suggesting? So the chances of Dublin v Tyrone coming out are the same as Dublin v Carlow. What would be the point in that. And if you did somehow get Kerry v Mayo and Dublin v Tyrone in the first round, and all that goes with it, surely the subsequent rounds would be weaker with these teams eliminated?

When is congress by the way?

Yes chances are low of Krry Dublin say but not impossible. Even if we had no big games in the first round, odds are we would in second. So really we could see Kerry, Dublin or Mayo go out after 2 games. It would mean teams play at same time, same amount of games, fixed calendar etc.

And yes, if we had Kerry Mayo, Dub Tyrone in first round, that would mean we maybe had Carlow Leitrim Antrim etc progressing further but you say that like it's a bad thing. Why shouldn't the weaker teams get to an AI semi, and afforded the opportunity because of the luck of the draw? Think of what a Carlow Antrim AI semi would do for those counties. Everyone moans because they're sick of Kerry Dublin Mayo in last 4 yet moan too of the possibility of a Leitrim or Louth getting there!
I didn't. I mentioned it in relation to your point about how great it would be for a Dublin v Tyrone draw in the first round, with ticket sales etc. If that happened then further down the line you could get a game like Dublin v the winner of Antrim v Leitrim where there'd likely be little of the anticipation that you highlighted in round 1.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on February 20, 2017, 11:45:18 AM
Esmeralda, Dublin Leitrim in Round 2. Is that any less appealing than Dublin v Longford in a Leinster QF or Kerry Waterford in a Munster semi?

Yes there will be mismatches, but there will with any system.

Your point on weaker subsequent rounds - the whole point for 32 teams involved is to afford them every chance of success. Yes Antrim mightn't be as good as Mayo but an open draw would afford them the possibility of success, like the other 31.

We've had 11 different AI winners since 1960, including Derry andArmaghs one win. Its boring and needs a shake up.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 20, 2017, 11:57:04 AM
No, it's not. Again, my point was in reply to what you suggested was needed in round 1 to get people interested. The contrast between what you said was needed and what could potentially happen is huge.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 20, 2017, 12:00:48 PM
Antrim or Leitrim won't win the AI unless you bar 20 Counties from taking part.
Do we let the 4 D4 teams play a KO competition with the winner getting to the AI Final?
The winner of a D3 competition get to the Semis whee they play the winner of a competition between the 16 D1 and Dr teams?
Do we handicap D1 teams say -6 points, D2 -4, D3 -0 and D4 +3.????
Or do we let the best teams meet in the closing stages of what is a CHAMPIONSHIP  not a social welfare game??
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 20, 2017, 12:10:12 PM
I agree, the IC championship shouldn't be about handicapping the best to allow inferior teams get further. All it has to be is a fair, well structured competition that means team A and team Z play the same number of games to win it and if you improve you can do better. There's hundreds of examples of well run fair competitions from around the world we just need to modify one to suit our needs.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on February 20, 2017, 12:16:28 PM
Last year Tipp beat Cork in Munster. People in Kerry were complaining because they were geared up for meeting cork in Killarney. The annual summer outing, big crowd, pubs full, money for the town. That's what Munster is, Kerry v cork. It's predicable and boring. And both teams know they just have to be geared up for August regardless of where the Munster title resides.

An open draw mightn't give you Dub Kerry or Mayo Tyrone in round 1 or indeed any interesting ties. But when is the first interesting tie as it is? Maybe an ulster final in july. Give the big teams a shake up, Kerry heading to ulster in round 1 will get their arse in gear. Yes the cream usually rises to the top but at least vary things. You could have Dublin in Enniskillen or Tyrone to Salthill, Kerry to Clones.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 20, 2017, 12:31:25 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on February 20, 2017, 12:16:28 PM
Last year Tipp beat Cork in Munster. People in Kerry were complaining because they were geared up for meeting cork in Killarney. The annual summer outing, big crowd, pubs full, money for the town. That's what Munster is, Kerry v cork. It's predicable and boring. And both teams know they just have to be geared up for August regardless of where the Munster title resides.

An open draw mightn't give you Dub Kerry or Mayo Tyrone in round 1 or indeed any interesting ties. But when is the first interesting tie as it is? Maybe an ulster final in july. Give the big teams a shake up, Kerry heading to ulster in round 1 will get their arse in gear. Yes the cream usually rises to the top but at least vary things. You could have Dublin in Enniskillen or Tyrone to Salthill, Kerry to Clones.
Except last year it wasn't.

Doesn't the back door give us unpredictable games? The current system is flawed but there seems to be endless threads on what is wrong and it's proving very difficult to come up with a solution to keep everyone happy.

In fairness to Padraic Duffy, he acknowledged this final point in the introduction to his new proposal. The "Super 8s" is something he seems to have come up with himself, but the keeping of the provincials, not introducing a second-tier competition etc. is the feedback he's received from the stakeholders.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on February 20, 2017, 04:29:04 PM
Last year it wasn't, but that's what theyve become accustomed to. I'd imagine Kerry and Cork are sick of the sight of each other. A rivalry is great and all, but when it happens constantly, it begins to lose it's appeal.

You do get the odd unpredictable game in the back door. Longford, Wicklow or Sligo might win 2 or 3 games, then stuffed by Kerry or Dublin in last eight. The big teams might get caught once, but not twice. A c'ship is not the same when it's not straight knock-out.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on February 20, 2017, 05:23:46 PM
there should be three or four super 8 competitions imho

one for the top teams, next best 8 and weakest 8.
it would give every team something to aim for.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 20, 2017, 05:40:39 PM
How about we call it the National Football League?
Anyway there are 3 motions for Congress
The HQ one for the Super 8
One from Laois proposing replacing Round 1 of the Qualifiers with 4 groups of 4
One from Carlow which I can't recall exactly but as far as I recall proposes starting Qualifiers earlier.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Derry Optimist on February 20, 2017, 05:58:21 PM
If the All Ireland championship is to be really competitive on a consistently regular basis the only solution is to abolish the current Provincial format and replace it with a system based on equality for all.The different no of counties in each provinces simply copper fastens the glaring inequalities at present which make it easier for Munster and Connacht provincial winners to reach the All Ireland Quarter finals.
In addition and to make every county in Ireland to have at least a realistic chance of being at least competitive at their own level I believe there should be three graded and separate championships such as those which exist in most County club championships ie Senior,Intermediate and Junior.There should be twelve counties in the Senior(Sam Maguire Cup),ten in Intermediate and ten in the Junior championship.Current league placings should determine which county plays in which championship.The games in the  final stages of these latter two could act as curtain risers to  last 8 Senior games in Croke park or wherever they are played.
Do I think that these thoughts of mine will become a reality? Highly unlikely I would suggest simply because most counties, especially the so-called weaker ones live, in the dreamland of thinking that this will be their year to win the long awaited Provincial title. So they hire the dearest manager who trains his panellists for four or five nights a week until the more intelligent players/ fringe panellists get fed up with the disproportionate ratio of training sessions to actual matches and then drop out.Eventually the manager is short of at least ten of his best players and ten of his fringe players. The rest lose heart, more matches are lost( the manager is now playing a practically reserve team)and the manager is forced to resign.There is no money left in the coffers and the supporters blame everybody except the provincial system which they slavishly adhere to.
If this trend keeps being replicated year in year out more and more players will become disillusioned and we will only be left with the Super 8.Can some GAA visionary with  courage and foresight not appeal to the masses and explain how our great game is being eroded in terms of non competitive  and unfair championship structures on the one hand and the presence of an unsightly ultra defensive playing system on the other?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 20, 2017, 07:34:50 PM
A simple exercise would be to ask congress delegates the following.
"Who here is from a junior club? Put up your hand."
"Who here is from an intermediate club? Put up your hand."
"Who here is from a senior club? Put up your hand."

"Now, leave your hand up if you think every club in your county should play in an ungraded championship with one winner at the end of it all."

I guarantee you the junior & intermediate lads wouldn't be long taking their hands down.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on February 20, 2017, 07:52:11 PM
Derry and Down were affected with players opting out. Now both are unlikely to be winning an AI, but what is the drop out rate in Waterford, Carlow, Limerick etc? Derry/Down at least have won AI and NFL in recent years/played in Div 1. Why would a Waterford player commit to a Div 4 campaign and early c'ship exit? Maybe this is a reason why such counties don't improve.

The current set up is elitist and the Super 8 moreso.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on February 20, 2017, 08:00:19 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on February 20, 2017, 07:34:50 PM
A simple exercise would be to ask congress delegates the following.
"Who here is from a junior club? Put up your hand."
"Who here is from an intermediate club? Put up your hand."
"Who here is from a senior club? Put up your hand."

"Now, leave your hand up if you think every club in your county should play in an ungraded championship with one winner at the end of it all."

I guarantee you the junior & intermediate lads wouldn't be long taking their hands down.
Sounds like a great idea.
Why hasn't someone else come up with that?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 20, 2017, 08:04:07 PM
All competitive sport creates elitism by its very nature.
Are you going to let Waterford get a bye to the final or what?
Senior/Inter/Junior for the AI  is so logical it's a no brainer but anyone here over 40 won't live to see it.
You can still have your Provincials with everyone entering and a League of some sort too if you want.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trileacman on February 20, 2017, 08:14:14 PM
My main concern in all of this is that we reduce the number of trophies being handed out from 5 to 1 in championship terms. That mightn't seem a huge issue for some but those counties outside the big 3 it's often a rare and historic chance to nail down some silverware.

For example last year Tyrone would have just had a "good year" with f**k all really to show for it if there were no provincial championship. Quality footballers such as Dermot McCabe, Conor McManus, Mark Breheny, Karl Mannion, Kevin Cassidy amongst others would have f**k all to show for their careers bar the piecemeal allstars.

I have to laugh that everyone thinks that they've imagined the ideal championship and the cure for all our ills. People heralded the back door as the tonic for the weaker teams. The decade before the back door produced 7 different winners of the All Ireland and a variety of runners
-up. The decade after the back door produced only 5. This decade has produced only 3 so far and there'd be slim odds that it will surpass 5.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 20, 2017, 08:23:24 PM
Only 4 AI winners in the 70's and 5 in the 80's I think.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 20, 2017, 08:26:13 PM
The back door was designed to give weaker teams a second chance.
By default, this also meant that stronger teams also got a second chance.
Don't think anyone really though it would result in the likes of Carlow winning an All-Ireland.
It did however result in 'middle-tier' teams like Fermanagh & Sligo progressing further in the championship than they could have hoped to under the previous structure.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on February 20, 2017, 08:54:00 PM
I can understand why he big counties like Dublin, Mayo, Kerry etc voting in favour of these proposals. What I don't understand is how delegates from smaller counties would vote for these proposals if they genuinely have no heir counties best interest at heart. It's not as if Padraic Duffy is touring the country to try and sell his proposals around the counties!!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on February 20, 2017, 09:21:07 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 20, 2017, 08:54:00 PM
I can understand why he big counties like Dublin, Mayo, Kerry etc voting in favour of these proposals. What I don't understand is how delegates from smaller counties would vote for these proposals if they genuinely have no heir counties best interest at heart. It's not as if Padraic Duffy is touring the country to try and sell his proposals around the counties!!

Duffy's probably greasing the wheels with wink-nod offers of development grants and the like. You scratch my back I'll scratch yours and all that shite. Don't underestimate turkeys' ability to vote for Christmas..
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dubhaltach on February 20, 2017, 09:34:39 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 20, 2017, 08:54:00 PM
I can understand why he big counties like Dublin, Mayo, Kerry etc voting in favour of these proposals. What I don't understand is how delegates from smaller counties would vote for these proposals if they genuinely have no heir counties best interest at heart. It's not as if Padraic Duffy is touring the country to try and sell his proposals around the counties!!

They've added in a sweetener for weaker counties by giving division 3 and 4 counties home advantage in the qualifiers. The proposals also say that 'A significant proportion of this increase (cash from the super 8s) should be ring-fenced for development of our games in less successful counties.'

While the proposals will be of little real benefit to the smaller counties, they're still a bit better than what's currently there.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on February 20, 2017, 09:36:58 PM
Quote from: Syferus on February 20, 2017, 09:21:07 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 20, 2017, 08:54:00 PM
I can understand why he big counties like Dublin, Mayo, Kerry etc voting in favour of these proposals. What I don't understand is how delegates from smaller counties would vote for these proposals if they genuinely have no heir counties best interest at heart. It's not as if Padraic Duffy is touring the country to try and sell his proposals around the counties!!

Duffy's probably greasing the wheels with wink-nod offers of development grants and the like. You scratch my back I'll scratch yours and all that shite. Don't underestimate turkeys' ability to vote for Christmas..

Wouldn't surprise me. Its ridiculous that he has been going around canvassing support for this motion. Then you have his fellow county man Dick Clerkin wheeled out last night to add weight to the argument. They are telling everyone how to vote, only in Ireland could this happen.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trileacman on February 20, 2017, 09:40:36 PM
In all honestly none  of these new proposals will mean f**k all. The big counties will still win out, players will still be torn away from their clubs and there will still be hammerings of weaker sides. No system will be much better than what's there already as there all pretty similar. The only mark of any change which will win out will be the continued inexonerable slide towards a semi-professional/ professional elite and economic interests of Mckenna et al.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: theticklemister on February 20, 2017, 09:54:12 PM
As someone said before hand, its the weaker counties who need more games, not the biggest. How can they improve if they don't get more games. Leitrim may get 2/3 games in FBD League, 7 in league and 2 in cship. They will not improve on this. GLOSSED OVER

It's the same with the defensive system and puke football. They introduced the mark. This still doesn't stop teams from playing this ultra defensive system. GLOSSED OVER

ON TWO OCCASIONS THEY HAVE FAILED TO ADDRESS THE PROPER ISSUES.

What are all the county's consensuses on this matter does anyone know? will they get 2/3?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 20, 2017, 10:24:05 PM
theticklemister, if Leitrim wanted to/were able to improve, why wouldn't they start with the league? Set out goals to get promoted to Division 3 in the x years. That would be a step forward, interest among all GAA people in the county would increase I'd have thought. Try to progress that way and take it from there. If you try to let teams like Leitrim have more competitive games, aren't they going to be of a similar nature to what they encounter in Division 4 already, only in the summer?

As for the senior, intermediate, junior proposals, how many times does it need to be said that they players from the weaker counties don't want it? They also want to retain the provincials.

For all those that love the Duffy-bashing and telling us what the cheeky devil is really up to (greasing wheels and such), could you imagine if he'd come up with a proposal that got rid of either of these when players from the weaker counties wanted them retained?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 20, 2017, 10:38:51 PM
Emeralda since when did players from the weaker Counties become the ruling body if the GAA?
The 3 grades would give weaker Counties a Summer competition they'd have a chance of winning and getting promoted to a higher grade. The present system more often than not gives them 2 defeats sometimes by big margins.
It's not a revolutionary proposal - it already happens across the 32 Counties in club Championships.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 20, 2017, 10:41:26 PM
Maybe we shouldn't pay so much attention to what the players want.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on February 20, 2017, 10:59:02 PM
Of course the players want high level exposure against the best teams and who can blame them. But it doesn't make it the right system and it is not the players job to govern the sport.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 21, 2017, 08:30:03 AM
Rossfan, I didn't say they're the ruling body. They're one stakeholder, but a very important one I think you'd agree. Duffy listened to what they had to say and included it when coming up with his proposal.

The point is that you need to bring the players with you. If you decide, in 2017, to scrap the provincials and bring in a three-tiered championship you'll cause mayhem and it won't get through congress.

Duffy is accused of all sorts but when his proposal reflects the desires of the players he's criticised too.

Who else would you all consider should be listened to ahead of the players?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 21, 2017, 09:51:58 AM
I said keep the Provincials
I said  replicating club systems at I C level won't happen in my lifetime
I don't and haven't  criticised Partick Duffy
Players with weaker Counties are one of many stakeholders but they will be around for about 5 or 6 years, officials, supporters etc will be around a lot longer.
Talking to/listening to one particular group is good but doesn't mean giving them a veto.
As I said before time the GAA set up a Group to look at 2040/2050 - competitions, demographics, organisational structures and so on ( but NOT fixtures calendar - that needs sorting out NOW).
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: screenexile on February 21, 2017, 10:04:44 AM
Does this new system mean it may be possible for Dublin/Kerry/Mayo to get beaten twice and still make an All Ireland Final/Win an All Ireland??
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on February 21, 2017, 10:05:55 AM
Quote from: screenexile on February 21, 2017, 10:04:44 AM
Does this new system mean it may be possible for Dublin/Kerry/Mayo to get beaten twice and still make an All Ireland Final/Win an All Ireland??
Appears so.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rosnarun on February 21, 2017, 10:12:34 AM
one of the main issues regarding any kind of change is the need to keep up the illusion that all teams are equal and its a mortal sin to treat them as anything else.
yet hurling does not have this problem are they elitist or just more realistic?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on February 21, 2017, 10:16:57 AM
Quote from: rosnarun on February 21, 2017, 10:12:34 AM
one of the main issues regarding any kind of change is the need to keep up the illusion that all teams are equal and its a mortal sin to treat them as anything else.
yet hurling does not have this problem are they elitist or just more realistic?

Elitist, marginal and nonsensical.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 21, 2017, 11:12:18 AM
Quote from: screenexile on February 21, 2017, 10:04:44 AM
Does this new system mean it may be possible for Dublin/Kerry/Mayo to get beaten twice and still make an All Ireland Final/Win an All Ireland??
Yes. Could lose in the Provincials and lose a group game. But technically they are separate competitions.
Syfīn there's far more nonsense in your insulting post than Rosnarun's factual one.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fuzzman on February 21, 2017, 11:15:17 AM
In the GAA proposal document they state:
The new structure will guarantee eight additional major games at venues within the provinces, which is particularly important in the context of the Association's investment in stadiums other than Croke Park. In addition, the playing of decisive matches of the championship in provincial venues will counter the Dublin-centred bias of the current structure. It will also bring top teams to provincial venues that they would never otherwise visit in the championship.

Team 1 and team 2 are always the provincial winners so lets say for argument we expect Kerry, Dublin, Mayo and Tyrone.

Team 1 always play team 2 in Croke park which means Dublin will always play one of their big rivals with home
advantage so we will never see Kerry v Dublin in Killarney or Mayo v Dublin in Castlebar. Would it not be fairer if they held them in a neutral venue like Clones or in the new Cork stadium (or Killarney if Dubs v Cork). Yes less revenue but a lot fairer to provincial winners outside Leinster.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 21, 2017, 11:41:14 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 21, 2017, 09:51:58 AM
I said keep the Provincials
I said  replicating club systems at I C level won't happen in my lifetime
I don't and haven't  criticised Partick Duffy
Players with weaker Counties are one of many stakeholders but they will be around for about 5 or 6 years, officials, supporters etc will be around a lot longer.
Talking to/listening to one particular group is good but doesn't mean giving them a veto.
As I said before time the GAA set up a Group to look at 2040/2050 - competitions, demographics, organisational structures and so on ( but NOT fixtures calendar - that needs sorting out NOW).
I know all that. Only the initial part of my reply was directed at you although you did seem to back the three-tiered system without mentioning that it won't happen anytime soon.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 21, 2017, 12:00:12 PM
When was the last time a major change in the GAA was welcomed by EVERYONE?
Sometimes you just have to do what's best and to hell with populism.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 21, 2017, 12:12:28 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on February 21, 2017, 12:00:12 PM
When was the last time a major change in the GAA was welcomed by EVERYONE?
Sometimes you just have to do what's best and to hell with populism.
Yes, but you also have to put forward something that has a chance of getting through.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 21, 2017, 01:04:02 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 21, 2017, 11:41:14 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 21, 2017, 09:51:58 AM
I said keep the Provincials
I said  replicating club systems at I C level won't happen in my lifetime
I don't and haven't  criticised Partick Duffy
Players with weaker Counties are one of many stakeholders but they will be around for about 5 or 6 years, officials, supporters etc will be around a lot longer.
Talking to/listening to one particular group is good but doesn't mean giving them a veto.
As I said before time the GAA set up a Group to look at 2040/2050 - competitions, demographics, organisational structures and so on ( but NOT fixtures calendar - that needs sorting out NOW).
I know all that. Only the initial part of my reply was directed at you although you did seem to back the three-tiered system without mentioning that it won't happen anytime soon.
Go back a page or 2 - I said no one over 40 would live to see it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thewobbler on February 21, 2017, 01:23:17 PM
I (personally, yes... me, everyone please look at me) did solve almost all the issues described in this thread, in a proposal a couple of years ago.

http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?topic=25868.msg1475581


People of course found a couple of new issues (such as when Tyrone endure both a dreadful league and provincial championship, their fans still expect them to be awarded a place in the last 16, plus some people expect the progress of weaker teams to be stymied, even though they'd be getting just as many games... and the majority of the them in an extremely competitive environment), but as I say, most of this thread's bugbears are put to bed.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 21, 2017, 01:25:34 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on February 21, 2017, 12:00:12 PM
When was the last time a major change in the GAA was welcomed by EVERYONE?
Sometimes you just have to do what's best and to hell with populism.

Who decides what is best? You?

Sickening arrogance.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Taylor on February 21, 2017, 01:45:55 PM
Ultimately the provinces are the issue here.

How much would the individual councils stand to lose if it went to say for example an open draw?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 21, 2017, 01:54:10 PM
Players, county boards and a significant number of fans like the provincials, and like the fact that everyone is in the All IReland Championship.

Media seem to hate it, because they are sick of early season mismatches.


I think the compromise is to link the championship to the leagues, based on a seeding, into the Provincials. Let the lower seeds play off before the high seeds come on board.

It means you wouldn't have your championship pairings until the end of the league, but does that matter?

Also, no qualifiers. Screw that.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thewobbler on February 21, 2017, 01:55:00 PM
Quote from: Taylor on February 21, 2017, 01:45:55 PM
Ultimately the provinces are the issue here.

How much would the individual councils stand to lose if it went to say for example an open draw?

1. The GAA absolutely needs provincial boards to administer and control games across the country; it is simply not possible to coordinate the competing needs of Derry and Donegal from an office in Dublin. Therefore taking away the provincial board's prized possession and cash cow is never going to happen. Everyone needs to be pragmatic here. This isn't "turkeys don't vote for Christmas" so much as "turkeys don't eat other turkeys".


2. While I would fancy Tyrone to win 9.99998 times out of 10 vs Antrim in a USFC game, you can be guaranteed that Antrim will put their heart and should into that game, hence 10,000 people will feel it is worth driving 40-odd miles and forking out £15 for the pleasure. But Wicklow vs Tyrone in an open draw? No thanks... we'll wait and see who Tyrone draw in the last 16. A football championship is all about whittling the competitors down to a final two. The provincial championships at least provide side stories in that process.


Always recall these two things before demanding the provincials are axed. Yep they're lopsided. But we'll balancing some form of imperfection with any system.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 21, 2017, 03:26:28 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 21, 2017, 01:25:34 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on February 21, 2017, 12:00:12 PM
When was the last time a major change in the GAA was welcomed by EVERYONE?
Sometimes you just have to do what's best and to hell with populism.

Who decides what is best? You?

Sickening arrogance.

I actually favour the Kildare approach which uses artificial intelligence to evaluate the best course of action.

(http://www.bostonprwire.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/Smart-Robots-1.jpg)

'Kildare delegate Sean Brady 2.0, pondering all those moments lost in time listening to Paraic Duffy, like tears in rain.'
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rufus T Firefly on February 21, 2017, 04:04:52 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on February 21, 2017, 01:55:00 PM
1. The GAA absolutely needs provincial boards to administer and control games across the country; it is simply not possible to coordinate the competing needs of Derry and Donegal from an office in Dublin. Therefore taking away the provincial board's prized possession and cash cow is never going to happen. Everyone needs to be pragmatic here. This isn't "turkeys don't vote for Christmas" so much as "turkeys don't eat other turkeys".


2. While I would fancy Tyrone to win 9.99998 times out of 10 vs Antrim in a USFC game, you can be guaranteed that Antrim will put their heart and should into that game, hence 10,000 people will feel it is worth driving 40-odd miles and forking out £15 for the pleasure. But Wicklow vs Tyrone in an open draw? No thanks... we'll wait and see who Tyrone draw in the last 16. A football championship is all about whittling the competitors down to a final two. The provincial championships at least provide side stories in that process.

Always recall these two things before demanding the provincials are axed. Yep they're lopsided. But we'll balancing some form of imperfection with any system.

Food for thought there wobbler - good post - and I say that as someone who feels the current system is unfair, and the Provincial Championships underpin that unfairness, and that we need some sort of change to freshen things up.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 21, 2017, 04:32:16 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 21, 2017, 01:54:10 PM
significant number of fans like the provincials, and like the fact that everyone is in the All IReland Championship.

428,725 at 32 Provincial games in 2016 would certainly confirm that they like the Provincials
12,941 at 9 First Round All Ireland games would suggest a lot of fans don't like everyone being in the 1 All Ireland


The 8 second round games gave us 34,000 with 12,000 of them at the Rhubarb game.

It means you wouldn't have your championship pairings until the end of the league, but does that matter? If it got rid of that daft "draws" programme in October it would be worth it for that alone

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Keyser soze on February 21, 2017, 05:14:38 PM
Am I missing something here. I have long been of the opinion that the GAA has the best and most popular amateur games in the world, drawing in massive audiences both live and on TV to watch both codes from a relatively small pool of people on this island [mainly]. It also has an absolutely unparalleled community, cultural and volunteer ethos.

When I read this thread however I could be forgiven for thinking that the organisation and the sport is dying on it's feet and that nobody goes to watch the games. The amount of angst on here about the divers ways to 'improve' the system is astonishing. Maybe I am a conservative [never thought I would say that lol] but those proposing changes can never see any negatives with introducing new radical formats or dispensing with or sidelining the provincial championships, structures which have made the GAA the fantastic organisation it is today.

I would caution you to be careful what you wish for.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 21, 2017, 05:55:45 PM
Massive crowds don't go to see our games because of the competition format nor do people volunteer for their club or county for that reason.

Nobody is claiming alternative formats are perfect or that the sport is dying but there are serious weaknesses and the sporting and entertainment worlds have changed massively. There's no point in saying the provincial championships have served us well when they existed primarily when sport was hardly ever on TV until the past 20-30 years.

People can now see dozens of high level soccer games on TV each week or go to European cup rugby games 7 or 8 times a year. That wasn't a reality for most of us growing up yet how many times can Kerry fans (for example) go a watch them play a genuine competitive game against top opposition at home?

We have a daft system and it will hinder us in the future if we don't address it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Maroon Manc on February 21, 2017, 06:15:21 PM
Get rid of the league, keep the provincials and create a championship that would guarantee every county a minimum of 6 games on a Champions League format.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 21, 2017, 06:37:25 PM
When or how was it decided that the GAA has the best and most popular amateur games in the world?
Sounds like the same school of thought that declares that fans of the 26 Cos soccer team are "the best fans in the world" ::)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on February 21, 2017, 08:36:25 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 21, 2017, 06:37:25 PM
When or how was it decided that the GAA has the best and most popular amateur games in the world?
Sounds like the same school of thought that declares that fans of the 26 Cos soccer team are "the best fans in the world" ::)

Most amateur sport is a bit shit in fairness.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trileacman on February 21, 2017, 09:07:32 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 21, 2017, 05:55:45 PM
Massive crowds don't go to see our games because of the competition format nor do people volunteer for their club or county for that reason.

Nobody is claiming alternative formats are perfect or that the sport is dying but there are serious weaknesses and the sporting and entertainment worlds have changed massively. There's no point in saying the provincial championships have served us well when they existed primarily when sport was hardly ever on TV until the past 20-30 years.

People can now see dozens of high level soccer games on TV each week or go to European cup rugby games 7 or 8 times a year. That wasn't a reality for most of us growing up yet how many times can Kerry fans (for example) go a watch them play a genuine competitive game against top opposition at home?

We have a daft system and it will hinder us in the future if we don't address it.

If you want entertainment go to Bon Jovi concert. If you think we're gonna compete with international games like soccer or rugby we won't and trying to ape them will only hasten or downfall.

The gaa strength is the amateur status and our connection to the locality. That's why the march towards elitism and professionalism is the greatest threat to our games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 21, 2017, 09:16:38 PM
That's nonsense in fairness. Again you can stick your head in the sand and think 1930's style sport but all elite level sport is a form of entertainment. People often build their weekends around sport events and view it as entertainment and that's a reality we have to accept. We are also in competition in Ireland with every sport that's popular there and kids are not going to differentiate between professional international sports and amateur national ones. 

By the way I don't se how developing a sensible competition structure is aping anyone or how it could possibly hasten our downfall. Sticking with a dysfunctional format that doesn't reflect modern society is definitely going to harm our sport.

I don't see any march to professionalism and I don't see how having a better competition format at the highest level would impact in any negative way on our local connection, which is a strength of course.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trileacman on February 21, 2017, 09:40:18 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 21, 2017, 09:16:38 PM
We are also in competition in Ireland with every sport that's popular there and kids are not going to differentiate between professional international sports and amateur national ones. 

By the way I don't se how developing a sensible competition structure is aping anyone or how it could possibly hasten our downfall. Sticking with a dysfunctional format that doesn't reflect modern society is definitely going to harm our sport.

I don't see any march to professionalism and I don't see how having a better competition format at the highest level would impact in any negative way on our local connection, which is a strength of course.

Yes kids will differentiate between professional and amateur sports. They'll stick to the game their dad played, they'll support the place there from not some city they've never visited in England, they'll want to be the sportsmen they get to see in the flesh not some tanned fcuker on a pixelated screen, they'll stick to the sport that happens a mile down the road not in anfield, goodison, limerick, Dublin, Galway or Belfast, they'll stick to the sport where the stars train on their local pitch, or where the stars are their teachers or work with their dads or take them for u-12 training, they'll stick with the sport that lets them in for a tenner not one that charges 70euro a head for a World Cup qualifying match.

You see amateursism is what dictates all that is special and unique about the gaa. Without it we're nothing more than rugby league.

How does our format not reflect modern society? What the f**k does that even mean? Give me an proper reason for changing the game like its a shorter season or players will be more sure  of the structure not such convoluted high hat bullshit.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 21, 2017, 09:50:17 PM
Tipperary voted to support the proposals tonight, despite a strong statement from Liam Kearns against the motion.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trileacman on February 21, 2017, 09:53:43 PM
And your wrong that everything needs to be entertaining. I didn't start supporting Tyrone or trillick as a kid because we were "entertaining". We were shite and played shite but it was our shite and I loved that. You've fallen into the Peter Mckenna trap that thinks the gaa is a product. Something to be bought and sold and glammed up to charge a consumer for. I don't need u2 playing at half time of the ai final or cheerleaders before throw-in for me to want to watch it and it's worth f**k all more if they bother to do that.

I don't need change for changes sake. I don't need a super 8 or 40,000 people at a interprovincial final. I don't need heated seats, hotdogs or overpriced pints of carlsberg. By all means change the game to accommodate club players or stamp down on cynicism or eradicate burnout.

But don't change the game to create "interest" or "entertainment" or increase gate revenue. People who turn up to gaa matches for entertainment should be refused entry and sent to the cinema.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 21, 2017, 10:09:42 PM
Jases Trillick them must be strong tablets yer on!!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on February 21, 2017, 10:15:30 PM
Quote from: Maroon Manc on February 21, 2017, 06:15:21 PM
Get rid of the league, keep the provincials and create a championship that would guarantee every county a minimum of 6 games on a Champions League format.

Cue the ability to lose a few games and win the All Ireland debate.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on February 21, 2017, 10:17:04 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on February 21, 2017, 01:23:17 PM
I (personally, yes... me, everyone please look at me) did solve almost all the issues described in this thread, in a proposal a couple of years ago.

http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?topic=25868.msg1475581


People of course found a couple of new issues (such as when Tyrone endure both a dreadful league and provincial championship, their fans still expect them to be awarded a place in the last 16, plus some people expect the progress of weaker teams to be stymied, even though they'd be getting just as many games... and the majority of the them in an extremely competitive environment), but as I say, most of this thread's bugbears are put to bed.

Best thought out situation I've seen yet.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 21, 2017, 10:19:50 PM
Quote from: trileacman on February 21, 2017, 09:53:43 PM
And your wrong that everything needs to be entertaining. I didn't start supporting Tyrone or trillick as a kid because we were "entertaining". We were shite and played shite but it was our shite and I loved that. You've fallen into the Peter Mckenna trap that thinks the gaa is a product. Something to be bought and sold and glammed up to charge a consumer for. I don't need u2 playing at half time of the ai final or cheerleaders before throw-in for me to want to watch it and it's worth f**k all more if they bother to do that.

I don't need change for changes sake. I don't need a super 8 or 40,000 people at a interprovincial final. I don't need heated seats, hotdogs or overpriced pints of carlsberg. By all means change the game to accommodate club players or stamp down on cynicism or eradicate burnout.

But don't change the game to create "interest" or "entertainment" or increase gate revenue. People who turn up to gaa matches for entertainment should be refused entry and sent to the cinema.

Good man. That's the greatest load of bollocks I've read in a long time. Do you still go to matches by horse and trap, do you abuse fellas for drinking a latte from Starbucks when walking to the match rather than a flask of milky tae and a hang sandwich? Do you moan to your mates about the amount of women at the match with their fancy sunglasses or the Tyrone supporters that weren't at some poxy McKenna cup game in the arse end of January??

To say that kids will play their Dads game and won't be influenced by TV sports stars is so far from reality that I wonder if there's any hope of having a reasonable conversation about this with you. Christ almighty Ger Egan and Jimmy Barry Murphy's sons play professional soccer and they are two of the GAA's biggest icons, Seanie O'Leary's son plays rugby, Mick Galway jacked in IC football for rugby, Darren Sweetman jacked in IC hurling for Munster rugby and there's loads more. Ask the majority of Irish kids what they want to be when they grow up and it will be a professional soccer player. We have great games and a lot going for us but it serves nobody to ignore the reality of the competition we face.

By the way, I've often spoken about the benefits of changing our structures so this certainly isn't about change for change's sake it's about have a better structured more vibrant, interesting IC season that will allow clubs more certainty about when they are playing too. The current system doesn't do that so why anyone would want to keep it is beyond me.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trileacman on February 22, 2017, 12:32:50 AM
Judging by the way your rhyming off players who left gaa for rugby or soccer it's obvious your pre-occupied by both of them. I'll leave you to dream up a "format  that reflects modern society", whatever the fcuk that's supposed to mean. More than likely it's one with group stages, sin bins, bigger goals and a rule preventing anyone from handling the ball bur the goalie.

The facts will be though in 10 years Leitrim will still be shite and getting hammered, there still be an elite set of teams, clubs will still be at loggerheads with the counties and we'll have another plethora of experts fit to fix all the ills of the world with things like seeding and 5 dedicated matches a year.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on February 22, 2017, 12:34:41 AM
Don't worry Zulu. Dublin will still win the AI no matter what the format is.

Duffy distracting people with an argument over format when the real one is season length and funding. The GAA at its most typical.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trileacman on February 22, 2017, 01:04:34 AM
There was a lad here who posted the 7 or 8 current problems with the championship a year or two ago in one of those threads. If someone remembers it and could dig it up it where all debate on this issue should eminate from. Most of the changes suggested address only one problem of the current system and create 2-3 more.

Wobblers is a sound suggestion but even it has its flaws, however the positives far outweigh the negatives. The problem is that a radical solution such as his is needed to address the current problems. The gaa democratic structure however is completely unable to pass such radical ideas as congress is so wide and such broad consensus is needed that only small piece meal changes can be made. This means some round robin/ champions league shite will be foisted on us and address simply no issues apart from the one that it's been a few months since we did something reckless.

Short of some benevolent dictator seizing gaa hq in the morning I hold out no hope for reasonable well-thought changes coming from Gaa congress hence I am opposed to any changes they may make or dream up. A champions league group here or a round Robin there achieve f**k all really and stand out as change for changes sake.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Avondhu star on February 22, 2017, 09:18:10 AM
Quote from: Zulu on February 21, 2017, 10:19:50 PM
Quote from: trileacman on February 21, 2017, 09:53:43 PM
And your wrong that everything needs to be entertaining. I didn't start supporting Tyrone or trillick as a kid because we were "entertaining". We were shite and played shite but it was our shite and I loved that. You've fallen into the Peter Mckenna trap that thinks the gaa is a product. Something to be bought and sold and glammed up to charge a consumer for. I don't need u2 playing at half time of the ai final or cheerleaders before throw-in for me to want to watch it and it's worth f**k all more if they bother to do that.

I don't need change for changes sake. I don't need a super 8 or 40,000 people at a interprovincial final. I don't need heated seats, hotdogs or overpriced pints of carlsberg. By all means change the game to accommodate club players or stamp down on cynicism or eradicate burnout.

But don't change the game to create "interest" or "entertainment" or increase gate revenue. People who turn up to gaa matches for entertainment should be refused entry and sent to the cinema.

Good man. That's the greatest load of bollocks I've read in a long time. Do you still go to matches by horse and trap, do you abuse fellas for drinking a latte from Starbucks when walking to the match rather than a flask of milky tae and a hang sandwich? Do you moan to your mates about the amount of women at the match with their fancy sunglasses or the Tyrone supporters that weren't at some poxy McKenna cup game in the arse end of January??

To say that kids will play their Dads game and won't be influenced by TV sports stars is so far from reality that I wonder if there's any hope of having a reasonable conversation about this with you. Christ almighty Ger Egan and Jimmy Barry Murphy's sons play professional soccer and they are two of the GAA's biggest icons, Seanie O'Leary's son plays rugby, Mick Galway jacked in IC football for rugby, Darren Sweetman jacked in IC hurling for Munster rugby and there's loads more. Ask the majority of Irish kids what they want to be when they grow up and it will be a professional soccer player. We have great games and a lot going for us but it serves nobody to ignore the reality of the competition we face.

By the way, I've often spoken about the benefits of changing our structures so this certainly isn't about change for change's sake it's about have a better structured more vibrant, interesting IC season that will allow clubs more certainty about when they are playing too. The current system doesn't do that so why anyone would want to keep it is beyond me.

Whos Ger Egan and Darren Sweetman?
Maybe you mean John Egan and Darren Sweetnam.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rosnarun on February 22, 2017, 09:32:40 AM
you got to love the written on the back of a fag box solutions to the championship format , these pages show the exact problem. we have 4 or six 'Solutions' to the problem
and We cant' even agree what the problem is . find a joint solution to cure all theses ills if you can
a) too much intercounty football
b) too little  intercounty football
c) burnout and 'abuse of player'
d) players not getting enough games
e) Clubs being pushed around by county boards/ management,fixture schedule
f) counties out of the championship in June still running club championship in October due to some minor/u21 involvement?
g) too much time wasted on provincial games
h) at least with provincial games 4 counties get to win something
one of my own
i) the curse of hurling the drawing up of fixture is always reliant of making room for hurling in some counties halving the number if Sunday's available
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on February 22, 2017, 09:53:06 AM
Quote from: Avondhu star on February 22, 2017, 09:18:10 AM
Quote from: Zulu on February 21, 2017, 10:19:50 PM
Quote from: trileacman on February 21, 2017, 09:53:43 PM
And your wrong that everything needs to be entertaining. I didn't start supporting Tyrone or trillick as a kid because we were "entertaining". We were shite and played shite but it was our shite and I loved that. You've fallen into the Peter Mckenna trap that thinks the gaa is a product. Something to be bought and sold and glammed up to charge a consumer for. I don't need u2 playing at half time of the ai final or cheerleaders before throw-in for me to want to watch it and it's worth f**k all more if they bother to do that.

I don't need change for changes sake. I don't need a super 8 or 40,000 people at a interprovincial final. I don't need heated seats, hotdogs or overpriced pints of carlsberg. By all means change the game to accommodate club players or stamp down on cynicism or eradicate burnout.

But don't change the game to create "interest" or "entertainment" or increase gate revenue. People who turn up to gaa matches for entertainment should be refused entry and sent to the cinema.

Good man. That's the greatest load of bollocks I've read in a long time. Do you still go to matches by horse and trap, do you abuse fellas for drinking a latte from Starbucks when walking to the match rather than a flask of milky tae and a hang sandwich? Do you moan to your mates about the amount of women at the match with their fancy sunglasses or the Tyrone supporters that weren't at some poxy McKenna cup game in the arse end of January??

To say that kids will play their Dads game and won't be influenced by TV sports stars is so far from reality that I wonder if there's any hope of having a reasonable conversation about this with you. Christ almighty Ger Egan and Jimmy Barry Murphy's sons play professional soccer and they are two of the GAA's biggest icons, Seanie O'Leary's son plays rugby, Mick Galway jacked in IC football for rugby, Darren Sweetman jacked in IC hurling for Munster rugby and there's loads more. Ask the majority of Irish kids what they want to be when they grow up and it will be a professional soccer player. We have great games and a lot going for us but it serves nobody to ignore the reality of the competition we face.

By the way, I've often spoken about the benefits of changing our structures so this certainly isn't about change for change's sake it's about have a better structured more vibrant, interesting IC season that will allow clubs more certainty about when they are playing too. The current system doesn't do that so why anyone would want to keep it is beyond me.

Whos Ger Egan and Darren Sweetman?
Maybe you mean John Egan and Darren Sweetnam.

Midfielder for Westmeath, didn't know he had a young lad  :P
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on February 22, 2017, 09:56:10 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 21, 2017, 09:50:17 PM
Tipperary voted to support the proposals tonight, despite a strong statement from Liam Kearns against the motion.

Saw that, Duffy's trip to Tipp to influence the hurling crowd was worth it in the end. Mayo and Kerry going to support the stupidly named Super 8s too. Never thought I'd say it but fair play to Cork, they are voting against it. Only thing the Super 8s has going for it IMO is that the GPA are supposed to be coming out against it. Maybe there is some merit in it there somewhere so.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: tippabu on February 22, 2017, 10:43:09 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 22, 2017, 09:56:10 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 21, 2017, 09:50:17 PM
Tipperary voted to support the proposals tonight, despite a strong statement from Liam Kearns against the motion.

Saw that, Duffy's trip to Tipp to influence the hurling crowd was worth it in the end. Mayo and Kerry going to support the stupidly named Super 8s too. Never thought I'd say it but fair play to Cork, they are voting against it. Only thing the Super 8s has going for it IMO is that the GPA are supposed to be coming out against it. Maybe there is some merit in it there somewhere so.

Tipp football bored,  management, players all completely against it, no surprise it was voted through....would have had better chance if we went for it and said it would be beneficial to tipp football almost certainly would've been voted no here then
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 10:53:42 AM
The GAA's concerted campaign drive seems to bearing fruit. Offer a few extra quid into the coffers of cash strapped county boards and it is amazing how the loyalty of county delegates can be swayed.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 22, 2017, 11:27:07 AM
An illustrious career in FF awaits Duffy if he ever jacks in the DG job.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 22, 2017, 11:40:42 AM
Quote from: Syferus on February 22, 2017, 12:34:41 AM
Don't worry Zulu. Dublin will still win the AI no matter what the format is.

Duffy distracting people with an argument over format when the real one is season length and funding. The GAA at its most typical.
Does his proposal not shorten the season?
Quote from: rosnarun on February 22, 2017, 09:32:40 AM
you got to love the written on the back of a fag box solutions to the championship format , these pages show the exact problem. we have 4 or six 'Solutions' to the problem
and We cant' even agree what the problem is . find a joint solution to cure all theses ills if you can
a) too much intercounty football
b) too little  intercounty football
c) burnout and 'abuse of player'
d) players not getting enough games
e) Clubs being pushed around by county boards/ management,fixture schedule
f) counties out of the championship in June still running club championship in October due to some minor/u21 involvement?
g) too much time wasted on provincial games
h) at least with provincial games 4 counties get to win something
one of my own
i) the curse of hurling the drawing up of fixture is always reliant of making room for hurling in some counties halving the number if Sunday's available

Nicely summarised.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Maroon Manc on February 22, 2017, 11:52:10 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on February 21, 2017, 10:15:30 PM
Quote from: Maroon Manc on February 21, 2017, 06:15:21 PM
Get rid of the league, keep the provincials and create a championship that would guarantee every county a minimum of 6 games on a Champions League format.

Cue the ability to lose a few games and win the All Ireland debate.

It would but we've been here before when the structure was changed in 2001. Its not possible to keep the provincials and expand the championship for everyone without getting rid of the league.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: twohands!!! on February 22, 2017, 11:55:29 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 22, 2017, 09:56:10 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 21, 2017, 09:50:17 PM
Tipperary voted to support the proposals tonight, despite a strong statement from Liam Kearns against the motion.

Saw that, Duffy's trip to Tipp to influence the hurling crowd was worth it in the end. Mayo and Kerry going to support the stupidly named Super 8s too. Never thought I'd say it but fair play to Cork, they are voting against it. Only thing the Super 8s has going for it IMO is that the GPA are supposed to be coming out against it. Maybe there is some merit in it there somewhere so.

Cork voting against it shows how much control the hurling side of the house have there. The fact that Cork voted against it despite the fact that it would have more than likely meant  more games (cash ) for the over budget new stadium says a world.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 22, 2017, 12:36:26 PM
Quote from: trileacman on February 22, 2017, 12:32:50 AM
Judging by the way your rhyming off players who left gaa for rugby or soccer it's obvious your pre-occupied by both of them. I'll leave you to dream up a "format  that reflects modern society", whatever the fcuk that's supposed to mean. More than likely it's one with group stages, sin bins, bigger goals and a rule preventing anyone from handling the ball bur the goalie.

The facts will be though in 10 years Leitrim will still be shite and getting hammered, there still be an elite set of teams, clubs will still be at loggerheads with the counties and we'll have another plethora of experts fit to fix all the ills of the world with things like seeding and 5 dedicated matches a year.

Is having an interest in other sports a bad thing or anti-GAA? As it happens I have hardly any interest in either sport but that's neither here nor there. I've laid out what I'd like to see and while it isn't perfect and sacrifices some things that others wouldn't it solves many of the issues we have at both club and county level.

You're right, some teams will always struggle (same in every sport) and as long as there isn't total separation between club and county there will still be issues. However, that doesn't mean we can't improve the situation and compete and develop in the modern sports world. You know the one with rural depopulation, longer working hours, less stay at home mothers, massively increased exposure to TV/online sport, increasing obesity and drop out of sport etc. Alternatively we could all try to live in your Darby O'Gill-esque world where Mammies see off their sons from the house front door as they skip down the road with their Dad, gear bags in hand. Maybe saluting a friendly farmer as he passes by on his tractor before arriving at the pitch where the whole village have turned out to support the U8's in their league game.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 02:18:47 PM
Do we know what way the vote is likely to go at this stage? I think everything at this stage is just mere speculation and I'm hopeful that the statements of the CPA in recent days will have influence in getting the 1/3rd support needed to prevent this motion from passing. Otherwise I think this has the capability of being a massive own goal for the GAA and will lead to a further divide between the GAA hierarchy and the grass roots.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: screenexile on February 22, 2017, 02:35:42 PM
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/gaa/allireland-in-huge-shakeup-35471157.html
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dubhaltach on February 22, 2017, 05:40:11 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 02:18:47 PM
Do we know what way the vote is likely to go at this stage? I think everything at this stage is just mere speculation and I'm hopeful that the statements of the CPA in recent days will have influence in getting the 1/3rd support needed to prevent this motion from passing. Otherwise I think this has the capability of being a massive own goal for the GAA and will lead to a further divide between the GAA hierarchy and the grass roots.

Out of interest, what's your main objection to these proposals going through?

I can see some logic in the CPA argument that they don't go far enough and that the can is being pushed down the road for another 3 years. But this is GAA Congress were talking about, no radical proposal is getting through there for another couple of decades. As far as I can see the only real changes proposed here are an extra 8 matches in July/August played at provincial venues. Grounds that are lucky to see one big match a year at present.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on February 22, 2017, 05:55:32 PM
I cannot see the smaller counties voting for this, nor the stronger hurling counties

and with Cork voting no, does it have much of a chance getting the % needed?
I hope not
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Donnellys Hollow on February 22, 2017, 05:59:15 PM
Kildare will be for it. The vote was tied and the chairman gave the casting vote in favour.

I hope it doesn't get the 2/3s needed.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: twohands!!! on February 22, 2017, 06:06:19 PM
Breakdown

For
Kerry
Tipperary
Mayo
Kildare

Against
Cork
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 22, 2017, 08:25:51 PM
Apparently, we're voting in favour of it as well.
We've been promised a box of bulbs for the floodlights in Navan.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: mrdeeds on February 22, 2017, 08:50:24 PM
Would it not make more sense to change the majority needed to 50% plus one rather than a two thirds first anf then any new proposals can be passed more easily.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 22, 2017, 09:03:30 PM
Quote from: Dubhaltach on February 22, 2017, 05:40:11 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 02:18:47 PM
Do we know what way the vote is likely to go at this stage? I think everything at this stage is just mere speculation and I'm hopeful that the statements of the CPA in recent days will have influence in getting the 1/3rd support needed to prevent this motion from passing. Otherwise I think this has the capability of being a massive own goal for the GAA and will lead to a further divide between the GAA hierarchy and the grass roots.

Out of interest, what's your main objection to these proposals going through?

I can see some logic in the CPA argument that they don't go far enough and that the can is being pushed down the road for another 3 years. But this is GAA Congress were talking about, no radical proposal is getting through there for another couple of decades. As far as I can see the only real changes proposed here are an extra 8 matches in July/August played at provincial venues. Grounds that are lucky to see one big match a year at present.
I'd like to know the answer to this question to all those opposed.

What I mean is, regardless of what anyone thinks the ideal solution is, do you think that the current system is better or worse than the new proposal?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thewobbler on February 22, 2017, 09:37:16 PM
Quote from: mrdeeds on February 22, 2017, 08:50:24 PM
Would it not make more sense to change the majority needed to 50% plus one rather than a two thirds first anf then any new proposals can be passed more easily.

This is the exact reason why it's in place.

Think about this. If a motion is passed with 50.01% of the vote, then we can fully expect a counter motion the following season and two small brown envelopes is all that's required to see it through.

Helps nobody. Plus there would be dozens more motions every year as they'd have a much higher chance of getting through. The tinkermen would delights while our hands suffer.

When a motion is passed with a 2/3rds majority it will almost certainly have time to measure its impact.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: twohands!!! on February 22, 2017, 09:54:22 PM
Breakdown what from I've seen so far (feel free to add - I say there are probably a lot of county boards taking votes this week)

For
Kerry
Tipperary
Mayo
Kildare
Meath

Against
Cork
GPA
CPA
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trileacman on February 22, 2017, 10:01:57 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 22, 2017, 09:03:30 PM
Quote from: Dubhaltach on February 22, 2017, 05:40:11 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 02:18:47 PM
Do we know what way the vote is likely to go at this stage? I think everything at this stage is just mere speculation and I'm hopeful that the statements of the CPA in recent days will have influence in getting the 1/3rd support needed to prevent this motion from passing. Otherwise I think this has the capability of being a massive own goal for the GAA and will lead to a further divide between the GAA hierarchy and the grass roots.

Out of interest, what's your main objection to these proposals going through?

I can see some logic in the CPA argument that they don't go far enough and that the can is being pushed down the road for another 3 years. But this is GAA Congress were talking about, no radical proposal is getting through there for another couple of decades. As far as I can see the only real changes proposed here are an extra 8 matches in July/August played at provincial venues. Grounds that are lucky to see one big match a year at present.
I'd like to know the answer to this question to all those opposed.

What I mean is, regardless of what anyone thinks the ideal solution is, do you think that the current system is better or worse than the new proposal?

It's worse. It creates extra games for 8 counties, locking up county players for a greater period of the summer. It allows the stronger teams to have a couple of shit days out and still win the All Ireland. It allows the Division 1 elite to play more against top sides, become richer and become stronger.

It's one and only positive is that it increases the gaa coffers and will produce and favour more lucrative TV deals. It's the championship structure that Rupert murdoch would dream up.

And I'm not just a dour negative bastard. I'll support intelligent change such as wobblers, but this new proposal is an abberation.

Why are you in favour of it?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 10:29:28 PM
Quote from: Dubhaltach on February 22, 2017, 05:40:11 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 02:18:47 PM
Do we know what way the vote is likely to go at this stage? I think everything at this stage is just mere speculation and I'm hopeful that the statements of the CPA in recent days will have influence in getting the 1/3rd support needed to prevent this motion from passing. Otherwise I think this has the capability of being a massive own goal for the GAA and will lead to a further divide between the GAA hierarchy and the grass roots.

Out of interest, what's your main objection to these proposals going through?

I can see some logic in the CPA argument that they don't go far enough and that the can is being pushed down the road for another 3 years. But this is GAA Congress were talking about, no radical proposal is getting through there for another couple of decades. As far as I can see the only real changes proposed here are an extra 8 matches in July/August played at provincial venues. Grounds that are lucky to see one big match a year at present.

Major objection is the so called super 8 element. The elite will play more top level games, gain more exposure and these counties will veer closer to semi-pro status. A Diluted league structure in the middle of the championship will do nothing for excitement and the possibility of shock results will become non existent. It also has the potential to create effective dead rubbers in mid summer and people staying away from attending the matches since they know there will always be another day out. There is absolutely no need for a super 8 structure other than for commercial reasons.

The abolition of replays I have no issue with and moving the season forward I'd be in favour of as well, even if I'd prefer the championship to be completed even earlier and run a club series that is properly promoted on tv between August-December.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: dec on February 22, 2017, 10:38:53 PM
How is the abolition of replays going to happen?
Just keep playing periods of extra time until one team wins?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 11:01:16 PM
Philip Jordan talking a lot of sense on the proposals for a Tyrone man!

http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2017/0222/854561-philip-jordan-gaa-change-needs-to-go-further/
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: bennydorano on February 22, 2017, 11:47:12 PM
Jordan is definitely one of the more sharper observers.

I personally don't see whats to gain from the Super 8 bar a few extra ££ and in all likelyhood it is a further sop to Sky. What is the point of it????
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dubhaltach on February 23, 2017, 12:57:07 AM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 10:29:28 PM
Quote from: Dubhaltach on February 22, 2017, 05:40:11 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 02:18:47 PM
Do we know what way the vote is likely to go at this stage? I think everything at this stage is just mere speculation and I'm hopeful that the statements of the CPA in recent days will have influence in getting the 1/3rd support needed to prevent this motion from passing. Otherwise I think this has the capability of being a massive own goal for the GAA and will lead to a further divide between the GAA hierarchy and the grass roots.

Out of interest, what's your main objection to these proposals going through?

I can see some logic in the CPA argument that they don't go far enough and that the can is being pushed down the road for another 3 years. But this is GAA Congress were talking about, no radical proposal is getting through there for another couple of decades. As far as I can see the only real changes proposed here are an extra 8 matches in July/August played at provincial venues. Grounds that are lucky to see one big match a year at present.

Major objection is the so called super 8 element. The elite will play more top level games, gain more exposure and these counties will veer closer to semi-pro status. A Diluted league structure in the middle of the championship will do nothing for excitement and the possibility of shock results will become non existent. It also has the potential to create effective dead rubbers in mid summer and people staying away from attending the matches since they know there will always be another day out. There is absolutely no need for a super 8 structure other than for commercial reasons.

The abolition of replays I have no issue with and moving the season forward I'd be in favour of as well, even if I'd prefer the championship to be completed even earlier and run a club series that is properly promoted on tv between August-December.

23 counties have made the all-Ireland quarter finals in the last 15 years so it's unlikely to be the same elite 8, year in year out. The majority of counties could have a realistic chance of making it that far. At present, 4 counties have realistic ambitions of winning the all Ireland. I don't think that any structural change to the championship is going to change that though.

The main driving force behind the super 8s is undoubtedly commercial reasons. But at the same time, as a supporter, the prospect of more games between the top teams at the height of summer is not something I'd have a problem with. At present, they usually only meet each other at this time of year when the weather is shite. The fact that the 2 provincial champions play each other first at the group stages should also reduce the possibility of dead rubber matches.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on February 23, 2017, 09:19:42 AM
Sligo and Leitrim voting for the proposal too.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 09:54:30 AM
Can original poster or admin stick up a poll to see what the gaaboard opinion is? Can add us to twohands list then.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 10:14:13 AM
23 counties made the last 8 in the last 15 years..........if this goes through it will be more or less be the same 8 counties in the last 8 for......well forever! There may be an odd shock in who gets into the last 8 but think about it like this......the counties who make the last 8 in the first year will have a considerable advantage over those that don't in terms of finance, exposure and experience gained, ease of player buy in the following year............therefore widening the gap. The GAA should be careful about what they wish for............and that is coming from a Tyrone man who are expected to be one of the top 8...........
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 10:28:46 AM
Quote from: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 10:14:13 AM
23 counties made the last 8 in the last 15 years..........if this goes through it will be more or less be the same 8 counties in the last 8 for......well forever! There may be an odd shock in who gets into the last 8 but think about it like this......the counties who make the last 8 in the first year will have a considerable advantage over those that don't in terms of finance, exposure and experience gained, ease of player buy in the following year............therefore widening the gap. The GAA should be careful about what they wish for............and that is coming from a Tyrone man who are expected to be one of the top 8...........

Graph of the above

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C5VU3YZWcAAzC96.jpg:large)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Owenmoresider on February 23, 2017, 10:31:37 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on February 23, 2017, 09:19:42 AM
Sligo and Leitrim voting for the proposal too.
Of course we would, we'd never disobey our masters.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dire Ear on February 23, 2017, 10:45:37 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 10:28:46 AM
Quote from: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 10:14:13 AM
23 counties made the last 8 in the last 15 years..........if this goes through it will be more or less be the same 8 counties in the last 8 for......well forever! There may be an odd shock in who gets into the last 8 but think about it like this......the counties who make the last 8 in the first year will have a considerable advantage over those that don't in terms of finance, exposure and experience gained, ease of player buy in the following year............therefore widening the gap. The GAA should be careful about what they wish for............and that is coming from a Tyrone man who are expected to be one of the top 8...........

Graph of the above

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C5VU3YZWcAAzC96.jpg:large)
Kerry hoors...16 times in 15 years   !!! ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 11:10:02 AM
Quote from: Dire Ear on February 23, 2017, 10:45:37 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 10:28:46 AM
Quote from: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 10:14:13 AM
23 counties made the last 8 in the last 15 years..........if this goes through it will be more or less be the same 8 counties in the last 8 for......well forever! There may be an odd shock in who gets into the last 8 but think about it like this......the counties who make the last 8 in the first year will have a considerable advantage over those that don't in terms of finance, exposure and experience gained, ease of player buy in the following year............therefore widening the gap. The GAA should be careful about what they wish for............and that is coming from a Tyrone man who are expected to be one of the top 8...........

Graph of the above

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C5VU3YZWcAAzC96.jpg:large)
Kerry hoors...16 times in 15 years   !!! ;)

16 years, 2001 - 2016. That's some going in fairness, 100% record, handy province or not.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 11:15:44 AM
What the graph illustrates is that there are already superpowers in GAA. The only county in Leinster that may make the super 8 is Dublin. How are the rest of the counties ever going to compete with Dublin? It is like asking Wycombe Wanderers to go toe to toe with Chelsea..........instead of proposals like this the GAA should be coming up with ideas to make the weaker counties (counties like Meath Down Cork Galway Armagh Cavan Roscommon and others) who have been traditionally competitive in a position where they can catch up with the top 4. That is the only way they are going to have a great championship in the future. And to think that Cavan and Roscommon are in Division One but are still so far off All Ireland contention just makes this argument stronger!
How do you do it?
Level up the financial resources each county team can spend.
Increase the number of GAA paid coaches in weaker counties
Improve training facilities in weaker counties
Limit the amount of training county teams do.
Have a fixture schedule that helps the club game in every county so that players in weaker counties dont choose club over county as they wont lose out playing with their club

The more counties who can be competitive the better the provincial and All Ireland series will be and the money will roll in from all around the country. If it is limited to 8 counties each year then the financial spread will be much less!



Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rosnarun on February 23, 2017, 11:17:16 AM
Quote from: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 10:14:13 AM
23 counties made the last 8 in the last 15 years..........if this goes through it will be more or less be the same 8 counties in the last 8 for......well forever! There may be an odd shock in who gets into the last 8 but think about it like this......the counties who make the last 8 in the first year will have a considerable advantage over those that don't in terms of finance, exposure and experience gained, ease of player buy in the following year............therefore widening the gap. The GAA should be careful about what they wish for............and that is coming from a Tyrone man who are expected to be one of the top 8...........
why 15 years? would 5 not be more relevant as that s reflects what's happening now .
without seeding any getting to the last 8 at present is not a sign of quality more of the draw you had to get there  .

it seems a lot of people idea of reform is to allow weak teams get as far as possible in the Championship and them try and catch out one of the bigger team instead of  a fair competition to find the best 16 ,8, 4, 2 teams to compete for best team  that will win the  all-Ireland final (in this normally happens any way )
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rosnarun on February 23, 2017, 11:19:36 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 11:10:02 AM
Quote from: Dire Ear on February 23, 2017, 10:45:37 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 10:28:46 AM
Quote from: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 10:14:13 AM
23 counties made the last 8 in the last 15 years..........if this goes through it will be more or less be the same 8 counties in the last 8 for......well forever! There may be an odd shock in who gets into the last 8 but think about it like this......the counties who make the last 8 in the first year will have a considerable advantage over those that don't in terms of finance, exposure and experience gained, ease of player buy in the following year............therefore widening the gap. The GAA should be careful about what they wish for............and that is coming from a Tyrone man who are expected to be one of the top 8...........

Graph of the above

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C5VU3YZWcAAzC96.jpg:large)
Kerry hoors...16 times in 15 years   !!! ;)

16 years, 2001 - 2016. That's some going in fairness, 100% record, handy province or not.
ared to believe Downs record is so bad considering they have won an allireland in that time. also shows current form is not a fluke
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fuzzman on February 23, 2017, 11:46:58 AM
Quote from: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 10:14:13 AM
23 counties made the last 8 in the last 15 years..........if this goes through it will be more or less be the same 8 counties in the last 8 for......well forever!

How do you come to that conclusion Trap? My understanding is that it would be the same format up to the quarterfinal stage and so the last 3 years showed a good spread of new teams making it through to the last 8 and surely this would continue.

Last year Tipperary and Clare were the surprise packages who joined Donegal and Mayo from the qualifiers route
In 2015 Fermanagh and Kildare were the two surprises joining Donegal and Tyrone
In 2014 the 4 qualifiers were Cork, Galway, Armagh and Monaghan

I think the proposal is trying to do a few things and depending on where you are from and what you want either for your county to try to win Sam, try to get more club games during the summer etc etc we will ALL be able to pick wholes in it and find fault with it.
I think one of the things they are TRYING to do is put more date structure on the matches so they will be able to say exactly what dates the matches will be on and so clubs can work around those dates better with their fixture list.

I think moving the AI final 2 weeks further forward was like a token gesture to the clubs to keep them sweet and not push for more radical changes to the structure of the intercounty season.

People here the phrase Elite 8 and they automatically jump to the conclusion it's the 8 richest or biggest counties breaking away but that's not true. Donegal showed a few years ago that it is possible to come from nowhere and get your house in order and become one of the big boys. Yes it requires hard work, fund raising and sacrifice but they went from being the whipping boys in Ulster to being the last team to beat the Dubs and are now a real force in Ulster.

Personally I can't decide whether the proposal is good or not. I suppose I would like to see more games between the big teams rather than seeing Kerry or the Dubs getting to AI semifinals having mainly played teams from Div2 or below. I think it's crazy that they have a seeded draw in Munster where last years finalists get a bye to the semifinals whereas in Ulster Tyrone, Monaghan or Donegal could still be knocked out in a preliminary round in May.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: magpie seanie on February 23, 2017, 11:54:32 AM
I'll give credit where it's due to the GPA for their opposition to this stupid idea and moreso the reasons they have listed for their opposition. Perhaps I have misread them and it's the Duffy's, O'Fearghail's and McKenna's that are really driving the professional agenda?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on February 23, 2017, 12:12:45 PM
I'm completely against this idea without reform of the leagues and provincial championships.
The round robin section should be first!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dubhaltach on February 23, 2017, 12:18:40 PM
Quote from: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 11:15:44 AM
What the graph illustrates is that there are already superpowers in GAA. The only county in Leinster that may make the super 8 is Dublin. How are the rest of the counties ever going to compete with Dublin? It is like asking Wycombe Wanderers to go toe to toe with Chelsea..........instead of proposals like this the GAA should be coming up with ideas to make the weaker counties (counties like Meath Down Cork Galway Armagh Cavan Roscommon and others) who have been traditionally competitive in a position where they can catch up with the top 4. That is the only way they are going to have a great championship in the future. And to think that Cavan and Roscommon are in Division One but are still so far off All Ireland contention just makes this argument stronger!
How do you do it?
Level up the financial resources each county team can spend.
Increase the number of GAA paid coaches in weaker counties
Improve training facilities in weaker counties
Limit the amount of training county teams do.

Have a fixture schedule that helps the club game in every county so that players in weaker counties dont choose club over county as they wont lose out playing with their club

The more counties who can be competitive the better the provincial and All Ireland series will be and the money will roll in from all around the country. If it is limited to 8 counties each year then the financial spread will be much less!

I would agree with you on most of those points. But it's championship format proposals that are being voted on here. As I've said previously, no championship format is going to give the weaker counties a chance of beating Dublin. Most GAA people would like to see an evening of the playing field, but IMO, that can only be addressed through motions that deal with finance. One example would be the idea that all sponsorship money is put into one pot and then divided equally to each county.

The graph also shows us that of the 5 counties that have made the last 8 once, 4 of them have made it there in the last 6 years. The fifth county, Wexford, made it there in 2008. Hardly an argument supporting the idea that 8 elite counties will play each other year in, year out.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 23, 2017, 12:25:51 PM
I don't think it's going to be any harder for a 'weaker' county to make the ''Super 8", but it's sure as hell going to be hard for them to get to a semi final. Tipp last year is probably the last time anyone outside of Division 1 makes an All Ireland semi final for a long time.

A lot of people would be quite happy with that. It's subjective. And I suppose there is the argument that the 4 best teams, rather than a team that got hot and got a bit of luck in a draw, should be in a semi final.

Imagine if Lincoln had to play Arsenal, Man United and Chelsea in a round robin at this stage, rather than just hope for a lucky day against Arsenal. Good night Luke. No place for dreams anymore :)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 23, 2017, 12:32:33 PM
If this proposal was in use last year would the groups have been -
Galway Kerry Westmeath and Rhubarbia
Dublin Tyrone Clare and Tipp.

Last year's Qtr  Finals drew 110,000.
Wonder how many would 12 games in the above 2 groups attract?

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 23, 2017, 12:38:54 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 23, 2017, 12:32:33 PM
If this proposal was in use last year would the groups have been -
Galway Kerry Westmeath and Rhubarbia
Dublin Tyrone Clare and Tipp.

Last year's Qtr  Finals drew 110,000.
Wonder how many would 12 games in the above 2 groups attract?

Is that a factor in doing this? Increased gates to get more money? I thought it was an attempt to have more high profile games between top teams, and less dross like Tipperary and Clare..
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: J70 on February 23, 2017, 12:43:00 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 11:01:16 PM
Philip Jordan talking a lot of sense on the proposals for a Tyrone man!

http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2017/0222/854561-philip-jordan-gaa-change-needs-to-go-further/

Excellent piece.

Although its not exactly rocket science to come up with some kind of system which addresses the club issue. Which further illustrates the extent of the disconnect.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on February 23, 2017, 12:43:42 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 23, 2017, 12:38:54 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 23, 2017, 12:32:33 PM
If this proposal was in use last year would the groups have been -
Galway Kerry Westmeath and Rhubarbia
Dublin Tyrone Clare and Tipp.

Last year's Qtr  Finals drew 110,000.
Wonder how many would 12 games in the above 2 groups attract?

Is that a factor in doing this? Increased gates to get more money? I thought it was an attempt to have more high profile games between top teams, and less dross like Tipperary and Clare..
I'd say it's the main factor to be honest.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 23, 2017, 12:46:28 PM
Reading this thread and it's a mirror image of many discussions we've had here about changes where most lads seem to go to the default setting of seeing everything that's not perfect about it and little of what's good about it.

Most people agree the current format is not working and that radical changes would not pass congress so why not give this a chance and see what happens? AZ is correct when he says a Tipp or Westmeath getting to an All Ireland semi final is less likely but you could also have Mayo/Dublin/Tyrone coming to Thurles in the last game where a draw for Tipp could get them to a semi final (or some other scenario). EVERY single suggestion you could come up with will have faults if we maintain the county structure as we have and then want a format that serves Waterford and Dublin equally well. It's  impossible so why not see if something else is an improvement?

By the way won't the extra revenue go towards levelling the financial playing field?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 23, 2017, 12:48:31 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 23, 2017, 12:46:28 PM
Reading this thread and it's a mirror image of many discussions we've had here about changes where most lads seem to go to the default setting of seeing everything that's not perfect about it and little of what's good about it.

Most people agree the current format is not working and that radical changes would not pass congress so why not give this a chance and see what happens? AZ is correct when he says a Tipp or Westmeath getting to an All Ireland semi final is less likely but you could also have Mayo/Dublin/Tyrone coming to Thurles in the last game where a draw for Tipp could get them to a semi final (or some other scenario). EVERY single suggestion you could come up with will have faults if we maintain the county structure as we have and then want a format that serves Waterford and Dublin equally well. It's  impossible so why not see if something else is an improvement?

By the way won't the extra revenue go towards levelling the financial playing field?
Anything that stops Westmeath getting to an All IReland semi final is fine by me.

Where did you hear that about the extra revenue? are the funds for these games earmarked to go into development outside of the big counties?

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GalwayBayBoy on February 23, 2017, 12:52:53 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 23, 2017, 12:38:54 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 23, 2017, 12:32:33 PM
If this proposal was in use last year would the groups have been -
Galway Kerry Westmeath and Rhubarbia
Dublin Tyrone Clare and Tipp.

Last year's Qtr  Finals drew 110,000.
Wonder how many would 12 games in the above 2 groups attract?

Is that a factor in doing this? Increased gates to get more money? I thought it was an attempt to have more high profile games between top teams, and less dross like Tipperary and Clare..

As the saying goes, when they say it's not about the money, it's about the money.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: shark on February 23, 2017, 01:02:11 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 23, 2017, 12:32:33 PM
If this proposal was in use last year would the groups have been -
Galway Kerry Westmeath and Rhubarbia
Dublin Tyrone Clare and Tipp.

Last year's Qtr  Finals drew 110,000.
Wonder how many would 12 games in the above 2 groups attract?

Donegal rather than Westmeath. Westmeath lost to Mayo in last qualifier round.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: OgraAnDun on February 23, 2017, 01:31:30 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on February 23, 2017, 11:19:36 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 11:10:02 AM
Quote from: Dire Ear on February 23, 2017, 10:45:37 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 10:28:46 AM
Quote from: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 10:14:13 AM
23 counties made the last 8 in the last 15 years..........if this goes through it will be more or less be the same 8 counties in the last 8 for......well forever! There may be an odd shock in who gets into the last 8 but think about it like this......the counties who make the last 8 in the first year will have a considerable advantage over those that don't in terms of finance, exposure and experience gained, ease of player buy in the following year............therefore widening the gap. The GAA should be careful about what they wish for............and that is coming from a Tyrone man who are expected to be one of the top 8...........

Graph of the above
CHART
Kerry hoors...16 times in 15 years   !!! ;)

16 years, 2001 - 2016. That's some going in fairness, 100% record, handy province or not.
ared to believe Downs record is so bad considering they have won an allireland in that time. also shows current form is not a fluke

Need to go back another few years for that unfortunately. Last one was in 1994.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on February 23, 2017, 01:32:53 PM
I'm very much against round robin in the GAA championship as it'll inevitably lead to dead rubbers. Will anyone go to games where both teams are already through or both are already out? Or when you have one team with nothing to play for and thus put out a changed team which makes it easy for their opponents to grab the win they need?

But as a 3 year experiment, I'd be prepared to give it a go. I think it is better at the QF stage than at an earlier stage when you'd have too many one sided games.

There will be huge excitement, and it will be an achievement in itself to make the Super 8. It won't negatively impact anyone who doesnt make it anymore than the current system. Personally I don't think it would widen the gap between the top 8 and the rest. More likely to incentivise others to make it. For many counties, once they are out of the provinical, heads go down, players head off, because there's nothing realistic to aim for if they haven't made their provincial final. Now almost every county will think, that with a bit of luck and a kind draw, we could just sneak into the Super8 (the 8-12 that think they have no chance, should be in the B championship - but they don't want that).

So I hope they give it the 3 year trial.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on February 23, 2017, 02:06:46 PM
I think there is growing momentum against these proposals and I'd still be hopeful that they won't get through particularly in light of the statements from both players bodies in recent days.

Is this voted for by secret ballot?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on February 23, 2017, 02:09:35 PM
It's looking like this super 8 championship format will become reality with some counties that shouldn't be voting for it suddenly voting in favour of it. Honestly I have seen much better formats outlined on here by chaps at 2am in the morning probably filled with alcohol than the super 8 format. If you ask me it's all a little fishy how this motion will get passed.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Avondhu star on February 23, 2017, 02:36:58 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on February 23, 2017, 02:09:35 PM
It's looking like this super 8 championship format will become reality with some counties that shouldn't be voting for it suddenly voting in favour of it. Honestly I have seen much better formats outlined on here by chaps at 2am in the morning probably filled with alcohol than the super 8 format. If you ask me it's all a little fishy how this motion will get passed.

Just check out who is buying the correct amount drink for the delegates before the vote
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 23, 2017, 02:39:59 PM
Quote from: trileacman on February 22, 2017, 10:01:57 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 22, 2017, 09:03:30 PM
Quote from: Dubhaltach on February 22, 2017, 05:40:11 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 02:18:47 PM
Do we know what way the vote is likely to go at this stage? I think everything at this stage is just mere speculation and I'm hopeful that the statements of the CPA in recent days will have influence in getting the 1/3rd support needed to prevent this motion from passing. Otherwise I think this has the capability of being a massive own goal for the GAA and will lead to a further divide between the GAA hierarchy and the grass roots.

Out of interest, what's your main objection to these proposals going through?

I can see some logic in the CPA argument that they don't go far enough and that the can is being pushed down the road for another 3 years. But this is GAA Congress were talking about, no radical proposal is getting through there for another couple of decades. As far as I can see the only real changes proposed here are an extra 8 matches in July/August played at provincial venues. Grounds that are lucky to see one big match a year at present.
I'd like to know the answer to this question to all those opposed.

What I mean is, regardless of what anyone thinks the ideal solution is, do you think that the current system is better or worse than the new proposal?

It's worse. It creates extra games for 8 counties, locking up county players for a greater period of the summer. It allows the stronger teams to have a couple of shit days out and still win the All Ireland. It allows the Division 1 elite to play more against top sides, become richer and become stronger.

It's one and only positive is that it increases the gaa coffers and will produce and favour more lucrative TV deals. It's the championship structure that Rupert murdoch would dream up.

And I'm not just a dour negative b**tard. I'll support intelligent change such as wobblers, but this new proposal is an abberation.

Why are you in favour of it?
I'll deal with your issues with it first if that's ok.

Eight counties will have their county players locked up for longer than currently is the situation. If ever there was a negative way of spinning the proposal it's this. The round prior to the Super 8/Quarter Finals would be played on the weekend of 2 July in 2016 under the new proposal. Under the old format this round was played two and three weeks later. If you look at the table in proposal it shows that all teams (excluding the top 8 for the minute) leave the championship earlier under the new format. So instead of focusing on 8 teams being in it too long, why not look at the other 24 having their players available to clubs earlier?

On to the last eight teams. As it stands, the two AI finalists will keep their players from their clubs up to the third Sunday in September. Under the new proposal, the final will be played three weeks earlier. So that's two more counties  you can to the 24 above. We're getting pretty thin on the ground with this point as we're left with six counties but I'll finish it out. The two losing semi-finalists under the current proposal left the championship on the 21st and 28th of August. With the new one, they'd be free two weeks earlier. So you're left with the four teams that don't get past the Super 8 stage; two of these would exit the same weekend and two would exit a week earlier.

So I think, unless I made a mistake, that your first point is factually incorrect. One of the reasons I'm in favour of the proposal is because, as you can now see, almost every county gets their players for club football earlier.

It does allow the top teams an extra slip-up, that's fair enough if that's a problem for you. I'll accept that.

But again, why not point out that it allows the likes of Tipp or Clare to play three games against the elite rather than telling us that the Division 1 teams get to play each other? There are countless posts about how difficult it will be to reach an AISF as if there was a trophy for it. Is it not as good to reach an AIQF stage and get three top games, including one at home and ride the wave that that would bring?

Comments (not yours) also about how different the last eight teams will be even though it's the exact same route to the last eight. Are people clear on the proposal because I'm all for opinion but there's just some glaring inaccuracies out there.

Philip Jordan's piece is being rightly applauded but it's largely irrelevant in 2017 as nothing  he says has any chance of getting through.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 03:09:49 PM
Quote from: magpie seanie on February 23, 2017, 11:54:32 AM
I'll give credit where it's due to the GPA for their opposition to this stupid idea and moreso the reasons they have listed for their opposition. Perhaps I have misread them and it's the Duffy's, O'Fearghail's and McKenna's that are really driving the professional agenda?

You haven't misread them Seanie. This isn't a board decision from the GPA, they had a vote of their members. So all the Sligo, Westmeath, Tipp, etc players would have voted against it and the Dublin, Kerry, Mayo, etc players would have voted for it. There's more of us (weak) than there is of them (strong), so that explains the GPA position.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on February 23, 2017, 03:16:47 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 03:09:49 PM
Quote from: magpie seanie on February 23, 2017, 11:54:32 AM
I'll give credit where it's due to the GPA for their opposition to this stupid idea and moreso the reasons they have listed for their opposition. Perhaps I have misread them and it's the Duffy's, O'Fearghail's and McKenna's that are really driving the professional agenda?

You haven't misread them Seanie. This isn't a board decision from the GPA, they had a vote of their members. So all the Sligo, Westmeath, Tipp, etc players would have voted against it and the Dublin, Kerry, Mayo, etc players would have voted for it. There's more of us (weak) than there is of them (strong), so that explains the GPA position.
But if Westmeath and Sligo have their "usual" year, the new format wouldn't impact them one iota.
If they have a really good year they would get to the Super8 QF stage, where they would play one home game, one away game (both probably sellouts and great atmosphere) and a game in Croker.

Why would Westmeath and Sligo players and fans be against that? No downside compared to current format and big potential upside if they have a good run.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 03:46:25 PM
Quote from: Hound on February 23, 2017, 03:16:47 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 03:09:49 PM
Quote from: magpie seanie on February 23, 2017, 11:54:32 AM
I'll give credit where it's due to the GPA for their opposition to this stupid idea and moreso the reasons they have listed for their opposition. Perhaps I have misread them and it's the Duffy's, O'Fearghail's and McKenna's that are really driving the professional agenda?

You haven't misread them Seanie. This isn't a board decision from the GPA, they had a vote of their members. So all the Sligo, Westmeath, Tipp, etc players would have voted against it and the Dublin, Kerry, Mayo, etc players would have voted for it. There's more of us (weak) than there is of them (strong), so that explains the GPA position.
But if Westmeath and Sligo have their "usual" year, the new format wouldn't impact them one iota.
If they have a really good year they would get to the Super8 QF stage, where they would play one home game, one away game (both probably sellouts and great atmosphere) and a game in Croker.

Why would Westmeath and Sligo players and fans be against that? No downside compared to current format and big potential upside if they have a good run.

Because like Tipp last year we'd fancy our chances in a one off game against the likes of Galway. We lost to Mayo and Dublin last year, while we were competitive at times in both games we weren't in danger of winning coming down either home straight. We wouldn't stand a chance of getting out of a group with two of the top four in it. That's a huge downside.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 23, 2017, 04:02:24 PM
I don't follow. If Westmeath made it to the super 8 they could be in a group with Galway (or a similar standard team) as their main rival for the runner up spot so win that one off game and they could still make the semi final.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on February 23, 2017, 04:02:50 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 03:46:25 PM
Quote from: Hound on February 23, 2017, 03:16:47 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 03:09:49 PM
Quote from: magpie seanie on February 23, 2017, 11:54:32 AM
I'll give credit where it's due to the GPA for their opposition to this stupid idea and moreso the reasons they have listed for their opposition. Perhaps I have misread them and it's the Duffy's, O'Fearghail's and McKenna's that are really driving the professional agenda?

You haven't misread them Seanie. This isn't a board decision from the GPA, they had a vote of their members. So all the Sligo, Westmeath, Tipp, etc players would have voted against it and the Dublin, Kerry, Mayo, etc players would have voted for it. There's more of us (weak) than there is of them (strong), so that explains the GPA position.
But if Westmeath and Sligo have their "usual" year, the new format wouldn't impact them one iota.
If they have a really good year they would get to the Super8 QF stage, where they would play one home game, one away game (both probably sellouts and great atmosphere) and a game in Croker.

Why would Westmeath and Sligo players and fans be against that? No downside compared to current format and big potential upside if they have a good run.

Because like Tipp last year we'd fancy our chances in a one off game against the likes of Galway. We lost to Mayo and Dublin last year, while we were competitive at times in both games we weren't in danger of winning coming down either home straight. We wouldn't stand a chance of getting out of a group with two of the top four in it. That's a huge downside.
That's a peculiar way of looking at it, in my opinion.

Is having a guaranteed 3 games not a huge benefit? Being part of the Super8 event? If Westmeath or Sligo get to a QF and draw Kerry or Dublin, they are 99% likely to get beaten. Whereas 3 games give you the change to make an impression, actually increases the chances of getting a big win and having that huge day out and helps to build for next year. I don't think any team is going to come from nowhere and win Sam in Year 1.

Clare would certainly have done better in the proposed system than the old system. And Tipp would have had one extra big game. If they'd lost that and gone out in the QF stage rather than SF, I'm not sure that would have made a huge difference.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 04:41:10 PM
Quote from: Hound on February 23, 2017, 04:02:50 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 03:46:25 PM
Quote from: Hound on February 23, 2017, 03:16:47 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 03:09:49 PM
Quote from: magpie seanie on February 23, 2017, 11:54:32 AM
I'll give credit where it's due to the GPA for their opposition to this stupid idea and moreso the reasons they have listed for their opposition. Perhaps I have misread them and it's the Duffy's, O'Fearghail's and McKenna's that are really driving the professional agenda?

You haven't misread them Seanie. This isn't a board decision from the GPA, they had a vote of their members. So all the Sligo, Westmeath, Tipp, etc players would have voted against it and the Dublin, Kerry, Mayo, etc players would have voted for it. There's more of us (weak) than there is of them (strong), so that explains the GPA position.
But if Westmeath and Sligo have their "usual" year, the new format wouldn't impact them one iota.
If they have a really good year they would get to the Super8 QF stage, where they would play one home game, one away game (both probably sellouts and great atmosphere) and a game in Croker.

Why would Westmeath and Sligo players and fans be against that? No downside compared to current format and big potential upside if they have a good run.

Because like Tipp last year we'd fancy our chances in a one off game against the likes of Galway. We lost to Mayo and Dublin last year, while we were competitive at times in both games we weren't in danger of winning coming down either home straight. We wouldn't stand a chance of getting out of a group with two of the top four in it. That's a huge downside.
That's a peculiar way of looking at it, in my opinion.

Is having a guaranteed 3 games not a huge benefit? Being part of the Super8 event? If Westmeath or Sligo get to a QF and draw Kerry or Dublin, they are 99% likely to get beaten. Whereas 3 games give you the change to make an impression, actually increases the chances of getting a big win and having that huge day out and helps to build for next year. I don't think any team is going to come from nowhere and win Sam in Year 1.

Clare would certainly have done better in the proposed system than the old system. And Tipp would have had one extra big game. If they'd lost that and gone out in the QF stage rather than SF, I'm not sure that would have made a huge difference.

If you were guaranteed to make the last 8 every year it would be. However the Westmeaths and Sligos only get there once in a blue moon. Take Tipp last year, if the Super 8's were in force they would have been in a group with Galway, Tyrone and Mayo. You don't need me to tell you how that would work out. This year they are starting on the back of making the AI semi final the previous year. Mayo and Donegal made huge strides in recent years after making the semi finals in the first year under new management. Mayo and Donegal probably had stronger foundations whereas Tipp could find themselves like Wexford in 08 but at least they have the knowledge of a successful year behind them.

Clare would have been in with Kerry, Dublin and Donegal. They wouldn't have a snowballs chance either way but if you had to choose one they only plausible route for progression would again be a one off game where the unthinkable happens. Lightening doesn't strike twice, let alone three times.

See Brolly has an article that fairly sums it up for me in the Indo today. http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/joe-brolly-super-eight-proposals-are-a-private-club-for-the-big-counties-a-commercial-juggernaut-35475716.html (http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/joe-brolly-super-eight-proposals-are-a-private-club-for-the-big-counties-a-commercial-juggernaut-35475716.html)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 23, 2017, 04:44:05 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 04:41:10 PM
Quote from: Hound on February 23, 2017, 04:02:50 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 03:46:25 PM
Quote from: Hound on February 23, 2017, 03:16:47 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 03:09:49 PM
Quote from: magpie seanie on February 23, 2017, 11:54:32 AM
I'll give credit where it's due to the GPA for their opposition to this stupid idea and moreso the reasons they have listed for their opposition. Perhaps I have misread them and it's the Duffy's, O'Fearghail's and McKenna's that are really driving the professional agenda?

You haven't misread them Seanie. This isn't a board decision from the GPA, they had a vote of their members. So all the Sligo, Westmeath, Tipp, etc players would have voted against it and the Dublin, Kerry, Mayo, etc players would have voted for it. There's more of us (weak) than there is of them (strong), so that explains the GPA position.
But if Westmeath and Sligo have their "usual" year, the new format wouldn't impact them one iota.
If they have a really good year they would get to the Super8 QF stage, where they would play one home game, one away game (both probably sellouts and great atmosphere) and a game in Croker.

Why would Westmeath and Sligo players and fans be against that? No downside compared to current format and big potential upside if they have a good run.

Because like Tipp last year we'd fancy our chances in a one off game against the likes of Galway. We lost to Mayo and Dublin last year, while we were competitive at times in both games we weren't in danger of winning coming down either home straight. We wouldn't stand a chance of getting out of a group with two of the top four in it. That's a huge downside.
That's a peculiar way of looking at it, in my opinion.

Is having a guaranteed 3 games not a huge benefit? Being part of the Super8 event? If Westmeath or Sligo get to a QF and draw Kerry or Dublin, they are 99% likely to get beaten. Whereas 3 games give you the change to make an impression, actually increases the chances of getting a big win and having that huge day out and helps to build for next year. I don't think any team is going to come from nowhere and win Sam in Year 1.

Clare would certainly have done better in the proposed system than the old system. And Tipp would have had one extra big game. If they'd lost that and gone out in the QF stage rather than SF, I'm not sure that would have made a huge difference.

If you were guaranteed to make the last 8 every year it would be. However the Westmeaths and Sligos only get there once in a blue moon. Take Tipp last year, if the Super 8's were in force they would have been in a group with Galway, Tyrone and Mayo. You don't need me to tell you how that would work out. This year they are starting on the back of making the AI semi final the previous year. Mayo and Donegal made huge strides in recent years after making the semi finals in the first year under new management. Mayo and Donegal probably had stronger foundations whereas Tipp could find themselves like Wexford in 08 but at least they have the knowledge of a successful year behind them.

Clare would have been in with Kerry, Dublin and Donegal. They wouldn't have a snowballs chance either way but if you had to choose one they only plausible route for progression would again be a one off game where the unthinkable happens. Lightening doesn't strike twice, let alone three times.

See Brolly has an article that fairly sums it up for me in the Indo today. http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/joe-brolly-super-eight-proposals-are-a-private-club-for-the-big-counties-a-commercial-juggernaut-35475716.html (http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/joe-brolly-super-eight-proposals-are-a-private-club-for-the-big-counties-a-commercial-juggernaut-35475716.html)
Would making the quarter final and hosting Mayo or Tyrone in Thurles not have built just as good a foundation. You think making the semi would be that much of a bigger step?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 23, 2017, 04:45:02 PM
Tipp hosted Tyrone in Thurles. It didn't work out so well.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 23, 2017, 04:47:28 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 23, 2017, 04:45:02 PM
Tipp hosted Tyrone in Thurles. It didn't work out so well.
Neither did Mayo v Tipp in Croke Park. Maybe Tipp should pack it in altogether  ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 04:51:30 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 23, 2017, 04:44:05 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 04:41:10 PM
Quote from: Hound on February 23, 2017, 04:02:50 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 03:46:25 PM
Quote from: Hound on February 23, 2017, 03:16:47 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 03:09:49 PM
Quote from: magpie seanie on February 23, 2017, 11:54:32 AM
I'll give credit where it's due to the GPA for their opposition to this stupid idea and moreso the reasons they have listed for their opposition. Perhaps I have misread them and it's the Duffy's, O'Fearghail's and McKenna's that are really driving the professional agenda?

You haven't misread them Seanie. This isn't a board decision from the GPA, they had a vote of their members. So all the Sligo, Westmeath, Tipp, etc players would have voted against it and the Dublin, Kerry, Mayo, etc players would have voted for it. There's more of us (weak) than there is of them (strong), so that explains the GPA position.
But if Westmeath and Sligo have their "usual" year, the new format wouldn't impact them one iota.
If they have a really good year they would get to the Super8 QF stage, where they would play one home game, one away game (both probably sellouts and great atmosphere) and a game in Croker.

Why would Westmeath and Sligo players and fans be against that? No downside compared to current format and big potential upside if they have a good run.

Because like Tipp last year we'd fancy our chances in a one off game against the likes of Galway. We lost to Mayo and Dublin last year, while we were competitive at times in both games we weren't in danger of winning coming down either home straight. We wouldn't stand a chance of getting out of a group with two of the top four in it. That's a huge downside.
That's a peculiar way of looking at it, in my opinion.

Is having a guaranteed 3 games not a huge benefit? Being part of the Super8 event? If Westmeath or Sligo get to a QF and draw Kerry or Dublin, they are 99% likely to get beaten. Whereas 3 games give you the change to make an impression, actually increases the chances of getting a big win and having that huge day out and helps to build for next year. I don't think any team is going to come from nowhere and win Sam in Year 1.

Clare would certainly have done better in the proposed system than the old system. And Tipp would have had one extra big game. If they'd lost that and gone out in the QF stage rather than SF, I'm not sure that would have made a huge difference.

If you were guaranteed to make the last 8 every year it would be. However the Westmeaths and Sligos only get there once in a blue moon. Take Tipp last year, if the Super 8's were in force they would have been in a group with Galway, Tyrone and Mayo. You don't need me to tell you how that would work out. This year they are starting on the back of making the AI semi final the previous year. Mayo and Donegal made huge strides in recent years after making the semi finals in the first year under new management. Mayo and Donegal probably had stronger foundations whereas Tipp could find themselves like Wexford in 08 but at least they have the knowledge of a successful year behind them.

Clare would have been in with Kerry, Dublin and Donegal. They wouldn't have a snowballs chance either way but if you had to choose one they only plausible route for progression would again be a one off game where the unthinkable happens. Lightening doesn't strike twice, let alone three times.

See Brolly has an article that fairly sums it up for me in the Indo today. http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/joe-brolly-super-eight-proposals-are-a-private-club-for-the-big-counties-a-commercial-juggernaut-35475716.html (http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/joe-brolly-super-eight-proposals-are-a-private-club-for-the-big-counties-a-commercial-juggernaut-35475716.html)
Would making the quarter final and hosting Mayo or Tyrone in Thurles not have built just as good a foundation. You think making the semi would be that much of a bigger step?

Of course a semi final is a bigger step than a quarter final. Was that a serious question?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 23, 2017, 04:53:53 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 04:51:30 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 23, 2017, 04:44:05 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 04:41:10 PM
Quote from: Hound on February 23, 2017, 04:02:50 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 03:46:25 PM
Quote from: Hound on February 23, 2017, 03:16:47 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 03:09:49 PM
Quote from: magpie seanie on February 23, 2017, 11:54:32 AM
I'll give credit where it's due to the GPA for their opposition to this stupid idea and moreso the reasons they have listed for their opposition. Perhaps I have misread them and it's the Duffy's, O'Fearghail's and McKenna's that are really driving the professional agenda?

You haven't misread them Seanie. This isn't a board decision from the GPA, they had a vote of their members. So all the Sligo, Westmeath, Tipp, etc players would have voted against it and the Dublin, Kerry, Mayo, etc players would have voted for it. There's more of us (weak) than there is of them (strong), so that explains the GPA position.
But if Westmeath and Sligo have their "usual" year, the new format wouldn't impact them one iota.
If they have a really good year they would get to the Super8 QF stage, where they would play one home game, one away game (both probably sellouts and great atmosphere) and a game in Croker.

Why would Westmeath and Sligo players and fans be against that? No downside compared to current format and big potential upside if they have a good run.

Because like Tipp last year we'd fancy our chances in a one off game against the likes of Galway. We lost to Mayo and Dublin last year, while we were competitive at times in both games we weren't in danger of winning coming down either home straight. We wouldn't stand a chance of getting out of a group with two of the top four in it. That's a huge downside.
That's a peculiar way of looking at it, in my opinion.

Is having a guaranteed 3 games not a huge benefit? Being part of the Super8 event? If Westmeath or Sligo get to a QF and draw Kerry or Dublin, they are 99% likely to get beaten. Whereas 3 games give you the change to make an impression, actually increases the chances of getting a big win and having that huge day out and helps to build for next year. I don't think any team is going to come from nowhere and win Sam in Year 1.

Clare would certainly have done better in the proposed system than the old system. And Tipp would have had one extra big game. If they'd lost that and gone out in the QF stage rather than SF, I'm not sure that would have made a huge difference.

If you were guaranteed to make the last 8 every year it would be. However the Westmeaths and Sligos only get there once in a blue moon. Take Tipp last year, if the Super 8's were in force they would have been in a group with Galway, Tyrone and Mayo. You don't need me to tell you how that would work out. This year they are starting on the back of making the AI semi final the previous year. Mayo and Donegal made huge strides in recent years after making the semi finals in the first year under new management. Mayo and Donegal probably had stronger foundations whereas Tipp could find themselves like Wexford in 08 but at least they have the knowledge of a successful year behind them.

Clare would have been in with Kerry, Dublin and Donegal. They wouldn't have a snowballs chance either way but if you had to choose one they only plausible route for progression would again be a one off game where the unthinkable happens. Lightening doesn't strike twice, let alone three times.

See Brolly has an article that fairly sums it up for me in the Indo today. http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/joe-brolly-super-eight-proposals-are-a-private-club-for-the-big-counties-a-commercial-juggernaut-35475716.html (http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/joe-brolly-super-eight-proposals-are-a-private-club-for-the-big-counties-a-commercial-juggernaut-35475716.html)
Would making the quarter final and hosting Mayo or Tyrone in Thurles not have built just as good a foundation. You think making the semi would be that much of a bigger step?

Of course a semi final is a bigger step than a quarter final. Was that a serious question?
Is that the question I asked? No is the answer.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 04:59:25 PM
Is a semi final a bigger step than getting a hiding off Mayo or Tyrone in Thurles in a last 8 round robin game? Is that the question?

If it is I think you know the answer.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 23, 2017, 05:00:55 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 23, 2017, 04:47:28 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 23, 2017, 04:45:02 PM
Tipp hosted Tyrone in Thurles. It didn't work out so well.
Neither did Mayo v Tipp in Croke Park. Maybe Tipp should pack it in altogether  ;)

You get the impression a few media people would prefer if all the weaker counties packed it in altogether.

By the way Tipp were fairly competitive v Mayo.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 23, 2017, 05:12:58 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 04:59:25 PM
Is a semi final a bigger step than getting a hiding off Mayo or Tyrone in Thurles in a last 8 round robin game? Is that the question?

If it is I think you know the answer.
My point/question is this. You're making it a major deal, for a county's progress, to make a semi-final because it suits your argument.

What I'm saying is that a county might progress just as much in the long term by playing three of these Super 8 games as they would playing in a semi-final. And please don't start with the black & white argument that getting to a SF is better than getting to a QF. I'm aware of that.

But again, look at how you're wording your question; "getting a hiding" of Mayo. Let me flip it around for you. Would it be more beneficial for Tipp to play three games and get a win, a draw and a narrow defeat than get "a hiding" in the AISF?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 23, 2017, 05:15:52 PM
And would have been against Tyrone whether a semi in Croker or a Super8 in Thurles or Omagh.
As an aside will Omagh be big enough for Tyrone home games if this goes ahead or will they have to go to Clones?
Mullingar might not qualify either? ?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on February 23, 2017, 05:52:48 PM
Is the GAA's aim to make as much money as possible or to develop the sport?

Most of the changes in recent years belie the fact the former is the sad truth.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 23, 2017, 10:02:31 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 23, 2017, 12:48:31 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 23, 2017, 12:46:28 PM
Reading this thread and it's a mirror image of many discussions we've had here about changes where most lads seem to go to the default setting of seeing everything that's not perfect about it and little of what's good about it.

Most people agree the current format is not working and that radical changes would not pass congress so why not give this a chance and see what happens? AZ is correct when he says a Tipp or Westmeath getting to an All Ireland semi final is less likely but you could also have Mayo/Dublin/Tyrone coming to Thurles in the last game where a draw for Tipp could get them to a semi final (or some other scenario). EVERY single suggestion you could come up with will have faults if we maintain the county structure as we have and then want a format that serves Waterford and Dublin equally well. It's  impossible so why not see if something else is an improvement?

By the way won't the extra revenue go towards levelling the financial playing field?
Anything that stops Westmeath getting to an All IReland semi final is fine by me.

Where did you hear that about the extra revenue? are the funds for these games earmarked to go into development outside of the big counties?

Yes, a significant proportion of the extra revenue will be ring fenced for development in lower level counties.

I don't think anyone opposing this has made a reasonable argument for opposing this. It isn't perfect, Paraic Duffy would accept that himself but it's worth trying for 3 years to see if it is an improvement or not. I also don't understand this opposition to the GAA generating money, like it or not it's required to run a major sporting organisation.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on February 23, 2017, 10:09:31 PM
It's a beginning, and anything that alters the current anachronistic and imbalanced All-Ireland structure for the better is welcome with me, however slight that tinkering may be initially. It was never going to be completely overhauled in one Congress-year.

It'll neither be as fantastic as the most enthusiastic proponents would claim, nor as awful as the most scathing detractors would clamour, but it deserves a run out nonetheless. Let's give it a lash, it can't be any worse than the current set-up, regardless of how it unfolds. :)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on February 23, 2017, 11:03:01 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 23, 2017, 10:02:31 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 23, 2017, 12:48:31 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 23, 2017, 12:46:28 PM
Reading this thread and it's a mirror image of many discussions we've had here about changes where most lads seem to go to the default setting of seeing everything that's not perfect about it and little of what's good about it.

Most people agree the current format is not working and that radical changes would not pass congress so why not give this a chance and see what happens? AZ is correct when he says a Tipp or Westmeath getting to an All Ireland semi final is less likely but you could also have Mayo/Dublin/Tyrone coming to Thurles in the last game where a draw for Tipp could get them to a semi final (or some other scenario). EVERY single suggestion you could come up with will have faults if we maintain the county structure as we have and then want a format that serves Waterford and Dublin equally well. It's  impossible so why not see if something else is an improvement?

By the way won't the extra revenue go towards levelling the financial playing field?
Anything that stops Westmeath getting to an All IReland semi final is fine by me.

Where did you hear that about the extra revenue? are the funds for these games earmarked to go into development outside of the big counties?

Yes, a significant proportion of the extra revenue will be ring fenced for development in lower level counties.

I don't think anyone opposing this has made a reasonable argument for opposing this. It isn't perfect, Paraic Duffy would accept that himself but it's worth trying for 3 years to see if it is an improvement or not. I also don't understand this opposition to the GAA generating money, like it or not it's required to run a major sporting organisation.
I'll believe the ring fencing when I see it

I cannot see how having a round robin series half way through the championship will work.
The champions league tried that a few years ago, then reverted back to the current system.

you will get the same 3/4 teams into the semi finals every year - counties with the largest pick, most resources to finance the team
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 23, 2017, 11:24:00 PM
The ring fencing will definitely happen or do you genuinely think the GAA want one or two teams to win everything?

The league is highlighting that fans want to see the best teams play each other and this format is providing more of that so I expect it will be successful.

Of course the best 3 or 4 teams will make the semi finals each year but that should happen in any system most of the time.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 23, 2017, 11:36:34 PM
How many different teams reached the Semis the last 5 years?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on February 23, 2017, 11:52:42 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 23, 2017, 11:36:34 PM
How many different teams reached the Semis the last 5 years?

Six
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on February 23, 2017, 11:54:54 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 23, 2017, 11:24:00 PM
The ring fencing will definitely happen or do you genuinely think the GAA want one or two teams to win everything?

The league is highlighting that fans want to see the best teams play each other and this format is providing more of that so I expect it will be successful.

Of course the best 3 or 4 teams will make the semi finals each year but that should happen in any system most of the time.
but the same few teams are already winning most titles
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 24, 2017, 12:09:16 AM
They are but are you saying we should come up with a system that hinders the best teams from winning championships?

The best team in Ireland should win the All Ireland and this proposed system doesn't impact on that so what is the problem?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 24, 2017, 09:29:23 AM
Quote from: Zulu on February 23, 2017, 11:24:00 PM
The ring fencing will definitely happen or do you genuinely think the GAA want one or two teams to win everything?

The league is highlighting that fans want to see the best teams play each other and this format is providing more of that so I expect it will be successful.

Of course the best 3 or 4 teams will make the semi finals each year but that should happen in any system most of the time.

Given what's happened with Dublin and the funding spend in development there, and compared to the investment in other counties, I'm not sure the GAA is overy bothered about competitive balance, if that's what you're asking.

You asked a question somewhere about 'what's wrong with raising money, we need money' and I agree 100%. However, I made a point here a couple of years ago, which is being reinforced with almost every proposal and decision coming out of CP.

I believe we have appointed some very good men, like Peter McKenna and Paraic Duffy, who are good businessmen and are approaching running the GAA as a profit making enterprise. All decisions and proposals from them are from that perspective. Brand identiy. Maximising revenue streams, increasing profit.

And that's a worry for me. We absolutely need good people running the business side, to ensure ADEQUATE finances are raised to support our organisation and it's development, in both Capital ventures and Coaching and Games development. However, there has to be a recognition that the games, and the people playing it, are the most important thing. And ALL decisions should have that fact as the basic sanity check for the decisions. Will this decision help the games, their competitiveness, and the people playing it.

At the moment, I think the first question they ask themselves is "Will this decision be financially lucrative, will it sell more jerseys, or sell more ads for TV companies?".

And when that is the situation, the tail starts wagging the dog, and you have decisions made which are good from a financial standpoint, but the games and players and fans have to adapt or accept the change even if they don't want it.

If they looked at it from the other side, I'm not sure a Super 8 would be the answer, and I'm not sure a few other decisions coming out of Croke Park would be the answer to other issues.

At some point, we have to remember we need ENOUGH money to run and finance the organisation, but we don't always have to be looking for the next chance to maximise revenue and become like a Corporation who bases it's whole culture off the bottom line.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 24, 2017, 09:38:15 AM
Like everything in life, business, government etc it's all about getting the right BALANCE.
Isn't it up to Co Boards who are made up of delegates from Clubs Central Council made up of delegates from Counties and the annual Congress to ensure the balance is met between the obvious need for money and the neEdstaston of the games/players etc.?
Obviously a lot of people think the 8s is good for the games.
I think any round Robin in the AI championship should be for the other 24 which would be better for the game but could well be a flop financially.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on February 24, 2017, 09:47:44 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 23, 2017, 05:12:58 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 04:59:25 PM
Is a semi final a bigger step than getting a hiding off Mayo or Tyrone in Thurles in a last 8 round robin game? Is that the question?

If it is I think you know the answer.
My point/question is this. You're making it a major deal, for a county's progress, to make a semi-final because it suits your argument.

What I'm saying is that a county might progress just as much in the long term by playing three of these Super 8 games as they would playing in a semi-final. And please don't start with the black & white argument that getting to a SF is better than getting to a QF. I'm aware of that.

But again, look at how you're wording your question; "getting a hiding" of Mayo. Let me flip it around for you. Would it be more beneficial for Tipp to play three games and get a win, a draw and a narrow defeat than get "a hiding" in the AISF?

I don't think getting to the Super 8 every year in 10 is going to help in any way in the long term (the same as getting to a SF one year in 10 tbf). The idea behind the qualifiers when they came in was to give the counties who traditionally only got the one championship game each year a second day out. This was laudable but the downside is that if a stronger county got caught out they got a second bite at the cherry. This super 8 proposal purposely sets out to make the strong counties even stronger as the counties who will benefit most from it are those who will make the last 8 year upon year. We already have huge imbalances from coaching to funding to seeded draws to Dublin having the keys to Croke Park and now HQ are trying to put another road block in front of the smaller counties. Westmeath did their bit for the association last night by agreeing to vote against it, hopefully the remaining counties follow suit.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Keyser soze on February 24, 2017, 09:54:55 AM
Does any of you have a round robin in their championship? How does it work?

Derry tried it about ten years ago, it was hurriedly ditched without fanfare after a couple of years, as it was a complete disaster. It was replaced with a back door, which has now been ditched at Senior level as well, and has gone back to straight knockout. As far as I recollect the same or a similar thing happened in a number of other counties as well. [though i do not have a great memory lol]

I think that it is unfathomable that Duffy should now bring this forward as a solution to any perceived ills existing in the GAA as I just cannot see what the rationale for such a move could be given that this format has been proved not to work

In GAA more people come to watch championship football because it is do or die and the pace and intensity is a step up from league football. This is true at any grade of football, club or county. If you change championship to a league format you will lose all the things that make a championship a championship.

I can see some merit in suggesting rationalizing the draw outside the traditional provincial structures to provide a more level playing field [sorry] or even splitting the championship into Senior and Intermediate, not that i agree that we should do this, but of all the possible solutions this round robin proposal is the stupidest possible outcome.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on February 24, 2017, 10:09:27 AM
Quote from: Keyser soze on February 24, 2017, 09:54:55 AM
Does any of you have a round robin in their championship? How does it work?

Derry tried it about ten years ago, it was hurriedly ditched without fanfare after a couple of years, as it was a complete disaster. It was replaced with a back door, which has now been ditched at Senior level as well, and has gone back to straight knockout. As far as I recollect the same or a similar thing happened in a number of other counties as well. [though i do not have a great memory lol]

I think that it is unfathomable that Duffy should now bring this forward as a solution to any perceived ills existing in the GAA as I just cannot see what the rationale for such a move could be given that this format has been proved not to work

In GAA more people come to watch championship football because it is do or die and the pace and intensity is a step up from league football. This is true at any grade of football, club or county. If you change championship to a league format you will lose all the things that make a championship a championship.

I can see some merit in suggesting rationalizing the draw outside the traditional provincial structures to provide a more level playing field [sorry] or even splitting the championship into Senior and Intermediate, not that i agree that we should do this, but of all the possible solutions this round robin proposal is the stupidest possible outcome.
I thought most counties have a round robin in the championship, at the start!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 24, 2017, 10:21:15 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 24, 2017, 09:47:44 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 23, 2017, 05:12:58 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 04:59:25 PM
Is a semi final a bigger step than getting a hiding off Mayo or Tyrone in Thurles in a last 8 round robin game? Is that the question?

If it is I think you know the answer.
My point/question is this. You're making it a major deal, for a county's progress, to make a semi-final because it suits your argument.

What I'm saying is that a county might progress just as much in the long term by playing three of these Super 8 games as they would playing in a semi-final. And please don't start with the black & white argument that getting to a SF is better than getting to a QF. I'm aware of that.

But again, look at how you're wording your question; "getting a hiding" of Mayo. Let me flip it around for you. Would it be more beneficial for Tipp to play three games and get a win, a draw and a narrow defeat than get "a hiding" in the AISF?

I don't think getting to the Super 8 every year in 10 is going to help in any way in the long term (the same as getting to a SF one year in 10 tbf). The idea behind the qualifiers when they came in was to give the counties who traditionally only got the one championship game each year a second day out. This was laudable but the downside is that if a stronger county got caught out they got a second bite at the cherry. This super 8 proposal purposely sets out to make the strong counties even stronger as the counties who will benefit most from it are those who will make the last 8 year upon year. We already have huge imbalances from coaching to funding to seeded draws to Dublin having the keys to Croke Park and now HQ are trying to put another road block in front of the smaller counties. Westmeath did their bit for the association last night by agreeing to vote against it, hopefully the remaining counties follow suit.
I'm not sure why you're talking about one year in ten. If Westmeath got to the last eight in 2018 and had a game in Cusack Park against Mayo/Tyrone/Dublin/Kerry, a game against, say, Galway in Croke Park and a game against say Donegal in Breffni Park, do you not think that would promote the game in the county just as much as getting to a semi-final? Who knows how the county would build on that in the coming years. My point is that the Super 8 proposal doesn't seem to be a hugely, if at all, inferior place to be than an AISF.

You talk about the Super 8 making the stronger teams stronger. How? Do you mean by letting them have a potentially third chance? This is another example of where everyone has different complaints about the current system. One of the many areas that Duffy tried to address with this was the complaint that the only teams that didn't get a second chance in the All-Ireland series were the provincial champions. If you read the proposal, you'll see all of the issues that an attempt has been made to address. This is one of them.

Ultimately, on this thread and elsewhere, I think the general view is that those against it are so for factually incorrect reasons or for the reason that it doesn't solve everything.

I believe that's it's not perfect because it's impossible to be so, but that it condenses the season, gives players back to their clubs earlier and should be trialled for three years.

All interested parties can use the intervening period to make suggestions and have discussions for the next exciting episode.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on February 24, 2017, 10:29:19 AM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 24, 2017, 10:09:27 AM
Quote from: Keyser soze on February 24, 2017, 09:54:55 AM
Does any of you have a round robin in their championship? How does it work?

Derry tried it about ten years ago, it was hurriedly ditched without fanfare after a couple of years, as it was a complete disaster. It was replaced with a back door, which has now been ditched at Senior level as well, and has gone back to straight knockout. As far as I recollect the same or a similar thing happened in a number of other counties as well. [though i do not have a great memory lol]

I think that it is unfathomable that Duffy should now bring this forward as a solution to any perceived ills existing in the GAA as I just cannot see what the rationale for such a move could be given that this format has been proved not to work

In GAA more people come to watch championship football because it is do or die and the pace and intensity is a step up from league football. This is true at any grade of football, club or county. If you change championship to a league format you will lose all the things that make a championship a championship.

I can see some merit in suggesting rationalizing the draw outside the traditional provincial structures to provide a more level playing field [sorry] or even splitting the championship into Senior and Intermediate, not that i agree that we should do this, but of all the possible solutions this round robin proposal is the stupidest possible outcome.
I thought most counties have a round robin in the championship, at the start!

I really like our system. 16 team senior and intermediate championship.

Round 1  - Open Draw

8 games - 8 losers, 8 winner

Round 2 - Open draw

4 losers v 4 losers

The 4 losers go into relegation play-off semi-finals
The 4 winners go into round 3

4 winners v 4 winners

The 4 winners go into Q/F
The 4 losers go into round 3 to play the "loser" winners, not allowed draw team previously played.

Round 3

4 Loser winners v 4 winner losers

4 teams in to q/f

Q/F onwards straight knock-out. Every game is competitive with meaning. Each team guaranteed 3 championship (inc relegation p/o) 



Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Donnellys Hollow on February 24, 2017, 10:32:11 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on February 24, 2017, 10:29:19 AM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 24, 2017, 10:09:27 AM
Quote from: Keyser soze on February 24, 2017, 09:54:55 AM
Does any of you have a round robin in their championship? How does it work?

Derry tried it about ten years ago, it was hurriedly ditched without fanfare after a couple of years, as it was a complete disaster. It was replaced with a back door, which has now been ditched at Senior level as well, and has gone back to straight knockout. As far as I recollect the same or a similar thing happened in a number of other counties as well. [though i do not have a great memory lol]

I think that it is unfathomable that Duffy should now bring this forward as a solution to any perceived ills existing in the GAA as I just cannot see what the rationale for such a move could be given that this format has been proved not to work

In GAA more people come to watch championship football because it is do or die and the pace and intensity is a step up from league football. This is true at any grade of football, club or county. If you change championship to a league format you will lose all the things that make a championship a championship.

I can see some merit in suggesting rationalizing the draw outside the traditional provincial structures to provide a more level playing field [sorry] or even splitting the championship into Senior and Intermediate, not that i agree that we should do this, but of all the possible solutions this round robin proposal is the stupidest possible outcome.
I thought most counties have a round robin in the championship, at the start!

I really like our system. 16 team senior and intermediate championship.

Round 1  - Open Draw

8 games - 8 losers, 8 winner

Round 2 - Open draw

4 losers v 4 losers

The 4 losers go into relegation play-off semi-finals
The 4 winners go into round 3

4 winners v 4 winners

The 4 winners go into Q/F
The 4 losers go into round 3 to play the "loser" winners, not allowed draw team previously played.

Round 3

4 Loser winners v 4 winner losers

4 teams in to q/f

Q/F onwards straight knock-out. Every game is competitive with meaning. Each team guaranteed 3 championship (inc relegation p/o)

It's a great system. Hard to believe there were a few club delegates who wanted it changed not so long ago.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 24, 2017, 10:33:28 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 24, 2017, 09:38:15 AM
Like everything in life, business, government etc it's all about getting the right BALANCE.
Isn't it up to Co Boards who are made up of delegates from Clubs Central Council made up of delegates from Counties and the annual Congress to ensure the balance is met between the obvious need for money and the neEdstaston of the games/players etc.?
Obviously a lot of people think the 8s is good for the games.
I think any round Robin in the AI championship should be for the other 24 which would be better for the game but could well be a flop financially.

I agree Rossfan. It's about Balance. I just think it's weighted towards financial considerations more than competitive balance (no pun intended) or the 'good of the game' a lot these days.

I don't think they are trying to hurt the games, of course, but I think they think along the lines of 'this will increase revenue by x% and the clubs/counties can just change this to allow/accomodate it'.

Also, I hope this doesn't need to be said, but I will anyway just in case, I don't believe people on here advocating for changes like this are in any way ignorant of the needs of the game. I know we're all involved and just have different opinions on the best way to do things, but I believe we are all coming at it from the perspective of the games.

It's my opinion that a bit of that has been lost in HQ since they realised they need to be professional about running a business, even if the business itself is an amateur one.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on February 24, 2017, 10:48:07 AM
Quote from: Donnellys Hollow on February 24, 2017, 10:32:11 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on February 24, 2017, 10:29:19 AM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 24, 2017, 10:09:27 AM
Quote from: Keyser soze on February 24, 2017, 09:54:55 AM
Does any of you have a round robin in their championship? How does it work?

Derry tried it about ten years ago, it was hurriedly ditched without fanfare after a couple of years, as it was a complete disaster. It was replaced with a back door, which has now been ditched at Senior level as well, and has gone back to straight knockout. As far as I recollect the same or a similar thing happened in a number of other counties as well. [though i do not have a great memory lol]

I think that it is unfathomable that Duffy should now bring this forward as a solution to any perceived ills existing in the GAA as I just cannot see what the rationale for such a move could be given that this format has been proved not to work

In GAA more people come to watch championship football because it is do or die and the pace and intensity is a step up from league football. This is true at any grade of football, club or county. If you change championship to a league format you will lose all the things that make a championship a championship.

I can see some merit in suggesting rationalizing the draw outside the traditional provincial structures to provide a more level playing field [sorry] or even splitting the championship into Senior and Intermediate, not that i agree that we should do this, but of all the possible solutions this round robin proposal is the stupidest possible outcome.
I thought most counties have a round robin in the championship, at the start!

I really like our system. 16 team senior and intermediate championship.

Round 1  - Open Draw

8 games - 8 losers, 8 winner

Round 2 - Open draw

4 losers v 4 losers

The 4 losers go into relegation play-off semi-finals
The 4 winners go into round 3

4 winners v 4 winners

The 4 winners go into Q/F
The 4 losers go into round 3 to play the "loser" winners, not allowed draw team previously played.

Round 3

4 Loser winners v 4 winner losers

4 teams in to q/f

Q/F onwards straight knock-out. Every game is competitive with meaning. Each team guaranteed 3 championship (inc relegation p/o)

It's a great system. Hard to believe there were a few club delegates who wanted it changed not so long ago.
Sounds a good system all right.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on February 24, 2017, 10:59:35 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 24, 2017, 10:21:15 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 24, 2017, 09:47:44 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 23, 2017, 05:12:58 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 04:59:25 PM
Is a semi final a bigger step than getting a hiding off Mayo or Tyrone in Thurles in a last 8 round robin game? Is that the question?

If it is I think you know the answer.
My point/question is this. You're making it a major deal, for a county's progress, to make a semi-final because it suits your argument.

What I'm saying is that a county might progress just as much in the long term by playing three of these Super 8 games as they would playing in a semi-final. And please don't start with the black & white argument that getting to a SF is better than getting to a QF. I'm aware of that.

But again, look at how you're wording your question; "getting a hiding" of Mayo. Let me flip it around for you. Would it be more beneficial for Tipp to play three games and get a win, a draw and a narrow defeat than get "a hiding" in the AISF?

I don't think getting to the Super 8 every year in 10 is going to help in any way in the long term (the same as getting to a SF one year in 10 tbf). The idea behind the qualifiers when they came in was to give the counties who traditionally only got the one championship game each year a second day out. This was laudable but the downside is that if a stronger county got caught out they got a second bite at the cherry. This super 8 proposal purposely sets out to make the strong counties even stronger as the counties who will benefit most from it are those who will make the last 8 year upon year. We already have huge imbalances from coaching to funding to seeded draws to Dublin having the keys to Croke Park and now HQ are trying to put another road block in front of the smaller counties. Westmeath did their bit for the association last night by agreeing to vote against it, hopefully the remaining counties follow suit.
I'm not sure why you're talking about one year in ten. If Westmeath got to the last eight in 2018 and had a game in Cusack Park against Mayo/Tyrone/Dublin/Kerry, a game against, say, Galway in Croke Park and a game against say Donegal in Breffni Park, do you not think that would promote the game in the county just as much as getting to a semi-final? Who knows how the county would build on that in the coming years. My point is that the Super 8 proposal doesn't seem to be a hugely, if at all, inferior place to be than an AISF.

You talk about the Super 8 making the stronger teams stronger. How? Do you mean by letting them have a potentially third chance? This is another example of where everyone has different complaints about the current system. One of the many areas that Duffy tried to address with this was the complaint that the only teams that didn't get a second chance in the All-Ireland series were the provincial champions. If you read the proposal, you'll see all of the issues that an attempt has been made to address. This is one of them.

Ultimately, on this thread and elsewhere, I think the general view is that those against it are so for factually incorrect reasons or for the reason that it doesn't solve everything.

I believe that's it's not perfect because it's impossible to be so, but that it condenses the season, gives players back to their clubs earlier and should be trialled for three years.

All interested parties can use the intervening period to make suggestions and have discussions for the next exciting episode.

Because that's how often on average the weaker teams make the last 8, check the graph posted earlier. In your example, no, I don't believe those 3 games would promote the game anywhere near as advancing to a stage of the championship we have never reached before. We'll have to agree to disagree, a SF appearance trumps over 3 games at last 8 level for me.

Super 8 will make the stronger teams stronger as they will have 3 tough games at the highest level each year where they can refine their systems, processes and performances. The provincial champions not getting a second chance is a bit of a red herring. Everyone gets one chance to win their provincial championship. They then get another chance to win the AI. Everyone is in the same boat.

The reason people are against it are not that it doesn't solve everything. The reasons people are against it are:

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 24, 2017, 11:04:08 AM
We have 2 groups of 6 at Senior and Inter.
A strong group and a weak group.
Top 2 in strong group go to Semis,  3rd and 4th in strong group and top 2 in weak group play Qtr Finals.
Bottom 2 in strong group relegated to weak group replaced by top 2 in weak group. Bottom 2 in weak group relegation play off.
AZ - I agree that people here proposing different systems are thinking what's best for the games.
I still think the best logical long term solution is Senior/Inter and Junior AIs at Inter County - while keeping the Provincials open to all and having some sort of League early in the year.
However what's the best achievable in the intervening 40 years?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on February 24, 2017, 11:12:42 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on February 24, 2017, 10:29:19 AM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 24, 2017, 10:09:27 AM
Quote from: Keyser soze on February 24, 2017, 09:54:55 AM
Does any of you have a round robin in their championship? How does it work?

Derry tried it about ten years ago, it was hurriedly ditched without fanfare after a couple of years, as it was a complete disaster. It was replaced with a back door, which has now been ditched at Senior level as well, and has gone back to straight knockout. As far as I recollect the same or a similar thing happened in a number of other counties as well. [though i do not have a great memory lol]

I think that it is unfathomable that Duffy should now bring this forward as a solution to any perceived ills existing in the GAA as I just cannot see what the rationale for such a move could be given that this format has been proved not to work

In GAA more people come to watch championship football because it is do or die and the pace and intensity is a step up from league football. This is true at any grade of football, club or county. If you change championship to a league format you will lose all the things that make a championship a championship.

I can see some merit in suggesting rationalizing the draw outside the traditional provincial structures to provide a more level playing field [sorry] or even splitting the championship into Senior and Intermediate, not that i agree that we should do this, but of all the possible solutions this round robin proposal is the stupidest possible outcome.
I thought most counties have a round robin in the championship, at the start!

I really like our system. 16 team senior and intermediate championship.

Round 1  - Open Draw

8 games - 8 losers, 8 winner

Round 2 - Open draw

4 losers v 4 losers

The 4 losers go into relegation play-off semi-finals
The 4 winners go into round 3

4 winners v 4 winners

The 4 winners go into Q/F
The 4 losers go into round 3 to play the "loser" winners, not allowed draw team previously played.

Round 3

4 Loser winners v 4 winner losers

4 teams in to q/f

Q/F onwards straight knock-out. Every game is competitive with meaning. Each team guaranteed 3 championship (inc relegation p/o)
I like it
the first match is really important and each round has an element of knockout to it
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 24, 2017, 11:24:04 AM
I like Croí's point about overshadowing the hurley stuff. Sure that could all be played in May and June and get them out of the way :D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fuzzman on February 24, 2017, 11:50:45 AM
As has been said on here before there seems to be lots of people wanting different things and not everyone can agree what are the main problems to solve.

You can see the different attitudes in Gaels from those who deal with underage teams to the hard working club chairman, to the county manager who will often put his team's needs before those of what's best for the clubs and of course there are those at the top presidential and business levels who might say they want to help the grassroots but often make higher level choices.

The GAA know that Dublin is their golden goose and so it has always been in their interests to get as many matches as possible with the Dubs in Croke Park with a huge crowd. It takes in a great income from match attendance and now also from TV revenue and sponsorship. This new system will ensure an extra game for Dublin against another provincial winner (should Dublin be lucky enough to win Leinster of course) and against a qualifier whereas before it would just have been a quarterfinal against a qualifier.

The biggest loser (at county level) in this new system is definitely the underdog teams like Tipperary last year who might occasionally beat a big team like Cork or Galway but if they are in a group with 2 provincial winners then you would be very surprised if they would come 2nd in the group. As a Tyrone man I think the new system will suit us much better whether we are a provincial winner or a qualifier. Actually the idea of playing the Dubs or Kerry in Omagh/Clones if we were a qualifier would be very exciting.

There seems to be a feeling that once this is voted in that they won't be able to say No to it in 3 years again if people aren't happy with it. For me personally I think it's still too easy for Kerry and Dublin to get to a semifinal compared to Ulster sides. It would be an interesting group if you had Kerry, Dublin, Tyrone and Mayo should Tyrone and Mayo not win their provinces.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 24, 2017, 12:30:30 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 24, 2017, 10:59:35 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 24, 2017, 10:21:15 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 24, 2017, 09:47:44 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 23, 2017, 05:12:58 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 04:59:25 PM
Is a semi final a bigger step than getting a hiding off Mayo or Tyrone in Thurles in a last 8 round robin game? Is that the question?

If it is I think you know the answer.
My point/question is this. You're making it a major deal, for a county's progress, to make a semi-final because it suits your argument.

What I'm saying is that a county might progress just as much in the long term by playing three of these Super 8 games as they would playing in a semi-final. And please don't start with the black & white argument that getting to a SF is better than getting to a QF. I'm aware of that.

But again, look at how you're wording your question; "getting a hiding" of Mayo. Let me flip it around for you. Would it be more beneficial for Tipp to play three games and get a win, a draw and a narrow defeat than get "a hiding" in the AISF?

I don't think getting to the Super 8 every year in 10 is going to help in any way in the long term (the same as getting to a SF one year in 10 tbf). The idea behind the qualifiers when they came in was to give the counties who traditionally only got the one championship game each year a second day out. This was laudable but the downside is that if a stronger county got caught out they got a second bite at the cherry. This super 8 proposal purposely sets out to make the strong counties even stronger as the counties who will benefit most from it are those who will make the last 8 year upon year. We already have huge imbalances from coaching to funding to seeded draws to Dublin having the keys to Croke Park and now HQ are trying to put another road block in front of the smaller counties. Westmeath did their bit for the association last night by agreeing to vote against it, hopefully the remaining counties follow suit.
I'm not sure why you're talking about one year in ten. If Westmeath got to the last eight in 2018 and had a game in Cusack Park against Mayo/Tyrone/Dublin/Kerry, a game against, say, Galway in Croke Park and a game against say Donegal in Breffni Park, do you not think that would promote the game in the county just as much as getting to a semi-final? Who knows how the county would build on that in the coming years. My point is that the Super 8 proposal doesn't seem to be a hugely, if at all, inferior place to be than an AISF.

You talk about the Super 8 making the stronger teams stronger. How? Do you mean by letting them have a potentially third chance? This is another example of where everyone has different complaints about the current system. One of the many areas that Duffy tried to address with this was the complaint that the only teams that didn't get a second chance in the All-Ireland series were the provincial champions. If you read the proposal, you'll see all of the issues that an attempt has been made to address. This is one of them.

Ultimately, on this thread and elsewhere, I think the general view is that those against it are so for factually incorrect reasons or for the reason that it doesn't solve everything.

I believe that's it's not perfect because it's impossible to be so, but that it condenses the season, gives players back to their clubs earlier and should be trialled for three years.

All interested parties can use the intervening period to make suggestions and have discussions for the next exciting episode.

Because that's how often on average the weaker teams make the last 8, check the graph posted earlier. In your example, no, I don't believe those 3 games would promote the game anywhere near as advancing to a stage of the championship we have never reached before. We'll have to agree to disagree, a SF appearance trumps over 3 games at last 8 level for me.

Super 8 will make the stronger teams stronger as they will have 3 tough games at the highest level each year where they can refine their systems, processes and performances. The provincial champions not getting a second chance is a bit of a red herring. Everyone gets one chance to win their provincial championship. They then get another chance to win the AI. Everyone is in the same boat.

The reason people are against it are not that it doesn't solve everything. The reasons people are against it are:


  • It makes the strong stronger
  • The players are against it
  • We are locked into it for the next 3 years
  • The CPA don't get a chance to fix the fixtures (Since no one else will despite their promises)
  • It's designed to make money rather than being for the betterment of the association
  • Hurling will be completely overshadowed while all these Super 8 games are going on
But if you reach the AISF once in ten years is that any use? I don't follow the logic.

I agree we should agree to disagree on the next point.

Would the weaker teams not benefit from playing better teams in a similar way that you say the strong teams will? Again, we hear a lot about how the weaker teams need to be exposed to a better standard. Like I said, the argument are all very conflicting.

The CPA has certainly complicated matters by trying to come to the table so late. I think it's reasonable for them to wait the three years to come up with a better proposal. There's no evidence that hurling will overshadowed. The GPA are against it which is definitely noteworthy, although strange considering the number of elements it's addressed.

Anyway, we'll see what happens. I hope some of it goes through and then at least we can see how it goes.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on February 24, 2017, 01:36:20 PM
It's incredible that a proposal opposed by both players' unions, supporters and pretty much any club that has its own best interests at heart has a massive chance of being passed at congress.

A democracy is something the GAA is very far from.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on February 24, 2017, 01:42:12 PM
I'm undecided over the super 8s format. I do like the idea of the top teams playing against each other in more important games. I also see the argument over it not helping the club fixtures.

Everyone has to agree its extremely difficult to fix the fixtures issues and no matter what the gaa do won't be perfect. In my opinion the biggest issues based on Tyrone currently are:

1) Too much uncertainty over club fixtures. Players have no idea when the next game is because of dependency on when Tyrone progress. Games are also moved if there is replays etc.
2) Players trying to serve club and county at same time. To me this is leading to even further weeks wasted as county manager trying to protect their players ahead of big games which is understandable as their opposition will no doubt do the same.
3) The inter county championship is too drawn out with too many breaks between games in the provincial series.
4) Their is too many warm up games at county leave (pre season then league) and not enough meaningful big games between the top teams.

I've now come to the conclusion that their should be a total split season for county players. The county season should run from February (pre season January) to end of July (other teams will obviously drop out earlier) and during that period the county players play no club games. The club season should start without them in say April and run away with regular fixtures every week. Personally I think if that's the case your league division shouldn't determine the championship you play in. The fact the league is all before the championship should keep players interested.

From February to the end of July there is 26 weekends so there is plenty of time for decent county competitions. I think they need totally revised based on what is there currently. I'd personally start with the provincials and have groupings in each provincial championship like they currently have in pre season tournaments and your position based on those 3 or 4 games would determine whether you enter the senior, intermediate or junior championship after that. The provincial winners could carry points over to the main championship to give greater incentive to win provincial championship. Once completed there would then be a senior championship with 16 teams and the other two with 8. Each team has 7 games. Then quarter finals for senior (or semi finals for the other two). I'd potentially have a route of allowing the junior/intermediate teams a play off to get back in the main championship so everyone still has chance of All Ireland.

For the clubs they'd have started in April with county players coming in start of August or before and being totally free to concentrate on club activities to end of October. All counties have to be finished up by then except for provincial championships.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 24, 2017, 02:04:16 PM
(https://www.mayobooks.ie/image/cache/data/DSC_1400-500x500.jpg)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 24, 2017, 02:22:37 PM
Quote from: Syferus on February 24, 2017, 01:36:20 PM
It's incredible that a proposal opposed by both players' unions, supporters and pretty much any club that has its own best interests at heart has a massive chance of being passed at congress.

A democracy is something the GAA is very far from.
Where do you get this from?

The players' unions point is fair enough but supporters and any club that has its own best interests at heart is, in the first instance an unfounded generalisation, and in the second instance your opinion based on what, I'm not sure.

Are all these groups not members of their clubs where they can go and voice their opposition if it is indeed the case?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Keyser soze on February 24, 2017, 03:04:25 PM
So Roscommon have a round robin and Kildare a back door, any others. I was sure Tyrone and Down had tried round robin in the past....anyone??
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on February 24, 2017, 03:49:38 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 24, 2017, 12:30:30 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 24, 2017, 10:59:35 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 24, 2017, 10:21:15 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 24, 2017, 09:47:44 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 23, 2017, 05:12:58 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 04:59:25 PM
Is a semi final a bigger step than getting a hiding off Mayo or Tyrone in Thurles in a last 8 round robin game? Is that the question?

If it is I think you know the answer.
My point/question is this. You're making it a major deal, for a county's progress, to make a semi-final because it suits your argument.

What I'm saying is that a county might progress just as much in the long term by playing three of these Super 8 games as they would playing in a semi-final. And please don't start with the black & white argument that getting to a SF is better than getting to a QF. I'm aware of that.

But again, look at how you're wording your question; "getting a hiding" of Mayo. Let me flip it around for you. Would it be more beneficial for Tipp to play three games and get a win, a draw and a narrow defeat than get "a hiding" in the AISF?

I don't think getting to the Super 8 every year in 10 is going to help in any way in the long term (the same as getting to a SF one year in 10 tbf). The idea behind the qualifiers when they came in was to give the counties who traditionally only got the one championship game each year a second day out. This was laudable but the downside is that if a stronger county got caught out they got a second bite at the cherry. This super 8 proposal purposely sets out to make the strong counties even stronger as the counties who will benefit most from it are those who will make the last 8 year upon year. We already have huge imbalances from coaching to funding to seeded draws to Dublin having the keys to Croke Park and now HQ are trying to put another road block in front of the smaller counties. Westmeath did their bit for the association last night by agreeing to vote against it, hopefully the remaining counties follow suit.
I'm not sure why you're talking about one year in ten. If Westmeath got to the last eight in 2018 and had a game in Cusack Park against Mayo/Tyrone/Dublin/Kerry, a game against, say, Galway in Croke Park and a game against say Donegal in Breffni Park, do you not think that would promote the game in the county just as much as getting to a semi-final? Who knows how the county would build on that in the coming years. My point is that the Super 8 proposal doesn't seem to be a hugely, if at all, inferior place to be than an AISF.

You talk about the Super 8 making the stronger teams stronger. How? Do you mean by letting them have a potentially third chance? This is another example of where everyone has different complaints about the current system. One of the many areas that Duffy tried to address with this was the complaint that the only teams that didn't get a second chance in the All-Ireland series were the provincial champions. If you read the proposal, you'll see all of the issues that an attempt has been made to address. This is one of them.

Ultimately, on this thread and elsewhere, I think the general view is that those against it are so for factually incorrect reasons or for the reason that it doesn't solve everything.

I believe that's it's not perfect because it's impossible to be so, but that it condenses the season, gives players back to their clubs earlier and should be trialled for three years.

All interested parties can use the intervening period to make suggestions and have discussions for the next exciting episode.

Because that's how often on average the weaker teams make the last 8, check the graph posted earlier. In your example, no, I don't believe those 3 games would promote the game anywhere near as advancing to a stage of the championship we have never reached before. We'll have to agree to disagree, a SF appearance trumps over 3 games at last 8 level for me.

Super 8 will make the stronger teams stronger as they will have 3 tough games at the highest level each year where they can refine their systems, processes and performances. The provincial champions not getting a second chance is a bit of a red herring. Everyone gets one chance to win their provincial championship. They then get another chance to win the AI. Everyone is in the same boat.

The reason people are against it are not that it doesn't solve everything. The reasons people are against it are:


  • It makes the strong stronger
  • The players are against it
  • We are locked into it for the next 3 years
  • The CPA don't get a chance to fix the fixtures (Since no one else will despite their promises)
  • It's designed to make money rather than being for the betterment of the association
  • Hurling will be completely overshadowed while all these Super 8 games are going on
But if you reach the AISF once in ten years is that any use? I don't follow the logic.

I agree we should agree to disagree on the next point.

Would the weaker teams not benefit from playing better teams in a similar way that you say the strong teams will? Again, we hear a lot about how the weaker teams need to be exposed to a better standard. Like I said, the argument are all very conflicting.

The CPA has certainly complicated matters by trying to come to the table so late. I think it's reasonable for them to wait the three years to come up with a better proposal. There's no evidence that hurling will overshadowed. The GPA are against it which is definitely noteworthy, although strange considering the number of elements it's addressed.

Anyway, we'll see what happens. I hope some of it goes through and then at least we can see how it goes.

According to Loughnane in the Star yesterday: "If the changes are agreed, then there will be 19 football Championship games in the months of July and August. But, in those prime months, there will be just five senior hurling matches". There's evidence for you.

And it's certainly not reasonable to punish anyone who plays gaelic games in Ireland just because the CPA came to the table late as you put it. The motions to move back the AI finals and the use of extra time in the case of a draw outside of finals will and should IMO pass at congress. The super 8s could go either way, certainly there's a late push against it, depends if enough delegates can be swayed despite Duffys trips around the country.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 24, 2017, 04:45:25 PM
Quote from: Keyser soze on February 24, 2017, 03:04:25 PM
So Roscommon have a round robin and Kildare a back door, any others. I was sure Tyrone and Down had tried round robin in the past....anyone??
As far as I know there are group stages in all the Connacht Counties plus Westmeath and East Meath.  Think Longford and Offaly have too.

Croí - the Super 8s should stand or fall on their own merits not be rejected because the hurley crowd only have a few games in their Championship.
In fact this proposal is probably more suited to them than football.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Owenmoresider on February 24, 2017, 04:49:44 PM
Quote from: Keyser soze on February 24, 2017, 03:04:25 PM
So Roscommon have a round robin and Kildare a back door, any others. I was sure Tyrone and Down had tried round robin in the past....anyone??
By my reckoning it breaks down thus:
Round Robin* - Sligo, Leitrim, Roscommon, Mayo, Donegal, Cavan, Longford, Westmeath, Meath, Louth, Offaly, Carlow, Wexford, Tipperary (& divisional c'ships), Limerick and Waterford.
Back Door - Galway, Monaghan, Armagh, Down, Kildare, Laois, Wicklow, Clare, Cork, Kerry.
Straight KO - Tyrone, Fermanagh, Derry, Antrim, Dublin.

* - you know where you can shove your "Champions League format" bollocks.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 24, 2017, 04:52:57 PM
Croi, who's being punished? Such emotive language.

And Ger Loughnane telling us, rightly or wrongly, how many games there are is not evidence of anything. Unless you want it to be of course.

Sure if we get hammerings and dead rubbers with the Super 8 won't everyone be looking to hurling for a decent bit of entertainment? ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on February 24, 2017, 05:26:15 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 24, 2017, 04:52:57 PM
Croi, who's being punished? Such emotive language.

And Ger Loughnane telling us, rightly or wrongly, how many games there are is not evidence of anything. Unless you want it to be of course.

Sure if we get hammerings and dead rubbers with the Super 8 won't everyone be looking to hurling for a decent bit of entertainment? ;)

Players like these are being punished.

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/who-do-the-gaa-top-brass-think-they-are-by-ignoring-players-1.2987799 (http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/who-do-the-gaa-top-brass-think-they-are-by-ignoring-players-1.2987799)

Super 8s not only do nothing for them but lock them into a format that will punish them for an extra 3 years before the CPA can help to work out a format that suits as many people as possible. At least give them a shot at it. Instead of this elitist nonsense.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 24, 2017, 06:17:01 PM
Quote from: Owenmoresider on February 24, 2017, 04:49:44 PM
Quote from: Keyser soze on February 24, 2017, 03:04:25 PM
So Roscommon have a round robin and Kildare a back door, any others. I was sure Tyrone and Down had tried round robin in the past....anyone??
By my reckoning it breaks down thus:
Round Robin* - Sligo, Leitrim, Roscommon, Mayo, Donegal, Cavan, Longford, Westmeath, Meath, Louth, Offaly, Carlow, Wexford, Tipperary (& divisional c'ships), Limerick and Waterford.
Back Door - Galway, Monaghan, Armagh, Down, Kildare, Laois, Wicklow, Clare, Cork.
Straight KO - Tyrone, Fermanagh, Derry, Antrim, Dublin, Kerry.

* - you know where you can shove your "Champions League format" bollocks.

I think Kerry have a back door if you lose in the first round.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 24, 2017, 07:32:47 PM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 24, 2017, 05:26:15 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 24, 2017, 04:52:57 PM
Croi, who's being punished? Such emotive language.

And Ger Loughnane telling us, rightly or wrongly, how many games there are is not evidence of anything. Unless you want it to be of course.

Sure if we get hammerings and dead rubbers with the Super 8 won't everyone be looking to hurling for a decent bit of entertainment? ;)

Players like these are being punished.

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/who-do-the-gaa-top-brass-think-they-are-by-ignoring-players-1.2987799 (http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/who-do-the-gaa-top-brass-think-they-are-by-ignoring-players-1.2987799)

Super 8s not only do nothing for them but lock them into a format that will punish them for an extra 3 years before the CPA can help to work out a format that suits as many people as possible. At least give them a shot at it. Instead of this elitist nonsense.
If Duffy had not brought any proposals this year then we'd be waiting until this time next year for a proposal which would mean 2019 at the earliest for the proposal to be brought in. Why haven't the club players done something earlier? Did you read Aaron Kernan's comments about the club player? Moan about everything, do nothing. Even some of the lads coming out against the new proposals are accepting that they themselves are partly to blame.

Had Duffy not brought these proposals I'd have my doubts as to whether the CPA would exist yet. They've existed, what, a couple of months, and things should stand still?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Owenmoresider on February 24, 2017, 07:33:19 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 24, 2017, 06:17:01 PM
Quote from: Owenmoresider on February 24, 2017, 04:49:44 PM
Quote from: Keyser soze on February 24, 2017, 03:04:25 PM
So Roscommon have a round robin and Kildare a back door, any others. I was sure Tyrone and Down had tried round robin in the past....anyone??
By my reckoning it breaks down thus:
Round Robin* - Sligo, Leitrim, Roscommon, Mayo, Donegal, Cavan, Longford, Westmeath, Meath, Louth, Offaly, Carlow, Wexford, Tipperary (& divisional c'ships), Limerick and Waterford.
Back Door - Galway, Monaghan, Armagh, Down, Kildare, Laois, Wicklow, Clare, Cork.
Straight KO - Tyrone, Fermanagh, Derry, Antrim, Dublin, Kerry.

* - you know where you can shove your "Champions League format" bollocks.

I think Kerry have a back door if you lose in the first round.
Actually that's correct, thought that had gone last year but evidently not.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: criostlinn on February 24, 2017, 08:42:59 PM
If people just keep looking at the negatives in every system we will never change. No system is perfect but at least they are trying something. I say give it a go and see what happens.

All this focus on the weaker counties not getting enough from it. That maybe true, but what are they getting at the moment. The only way to address this is to have a second tier competition and then they get to play teams of equal ability all year. But its my impression they don't want this and it certainly wouldn't have been any good to Tipperary last year.   So what next. Maybe a handicap system. Give Clare a 10 point start against Kerry. The Rossies a 15 point start against Mayo, etc etc. At the end of the day what ever system comes in, it should be about the best team winning.  Supporting weaker counties should be done off the pitch with funding and promotional work. Try ad bring them up to the level of teh stronger teams.  It should not be about handicapping stronger teams to bring everyone down to the same level.

This arguement about this super 8 system only suiting the strong teams. Last year Kerry waltzed into the Semi Final without breaking a sweat. Many (mainly Tymonies) rightly complained. If we had a super 8 system last year they would have been into a group with Ddublin, Donegal and Clare. Would they have made the Semi Final from this. Maybe. But it wouldn't have been as easy.

But above all. This new systems gives the media a greater chance of having 2 Dublin-Kerry love ins every year. One in the Super 8 and another in the All Ireland final. They'll be righting ballads and books for years about the time the Dubs toppled the Kingdom in Killarney. For that alone we cant let this opportunity pass. Vote yes
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 24, 2017, 09:41:30 PM
What is this new system supposed to deliver though? What exactly I'd it's purpose?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 24, 2017, 09:45:17 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 24, 2017, 09:41:30 PM
What is this new system supposed to deliver though? What exactly I'd it's purpose?
AZ, you come across as someone that's read the document. It's all explained in there.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Tubberman on February 24, 2017, 09:46:03 PM
Quote from: criostlinn on February 24, 2017, 08:42:59 PM
If people just keep looking at the negatives in every system we will never change. No system is perfect but at least they are trying something. I say give it a go and see what happens.

All this focus on the weaker counties not getting enough from it. That maybe true, but what are they getting at the moment. The only way to address this is to have a second tier competition and then they get to play teams of equal ability all year. But its my impression they don't want this and it certainly wouldn't have been any good to Tipperary last year.   So what next. Maybe a handicap system. Give Clare a 10 point start against Kerry. The Rossies a 15 point start against Mayo, etc etc. At the end of the day what ever system comes in, it should be about the best team winning.  Supporting weaker counties should be done off the pitch with funding and promotional work. Try ad bring them up to the level of teh stronger teams.  It should not be about handicapping stronger teams to bring everyone down to the same level.

This arguement about this super 8 system only suiting the strong teams. Last year Kerry waltzed into the Semi Final without breaking a sweat. Many (mainly Tymonies) rightly complained. If we had a super 8 system last year they would have been into a group with Ddublin, Donegal and Clare. Would they have made the Semi Final from this. Maybe. But it wouldn't have been as easy.

But above all. This new systems gives the media a greater chance of having 2 Dublin-Kerry love ins every year. One in the Super 8 and another in the All Ireland final. They'll be righting ballads and books for years about the time the Dubs toppled the Kingdom in Killarney. For that alone we cant let this opportunity pass. Vote yes

Because it's better than what's currently there does not make it the best option.
Rather than implementing a seriously flawed system now, would we not be better to wait another year with the aim of implementing a far superior system.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on February 24, 2017, 09:50:16 PM
I still don't understand what the positives of it are?

more games? for a very small bunch of counties. the elite just getting better.
it should be more games for more counties, then run off the knockout stages.

more money? surely more games at an earlier stage would do that too?

more media coverage? is that how GAA competitions are now measured?
cause RTE are just terrible at GAA coverage.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 24, 2017, 09:55:32 PM
Don't worry.
RTE will probably only be covering half of these games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 24, 2017, 09:58:01 PM
I understand the document talks about the calendar and shortening the season  but specifically what is the bennfit of the new groups? Is it purely financial? Is it to give the media more games to cover?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 24, 2017, 10:04:52 PM
Improve 'the product'.
More 'high quality' games.
Increase visibility.
Increase revenue.
Etc.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 24, 2017, 10:06:36 PM
Is that just your spin on it? It does sound like that's the main reason behind it alright
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 24, 2017, 10:07:46 PM
That's just me imagining how McKenna sold it to Duffy.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on February 24, 2017, 10:09:51 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 24, 2017, 09:58:01 PM
I understand the document talks about the calendar and shortening the season  but specifically what is the bennfit of the new groups? Is it purely financial? Is it to give the media more games to cover?

To get the top teams playing each other more often during a season? I think that could be good. Maybe in this scenario every team will earn their semi final place and avoid a situation like last year were Kerry had to beat Clare then Tipp then Clare to get to an AI semi final?  I'm no particular fan of the idea but I think perhaps the main reason is to dip the toes into a league type format in the championship. Changing things very quickly doesn't tend to happen in the GAA and I think this is a stepping stone to further change......maybe in 40 years time.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 24, 2017, 10:17:03 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 24, 2017, 09:58:01 PM
I understand the document talks about the calendar and shortening the season  but specifically what is the bennfit of the new groups? Is it purely financial? Is it to give the media more games to cover?
Sorry, I must try to split the whole proposal from the Super 8 part.

I don't have it in front of me but the two reasons I recall reading are that the provincial winners get a second chance (they were the only teams that didn't previously up to the Q/F) and it makes it harder for the likes of Kerry to win the AI as their route to the SF would be much tougher than it is currently.

I think it might also state the benefits to the lesser teams that make the last eight of getting a big gun in a home draw and the general exposure to playing the better teams.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Kuwabatake Sanjuro on February 24, 2017, 10:23:18 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 24, 2017, 10:17:03 PM


I think it might also state the benefits to the lesser teams that make the last eight of getting a big gun in a home draw and the general exposure to playing the better teams.

The chances of say a minnow like Kildare ever being allowed to have a home game against the Dubs is laughable in the extreme.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: criostlinn on February 24, 2017, 10:57:22 PM
Quote from: Tubberman on February 24, 2017, 09:46:03 PM
Quote from: criostlinn on February 24, 2017, 08:42:59 PM
If people just keep looking at the negatives in every system we will never change. No system is perfect but at least they are trying something. I say give it a go and see what happens.

All this focus on the weaker counties not getting enough from it. That maybe true, but what are they getting at the moment. The only way to address this is to have a second tier competition and then they get to play teams of equal ability all year. But its my impression they don't want this and it certainly wouldn't have been any good to Tipperary last year.   So what next. Maybe a handicap system. Give Clare a 10 point start against Kerry. The Rossies a 15 point start against Mayo, etc etc. At the end of the day what ever system comes in, it should be about the best team winning.  Supporting weaker counties should be done off the pitch with funding and promotional work. Try ad bring them up to the level of teh stronger teams.  It should not be about handicapping stronger teams to bring everyone down to the same level.

This arguement about this super 8 system only suiting the strong teams. Last year Kerry waltzed into the Semi Final without breaking a sweat. Many (mainly Tymonies) rightly complained. If we had a super 8 system last year they would have been into a group with Ddublin, Donegal and Clare. Would they have made the Semi Final from this. Maybe. But it wouldn't have been as easy.

But above all. This new systems gives the media a greater chance of having 2 Dublin-Kerry love ins every year. One in the Super 8 and another in the All Ireland final. They'll be righting ballads and books for years about the time the Dubs toppled the Kingdom in Killarney. For that alone we cant let this opportunity pass. Vote yes

Because it's better than what's currently there does not make it the best option.
Rather than implementing a seriously flawed system now, would we not be better to wait another year with the aim of implementing a far superior system.

No doubt wait another year or two for that matter for a far superior system if one is available but I can guarantee you no matter what is suggested fault will be found in it.

I for the life of me cannot see a system, that is not 2 tier, that will make weaker counties more competitive. Don't get me wrong I'm all for trying to help the so called weaker counties make the breakthrough but I don't see how rigging a competition to do this will help anyone.  Can anyone show me the ideal format that everyone will support. And please spare me the 2 tier "Tommy Murphy" competitions and the scrapping the provincial championships because we know these are non runner
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rrhf on February 25, 2017, 07:18:15 AM
The big question is: if they change the name. Could a team like Mayo actually win a super 8 final?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: tippabu on February 25, 2017, 10:58:31 AM
Motion passed
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on February 25, 2017, 11:05:47 AM
Quote from: BennyHarp on February 24, 2017, 10:09:51 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 24, 2017, 09:58:01 PM
I understand the document talks about the calendar and shortening the season  but specifically what is the bennfit of the new groups? Is it purely financial? Is it to give the media more games to cover?

To get the top teams playing each other more often during a season? I think that could be good. Maybe in this scenario every team will earn their semi final place and avoid a situation like last year were Kerry had to beat Clare then Tipp then Clare to get to an AI semi final?  I'm no particular fan of the idea but I think perhaps the main reason is to dip the toes into a league type format in the championship. Changing things very quickly doesn't tend to happen in the GAA and I think this is a stepping stone to further change......maybe in 40 years time.
don't they do that already?
its called the national football league
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on February 25, 2017, 11:27:29 AM
Quote from: tippabu on February 25, 2017, 10:58:31 AM
Motion passed
Not surprising, men in suits with money/greed on their minds was always going to pass that motion. To hell with club football and the weaker counties in the AI championship sure what do they matter.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: vallankumous on February 25, 2017, 11:41:43 AM
Quote from: tippabu on February 25, 2017, 10:58:31 AM
Motion passed

The fun only begins now.
Let's see if this CPA has any teeth.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Take Your Points on February 25, 2017, 11:44:49 AM
Early warning to Tony Fearon!

When booking your hotel for the All Ireland football weekend, please note the final will be on the last Sunday in August in 2018.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on February 25, 2017, 11:45:03 AM
The suits have voted, it's now time for the people at grass roots level struggling with crippling debts and growing disenchantment to take back our organisation. I hope the CPA are strong on this and seriously look at the prospect of a strike. What sort of organisation goes against the beliefs and wishes of it's playing members to such an extent. Dinosaurs at board level promised a few extra quid to buy their vote and ignoring the growing problems for the sport. it's long past the time for major reform. This vote is a big 2 fingers up to grass roots players.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on February 25, 2017, 11:46:26 AM
I cannot understand how so many counties voted for this?

What have they been promised in return?
eg Leitrim, Longford, Antrim, Fermanagh, Wicklow, Carlow, Waterford, Limerick, Kilkenny, Louth, Sligo, Westmeath, Offaly
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on February 25, 2017, 11:53:14 AM
Why wouldn't the smaller counties vote for it in exchange for money to support and promote games in their county? What difference will the super 8s make to them? They'll get knocked out and play the same championship games as they do now. If anything it'll help club activity in those counties by tightening up the schedule.

The only way things will improve for them is to have their own championship that everyone aspires to win with possibly a route back into the main championship for the winners.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: vallankumous on February 25, 2017, 11:54:36 AM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 25, 2017, 11:46:26 AM
I cannot understand how so many counties voted for this?

What have they been promised in return?
eg Leitrim, Longford, Antrim, Fermanagh, Wicklow, Carlow, Waterford, Limerick, Kilkenny, Louth, Sligo, Westmeath, Offaly

Maximum coverage for our major sponsors. Remember, we are dealing with the same companies that sponsor FIFA tournaments.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on February 25, 2017, 11:55:09 AM
You'd also have to wonder in the small counties how their is issues over club fixtures. They generally are knocked out by early July at the latest. That gives them nearly 4 months to get their championship and remaining games played off.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on February 25, 2017, 12:01:14 PM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 25, 2017, 11:46:26 AM
I cannot understand how so many counties voted for this?

What have they been promised in return?
eg Leitrim, Longford, Antrim, Fermanagh, Wicklow, Carlow, Waterford, Limerick, Kilkenny, Louth, Sligo, Westmeath, Offaly
All were probably given funding by HQ recently and told they wouldnt receive any more funding unless they passed this motion. Even a super 8 county like Mayo had to say yes after the interest free loan they got from HQ for MacHale park.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on February 25, 2017, 12:07:54 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on February 25, 2017, 11:53:14 AM
Why wouldn't the smaller counties vote for it in exchange for money to support and promote games in their county? What difference will the super 8s make to them? They'll get knocked out and play the same championship games as they do now. If anything it'll help club activity in those counties by tightening up the schedule.

The only way things will improve for them is to have their own championship that everyone aspires to win with possibly a route back into the main championship for the winners.

Maybe I've missed something but is this not an amateur organisation based on a volunteer ethos. The congregation of board delegates are a bunch of career politicians who are totally out of touch with the people on the ground and who in effect voted according to how they were told by the hierarchy. Lobbying and promises of more finance have won the day. Hurling completely discarded as well. I hope that this is the straw that broke the camels back.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 25, 2017, 12:12:25 PM
Jases lads calm down!!
We have 3 years to come up with a better system and lobby/promote it for Congress 2020.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on February 25, 2017, 12:14:57 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 25, 2017, 12:07:54 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on February 25, 2017, 11:53:14 AM
Why wouldn't the smaller counties vote for it in exchange for money to support and promote games in their county? What difference will the super 8s make to them? They'll get knocked out and play the same championship games as they do now. If anything it'll help club activity in those counties by tightening up the schedule.

The only way things will improve for them is to have their own championship that everyone aspires to win with possibly a route back into the main championship for the winners.

Maybe I've missed something but is this not an amateur organisation based on a volunteer ethos. The congregation of board delegates are a bunch of career politicians who are totally out of touch with the people on the ground and who in effect voted according to how they were told by the hierarchy. Lobbying and promises of more finance have won the day. Hurling completely discarded as well. I hope that this is the straw that broke the camels back.

What difference will the super 8s make to a county who maybe make the quarters once every 15 years anyway? That's the question I'm asking. They'll still be finished up by July giving plenty of time for club games in the county. How is a few extra games between the top counties actually going to effect them?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: vallankumous on February 25, 2017, 12:24:17 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 25, 2017, 12:12:25 PM
Jases lads calm down!!
We have 3 years to come up with a better system and lobby/promote it for Congress 2020.

3 years is a long time in a club players life. It's time enough to start a career, find a partner, get married and have a child. 3 years is life changing and anyone thinking about giving the next 3 years of their lives to club football will be thinking very hard about it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on February 25, 2017, 12:24:53 PM
The GAA hierarchy = a dictatorship.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on February 25, 2017, 12:33:59 PM
Quote from: vallankumous on February 25, 2017, 12:24:17 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 25, 2017, 12:12:25 PM
Jases lads calm down!!
We have 3 years to come up with a better system and lobby/promote it for Congress 2020.

3 years is a long time in a club players life. It's time enough to start a career, find a partner, get married and have a child. 3 years is life changing and anyone thinking about giving the next 3 years of their lives to club football will be thinking very hard about it.
Nail on head. Calm down sure its only three years  ::)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on February 25, 2017, 12:37:41 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on February 25, 2017, 12:14:57 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 25, 2017, 12:07:54 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on February 25, 2017, 11:53:14 AM
Why wouldn't the smaller counties vote for it in exchange for money to support and promote games in their county? What difference will the super 8s make to them? They'll get knocked out and play the same championship games as they do now. If anything it'll help club activity in those counties by tightening up the schedule.

The only way things will improve for them is to have their own championship that everyone aspires to win with possibly a route back into the main championship for the winners.

Maybe I've missed something but is this not an amateur organisation based on a volunteer ethos. The congregation of board delegates are a bunch of career politicians who are totally out of touch with the people on the ground and who in effect voted according to how they were told by the hierarchy. Lobbying and promises of more finance have won the day. Hurling completely discarded as well. I hope that this is the straw that broke the camels back.

What difference will the super 8s make to a county who maybe make the quarters once every 15 years anyway? That's the question I'm asking. They'll still be finished up by July giving plenty of time for club games in the county. How is a few extra games between the top counties actually going to effect them?

1. It does nothing to address the inequality of the present system where Dublin and Kerry are effectively in one county provinces and have effectively a bye into the quarter finals each year. Now they can also afford to lose a game in the super 8's (I'm hating that title already) and still probably make the semi final. So they now have effectively a bye into the semi finals each year. The strong will get even further detached from the rest when exactly the opposite was needed to correct the imbalance.

2. I can envisage a scenario whereby players from weaker counties concentrate all their resources entirely on club football if the present system prevails That sounds dramatic but look at what it costs to field an inter county senior team each year. In excess of €500,000 in a lot of cases and that is just for the unsuccessful counties. Indeed it is already happening with lots of players opting out of playing county football in counties like Derry, Down, Galway etc. This will not alleviate the problem and will only serve to increase the divide between weak and strong.

3. I read somewhere that in the peak season months of Jul-Aug-Sep there will be something like 19 football games as opposed to 7 hurling games. This does nothing for hurling.

4. It is now implementted for a trial period of 3 years. Its like sticking a plaster on a bucket with a hole, it does absolutely nothing to address the main issues in our games which I think most people can agree on. Fixtures, championship structure & inequality of the provincial system and finally spiralling costs for counties and clubs.

5. The risk of dead rubbers at a stage of the championship where the results should be do or die. Correspondingly attendances dropping off as people know there will be other days.

But hey, from the GAA's perspective everything is sorted now and we can move on becasue nobody can say we didn't do anything. Now has anyone got any contact details for the CPA.     
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ONeill on February 25, 2017, 12:44:39 PM
As long as they don't touch the McKenna Cup
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 12:50:54 PM
Quote from: rrhf on February 25, 2017, 07:18:15 AM
The big question is: if they change the name. Could a team like Mayo actually win a super 8 final?

They'd have to change Mayo's name as well.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 25, 2017, 01:06:55 PM
Well if nothing else, let's hope the anger that it's generated spurs those against it into action. The CPA has existed for how long? Why haven't the club players revolted years ago instead of now when an actual shortening of the inter-county season is put in place?

Clubs will get their players earlier in the next three summers. The Super 8 will mean nothing either good or bad to clubs compared to this year. So let's all see what the next step will be.

And three years is a short time when you consider how long there's been a general dissatisfaction with this issue.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on February 25, 2017, 01:07:19 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 12:50:54 PM
Quote from: rrhf on February 25, 2017, 07:18:15 AM
The big question is: if they change the name. Could a team like Mayo actually win a super 8 final?

They'd have to change Mayo's name as well.

Was thinking the same with Meath. Maybe they should have a super 4 Leinster title for them to have a chance of winning one instead of a the tarnished one they won 7 years ago! :)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on February 25, 2017, 01:09:06 PM
Presumably these 3 games will be played weekly.

So, let's say Donegal win Ulster. Then 3 games, let's say Kerry A, Galway H, Kildare in Croke Park. That's an Ulster final, a trip to Kerry and Dublin all within about 3 weeks. If they progress, another trip to Croke Park for a semi final. 5 big games in 6 weeks? At €25+ for a ticket, who's going to afford that?

P Duffy says there's big turnouts for QFs. Yeah, as a one off match! If Donegal lost their first 2 games and are already out before they travel to Croke Park, who the hell's gonna go to that?!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on February 25, 2017, 01:11:30 PM
This year is the last year of my Season ticket renewal! This smacks of feeding the Croke park and the Dublin supporter. The weaker counties who voted for this will gain nothing and deserve to stay where they are for their short sightedness.

THE GRAB ALL ASSOCIATION is definitely living up to its name!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on February 25, 2017, 01:15:00 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on February 25, 2017, 01:11:30 PM
This year is the last year of my Season ticket renewal! This smacks of feeding the Croke park and the Dublin supporter. The weaker counties who voted for this will gain nothing and deserve to stay where they are for their short sightedness.

THE GRAB ALL ASSOCIATION is definitely living up to its name!
You honestly think they could afford to voted against it? The G could also stand for greed.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 01:21:18 PM
I wouldn't be a big fan of this 'players good, officials bad' narrative in the context of this vote.
The officials are the ones who see the accounts and have to keep the show on the road.
If Duffy & Co. dangled a nice juicy carrot in front of them for supporting this, I'd find it hard to blame them for taking a bite of it.
Maybe it won't be the end of the world, we'll have to wait and see how it works in practice.
A lot of hysterical stuff being spouted online this morning.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on February 25, 2017, 01:26:09 PM
Michael Duignan‏@DuignanMichael  18 mi

Congress & its delegates are detached from reality. They're being conned by the commercial arm that now runs the GAA. So sad.  #elitism
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on February 25, 2017, 01:28:11 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 01:21:18 PM
I wouldn't be a big fan of this 'players good, officials bad' narrative in the context of this vote.
The officials are the ones who see the accounts and have to keep the show on the road.
If Duffy & Co. dangled a nice juicy carrot in front of them for supporting this, I'd find it hard to blame them for taking a bite of it.
Maybe it won't be the end of the world, we'll have to wait and see how it works in practice.
A lot of hysterical stuff being spouted online this morning.

Therein lies the problem.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Maroon Manc on February 25, 2017, 01:31:48 PM
I'm not a fan but this is the start of the experiment which if works will see a Champions League type format brought in for everyone which I'd be happy with.

Going to be a very busy July & August for the 2 counties who reach the final next year with 6 games to be played over 8 or 9 weekends. The county with the biggest squad is really going to benefit here, can't think who that is!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 01:38:20 PM
Lads, is this the long con that explains the ongoing relationship with SKY?
Hard to see why they'd be bothered otherwise.
Multiple games running concurrently at the business end of the championship.
They'll be given a big chunk of them to cover, probably with first refusal once they see the match-ups.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on February 25, 2017, 01:40:49 PM
Overall, this appears to be farce. However, it will throw up some deadly fixtures. Think Dublin v Kerry in Kilarney on a warm summers evening or Tyrone v Mayo up in Healy Park. Provincial grounds packed to the rafters for real do-or-die style games.

Doesn't outweigh all the negatives though.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 01:42:21 PM
Meath vs. Kildare in the redeveloped Pairc Tailteann.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: criostlinn on February 25, 2017, 01:49:09 PM
Quote from: seafoid on February 25, 2017, 01:26:09 PM
Michael Duignan‏@DuignanMichael  18 mi

Congress & its delegates are detached from reality. They're being conned by the commercial arm that now runs the GAA. So sad.  #elitism

Did Donald Trump hack into Michael Duignan's twitter account or something
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 01:53:03 PM
They'll have to come up with a different name for it anyway.
'Super 8' is classic Sky Sports nonsense.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Aughafad on February 25, 2017, 01:57:04 PM
With the World Cup in 2018, sky won't give a shit about the super 8 as they'll be on at the same time.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: vallankumous on February 25, 2017, 01:57:13 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 01:38:20 PM
Lads, is this the long con that explains the ongoing relationship with SKY?
Hard to see why they'd be bothered otherwise.
Multiple games running concurrently at the business end of the championship.
They'll be given a big chunk of them to cover, probably with first refusal once they see the match-ups.

Yes, there is only one reason to make these changes. More games at peak times with the bigger Counties. Although it's not only Sky. Not only that but SKY money is your money and the money sucked out of small publicans at extortion rates across small towns and villages. There's also the massive companies that sponsor the top teams. Vodafone, Kerrygroup etc. They all want as much return as possible on their investment. And the GAA have provided.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fuzzman on February 25, 2017, 01:58:37 PM
Provincial winners can only meet in Croker and the Dubs get their home match against a qualifier in Croker too of course so Kerry and Mayo will have to throw their provincial final if they want a home advantage v the Dubs.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 02:02:26 PM
Quote from: Aughafad on February 25, 2017, 01:57:04 PM
With the World Cup in 2018, sky won't give a shit about the super 8 as they'll be on at the same time.

The world cup in 2018 will be covered by a terrestrial channel in Ireland.
They're trying to increase their market share here, and hang onto subscribers over the summer when there's no english soccer on.
GAA coverage is kind of a loss-leader for them.
Actually, do Sky even cover the world cup?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rrhf on February 25, 2017, 02:24:29 PM
Could there now be the split between club and county.
I'm surprised at the gpas position, how did this pass without a secret support even on their side. How many county boards supported this.
This can lead to professionalism quicker.
Will grassroots ignore the county gravy train and attendances fall.
Could be an interesting few years.
I
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on February 25, 2017, 02:25:45 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 01:21:18 PM
I wouldn't be a big fan of this 'players good, officials bad' narrative in the context of this vote.
The officials are the ones who see the accounts and have to keep the show on the road.
If Duffy & Co. dangled a nice juicy carrot in front of them for supporting this, I'd find it hard to blame them for taking a bite of it.
Maybe it won't be the end of the world, we'll have to wait and see how it works in practice.
A lot of hysterical stuff being spouted online this morning.

Yeah, right. Even if it's a bloody disaster, the GAA hierarchy will continue to talk about how great it is, and how well it's working when it plainly isn't. Look at the black card. Vast majority speaking out against it,but they're ignored. Its here to stay.

Now it's here, it's here to stay regardless if everyone man in the country is against it. Move along, nothing to see here.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 02:34:46 PM
Quote from: rrhf on February 25, 2017, 02:24:29 PM
Could there now be the split between club and county.
I'm surprised at the gpas position, how did this pass without a secret support even on their side. How many county boards supported this.
This can lead to professionalism quicker.
Will grassroots ignore the county gravy train and attendances fall.
Could be an interesting few years.
I

What leverage did they bring to bear?
Where was the 'listen to us, or else' attitude of old?
They're bought and paid for at this stage.
If the CPA had got going a year ago, and half the people moaning now had signed up, then there might have been a different outcome.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: vallankumous on February 25, 2017, 02:36:30 PM
Quote from: rrhf on February 25, 2017, 02:24:29 PM
Could there now be the split between club and county.
I'm surprised at the gpas position, how did this pass without a secret support even on their side. How many county boards supported this.
This can lead to professionalism quicker.
Will grassroots ignore the county gravy train and attendances fall.
Could be an interesting few years.
I

There already is a split, it just hasn't been given a name.

I know that I have on occasion been quite happy to see my county team fail to progress. Now there will be times I hope they don't win a Provincial championship or go a distance in the qualifiers.
I think the CPA will react strongly. If only to strngthen themselves. This is the GAA creating a monster they will have to meet head on soon.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 02:41:55 PM
Lot of ill informed hysteria here. It's two rounds of games played within 8 days added to the calendar that's already there. To listen to some posters here hurling has been disbanded, clubs have to play all their games Christmas week and Paraic Duffy is more interested in partying with Jay Z than helping the GAA.

At the very least, this is worth giving a go and unlike the pessimistic soothsayers claims here we can actually review and change it in 2020.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: mrhardyannual on February 25, 2017, 02:45:58 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 01:21:18 PM
I wouldn't be a big fan of this 'players good, officials bad' narrative in the context of this vote.
The officials are the ones who see the accounts and have to keep the show on the road.
If Duffy & Co. dangled a nice juicy carrot in front of them for supporting this, I'd find it hard to blame them for taking a bite of it.
Maybe it won't be the end of the world, we'll have to wait and see how it works in practice.
A lot of hysterical stuff being spouted online this morning.

I couldn't agree more. It's time for a little objectivity here rather than this constant barrage of abuse at county officials. I often disagree with the decision of our county board but to suggest that they are all out of touch with their clubs is unfair as most of them have been, and still are, driving forces within their clubs.

How representative is the CPA? For a "players association" it is front loaded by GAA personalities, ex-managers &  ex-players (Dempsey, Curran, Kernan etc) all or many of whom have been involved in bringing forward alternative proposals for change within the association that have not met with universal support. 

A few points:

Clubs complain of  club matches being postponed etc. during the inter-county season yet the same clubs do nothing about it at county board level. Last year there was near universal disapproval within Mayo at the postponement of the final round of the round-robin section of the county championship. The move was signalled in advance of a county board meeting, all senior and intermediate clubs were affected (32 of 48 clubs) and yet the deferral was agreed by the clubs at the county board. Why?

Clubs complain of the costs involved in competing at club level. The greatest cost involved is in the hiring of professional management and backroom teams (physio, S&C, medical etc). A small band of managers operate on a lucrative circuit around Mayo & Galway. Despite this, county championships have been won by very few teams yet players in all clubs demand these outsiders. Most clubs are up to their eyes in debt and it is not the players who are out fundraising to pay off the debts. Why not?

The majority of those who support GAA inter-county teams have little or no involvement in clubs. The advent of season tickets has exacerbated this as people now have access to tickets without involving themselves in clubs. They are the most vocal when it comes to attacking anybody who would try to curb the incidence of county managers having games called off to "protect" county players. And despite the fact that it hurts their own interests you will find that club players are among this group. Should pressure groups such as county supporters have more say than clubs?

We now have a near-professional approach to the playing of county and club championships while professing to be an amateur organisation. At a recent meeting to look towards a vision of the GAA in 2034 most people attending professed a vision of the GAA as being amateur, having defined programmes of club and county games, an end to the hiring of external coaches/managers, county players playing for their clubs, a reduction of red tape/administration at club level and players playing for the enjoyment of the game rather than the winning of titles. When asked what they thought would be the reality they almost entirely saw the opposite, i.e more professionalism, administration, debt and club football played without their county players. Finally when asked what steps could be taken to make their vision a reality there was a near unanimous silence.

My point is that we lack an agreed vision of what we want in the future. Without this vision we will continue to be reacting to problems rather than planning for the future. We cannot afford a professional game based on a 32 county basis. A rugby-like franchise system with a limited number of teams based around the strongest counties and large urban areas with more than one Dublin based side might work but would struggle to gain acceptance from followers of disenfranchised counties.... yet this is where we are heading. Clubs too need to face up to the reality of what they are..... clubs for the promotion and development of Gaelic Games or semi-professional outfits being run for the benefit of the few by the efforts of many. Until players step up to the mark in contributing to the running of their clubs the CPA will continue to be a mouthpiece for those who want to representation without participation.

I see that John Horan is suggesting a root and branch review of the association on the lines of the McNamee commission. It can't come too soon.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 02:46:34 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 02:41:55 PM
Lot of ill informed hysteria here. It's two rounds of games played within 8 days added to the calendar that's already there. To listen to some posters here hurling has been disbanded, clubs have to play all their games Christmas week and Paraic Duffy is more interested in partying with Jay Z than helping the GAA.

At the very least, this is worth giving a go and unlike the pessimistic soothsayers claims here we can actually re Jew and change it in 2020.

???
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 02:49:26 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 02:46:34 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 02:41:55 PM
Lot of ill informed hysteria here. It's two rounds of games played within 8 days added to the calendar that's already there. To listen to some posters here hurling has been disbanded, clubs have to play all their games Christmas week and Paraic Duffy is more interested in partying with Jay Z than helping the GAA.

At the very least, this is worth giving a go and unlike the pessimistic soothsayers claims here we can actually re Jew and change it in 2020.

Oops, changed that now!
???
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: vallankumous on February 25, 2017, 02:49:53 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 02:41:55 PM
Lot of ill informed hysteria here. It's two rounds of games played within 8 days added to the calendar that's already there. To listen to some posters here hurling has been disbanded, clubs have to play all their games Christmas week and Paraic Duffy is more interested in partying with Jay Z than helping the GAA.

At the very least, this is worth giving a go and unlike the pessimistic soothsayers claims here we can actually re Jew and change it in 2020.

Reductio ad absurdum rather than make a point makes it seem like you have a weak argument.

I wonder why they would propose this? The major thing here is more games for top teams for no reason other than to have more games for top teams. What would be the motivation behind that? Could it be sponsorship or TV deals? If so then is this not a genuine reason to be concerned?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 25, 2017, 02:55:55 PM
Also, in the context of the uproar on social media, if we've learned anything in the last 2 years it is that there is a silent majority who are willing to act and a vocal minority who are happy to just make noise.
The outrage will blow over by Monday.
The powers that be fully understand how this works.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on February 25, 2017, 02:59:28 PM
This had to be passed now, before the CPA became stronger.

The CPA will do nothing about it now. It's the little guy v the corporation.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on February 25, 2017, 03:02:47 PM
Don't think this is a good idea. Like AZ, Rossfan and a few others, I think it's primarily driven by commercial interests rather than anything else.

However, it'll be a huge success in the first few years due to the novelty of it and the quality of the teams involved. I think that will level off in subsequent years as it becomes stale with the same teams competing all the time. The new phrase will be "sure the championship doesn't start properly til the semi finals"

Any talk of it improving the lot of "weaker" counties is rubbish and in fairness, a change in the fixtures calendar isn't the way to improve standards - extra coaches and money is the only way to do that.

What I'd like to see is something like this:

Club season from Jan-mid May, county from mid-may-Sept
League played off first to qualify for the all Ireland series - say top 6 in D1, top 3 in D2, top 2 in 3 and top in D4 or something similar.
Provincials played next since they can't be abolished. Four winners qualify for the all Ireland series (maybe with home adv). Some sort of system to be devised for who replaces teams who've won two spots in the all Ireland series.
Seeded knockout competition from there on in.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 03:06:34 PM
Quote from: vallankumous on February 25, 2017, 02:49:53 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 02:41:55 PM
Lot of ill informed hysteria here. It's two rounds of games played within 8 days added to the calendar that's already there. To listen to some posters here hurling has been disbanded, clubs have to play all their games Christmas week and Paraic Duffy is more interested in partying with Jay Z than helping the GAA.

At the very least, this is worth giving a go and unlike the pessimistic soothsayers claims here we can actually review and change it in 2020.

Reductio ad absurdum rather than make a point makes it seem like you have a weak argument.

I wonder why they would propose this? The major thing here is more games for top teams for no reason other than to have more games for top teams. What would be the motivation behind that? Could it be sponsorship or TV deals? If so then is this not a genuine reason to be concerned?

Well first off the vast majority of people accept what we have doesn't work, secondly the provincials had to be kept so making a change which helps clubs, provincial champions and the promotion and finance of the GAA had to be done on this basis.

It isn't perfect but there isn't a perfect system so why not give this a go rather than complain about the current system yet have no realistic alternative?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 25, 2017, 03:24:27 PM
What difference will this make to Johnny who plays for Aughawillan for example?
A chap who never did and never will get near a County team.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: johnpower on February 25, 2017, 03:30:28 PM
Well good to see some change never thought it would get through
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on February 25, 2017, 03:37:28 PM
Quote from: johnpower on February 25, 2017, 03:30:28 PM
Well good to see some change never thought it would get through

You weren't paying much attention to Duffy's gerrymandering, then.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on February 25, 2017, 03:38:46 PM
Quote from: Maroon Manc on February 25, 2017, 01:31:48 PM
I'm not a fan but this is the start of the experiment which if works will see a Champions League type format brought in for everyone which I'd be happy with.

Going to be a very busy July & August for the 2 counties who reach the final next year with 6 games to be played over 8 or 9 weekends. The county with the biggest squad is really going to benefit here, can't think who that is!

This has Dublin Dominance written all over it! More games in Croker to feed that monster. Professionalism has arrived.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Kuwabatake Sanjuro on February 25, 2017, 04:21:03 PM
2 home games for Dublin every year when the other 7 will only get 1, how will that be fair?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on February 25, 2017, 04:28:33 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on February 25, 2017, 03:38:46 PM
Quote from: Maroon Manc on February 25, 2017, 01:31:48 PM
I'm not a fan but this is the start of the experiment which if works will see a Champions League type format brought in for everyone which I'd be happy with.

Going to be a very busy July & August for the 2 counties who reach the final next year with 6 games to be played over 8 or 9 weekends. The county with the biggest squad is really going to benefit here, can't think who that is!

This has Dublin Dominance written all over it! More games in Croker to feed that monster. Professionalism has arrived.

Once a lot of counties are out of their province the season's over pretty much now for them. There's no carrot on the stick bar multiple drubbings in August for them now. Very disappointing how the GAA has gone from a genuinely amateur organisation to one fixated on profits over the last two decades. People are going to stop bothering and caring in a lot of counties.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 05:22:12 PM
Bringing forward the All-Ireland finals to August while expanding the football championship simply doesn't make sense.

There is going to be a serious squeeze on the calendar.

The hurling championship will be dwarfed by football.

Inevitably hurling will then look to incorporate its own round robin Super 8 or Super 6 series, and then the All-Ireland finals will have to be moved back to their original September dates.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 25, 2017, 05:22:34 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 25, 2017, 03:24:27 PM
What difference will this make to Johnny who plays for Aughawillan for example?
A chap who never did and never will get near a County team.
None.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 05:28:46 PM
Quote from: Kuwabatake Sanjuro on February 25, 2017, 04:21:03 PM
2 home games for Dublin every year when the other 7 will only get 1, how will that be fair?
Dublin play all of their All-Ireland football quarter-finals at Croke Park as it is.

So it'll be going from Dublin having 100% of their quarter-final stage games at home to having 66.666% of their quarter-final stage games at home.

And their opponents will go from having 0% of their quarter-final stage games at home to having 33.333% of them at home.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Aughafad on February 25, 2017, 05:58:59 PM
The only time Dublin will be out of Croke park it'll be against so called weaker teams! Not against Kerry, Cork,Donegal, Mayo or Tyrone. And when they do play one of these teams away from home it'll be when they are weaker
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on February 25, 2017, 06:04:29 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 05:22:12 PM
Bringing forward the All-Ireland finals to August while expanding the football championship simply doesn't make sense.

There is going to be a serious squeeze on the calendar.

The hurling championship will be dwarfed by football.

Inevitably hurling will then look to incorporate its own round robin Super 8 or Super 6 series, and then the All-Ireland finals will have to be moved back to their original September dates.
It's a wonder that hurling counties haven't kicked up about this.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 25, 2017, 06:07:17 PM
Hurling counties wouldn't lower themselves to think about how they should vote on mere football matters.
Anyway it's up to the hurley to re organise their own  little championshipeen.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 06:07:32 PM
A sample calendar for the 2018 inter-county seson may look something like as follows:

April 8: NFL Final
April 15: NHL Final

April 22: Provincial football preliminary rounds
April 29: Provincial football quarter-finals
May 5/6: Provincial football quarter finals, 1 Munster hurling quarter-final
May 12/13: Provincial football quarter-finals/semi-finals, Leinster hurling quarter-finals
May 19/20: Provincial football semi-finals, 1 Munster Hurling semi-final, Football qualifiers Round 1
May 26/27: Provincial football semi-finals,  1 Munster hurling semi-final

Sat June 2: Football qualifiers round 2, Leinster hurling semi-finals
Sun June 3: Munster Football Final, Connacht Football Final
Sat June 9: Football Qualifiers Round 3
Sun June 10: Leinster Football Final, Ulster Football Final
Sat June 16: Hurling Qualifiers Round 1
Sun June 17: Football Qualifiers Round 4
Sun June 24: Munster Hurling Final,  Leinster Hurling Final
Sat June 30: Hurling Qualifiers Round 2

Sun July 1: All-Ireland Football Super 8 Round 1
Sat July 7: All-Ireland Football Super 8 Round 2
Sun July 8: All-Ireland Hurling Quarter-finals
July 14/15: All-Ireland Football Super 8 Round 3
July 21/22: All-Ireland Hurling Semi-Finals
July 28/29: All-Ireland Football Semi-Finals

August 4/5: Nothing*
August 12: All-Ireland Hurling final
August 26: All-Ireland Football final

*Hurling semi-finals will require a three week gap to the final as a two week gap could require a team play an All-Ireland final on its third week out in a row, if there was a semi-final replay.

You can still get replays even with extra-time in the football championship, and they will still happen.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on February 25, 2017, 06:33:54 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 06:07:32 PM
A sample calendar for the 2018 inter-county seson may look something like as follows:

*Hurling semi-finals will require a three week gap to the final as a two week gap could require a team play an All-Ireland final on its third week out in a row, if there was a semi-final replay.

You can still get replays even with extra-time in the football championship, and they will still happen.
April 8: NFL Final
10 April : US rounds up Muslims in internment camps
April 15: NHL Final

April 22: Provincial football preliminary rounds
April 27 : CNN shut down
April 29: Provincial football quarter-finals
May 5/6: Provincial football quarter finals, 1 Munster hurling quarter-final, New York State secedes from US
May 12/13: Provincial football quarter-finals/semi-finals, Leinster hurling quarter-finals, NRA declares war on New York Times
May 19/20: Provincial football semi-finals, 1 Munster Hurling semi-final, Football qualifiers Round 1
US declares tariffs of 100% on French products
May 26/27: Provincial football semi-finals,  1 Munster hurling semi-final

Sat June 2: Football qualifiers round 2, Leinster hurling semi-finals, RNC declares Trump president for life
Sun June 3: Munster Football Final, Connacht Football Final, Congress is burnt down
Sat June 9: Football Qualifiers Round 3 , US Government declares emergency powers
Sun June 10: Leinster Football Final, Ulster Football Final, Whitey admits Trump may be dangerous
Sat June 16: Hurling Qualifiers Round 1
Sun June 17: Football Qualifiers Round 4
Sun June 24: Munster Hurling Final,  Leinster Hurling Final, Mexico is attacked
Sat June 30: Hurling Qualifiers Round 2

Sun July 1: All-Ireland Football Super 8 Round 1, Tariffs of 150% are slapped on Chinese products
Sat July 7: All-Ireland Football Super 8 Round 2, Trump visits North Korea
Sun July 8: All-Ireland Hurling Quarter-finals Mexico war ends
July 14/15: All-Ireland Football Super 8 Round 3
July 21/22: All-Ireland Hurling Semi-Finals
July 28/29: All-Ireland Football Semi-Finals

August 4/5: Nothing* US launches nuclear war against the EU. 
August 12: All-Ireland Hurling final takes place online
August 26: All-Ireland Football final is cancelled
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 06:46:42 PM
Quote from: seafoid on February 25, 2017, 06:33:54 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 06:07:32 PM
A sample calendar for the 2018 inter-county seson may look something like as follows:

*Hurling semi-finals will require a three week gap to the final as a two week gap could require a team play an All-Ireland final on its third week out in a row, if there was a semi-final replay.

You can still get replays even with extra-time in the football championship, and they will still happen.
April 8: NFL Final
10 April : US rounds up Muslims in internment camps
April 15: NHL Final

April 22: Provincial football preliminary rounds
April 27 : CNN shut down
April 29: Provincial football quarter-finals
May 5/6: Provincial football quarter finals, 1 Munster hurling quarter-final, New York State secedes from US
May 12/13: Provincial football quarter-finals/semi-finals, Leinster hurling quarter-finals, NRA declares war on New York Times
May 19/20: Provincial football semi-finals, 1 Munster Hurling semi-final, Football qualifiers Round 1
US declares tariffs of 100% on French products
May 26/27: Provincial football semi-finals,  1 Munster hurling semi-final

Sat June 2: Football qualifiers round 2, Leinster hurling semi-finals, RNC declares Trump president for life
Sun June 3: Munster Football Final, Connacht Football Final, Congress is burnt down
Sat June 9: Football Qualifiers Round 3 , US Government declares emergency powers
Sun June 10: Leinster Football Final, Ulster Football Final, Whitey admits Trump may be dangerous
Sat June 16: Hurling Qualifiers Round 1
Sun June 17: Football Qualifiers Round 4
Sun June 24: Munster Hurling Final,  Leinster Hurling Final, Mexico is attacked
Sat June 30: Hurling Qualifiers Round 2

Sun July 1: All-Ireland Football Super 8 Round 1, Tariffs of 150% are slapped on Chinese products
Sat July 7: All-Ireland Football Super 8 Round 2, Trump visits North Korea
Sun July 8: All-Ireland Hurling Quarter-finals Mexico war ends
July 14/15: All-Ireland Football Super 8 Round 3
July 21/22: All-Ireland Hurling Semi-Finals
July 28/29: All-Ireland Football Semi-Finals

August 4/5: Nothing* US launches nuclear war against the EU. 
August 12: All-Ireland Hurling final takes place online
August 26: All-Ireland Football final is cancelled
You're confusing a lot of 2017 events with 2018 there.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GalwayBayBoy on February 25, 2017, 07:17:24 PM
Not an exact poll or anything but notable how many intercounty players have spoken out against it on Twitter today. Some choice language used and all. Lot of frustration there.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on February 25, 2017, 07:44:28 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on February 25, 2017, 07:17:24 PM
Not an exact poll or anything but notable how many intercounty players have spoken out against it on Twitter today. Some choice language used and all. Lot of frustration there.

Eg
https://twitter.com/JoeBrolly1993
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:10:45 PM
Quote from: hardstation on February 25, 2017, 10:03:01 PM
How does this make the championship better?

The media will be happy.  More games between the big guns to talk and write about.

I'm not against it to be honest but I think it's just change for changes sake.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:19:10 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:10:45 PM
Quote from: hardstation on February 25, 2017, 10:03:01 PM
How does this make the championship better?

The media will be happy.  More games between the big guns to talk and write about.

I'm not against it to be honest but I think it's just change for changes sake.

AZ how do you make that out? You're a defender of the provincials so if you keep them hoe do we improve the format for teams? Are round robin within the provincials? This is far from perfect but it gives provincial winners a second chance, more big games at provincial venues and more high profile games involving the best teams. It doesn't solve all issues but I'm all ears if someone here has the solution.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 10:19:49 PM
I'd much rather have kept the All-Ireland finals in September, and neither am I a fan of the Super 8 concept, but I really don't get this thing about the changes being bad for clubs.

Each county declares that they will start their county championship no earlier than say, the last week in July. That gives ample time for counties to run off their county championships. Club players will have a much greater degree of certainty as regards when their championship campaign begins and can plan holidays accordingly. Even in Dublin, where championships likely still won't begin until the second week of September, it's ample time to run them off compared to this year.

The Dublin county championship actually proves that club championships are more exciting when run off in a short time frame, in my view.


Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ONeill on February 25, 2017, 10:21:03 PM
I think club players were hoping for something that does make a difference to them, not a pretend change that really doesn't affect the majority atall.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:26:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:19:10 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:10:45 PM
Quote from: hardstation on February 25, 2017, 10:03:01 PM
How does this make the championship better?

The media will be happy.  More games between the big guns to talk and write about.

I'm not against it to be honest but I think it's just change for changes sake.



AZ how do you make that out? You're a defender of the provincials so if you keep them hoe do we improve the format for teams? Are round robin within the provincials? This is far from perfect but it gives provincial winners a second chance, more big games at provincial venues and more high profile games involving the best teams. It doesn't solve all issues but I'm all ears if someone here has the solution.

Come on Zulu.  This is popcorn. Big swinging micky. It's a cosmetic change to give more games between big teams.

And as such it is fine. But it's not structural reform.  And its not alleviating any pressures anywhere. In fact I can't see how this doesn't squeeze the accordion more.

I think this is the first step towarda champions league style tiered championships. Then the media partners can spend the entire summer talking about 8 teams and ignoring everyone else.


My preference is for seeded provincial championships based on league finish. And straight knockout
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:26:40 PM
How is this pretend change? I'm sick of hearing people complain but only want a solution that isn't even possible. We can't have a provincial championship and club and county players playing multiple age groups and two codes. That is the simple reality. Stop complaining and layout the solution rather than knock an imperfect solution.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on February 25, 2017, 10:28:10 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 10:19:49 PM
I'd much rather have kept the All-Ireland finals in September, and neither am I a fan of the Super 8 concept, but I really don't get this thing about the changes being bad for clubs.

Each county declares that they will start their county championship no earlier than say, the last week in July. That gives ample time for counties to run off their county championships. Club players will have a much greater degree of certainty as regards when their championship campaign begins and can plan holidays accordingly. Even in Dublin, where championships likely still won't begin until the second week of September, it's ample time to run them off compared to this year.

The Dublin county championship actually proves that club championships are more exciting when run off in a short time frame, in my view.

http://www.dublingaa.ie/competitions/results/107502

For someone talking about the greatness of the Dublin Superclub Championship you don't seem to know when it starts.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:29:25 PM
I told you the solution I'd like.

Also I said I'm not against this I just think it's a sop to the media.

I think you are detached Zulu. Come home
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:30:26 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:26:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:19:10 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:10:45 PM
Quote from: hardstation on February 25, 2017, 10:03:01 PM
How does this make the championship better?

The media will be happy.  More games between the big guns to talk and write about.

I'm not against it to be honest but I think it's just change for changes sake.



AZ how do you make that out? You're a defender of the provincials so if you keep them hoe do we improve the format for teams? Are round robin within the provincials? This is far from perfect but it gives provincial winners a second chance, more big games at provincial venues and more high profile games involving the best teams. It doesn't solve all issues but I'm all ears if someone here has the solution.

Come on Zulu.  This is popcorn. Big swinging micky. It's a cosmetic change to give more games between big teams.

And as such it is fine. But it's not structural reform.  And its not alleviating any pressures anywhere. In fact I can't see how this doesn't squeeze the accordion more.

I think this is the first step towarda champions league style tiered championships. Then the media partners can spend the entire summer talking about 8 teams and ignoring everyone else.


My preference is for seeded provincial championships based on league finish. And straight knockout

What does that even mean? Lets say we accept your solution, and I don't, does that get through congress? This is an imperfect solution based on the parameters set by the counties. Is it not worth a go?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 10:34:17 PM
Quote from: Syferus on February 25, 2017, 10:28:10 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 10:19:49 PM
I'd much rather have kept the All-Ireland finals in September, and neither am I a fan of the Super 8 concept, but I really don't get this thing about the changes being bad for clubs.

Each county declares that they will start their county championship no earlier than say, the last week in July. That gives ample time for counties to run off their county championships. Club players will have a much greater degree of certainty as regards when their championship campaign begins and can plan holidays accordingly. Even in Dublin, where championships likely still won't begin until the second week of September, it's ample time to run them off compared to this year.

The Dublin county championship actually proves that club championships are more exciting when run off in a short time frame, in my view.

http://www.dublingaa.ie/competitions/results/107502

For someone talking about the greatness of the Dublin Superclub Championship you don't seem to know when it starts.
I know when the Dublin club championships begin, mate.

And the new system will give more time for them to be run off.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:34:57 PM
What does what mean?

You've made it clear that you like the big boys clashing at the end of the year, and the more often the better. Fine. To be honest I don't give a shite about the big boys. They are always ok.

You sneer at provincial championships. I don't, I like the, and I think I am in the majority there. So I would like a way, if we have to fix some nebulous problem, to make sure the provincials are part of that.


I find your attitude on this very condescending.

And again, I've said several times I'm not against this, I just think it's a bit of window dressing.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:37:05 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:29:25 PM
I told you the solution I'd like.

Also I said I'm not against this I just think it's a sop to the media.

I think you are detached Zulu. Come home

I know you think it's a sop to the media but I completely disagree. Your solution isn't the same as wobblers or mine yet we are all genuine GAA men so how do we come up with a solution that we all agree? We can't. This is a modest change that has multiple benefits yet to listen to some of the criticism you'd think the GAA has been banned. It's complete shite.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:39:36 PM
I think you are foisting your frustrations with other posters on me. I said, sigh, I'm not against this. All I said is its neither fish nor fowl. I mean what exactly is it other than more games to sell to customers and media.

But again, it's grand. Let's see how it goes, I'm sure the games will be interesting and novel.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:44:08 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:34:57 PM
What does what mean?

You've made it clear that you like the big boys clashing at the end of the year, and the more often the better. Fine. To be honest I don't give a shite about the big boys. They are always ok.

You sneer at provincial championships. I don't, I like the, and I think I am in the majority there. So I would like a way, if we have to fix some nebulous problem, to make sure the provincials are part of that.


I find your attitude on this very condescending.

And again, I've said several times I'm not against this, I just think it's a bit of window dressing.

AZ, you're a good poster but when you accuse me of being condensing while saying I'm all about seeing the big boys clashing, well just say that's nonsense. Neither do I sneer at provincials, I just think they are central to our problems. Please put forward a proposal where the provincials are central to a format where weaker teams are helped and the sport is promoted?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on February 25, 2017, 10:48:29 PM
The central problem is the money and the coaching it provides and the GAA's unwillingness to split a county that is the size of most of the rest of the country combined because it's a cash cow, and well you know it Zulu.

I'd have thought you'd be out celebrating a Dublin president and an elitist addition to the championship calendar..
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ONeill on February 25, 2017, 10:49:13 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:34:57 PM
What does what mean?

You've made it clear that you like the big boys clashing at the end of the year, and the more often the better. Fine. To be honest I don't give a shite about the big boys. They are always ok.

You sneer at provincial championships. I don't, I like the, and I think I am in the majority there. So I would like a way, if we have to fix some nebulous problem, to make sure the provincials are part of that.



I detest the provincials. In 100 years, our grandchildren will be laughing that, in sport, there was a competition which saw 4 competitions - one with 9 teams, one with 7 although two of them weren't in Ireland, another with 6 and another with 12 teams, to reach the same stage and some teams in the smaller groupings played less than others in it. And some teams played 4 games, without replays, to reach the quarter finals and others played 2 to do the same. But people liked it cos it was traditional.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: clarshack on February 25, 2017, 10:53:27 PM
This format will be similar to what the champions league was like when it started back in 1991/1992. The champions league back then had some qualifying rounds, then 2 groups of 4 teams then the winners of each group met in the final. I wonder where the GAA will be in 10 years time...
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:55:54 PM
Quote from: ONeill on February 25, 2017, 10:49:13 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:34:57 PM
What does what mean?

You've made it clear that you like the big boys clashing at the end of the year, and the more often the better. Fine. To be honest I don't give a shite about the big boys. They are always ok.

You sneer at provincial championships. I don't, I like the, and I think I am in the majority there. So I would like a way, if we have to fix some nebulous problem, to make sure the provincials are part of that.



I detest the provincials. In 100 years, our grandchildren will be laughing that, in sport, there was a competition which saw 4 competitions - one with 9 teams, one with 7 although two of them weren't in Ireland, another with 6 and another with 12 teams, to reach the same stage and some teams in the smaller groupings played less than others in it. And some teams played 4 games, without replays, to reach the quarter finals and others played 2 to do the same. But people liked it cos it was traditional.

Fair enough, I like them. And I like them because it gives mid tier teams a somewhat realistic target every year, and high stakes games against close rivals.

I'd have no problem with 4 8 team provincials though. North South East and West.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:57:21 PM
Quote from: Syferus on February 25, 2017, 10:48:29 PM
The central problem is the money and the coaching it provides and the GAA's unwillingness to split a county that is the size of most of the rest of the country combined because it's a cash cow, and well you know it Zulu.

I'd have thought you'd be out celebrating a Dublin president and an elitist addition to the championship calendar..

Syferus, you come across as a genuine passionate GAA man but you talk some shite. Just try to talk some sense and we might be able to discuss these things.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on February 25, 2017, 10:58:23 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:55:54 PM
Quote from: ONeill on February 25, 2017, 10:49:13 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:34:57 PM
What does what mean?

You've made it clear that you like the big boys clashing at the end of the year, and the more often the better. Fine. To be honest I don't give a shite about the big boys. They are always ok.

You sneer at provincial championships. I don't, I like the, and I think I am in the majority there. So I would like a way, if we have to fix some nebulous problem, to make sure the provincials are part of that.



I detest the provincials. In 100 years, our grandchildren will be laughing that, in sport, there was a competition which saw 4 competitions - one with 9 teams, one with 7 although two of them weren't in Ireland, another with 6 and another with 12 teams, to reach the same stage and some teams in the smaller groupings played less than others in it. And some teams played 4 games, without replays, to reach the quarter finals and others played 2 to do the same. But people liked it cos it was traditional.

Fair enough, I like them. And I like them because it gives mid tier teams a somewhat realistic target every year, and high stakes games against close rivals.

I'd have no problem with 4 8 team provincials though. North South East and West.

It would only make sense if all teams had similar budgets and halfways comparable populations. Trying to make one aspect of the GAA fair while leaving a more massive inbalance elsewhere is the definition of skin-deep change.

This year's changes barely amounts to painting the pig's eyelashes with mascara.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:58:44 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:44:08 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:34:57 PM
What does what mean?

You've made it clear that you like the big boys clashing at the end of the year, and the more often the better. Fine. To be honest I don't give a shite about the big boys. They are always ok.

You sneer at provincial championships. I don't, I like the, and I think I am in the majority there. So I would like a way, if we have to fix some nebulous problem, to make sure the provincials are part of that.


I find your attitude on this very condescending.

And again, I've said several times I'm not against this, I just think it's a bit of window dressing.

AZ, you're a good poster but when you accuse me of being condensing while saying I'm all about seeing the big boys clashing, well just say that's nonsense. Neither do I sneer at provincials, I just think they are central to our problems. Please put forward a proposal where the provincials are central to a format where weaker teams are helped and the sport is promoted?

You don't sneer at provincials, you would just get rid of them in the morning, thanks for clarifying.

Provincial championships, seeded such that weaker teams play each other in earlier rounds, with seedings based in league final position. No back doors,no qualifiers.

That would be fundamental reform, but so simple to do.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:59:07 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:55:54 PM
Quote from: ONeill on February 25, 2017, 10:49:13 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:34:57 PM
What does what mean?

You've made it clear that you like the big boys clashing at the end of the year, and the more often the better. Fine. To be honest I don't give a shite about the big boys. They are always ok.

You sneer at provincial championships. I don't, I like the, and I think I am in the majority there. So I would like a way, if we have to fix some nebulous problem, to make sure the provincials are part of that.



I detest the provincials. In 100 years, our grandchildren will be laughing that, in sport, there was a competition which saw 4 competitions - one with 9 teams, one with 7 although two of them weren't in Ireland, another with 6 and another with 12 teams, to reach the same stage and some teams in the smaller groupings played less than others in it. And some teams played 4 games, without replays, to reach the quarter finals and others played 2 to do the same. But people liked it cos it was traditional.

Fair enough, I like them. And I like them because it gives mid tier teams a somewhat realistic target every year, and high stakes games against close rivals.

I'd have no problem with 4 8 team provincials though. North South East and West.

It doesn't do that though and it certainly isn't the only format that can do that.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Itchy on February 25, 2017, 11:00:54 PM
Can someone explain to me as i am obviously stupid, how does this help club players throughout Ireland?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 11:01:13 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:26:40 PM
How is this pretend change? I'm sick of hearing people complain but only want a solution that isn't even possible. We can't have a provincial championship and club and county players playing multiple age groups and two codes. That is the simple reality. Stop complaining and layout the solution rather than knock an imperfect solution.
For certainty for club players to be achieved as regards when their championship games are, the inter-county deck has to be effectively cleared for the year.

If club championship games are to be played during a county's involvement in the inter-county championship, there can never be any certainty as to when these club games will be. Your county could be playing in a provincial final, they could be playing in the qualifiers.

But you won't know in advance when the county will be playing (at least once the first provincial game is over) so you can't plan with certainty as to when to schedule club championship games.

This plan at least gives certainty.

Club league games go ahead without county players. This is generally the case as it is. There can now be certainty over this and about planning ordinary club league games without county players.

County Championships in all counties should begin no earlier than the last week in July, which will be the case in most counties as most counties will have no involvement in the inter-county championships beyond late July. There should be now certainty over this.











Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 11:01:21 PM
Quote from: Syferus on February 25, 2017, 10:58:23 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:55:54 PM
Quote from: ONeill on February 25, 2017, 10:49:13 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:34:57 PM
What does what mean?

You've made it clear that you like the big boys clashing at the end of the year, and the more often the better. Fine. To be honest I don't give a shite about the big boys. They are always ok.

You sneer at provincial championships. I don't, I like the, and I think I am in the majority there. So I would like a way, if we have to fix some nebulous problem, to make sure the provincials are part of that.



I detest the provincials. In 100 years, our grandchildren will be laughing that, in sport, there was a competition which saw 4 competitions - one with 9 teams, one with 7 although two of them weren't in Ireland, another with 6 and another with 12 teams, to reach the same stage and some teams in the smaller groupings played less than others in it. And some teams played 4 games, without replays, to reach the quarter finals and others played 2 to do the same. But people liked it cos it was traditional.

Fair enough, I like them. And I like them because it gives mid tier teams a somewhat realistic target every year, and high stakes games against close rivals.

I'd have no problem with 4 8 team provincials though. North South East and West.

It would only make sense if all teams had similar budgets and halfways comparable populations. Trying to make one aspect of the GAA fair while leaving a more massive inbalance elsewhere is the definition of skin-deep change.

This year's changes barely amounts to painting the pig's eyelashes with mascara.

That is the elephant in the room. The provinces get more inequitable as the big budget teams in each, bar Ulster so far, pull away from the others. But to solve that by removing the provinces is the definition of solving the wrong problem.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 11:02:27 PM
Quote from: Itchy on February 25, 2017, 11:00:54 PM
Can someone explain to me as i am obviously stupid, how does this help club players throughout Ireland?

This proposal does nothing. The other two which moved the All Ireland forward are good and worthy.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 11:04:53 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 11:01:13 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:26:40 PM
How is this pretend change? I'm sick of hearing people complain but only want a solution that isn't even possible. We can't have a provincial championship and club and county players playing multiple age groups and two codes. That is the simple reality. Stop complaining and layout the solution rather than knock an imperfect solution.
For certainty for club players to be achieved as regards when their championship games are, the inter-county deck has to be effectively cleared for the year.

If club championship games are to be played during a county's involvement in the inter-county championship, there can never be any certainty as to when these club games will be. Your county could be playing in a provincial final, they could be playing in the qualifiers.

But you won't know in advance when the county will be playing (at least once the first provincial game is over) so you can't plan with certainty as to when to schedule club championship games.

This plan at least gives certainty.

Club league games go ahead without county players. This is generally the case as it is. There can now be certainty over this and about planning ordinary club league games without county players.

County Championships in all counties should begin no earlier than the last week in July, which will be the case in most counties as most counties will have no involvement in the inter-county championships beyond late July. There should be now certainty over this.

Sid all of that could have been achieved without the Super 8 motion, which is why I say that the super 8 is just window dressing to placate media and corporate partners.

I fully support the initiative to shorten the season.

I don't really understand the hostility to the Super 8 either mind you.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 11:06:36 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:58:44 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:44:08 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 10:34:57 PM
What does what mean?

You've made it clear that you like the big boys clashing at the end of the year, and the more often the better. Fine. To be honest I don't give a shite about the big boys. They are always ok.

You sneer at provincial championships. I don't, I like the, and I think I am in the majority there. So I would like a way, if we have to fix some nebulous problem, to make sure the provincials are part of that.


I find your attitude on this very condescending.

And again, I've said several times I'm not against this, I just think it's a bit of window dressing.

AZ, you're a good poster but when you accuse me of being condensing while saying I'm all about seeing the big boys clashing, well just say that's nonsense. Neither do I sneer at provincials, I just think they are central to our problems. Please put forward a proposal where the provincials are central to a format where weaker teams are helped and the sport is promoted?

You don't sneer at provincials, you would just get rid of them in the morning, thanks for clarifying.

Provincial championships, seeded such that weaker teams play each other in earlier rounds, with seedings based in league final position. No back doors,no qualifiers.

That would be fundamental reform, but so simple to do.

Why would Waterford, Carlow, Wicklow want to play each other early so they could get beaten by the same teams they always got beaten by?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 11:09:17 PM
Sure why should they bother at all? They seem to like it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on February 25, 2017, 11:11:53 PM
Mayo this year were beaten by Galway.

Game 1 Mayo v Galway


They then went on to play

Game 2  v Fermanagh
Game 3 v Kildare
Game 4 v Westmeath

So then i presume we'd have this group stage of the Super 8

Tipp
Galway
Mayo
Tyrone

So games for Mayo would be


Game 5 Mayo v Galway
Game 6 Mayo v Tipp
Game 7 Mayo v Tyrone

So we'll presume Mayo top the group and play the Runner up of the other group

Game 8 Mayo v Kerry

And if then they win that of course you have

Game 9 Dublin in the final.

Game 10 the Replay


Thoughts

10 games to win an AI in the Mayo example above. Probably more if you are an Ulster team who wins a Preliminary round and loses a Quater final in the Ulster Championship.


I have to say Mayo were stretched after the Fermanagh/Kildare/Westmeath games coming into their game against Tyrone. Imagine having those hurdles and then asked to proceed onto the Tyrone/Tipp/Galway games before you see a semi final.

Under the new set-up could Mayo lose twice and win an AI?

Under the new set-up (and using the above example) could Mayo lose twice to Galway and win an AI?

Do Dublin Get to play ALL there Super 8 games in Croker?

Will teams throw games not to meet Dublin in a semi-final?

What happens where you have two teams with nothing to play for in the final game of the Super 8 round robin?

What happens when you have one team with something to play for and another with nothing to play for in the final game of the Super 8 round robin?

What happens when you have one team with something to play for and another with nothing to play for in the final game of the Super 8 round robin and another team depends on a result from the team who has nothing to play for?

















Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 11:12:30 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 11:04:53 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 11:01:13 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:26:40 PM
How is this pretend change? I'm sick of hearing people complain but only want a solution that isn't even possible. We can't have a provincial championship and club and county players playing multiple age groups and two codes. That is the simple reality. Stop complaining and layout the solution rather than knock an imperfect solution.
For certainty for club players to be achieved as regards when their championship games are, the inter-county deck has to be effectively cleared for the year.

If club championship games are to be played during a county's involvement in the inter-county championship, there can never be any certainty as to when these club games will be. Your county could be playing in a provincial final, they could be playing in the qualifiers.

But you won't know in advance when the county will be playing (at least once the first provincial game is over) so you can't plan with certainty as to when to schedule club championship games.

This plan at least gives certainty.

Club league games go ahead without county players. This is generally the case as it is. There can now be certainty over this and about planning ordinary club league games without county players.

County Championships in all counties should begin no earlier than the last week in July, which will be the case in most counties as most counties will have no involvement in the inter-county championships beyond late July. There should be now certainty over this.

Sid all of that could have been achieved without the Super 8 motion, which is why I say that the super 8 is just window dressing to placate media and corporate partners.

I fully support the initiative to shorten the season.

I don't really understand the hostility to the Super 8 either mind you.

The Super 8 does two things. It makes it more difficult to organise the inter-county calendar. the start of the championship will be pushed back almost on top of the league. The inter county calendar will now run effectively non-stop from the start of January to the end of August.

It is also a way to make up for the shortfall which will come from the smaller amount of replays, which have been a big money spinner and driver of media publicity for the GAA over the years, eg. the Dublin-Mayo replay in 2015 and the Kerry Mayo replay in 2014.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 11:13:24 PM
I'm asking because you are criticising the new system. I think the current system is  a disaster and the new one falls short but I support the new one because it is better. You seem to be against both.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 11:13:47 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 11:12:30 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 11:04:53 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 25, 2017, 11:01:13 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 10:26:40 PM
How is this pretend change? I'm sick of hearing people complain but only want a solution that isn't even possible. We can't have a provincial championship and club and county players playing multiple age groups and two codes. That is the simple reality. Stop complaining and layout the solution rather than knock an imperfect solution.
For certainty for club players to be achieved as regards when their championship games are, the inter-county deck has to be effectively cleared for the year.

If club championship games are to be played during a county's involvement in the inter-county championship, there can never be any certainty as to when these club games will be. Your county could be playing in a provincial final, they could be playing in the qualifiers.

But you won't know in advance when the county will be playing (at least once the first provincial game is over) so you can't plan with certainty as to when to schedule club championship games.

This plan at least gives certainty.

Club league games go ahead without county players. This is generally the case as it is. There can now be certainty over this and about planning ordinary club league games without county players.

County Championships in all counties should begin no earlier than the last week in July, which will be the case in most counties as most counties will have no involvement in the inter-county championships beyond late July. There should be now certainty over this.

Sid all of that could have been achieved without the Super 8 motion, which is why I say that the super 8 is just window dressing to placate media and corporate partners.

I fully support the initiative to shorten the season.

I don't really understand the hostility to the Super 8 either mind you.

The Super 8 does two things. It makes it more difficult to organise the calendar. the start of the championship will be pushed back almost on top of the league. The inter county calendar will now run effectively non-stop from the start of January to the end of August.

It is also a way to make up for the shortfall which will come from the smaller amount of replays, which have been a big money spinner and driver of media publicity for the GAA over the years, eg. the Dublin-Mayo replay in 2015 and the Kerry Mayo replay in 2014.

Never thought of it in terms of making up replay shortfall. Good point.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 11:14:47 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 11:13:24 PM
I'm asking because you are criticising the new system. I think the current system is  a disaster and the new one falls short but I support the new one because it is better. You seem to be against both.

Jesus. Will you read what I wrote 😀 I said I'm NOT against the new change. I just don't see much difference in it in real terms.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on February 25, 2017, 11:16:51 PM
Bunker, Mayo could actually lose 3 times and still win an AI...if they were drawn against Laois, and they still hadn't learnt to count.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 11:18:19 PM
I saw you're not against it but you still seem to be complaining about it!! It isn't perfect but worth a try, can we agree on that???!!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 11:21:43 PM
I don't think I'm complaining about it. You should see me when I start complaining! All I said is I didn't really see the point of it, other than as an update to the product offered to media and sponsors.

I'm more than willing to see what happens with it, I never said otherwise. So yes, we can agree on that. Stand down to Defcon 4. 😀
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 11:30:32 PM
Quote from: hardstation on February 25, 2017, 11:29:42 PM
AZ, I'm not sure why you're trying to turn people against this change when you haven't offered any decent alternative.

😀
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 11:30:45 PM
Ok.

Point 1. Provincial winners get a second chance

Point 2. More high profile games

Point 3. No easy paths to All Ireland SF

Point 4. Big games at local venues giving families a better opportunity to see games
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on February 25, 2017, 11:31:56 PM
Quote from: hardstation on February 25, 2017, 11:29:42 PM
AZ, I'm not sure why you're trying to turn people against this change when you haven't offered any decent alternative.

There's not many left to turn against it in the first place.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 11:34:53 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 11:30:45 PM
Ok.

Point 1. Provincial winners get a second chance - Fair enough but that was never a big issue to me.

Point 2. More high profile games - Agreed. I think this is actually point 1.

Point 3. No easy paths to All Ireland SF - granted.

Point 4. Big games at local venues giving families a better opportunity to see games - ok but again, wasn't a big issue to me.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 11:40:32 PM
So you agree, this is good?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 25, 2017, 11:45:31 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 11:40:32 PM
So you agree, this is good?

Are you rising me now? I'm not against it. I have no meas on points 1 or 4 and I think point 2 is the main point.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 26, 2017, 12:03:22 AM
Not rising and I know you are not against more high profile games but I'm struggling to find what you're against. You're for the provincials and more games for the weaker teams, if so, how do we do that?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 26, 2017, 12:07:49 AM
Quote from: Zulu on February 26, 2017, 12:03:22 AM
Not rising and I know you are not against more high profile games but I'm struggling to find what you're against. You're for the provincials and more games for the weaker teams, if so, how do we do that?

I'm NOT against it. How many times do I have to say that?  As far as I'm concerned its just a few extra games after the provincials, so rock on.

And also, where did I say I'm for more games for the weaker teams? Sure I'd do away with the qualifiers.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on February 26, 2017, 12:10:05 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on February 25, 2017, 11:16:51 PM
Bunker, Mayo could actually lose 3 times and still win an AI...if they were drawn against Laois, and they still hadn't learnt to count.

Sweet Jehovah, it gets worse!  ;D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 26, 2017, 12:17:56 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 26, 2017, 12:07:49 AM
Quote from: Zulu on February 26, 2017, 12:03:22 AM
Not rising and I know you are not against more high profile games but I'm struggling to find what you're against. You're for the provincials and more games for the weaker teams, if so, how do we do that?

I'm NOT against it. How many times do I have to say that?  As far as I'm concerned its just a few extra games after the provincials, so rock on.

And also, where did I say I'm for more games for the weaker teams? Sure I'd do away with the qualifiers.

Ok, so you are for this? Why do away with the qualifiers?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 26, 2017, 12:25:21 AM
I don't like the qualifiers because weak teams just get hammered twice, and mid tier teams who catch a bigger team should be knocking them out. Kerry losing to Cork, and then getting further than them in the AI series doesn't sit right with me. I think it has diluted the intensity of the provincial games. there's a safety valve and the supporters know this too.

As for this proposal, it's not something I'd have bothered suggesting, and I still think it was suggested for financial reasons rather than competiton reasons, but it's worth giving a chance. Yeah. I certainly don't see it as Armageddon like others seem to.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on February 26, 2017, 12:34:36 AM
Quote from: Zulu on February 25, 2017, 11:30:45 PM
Ok.

Point 1. Provincial winners get a second chance And back door losers get a third chance

Point 2. More high profile games Also the chance of a weak team getting three tankings!

Point 3. No easy paths to All Ireland SF In theory, until you see Kerrys group! :P

Point 4. Big games at local venues giving families a better opportunity to see games. Can you honestly see games involving Dublin being played outside Croker?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 26, 2017, 12:39:27 AM
What is it we want here?

Do we want a championship system where the weaker inter-county teams get more games?
Do we want to see big inter-county teams playing more games against each other?
Do we want to keep the provincial championships?
Do we want club championship matches to be played throughout the summer?
Do we want county teams to release players for club games during the inter-county championships?
Do we want county teams to prepare without interference as managers would want?
Do we want county players to play club league games?
Do we want players to be able to play both football and hurling?
Do we want the GAA to have high profile matches throughout the year?
Do we want additional revenue to distribute to clubs?
Do we want a gap of at least two weeks between rounds of the inter-county championships?
Do we want to play off the All-Ireland club championships in the calendar year?
Do we want to deprive club players their day in Croke Park on St. Patrick's Day?
Do we want a club fixture list with certainty?

Because we can't have all of these things. Many of them are in direct conflict.


Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 26, 2017, 12:45:06 AM
That's my point all along. What problem is it we are trying to solve. A lot of people say there is definitely a problem, but there's not much consensus on what it is.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RealSpiritof98 on February 26, 2017, 03:28:45 AM
Why is it now all about giving these teams ''a season''. They are representing their county, they are what WE the club's are putting forward as our best team. if we/they get beat after 1 game then so be it, why did having to accommodate lengthy pre -seasons/preparations for all be the prerogative of a 'season'. The best teams rise to the top most times but the brutal and wonderful but most rewarding end of sport is knock out competition period!!!!!! and its what the legends of our game are made of. Time to get back to the root of our games and stop pandering to the commercial aspect as these people want to solely make money on the back of our games. Unlike many PROFESSIONAL SPORTS that rely on massive income our game will always survive  and us (the people) can actually do something about it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on February 26, 2017, 08:56:02 AM
Where will the Champions League money go?
Presumably more exposure will mean higher sponsorship income
Meaning  players will want more nutritional subsidies
But GF is a mess

Will the Super 8 help Kerry beat Dublin?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Itchy on February 26, 2017, 10:31:32 AM
I read a lot of anger on social media and my own club have been very vocal on twitter condemning these motions. There is a strange disconnect between ordinary members being mostly against (anecdotally) yet delegates and county boards being overwhelmingly for. Leave that aside for now, this is a huge 2 fingers up to the players, both club and county. As a club volunteer and coach I am primarily concerned with the club scene. I can see a strike of sorts on the cards here - in fact I would recommend one!

I would suggest that all players should go to the next monthly meeting of the club and mandate them not to pay their county board fees. If every club in Ireland does that the delegates wont be long listening to them. It seems money rules everything in the GAA and it is sad to see the first president from my own county making such a disgrace of himself overseeing this mess.

Edit - breaking  http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gpa-will-respond-strongly-to-super-8-snub-says-earley-778890.html
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on February 26, 2017, 11:26:57 AM
When the POA is calling it elitist you know there is something seriously wrong.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on February 26, 2017, 11:50:41 AM
Na uasal agus íseal ach thuas seal agus thíos seal. Especially in GAA. Mayo might get another year or 2 out of the team they have now.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 26, 2017, 12:55:13 PM
The more I look at this, the more the "outrage" of club players appears to be built around absolutely nothing.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 26, 2017, 01:11:08 PM
Regardless of how I feel about it myself, it's abundantly clear that a significant proportion of the outrage is just noise, i.e. 'People are giving out about something, I'll join in otherwise I'll feel left out."
It doesn't take much effort to tweet about the 'Grab All Association' and how they're a 'DISGRACE!'.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 26, 2017, 01:21:43 PM
Where did this statistic come from? Sounds like nonsense.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/radical-reform-gets-green-light-in-bloodless-congress-victory-35482934.html

Since the qualifiers were introduced in 2001:
Quote
On average it took seven games for a team to win an All-Ireland senior football championship over 21 weeks. The new system would have nine rounds over 18 weeks.

Dublin played their first game on June 4 last year. Their last game was on October 1. That's 18 weeks, and that's with a replay in the final. No team has ever taken 21 weeks to complete their All-Ireland winning programme of fixtures since the qualifiers were introduced, as far as I'm aware.

Tyrone took 20 weeks to win the 2003 All-Ireland (May 18-September 28), and that's the longest time frame I can think of.

Tyrone 2005 and Donegal 2012 took 19 weeks respectively, but most other All-Ireland winning campaigns lasted around 16 weeks.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on February 26, 2017, 01:25:46 PM
September will have to be added to the list of months with nothing interesting happening
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 26, 2017, 01:29:43 PM
Quote from: seafoid on February 26, 2017, 01:25:46 PM
September will have to be added to the list of months with nothing interesting happening
While I sometimes think the first night of winter is the night University Challenge returns to BBC 2 in the second week of July, I generally think of the night of the All-Ireland football final as the actual first night of winter.

So winter will begin in August, now.

Keith Duggan has a lovely piece in yesterday's Irish Times re. same.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 26, 2017, 01:34:19 PM
It took us 56 weeks to get to the the All-Ireland final in '91.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 26, 2017, 01:35:40 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on February 26, 2017, 01:34:19 PM
It took us 56 weeks to get to the the All-Ireland final in '91.
That was balanced out by a 1 week campaign in 1992.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 26, 2017, 01:40:38 PM
We needed the break.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sam03/05 on February 26, 2017, 03:56:21 PM
Surely these proposals will actually be good for club football
Yes there will be a lot of county games in July / August
But that's no different from now. ( with most of the weaker counties knocked out by that stage anyway) 
The fact that the season is over the last week in August
Allows the club season to effectively be played in September / October / November
Surely that is a much better alternative than what's in place now.

Also the Dubs will have to play two championship games away from Croke Park
Which will add a lot of interesting games. The likes of Kerry won't have a cake walk to the
Final every year oi they had to go away to Ballybofey or somewhere.
The only thing that's missing is atwo tiered structure with the second tier  playing final at All Ire final.
Overall I think it's actually a better deal for club players
As the club championships will take place in sept/ Oct/ Dec no matter what

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on February 26, 2017, 04:22:42 PM
None of those games are terribly interesting. Dublin could play those teams on an inflatable raft with 14 men and probably still win.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on February 26, 2017, 04:37:38 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 26, 2017, 01:29:43 PM
Quote from: seafoid on February 26, 2017, 01:25:46 PM
September will have to be added to the list of months with nothing interesting happening
While I sometimes think the first night of winter is the night University Challenge returns to BBC 2 in the second week of July, I generally think of the night of the All-Ireland football final as the actual first night of winter.

So winter will begin in August, now.

Keith Duggan has a lovely piece in yesterday's Irish Times re. same.

I think the Rose of Tralee will be the official end of summer now
There is such a finality to the end of the football final. It's such a long grey time until TSG cranks up again. 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fuzzman on February 27, 2017, 10:11:26 AM
Sam 03/05, usually the Dubs get a 1/4 final, semifinal and AI final in Croker
Now they get 2 of their group matches in croker and one away so basically an extra game in Croker before the semi and final meaning an extra large payout for the GAA.

It sounds like the GPA are saying the county players don't want all these extra matches in July & August but were never consulted.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Scarlet on February 27, 2017, 10:12:35 AM
Quote from: Itchy on February 26, 2017, 10:31:32 AM
I read a lot of anger on social media and my own club have been very vocal on twitter condemning these motions. There is a strange disconnect between ordinary members being mostly against (anecdotally) yet delegates and county boards being overwhelmingly for. Leave that aside for now, this is a huge 2 fingers up to the players, both club and county. As a club volunteer and coach I am primarily concerned with the club scene. I can see a strike of sorts on the cards here - in fact I would recommend one!

I would suggest that all players should go to the next monthly meeting of the club and mandate them not to pay their county board fees. If every club in Ireland does that the delegates wont be long listening to them. It seems money rules everything in the GAA and it is sad to see the first president from my own county making such a disgrace of himself overseeing this mess.

Edit - breaking  http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gpa-will-respond-strongly-to-super-8-snub-says-earley-778890.html

This is a key key thing. If a county man walks into a local club meeting when prior to this being up decision at county board level and really makes his case the club will be swayed to in turn vote against it at county convention, then it would have been defeated.
There is already a mechanism in the GAA that could have stopped the Super 8s. No point Tweeting anger all day and saying the GAA don't listen when there was no effort to engage in the channels that are already there.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on February 27, 2017, 10:58:55 AM
With most things these days or any kind of change I do think the reaction has been over the top. It won't finish club football or lead to professionalism etc. I said before I do think a split in the season for county players is needed and maybe this is a move towards that. Judging by an earlier draft schedule for next year (I'm not sure how official it was) 30 counties will finish up by the end of July. Does that not lead to enough time for county players to be available for the most important club games?

Club football and scheduling has to be looked at and this definitely adds to the urgency needed to look at it. In Tyrone (county I have most knowledge off) there is 15 club league games followed by relegation/promotion play offs and a straight knockout championship. There is 3 divisions of 16 with division one teams entering senior championship, division 2 intermediate and division 3 junior. County players are available for 10 of the league games plus the play offs and championships. What usually happens is the first 7 or so games with the county players get played by late June/early July and the 5 starred games are used quick enough. This then leads to weeks of inactivity waiting for Tyrone to finish up. Then its a struggle to get the remaining 3 league games played plus the championship and league play off games.

The new system could make it even harder as there will be less room in the calendar in April/May/June for league games. So county boards should be thinking about what would work best.

If it was up to me I'd change the structures in Tyrone. I'd have a league that runs from April to end of July which doesn't determine the championship you play in and the dates are set in stone and played whether county players are free or not. I'd do the leagues on a regional basis split by senior/intermediate so the games are local games with less travelling and play them on a Friday night to suit the club players. A lot of derbies and great prep for the championship with it being run off before it.

Then from start of August have the championship which would have a league element. There's 16 teams at senior level so split them into 2 groups of 8 (some kind of seeding to avoid all strong teams in one group - maybe based on earlier regional leagues). 7 games with county players available for them all. Played until 3rd week in September. Top 4 teams make the quarter finals to be played off in October. Bottom teams relegated to next division and second from bottom involved in a play off (same week quarter finals played).

County players would be available for all games that determine your championship status and its less games to fit in with them than the current requirement. There'd be regular football for club players from April to July with lots of local derbies acting as great prep for the championship and a good stand alone comp. And the benefit of Friday night games to avoid taking up the weekends.

The one big potential flaw in my system is if Tyrone got to the All Ireland final in 3rd week of August. But surely for most counties thinking outside the box a little could lead to a far better structure and less reliance on county fixtures to determine games. And most counties wont get to the All Ireland final so will have a minimum of 3 months to get games played with county players.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: LeoMc on February 27, 2017, 01:36:15 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on February 27, 2017, 10:58:55 AM
With most things these days or any kind of change I do think the reaction has been over the top. It won't finish club football or lead to professionalism etc. I said before I do think a split in the season for county players is needed and maybe this is a move towards that. Judging by an earlier draft schedule for next year (I'm not sure how official it was) 30 counties will finish up by the end of July. Does that not lead to enough time for county players to be available for the most important club games?

Club football and scheduling has to be looked at and this definitely adds to the urgency needed to look at it. In Tyrone (county I have most knowledge off) there is 15 club league games followed by relegation/promotion play offs and a straight knockout championship. There is 3 divisions of 16 with division one teams entering senior championship, division 2 intermediate and division 3 junior. County players are available for 10 of the league games plus the play offs and championships. What usually happens is the first 7 or so games with the county players get played by late June/early July and the 5 starred games are used quick enough. This then leads to weeks of inactivity waiting for Tyrone to finish up. Then its a struggle to get the remaining 3 league games played plus the championship and league play off games.

The new system could make it even harder as there will be less room in the calendar in April/May/June for league games. So county boards should be thinking about what would work best.

If it was up to me I'd change the structures in Tyrone. I'd have a league that runs from April to end of July which doesn't determine the championship you play in and the dates are set in stone and played whether county players are free or not. I'd do the leagues on a regional basis split by senior/intermediate so the games are local games with less travelling and play them on a Friday night to suit the club players. A lot of derbies and great prep for the championship with it being run off before it.

Then from start of August have the championship which would have a league element. There's 16 teams at senior level so split them into 2 groups of 8 (some kind of seeding to avoid all strong teams in one group - maybe based on earlier regional leagues). 7 games with county players available for them all. Played until 3rd week in September. Top 4 teams make the quarter finals to be played off in October. Bottom teams relegated to next division and second from bottom involved in a play off (same week quarter finals played).

County players would be available for all games that determine your championship status and its less games to fit in with them than the current requirement. There'd be regular football for club players from April to July with lots of local derbies acting as great prep for the championship and a good stand alone comp. And the benefit of Friday night games to avoid taking up the weekends.

The one big potential flaw in my system is if Tyrone got to the All Ireland final in 3rd week of August. But surely for most counties thinking outside the box a little could lead to a far better structure and less reliance on county fixtures to determine games. And most counties wont get to the All Ireland final so will have a minimum of 3 months to get games played with county players.
Why ruin a perfectly good championship by turning it into a league and the league into a series of meaningless friendlies?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Norf Tyrone on February 27, 2017, 01:42:12 PM
How many committee people were asked by their Club their pref prior to the vote so that the County knew which way to cast.

I was asked re Super 8s but no other motion.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on February 27, 2017, 02:14:19 PM
Quote from: LeoMc on February 27, 2017, 01:36:15 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on February 27, 2017, 10:58:55 AM
With most things these days or any kind of change I do think the reaction has been over the top. It won't finish club football or lead to professionalism etc. I said before I do think a split in the season for county players is needed and maybe this is a move towards that. Judging by an earlier draft schedule for next year (I'm not sure how official it was) 30 counties will finish up by the end of July. Does that not lead to enough time for county players to be available for the most important club games?

Club football and scheduling has to be looked at and this definitely adds to the urgency needed to look at it. In Tyrone (county I have most knowledge off) there is 15 club league games followed by relegation/promotion play offs and a straight knockout championship. There is 3 divisions of 16 with division one teams entering senior championship, division 2 intermediate and division 3 junior. County players are available for 10 of the league games plus the play offs and championships. What usually happens is the first 7 or so games with the county players get played by late June/early July and the 5 starred games are used quick enough. This then leads to weeks of inactivity waiting for Tyrone to finish up. Then its a struggle to get the remaining 3 league games played plus the championship and league play off games.

The new system could make it even harder as there will be less room in the calendar in April/May/June for league games. So county boards should be thinking about what would work best.

If it was up to me I'd change the structures in Tyrone. I'd have a league that runs from April to end of July which doesn't determine the championship you play in and the dates are set in stone and played whether county players are free or not. I'd do the leagues on a regional basis split by senior/intermediate so the games are local games with less travelling and play them on a Friday night to suit the club players. A lot of derbies and great prep for the championship with it being run off before it.

Then from start of August have the championship which would have a league element. There's 16 teams at senior level so split them into 2 groups of 8 (some kind of seeding to avoid all strong teams in one group - maybe based on earlier regional leagues). 7 games with county players available for them all. Played until 3rd week in September. Top 4 teams make the quarter finals to be played off in October. Bottom teams relegated to next division and second from bottom involved in a play off (same week quarter finals played).

County players would be available for all games that determine your championship status and its less games to fit in with them than the current requirement. There'd be regular football for club players from April to July with lots of local derbies acting as great prep for the championship and a good stand alone comp. And the benefit of Friday night games to avoid taking up the weekends.

The one big potential flaw in my system is if Tyrone got to the All Ireland final in 3rd week of August. But surely for most counties thinking outside the box a little could lead to a far better structure and less reliance on county fixtures to determine games. And most counties wont get to the All Ireland final so will have a minimum of 3 months to get games played with county players.
Why ruin a perfectly good championship by turning it into a league and the league into a series of meaningless friendlies?

1) To give the players regular games through the season.
2) To allow club players to know when their games will be played.
3) To allow county players to play in every match that determines what championship a club is in which seems fair.
4) To reduce the number of games county players have to play for their clubs whilst not disadvantaging their clubs
5) To ensure the club season finishes earlier than currently.

I'm not sure the above system would ruin the championship. Games could be spread out across the weekend to give maximum exposure. The risk would be that clubs wouldn't take the initial league serious. But if its played independently with local matches and before the championship surely you would get buy in from the clubs. Currently there is plenty of meaningless games in the league especially towards the end after the championship is completed.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on February 27, 2017, 02:18:25 PM
One of the stupidest elements of our current system is that only one provincial game is played on each weekend. Absolutely ridiculous how long it takes to run off these competitions. For example, the Ulster should be ran off as follows:

Weekend One: Preliminary round

Weekend two: Saturday Evening QF1
                      Sunday QF2

Weekend three: Saturday Evening QF3
                      Sunday QF4

Weekend four: Sunday SF1 (QF1 v QF2)
                     
Weekend five: Sunday SF2 (QF3 v QF4)

Weekend Seven: Sunday Ulster Final

The 2016 Ulster championship started on the 15th May and finished on the 17th July. The above shaves two weeks off this that could be used to shorten the county calendar or to free up two full weekends of guaranteed club football across Ulster.
 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 02:29:39 PM
Omagh gael, you know that that is what has been voted through or are you just applauding that it has been passed?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on February 27, 2017, 02:34:25 PM
Quote from: sam03/05 on February 26, 2017, 03:56:21 PM
Surely these proposals will actually be good for club football
Yes there will be a lot of county games in July / August
But that's no different from now. ( with most of the weaker counties knocked out by that stage anyway) 
The fact that the season is over the last week in August
Allows the club season to effectively be played in September / October / November
Surely that is a much better alternative than what's in place now.

Also the Dubs will have to play two championship games away from Croke Park
Which will add a lot of interesting games. The likes of Kerry won't have a cake walk to the
Final every year oi they had to go away to Ballybofey or somewhere.
The only thing that's missing is atwo tiered structure with the second tier  playing final at All Ire final.
Overall I think it's actually a better deal for club players
As the club championships will take place in sept/ Oct/ Dec no matter what


This line made me smile! Do you honestly think that they (the GAA Hierarchy)will have Dublin playing outside Croker in the Championship? You are really naive if you think that. Think about it? This has more games in Croker written all over it!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 02:41:08 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on February 27, 2017, 02:34:25 PM
Quote from: sam03/05 on February 26, 2017, 03:56:21 PM
Surely these proposals will actually be good for club football
Yes there will be a lot of county games in July / August
But that's no different from now. ( with most of the weaker counties knocked out by that stage anyway) 
The fact that the season is over the last week in August
Allows the club season to effectively be played in September / October / November
Surely that is a much better alternative than what's in place now.

Also the Dubs will have to play two championship games away from Croke Park
Which will add a lot of interesting games. The likes of Kerry won't have a cake walk to the
Final every year oi they had to go away to Ballybofey or somewhere.
The only thing that's missing is atwo tiered structure with the second tier  playing final at All Ire final.
Overall I think it's actually a better deal for club players
As the club championships will take place in sept/ Oct/ Dec no matter what


This line made me smile! Do you honestly think that they (the GAA Hierarchy)will have Dublin playing outside Croker in the Championship? You are really naive if you think that. Think about it? This has more games in Croker written all over it!
While some cynicism is expected in GAA land, do you genuinely think that Dublin won't play their third game in the group outside of Croke Park, after playing the first two there?

They played outside Croker last year and will do so again this year so it's already happening.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 27, 2017, 02:50:40 PM
Quote from: omagh_gael on February 27, 2017, 02:18:25 PM
One of the stupidest elements of our current system is that only one provincial game is played on each weekend. Absolutely ridiculous how long it takes to run off these competitions. For example, the Ulster should be ran off as follows:

Weekend One: Preliminary round

Weekend two: Saturday Evening QF1
                      Sunday QF2

Weekend three: Saturday Evening QF3
                      Sunday QF4

Weekend four: Sunday SF1 (QF1 v QF2)
                     
Weekend five: Sunday SF2 (QF3 v QF4)

Weekend Seven: Sunday Ulster Final

The 2016 Ulster championship started on the 15th May and finished on the 17th July. The above shaves two weeks off this that could be used to shorten the county calendar or to free up two full weekends of guaranteed club football across Ulster.


I would suggest that across all provinces, the preliminary rounds should be played across one weekend.

Then the quarter-finals across two weekends, and the semi-finals across two.

Then the provincial finals across two.

That's a total of seven weeks to run off every provincial championship game.

For 2018, the championship would start on the weekend of April 28th/29th, with the second two provincial finals (Leinster and Ulster) on Sunday June 10th.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 02:54:19 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 27, 2017, 02:50:40 PM
Quote from: omagh_gael on February 27, 2017, 02:18:25 PM
One of the stupidest elements of our current system is that only one provincial game is played on each weekend. Absolutely ridiculous how long it takes to run off these competitions. For example, the Ulster should be ran off as follows:

Weekend One: Preliminary round

Weekend two: Saturday Evening QF1
                      Sunday QF2

Weekend three: Saturday Evening QF3
                      Sunday QF4

Weekend four: Sunday SF1 (QF1 v QF2)
                     
Weekend five: Sunday SF2 (QF3 v QF4)

Weekend Seven: Sunday Ulster Final

The 2016 Ulster championship started on the 15th May and finished on the 17th July. The above shaves two weeks off this that could be used to shorten the county calendar or to free up two full weekends of guaranteed club football across Ulster.


I would suggest that across all provinces, the preliminary rounds should be played across one weekend.

Then the quarter-finals across two weekends, and the semi-finals across two.

Then the provincial finals across two.

That's a total of seven weeks to run off every provincial championship game.

For 2018, the championship would start on the weekend of April 28th/29th, with the second two provincial finals (Leinster and Ulster) on Sunday June 10th.
Seriously lads, this is what's in the proposal. Why are so many commenting without reading. The hysteria is bad enough without looking for what's already been agreed upon.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on February 27, 2017, 03:00:20 PM
Quote from: Itchy on February 26, 2017, 10:31:32 AM
I read a lot of anger on social media and my own club have been very vocal on twitter condemning these motions. There is a strange disconnect between ordinary members being mostly against (anecdotally) yet delegates and county boards being overwhelmingly for. Leave that aside for now, this is a huge 2 fingers up to the players, both club and county. As a club volunteer and coach I am primarily concerned with the club scene. I can see a strike of sorts on the cards here - in fact I would recommend one!

I would suggest that all players should go to the next monthly meeting of the club and mandate them not to pay their county board fees. If every club in Ireland does that the delegates wont be long listening to them. It seems money rules everything in the GAA and it is sad to see the first president from my own county making such a disgrace of himself overseeing this mess.

Edit - breaking  http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gpa-will-respond-strongly-to-super-8-snub-says-earley-778890.html

That is probably the best idea I heard yet. I have no doubt that the main reason for the proposals getting through is the promise of additional money back to the counties from the Super 8 TV deal that can be sold to Sky/RTE. Cash strapped counties, many of whom are in large debt, will be seduced by the promise of a few extra quid which makes their jobs an awful lot easier. They are already under considerable financial strain and this super 8 in their minds will ease the problem somewhat. Ultimately the cash strapped counties pass the debt onto the clubs by way of increased fees, levies and imposed fundraising. If clubs refused to co-operate with unity then it would be groundhog day and the hierarchy in positions of power may finally be forced to sit up and listen.

Already, a lot of people are shrugging their shoulders as if to say, it's in now so lets just work with it. Before long it will just be another bone of contention while the main over riding issues have still to be properly addressed. I feel as if it will take something a lot more dramatic such as you suggest to ever bring about the change that is urgently required. 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 27, 2017, 03:01:10 PM
For Dublin (as a Dublin supporter), this would mean a potential list of fixtures for 2018 would look like this:

January: O'Byrne Cup
February 4: NFL Round 1
February 11: NFL Round 2
February 25: NFL Round 3
March 4: NFL Round 4
March 11: NFL Round 5
March 25: NFL Round 6
April 1: NFL Round 7
April 8: NFL final

May 13: Leinster quarter-final
May 27: Leinster semi-final
June 10: Leinster final
July 1: Super 8 Round 1
July 7: Super 8 Round 2
July 15: Super 8 Round 3
August 5: All-Ireland semi-final
August 26: All-Ireland final
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 27, 2017, 03:09:51 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 02:54:19 PM

Seriously lads, this is what's in the proposal. Why are so many commenting without reading. The hysteria is bad enough without looking for what's already been agreed upon.

As far as I'm aware, nothing has been agreed upon as regards when the provincial championships will start, or the gaps between matches.

Flesh also has to be put upon the bones of how it will affect the hurling championship, ie. will the two All-Ireland hurling semi-finals be played on the same weekend - hurling people may not be happy with losing a high profile weekend through no fault of their own.

Remember, the hurling championship remains unchanged in format, and there will still be replays. This then can have a knock on impact on football.

There are a number of questions that are still to be answered.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on February 27, 2017, 03:15:19 PM
If THIS HAD OF BEEN IN LAST YEAR TYRONE WOULD HAVE BEEN AWAY TO CLARE AND HOME TO TIPPERARY - NOT MUCH APPEAL IN THOSE GAMES - WOULD BE LUCKY TO GET 3000 AT THEM...........
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on February 27, 2017, 03:25:50 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 02:41:08 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on February 27, 2017, 02:34:25 PM
Quote from: sam03/05 on February 26, 2017, 03:56:21 PM
Surely these proposals will actually be good for club football
Yes there will be a lot of county games in July / August
But that's no different from now. ( with most of the weaker counties knocked out by that stage anyway) 
The fact that the season is over the last week in August
Allows the club season to effectively be played in September / October / November
Surely that is a much better alternative than what's in place now.

Also the Dubs will have to play two championship games away from Croke Park
Which will add a lot of interesting games. The likes of Kerry won't have a cake walk to the
Final every year oi they had to go away to Ballybofey or somewhere.
The only thing that's missing is atwo tiered structure with the second tier  playing final at All Ire final.
Overall I think it's actually a better deal for club players
As the club championships will take place in sept/ Oct/ Dec no matter what


This line made me smile! Do you honestly think that they (the GAA Hierarchy)will have Dublin playing outside Croker in the Championship? You are really naive if you think that. Think about it? This has more games in Croker written all over it!
While some cynicism is expected in GAA land, do you genuinely think that Dublin won't play their third game in the group outside of Croke Park, after playing the first two there?

They played outside Croker last year and will do so again this year so it's already happening.

The GAA in 2014 would not let Mayo /Kerry replay be played in Croker just in case the Dublin/Donegal semi final game ended in a draw!

Corporate Boxes, Sky TV, Dublin Media, Dublin fans, Sponsors, etc will bay for games in the Capital. They might let Dublin down to the sticks if the game is a dead rubber. Which more likely would be the third game.

This is a Corporate entity we are dealing with. They are interested in maximising making money. They care little about the supporter or the players involved. They are just entities to be used in maximising profits. The (fake) Amateur umbrella they hide under is convenient for high moral ground when standing against other sports.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 03:26:36 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 27, 2017, 03:09:51 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 02:54:19 PM

Seriously lads, this is what's in the proposal. Why are so many commenting without reading. The hysteria is bad enough without looking for what's already been agreed upon.

As far as I'm aware, nothing has been agreed upon as regards when the provincial championships will start, or the gaps between matches.

Flesh also has to be put upon the bones of how it will affect the hurling championship, ie. will the two All-Ireland hurling semi-finals be played on the same weekend - hurling people may not be happy with losing a high profile weekend through no fault of their own.

Remember, the hurling championship remains unchanged in format, and there will still be replays. This then can have a knock on impact on football.

There are a number of questions that are still to be answered.
Well it might need to be rubber-stamped but it is all outlined in the proposal document.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on February 27, 2017, 03:36:00 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 03:26:36 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 27, 2017, 03:09:51 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 02:54:19 PM

Seriously lads, this is what's in the proposal. Why are so many commenting without reading. The hysteria is bad enough without looking for what's already been agreed upon.

As far as I'm aware, nothing has been agreed upon as regards when the provincial championships will start, or the gaps between matches.

Flesh also has to be put upon the bones of how it will affect the hurling championship, ie. will the two All-Ireland hurling semi-finals be played on the same weekend - hurling people may not be happy with losing a high profile weekend through no fault of their own.

Remember, the hurling championship remains unchanged in format, and there will still be replays. This then can have a knock on impact on football.

There are a number of questions that are still to be answered.
Well it might need to be rubber-stamped but it is all outlined in the proposal document.

Was this included in the super 8 proposal? If so I missed the element that pertained to compressing the provincials. Do you've a link?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 27, 2017, 03:40:17 PM
Quote from: The Trap on February 27, 2017, 03:15:19 PM
HAD OF BEEN ..

Black Card.

Does the extra time provision not apply to the hurley shtuff? ?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 27, 2017, 04:01:33 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 03:26:36 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 27, 2017, 03:09:51 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 02:54:19 PM

Seriously lads, this is what's in the proposal. Why are so many commenting without reading. The hysteria is bad enough without looking for what's already been agreed upon.

As far as I'm aware, nothing has been agreed upon as regards when the provincial championships will start, or the gaps between matches.

Flesh also has to be put upon the bones of how it will affect the hurling championship, ie. will the two All-Ireland hurling semi-finals be played on the same weekend - hurling people may not be happy with losing a high profile weekend through no fault of their own.

Remember, the hurling championship remains unchanged in format, and there will still be replays. This then can have a knock on impact on football.

There are a number of questions that are still to be answered.
Well it might need to be rubber-stamped but it is all outlined in the proposal document.

The proposal document is very much a bare bones document.

Apart from stating that the All-Ireland finals will take place on unspecified dates in August (which is actually Motion 5, not Motion 4), it states very little about scheduling.

Apart from its complete lack of information about provincial scheduling, another thing it doesn't state, is whether there will still be a two week gap between the hurling and football finals, or whether they will be on successive weeks.

This is all Motion 4 on the official document says about scheduling. Motion 5 deals with moving the All-Ireland finals to August.

Although it's widely believed the All-Ireland football semi-finals will take place on the same weekend and that the three rounds of the Super 8 will take place on successive weekends, I don't see anything official about it.

http://www.gaa.ie/mm/Document/TheGAA/Publications/13/61/46/AnChomhdh%C3%A1ilBhliant%C3%BAil2017-R%C3%BAindonChomhdh%C3%A1il_English.pdf

(1) Scheduling
Qualifier Games shall be played on Saturdays/Sundays as deemed
appropriate by the Central Competitions Control Committee, but
the Schedule of Games shall avoid conflict with the Provincial
Championships schedules (including Replays), and shall also allow
sufficient dates for Club Championship fixtures. Consideration
shall be given to the dual involvement of Counties in both Hurling
and Football, and, where feasible, avoid the same weekend.
Provincial Runners-Up shall be allowed, where feasible, a
thirteen-day gap between their Provincial Final and their
participation in the All-Ireland Qualifier Series.
All Games in each Round of the All-Ireland Qualifier Series shall
be played over not more than two consecutive weekends, save in
exceptional circumstances.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 04:20:27 PM
Omagh gael, the proposal was all the one until they decided to split it out into three, probably fearing that the Super 8 might stop the whole thing from getting through. This is the link to the original document which has been in circulation for several months now http://www.gaa.ie/mm/Document/GaaIe/GAANews/13/41/92/FootballRevisionProposalA4SPREADSSCpdf_English.pdf

Appendix 2 shows how they saw the new schedule.

Sid, are you talking about a different document as the hurling schedule is contained here too as well as the provincials.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 27, 2017, 06:57:21 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on February 27, 2017, 02:34:25 PM
Quote from: sam03/05 on February 26, 2017, 03:56:21 PM
Surely these proposals will actually be good for club football
Yes there will be a lot of county games in July / August
But that's no different from now. ( with most of the weaker counties knocked out by that stage anyway) 
The fact that the season is over the last week in August
Allows the club season to effectively be played in September / October / November
Surely that is a much better alternative than what's in place now.

Also the Dubs will have to play two championship games away from Croke Park
Which will add a lot of interesting games. The likes of Kerry won't have a cake walk to the
Final every year oi they had to go away to Ballybofey or somewhere.
The only thing that's missing is atwo tiered structure with the second tier  playing final at All Ire final.
Overall I think it's actually a better deal for club players
As the club championships will take place in sept/ Oct/ Dec no matter what


This line made me smile! Do you honestly think that they (the GAA Hierarchy)will have Dublin playing outside Croker in the Championship? You are really naive if you think that. Think about it? This has more games in Croker written all over it!

That's complete nonsense. Talk about fake news!! It's in the motion that each team gets one home game so it's impossible for the Dublin to play all three games at home unless the home team gives up home advantage and I doubt many would do that. In fairness, lads are giving out about this on numerous fronts but giving out about something that won't happen is pretty daft.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 27, 2017, 06:58:28 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 27, 2017, 03:40:17 PM
Quote from: The Trap on February 27, 2017, 03:15:19 PM
HAD OF BEEN ..

Black Card.

Does the extra time provision not apply to the hurley shtuff? ?

ET applies to both codes.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on February 27, 2017, 07:00:30 PM
It'll be the GAA vs a lot of players
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rosnarun on February 27, 2017, 07:12:15 PM
A Lot this is a high Pissing Contest  or a battle for control for the Gaa depending on how dramatic you are .
The only real objection the CPA and GPA have to the super 8 /championship changes wass that they were ignored in the formulation of it . If the CPA had come up with it and got it through congress it would have been seen as a massive coup .
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on February 27, 2017, 07:14:04 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 27, 2017, 06:57:21 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on February 27, 2017, 02:34:25 PM
Quote from: sam03/05 on February 26, 2017, 03:56:21 PM
Surely these proposals will actually be good for club football
Yes there will be a lot of county games in July / August
But that's no different from now. ( with most of the weaker counties knocked out by that stage anyway) 
The fact that the season is over the last week in August
Allows the club season to effectively be played in September / October / November
Surely that is a much better alternative than what's in place now.

Also the Dubs will have to play two championship games away from Croke Park
Which will add a lot of interesting games. The likes of Kerry won't have a cake walk to the
Final every year oi they had to go away to Ballybofey or somewhere.
The only thing that's missing is atwo tiered structure with the second tier  playing final at All Ire final.
Overall I think it's actually a better deal for club players
As the club championships will take place in sept/ Oct/ Dec no matter what


This line made me smile! Do you honestly think that they (the GAA Hierarchy)will have Dublin playing outside Croker in the Championship? You are really naive if you think that. Think about it? This has more games in Croker written all over it!

That's complete nonsense. Talk about fake news!! It's in the motion that each team gets one home game so it's impossible for the Dublin to play all three games at home unless the home team gives up home advantage and I doubt many would do that. In fairness, lads are giving out about this on numerous fronts but giving out about something that won't happen is pretty daft.

They played a first round Leinster Championship game. The GAA in 2014 would not let Mayo /Kerry replay be played in Croker just in case the Dublin/Donegal semi final game ended in a draw!

Corporate Boxes, Sky TV, Dublin Media, Dublin fans, Sponsors, etc will bay for games in the Capital. They might let Dublin down to the sticks if the game is a dead rubber. Which more likely would be the third game.

This is a Corporate entity we are dealing with. They are interested in maximising making money. They care little about the supporter or the players involved. They are just entities to be used in maximising profits. The (fake) Amateur umbrella they hide under is convenient for high moral ground when standing against other sports.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on February 27, 2017, 07:39:09 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 04:20:27 PM
Omagh gael, the proposal was all the one until they decided to split it out into three, probably fearing that the Super 8 might stop the whole thing from getting through. This is the link to the original document which has been in circulation for several months now http://www.gaa.ie/mm/Document/GaaIe/GAANews/13/41/92/FootballRevisionProposalA4SPREADSSCpdf_English.pdf

Appendix 2 shows how they saw the new schedule.

Sid, are you talking about a different document as the hurling schedule is contained here too as well as the provincials.

Sorry, I hadn't seen that document.

I do see a weakness straight off in the proposed schedule.

Group 1 of the Super 8 gets a week's rest after the first fixture, whereas Group 2 doesn't - they have to play for three consecutive weeks.

As both All-Ireland semi-finals are to be played on the same weekend, which is the weekend immediately following the conclusion of the Super 8, this would mean that the teams that qualify for the semi-finals from Group 2 would be playing for the fourth week in a row, whereas their opponents would only be playing for the third week in a row.

That's a clear advantage to teams in Group 1, which coincidentally, Dublin are in.  ;D




Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 27, 2017, 08:03:53 PM
Why can't they play the 2 groups the same weekend - 2 games Saturday, 2 Sunday.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 08:12:41 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on February 27, 2017, 07:39:09 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 27, 2017, 04:20:27 PM
Omagh gael, the proposal was all the one until they decided to split it out into three, probably fearing that the Super 8 might stop the whole thing from getting through. This is the link to the original document which has been in circulation for several months now http://www.gaa.ie/mm/Document/GaaIe/GAANews/13/41/92/FootballRevisionProposalA4SPREADSSCpdf_English.pdf

Appendix 2 shows how they saw the new schedule.

Sid, are you talking about a different document as the hurling schedule is contained here too as well as the provincials.

Sorry, I hadn't seen that document.

I do see a weakness straight off in the proposed schedule.

Group 1 of the Super 8 gets a week's rest after the first fixture, whereas Group 2 doesn't - they have to play for three consecutive weeks.

As both All-Ireland semi-finals are to be played on the same weekend, which is the weekend immediately following the conclusion of the Super 8, this would mean that the teams that qualify for the semi-finals from Group 2 would be playing for the fourth week in a row, whereas their opponents would only be playing for the third week in a row.

That's a clear advantage to teams in Group 1, which coincidentally, Dublin are in.  ;D
Not having a go at you, but I'd say you're in the majority of posters that haven't read the document.

Moyles and Burns debating it on Newtalk now and it's civil but highlights the depths of problems that exist; so many people and groups of people with a seemingly endless list of issues.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 27, 2017, 08:30:53 PM
In fairness to Jarlath, I'd agree with him about the GPA dropping the ball on this one.
Had months to consult their membership and thrash out some of the issues.
Instead, just asked them for a straight 'Yes/No' answer a couple of weeks ago.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 27, 2017, 10:50:23 PM
The discussion here is mirrored nationally and just underlines why congress were right to pass this. There is no proposal that will make everyone happy and be get passed in congress. Given the need to retain the provincials then the super 8's is as good an option as any. Reading the players criticism on twitter was revealing because solving some players issues would only make other players issues worse. Again, highlighting the impossible position the GAA are in.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on February 27, 2017, 11:03:17 PM
God, the amount of Arse licking on this thread would make you sick. This is the beginning of semi-pro. What Dublin are already. As I said earlier. Dublin will play all their games at home in Croker. The spin (to use the pun) of them travelling to Ballybofey is for those on cloud cocoo land. Asking lads who have jobs to tog out nearly every week in July and August is really taking advantage. But hey Sky sports will be happy and corporate boxes have to be used and abused.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 27, 2017, 11:36:54 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on February 27, 2017, 11:03:17 PM
God, the amount of Arse licking on this thread would make you sick. This is the beginning of semi-pro. What Dublin are already. As I said earlier. Dublin will play all their games at home in Croker. The spin (to use the pun) of them travelling to Ballybofey is for those on cloud cocoo land. Asking lads who have jobs to tog out nearly every week in July and August is really taking advantage. But hey Sky sports will be happy and corporate boxes have to be used and abused.

And the amount of unfounded moaning is fairly sickening too. There's been lads on this boarding heralding every change as the start of professionalism in the GAA and they were, like you are now, wrong. The numbers don't add up.

Jesus, complaining about lads playing football must take the biscuit. Do lads not play games every week in the league, or do they not work in the spring? They'll play and then do two easy training sessions and play again. Ideal for many young fit athletes.

It's clear there are a lot of lads who will complain and throw unfounded criticisms based on their own unsupported views. Lets see how this works out and if it's the world ending disaster some here believe it will be then we can go back to the current format.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: screenexile on February 28, 2017, 01:05:22 AM
Quote from: Zulu on February 27, 2017, 11:36:54 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on February 27, 2017, 11:03:17 PM
God, the amount of Arse licking on this thread would make you sick. This is the beginning of semi-pro. What Dublin are already. As I said earlier. Dublin will play all their games at home in Croker. The spin (to use the pun) of them travelling to Ballybofey is for those on cloud cocoo land. Asking lads who have jobs to tog out nearly every week in July and August is really taking advantage. But hey Sky sports will be happy and corporate boxes have to be used and abused.

And the amount of unfounded moaning is fairly sickening too. There's been lads on this boarding heralding every change as the start of professionalism in the GAA and they were, like you are now, wrong. The numbers don't add up.

Jesus, complaining about lads playing football must take the biscuit. Do lads not play games every week in the league, or do they not work in the spring? They'll play and then do two easy training sessions and play again. Ideal for many young fit athletes.

It's clear there are a lot of lads who will complain and throw unfounded criticisms based on their own unsupported views. Lets see how this works out and if it's the world ending disaster some here believe it will be then we can go back to the current format.

f**k the lads playing 3 weeks in a row what about Sligo/Carlow/Antrim/Waterford who have a real chance of playing 2 games within 3:4 weeks and then none in the height of summer?

Interesting to note it's the Dubs mostly in favour of this... hilarious what passes for democracy these days GAA is a worse system than the Electoral College FFS! Members of our club certainly weren't balloted on the Super 8 issue and I'd wager very few clubs around the country were either!

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 08:49:51 AM
You're proving my position by again and it's far from just Dubs supporting this. But you ask about Waterford and the like, ok what's your solution then? Duffy, nor anyone else said this was the solution to all our issues but I'd like to hear how we can keep the provincials and provide the weaker teams more games, in the height of summer no less???

So, screenexile let's hear your proposal that provides the weaker teams meaningful games in the height of summer and gives the clubs more time with their IC players as well.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:18:36 AM
I don't see any right minded player or manager wanting to play three extra matches at that stage of a competition. No benefit to the teams. increased injury risk and fatigue when you least need it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on February 28, 2017, 09:19:45 AM
Quote from: screenexile on February 28, 2017, 01:05:22 AM

f**k the lads playing 3 weeks in a row what about Sligo/Carlow/Antrim/Waterford who have a real chance of playing 2 games within 3:4 weeks and then none in the height of summer?

But these counties want to keep the provincial system, and they want to stay in the All Ireland series, rather than have a B/Intermediate competition.

So yes, the weakest teams will stay as they are. No change from the current system, apart from the 2nd game is likely to be played a bit earlier.

A minimum of two championship games. And if that results in two losses, then it's back to their clubs to play club football in the height of the summer and the club footballers are happy that their competitions can proceed.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ballinaman on February 28, 2017, 09:30:01 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:18:36 AM
I don't see any right minded player or manager wanting to play three extra matches at that stage of a competition. No benefit to the teams. increased injury risk and fatigue when you least need it.
Shouldn't be a problem if the mid week training is adjusted accordingly. However, with the amount of dinosaurs still taking sessions there might be problems...workrate wasn't high enough last Saturday lads, let's train the bollox off ye Wednesday to get us right for next Saturday..that'll do the trick.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 09:32:51 AM
Quote from: Zulu on February 27, 2017, 11:36:54 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on February 27, 2017, 11:03:17 PM
God, the amount of Arse licking on this thread would make you sick. This is the beginning of semi-pro. What Dublin are already. As I said earlier. Dublin will play all their games at home in Croker. The spin (to use the pun) of them travelling to Ballybofey is for those on cloud cocoo land. Asking lads who have jobs to tog out nearly every week in July and August is really taking advantage. But hey Sky sports will be happy and corporate boxes have to be used and abused.

And the amount of unfounded moaning is fairly sickening too. There's been lads on this boarding heralding every change as the start of professionalism in the GAA and they were, like you are now, wrong. The numbers don't add up.

Jesus, complaining about lads playing football must take the biscuit. Do lads not play games every week in the league, or do they not work in the spring? They'll play and then do two easy training sessions and play again. Ideal for many young fit athletes.

It's clear there are a lot of lads who will complain and throw unfounded criticisms based on their own unsupported views. Lets see how this works out and if it's the world ending disaster some here believe it will be then we can go back to the current format.
From the Bunker, I'll restrain myself to say that I just disagree with you.

Giving out about lads playing every week. Isn't that what they bloody want? More games, less training.

You genuinely think that Dublin, after playing their first two Super 8 games, are going to play in Croke Park again? I don't.

And as for your arse licking comment. As the  young girls say, I just can't.................
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:43:01 AM
Quote from: ballinaman on February 28, 2017, 09:30:01 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:18:36 AM
I don't see any right minded player or manager wanting to play three extra matches at that stage of a competition. No benefit to the teams. increased injury risk and fatigue when you least need it.
Shouldn't be a problem if the mid week training is adjusted accordingly. However, with the amount of dinosaurs still taking sessions there might be problems...workrate wasn't high enough last Saturday lads, let's train the bollox off ye Wednesday to get us right for next Saturday..that'll do the trick.

So you reach the last eight in the championship and you're telling me that you would rather play three matches rather than one match to get to the semi final ???
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 09:49:30 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:43:01 AM
Quote from: ballinaman on February 28, 2017, 09:30:01 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:18:36 AM
I don't see any right minded player or manager wanting to play three extra matches at that stage of a competition. No benefit to the teams. increased injury risk and fatigue when you least need it.
Shouldn't be a problem if the mid week training is adjusted accordingly. However, with the amount of dinosaurs still taking sessions there might be problems...workrate wasn't high enough last Saturday lads, let's train the bollox off ye Wednesday to get us right for next Saturday..that'll do the trick.

So you reach the last eight in the championship and you're telling me that you would rather play three matches rather than one match to get to the semi final ???
If you told a team in June that they had to play no games and that they'd go straight into the All-Ireland final I'd say they'd take that too.

The point is that players want to play more games during the summer months. It also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult. That's two problems that the Super 8 solves. If it creates a problem elsewhere then fair enough. But the claim is that the proposals tried to address some of the issues that GAA people had with the current system.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on February 28, 2017, 10:04:42 AM
QuoteIt also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult.

Actually it makes it easier for Dublin to get to the final, they can now afford a bad day after Leinster and still have a chance, whereas a bad day in the quarters and they were gone.

Anyway I am all for change, however let's be brutally honest, if any county with a county ground capacity less than 15k have Dublin in the group stages not a hope in hell they will be allowed play Dublin at home, not a hope in hell.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 10:08:49 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on February 28, 2017, 10:04:42 AM
QuoteIt also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult.

Actually it makes it easier for Dublin to get to the final, they can now afford a bad day after Leinster and still have a chance, whereas a bad day in the quarters and they were gone.

Anyway I am all for change, however let's be brutally honest, if any county with a county ground capacity less than 15k have Dublin in the group stages not a hope in hell they will be allowed play Dublin at home, not a hope in hell.
But would it be moved to Croke Park?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on February 28, 2017, 10:20:58 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 10:08:49 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on February 28, 2017, 10:04:42 AM
QuoteIt also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult.

Actually it makes it easier for Dublin to get to the final, they can now afford a bad day after Leinster and still have a chance, whereas a bad day in the quarters and they were gone.

Anyway I am all for change, however let's be brutally honest, if any county with a county ground capacity less than 15k have Dublin in the group stages not a hope in hell they will be allowed play Dublin at home, not a hope in hell.
But would it be moved to Croke Park?

Hard to say, if a Leinster county probably, more than likely a neutral venue, Thurles, Limerick, Kilkenny or Clones. It would still give Dublin 2 home games and 1 neutral. All teams are equal some are just more equal than others.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 10:29:43 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on February 28, 2017, 10:20:58 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 10:08:49 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on February 28, 2017, 10:04:42 AM
QuoteIt also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult.

Actually it makes it easier for Dublin to get to the final, they can now afford a bad day after Leinster and still have a chance, whereas a bad day in the quarters and they were gone.

Anyway I am all for change, however let's be brutally honest, if any county with a county ground capacity less than 15k have Dublin in the group stages not a hope in hell they will be allowed play Dublin at home, not a hope in hell.
But would it be moved to Croke Park?

Hard to say, if a Leinster county probably, more than likely a neutral venue, Thurles, Limerick, Kilkenny or Clones. It would still give Dublin 2 home games and 1 neutral. All teams are equal some are just more equal than others.
Well my point was that they wouldn't play their third game in Croke Park. It's clearly stated in the proposal that grounds would be subject to approval by the CCCC.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:32:58 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 09:49:30 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:43:01 AM
Quote from: ballinaman on February 28, 2017, 09:30:01 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:18:36 AM
I don't see any right minded player or manager wanting to play three extra matches at that stage of a competition. No benefit to the teams. increased injury risk and fatigue when you least need it.
Shouldn't be a problem if the mid week training is adjusted accordingly. However, with the amount of dinosaurs still taking sessions there might be problems...workrate wasn't high enough last Saturday lads, let's train the bollox off ye Wednesday to get us right for next Saturday..that'll do the trick.

So you reach the last eight in the championship and you're telling me that you would rather play three matches rather than one match to get to the semi final ???
If you told a team in June that they had to play no games and that they'd go straight into the All-Ireland final I'd say they'd take that too.

The point is that players want to play more games during the summer months. It also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult. That's two problems that the Super 8 solves. If it creates a problem elsewhere then fair enough. But the claim is that the proposals tried to address some of the issues that GAA people had with the current system.

So do club players (the GAA majority).
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 10:38:43 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:32:58 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 09:49:30 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:43:01 AM
Quote from: ballinaman on February 28, 2017, 09:30:01 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:18:36 AM
I don't see any right minded player or manager wanting to play three extra matches at that stage of a competition. No benefit to the teams. increased injury risk and fatigue when you least need it.
Shouldn't be a problem if the mid week training is adjusted accordingly. However, with the amount of dinosaurs still taking sessions there might be problems...workrate wasn't high enough last Saturday lads, let's train the bollox off ye Wednesday to get us right for next Saturday..that'll do the trick.

So you reach the last eight in the championship and you're telling me that you would rather play three matches rather than one match to get to the semi final ???
If you told a team in June that they had to play no games and that they'd go straight into the All-Ireland final I'd say they'd take that too.

The point is that players want to play more games during the summer months. It also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult. That's two problems that the Super 8 solves. If it creates a problem elsewhere then fair enough. But the claim is that the proposals tried to address some of the issues that GAA people had with the current system.

So do club players (the GAA majority).
I know. So what do you do? I see the Wicklow manager saying his players should go on strike because they only got two games last summer. The Wicklow club players will be able to play all of July, August and September next year. How do you keep everyone happy? What does the Wicklow manager want so that he gets more games? A second-tier championship that they can compete in? Nope, the very players he says are being treated like dogs don't want it.

So many complaints, so few answers.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: LeoMc on February 28, 2017, 10:44:30 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:32:58 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 09:49:30 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:43:01 AM
Quote from: ballinaman on February 28, 2017, 09:30:01 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:18:36 AM
I don't see any right minded player or manager wanting to play three extra matches at that stage of a competition. No benefit to the teams. increased injury risk and fatigue when you least need it.
Shouldn't be a problem if the mid week training is adjusted accordingly. However, with the amount of dinosaurs still taking sessions there might be problems...workrate wasn't high enough last Saturday lads, let's train the bollox off ye Wednesday to get us right for next Saturday..that'll do the trick.

So you reach the last eight in the championship and you're telling me that you would rather play three matches rather than one match to get to the semi final ???
If you told a team in June that they had to play no games and that they'd go straight into the All-Ireland final I'd say they'd take that too.

The point is that players want to play more games during the summer months. It also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult. That's two problems that the Super 8 solves. If it creates a problem elsewhere then fair enough. But the claim is that the proposals tried to address some of the issues that GAA people had with the current system.

So do club players (the GAA majority).

Bringing the games forward addresses this. Even clubs in successful counties get September back. Those outside the 8 have July / August for their club games also.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:49:25 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 10:38:43 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:32:58 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 09:49:30 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:43:01 AM
Quote from: ballinaman on February 28, 2017, 09:30:01 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:18:36 AM
I don't see any right minded player or manager wanting to play three extra matches at that stage of a competition. No benefit to the teams. increased injury risk and fatigue when you least need it.
Shouldn't be a problem if the mid week training is adjusted accordingly. However, with the amount of dinosaurs still taking sessions there might be problems...workrate wasn't high enough last Saturday lads, let's train the bollox off ye Wednesday to get us right for next Saturday..that'll do the trick.

So you reach the last eight in the championship and you're telling me that you would rather play three matches rather than one match to get to the semi final ???
If you told a team in June that they had to play no games and that they'd go straight into the All-Ireland final I'd say they'd take that too.

The point is that players want to play more games during the summer months. It also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult. That's two problems that the Super 8 solves. If it creates a problem elsewhere then fair enough. But the claim is that the proposals tried to address some of the issues that GAA people had with the current system.

So do club players (the GAA majority).
I know. So what do you do? I see the Wicklow manager saying his players should go on strike because they only got two games last summer. The Wicklow club players will be able to play all of July, August and September next year. How do you keep everyone happy? What does the Wicklow manager want so that he gets more games? A second-tier championship that they can compete in? Nope, the very players he says are being treated like dogs don't want it.

So many complaints, so few answers.

A tiered championship is the answer. Yes teams always want to play in the Sam Maguire but if they want more meaningful games then a structure similar to the hurling championship must be introduced in football. Earn your right to compete.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on February 28, 2017, 10:51:04 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on February 28, 2017, 10:04:42 AM
QuoteIt also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult.

Actually it makes it easier for Dublin to get to the final, they can now afford a bad day after Leinster and still have a chance, whereas a bad day in the quarters and they were gone.

Anyway I am all for change, however let's be brutally honest, if any county with a county ground capacity less than 15k have Dublin in the group stages not a hope in hell they will be allowed play Dublin at home, not a hope in hell.

First paragraph bang on Dinny. Come to think of it your second one is too. I don't believe they will be forced to play in CP though.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:52:25 AM
Quote from: LeoMc on February 28, 2017, 10:44:30 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:32:58 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 09:49:30 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:43:01 AM
Quote from: ballinaman on February 28, 2017, 09:30:01 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:18:36 AM
I don't see any right minded player or manager wanting to play three extra matches at that stage of a competition. No benefit to the teams. increased injury risk and fatigue when you least need it.
Shouldn't be a problem if the mid week training is adjusted accordingly. However, with the amount of dinosaurs still taking sessions there might be problems...workrate wasn't high enough last Saturday lads, let's train the bollox off ye Wednesday to get us right for next Saturday..that'll do the trick.

So you reach the last eight in the championship and you're telling me that you would rather play three matches rather than one match to get to the semi final ???
If you told a team in June that they had to play no games and that they'd go straight into the All-Ireland final I'd say they'd take that too.

The point is that players want to play more games during the summer months. It also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult. That's two problems that the Super 8 solves. If it creates a problem elsewhere then fair enough. But the claim is that the proposals tried to address some of the issues that GAA people had with the current system.

So do club players (the GAA majority).

Bringing the games forward addresses this. Even clubs in successful counties get September back. Those outside the 8 have July / August for their club games also.

All but two counties had September anyway.  ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 10:54:18 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:49:25 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 10:38:43 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:32:58 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 09:49:30 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:43:01 AM
Quote from: ballinaman on February 28, 2017, 09:30:01 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:18:36 AM
I don't see any right minded player or manager wanting to play three extra matches at that stage of a competition. No benefit to the teams. increased injury risk and fatigue when you least need it.
Shouldn't be a problem if the mid week training is adjusted accordingly. However, with the amount of dinosaurs still taking sessions there might be problems...workrate wasn't high enough last Saturday lads, let's train the bollox off ye Wednesday to get us right for next Saturday..that'll do the trick.

So you reach the last eight in the championship and you're telling me that you would rather play three matches rather than one match to get to the semi final ???
If you told a team in June that they had to play no games and that they'd go straight into the All-Ireland final I'd say they'd take that too.

The point is that players want to play more games during the summer months. It also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult. That's two problems that the Super 8 solves. If it creates a problem elsewhere then fair enough. But the claim is that the proposals tried to address some of the issues that GAA people had with the current system.

So do club players (the GAA majority).
I know. So what do you do? I see the Wicklow manager saying his players should go on strike because they only got two games last summer. The Wicklow club players will be able to play all of July, August and September next year. How do you keep everyone happy? What does the Wicklow manager want so that he gets more games? A second-tier championship that they can compete in? Nope, the very players he says are being treated like dogs don't want it.

So many complaints, so few answers.

A tiered championship is the answer. Yes teams always want to play in the Sam Maguire but if they want more meaningful games then a structure similar to the hurling championship must be introduced in football. Earn your right to compete.
Fine, but that won't pass at congress even with the 60% pass rate so, with respect, it's fairly pointless in 2017. Maybe in three years time it might be a runner but we're dealing with, and criticising, what's been passed in 2017.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 11:05:10 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 10:54:18 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:49:25 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 10:38:43 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:32:58 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 09:49:30 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:43:01 AM
Quote from: ballinaman on February 28, 2017, 09:30:01 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:18:36 AM
I don't see any right minded player or manager wanting to play three extra matches at that stage of a competition. No benefit to the teams. increased injury risk and fatigue when you least need it.
Shouldn't be a problem if the mid week training is adjusted accordingly. However, with the amount of dinosaurs still taking sessions there might be problems...workrate wasn't high enough last Saturday lads, let's train the bollox off ye Wednesday to get us right for next Saturday..that'll do the trick.

So you reach the last eight in the championship and you're telling me that you would rather play three matches rather than one match to get to the semi final ???
If you told a team in June that they had to play no games and that they'd go straight into the All-Ireland final I'd say they'd take that too.

The point is that players want to play more games during the summer months. It also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult. That's two problems that the Super 8 solves. If it creates a problem elsewhere then fair enough. But the claim is that the proposals tried to address some of the issues that GAA people had with the current system.

So do club players (the GAA majority).
I know. So what do you do? I see the Wicklow manager saying his players should go on strike because they only got two games last summer. The Wicklow club players will be able to play all of July, August and September next year. How do you keep everyone happy? What does the Wicklow manager want so that he gets more games? A second-tier championship that they can compete in? Nope, the very players he says are being treated like dogs don't want it.

So many complaints, so few answers.

A tiered championship is the answer. Yes teams always want to play in the Sam Maguire but if they want more meaningful games then a structure similar to the hurling championship must be introduced in football. Earn your right to compete.
Fine, but that won't pass at congress even with the 60% pass rate so, with respect, it's fairly pointless in 2017. Maybe in three years time it might be a runner but we're dealing with, and criticising, what's been passed in 2017.

I agree with that. However in three years time there will never be an appetite for the tiered system. If it had been treated the same way in hurling the structure would never have changed either. The decision had to be taken despite the protests.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 11:09:07 AM
Despite the players' protests? Who's in favour of such a system?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 11:12:04 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 11:09:07 AM
Despite the players' protests? Who's in favour of such a system?

Not player protests in hurling, it was more the county boards.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 11:21:27 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 11:12:04 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 11:09:07 AM
Despite the players' protests? Who's in favour of such a system?

Not player protests in hurling, it was more the county boards.
But we're talking about the football system in there here and now. I'm not sure what stakeholders are behind such a move, other than the media who play the non-elitist card but who I suspect want the weaker teams out of their sight so the can focus on the big guns.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 12:17:45 PM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 11:05:10 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 10:54:18 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:49:25 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 10:38:43 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:32:58 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 09:49:30 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:43:01 AM
Quote from: ballinaman on February 28, 2017, 09:30:01 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:18:36 AM
I don't see any right minded player or manager wanting to play three extra matches at that stage of a competition. No benefit to the teams. increased injury risk and fatigue when you least need it.
Shouldn't be a problem if the mid week training is adjusted accordingly. However, with the amount of dinosaurs still taking sessions there might be problems...workrate wasn't high enough last Saturday lads, let's train the bollox off ye Wednesday to get us right for next Saturday..that'll do the trick.

So you reach the last eight in the championship and you're telling me that you would rather play three matches rather than one match to get to the semi final ???
If you told a team in June that they had to play no games and that they'd go straight into the All-Ireland final I'd say they'd take that too.

The point is that players want to play more games during the summer months. It also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult. That's two problems that the Super 8 solves. If it creates a problem elsewhere then fair enough. But the claim is that the proposals tried to address some of the issues that GAA people had with the current system.

So do club players (the GAA majority).
I know. So what do you do? I see the Wicklow manager saying his players should go on strike because they only got two games last summer. The Wicklow club players will be able to play all of July, August and September next year. How do you keep everyone happy? What does the Wicklow manager want so that he gets more games? A second-tier championship that they can compete in? Nope, the very players he says are being treated like dogs don't want it.

So many complaints, so few answers.

A tiered championship is the answer. Yes teams always want to play in the Sam Maguire but if they want more meaningful games then a structure similar to the hurling championship must be introduced in football. Earn your right to compete.
Fine, but that won't pass at congress even with the 60% pass rate so, with respect, it's fairly pointless in 2017. Maybe in three years time it might be a runner but we're dealing with, and criticising, what's been passed in 2017.

I agree with that. However in three years time there will never be an appetite for the tiered system. If it had been treated the same way in hurling the structure would never have changed either. The decision had to be taken despite the protests.

You don't know what people will want in 3 years time and you don't know the tiered system will work in football. There's fairly clear tiers in hurling. Finally, Croke Park are getting abused to the high hilt for this fairly modest change and you thing they should have forced (how I don't know) a proposal through that would have had little or no support in congress?

As Esmarelda keeps pointing out, this was the only realistic change that was likely to get through congress. The more radical changes that most agree we need won't get through in one go. So criticisms have to be tempered by that reality if they are to be valid.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 12:26:23 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 12:17:45 PM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 11:05:10 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 10:54:18 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:49:25 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 10:38:43 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:32:58 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 09:49:30 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:43:01 AM
Quote from: ballinaman on February 28, 2017, 09:30:01 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:18:36 AM
I don't see any right minded player or manager wanting to play three extra matches at that stage of a competition. No benefit to the teams. increased injury risk and fatigue when you least need it.
Shouldn't be a problem if the mid week training is adjusted accordingly. However, with the amount of dinosaurs still taking sessions there might be problems...workrate wasn't high enough last Saturday lads, let's train the bollox off ye Wednesday to get us right for next Saturday..that'll do the trick.

So you reach the last eight in the championship and you're telling me that you would rather play three matches rather than one match to get to the semi final ???
If you told a team in June that they had to play no games and that they'd go straight into the All-Ireland final I'd say they'd take that too.

The point is that players want to play more games during the summer months. It also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult. That's two problems that the Super 8 solves. If it creates a problem elsewhere then fair enough. But the claim is that the proposals tried to address some of the issues that GAA people had with the current system.

So do club players (the GAA majority).
I know. So what do you do? I see the Wicklow manager saying his players should go on strike because they only got two games last summer. The Wicklow club players will be able to play all of July, August and September next year. How do you keep everyone happy? What does the Wicklow manager want so that he gets more games? A second-tier championship that they can compete in? Nope, the very players he says are being treated like dogs don't want it.

So many complaints, so few answers.

A tiered championship is the answer. Yes teams always want to play in the Sam Maguire but if they want more meaningful games then a structure similar to the hurling championship must be introduced in football. Earn your right to compete.
Fine, but that won't pass at congress even with the 60% pass rate so, with respect, it's fairly pointless in 2017. Maybe in three years time it might be a runner but we're dealing with, and criticising, what's been passed in 2017.

I agree with that. However in three years time there will never be an appetite for the tiered system. If it had been treated the same way in hurling the structure would never have changed either. The decision had to be taken despite the protests.

You don't know what people will want in 3 years time and you don't know the tiered system will work in football. There's fairly clear tiers in hurling. Finally, Croke Park are getting abused to the high hilt for this fairly modest change and you thing they should have forced (how I don't know) a proposal through that would have had little or no support in congress?

As Esmarelda keeps pointing out, this was the only realistic change that was likely to get through congress. The more radical changes that most agree we need won't get through in one go. So criticisms have to be tempered by that reality if they are to be valid.

I suppose if you want to cut to the chase you'll probably find that it has a lot to do with an up and coming SKY deal  ;) lets not be naive
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 12:35:40 PM
I don't know if that's true but this super 8 also address some issues that needed addressing anyway.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 12:43:28 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 12:35:40 PM
I don't know if that's true but this super 8 also address some issues that needed addressing anyway.

What issues are being addressed ? I'm at a loss.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on February 28, 2017, 12:44:28 PM
This is what the recent changes (last 2 years) will mean for club football in Tyrone in 2018:

County minors are not allowed to play for the club seniors until Tyrone are beat in minor championship (somewhere between end of May and end of August)
County minors are not allowed to train with the club at minor or senior level for the same period
17 year olds are not allowed to play for the club seniors/reserves
County Under 20s will be preparing for a summer championship match thus not training with the club and probably missing games for friendlies etc at the managers wishes.
County seniors will be playing O'Fiach Cup, McKenna Cup, National League, Ulster Championship and Super 8s if they qualify as expected. All of this has to be squeezed in by end of August.
In Tyrone there are usually 5 starred games to accommodate county players and they then play the rest of the club league games. Where are these club games going to be fitted into a compressed schedule? There wont be much of a gap between end of league and start of Ulster championship and between Ulster championship games and then on to qualifiers/super 8s.
The answer is there will be very little if any opportunity to play for the club.

For people who say that these proposals will help club football I think you don't understand the reality of the situation. Personally I have no time for the county scene any more but I know lots of people who go to county games that have no allegiance to any club. The fixtures makers in Tyrone already have a nightmare, we don't know the dates of any league or championship matches in any divisions and normally don't know what is happening from one week to the next. 2018 is going to be an absolute nightmare and it is only when we are going through it that people will realise the extent of the problem.

Anybody who can come back to me during/after the 2018 club season in Tyrone and can tell me any different to the nightmare scenario above I will be glad to say I was wrong.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on February 28, 2017, 12:48:12 PM
MYTHS

That super 8 is for the benefit of Club football.
That it is for the benefit of the weaker counties.
That it is for the benefit of the players.
That it makes it harder for Kerry/Dublin to win AI titles.
That Dublin would be asked to play outside Croker in Super 8.

REALITIES


Croker needs more big games to satisfy Vendors, Corporate Boxes, Sky TV, Dublin Media.
Dublin will only play Super 8 game outside Croker if game is a dead Rubber.
Leading counties Dublin/Kerry/Tyrone/Donegal/Mayo now get three chances.
To play games week in week out over the months of July and August needs huge player resources.
There is the cost on the fan?
The disruption of Holidays.
It's alright for Zulu and his fellow Dubs who will have all this on his doorstep with little peripheral cost or time.
How many backdoor routes can you create for to get a AI winner?

We already have all the Good teams playing each other in Division One of the League.
This is the Cup! Is the Cup not supposed to be Knockout?


The Reality is that the GAA want to Milk the Dublin Cash cow! When they are looking at the Big games they are looking at how many of the Good teams they can get playing Dublin and filling Croke Park.

Consecutive Draws between Mayo and Dublin have shown them the real money that can be mopped up from this.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 12:54:02 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on February 28, 2017, 12:48:12 PM
MYTHS

That super 8 is for the benefit of Club football.
That it is for the benefit of the weaker counties.
That it is for the benefit of the players.
That it makes it harder for Kerry/Dublin to win AI titles.
That Dublin would be asked to play outside Croker in Super 8.

REALITIES


Croker needs more big games to satisfy Vendors, Corporate Boxes, Sky TV, Dublin Media.
Dublin will only play Super 8 game outside Croker if game is a dead Rubber.
Leading counties Dublin/Kerry/Tyrone/Donegal/Mayo now get three chances.
To play games week in week out over the months of July and August needs huge player resources.
There is the cost on the fan?
The disruption of Holidays.
It's alright for Zulu and his fellow Dubs who will have all this on his doorstep with little peripheral cost or time.
How many backdoor routes can you create for to get a AI winner?

We already have all the Good teams playing each other in Division One of the League.
This is the Cup! Is the Cup not supposed to be Knockout?


The Reality is that the GAA want to Milk the Dublin Cash cow! When they are looking at the Big games they are looking at how many of the Good teams they can get playing Dublin and filling Croke Park.

Consecutive Draws between Mayo and Dublin have shown them the real money that can be mopped up from this.

Spot on. Seems about right.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 12:54:40 PM
We've removed replays outside of provincial and All Ireland finals and moved the championship forward to August so freeing up September. We have increased the number of high profile games at the business end of the championship, brought big games to provincial venues and helped to address the imbalances between the way Munster champions get to an All Ireland and the Ulster ones do. We have a championship that trundles on until maybe QF stage before we get any notable games and even then it's often SF stage. So we now have a better championship, less gaps between games, more time for clubs after championship. We also saw congress stick to their guns on U17 players which will also eventually help schedule club games.

As I said, as everyone who supports this says, this isn't the solution to our problems but it is part of a movement towards a better format that hopefully will address most of our problems.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 01:07:32 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 12:54:40 PM
We've removed replays outside of provincial and All Ireland finals and moved the championship forward to August so freeing up September. We have increased the number of high profile games at the business end of the championship, brought big games to provincial venues and helped to address the imbalances between the way Munster champions get to an All Ireland and the Ulster ones do. We have a championship that trundles on until maybe QF stage before we get any notable games and even then it's often SF stage. So we now have a better championship, less gaps between games, more time for clubs after championship. We also saw congress stick to their guns on U17 players which will also eventually help schedule club games.

As I said, as everyone who supports this says, this isn't the solution to our problems but it is part of a movement towards a better format that hopefully will address most of our problems.

The removal of replays is was not part of the motion on super 8s.
Introduced a round of dead rubber games at the business end of the championship.
Made it easier on the Munster finalists giving them an additional chance.
Only 2 counties are affected in September anyway.
So I'll ask again what issues does the super 8 FIX.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on February 28, 2017, 01:09:23 PM
Zulu, its a great proposal for Dublin, Kerry, Mayo county teams who will probably make the super 8 every year. Its a terrible proposal for their club sides who have county footballers though.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on February 28, 2017, 01:13:17 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 08:49:51 AM
You're proving my position by again and it's far from just Dubs supporting this. But you ask about Waterford and the like, ok what's your solution then? Duffy, nor anyone else said this was the solution to all our issues but I'd like to hear how we can keep the provincials and provide the weaker teams more games, in the height of summer no less???

So, screenexile let's hear your proposal that provides the weaker teams meaningful games in the height of summer and gives the clubs more time with their IC players as well.

Move the league to summertime and qualification for the all Ireland series is based on league position. Provincial winners also qualify for the all Ireland series. All run off over say 4 months. Club games played in the first half of the year.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on February 28, 2017, 01:22:14 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 12:54:40 PM
We've removed replays outside of provincial and All Ireland finals and moved the championship forward to August so freeing up September. We have increased the number of high profile games at the business end of the championship, brought big games to provincial venues and helped to address the imbalances between the way Munster champions get to an All Ireland and the Ulster ones do. We have a championship that trundles on until maybe QF stage before we get any notable games and even then it's often SF stage. So we now have a better championship, less gaps between games, more time for clubs after championship. We also saw congress stick to their guns on U17 players which will also eventually help schedule club games.

As I said, as everyone who supports this says, this isn't the solution to our problems but it is part of a movement towards a better format that hopefully will address most of our problems.

Stay quiet you, Dub. :)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: mrdeeds on February 28, 2017, 02:45:10 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 12:54:40 PM
We've removed replays outside of provincial and All Ireland finals and moved the championship forward to August so freeing up September. We have increased the number of high profile games at the business end of the championship, brought big games to provincial venues and helped to address the imbalances between the way Munster champions get to an All Ireland and the Ulster ones do. We have a championship that trundles on until maybe QF stage before we get any notable games and even then it's often SF stage. So we now have a better championship, less gaps between games, more time for clubs after championship. We also saw congress stick to their guns on U17 players which will also eventually help schedule club games.

As I said, as everyone who supports this says, this isn't the solution to our problems but it is part of a movement towards a better format that hopefully will address most of our problems.

Ulster teams still at diaadvantage. They will still have tough games to get there and need to peak earlier than others while Mayo Kerry and Dublin are guaranteed to get there and can peak later.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on February 28, 2017, 03:15:20 PM
There are over 200 games played in the 2 months it takes to run off the NFL.
What's the equivalent stat for the football championship?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: LeoMc on February 28, 2017, 03:19:49 PM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:52:25 AM
Quote from: LeoMc on February 28, 2017, 10:44:30 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 10:32:58 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 09:49:30 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:43:01 AM
Quote from: ballinaman on February 28, 2017, 09:30:01 AM
Quote from: ha ha derry on February 28, 2017, 09:18:36 AM
I don't see any right minded player or manager wanting to play three extra matches at that stage of a competition. No benefit to the teams. increased injury risk and fatigue when you least need it.
Shouldn't be a problem if the mid week training is adjusted accordingly. However, with the amount of dinosaurs still taking sessions there might be problems...workrate wasn't high enough last Saturday lads, let's train the bollox off ye Wednesday to get us right for next Saturday..that'll do the trick.

So you reach the last eight in the championship and you're telling me that you would rather play three matches rather than one match to get to the semi final ???
If you told a team in June that they had to play no games and that they'd go straight into the All-Ireland final I'd say they'd take that too.

The point is that players want to play more games during the summer months. It also makes it a more level playing field by making the path to the final for the likes of Dublin and Kerry more difficult. That's two problems that the Super 8 solves. If it creates a problem elsewhere then fair enough. But the claim is that the proposals tried to address some of the issues that GAA people had with the current system.

So do club players (the GAA majority).

Bringing the games forward addresses this. Even clubs in successful counties get September back. Those outside the 8 have July / August for their club games also.

All but two counties had September anyway.  ;)
That is what I was judging success on.  :P
The next 6 also get a couple of weeks of August back.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 03:22:45 PM
Mr. Deeds, that's what you get when you stick to provincial championships, unless the Munster teams improve.  Not much you can do without scrapping the provincials.

The Trap, how do you mean it's bad for club with county players?

Ha ha Derry, there may be dead rubber games granted. But could you not try to make your argument balanced by saying "might be" instead of implying they're a certainty?
Munster champions get a second chance but will still encounter more difficult games en route to the final. Can you also accept this?
Clubs of the six teams not making the semi-finals will also get their players back earlier.

From the Bunker is in WUM territory so I won't encourage him/her.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 04:14:54 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 28, 2017, 01:22:14 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 12:54:40 PM
We've removed replays outside of provincial and All Ireland finals and moved the championship forward to August so freeing up September. We have increased the number of high profile games at the business end of the championship, brought big games to provincial venues and helped to address the imbalances between the way Munster champions get to an All Ireland and the Ulster ones do. We have a championship that trundles on until maybe QF stage before we get any notable games and even then it's often SF stage. So we now have a better championship, less gaps between games, more time for clubs after championship. We also saw congress stick to their guns on U17 players which will also eventually help schedule club games.

As I said, as everyone who supports this says, this isn't the solution to our problems but it is part of a movement towards a better format that hopefully will address most of our problems.

Stay quiet you, Dub. :)

Yeah, I'm not sure why I'm labelled a Dub!! And a game in CP will cost me more time and money than most in Ireland - on my bloody doorstep!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on February 28, 2017, 04:18:00 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on February 28, 2017, 03:15:20 PM
There are over 200 games played in the 2 months it takes to run off the NFL.
What's the equivalent stat for the football championship?
Around 60/62 games played over almost 5 months.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 04:28:15 PM
It appears to me that most of the criticism is based on the fact it's not perfect but if that's the baseline then we're better off keeping it as we are and complaining our way through the championships. There's no point in proposing what mcdanger2 said, even though I'd agree with much of it but it won't get through congress. There is little you can do for the weaker teams if you keep the provincials and it's extremely difficult to do much more for the clubs as long as many club players play two codes and some two levels. But making the changes required there won't get the support necessary either.

I think there is a lot in this proposal and it does help FIX a poor championship structure.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: JoG2 on February 28, 2017, 04:52:12 PM
Quote from: The Trap on February 28, 2017, 12:44:28 PM
This is what the recent changes (last 2 years) will mean for club football in Tyrone in 2018:

County minors are not allowed to play for the club seniors until Tyrone are beat in minor championship (somewhere between end of May and end of August)
County minors are not allowed to train with the club at minor or senior level for the same period
17 year olds are not allowed to play for the club seniors/reserves
County Under 20s will be preparing for a summer championship match thus not training with the club and probably missing games for friendlies etc at the managers wishes.
County seniors will be playing O'Fiach Cup, McKenna Cup, National League, Ulster Championship and Super 8s if they qualify as expected. All of this has to be squeezed in by end of August.
In Tyrone there are usually 5 starred games to accommodate county players and they then play the rest of the club league games. Where are these club games going to be fitted into a compressed schedule? There wont be much of a gap between end of league and start of Ulster championship and between Ulster championship games and then on to qualifiers/super 8s.
The answer is there will be very little if any opportunity to play for the club.

For people who say that these proposals will help club football I think you don't understand the reality of the situation. Personally I have no time for the county scene any more but I know lots of people who go to county games that have no allegiance to any club. The fixtures makers in Tyrone already have a nightmare, we don't know the dates of any league or championship matches in any divisions and normally don't know what is happening from one week to the next. 2018 is going to be an absolute nightmare and it is only when we are going through it that people will realise the extent of the problem.

Anybody who can come back to me during/after the 2018 club season in Tyrone and can tell me any different to the nightmare scenario above I will be glad to say I was wrong.

just to be clear, if a player has turned 17 the calendar year before the 2017 league / championship ie 31st December 1999 or before, they can play senior club.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Avondhu star on February 28, 2017, 07:20:10 PM
Quote from: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 12:54:40 PM
We've removed replays outside of provincial and All Ireland finals and moved the championship forward to August so freeing up September. We have increased the number of high profile games at the business end of the championship, brought big games to provincial venues and helped to address the imbalances between the way Munster champions get to an All Ireland and the Ulster ones do. We have a championship that trundles on until maybe QF stage before we get any notable games and even then it's often SF stage. So we now have a better championship, less gaps between games, more time for clubs after championship. We also saw congress stick to their guns on U17 players which will also eventually help schedule club games.

As I said, as everyone who supports this says, this isn't the solution to our problems but it is part of a movement towards a better format that hopefully will address most of our problems.

Why dont we have any"notable" games before qf or sf? Because with the exception of the Ulster championship the provincial title is of no value. Dublin Kerry Cork Mayo know that they will in all likelihood be in the quarter finals either front door or back door and adjust their training plans accordingly.
As regards having the All Ireland finals in August its just waving the white flag and handing ovet September to the following June to rugby and soccer on television,newspapers etc
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rodney trotter on February 28, 2017, 07:22:53 PM
Teams could lose the first 2 games and have nothing to play for in the 3rd game. Imagine that non event in Croke Park,
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 07:36:06 PM
But again all your saying is it isn't perfect and the reality is that if we want to cater for two separate codes, have players play at two different levels (club and county) and give everyone enough games and structure to their season then we need to make some very unpopular decisions and change the GAA dramatically.

Since that's not going to happen then this is a reasonable development.


Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on February 28, 2017, 07:49:12 PM
According to the GAA document, The Order of Games in each Group has been pre-determined as follows, presuming 2 points for a win and 1 for a draw:

Round 1
Team 1 v Team 2 in Croke Park
Team 3 v Team 4 in Croke Park

Round 2
Team 1 v Team 3 or 4  Home advantage for provincial champions.
Team 2 V Team 3 or 4  Home advantage for provincial champions.

Round 3
Team 1 v Team 3 or 4  Home advantage for Team 3 or 4.
Team 2 v Team 3 or 4  Home advantage for Team 3 or 4.

The winner of the Team 1 v Team 2 will have a big advantage and winning the Round 2 game at home will see them through.  Does that leave the final game away from home a dead rubber?  Or maybe play to avoid a "bigger" team in the other group, depending on results from that group?

Loser of Team 1 v Team 2 will need two wins to advance so no dead rubber in Round 3.  Of course, their opponent in Round 3 may have lost both games to that point which would leave them nothing to play for in that final game.

Would 3 points for a win make a difference?  Is a three-way tie possible...outside of every game finishing level...or is a two-way tie for second place most likely?


Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on February 28, 2017, 07:55:43 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 03:22:45 PM
Mr. Deeds, that's what you get when you stick to provincial championships, unless the Munster teams improve.  Not much you can do without scrapping the provincials.

The Trap, how do you mean it's bad for club with county players?

Ha ha Derry, there may be dead rubber games granted. But could you not try to make your argument balanced by saying "might be" instead of implying they're a certainty?
Munster champions get a second chance but will still encounter more difficult games en route to the final. Can you also accept this?
Clubs of the six teams not making the semi-finals will also get their players back earlier.

From the Bunker is in WUM territory so I won't encourage him/her.

I'm not on a wind up! I'm disgusted with the Super 8! It creates more problems than it solves. I hate the thought that the stronger teams now get a third chance. The advantages that were available to the stronger teams have become bigger advantages. Dublin come out of this smelling of roses! Their big squad, home games and professional set-up will suit the rapid fire nature of the games.  Kerry/Tyrone/Mayo/Donegal will hold their own. Counties like Monaghan who are punching above their weight would be stretched!

But hey, Zulu who is bored out his mind with the Leinster Championship needs a bit stimulation on his doorstep! So lets create a longer version of what we already have over a shorter space of time.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on February 28, 2017, 08:32:29 PM
I'm not arguing for the Trap, but I do think that clubs with county players will be punished when the county leagues are going on.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 09:03:43 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on February 28, 2017, 07:55:43 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 03:22:45 PM
Mr. Deeds, that's what you get when you stick to provincial championships, unless the Munster teams improve.  Not much you can do without scrapping the provincials.

The Trap, how do you mean it's bad for club with county players?

Ha ha Derry, there may be dead rubber games granted. But could you not try to make your argument balanced by saying "might be" instead of implying they're a certainty?
Munster champions get a second chance but will still encounter more difficult games en route to the final. Can you also accept this?
Clubs of the six teams not making the semi-finals will also get their players back earlier.

From the Bunker is in WUM territory so I won't encourage him/her.

I'm not on a wind up! I'm disgusted with the Super 8! It creates more problems than it solves. I hate the thought that the stronger teams now get a third chance. The advantages that were available to the stronger teams have become bigger advantages. Dublin come out of this smelling of roses! Their big squad, home games and professional set-up will suit the rapid fire nature of the games.  Kerry/Tyrone/Mayo/Donegal will hold their own. Counties like Monaghan who are punching above their weight would be stretched!

But hey, Zulu who is bored out his mind with the Leinster Championship needs a bit stimulation on his doorstep! So lets create a longer version of what we already have over a shorter space of time.

Just for clarity, I'm not a Dub or living in Dublin but I am, like most everybody else, board out of my mind with the championship. The league is brilliant thankfully and gives everybody something meaningful.

FoB unless you can suggest something better and that will pass congress then I don't understand where you're coming from at all.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on February 28, 2017, 09:08:59 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on February 28, 2017, 07:49:12 PM
According to the GAA document, The Order of Games in each Group has been pre-determined as follows, presuming 2 points for a win and 1 for a draw:

Round 1
Team 1 v Team 2 in Croke Park
Team 3 v Team 4 in Croke Park

Round 2
Team 1 v Team 3 or 4  Home advantage for provincial champions.
Team 2 V Team 3 or 4  Home advantage for provincial champions.

Round 3
Team 1 v Team 3 or 4  Home advantage for Team 3 or 4.
Team 2 v Team 3 or 4  Home advantage for Team 3 or 4.

The winner of the Team 1 v Team 2 will have a big advantage and winning the Round 2 game at home will see them through.  Does that leave the final game away from home a dead rubber?  Or maybe play to avoid a "bigger" team in the other group, depending on results from that group?

Loser of Team 1 v Team 2 will need two wins to advance so no dead rubber in Round 3.  Of course, their opponent in Round 3 may have lost both games to that point which would leave them nothing to play for in that final game.

Would 3 points for a win make a difference?  Is a three-way tie possible...outside of every game finishing level...or is a two-way tie for second place most likely?

Regardless of the order of games, if one or two teams enter the final round having lost both previous games, there'll be one or two dead rubbers. Ideally, all four teams would have won one game entering the last round but that's probably unlikely unless it's a very competitive group.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Avondhu star on March 01, 2017, 08:34:32 AM
Quote from: Zulu on February 28, 2017, 09:03:43 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on February 28, 2017, 07:55:43 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on February 28, 2017, 03:22:45 PM
Mr. Deeds, that's what you get when you stick to provincial championships, unless the Munster teams improve.  Not much you can do without scrapping the provincials.

The Trap, how do you mean it's bad for club with county players?

Ha ha Derry, there may be dead rubber games granted. But could you not try to make your argument balanced by saying "might be" instead of implying they're a certainty?
Munster champions get a second chance but will still encounter more difficult games en route to the final. Can you also accept this?
Clubs of the six teams not making the semi-finals will also get their players back earlier.

From the Bunker is in WUM territory so I won't encourage him/her.

I'm not on a wind up! I'm disgusted with the Super 8! It creates more problems than it solves. I hate the thought that the stronger teams now get a third chance. The advantages that were available to the stronger teams have become bigger advantages. Dublin come out of this smelling of roses! Their big squad, home games and professional set-up will suit the rapid fire nature of the games.  Kerry/Tyrone/Mayo/Donegal will hold their own. Counties like Monaghan who are punching above their weight would be stretched!

But hey, Zulu who is bored out his mind with the Leinster Championship needs a bit stimulation on his doorstep! So lets create a longer version of what we already have over a shorter space of time.

Just for clarity, I'm not a Dub or living in Dublin but I am, like most everybody else, board out of my mind with the championship. The league is brilliant thankfully and gives everybody something meaningful.

FoB unless you can suggest something better and that will pass congress then I don't understand where you're coming from at all.
I agree with you. I find the league a lot more enjoyable. Players are fitter now than years ago and there are a lot more  competitive games. What good is Dublin v Wicklow or Kerry v Waterford in the championship? We have to wait all summer for a decent game usually a semi final. Even the Qfs are thrown up mismatches
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on March 01, 2017, 08:48:17 AM
The league certainly undergone a perception shift. The Championship is still the holy grail, and while you have lads like Liam Kearns downplaying it and saying the Chammpionship is the main focus, I think most managers and players understand that to play the long game, consistently competitive in championship, you have to be operating at a higher level in the league.

If we made your league finishing position a factor in what stage of the championship you entered, you might have another boost.

In fairness TG4 and Eir have also added greatly to the appeal of the league.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on March 01, 2017, 09:16:52 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 01, 2017, 08:48:17 AM
The league certainly undergone a perception shift. The Championship is still the holy grail, and while you have lads like Liam Kearns downplaying it and saying the Chammpionship is the main focus, I think most managers and players understand that to play the long game, consistently competitive in championship, you have to be operating at a higher level in the league.

If we made your league finishing position a factor in what stage of the championship you entered, you might have another boost.

In fairness TG4 and Eir have also added greatly to the appeal of the league.
I was thinking something the same the other night in bed AZ. Kind of like the FA cup in England, Div 3 and 4 enter the 1st round, 8 winners and Div 2 in second round 8 winners and Div 1 in 3rd round. It would be open draw first team home advantage etc. Gives all counties incentive to move up the leagues. I know the provincials would be rendered useless, but something would have to give.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on March 01, 2017, 09:26:29 AM
The league is a great competition. Apart from the occasional game in D4, almost all games are between fairly evenly matched teams
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: munchkin on March 01, 2017, 10:06:56 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on March 01, 2017, 09:16:52 AM
I was thinking something the same the other night in bed AZ. Kind of like the FA cup in England, Div 3 and 4 enter the 1st round, 8 winners and Div 2 in second round 8 winners and Div 1 in 3rd round. It would be open draw first team home advantage etc. Gives all counties incentive to move up the leagues. I know the provincials would be rendered useless, but something would have to give.
i was thinking along the same lines, except that winning the province gives you a wild card to a later stage  if you havent already automatically qualified as a div1 team.
Similar to the way that winning the champions league might kick out a 4th place team in England or Germany.

it will NEVER pass congress without some sort of direct qualification or benefit from winning the province which is why something like that would be needed.
(now.... that the format of the championship requires congress approval to allow it to be written into the rule book  is another issue !)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 01, 2017, 10:21:37 AM
Genuine question for everyone, but especially for those against the Super 8; what do the the weaker counties want? I'm talking primarily about the counties in Division 4. Does anyone know anyone involved, be it players, management etc?

We've heard that they want the provincials kept and that they don't want a tiered championship. Then we hear the Wicklow manager advocating a strike in light of what was passed at congress.

I'm just wondering what kind up set-up they have in mind that would right the wrong of what was passed.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on March 01, 2017, 10:24:39 AM
I think they want to be in the All Ireland championship proper, and they want the Provincials, but they want more games. That's going to be very tricky to do. 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 01, 2017, 10:41:55 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 01, 2017, 10:24:39 AM
I think they want to be in the All Ireland championship proper, and they want the Provincials, but they want more games. That's going to be very tricky to do.
Yeah that seems to be it in high level terms but I wonder have the any ideas on it. Is a round-robin at the beginning of the championship to qualify for the latter stages a runner at all I wonder?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 01, 2017, 10:51:37 AM
I threw out a suggestion last year that
6 lowest teams in NFL play for the AI JFC, winners get into AI SFC.
Next 6 lowest play AI IFC, winners get into AI SFC.
12 teams who don't make Provincials Finals play Round 1 AI SFC
6 winners of Round 1 plus the Junior and Inter winners play the 8 Provincials Finalists. Provincial Champions seeded and get home venues.
Of course if the NFL was transferred to Summer and became the Championship........
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 01, 2017, 10:55:33 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 01, 2017, 10:51:37 AM
I threw out a suggestion last year that
6 lowest teams in NFL play for the AI JFC, winners get into AI SFC.
Next 6 lowest play AI IFC, winners get into AI SFC.
12 teams who don't make Provincials Finals play Round 1 AI SFC
6 winners of Round 1 plus the Junior and Inter winners play the 8 Provincials Finalists. Provincial Champions seeded and get home venues.
Of course if the NFL was transferred to Summer and became the Championship........
I remember it and thought it was a great idea, although difficult to fit in to the calendar with the league as it is.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fuzzman on March 01, 2017, 11:04:32 AM
I always wondered could we somehow use the league (Div1) and the provincials to decide which teams make the last 8. What I mean is say you took the top 4 teams in Div 1 and they qualify for the last 8 and then they sit out the provincials.
Then you play the provincials as usual without the big guns. It's a bit like the premier league teams already in the 3rd round of the FA cup.

So last year's top 4 were Dublin, Kerry, Roscommon and Donegal.
Then you would probably have got Westmeath, Tipperary, Galway and Tyrone from the provinces. Mayo & Clare missing out.

Pros. Gives the league a lot more importance and good reward for 4 best teams
         Gives lesser counties a better chance of winning their provincial championship especially in Leinster & Munster 
         No need for all the qualifier matches so more time for club football.

Cons. What if two teams from the same province say Cork & Kerry only leaving 3 in Munster
          Teams qualified through league will have no games until July.

Of course there would be some problems with it but at least it could give the provincials a new lease of life with the usual suspects of Dublin, Mayo and Kerry out of them to give other teams a chance.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on March 01, 2017, 11:32:46 AM
Another Con to that is winning a Munster without Cork and Kerry in it means feck all.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on March 01, 2017, 11:38:17 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on March 01, 2017, 10:21:37 AM
Genuine question for everyone, but especially for those against the Super 8; what do the the weaker counties want? I'm talking primarily about the counties in Division 4. Does anyone know anyone involved, be it players, management etc?

We've heard that they want the provincials kept and that they don't want a tiered championship. Then we hear the Wicklow manager advocating a strike in light of what was passed at congress.

I'm just wondering what kind up set-up they have in mind that would right the wrong of what was passed.
Then you often hear an argument from weaker counties that round robin series inherently favour the strong teams because they have stronger panels.

The arguments are labyrinthine.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on March 01, 2017, 11:47:59 AM
Which is Zulu's point all along. So many facets.

Also my point, so many 'problems' so how on earth do you solve them, or who even identifies what the biggest ones are?

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on March 01, 2017, 11:54:12 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 01, 2017, 11:47:59 AM
Which is Zulu's point all along. So many facets.

Also my point, so many 'problems' so how on earth do you solve them, or who even identifies what the biggest ones are?

It's a bit like politics.

You get individuals claiming to speak for "the people".

When they clearly don't, because "the people" are of many different opinions, and deeply divided.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Main Street on March 01, 2017, 12:14:05 PM
The starting point of the AI are the provincials.
The qualifiers have addressed the issue to a good extent of the inequities in the orig system and the continued success of back door teams is a testament to that  success.The prov winner was rewarded by getting straight through to the 1/4s and was seeded (a theoretical advantage).

In this new system the provincial winners are even more advantaged in the last 8 draw.
However in the example draw for 2016, Dublin would have had to travel to Tyrone, an interesting hypothetical  to say the least.  Maybe not all about this new format is as cut and dried, as predetermined as it might appear.

Calling any part of a competition super this or super that, is sick bucket territory, akin to rugby hype (both codes). iIhope this does not mean pre game hype, nausea educing fireworks etc, ear bashing decibel level music, just because some market survey indicated that its good for the game.


  It's the GAA,  it could be called the Eightsome.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ha ha derry on March 01, 2017, 12:15:52 PM
The 13 day rule being reduced to 6 day rule would be a big benefit to clubs and county panellists. would free up almost a month during the summer whilst still allowing the county programmes to continue unhindered.
County players have no bother playing on a weekly basis during the league so shouldn't be a problem.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on March 01, 2017, 12:16:24 PM
Can they not just keep calling it 'The All-Ireland Series'?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on March 01, 2017, 12:26:39 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 01, 2017, 12:14:05 PM


Calling any part of a competition super this or super that, is sick bucket territory, akin to rugby hype (both codes). iIhope this does not mean pre game hype, nausea educing fireworks etc, ear bashing decibel level music, just because some market survey indicated that its good for the game.

"The humble little round robin series."
"The League of Counties"
"The All-Ireland Merry-go-round"
"The G(AA)8
"The 8 Balls"
"The Octagon"
"The Dead Rubber Series"
"The 8 wonder"
"Who 8 all the pies?"
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 01, 2017, 12:32:23 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on March 01, 2017, 12:16:24 PM
Can they not just keep calling it 'The All-Ireland Series'?

That would be the right name for it.
You'd have the All Ireland Qualifiers
The All Ireland Series
And the All  Ireland Championship.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 01, 2017, 12:42:39 PM
Where did the Super 8 slogan come from? Media? I assumed it wasn't an official title.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on March 01, 2017, 12:50:43 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on March 01, 2017, 12:42:39 PM
Where did the Super 8 slogan come from? Media? I assumed it wasn't an official title.

Should be Elite Eight anyway. Like March Madness
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on March 01, 2017, 01:04:38 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 01, 2017, 12:50:43 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on March 01, 2017, 12:42:39 PM
Where did the Super 8 slogan come from? Media? I assumed it wasn't an official title.

Should be Elite Eight anyway. Like March Madness

More like Dublin + the Severely Substandard Seven.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on March 01, 2017, 01:06:45 PM
I'm not a big fan of how this super 8 has come about and it by no means addresses or even attempts to address the big issues within the structure of the fixtures.  But now that its definitely happening and theres not much we can do about it, I for one am looking forward to the group stages to how it all pans out. The first year at least will be exciting.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 01, 2017, 01:12:36 PM
I've read here people say that the League is good? No more than that!  It's ok for a bit of tippey tappey in the Spring! Jez, Mayo have not broke a sweat in the League since 2010. Kerry don't give a sh1t until the last couple of games. Donegal and Tyrone have been relegated and promoted. And then there is the Dubs who with the biggest squad and all home games at the knock out stage have just waltzed to title after title. The League finals have been shambolic the last couple of years.

All the rest bar Cork and maybe Monaghan are temporary residents of division One.

The GAA have created a monster in DUBLIN GAA. This will not go away! The SUPER 8 will only make Dublin bigger and bigger. Until they get so big they will be like Celtic in the Scottish league (If they are not already?).

You can dress it up anyway you like!


It is said there are no other solutions to the problems. So what do the GAA do? Introduce Super 8 meaning there are more games in a smaller time frame and give teams another chance to lose and we call this a solution?

The GAA want it both ways they want the professional prices they charge for their Corporate Boxes, their Sky deals and their ticket prices. While asking more and more from Amateur players. 'Butter on both sides'

The expectation on Amateur players is so high, that many players are opting out. This will only add to it.

No Dublin games in the Championship will be played outside Croker in the Super 8 unless its a dead rubber game.

The fans will soon start voting with there feet. They have started already.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Main Street on March 01, 2017, 01:46:11 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on March 01, 2017, 12:26:39 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 01, 2017, 12:14:05 PM


Calling any part of a competition super this or super that, is sick bucket territory, akin to rugby hype (both codes). iIhope this does not mean pre game hype, nausea educing fireworks etc, ear bashing decibel level music, just because some market survey indicated that its good for the game.

"The humble little round robin series."
"The League of Counties"
"The All-Ireland Merry-go-round"
"The G(AA)8
"The 8 Balls"
"The Octagon"
"The Dead Rubber Series"
"The 8 wonder"
"Who 8 all the pies?"

The AI final        -   The Super Croke

when Mayo lose  -  The Super Choke  (sorry for that)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: vallankumous on March 01, 2017, 01:49:44 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 27, 2017, 08:03:53 PM
Why can't they play the 2 groups the same weekend - 2 games Saturday, 2 Sunday.

Everything about this points to revenue. That's the answer to almost all the questions.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on March 01, 2017, 01:51:04 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 01, 2017, 01:12:36 PM
I've read here people say that the League is good? No more than that!  It's ok for a bit of tippey tappey in the Spring! Jez, Mayo have not broke a sweat in the League since 2010. Kerry don't give a sh1t until the last couple of games. Donegal and Tyrone have been relegated and promoted. And then there is the Dubs who with the biggest squad and all home games at the knock out stage have just waltzed to title after title. The League finals have been shambolic the last couple of years.

All the rest bar Cork and maybe Monaghan are temporary residents of division One.

The GAA have created a monster in DUBLIN GAA. This will not go away! The SUPER 8 will only make Dublin bigger and bigger. Until they get so big they will be like Celtic in the Scottish league (If they are not already?).

You can dress it up anyway you like!


It is said there are no other solutions to the problems. So what do the GAA do? Introduce Super 8 meaning there are more games in a smaller time frame and give teams another chance to lose and we call this a solution?

The GAA want it both ways they want the professional prices they charge for their Corporate Boxes, their Sky deals and their ticket prices. While asking more and more from Amateur players. 'Butter on both sides'

The expectation on Amateur players is so high, that many players are opting out. This will only add to it.

No Dublin games in the Championship will be played outside Croker in the Super 8 unless its a dead rubber game.

The fans will soon start voting with there feet. They have started already.

I'm not convinced by the change particularly on club football in the counties who make the All Ireland final. For most counties there season will be over by June/July and plenty of time to play club games.

But a lot of what you are saying is very over the top. I don't see how this will make Dublin much stronger. They currently are walking Leinster and then have one game to get to the semis. The new system should in theory make it tougher for them to get through (though I'm sure they still will). I've do doubt they will play one game outside croke park and no idea why you would be so confident that they won't.

Are the Dubs any more dominant now than Kerry were in the 80's? I predict they will actually slip back a little over the next few years. They will still pick up more all Irelands but wont be dominant.

In relation to the number of games a few more actually wont do any harm. Currently county players train from December to July (8 months) and ignoring pre season comps used for experimentation only play 7 league games and 4 to 5 championship games max. Very few for the training done.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 01, 2017, 02:13:19 PM
You don't see how Dublin will get stronger from Super 8? Really?

More home games?

No disruption in relation to traveling for games.

More sponsorship?

Opportunity to have a bad game after Provincial win?

Keeps bigger squad happy with games?

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on March 01, 2017, 02:41:27 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 01, 2017, 02:13:19 PM
You don't see how Dublin will get stronger from Super 8? Really?

More home games?

They currently play 100% of games on from leinster semi at home. Not sure how this will make a big difference and will actually bring them out of croke park at the business end of the season.


No disruption in relation to traveling for games.

They don't have any disruption currently and haven't for the last 100 years (bar one or two exceptions) at the business end of the season. So again not sure how super 8 will change that.


More sponsorship?

Maybe slightly more but would imagine it wont be a massive factor given its only 2 extra games.

Opportunity to have a bad game after Provincial win?

Wont this be the same for all provincial champions? Currently many people think the system is unfair the fact they don't get a second chance. Maybe it'll add more meaning to the provincial championships.

Keeps bigger squad happy with games?

It's hard to tell how strong the squad is until actually tested and I don't think there'll be much rotation for the sake of it at that stage of the year.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on March 01, 2017, 02:46:28 PM
Unless they split Dublin or introduce a handicap I'm not sure there is any system that will reduce their chances of winning the All Ireland. They are strong enough that no matter what system is used they'll get to the semi's most years. After that they may be beaten by one of the top teams. I'm not sure what people want but at the end of the day the best team on average will win and should win the all Ireland.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on March 01, 2017, 03:04:54 PM
Quote from: Syferus on March 01, 2017, 01:04:38 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 01, 2017, 12:50:43 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on March 01, 2017, 12:42:39 PM
Where did the Super 8 slogan come from? Media? I assumed it wasn't an official title.

Should be Elite Eight anyway. Like March Madness

More like Dublin + the Severely Substandard Seven.

Snow blue and the 7 dwarfs
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fuzzman on March 01, 2017, 04:13:04 PM
If we apply the teams from this year's last 8 to the new set up for next season I think we come with these groups and fixtures.
Group 1   Group 2
Tyrone      Kerry
Dub          Galway
Tipp          Donegal
Clare         Mayo   

Round 1
Dub v Tyrone in Croker
Tipp v Clare in Croker

Round 2
Tyrone v Tipp in Tyrone
Dub v Clare in Croker

Round 3
Clare v Tyrone in Clare
Tipp v Dublin in Tipp

Possible Final table
Dublin
Tyrone
Tipp
Clare

Round 1
Kerry v Galway in Croker
Donegal v Mayo in Croker

Round 2
Kerry v Donegal in Kerry
Galway v Mayo in Galway

Round 3
Kerry v Mayo in Mayo
Galway v Donegal in Donegal

Possible Final table
Kerry
Mayo
Donegal
Galway

So the semis would be Kerry v Tyrone and Mayo v Dublin.

With Dublin being so dominant lately you would imagine with the new system that even if they were to lose to a provincial winner in Croker or they were to lose away from home to a big gun in the qualifiers like Mayo, Kerry or Tyrone who lost their provincial final, it would still be very likely they will come 2nd in their group and so always be making the semi final. It will only be in years where they have a Kerry, Mayo and Tyrone/Donegal in their group that they will struggle to come out of their group.
Saying that it is probably easier for teams like Tyrone, Kerry and Mayo to play the Dubs in Croker and beat them than it is for other teams to win away from home in Kerry, Mayo or Ulster.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on March 01, 2017, 05:18:00 PM
Some proposals that Aidan O'Rourke has put up on QUB page. As a former player and manager at club and county level and as sports development officer at third level, someone like O'Rourke is in a good position to provide an input. The CPA need to produce some sort of framework that can prove workable. The perfect solution does not exist but I think most people would like to see a split club and county season. The problem will be in trying to convince the bean counters in Croke Park that the GAA needs to become a more participation focussed organisation than a spectator and commercial one. I think this is possible if the county calendar runs in the first half of the year with a greater focus on TV exposure in this period. The club championship has massive potential to be grown as well with a dedicated weekly programme for the second half of the year that keep the games going all year round. 

http://queens.gaa.ie/2017/03/01/proposed-alternative-gaa-calendar/

http://queens.gaa.ie/2017/03/01/proposed-gaa-calendar-continued/
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Scarlet on March 01, 2017, 05:36:50 PM
The CPA are sending an email regarding what they want their members to do and one of the things is to get involved at their clubs and go to meetings.
Now all this BS about the disconnect but if we drill into it, why is the group claiming to be all about club men not acknowledging the fact that they can't influence club delegates?
The GPA also are making noises in support of the GPA but they don't ever make any cases for their members being more available for their clubs as that would upset the county managers.

Here are two player groups who, in the case of the GPA represent 1.5% of the overall playing population, and the other only starting out who also represent the minority of the club men who think they speak for everyone.

The mechanism was there to stop Super 8 by giving the club delegate a mandate to bring it up and make noise when it was being voted on at county board level, and then in turn all the way to congress.
If a county man walked into their club meeting and lay it out their voice would be heard and some counties could have been swayed. But sure with all this disconnect the GPA members couldn't make their club meeting...

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on March 01, 2017, 05:49:51 PM
I'd love to see someone do the GAA equivalent of a TED Talk on championship structures & fixtures.
These are the issues for the club and county player, and here's how we're going to fix them.
It's a confusing mess at the moment.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Avondhu star on March 01, 2017, 06:52:57 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on March 01, 2017, 12:42:39 PM
Where did the Super 8 slogan come from? Media? I assumed it wasn't an official title.

It gels in with Sky Sport Super Sunday. Ideally the All Irelands will be over by the end of August and wont interfere with the Sky Transfer Window Super Countdown.
God forbid that aDublin Kerry final would interfere with the news of Daryl Murphy transferring to Accrington Stanley or Mick McCarthys Ipswich signing Carlos Kickaball from Deportivo
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 01, 2017, 07:35:32 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on March 01, 2017, 02:41:27 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 01, 2017, 02:13:19 PM
You don't see how Dublin will get stronger from Super 8? Really?

More home games?

They currently play 100% of games on from leinster semi at home. Not sure how this will make a big difference and will actually bring them out of croke park at the business end of the season.


Yes, more home games with less pressure in a league type environment!

No disruption in relation to traveling for games.

They don't have any disruption currently and haven't for the last 100 years (bar one or two exceptions) at the business end of the season. So again not sure how super 8 will change that.

While the rest of the teams are trapsing around the country week in week out. The Dubs are playing home games, sleeping in their own beds with little worry of travel itenary and so on.


More sponsorship?

Maybe slightly more but would imagine it wont be a massive factor given its only 2 extra games.

Opportunity to have a bad game after Provincial win?

Wont this be the same for all provincial champions? Currently many people think the system is unfair the fact they don't get a second chance. Maybe it'll add more meaning to the provincial championships.

Of course it will be the same for provincial Champions! But do you realise Dublin may now be beaten twice at home and still win an AI!

Keeps bigger squad happy with games?

It's hard to tell how strong the squad is until actually tested and I don't think there'll be much rotation for the sake of it at that stage of the year.

You don't have to be Einstein to realise how strong Dublins squad is. They won the O'Byrne Cup with their 'C' team!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 01, 2017, 08:51:24 PM
https://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2017/0228/855993-wicklow-boss-backs-strike-over-super-8-proposals/ (https://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2017/0228/855993-wicklow-boss-backs-strike-over-super-8-proposals/)

Wicklow senior football manager Johnny Magee believes that football players should go on strike in response to the so-called Super 8 proposals for Championship football.

The motion to introduce the Super 8 was passed at Congress at the weekend with 76 per cent of the delegates voting to trial the new format for a three-year period.

GPA CEO Dermot Earley spoke out about the new changes on behalf of the inter-county players, stating that there was not proper consultation and that the new format would not help the gulf in standards between the top sides in the country and the weaker counties.

However, the GPA left it late to formulate an opinion on the Super 8 proposals and their views appeared to be sidelined at Congress.

Wicklow boss Magee feels that it's a move that will only benefit the bigger counties and that it will widen the gap further between the haves and the have nots.

"There's only so many times you can kick a dog before it bites back," he said on RTÉ's Game On.

"It suits the so called top teams because it leads to more exposure and advertising, so they're not going to complain about it.

"How are you meant to entice the players to play? By 2 April we [Wicklow] will have played 10 games – that's 10 games in 13 or 14 weeks in the muck of winter football.

"We then played two Championship matches last year on 14 May and on 18 June and then nothing for over five months."

"They missed out on all the summer and where in the fairness and the equality?

"Croke Park are not looking at the so-called weaker teams. To have a game that you love and to be left out in the cold – that's exactly what's happening here."

Johnny Magee‏ @JohnnyMagee06  Feb 25

More Total disrespect&regard 4 club&county players opinion.There is NO game without players! #ALL OUTSTRIKE club&county


The former Dublin defender went even further when speaking to the Irish Examiner and claimed that if he was still a player, he go on strike.

"What do they really expect up in Croke Park?," he asked. "The word strike might sound very strong but at the end of the day the players have voiced their opinion and it's not been listened to. And this is not once, it's happened two years in a row that the GPA has been ignored.

"I feel the players have been disrespected once too often. If I was still a player, my opinion would be that I will go on strike because that's twice now they haven't listened to us."

"I can't see it ending in a nice way. And it's not going to be the fault of players. They feel they've voiced their opinion twice now and been shot down. So where does it end?"

"Something has to change. It keeps going round in circles but at the end of the day it's not going to solve anything."
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on March 01, 2017, 08:56:15 PM
Sure Wicklow are on strike with years now.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 01, 2017, 09:06:16 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 01, 2017, 08:56:15 PM
Sure Wicklow are on strike with years now.
:D ;D
110 at least!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on March 01, 2017, 09:38:16 PM
Utter nonsense from Johnny. What he is actually saying is why aren't Wicklow playing more games in the summer. Ok so, if the system was set up so that the weaker teams were playing less in winter (Spring I think you'll find in reality) and more in the summer then when do club players play Johnny??? Another thing for Johnny and  Wicklow to consider is trying to bloody improve!!! You'll get more summer games if you do that.

The GPA are talking rubbish and the CPA not much better and then we have the paranoid Dub bashers who see everything as a Dub promotion tool and everyone as a Dub.

People calming down and watching how this works out is the way forward.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 01, 2017, 10:56:06 PM
Where are u from Zulu anyway?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Main Street on March 01, 2017, 11:02:11 PM
Quote from: Zulu on March 01, 2017, 09:38:16 PM
Utter nonsense from Johnny. What he is actually saying is why aren't Wicklow playing more games in the summer. Ok so, if the system was set up so that the weaker teams were playing less in winter (Spring I think you'll find in reality) and more in the summer then when do club players play Johnny??? Another thing for Johnny and  Wicklow to consider is trying to bloody improve!!! You'll get more summer games if you do that.

The GPA are talking rubbish and the CPA not much better and then we have the paranoid Dub bashers who see everything as a Dub promotion tool and everyone as a Dub.

People calming down and watching how this works out is the way forward.
Be more respectful to others' opinions and less of that you know the real way forward and all must agree with you, otherwise they're talking rubbish because you are so sure of the way forward. The Wicklow manager has his valid concerns and his valid opinions, just as other people here have their opinions, what we abide by in the end are the rules of congress and observe the test of time.

I am open to the new format but I have my reservations.
The current long drawn out championship format could have been tweaked positivily in different ways re scheduling However the current shortcomings have been used to push this "radical" so called solution which at present is just a questionable theory which might go some way to relieve some of the shortcomings of the current system.
I think the Wicklow manager knows more about how this  can possibly effect his county than you do.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trileacman on March 01, 2017, 11:33:30 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 01, 2017, 11:02:11 PM
Quote from: Zulu on March 01, 2017, 09:38:16 PM
Utter nonsense from Johnny. What he is actually saying is why aren't Wicklow playing more games in the summer. Ok so, if the system was set up so that the weaker teams were playing less in winter (Spring I think you'll find in reality) and more in the summer then when do club players play Johnny??? Another thing for Johnny and  Wicklow to consider is trying to bloody improve!!! You'll get more summer games if you do that.

The GPA are talking rubbish and the CPA not much better and then we have the paranoid Dub bashers who see everything as a Dub promotion tool and everyone as a Dub.

People calming down and watching how this works out is the way forward.
Be more respectful to others' opinions and less of that you know the real way forward and all must agree with you, otherwise they're talking rubbish because you are so sure of the way forward. The Wicklow manager has his valid concerns and his valid opinions, just as other people here have their opinions, what we abide by in the end are the rules of congress and observe the test of time.

I am open to the new format but I have my reservations.
The current long drawn out championship format could have been tweaked positivily in different ways re scheduling However the current shortcomings have been used to push this "radical" so called solution which at present is just a questionable theory which might go some way to relieve some of the shortcomings of the current system.
I think the Wicklow manager knows more about how this  can possibly effect his county than you do.

Agreed. Most of the rebukes centre on the view that  "he should worry about managing Wicklow".

Blaming a manager for Wicklow lack of success is the just being oblivious to the plight of the weaker counties but of course that's a beloved past time of the elite and top brass.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on March 01, 2017, 11:46:05 PM
Quote from: trileacman on March 01, 2017, 11:33:30 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 01, 2017, 11:02:11 PM
Quote from: Zulu on March 01, 2017, 09:38:16 PM
Utter nonsense from Johnny. What he is actually saying is why aren't Wicklow playing more games in the summer. Ok so, if the system was set up so that the weaker teams were playing less in winter (Spring I think you'll find in reality) and more in the summer then when do club players play Johnny??? Another thing for Johnny and  Wicklow to consider is trying to bloody improve!!! You'll get more summer games if you do that.

The GPA are talking rubbish and the CPA not much better and then we have the paranoid Dub bashers who see everything as a Dub promotion tool and everyone as a Dub.

People calming down and watching how this works out is the way forward.
Be more respectful to others' opinions and less of that you know the real way forward and all must agree with you, otherwise they're talking rubbish because you are so sure of the way forward. The Wicklow manager has his valid concerns and his valid opinions, just as other people here have their opinions, what we abide by in the end are the rules of congress and observe the test of time.

I am open to the new format but I have my reservations.
The current long drawn out championship format could have been tweaked positivily in different ways re scheduling However the current shortcomings have been used to push this "radical" so called solution which at present is just a questionable theory which might go some way to relieve some of the shortcomings of the current system.
I think the Wicklow manager knows more about how this  can possibly effect his county than you do.

Agreed. Most of the rebukes centre on the view that  "he should worry about managing Wicklow".

Blaming a manager for Wicklow lack of success is the just being oblivious to the plight of the weaker counties but of course that's a beloved past time of the elite and top brass.

Do you mean respectful in the way Johnny is being respectful by suggesting strikes for minor changes in the season?

By the way, if you read what I said then you'd know I don't claim to know the way forward. In fact, I've repeatedly said there is no perfect way forward. However, it's hard to give credit to a guy saying players should strike because Wicklow aren't getting more games in the summer yet offering no concrete alternative.

My objection is to the ridiculous criticism of a fairly minor change and the abuse genuine GAA men like Pauric Duffy have gotten when there hasn't been one genuine alternative workable solution.

The super 8 isn't the solution but is better than what we have and worth having a look at. 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on March 02, 2017, 02:00:08 AM
Quote
My objection is to the ridiculous criticism of a fairly minor change and the abuse genuine GAA men like Pauric Duffy have gotten when there hasn't been one genuine alternative workable solution.

The super 8 isn't the solution but is better than what we have and worth having a look at
Duffy genuine  ;D

Zulu it seems you are one of those that wanted a change for the sake of change and couldn't care less what half arse change was made so long as the current format was changed.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 02, 2017, 10:33:11 AM
I hope Johnny and everyone else sit down sharpish and thrash this out because the debate is becoming very tiresome.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Main Street on March 02, 2017, 11:25:27 AM
Quote from: Zulu on March 01, 2017, 11:46:05 PM
Quote from: trileacman on March 01, 2017, 11:33:30 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 01, 2017, 11:02:11 PM
Quote from: Zulu on March 01, 2017, 09:38:16 PM
Utter nonsense from Johnny. What he is actually saying is why aren't Wicklow playing more games in the summer. Ok so, if the system was set up so that the weaker teams were playing less in winter (Spring I think you'll find in reality) and more in the summer then when do club players play Johnny??? Another thing for Johnny and  Wicklow to consider is trying to bloody improve!!! You'll get more summer games if you do that.

The GPA are talking rubbish and the CPA not much better and then we have the paranoid Dub bashers who see everything as a Dub promotion tool and everyone as a Dub.

People calming down and watching how this works out is the way forward.
Be more respectful to others' opinions and less of that you know the real way forward and all must agree with you, otherwise they're talking rubbish because you are so sure of the way forward. The Wicklow manager has his valid concerns and his valid opinions, just as other people here have their opinions, what we abide by in the end are the rules of congress and observe the test of time.

I am open to the new format but I have my reservations.
The current long drawn out championship format could have been tweaked positivily in different ways re scheduling However the current shortcomings have been used to push this "radical" so called solution which at present is just a questionable theory which might go some way to relieve some of the shortcomings of the current system.
I think the Wicklow manager knows more about how this  can possibly effect his county than you do.

Agreed. Most of the rebukes centre on the view that  "he should worry about managing Wicklow".

Blaming a manager for Wicklow lack of success is the just being oblivious to the plight of the weaker counties but of course that's a beloved past time of the elite and top brass.

Do you mean respectful in the way Johnny is being respectful by suggesting strikes for minor changes in the season?

By the way, if you read what I said then you'd know I don't claim to know the way forward. In fact, I've repeatedly said there is no perfect way forward. However, it's hard to give credit to a guy saying players should strike because Wicklow aren't getting more games in the summer yet offering no concrete alternative.

My objection is to the ridiculous criticism of a fairly minor change and the abuse genuine GAA men like Pauric Duffy have gotten when there hasn't been one genuine alternative workable solution.

The super 8 isn't the solution but is better than what we have and worth having a look at.
He said 'that if he was still a player, he'd go on strike'.
And it follows that the CPA also ignored by Congress have not ruled out strike action.

The issue for Johnny is not just about the super 8s  but also about not being listened to and disrespected.
"the players have voiced their opinion and it's not been listened to. And this is not once, it's happened two years in a row that the GPA has been ignored."
"I feel the players have been disrespected once too often. If I was still a player, my opinion would be that I will go on strike because that's twice now they haven't listened to us."

As even any good parent should realise, it's important to listen.

Johnny's opinion on the super 8s is that it's a negative step for the weaker counties which won't address the concerns he experiences. He does not have to offer up an alternative solution in order to point out the negatives of the super 8s for the weaker counties.
If he was asked, he might have done, but he does not have to point out his step forward  in order to have valid concerns about what he perceives as a step backwards for the players of the weaker counties.

You should listen to Johnny and show some respect for his opinions rather than keep repeating "rubbish".
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 02, 2017, 01:53:33 PM
Main Street, I think you're giving Magee to much credit here, possibly to have a go at Zulu, I don't know.

Anyone can give an opinion and not offer an alternative. It doesn't lead to much. "I think the Super 8 is brilliant and that's all that I have to say on the matter."

What players weren't listened to? As far as I can see, from the limited amount of information out there, the intercounty players got the retention of the provincials and the inclusion of everyone in the race for Sam, which is the feedback received last summer. The clubs of every county will have their county players back earlier than last year. I know this isn't specifically about the Super 8, but Motion 4 & 5 were part of the overall proposal along with the Super 8 so I think all changes to the intercounty championship should be looked at when deciding on whether things have improved. I think the CPA was too late coming to the table for this year, considering how long it took for the GPA to be recognised.

We've heard in the past week of how badly the GPA sought to hear their members' views on this and the reasons given for the vote against the Super 8 was that it didn't do enough for the weaker counties.  Fine, that's what it didn't do. But again, what was it that the weaker counties wanted? What was Duffy supposed to do? Leave it as it is or have a guess at what the weaker counties wanted? We also heard of one player not voting at all as the GPA hadn't explained the proposal well enough. I'd be interested t see the specific split of GPA members' votes.

I'm delighted with what was passed with the two other motions. I think the Super 8 could be interesting but will fail with the potential for dead rubber games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fuzzman on March 02, 2017, 02:58:45 PM
I would imagine the weaker counties much preferred the current system where they can go on a good run of matches through the qualifiers, playing teams of similar levels and then have a crack at a provincial winner in Croke Park. Tipperary's win over Galway last year can be compared to Wexford and Fermanagh making it to the AI semi finals in previous years.

Yes teams like that can still make it to the last 8 but they have a much lesser chance now of coming out of a group of 4 with 2 provincial winners and another qualifier. If Tipperary were in a group with say Galway, Monaghan and Westmeath they might fancy their chances but as been said before it's much harder to beat 2 provincial winners, especially one at their home venue.

I'm a little confused about some people saying that the clubs will be without their county players for longer now.
Is this correct as I thought they will all be finished 1 month earlier?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on March 02, 2017, 03:14:28 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 02, 2017, 02:58:45 PM
I would imagine the weaker counties much preferred the current system where they can go on a good run of matches through the qualifiers, playing teams of similar levels and then have a crack at a provincial winner in Croke Park. Tipperary's win over Galway last year can be compared to Wexford and Fermanagh making it to the AI semi finals in previous years.

Yes teams like that can still make it to the last 8 but they have a much lesser chance now of coming out of a group of 4 with 2 provincial winners and another qualifier. If Tipperary were in a group with say Galway, Monaghan and Westmeath they might fancy their chances but as been said before it's much harder to beat 2 provincial winners, especially one at their home venue.

I'm a little confused about some people saying that the clubs will be without their county players for longer now.
Is this correct as I thought they will all be finished 1 month earlier?

Would so called weaker teams who are seriously looking to develop not embrace the super 8 and have three big games rather than one?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fuzzman on March 02, 2017, 03:23:26 PM
That's one way of looking at it Benny from a neutral who would think it could benefit them long term in their progress but I suppose it's a lot more rewarding when they beat a big team in a knock out game and progress to an AI semi.

Think back to 2008 when Tyrone beat Dublin in the quarterfinal in the rain. Can you imagine if he had won that game but then had to meet them again in the semi final or final. It's hard to spring a surprise twice, especially for a smaller county. If Tipp had to play Galway again I wonder would they have beaten them again.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 02, 2017, 03:35:08 PM
Who are the "weaker" teams?
Everyone apart from Dublin, Mayowestros and Kerry?
Div 4 teams?
Perennial non achievers like Laythrum, London, WIcklow,  Antrim, Waterford?
Are there degrees of weakness? Weak/Weaker/Weakest?
If say instead of a Round robin last 8 you had it for the other 24 who would have come through in 2017 to face the Provincial finalists?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rosnarun on March 02, 2017, 04:49:15 PM
if A Weaker county get to the Quarter final now they will get 3 top class games something some leinster counties could take years besides to achieve
I can see why they would say the super 8's does not help the weaker counties but I fail to see how it hurts them.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rosnarun on March 02, 2017, 04:50:43 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 02, 2017, 03:35:08 PM
Who are the "weaker" teams?
Everyone apart from Dublin, Mayowestros and Kerry?
Div 4 teams?
Perennial non achievers like Laythrum, London, WIcklow,  Antrim, Waterford?
Are there degrees of weakness? Weak/Weaker/Weakest?
If say instead of a Round robin last 8 you had it for the other 24 who would have come through in 2017 to face the Provincial finalists?
the only way to decide that is from the league
tghere you have 4  levels any one who misses out tough . try harder in next years league
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 02, 2017, 05:34:54 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on March 02, 2017, 04:49:15 PM
if A Weaker county get to the Quarter final now they will get 3 top class games something some leinster counties could take years besides to achieve
I can see why they would say the super 8's does not help the weaker counties but I fail to see how it hurts them.
Only for the lopsided A and B  Qualifiers of recent years no weak teams would get to the Quarters.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on March 02, 2017, 06:40:01 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on March 02, 2017, 04:49:15 PM
if A Weaker county get to the Quarter final now they will get 3 top class games something some leinster counties could take years besides to achieve
I can see why they would say the super 8's does not help the weaker counties but I fail to see how it hurts them.

And get battered three times.

The GAA as an institution in the process of jumping the shark.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on March 02, 2017, 08:52:42 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 02, 2017, 03:23:26 PM
That's one way of looking at it Benny from a neutral who would think it could benefit them long term in their progress but I suppose it's a lot more rewarding when they beat a big team in a knock out game and progress to an AI semi.

Think back to 2008 when Tyrone beat Dublin in the quarterfinal in the rain. Can you imagine if he had won that game but then had to meet them again in the semi final or final. It's hard to spring a surprise twice, especially for a smaller county. If Tipp had to play Galway again I wonder would they have beaten them again.

Ah come on Fuzz. That wasn't a wet behind the ears Tyrone team. They were a team full of players with AI medals in their back pockets and would have beaten that Dublin team every day of the week. If Tipp got two home games in the super 8 then they'd have a decent chance of getting out of their group. I actually don't mind the super 8 as a concept. It just doesn't solve any of the main problems.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 02, 2017, 09:04:39 PM
The problem is a weaker team get to the Super 8. And if they get an almighty hammering in round one, suffer a few injuries and suspensions. A week later they have to pull themselves together for round two. They meet a side with a strong squad who can handle the week turnaround, injuries and suspensions. Another beating ensues. You get the general gist for game 3. Game 3 could involve a team wanting to improve score difference to finish top and an almighty massacre is suffered.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 02, 2017, 09:07:02 PM
Quote from: Syferus on March 02, 2017, 06:40:01 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on March 02, 2017, 04:49:15 PM
if A Weaker county get to the Quarter final now they will get 3 top class games something some leinster counties could take years besides to achieve
I can see why they would say the super 8's does not help the weaker counties but I fail to see how it hurts them.

And get battered three times.

The GAA as an institution in the process of jumping the shark.
Jumping the shark???? ??? ???
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 02, 2017, 09:13:42 PM
(https://marketoonist.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/100816.jumpingshark.jpg)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rosnarun on March 02, 2017, 10:06:47 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 02, 2017, 09:04:39 PM
The problem is a weaker team get to the Super 8. And if they get an almighty hammering in round one, suffer a few injuries and suspensions. A week later they have to pull themselves together for round two. They meet a side with a strong squad who can handle the week turnaround, injuries and suspensions. Another beating ensues. You get the general gist for game 3. Game 3 could involve a team wanting to improve score difference to finish top and an almighty massacre is suffered.
now hang on half the people are complaining the weaker team will get no where unfer the super 8's now your saying that it'll be  a problem if they do .
to reach that stage they will have had to have shown some form for a stage and not just turn up like to a 1st round provincial game.
plus it will some what boost their finances and show some of their players exactly what they need to do to escape the weaker team tag.
other wise Just cut the Weaker teams loose .
People's plan to progress weaker team seems to solely revolve around  a better team having a really bad day . it may make for a good day for one county but for a shit competition with unworthy winners
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trileacman on March 02, 2017, 10:36:44 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on March 02, 2017, 03:14:28 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 02, 2017, 02:58:45 PM
I would imagine the weaker counties much preferred the current system where they can go on a good run of matches through the qualifiers, playing teams of similar levels and then have a crack at a provincial winner in Croke Park. Tipperary's win over Galway last year can be compared to Wexford and Fermanagh making it to the AI semi finals in previous years.

Yes teams like that can still make it to the last 8 but they have a much lesser chance now of coming out of a group of 4 with 2 provincial winners and another qualifier. If Tipperary were in a group with say Galway, Monaghan and Westmeath they might fancy their chances but as been said before it's much harder to beat 2 provincial winners, especially one at their home venue.

I'm a little confused about some people saying that the clubs will be without their county players for longer now.
Is this correct as I thought they will all be finished 1 month earlier?

Would so called weaker teams who are seriously looking to develop not embrace the super 8 and have three big games rather than one?

3 big hammerings rather than one.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on March 02, 2017, 10:56:22 PM
Quote from: trileacman on March 02, 2017, 10:36:44 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on March 02, 2017, 03:14:28 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on March 02, 2017, 02:58:45 PM
I would imagine the weaker counties much preferred the current system where they can go on a good run of matches through the qualifiers, playing teams of similar levels and then have a crack at a provincial winner in Croke Park. Tipperary's win over Galway last year can be compared to Wexford and Fermanagh making it to the AI semi finals in previous years.

Yes teams like that can still make it to the last 8 but they have a much lesser chance now of coming out of a group of 4 with 2 provincial winners and another qualifier. If Tipperary were in a group with say Galway, Monaghan and Westmeath they might fancy their chances but as been said before it's much harder to beat 2 provincial winners, especially one at their home venue.

I'm a little confused about some people saying that the clubs will be without their county players for longer now.
Is this correct as I thought they will all be finished 1 month earlier?

Would so called weaker teams who are seriously looking to develop not embrace the super 8 and have three big games rather than one?

3 big hammerings rather than one.

So there's no other option than to have a two or three tier championship then. Otherwise we are going to get hammerings!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Derry Optimist on March 02, 2017, 11:08:43 PM
There is nothing wrong in principle with the concept of the Super 8  format as presently proposed.After all, every sport must have an elite layer of teams to make their sport achieve its true potential.

What is essentially wrong with these new proposals however  is that the GAA has not addressed the core problem - the real pressing needs of  the other 24 counties.As far as I can see no one in the top echelons of the GAA AND NO ONE in most of our County Boards will address the unpalatable but real fact that any All-Ireland championship that depends on being linked to the provincial championship is both unfair and definitely inequitable.
In most counties and at All Ireland club level we have three distinct championships
ie Senior,Intermediate and Junior.

These are competitive,fair  and equitable and most of all enjoyable (think Cuala,Ballyea,Slaughtneil and St Brigids) simply because every team is playing at their own level in any given year.This system allows them to compete equitably,be promoted or indeed relegated depending on their consistent performances over a period of time.

Too many counties have yearly. unrealistic expectations that this will be their year to win either the provincial or All Ireland Senior title. So they get the  most expensive manager who indulges them in the latest spartan training regime because everybody else is doing (this has gone from two nights a week training to five nights in some cases plus gym work)it.

Eventually the more intelligent players either drop out or reject an offer to join the panel.The remainder naturally lose interest. The manager resigns or retires or is sacked and the whole sorry cycle of yearly expectation quickly followed by total disillusionment starts all over again.The number of volunteers selling weekly lotto tickets and other various forms of fund raising get fed  eventually knocking doors and drift off into the sunset.If the current trend continues we will only be left with the Super 8!! and all our volunteers will be gone

That is why it is imperative that we have a three-tiered All Ireland championship ie Senior,Intermediate and Junior.Current placings in the National Football League should be the main criteria for deciding which championship each group plays in.

If the THE GAA Hierarchy,COUNTY BOARDS,GPA AND CPA  want Gaelic football to reach its full potential as a game and to treat all counties  and all players fairly and equally then this the only way forward.Otherwise we will all keep dreaming that next year will be our year for provincial or national Senior glory regardless of how good our players are!!

Over to all stakeholders and address the real problem.Our players,supporters and our great game deserves it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Gold on March 02, 2017, 11:36:20 PM
There will be some amount of dead rubber 3rd games. Teams who have won twice and qualified top already putting out reserve sides for their 3rd match

Shite plan, not properly thought through

We could even see 2 teams playing for a draw to  qualify

This is championship football ffs
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: didlyi on March 02, 2017, 11:59:04 PM
Quote from: Gold on March 02, 2017, 11:36:20 PM
There will be some amount of dead rubber 3rd games. Teams who have won twice and qualified top alreadye putting out reserve sides for their 3rd match

Shite plan, not properly thought through

We could even see 2 teams playing for a draw to  qualify

Thks is championship football ffs


Agree with everything......and theres nothing worse than a dead rubber game at that late stage of a championship.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on March 03, 2017, 07:23:16 AM
Brilliant idea, really looking forward to it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on March 03, 2017, 09:14:28 AM
Quote from: Syferus on March 01, 2017, 01:04:38 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 01, 2017, 12:50:43 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on March 01, 2017, 12:42:39 PM
Where did the Super 8 slogan come from? Media? I assumed it wasn't an official title.

Should be Elite Eight anyway. Like March Madness

More like Dublin + the Severely Substandard Seven.
But there's only 1 county Roscommon.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Keyser soze on March 03, 2017, 10:01:50 AM
Quote from: didlyi on March 02, 2017, 11:59:04 PM
Quote from: Gold on March 02, 2017, 11:36:20 PM
There will be some amount of dead rubber 3rd games. Teams who have won twice and qualified top alreadye putting out reserve sides for their 3rd match

Shite plan, not properly thought through

We could even see 2 teams playing for a draw to  qualify

Thks is championship football ffs


Agree with everything......and theres nothing worse than a dead rubber game at that late stage of a championship.

That's it in a nutshell.

These problems had arisen in various counties that tried round robin previously so didn't require much more than some basic research to identify some pretty significant potential drawbacks. The fact that Duffy is manifestly unable to identify these is atypical of your average GAA adminstrator. Get a bright idea, [usually shamelessly plagiarized from another sport] and get it pushed through without the slightest consideration that there might be some negatives associated with it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 03, 2017, 10:23:33 AM
A lot if not most Counties have group stages in their Championships
BUT they have them at the start not 3 Quarters way through.
As I've said before then new system is voted in by the Congress, is there for 3 years so it's up to those opposed to it to
1 - devise and agree a better alternative
2- sell it to the GAA membership and County Boards
3- get it to Congress 2019 with a view to introducing it for Championship 2021.

Or we can rant in the media, twitter GAAboard etc etc
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on March 03, 2017, 10:31:42 AM
Disappointing but not surprising that this came in. We've tied ourselves to only the second change to our championship in our history for the next three years, which ultimately will be abandoned. Round robins don't work in our championships, we saw that previously when we had round robins in the hurling championship where teams were beaten two or three times but were still in the championship. It'll now be possible for teams to get beaten three times but still make the AI semi finals. Hopefully the CPA can bang enough heads together and come up with a workable solution in the next few months. If Duffy then puts half the effort behind a workable solution that he put behind this proposal a special congress next Autumn could see that this farce will never see the light of day.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Keyser soze on March 03, 2017, 11:17:57 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 03, 2017, 10:23:33 AM
A lot if not most Counties have group stages in their Championships
BUT they have them at the start not 3 Quarters way through.
As I've said before then new system is voted in by the Congress, is there for 3 years so it's up to those opposed to it to
1 - devise and agree a better alternative
2- sell it to the GAA membership and County Boards
3- get it to Congress 2019 with a view to introducing it for Championship 2021.

Or we can rant in the media, twitter GAAboard etc etc


Can you name some counties that do? I asked about this a week ago and only Kildare, with a backdoor system, and Roscommon have a round robin sytem. It certainly isnt popular in Ulster. Derry tried it and it was a complete bollocks of a system, same as Duffys will be.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on March 03, 2017, 11:28:15 AM
Offaly has Round Robin, Tipperary has Round Robin.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on March 03, 2017, 11:28:42 AM
We've group stages in Meath.
3 groups of 6.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 03, 2017, 11:38:44 AM
Pay attention Keyser. .I listed a scatter of them last week - all Connacht Cavan Meath Offaly Westmeath off the top of my head. Think Wexford also.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on March 03, 2017, 11:40:43 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 03, 2017, 11:38:44 AM
Pay attention Keyser. .I listed a scatter of them last week - all Connacht Cavan Meath Offaly Westmeath off the top of my head. Think Wexford also.

Waterford has as well.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on March 03, 2017, 01:00:46 PM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 03, 2017, 10:01:50 AM
Quote from: didlyi on March 02, 2017, 11:59:04 PM
Quote from: Gold on March 02, 2017, 11:36:20 PM
There will be some amount of dead rubber 3rd games. Teams who have won twice and qualified top alreadye putting out reserve sides for their 3rd match

Shite plan, not properly thought through

We could even see 2 teams playing for a draw to  qualify

Thks is championship football ffs


Agree with everything......and theres nothing worse than a dead rubber game at that late stage of a championship.

That's it in a nutshell.

These problems had arisen in various counties that tried round robin previously so didn't require much more than some basic research to identify some pretty significant potential drawbacks. The fact that Duffy is manifestly unable to identify these is atypical of your average GAA adminstrator. Get a bright idea, [usually shamelessly plagiarized from another sport] and get it pushed through without the slightest consideration that there might be some negatives associated with it.

I've been accused of lacking respect for other opinions by labelling them rubbish but this is another example of the nonsense that is coming out of people criticising this.

Keyser do you genuinely believe that Pauric Duffy and numerous other senior GAA administrators never considered that a round robin format could lead to some dead rubber games? If so, then you are simply posting nonsense.

Of course there could, and will, be some dead rubbers but we could also have some tremendous last round games with teams needing to win and maybe win by 3 or 4 points to qualify while their opponents need at least a draw. If there is going to be hammerings and loads of dead rubbers when the best 8 teams meet then that's a clear admission that we have a handful of teams way ahead of everyone else so there isn't any format that will change that. However, I don't agree with the doom and gloom merchants. We could have two groups like this - Mayo, Kerry, Monaghan & Kildare and Dublin, Tyrone, Donegal & Galway. At the moment we probably have 6 competitive teams but there's no reason that one or two more can't close the gap. The above groups would be very competitive and While Dublin may be playing Kildare in a dead rubber Mayo and Kerry will be meeting in a do or die game.

The reason I have no time for the majority of criticism of the super 8's is because it is a decent proposal if you have to keep the provincials and if you want to get more structure and more games between the big teams. This format helps clubs and can help the weaker counties by giving them more money/resources (you know, the thing many on here claim is vital to closing the gap between the big teams and the rest) as a result of the revenue generated by the new games.

It's not, nor has it ever been promoted, as the solution to all problems so why people keep criticising it for what it's not is beyond me.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Keyser soze on March 03, 2017, 02:29:20 PM
Quote from: Zulu on March 03, 2017, 01:00:46 PM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 03, 2017, 10:01:50 AM
Quote from: didlyi on March 02, 2017, 11:59:04 PM
Quote from: Gold on March 02, 2017, 11:36:20 PM
There will be some amount of dead rubber 3rd games. Teams who have won twice and qualified top alreadye putting out reserve sides for their 3rd match

Shite plan, not properly thought through

We could even see 2 teams playing for a draw to  qualify

Thks is championship football ffs


Agree with everything......and theres nothing worse than a dead rubber game at that late stage of a championship.

That's it in a nutshell.

These problems had arisen in various counties that tried round robin previously so didn't require much more than some basic research to identify some pretty significant potential drawbacks. The fact that Duffy is manifestly unable to identify these is atypical of your average GAA adminstrator. Get a bright idea, [usually shamelessly plagiarized from another sport] and get it pushed through without the slightest consideration that there might be some negatives associated with it.

I've been accused of lacking respect for other opinions by labelling them rubbish but this is another example of the nonsense that is coming out of people criticising this.

Keyser do you genuinely believe that Pauric Duffy and numerous other senior GAA administrators never considered that a round robin format could lead to some dead rubber games? If so, then you are simply posting nonsense.

Of course there could, and will, be some dead rubbers but we could also have some tremendous last round games with teams needing to win and maybe win by 3 or 4 points to qualify while their opponents need at least a draw. If there is going to be hammerings and loads of dead rubbers when the best 8 teams meet then that's a clear admission that we have a handful of teams way ahead of everyone else so there isn't any format that will change that. However, I don't agree with the doom and gloom merchants. We could have two groups like this - Mayo, Kerry, Monaghan & Kildare and Dublin, Tyrone, Donegal & Galway. At the moment we probably have 6 competitive teams but there's no reason that one or two more can't close the gap. The above groups would be very competitive and While Dublin may be playing Kildare in a dead rubber Mayo and Kerry will be meeting in a do or die game.

The reason I have no time for the majority of criticism of the super 8's is because it is a decent proposal if you have to keep the provincials and if you want to get more structure and more games between the big teams. This format helps clubs and can help the weaker counties by giving them more money/resources (you know, the thing many on here claim is vital to closing the gap between the big teams and the rest) as a result of the revenue generated by the new games.

It's not, nor has it ever been promoted, as the solution to all problems so why people keep criticising it for what it's not is beyond me.

Or all 4 final round games could just as easily be dead rubbers!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 03, 2017, 02:49:54 PM
Or the sky could fall in. ....
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Keyser soze on March 03, 2017, 04:54:52 PM
Sky could fall out if they hafta hype dead rubbers lol 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on March 04, 2017, 09:40:19 AM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 03, 2017, 02:29:20 PM
Quote from: Zulu on March 03, 2017, 01:00:46 PM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 03, 2017, 10:01:50 AM
Quote from: didlyi on March 02, 2017, 11:59:04 PM
Quote from: Gold on March 02, 2017, 11:36:20 PM
There will be some amount of dead rubber 3rd games. Teams who have won twice and qualified top alreadye putting out reserve sides for their 3rd match

Shite plan, not properly thought through

We could even see 2 teams playing for a draw to  qualify

Thks is championship football ffs


Agree with everything......and theres nothing worse than a dead rubber game at that late stage of a championship.

That's it in a nutshell.

These problems had arisen in various counties that tried round robin previously so didn't require much more than some basic research to identify some pretty significant potential drawbacks. The fact that Duffy is manifestly unable to identify these is atypical of your average GAA adminstrator. Get a bright idea, [usually shamelessly plagiarized from another sport] and get it pushed through without the slightest consideration that there might be some negatives associated with it.

I've been accused of lacking respect for other opinions by labelling them rubbish but this is another example of the nonsense that is coming out of people criticising this.

Keyser do you genuinely believe that Pauric Duffy and numerous other senior GAA administrators never considered that a round robin format could lead to some dead rubber games? If so, then you are simply posting nonsense.

Of course there could, and will, be some dead rubbers but we could also have some tremendous last round games with teams needing to win and maybe win by 3 or 4 points to qualify while their opponents need at least a draw. If there is going to be hammerings and loads of dead rubbers when the best 8 teams meet then that's a clear admission that we have a handful of teams way ahead of everyone else so there isn't any format that will change that. However, I don't agree with the doom and gloom merchants. We could have two groups like this - Mayo, Kerry, Monaghan & Kildare and Dublin, Tyrone, Donegal & Galway. At the moment we probably have 6 competitive teams but there's no reason that one or two more can't close the gap. The above groups would be very competitive and While Dublin may be playing Kildare in a dead rubber Mayo and Kerry will be meeting in a do or die game.

The reason I have no time for the majority of criticism of the super 8's is because it is a decent proposal if you have to keep the provincials and if you want to get more structure and more games between the big teams. This format helps clubs and can help the weaker counties by giving them more money/resources (you know, the thing many on here claim is vital to closing the gap between the big teams and the rest) as a result of the revenue generated by the new games.

It's not, nor has it ever been promoted, as the solution to all problems so why people keep criticising it for what it's not is beyond me.

Or all 4 final round games could just as easily be dead rubbers!

And the premiership is sometimes over with weeks to go, the last round of the six nations is sometimes irrelevant to who will be champions etc. Is the bar being set at perfect?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Owenmoresider on March 04, 2017, 03:49:48 PM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 03, 2017, 11:17:57 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 03, 2017, 10:23:33 AM
A lot if not most Counties have group stages in their Championships
BUT they have them at the start not 3 Quarters way through.
As I've said before then new system is voted in by the Congress, is there for 3 years so it's up to those opposed to it to
1 - devise and agree a better alternative
2- sell it to the GAA membership and County Boards
3- get it to Congress 2019 with a view to introducing it for Championship 2021.

Or we can rant in the media, twitter GAAboard etc etc


Can you name some counties that do? I asked about this a week ago and only Kildare, with a backdoor system, and Roscommon have a round robin sytem. It certainly isnt popular in Ulster. Derry tried it and it was a complete bollocks of a system, same as Duffys will be.
Quote from: Owenmoresider on February 24, 2017, 04:49:44 PM
Quote from: Keyser soze on February 24, 2017, 03:04:25 PM
So Roscommon have a round robin and Kildare a back door, any others. I was sure Tyrone and Down had tried round robin in the past....anyone??

By my reckoning it breaks down thus:
Round Robin* - Sligo, Leitrim, Roscommon, Mayo, Donegal, Cavan, Longford, Westmeath, Meath, Louth, Offaly, Carlow, Wexford, Tipperary (& divisional c'ships), Limerick and Waterford.
Back Door - Galway, Monaghan, Armagh, Down, Kildare, Laois, Wicklow, Clare, Cork, Kerry.
Straight KO - Tyrone, Fermanagh, Derry, Antrim, Dublin.

* - you know where you can shove your "Champions League format" bollocks.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on March 04, 2017, 04:22:17 PM
Quote from: Zulu on March 04, 2017, 09:40:19 AM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 03, 2017, 02:29:20 PM
Quote from: Zulu on March 03, 2017, 01:00:46 PM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 03, 2017, 10:01:50 AM
Quote from: didlyi on March 02, 2017, 11:59:04 PM
Quote from: Gold on March 02, 2017, 11:36:20 PM
There will be some amount of dead rubber 3rd games. Teams who have won twice and qualified top alreadye putting out reserve sides for their 3rd match

Shite plan, not properly thought through

We could even see 2 teams playing for a draw to  qualify

Thks is championship football ffs


Agree with everything......and theres nothing worse than a dead rubber game at that late stage of a championship.

That's it in a nutshell.

These problems had arisen in various counties that tried round robin previously so didn't require much more than some basic research to identify some pretty significant potential drawbacks. The fact that Duffy is manifestly unable to identify these is atypical of your average GAA adminstrator. Get a bright idea, [usually shamelessly plagiarized from another sport] and get it pushed through without the slightest consideration that there might be some negatives associated with it.

I've been accused of lacking respect for other opinions by labelling them rubbish but this is another example of the nonsense that is coming out of people criticising this.

Keyser do you genuinely believe that Pauric Duffy and numerous other senior GAA administrators never considered that a round robin format could lead to some dead rubber games? If so, then you are simply posting nonsense.

Of course there could, and will, be some dead rubbers but we could also have some tremendous last round games with teams needing to win and maybe win by 3 or 4 points to qualify while their opponents need at least a draw. If there is going to be hammerings and loads of dead rubbers when the best 8 teams meet then that's a clear admission that we have a handful of teams way ahead of everyone else so there isn't any format that will change that. However, I don't agree with the doom and gloom merchants. We could have two groups like this - Mayo, Kerry, Monaghan & Kildare and Dublin, Tyrone, Donegal & Galway. At the moment we probably have 6 competitive teams but there's no reason that one or two more can't close the gap. The above groups would be very competitive and While Dublin may be playing Kildare in a dead rubber Mayo and Kerry will be meeting in a do or die game.

The reason I have no time for the majority of criticism of the super 8's is because it is a decent proposal if you have to keep the provincials and if you want to get more structure and more games between the big teams. This format helps clubs and can help the weaker counties by giving them more money/resources (you know, the thing many on here claim is vital to closing the gap between the big teams and the rest) as a result of the revenue generated by the new games.

It's not, nor has it ever been promoted, as the solution to all problems so why people keep criticising it for what it's not is beyond me.

Or all 4 final round games could just as easily be dead rubbers!

And the premiership is sometimes over with weeks to go, the last round of the six nations is sometimes irrelevant to who will be champions etc. Is the bar being set at perfect?

At least you're finally comparing Dublin with professional teams.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Keyser soze on March 04, 2017, 06:18:08 PM
Quote from: Zulu on March 04, 2017, 09:40:19 AM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 03, 2017, 02:29:20 PM
Quote from: Zulu on March 03, 2017, 01:00:46 PM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 03, 2017, 10:01:50 AM
Quote from: didlyi on March 02, 2017, 11:59:04 PM
Quote from: Gold on March 02, 2017, 11:36:20 PM
There will be some amount of dead rubber 3rd games. Teams who have won twice and qualified top alreadye putting out reserve sides for their 3rd match

Shite plan, not properly thought through

We could even see 2 teams playing for a draw to  qualify

Thks is championship football ffs


Agree with everything......and theres nothing worse than a dead rubber game at that late stage of a championship.

That's it in a nutshell.

These problems had arisen in various counties that tried round robin previously so didn't require much more than some basic research to identify some pretty significant potential drawbacks. The fact that Duffy is manifestly unable to identify these is atypical of your average GAA adminstrator. Get a bright idea, [usually shamelessly plagiarized from another sport] and get it pushed through without the slightest consideration that there might be some negatives associated with it.

I've been accused of lacking respect for other opinions by labelling them rubbish but this is another example of the nonsense that is coming out of people criticising this.

Keyser do you genuinely believe that Pauric Duffy and numerous other senior GAA administrators never considered that a round robin format could lead to some dead rubber games? If so, then you are simply posting nonsense.

Of course there could, and will, be some dead rubbers but we could also have some tremendous last round games with teams needing to win and maybe win by 3 or 4 points to qualify while their opponents need at least a draw. If there is going to be hammerings and loads of dead rubbers when the best 8 teams meet then that's a clear admission that we have a handful of teams way ahead of everyone else so there isn't any format that will change that. However, I don't agree with the doom and gloom merchants. We could have two groups like this - Mayo, Kerry, Monaghan & Kildare and Dublin, Tyrone, Donegal & Galway. At the moment we probably have 6 competitive teams but there's no reason that one or two more can't close the gap. The above groups would be very competitive and While Dublin may be playing Kildare in a dead rubber Mayo and Kerry will be meeting in a do or die game.

The reason I have no time for the majority of criticism of the super 8's is because it is a decent proposal if you have to keep the provincials and if you want to get more structure and more games between the big teams. This format helps clubs and can help the weaker counties by giving them more money/resources (you know, the thing many on here claim is vital to closing the gap between the big teams and the rest) as a result of the revenue generated by the new games.

It's not, nor has it ever been promoted, as the solution to all problems so why people keep criticising it for what it's not is beyond me.

Or all 4 final round games could just as easily be dead rubbers!

And the premiership is sometimes over with weeks to go, the last round of the six nations is sometimes irrelevant to who will be champions etc. Is the bar being set at perfect?

Now you're getting it. Those are LEAGUE competitions. We are discussing championship!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on March 04, 2017, 06:40:03 PM
No lads, we are discussing competition formats. How do we structure ours so that all teams get a decent season, that's the discussion. We don't have it now and the super 8's won't deliver it but it's a step in the right direction.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Keyser soze on March 04, 2017, 06:55:38 PM
Here sure let everybody play away all summer and give everybody a medal and a cup at the end of it. And a kitbag and a bottle of Isotonic when ur at it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on March 04, 2017, 07:30:38 PM
Yep, because that's what we're saying. Good man keep posting utter nonsense.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 04, 2017, 07:53:09 PM
Keyser needs to get out more methinks.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Keyser soze on March 05, 2017, 11:23:38 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 04, 2017, 07:53:09 PM
Keyser needs to get out more methinks.

From a man with over 10,000 posts  ::)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 05, 2017, 09:10:56 PM
In 13 years buck.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 28, 2017, 04:08:57 PM
Time to drag this up again, no craic without it.

So it seems that only 12% of club players agree with the Super 8 being introduced.

I would question the reasons for asking this question in isolation. I know there is much more to the survey they carried out but what would a club player have against the Super 8 in comparison to what they currently have?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 28, 2017, 04:49:18 PM
The hurley crowd are leaving their "League" the same format again next year so I presume there won't be changes to their Championship for a few more years at least.
As for the "Super 8" they've been approved at Congress.
Only difference for Club only players is that they should be out of their Championships earlier. Should help a lot of Junior soccer clubs mind you.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 28, 2017, 08:06:56 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 28, 2017, 04:49:18 PM
The hurley crowd are leaving their "League" the same format again next year so I presume there won't be changes to their Championship for a few more years at least.
As for the "Super 8" they've been approved at Congress.
Only difference for Club only players is that they should be out of their Championships earlier. Should help a lot of Junior soccer clubs mind you.
That's what I mean. Surely they're answering a different question. Although it hasn't been disclosed what exactly they were asked.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 30, 2017, 12:07:19 PM
I see the hurley crowd are now talking about the need to revamp their Championship  due to the football revamp.
The Galway question also needs to be addressed.
A few questioning the value of the (gasp!shock!)Munster Championship.
Even Ger Loughnane  on Seó  Spóirt one night.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Lone Shark on April 02, 2017, 01:57:18 AM
I see some Meath heads are a bit peeved at the team that Kildare have picked for this weekend's game in Galway. A match that would be very competitive if both sides were at full strength, now sees Paddy Power lay odds of 1/14 Galway and 9/1 Kildare, with an 8 point handicap.

If Meath are annoyed now, imagine if this happened in the championship, at the quarter final stages? I cannot get my head around why no-one is considering the absolute sh1tstorm that will be unleashed when this finally happens.

Moreover, has anybody outlined what will happen in the event of a walkover in a game like that?

Think logically for a moment, and imagine I'm the Dublin manager, in a super eight group featuring the Dubs, Kerry, provincial winners, and we'll say Cavan and Kildare for the sake of argument. The first four results are:

Dublin beat Cavan in Breffni
Kildare and Kerry draw in Newbridge

Kildare beat Cavan in Croke Park
Dublin beat Kerry in Croke Park

Final round is coming up, and Kerry will almost certainly beat Cavan in Killarney- but if Dublin don't beat Kildare, Kerry wwill be knocked out regardless- and with all due respect to Kildare, there's only one of those teams that represents a potential threat to Dublin in an All Ireland final.

Moreover, why in the name of God would I risk injuries in that game? Surely the logical thing to do for both reasons is to either concede a walkover, or else give a full game to the players in my squad that are effectively numbers 21-35. Are we ready for the riots that would ensue when that happens?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: joemamas on April 02, 2017, 03:36:52 AM
Fair and good point.
You just hope that managers have some integrity, on the other hand if you don't control your own destiny a la Meath tomorrow then can you really blame somebody else
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on April 02, 2017, 09:55:19 AM
This is the bother with a dead rubber last round game, especially if it is only a dead rubber game for one of the contestants. It will in turn make the other fixture in the group redundant as well.

The thing I hate most about Super 8 is that you can beat Beat Dublin, Tyrone, Donegal, Kerry, Mayo in the home run of the championship after any of them could have been beaten in their provincial Championship and they could still have to be beaten in a final. It's just wrong giving teams so many chances.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on April 02, 2017, 10:49:13 AM
Quote from: Lone Shark on April 02, 2017, 01:57:18 AM
I see some Meath heads are a bit peeved at the team that Kildare have picked for this weekend's game in Galway. A match that would be very competitive if both sides were at full strength, now sees Paddy Power lay odds of 1/14 Galway and 9/1 Kildare, with an 8 point handicap.

If Meath are annoyed now, imagine if this happened in the championship, at the quarter final stages? I cannot get my head around why no-one is considering the absolute sh1tstorm that will be unleashed when this finally happens.

Moreover, has anybody outlined what will happen in the event of a walkover in a game like that?

Think logically for a moment, and imagine I'm the Dublin manager, in a super eight group featuring the Dubs, Kerry, provincial winners, and we'll say Cavan and Kildare for the sake of argument. The first four results are:

Dublin beat Cavan in Breffni
Kildare and Kerry draw in Newbridge

Kildare beat Cavan in Croke Park
Dublin beat Kerry in Croke Park

Final round is coming up, and Kerry will almost certainly beat Cavan in Killarney- but if Dublin don't beat Kildare, Kerry wwill be knocked out regardless- and with all due respect to Kildare, there's only one of those teams that represents a potential threat to Dublin in an All Ireland final.

Moreover, why in the name of God would I risk injuries in that game? Surely the logical thing to do for both reasons is to either concede a walkover, or else give a full game to the players in my squad that are effectively numbers 21-35. Are we ready for the riots that would ensue when that happens?
Although your general point about the dead rubbers is valid, to quote from the proposal itself: "Again, critics seem to expect an ideal in the GAA that does not exist anywhere else - there is a risk of a 'dead rubber' game in every kind of round-robin format
in every sport. Moreover, many of our counties are happy to play their club championships on this basis. In addition – and very importantly – the fact that the two provincial champions in each of the groups play each other in the first game reduces the likelihood of meaningless games in Round 3."

In your example, Dublin would play Kerry and Cavan would play Kidare in the first game.

Also, Kildare drawing against Kerry? Sure I thought the small teams had no chance in this format :)

Finally, if players decide to pass up a game against a Top 8 team in July/August then it might say a lot about them. I know that's easy for me to say and it might seem harsh, but surely players want to play the big teams in order to grow, even if there isn't an immediate benefit to it?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: OgraAnDun on April 02, 2017, 12:04:50 PM
Quote from: joemamas on April 02, 2017, 03:36:52 AM
Fair and good point.
You just hope that managers have some integrity, on the other hand if you don't control your own destiny a la Meath tomorrow then can you really blame somebody else

It's not really about integrity, if you've already qualified (like Kildare have been promoted), then the manager has every right to rest a few players, see how good the bench is and avoid any possible injuries to the main men.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on April 02, 2017, 01:18:12 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on April 02, 2017, 10:49:13 AM
Quote from: Lone Shark on April 02, 2017, 01:57:18 AM
I see some Meath heads are a bit peeved at the team that Kildare have picked for this weekend's game in Galway. A match that would be very competitive if both sides were at full strength, now sees Paddy Power lay odds of 1/14 Galway and 9/1 Kildare, with an 8 point handicap.

If Meath are annoyed now, imagine if this happened in the championship, at the quarter final stages? I cannot get my head around why no-one is considering the absolute sh1tstorm that will be unleashed when this finally happens.

Moreover, has anybody outlined what will happen in the event of a walkover in a game like that?

Think logically for a moment, and imagine I'm the Dublin manager, in a super eight group featuring the Dubs, Kerry, provincial winners, and we'll say Cavan and Kildare for the sake of argument. The first four results are:

Dublin beat Cavan in Breffni
Kildare and Kerry draw in Newbridge

Kildare beat Cavan in Croke Park
Dublin beat Kerry in Croke Park

Final round is coming up, and Kerry will almost certainly beat Cavan in Killarney- but if Dublin don't beat Kildare, Kerry wwill be knocked out regardless- and with all due respect to Kildare, there's only one of those teams that represents a potential threat to Dublin in an All Ireland final.

Moreover, why in the name of God would I risk injuries in that game? Surely the logical thing to do for both reasons is to either concede a walkover, or else give a full game to the players in my squad that are effectively numbers 21-35. Are we ready for the riots that would ensue when that happens?
Although your general point about the dead rubbers is valid, to quote from the proposal itself: "Again, critics seem to expect an ideal in the GAA that does not exist anywhere else - there is a risk of a 'dead rubber' game in every kind of round-robin format
in every sport. Moreover, many of our counties are happy to play their club championships on this basis. In addition – and very importantly – the fact that the two provincial champions in each of the groups play each other in the first game reduces the likelihood of meaningless games in Round 3."

In your example, Dublin would play Kerry and Cavan would play Kidare in the first game.

Also, Kildare drawing against Kerry? Sure I thought the small teams had no chance in this format :)

Finally, if players decide to pass up a game against a Top 8 team in July/August then it might say a lot about them. I know that's easy for me to say and it might seem harsh, but surely players want to play the big teams in order to grow, even if there isn't an immediate benefit to it?

RUBBISH! Players don't decide to play. Managers decide if they play! There will be dead rubber games. This is a fact! Players will be rested by the teams with bigger squads in games of less importance. Super 8 will give the Dublin (especially), Tyrone, Donegal, Kerry, Mayo more breathing space.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on April 02, 2017, 01:32:47 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on April 02, 2017, 01:18:12 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on April 02, 2017, 10:49:13 AM
Quote from: Lone Shark on April 02, 2017, 01:57:18 AM
I see some Meath heads are a bit peeved at the team that Kildare have picked for this weekend's game in Galway. A match that would be very competitive if both sides were at full strength, now sees Paddy Power lay odds of 1/14 Galway and 9/1 Kildare, with an 8 point handicap.

If Meath are annoyed now, imagine if this happened in the championship, at the quarter final stages? I cannot get my head around why no-one is considering the absolute sh1tstorm that will be unleashed when this finally happens.

Moreover, has anybody outlined what will happen in the event of a walkover in a game like that?

Think logically for a moment, and imagine I'm the Dublin manager, in a super eight group featuring the Dubs, Kerry, provincial winners, and we'll say Cavan and Kildare for the sake of argument. The first four results are:

Dublin beat Cavan in Breffni
Kildare and Kerry draw in Newbridge

Kildare beat Cavan in Croke Park
Dublin beat Kerry in Croke Park

Final round is coming up, and Kerry will almost certainly beat Cavan in Killarney- but if Dublin don't beat Kildare, Kerry wwill be knocked out regardless- and with all due respect to Kildare, there's only one of those teams that represents a potential threat to Dublin in an All Ireland final.

Moreover, why in the name of God would I risk injuries in that game? Surely the logical thing to do for both reasons is to either concede a walkover, or else give a full game to the players in my squad that are effectively numbers 21-35. Are we ready for the riots that would ensue when that happens?
Although your general point about the dead rubbers is valid, to quote from the proposal itself: "Again, critics seem to expect an ideal in the GAA that does not exist anywhere else - there is a risk of a 'dead rubber' game in every kind of round-robin format
in every sport. Moreover, many of our counties are happy to play their club championships on this basis. In addition – and very importantly – the fact that the two provincial champions in each of the groups play each other in the first game reduces the likelihood of meaningless games in Round 3."

In your example, Dublin would play Kerry and Cavan would play Kidare in the first game.

Also, Kildare drawing against Kerry? Sure I thought the small teams had no chance in this format :)

Finally, if players decide to pass up a game against a Top 8 team in July/August then it might say a lot about them. I know that's easy for me to say and it might seem harsh, but surely players want to play the big teams in order to grow, even if there isn't an immediate benefit to it?

RUBBISH! Players don't decide to play. Managers decide if they play! There will be dead rubber games. This is a fact! Players will be rested by the teams with bigger squads in games of less importance. Super 8 will give the Dublin (especially), Tyrone, Donegal, Kerry, Mayo more breathing space.
I meant if players from the teams that are already out decide to leave the panel with a game left. Managers would have no say in that case.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on April 02, 2017, 02:02:56 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on April 02, 2017, 09:55:19 AM
This is the bother with a dead rubber last round game, especially if it is only a dead rubber game for one of the contestants. It will in turn make the other fixture in the group redundant as well.

The thing I hate most about Super 8 is that you can beat Beat Dublin, Tyrone, Donegal, Kerry, Mayo in the home run of the championship after any of them could have been beaten in their provincial Championship and they could still have to be beaten in a final. It's just wrong giving teams so many chances.

You hate giving teams more games?? So what if they could be beaten twice and still win the All Ireland? There's hardly a major team sport competition in the world that is straight knockout. In an era of mass sports coverage only a mad man would argue for less
GAA games. We need more bloody games not less.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on April 02, 2017, 06:49:26 PM
Quote from: Zulu on April 02, 2017, 02:02:56 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on April 02, 2017, 09:55:19 AM
This is the bother with a dead rubber last round game, especially if it is only a dead rubber game for one of the contestants. It will in turn make the other fixture in the group redundant as well.

The thing I hate most about Super 8 is that you can beat Beat Dublin, Tyrone, Donegal, Kerry, Mayo in the home run of the championship after any of them could have been beaten in their provincial Championship and they could still have to be beaten in a final. It's just wrong giving teams so many chances.

You hate giving teams more games?? So what if they could be beaten twice and still win the All Ireland? There's hardly a major team sport competition in the world that is straight knockout. In an era of mass sports coverage only a mad man would argue for less
GAA games. We need more bloody games not less.

How many intercounty games do you go to in a Summer?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on April 02, 2017, 06:52:07 PM
Zero for most of the past six or seven years, why?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on April 03, 2017, 12:01:32 AM
Quote from: Zulu on April 02, 2017, 06:52:07 PM
Zero for most of the past six or seven years, why?

You see, you want more games! But you won't be traipsing around the country to go see them. It costs a lot of money and time! We already have enough games in the Summer. It's ok for the Dubs all the games are on their door-step. Time and money to go to games are a lot less for them. You'll give me the yarn of the Super 8 giving home games. But that, like all the other promises is baloney! Dublin will play all their games in Croker unless their last game is a Dead Rubber!

I'm guessing you are not living in Ireland and this is the reason you can't make it to games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on April 03, 2017, 12:33:12 AM
Yep, abroad. Games are primarily for the players. Of course I understand it's costly for supporters but that's hardly a reason not to have them. Supporters can choose not go to some games if they can't afford it but we should still have them. Today was a perfect example of what our season should look like, lots of games between teams of similar ability dotted all over the country with big crowds. Now championship takes over and the God-awful provincial championships will bore us to death for two months before we get a few games worth taking about. I much prefer the league to the championship which is usually terrible bar one or two games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: moysider on April 03, 2017, 12:51:32 AM

I really enjoyed that stuff in Castlebar today. I would be of the opinion that the league is not broad enough. Not enough games imo. I'd scrap the early provincial stuff and have 3 divisions of 10 and a proper league without a final. It's all very well going on about the clubs but the only show in town really is the inter-county game. It's what drives the popularity of the sport.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on April 05, 2017, 10:03:39 AM
Quote from: Lone Shark on April 02, 2017, 01:57:18 AM
I see some Meath heads are a bit peeved at the team that Kildare have picked for this weekend's game in Galway. A match that would be very competitive if both sides were at full strength, now sees Paddy Power lay odds of 1/14 Galway and 9/1 Kildare, with an 8 point handicap.

If Meath are annoyed now, imagine if this happened in the championship, at the quarter final stages? I cannot get my head around why no-one is considering the absolute sh1tstorm that will be unleashed when this finally happens.

Moreover, has anybody outlined what will happen in the event of a walkover in a game like that?

Think logically for a moment, and imagine I'm the Dublin manager, in a super eight group featuring the Dubs, Kerry, provincial winners, and we'll say Cavan and Kildare for the sake of argument. The first four results are:

Dublin beat Cavan in Breffni
Kildare and Kerry draw in Newbridge

Kildare beat Cavan in Croke Park
Dublin beat Kerry in Croke Park

Final round is coming up, and Kerry will almost certainly beat Cavan in Killarney- but if Dublin don't beat Kildare, Kerry wwill be knocked out regardless- and with all due respect to Kildare, there's only one of those teams that represents a potential threat to Dublin in an All Ireland final.

Moreover, why in the name of God would I risk injuries in that game? Surely the logical thing to do for both reasons is to either concede a walkover, or else give a full game to the players in my squad that are effectively numbers 21-35. Are we ready for the riots that would ensue when that happens?

Yet another reason why round robins don't and won't work in our championship. Remember there used to be one in the hurling championship after you got knocked out of your provincial championship and they had to get rid of it due to lack of interest and teams qualifying out of it after loosing two games? Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it. CPA have a proposal they are ready to bring forward apparently, very interested to see what they have come up with.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on April 05, 2017, 11:47:45 AM
Bottom line is that what we have isn't working so whatever about the weaknesses of a round robin it's worth experimenting with until we are willing to grasp the nettle and make real changes.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on April 05, 2017, 11:58:20 AM
Problem with that is we have to hold on to the nettle for three years now. And it'll be the clubs and the weaker counties, the 99.9%, that will feel the sting for three more years than they have to. Short sighted and dollar orientated.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on April 05, 2017, 12:07:37 PM
Quote from: Zulu on April 05, 2017, 11:47:45 AM
Bottom line is that what we have isn't working so whatever about the weaknesses of a round robin it's worth experimenting with until we are willing to grasp the nettle and make real changes.

The current system works better only if your only concern is the bank balance of the GAA. Tell clubs and counties that aren't Dublin or Mayo or Kerry it offers them any advantage or improvement.

I do wonder sometimes about you, Zulu.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on April 05, 2017, 12:19:38 PM
Quote from: Syferus on April 05, 2017, 12:07:37 PM


I do wonder sometimes about you, Zulu.
I'd say the feeling would be mutual.
In fact most of  us here wonder about Syfīn all the time.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on April 05, 2017, 01:14:37 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on April 05, 2017, 12:19:38 PM
Quote from: Syferus on April 05, 2017, 12:07:37 PM


I do wonder sometimes about you, Zulu.
I'd say the feeling would be mutual.
In fact most of  us here wonder about Syfīn all the time.

The voices in your head aren't real people.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on April 18, 2017, 11:10:14 AM
Something in the "Independent "(sic) today about the CPA not announcing their master fixtures blueprint just yet.
They had to revise it after the Congress decision to adopt the "Super 8" and they are in discussion with other "stakeholders".
It's believed their plan provides for dedicated weekends for Club fixtures and an AI Intermediate Inter County football championship.
Another group pinching my ideas  ???(SF on the future All Ireland set up).
http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/cpa-underestimated-scale-of-problems-in-gaa-448162.html

Update from a real paper.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on May 30, 2017, 10:21:13 AM
Spailpín knows his stuff http://spailpin.blogspot.ie/2017/05/the-football-championship-pageant-not.html (http://spailpin.blogspot.ie/2017/05/the-football-championship-pageant-not.html)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on May 30, 2017, 10:40:11 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on May 30, 2017, 10:21:13 AM
Spailpín knows his stuff http://spailpin.blogspot.ie/2017/05/the-football-championship-pageant-not.html (http://spailpin.blogspot.ie/2017/05/the-football-championship-pageant-not.html)
Not bad. His last paragraph however has the intercounty season spanning up to nine months. Did he all of a sudden forget about the clubs?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on July 23, 2017, 09:16:37 AM
So with the final 8 very nearly sorted, would anyone really have the appetite now for a two group round robin tournament? Personally I think the knock out stage at qtr final stage is when the championship finally starts to crank into gear, i think I'd have no desire for a mini league now.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 23, 2017, 09:28:28 AM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 23, 2017, 09:16:37 AM
So with the final 8 very nearly sorted, would anyone really have the appetite now for a two group round robin tournament? Personally I think the knock out stage at qtr final stage is when the championship finally starts to crank into gear, i think I'd have no desire for a mini league now.

Agreed!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on July 23, 2017, 09:34:40 AM
Yeah, now that this time is upon us it feels less desirable.

Time will tell I suppose.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 09:34:58 AM
This year wouldn't have been the worst year for it. You'd have had a group for example of Tyrone Dublin Mayo and Galway. That surely would lead to some great games. Dublin would have headed potentially to castkebar for a championship game which would be great. As a Tyrone fan a trip to Galway would be nice and a big home game to Mayo would be some occasion. The worry would be the last round of games could have teams playing for nothing.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 23, 2017, 09:39:25 AM
A trip to Salthill would be a nightmare ;D
Meanwhile we'd be with Kerry and probably Monaghan and Kildare.
I suppose Kildare's "home"game would be in Portlaoise?
And no doubt Dublin's home game and "neutral" game will bith be in CrokePark  of course.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 23, 2017, 10:00:21 AM
For the Mayo Season ticket holder it would have meant

Sligo(home)
Galway (away)
Derry (Home)
Clare (away)
Cork (Limerick)
Tyrone (away)
Dublin (away as usual)
Galway (home)
Kerry (Croke Park)
Dublin (away)

Just too many games and a huge financial and time cost!

Gaelic games has always been about decent rest time between games and the build up to the next game.

That is the reason I won't be renewing my season ticket next year!

How many chances can you be giving Kerry and Dublin to win an All Ireland?

How many extra games can you be putting on AMATEUR players and in consecutive weeks.

We have knock out in the Provincial series and we have knock out in the All Ireland series, why introduce this?

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 10:07:46 AM
If you look at Kerry and dublins quarter final record I think you'll find no evidence to back up that the super 8s will make it easier for them. If anything it should give the 8 teams more of an even chance of getting through. Though it is unfair the dubs get two games in croke park but it also means another county will helping them.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 10:16:37 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 23, 2017, 10:00:21 AM
For the Mayo Season ticket holder it would have meant

Sligo(home)
Galway (away)
Derry (Home)
Clare (away)
Cork (Limerick)
Tyrone (away)
Dublin (away as usual)
Galway (home)
Kerry (Croke Park)
Dublin (away)

Just too many games and a huge financial and time cost!

Gaelic games has always been about decent rest time between games and the build up to the next game.

That is the reason I won't be renewing my season ticket next year!

How many chances can you be giving Kerry and Dublin to win an All Ireland?

How many extra games can you be putting on AMATEUR players and in consecutive weeks.

We have knock out in the Provincial series and we have knock out in the All Ireland series, why introduce this?

It's as well you don't follow a soccer or rugby team. The one thing the gaa championship lacks is important games between the big teams at the height of summer. This will help improve that. Hopefully they use sensible pricing and have a ticket for the counties three games. Currently quarter finals are 30 or 35 Euro from memory, if you got three games for 45/50 surely everyone would be a winner.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 23, 2017, 10:21:08 AM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 10:16:37 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 23, 2017, 10:00:21 AM
For the Mayo Season ticket holder it would have meant

Sligo(home)
Galway (away)
Derry (Home)
Clare (away)
Cork (Limerick)
Tyrone (away)
Dublin (away as usual)
Galway (home)
Kerry (Croke Park)
Dublin (away)

Just too many games and a huge financial and time cost!

Gaelic games has always been about decent rest time between games and the build up to the next game.

That is the reason I won't be renewing my season ticket next year!

How many chances can you be giving Kerry and Dublin to win an All Ireland?

How many extra games can you be putting on AMATEUR players and in consecutive weeks.

We have knock out in the Provincial series and we have knock out in the All Ireland series, why introduce this?

It's as well you don't follow a soccer or rugby team. The one thing the gaa championship lacks is important games between the big teams at the height of summer. This will help improve that. Hopefully they use sensible pricing and have a ticket for the counties three games. Currently quarter finals are 30 or 35 Euro from memory, if you got three games for 45/50 surely everyone would be a winner.

Apart from people who prefer their amateur sports competitions not be dominated by the same four or five semi-pro sides..

Duffy is to the national GAA what Prenty is to Connacht. Money is king, the dollar means more than fairness. What a terrible moment in the history of the sport.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 10:24:17 AM
Given the extra summer games they should shorten the leagues to free up time for clubs. Fir example expand division one and two to 12 teams but split it into two sixes. Top team from each section plays off in final. That would cut out a couple of years from counties seasons with them being potentially replaced by important championship games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 10:27:22 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 23, 2017, 10:21:08 AM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 10:16:37 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 23, 2017, 10:00:21 AM
For the Mayo Season ticket holder it would have meant

Sligo(home)
Galway (away)
Derry (Home)
Clare (away)
Cork (Limerick)
Tyrone (away)
Dublin (away as usual)
Galway (home)
Kerry (Croke Park)
Dublin (away)

Just too many games and a huge financial and time cost!

Gaelic games has always been about decent rest time between games and the build up to the next game.

That is the reason I won't be renewing my season ticket next year!

How many chances can you be giving Kerry and Dublin to win an All Ireland?

How many extra games can you be putting on AMATEUR players and in consecutive weeks.

We have knock out in the Provincial series and we have knock out in the All Ireland series, why introduce this?

It's as well you don't follow a soccer or rugby team. The one thing the gaa championship lacks is important games between the big teams at the height of summer. This will help improve that. Hopefully they use sensible pricing and have a ticket for the counties three games. Currently quarter finals are 30 or 35 Euro from memory, if you got three games for 45/50 surely everyone would be a winner.

Apart from people who prefer their amateur sports competitions not be dominated by the same four or five semi-pro sides..

Duffy is to the national GAA what Prenty is to Connacht. Money is king, the dollar means more than fairness. What a terrible moment in the history of the sport.

Up to the super 8s stage the championship will be run identical to now. Every county will have the exact same chance of reaching the super 8s as they do the quarter finals now. Talk of the same sides dominating is the usual type of hyper bole created by gaa fans when there is change.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 23, 2017, 10:30:31 AM
Reducing the NFL would mean  less games for the 24 "B" teams though.
Syfīn, Paraic Duffy didn't bring in the Super 8. Congress did.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 23, 2017, 10:37:28 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 23, 2017, 10:30:31 AM
Reducing the NFL would mean  less games for the 24 "B" teams though.
Syfīn, Paraic Duffy didn't bring in the Super 8. Congress did.

Did you type that with a straight face? I suppose they brought in the destruction of the U21 grade too, all without any serious lobbying from their boss in HQ?

Christ on a stripper pole you can obsess over semantics for no reason at all sometimes.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 10:38:22 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 23, 2017, 10:30:31 AM
Reducing the NFL would mean  less games for the 24 "B" teams though.
Syfīn, Paraic Duffy didn't bring in the Super 8. Congress did.

The league is a warm up to the championship. There is far too many warm up games played in county football that no one loses any sleep over if they win or lose. Few less league games wouldn't do anyone any harm.

And there won't be 24 b teams. Every team will have same chance of reaching super 8 stage as they do quarter finals now. That isn't the same 8 teams every year. Undoubtedly the better teams will get there more than the weaker teams, that's the nature of sport. If the weaker teams want to play in the main championship the only way they'll be guaranteed competitive games every year  is through a handicap system.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Itchy on July 23, 2017, 02:15:34 PM
Looking at the last 8 I cant help but think how great the super 8 will be for the weaker counties. They can sit at home and admire the great games on TV and it will surely inspire them to greater things. Roll on 2018.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 23, 2017, 02:18:25 PM
Quote from: Itchy on July 23, 2017, 02:15:34 PM
Looking at the last 8 I cant help but think how great the super 8 will be for the weaker counties. They can sit at home and admire the great games on TV and it will surely inspire them to greater things. Roll on 2018.

It's not the first time a Cavan man has stood still in awe of Roscommon anyways.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 23, 2017, 02:23:57 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 23, 2017, 10:30:31 AM
Reducing the NFL would mean  less games for the 24 "B" teams though.
Syfīn, Paraic Duffy didn't bring in the Super 8. Congress did.
:D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on July 23, 2017, 09:43:07 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 09:34:58 AM
This year wouldn't have been the worst year for it. You'd have had a group for example of Tyrone Dublin Mayo and Galway. That surely would lead to some great games. Dublin would have headed potentially to castkebar for a championship game which would be great. As a Tyrone fan a trip to Galway would be nice and a big home game to Mayo would be some occasion. The worry would be the last round of games could have teams playing for nothing.

First year will be good, 2nd & 3rd probably too but after a few years, it'll become stale and crowds will drop off
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on July 23, 2017, 10:04:36 PM
within 10 years you will have 8 groups of 4
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 23, 2017, 11:53:11 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 09:34:58 AM
This year wouldn't have been the worst year for it. You'd have had a group for example of Tyrone Dublin Mayo and Galway. That surely would lead to some great games. Dublin would have headed potentially to castkebar for a championship game which would be great. As a Tyrone fan a trip to Galway would be nice and a big home game to Mayo would be some occasion. The worry would be the last round of games could have teams playing for nothing.

Dublin play a Championship game in Castlebar - Are you on drugs! Do you still believe in Santa?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 24, 2017, 12:27:39 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 23, 2017, 10:30:31 AM
Paraic Duffy didn't bring in the Super 8. Congress did.

(http://www.gifbin.com/bin/062010/1275389857_naked-gun-facepalm.gif)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 24, 2017, 01:07:21 AM
Imagine the totally uninspiring match-ups we'd have got this year - Galway, Roscommon and Mayo would all be playing teams they've already played this summer. The system is insane.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 24, 2017, 08:18:42 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 23, 2017, 11:53:11 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 09:34:58 AM
This year wouldn't have been the worst year for it. You'd have had a group for example of Tyrone Dublin Mayo and Galway. That surely would lead to some great games. Dublin would have headed potentially to castkebar for a championship game which would be great. As a Tyrone fan a trip to Galway would be nice and a big home game to Mayo would be some occasion. The worry would be the last round of games could have teams playing for nothing.

Dublin play a Championship game in Castlebar - Are you on drugs! Do you still believe in Santa?
If Leinster champions next year, Dublin will get 2 games in Croker in the Super 8. But they won't get all 3. All games between provincial champions will be at Croker. Of the 2 games against the qualifiers one will be in Croke Park, the other will be away.

QuoteImagine the totally uninspiring match-ups we'd have got this year - Galway, Roscommon and Mayo would all be playing teams they've already played this summer. The system is insane.
A and B will be gone next year. So if the Super 8 was in place this year, Galway and Mayo would both have a 50% chance of being in the same group as Roscommon. Not sure if its in, but would probably make sense to keep provincial runners up in opposite group to provincial winners.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 24, 2017, 08:20:19 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 23, 2017, 11:53:11 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 09:34:58 AM
This year wouldn't have been the worst year for it. You'd have had a group for example of Tyrone Dublin Mayo and Galway. That surely would lead to some great games. Dublin would have headed potentially to castkebar for a championship game which would be great. As a Tyrone fan a trip to Galway would be nice and a big home game to Mayo would be some occasion. The worry would be the last round of games could have teams playing for nothing.

Dublin play a Championship game in Castlebar - Are you on drugs! Do you still believe in Santa?

If that's the way the draw works out then yes they would. I'd be very confident it would happen. Now if they were to play a team with a smaller ground than Castlebar it could get moved. For example if they played Tyrone the game could well be moved from Omagh which holds 18000 to the new casement which will hold 34000. No idea why you think it would get moved to croke park or think the other counties would let it happen.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 24, 2017, 08:22:50 AM
Quote from: Hound on July 24, 2017, 08:18:42 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 23, 2017, 11:53:11 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 09:34:58 AM
This year wouldn't have been the worst year for it. You'd have had a group for example of Tyrone Dublin Mayo and Galway. That surely would lead to some great games. Dublin would have headed potentially to castkebar for a championship game which would be great. As a Tyrone fan a trip to Galway would be nice and a big home game to Mayo would be some occasion. The worry would be the last round of games could have teams playing for nothing.

Dublin play a Championship game in Castlebar - Are you on drugs! Do you still believe in Santa?
If Leinster champions next year, Dublin will get 2 games in Croker in the Super 8. But they won't get all 3. All games between provincial champions will be at Croker. Of the 2 games against the qualifiers one will be in Croke Park, the other will be away.

QuoteImagine the totally uninspiring match-ups we'd have got this year - Galway, Roscommon and Mayo would all be playing teams they've already played this summer. The system is insane.
A and B will be gone next year. So if the Super 8 was in place this year, Galway and Mayo would both have a 50% chance of being in the same group as Roscommon. Not sure if its in, but would probably make sense to keep provincial runners up in opposite group to provincial winners.

I'm pretty sure they will be keeping the provincial champions apart next year. So one of the groups based on this year would have been tyrone, Dublin, mayo and Galway. Some group that would have been. If the favourites win next Saturday the other group would have been Kerry Roscommon Kildare and Monaghan. Plenty of interesting games in there.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 24, 2017, 09:38:30 AM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 24, 2017, 08:20:19 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 23, 2017, 11:53:11 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 09:34:58 AM
This year wouldn't have been the worst year for it. You'd have had a group for example of Tyrone Dublin Mayo and Galway. That surely would lead to some great games. Dublin would have headed potentially to castkebar for a championship game which would be great. As a Tyrone fan a trip to Galway would be nice and a big home game to Mayo would be some occasion. The worry would be the last round of games could have teams playing for nothing.

Dublin play a Championship game in Castlebar - Are you on drugs! Do you still believe in Santa?

If that's the way the draw works out then yes they would. I'd be very confident it would happen. Now if they were to play a team with a smaller ground than Castlebar it could get moved. For example if they played Tyrone the game could well be moved from Omagh which holds 18000 to the new casement which will hold 34000. No idea why you think it would get moved to croke park or think the other counties would let it happen.

Why do Leinster Counties let Dublin play early rounds in Croker ------ MONEY! If Mayo were to play Dublin there is no way the game would be in McHale Park. Corporate Boxes, Ground capacity, You name it. This is the real world. for god sake Mayo and Kerry had to play a replay in Limerick in case an unplayed Dublin game ended in a draw!

Money, Money, Money.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on July 24, 2017, 10:02:43 AM
Kerry Mayo was in Limerick because of that American Football bollix.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on July 24, 2017, 10:04:58 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 24, 2017, 09:38:30 AM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 24, 2017, 08:20:19 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 23, 2017, 11:53:11 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 09:34:58 AM
This year wouldn't have been the worst year for it. You'd have had a group for example of Tyrone Dublin Mayo and Galway. That surely would lead to some great games. Dublin would have headed potentially to castkebar for a championship game which would be great. As a Tyrone fan a trip to Galway would be nice and a big home game to Mayo would be some occasion. The worry would be the last round of games could have teams playing for nothing.

Dublin play a Championship game in Castlebar - Are you on drugs! Do you still believe in Santa?

If that's the way the draw works out then yes they would. I'd be very confident it would happen. Now if they were to play a team with a smaller ground than Castlebar it could get moved. For example if they played Tyrone the game could well be moved from Omagh which holds 18000 to the new casement which will hold 34000. No idea why you think it would get moved to croke park or think the other counties would let it happen.

Why do Leinster Counties let Dublin play early rounds in Croker ------ MONEY! If Mayo were to play Dublin there is no way the game would be in McHale Park. Corporate Boxes, Ground capacity, You name it. This is the real world. for god sake Mayo and Kerry had to play a replay in Limerick in case an unplayed Dublin game ended in a draw!

Money, Money, Money.
You really have backed that horse and flogged it to death.

I hope for your sake that the games are in Croker. :)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on July 24, 2017, 10:05:18 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 24, 2017, 10:02:43 AM
Kerry Mayo was in Limerick because of that American Football bollix.
How did that go?

The american football, I mean
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rosnarun on July 24, 2017, 10:31:47 AM
Every one wants to change the structures but I don't think I have ever seen 2 identical plans
most people whole idea on structure seems to be based around the fact that Longford or leitrim have to be involved ion the business end no matter how poor they are
the only way to do that is have multiple competitions like the hurley boys
any  one want that? I didn't think so
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on July 24, 2017, 10:35:20 AM
Quote from: rosnarun on July 24, 2017, 10:31:47 AM
Every one wants to change the structures but I don't think I have ever seen 2 identical plans
most people whole idea on structure seems to be based around the fact that Longford or leitrim have to be involved ion the business end no matter how poor they are
the only way to do that is have multiple competitions like the hurley boys
any  one want that? I didn't think so
Exactly, and the clubs in these counties are delighted they'll be out earlier next year so they can get their championships run off in the summer months.

Impossible to keep everyone happy and that's before considering that you needed 67% agreement to pass anything.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 24, 2017, 10:36:08 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 24, 2017, 09:38:30 AM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 24, 2017, 08:20:19 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 23, 2017, 11:53:11 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 09:34:58 AM
This year wouldn't have been the worst year for it. You'd have had a group for example of Tyrone Dublin Mayo and Galway. That surely would lead to some great games. Dublin would have headed potentially to castkebar for a championship game which would be great. As a Tyrone fan a trip to Galway would be nice and a big home game to Mayo would be some occasion. The worry would be the last round of games could have teams playing for nothing.

Dublin play a Championship game in Castlebar - Are you on drugs! Do you still believe in Santa?

If that's the way the draw works out then yes they would. I'd be very confident it would happen. Now if they were to play a team with a smaller ground than Castlebar it could get moved. For example if they played Tyrone the game could well be moved from Omagh which holds 18000 to the new casement which will hold 34000. No idea why you think it would get moved to croke park or think the other counties would let it happen.

Why do Leinster Counties let Dublin play early rounds in Croker ------ MONEY! If Mayo were to play Dublin there is no way the game would be in McHale Park. Corporate Boxes, Ground capacity, You name it. This is the real world. for god sake Mayo and Kerry had to play a replay in Limerick in case an unplayed Dublin game ended in a draw!

Money, Money, Money.

Dublin have played outside croke park in the championship the last two years. They play their league games away from home like everyone else. There is no doubt they will play one the three games outside croke park.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 24, 2017, 10:38:19 AM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 24, 2017, 10:36:08 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 24, 2017, 09:38:30 AM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 24, 2017, 08:20:19 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 23, 2017, 11:53:11 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2017, 09:34:58 AM
This year wouldn't have been the worst year for it. You'd have had a group for example of Tyrone Dublin Mayo and Galway. That surely would lead to some great games. Dublin would have headed potentially to castkebar for a championship game which would be great. As a Tyrone fan a trip to Galway would be nice and a big home game to Mayo would be some occasion. The worry would be the last round of games could have teams playing for nothing.

Dublin play a Championship game in Castlebar - Are you on drugs! Do you still believe in Santa?

If that's the way the draw works out then yes they would. I'd be very confident it would happen. Now if they were to play a team with a smaller ground than Castlebar it could get moved. For example if they played Tyrone the game could well be moved from Omagh which holds 18000 to the new casement which will hold 34000. No idea why you think it would get moved to croke park or think the other counties would let it happen.

Why do Leinster Counties let Dublin play early rounds in Croker ------ MONEY! If Mayo were to play Dublin there is no way the game would be in McHale Park. Corporate Boxes, Ground capacity, You name it. This is the real world. for god sake Mayo and Kerry had to play a replay in Limerick in case an unplayed Dublin game ended in a draw!

Money, Money, Money.

Dublin have played outside croke park in the championship the last two years. They play their league games away from home like everyone else. There is no doubt they will play one the three games outside croke park.

By the fúcking definition of this insane system it should be two.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 24, 2017, 10:38:44 AM
Colm O'Rourke wrote an article saying it hasn't been a good championship and he based it on the fact that there is only one team in division 3 or 4 in the last 12. What is the obsession with wanting poor teams to out perform better teams? It doesn't happen in any other sport. Armagh are the only division 3 team left on merit. Tipperary easily could have been there too. The championship is set up nicely with a lot of good teams left.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on July 24, 2017, 10:51:03 AM
Lads who want to change the format can't be seen saying it's a good championship, otherwise why would you change it? I just don't listen to those lads anymore. I think it's been a very good championship so far. Fluctuations in quality, sure. A few hammerings, sure. But in general some close, competitive, exciting games. That's what we want most of all.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 24, 2017, 10:57:12 AM
Complaining that the bottom 16 teams don't get to the closing stages of the CHAMPIONSHIP. :o
What do they want - a handicap system?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 11:12:17 AM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on July 24, 2017, 10:05:18 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 24, 2017, 10:02:43 AM
Kerry Mayo was in Limerick because of that American Football bollix.
How did that go?

The american football, I mean

Penn state scored a field goal with the last kick to defeat university of Florida if I recall correctly.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 11:14:23 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 24, 2017, 10:57:12 AM
Complaining that the bottom 16 teams don't get to the closing stages of the CHAMPIONSHIP. :o
What do they want - a handicap system?

Exactly. If they want to make the final stages of the championship they should work harder. If Clare/Tipperary can come on leaps and bounds in football then there's no excuse.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 24, 2017, 11:39:04 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 11:14:23 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 24, 2017, 10:57:12 AM
Complaining that the bottom 16 teams don't get to the closing stages of the CHAMPIONSHIP. :o
What do they want - a handicap system?

Exactly. If they want to make the final stages of the championship they should work harder. If Clare/Tipperary can come on leaps and bounds in football then there's no excuse.

Go to Leitrim and spout your elitism, please.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on July 24, 2017, 11:40:49 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 24, 2017, 11:39:04 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 11:14:23 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 24, 2017, 10:57:12 AM
Complaining that the bottom 16 teams don't get to the closing stages of the CHAMPIONSHIP. :o
What do they want - a handicap system?

Exactly. If they want to make the final stages of the championship they should work harder. If Clare/Tipperary can come on leaps and bounds in football then there's no excuse.
I can just imagine the research and analysis O'Rourke would do if asked to cover a Junior Championship match between Leitrim and Wicklow.

Go to Leitrim and spout your elitism, please.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 12:38:35 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 24, 2017, 11:39:04 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 11:14:23 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 24, 2017, 10:57:12 AM
Complaining that the bottom 16 teams don't get to the closing stages of the CHAMPIONSHIP. :o
What do they want - a handicap system?

Exactly. If they want to make the final stages of the championship they should work harder. If Clare/Tipperary can come on leaps and bounds in football then there's no excuse.

Go to Leitrim and spout your elitism, please.

This notion that weaker teams have a right to be in the latter stages isn't right. Teams should be there on merit, not pity.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Orior on July 24, 2017, 09:34:36 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 12:38:35 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 24, 2017, 11:39:04 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 11:14:23 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 24, 2017, 10:57:12 AM
Complaining that the bottom 16 teams don't get to the closing stages of the CHAMPIONSHIP. :o
What do they want - a handicap system?

Exactly. If they want to make the final stages of the championship they should work harder. If Clare/Tipperary can come on leaps and bounds in football then there's no excuse.

Go to Leitrim and spout your elitism, please.

This notion that weaker teams have a right to be in the latter stages isn't right. Teams should be there on merit, not pity.

It is also inherently unfair, because some counties have less population, less clubs and less players than others.

I'm not in favour of the super 8's, even though Armagh would have benefited from it in the past. The new system takes away from the magic of the knockout stages.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 10:10:43 PM
Quote from: Orior on July 24, 2017, 09:34:36 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 12:38:35 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 24, 2017, 11:39:04 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 11:14:23 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 24, 2017, 10:57:12 AM
Complaining that the bottom 16 teams don't get to the closing stages of the CHAMPIONSHIP. :o
What do they want - a handicap system?

Exactly. If they want to make the final stages of the championship they should work harder. If Clare/Tipperary can come on leaps and bounds in football then there's no excuse.

Go to Leitrim and spout your elitism, please.

This notion that weaker teams have a right to be in the latter stages isn't right. Teams should be there on merit, not pity.

It is also inherently unfair, because some counties have less population, less clubs and less players than others.

I'm not in favour of the super 8's, even though Armagh would have benefited from it in the past. The new system takes away from the magic of the knockout stages.

I hear you. Quarter final days are always nice. Don't see how super 8 helps weaker counties anyway if they qualification for a quarter final is still the same.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on July 24, 2017, 10:24:49 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 24, 2017, 11:39:04 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 11:14:23 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 24, 2017, 10:57:12 AM
Complaining that the bottom 16 teams don't get to the closing stages of the CHAMPIONSHIP. :o
What do they want - a handicap system?

Exactly. If they want to make the final stages of the championship they should work harder. If Clare/Tipperary can come on leaps and bounds in football then there's no excuse.

Go to Leitrim and spout your elitism, please.

So every club championship in every county is elitist? Would you go to the smallest club at the bottom of Div 4 in Leitrim and tell them that they should be playing senior football? Would they want to? The situation at county level where there are the haves and have nots is replicated in every county in Ireland and the problem is solved by a tiered championship / league structure which seems to work for all. In fact many clubs would actively avoid a grade 1 / senior place if they thought they had no chance of winning the competition. If teams develop over a period of time they can still compete in the senior championship via promotions. The challenge is finding a way that isn't just a Tommy Murphy rehash!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on July 25, 2017, 09:50:45 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 10:10:43 PM
Quote from: Orior on July 24, 2017, 09:34:36 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 12:38:35 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 24, 2017, 11:39:04 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 24, 2017, 11:14:23 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 24, 2017, 10:57:12 AM
Complaining that the bottom 16 teams don't get to the closing stages of the CHAMPIONSHIP. :o
What do they want - a handicap system?

Exactly. If they want to make the final stages of the championship they should work harder. If Clare/Tipperary can come on leaps and bounds in football then there's no excuse.

Go to Leitrim and spout your elitism, please.

This notion that weaker teams have a right to be in the latter stages isn't right. Teams should be there on merit, not pity.

It is also inherently unfair, because some counties have less population, less clubs and less players than others.

I'm not in favour of the super 8's, even though Armagh would have benefited from it in the past. The new system takes away from the magic of the knockout stages.

I hear you. Quarter final days are always nice. Don't see how super 8 helps weaker counties anyway if they qualification for a quarter final is still the same.
The only case I remember being made for the smaller counties, with regards to the Super 8, is that if a smaller team was to make it that far, then they would be guaranteed three games against top opposition, rather than just one.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on July 25, 2017, 10:00:14 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on July 25, 2017, 09:50:45 AM
The only case I remember being made for the smaller counties, with regards to the Super 8, is that if a smaller team was to make it that far, then they would be guaranteed three games against top opposition, rather than just one.

three times the fun

(https://i.giphy.com/media/nq0qLlrcdahiw/200.gif)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Orior on July 25, 2017, 10:11:53 AM
The timing just isn't right there, lol. Quite hypnotic all the same.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Aughafad on August 01, 2017, 07:09:42 PM
Correct me if i'm wrong but if the super 8s were in operation this year, the groups would be:

Group A - Dublin, Tyrone, Mayo, Galway
Group B - Kerry, Roscommon, Monaghan, Armagh

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on August 01, 2017, 07:16:44 PM
Quote from: Aughafad on August 01, 2017, 07:09:42 PM
Correct me if i'm wrong but if the super 8s were in operation this year, the groups would be:

Group A - Dublin, Tyrone, Mayo, Galway
Group B - Kerry, Roscommon, Monaghan, Armagh

Thats correct.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Aughafad on August 01, 2017, 07:25:18 PM
Group A would be good but Group B is a bit Meh!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 01, 2017, 07:33:20 PM
Quote from: Aughafad on August 01, 2017, 07:25:18 PM
Group A would be good but Group B is a bit Meh!

Neither group would be good. The only one of consequence in A would be Mayo-Tyrone as it would decide the runner up.

People should do well to remember that being runner up in the group that doesn't contain Dublin will mean the 'carrot' is a death sentence in the AISF every time.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 01, 2017, 07:39:57 PM
Quote from: Aughafad on August 01, 2017, 07:25:18 PM
Group A would be good but Group B is a bit Meh!
Be a great battle for 2nd place though.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 08:07:36 PM
Super 8 shows us how the Month of August will be destroyed for family time. Mayo fans have had a taste of week after week of consecutive games. All costing great amounts of Money and Time. Dublin will have no worries as their three Super 8 games as well as the AI semi final and Final will be all home games and cost them less in terms of money and time. 

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 08:37:22 PM
Family time???? For the love of Jesus. Poor Mayo playing football every week in the summer and their poor fans watching high quality sport every weekend. Why hasn't somebody organised a concert to help them in this time of tragedy?

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 01, 2017, 08:43:32 PM
Way things are going the Rhubarbs won't have to worry about the so called "Super 8" next couple of years.
Has an official title been picked yet? I'd expect the "All Ireland Series"
I presume a Kerry/ Dublin neutral game in 2019 will be in Páirc Phroinnsias UÍ Mhurchú ;D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on August 01, 2017, 08:48:08 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 08:07:36 PM
Super 8 shows us how the Month of August will be destroyed for family time. Mayo fans have had a taste of week after week of consecutive games. All costing great amounts of Money and Time. Dublin will have no worries as their three Super 8 games as well as the AI semi final and Final will be all home games and cost them less in terms of money and time.

Ah christ, the run through the qualifiers this year and last has been brilliant. Games every couple of weeks, always on the box if you're not able to make the games, what more could you want (apart from the obvious)?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: mrhardyannual on August 01, 2017, 08:49:03 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 08:07:36 PM
Super 8 shows us how the Month of August will be destroyed for family time. Mayo fans have had a taste of week after week of consecutive games. All costing great amounts of Money and Time. Dublin will have no worries as their three Super 8 games as well as the AI semi final and Final will be all home games and cost them less in terms of money and time.
Is there no end to the hyperbole! Super 8 will be the death of family time! Why not throw in the Rosary, Mass, the Rural way of life and anything else you want. Mayo people like me and my children go to matches because they enjoy them and because they are family outings' If the cost is too great, people will stop attending and prices will fall.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 08:52:26 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 08:37:22 PM
Family time???? For the love of Jesus. Poor Mayo playing football every week in the summer and their poor fans watching high quality sport every weekend. Why hasn't somebody organised a concert to help them in this time of tragedy?

Says the lad who has No COUNTY and goes to NO GAMES!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: mrhardyannual on August 01, 2017, 08:53:06 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 01, 2017, 07:33:20 PM
Quote from: Aughafad on August 01, 2017, 07:25:18 PM
Group A would be good but Group B is a bit Meh!

Neither group would be good. The only one of consequence in A would be Mayo-Tyrone as it would decide the runner up.

People should do well to remember that being runner up in the group that doesn't contain Dublin will mean the 'carrot' is a death sentence in the AISF every time.
The beauty of sport is that results do not always follow predictions. Why did underdogs Roscommon win the Connacht title when the dogs in the street would have told them they had no chance?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 09:26:30 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 08:52:26 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 08:37:22 PM
Family time???? For the love of Jesus. Poor Mayo playing football every week in the summer and their poor fans watching high quality sport every weekend. Why hasn't somebody organised a concert to help them in this time of tragedy?

Says the lad who has No COUNTY and goes to NO GAMES!

Your fellow countymen also dismissed your ridiculous hyperbole in posts just after me. When I did live in Ireland I attended regularly by the way and when I bring my club underage teams to tournaments it costs me hundreds of pounds per year as we usually have to travel hundreds of miles for tournaments and stay overnight so spare me your moaning about a trip to bloody Dublin.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 01, 2017, 09:30:01 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 09:26:30 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 08:52:26 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 08:37:22 PM
Family time???? For the love of Jesus. Poor Mayo playing football every week in the summer and their poor fans watching high quality sport every weekend. Why hasn't somebody organised a concert to help them in this time of tragedy?

Says the lad who has No COUNTY and goes to NO GAMES!

Your fellow countymen also dismissed your ridiculous hyperbole in posts just after me. When I did live in Ireland I attended regularly by the way and when I bring my club underage teams to tournaments it costs me hundreds of pounds per year as we usually have to travel hundreds of miles for tournaments and stay overnight so spare me your moaning about a trip to bloody Dublin.

If you want people to take you seriously just admit you're a Dub and stop trying to hide it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 09:42:26 PM
Syferus, turn off your computer before your mother grounds you for being up too late and let the adults talk.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 01, 2017, 09:52:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 09:42:26 PM
Syferus, turn off your computer before your mother grounds you for been up too late and let the adults talk.

So you're not going to admit it, then?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: anportmorforjfc on August 01, 2017, 09:54:22 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 09:42:26 PM
Syferus, turn off your computer before your mother grounds you for been up too late and let the adults talk.

Your in some form the night Zulu  :P
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 09:55:23 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 09:26:30 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 08:52:26 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 08:37:22 PM
Family time???? For the love of Jesus. Poor Mayo playing football every week in the summer and their poor fans watching high quality sport every weekend. Why hasn't somebody organised a concert to help them in this time of tragedy?

Says the lad who has No COUNTY and goes to NO GAMES!

Your fellow countymen also dismissed your ridiculous hyperbole in posts just after me. When I did live in Ireland I attended regularly by the way and when I bring my club underage teams to tournaments it costs me hundreds of pounds per year as we usually have to travel hundreds of miles for tournaments and stay overnight so spare me your moaning about a trip to bloody Dublin.

Ah, sure we all do that! Those one off events. Great fun! But here we are having days out where in my case you are dealing with Multiples of 5 (if you bring the family). Croke Park and Dublin are not user friendly when it comes to Families. Family tickets are usually located in the Davin and Don't dare even think about buying food. If you are foolish enough to go by train it's more fun!

The GAA showed total disregard for (the loyal) Mayo supporters especially by having this game in Croke Park a day before they go back to work on a Bank Holiday Weekend. Two decent venues in Connacht that could have facilitated the game and brought a bit of Revenue to one of those towns. But you have no worries about any of these issues. It's on the TV, you'll be grand!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 10:02:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 01, 2017, 09:52:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 09:42:26 PM
Syferus, turn off your computer before your mother grounds you for been up too late and let the adults talk.

So you're not going to admit it, then?

Admit to being a Dub? No, because I'm not but if it makes you feel better carry on believing it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 10:14:14 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 09:55:23 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 09:26:30 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 08:52:26 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 08:37:22 PM
Family time???? For the love of Jesus. Poor Mayo playing football every week in the summer and their poor fans watching high quality sport every weekend. Why hasn't somebody organised a concert to help them in this time of tragedy?

Says the lad who has No COUNTY and goes to NO GAMES!

Your fellow countymen also dismissed your ridiculous hyperbole in posts just after me. When I did live in Ireland I attended regularly by the way and when I bring my club underage teams to tournaments it costs me hundreds of pounds per year as we usually have to travel hundreds of miles for tournaments and stay overnight so spare me your moaning about a trip to bloody Dublin.

Ah, sure we all do that! Those one off events. Great fun! But here we are having days out where in my case you are dealing with Multiples of 5 (if you bring the family). Croke Park and Dublin are not user friendly when it comes to Families. Family tickets are usually located in the Davin and Don't dare even think about buying food. If you are foolish enough to go by train it's more fun!

The GAA showed total disregard for (the loyal) Mayo supporters especially by having this game in Croke Park a day before they go back to work on a Bank Holiday Weekend. Two decent venues in Connacht that could have facilitated the game and brought a bit of Revenue to one of those towns. But you have no worries about any of these issues. It's on the TV, you'll be grand!

You don't have tournaments as costly as ours to attend so get off that high horse, I and many others abroad have to pay huge money to promote our games.

You have a choice about attending games. I was at the Cork game and while there was a great Mayo crowd there it wasn't as big as what attended last Sunday so if cost is an issue you can watch one game on TV. Now that's not to say I'm not sympathetic of the cost to families going to games and I'd have no issue if the replay was in Connacht but spare me your nonsense regarding the super 8. We want more games and this is a great time to be a Mayo supporter and I'm sure everyone is enjoying it even if the credit card is getting s bit of a hammering.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on August 01, 2017, 10:25:28 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 01, 2017, 08:43:32 PM
Has an official title been picked yet?
Duffys chosen eight or my way or the highway.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 10:30:16 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 10:14:14 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 09:55:23 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 09:26:30 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 08:52:26 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 08:37:22 PM
Family time???? For the love of Jesus. Poor Mayo playing football every week in the summer and their poor fans watching high quality sport every weekend. Why hasn't somebody organised a concert to help them in this time of tragedy?

Says the lad who has No COUNTY and goes to NO GAMES!

Your fellow countymen also dismissed your ridiculous hyperbole in posts just after me. When I did live in Ireland I attended regularly by the way and when I bring my club underage teams to tournaments it costs me hundreds of pounds per year as we usually have to travel hundreds of miles for tournaments and stay overnight so spare me your moaning about a trip to bloody Dublin.

Ah, sure we all do that! Those one off events. Great fun! But here we are having days out where in my case you are dealing with Multiples of 5 (if you bring the family). Croke Park and Dublin are not user friendly when it comes to Families. Family tickets are usually located in the Davin and Don't dare even think about buying food. If you are foolish enough to go by train it's more fun!

The GAA showed total disregard for (the loyal) Mayo supporters especially by having this game in Croke Park a day before they go back to work on a Bank Holiday Weekend. Two decent venues in Connacht that could have facilitated the game and brought a bit of Revenue to one of those towns. But you have no worries about any of these issues. It's on the TV, you'll be grand!

You don't have tournaments as costly as ours to attend so get off that high horse, I and many others abroad have to pay huge money to promote our games.

You have a choice about attending games. I was at the Cork game and while there was a great Mayo crowd there it wasn't as big as what attended last Sunday so if cost is an issue you can watch one game on TV. Now that's not to say I'm not sympathetic of the cost to families going to games and I'd have no issue if the replay was in Connacht but spare me your nonsense regarding the super 8. We want more games and this is a great time to be a Mayo supporter and I'm sure everyone is enjoying it even if the credit card is getting s bit of a hammering.

Of course I have a choice as such! But being a Season ticket holder, You are debited unless you use your Opt out option. I missed my Second Mayo Match last weekend - using the opt out. The only other game I missed was the Kerry League game. The constant Weekends of games has an effect on the kids training and chill out time. Getting to and from venues the last couple of weeks has been serious work. I am football mad! And love to go to games. But there are beginning to be to many games anymore in the Summer. The cost is another thing.  And the GAA are pumping up the prices. This I feel could be the last year of me having a Season Ticket. The Super 8 is the Big turnoff, It will add 2 more games to the year and I can see the boys in headquarters pull a few fast strokes in regards to prices and venues. I'm sure Sky will have an input into it aswell, so for the common supporter things won't get better.

Also Season Ticket holders Seats in Croke park get poorer and poorer each year. Won't be long until we are in the Davin with the Family tickets soon!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 10:41:06 PM
There are a few issues there and I understand what you're saying in most respects but I don't agree that the super 8 is bad due to too many extra games. Players want them, supporters want them and the game needs them. Yes, some supporters will have to pick and choose their games but that's life. Surely, it's better to have more games even if you have to watch some of them on TV?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on August 01, 2017, 10:43:21 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 10:30:16 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 10:14:14 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 09:55:23 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 09:26:30 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 08:52:26 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 08:37:22 PM
Family time???? For the love of Jesus. Poor Mayo playing football every week in the summer and their poor fans watching high quality sport every weekend. Why hasn't somebody organised a concert to help them in this time of tragedy?

Says the lad who has No COUNTY and goes to NO GAMES!

Your fellow countymen also dismissed your ridiculous hyperbole in posts just after me. When I did live in Ireland I attended regularly by the way and when I bring my club underage teams to tournaments it costs me hundreds of pounds per year as we usually have to travel hundreds of miles for tournaments and stay overnight so spare me your moaning about a trip to bloody Dublin.

Ah, sure we all do that! Those one off events. Great fun! But here we are having days out where in my case you are dealing with Multiples of 5 (if you bring the family). Croke Park and Dublin are not user friendly when it comes to Families. Family tickets are usually located in the Davin and Don't dare even think about buying food. If you are foolish enough to go by train it's more fun!

The GAA showed total disregard for (the loyal) Mayo supporters especially by having this game in Croke Park a day before they go back to work on a Bank Holiday Weekend. Two decent venues in Connacht that could have facilitated the game and brought a bit of Revenue to one of those towns. But you have no worries about any of these issues. It's on the TV, you'll be grand!

You don't have tournaments as costly as ours to attend so get off that high horse, I and many others abroad have to pay huge money to promote our games.

You have a choice about attending games. I was at the Cork game and while there was a great Mayo crowd there it wasn't as big as what attended last Sunday so if cost is an issue you can watch one game on TV. Now that's not to say I'm not sympathetic of the cost to families going to games and I'd have no issue if the replay was in Connacht but spare me your nonsense regarding the super 8. We want more games and this is a great time to be a Mayo supporter and I'm sure everyone is enjoying it even if the credit card is getting s bit of a hammering.

Of course I have a choice as such! But being a Season ticket holder, You are debited unless you use your Opt out option. I missed my Second Mayo Match last weekend - using the opt out. The only other game I missed was the Kerry League game. The constant Weekends of games has an effect on the kids training and chill out time. Getting to and from venues the last couple of weeks has been serious work. I am football mad! And love to go to games. But there are beginning to be to many games anymore in the Summer. The cost is another thing.  And the GAA are pumping up the prices. This I feel could be the last year of me having a Season Ticket. The Super 8 is the Big turnoff, It will add 2 more games to the year and I can see the boys in headquarters pull a few fast strokes in regards to prices and venues. I'm sure Sky will have an input into it aswell, so for the common supporter things won't get better.

Also Season Ticket holders Seats in Croke park get poorer and poorer each year. Won't be long until we are in the Davin with the Family tickets soon!

Nonsense, I know Tyrone are in 305/306 this weekend! Couldnt ask for better.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:22:01 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 10:41:06 PM
There are a few issues there and I understand what you're saying in most respects but I don't agree that the super 8 is bad due to too many extra games. Players want them, supporters want them and the game needs them. Yes, some supporters will have to pick and choose their games but that's life. Surely, it's better to have more games even if you have to watch some of them on TV?

It just favours Dublin and Bored Dublin fans. Everybody else it is just a nuisance and another money making racket by the GAA. To think Dublin could lose two games next year and end up AI Champions! How depressing is that? Not for you or Dublin fans naturally. ;)

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 01, 2017, 11:25:11 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 10:41:06 PM
There are a few issues there and I understand what you're saying in most respects but I don't agree that the super 8 is bad due to too many extra games. Players want them, supporters want them and the game needs them. Yes, some supporters will have to pick and choose their games but that's life. Surely, it's better to have more games even if you have to watch some of them on TV?
Exactly. In fairness I'm impressed with the originality and variety with which people are able to criticise this proposal, twelve months before it begins.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on August 01, 2017, 11:35:09 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 10:41:06 PM
There are a few issues there and I understand what you're saying in most respects but I don't agree that the super 8 is bad due to too many extra games. Players want them, supporters want them and the game needs them. Yes, some supporters will have to pick and choose their games but that's life. Surely, it's better to have more games even if you have to watch some of them on TV?

Sure even watching them on TV has become complicated, it is easier to go to the game.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Aughafad on August 01, 2017, 11:37:14 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 08:07:36 PM
Super 8 shows us how the Month of August will be destroyed for family time. Mayo fans have had a taste of week after week of consecutive games. All costing great amounts of Money and Time. Dublin will have no worries as their three Super 8 games as well as the AI semi final and Final will be all home games and cost them less in terms of money and time.

No they won't, as the rules voted in at congress state each team will have one game in croke park, one game at home and one away game which cannot be croke park.

In theory Dublin will have one game in croke park, one in Parnell and one in somewhere such as Castlebar.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:42:40 PM
Quote from: Aughafad on August 01, 2017, 11:37:14 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 08:07:36 PM
Super 8 shows us how the Month of August will be destroyed for family time. Mayo fans have had a taste of week after week of consecutive games. All costing great amounts of Money and Time. Dublin will have no worries as their three Super 8 games as well as the AI semi final and Final will be all home games and cost them less in terms of money and time.

No they won't, as the rules voted in at congress state each team will have one game in croke park, one game at home and one away game which cannot be croke park.

In theory Dublin will have one game in croke park, one in Parnell and one in somewhere such as Castlebar.

Sounds Super Duper! Where is Parnell Park? Does it have a Press Box?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 01, 2017, 11:43:57 PM
Quote from: Aughafad on August 01, 2017, 11:37:14 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 08:07:36 PM
Super 8 shows us how the Month of August will be destroyed for family time. Mayo fans have had a taste of week after week of consecutive games. All costing great amounts of Money and Time. Dublin will have no worries as their three Super 8 games as well as the AI semi final and Final will be all home games and cost them less in terms of money and time.

No they won't, as the rules voted in at congress state each team will have one game in croke park, one game at home and one away game which cannot be croke park.

In theory Dublin will have one game in croke park, one in Parnell and one in somewhere such as Castlebar.

Best joke I've heard all year.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:49:07 PM
Wouldn't it be some craic if there was a three way tie for second place in one of the Groups in the Super Duper 8!

The GAA could scam three more games in a round robin play off. Or would away scores come into play. That would be fun! ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 01, 2017, 11:52:50 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:49:07 PM
Wouldn't it be some craic if there was a three way tie for second place in one of the Groups in the Super Duper 8!

The GAA could scam three more games in a round robin play off. Or would away scores come into play. That would be fun! ;)

I can only imagine how diminished Sunday's match would have been had it been a AIQF next year.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:57:12 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 01, 2017, 11:52:50 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:49:07 PM
Wouldn't it be some craic if there was a three way tie for second place in one of the Groups in the Super Duper 8!

The GAA could scam three more games in a round robin play off. Or would away scores come into play. That would be fun! ;)

I can only imagine how diminished Sunday's match would have been had it been a AIQF next year.

Sundays game would have meant nothing, well not as much as it did! Both would have trotted off to get ready to play another game that they probably could afford to probably draw or even lose. Exciting stuff!

Then there is the final sets of games where you have two teams already through to the Semi-finals and two teams with nothing to play for!

In other words four teams with nothing to play for!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on August 02, 2017, 12:13:01 AM
This super 8 craic might drive one back to Season Ticket, if you thought there was a chance of Armagh getting in (and given their improvement there is such a chance) and of Dublin/Kerry etc coming to Armagh, then tickets might be scarce.

Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:42:40 PM
Sounds Super Duper! Where is Parnell Park? Does it have a Press Box?

Not sure about a press box, but it has a serious number of jacks.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 12:28:09 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:22:01 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2017, 10:41:06 PM
There are a few issues there and I understand what you're saying in most respects but I don't agree that the super 8 is bad due to too many extra games. Players want them, supporters want them and the game needs them. Yes, some supporters will have to pick and choose their games but that's life. Surely, it's better to have more games even if you have to watch some of them on TV?

It just favours Dublin and Bored Dublin fans. Everybody else it is just a nuisance and another money making racket by the GAA. To think Dublin could lose two games next year and end up AI Champions! How depressing is that? Not for you or Dublin fans naturally. ;)

It's a nuisance to see more games involving your county in the summer? Ok so, I guess you can't wait until Mayo fall back into the pack so and won't have these nuisance games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 12:32:50 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:57:12 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 01, 2017, 11:52:50 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:49:07 PM
Wouldn't it be some craic if there was a three way tie for second place in one of the Groups in the Super Duper 8!

The GAA could scam three more games in a round robin play off. Or would away scores come into play. That would be fun! ;)

I can only imagine how diminished Sunday's match would have been had it been a AIQF next year.

Sundays game would have meant nothing, well not as much as it did! Both would have trotted off to get ready to play another game that they probably could afford to probably draw or even lose. Exciting stuff!

Then there is the final sets of games where you have two teams already through to the Semi-finals and two teams with nothing to play for!

In other words four teams with nothing to play for!

Jesus lads, yer great craic altogether. So after drawing the first game you can afford to lose your second game, how does that work? And both groups will always end up with final rounds with nothing to play for, no other options?

The super 8 isn't perfect but is worth trying given the limitations imposed on Duffy.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:38:19 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 12:32:50 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:57:12 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 01, 2017, 11:52:50 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:49:07 PM
Wouldn't it be some craic if there was a three way tie for second place in one of the Groups in the Super Duper 8!

The GAA could scam three more games in a round robin play off. Or would away scores come into play. That would be fun! ;)

I can only imagine how diminished Sunday's match would have been had it been a AIQF next year.

Sundays game would have meant nothing, well not as much as it did! Both would have trotted off to get ready to play another game that they probably could afford to probably draw or even lose. Exciting stuff!

Then there is the final sets of games where you have two teams already through to the Semi-finals and two teams with nothing to play for!

In other words four teams with nothing to play for!

Jesus lads, yer great craic altogether. So after drawing the first game you can afford to lose your second game, how does that work? And both groups will always end up with final rounds with nothing to play for, no other options?

The super 8 isn't perfect but is worth trying given the limitations imposed on Duffy.

Duffy's only limitation is his imagination.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 02, 2017, 12:50:13 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 12:32:50 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:57:12 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 01, 2017, 11:52:50 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:49:07 PM
Wouldn't it be some craic if there was a three way tie for second place in one of the Groups in the Super Duper 8!

The GAA could scam three more games in a round robin play off. Or would away scores come into play. That would be fun! ;)

I can only imagine how diminished Sunday's match would have been had it been a AIQF next year.

Sundays game would have meant nothing, well not as much as it did! Both would have trotted off to get ready to play another game that they probably could afford to probably draw or even lose. Exciting stuff!

Then there is the final sets of games where you have two teams already through to the Semi-finals and two teams with nothing to play for!

In other words four teams with nothing to play for!

Jesus lads, yer great craic altogether. So after drawing the first game you can afford to lose your second game, how does that work? And both groups will always end up with final rounds with nothing to play for, no other options?

The super 8 isn't perfect but is worth trying given the limitations imposed on Duffy.

Example    Kerry Beat Galway
                Mayo draw Rossies
                Kerry beat Rossies
                Galway beat Mayo
                Kerry already through put B team out against Mayo and lose
                Rossies Beat Galway

Kerry Qualified

Mayo and Rossies finish level on points and Score difference - What do you do?

Scenario two


                Kerry Beat Galway
                Mayo Beat Rossies
                Kerry beat Rossies
                Galway lose to Mayo
                Kerry already through put B team out against Mayo already through put B team
                Rossies v Galway who cares?


Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 12:52:57 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:38:19 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 12:32:50 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:57:12 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 01, 2017, 11:52:50 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:49:07 PM
Wouldn't it be some craic if there was a three way tie for second place in one of the Groups in the Super Duper 8!

The GAA could scam three more games in a round robin play off. Or would away scores come into play. That would be fun! ;)

I can only imagine how diminished Sunday's match would have been had it been a AIQF next year.

Sundays game would have meant nothing, well not as much as it did! Both would have trotted off to get ready to play another game that they probably could afford to probably draw or even lose. Exciting stuff!

Then there is the final sets of games where you have two teams already through to the Semi-finals and two teams with nothing to play for!

In other words four teams with nothing to play for!

Jesus lads, yer great craic altogether. So after drawing the first game you can afford to lose your second game, how does that work? And both groups will always end up with final rounds with nothing to play for, no other options?

The super 8 isn't perfect but is worth trying given the limitations imposed on Duffy.

Duffy's only limitation is his imagination.

Wrong again. Do you know the limitations I'm talking about?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 12:56:36 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 02, 2017, 12:50:13 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 12:32:50 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:57:12 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 01, 2017, 11:52:50 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:49:07 PM
Wouldn't it be some craic if there was a three way tie for second place in one of the Groups in the Super Duper 8!

The GAA could scam three more games in a round robin play off. Or would away scores come into play. That would be fun! ;)

I can only imagine how diminished Sunday's match would have been had it been a AIQF next year.

Sundays game would have meant nothing, well not as much as it did! Both would have trotted off to get ready to play another game that they probably could afford to probably draw or even lose. Exciting stuff!

Then there is the final sets of games where you have two teams already through to the Semi-finals and two teams with nothing to play for!

In other words four teams with nothing to play for!

Jesus lads, yer great craic altogether. So after drawing the first game you can afford to lose your second game, how does that work? And both groups will always end up with final rounds with nothing to play for, no other options?

The super 8 isn't perfect but is worth trying given the limitations imposed on Duffy.

Example    Kerry Beat Galway
                Mayo draw Rossies
                Kerry beat Rossies
                Galway beat Mayo
                Kerry already through put B team out against Mayo and lose
                Rossies Beat Galway

Kerry Qualified

Mayo and Rossies finish level on points and Score difference - What do you do?

Scenario two


                Kerry Beat Galway
                Mayo Beat Rossies
                Kerry beat Rossies
                Galway lose to Mayo
                Kerry already through put B team out against Mayo already through put B team
                Rossies v Galway who cares?

We all know you can have dead rubbers but you seem to be ignoring the reality that we could also have groups going down to the wire and scenarios where all teams can qualify going into the last round. There's no perfect solution but there's plenty of scope for great games in this format.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 02, 2017, 01:07:32 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 12:56:36 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 02, 2017, 12:50:13 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 12:32:50 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:57:12 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 01, 2017, 11:52:50 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2017, 11:49:07 PM
Wouldn't it be some craic if there was a three way tie for second place in one of the Groups in the Super Duper 8!

The GAA could scam three more games in a round robin play off. Or would away scores come into play. That would be fun! ;)

I can only imagine how diminished Sunday's match would have been had it been a AIQF next year.

Sundays game would have meant nothing, well not as much as it did! Both would have trotted off to get ready to play another game that they probably could afford to probably draw or even lose. Exciting stuff!

Then there is the final sets of games where you have two teams already through to the Semi-finals and two teams with nothing to play for!

In other words four teams with nothing to play for!

Jesus lads, yer great craic altogether. So after drawing the first game you can afford to lose your second game, how does that work? And both groups will always end up with final rounds with nothing to play for, no other options?

The super 8 isn't perfect but is worth trying given the limitations imposed on Duffy.

Example    Kerry Beat Galway
                Mayo draw Rossies
                Kerry beat Rossies
                Galway beat Mayo
                Kerry already through put B team out against Mayo and lose
                Rossies Beat Galway

Kerry Qualified

Mayo and Rossies finish level on points and Score difference - What do you do?

Scenario two


                Kerry Beat Galway
                Mayo Beat Rossies
                Kerry beat Rossies
                Galway lose to Mayo
                Kerry already through put B team out against Mayo already through put B team
                Rossies v Galway who cares?

We all know you can have dead rubbers but you seem to be ignoring the reality that we could also have groups going down to the wire and scenarios where all teams can qualify going into the last round. There's no perfect solution but there's plenty of scope for great games in this format.

Prolonging an already to drawn out Championship that will just see Kerry and Dublin in the final and give them more chances to feck up and recover along the way!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 01:13:23 AM
Sure why don't we scrap it altogether? The same few teams win most competitions in most sports. Like most others I want to see more football, not less. You always not watch it FtB.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 02, 2017, 01:17:06 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 01:13:23 AM
Sure why don't we scrap it altogether? The same few teams win most competitions in most sports. Like most others I want to see more football, not less. You always not watch it FtB.

We will have to scrap it soon. Croke park has created a monster and we have now got to a stage where we celebrate a team losing by 9 points in a Leinster final.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on August 02, 2017, 01:22:45 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 02, 2017, 01:17:06 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 01:13:23 AM
Sure why don't we scrap it altogether? The same few teams win most competitions in most sports. Like most others I want to see more football, not less. You always not watch it FtB.

We will have to scrap it soon. Croke park has created a monster and we have now got to a stage where we celebrate a team losing by 9 points in a Leinster final.

We only have to throw Dublin out. Monaghan/Mayo/Roscommon/Tyrone/Armagh/Kildare etc could have games among each other and you wouldn't know who would win.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 09:43:03 AM
If the new format was to be applied to this year's championship, the first games wouldn't have been Kerry v Galway or Mayo v Roscommon. The first games would be the two provincial champions in that group playing each other.

For example, Dublin would play Tyrone this weekend. For argument's sake, say Dublin won, then Tyrone would go into their second game with zero points. Armagh would have played Monaghan and again, for argument's sake, say Monaghan won, then a provincial champion would be playing catch-up going into the second game. Depending on how the fixtures fell, we could have a situation where Tyrone would have to beat Monaghan to progress.

So as not to be as biased as some posters, it should be pointed out that of course in this scenario Dublin's last game against Armagh would be a dead rubber.

The system is not perfect and I think it will most likely ultimately fail due to the possibility of dead rubbers and the general moaning of the GAA public.

It's so much easier to moan endlessly than read the reasoning behind the proposal and give it a chance. It's going to be a long year.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 09:55:02 AM
It's been voted in for 3 years.
How about we see how it works out folks?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:48:40 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 09:55:02 AM
It's been voted in for 3 years.
How about we see how it works out folks?

Round robins aren't some new untested structure. We know exactly how they work without wasting three years with a transparent attempt by Duffy to paper over falling attendances.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 02, 2017, 01:13:23 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:48:40 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 09:55:02 AM
It's been voted in for 3 years.
How about we see how it works out folks?

Round robins aren't some new untested structure. We know exactly how they work without wasting three years with a transparent attempt by Duffy to paper over falling attendances.

Listen it will be great. Think of all the money that will be generated by all the extra home games for Dublin. Except for maybe their last dead Rubber game. But hey Dublin fans are so used to dead games at the moment they probably won't notice. For all the er teams just think of the novelty of playing all those games in Croker. Super Duper!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on August 02, 2017, 01:31:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:48:40 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 09:55:02 AM
It's been voted in for 3 years.
How about we see how it works out folks?

Round robins aren't some new untested structure. We know exactly how they work without wasting three years with a transparent attempt by Duffy to paper over falling attendances.

Are attendances falling that much? Rosc v Mayo will be well enough attended and the place is full on Saturday. It depends on the combination of teams involved.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 01:56:20 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:48:40 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 09:55:02 AM
It's been voted in for 3 years.
How about we see how it works out folks?

Round robins aren't some new untested structure. We know exactly how they work without wasting three years with a transparent attempt by Duffy to paper over falling attendances.

Again, there were limitations imposed so the proposal is a reflection of what the membership wanted and what they didn't want. If we want a proper competition then it should be a league with (perhaps) a cup competition. But people don't want to be that drastic so we have a halfway house solution. We know you and FtB spend your days locked in a darkened room depressed at the big bad Dubs winning everything but let the rest of us enjoy the journey and see how the super 8 works out. I know everyone here will agree you've never been wrong on anything but perhaps the super 8 will buck the trend.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:06:41 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on August 02, 2017, 01:31:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:48:40 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 09:55:02 AM
It's been voted in for 3 years.
How about we see how it works out folks?

Round robins aren't some new untested structure. We know exactly how they work without wasting three years with a transparent attempt by Duffy to paper over falling attendances.

Are attendances falling that much? Rosc v Mayo will be well enough attended and the place is full on Saturday. It depends on the combination of teams involved.

In the last 12 months the attendance of the exact same pairing in the Connacht final fell by about 7,000. This being a relatively competitive match-up, far removed from the one-sided drubbings Leinster has become known for. People are turning off their TVs and not bothering to attend. If you think the sport isn't shrinking you aren't really looking very closely at all.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:42:08 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:06:41 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on August 02, 2017, 01:31:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:48:40 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 09:55:02 AM
It's been voted in for 3 years.
How about we see how it works out folks?

Round robins aren't some new untested structure. We know exactly how they work without wasting three years with a transparent attempt by Duffy to paper over falling attendances.

Are attendances falling that much? Rosc v Mayo will be well enough attended and the place is full on Saturday. It depends on the combination of teams involved.

In the last 12 months the attendance of the exact same pairing in the Connacht final fell by about 7,000. This being a relatively competitive match-up, far removed from the one-sided drubbings Leinster has become known for. People are turning off their TVs and not bothering to attend. If you think the sport isn't shrinking you aren't really looking very closely at all.
What's the solution?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:42:59 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:42:08 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:06:41 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on August 02, 2017, 01:31:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:48:40 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 09:55:02 AM
It's been voted in for 3 years.
How about we see how it works out folks?

Round robins aren't some new untested structure. We know exactly how they work without wasting three years with a transparent attempt by Duffy to paper over falling attendances.

Are attendances falling that much? Rosc v Mayo will be well enough attended and the place is full on Saturday. It depends on the combination of teams involved.

In the last 12 months the attendance of the exact same pairing in the Connacht final fell by about 7,000. This being a relatively competitive match-up, far removed from the one-sided drubbings Leinster has become known for. People are turning off their TVs and not bothering to attend. If you think the sport isn't shrinking you aren't really looking very closely at all.
What's the solution?

Dublin are the problem and the solution.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:46:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:42:59 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:42:08 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:06:41 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on August 02, 2017, 01:31:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:48:40 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 09:55:02 AM
It's been voted in for 3 years.
How about we see how it works out folks?

Round robins aren't some new untested structure. We know exactly how they work without wasting three years with a transparent attempt by Duffy to paper over falling attendances.

Are attendances falling that much? Rosc v Mayo will be well enough attended and the place is full on Saturday. It depends on the combination of teams involved.

In the last 12 months the attendance of the exact same pairing in the Connacht final fell by about 7,000. This being a relatively competitive match-up, far removed from the one-sided drubbings Leinster has become known for. People are turning off their TVs and not bothering to attend. If you think the sport isn't shrinking you aren't really looking very closely at all.
What's the solution?

Dublin are the problem and the solution.
Your solution to the Connacht final attendance falling by 7,000 in one year is to tell us that Dublin is the problem?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:47:46 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:46:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:42:59 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:42:08 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:06:41 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on August 02, 2017, 01:31:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:48:40 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 09:55:02 AM
It's been voted in for 3 years.
How about we see how it works out folks?

Round robins aren't some new untested structure. We know exactly how they work without wasting three years with a transparent attempt by Duffy to paper over falling attendances.

Are attendances falling that much? Rosc v Mayo will be well enough attended and the place is full on Saturday. It depends on the combination of teams involved.

In the last 12 months the attendance of the exact same pairing in the Connacht final fell by about 7,000. This being a relatively competitive match-up, far removed from the one-sided drubbings Leinster has become known for. People are turning off their TVs and not bothering to attend. If you think the sport isn't shrinking you aren't really looking very closely at all.
What's the solution?

Dublin are the problem and the solution.
Your solution to the Connacht final attendance falling by 7,000 in one year is to tell us that Dublin is the problem?

I've explained my solution in this thread and in others in detail.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:48:36 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:47:46 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:46:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:42:59 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:42:08 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:06:41 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on August 02, 2017, 01:31:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:48:40 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 09:55:02 AM
It's been voted in for 3 years.
How about we see how it works out folks?

Round robins aren't some new untested structure. We know exactly how they work without wasting three years with a transparent attempt by Duffy to paper over falling attendances.

Are attendances falling that much? Rosc v Mayo will be well enough attended and the place is full on Saturday. It depends on the combination of teams involved.

In the last 12 months the attendance of the exact same pairing in the Connacht final fell by about 7,000. This being a relatively competitive match-up, far removed from the one-sided drubbings Leinster has become known for. People are turning off their TVs and not bothering to attend. If you think the sport isn't shrinking you aren't really looking very closely at all.
What's the solution?

Dublin are the problem and the solution.
Your solution to the Connacht final attendance falling by 7,000 in one year is to tell us that Dublin is the problem?

I've explained my solution in this thread and in others in detail.
Summary form will do.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on August 02, 2017, 03:13:46 PM
Top Six instead...4 provincial champs plus one qualifier from A and one from B.

Two groups of 3, two games for each county, top two to semifinals.

So this year would see Kerry, Roscommon and Mayo/Galway on one side and Dublin, Tyrone and Monaghan/Armagh on the other.  Game 1 has the Provincial champs meet in Croke Park, and qualifier has two away games.  Winner of game 1 plays qualifier in game 2.  Let's assume winner of game 1 wins again.  That means the last game, between loser of game 1 and qualifier, is for a semifinal spot.  No draws, no extra time even, winner decided by playing on after normal time and time added on until we get a score.  A scenario could arise with all three teams having one win each...how best to sort that out? Is Scoring difference really fair, or is the Aussie % better as it takes differing weather conditions into account? 

I suggest goals scored be the first tie-breaker.  That would be different.

We can call it the Six-Pack.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Owenmoresider on August 02, 2017, 03:25:43 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on August 02, 2017, 03:13:46 PM
Top Six instead...4 provincial champs plus one qualifier from A and one from B.

Two groups of 3, two games for each county, top two to semifinals.

So this year would see Kerry, Roscommon and Mayo/Galway on one side and Dublin, Tyrone and Monaghan/Armagh on the other.  Game 1 has the Provincial champs meet in Croke Park, and qualifier has two away games.  Winner of game 1 plays qualifier in game 2.  Let's assume winner of game 1 wins again.  That means the last game, between loser of game 1 and qualifier, is for a semifinal spot.  No draws, no extra time even, winner decided by playing on after normal time and time added on until we get a score.  A scenario could arise with all three teams having one win each...how best to sort that out? Is Scoring difference really fair, or is the Aussie % better as it takes differing weather conditions into account? 

I suggest goals scored be the first tie-breaker.  That would be different.

We can call it the Six-Pack.
If you went down that route I'd suggest that it could be loosely based on the AFL playoffs scenario (8 go through, top 4 play off 1v4 2v3, losers of those meet the winners of playoffs 5v8 6v7, those winners then meet the winners of the two top 4 games to qualify for the Grand Final). http://www.droppunt.com/images/AFL-Finals-System.gif (http://www.droppunt.com/images/AFL-Finals-System.gif)

Here the four teams through from the qualifiers playoff, Mayo v Galway and Monaghan v Armagh, while the four provincial winners playoff, Kerry v Roscommon and Dublin v Tyrone, those two winners go straight to the semi finals and the losers (say Ros and Dublin) play the winners of the qualifier ties (say Mayo and Monaghan), Roscommon v Mayo and Dublin v Monaghan, with the winners advancing to the semis.

To avoid repeat clashes (like the AFL do per link above) you'd then have Kerry v Dublin and Tyrone v Mayo or Ros in the semis. Still takes time but at least each game counts for something.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 03:43:09 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:48:36 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:47:46 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:46:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:42:59 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:42:08 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:06:41 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on August 02, 2017, 01:31:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:48:40 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 09:55:02 AM
It's been voted in for 3 years.
How about we see how it works out folks?

Round robins aren't some new untested structure. We know exactly how they work without wasting three years with a transparent attempt by Duffy to paper over falling attendances.

Are attendances falling that much? Rosc v Mayo will be well enough attended and the place is full on Saturday. It depends on the combination of teams involved.

In the last 12 months the attendance of the exact same pairing in the Connacht final fell by about 7,000. This being a relatively competitive match-up, far removed from the one-sided drubbings Leinster has become known for. People are turning off their TVs and not bothering to attend. If you think the sport isn't shrinking you aren't really looking very closely at all.
What's the solution?

Dublin are the problem and the solution.
Your solution to the Connacht final attendance falling by 7,000 in one year is to tell us that Dublin is the problem?

I've explained my solution in this thread and in others in detail.
Summary form will do.
C'mon Syfīn Let us in on the secret as we haven't time to be trawling back. :D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 03:55:11 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on August 02, 2017, 03:13:46 PM
Top Six instead...4 provincial champs plus one qualifier from A and one from B.

Two groups of 3, two games for each county, top two to semifinals.

So this year would see Kerry, Roscommon and Mayo/Galway on one side and Dublin, Tyrone and Monaghan/Armagh on the other.  Game 1 has the Provincial champs meet in Croke Park, and qualifier has two away games.  Winner of game 1 plays qualifier in game 2.  Let's assume winner of game 1 wins again.  That means the last game, between loser of game 1 and qualifier, is for a semifinal spot.  No draws, no extra time even, winner decided by playing on after normal time and time added on until we get a score.  A scenario could arise with all three teams having one win each...how best to sort that out? Is Scoring difference really fair, or is the Aussie % better as it takes differing weather conditions into account? 

I suggest goals scored be the first tie-breaker.  That would be different.

We can call it the Six-Pack.
I like it but it just doesn't have the same effect without mentioning Duffy, Money, The Dubs or Sky in it.

Seriously though, very good idea.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2017, 05:58:56 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:47:46 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:46:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:42:59 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:42:08 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:06:41 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on August 02, 2017, 01:31:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:48:40 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 09:55:02 AM
It's been voted in for 3 years.
How about we see how it works out folks?

Round robins aren't some new untested structure. We know exactly how they work without wasting three years with a transparent attempt by Duffy to paper over falling attendances.

Are attendances falling that much? Rosc v Mayo will be well enough attended and the place is full on Saturday. It depends on the combination of teams involved.

In the last 12 months the attendance of the exact same pairing in the Connacht final fell by about 7,000. This being a relatively competitive match-up, far removed from the one-sided drubbings Leinster has become known for. People are turning off their TVs and not bothering to attend. If you think the sport isn't shrinking you aren't really looking very closely at all.
What's the solution?

Dublin are the problem and the solution.
Your solution to the Connacht final attendance falling by 7,000 in one year is to tell us that Dublin is the problem?

I've explained my solution in this thread and in others in detail.

He's solution involved splitting the Dubs and Cork and joining the likes of Longford and Roscommon or Laois and Offaly. Outside of it solving none of our problems, creating many more, being cloud cuckoo land unrealistic and anti-GAA I fail to see any problems with his 'solution'. Perhaps other posters can point out the problems to me?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: mrhardyannual on August 02, 2017, 07:19:43 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 02:06:41 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on August 02, 2017, 01:31:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 12:48:40 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 09:55:02 AM
It's been voted in for 3 years.
How about we see how it works out folks?

Round robins aren't some new untested structure. We know exactly how they work without wasting three years with a transparent attempt by Duffy to paper over falling attendances.
On the face of it the drop of 6000 from 2016 to 2017 appears to back up your contention but only if seen in isolation. While the attendance figures dropped from 24324 in 2016 to 18287 it was still considerably higher than the figure of 15960 that attended the 2016 replay between the same sides. As I would confidently estimate that the Roscommon support in Croke Park last Sunday was at least equal to that 16000 odd, it would suggest that the prime factor in determining level of support (discounting weather conditions etc) is expectation. In this regard expectation in Roscommon was high before the 2016 Connacht final, depressed for the replay, muted for the Connacht Final 2017 and rampant for last Sunday.

Are attendances falling that much? Rosc v Mayo will be well enough attended and the place is full on Saturday. It depends on the combination of teams involved.

In the last 12 months the attendance of the exact same pairing in the Connacht final fell by about 7,000. This being a relatively competitive match-up, far removed from the one-sided drubbings Leinster has become known for. People are turning off their TVs and not bothering to attend. If you think the sport isn't shrinking you aren't really looking very closely at all.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 07:45:12 PM
We had a bit if a bandwagon last year in Salthill but this year we had roughly the same 6,000 that were at the Leitrim game.
Howevera Connacht Title and improved performance plus a day out in HQ and we're rolling again.
Attendances are generally up this Summer.
Hurling massively because Cork and Wexford going well draw huge crowds. 366k to date compared to 230k at same stage last year.
Football
Connacht down 11k - replayed final 2016
Leinster up 30
Munster up 10
Ulster down 45 - 2 draws 2016
Qualifiers and 1st 2 Qtr Finals up 90k.

By the way the 1990 Connacht Final had 17,000 !!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 08:16:10 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 07:45:12 PM
We had a bit if a bandwagon last year in Salthill but this year we had roughly the same 6,000 that were at the Leitrim game.
Howevera Connacht Title and improved performance plus a day out in HQ and we're rolling again.
Attendances are generally up this Summer.
Hurling massively because Cork and Wexford going well draw huge crowds. 366k to date compared to 230k at same stage last year.
Football
Connacht down 11k - replayed final 2016
Leinster up 30
Munster up 10
Ulster down 45 - 2 draws 2016
Qualifiers and 1st 2 Qtr Finals up 90k.

By the way the 1990 Connacht Final had 17,000 !!

The population of Ireland was lower in 1990. The height for attendances was when it made sense to move Ulster finals to Croker - if you're telling me interest is still at those levels I'm speechless.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on August 02, 2017, 08:21:22 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 08:16:10 PM
The population of Ireland was lower in 1990. The height for attendances was when it made sense to move Ulster finals to Croker - if you're telling me interest is still at those levels I'm speechless.

Does being speechless mean you won't be posting?
Interest isn't at those levels, Armagh have not been doing as well.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 08:53:03 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 08:16:10 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 07:45:12 PM
We had a bit if a bandwagon last year in Salthill but this year we had roughly the same 6,000 that were at the Leitrim game.
Howevera Connacht Title and improved performance plus a day out in HQ and we're rolling again.
Attendances are generally up this Summer.
Hurling massively because Cork and Wexford going well draw huge crowds. 366k to date compared to 230k at same stage last year.
Football
Connacht down 11k - replayed final 2016
Leinster up 30
Munster up 10
Ulster down 45 - 2 draws 2016
Qualifiers and 1st 2 Qtr Finals up 90k.

By the way the 1990 Connacht Final had 17,000 !!

The population of Ireland was lower in 1990. The height for attendances was when it made sense to move Ulster finals to Croker - if you're telling me interest is still at those levels I'm speechless.
Wish you would take a vow of silence first a few days.
Still waiting for your Championship proposal ;)

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 08:55:43 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 08:53:03 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 02, 2017, 08:16:10 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 07:45:12 PM
We had a bit if a bandwagon last year in Salthill but this year we had roughly the same 6,000 that were at the Leitrim game.
Howevera Connacht Title and improved performance plus a day out in HQ and we're rolling again.
Attendances are generally up this Summer.
Hurling massively because Cork and Wexford going well draw huge crowds. 366k to date compared to 230k at same stage last year.
Football
Connacht down 11k - replayed final 2016
Leinster up 30
Munster up 10
Ulster down 45 - 2 draws 2016
Qualifiers and 1st 2 Qtr Finals up 90k.

By the way the 1990 Connacht Final had 17,000 !!

The population of Ireland was lower in 1990. The height for attendances was when it made sense to move Ulster finals to Croker - if you're telling me interest is still at those levels I'm speechless.
Wish you would take a vow of silence first a few days.
Still waiting for your Championship proposal ;)

Use the search function.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 02, 2017, 10:32:54 PM
I'll take that as a No then.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on August 05, 2017, 06:39:02 PM
So next year we will have lots of games like Kerry v Galway tyrone v armagh and Dublin v monaghan to look forward to.....
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ashman on August 05, 2017, 06:42:33 PM
Hope it backfires and the crowds are small .
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on August 05, 2017, 06:44:48 PM
Most of the last round of games will prob be pointless..   
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 05, 2017, 06:45:11 PM
Right on cue.

Conversely, we'll not hear the usual suspects tell us that it's a disgrace that these games were on Sky, because the games weren't any good.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on August 05, 2017, 06:58:13 PM
Esmerelda I have been saying for a while now that cake was right about the comparison between gaa and Catholic church......it's going to f**k up sooner rather than later the to bad decisions made by the leaders!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:03:23 PM
Eh? At least the super 8 would provide us with some good games as opposed to what we have.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 05, 2017, 07:04:20 PM
Quote from: The Trap on August 05, 2017, 06:58:13 PM
Esmerelda I have been saying for a while now that cake was right about the comparison between gaa and Catholic church......it's going to f**k up sooner rather than later the to bad decisions made by the leaders!
I know. I've been reading.

Solutions is what we want. Based on today's games in isolation it's back to straight knockout and four provincial winners through to the semi-finals.

However, if Cork/Kildare/Galway/Donegal get their act together then the following year we can say that we need to bring back the back door because these teams should be in Croke Park in August.

Reactionary one-liners are pointless and predictable.

Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:03:23 PM
Eh? At least the super 8 would provide us with some good games as opposed to what we have.
Exactly.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:06:32 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:03:23 PM
Eh? At least the super 8 would provide us with some good games as opposed to what we have.

It would provide us at least twice as many of games like the one that's so one-sided that it's allowing you to post on a forum right now.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on August 05, 2017, 07:06:47 PM
We might get the good games in the semi finals......let the lads at away at club football and enjoy their lives instead of feeding a commercial gravy train.....
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:10:02 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:06:32 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:03:23 PM
Eh? At least the super 8 would provide us with some good games as opposed to what we have.

It would provide us at least twice as many of games like the one that's so one-sided that it's allowing you to post on a forum right now.

Not necessarily. We could be watching Dublin against Mayo in Castlebar or Monaghan against Roscommon in Clones. There'll be bad games in any system, the issue is can we get more good games in a different one? 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 05, 2017, 07:15:47 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:10:02 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:06:32 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:03:23 PM
Eh? At least the super 8 would provide us with some good games as opposed to what we have.

It would provide us at least twice as many of games like the one that's so one-sided that it's allowing you to post on a forum right now.

Not necessarily. We could be watching Dublin against Mayo in Castlebar or Monaghan against Roscommon in Clones. There'll be bad games in any system, the issue is can we get more good games in a different one?
You're very game Zulu.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:18:19 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:10:02 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:06:32 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:03:23 PM
Eh? At least the super 8 would provide us with some good games as opposed to what we have.

It would provide us at least twice as many of games like the one that's so one-sided that it's allowing you to post on a forum right now.

Not necessarily. We could be watching Dublin against Mayo in Castlebar or Monaghan against Roscommon in Clones. There'll be bad games in any system, the issue is can we get more good games in a different one?

The only reason you might have more good games is by sheer volume, you're also increasing the dross exponentially as well. That's a terrible way to do it and dilutes the product even more.

If you can't see that the answer to more competitive games isn't a formatting problem I'm afraid you're well off the mark.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 05, 2017, 07:20:55 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:18:19 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:10:02 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:06:32 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:03:23 PM
Eh? At least the super 8 would provide us with some good games as opposed to what we have.

It would provide us at least twice as many of games like the one that's so one-sided that it's allowing you to post on a forum right now.

Not necessarily. We could be watching Dublin against Mayo in Castlebar or Monaghan against Roscommon in Clones. There'll be bad games in any system, the issue is can we get more good games in a different one?

The only reason you might have more good games is by sheer volume, you're also increasing the dross exponentially as well. That's a terrible way to do it and dilutes the product even more.

If you can't see that the answer to more competitive games isn't a formatting problem I'm afraid you're well off the mark.
Question for you. The solution you've told us previously, which you won't repeat, would it have gotten a 2/3 vote in Congress? Let's pretend that the people voting didn't know that it came from you.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:24:20 PM
Every sport in the world provides more games than we do and all those sports provide poor games and great games. The only way, absolutely only way, to provide more good games is to provide more games between the top teams. The super 8 does that. Of course we need to look at the finances and other issues but money won't make Longford competitive against Dublin every year and splitting counties is anti-GAA, not to mention unrealistic. So the only realistic option for now is to pit Dublin, Mayo and Kerry against each other more often and hope the likes of Kildare, Galway etc. can close the gap.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:24:48 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 05, 2017, 07:20:55 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:18:19 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:10:02 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:06:32 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:03:23 PM
Eh? At least the super 8 would provide us with some good games as opposed to what we have.

It would provide us at least twice as many of games like the one that's so one-sided that it's allowing you to post on a forum right now.

Not necessarily. We could be watching Dublin against Mayo in Castlebar or Monaghan against Roscommon in Clones. There'll be bad games in any system, the issue is can we get more good games in a different one?

The only reason you might have more good games is by sheer volume, you're also increasing the dross exponentially as well. That's a terrible way to do it and dilutes the product even more.

If you can't see that the answer to more competitive games isn't a formatting problem I'm afraid you're well off the mark.
Question for you. The solution you've told us previously, which you won't repeat, would it have gotten a 2/3 vote in Congress? Let's pretend that the people voting didn't know that it came from you.

I'm sick of the same loop of discussing what needs to be done. I'm not going to get into it here; you're not bothered to use the search function, so like hell will I be bothered to type it up again. There's enough circling and circling the same topics on this forum without adding to it in the middle of the season. There was more than enough threads on championship format ideas to whet any appetite you have for the topic.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:25:53 PM
Bullshit, you've no solution. Stop moaning about other suggestions when you've none yourself.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 07:26:53 PM
Can you imagine Armagh having to play Dublin in the next game and Monaghan having to Play Tyrone. And all within a week?

NIGHTMARE
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on August 05, 2017, 07:27:10 PM
There is NO solution. We had a great game and we ruined it!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on August 05, 2017, 07:28:40 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:24:20 PM
Every sport in the world provides more games than we do and all those sports provide poor games and great games. The only way, absolutely only way, to provide more good games is to provide more games between the top teams. The super 8 does that. Of course we need to look at the finances and other issues but money won't make Longford competitive against Dublin every year and splitting counties is anti-GAA, not to mention unrealistic. So the only realistic option for now is to pit Dublin, Mayo and Kerry against each other more often and hope the likes of Kildare, Galway etc. can close the gap.

What about a World Series of Gaelic Football where Kerry and Dublin play each other over a best of seven matches?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:28:54 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:25:53 PM
Bullshit, you've no solution. Stop moaning about other suggestions when you've none yourself.

Already stated multiple times. Your solution is to let Dublin win endless titles as they drain national interest in the sport with their GAA-endorsed advatantages. You know very well how much has changed in the last 15 years to add to all the natural advantages your pet county has.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 05, 2017, 07:31:56 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:24:48 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 05, 2017, 07:20:55 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:18:19 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:10:02 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:06:32 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:03:23 PM
Eh? At least the super 8 would provide us with some good games as opposed to what we have.

It would provide us at least twice as many of games like the one that's so one-sided that it's allowing you to post on a forum right now.

Not necessarily. We could be watching Dublin against Mayo in Castlebar or Monaghan against Roscommon in Clones. There'll be bad games in any system, the issue is can we get more good games in a different one?

The only reason you might have more good games is by sheer volume, you're also increasing the dross exponentially as well. That's a terrible way to do it and dilutes the product even more.

If you can't see that the answer to more competitive games isn't a formatting problem I'm afraid you're well off the mark.
Question for you. The solution you've told us previously, which you won't repeat, would it have gotten a 2/3 vote in Congress? Let's pretend that the people voting didn't know that it came from you.

I'm sick of the same loop of discussing what needs to be done. I'm not going to get into it here; you're not bothered to use the search function, so like hell will I be bothered to type it up again. There's enough circling and circling the same topics on this forum without adding to it in the middle of the season. There was more than enough threads on championship format ideas to whet any appetite you have for the topic.
I didn't ask you to repeat it. I asked if you thought it would get a two thirds majority at congress. Would it?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:37:02 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:28:54 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:25:53 PM
Bullshit, you've no solution. Stop moaning about other suggestions when you've none yourself.

Already stated multiple times. Your solution is to let Dublin win endless titles as they drain national interest in the sport with their GAA-endorsed advatantages. You know very well how much has changed in the last 15 years to add to all the natural ad ranges your pet county has.

Again, nonsense. I'm tempted to ask you to put your mother on the phone as I feel like I'm speaking to a child. I don't want Dublin, or any other county, win every year. I want us to have a fair format for everyone. Dublin, due to their population will always be there or thereabouts but splitting counties and amalgamating counties is pie in the sky stuff so lets work for a realistic format that will give counties a better season even if Dublin and one or two others are likely to win the majority of All Irelands.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: screenexile on August 05, 2017, 07:43:06 PM
Should we just call the All Ireland Championship the super 3's??

(Super 2's depending on how much the Dubs beat Tyrone by)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Gabriel_Hurl on August 05, 2017, 07:46:20 PM
There's salt in them tears  :D :D :D :D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 08:15:16 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:10:02 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 07:06:32 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 07:03:23 PM
Eh? At least the super 8 would provide us with some good games as opposed to what we have.

It would provide us at least twice as many of games like the one that's so one-sided that it's allowing you to post on a forum right now.

Not necessarily. We could be watching Dublin against Mayo in Castlebar or Monaghan against Roscommon in Clones. There'll be bad games in any system, the issue is can we get more good games in a different one?

Are you for REAL? You think that a Championship game involving Mayo and Dublin would be in Castlebar? Really? You are one naive individual.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 08:18:26 PM
Give it a rest FtB, of course that will happen if the teams meet and Mayo have a home game against Dublin. You're CB would be lynched if they didn't have 20-30,000 Dubs coming to Mayo for a game. Your paranoia is getting the better of you.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 05, 2017, 08:21:43 PM
Quote from: The Trap on August 05, 2017, 07:27:10 PM
There is NO solution. We had a great game and we ruined it!
Could you elaborate on that please?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 08:24:49 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 08:18:26 PM
Give it a rest FtB, of course that will happen if the teams meet and Mayo have a home game against Dublin. You're CB would be lynched if they didn't have 20-30,000 Dubs coming to Mayo for a game. Your paranoia is getting the better of you.

What is the Capacity of McHale Park?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on August 05, 2017, 08:47:25 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on August 02, 2017, 03:13:46 PM
Top Six instead...4 provincial champs plus one qualifier from A and one from B.

Two groups of 3, two games for each county, top two to semifinals.

So this year would see Kerry, Roscommon and Mayo/Galway on one side and Dublin, Tyrone and Monaghan/Armagh on the other.  Game 1 has the Provincial champs meet in Croke Park, and qualifier has two away games.  Winner of game 1 plays qualifier in game 2.  Let's assume winner of game 1 wins again.  That means the last game, between loser of game 1 and qualifier, is for a semifinal spot.  No draws, no extra time even, winner decided by playing on after normal time and time added on until we get a score.  A scenario could arise with all three teams having one win each...how best to sort that out? Is Scoring difference really fair, or is the Aussie % better as it takes differing weather conditions into account? 

I suggest goals scored be the first tie-breaker.  That would be different.

We can call it the Six-Pack.

This should gain momentum as a way forward.  Although I would tweak it to send qualifier counties away from their provincial champions.

This year would see a final qualifier pair of games, Mayo/Galway and Armagh/Monaghan.   Mayo/Galway winner joins Dublin and Tyrone, Armagh/Monaghan winner joins Kerry and Roscommon.

Game 1 in sees provincial champs play (thereby giving qualifier winner a week off)...Kerry v Roscommon and Dublin v Tyrone, both games in Croke Park.

Game 2 is loser of Game 1 v qualifier, with loser of Game 1 at home, and Game 3 is winner Game 1 at home v qualifier.

Provincial championship worth a lot when it comes to "seeding", and the hard road is for the qualifier teams. 

All I need is how to separate the nightmare scenario of the three teams getting one win each....any thoughts?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 09:47:08 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 08:24:49 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 08:18:26 PM
Give it a rest FtB, of course that will happen if the teams meet and Mayo have a home game against Dublin. You're CB would be lynched if they didn't have 20-30,000 Dubs coming to Mayo for a game. Your paranoia is getting the better of you.

What is the Capacity of McHale Park?

I don't know, 35,000? I understand the capacity is less than the demand would be but whatever about a county with a 20,000 capacity or less having to give up home advantage, Mayo would not and to imply otherwise is disingenuous to say the least.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:03:40 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 09:47:08 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 08:24:49 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 08:18:26 PM
Give it a rest FtB, of course that will happen if the teams meet and Mayo have a home game against Dublin. You're CB would be lynched if they didn't have 20-30,000 Dubs coming to Mayo for a game. Your paranoia is getting the better of you.

What is the Capacity of McHale Park?

I don't know, 35,000? I understand the capacity is less than the demand would be but whatever about a county with a 20,000 capacity or less having to give up home advantage, Mayo would not and to imply otherwise is disingenuous to say the least.

It holds 38,000 (all seated). You are talking about 20-30,000 Dubs coming to Mayo for a game.  Do you think the GAA who invented this Super 8 to get extra revenue from the Game will have Dublin play a Championship game in McHale park minus the extra capacity, the Rent paying Vendors and Corporate Boxes? This is not about getting better games. This is not about giving everyone a fair chance. This is about the GAA regaining declining revenue. This game would only be played in McHale Park if it was a Dead Rubber fixture!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 05, 2017, 10:12:07 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:03:40 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 09:47:08 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 08:24:49 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 08:18:26 PM
Give it a rest FtB, of course that will happen if the teams meet and Mayo have a home game against Dublin. You're CB would be lynched if they didn't have 20-30,000 Dubs coming to Mayo for a game. Your paranoia is getting the better of you.

What is the Capacity of McHale Park?

I don't know, 35,000? I understand the capacity is less than the demand would be but whatever about a county with a 20,000 capacity or less having to give up home advantage, Mayo would not and to imply otherwise is disingenuous to say the least.

It holds 38,000 (all seated). You are talking about 20-30,000 Dubs coming to Mayo for a game.  Do you think the GAA who invented this Super 8 to get extra revenue from the Game will have Dublin play a Championship game in McHale park minus the extra capacity, the Rent paying Vendors and Corporate Boxes? This is not about getting better games. This is not about giving everyone a fair chance. This is about the GAA regaining declining revenue. This game would only be played in McHale Park if it was a Dead Rubber fixture!
Ha ha. Already a step back from what you've REPEATEDLY said previously.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:14:58 PM
FtB, with respect, that's not true. Every second year (almost) there's a Munster final in Killarney with 30,000 Corkonians going  to Killarney, many knowing they won't get a ticket for the match. The same would happen if Mayo hosted Dublin. The GAA isn't run by non-GAA people but they have to make some tough decisions. I'm a genuine GAA man but believe the provincials are a complete crock, other genuine GAA people believe they are vital. Duffy and others have to try and make decisions that will annoy people irrespective of what they do. It's easy to say the guys at the top aren't GAA men when the rest of us fundamentally disagree on many things. It's a poisoned chalice running the GAA IMO.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:16:34 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 05, 2017, 10:12:07 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:03:40 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 09:47:08 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 08:24:49 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 08:18:26 PM
Give it a rest FtB, of course that will happen if the teams meet and Mayo have a home game against Dublin. You're CB would be lynched if they didn't have 20-30,000 Dubs coming to Mayo for a game. Your paranoia is getting the better of you.

What is the Capacity of McHale Park?

I don't know, 35,000? I understand the capacity is less than the demand would be but whatever about a county with a 20,000 capacity or less having to give up home advantage, Mayo would not and to imply otherwise is disingenuous to say the least.

It holds 38,000 (all seated). You are talking about 20-30,000 Dubs coming to Mayo for a game.  Do you think the GAA who invented this Super 8 to get extra revenue from the Game will have Dublin play a Championship game in McHale park minus the extra capacity, the Rent paying Vendors and Corporate Boxes? This is not about getting better games. This is not about giving everyone a fair chance. This is about the GAA regaining declining revenue. This game would only be played in McHale Park if it was a Dead Rubber fixture!
Ha ha. Already a step back from what you've REPEATEDLY said previously.


There is NO step back from what I said previously.  ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on August 05, 2017, 10:17:06 PM
The problem is a gap in standards. No changes to championship structure is going to alleviate that
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:17:58 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on August 05, 2017, 10:17:06 PM
The problem is a gap in standards. No changes to championship structure is going to alleviate that

+1
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on August 05, 2017, 10:19:50 PM
Gaelic is in a very bad state if 3 of the 4 qfs are walkovers
The Super 8 is partly to bring up standards of the lower 4 but also about money . I think the GAA is too complacent about the supporters . For how long.more are people going to.pay to watch mismatched teams?  And is great to see the Dubs with a team like that but it certainly isn't fair.
 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on August 05, 2017, 10:20:42 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on August 05, 2017, 10:17:06 PM
The problem is a gap in standards. No changes to championship structure is going to alleviate that

You need campaign finance reform
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:23:49 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:14:58 PM
FtB, with respect, that's not true. Every second year (almost) there's a Munster final in Killarney with 30,000 Corkonians going  to Killarney, many knowing they won't get a ticket for the match. The same would happen if Mayo hosted Dublin. The GAA isn't run by non-GAA people but they have to make some tough decisions. I'm a genuine GAA man but believe the provincials are a complete crock, other genuine GAA people believe they are vital. Duffy and others have to try and make decisions that will annoy people irrespective of what they do. It's easy to say the guys at the top aren't GAA men when the rest of us fundamentally disagree on many things. It's a poisoned chalice running the GAA IMO.

This is not Kerry and Cork! This is Dublin! Kerry and Cork have a Provincial Championship agreement. There is no such agreement between Dublin and any other county. All Super 8 games involving Dublin will be in Dublin. Ground Capacity and all the other factors influence this.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:24:56 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:17:58 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on August 05, 2017, 10:17:06 PM
The problem is a gap in standards. No changes to championship structure is going to alleviate that

+1

Partly true, but more games and teams training together for longer will help improve them. However, it won't mean Galway (for example) will beat Dublin but it does mean counties get a better season. I could probably name 4 teams for any sports tournament in the world where one of them will win it, you might get a few surprises but I doubt there's any nigh level team competition in the world that isn't confined to a handful of likely winners.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 10:25:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:14:58 PM
FtB, with respect, that's not true. Every second year (almost) there's a Munster final in Killarney with 30,000 Corkonians going  to Killarney, many knowing they won't get a ticket for the match. The same would happen if Mayo hosted Dublin. The GAA isn't run by non-GAA people but they have to make some tough decisions. I'm a genuine GAA man but believe the provincials are a complete crock, other genuine GAA people believe they are vital. Duffy and others have to try and make decisions that will annoy people irrespective of what they do. It's easy to say the guys at the top aren't GAA men when the rest of us fundamentally disagree on many things. It's a poisoned chalice running the GAA IMO.

Hang on, 30,000 Cork football supporters? Are you sending these communiques from a parallel universe or something?

Rolling on the floor laughing.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:27:01 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:23:49 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:14:58 PM
FtB, with respect, that's not true. Every second year (almost) there's a Munster final in Killarney with 30,000 Corkonians going  to Killarney, many knowing they won't get a ticket for the match. The same would happen if Mayo hosted Dublin. The GAA isn't run by non-GAA people but they have to make some tough decisions. I'm a genuine GAA man but believe the provincials are a complete crock, other genuine GAA people believe they are vital. Duffy and others have to try and make decisions that will annoy people irrespective of what they do. It's easy to say the guys at the top aren't GAA men when the rest of us fundamentally disagree on many things. It's a poisoned chalice running the GAA IMO.

This is not Kerry and Cork! This is Dublin! Kerry and Cork have a Provincial Championship agreement. There is no such agreement between Dublin and any other county. All Super 8 games involving Dublin will be in Dublin. Ground Capacity and all the other factors influence this.

Wrong, you couldn't be more wrong. If Mayo are playing Dublin at home in the super 8 you will be playing them in Castlebar, guaranteed.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:29:13 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 05, 2017, 10:25:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:14:58 PM
FtB, with respect, that's not true. Every second year (almost) there's a Munster final in Killarney with 30,000 Corkonians going  to Killarney, many knowing they won't get a ticket for the match. The same would happen if Mayo hosted Dublin. The GAA isn't run by non-GAA people but they have to make some tough decisions. I'm a genuine GAA man but believe the provincials are a complete crock, other genuine GAA people believe they are vital. Duffy and others have to try and make decisions that will annoy people irrespective of what they do. It's easy to say the guys at the top aren't GAA men when the rest of us fundamentally disagree on many things. It's a poisoned chalice running the GAA IMO.

Hang on, 30,000 Cork football supporters? Are you sending these communiques from a parallel universe or something?

Rolling on the floor laughing.

I've been at Munster finals in Killarney but like your state of the union address re Cavan minors you seem to think you know everything when all the evidence points in the other direction.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on August 05, 2017, 10:31:32 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:27:01 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:23:49 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:14:58 PM
FtB, with respect, that's not true. Every second year (almost) there's a Munster final in Killarney with 30,000 Corkonians going  to Killarney, many knowing they won't get a ticket for the match. The same would happen if Mayo hosted Dublin. The GAA isn't run by non-GAA people but they have to make some tough decisions. I'm a genuine GAA man but believe the provincials are a complete crock, other genuine GAA people believe they are vital. Duffy and others have to try and make decisions that will annoy people irrespective of what they do. It's easy to say the guys at the top aren't GAA men when the rest of us fundamentally disagree on many things. It's a poisoned chalice running the GAA IMO.

This is not Kerry and Cork! This is Dublin! Kerry and Cork have a Provincial Championship agreement. There is no such agreement between Dublin and any other county. All Super 8 games involving Dublin will be in Dublin. Ground Capacity and all the other factors influence this.

Wrong, you couldn't be more wrong. If Mayo are playing Dublin at home in the super 8 you will be playing them in Castlebar, guaranteed.

Isn't it the case though that that will only happen in years where one of the teams is a qualifier?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 05, 2017, 10:33:05 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:16:34 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 05, 2017, 10:12:07 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:03:40 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 09:47:08 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 08:24:49 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 08:18:26 PM
Give it a rest FtB, of course that will happen if the teams meet and Mayo have a home game against Dublin. You're CB would be lynched if they didn't have 20-30,000 Dubs coming to Mayo for a game. Your paranoia is getting the better of you.

What is the Capacity of McHale Park?

I don't know, 35,000? I understand the capacity is less than the demand would be but whatever about a county with a 20,000 capacity or less having to give up home advantage, Mayo would not and to imply otherwise is disingenuous to say the least.

It holds 38,000 (all seated). You are talking about 20-30,000 Dubs coming to Mayo for a game.  Do you think the GAA who invented this Super 8 to get extra revenue from the Game will have Dublin play a Championship game in McHale park minus the extra capacity, the Rent paying Vendors and Corporate Boxes? This is not about getting better games. This is not about giving everyone a fair chance. This is about the GAA regaining declining revenue. This game would only be played in McHale Park if it was a Dead Rubber fixture!
Ha ha. Already a step back from what you've REPEATEDLY said previously.


There is NO step back from what I said previously.  ;)
July 24th 2017 - "If Mayo were to play Dublin there is no way the game would be in McHale Park."
July 23rd 2017 - "Dublin play a Championship game in Castlebar - Are you on drugs! Do you still believe in Santa?"

I see you also mention the new version. So which is it?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on August 05, 2017, 10:34:49 PM
So tell me Zulu, what will replace the provincial councils, or will they just die away under your plan?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:35:15 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on August 05, 2017, 10:31:32 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:27:01 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:23:49 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:14:58 PM
FtB, with respect, that's not true. Every second year (almost) there's a Munster final in Killarney with 30,000 Corkonians going  to Killarney, many knowing they won't get a ticket for the match. The same would happen if Mayo hosted Dublin. The GAA isn't run by non-GAA people but they have to make some tough decisions. I'm a genuine GAA man but believe the provincials are a complete crock, other genuine GAA people believe they are vital. Duffy and others have to try and make decisions that will annoy people irrespective of what they do. It's easy to say the guys at the top aren't GAA men when the rest of us fundamentally disagree on many things. It's a poisoned chalice running the GAA IMO.

This is not Kerry and Cork! This is Dublin! Kerry and Cork have a Provincial Championship agreement. There is no such agreement between Dublin and any other county. All Super 8 games involving Dublin will be in Dublin. Ground Capacity and all the other factors influence this.

Wrong, you couldn't be more wrong. If Mayo are playing Dublin at home in the super 8 you will be playing them in Castlebar, guaranteed.

Isn't it the case though that that will only happen in years where one of the teams is a qualifier?

Yes, I think so but that would be the scenario in the past two years.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:35:55 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on August 05, 2017, 10:34:49 PM
So tell me Zulu, what will replace the provincial councils, or will they just die away under your plan?

Why would the provincial councils have to be replaced?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:37:51 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 05, 2017, 10:33:05 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:16:34 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 05, 2017, 10:12:07 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:03:40 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 09:47:08 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 08:24:49 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 08:18:26 PM
Give it a rest FtB, of course that will happen if the teams meet and Mayo have a home game against Dublin. You're CB would be lynched if they didn't have 20-30,000 Dubs coming to Mayo for a game. Your paranoia is getting the better of you.

What is the Capacity of McHale Park?

I don't know, 35,000? I understand the capacity is less than the demand would be but whatever about a county with a 20,000 capacity or less having to give up home advantage, Mayo would not and to imply otherwise is disingenuous to say the least.

It holds 38,000 (all seated). You are talking about 20-30,000 Dubs coming to Mayo for a game.  Do you think the GAA who invented this Super 8 to get extra revenue from the Game will have Dublin play a Championship game in McHale park minus the extra capacity, the Rent paying Vendors and Corporate Boxes? This is not about getting better games. This is not about giving everyone a fair chance. This is about the GAA regaining declining revenue. This game would only be played in McHale Park if it was a Dead Rubber fixture!
Ha ha. Already a step back from what you've REPEATEDLY said previously.


There is NO step back from what I said previously.  ;)
July 24th 2017 - "If Mayo were to play Dublin there is no way the game would be in McHale Park."
July 23rd 2017 - "Dublin play a Championship game in Castlebar - Are you on drugs! Do you still believe in Santa?"

I see you also mention the new version. So which is it?

And I stick by what I said there will be no meaningful Championship Game with the Dubs coming to Castlebar. But hey you believe what you believe!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on August 05, 2017, 10:39:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:35:55 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on August 05, 2017, 10:34:49 PM
So tell me Zulu, what will replace the provincial councils, or will they just die away under your plan?

Why would the provincial councils have to be replaced?

If you are advocating no provincial championships, what purpose will they serve? 

Every County Board runs their own affairs, and a central All-Ireland championship seems to be your preference.  So what would the provincial councils do?  Be a regional coordinator for Central Council?

Or would they continue just for minor and U20?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:41:39 PM
That's like saying I believe the world is flat but hey you believe what you want. You have provided nothing to support your assertion that a home Mayo game will be played in Croke Park and I'm absolutely certain you are wrong.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:43:53 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on August 05, 2017, 10:39:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:35:55 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on August 05, 2017, 10:34:49 PM
So tell me Zulu, what will replace the provincial councils, or will they just die away under your plan?

Why would the provincial councils have to be replaced?

If you are advocating no provincial championships, what purpose will they serve? 

Every County Board runs their own affairs, and a central All-Ireland championship seems to be your preference.  So what would the provincial councils do?  Be a regional coordinator for Central Council?

Sorry, do we only have provincial councils to run a handful of provincial championship games each year?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:48:55 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:41:39 PM
That's like saying I believe the world is flat but hey you believe what you want. You have provided nothing to support your assertion that a home Mayo game will be played in Croke Park and I'm absolutely certain you are wrong.

Not going to waste any more of your time or mine. Dublin play Championship games in Croke Park. Especially big games. The market place determines this.

Look, we will have to wait and see.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on August 05, 2017, 10:52:42 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:43:53 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on August 05, 2017, 10:39:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:35:55 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on August 05, 2017, 10:34:49 PM
So tell me Zulu, what will replace the provincial councils, or will they just die away under your plan?

Why would the provincial councils have to be replaced?

If you are advocating no provincial championships, what purpose will they serve? 

Every County Board runs their own affairs, and a central All-Ireland championship seems to be your preference.  So what would the provincial councils do?  Be a regional coordinator for Central Council?

Sorry, do we only have provincial councils to run a handful of provincial championship games each year?

If you are saying the provincial council will be the regional branch of Central Council, then fair enough.  Without a provincial championship they will lose a lot of their current funding.  How will that be replaced?

Are you abolishing minor and U20 provincial systems as well in favour of open draws?

Are the provincial championships gone for hurling as well under your plan?

Just curious...I see merit in having the conversation about finishing provincial championships, but it must be discussed to deeper levels for the impacts throughout each region.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 11:01:06 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 05, 2017, 10:48:55 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:41:39 PM
That's like saying I believe the world is flat but hey you believe what you want. You have provided nothing to support your assertion that a home Mayo game will be played in Croke Park and I'm absolutely certain you are wrong.

Not going to waste any more of your time or mine. Dublin play Championship games in Croke Park. Especially big games. The market place determines this.

Look, we will have to wait and see.

Fair enough.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 11:04:18 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on August 05, 2017, 10:52:42 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:43:53 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on August 05, 2017, 10:39:25 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 05, 2017, 10:35:55 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on August 05, 2017, 10:34:49 PM
So tell me Zulu, what will replace the provincial councils, or will they just die away under your plan?

Why would the provincial councils have to be replaced?

If you are advocating no provincial championships, what purpose will they serve? 

Every County Board runs their own affairs, and a central All-Ireland championship seems to be your preference.  So what would the provincial councils do?  Be a regional coordinator for Central Council?

Sorry, do we only have provincial councils to run a handful of provincial championship games each year?

If you are saying the provincial council will be the regional branch of Central Council, then fair enough.  Without a provincial championship they will lose a lot of their current funding.  How will that be replaced?

Are you abolishing minor and U20 provincial systems as well in favour of open draws?

Are the provincial championships gone for hurling as well under your plan?

Just curious...I see merit in having the conversation about finishing provincial championships, but it must be discussed to deeper levels for the impacts throughout each region.

Of course, it's complicated but I see no reason why an organisation like the GAA can't organise finances so that regional bodies like provincial councils can't still get what they need. That would be the least of the problems I think.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on August 06, 2017, 10:47:40 AM
there isn't going to be anything 'super' about these super 8s

most games will be one sided
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 06, 2017, 11:27:01 AM
Change it to the "Big 5"
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: balladmaker on August 06, 2017, 01:11:20 PM
QuoteChange it to the "Big 5"

There is no Big 5, just a Big 3 .... Dublin, Tyrone and Kerry in that order as I see it presently.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 06, 2017, 01:16:44 PM
Quote from: balladmaker on August 06, 2017, 01:11:20 PM
QuoteChange it to the "Big 5"

There is no Big 5, just a Big 3 .... Dublin, Tyrone and Kerry in that order as I see it presently.

Tyrone have no right to be in that group before Mayo. There's Dublin and then there's three teams a good step after them, nearer the rest than Dublin.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 06, 2017, 01:22:21 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 06, 2017, 01:16:44 PM
Quote from: balladmaker on August 06, 2017, 01:11:20 PM
QuoteChange it to the "Big 5"

There is no Big 5, just a Big 3 .... Dublin, Tyrone and Kerry in that order as I see it presently.

Tyrone have no right to be in that group before Mayo. There's Dublin and then there's three teams a good step after them, nearer the rest than Dublin.

Tyrone have to be there. They nearly beat Dublin in the League in March and they beat Derry, Donegal, Down and Armagh this year - all Hammerings.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 06, 2017, 01:35:17 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 06, 2017, 01:22:21 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 06, 2017, 01:16:44 PM
Quote from: balladmaker on August 06, 2017, 01:11:20 PM
QuoteChange it to the "Big 5"

There is no Big 5, just a Big 3 .... Dublin, Tyrone and Kerry in that order as I see it presently.

Tyrone have no right to be in that group before Mayo. There's Dublin and then there's three teams a good step after them, nearer the rest than Dublin.

Tyrone have to be there. They nearly beat Dublin in the League in March and they beat Derry, Donegal, Down and Armagh this year - all Hammerings.

Monaghan gave Dublin a proper game in the league too - so what?

If we used league pairings as any guide for championship the Roscommon Mayo match would have both had Mayo as the Connacht champions and the end result a whitewash for Mayo. Teams peak at different times.

Tyrone have, as always, just played at one level all year. Dublin will have their best 15 playing in the semi, in the first match all year that there's the remotest chance the opposition will be competitive. If you think their league match with Dublin will be any indication of the gap between the two sides you're in for a surprise.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 06, 2017, 01:39:27 PM
There are 5 teams still standing in the AI race.
We'll know the 1 to 5 order on 18th September (barring a draw).
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on August 06, 2017, 01:48:25 PM
Syph, you can park your depressive obsession with Tír Eoghain, and focus on your own fecking game at hand, muppet.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: imtommygunn on August 06, 2017, 01:53:04 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 06, 2017, 01:39:27 PM
There are 5 teams still standing in the AI race.
We'll know the 1 to 5 order on 18th September (barring a draw).

The 5 left are not the top 5 though. They are the top 4 plus one other who is in the top 8. Whoever loses mayo roscommon has proved nothing more than being equal with the other 3 already knocked out quarter finalists...
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 06, 2017, 02:00:51 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on August 06, 2017, 01:48:25 PM
Syph, you can park your depressive obsession with Tír Eoghain, and focus on your own fecking game at hand, muppet.

I talk about Tyrone so little comparative to most of the other counties remaining in the championship it's very illustrative as to where your mind is that you'd think I care enough about Tyrone to be obsessed.

I suppose the usual attitude for you is anything barring fawning poor mouthing is obsession.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on August 06, 2017, 02:07:25 PM
If you had anything rational or objective to say it might be worth the hearing, but it's just noise, thoroughly uninformed noise.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 06, 2017, 02:18:56 PM
Can anyone help me with the help function to find Syferus's proposal?

From The Bunker, do you have by the way? I'm genuinely interested.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 06, 2017, 02:45:37 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 06, 2017, 01:53:04 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 06, 2017, 01:39:27 PM
There are 5 teams still standing in the AI race.
We'll know the 1 to 5 order on 18th September (barring a draw).

The 5 left are not the top 5 though. They are the top 4 plus one other who is in the top 8. Whoever loses mayo roscommon has proved nothing more than being equal with the other 3 already knocked out quarter finalists...

Last week the  Ulster items told us we were the weakest of the 8 left.
Think it's fair to say ye got that very wrong.
Now ye're spluttering rubbish again.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: imtommygunn on August 06, 2017, 02:50:02 PM
Ok so when someone gets knocked out in the last 8 you are better than the other 3? Grand so.

Spluttering rubbish. Love the irony of that comment ;D

Also is it not the ulster people with the chip on their shoulder? Who said mayo would beat roscommon? You drew that conclusion yourself.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 06, 2017, 02:52:30 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 06, 2017, 02:50:02 PM
Ok so when someone gets knocked out in the last 8 you are better than the other 3? Grand so.

Spluttering rubbish. Love the irony of that comment ;D

Also is it not the ulster people with the chip on their shoulder? Who said mayo would beat roscommon? You drew that conclusion yourself.

There's a difference between drawing and being absolutely hammered. It's incredibly sad that it even needs to be said. Please stop digging a hole for yourself.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: imtommygunn on August 06, 2017, 03:00:48 PM
More irony ;D

Monaghan, galway, armagh and roscommon/ mayo are 5-8. Mayo and roscommon are PROBABLY better than galway and armagh. Not convinced that either are better than monaghan though.

There is a difference in each quarter finalists opposition too so whether they draw and then get beat or just get hammered isn't really that relevant. You got hammered by a team that we didn't play and we played someone worse but drew so must be better. Hardly comparable.

More chips on the shoulder. You might beat mayo you know.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 06, 2017, 03:02:26 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 06, 2017, 03:00:48 PM
More irony ;D

Monaghan, galway, armagh and roscommon/ mayo are 5-8. Mayo and roscommon are PROBABLY better than galway and armagh. Not convinced that either are better than monaghan though.

There is a difference in each quarter finalists opposition too so whether they draw and then get beat or just get hammered isn't really that relevant. You got hammered by a team that we didn't play and we played someone worse but drew so must be better. Hardly comparable.

More chips on the shoulder. You might beat mayo you know.

If you actually think Monaghan are better than Mayo this conversation is over.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: imtommygunn on August 06, 2017, 03:10:41 PM
They might be better than their opposition though ;D

Mayo aren't great this year at all. Really far off where they were unless they really waken up - whether it is still there or not still remains to be seen If roscommon can challenge them then so could monaghan unless roscommon got them on the hop. Don't forget a very average side in derry were very close to putting mayo out and clare rattled them.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 06, 2017, 04:07:23 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 06, 2017, 03:10:41 PM
They might be better than their opposition though ;D

Mayo aren't great this year at all. Really far off where they were unless they really waken up - whether it is still there or not still remains to be seen If roscommon can challenge them then so could monaghan unless roscommon got them on the hop. Don't forget a very average side in derry were very close to putting mayo out and clare rattled them.

But they didn't! Just like teams like westmeath, Sligo and Antrim came close to beating Kerry when they were a top team using the back door, but Didn't!

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on August 06, 2017, 04:14:14 PM
Can't help feeling the Super 8s will be one of the biggest errors the GAA men in suits will bring in. And once its end there will be no going back only slight adjustment made to this "money" making format. You'll have the few of those that will say lets wait and see it might be better than what we already have but the same was said about Mr Trump.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on August 06, 2017, 04:18:24 PM
I'm not a fan of the Super 8 concept, but I think this idea that Dublin, Tyrone & Kerry will go around the country laying waste to the opposition next year, based on the quarter-finals, is a bit simplistic.
I'm very curious to see Dublin on the road.
No doubt there will be one or two hammerings on the way, but I think teams will be a lot more relaxed as it's not 'lose this and you're gone' anymore.
There might be a bit more adventure, with teams willing to have a cut instead of shutting up shop to limit the damage.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on August 06, 2017, 04:19:38 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 06, 2017, 01:16:44 PM
Quote from: balladmaker on August 06, 2017, 01:11:20 PM
QuoteChange it to the "Big 5"

There is no Big 5, just a Big 3 .... Dublin, Tyrone and Kerry in that order as I see it presently.

Tyrone have no right to be in that group before Mayo. There's Dublin and then there's three teams a good step after them, nearer the rest than Dublin.

Mayo were beat by Galway, then struggled against Derry, Clare and Roscommon. Of course Tyrone have more of a right to be there over Mayo.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 06, 2017, 04:43:37 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on August 06, 2017, 04:19:38 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 06, 2017, 01:16:44 PM
Quote from: balladmaker on August 06, 2017, 01:11:20 PM
QuoteChange it to the "Big 5"

There is no Big 5, just a Big 3 .... Dublin, Tyrone and Kerry in that order as I see it presently.

Tyrone have no right to be in that group before Mayo. There's Dublin and then there's three teams a good step after them, nearer the rest than Dublin.

Mayo were beat by Galway, then struggled against Derry, Clare and Roscommon. Of course Tyrone have more of a right to be there over Mayo.

How many times have Tyrone beat Mayo in the championship since Dublin started dominating? Actually, how many times have Tyrone made the final since then? This sport is about what you do, not what you might do. Unless Tyrone shock the island and beat Dublin they will have done little to eclipse what Mayo have done in the last five or six years.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on August 06, 2017, 04:47:48 PM
IF Roscommon beat Mayo the semi final will be a walkover for Kerry........if Mayo win and get a couple of weeks decent prep we might get two decent semi finals to save the season......but it's been that way for a few years now......
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on August 06, 2017, 05:13:06 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 06, 2017, 04:43:37 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on August 06, 2017, 04:19:38 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 06, 2017, 01:16:44 PM
Quote from: balladmaker on August 06, 2017, 01:11:20 PM
QuoteChange it to the "Big 5"

There is no Big 5, just a Big 3 .... Dublin, Tyrone and Kerry in that order as I see it presently.

Tyrone have no right to be in that group before Mayo. There's Dublin and then there's three teams a good step after them, nearer the rest than Dublin.

Mayo were beat by Galway, then struggled against Derry, Clare and Roscommon. Of course Tyrone have more of a right to be there over Mayo.

How many times have Tyrone beat Mayo in the championship since Dublin started dominating? Actually, how many times have Tyrone made the final since then? This sport is about what you do, not what you might do. Unless Tyrone shock the island and beat Dublin they will have done little to eclipse what Mayo have done in the last five or six years.

Its not about the last 5 or 6 years. You can't claim they are better than Tyrone at the minute off the back of past achievements. How far back do you go? Let's start at 2003 sure....
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on August 06, 2017, 05:21:44 PM
The only useful thing to do with an 8 is divide Dublin in 8, each bit of which would still have more people than Kerry and significantly more than the likes of Mayo. This could become a new "province".
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 06, 2017, 05:39:09 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 06, 2017, 04:07:23 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 06, 2017, 03:10:41 PM
They might be better than their opposition though ;D

Mayo aren't great this year at all. Really far off where they were unless they really waken up - whether it is still there or not still remains to be seen If roscommon can challenge them then so could monaghan unless roscommon got them on the hop. Don't forget a very average side in derry were very close to putting mayo out and clare rattled them.

But they didn't! Just like teams like westmeath, Sligo and Antrim came close to beating Kerry when they were a top team using the back door, but Didn't!

Why don't we just accept that Ulster teams are wonderful and Connacht teams are sh1te. ::)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 06, 2017, 05:42:32 PM
What's the relevance of this Top 5 discussion in the context of the Super 8?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: imtommygunn on August 06, 2017, 06:00:22 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 06, 2017, 05:39:09 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 06, 2017, 04:07:23 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 06, 2017, 03:10:41 PM
They might be better than their opposition though ;D

Mayo aren't great this year at all. Really far off where they were unless they really waken up - whether it is still there or not still remains to be seen If roscommon carn challenge them then so could monaghan unless roscommon got them on the hop. Don't forget a very average side in derry were very close to putting mayo out and clare rattled them.

What has ulster got to do with anything? What kind of debate is that? I'm from ulster so can't have an opinion as it's biased?  5 is a made up number because 2 teams drew esmaralda. That seems the crux of it.
But they didn't! Just like teams like westmeath, Sligo and Antrim came close to beating Kerry when they were a top team using the back door, but Didn't!

Why don't we just accept that Ulster teams are wonderful and Connacht teams are sh1te. ::)

What has ulster got to do with anything? Convenient get out of any reasoned debate.

5 is a made up number esmeralda. Two teams drew leaving 5 counties left so whoever loses is the 5th best team in the country seems to be the point. I am debating that. They are somewhere from 5-8.

Granted derry didn't mayo ftb but you would expect mayo of old to get better from that and they haven't yet. i hope you do but remains to be seen if you have still "got it".

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on August 06, 2017, 06:07:42 PM
Prediction for next 5 years:
Always in last 8:
Dublin and Kerry

Teams that if they make last 8 might compete with Dublin and Kerry:
Tyrone - might do a Donegal in a couple of years and drop away for a year or two
Mayo - prob get another new manager, replenish the batteries and go again and again

Other teams:
Leinster
Kildare - seem to have the right attitude so may make a run to last 8 occasionally but won't win anything
Meath - the game needs Meath but they are so far away it's unreal for a massively populated place that is gaa mad......maybe within 5 years they could get back to being competitive
No other team has a hope
Munster
Cork - same as Meath, football needs a strong Cork....maybe a new manager can do something as again this is a massive gaa county that should be doing better
Tipp and Clare have done really well recently but don't have the resources to mount a challenge in a top 8
Connaught
Galway - just like Meath and cork we need a strong Galway.....would be worried though how this team lost so badly to Tipp Roscommon and Kerry in last 12 months. Do they have the balls to keep at it?
Roscommon - can make top 8 occasionally but that's about it
Ulster
Donegal - will take a while to regroup but can make top 8 a couple of times in next 5 years without challenging for Sam
Derry - are one county sitting under the radar that could come good but a bit like Galway have they the balls to work hard enough at it?
Monaghan Armagh Cavan may make it to last 8 with a good draw but that's about as far as they will go.

Basically it's between Dublin and Kerry for at least the first 5 years of the super 8. Tyrone and Mayo will keep at it this year and next.

There are so many counties that have no hope, will they keep at it?


Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on August 06, 2017, 06:11:46 PM
Malachy O'Rourke: Super 8s will make strong stronger

Quote
Malachy O'Rourke fears the introduction of the Super 8 format on a three-year trial basis next year will only widen the gap between the top three or four football counties and the rest.

The Monaghan manager believes the new format will make it even harder for those outside Dublin, Kerry, Tyrone and possibly Mayo to come through the All-Ireland SFC quarter-final stage next year. He was speaking after the Farney County's heavy defeat to Dublin in Croke Park yesterday.

"You can't argue with that after today," he told RTE.

"Armagh got well beaten by Tyrone just before us, and certainly there are a couple of counties getting that bit stronger and have pulled ahead this year. I could be proved wrong but I think it [Super 8s] will [make it harder].

"If I'm speaking honestly, I think it will. Especially for the smaller counties with less resources, if we play a really tough game one week and we have to go out again the following week, you're probably going to have fellas carrying injuries, you might have suspensions and things like that there.

"Whereas the stronger counties don't rely on a few individuals as much. They have stronger panels. I could be proved wrong but I think it will [make it harder].

"You can never say that. You can never write anyone off. But I just think the actual format, and maybe I'll be proved wrong, if you've a home game in Clones and things like that, that could change it, just if you're asking me my honest opinion, I think it will make it tougher."
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on August 07, 2017, 02:46:46 PM
OMG..........4 Turkey shoots
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Taylor on August 07, 2017, 02:54:19 PM
We should just change it to the Super 4. Top 2 play in final

Super 8 is going to be a complete balls up given the gap between the top 4 and the rest
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on August 07, 2017, 03:10:49 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 07, 2017, 02:54:19 PM
We should just change it to the Super 4. Top 2 play in final

Super 8 is going to be a complete balls up given the gap between the top 4 and the rest

One of the "Super 4" didn't make the semis last year
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: J70 on August 07, 2017, 03:15:17 PM
The kick-out has been a big issue in some of the unexpected hammerings dished out this year. Certainly in Donegal's losses to Tyrone and Galway, and absolutely today.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on August 07, 2017, 03:21:24 PM
Tipp got to last 4 last year but do you honestly think they would have beaten mayo Dublin kerry or tyrone had they met? Only reason tyrone did not get to semi final was because they met mayo in last 8
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 07, 2017, 03:27:49 PM
While it's not looking good for the super 8 based on this years QF's that's not to say the gap will be as big next year or the year after. Kildare will certainly improve, as will Roscommon. You'd expect Galway, Armagh, Donegal, Cork and, maybe, Monaghan and Meath to do so too. The top four might do so as well but the likes of Roscommon and Kildare certainly have more room for improvement. It doesn't matter the format if we have a few teams miles ahead of the rest but I don't think the gap will be the same in the coming years.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on August 07, 2017, 03:36:20 PM
We have sometimes heard the strange concept that the winners of the any B championship should be allowed back into the AI series at a late stage. I think events this weekend show how pointless that would be.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: StGallsGAA on August 07, 2017, 04:11:32 PM
Tyrone, Mayo, Dublin and Kerry to play one another home and away every year for the next decade to decide Sam.  Winner takes all.  All other county teams to take up hurling and/or camogie.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on August 07, 2017, 05:02:53 PM
Quote from: StGallsGAA on August 07, 2017, 04:11:32 PM
Tyrone, Mayo, Dublin and Kerry to play one another home and away every year for the next decade to decide Sam.  Winner takes all.  All other county teams to take up hurling and/or camogie.

Hilarious how Tyrone having one good year and Donegal having one bad year means we are going to be the dominant force for the next decade.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Solo_run on August 07, 2017, 05:04:02 PM
So the top 4 teams have all destroyed the lower ranking teams and now there is going to be a super 8  :o ;D

Can the GAA do anything right?!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 07, 2017, 09:31:15 PM
Yeah, time for two sixteen team championships.
Sorry, time for a three tiered championship.
Nope, that won't work again.
In the absence of a solution, let's blame Duffy and the Super 8.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on August 07, 2017, 10:21:23 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 07, 2017, 03:27:49 PM
While it's not looking good for the super 8 based on this years QF's that's not to say the gap will be as big next year or the year after. Kildare will certainly improve, as will Roscommon. You'd expect Galway, Armagh, Donegal, Cork and, maybe, Monaghan and Meath to do so too. The top four might do so as well but the likes of Roscommon and Kildare certainly have more room for improvement. It doesn't matter the format if we have a few teams miles ahead of the rest but I don't think the gap will be the same in the coming years.
You'll have entropy in the top 4 and growth in the pretenders so things should be better over the next few years
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: LeoMc on August 08, 2017, 07:51:02 AM
Two 16 team championships. Straight knock out. No back door.
8 teams beaten in round 1 (senior) play off. Bottom 4 drop to the second tier the next year.
4 Semi-finalists in the second tier move up to Senior the following year.
8 teams beaten in round 1 (2nd tier) play off for a 3rd tier trophy if there is a need to ensure everyone gets a minimum of 2 games.

Win 2 games and you play with the big boys the following year. Lose 2 and you go back down.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: APM on August 08, 2017, 09:40:05 AM
I have to laugh at the nonsense about splitting the championship into tiers.  We have four teams a mile ahead of the rest.  On their day, some of the rest will give them a game if they are at the top of their game and the top teams under perform.  Outside that it is competitive among the remainder.  The other division 1 teams (2017/18), Monaghan, Donegal, Cavan, Galway and Kildare were all beaten by Division 2 / 3 opposition in the Championship this year. 

If you were trying to tier the Championship on this years form, you would segment the top four from Division 1.  Another segment from the bottom half of Division 1, all of Division 2 and the top three teams in Division 3.  The remainder of Division 3 and 4 would be in a third tier (although that would be tough on Carlow). Obviously you would have to make an exception for Longford given their uncanny ability to perform in the qualifiers. 

The nonsense is that if you were to segment on the basis of performance, the top tier would start at Semi-Finals.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fuzzman on August 11, 2017, 05:28:08 PM
I think one of the big pluses that the Super 8s will give us is more matches for those 2nd tier teams against the top 4.
If you work backwards, there is always going to be one winner, then the top 2, top 4 and top 8
Usually those teams who make it to the quarterfinals like say Monaghan, Galway, Cork and maybe Kildare in recent years tend to only get one game in Croke park as their reward for getting that far.

Now they get 3 more games against 2 provincial winners and against another qualifier team. As we call know, you only get better by playing teams that are better than you and so in my view this new structure rewards those teams with 3 more games rather than just one more where they might get hockeyed by a provincial winner.
Those of you, like Brolly said, could argue that they could get 3 more hammerings (or at least two) but at least they are getting games. I'd say Armagh, Monaghan, Roscommon and Galway would all love to play 3 more championship games so that they can better themselves.

I'd be curious what fans from those counties would prefer next year. A once off game against one of the provincial winners or 3 more games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 11, 2017, 05:36:09 PM
We got 2 games this year!!
Our lads need to train more than this year's  starting in April lark if we're to be able for 3 big games in successive weeks.
A once off game is great if you win but 3 slightly less pressurised games would be better for a developing team in my humble.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on August 11, 2017, 06:05:36 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on August 11, 2017, 05:28:08 PM

I'd be curious what fans from those counties would prefer next year. A once off game against one of the provincial winners or 3 more games.
Teams coming through the qualifiers will more than likely have played a good few games to reach the last 8 and won't have the conditioning work done of the top four teams for another 3 more games to just to reach the final 4. Supporters i can imagine of underdogs would want that off game with the chance to catch the favourites on the hop, Roscommon for example were a kick of a ball from doing that, Tipp achieved it last year and Wexford,Fermanagh in past.  Little or no chance of the underdog coming out of round robin system, they might be lucky to win one of the three games and the probably well bet in the other two games.

The "Super 8" IMO will just make the top 4 stronger and create a bigger gap between those 4 and the rest.



Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on August 11, 2017, 06:27:49 PM
This year it would have been between Armagh and roscommon for a semi final spot. And only 2 between tyrone/mayo/dublin. Now imagine THAT.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on August 11, 2017, 07:03:07 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on August 11, 2017, 06:27:49 PM
This year it would have been between Armagh and roscommon for a semi final spot. And only 2 between tyrone/mayo/dublin. Now imagine THAT.
Armagh and Roscommon would have finished 3rd and 4th behind Monaghan,Kerry in their group this year.  Dublin would top the other group with Tyrone and Mayo in a battle to finish 2nd.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on August 11, 2017, 07:11:38 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on August 11, 2017, 07:03:07 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on August 11, 2017, 06:27:49 PM
This year it would have been between Armagh and roscommon for a semi final spot. And only 2 between tyrone/mayo/dublin. Now imagine THAT.
Armagh and Roscommon would have finished 3rd and 4th behind Monaghan,Kerry in their group this year.  Dublin would top the other group with Tyrone and Mayo in a battle to finish 2nd.

I didn't know you had the power to observe parallel universes..
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 11, 2017, 07:38:18 PM
Kerry would have topped the group with 6 points.
2nd would have been between us and Monaghan.
Sure while I'm at it we'd bate Tyrone in the SF and lose to our western neighbours in the Final replay.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 11, 2017, 09:06:13 PM
If we by some far stretch of the imagination we beat Kerry this year. It would be great, marvelous in fact. If we beat them in the Super 8 next year, I'd imagine it would feel no better than beating them in a League Match. The Same would go for Tyrone with Dublin. Like Roscommon a week ago, they showed their hand to Mayo and Mayo got a second chance to make amends. A beaten Dublin or Kerry would get a second chance to see the hand of their aggressor and learn how to beat them later.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on August 11, 2017, 09:33:01 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 10, 2017, 09:32:41 PM
At the beginning of the year, I expected us to meet Kerry as Connacht Champions and I expected us to beat them. I actually thought it was the easier side of the draw avoiding Tyrone and Dublin.  We are were we are the long way.  I still strangely expect us to win!

Quote from: From the Bunker on August 11, 2017, 09:06:13 PM
If we by some far stretch of the imagination we beat Kerry this year. It would be great, marvelous in fact.

Imagination running wild or unable to make up your mind?  ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 11, 2017, 09:46:44 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on August 11, 2017, 09:33:01 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 10, 2017, 09:32:41 PM
At the beginning of the year, I expected us to meet Kerry as Connacht Champions and I expected us to beat them. I actually thought it was the easier side of the draw avoiding Tyrone and Dublin.  We are were we are the long way.  I still strangely expect us to win!

Quote from: From the Bunker on August 11, 2017, 09:06:13 PM
If we by some far stretch of the imagination we beat Kerry this year. It would be great, marvelous in fact.

Imagination running wild or unable to make up your mind?  ;)

Was trying to play my earlier post down! Yeah still expect us to win!   :)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fuzzman on August 12, 2017, 12:29:12 AM
Who was the last team who got to an AI final that came from nowhere?
Down 2010, Fuzz
OK OK besides them smart ass
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 12, 2017, 12:32:57 AM
Quote from: Fuzzman on August 12, 2017, 12:29:12 AM
Who was the last team who got to an AI final that came from nowhere?
Down 2010, Fuzz
OK OK besides them smart ass

Mayo 1996! Were in Division 3!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fuzzman on August 12, 2017, 12:57:09 AM
Exactly Bunker. Its a very rare occurrence yet so many of us want a system that promotes the shock result and want the beat teams to lose.

I think what Jim McGuiness did to Donegal football should be the blueprint for any other county in the top 16 to follow.
This was a team who were losing first round games to Antrim and he showed what can be achieved.

I'd love to know what Brolly and ORourke would like their solution to be. Most counties don't want to play in B championships.
I think most Armagh, Roscommon and even Tyrone fans when we lose to Dublin, would say it was an enjoyable season.
Not everyone can make it to the final or semis.
But it would be nice.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 12, 2017, 01:07:25 AM
Good season for us winning only our 3rd Connacht in 26 years. 22nd or 13rd over all though.
Previous 2 were flash in the pans. We're hoping we're on the cusp of better things.
However if I'd been born and raised a few miles to the East in either Laythrum or Larryland  what would Inter County football have to offer me?
Would I like to have the chance of winning an AI Junior or Inter or would I prefer batins left right and centre?
I know the Larries burst a few balloons over the years but how many Cups won?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on August 12, 2017, 11:12:33 AM
Quote from: Fuzzman on August 12, 2017, 12:29:12 AM
Who was the last team who got to an AI final that came from nowhere?
Down 2010, Fuzz
OK OK besides them smart ass
Sligo beat Tyrone in 02. The previous year they were out in the QFs
Would that not count ?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 12, 2017, 11:15:27 AM
Quote from: seafoid on August 12, 2017, 11:12:33 AM
Quote from: Fuzzman on August 12, 2017, 12:29:12 AM
Who was the last team who got to an AI final that came from nowhere?
Down 2010, Fuzz
OK OK besides them smart ass
Sligo beat Tyrone in 02. The previous year they were out in the QFs
Would that not count ?

Yes, if he did not ask Who was the last team who got to an AI final that came from nowhere?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on August 12, 2017, 11:39:50 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 12, 2017, 11:15:27 AM
Quote from: seafoid on August 12, 2017, 11:12:33 AM
Quote from: Fuzzman on August 12, 2017, 12:29:12 AM
Who was the last team who got to an AI final that came from nowhere?
Down 2010, Fuzz
OK OK besides them smart ass
Sligo beat Tyrone in 02. The previous year they were out in the QFs
Would that not count ?

Yes, if he did not ask Who was the last team who got to an AI final that came from nowhere?
But sher Tyrone is the back arse  of beyond even in northern Ireland
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on August 12, 2017, 11:42:41 AM
Quote from: seafoid on August 12, 2017, 11:39:50 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 12, 2017, 11:15:27 AM
Quote from: seafoid on August 12, 2017, 11:12:33 AM
Quote from: Fuzzman on August 12, 2017, 12:29:12 AM
Who was the last team who got to an AI final that came from nowhere?
Down 2010, Fuzz
OK OK besides them smart ass
Sligo beat Tyrone in 02. The previous year they were out in the QFs
Would that not count ?

Yes, if he did not ask Who was the last team who got to an AI final that came from nowhere?
But sher Tyrone is the back arse  of beyond even in northern Ireland

A great partitionist statement there seafoid, if ever I saw one! ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on August 12, 2017, 12:18:42 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on August 12, 2017, 12:29:12 AM
Who was the last team who got to an AI final that came from nowhere?
Down 2010, Fuzz
OK OK besides them smart ass
Tyrone in 2008. Knocked out of the 2006,07 championships by average Meath,Laois sides. In 2008 knocked out of Ulster by Down and weren't given much of chance to do much that summer, then out of nowhere everything fell in place against Dublin in the All Ireland quarter final and then only had to beat Wexford to reach the AI final, Armagh letting their eye off the ball a big help there.



Quote from: Fuzzman on August 12, 2017, 12:57:09 AM
I think what Jim McGuiness did to Donegal football should be the blueprint for any other county in the top 16 to follow.
This was a team who were losing first round games to Antrim and he showed what can be achieved.
What McGuiness did was get talented bunch of players that were underachieving to achieve. The players had to buy into his beliefs and leave their own egos behind.  While he still has his critics for the system of play he used i think the balance he struck between defence and attack in 2012 was as good as any All Ireland winner the last decade.

At the moment what county is like Donegal was in 2010 (before MGuiness arrived) Cork,Galway? the best you are going to get out of some other counties is provincial titles and/or the rare semi final appearance but the super 8 will make it even tougher for those teams to reach the final 4 now.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fuzzman on August 12, 2017, 08:46:51 PM
Interesting article from ToS, especially where he says he would have been of to the US if Kerry were not in the running for titles every year.
http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/toms-s-joe-canning-was-on-the-money-the-attitude-towards-alcohol-in-the-gaa-is-all-wrong-36025988.html

I wonder how Jamie Clarke and McManus feel this year?
I'd say some of the Donegal lads who went to the States are glad they did now.

I think the reason the gap is widening is simply because the top 4 are more or less professional athletes now and play the game at a different level to the rest.
Many are saying Ulster is poor this year because the standard has fallen but I think its because Tyrone have had to move their standards to the next level. As Brian McGuigan said last Sunday Peter Donnelly has had a huge impact on the physicality of this Tyrone team. He said Dublin and Kerry were leaving them behind and so they are much stronger and fitter now. Did ye watch that video where Tiernan McCann was away ahead of the others on fitness tests?
I think Tyrone have just raised the bar on Ulster to the level that Dublin have in Leinster and Kerry have in Munster.

That's why Brolly and Co are not happy with how the competition is no longer interesting. It took this Tyrone team three years to get to this level though and it is quite likely it will all end on 2 weeks time.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on August 12, 2017, 09:56:08 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on August 12, 2017, 08:46:51 PM
Interesting article from ToS, especially where he says he would have been of to the US if Kerry were not in the running for titles every year.
http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/toms-s-joe-canning-was-on-the-money-the-attitude-towards-alcohol-in-the-gaa-is-all-wrong-36025988.html

I wonder how Jamie Clarke and McManus feel this year?
I'd say some of the Donegal lads who went to the States are glad they did now.

I think the reason the gap is widening is simply because the top 4 are more or less professional athletes now and play the game at a different level to the rest.
Many are saying Ulster is poor this year because the standard has fallen but I think its because Tyrone have had to move their standards to the next level. As Brian McGuigan said last Sunday Peter Donnelly has had a huge impact on the physicality of this Tyrone team. He said Dublin and Kerry were leaving them behind and so they are much stronger and fitter now. Did ye watch that video where Tiernan McCann was away ahead of the others on fitness tests?
I think Tyrone have just raised the bar on Ulster to the level that Dublin have in Leinster and Kerry have in Munster.

That's why Brolly and Co are not happy with how the competition is no longer interesting. It took this Tyrone team three years to get to this level though and it is quite likely it will all end on 2 weeks time.
Fuzz

I think it's like whiskey. It takes time for whiskey to mature. Stuff that is 1 year old can never be as good as stuff that is 7 years old.
Before you needed skill, experience and team coherence . Now you need skill, experience, team coherence and to have enough work done on your physique.
In 96 Mayo came out of nowhere to beat Kerry but that wouldn't happen today.
The Dubs, Mayo and Kerry all have the experience and the physique. It is almost professional.  The barriers to entry are very high. Much higher than in the past. Colm O'Rourke was in the paper recently talking about the training they did in 91. Pretty relaxed compared to now.

Galway have been developing the current team for a few years. They got kicked around by Mayo a few times so they had to do the gym work. But that still wasn't enough. I can see why players might not be arsed.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 12, 2017, 11:01:41 PM
Quote from: seafoid on August 12, 2017, 09:56:08 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on August 12, 2017, 08:46:51 PM
Interesting article from ToS, especially where he says he would have been of to the US if Kerry were not in the running for titles every year.
http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/toms-s-joe-canning-was-on-the-money-the-attitude-towards-alcohol-in-the-gaa-is-all-wrong-36025988.html

I wonder how Jamie Clarke and McManus feel this year?
I'd say some of the Donegal lads who went to the States are glad they did now.

I think the reason the gap is widening is simply because the top 4 are more or less professional athletes now and play the game at a different level to the rest.
Many are saying Ulster is poor this year because the standard has fallen but I think its because Tyrone have had to move their standards to the next level. As Brian McGuigan said last Sunday Peter Donnelly has had a huge impact on the physicality of this Tyrone team. He said Dublin and Kerry were leaving them behind and so they are much stronger and fitter now. Did ye watch that video where Tiernan McCann was away ahead of the others on fitness tests?
I think Tyrone have just raised the bar on Ulster to the level that Dublin have in Leinster and Kerry have in Munster.

That's why Brolly and Co are not happy with how the competition is no longer interesting. It took this Tyrone team three years to get to this level though and it is quite likely it will all end on 2 weeks time.
Fuzz

I think it's like whiskey. It takes time for whiskey to mature. Stuff that is 1 year old can never be as good as stuff that is 7 years old.
Before you needed skill, experience and team coherence . Now you need skill, experience, team coherence and to have enough work done on your physique.
In 96 Mayo came out of nowhere to beat Kerry but that wouldn't happen today.
The Dubs, Mayo and Kerry all have the experience and the physique. It is almost professional.  The barriers to entry are very high. Much higher than in the past. Colm O'Rourke was in the paper recently talking about the training they did in 91. Pretty relaxed compared to now.

Galway have been developing the current team for a few years. They got kicked around by Mayo a few times so they had to do the gym work. But that still wasn't enough. I can see why players might not be arsed.

In fairness Kerry (hard to believe) came from nowhere as well! Kerry had won one (yes one) of the previous nine Munster titles. That single title was won in 1991.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: clarshack on August 12, 2017, 11:29:42 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 12, 2017, 11:01:41 PM
Quote from: seafoid on August 12, 2017, 09:56:08 PM
Quote from: Fuzzman on August 12, 2017, 08:46:51 PM
Interesting article from ToS, especially where he says he would have been of to the US if Kerry were not in the running for titles every year.
http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/toms-s-joe-canning-was-on-the-money-the-attitude-towards-alcohol-in-the-gaa-is-all-wrong-36025988.html

I wonder how Jamie Clarke and McManus feel this year?
I'd say some of the Donegal lads who went to the States are glad they did now.

I think the reason the gap is widening is simply because the top 4 are more or less professional athletes now and play the game at a different level to the rest.
Many are saying Ulster is poor this year because the standard has fallen but I think its because Tyrone have had to move their standards to the next level. As Brian McGuigan said last Sunday Peter Donnelly has had a huge impact on the physicality of this Tyrone team. He said Dublin and Kerry were leaving them behind and so they are much stronger and fitter now. Did ye watch that video where Tiernan McCann was away ahead of the others on fitness tests?
I think Tyrone have just raised the bar on Ulster to the level that Dublin have in Leinster and Kerry have in Munster.

That's why Brolly and Co are not happy with how the competition is no longer interesting. It took this Tyrone team three years to get to this level though and it is quite likely it will all end on 2 weeks time.
Fuzz

I think it's like whiskey. It takes time for whiskey to mature. Stuff that is 1 year old can never be as good as stuff that is 7 years old.
Before you needed skill, experience and team coherence . Now you need skill, experience, team coherence and to have enough work done on your physique.
In 96 Mayo came out of nowhere to beat Kerry but that wouldn't happen today.
The Dubs, Mayo and Kerry all have the experience and the physique. It is almost professional.  The barriers to entry are very high. Much higher than in the past. Colm O'Rourke was in the paper recently talking about the training they did in 91. Pretty relaxed compared to now.

Galway have been developing the current team for a few years. They got kicked around by Mayo a few times so they had to do the gym work. But that still wasn't enough. I can see why players might not be arsed.

In fairness Kerry (hard to believe) came from nowhere as well! Kerry had won one (yes one) of the previous nine Munster titles. That single title was won in 1991.

whatever happened Pa Dennehy?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ONeill on August 12, 2017, 11:32:51 PM
Sick to the teeth of this acute analysis of the present.

Look back over provincial score lines right back the 70s or All Ireland semis or finals. Some real blitzing sessions, especially at AI semi final stage. It won't be like that this year. There have always been 2 or 3 teams far better than everyone else, bar a few years when there was an evening-out. Tyrone won't always be there. This Mayo team are on their last legs though they have been a fairly consistent county in my lifetime. Dublin and Kerry will nearly always be there. Galway, Meath and Cork will rise again...and so on.

The amount of football on TV now is only highlighting that fact to the general public.

Secondly, a lot of these 'club-first' men are lamenting the gap at the top of the county scene. Fcuk the county scene then.

Finally, football isn't a great product. Never was, unless the real class sides met. Again, TV saturation is only showing that now. It's a lot better, technically and physically,  than 20 years ago though.

Maybe I'm wrong but it's a bollocks to listen to. The county scene isn't the be-all and end-all.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 13, 2017, 12:15:19 AM
Quote from: ONeill on August 12, 2017, 11:32:51 PM
Sick to the teeth of this acute analysis of the present.

Look back over provincial score lines right back the 70s or All Ireland semis or finals. Some real blitzing sessions, especially at AI semi final stage. It won't be like that this year. There have always been 2 or 3 teams far better than everyone else, bar a few years when there was an evening-out. Tyrone won't always be there. This Mayo team are on their last legs though they have been a fairly consistent county in my lifetime. Dublin and Kerry will nearly always be there. Galway, Meath and Cork will rise again...and so on.

The amount of football on TV now is only highlighting that fact to the general public.

Secondly, a lot of these 'club-first' men are lamenting the gap at the top of the county scene. Fcuk the county scene then.

Finally, football isn't a great product. Never was, unless the real class sides met. Again, TV saturation is only showing that now. It's a lot better, technically and physically,  than 20 years ago though.

Maybe I'm wrong but it's a bollocks to listen to. The county scene isn't the be-all and end-all.


Good post! What has confused everybody is that we had a era in the 90's where the Northern teams came good and the Connacht teams came good. The noughties was open to anybody having a go - Sligo, Westmeath, Wexford, Fermanagh, Laois to name a few. But now we are back to a domineering 4-6 with a real dominant Dublin!

There are people who follow their County team who don't really have a club! Just like there are People who follow the Rep. Of Ireland Soccer team but don't have a League of Ireland club. Those who do have a club in both codes usually put the club first!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ONeill on August 13, 2017, 12:28:07 AM
It's even more than that. We're being told how shit county football is by pundits on RTE who make a nice sum from telling us that...and that there needs to be a more socialist model. You have the same pundits monopolising print journalism for very handsome sums, regurgitating articles for various publications in the same week at the expense of qualified journalists.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Owen Brannigan on August 13, 2017, 01:20:24 PM
Quote from: ONeill on August 13, 2017, 12:28:07 AM
It's even more than that. We're being told how shit county football is by pundits on RTE who make a nice sum from telling us that...and that there needs to be a more socialist model. You have the same pundits monopolising print journalism for very handsome sums, regurgitating articles for various publications in the same week at the expense of qualified journalists.

+1

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Taylor on August 13, 2017, 01:24:32 PM
Quote from: Owen Brannigan on August 13, 2017, 01:20:24 PM
Quote from: ONeill on August 13, 2017, 12:28:07 AM
It's even more than that. We're being told how shit county football is by pundits on RTE who make a nice sum from telling us that...and that there needs to be a more socialist model. You have the same pundits monopolising print journalism for very handsome sums, regurgitating articles for various publications in the same week at the expense of qualified journalists.

+1

And then you have boys like B Flynn calling out amateur players and continually trying to be controversial in order to make money
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on August 13, 2017, 01:44:41 PM
Quote from: Owen Brannigan on August 13, 2017, 01:20:24 PM
Quote from: ONeill on August 13, 2017, 12:28:07 AM
It's even more than that. We're being told how shit county football is by pundits on RTE who make a nice sum from telling us that...and that there needs to be a more socialist model. You have the same pundits monopolising print journalism for very handsome sums, regurgitating articles for various publications in the same week at the expense of qualified journalists.

+1
It is crap ,regardless of how much pundits get paid
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: LilySavage on August 13, 2017, 01:50:28 PM
ORourke getting it from RTE, The Sunday Indo and Paddy Power. Looks like he's just a token GAA contributor for each as he'd have surely got the road for his negativity . For the gambling crowd , he couldn't pick his nose so maybe they're happy enough with him. Class A hypocrite.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 13, 2017, 02:10:22 PM
Quote from: LilySavage on August 13, 2017, 01:50:28 PM
ORourke getting it from RTE, The Sunday Indo and Paddy Power. Looks like he's just a token GAA contributor for each as he'd have surely got the road for his negativity . For the gambling crowd , he couldn't pick his nose so maybe they're happy enough with him. Class A hypocrite.

O'Rourke needs all these sources of Income along with being the Principal of a School to cover bad debts from investments during the boom!  :-\
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: mrhardyannual on August 13, 2017, 07:10:21 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 13, 2017, 02:10:22 PM
Quote from: LilySavage on August 13, 2017, 01:50:28 PM
ORourke getting it from RTE, The Sunday Indo and Paddy Power. Looks like he's just a token GAA contributor for each as he'd have surely got the road for his negativity . For the gambling crowd , he couldn't pick his nose so maybe they're happy enough with him. Class A hypocrite.

O'Rourke needs all these sources of Income along with being the Principal of a School to cover bad debts from investments during the boom!  :-\
Boom Boom  ;D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Il Bomber Destro on August 13, 2017, 07:59:34 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 13, 2017, 02:10:22 PM
Quote from: LilySavage on August 13, 2017, 01:50:28 PM
ORourke getting it from RTE, The Sunday Indo and Paddy Power. Looks like he's just a token GAA contributor for each as he'd have surely got the road for his negativity . For the gambling crowd , he couldn't pick his nose so maybe they're happy enough with him. Class A hypocrite.

O'Rourke needs all these sources of Income along with being the Principal of a School to cover bad debts from investments during the boom!  :-\

I found it a bit hypocritical that a failed property developer  was putting forward a socialist GAA model.

Dublin and to a lesser degree, Kerry with a huge conglomerate behind them will always have financial advantages but if the likes of Tyrone, Donegal, Mayo can be competitive then why can't the likes of Kildare, Cork, Meath, Antrim, Galway. If the likes of Monaghan can win Ulster titles and be competitive with anyone outside of Dublin, then there's no reason why Cavan, Sligo, Laois, Westmeath etc can't. If Fermanagh can make an All Ireland quarter final and play the best team in the country and not disgrace themselves then what is stopping the likes of Leitrim, Carlow or Longford (who in fairness equip themselves well with what they've got) from doing similar.

There is a finance imbalance that certainly needs to be addressed but too many counties try and use it as an excuse when similar counties to them are getting the best out of themselves with similar resources.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on August 27, 2017, 05:05:10 PM
Oh shit.......super 2 and maybe in a few weeks we will all realise it's a super 1
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: under the bar on August 27, 2017, 07:38:53 PM
Today shows that super 8s will simply ensure that Dublin will never get caught cold coming out of Leinster!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 27, 2017, 07:51:03 PM
Their last quarter final defeat??
2009?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Wildweasel74 on August 27, 2017, 07:54:28 PM
I get the thread changed to the Super One
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: mrhardyannual on August 27, 2017, 11:11:49 PM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on August 27, 2017, 07:54:28 PM
I get the thread changed to the Super One
Thanks, but in fairness you should include Dublin .....at least for another three weeks.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on August 27, 2017, 11:42:51 PM
Quote from: under the bar on August 27, 2017, 07:38:53 PM
Today shows that super 8s will simply ensure that Dublin will never get caught cold coming out of Leinster!
croke park now belongs to the Dubs
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dub000737 on August 28, 2017, 10:31:29 PM
Stop worrying about Tyrone not able to match Dublin. Don't be using that to call for change. No team in Ireland will get near Dublin.

1 Dublin
2 No other county
3 No other county
4 Tyrone, Mayo, Kerry
5 No other county
6 Monaghan, Donegal, Galway
7 Tipperary, Down, Armagh, Clare, Meath, Kildare
8 The rest
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 12, 2018, 01:55:45 PM
Just wondering with the emergence of the Super 8's could we get the first All Ireland winner to lose two Championship games. Also could we get a team knocked out without losing any games?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: westbound on March 12, 2018, 02:12:38 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2018, 01:55:45 PM
Just wondering with the emergence of the Super 8's could we get the first All Ireland winner to lose two Championship games. Also could we get a team knocked out without losing any games?

In theory, the answer is yes to both.

In fact, in theory, it's possible that a team could lose THREE games and still win the all ireland. Lose provincial championship, and lose two games in the super 8's and get through on score difference. (table would have to finish 6,2,2,2).  Highly unlikely, but still possible.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 12, 2018, 02:42:56 PM
Quote from: westbound on March 12, 2018, 02:12:38 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2018, 01:55:45 PM
Just wondering with the emergence of the Super 8's could we get the first All Ireland winner to lose two Championship games. Also could we get a team knocked out without losing any games?

In theory, the answer is yes to both.

In fact, in theory, it's possible that a team could lose THREE games and still win the all ireland. Lose provincial championship, and lose two games in the super 8's and get through on score difference. (table would have to finish 6,2,2,2).  Highly unlikely, but still possible.


Jez, it gone gas altogether. The Championship loses credibility by the year!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 12, 2018, 03:12:56 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2018, 02:42:56 PM
Quote from: westbound on March 12, 2018, 02:12:38 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2018, 01:55:45 PM
Just wondering with the emergence of the Super 8's could we get the first All Ireland winner to lose two Championship games. Also could we get a team knocked out without losing any games?

In theory, the answer is yes to both.

In fact, in theory, it's possible that a team could lose THREE games and still win the all ireland. Lose provincial championship, and lose two games in the super 8's and get through on score difference. (table would have to finish 6,2,2,2).  Highly unlikely, but still possible.


Jez, it gone gas altogether. The Championship loses credibility by the year!
;D ;D
How will I re-open a thread that hasn't been touched in six months so I can give out? I know, I'll ask a question I already know the answer to, and go from there.

Back to straight knock-out to hell with it. :)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on March 12, 2018, 05:30:59 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2018, 01:55:45 PM
Just wondering with the emergence of the Super 8's could we get the first All Ireland winner to lose two Championship games. Also could we get a team knocked out without losing any games?
Just another example of how daft this new format is. Were the county reps sipping whiskey for the day when this was voted in?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on March 12, 2018, 05:40:39 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2018, 01:55:45 PM
Just wondering with the emergence of the Super 8's could we get the first All Ireland winner to lose two Championship games. Also could we get a team knocked out without losing any games?
That has already happened - 20 years ago.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on March 12, 2018, 05:46:54 PM
I still dont get it, I know im a biteen slow but I still havent heard one person tell me how you can run a competition on a Home, away, neutral game for each team where one team plays both their home game and neutral game at the same venue . This competition is not legitimate.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: LooseCannon on March 12, 2018, 05:47:55 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on March 12, 2018, 05:40:39 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 12, 2018, 01:55:45 PM
Just wondering with the emergence of the Super 8's could we get the first All Ireland winner to lose two Championship games. Also could we get a team knocked out without losing any games?
That has already happened - 20 years ago.
Don't tell me that you're a bitter klare man?  ;D
If klare were good enough, they'd have won the replay.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 12, 2018, 06:11:34 PM
Down with Biffo mob rule!!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 12, 2018, 06:27:49 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on March 12, 2018, 05:46:54 PM
I still dont get it, I know im a biteen slow but I still havent heard one person tell me how you can run a competition on a Home, away, neutral game for each team where one team plays both their home game and neutral game at the same venue . This competition is not legitimate.
You're not wrong, but Dublin have played every semi-final and final they've been in in Croke Park so was any All-Ireland they competed in legitimate?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on March 12, 2018, 06:35:24 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on March 12, 2018, 06:27:49 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on March 12, 2018, 05:46:54 PM
I still dont get it, I know im a biteen slow but I still havent heard one person tell me how you can run a competition on a Home, away, neutral game for each team where one team plays both their home game and neutral game at the same venue . This competition is not legitimate.
You're not wrong, but Dublin have played every semi-final and final they've been in in Croke Park so was any All-Ireland they competed in legitimate?

I notice they avoided the Polo Ground year.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on March 12, 2018, 09:20:59 PM
Fellas come on, which is it? Dublin are going to win the AI. They'll hardly lose once, never mind twice. Three times is stretching it a bit for them.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 12, 2018, 10:01:01 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on March 12, 2018, 05:46:54 PM
I still dont get it, I know im a biteen slow but I still havent heard one person tell me how you can run a competition on a Home, away, neutral game for each team where one team plays both their home game and neutral game at the same venue . This competition is not legitimate.

It's called making money. You have the largest supported team, and give them ease of convenience getting to their games. The easier it is to go to these games the more that will go! Throw in the Neutral venue excuse and the everybody loves playing Dublin in Croker and the Sting is set!

Super 8 is made for the Dubs. Three games in three weeks is a nightmare for the likes of a small squad like Monaghan. Suspensions, injuries and general tiredness would even destroy Mayo/Kerry! But hey Dublin will get their turn to Turkey shoot one by one the chasing bunch on their home patch. And we'll all be told how lucky we are to be around to witness such a great spectacle!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on March 12, 2018, 10:20:06 PM
My point is , a competition has to have rules, guidelines .


What is the name of Dublins official home ground ?

Do counties have to name a homeground or can they play it anywhere they choose ?

Home game : does that mean the distribution of tickets is controlled by the home county ?

Can the public see the guidelines for this new competition format?

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 12, 2018, 10:28:41 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on March 12, 2018, 10:20:06 PM
My point is , a competition has to have rules, guidelines .


What is the name of Dublins official home ground ?

Do counties have to name a homeground or can they play it anywhere they choose ?

Home game : does that mean the distribution of tickets is controlled by the home county ?

Can the public see the guidelines for this new competition format?


Bit late for all of that! Besides nobody cares! Or at least they pretend they don't! There will be nothing in the media. It is what it is!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 12, 2018, 11:33:04 PM
Rhubarbeens getting worried about the format.
End of the 2011 to 2017 squad must be nigh😊
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 13, 2018, 06:10:45 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 12, 2018, 11:33:04 PM
Rhubarbeens getting worried about the format.
End of the 2011 to 2017 squad must be nigh😊

To late in the day for worry. Our ship has sailed. Super 8 will be a disaster for the Rossies also!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on March 13, 2018, 06:27:41 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 12, 2018, 11:33:04 PM
Rhubarbeens getting worried about the format.
End of the 2011 to 2017 squad must be nigh😊

Although that is true , our ship has sailed , you wont hear anyone that follows Mayo say otherwise unless they are deluded. That has nothing to do with my opinion on the unfairness of the super 8s  though in terms of Dublin favouritism.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 13, 2018, 09:49:58 AM
No matter what format the only thing at issue is who'll be bet by Dublin in the AI Final.
Sure it'll be a bit of craic with 7 of the rest of us playing a mini league in July to work towards that.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on March 13, 2018, 09:53:41 AM
Is there any data from other Super 8 arrangements? Would a team ike the Dubs pull away or would the frequency of the matches bring up the level or 1 or 2 of the other teams? Would Super 8 improve competiveness or worsen it ?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rosnarun on March 13, 2018, 10:15:54 AM
I bet you have called 10 out of the last 2 recessions too

Quote from: larryin89 on March 13, 2018, 06:27:41 AM

Although that is true , our ship has sailed , you wont hear anyone that follows Mayo say otherwise unless they are deluded. That has nothing to do with my opinion on the unfairness of the super 8s  though in terms of Dublin favouritism.






Quote from: larryin89 on June 30, 2017, 10:57:54 PM
It has the makings of a very sad day for mayo football, its no addition me raving how great these last few years have been, as neutrals just enjoy sneering it seems at a fantastic group of players who have given their all for the cause. I'll always speak their names with pride though and I'd hope all mayo people will too.

Finest of memories and an enjoyable journey its been .


and to Complete you hypocrisy
Quote from: larryin89 on July 24, 2016, 12:48:33 AM

I respect people are entitled to form an opinion obviously but id like to know what you and your ilk will do if we beat both westmeath and qf opponents ? What happens then , how can you and tommy carr et el be so wrong. The disrespect shown to this group of mayo players is fuckn disgraceful . People need to take a good look at themselves , five aisf appearances on the trot ffs man , some of ye need chokin i swear.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 13, 2018, 10:17:32 AM
Hopefully it's scrapped ASAP so we can move on and moan about something else. Maybe something that has had a chance to occur.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: westbound on March 13, 2018, 10:58:13 AM
Assuming that Dublin will qualify for the super 8's and assuming that they will also qualify for the semi final, is there any incentive for any team to even try to beat them in the super 8's?

I'm not sure who will be in the group with Dublin, but even if Mayo or Kerry are in the group with Dublin is there any real incentive for winning the game? (unless it's the last game in the group and you need the points!)
Take Mayo, for example. If Mayo beat dublin in the super 8's then they'll probably finish ahead of Dublin in the group and therefore have an easier (in theory) semi final. But they'll end up meeting Dublin in the final again, except this time you've given Dublin a revenge mission and you've shown them how there are beatable.

I can see the teams in Dublin's group just rolling over (resting players etc.) against the dubs and then going all out to win the other two games! Then trying to catch Dublin in the final (or hope they lose the semi final)!

In fairness the other super 8 group could have great games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Maroon Manc on March 13, 2018, 11:09:13 AM
Think the structure is Munster & Connacht champions along with the losers from the Leinster & Ulster finals should they win their round 4 qualifier in one group.

I think they've done away with the A & B side of the qualifiers but will there their be anything in place to try and avoid a repeat pairing of a provincial game in one of the groups?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on March 13, 2018, 11:13:50 AM
Quote from: larryin89 on March 12, 2018, 10:20:06 PM
My point is , a competition has to have rules, guidelines .


What is the name of Dublins official home ground ?

Do counties have to name a homeground or can they play it anywhere they choose ?

Home game : does that mean the distribution of tickets is controlled by the home county ?

Can the public see the guidelines for this new competition format?
You are missing the point that it wasn't Dublin who came up with this.

The vast majority of counties think that if you win your provincial championship, you deserve at least 1 game in Croker. Hence the decision that games between the provincial champions must be played in Croke Park in the Super 8s. It actually makes sense.

Leinster champions have always played their QF in Croke Park, the Super 8 does not change that. 

If Kildare or Meath won Leinster, then Dublin would only get 1 game in Croker in the Super 8. Again why Kildare and Meath fell so far behind Kerry, Mayo, Donegal, Tyrone is for another debate. Dublin's fault according to the Kildare lads. Though I do believe Kildare are finally going in the right direction.

The mistake the GAA have made, and it'll probably take a year into it before the authorities cop onto it, is that the provincial champions play their away games last. Therefore, there's a chance the provincial champions away game will be a dead rubber. So cue uproar if Dublin win 2 games in Croker and have an away game that is of totally no consequence.

The order should be Provincial champions match up first, then provincial champions play away, then in 3rd match they play at home.

(The other side of the coin is that if there happens to be something riding on the last of the Super 8 games, the current scenario would have Dublin outside Croker for it, so that might have been the intention and that would be very interesting - for example if Mayo got another draw against us in Croker, and our third game ended up being a trip to Donegal or Tyrone, with Dublin needing at least a draw to progress).

I find it hilarious that people think that the additional "back door" element of the Super 8 is for Dublin's benefit. Unlike Kerry, Mayo, Cork, Galway, etc, we've never made an All Ireland final through the back door. Did nobody see that Mayo playing ever week last year improved them! Would Mayo and Kerry not have liked an additional attempt at beating us in the last 3 years? 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 13, 2018, 11:26:56 AM
Quote from: Hound on March 13, 2018, 11:13:50 AM
Quote from: larryin89 on March 12, 2018, 10:20:06 PM
My point is , a competition has to have rules, guidelines .


What is the name of Dublins official home ground ?

Do counties have to name a homeground or can they play it anywhere they choose ?

Home game : does that mean the distribution of tickets is controlled by the home county ?

Can the public see the guidelines for this new competition format?
You are missing the point that it wasn't Dublin who came up with this.

The vast majority of counties think that if you win your provincial championship, you deserve at least 1 game in Croker. Hence the decision that games between the provincial champions must be played in Croke Park in the Super 8s. It actually makes sense.

Leinster champions have always played their QF in Croke Park, the Super 8 does not change that. 

If Kildare or Meath won Leinster, then Dublin would only get 1 game in Croker in the Super 8. Again why Kildare and Meath fell so far behind Kerry, Mayo, Donegal, Tyrone is for another debate. Dublin's fault according to the Kildare lads. Though I do believe Kildare are finally going in the right direction.

The mistake the GAA have made, and it'll probably take a year into it before the authorities cop onto it, is that the provincial champions play their away games last. Therefore, there's a chance the provincial champions away game will be a dead rubber. So cue uproar if Dublin win 2 games in Croker and have an away game that is of totally no consequence.

The order should be Provincial champions match up first, then provincial champions play away, then in 3rd match they play at home.

(The other side of the coin is that if there happens to be something riding on the last of the Super 8 games, the current scenario would have Dublin outside Croker for it, so that might have been the intention and that would be very interesting - for example if Mayo got another draw against us in Croker, and our third game ended up being a trip to Donegal or Tyrone, with Dublin needing at least a draw to progress).

I find it hilarious that people think that the additional "back door" element of the Super 8 is for Dublin's benefit. Unlike Kerry, Mayo, Cork, Galway, etc, we've never made an All Ireland final through the back door. Did nobody see that Mayo playing ever week last year improved them! Would Mayo and Kerry not have liked an additional attempt at beating us in the last 3 years?
It's good to see an alternative view.

My understanding of it is that the two provincial champions in each group will play off first in Croke Park. The theory being that one will lose and one of the two weaker teams will win the other game which is an attempt to lessen the likelihood of the awful, awful dead rubber.

You'r actually right about Dublin not winning Leinster which I wasn't aware of.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 13, 2018, 11:44:31 AM
If Dublin don't win Leinster but make the last 8 won't they still have 2 games in Croke Pk?
Their "neutral" and home game?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 13, 2018, 11:58:54 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 13, 2018, 11:44:31 AM
If Dublin don't win Leinster but make the last 8 won't they still have 2 games in Croke Pk?
Their "neutral" and home game?
Yes, sorry, that's what I thought initially but Hound very easily convinced me I was wrong.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 13, 2018, 04:27:31 PM
Ye have me confused.
Don't the non Provincial Champions in the groups get a home game too??
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 13, 2018, 04:40:55 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 13, 2018, 04:27:31 PM
Ye have me confused.
Don't the non Provincial Champions in the groups get a home game too??

;D ;D ;D
Yes they do. Your last post was correct.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 13, 2018, 04:57:44 PM
So Dublin's home game will be in ......... Parnell Park  ;) ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: westbound on March 13, 2018, 05:12:52 PM
Ye have me confused now as well!!

Are all the neutral games in croke park?

If not why does dublin's neutral game have to be in croke park (other than crowd size)?

Is everyone who qualifies for super 8's guaranteed one match  (minimum) in croke park?




Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on March 13, 2018, 05:18:47 PM
Quote from: westbound on March 13, 2018, 05:12:52 PM
Ye have me confused now as well!!

Are all the neutral games in croke park?
No mention of neutral games. Everyone will get one game in Croke Park

If not why does dublin's neutral game have to be in croke park (other than crowd size)?
See above

Is everyone who qualifies for super 8's guaranteed one match  (minimum) in croke park?
Yes
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on March 13, 2018, 05:25:49 PM
Round 1 games are in Croke Park...provincial champions play each other and team 3 plays team 4.

Is round two (home game for provincial champions) the winners of round 1 playing each other?

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Maroon Manc on March 13, 2018, 05:32:12 PM
I'm under the impression that either the losers of Connacht & Munster should they win their R4 game will play 2 games in Croker; One as a neutral venue and other will be because of Dublins home game.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on March 13, 2018, 05:42:09 PM
Thanks for that input hound and I understand its not Dublin making up the rules .

Can I just have the name of Dublins home ground ?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on March 13, 2018, 05:50:23 PM
Quote from: Maroon Manc on March 13, 2018, 05:32:12 PM
I'm under the impression that either the losers of Connacht & Munster should they win their R4 game will play 2 games in Croker; One as a neutral venue and other will be because of Dublins home game.

No neutral venues in Super 8.  Round 1 games will both be in Croke Park (provincial champs play each other).  Round 2 games will be at provincial winners home.  Round 3 games will be hosted by teams 3 and 4 (the beaten provincial finalist or the team that beat them in the last round of qualifiers).

Is round 2 the winners of round 1 meeting?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on March 13, 2018, 05:55:05 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 13, 2018, 05:50:23 PM
Quote from: Maroon Manc on March 13, 2018, 05:32:12 PM
I'm under the impression that either the losers of Connacht & Munster should they win their R4 game will play 2 games in Croker; One as a neutral venue and other will be because of Dublins home game.

No neutral venues in Super 8.  Round 1 games will both be in Croke Park (provincial champs play each other).  Round 2 games will be at provincial winners home.  Round 3 games will be hosted by teams 3 and 4 (the beaten provincial finalist or the team that beat them in the last round of qualifiers).

Is round 2 the winners of round 1 meeting?

Its like we are goin round and round here.

Its just a simple question, what is the fooking name of Dublins home ground ?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on March 13, 2018, 06:01:01 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on March 13, 2018, 05:55:05 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 13, 2018, 05:50:23 PM
Quote from: Maroon Manc on March 13, 2018, 05:32:12 PM
I'm under the impression that either the losers of Connacht & Munster should they win their R4 game will play 2 games in Croker; One as a neutral venue and other will be because of Dublins home game.

No neutral venues in Super 8.  Round 1 games will both be in Croke Park (provincial champs play each other).  Round 2 games will be at provincial winners home.  Round 3 games will be hosted by teams 3 and 4 (the beaten provincial finalist or the team that beat them in the last round of qualifiers).

Is round 2 the winners of round 1 meeting?

Its like we are goin round and round here.

Its just a simple question, what is the fooking name of Dublins home ground ?

Dunno.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on March 13, 2018, 06:02:09 PM
Will Kildare host a game in Newbridge if they get to the Super 8?  If their ground is deemed unsuitable based on crowd expectations, I'm sure they will opt for Croke Park as an alternative.

Likewise, if Dublin expect crowd issues at Parnell Park, I'm sure a request to use Croke Park instead will be given a fair hearing.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jell 0 Biafra on March 13, 2018, 06:43:51 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on March 13, 2018, 05:55:05 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 13, 2018, 05:50:23 PM
Quote from: Maroon Manc on March 13, 2018, 05:32:12 PM
I'm under the impression that either the losers of Connacht & Munster should they win their R4 game will play 2 games in Croker; One as a neutral venue and other will be because of Dublins home game.

No neutral venues in Super 8.  Round 1 games will both be in Croke Park (provincial champs play each other).  Round 2 games will be at provincial winners home.  Round 3 games will be hosted by teams 3 and 4 (the beaten provincial finalist or the team that beat them in the last round of qualifiers).

Is round 2 the winners of round 1 meeting?

Its like we are goin round and round here.

Its just a simple question, what is the fooking name of Dublins home ground ?

That must be frustrating.  If only someone knew the answer to this headscratcher.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on March 13, 2018, 06:53:15 PM
Quote from: Jell 0 Biafra on March 13, 2018, 06:43:51 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on March 13, 2018, 05:55:05 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 13, 2018, 05:50:23 PM
Quote from: Maroon Manc on March 13, 2018, 05:32:12 PM
I'm under the impression that either the losers of Connacht & Munster should they win their R4 game will play 2 games in Croker; One as a neutral venue and other will be because of Dublins home game.

No neutral venues in Super 8.  Round 1 games will both be in Croke Park (provincial champs play each other).  Round 2 games will be at provincial winners home.  Round 3 games will be hosted by teams 3 and 4 (the beaten provincial finalist or the team that beat them in the last round of qualifiers).

Is round 2 the winners of round 1 meeting?

Its like we are goin round and round here.

Its just a simple question, what is the fooking name of Dublins home ground ?

That must be frustrating.  If only someone knew the answer to this headscratcher.

Although youre being sarcsstic it is indeed.a headscratcher.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on March 13, 2018, 06:53:54 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 13, 2018, 05:50:23 PM
Quote from: Maroon Manc on March 13, 2018, 05:32:12 PM
I'm under the impression that either the losers of Connacht & Munster should they win their R4 game will play 2 games in Croker; One as a neutral venue and other will be because of Dublins home game.

No neutral venues in Super 8.  Round 1 games will both be in Croke Park (provincial champs play each other).  Round 2 games will be at provincial winners home.  Round 3 games will be hosted by teams 3 and 4 (the beaten provincial finalist or the team that beat them in the last round of qualifiers).

Is round 2 the winners of round 1 meeting?

Round 1 is the neutral ground round. Provincial winners play each other in CP. Other 4 play each other in CP as well.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 14, 2018, 09:34:30 AM
Meanwhile for the less than Super

https://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2018/0314/947271-horan-wants-intermediate-football-championship-by-2021/
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on March 14, 2018, 09:42:54 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 14, 2018, 09:34:30 AM
Meanwhile for the less than Super

https://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2018/0314/947271-horan-wants-intermediate-football-championship-by-2021/
Turlough O'Brien talked the most sense there.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on March 14, 2018, 10:54:46 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 14, 2018, 09:34:30 AM
Meanwhile for the less than Super

https://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2018/0314/947271-horan-wants-intermediate-football-championship-by-2021/

I see the new president is a bit of a turkey. Trying to solve a systematic problem with a format change. But of course he's a figurehead so his opinion doesn't really count for much anyways.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on March 14, 2018, 10:59:57 AM
I was wondering if the Super 8s would benefit Mayo. The team has lost 3 finals by a single point.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 14, 2018, 11:14:35 AM
Quote from: seafoid on March 14, 2018, 10:59:57 AM
I was wondering if the Super 8s would benefit Mayo. The team has lost 3 finals by a single point.

I think it will benefit Galway! They will get to play a championship game in Croke Park without a win or bust scenario and this might help them get over their Croke Park Hoodoo! A weight that has been hanging over their heads for 17 years now!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 14, 2018, 12:53:02 PM
But but but.... the media always tell us that Galway are a great Croke Park team.....9
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on March 14, 2018, 01:09:18 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on March 13, 2018, 05:42:09 PM
Thanks for that input hound and I understand its not Dublin making up the rules .

Can I just have the name of Dublins home ground ?
Parnell Park is Dublin's home ground.

Like home grounds in some other counties its capacity isn't great for big grounds, so games get played in Croke Park. So while the hurlers play some home games in Parnell Park every year, the footballers haven't played there in quite a while (perhaps when we drew London in the qualifiers). So in recent years all the home games of the Dublin senior football team get played in Croke Park.

Certainly more Leinster QF and SF games should be played outside Croke Park, but the counties in Leinster like the money the Dublin fans generate when games are in Croke Park, and it takes a lot of persuasion to get even the very odd Dublin game moved out.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GaillimhIarthair on March 14, 2018, 01:13:48 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 14, 2018, 11:14:35 AM
Quote from: seafoid on March 14, 2018, 10:59:57 AM
I was wondering if the Super 8s would benefit Mayo. The team has lost 3 finals by a single point.

I think it will benefit Galway! They will get to play a championship game in Croke Park without a win or bust scenario and this might help them get over their Croke Park Hoodoo! A weight that has been hanging over their heads for 17 years now!
Imagine having a 67 year drought hanging over yer head!  ;) 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Maroon Manc on March 14, 2018, 02:30:53 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 13, 2018, 05:50:23 PM
Quote from: Maroon Manc on March 13, 2018, 05:32:12 PM
I'm under the impression that either the losers of Connacht & Munster should they win their R4 game will play 2 games in Croker; One as a neutral venue and other will be because of Dublins home game.

No neutral venues in Super 8.  Round 1 games will both be in Croke Park (provincial champs play each other).  Round 2 games will be at provincial winners home.  Round 3 games will be hosted by teams 3 and 4 (the beaten provincial finalist or the team that beat them in the last round of qualifiers).

Is round 2 the winners of round 1 meeting?



The point I was trying to make and should have been more clearer is that one of the teams coming through a R4 qualifier will have 2 games in Croker.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on March 14, 2018, 02:43:30 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 14, 2018, 11:14:35 AM
Quote from: seafoid on March 14, 2018, 10:59:57 AM
I was wondering if the Super 8s would benefit Mayo. The team has lost 3 finals by a single point.

I think it will benefit Galway! They will get to play a championship game in Croke Park without a win or bust scenario and this might help them get over their Croke Park Hoodoo! A weight that has been hanging over their heads for 17 years now!
How many years had Mayo been waiting  before 1985 turned up ?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on March 14, 2018, 03:15:11 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 14, 2018, 02:43:30 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 14, 2018, 11:14:35 AM
Quote from: seafoid on March 14, 2018, 10:59:57 AM
I was wondering if the Super 8s would benefit Mayo. The team has lost 3 finals by a single point.

I think it will benefit Galway! They will get to play a championship game in Croke Park without a win or bust scenario and this might help them get over their Croke Park Hoodoo! A weight that has been hanging over their heads for 17 years now!
How many years had Mayo been waiting  before 1985 turned up ?
1989 v Tyrone was Mayo first championship win in Croke park since 1951 I believe.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: westbound on March 14, 2018, 04:22:09 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on March 13, 2018, 05:18:47 PM
Quote from: westbound on March 13, 2018, 05:12:52 PM
Ye have me confused now as well!!

Are all the neutral games in croke park?
No mention of neutral games. Everyone will get one game in Croke Park

If not why does dublin's neutral game have to be in croke park (other than crowd size)?
See above

Is everyone who qualifies for super 8's guaranteed one match  (minimum) in croke park?
Yes

Thanks.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on March 14, 2018, 04:23:54 PM
Quote from: Hound on March 14, 2018, 01:09:18 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on March 13, 2018, 05:42:09 PM
Thanks for that input hound and I understand its not Dublin making up the rules .

Can I just have the name of Dublins home ground ?
Parnell Park is Dublin's home ground.

Like home grounds in some other counties its capacity isn't great for big grounds, so games get played in Croke Park. So while the hurlers play some home games in Parnell Park every year, the footballers haven't played there in quite a while (perhaps when we drew London in the qualifiers). So in recent years all the home games of the Dublin senior football team get played in Croke Park.

Certainly more Leinster QF and SF games should be played outside Croke Park, but the counties in Leinster like the money the Dublin fans generate when games are in Croke Park, and it takes a lot of persuasion to get even the very odd Dublin game moved out.
Dublin used to be beaten regularly in Parnell Park in the league
Croke Park is a very big advantage for them
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on March 14, 2018, 04:24:58 PM
Everyone will get *at least* one game in Croke Park.

1 home,
1 away
1 in Croke Park (neutral).

But for the purposes of this, Dublin's home venue is Croke Park.

I also am interested to see what happens when the last 8 includes Kildare or Meath for example. Will a Super 8 game be allowed go ahead in Newbridge or the grassy, grassy banks of Pairc Tailteann?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: magpie seanie on March 14, 2018, 04:53:48 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 14, 2018, 04:24:58 PM
Everyone will get *at least* one game in Croke Park.

1 home,
1 away
1 in Croke Park (neutral).

But for the purposes of this, Dublin's home venue is Croke Park.

I also am interested to see what happens when the last 8 includes Kildare or Meath for example. Will a Super 8 game be allowed go ahead in Newbridge or the grassy, grassy banks of Pairc Tailteann?

There will be some "agreement" involving money.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on March 14, 2018, 05:41:27 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 14, 2018, 04:24:58 PM
Everyone will get *at least* one game in Croke Park.

1 home,
1 away
1 in Croke Park (neutral).

But for the purposes of this, Dublin's home venue is Croke Park.

I also am interested to see what happens when the last 8 includes Kildare or Meath for example. Will a Super 8 game be allowed go ahead in Newbridge or the grassy, grassy banks of Pairc Tailteann?

More than likely won't be allowed to play at home instead given the choice what neutral venue they want to play their "home" game in.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 14, 2018, 05:51:00 PM
If Kildare or Meath get a home game v Dublin there will be some quare pressure out on them to play it in Croke Park.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 14, 2018, 07:00:06 PM
Quote from: Hound on March 14, 2018, 01:09:18 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on March 13, 2018, 05:42:09 PM
Thanks for that input hound and I understand its not Dublin making up the rules .

Can I just have the name of Dublins home ground ?
Parnell Park is Dublin's home ground.

Like home grounds in some other counties its capacity isn't great for big grounds, so games get played in Croke Park. So while the hurlers play some home games in Parnell Park every year, the footballers haven't played there in quite a while (perhaps when we drew London in the qualifiers). So in recent years all the home games of the Dublin senior football team get played in Croke Park.

Certainly more Leinster QF and SF games should be played outside Croke Park, but the counties in Leinster like the money the Dublin fans generate when games are in Croke Park, and it takes a lot of persuasion to get even the very odd Dublin game moved out.


Jez Poor Dublin having to play Neutral or away fixtures all the time. Jez, next you'll be telling us ye don't get any funding of any kind and that all the Dublin players work!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 14, 2018, 09:43:02 PM
Quote from: GaillimhIarthair on March 14, 2018, 01:13:48 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 14, 2018, 11:14:35 AM
Quote from: seafoid on March 14, 2018, 10:59:57 AM
I was wondering if the Super 8s would benefit Mayo. The team has lost 3 finals by a single point.

I think it will benefit Galway! They will get to play a championship game in Croke Park without a win or bust scenario and this might help them get over their Croke Park Hoodoo! A weight that has been hanging over their heads for 17 years now!
Imagine having a 67 year drought hanging over yer head!  ;)

If you are 17, there's not much difference between a 17 year wait and a 67 year wait! ;)

How long is it since ye beat Kerry or Dublin in the Championship? 30 years? 40 years? 50 years?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GaillimhIarthair on March 14, 2018, 11:11:52 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 14, 2018, 09:43:02 PM
Quote from: GaillimhIarthair on March 14, 2018, 01:13:48 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 14, 2018, 11:14:35 AM
Quote from: seafoid on March 14, 2018, 10:59:57 AM
I was wondering if the Super 8s would benefit Mayo. The team has lost 3 finals by a single point.

I think it will benefit Galway! They will get to play a championship game in Croke Park without a win or bust scenario and this might help them get over their Croke Park Hoodoo! A weight that has been hanging over their heads for 17 years now!
Imagine having a 67 year drought hanging over yer head!  ;)

If you are 17, there's not much difference between a 17 year wait and a 67 year wait! ;)

How long is it since ye beat Kerry or Dublin in the Championship? 30 years? 40 years? 50 years?
LOL! We are both a long way past 17 unfortunately FTB!!
Whatever the length of time, it's been much too long, that's for sure.  Nothing to be gained in looking backwards though, more bad days than good unfortunately.  They do however make days like our hurlers had last Sept all the more sweeter when they do eventually come around.
Best of luck for the remainder of the league and sure we'll see ye in May!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on March 14, 2018, 11:18:31 PM
Quote from: GaillimhIarthair on March 14, 2018, 11:11:52 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 14, 2018, 09:43:02 PM
Quote from: GaillimhIarthair on March 14, 2018, 01:13:48 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 14, 2018, 11:14:35 AM
Quote from: seafoid on March 14, 2018, 10:59:57 AM
I was wondering if the Super 8s would benefit Mayo. The team has lost 3 finals by a single point.

I think it will benefit Galway! They will get to play a championship game in Croke Park without a win or bust scenario and this might help them get over their Croke Park Hoodoo! A weight that has been hanging over their heads for 17 years now!
Imagine having a 67 year drought hanging over yer head!  ;)

If you are 17, there's not much difference between a 17 year wait and a 67 year wait! ;)

How long is it since ye beat Kerry or Dublin in the Championship? 30 years? 40 years? 50 years?
LOL! We are both a long way past 17 unfortunately FTB!!
Whatever the length of time, it's been much too long, that's for sure.  Nothing to be gained in looking backwards though, more bad days than good unfortunately.  They do however make days like our hurlers had last Sept all the more sweeter when they do eventually come around.
Best of luck for the remainder of the league and sure we'll see ye in May!

+1
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on March 14, 2018, 11:30:42 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 14, 2018, 05:51:00 PM
If Kildare or Meath get a home game v Dublin there will be some quare pressure out on them to play it in Croke Park.
Sure it was obvious when the system was announced that some counties' home grounds would be deemed not big enough for a Super 8 match.

We already know Waterford won't play their home matches in the Munster hurling championship in Walsh Park.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on March 15, 2018, 01:10:24 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on March 14, 2018, 11:30:42 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 14, 2018, 05:51:00 PM
If Kildare or Meath get a home game v Dublin there will be some quare pressure out on them to play it in Croke Park.
Sure it was obvious when the system was announced that some counties' home grounds would be deemed not big enough for a Super 8 match.

We already know Waterford won't play their home matches in the Munster hurling championship in Walsh Park.

The important thing is that the county gets to choose the venue. Kildare might want to play in Portlaoise or Kilkenny, Meath might have to resort to Breffni Park! 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on March 15, 2018, 05:55:44 AM
The day the kildares and meaths  start insisting on bringing the Dubs to Newbridge and Navan with the home crowd making up the majority of the attendance putting the dubs support  on one small terrace and telling the rest tough shit its sold out ,booing their free takers in a hostile environment is the day the GAA grow a pair and stand up to this absolute farce of an unfair system.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on March 15, 2018, 08:19:06 AM
Quote from: larryin89 on March 15, 2018, 05:55:44 AM
The day the kildares and meaths  start insisting on bringing the Dubs to Newbridge and Navan with the home crowd making up the majority of the attendance putting the dubs support  on one small terrace and telling the rest tough shit its sold out ,booing their free takers in a hostile environment is the day the GAA grow a pair and stand up to this absolute farce of an unfair system.
the GAA should fund the redevelopment of Newbridge.. It is 10 years since the crash and the ground is a kip. Time to move on.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on March 15, 2018, 09:04:23 AM
I believe they're going to redevelop it but sure it's so hemmed in on all sides it'll never be bigger than 8/10,000.
You can imagine the media campaign if Larry's scenario came to pass - GAA preventing 60,000 people seeing a big match.
HQ on to the County Boards saying "You're responsible for a potential loss of €1.5m,  remember that when ye're looking for grants"
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rosnarun on March 15, 2018, 10:14:37 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 15, 2018, 09:04:23 AM
I believe they're going to redevelop it but sure it's so hemmed in on all sides it'll never be bigger than 8/10,000.
You can imagine the media campaign if Larry's scenario came to pass - GAA preventing 60,000 people seeing a big match.
HQ on to the County Boards saying "You're responsible for a potential loss of €1.5m,  remember that when ye're looking for grants"
I think 8-10k stadiums could do very well out of the super 8 .if teams are looking for neutral grounds that would be loads for most matches.
not sure if St conleths would be a good spot in the middle of the town
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: AZOffaly on March 15, 2018, 11:12:52 AM
Quote from: rosnarun on March 15, 2018, 10:14:37 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 15, 2018, 09:04:23 AM
I believe they're going to redevelop it but sure it's so hemmed in on all sides it'll never be bigger than 8/10,000.
You can imagine the media campaign if Larry's scenario came to pass - GAA preventing 60,000 people seeing a big match.
HQ on to the County Boards saying "You're responsible for a potential loss of €1.5m,  remember that when ye're looking for grants"
I think 8-10k stadiums could do very well out of the super 8 .if teams are looking for neutral grounds that would be loads for most matches.
not sure if St conleths would be a good spot in the middle of the town

If the average crowd at a Super 8 game is 8-10k, then the top brass will consider it a failure. In my humble opinion, the main reason for this is to generate more income by having more 'high profile' games, as a stepping stone to a tiered All Ireland.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Maroon Manc on March 15, 2018, 01:48:49 PM
I'm assuming that their will be double headers on the Saturday and Sunday of the opening weekend of the Super 8's?

Good luck to the Ulster champions playing Dublin at their 'neutral' venue.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on March 15, 2018, 02:14:00 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 15, 2018, 11:12:52 AM
Quote from: rosnarun on March 15, 2018, 10:14:37 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on March 15, 2018, 09:04:23 AM
I believe they're going to redevelop it but sure it's so hemmed in on all sides it'll never be bigger than 8/10,000.
You can imagine the media campaign if Larry's scenario came to pass - GAA preventing 60,000 people seeing a big match.
HQ on to the County Boards saying "You're responsible for a potential loss of €1.5m,  remember that when ye're looking for grants"
I think 8-10k stadiums could do very well out of the super 8 .if teams are looking for neutral grounds that would be loads for most matches.
not sure if St conleths would be a good spot in the middle of the town

If the average crowd at a Super 8 game is 8-10k, then the top brass will consider it a failure. In my humble opinion, the main reason for this is to generate more income by having more 'high profile' games, as a stepping stone to a tiered All Ireland.
They want to get attendances up, I think, because the qualifier effect has worn off.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on May 27, 2018, 11:56:02 PM
Looking at all the amount of games that were played this weekend (and not televised). There looks to be a rushing through of getting the Provincial championship finished and getting down to the real business of the Super 8's and there after.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rosnarun on May 29, 2018, 02:00:10 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on May 27, 2018, 11:56:02 PM
Looking at all the amount of games that were played this weekend (and not televised). There looks to be a rushing through of getting the Provincial championship finished and getting down to the real business of the Super 8's and there after.
it also has a lot to do with the CPa and club fixtures . it looks like the GAA are bending over backward to try and gt 2 incompatible competitions run off together and its leaving no one happier.
with drawing county players from club championships looks like the only way .
problem there is when is some one a county player. or would you have closed county squads
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on May 29, 2018, 02:41:21 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on May 29, 2018, 02:00:10 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on May 27, 2018, 11:56:02 PM
Looking at all the amount of games that were played this weekend (and not televised). There looks to be a rushing through of getting the Provincial championship finished and getting down to the real business of the Super 8's and there after.
it also has a lot to do with the CPa and club fixtures . it looks like the GAA are bending over backward to try and gt 2 incompatible competitions run off together and its leaving no one happier.
with drawing county players from club championships looks like the only way .
problem there is when is some one a county player. or would you have closed county squads

No doubt! But there seems to be a gung-ho feel of getting rid of the Riff Raff and getting to the games where the real money is.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: shark on May 29, 2018, 03:48:15 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on May 29, 2018, 02:00:10 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on May 27, 2018, 11:56:02 PM
Looking at all the amount of games that were played this weekend (and not televised). There looks to be a rushing through of getting the Provincial championship finished and getting down to the real business of the Super 8's and there after.
it also has a lot to do with the CPa and club fixtures . it looks like the GAA are bending over backward to try and gt 2 incompatible competitions run off together and its leaving no one happier.
with drawing county players from club championships looks like the only way .
problem there is when is some one a county player. or would you have closed county squads

That happens and some county teams won't even field. In weaker counties the majority of players would not play county if they thought they couldn't play club. Bad enough giving up a large percentage your life for little reward, no way they give up the only part of the game where they can actually win something.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on May 29, 2018, 03:59:00 PM
Quote from: Maroon Manc on March 15, 2018, 01:48:49 PM
I'm assuming that their will be double headers on the Saturday and Sunday of the opening weekend of the Super 8's?

Good luck to the Ulster champions playing Dublin at their 'neutral' venue.
The Ulster champions were never scheduled to play the Leinster champions at a neutral venue.

The first round of games is, and always has been, scheduled for Croke Park regardless of who is playing in them.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on May 29, 2018, 04:11:55 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on May 29, 2018, 02:41:21 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on May 29, 2018, 02:00:10 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on May 27, 2018, 11:56:02 PM
Looking at all the amount of games that were played this weekend (and not televised). There looks to be a rushing through of getting the Provincial championship finished and getting down to the real business of the Super 8's and there after.
it also has a lot to do with the CPa and club fixtures . it looks like the GAA are bending over backward to try and gt 2 incompatible competitions run off together and its leaving no one happier.
with drawing county players from club championships looks like the only way .
problem there is when is some one a county player. or would you have closed county squads

No doubt! But there seems to be a gung-ho feel of getting rid of the Riff Raff and getting to the games where the real money is.
Isn't that what competitive sport is usually all about.?
Will ye be rejoining the riff raff for the 1st time since 2010?😀
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: bamboo on May 29, 2018, 05:46:04 PM
I thought it was the final round of the super 8s that was scheduled for Croke Park- On the bank holiday weekend ?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on May 30, 2018, 07:34:47 AM
Quote from: bamboo on May 29, 2018, 05:46:04 PM
I thought it was the final round of the super 8s that was scheduled for Croke Park- On the bank holiday weekend ?

Nope. The round scheduled for the 14th/15th July is though.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on May 30, 2018, 08:06:51 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on May 29, 2018, 04:11:55 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on May 29, 2018, 02:41:21 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on May 29, 2018, 02:00:10 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on May 27, 2018, 11:56:02 PM
Looking at all the amount of games that were played this weekend (and not televised). There looks to be a rushing through of getting the Provincial championship finished and getting down to the real business of the Super 8's and there after.
it also has a lot to do with the CPa and club fixtures . it looks like the GAA are bending over backward to try and gt 2 incompatible competitions run off together and its leaving no one happier.
with drawing county players from club championships looks like the only way .
problem there is when is some one a county player. or would you have closed county squads

No doubt! But there seems to be a gung-ho feel of getting rid of the Riff Raff and getting to the games where the real money is.
Isn't that what competitive sport is usually all about.?
Will ye be rejoining the riff raff for the 1st time since 2010?😀

We just might. Been riding our luck on his back door gimmick for the last couple of years.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on May 30, 2018, 01:57:19 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on May 30, 2018, 08:06:51 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on May 29, 2018, 04:11:55 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on May 29, 2018, 02:41:21 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on May 29, 2018, 02:00:10 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on May 27, 2018, 11:56:02 PM
Looking at all the amount of games that were played this weekend (and not televised). There looks to be a rushing through of getting the Provincial championship finished and getting down to the real business of the Super 8's and there after.
it also has a lot to do with the CPa and club fixtures . it looks like the GAA are bending over backward to try and gt 2 incompatible competitions run off together and its leaving no one happier.
with drawing county players from club championships looks like the only way .
problem there is when is some one a county player. or would you have closed county squads

No doubt! But there seems to be a gung-ho feel of getting rid of the Riff Raff and getting to the games where the real money is.
Isn't that what competitive sport is usually all about.?
Will ye be rejoining the riff raff for the 1st time since 2010?😀

We just might. Been riding our luck on his back door gimmick for the last couple of years.

I think Kerry are going to be vulnerable in Munster this year, although I think a Munster defeat might be no harm for them in the long run. But if they do lose, you could have the "dream scenario" of Dublin, Monaghan, Mayo and Kerry in one Super 8 group, which again would tie in with Monaghan's luck in quarter-final draws! (of course Donegal may have something to say in Ulster).

Then you'd have the scenario as to whether it would be Killarney or Castlebar that hosts Dublin's away game! I'm sure the Mayo lads are saying - it would definitely be Killarney, and they'd be probably be right :)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on May 30, 2018, 02:23:08 PM
Quote from: Hound on May 30, 2018, 01:57:19 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on May 30, 2018, 08:06:51 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on May 29, 2018, 04:11:55 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on May 29, 2018, 02:41:21 PM
Quote from: rosnarun on May 29, 2018, 02:00:10 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on May 27, 2018, 11:56:02 PM
Looking at all the amount of games that were played this weekend (and not televised). There looks to be a rushing through of getting the Provincial championship finished and getting down to the real business of the Super 8's and there after.
it also has a lot to do with the CPa and club fixtures . it looks like the GAA are bending over backward to try and gt 2 incompatible competitions run off together and its leaving no one happier.
with drawing county players from club championships looks like the only way .
problem there is when is some one a county player. or would you have closed county squads

No doubt! But there seems to be a gung-ho feel of getting rid of the Riff Raff and getting to the games where the real money is.
Isn't that what competitive sport is usually all about.?
Will ye be rejoining the riff raff for the 1st time since 2010?😀

We just might. Been riding our luck on his back door gimmick for the last couple of years.

I think Kerry are going to be vulnerable in Munster this year, although I think a Munster defeat might be no harm for them in the long run. But if they do lose, you could have the "dream scenario" of Dublin, Monaghan, Mayo and Kerry in one Super 8 group, which again would tie in with Monaghan's luck in quarter-final draws! (of course Donegal may have something to say in Ulster).

Then you'd have the scenario as to whether it would be Killarney or Castlebar that hosts Dublin's away game! I'm sure the Mayo lads are saying - it would definitely be Killarney, and they'd be probably be right :)

If Dublin's away game is a dead rubber it will be outside the Capital. Otherwise you'll have the usual - you have to let all the fans that want to go be able to,  all teams want to play in Croke Park, Croke Park is a neutral venue and so on.....
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: joemamas on May 30, 2018, 02:33:42 PM
Q
Apologies for any grief I may cause,
but, lets assume that
Dublin, Monaghan, Galway and Kerry win provinces.
Roscommon as Connaught runners up qualify,
Donegal as Ulster runners up qualify,
Mayo (manage to stay alive and beat Leinster runners up)
and for argument sake Tyrone Beat Cork,

What will group A and B look like.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: westbound on May 30, 2018, 03:05:42 PM
Quote from: joemamas on May 30, 2018, 02:33:42 PM
Q
Apologies for any grief I may cause,
but, lets assume that
Dublin, Monaghan, Galway and Kerry win provinces.
Roscommon as Connaught runners up qualify,
Donegal as Ulster runners up qualify,
Mayo (manage to stay alive and beat Leinster runners up)
and for argument sake Tyrone Beat Cork,

What will group A and B look like.

The Groups are as follows:

1. Munster Winner, Connacht Winner, Ulster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Leinster runner (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer)

2. Ulster Winner, Leinster Winner, Munster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Connacht runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer).

Based on your assumptions, the groups would be:
1. Kerry, Galway, Donegal, Mayo
2. Monaghan, Dublin, Tyrone & Roscommon

The fixtures would then be as follows:
14/15 Jul
Kerry V Galway -  Croke park
Donegal V Mayo - Croke park
21/22 Jul
Donegal V Galway - Donegal home venue
Mayo V Kerry - Mayo home venue
4/5th Aug
Kerry V Donegal - Kerry home venue
Galway V Mayo - Galway home venue

and in the other group:
14/15 Jul
Monaghan V Dublin -  Croke park
Tyrone V Roscommon - Croke park
21/22 Jul
Tyrone V Dublin - Tyrone home venue
Roscommon V Monaghan - Roscommon home venue
4/5th Aug
Monaghan V Tyrone - Monaghan home venue
Dublin V Roscommon - Dublin home venue
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: joemamas on May 30, 2018, 03:30:12 PM
Quote from: westbound on May 30, 2018, 03:05:42 PM
Quote from: joemamas on May 30, 2018, 02:33:42 PM
Q
Apologies for any grief I may cause,
but, lets assume that
Dublin, Monaghan, Galway and Kerry win provinces.
Roscommon as Connaught runners up qualify,
Donegal as Ulster runners up qualify,
Mayo (manage to stay alive and beat Leinster runners up)
and for argument sake Tyrone Beat Cork,

What will group A and B look like.

The Groups are as follows:

1. Munster Winner, Connacht Winner, Ulster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Leinster runner (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer)

2. Ulster Winner, Leinster Winner, Munster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Connacht runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer).

Based on your assumptions, the groups would be:
1. Kerry, Galway, Donegal, Mayo
2. Monaghan, Dublin, Tyrone & Roscommon

The fixtures would then be as follows:
14/15 Jul
Kerry V Galway -  Croke park
Donegal V Mayo - Croke park
21/22 Jul
Donegal V Galway - Donegal home venue
Mayo V Kerry - Mayo home venue
4/5th Aug
Kerry V Donegal - Kerry home venue
Galway V Mayo - Galway home venue

and in the other group:
14/15 Jul
Monaghan V Dublin -  Croke park
Tyrone V Roscommon - Croke park
21/22 Jul
Tyrone V Dublin - Tyrone home venue
Roscommon V Monaghan - Roscommon home venue
4/5th Aug
Monaghan V Tyrone - Monaghan home venue
Dublin V Roscommon - Dublin home venue

Thank you
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on May 30, 2018, 04:28:59 PM
As much as it is maligned, those fixtures would throw up some great matches.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on May 30, 2018, 04:32:16 PM
AI semi Finals
Kerry v Ros
Dublin v Mayowestros.
Final Kerry v Mayowestros. ...... and  :'( :'(
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 01:24:40 AM
Quote from: omagh_gael on May 30, 2018, 04:28:59 PM
As much as it is maligned, those fixtures would throw up some great matches.

You think?  ::)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on June 03, 2018, 12:04:31 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 01:24:40 AM
Quote from: omagh_gael on May 30, 2018, 04:28:59 PM
As much as it is maligned, those fixtures would throw up some great matches.

You think?  ::)
Yeah omagh_gael, stop being so bloody positive.

We're told that the league is a great competition as it pits teams of similar standing against each other. However, when a poster says that multiple games involving eight of the top nine ranked teams would be great, it gets dismissed. The incessant, endless, negative moaning side of the GAA in a nutshell.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on June 03, 2018, 01:00:07 PM
Only the football crowd.
The hurley crew are always blowing trumpets -seems Cork v Limerick was the greatest game ever in the Munster Championship.
The new format is wonderful, packed Provincial Stadia, home and away fixtures, atmosphere,  excitement thrills spills etc.

Meanwhile on planet Football -all shite, terrible stuff, new formats shite, moan groan doom gloom.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on June 03, 2018, 02:45:37 PM
Football needs rule changes more than it needs a change in format.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 04:28:33 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on June 03, 2018, 02:45:37 PM
Football needs rule changes more than it needs a change in format.

The spectacle is nearly dead. If it's not one of these blanket defence hand ball games, it's one team dishing out a hammering to the other team.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: mrdeeds on June 03, 2018, 04:30:27 PM
Can Tyrone and Monaghan meet again?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on June 03, 2018, 04:31:46 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on June 03, 2018, 02:45:37 PM
Football needs rule changes more than it needs a change in format.

13 men.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 04:32:52 PM
Quote from: mrdeeds on June 03, 2018, 04:30:27 PM
Can Tyrone and Monaghan meet again?

Yes!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 04:35:15 PM
Quote from: Syferus on June 03, 2018, 04:31:46 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on June 03, 2018, 02:45:37 PM
Football needs rule changes more than it needs a change in format.

13 men.

Yes, would suit the weaker teams. As they in theory would need 2 less starting stars. Then again the open spaces might suit the stronger sides!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 08:41:55 PM
So Monaghan and Clare have had almighty falls today. Both losses will be damaging.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on June 03, 2018, 08:47:29 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 08:41:55 PM
So Monaghan and Clare have had almighty falls today. Both losses will be damaging.

Both are going to be awkward draws for the R1 winners.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 09:10:25 PM
Quote from: Syferus on June 03, 2018, 08:47:29 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 08:41:55 PM
So Monaghan and Clare have had almighty falls today. Both losses will be damaging.

Both are going to be awkward draws for the R1 winners.

Absolutely! Just both took big hits on Morale today! Round One Winners will have shook off the cobwebs and have a win behind them. There seems to be a balancing out of teams below Kerry and Dublin. Think we are heading back to the '70's again which will suit the media, but not the rest of us mere mortals! :(
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on June 03, 2018, 09:13:55 PM
Quote from: westbound on May 30, 2018, 03:05:42 PM
Quote from: joemamas on May 30, 2018, 02:33:42 PM
Q
Apologies for any grief I may cause,
but, lets assume that
Dublin, Monaghan, Galway and Kerry win provinces.
Roscommon as Connaught runners up qualify,
Donegal as Ulster runners up qualify,
Mayo (manage to stay alive and beat Leinster runners up)
and for argument sake Tyrone Beat Cork,

What will group A and B look like.

The Groups are as follows:

1. Munster Winner, Connacht Winner, Ulster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Leinster runner (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer)

2. Ulster Winner, Leinster Winner, Munster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Connacht runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer).

Based on your assumptions, the groups would be:
1. Kerry, Galway, Donegal, Mayo
2. Monaghan, Dublin, Tyrone & Roscommon

The fixtures would then be as follows:
14/15 Jul
Kerry V Galway -  Croke park
Donegal V Mayo - Croke park
21/22 Jul
Donegal V Galway - Donegal home venue
Mayo V Kerry - Mayo home venue
4/5th Aug
Kerry V Donegal - Kerry home venue
Galway V Mayo - Galway home venue

and in the other group:
14/15 Jul
Monaghan V Dublin -  Croke park
Tyrone V Roscommon - Croke park
21/22 Jul
Tyrone V Dublin - Tyrone home venue
Roscommon V Monaghan - Roscommon home venue
4/5th Aug
Monaghan V Tyrone - Monaghan home venue
Dublin V Roscommon - Dublin home venue

So how does today's results change things?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on June 03, 2018, 09:23:21 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 09:10:25 PM
Quote from: Syferus on June 03, 2018, 08:47:29 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 08:41:55 PM
So Monaghan and Clare have had almighty falls today. Both losses will be damaging.

Both are going to be awkward draws for the R1 winners.

Absolutely! Just both took big hits on Morale today! Round One Winners will have shook off the cobwebs and have a win behind them. There seems to be a balancing out of teams below Kerry and Dublin. Think we are heading back to the '70's again which will suit the media, but not the rest of us mere mortals! :(
Galway and the Rossies hammering the lesser lights too. Maybe should be just the Super 4!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on June 03, 2018, 09:49:47 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 03, 2018, 09:13:55 PM
Quote from: westbound on May 30, 2018, 03:05:42 PM
Quote from: joemamas on May 30, 2018, 02:33:42 PM
Q
Apologies for any grief I may cause,
but, lets assume that
Dublin, Monaghan, Galway and Kerry win provinces.
Roscommon as Connaught runners up qualify,
Donegal as Ulster runners up qualify,
Mayo (manage to stay alive and beat Leinster runners up)
and for argument sake Tyrone Beat Cork,

What will group A and B look like.

The Groups are as follows:

1. Munster Winner, Connacht Winner, Ulster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Leinster runner (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer)

2. Ulster Winner, Leinster Winner, Munster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Connacht runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer).

Based on your assumptions, the groups would be:
1. Kerry, Galway, Donegal, Mayo
2. Monaghan, Dublin, Tyrone & Roscommon

The fixtures would then be as follows:
14/15 Jul
Kerry V Galway -  Croke park
Donegal V Mayo - Croke park
21/22 Jul
Donegal V Galway - Donegal home venue
Mayo V Kerry - Mayo home venue
4/5th Aug
Kerry V Donegal - Kerry home venue
Galway V Mayo - Galway home venue

and in the other group:
14/15 Jul
Monaghan V Dublin -  Croke park
Tyrone V Roscommon - Croke park
21/22 Jul
Tyrone V Dublin - Tyrone home venue
Roscommon V Monaghan - Roscommon home venue
4/5th Aug
Monaghan V Tyrone - Monaghan home venue
Dublin V Roscommon - Dublin home venue

So how does today's results change things?

Monaghan aren't guaranteed group 2.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on June 03, 2018, 10:18:49 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on June 03, 2018, 09:49:47 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 03, 2018, 09:13:55 PM
Quote from: westbound on May 30, 2018, 03:05:42 PM
Quote from: joemamas on May 30, 2018, 02:33:42 PM
Q
Apologies for any grief I may cause,
but, lets assume that
Dublin, Monaghan, Galway and Kerry win provinces.
Roscommon as Connaught runners up qualify,
Donegal as Ulster runners up qualify,
Mayo (manage to stay alive and beat Leinster runners up)
and for argument sake Tyrone Beat Cork,

What will group A and B look like.

The Groups are as follows:

1. Munster Winner, Connacht Winner, Ulster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Leinster runner (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer)

2. Ulster Winner, Leinster Winner, Munster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Connacht runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer).

Based on your assumptions, the groups would be:
1. Kerry, Galway, Donegal, Mayo
2. Monaghan, Dublin, Tyrone & Roscommon

The fixtures would then be as follows:
14/15 Jul
Kerry V Galway -  Croke park
Donegal V Mayo - Croke park
21/22 Jul
Donegal V Galway - Donegal home venue
Mayo V Kerry - Mayo home venue
4/5th Aug
Kerry V Donegal - Kerry home venue
Galway V Mayo - Galway home venue

and in the other group:
14/15 Jul
Monaghan V Dublin -  Croke park
Tyrone V Roscommon - Croke park
21/22 Jul
Tyrone V Dublin - Tyrone home venue
Roscommon V Monaghan - Roscommon home venue
4/5th Aug
Monaghan V Tyrone - Monaghan home venue
Dublin V Roscommon - Dublin home venue

How do you know that, for example,
Mayo would be group one?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: twohands!!! on June 03, 2018, 10:59:37 PM
Things are a small bit clearer in terms of the look of the groups.

1. Munster Winner (Kerry/Cork) Connacht Winner (Galway/Roscommon) Ulster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Leinster runner (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer)

2. Ulster Winner (Fermanagh/Down/Donegal) , Leinster Winner (Laois/Carlow/Dublin/Longford), Munster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Connacht runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer).

If you look at who the bookies have as favourites for the provincial titles the groups would be

1. Kerry, Galway, Fermanagh or whoever beats them from the qualifiers, Laois or Carlow or whoever beats them from the qualifiers.

2 Donegal, Dublin, Cork or whoever beats them from the qualifiers, Roscommon or whoever beats them from the qualifiers.

The draw for Round 4 where the 4 losing provincial sides will drawn against the final 4 who came through the qualifiers will be huge.

I wonder what odds you would get on all 4 Provincial winners making the semi-finals?


Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 11:56:36 PM
Quote from: Hound on June 03, 2018, 09:23:21 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 09:10:25 PM
Quote from: Syferus on June 03, 2018, 08:47:29 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 08:41:55 PM
So Monaghan and Clare have had almighty falls today. Both losses will be damaging.

Both are going to be awkward draws for the R1 winners.

Absolutely! Just both took big hits on Morale today! Round One Winners will have shook off the cobwebs and have a win behind them. There seems to be a balancing out of teams below Kerry and Dublin. Think we are heading back to the '70's again which will suit the media, but not the rest of us mere mortals! :(
Galway and the Rossies hammering the lesser lights too. Maybe should be just the Super 4!

You know it's a Super One - or should I rephrase that a Chosen One!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on June 04, 2018, 02:09:29 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 11:56:36 PM
Quote from: Hound on June 03, 2018, 09:23:21 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 09:10:25 PM
Quote from: Syferus on June 03, 2018, 08:47:29 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on June 03, 2018, 08:41:55 PM
So Monaghan and Clare have had almighty falls today. Both losses will be damaging.

Both are going to be awkward draws for the R1 winners.

Absolutely! Just both took big hits on Morale today! Round One Winners will have shook off the cobwebs and have a win behind them. There seems to be a balancing out of teams below Kerry and Dublin. Think we are heading back to the '70's again which will suit the media, but not the rest of us mere mortals! :(
Galway and the Rossies hammering the lesser lights too. Maybe should be just the Super 4!

You know it's a Super One - or should I rephrase that a Chosen One!

We'd have had some of the most memorable AI championships in history these last five years if it wasn't for Dublin. With them it has been a series of rote, predictable results. Outside of them there's so many teams that can beat each other. A sport rotting fro nthe top down.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on June 04, 2018, 08:05:47 AM
Nothing more predictable than a 1 point win in the All Ireland final, with an odd draw thrown in.

Do you know it was the money we paid him that turned Dean Rock from a flaky enough freetaker into one the very best around, not the practice, practice, practice ?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on June 04, 2018, 08:29:14 AM
Monaghan losing changes the outlook for provincial finalists. Eg Carlow/Laois were both thinking get to Leinster final,  lose and then just one match between them and the Super 8. But now there are at least 3 highly rated D1 teams in the qualifiers.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Maroon Manc on June 04, 2018, 12:18:05 PM
Probably already mentioned but looking at the hurling teams who've played 3 weeks in a go have struggled so far, don't think any of them have won so far. You've got to wonder what state the likes of Tyrone, Mayo & Monaghan will be in as they've to play 5 weeks in a row if they all make the super 8's.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: LeoMc on June 04, 2018, 01:10:51 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on June 03, 2018, 10:59:37 PM
Things are a small bit clearer in terms of the look of the groups.

1. Munster Winner (Kerry/Cork) Connacht Winner (Galway/Roscommon) Ulster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Leinster runner (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer)

2. Ulster Winner (Fermanagh/Down/Donegal) , Leinster Winner (Laois/Carlow/Dublin/Longford), Munster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Connacht runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer).

If you look at who the bookies have as favourites for the provincial titles the groups would be

1. Kerry, Galway, Fermanagh or whoever beats them from the qualifiers, Laois or Carlow or whoever beats them from the qualifiers.

2 Donegal, Dublin, Cork or whoever beats them from the qualifiers, Roscommon or whoever beats them from the qualifiers.

The draw for Round 4 where the 4 losing provincial sides will drawn against the final 4 who came through the qualifiers will be huge.

I wonder what odds you would get on all 4 Provincial winners making the semi-finals?
If Fermanagh win Ulster you would get long enough odds. They will still be touring round the County with the Anglo Celt when the All-stars are announced.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: westbound on June 05, 2018, 04:19:23 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 03, 2018, 10:18:49 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on June 03, 2018, 09:49:47 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 03, 2018, 09:13:55 PM
Quote from: westbound on May 30, 2018, 03:05:42 PM
Quote from: joemamas on May 30, 2018, 02:33:42 PM
Q
Apologies for any grief I may cause,
but, lets assume that
Dublin, Monaghan, Galway and Kerry win provinces.
Roscommon as Connaught runners up qualify,
Donegal as Ulster runners up qualify,
Mayo (manage to stay alive and beat Leinster runners up)
and for argument sake Tyrone Beat Cork,

What will group A and B look like.

The Groups are as follows:

1. Munster Winner, Connacht Winner, Ulster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Leinster runner (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer)

2. Ulster Winner, Leinster Winner, Munster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Connacht runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer).


Based on your assumptions, the groups would be:
1. Kerry, Galway, Donegal, Mayo
2. Monaghan, Dublin, Tyrone & Roscommon

The fixtures would then be as follows:
14/15 Jul
Kerry V Galway -  Croke park
Donegal V Mayo - Croke park
21/22 Jul
Donegal V Galway - Donegal home venue
Mayo V Kerry - Mayo home venue
4/5th Aug
Kerry V Donegal - Kerry home venue
Galway V Mayo - Galway home venue

and in the other group:
14/15 Jul
Monaghan V Dublin -  Croke park
Tyrone V Roscommon - Croke park
21/22 Jul
Tyrone V Dublin - Tyrone home venue
Roscommon V Monaghan - Roscommon home venue
4/5th Aug
Monaghan V Tyrone - Monaghan home venue
Dublin V Roscommon - Dublin home venue

How do you know that, for example,
Mayo would be group one?

These groups are based on the assumption provided by joemamas.
If Mayo beat the leinster runners up (as assumed joemamas) in R4 of the qualifers, they would be group 1.

The bit I've bolded above is set in stone. The example groups based on assumptions will change depending on results and qualifer draws (Monaghan assumption already proved to be incorrect). Also, unless Tyrone, Mayo and Monaghan avoid each other in the R2, and R3 qualifer draws they can't all make the super 8's.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: joemamas on June 05, 2018, 06:09:14 PM
Quote from: westbound on June 05, 2018, 04:19:23 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 03, 2018, 10:18:49 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on June 03, 2018, 09:49:47 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 03, 2018, 09:13:55 PM
Quote from: westbound on May 30, 2018, 03:05:42 PM
Quote from: joemamas on May 30, 2018, 02:33:42 PM
Q
Apologies for any grief I may cause,
but, lets assume that
Dublin, Monaghan, Galway and Kerry win provinces.
Roscommon as Connaught runners up qualify,
Donegal as Ulster runners up qualify,
Mayo (manage to stay alive and beat Leinster runners up)
and for argument sake Tyrone Beat Cork,

What will group A and B look like.

The Groups are as follows:

1. Munster Winner, Connacht Winner, Ulster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Leinster runner (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer)

2. Ulster Winner, Leinster Winner, Munster runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer), & Connacht runner up (or team that beats them in Round4qualifer).


Based on your assumptions, the groups would be:
1. Kerry, Galway, Donegal, Mayo
2. Monaghan, Dublin, Tyrone & Roscommon

The fixtures would then be as follows:
14/15 Jul
Kerry V Galway -  Croke park
Donegal V Mayo - Croke park
21/22 Jul
Donegal V Galway - Donegal home venue
Mayo V Kerry - Mayo home venue
4/5th Aug
Kerry V Donegal - Kerry home venue
Galway V Mayo - Galway home venue

and in the other group:
14/15 Jul
Monaghan V Dublin -  Croke park
Tyrone V Roscommon - Croke park
21/22 Jul
Tyrone V Dublin - Tyrone home venue
Roscommon V Monaghan - Roscommon home venue
4/5th Aug
Monaghan V Tyrone - Monaghan home venue
Dublin V Roscommon - Dublin home venue

How do you know that, for example,
Mayo would be group one?

These groups are based on the assumption provided by joemamas.
If Mayo beat the leinster runners up (as assumed joemamas) in R4 of the qualifers, they would be group 1.

The bit I've bolded above is set in stone. The example groups based on assumptions will change depending on results and qualifer draws (Monaghan assumption already proved to be incorrect). Also, unless Tyrone, Mayo and Monaghan avoid each other in the R2, and R3 qualifer draws they can't all make the super 8's.

Thanks, please feel free to update in the coming weeks.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on June 16, 2018, 02:27:51 PM
https://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/our-gaa-experts-give-their-super-8-predictions-and-some-big-counties-miss-out-37016841.html
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ONeill on June 16, 2018, 07:07:10 PM
Peter Canavan: Dublin, Kerry, Galway, Donegal, Tyrone, Monaghan, Mayo, Roscommon.

Martin Breheny: Dublin, Donegal, Galway, Kerry, Cork, Mayo, Tyrone, Roscommon.

Sinead Kissane: Dublin, Kerry, Galway, Donegal, Monaghan, Mayo, Roscommon, Cork.

Donnchadh Boyle: Dublin, Kerry, Galway, Donegal, Mayo, Monaghan, Roscommon, Tyrone.

Tomás Ó Sé: Dublin, Kerry, Galway, Donegal, Monaghan, Cork, Mayo, Roscommon.

Dick Clerkin: Dublin, Kerry, Galway, Donegal, Mayo, Roscommon, Tyrone, Monaghan.

Michael Verney: Dublin, Kerry, Galway, Donegal, Roscommon, Tyrone, Mayo, Cork.

Colm Keys: Dublin, Kerry, Galway, Donegal, Mayo, Monaghan, Cork, Roscommon.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on June 16, 2018, 07:10:02 PM
Mayo in all of them. Please Lord let them be correct.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: joemamas on June 16, 2018, 07:41:56 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on June 16, 2018, 07:10:02 PM
Mayo in all of them. Please Lord let them be correct.

Amen

However, it is really a crapshoot.
Other than provincial winners, you cannot pick Tyrone, Monaghan, Roscommon and Mayo with any degree of confidence.
Mayo could meet Monaghan, the winners could meet Roscommon, so two out of four could be gone.
I sincerely hope they are correct.
The eight I personally would like to see
Dublin,Kerry,Galway, Donegal, Monaghan, Mayo, Roscommon and either Cavan or Tyrone.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on June 16, 2018, 08:04:31 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on June 16, 2018, 07:10:02 PM
Mayo in all of them. Please Lord let them be correct.
Fermanagh/Laois in none. Might be groupthink
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: tonto1888 on June 16, 2018, 08:10:26 PM
Quote from: seafoid on June 16, 2018, 08:04:31 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on June 16, 2018, 07:10:02 PM
Mayo in all of them. Please Lord let them be correct.
Fermanagh/Laois in none. Might be groupthink

Do you think either really have a chance?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on June 16, 2018, 08:16:56 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on June 16, 2018, 08:10:26 PM
Quote from: seafoid on June 16, 2018, 08:04:31 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on June 16, 2018, 07:10:02 PM
Mayo in all of them. Please Lord let them be correct.
Fermanagh/Laois in none. Might be groupthink

Do you think either really have a chance?
They need to win 1 match if they lose their final.
Depends on the draw. I don't know how good Monaghan and Tyrone are tbh.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: shark on June 16, 2018, 08:28:55 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on June 16, 2018, 08:10:26 PM
Quote from: seafoid on June 16, 2018, 08:04:31 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on June 16, 2018, 07:10:02 PM
Mayo in all of them. Please Lord let them be correct.
Fermanagh/Laois in none. Might be groupthink

Do you think either really have a chance?

You do realise that the draw is not preordained? Laois/Fermanagh could play the winners of (Louth v Leitrim) v (Cavan v Down) or Armagh, or Longford.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: giveballaghback on June 16, 2018, 08:33:42 PM
Have Galway beaten the Rossies already joemamas? feck i intended going to that game.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Kuwabatake Sanjuro on June 16, 2018, 08:35:48 PM
Nobody expecting a single Leinster team to make it apart from the overlords.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: tippabu on June 16, 2018, 09:03:45 PM
Quote from: giveballaghback on June 16, 2018, 08:33:42 PM
Have Galway beaten the Rossies already joemamas? feck i intended going to that game.

relax...hes just putting up a scenario where teams tipped can be drawn to knock each other out, mayo couldnt play galway in round 4 so no point putting up rossies/galway
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on June 16, 2018, 10:35:56 PM
Saw Monaghan v Fermanagh in the flesh. Sadly they're not all they're made out to be in my opinion.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Itchy on June 17, 2018, 09:15:53 AM
Quote from: shark on June 16, 2018, 08:28:55 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on June 16, 2018, 08:10:26 PM
Quote from: seafoid on June 16, 2018, 08:04:31 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on June 16, 2018, 07:10:02 PM
Mayo in all of them. Please Lord let them be correct.
Fermanagh/Laois in none. Might be groupthink

Do you think either really have a chance?

You do realise that the draw is not preordained? Laois/Fermanagh could play the winners of (Louth v Leitrim) v (Cavan v Down) or Armagh, or Longford.

The whole prediction thing is daft. Sure every e has mayo and Tyrone in the last 8 yet they could easily be drawn to play each other in the next round. I'd say 2 places will be down to the luck of the draw.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Boy Wonder on June 17, 2018, 11:26:07 AM
If you want the highest ranking teams AND equal provincial representation the best outcome would be :

Group 1
Connacht Champions    Galway (D1)
Munster Champions    Kerry (D1)
Ulster Runner-up      Fermanagh (D3)     Tyrone
Leinster Runner-up      Laois (D4)     Kildare

Group 2
Leinster Champions    Dublin (D1)
Ulster Champions    Donegal (D1)
Connacht Runner-up   Roscommon (D2)     Mayo
Munster Runner-up     Cork (D2)

But in all probability you won't get groups as balanced as above and one group will appear stronger that the other on paper.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on June 17, 2018, 11:27:55 AM
I must have missed the Connacht Final ::)
The disrespect.....
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: tippabu on June 17, 2018, 11:33:28 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 17, 2018, 11:27:55 AM
I must have missed the Connacht Final ::)
The disrespect.....

Yer awful touché about this;).....he was basing it on highest ranked teams and equal rep of provinces and galway mayo are ahead in that aspect (Clare higher ranked than clare btw and monaghan ahead of tyrone!).

Best of luck today btw....hopefully its going to be a better game to watch than most galways this year
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on June 17, 2018, 08:46:50 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 17, 2018, 11:27:55 AM
I must have missed the Connacht Final ::)
The disrespect.....

Did you catch the Connacht final this time?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on June 17, 2018, 10:38:28 PM
I'm not sure of the rules re repeat  fixtures in the round 3 draw, but with expected rusults next week there is some probably  of a Mayo v Monaghan or Tyrone, so removed a big gun. Someone middling might  draw the winners of Louth v Leitrim and likely beat them, but this would provide an opportunity for the provincial losers to beat this team and reach the super 8, so it is very much dependent on the draw.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on June 18, 2018, 09:03:30 AM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 17, 2018, 08:46:50 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 17, 2018, 11:27:55 AM
I must have missed the Connacht Final ::)
The disrespect.....

Did you catch the Connacht final this time?
Yes for the third year in a row unlike some Counties :P
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: straightred on June 18, 2018, 09:37:57 AM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 17, 2018, 10:38:28 PM
I'm not sure of the rules re repeat  fixtures in the round 3 draw, but with expected rusults next week there is some probably  of a Mayo v Monaghan or Tyrone, so removed a big gun. Someone middling might  draw the winners of Louth v Leitrim and likely beat them, but this would provide an opportunity for the provincial losers to beat this team and reach the super 8, so it is very much dependent on the draw.

r3 and r4 don't allow repeats so tyrone can't get monaghan in r3 and Fermanagh can't get monaghan in r4 (if they are all in these draws)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on June 18, 2018, 09:38:44 AM
Quote from: The Boy Wonder on June 17, 2018, 11:26:07 AM
If you want the highest ranking teams AND equal provincial representation the best outcome would be :

Group 1
Connacht Champions    Galway (D1)
Munster Champions    Kerry (D1)
Ulster Runner-up      Fermanagh (D3)     Tyrone
Leinster Runner-up      Laois (D4)     Kildare

Group 2
Leinster Champions    Dublin (D1)
Ulster Champions    Donegal (D1)
Connacht Runner-up   Roscommon (D2)     Mayo
Munster Runner-up     Cork (D2)

But in all probability you won't get groups as balanced as above and one group will appear stronger that the other on paper.
That is just D1 minus Monaghan
Winter/spring

For harder ground you have some different counties
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on June 18, 2018, 09:47:38 AM
Quote from: straightred on June 18, 2018, 09:37:57 AM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 17, 2018, 10:38:28 PM
I'm not sure of the rules re repeat  fixtures in the round 3 draw, but with expected rusults next week there is some probably  of a Mayo v Monaghan or Tyrone, so removed a big gun. Someone middling might  draw the winners of Louth v Leitrim and likely beat them, but this would provide an opportunity for the provincial losers to beat this team and reach the super 8, so it is very much dependent on the draw.

r3 and r4 don't allow repeats so tyrone can't get monaghan in r3 and Fermanagh can't get monaghan in r4 (if they are all in these draws)

Which increases the chances of Tyrone, Monaghan and Fermanagh reaching the Super 8. Mind you Fermanagh can't get Armagh either, which might push them on to Mayo if both Armagh and Monaghan were still in the R4 draw.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on June 18, 2018, 10:09:19 AM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 18, 2018, 09:47:38 AM
Quote from: straightred on June 18, 2018, 09:37:57 AM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 17, 2018, 10:38:28 PM
I'm not sure of the rules re repeat  fixtures in the round 3 draw, but with expected rusults next week there is some probably  of a Mayo v Monaghan or Tyrone, so removed a big gun. Someone middling might  draw the winners of Louth v Leitrim and likely beat them, but this would provide an opportunity for the provincial losers to beat this team and reach the super 8, so it is very much dependent on the draw.

r3 and r4 don't allow repeats so tyrone can't get monaghan in r3 and Fermanagh can't get monaghan in r4 (if they are all in these draws)

Which increases the chances of Tyrone, Monaghan and Fermanagh reaching the Super 8. Mind you Fermanagh can't get Armagh either, which might push them on to Mayo if both Armagh and Monaghan were still in the R4 draw.
If you assume that each province has 2 slots in the Super 8 and that the Dubs, Kerry, Cork, Galway, Donegal  and Mayo will make it there is one free Ulster slot and a free Leinster slot and Tyrone, Monaghan, Ros and Fermanagh plus others probably in competition for those spots. 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on June 18, 2018, 10:27:03 AM
Quote from: straightred on June 18, 2018, 09:37:57 AM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 17, 2018, 10:38:28 PM
I'm not sure of the rules re repeat  fixtures in the round 3 draw, but with expected rusults next week there is some probably  of a Mayo v Monaghan or Tyrone, so removed a big gun. Someone middling might  draw the winners of Louth v Leitrim and likely beat them, but this would provide an opportunity for the provincial losers to beat this team and reach the super 8, so it is very much dependent on the draw.

r3 and r4 don't allow repeats so tyrone can't get monaghan in r3 and Fermanagh can't get monaghan in r4 (if they are all in these draws)

Are you 100% regarding r3? Can't understand why repeat fixtures allowed r1 and r2 but not r3? I understand why repeat not allowed in r4 as a reward/incentive to those teams that reached their provincial final as it would be a real kick in the teeth to be put out by a team that you've already beat.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: straightred on June 18, 2018, 10:36:13 AM
Quote from: omagh_gael on June 18, 2018, 10:27:03 AM
Quote from: straightred on June 18, 2018, 09:37:57 AM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 17, 2018, 10:38:28 PM
I'm not sure of the rules re repeat  fixtures in the round 3 draw, but with expected rusults next week there is some probably  of a Mayo v Monaghan or Tyrone, so removed a big gun. Someone middling might  draw the winners of Louth v Leitrim and likely beat them, but this would provide an opportunity for the provincial losers to beat this team and reach the super 8, so it is very much dependent on the draw.

r3 and r4 don't allow repeats so tyrone can't get monaghan in r3 and Fermanagh can't get monaghan in r4 (if they are all in these draws)

Are you 100% regarding r3? Can't understand why repeat fixtures allowed r1 and r2 but not r3? I understand why repeat not allowed in r4 as a reward/incentive to those teams that reached their provincial final as it would be a real kick in the teeth to be put out by a team that you've already beat.

I took it from this

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_All-Ireland_Senior_Football_Championship
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on June 18, 2018, 10:36:50 AM
Quote from: seafoid on June 18, 2018, 10:09:19 AM
If you assume that each province has 2 slots in the Super 8 and that the Dubs, Kerry, Cork, Galway, Donegal  and Mayo will make it there is one free Ulster slot and a free Leinster slot and Tyrone, Monaghan, Ros and Fermanagh plus others probably in competition for those spots.

Mayo are likely to progress, but they would have a chance of meeting either Tyrone/Monaghan and then Cork in the following round and these might well be close games, especially with Cork you never know. If Mayo drew Cork and Fermanagh could not draw Monaghan/Tyrone, then they would get a lesser team and might make the Super 8s, while Mayo might not. The draw next week will tell all.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: joemamas on June 18, 2018, 01:58:17 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 18, 2018, 10:36:50 AM
Quote from: seafoid on June 18, 2018, 10:09:19 AM
If you assume that each province has 2 slots in the Super 8 and that the Dubs, Kerry, Cork, Galway, Donegal  and Mayo will make it there is one free Ulster slot and a free Leinster slot and Tyrone, Monaghan, Ros and Fermanagh plus others probably in competition for those spots.

Mayo are likely to progress, but they would have a chance of meeting either Tyrone/Monaghan and then Cork in the following round and these might well be close games, especially with Cork you never know. If Mayo drew Cork and Fermanagh could not draw Monaghan/Tyrone, then they would get a lesser team and might make the Super 8s, while Mayo might not. The draw next week will tell all.

Agree, this time next week we will have a clearer idea.
Hope Mayo win next week and avoid Monaghan and Tyrone, which may be difficult, especially if they cannot play each other in R3.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: An Fhairche Abu on June 18, 2018, 02:24:58 PM
Going to be an exciting Round 4 draw for everyone in a few weeks, all the permutations for the remainder of the summer will be known at that point, looking forward to seeing who comes through the qualifiers although Galway could end up in a group of death by the same token.

Galway's home fixture is due to be on played on either the Saturday or Sunday of race week, which is also the August Bank Holiday weekend. Galway city will be absolute carnage (in many different respects) whichever day it is on!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: J70 on June 18, 2018, 02:31:32 PM
Some serious dismissal of Fermanagh here (or maybe premature assessment of Donegal?). Ulster final is still to be played.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on June 18, 2018, 02:35:56 PM
Kiss of Death from Arlene.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rosnarun on June 18, 2018, 02:40:41 PM
Quote from: seafoid on June 18, 2018, 09:38:44 AM
Quote from: The Boy Wonder on June 17, 2018, 11:26:07 AM
If you want the highest ranking teams AND equal provincial representation the best outcome would be :

Group 1
Connacht Champions    Galway (D1)
Munster Champions    Kerry (D1)
Ulster Runner-up      Fermanagh (D3)     Tyrone
Leinster Runner-up      Laois (D4)     Kildare

Group 2
Leinster Champions    Dublin (D1)
Ulster Champions    Donegal (D1)
Connacht Runner-up   Roscommon (D2)     Mayo
Munster Runner-up     Cork (D2)

But in all probability you won't get groups as balanced as above and one group will appear stronger that the other on paper.
That is just D1 minus Monaghan
Winter/spring

For harder ground you have some different counties

those groups would really wet the appetite
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on June 18, 2018, 03:16:36 PM
As Fermanagh could not play Monaghan or Tyrone, if they are still there, then that increases the chance of Cork drawing one of these, which reduces Cork's prospects.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: haranguerer on June 18, 2018, 03:36:43 PM
Why couldn't Fermanagh meet Tyrone?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: joemamas on June 18, 2018, 03:36:56 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 18, 2018, 03:16:36 PM
As Fermanagh could not play Monaghan or Tyrone, if they are still there, then that increases the chance of Cork drawing one of these, which reduces Cork's prospects.

Why could Fermanagh not play Tyrone?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on June 18, 2018, 03:39:16 PM
Quote from: joemamas on June 18, 2018, 03:36:56 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 18, 2018, 03:16:36 PM
As Fermanagh could not play Monaghan or Tyrone, if they are still there, then that increases the chance of Cork drawing one of these, which reduces Cork's prospects.

Why could Fermanagh not play Tyrone?
Health and Safety or else because they have already played Monaghan and they beat Tyrone?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on June 18, 2018, 04:22:05 PM
Round 2
Tipperary v Mayo
Waterford v Monaghan
Cavan v Down
Carlow v Tyrone
Offaly v Clare
Longford v Kildare
Sligo v Armagh
Leitrim v Louth

I'm picking the teams bolded above as the winners. Mayo, Monaghan, Cavan, Tyrone, Clare, Sligo & Louth.
Tyrone can't play Monaghan and that's the only game that would be restricted.

Monaghan should they get to round 4 can't play Fermanagh (providing they lose).

I think if Tyrone can avoid Mayo in round 3 we'll be able to make the super8 as I don't think there's much else to worry about in the qualifiers at the moment and the likely 4 provincial losers wouldn't worry you too much either.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dire Ear on June 18, 2018, 04:52:48 PM
Think he meant to say Monaghan can't play Ferm or Tyr ?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on June 18, 2018, 04:57:36 PM
Quote from: Dire Ear on June 18, 2018, 04:52:48 PM
Think he meant to say Monaghan can't play Ferm or Tyr ?

Is there actually any barred matchups in R4? It seems to change each year so I wouldn't want to be assuming either way.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on June 18, 2018, 05:01:37 PM
Yeah you can't play a team you've played before in R3 & R4. Assuming Dublin, Donegal and Kerry win...

Ross can't play Leitrim
Fermanagh can't play Monaghan or Armagh
Laois can't play Carlow
Cork can''t play Tipp
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on June 18, 2018, 05:56:35 PM
Quote from: Jayop on June 18, 2018, 05:01:37 PM
Yeah you can't play a team you've played before in R3 & R4. Assuming Dublin, Donegal and Kerry win...

Ross can't play Leitrim
Fermanagh can't play Monaghan or Armagh
Laois can't play Carlow
Cork can''t play Tipp

Tipp ,lol.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: tippabu on June 18, 2018, 06:01:32 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on June 18, 2018, 05:56:35 PM
Quote from: Jayop on June 18, 2018, 05:01:37 PM
Yeah you can't play a team you've played before in R3 & R4. Assuming Dublin, Donegal and Kerry win...

Ross can't play Leitrim
Fermanagh can't play Monaghan or Armagh
Laois can't play Carlow
Cork can''t play Tipp

Tipp ,lol.

No need to rub it in :'(
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: LooseCannon on June 18, 2018, 06:47:10 PM
Tipperary v Mayo
Waterford v Monaghan
Cavan v Down
Carlow v Tyrone
Offaly v Clare
Longford v Kildare
Sligo v Armagh
Leitrim v Louth
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on June 18, 2018, 06:48:49 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on June 18, 2018, 05:56:35 PM
Quote from: Jayop on June 18, 2018, 05:01:37 PM
Yeah you can't play a team you've played before in R3 & R4. Assuming Dublin, Donegal and Kerry win...

Ross can't play Leitrim
Fermanagh can't play Monaghan or Armagh
Laois can't play Carlow
Cork can''t play Tipp

Tipp ,lol.

Well I don't expect Leitrim, Armagh or Carlow to get to round 4 either but had to include all possibilities.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on June 18, 2018, 06:56:09 PM
I suppose we nearly all expect Dublin, Donegal and Kerry to win the other 3 Provincials?
We're groping in the dark until the 3rd Round draw next Monday.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on June 18, 2018, 10:00:37 PM
Yep, the third round draw will give us a real indication of who to expect to be in the super8.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: An Fhairche Abu on June 23, 2018, 10:00:28 PM
Ciaran Duggan apparently sustained a broken wrist in club action for Annaghdown this evening, won't be seen again for the rest of the summer if those initial reports are correct.
He's been good this year so it's a fair hit to Galway's squad depth ahead of the Super 8 matches but it might give the likes of Michael Daly a way back in now.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on June 24, 2018, 07:21:38 PM
So the groups are
Kerry, Galway,  Laois/Qualifier, Fermanagh/Qualifier.

Donegal, Dublin, Cork/Qualifier, Ros/Qualifier.
Ros/Q homega to Donegal in game 2 and away to Dublin game 3.
How many does Parnell Park hold?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Owen Brannigan on June 24, 2018, 09:11:48 PM
Saturday, July 14/Sunday July 15:

Croke Park

Kerry v Galway

Fermanagh/R4 winner v Laois /R4 winer

Dublin v Donegal

Cork /R4 winner v Roscommon/R 4 winner.


Saturday July 21/Sunday July 22

Beaten Provincial finalists or team that beats them in Round 4 are at home

Fermanagh/R4 winner v Galway

Laois/R4 winner v Kerry

Cork/R4 winner v Donegal

Roscommon/R4 winner v Dublin

Saturday August 4, Sunday August 5, Monday August 6

Provincial Champions have home advantage

Kerry v Fermanagh/R4 winner

Galway v Laois/R4 winner

Dublin v Cork/R4 winner

Donegal v Roscommon/R4 winner
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Aaron Boone on June 24, 2018, 09:26:34 PM
Interesting, despite the permutations to come, the provincial winners know their next opponents.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on June 24, 2018, 09:32:43 PM
Check the GAA website  Owen.
As I said above Ros/Rd4 winner away to Dublin in Round 3.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on June 24, 2018, 11:18:34 PM
Quote from: Owen Brannigan on June 24, 2018, 09:11:48 PM
Saturday, July 14/Sunday July 15:

Croke Park

Kerry v Galway

Fermanagh/R4 winner v Laois /R4 winer

Dublin v Donegal

Cork /R4 winner v Roscommon/R 4 winner.


Saturday July 21/Sunday July 22

Beaten Provincial finalists or team that beats them in Round 4 are at home

Fermanagh/R4 winner v Galway

Laois/R4 winner v Kerry

Cork/R4 winner v Donegal DUBLIN

Roscommon/R4 winner v Dublin DONEGAL

Saturday August 4, Sunday August 5, Monday August 6

Provincial Champions have home advantage

Kerry v Fermanagh/R4 winner

Galway v Laois/R4 winner

Dublin DONEGAL v Cork/R4 winner

Donegal DUBLIN v Roscommon/R4 winner

FIXED.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: giveballaghback on June 24, 2018, 11:45:53 PM
have Donegal not got the option to take Dublin to a neutral venue for the first match.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on June 24, 2018, 11:58:13 PM
Quote from: giveballaghback on June 24, 2018, 11:45:53 PM
have Donegal not got the option to take Dublin to a neutral venue for the first match.

Croke Park is the Neutral venue. ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: giveballaghback on June 25, 2018, 12:11:58 AM
Thanks bunker, and still they gazed and still their wonder grew.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on June 25, 2018, 12:20:57 AM
Dublin and Donegal could be played in Clones or Breffni as a neutral venue.
Kerry/Galway or Cork/Rosc in Limerick.
who knows what combination will be in the other game.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on June 25, 2018, 07:10:50 AM
Quote from: giveballaghback on June 24, 2018, 11:45:53 PM
have Donegal not got the option to take Dublin to a neutral venue for the first match.
There is no mention of "neutral venue" in any of the Super 8 rules and regulations.

Provincial champions play each other in Croke Park. Qualifiers play each other in Croke Park. This means that every team is guaranteed one game in Croke Park, with the corollory that as Dublin has nominated Croke Park as their home venue, we are guaranteed two.

Maybe the rules need to be changed.

Hasn't been a great year for "home advantage" in the qualifiers. 15 games (1 was neutral) 2 home wins,  13 away wins. Plus Connacht and Munster finals, home teams lost. If it had been the opposite I can imagine the articles on it.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on June 25, 2018, 08:48:17 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 24, 2018, 09:32:43 PM
Check the GAA website  Owen.
As I said above Ros/Rd4 winner away to Dublin in Round 3.
The Indo has it the way Owen had it. Presume the GAA website is the right version. Although not sure we can 100% count on that.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: blewuporstuffed on June 25, 2018, 09:10:00 AM
Quote from: Hound on June 25, 2018, 07:10:50 AM
Quote from: giveballaghback on June 24, 2018, 11:45:53 PM
have Donegal not got the option to take Dublin to a neutral venue for the first match.
There is no mention of "neutral venue" in any of the Super 8 rules and regulations.

Provincial champions play each other in Croke Park. Qualifiers play each other in Croke Park. This means that every team is guaranteed one game in Croke Park, with the corollory that as Dublin has nominated Croke Park as their home venue, we are guaranteed two.

Maybe the rules need to be changed.

Hasn't been a great year for "home advantage" in the qualifiers. 15 games (1 was neutral) 2 home wins,  13 away wins. Plus Connacht and Munster finals, home teams lost. If it had been the opposite I can imagine the articles on it.

We haven't even played this yet, and already we need a rule change. They knew this was going to happen so there will be no appetite to change it. Its a ridiculous situation.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: galwayman on June 25, 2018, 09:14:09 AM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 25, 2018, 12:20:57 AM
Dublin and Donegal could be played in Clones or Breffni as a neutral venue.
Kerry/Galway or Cork/Rosc in Limerick.
who knows what combination will be in the other game.
The provincial winners play each other first up in Croker on the weekend of 14/15 July that's already decided.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on June 25, 2018, 09:55:03 AM
Have there been any changes to the season ticket structure with the Super 8s coming in this year, or do the same rules apply as in previous years?
Was just thinking of the likelihood that the Kildare/Mayo qualifier game will be switched from Newbridge as the capacity is restricted and season ticket holders from Mayo have to be accommodated.
Probably won't be an issue in the Super 8s as the teams likely to be involved have adequate county grounds, capacity-wise.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on June 25, 2018, 10:52:17 AM
I presume you'll get €5 reduction per game if you're team is involved?
I see they have cut price package tickets on sale for the 2 sets of super 8 games in Croker and the 2 AI Semis.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GetOverTheBar on June 26, 2018, 12:09:19 PM
Devastating news for Paddy McBrearty, Donegal and indeed the rest of Ireland if Thomas Niblock's latest tweet true - saying he's done the cruciate.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Unlaoised on June 26, 2018, 12:32:37 PM
In the draw next monday say you have

cork
Rossies
Fermanagh
Laois

in the other bowl Say

Monaghan
Mayo
Clare
Tyrone


Do the Division 3/4 teams get home advantage????????
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on June 26, 2018, 12:51:58 PM
Quote from: Unlaoised on June 26, 2018, 12:32:37 PM
In the draw next monday say you have

cork
Rossies
Fermanagh
Laois

in the other bowl Say

Monaghan
Mayo
Clare
Tyrone


Do the Division 3/4 teams get home advantage????????

No, in round four the CCCC have control of fixture setting. I'd say you'll get two out of the four in neutral venues and the two fixtures with the biggest following in a Croker double. Especially after this weeks fiasco.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on June 26, 2018, 12:55:25 PM
Michael Buble in Croke Park on SAT 7th so does that rule that out?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Solo_run on June 26, 2018, 12:58:57 PM
Quote from: The Trap on June 26, 2018, 12:55:25 PM
Michael Buble in Croke Park on SAT 7th so does that rule that out?

F*ck sake - I am over for a night out
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on June 26, 2018, 01:15:52 PM
Quote from: The Trap on June 26, 2018, 12:55:25 PM
Michael Buble in Croke Park on SAT 7th so does that rule that out?

There you are, four neutral venues the likely option.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: galwayman on June 26, 2018, 01:21:53 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on June 26, 2018, 12:58:57 PM
Quote from: The Trap on June 26, 2018, 12:55:25 PM
Michael Buble in Croke Park on SAT 7th so does that rule that out?

F*ck sake - I am over for a night out
A concert the week before the start of the super 8. How has Croker stood up to games in the week following a concert previously?
I'm struggling to remember.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Maroon Manc on June 26, 2018, 01:24:43 PM
Quote from: galwayman on June 26, 2018, 01:21:53 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on June 26, 2018, 12:58:57 PM
Quote from: The Trap on June 26, 2018, 12:55:25 PM
Michael Buble in Croke Park on SAT 7th so does that rule that out?

F*ck sake - I am over for a night out
A concert the week before the start of the super 8. How has Croker stood up to games in the week following a concert previously?
I'm struggling to remember.

Another reason why HQ are so desperate for this weekends double bill to take place given they'll miss out in R4.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on June 26, 2018, 04:15:07 PM
Quote from: GetOverTheBar on June 26, 2018, 12:09:19 PM
Devastating news for Paddy McBrearty, Donegal and indeed the rest of Ireland if Thomas Niblock's latest tweet true - saying he's done the cruciate.

I thought he hurt the ankle?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on June 26, 2018, 05:52:22 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on June 26, 2018, 04:15:07 PM
Quote from: GetOverTheBar on June 26, 2018, 12:09:19 PM
Devastating news for Paddy McBrearty, Donegal and indeed the rest of Ireland if Thomas Niblock's latest tweet true - saying he's done the cruciate.

I thought he hurt the ankle?
Donegal twitter confirmed it was the ACL he tore and is out for the season. Awful news for a lad that was showing his best form for the first time ever really. Probably the player of the year so far.

https://twitter.com/officialdonegal/status/1011570993008168960
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on June 26, 2018, 05:57:56 PM
Quote from: Maroon Manc on June 26, 2018, 01:24:43 PM
Quote from: galwayman on June 26, 2018, 01:21:53 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on June 26, 2018, 12:58:57 PM
Quote from: The Trap on June 26, 2018, 12:55:25 PM
Michael Buble in Croke Park on SAT 7th so does that rule that out?

F*ck sake - I am over for a night out
A concert the week before the start of the super 8. How has Croker stood up to games in the week following a concert previously?
I'm struggling to remember.

Another reason why HQ are so desperate for this weekends double bill to take place given they'll miss out in R4.

They wouldn't have scheduled the concert that weekend if they were all that worried about R4. They make an absolute mint off those concerts, probably far more than what 25k in Croker for two R4 matches would net.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on June 26, 2018, 06:01:03 PM
Quote from: Jayop on June 26, 2018, 05:52:22 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on June 26, 2018, 04:15:07 PM
Quote from: GetOverTheBar on June 26, 2018, 12:09:19 PM
Devastating news for Paddy McBrearty, Donegal and indeed the rest of Ireland if Thomas Niblock's latest tweet true - saying he's done the cruciate.

I thought he hurt the ankle?
Donegal twitter confirmed it was the ACL he tore and is out for the season. Awful news for a lad that was showing his best form for the first time ever really. Probably the player of the year so far.

https://twitter.com/officialdonegal/status/1011570993008168960
Sad news. Great player
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on June 26, 2018, 06:03:56 PM
Super 8*
* Super 8 may not be available as planned due to poor crisis management.  The GAA reserves the right to replace the product with a Junior C intercounty competition. Your statutory rights are not affected.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on June 27, 2018, 01:44:01 PM
Now that the 4Cs have egg on their faces they will probably be reticent about pulling home venues from anyone in the Super 8s.
Galway and Kerry will be ok with their capacities while Dublin no doubt can use Croke Park  ::).
Ballybofey might be deemed a problem if Donegal's home game turns out to be Mayo or Tyrone.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on June 27, 2018, 02:55:07 PM
Scenario:  Kildare beat Mayo, then beat Cork.  That gives Kildare a home game v Dublin on 21/22 July.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on June 27, 2018, 09:28:24 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on June 27, 2018, 02:55:07 PM
Scenario:  Kildare beat Mayo, then beat Cork.  That gives Kildare a home game v Dublin on 21/22 July.

And that was why the GAA were hoping to put this precedence in place now so they can strip this away.

In all likelyhood that would have given either Mayo 2 games at home and a Croker game every year and Dublin 3 home games most years. Joke shop stuff.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on June 29, 2018, 12:56:37 AM
http://imgur.com/hqjE1kF
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: armaghniac on June 30, 2018, 08:55:05 PM
Monaghan and Tyrone with a good chance of beating the provincial losers. Kildare too if they can raise themselves two weeks in a row. Armagh can't get Fermanagh and would probably be happiest with Laois.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:01:14 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 30, 2018, 08:55:05 PM
Monaghan and Tyrone with a good chance of beating the provincial losers. Kildare too if they can raise themselves two weeks in a row. Armagh can't get Fermanagh and would probably be happiest with Laois.

Will they f**k raise their game, that's two cup finals won in a week for them so they'll go back to the usual cowardly performances
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: illdecide on June 30, 2018, 09:11:49 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:01:14 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 30, 2018, 08:55:05 PM
Monaghan and Tyrone with a good chance of beating the provincial losers. Kildare too if they can raise themselves two weeks in a row. Armagh can't get Fermanagh and would probably be happiest with Laois.

Will they f**k raise their game, that's two cup finals won in a week for them so they'll go back to the usual cowardly performances

Ohh someone is a sore loser ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:14:11 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 30, 2018, 09:11:49 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:01:14 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 30, 2018, 08:55:05 PM
Monaghan and Tyrone with a good chance of beating the provincial losers. Kildare too if they can raise themselves two weeks in a row. Armagh can't get Fermanagh and would probably be happiest with Laois.

Will they f**k raise their game, that's two cup finals won in a week for them so they'll go back to the usual cowardly performances

Ohh someone is a sore loser ;)

Are you saying they will?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: greatpoint on June 30, 2018, 09:17:50 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:14:11 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 30, 2018, 09:11:49 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:01:14 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 30, 2018, 08:55:05 PM
Monaghan and Tyrone with a good chance of beating the provincial losers. Kildare too if they can raise themselves two weeks in a row. Armagh can't get Fermanagh and would probably be happiest with Laois.

Will they f**k raise their game, that’s two cup finals won in a week for them so they’ll go back to the usual cowardly performances



Ohh someone is a sore loser ;)

Are you saying they will?

Is this a parody account?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: illdecide on June 30, 2018, 09:39:17 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:14:11 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 30, 2018, 09:11:49 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:01:14 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 30, 2018, 08:55:05 PM
Monaghan and Tyrone with a good chance of beating the provincial losers. Kildare too if they can raise themselves two weeks in a row. Armagh can't get Fermanagh and would probably be happiest with Laois.

Will they f**k raise their game, that's two cup finals won in a week for them so they'll go back to the usual cowardly performances

Ohh someone is a sore loser ;)

Are you saying they will?

Dunno, but it sounds like sour grapes to me. They've certainly a chance whereas Mayo have none, time will tell.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:59:21 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 30, 2018, 09:39:17 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:14:11 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 30, 2018, 09:11:49 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:01:14 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 30, 2018, 08:55:05 PM
Monaghan and Tyrone with a good chance of beating the provincial losers. Kildare too if they can raise themselves two weeks in a row. Armagh can't get Fermanagh and would probably be happiest with Laois.

Will they f**k raise their game, that's two cup finals won in a week for them so they'll go back to the usual cowardly performances

Ohh someone is a sore loser ;)

Are you saying they will?

Dunno, but it sounds like sour grapes to me. They've certainly a chance whereas Mayo have none, time will tell.

No chance, they'll roll over when they meet a solid team... again
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: twohands!!! on June 30, 2018, 10:50:04 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:59:21 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 30, 2018, 09:39:17 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:14:11 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 30, 2018, 09:11:49 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:01:14 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 30, 2018, 08:55:05 PM
Monaghan and Tyrone with a good chance of beating the provincial losers. Kildare too if they can raise themselves two weeks in a row. Armagh can't get Fermanagh and would probably be happiest with Laois.

Will they f**k raise their game, that's two cup finals won in a week for them so they'll go back to the usual cowardly performances

Ohh someone is a sore loser ;)

Are you saying they will?

Dunno, but it sounds like sour grapes to me. They've certainly a chance whereas Mayo have none, time will tell.

No chance, they'll roll over when they meet a solid team... again

The good news for Kildare is that Carlow are already out so they can't meet them again :P
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on June 30, 2018, 10:51:55 PM
So the big 3 are now Dublin, Kerry and Galway.
Maybe we should just let them play a Super 3!.
It would avoid some awful takings which we'll get with 8.
Armagh, Fermanagh, Laois are awful.
Cork not much better
Ros, Monaghan, Kildare middlin.
Donegal and Tyrone -remains to be seen.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: inthrough on July 01, 2018, 12:30:07 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 27, 2018, 01:44:01 PM
Now that the 4Cs have egg on their faces they will probably be reticent about pulling home venues from anyone in the Super 8s.
Galway and Kerry will be ok with their capacities while Dublin no doubt can use Croke Park  ::).
Ballybofey might be deemed a problem if Donegal's home game turns out to be Mayo or Tyrone.
There is no bloody way Donegal are giving Ballybofey up when they will already have played two away games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 01, 2018, 12:41:43 AM
What's the licensed capacity of Ballybofey?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: inthrough on July 01, 2018, 12:47:17 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 01, 2018, 12:41:43 AM
What's the licensed capacity of Ballybofey?
Around 18,000
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 01, 2018, 12:50:24 AM
Should be alright so.
Thing about the so called Super 8s is with a 3 games series you'll have fewer "away" supporters than with once off knock out games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Solo_run on July 01, 2018, 01:17:38 AM
Group 1
Dublin
Donegal

Group 2
Kerry
Galway

Kildare/Tyrone can get Laois, Cork, Roscommon or Fermanagh.
Armagh/Monaghan can get Laois, Cork or Roscommon

Draw Laois/Fermanagh winner goes into Group 2
Draw Roscommon/Cork winner goes into Group 1
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 01, 2018, 09:43:26 AM
All down to the draw now with Laois and Fermanagh the 2 unexpected members of the last 12. Armagh were there last year.
Rhubarbs and possibly Tipp the unexpected casualties.
I expect the 4 Qualifiers all feel they can beat the 4 Provincial finalists with their momentum and confidence gained from successive victories.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Owen Brannigan on July 01, 2018, 11:41:30 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 30, 2018, 10:51:55 PM
So the big 3 are now Dublin, Kerry and Galway.
Maybe we should just let them play a Super 3!.
It would avoid some awful takings which we'll get with 8.
Armagh, Fermanagh, Laois are awful.
Cork not much better
Ros, Monaghan, Kildare middlin.
Donegal and Tyrone -remains to be seen.

Why are you so concerned about the financial aspects of this series?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 01, 2018, 12:04:41 PM
Quote from: galwayman on June 26, 2018, 01:21:53 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on June 26, 2018, 12:58:57 PM
Quote from: The Trap on June 26, 2018, 12:55:25 PM
Michael Buble in Croke Park on SAT 7th so does that rule that out?

F*ck sake - I am over for a night out
A concert the week before the start of the super 8. How has Croker stood up to games in the week following a concert previously?
I'm struggling to remember.

I remember the hill 1/3 of the pitch being slippy a few years ago after sheeran had a stage on it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 01, 2018, 12:06:39 PM
Quote from: Owen Brannigan on July 01, 2018, 11:41:30 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 30, 2018, 10:51:55 PM
So the big 3 are now Dublin, Kerry and Galway.
Maybe we should just let them play a Super 3!.
It would avoid some awful takings which we'll get with 8.
Armagh, Fermanagh, Laois are awful.
Cork not much better
Ros, Monaghan, Kildare middlin.
Donegal and Tyrone -remains to be seen.

Why are you so concerned about the financial aspects of this series?
You do realise that's a typo?
Tankings.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 01, 2018, 12:09:30 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 01, 2018, 12:06:39 PM
Quote from: Owen Brannigan on July 01, 2018, 11:41:30 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 30, 2018, 10:51:55 PM
So the big 3 are now Dublin, Kerry and Galway.
Maybe we should just let them play a Super 3!.
It would avoid some awful takings which we'll get with 8.
Armagh, Fermanagh, Laois are awful.
Cork not much better
Ros, Monaghan, Kildare middlin.
Donegal and Tyrone -remains to be seen.

Why are you so concerned about the financial aspects of this series?
You do realise that's a typo?
Tankings.

That's a very unfortunate typo in fairness  ;D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: illdecide on July 01, 2018, 02:28:37 PM
😂
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on July 01, 2018, 03:55:19 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 30, 2018, 09:11:49 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:01:14 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 30, 2018, 08:55:05 PM
Monaghan and Tyrone with a good chance of beating the provincial losers. Kildare too if they can raise themselves two weeks in a row. Armagh can't get Fermanagh and would probably be happiest with Laois.

Will they f**k raise their game, that's two cup finals won in a week for them so they'll go back to the usual cowardly performances

Ohh someone is a sore loser ;)

You're not replying to a mayo supporter there
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 01, 2018, 04:04:08 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 01, 2018, 03:55:19 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 30, 2018, 09:11:49 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:01:14 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 30, 2018, 08:55:05 PM
Monaghan and Tyrone with a good chance of beating the provincial losers. Kildare too if they can raise themselves two weeks in a row. Armagh can't get Fermanagh and would probably be happiest with Laois.

Will they f**k raise their game, that's two cup finals won in a week for them so they'll go back to the usual cowardly performances

Ohh someone is a sore loser ;)

You're not replying to a mayo supporter there

MAYO4SAM14 is not a Mayo supporter! No Mayo supporter would make such comments after being defeated by a County who has gotten a hard time from the GAA Fraternity because we know all about getting a hard time from the GAA Fraternity. His profile is a contradiction under County he has Mayo/Galway!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: tonto1888 on July 01, 2018, 04:54:20 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 30, 2018, 10:51:55 PM
So the big 3 are now Dublin, Kerry and Galway.
Maybe we should just let them play a Super 3!.
It would avoid some awful takings which we'll get with 8.
Armagh, Fermanagh, Laois are awful.
Cork not much better
Ros, Monaghan, Kildare middlin.
Donegal and Tyrone -remains to be seen.
How much of Armagh have you actually seen this year?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 01, 2018, 05:37:53 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on July 01, 2018, 04:54:20 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 30, 2018, 10:51:55 PM
So the big 3 are now Dublin, Kerry and Galway.
Maybe we should just let them play a Super 3!.
It would avoid some awful takings which we'll get with 8.
Armagh, Fermanagh, Laois are awful.
Cork not much better
Ros, Monaghan, Kildare middlin.
Donegal and Tyrone -remains to be seen.
How much of Armagh have you actually seen this year?

Just to let Rosfan know Armagh,Fermanagh are as good as any team in Division two this year so if Armagh,Fermanagh are awful then so to was all of the Division two teams this year.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 01, 2018, 06:17:12 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 01, 2018, 05:37:53 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on July 01, 2018, 04:54:20 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 30, 2018, 10:51:55 PM
So the big 3 are now Dublin, Kerry and Galway.
Maybe we should just let them play a Super 3!.
It would avoid some awful takings which we'll get with 8.
Armagh, Fermanagh, Laois are awful.
Cork not much better
Ros, Monaghan, Kildare middlin.
Donegal and Tyrone -remains to be seen.
How much of Armagh have you actually seen this year?

Just to let Rosfan know Armagh,Fermanagh are as good as any team in Division two this year so if Armagh,Fermanagh are awful then so to was all of the Division two teams this year.

Ehh.. we'll see if this is true.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 01, 2018, 06:23:07 PM
The 6 Cos humour by passes very evident today Syfīn 😀
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on July 01, 2018, 06:42:34 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 01, 2018, 04:04:08 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 01, 2018, 03:55:19 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 30, 2018, 09:11:49 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on June 30, 2018, 09:01:14 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on June 30, 2018, 08:55:05 PM
Monaghan and Tyrone with a good chance of beating the provincial losers. Kildare too if they can raise themselves two weeks in a row. Armagh can't get Fermanagh and would probably be happiest with Laois.

Will they f**k raise their game, that's two cup finals won in a week for them so they'll go back to the usual cowardly performances

Ohh someone is a sore loser ;)

You're not replying to a mayo supporter there

MAYO4SAM14 is not a Mayo supporter! No Mayo supporter would make such comments after being defeated by a County who has gotten a hard time from the GAA Fraternity because we know all about getting a hard time from the GAA Fraternity. His profile is a contradiction under County he has Mayo/Galway!

Do you need a picture of my season ticket? I live in Galway like a lot of Mayo people do
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 01, 2018, 07:14:59 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 01, 2018, 06:17:12 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 01, 2018, 05:37:53 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on July 01, 2018, 04:54:20 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 30, 2018, 10:51:55 PM
So the big 3 are now Dublin, Kerry and Galway.
Maybe we should just let them play a Super 3!.
It would avoid some awful takings which we'll get with 8.
Armagh, Fermanagh, Laois are awful.
Cork not much better
Ros, Monaghan, Kildare middlin.
Donegal and Tyrone -remains to be seen.
How much of Armagh have you actually seen this year?

Just to let Rosfan know Armagh,Fermanagh are as good as any team in Division two this year so if Armagh,Fermanagh are awful then so to was all of the Division two teams this year.

Ehh.. we'll see if this is true.

You have already seen Armagh beat Clare who finished 3rd in Division two. Fermanagh beat Monaghan Division one and we'll see if Roscommon can beat Monaghan if drawn against them.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 01, 2018, 07:40:16 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 01, 2018, 07:14:59 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 01, 2018, 06:17:12 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 01, 2018, 05:37:53 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on July 01, 2018, 04:54:20 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 30, 2018, 10:51:55 PM
So the big 3 are now Dublin, Kerry and Galway.
Maybe we should just let them play a Super 3!.
It would avoid some awful takings which we'll get with 8.
Armagh, Fermanagh, Laois are awful.
Cork not much better
Ros, Monaghan, Kildare middlin.
Donegal and Tyrone -remains to be seen.
How much of Armagh have you actually seen this year?

Just to let Rosfan know Armagh,Fermanagh are as good as any team in Division two this year so if Armagh,Fermanagh are awful then so to was all of the Division two teams this year.

Ehh.. we'll see if this is true.

You have already seen Armagh beat Clare who finished 3rd in Division two. Fermanagh beat Monaghan Division one and we'll see if Roscommon can beat Monaghan if drawn against them.

Sport isn't a straight line.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: giveballaghback on July 01, 2018, 07:45:25 PM
And we have seen Carlow who beat Kildare and Kildare who beat Mayo and Leitrim who ah jayus give it up lads 8)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 01, 2018, 08:05:09 PM
Looks like the AI Final will be Fermanagh v Armagh.
Better put one of these in  :D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 01, 2018, 08:07:53 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 01, 2018, 08:05:09 PM
Looks like the AI Final will be Fermanagh v Armagh.
Better put one of these in  :D

Or Roscommon.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 01, 2018, 08:44:42 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 01, 2018, 05:37:53 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on July 01, 2018, 04:54:20 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 30, 2018, 10:51:55 PM
So the big 3 are now Dublin, Kerry and Galway.
Maybe we should just let them play a Super 3!.
It would avoid some awful takings which we'll get with 8.
Armagh, Fermanagh, Laois are awful.
Cork not much better
Ros, Monaghan, Kildare middlin.
Donegal and Tyrone -remains to be seen.
How much of Armagh have you actually seen this year?

Just to let Rosfan know Armagh,Fermanagh are as good as any team in Division two this year so if Armagh,Fermanagh are awful then so to was all of the Division two teams this year.
On what basis are Armagh as good as any D2 team?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 01, 2018, 08:46:55 PM
It's too easy Seafóidín.  ;D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 01, 2018, 09:00:02 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 01, 2018, 08:44:42 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 01, 2018, 05:37:53 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on July 01, 2018, 04:54:20 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 30, 2018, 10:51:55 PM
So the big 3 are now Dublin, Kerry and Galway.
Maybe we should just let them play a Super 3!.
It would avoid some awful takings which we'll get with 8.
Armagh, Fermanagh, Laois are awful.
Cork not much better
Ros, Monaghan, Kildare middlin.
Donegal and Tyrone -remains to be seen.
How much of Armagh have you actually seen this year?

Just to let Rosfan know Armagh,Fermanagh are as good as any team in Division two this year so if Armagh,Fermanagh are awful then so to was all of the Division two teams this year.
On what basis are Armagh as good as any D2 team?

On the basis teams from Div 2 this year are very average.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Solo_run on July 01, 2018, 09:12:51 PM
The league isn't really an indicator. Roscommon peaked in the league and continued their form in the final of the provincials. I can't see them getting any better

Armagh didn't peak in the league and I don't think they have peaked still in which is the problem with this team for too long they blow hot and cold. They have given a glimpse of what they are capable of in the last 8 minutes in the game yesterday. Armagh are looking at a potential 2nd QF in two years and their third in 4 years with many of these coming off the back of third division.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 01, 2018, 09:15:25 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 01, 2018, 08:44:42 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 01, 2018, 05:37:53 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on July 01, 2018, 04:54:20 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on June 30, 2018, 10:51:55 PM
So the big 3 are now Dublin, Kerry and Galway.
Maybe we should just let them play a Super 3!.
It would avoid some awful takings which we'll get with 8.
Armagh, Fermanagh, Laois are awful.
Cork not much better
Ros, Monaghan, Kildare middlin.
Donegal and Tyrone -remains to be seen.
How much of Armagh have you actually seen this year?

Just to let Rosfan know Armagh,Fermanagh are as good as any team in Division two this year so if Armagh,Fermanagh are awful then so to was all of the Division two teams this year.
On what basis are Armagh as good as any D2 team?
Only two Div 2 teams left now. Few of those knocked out covered themselves in glory either. Louth hammered by Leitrim. Cavan left to wonder when their U21 success will be seen at senior championship level. Cork were hopeless in the Munster final, Tipp no fitness to last past 50 mins. Meath knocked out of Leinster championship by a Div 3 team at least they went down fighting on and off the field v Tyrone and Clare beaten by Armagh yesterday but shouldn't forget Armagh reached the last eight last year by beating Kildare something Mayo couldn't do yesterday.

Div 2 is really Roscommon the winners of that division who are left to fly the flag on their own as i don't trust Cork to beat any side in round 4. What level are they though? were competitive against one of the form teams in Div 1 in the provincial final and didn't lose it until injury time has the 4 week break been a help of hindrance and drawing Tyrone for example will be just as tough to beat as Galway was.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 01, 2018, 09:17:20 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 01, 2018, 09:12:51 PM
The league isn't really an indicator. Roscommon peaked in the league and continued their form in the final of the provincials. I can't see them getting any better

Armagh didn't peak in the league and I don't think they have peaked still in which is the problem with this team for too long they blow hot and cold. They have given a glimpse of what they are capable of in the last 8 minutes in the game yesterday. Armagh are looking at a potential 2nd QF in two years and their third in 4 years with many of these coming off the back of third division.

You watched a grand total of zero Roscommon league matches to even think about typing that.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 01, 2018, 09:21:02 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 01, 2018, 09:12:51 PM
The league isn’t really an indicator. Roscommon peaked in the league and continued their form in the final of the provincials. I can’t see them getting any better

Armagh didn’t peak in the league and I don’t think they have peaked still in which is the problem with this team for too long they blow hot and cold. They have given a glimpse of what they are capable of in the last 8 minutes in the game yesterday. Armagh are looking at a potential 2nd QF in two years and their third in 4 years with many of these coming off the back of third division.

I don't believe they did. Lost to Down,drew with Meath beat Tipp,Cavan,Cork with late rallys. They peaked in 2016 for the league when they beat Kerry and Donegal away and had nothing left after the two Connacht finals.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: giveballaghback on July 01, 2018, 09:21:20 PM
Clares fitness levels were just not good enough yesterday, if they were anyway near what would be acceptable from a team playing at this stage of the championship Armagh would be out.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 01, 2018, 09:59:22 PM
Quote from: giveballaghback on July 01, 2018, 09:21:20 PM
Clares fitness levels were just not good enough yesterday, if they were anyway near what would be acceptable from a team playing at this stage of the championship Armagh would be out.

Did you see the game?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: giveballaghback on July 01, 2018, 10:07:22 PM
quote directly from a member of one of the teams, exact words.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Throw ball on July 01, 2018, 10:10:34 PM
Quote from: giveballaghback on July 01, 2018, 09:21:20 PM
Clares fitness levels were just not good enough yesterday, if they were anyway near what would be acceptable from a team playing at this stage of the championship Armagh would be out.

Through all the bluster on this thread you do have a point here. To counter that though Armagh did shoot 18 wides. Some of these were frees they would normally put over with their eyes closed. Overall I thought they were 2 evenly matched teams. Neither would have enough to trouble a decent team.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 02, 2018, 12:34:27 AM
ZULU my super 8 advocate!

https://www.sportsjoe.ie/football/will-st-conleths-park-still-be-a-suitable-ground-if-kildare-advance-to-the-super-8s-166410 (https://www.sportsjoe.ie/football/will-st-conleths-park-still-be-a-suitable-ground-if-kildare-advance-to-the-super-8s-166410)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 02, 2018, 05:49:43 AM
The Super 8s won't have 8 super teams. Because there aren't that many. Maybe there will be a Super 4 lording it over a Sloppy 4.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/colm-orourke-this-is-the-end-of-mayo-as-we-have-known-them-37068850.html

Nobody will want to meet Tyrone but there should be a health warning with their matches.

The standard was not good but it looks as if Tyrone are bound for the Super 8. However, they were quite sloppy and are still a bit behind the top sides. They have not changed from last year when their style was picked apart by Dublin.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 02, 2018, 06:35:15 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 02, 2018, 05:49:43 AM
The Super 8s won't have 8 super teams. Because there aren't that many. Maybe there will be a Super 4 lording it over a Sloppy 4.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/colm-orourke-this-is-the-end-of-mayo-as-we-have-known-them-37068850.html

Nobody will want to meet Tyrone but there should be a health warning with their matches.

The standard was not good but it looks as if Tyrone are bound for the Super 8. However, they were quite sloppy and are still a bit behind the top sides. They have not changed from last year when their style was picked apart by Dublin.

Maybe there will be a Super 1 and a half!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: cornetto on July 02, 2018, 09:12:03 AM
Phase 1 July 14/15

Kerry vs Galway @ Croke Park

Fermanagh/Kildare vs Laois/Monaghan @ Croke Park

Phase 2 July 21/22

Fermanagh/Kildare vs Galway

Laois/Monaghan vs Kerry



Phase 3 August 4/5

Kerry vs Fermanagh/Kildare
Galway vs Laois/Monaghan

Super 8 Group Two

Teams: Donegal, Dublin, Cork or Tyrone, Roscommon or Armagh

Phase 1 July 14/15

Dublin vs Donegal @ Croke Park



Cork/Tyrone vs Roscommon/Armagh @ Croke Park

Phase 2 July 21/22

Cork/Tyrone vs Dublin
Roscommon/Armagh vs Donegal

Phase 3 August 4/5/6

Donegal vs Cork/Tyrone
Dublin vs Roscommon/Armagh

All-Ireland Football Championship semi-finals

August 11/12

Group One winner vs Group Two runner-up
Group Two winner vs Group One runner-up.


Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 02, 2018, 09:15:37 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 02, 2018, 06:35:15 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 02, 2018, 05:49:43 AM
The Super 8s won't have 8 super teams. Because there aren't that many. Maybe there will be a Super 4 lording it over a Sloppy 4.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/colm-orourke-this-is-the-end-of-mayo-as-we-have-known-them-37068850.html

Nobody will want to meet Tyrone but there should be a health warning with their matches.

The standard was not good but it looks as if Tyrone are bound for the Super 8. However, they were quite sloppy and are still a bit behind the top sides. They have not changed from last year when their style was picked apart by Dublin.

Maybe there will be a Super 1 and a half!
It could be Snow white and the 7 dwarves.
If the Super 8 features the kind of hammerings that the Provincial finals had it won't be good.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 02, 2018, 09:24:01 AM
If they make it, Kildare's home game would be v Galway. Interesting!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on July 02, 2018, 11:16:24 AM
Galway v Monaghan for a place in the All-Ireland semi-finals. Bank Holiday weekend, races weekend.

It'll be CHAOS!

I can't wait for the controversy.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 02, 2018, 11:20:04 AM
Hyde Park is available.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: straightred on July 02, 2018, 12:17:23 PM
Looking ahead to the 15th July are they going to go head to head with the World cup final (4pm)?

They could just about have a triple header on the Saturday. Kerry - Galway, Fermanagh/Kildare - Laois/Monaghan and Cork/Tyrone - rosscomon/Armagh. Have the Dublin - Donegal game at 1pm on the Sunday
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 02, 2018, 12:50:38 PM
Quote from: straightred on July 02, 2018, 12:17:23 PM
Looking ahead to the 15th July are they going to go head to head with the World cup final (4pm)?

They could just about have a triple header on the Saturday. Kerry - Galway, Fermanagh/Kildare - Laois/Monaghan and Cork/Tyrone - rosscomon/Armagh. Have the Dublin - Donegal game at 1pm on the Sunday

Imagine if it's England...
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: straightred on July 02, 2018, 12:54:15 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 02, 2018, 12:50:38 PM
Quote from: straightred on July 02, 2018, 12:17:23 PM
Looking ahead to the 15th July are they going to go head to head with the World cup final (4pm)?

They could just about have a triple header on the Saturday. Kerry - Galway, Fermanagh/Kildare - Laois/Monaghan and Cork/Tyrone - rosscomon/Armagh. Have the Dublin - Donegal game at 1pm on the Sunday

Imagine if it's England...

No - that's the stuff of nightmares  :-[
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 02, 2018, 12:58:03 PM
Quote from: straightred on July 02, 2018, 12:17:23 PM
Looking ahead to the 15th July are they going to go head to head with the World cup final (4pm)?

They could just about have a triple header on the Saturday. Kerry - Galway, Fermanagh/Kildare - Laois/Monaghan and Cork/Tyrone - rosscomon/Armagh. Have the Dublin - Donegal game at 1pm on the Sunday

It's well known in GAA circles down here that the north lads hate soccer.

So it'll be Dubs v Donegal and Kerry v Galway on Saturday, with the all Ulster double bill on Sunday!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: LeoMc on July 02, 2018, 01:27:49 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 02, 2018, 12:58:03 PM
Quote from: straightred on July 02, 2018, 12:17:23 PM
Looking ahead to the 15th July are they going to go head to head with the World cup final (4pm)?

They could just about have a triple header on the Saturday. Kerry - Galway, Fermanagh/Kildare - Laois/Monaghan and Cork/Tyrone - rosscomon/Armagh. Have the Dublin - Donegal game at 1pm on the Sunday

It's well known in GAA circles down here that the north lads hate soccer.

So it'll be Dubs v Donegal and Kerry v Galway on Saturday, with the all Ulster double bill on Sunday!
Sure we might get a bank holiday if England win on the Sunday.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: cornetto on July 02, 2018, 04:51:38 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on July 02, 2018, 11:16:24 AM
Galway v Monaghan for a place in the All-Ireland semi-finals. Bank Holiday weekend, races weekend.

It'll be CHAOS!

I can't wait for the controversy.
The sad part about it is the game game could be a dead rubber if Galway lose first 2 games and Monaghan win theirs.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on July 02, 2018, 04:52:41 PM
#tuamornowhere
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: longballin on July 02, 2018, 04:58:27 PM
Can it go to point difference in the league table? Im guessing it can
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on July 02, 2018, 05:17:27 PM
Quote from: longballin on July 02, 2018, 04:58:27 PM
Can it go to point difference in the league table? Im guessing it can

In the event of teams finishing on equal points the tie shall be decide by the following means and in the order specified:

(i) Where two teams only are involved - the outcome of the meeting of the two teams in the Group

(ii) Score difference - subtracting the total scores against from the total scores for

(iii) Highest total score for

(iv) Highest total goals for

(v) a play-off
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on July 02, 2018, 05:25:56 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on July 02, 2018, 05:17:27 PM
Quote from: longballin on July 02, 2018, 04:58:27 PM
Can it go to point difference in the league table? Im guessing it can

In the event of teams finishing on equal points the tie shall be decide by the following means and in the order specified:

(i) Where two teams only are involved - the outcome of the meeting of the two teams in the Group

(ii) Score difference - subtracting the total scores against from the total scores for

(iii) Highest total score for

(iv) Highest total goals for

(v) a play-off

Highly unlikely, but what if three teams are level on points and are equal on (i)-(iii)? Obviously there can't be a three team play off. Also where did you find this list?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on July 02, 2018, 05:37:45 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on July 02, 2018, 05:25:56 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on July 02, 2018, 05:17:27 PM
Quote from: longballin on July 02, 2018, 04:58:27 PM
Can it go to point difference in the league table? Im guessing it can

In the event of teams finishing on equal points the tie shall be decide by the following means and in the order specified:

(i) Where two teams only are involved - the outcome of the meeting of the two teams in the Group

(ii) Score difference - subtracting the total scores against from the total scores for

(iii) Highest total score for

(iv) Highest total goals for

(v) a play-off

Highly unlikely, but what if three teams are level on points and are equal on (i)-(iii)? Obviously there can't be a three team play off. Also where did you find this list?

http://www.gaa.ie/sportteller-content/stories/1/1/da3cc421-de34-4bdf-acdf-8588f1e77048/index.html#Slide_6

Quite a decent document that.

If three teams are level, the odds of they all having identical scoring records would be astronomical.  One team would surely be eliminated and the other two might get a play-off if everything else was level.

Even the soccer World Cup groups had something similar - remember 1994 with Ireland's group - all 4 teams on 4 points and all 4 with a goal difference of 0.  It got sorted on goals for deciding first and fourth - deciding second came down to the game between the two (Ireland beat Italy 1-0).

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on July 02, 2018, 06:45:32 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on July 02, 2018, 05:37:45 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on July 02, 2018, 05:25:56 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on July 02, 2018, 05:17:27 PM
Quote from: longballin on July 02, 2018, 04:58:27 PM
Can it go to point difference in the league table? Im guessing it can

In the event of teams finishing on equal points the tie shall be decide by the following means and in the order specified:

(i) Where two teams only are involved - the outcome of the meeting of the two teams in the Group

(ii) Score difference - subtracting the total scores against from the total scores for

(iii) Highest total score for

(iv) Highest total goals for

(v) a play-off

Highly unlikely, but what if three teams are level on points and are equal on (i)-(iii)? Obviously there can't be a three team play off. Also where did you find this list?

http://www.gaa.ie/sportteller-content/stories/1/1/da3cc421-de34-4bdf-acdf-8588f1e77048/index.html#Slide_6

Quite a decent document that.

If three teams are level, the odds of they all having identical scoring records would be astronomical.  One team would surely be eliminated and the other two might get a play-off if everything else was level.

Even the soccer World Cup groups had something similar - remember 1994 with Ireland's group - all 4 teams on 4 points and all 4 with a goal difference of 0.  It got sorted on goals for deciding first and fourth - deciding second came down to the game between the two (Ireland beat Italy 1-0).

Where does it say that in the document?
Also no matter how unlikely surely the Newbridge saga will have taught the GAA they need to have all eventualities accounted for
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on July 02, 2018, 06:56:29 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on July 02, 2018, 06:45:32 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on July 02, 2018, 05:37:45 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on July 02, 2018, 05:25:56 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on July 02, 2018, 05:17:27 PM
Quote from: longballin on July 02, 2018, 04:58:27 PM
Can it go to point difference in the league table? Im guessing it can

In the event of teams finishing on equal points the tie shall be decide by the following means and in the order specified:

(i) Where two teams only are involved - the outcome of the meeting of the two teams in the Group

(ii) Score difference - subtracting the total scores against from the total scores for

(iii) Highest total score for

(iv) Highest total goals for

(v) a play-off

Highly unlikely, but what if three teams are level on points and are equal on (i)-(iii)? Obviously there can't be a three team play off. Also where did you find this list?

http://www.gaa.ie/sportteller-content/stories/1/1/da3cc421-de34-4bdf-acdf-8588f1e77048/index.html#Slide_6

Quite a decent document that.

If three teams are level, the odds of they all having identical scoring records would be astronomical.  One team would surely be eliminated and the other two might get a play-off if everything else was level.

Even the soccer World Cup groups had something similar - remember 1994 with Ireland's group - all 4 teams on 4 points and all 4 with a goal difference of 0.  It got sorted on goals for deciding first and fourth - deciding second came down to the game between the two (Ireland beat Italy 1-0).

Where does it say that in the document?
Also no matter how unlikely surely the Newbridge saga will have taught the GAA they need to have all eventualities accounted for

Did you click the link?  Should open on slide 6. 


Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GalwayBayBoy on July 02, 2018, 07:13:20 PM
Just listening to the GAA Hour there and the boys brought it up but a bit mad to think the Rossies can get into the Super 8's by beating just Leitrim and Armagh. Luck of the draw I know.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Paudi Meehan on July 02, 2018, 07:18:48 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 02, 2018, 07:13:20 PM
Just listening to the GAA Hour there and the boys brought it up but a bit mad to think the Rossies can get into the Super 8's by beating just Leitrim and Armagh. Luck of the draw I know.

Except that lucky draw isn't available to everyone...
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 02, 2018, 07:20:35 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 02, 2018, 07:13:20 PM
Just listening to the GAA Hour there and the boys brought it up but a bit mad to think the Rossies can get into the Super 8's by beating just Leitrim and Armagh. Luck of the draw I know.

Isn't it mad that random draws throw up random results, lads?!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Manning18 on July 02, 2018, 07:38:48 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 02, 2018, 07:20:35 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 02, 2018, 07:13:20 PM
Just listening to the GAA Hour there and the boys brought it up but a bit mad to think the Rossies can get into the Super 8's by beating just Leitrim and Armagh. Luck of the draw I know.

Isn't it mad that random draws throw up random results, lads?!

Is anyone suggesting it's fixed? Just someone pointing out one of the poxiest draws in the history of the GAA. And it's happened twice to Roscommon in 3 years, although they didn't take advantage the first time by losing to Clare two years back.

Something they need to look at if provincial losers continue to only need one game to make the Super 8s. Never understood why provincial losers didn't enter the qualifiers at R3 and have the 8 qualifiers pair off in R4
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 02, 2018, 07:50:39 PM
Ros played 5 games in Connacht in 2016  ;)
As long as the Provincial Championships continue to be so integrated into the AI series inequalities will continue.
Monaghan play Waterford, Laythrum and now Laois. Soft or what?
Mind you they probably thought the same when facing Fermanagh.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 02, 2018, 07:54:32 PM
Quote from: Manning18 on July 02, 2018, 07:38:48 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 02, 2018, 07:20:35 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 02, 2018, 07:13:20 PM
Just listening to the GAA Hour there and the boys brought it up but a bit mad to think the Rossies can get into the Super 8's by beating just Leitrim and Armagh. Luck of the draw I know.

Isn't it mad that random draws throw up random results, lads?!

Is anyone suggesting it's fixed? Just someone pointing out one of the poxiest draws in the history of the GAA. And it's happened twice to Roscommon in 3 years, although they didn't take advantage the first time by losing to Clare two years back.

Something they need to look at if provincial losers continue to only need one game to make the Super 8s. Never understood why provincial losers didn't enter the qualifiers at R3 and have the 8 qualifiers pair off in R4

If you don't understand why then you need to look at schedule that the Quailifiers and provincial championship were run off for years.

Indeed even this year only Roscommon have a fair three week break from losing a provincial final. 7 and 13 day turnarounds are a bit mad in that context so to try and make it any tougher on them would be insane and devalue the only tournaments all but one county even have a chance of winning in the championship.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 02, 2018, 07:56:37 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 02, 2018, 07:13:20 PM
Just listening to the GAA Hour there and the boys brought it up but a bit mad to think the Rossies can get into the Super 8's by beating just Leitrim and Armagh. Luck of the draw I know.
What idiot lads brought that up? Kildare thought they got the luck of the draw when paired with Armagh last year.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 02, 2018, 07:59:55 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 02, 2018, 07:56:37 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 02, 2018, 07:13:20 PM
Just listening to the GAA Hour there and the boys brought it up but a bit mad to think the Rossies can get into the Super 8's by beating just Leitrim and Armagh. Luck of the draw I know.
What idiot lads brought that up? Kildare thought they got the luck of the draw when paired with Armagh last year.

Very defensive.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 02, 2018, 08:04:10 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 02, 2018, 07:59:55 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 02, 2018, 07:56:37 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 02, 2018, 07:13:20 PM
Just listening to the GAA Hour there and the boys brought it up but a bit mad to think the Rossies can get into the Super 8's by beating just Leitrim and Armagh. Luck of the draw I know.
What idiot lads brought that up? Kildare thought they got the luck of the draw when paired with Armagh last year.

Very defensive.
No beat them playing offensive football.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on July 03, 2018, 10:27:47 AM
Quote from: cornetto on July 02, 2018, 04:51:38 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on July 02, 2018, 11:16:24 AM
Galway v Monaghan for a place in the All-Ireland semi-finals. Bank Holiday weekend, races weekend.

It'll be CHAOS!

I can't wait for the controversy.
The sad part about it is the game game could be a dead rubber if Galway lose first 2 games and Monaghan win theirs.
The fixture schedule mitigates against Galway and Donegal, I feel.

Both are likely to lose their opening games to Kerry and Dublin respectively.

They could then be facing into must win away games against Kildare and Roscommon/Armagh.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Maroon Manc on July 03, 2018, 10:33:47 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on July 03, 2018, 10:27:47 AM
Quote from: cornetto on July 02, 2018, 04:51:38 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on July 02, 2018, 11:16:24 AM
Galway v Monaghan for a place in the All-Ireland semi-finals. Bank Holiday weekend, races weekend.

It'll be CHAOS!

I can't wait for the controversy.
The sad part about it is the game game could be a dead rubber if Galway lose first 2 games and Monaghan win theirs.
The fixture schedule mitigates against Galway and Donegal, I feel.

Both are likely to lose their opening games to Kerry and Dublin respectively.

They could then be facing into must win away games against Kildare and Roscommon/Armagh.

It does but then again should Kildare beat Fermanagh they will be on their 5th game in 5 weeks against Galway.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 03, 2018, 11:02:26 AM
Quote from: sid waddell on July 03, 2018, 10:27:47 AM
Quote from: cornetto on July 02, 2018, 04:51:38 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on July 02, 2018, 11:16:24 AM
Galway v Monaghan for a place in the All-Ireland semi-finals. Bank Holiday weekend, races weekend.

It'll be CHAOS!

I can't wait for the controversy.
The sad part about it is the game game could be a dead rubber if Galway lose first 2 games and Monaghan win theirs.
The fixture schedule mitigates against Galway and Donegal, I feel.

Both are likely to lose their opening games to Kerry and Dublin respectively.

They could then be facing into must win away games against Kildare and Roscommon/Armagh.
Have Fermanagh conceded? :o
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: oliverkelly on July 03, 2018, 11:29:47 AM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 02, 2018, 07:13:20 PM
Just listening to the GAA Hour there and the boys brought it up but a bit mad to think the Rossies can get into the Super 8's by beating just Leitrim and Armagh. Luck of the draw I know.

Dublin have got to super 8's by beating Wicklow, Longford and Laois. All worse teams than Armagh based on previous years championship and current league standings. So if we do beat Armagh we will deserve to be there just as much as everyone else
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: weareros on July 03, 2018, 11:47:55 AM
Quote from: oliverkelly on July 03, 2018, 11:29:47 AM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 02, 2018, 07:13:20 PM
Just listening to the GAA Hour there and the boys brought it up but a bit mad to think the Rossies can get into the Super 8's by beating just Leitrim and Armagh. Luck of the draw I know.

Dublin have got to super 8's by beating Wicklow, Longford and Laois. All worse teams than Armagh based on previous years championship and current league standings. So if we do beat Armagh we will deserve to be there just as much as everyone else

That was just that Derry buck who always get super defensive about Ulster football when Wooly mentioned Monaghan had got 3 Div 4 teams in the qualifiers. The reality is Armagh were in the 1/4s last year and while they just got out of Div 3, they are a strong Div 2 standard team that will have a good chance of promotion to Div 1. This is the most even R4 game.

Finally both Monaghan and Roscommon are two of the smallest counties population wise, both rural economic backwaters. Luck has no bearing when such counties punch above their weight.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Solo_run on July 03, 2018, 02:15:32 PM
Quote from: weareros on July 03, 2018, 11:47:55 AM
Quote from: oliverkelly on July 03, 2018, 11:29:47 AM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 02, 2018, 07:13:20 PM
Just listening to the GAA Hour there and the boys brought it up but a bit mad to think the Rossies can get into the Super 8's by beating just Leitrim and Armagh. Luck of the draw I know.

Dublin have got to super 8's by beating Wicklow, Longford and Laois. All worse teams than Armagh based on previous years championship and current league standings. So if we do beat Armagh we will deserve to be there just as much as everyone else

That was just that Derry buck who always get super defensive about Ulster football when Wooly mentioned Monaghan had got 3 Div 4 teams in the qualifiers. The reality is Armagh were in the 1/4s last year and while they just got out of Div 3, they are a strong Div 2 standard team that will have a good chance of promotion to Div 1. This is the most even R4 game.

Finally both Monaghan and Roscommon are two of the smallest counties population wise, both rural economic backwaters. Luck has no bearing when such counties punch above their weight.

Armagh remained in Division 3 as Tipp scored a late goal...but I get what you mean.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: giveherlong on July 03, 2018, 02:57:27 PM
Anybody know who has the TV rights for super 8s and what's the split between RTE/Sky games?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Gabriel_Hurl on July 03, 2018, 03:07:02 PM
Sky exclusives

QuoteSaturday, 14 July
5pm: Super 8 round 1

Saturday, 21 July
5pm: Super 8 round 2
7pm: Super 8 round 2

Saturday, 4 August
7pm: Super 8 round 3
7pm: Super 8 round 3
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Taylor on July 03, 2018, 04:11:52 PM
Quote from: weareros on July 03, 2018, 11:47:55 AM
Quote from: oliverkelly on July 03, 2018, 11:29:47 AM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 02, 2018, 07:13:20 PM
Just listening to the GAA Hour there and the boys brought it up but a bit mad to think the Rossies can get into the Super 8's by beating just Leitrim and Armagh. Luck of the draw I know.

Dublin have got to super 8's by beating Wicklow, Longford and Laois. All worse teams than Armagh based on previous years championship and current league standings. So if we do beat Armagh we will deserve to be there just as much as everyone else

That was just that Derry buck who always get super defensive about Ulster football when Wooly mentioned Monaghan had got 3 Div 4 teams in the qualifiers. The reality is Armagh were in the 1/4s last year and while they just got out of Div 3, they are a strong Div 2 standard team that will have a good chance of promotion to Div 1. This is the most even R4 game.

Finally both Monaghan and Roscommon are two of the smallest counties population wise, both rural economic backwaters. Luck has no bearing when such counties punch above their weight.

Behave yourself.

Wont get promotion.

Is by the luck of God they get to super 8's they will be demolished in all 3 games which will show how far away they are from division 1 standard
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 03, 2018, 04:29:32 PM
Official
Donegal v Dublin 7pm Saturday 14th.
Galway v Kerry 4pm Sunday 15th.

Other fixtyres to be confirmed 9that July.
I presume Monaghan/Laois v Fermanagh/Kildare 2pm 15th and
Ros/Armagh v Cork/Tyrone at5 pm 14th.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GalwayBayBoy on July 03, 2018, 04:31:07 PM
Kerry v Galway clashing with the World Cup final. Both starting at exact same time at 4pm.

That is not a good idea I feel.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: An Fhairche Abu on July 03, 2018, 04:34:58 PM
Well that's one World Cup final I won't be watching so. I knew well that the Dubs wouldn't be put opposite it anyway. Bit strange having Group 2 out first though isn't it?  ::)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: weareros on July 03, 2018, 04:37:38 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 03, 2018, 04:31:07 PM
Kerry v Galway clashing with the World Cup final. Both starting at exact same time at 4pm.

That is not a good idea I feel.

I doubt FIFA will change it despite the loss of viewers to those two aristocrats.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 03, 2018, 04:47:40 PM
Quote from: Taylor on July 03, 2018, 04:11:52 PM
Quote from: weareros on July 03, 2018, 11:47:55 AM
Quote from: oliverkelly on July 03, 2018, 11:29:47 AM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 02, 2018, 07:13:20 PM
Just listening to the GAA Hour there and the boys brought it up but a bit mad to think the Rossies can get into the Super 8's by beating just Leitrim and Armagh. Luck of the draw I know.

Dublin have got to super 8's by beating Wicklow, Longford and Laois. All worse teams than Armagh based on previous years championship and current league standings. So if we do beat Armagh we will deserve to be there just as much as everyone else

That was just that Derry buck who always get super defensive about Ulster football when Wooly mentioned Monaghan had got 3 Div 4 teams in the qualifiers. The reality is Armagh were in the 1/4s last year and while they just got out of Div 3, they are a strong Div 2 standard team that will have a good chance of promotion to Div 1. This is the most even R4 game.

Finally both Monaghan and Roscommon are two of the smallest counties population wise, both rural economic backwaters. Luck has no bearing when such counties punch above their weight.

Behave yourself.

Wont get promotion
.

Is by the luck of God they get to super 8's they will be demolished in all 3 games which will show how far away they are from division 1 standard
Tipp was one win away from getting promotion to Division one they are no better than Armagh. Division two next year will be Donegal promoted a number of other counties good enough to join them including Armagh.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 03, 2018, 04:49:07 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 03, 2018, 04:47:40 PM
Quote from: Taylor on July 03, 2018, 04:11:52 PM
Quote from: weareros on July 03, 2018, 11:47:55 AM
Quote from: oliverkelly on July 03, 2018, 11:29:47 AM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 02, 2018, 07:13:20 PM
Just listening to the GAA Hour there and the boys brought it up but a bit mad to think the Rossies can get into the Super 8's by beating just Leitrim and Armagh. Luck of the draw I know.

Dublin have got to super 8's by beating Wicklow, Longford and Laois. All worse teams than Armagh based on previous years championship and current league standings. So if we do beat Armagh we will deserve to be there just as much as everyone else

That was just that Derry buck who always get super defensive about Ulster football when Wooly mentioned Monaghan had got 3 Div 4 teams in the qualifiers. The reality is Armagh were in the 1/4s last year and while they just got out of Div 3, they are a strong Div 2 standard team that will have a good chance of promotion to Div 1. This is the most even R4 game.

Finally both Monaghan and Roscommon are two of the smallest counties population wise, both rural economic backwaters. Luck has no bearing when such counties punch above their weight.

Behave yourself.

Wont get promotion
.

Is by the luck of God they get to super 8's they will be demolished in all 3 games which will show how far away they are from division 1 standard
Tipp was one win away from getting promotion to Division one they are no better than Armagh. Division two next year will be Donegal promoted a number of other counties good enough to join them including Armagh.

Why do you always assume the best for Ulster teams only?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 03, 2018, 05:23:45 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 03, 2018, 04:31:07 PM
Kerry v Galway clashing with the World Cup final. Both starting at exact same time at 4pm.

That is not a good idea I feel.

Let them play away.
Sick of this nonsense.
It'll have a marginal negative effect on the TV audience, and little or no effect on the attendance.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Manning18 on July 03, 2018, 05:30:35 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 03, 2018, 05:23:45 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 03, 2018, 04:31:07 PM
Kerry v Galway clashing with the World Cup final. Both starting at exact same time at 4pm.

That is not a good idea I feel.

Let them play away.
Sick of this nonsense.
It'll have a marginal negative effect on the TV audience, and little or no effect on the attendance.

The Galway hurlers lose on Sunday and theyre due to play in Cork the same day. Id say that could affect attendance. Why put group 2 (dubs group) on first if the soccer doesnt matter or isnt a consideration?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 03, 2018, 05:32:47 PM
Quote from: weareros on July 03, 2018, 04:37:38 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 03, 2018, 04:31:07 PM
Kerry v Galway clashing with the World Cup final. Both starting at exact same time at 4pm.

That is not a good idea I feel.

I doubt FIFA will change it despite the loss of viewers to those two aristocrats.
The World Cup is way too long and young people with iPhones have such low reserves of attention..
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 03, 2018, 05:40:44 PM
If there is no specific Irish interest in an international sporting event then it should have no bearing whatsoever on GAA fixtures.
Ignore the inevitable bitching about it on social media, if it wasn't that it would be something else.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Manning18 on July 03, 2018, 05:46:18 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 03, 2018, 05:40:44 PM
If there is no specific Irish interest in an international sporting event then it should have no bearing whatsoever on GAA fixtures.
Ignore the inevitable bitching about it on social media, if it wasn't that it would be something else.

If it should have no bearing then why aren't you wondering why group 2 isnt being played Sunday? The Connacht final was the week before the rest. If Soccer should have no bearing then this game should be Saturday and not Sunday
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 03, 2018, 05:46:40 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 03, 2018, 05:32:47 PM
Quote from: weareros on July 03, 2018, 04:37:38 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 03, 2018, 04:31:07 PM
Kerry v Galway clashing with the World Cup final. Both starting at exact same time at 4pm.

That is not a good idea I feel.

I doubt FIFA will change it despite the loss of viewers to those two aristocrats.
The World Cup is way too long and young people with iPhones have such low reserves of attention..

Those devices are just vehicles of capitalist propaganda, seafoid.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 03, 2018, 05:51:50 PM
Quote from: Manning18 on July 03, 2018, 05:46:18 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 03, 2018, 05:40:44 PM
If there is no specific Irish interest in an international sporting event then it should have no bearing whatsoever on GAA fixtures.
Ignore the inevitable bitching about it on social media, if it wasn't that it would be something else.

If it should have no bearing then why aren't you wondering why group 2 isnt being played Sunday? The Connacht final was the week before the rest. If Soccer should have no bearing then this game should be Saturday and not Sunday

Because Dubs aren't real GAA people and they'd arrive late in a heap from the pub for their game.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: straightred on July 03, 2018, 05:54:18 PM
its stupid almost childish defiance and above all its avoidable. Who only likes one sport nowadays. Whether you like it or not (and everyone is free to like what they want) the world cup is the biggest sporting show on earth. Its every 4 years and nothing else comes close. Why force people to choose ?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 03, 2018, 05:58:42 PM
Kerry and Galway "genuine GAA people" and "real fans" will go to see their teams anyway.
The "casual fans" and the "I like all sports" folks wouldn't be going anyway as the Quarter Finals are now a 3 games series and they'll be just going to their home game.
I will of course be watching Kerry v Galway if not working.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Whishtup on July 03, 2018, 11:46:33 PM
With the strong possibility that the Dublin group will be a Dublin vs Ulster affair, I suggest that the northern teams should form a secret Alliance and strategically quash this great blue tyranny!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 04, 2018, 08:20:36 AM
Quote from: straightred on July 03, 2018, 05:54:18 PM
its stupid almost childish defiance and above all its avoidable. Who only likes one sport nowadays. Whether you like it or not (and everyone is free to like what they want) the world cup is the biggest sporting show on earth. Its every 4 years and nothing else comes close. Why force people to choose ?
Absolutely, games on Sunday should be noon and 2pm.

Also, games on Saturday should be 3pm and 5pm. Donegal people having to leave Croker at 9pm on a Sunday night to go home to Donegal is ridiculous, and more worthy of complaint than anything else about these fixtures.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Owenmoresider on July 04, 2018, 08:47:02 AM
Quote from: Hound on July 04, 2018, 08:20:36 AM
Quote from: straightred on July 03, 2018, 05:54:18 PM
its stupid almost childish defiance and above all its avoidable. Who only likes one sport nowadays. Whether you like it or not (and everyone is free to like what they want) the world cup is the biggest sporting show on earth. Its every 4 years and nothing else comes close. Why force people to choose ?
Absolutely, games on Sunday should be noon and 2pm.

Also, games on Saturday should be 3pm and 5pm. Donegal people having to leave Croker at 9pm on a Sunday night to go home to Donegal is ridiculous, and more worthy of complaint than anything else about these fixtures.
Well Donegal certainly have a more worthy complaint than that of the timing anyway.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: An Fhairche Abu on July 04, 2018, 10:42:50 AM
FAO Galway folk, seen rumours in a couple of places elsewhere that our captain is a big doubt for the Kerry match, any definite info on that?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 04, 2018, 10:47:52 AM
Quote from: An Fhairche Abu on July 04, 2018, 10:42:50 AM
FAO Galway folk, seen rumours in a couple of places elsewhere that our captain is a big doubt for the Kerry match, any definite info on that?

He should have been suspended for this game for punching Lavin in the head anyways. I hope referees are starting to cop on about Comer.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 04, 2018, 10:52:02 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 03, 2018, 05:46:40 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 03, 2018, 05:32:47 PM
Quote from: weareros on July 03, 2018, 04:37:38 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 03, 2018, 04:31:07 PM
Kerry v Galway clashing with the World Cup final. Both starting at exact same time at 4pm.

That is not a good idea I feel.

I doubt FIFA will change it despite the loss of viewers to those two aristocrats.
The World Cup is way too long and young people with iPhones have such low reserves of attention..

Those devices are just vehicles of capitalist propaganda, seafoid.
Hey Syf
I found ya a girlfriend.

.@JudgeJeanine: "Right now in America, there are forces dug in, organized, and well-funded doing whatever is necessary to make socialism happen. Today's demonstrations are part of an ongoing step-by-step agenda to change our country at its very core."

She would love Knockroghery .
Imagine her in  Ros jersey. Jaysus 
https://youtu.be/YNSxNsr4wmA
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on July 04, 2018, 10:56:37 AM
Quote from: An Fhairche Abu on July 04, 2018, 10:42:50 AM
FAO Galway folk, seen rumours in a couple of places elsewhere that our captain is a big doubt for the Kerry match, any definite info on that?
England haven't haven't been in a World Cup final since 1966 - you can't blame lads for pulling out of an amateur sports game which clashes with it.

It's going to be one of the truly great communal occasions of our time.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Duine Eile on July 04, 2018, 11:15:51 AM
Quote from: An Fhairche Abu on July 04, 2018, 10:42:50 AM
FAO Galway folk, seen rumours in a couple of places elsewhere that our captain is a big doubt for the Kerry match, any definite info on that?

He didn't play for Annaghdown in the last round of the club championship because of a shoulder injury but as far as I know it was more of a precaution and he would be fine for Kerry, same goes for
Eoghan Kerin. Kerin would be a bigger loss than Comer I think. Very light on back cover.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: An Fhairche Abu on July 04, 2018, 11:23:46 AM
Thanks Duine Eile
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Duine Eile on July 04, 2018, 12:31:08 PM
Quote from: An Fhairche Abu on July 04, 2018, 11:23:46 AM
Thanks Duine Eile

No bother, just hope I'm right!  ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: laoislad on July 04, 2018, 12:40:31 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on July 02, 2018, 11:16:24 AM
Galway v Monaghan for a place in the All-Ireland semi-finals. Bank Holiday weekend, races weekend.

It'll be CHAOS!

I can't wait for the controversy.
When did Monaghan qualify for the Super 8's?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: oliverkelly on July 04, 2018, 12:48:13 PM
Quote from: An Fhairche Abu on July 04, 2018, 10:42:50 AM
FAO Galway folk, seen rumours in a couple of places elsewhere that our captain is a big doubt for the Kerry match, any definite info on that?

Comer and Walsh were both missing for Galway in last saturdays challenge against Roscommon
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: maddog on July 05, 2018, 04:07:38 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

Would say more of an issue would be the general lack of game time involved in making 1/4 final via a provincial win.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: longballin on July 05, 2018, 04:22:39 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Only time that will give the Dubs a game. Can't see other than Dublin V Kerry All Ireland final.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: greatpoint on July 05, 2018, 04:33:00 PM
Quote from: longballin on July 05, 2018, 04:22:39 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Only time that will give the Dubs a game. Can't see other than Dublin V Kerry All Ireland final.

Given that they haven't beaten Dublin in the Championship in close to a decade I'm not so confident.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 05, 2018, 05:06:59 PM
Quote from: longballin on July 05, 2018, 04:22:39 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Only time that will give the Dubs a game. Can't see other than Dublin V Kerry All Ireland final.

Looking at the two round robin groups i think its nicely set up for a repeat of the Div 1 final and especially if Galway manage to beat Kerry in round 1.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:11:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

You've a history of incorrectly writing Kerry off. Kerry may fall short but to say they aren't within a country mile of winning the AI is patently nonsense. Only Dublin are definitely ahead of them and even then, Kerry might have the better forward line, albeit, still to be proven.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:18:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:11:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

You've a history of incorrectly writing Kerry off. Kerry may fall short but to say they aren't within a country mile of winning the AI is patently nonsense. Only Dublin are definitely ahead of them and even then, Kerry might have the better forward line, albeit, still to be proven.

One AI in nine seasons (btw, that is triple their historical average), and the one they did win was because Donegal did the dirty work and beat Dublin for them. I think I've been proven very correct.

You have a history of defending Dublin and pretending like the championship is in any sense balanced or fair.. you're not exactly winning that argument.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 05, 2018, 05:41:45 PM
2014 our village eejit said Kerry wouldn't win an AI for years.
2017 NFL final he said Dublin would "hockey" Kerry.
I can see a few kutehoor smiles there again after his latest outburst.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: lenny on July 05, 2018, 05:44:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:18:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:11:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

You've a history of incorrectly writing Kerry off. Kerry may fall short but to say they aren't within a country mile of winning the AI is patently nonsense. Only Dublin are definitely ahead of them and even then, Kerry might have the better forward line, albeit, still to be proven.

One AI in nine seasons (btw, that is triple their historical average), and the one they did win was because Donegal did the dirty work and beat Dublin for them. I think I've been proven very correct.

You have a history of defending Dublin and pretending like the championship is in any sense balanced or fair.. you're not exactly winning that argument.

I would fancy Kerry this year to win or go very close. It's pathetic to say this Kerry team have won one AI in 9 seasons. A lot of these Kerry players are in their first season and it's therefore a new team albeit with plenty of experience there. The new players seem to have injected the much needed pace which gives them a chance of bridging the advantage dublin had in that department.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:48:37 PM
Quote from: lenny on July 05, 2018, 05:44:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:18:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:11:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

You've a history of incorrectly writing Kerry off. Kerry may fall short but to say they aren't within a country mile of winning the AI is patently nonsense. Only Dublin are definitely ahead of them and even then, Kerry might have the better forward line, albeit, still to be proven.

One AI in nine seasons (btw, that is triple their historical average), and the one they did win was because Donegal did the dirty work and beat Dublin for them. I think I've been proven very correct.

You have a history of defending Dublin and pretending like the championship is in any sense balanced or fair.. you're not exactly winning that argument.

I would fancy Kerry this year to win or go very close. It's pathetic to say this Kerry team have won one AI in 9 seasons. A lot of these Kerry players are in their first season and it's therefore a new team albeit with plenty of experience there. The new players seem to have injected the much needed pace which gives them a chance of bridging the advantage dublin had in that department.

No, it's actually factual to say Kerry have won one AI in nine seasons.

And this team current team isn't being driven by those young lads either. Galway aren't great but are better set up than Kerry to give Dublin this year.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:58:27 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:18:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:11:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

You've a history of incorrectly writing Kerry off. Kerry may fall short but to say they aren't within a country mile of winning the AI is patently nonsense. Only Dublin are definitely ahead of them and even then, Kerry might have the better forward line, albeit, still to be proven.

One AI in nine seasons (btw, that is triple their historical average), and the one they did win was because Donegal did the dirty work and beat Dublin for them. I think I've been proven very correct.

You have a history of defending Dublin and pretending like the championship is in any sense balanced or fair.. you're not exactly winning that argument.

You have an even longer history of being wrong about things but still manging to twist reality in your own head to convince yourself you were in fact right.

As long as I've been on this board I've been arguing the championship is a mess and anything but fair. I've only defended Dublin against some of the more ridiculous charges thrown at them here. But you have an equally illustrious history of changing the subject when your hyperbolic statements are called out for the nonsense they are.

Btw, I presume you'll put the same asterixis besides Roscommon's last Connacht title considering Galway did the hard work b y beating Mayo?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 06:01:39 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:58:27 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:18:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:11:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

You've a history of incorrectly writing Kerry off. Kerry may fall short but to say they aren't within a country mile of winning the AI is patently nonsense. Only Dublin are definitely ahead of them and even then, Kerry might have the better forward line, albeit, still to be proven.

One AI in nine seasons (btw, that is triple their historical average), and the one they did win was because Donegal did the dirty work and beat Dublin for them. I think I've been proven very correct.

You have a history of defending Dublin and pretending like the championship is in any sense balanced or fair.. you're not exactly winning that argument.

You have an even longer history of being wrong about things but still manging to twist reality in your own head to convince yourself you were in fact right.

As long as I've been on this board I've been arguing the championship is a mess and anything but fair. I've only defended Dublin against some of the more ridiculous charges thrown at them here. But you have an equally illustrious history of changing the subject when your hyperbolic statements are called out for the nonsense they are.

Btw, I presume you'll put the same asterixis besides Roscommon's last Connacht title considering Galway did the hard work b y beating Mayo?

Mayo haven't even contested a Connacht final since 2015, try to keep up Zu.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 06:20:33 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

Current bookies odds to pick up Sam

Kerry 11/4 to win Sam
Roscommon 66/1 to win Sam

Based on these odds how many miles (country or otherwise) are Roscommon off winning the AI?


Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Manning18 on July 05, 2018, 06:34:02 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:58:27 PM


Btw, I presume you'll put the same asterixis besides Roscommon's last Connacht title considering Galway did the hard work b y beating Mayo?

There will always be an asterisk beside that one anyway. Beating Galway once off in horrible conditions, sandwiched between two losses to Galway in normal conditions and immediately preceding a hammering by Mayo. 2010 must be the biggest asterisk in Connacht history, while even the hard fought 2001 must feel a little hollow given what happened in the QF that year. Winning competitions is about proving you're the best team in that competition and Roscommon havent done that since the early 90's
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 05, 2018, 06:51:48 PM
So we didn't win Connacht in 2001/10/17???
I was at those 3 Finals and remember our captains being presented with the Nestor Cup.
Had we to give it back the next day or what?
Have I stepped into a parallel Universe?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on July 05, 2018, 07:00:59 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 05, 2018, 06:51:48 PM
So we didn't win Connacht in 2001/10/17???
I was at those 3 Finals and remember our captains being presented with the Fahy Cup.
Had we to given it back the next day or what?
Have I stepped into a parallel Universe?

JJ NESTOR
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 07:04:32 PM
Quote from: Manning18 on July 05, 2018, 06:34:02 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:58:27 PM


Btw, I presume you'll put the same asterixis besides Roscommon's last Connacht title considering Galway did the hard work b y beating Mayo?

There will always be an asterisk beside that one anyway. Beating Galway once off in horrible conditions, sandwiched between two losses to Galway in normal conditions and immediately preceding a hammering by Mayo. 2010 must be the biggest asterisk in Connacht history, while even the hard fought 2001 must feel a little hollow given what happened in the QF that year. Winning competitions is about proving you're the best team in that competition and Roscommon havent done that since the early 90's

Weak attempt.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 05, 2018, 07:31:44 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 07:04:32 PM
Quote from: Manning18 on July 05, 2018, 06:34:02 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:58:27 PM


Btw, I presume you'll put the same asterixis besides Roscommon's last Connacht title considering Galway did the hard work b y beating Mayo?

There will always be an asterisk beside that one anyway. Beating Galway once off in horrible conditions, sandwiched between two losses to Galway in normal conditions and immediately preceding a hammering by Mayo. 2010 must be the biggest asterisk in Connacht history, while even the hard fought 2001 must feel a little hollow given what happened in the QF that year. Winning competitions is about proving you're the best team in that competition and Roscommon havent done that since the early 90's

Weak attempt.

There will be no Asterisk, no more than there will be one beside Galways first AI football title in 1925!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 05, 2018, 07:35:20 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on July 05, 2018, 07:00:59 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 05, 2018, 06:51:48 PM
So we didn't win Connacht in 2001/10/17???
I was at those 3 Finals and remember our captains being presented with the Fahy Cup.
Had we to given it back the next day or what?
Have I stepped into a parallel Universe?

JJ NESTOR
Ta Lar -amended.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 05, 2018, 07:45:09 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 06:20:33 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

Current bookies odds to pick up Sam

Kerry 11/4 to win Sam
Roscommon 66/1 to win Sam

Based on these odds how many miles (country or otherwise) are Roscommon off winning the AI?

Both odds should be much longer. This new format makes it much harder now for underdogs such as Roscommon from the reaching the last four anymore. While Kerry with their tradition are capable of reaching another All Ireland final however half of their team are in their first championship season too many raw players in their team to expect them to topple an experienced team like Dublin.

I'm going to predict that Dublin for the first time since the 70s will win the All Ireland final by large margin this September.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on July 05, 2018, 09:54:58 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:48:37 PM
Quote from: lenny on July 05, 2018, 05:44:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:18:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:11:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

You've a history of incorrectly writing Kerry off. Kerry may fall short but to say they aren't within a country mile of winning the AI is patently nonsense. Only Dublin are definitely ahead of them and even then, Kerry might have the better forward line, albeit, still to be proven.

One AI in nine seasons (btw, that is triple their historical average), and the one they did win was because Donegal did the dirty work and beat Dublin for them. I think I've been proven very correct.

You have a history of defending Dublin and pretending like the championship is in any sense balanced or fair.. you're not exactly winning that argument.

I would fancy Kerry this year to win or go very close. It's pathetic to say this Kerry team have won one AI in 9 seasons. A lot of these Kerry players are in their first season and it's therefore a new team albeit with plenty of experience there. The new players seem to have injected the much needed pace which gives them a chance of bridging the advantage dublin had in that department.

No, it's actually factual to say Kerry have won one AI in nine seasons.

And this team current team isn't being driven by those young lads either. Galway aren't great but are better set up than Kerry to give Dublin this year.

How many counties have a better record in those 9 years? Just Dublin?

I think Galway will struggle in CP against Kerry
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: lenny on July 05, 2018, 10:24:45 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:48:37 PM
Quote from: lenny on July 05, 2018, 05:44:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:18:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:11:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

You've a history of incorrectly writing Kerry off. Kerry may fall short but to say they aren't within a country mile of winning the AI is patently nonsense. Only Dublin are definitely ahead of them and even then, Kerry might have the better forward line, albeit, still to be proven.

One AI in nine seasons (btw, that is triple their historical average), and the one they did win was because Donegal did the dirty work and beat Dublin for them. I think I've been proven very correct.

You have a history of defending Dublin and pretending like the championship is in any sense balanced or fair.. you're not exactly winning that argument.

I would fancy Kerry this year to win or go very close. It's pathetic to say this Kerry team have won one AI in 9 seasons. A lot of these Kerry players are in their first season and it's therefore a new team albeit with plenty of experience there. The new players seem to have injected the much needed pace which gives them a chance of bridging the advantage dublin had in that department.

No, it's actually factual to say Kerry have won one AI in nine seasons.

And this team current team isn't being driven by those young lads either. Galway aren't great but are better set up than Kerry to give Dublin this year.

It's not factual to say this Kerry team have won one AI in 9 years. This is a new team and it looks pretty exciting to me although they have yet to face a tough test.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 10:35:51 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 05, 2018, 09:54:58 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:48:37 PM
Quote from: lenny on July 05, 2018, 05:44:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:18:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:11:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

You've a history of incorrectly writing Kerry off. Kerry may fall short but to say they aren't within a country mile of winning the AI is patently nonsense. Only Dublin are definitely ahead of them and even then, Kerry might have the better forward line, albeit, still to be proven.

One AI in nine seasons (btw, that is triple their historical average), and the one they did win was because Donegal did the dirty work and beat Dublin for them. I think I've been proven very correct.

You have a history of defending Dublin and pretending like the championship is in any sense balanced or fair.. you're not exactly winning that argument.

I would fancy Kerry this year to win or go very close. It's pathetic to say this Kerry team have won one AI in 9 seasons. A lot of these Kerry players are in their first season and it's therefore a new team albeit with plenty of experience there. The new players seem to have injected the much needed pace which gives them a chance of bridging the advantage dublin had in that department.

No, it's actually factual to say Kerry have won one AI in nine seasons.

And this team current team isn't being driven by those young lads either. Galway aren't great but are better set up than Kerry to give Dublin this year.

How many counties have a better record in those 9 years? Just Dublin?

I think Galway will struggle in CP against Kerry

And I think you're over-rating how good Kerry, which has been a common theme these last nine seasons.

Dublin, by the way, will have six from eight when they win this year's title in two months' time. To say Kerry's record is second best in that context pretends like it's much of a competition to begin with.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on July 05, 2018, 10:54:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 10:35:51 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 05, 2018, 09:54:58 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:48:37 PM
Quote from: lenny on July 05, 2018, 05:44:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:18:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:11:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

You've a history of incorrectly writing Kerry off. Kerry may fall short but to say they aren't within a country mile of winning the AI is patently nonsense. Only Dublin are definitely ahead of them and even then, Kerry might have the better forward line, albeit, still to be proven.

One AI in nine seasons (btw, that is triple their historical average), and the one they did win was because Donegal did the dirty work and beat Dublin for them. I think I've been proven very correct.

You have a history of defending Dublin and pretending like the championship is in any sense balanced or fair.. you're not exactly winning that argument.

I would fancy Kerry this year to win or go very close. It's pathetic to say this Kerry team have won one AI in 9 seasons. A lot of these Kerry players are in their first season and it's therefore a new team albeit with plenty of experience there. The new players seem to have injected the much needed pace which gives them a chance of bridging the advantage dublin had in that department.

No, it's actually factual to say Kerry have won one AI in nine seasons.

And this team current team isn't being driven by those young lads either. Galway aren't great but are better set up than Kerry to give Dublin this year.

How many counties have a better record in those 9 years? Just Dublin?

I think Galway will struggle in CP against Kerry

And I think you're over-rating how good Kerry, which
has been a common theme these last nine seasons.

Dublin, by the way, will have six from eight when they win this year's title in two months' time. To say Kerry's record is second best in that context pretends like it's much of a competition to begin with.

So are you saying Galway won't struggle to beat kerry?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 05, 2018, 11:27:33 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 05, 2018, 10:54:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 10:35:51 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 05, 2018, 09:54:58 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:48:37 PM
Quote from: lenny on July 05, 2018, 05:44:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:18:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:11:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

You've a history of incorrectly writing Kerry off. Kerry may fall short but to say they aren't within a country mile of winning the AI is patently nonsense. Only Dublin are definitely ahead of them and even then, Kerry might have the better forward line, albeit, still to be proven.

One AI in nine seasons (btw, that is triple their historical average), and the one they did win was because Donegal did the dirty work and beat Dublin for them. I think I've been proven very correct.

You have a history of defending Dublin and pretending like the championship is in any sense balanced or fair.. you're not exactly winning that argument.

I would fancy Kerry this year to win or go very close. It's pathetic to say this Kerry team have won one AI in 9 seasons. A lot of these Kerry players are in their first season and it's therefore a new team albeit with plenty of experience there. The new players seem to have injected the much needed pace which gives them a chance of bridging the advantage dublin had in that department.

No, it's actually factual to say Kerry have won one AI in nine seasons.

And this team current team isn't being driven by those young lads either. Galway aren't great but are better set up than Kerry to give Dublin this year.

How many counties have a better record in those 9 years? Just Dublin?

I think Galway will struggle in CP against Kerry

And I think you're over-rating how good Kerry, which
has been a common theme these last nine seasons.

Dublin, by the way, will have six from eight when they win this year's title in two months' time. To say Kerry's record is second best in that context pretends like it's much of a competition to begin with.

So are you saying Galway won't struggle to beat kerry?

Galway will struggle to beat Kerry! Because traditionally that's the way it works. Kerry always expect to beat Galway.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 11:34:54 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 05, 2018, 10:54:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 10:35:51 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 05, 2018, 09:54:58 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:48:37 PM
Quote from: lenny on July 05, 2018, 05:44:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:18:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:11:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

You've a history of incorrectly writing Kerry off. Kerry may fall short but to say they aren't within a country mile of winning the AI is patently nonsense. Only Dublin are definitely ahead of them and even then, Kerry might have the better forward line, albeit, still to be proven.

One AI in nine seasons (btw, that is triple their historical average), and the one they did win was because Donegal did the dirty work and beat Dublin for them. I think I've been proven very correct.

You have a history of defending Dublin and pretending like the championship is in any sense balanced or fair.. you're not exactly winning that argument.

I would fancy Kerry this year to win or go very close. It's pathetic to say this Kerry team have won one AI in 9 seasons. A lot of these Kerry players are in their first season and it's therefore a new team albeit with plenty of experience there. The new players seem to have injected the much needed pace which gives them a chance of bridging the advantage dublin had in that department.

No, it's actually factual to say Kerry have won one AI in nine seasons.

And this team current team isn't being driven by those young lads either. Galway aren't great but are better set up than Kerry to give Dublin this year.

How many counties have a better record in those 9 years? Just Dublin?

I think Galway will struggle in CP against Kerry

And I think you're over-rating how good Kerry, which
has been a common theme these last nine seasons.

Dublin, by the way, will have six from eight when they win this year's title in two months' time. To say Kerry's record is second best in that context pretends like it's much of a competition to begin with.

So are you saying Galway won't struggle to beat kerry?

They'll struggle plenty based on their gutless performance against them last year. But in terms of what both teams can offer on the field there's not much between them, honestly. Galway can at least somewhat contain Dublin, which is more than can be said for the likes of Tyrone or Donegal or Kerry. That's why they're probably the best match for them. That doesn't mean I think they're particularly close to beating Dublin, because no one is.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 05, 2018, 11:47:07 PM
Syferus, You are pretty close to the mark there! Galway have one advantage over the other 3 Provincial Champions, They have had a tougher campaign to reach the Super 8! Still think Galway are way off the mark (the mark being Dublin).
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GalwayBayBoy on July 06, 2018, 12:42:14 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 05, 2018, 11:27:33 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 05, 2018, 10:54:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 10:35:51 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 05, 2018, 09:54:58 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:48:37 PM
Quote from: lenny on July 05, 2018, 05:44:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:18:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:11:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

You've a history of incorrectly writing Kerry off. Kerry may fall short but to say they aren't within a country mile of winning the AI is patently nonsense. Only Dublin are definitely ahead of them and even then, Kerry might have the better forward line, albeit, still to be proven.

One AI in nine seasons (btw, that is triple their historical average), and the one they did win was because Donegal did the dirty work and beat Dublin for them. I think I've been proven very correct.

You have a history of defending Dublin and pretending like the championship is in any sense balanced or fair.. you're not exactly winning that argument.

I would fancy Kerry this year to win or go very close. It's pathetic to say this Kerry team have won one AI in 9 seasons. A lot of these Kerry players are in their first season and it's therefore a new team albeit with plenty of experience there. The new players seem to have injected the much needed pace which gives them a chance of bridging the advantage dublin had in that department.

No, it's actually factual to say Kerry have won one AI in nine seasons.

And this team current team isn't being driven by those young lads either. Galway aren't great but are better set up than Kerry to give Dublin this year.

How many counties have a better record in those 9 years? Just Dublin?

I think Galway will struggle in CP against Kerry

And I think you're over-rating how good Kerry, which
has been a common theme these last nine seasons.

Dublin, by the way, will have six from eight when they win this year's title in two months' time. To say Kerry's record is second best in that context pretends like it's much of a competition to begin with.

So are you saying Galway won't struggle to beat kerry?

Galway will struggle to beat Kerry! Because traditionally that's the way it works. Kerry always expect to beat Galway.

Kerry usually expect to beat everyone.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 06, 2018, 08:11:20 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 05, 2018, 11:27:33 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 05, 2018, 10:54:39 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 10:35:51 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 05, 2018, 09:54:58 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:48:37 PM
Quote from: lenny on July 05, 2018, 05:44:26 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 05:18:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 05, 2018, 05:11:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 05, 2018, 04:12:15 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 05, 2018, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 05, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
The team that will benefit most from the Super 8s is Kerry.

Yeah you'd think with their age profile this year it's set up lovely for them.
Also I saw one of the retired Kerry lads going on about how the break between winning the provincials and the quarter-final wasn't ideal as the break was often too long.

It's easy to say that when you think you're good enough to win those matches. This Kerry team aren't within a country mile of winning the AI.

You've a history of incorrectly writing Kerry off. Kerry may fall short but to say they aren't within a country mile of winning the AI is patently nonsense. Only Dublin are definitely ahead of them and even then, Kerry might have the better forward line, albeit, still to be proven.

One AI in nine seasons (btw, that is triple their historical average), and the one they did win was because Donegal did the dirty work and beat Dublin for them. I think I've been proven very correct.

You have a history of defending Dublin and pretending like the championship is in any sense balanced or fair.. you're not exactly winning that argument.

I would fancy Kerry this year to win or go very close. It's pathetic to say this Kerry team have won one AI in 9 seasons. A lot of these Kerry players are in their first season and it's therefore a new team albeit with plenty of experience there. The new players seem to have injected the much needed pace which gives them a chance of bridging the advantage dublin had in that department.

No, it's actually factual to say Kerry have won one AI in nine seasons.

And this team current team isn't being driven by those young lads either. Galway aren't great but are better set up than Kerry to give Dublin this year.

How many counties have a better record in those 9 years? Just Dublin?

I think Galway will struggle in CP against Kerry

And I think you're over-rating how good Kerry, which
has been a common theme these last nine seasons.

Dublin, by the way, will have six from eight when they win this year's title in two months' time. To say Kerry's record is second best in that context pretends like it's much of a competition to begin with.

So are you saying Galway won't struggle to beat kerry?

Galway will struggle to beat Kerry! Because traditionally that's the way it works. Kerry always expect to beat Galway.
Traditionally Dublin were Galway's bogey team. Only one win against them at the final stage.
Kerry were beaten 2 years in a row in 64 and 65.
The status quo only emerged with Micko''s team.
I was looking at a few Monaghan v Kerry semifinals from the late 70s/80s. The bomber was an early prototype of Donaghy.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GrandMasterFlash on July 06, 2018, 09:57:49 AM
To me, it seems that GAA congress base a significant number of decisions on a 'sure we'll wait and see how it goes' ethos: http://www.hoganstand.com/County/Monaghan/Article/Index/287475 (http://www.hoganstand.com/County/Monaghan/Article/Index/287475)

Like Newbridge-gate, and having to play the Leinster Final in Munster (involving a team from Connacht), the decision to allow any county team to nominate the same venue as home and neutral, seems like a bizarre oversight to me. The cynic might say there's something else at play here, and there usually is, but the amount of 'oversights' suggest that there's a reasonable amount of ineptitude at play here, by paid professionals..  :o
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 06, 2018, 10:32:09 AM
No team nominates a neutral venue for the Super 8s though.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GrandMasterFlash on July 06, 2018, 11:43:42 AM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 06, 2018, 10:32:09 AM
No team nominates a neutral venue for the Super 8s though.

OK, so who does nominate the neutral venue then, the CCCC?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 06, 2018, 11:52:39 AM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on July 06, 2018, 09:57:49 AM
To me, it seems that GAA congress base a significant number of decisions on a 'sure we'll wait and see how it goes' ethos: http://www.hoganstand.com/County/Monaghan/Article/Index/287475 (http://www.hoganstand.com/County/Monaghan/Article/Index/287475)

Like Newbridge-gate, and having to play the Leinster Final in Munster (involving a team from Connacht), the decision to allow any county team to nominate the same venue as home and neutral, seems like a bizarre oversight to me. The cynic might say there's something else at play here, and there usually is, but the amount of 'oversights' suggest that there's a reasonable amount of ineptitude at play here, by paid professionals..  :o

The whole "neutral" point is as disingenuous as saying Croke Park is not in Dublin. There was no hidden agenda or hidden anything, it was black and white from when it was proposed and certainly when it was accepted at Congress. There was never any intention to have a round of neutral games in the Super 8! It was a round of Croke Park games. The reason for this is to maximise revenues. It's not rocket science. 

There'll be an interesting debate at Congress next time. I'm sure change will happen but will it be for next year or will it be deferred until the end of the 3 year trial period. Not a whole lot to gain for the Leinster or Ulster teams by changing it before then.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GalwayBayBoy on July 07, 2018, 06:16:23 PM
Well looks like one group is sorted.

Dublin
Donegal
Roscommon
Tyrone
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 07, 2018, 06:18:50 PM
Quote from: GrandMasterFlash on July 06, 2018, 11:43:42 AM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 06, 2018, 10:32:09 AM
No team nominates a neutral venue for the Super 8s though.

OK, so who does nominate the neutral venue then, the CCCC?

Nobody.
It's 'home', 'away' or 'Croke Park'.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: longballin on July 07, 2018, 06:20:07 PM
so 'neutral' games as in Croke Park must be double headers?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on July 07, 2018, 06:39:03 PM
Shouldn't Roscommon v Dublin played in Portlaoise or Tullamore?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 07, 2018, 06:44:18 PM
So Tyrone start with Ross in croker, then Dublin in omagh and donegal in ballybofey for the final game.

I'd fancy Tyrone to get two wins there.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 07, 2018, 07:00:37 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 07, 2018, 06:44:18 PM
So Tyrone start with Ross in croker, then Dublin in omagh and donegal in ballybofey for the final game.

I'd fancy Tyrone to get two wins there.
The loss of PaddyMcB and Tyrone and Ros both being very impressive has probably moved Donegal from 2nd to 4th favs in this group.

Tyrone v Ros is massive. Very hard to call!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Norf Tyrone on July 07, 2018, 07:07:45 PM
I assume the CCC will announce all dates, times etc on Monday?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 07, 2018, 07:13:27 PM
Quote from: Norf Tyrone on July 07, 2018, 07:07:45 PM
I assume the CCC will announce all dates, times etc on Monday?

Sky sports said the Tyrone game will be on Saturday anyway.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Norf Tyrone on July 07, 2018, 07:32:11 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 07, 2018, 07:13:27 PM
Quote from: Norf Tyrone on July 07, 2018, 07:07:45 PM
I assume the CCC will announce all dates, times etc on Monday?

Sky sports said the Tyrone game will be on Saturday anyway.

Cheers
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 07, 2018, 07:43:29 PM
Now I don't know if that's official or if they were guessing.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 07, 2018, 08:01:37 PM
Highly likely it's Tyrone v Ros on Saturday at 5pm. But won't know for sure till Monday
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on July 07, 2018, 08:19:50 PM
On the presumption that Dublin will win the group, I think that the battle for second is wide open. Roscommon will be underdogs but I reckon they are capable of beating Tyrone in the wide open spaces of Croke Park providing they tighten up defensively. It's possible that Dublin could win all of their games and that 2 points and a healthy score difference could be enough for another side to make the semis.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: redzone on July 07, 2018, 08:24:36 PM
Anyone got the odds on Dublin not getting out of the group
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 07, 2018, 09:05:30 PM
Quote from: redzone on July 07, 2018, 08:24:36 PM
Anyone got the odds on Dublin not getting out of the group
20/1 I guess

That means if you bet €10, you lose €10
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: inthrough on July 07, 2018, 10:26:34 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 07, 2018, 06:44:18 PM
So Tyrone start with Ross in croker, then Dublin in omagh and donegal in ballybofey for the final game.

I'd fancy Tyrone to get two wins there.
Tyrone are not beating Donegal in Ballybofey, put your house on that.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: An Watcher on July 07, 2018, 10:33:21 PM
Pity the dubs didn't have to go to ballybofey.  Seriously tough place to win.   Mcbrearty is a major loss for them though so I'm hopeful for tyrone
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: inthrough on July 07, 2018, 10:44:36 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 07, 2018, 07:00:37 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 07, 2018, 06:44:18 PM
So Tyrone start with Ross in croker, then Dublin in omagh and donegal in ballybofey for the final game.

I'd fancy Tyrone to get two wins there.
The loss of PaddyMcB and Tyrone and Ros both being very impressive has probably moved Donegal from 2nd to 4th favs in this group.

Tyrone v Ros is massive. Very hard to call!
.
Don't kid yourself, Donegal scored 2-18 in the Ulster final where Paddy scored 0-1, they have had 3 weeks to adjust and are ready to go.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 07, 2018, 10:50:04 PM
Quote from: inthrough on July 07, 2018, 10:44:36 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 07, 2018, 07:00:37 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 07, 2018, 06:44:18 PM
So Tyrone start with Ross in croker, then Dublin in omagh and donegal in ballybofey for the final game.

I'd fancy Tyrone to get two wins there.
The loss of PaddyMcB and Tyrone and Ros both being very impressive has probably moved Donegal from 2nd to 4th favs in this group.

Tyrone v Ros is massive. Very hard to call!
.
Don't kid yourself, Donegal scored 2-18 in the Ulster final where Paddy scored 0-1, they have had 3 weeks to adjust and are ready to go.

Donegal weren't too hot even with McBrearty fit. We'll see if they aren't very soundly beaten by Dublin. In fact it will be a major surprse of all three teams with Dublin aren't well bet.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Champion The Wonder Horse on July 07, 2018, 10:51:00 PM
Tyrone Donegal the big game in this one. Winners beaten by Kerry in AI semi-final.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: greatpoint on July 07, 2018, 10:57:56 PM
I wouldn't be getting too excited about Tyrone, it's a decade since they've beaten a non-Ulster team in in a big game in Croke Park.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on July 07, 2018, 11:04:01 PM
Rossie's path to super 8s:

Leitrim (win)
Galway (loss)
Armagh (win)

Tyrone's path to super 8s:

Monaghan (loss)
Meath (win)
Carlow (win)
Cavan (win)
Cork (win)

https://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2018/0707/977085-cregg-massive-achievement-to-reach-super-8s/

Cregg must have bitten his tongue to stop the laughter during this interview.

When will these unequal paths be sorted so there's a level playing field?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 07, 2018, 11:08:54 PM
Quote from: omagh_gael on July 07, 2018, 11:04:01 PM
Rossie's path to super 8s:

Leitrim (win)
Galway (loss)
Armagh (win)

Tyrone's path to super 8s:

Monaghan (loss)
Meath (win)
Carlow (win)
Cavan (win)
Cork (win)

https://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2018/0707/977085-cregg-massive-achievement-to-reach-super-8s/

Cregg must have bitten his tongue to stop the laughter during this interview.

When will these unequal paths be sorted so there's a level playing field?

Oh, now the Tymoanie nonsense reaches full tilt. Most of the teams you listed would have got hammered by Galway or the Armagh team we played.

I suppose this will be the core of your excuse if Tyrone burn out in the final ten minutes next week? Ock aye, us poor Ulster lads had such a tough run in, what chance did we have!

And who the feck is yer water boy, he was comedy gold today, yelling at players half way up the field as if they could hear him, "NO SCORE, NO SCORE!!!!!!!!!!"...
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on July 07, 2018, 11:41:09 PM
We're very happy with our progress so far, Syf. Momentum is hard to beat.

Do you agree with Cregg's sentiments? You've had a spectacularly easy route to the super 8s.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 07, 2018, 11:50:06 PM
Quote from: omagh_gael on July 07, 2018, 11:41:09 PM
We're very happy with our progress so far, Syf. Momentum is hard to beat.

Do you agree with Cregg's sentiments? You've had a spectacularly easy route to the super 8s.

Are you well.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 07, 2018, 11:51:51 PM
This game will be won and lost on gaaboard.
Will the Tyrone posters go man on man against Syferus, or will they try to overwhelm him with superior numbers?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Manning18 on July 07, 2018, 11:55:50 PM
Cregg probably just said the first stock answer that came to his head in the interview. The point about it being farcical though is a sound one. A one off game to reach me Super 8s, and then when you lose that you get another one off game against a D3 side (with 3 weeks rest compared to their one) to reach them. Thought it was telling enough that a McGeeney side, usually well fit, looked out on their feet in injury time. Playing 77 mins in 28 degrees last week has to have told.

The system needs to be changed. We're getting there slowly. Part of me hopes the Super 8s bombs this year so we get the change this summer. A good Super 8s might paper over the cracks and they'll run with the same competitions again. Simplest solution for a quick fix is for provincial losers to enter the qualifiers at R3 and have them pair off in R4. Same rest period for qualifiers and provincial losers if possible
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on July 07, 2018, 11:59:35 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 07, 2018, 11:50:06 PM
Quote from: omagh_gael on July 07, 2018, 11:41:09 PM
We're very happy with our progress so far, Syf. Momentum is hard to beat.

Do you agree with Cregg's sentiments? You've had a spectacularly easy route to the super 8s.

Are you well.

Ah jaysis, you've lost the run of yourself. You pipped a team we obliterated in the QFs last year and outside of that beat a poor div4 team. You're on the wrong side of this debate, Syf. Familiar ground for yourself I suppose.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 12:00:47 AM
Quote from: Manning18 on July 07, 2018, 11:55:50 PM
Cregg probably just said the first stock answer that came to his head in the interview. The point about it being farcical though is a sound one. A one off game to reach me Super 8s, and then when you lose that you get another one off game against a D3 side (with 3 weeks rest compared to their one) to reach them. Thought it was telling enough that a McGeeney side, usually well fit, looked out on their feet in injury time. Playing 77 mins in 28 degrees last week has to have told.

The system needs to be changed. We're getting there slowly. Part of me hopes the Super 8s bombs this year so we get the change this summer. A good Super 8s might paper over the cracks and they'll run with the same competitions again. Simplest solution for a quick fix is for provincial losers to enter the qualifiers at R3 and have them pair off in R4. Same rest period for qualifiers and provincial losers if possible

Kerry had to beat that Cork team to get to the Super 8s. Dublin had Wicklow and Laois. And you're mouthing about Roscommon's run in being handy.

Lol.

I suppose this is the one month in the year when Galway people realise football exists, until the horsey stuff starts.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rodney trotter on July 08, 2018, 12:09:56 AM
Until they restructure the provinces and have 8 in each province, it will always be easier route for some teams.  There is that much changes in Gaa,  i doubt counties  will care what province they are put in.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 08, 2018, 12:12:37 AM
You can't have 8 in each PROVINCE unless you redraw County Boundaries.
Your could make 4 Regions of 8 but sure the Southern one would still be Kerry and a scatter of hurley Counties.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on July 08, 2018, 12:13:03 AM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 07, 2018, 11:51:51 PM
This game will be won and lost on gaaboard.
Will the Tyrone posters go man on man against Syferus, or will they try to overwhelm him with superior numbers?

As long as he doesn''t ruffle our hair we have him either way.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Manning18 on July 08, 2018, 12:15:45 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 12:00:47 AM
Quote from: Manning18 on July 07, 2018, 11:55:50 PM
Cregg probably just said the first stock answer that came to his head in the interview. The point about it being farcical though is a sound one. A one off game to reach me Super 8s, and then when you lose that you get another one off game against a D3 side (with 3 weeks rest compared to their one) to reach them. Thought it was telling enough that a McGeeney side, usually well fit, looked out on their feet in injury time. Playing 77 mins in 28 degrees last week has to have told.

The system needs to be changed. We're getting there slowly. Part of me hopes the Super 8s bombs this year so we get the change this summer. A good Super 8s might paper over the cracks and they'll run with the same competitions again. Simplest solution for a quick fix is for provincial losers to enter the qualifiers at R3 and have them pair off in R4. Same rest period for qualifiers and provincial losers if possible

Kerry had to beat that Cork team to get to the Super 8s. Dublin had Wicklow and Laois. And you're mouthing about Roscommon's run in being handy.

Lol.

I suppose this is the one month in the year when Galway people realise football exists, until the horsey stuff starts.

If Kerry or Dublin (who won 3 games) actually lost a game along the way and had to beat a D3 side off short rest then I'd be saying the same thing. Connacht and Munster are naturally skewed and these soft draws happen all to often. This has the potential to benefit Galway massively in future yet I want it gone as im not so biased that I can't see beyong my own nose. How can you really cherish making the Super 8s given whats happened? Where's the achievement in it?

As for your other comment, apologies for living in a place where we actually have other things that can also entertain us besides football, counting sheep and voting No
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 12:17:11 AM
Quote from: omagh_gael on July 07, 2018, 11:59:35 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 07, 2018, 11:50:06 PM
Quote from: omagh_gael on July 07, 2018, 11:41:09 PM
We're very happy with our progress so far, Syf. Momentum is hard to beat.

Do you agree with Cregg's sentiments? You've had a spectacularly easy route to the super 8s.

Are you well.


An Armagh team that has lost about 10 key players this year and also has had to contend with injuries to other key players like Ethan Rafferty and Paul Hughes. They were also without Aaron McKay and Ben Crealey today through injury who would have started if fit.
Ah jaysis, you've lost the run of yourself. You pipped a team we obliterated in the QFs last year and outside of that beat a poor div4 team. You're on the wrong side of this debate, Syf. Familiar ground for yourself I suppose.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 08, 2018, 12:29:49 AM
Quote from: omagh_gael on July 07, 2018, 11:41:09 PM
We're very happy with our progress so far, Syf. Momentum is hard to beat.

Do you agree with Cregg's sentiments? You've had a spectacularly easy route to the super 8s.

All qualifier games that Tyrone were expected to win that won't be the case for 2 of their next 3 games. Roscommon got nothing spectacularly easy today while Cork just rolled over against Tyrone.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: weareros on July 08, 2018, 08:23:01 AM
Quote from: rodney trotter on July 08, 2018, 12:09:56 AM
Until they restructure the provinces and have 8 in each province, it will always be easier route for some teams.  There is that much changes in Gaa,  i doubt counties  will care what province they are put in.

And then if you restructured provinces, so many counties still have to deal with the arbitrary county boundaries drawn up in Elizabethan times. While no county would want to amalgamate, the smaller populated counties have a disadvantage in player resources and the revenue they can generate from the populace to support a county team.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: weareros on July 08, 2018, 08:35:49 AM
Quote from: Manning18 on July 08, 2018, 12:15:45 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 12:00:47 AM
Quote from: Manning18 on July 07, 2018, 11:55:50 PM
Cregg probably just said the first stock answer that came to his head in the interview. The point about it being farcical though is a sound one. A one off game to reach me Super 8s, and then when you lose that you get another one off game against a D3 side (with 3 weeks rest compared to their one) to reach them. Thought it was telling enough that a McGeeney side, usually well fit, looked out on their feet in injury time. Playing 77 mins in 28 degrees last week has to have told.

The system needs to be changed. We're getting there slowly. Part of me hopes the Super 8s bombs this year so we get the change this summer. A good Super 8s might paper over the cracks and they'll run with the same competitions again. Simplest solution for a quick fix is for provincial losers to enter the qualifiers at R3 and have them pair off in R4. Same rest period for qualifiers and provincial losers if possible

Kerry had to beat that Cork team to get to the Super 8s. Dublin had Wicklow and Laois. And you're mouthing about Roscommon's run in being handy.

Lol.

I suppose this is the one month in the year when Galway people realise football exists, until the horsey stuff starts.

If Kerry or Dublin (who won 3 games) actually lost a game along the way and had to beat a D3 side off short rest then I'd be saying the same thing. Connacht and Munster are naturally skewed and these soft draws happen all to often. This has the potential to benefit Galway massively in future yet I want it gone as im not so biased that I can't see beyong my own nose. How can you really cherish making the Super 8s given whats happened? Where's the achievement in it?

As for your other comment, apologies for living in a place where we actually have other things that can also entertain us besides football, counting sheep and voting No

Connacht still has only one less game than Ulster. It had the only provincial finalist that was competitive. Playing more games in a province does not equal harder if you are winning easy games like Dublin, Donegal and Kerry. I think NY and London are better than the bottom tier teams in Ulster, Munster and Leinster. Even Div 4 Leitrim with a population of only 25k hammered Div 2 Louth. The draw in Connacht every now and then gets lopsided. When Ros won their 4 in a row, we had to beat Galway and Mayo every year. Then when we got the so called easy side of draw in 1981, Sligo dumped us out. In fact I remember an All-Ireland winning and favourites Galway U21 team getting knocked out by Leitrim not so long ago. Nothing more sanctimonious that Galway with their 250k population advantage belittling the smaller counties.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Manning18 on July 08, 2018, 09:57:03 AM
250k advantage? It's 250k total and football is only played in about half the county. Mayo has more footballers and around the same number of football clubs as Galway. Roscommon has a decent pool to play with. Try to sustain a top hurling team, and semi professional Soccer and Rugby sides before bringing the population argument into it. Huge amount of that population made up by exiled Mayo, Ros, Sligo people etc not to mention travelling students & non nationals.

I've already suggested a quick solution, let the provincial losers enter at R3 and pair them in R4 instead so we don't get a situation like Ros losing in Connacht and having to beat Clare or Armagh to get to this stage again. Not just picking on Ros either, the Munster situation is arguably worse and the anomaly will happen there also in future. Of course, Monaghan are the poxiest side currently with their amazing run of qualifier draws, but thats a freak occurance.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 09:59:42 AM
Galway win one game and lose the run of themselves. Typical.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 10:10:50 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 09:59:42 AM
Galway win one game and lose the run of themselves. Typical.

Syf, you are a hoor for th'oul projection.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_projection

You would make a great thesis
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: straightred on July 08, 2018, 10:15:07 AM
Quote from: Manning18 on July 08, 2018, 09:57:03 AM
250k advantage? It's 250k total and football is only played in about half the county. Mayo has more footballers and around the same number of football clubs as Galway. Roscommon has a decent pool to play with. Try to sustain a top hurling team, and semi professional Soccer and Rugby sides before bringing the population argument into it. Huge amount of that population made up by exiled Mayo, Ros, Sligo people etc not to mention travelling students & non nationals.

I've already suggested a quick solution, let the provincial losers enter at R3 and pair them in R4 instead so we don't get a situation like Ros losing in Connacht and having to beat Clare or Armagh to get to this stage again. Not just picking on Ros either, the Munster situation is arguably worse and the anomaly will happen there also in future. Of course, Monaghan are the poxiest side currently with their amazing run of qualifier draws, but thats a freak occurance.

They may well be but that's the luck of the draw this year and it hasn't been kind to them previously. However that isnt the point - if they make the last 8 they'll have had to play 3 qualifiers in a short space of time. Ulster and leinster counties don't get the luxury of these so called anomalies
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 10:29:33 AM
Most of the teams in the Super 8 haven't had a decent challenge yet.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: weareros on July 08, 2018, 10:35:16 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 10:29:33 AM
Most of the teams in the Super 8 haven't had a decent challenge yet.

Correct. Galway are the only team having had to beat two Div 1 teams in Connacht in tight, tense games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 08, 2018, 10:44:33 AM
Of the Provincial Champions only Galway from CONNACHT had 2 serious games.
The other 3 won turkey shoots and their combined winning margins must be well over 100 points or would it be 200?!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:04:19 AM
It should be an interesting Super 8s.

A shame Mayo didn't make it really. Dublin will definitely come out of the Super 8s but I think you could say 6 of the other 7 will certainly fancy their chances of progressing. I just think Roscommon are there to make up the numbers and look to be physically a long way off the other three teams.

If Monaghan win today, as expected, then you have a very interesting group. Monaghan are a seasoned Div 1 side, Galway are progressing, Kerry have a lot of exciting forwards and Kildare have momentum in their favour. None of the four sides should have reason to fear the other as there is not a great deal between him.

I think it will be between us and Donegal for the 2nd place in our group.

7 of the 8 teams played in Div 1 this year and the only team from Div 1 who didn't make it were eliminated by another Div 1 side.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 11:08:24 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:04:19 AM
It should be an interesting Super 8s.

A shame Mayo didn't make it really. Dublin will definitely come out of the Super 8s but I think you could say 6 of the other 7 will certainly fancy their chances of progressing. I just think Roscommon are there to make up the numbers and look to be physically a long way off the other three teams.

If Monaghan win today, as expected, then you have a very interesting group. Monaghan are a seasoned Div 1 side, Galway are progressing, Kerry have a lot of exciting forwards and Kildare have momentum in their favour. None of the four sides should have reason to fear the other as there is not a great deal between him.

I think it will be between us and Donegal for the 2nd place in our group.

7 of the 8 teams played in Div 1 this year and the only team from Div 1 who didn't make it were eliminated by another Div 1 side.

You've been exposed. By rights you should be banned again for making a second account to circumvent your permanent ban. Mods?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:19:57 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 11:08:24 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:04:19 AM
It should be an interesting Super 8s.

A shame Mayo didn't make it really. Dublin will definitely come out of the Super 8s but I think you could say 6 of the other 7 will certainly fancy their chances of progressing. I just think Roscommon are there to make up the numbers and look to be physically a long way off the other three teams.

If Monaghan win today, as expected, then you have a very interesting group. Monaghan are a seasoned Div 1 side, Galway are progressing, Kerry have a lot of exciting forwards and Kildare have momentum in their favour. None of the four sides should have reason to fear the other as there is not a great deal between him.

I think it will be between us and Donegal for the 2nd place in our group.

7 of the 8 teams played in Div 1 this year and the only team from Div 1 who didn't make it were eliminated by another Div 1 side.

You've been exposed. By rights you should be banned again for making a second account to circumvent your permanent ban. Mods?

I should be banned for dismissing Roscommon?

Aren't you a sensitive wee soul, maybe run along now and stop diluting from the football discussion with your nonsense.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 11:26:15 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:19:57 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 11:08:24 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:04:19 AM
It should be an interesting Super 8s.

A shame Mayo didn't make it really. Dublin will definitely come out of the Super 8s but I think you could say 6 of the other 7 will certainly fancy their chances of progressing. I just think Roscommon are there to make up the numbers and look to be physically a long way off the other three teams.

If Monaghan win today, as expected, then you have a very interesting group. Monaghan are a seasoned Div 1 side, Galway are progressing, Kerry have a lot of exciting forwards and Kildare have momentum in their favour. None of the four sides should have reason to fear the other as there is not a great deal between him.

I think it will be between us and Donegal for the 2nd place in our group.

7 of the 8 teams played in Div 1 this year and the only team from Div 1 who didn't make it were eliminated by another Div 1 side.

You've been exposed. By rights you should be banned again for making a second account to circumvent your permanent ban. Mods?

I should be banned for dismissing Roscommon?

Aren't you a sensitive wee soul, maybe run along now and stop diluting from the football discussion with your nonsense.

Reported.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:33:41 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 11:26:15 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:19:57 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 11:08:24 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:04:19 AM
It should be an interesting Super 8s.

A shame Mayo didn't make it really. Dublin will definitely come out of the Super 8s but I think you could say 6 of the other 7 will certainly fancy their chances of progressing. I just think Roscommon are there to make up the numbers and look to be physically a long way off the other three teams.

If Monaghan win today, as expected, then you have a very interesting group. Monaghan are a seasoned Div 1 side, Galway are progressing, Kerry have a lot of exciting forwards and Kildare have momentum in their favour. None of the four sides should have reason to fear the other as there is not a great deal between him.

I think it will be between us and Donegal for the 2nd place in our group.

7 of the 8 teams played in Div 1 this year and the only team from Div 1 who didn't make it were eliminated by another Div 1 side.

You've been exposed. By rights you should be banned again for making a second account to circumvent your permanent ban. Mods?

I should be banned for dismissing Roscommon?

Aren't you a sensitive wee soul, maybe run along now and stop diluting from the football discussion with your nonsense.

Reported.


Good snitching.


Your life must be very fulfilling if your Sunday morning consists of grassing posters up on a niche messageboard because they dismiss your team's chances.

I could say something about how pathetic your life must be and potential mental health issues but clearly you say a lot more for that than I ever could.

Do everyone a favour and run along as some of us just want to discuss the football without being slurred or brought down to your level.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 11:35:41 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:33:41 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 11:26:15 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:19:57 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 11:08:24 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:04:19 AM
It should be an interesting Super 8s.

A shame Mayo didn't make it really. Dublin will definitely come out of the Super 8s but I think you could say 6 of the other 7 will certainly fancy their chances of progressing. I just think Roscommon are there to make up the numbers and look to be physically a long way off the other three teams.

If Monaghan win today, as expected, then you have a very interesting group. Monaghan are a seasoned Div 1 side, Galway are progressing, Kerry have a lot of exciting forwards and Kildare have momentum in their favour. None of the four sides should have reason to fear the other as there is not a great deal between him.

I think it will be between us and Donegal for the 2nd place in our group.

7 of the 8 teams played in Div 1 this year and the only team from Div 1 who didn't make it were eliminated by another Div 1 side.

You've been exposed. By rights you should be banned again for making a second account to circumvent your permanent ban. Mods?

I should be banned for dismissing Roscommon?

Aren't you a sensitive wee soul, maybe run along now and stop diluting from the football discussion with your nonsense.

Reported.


Good snitching.


Your life must be very fulfilling if your Sunday morning consists of grassing posters up on a niche messageboard because they dismiss your team's chances.

I could say something about how pathetic your life must be and potential mental health issues but clearly you say a lot more for that than I ever could.

Do everyone a favour and run along as some of us just want to discuss the football without being slurred or brought down to your level.

Confirmed. Back on the ignore list you go.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:37:10 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 11:35:41 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:33:41 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 11:26:15 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:19:57 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 11:08:24 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:04:19 AM
It should be an interesting Super 8s.

A shame Mayo didn't make it really. Dublin will definitely come out of the Super 8s but I think you could say 6 of the other 7 will certainly fancy their chances of progressing. I just think Roscommon are there to make up the numbers and look to be physically a long way off the other three teams.

If Monaghan win today, as expected, then you have a very interesting group. Monaghan are a seasoned Div 1 side, Galway are progressing, Kerry have a lot of exciting forwards and Kildare have momentum in their favour. None of the four sides should have reason to fear the other as there is not a great deal between him.

I think it will be between us and Donegal for the 2nd place in our group.

7 of the 8 teams played in Div 1 this year and the only team from Div 1 who didn't make it were eliminated by another Div 1 side.

You've been exposed. By rights you should be banned again for making a second account to circumvent your permanent ban. Mods?

I should be banned for dismissing Roscommon?

Aren't you a sensitive wee soul, maybe run along now and stop diluting from the football discussion with your nonsense.

Reported.


Good snitching.


Your life must be very fulfilling if your Sunday morning consists of grassing posters up on a niche messageboard because they dismiss your team's chances.

I could say something about how pathetic your life must be and potential mental health issues but clearly you say a lot more for that than I ever could.

Do everyone a favour and run along as some of us just want to discuss the football without being slurred or brought down to your level.

Confirmed. Back on the ignore list you go.

Now why didn't you do that the first time before throwing a hysterical fit?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 11:42:48 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 08, 2018, 10:44:33 AM
Of the Provincial Champions only Galway from CONNACHT had 2 serious games.
The other 3 won turkey shoots and their combined winning margins must be well over 100 points or would it be 200?!
The only competitïve province is Connacht.
The only qualifer to come up against a real challenge was Kildare in #Newbridgeornowhere imo.
There aren't 8 super teams anyway .
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:46:17 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 11:42:48 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 08, 2018, 10:44:33 AM
Of the Provincial Champions only Galway from CONNACHT had 2 serious games.
The other 3 won turkey shoots and their combined winning margins must be well over 100 points or would it be 200?!
The only competitïve province is Connacht.
The only qualifer to come up against a real challenge was Kildare in #Newbridgeornowhere imo.
There aren't 8 super teams anyway .

Connacht was hardly competitive.

It had two competitive games.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 08, 2018, 11:50:45 AM
At serious comoetitive level
While Ulster had 1 Monaghan  v Tyrone.
Munster had none
Leinster had none.
There's now only 1 Super team.
3 Good teams
4 who are best of the rest
And Mayowestros .
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 11:52:21 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:46:17 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 11:42:48 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 08, 2018, 10:44:33 AM
Of the Provincial Champions only Galway from CONNACHT had 2 serious games.
The other 3 won turkey shoots and their combined winning margins must be well over 100 points or would it be 200?!
The only competitïve province is Connacht.
The only qualifer to come up against a real challenge was Kildare in #Newbridgeornowhere imo.
There aren't 8 super teams anyway .

Connacht was hardly competitive.

It had two competitive games.
Out of 6. Ulster had 0. Same for the other 2.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: imtommygunn on July 08, 2018, 11:55:01 AM
you missed tyrone monaghan and fermanagh monaghan?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:56:15 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 11:52:21 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:46:17 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 11:42:48 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 08, 2018, 10:44:33 AM
Of the Provincial Champions only Galway from CONNACHT had 2 serious games.
The other 3 won turkey shoots and their combined winning margins must be well over 100 points or would it be 200?!
The only competitïve province is Connacht.
The only qualifer to come up against a real challenge was Kildare in #Newbridgeornowhere imo.
There aren't 8 super teams anyway .

Connacht was hardly competitive.

It had two competitive games.
Out of 6. Ulster had 0. Same for the other 2.

It had the same amount of them as Connacht, Tyrone-Monaghan and Monaghan-Fermanagh. The difference between them was we had a high quality contest between Tyrone and Monaghan whereas the two games Galway won were awful with scores at a minimum.


Galway won their Connacht title by an aggregate score of 28 points where they faced the other three best teams in the province. Donegal won their Ulster title by an aggregate score of 31 points without having to face the other two best teams in the province.


I think what you're trying to say flies in the face of facts.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: weareros on July 08, 2018, 12:16:45 PM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:56:15 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 11:52:21 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:46:17 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 11:42:48 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 08, 2018, 10:44:33 AM
Of the Provincial Champions only Galway from CONNACHT had 2 serious games.
The other 3 won turkey shoots and their combined winning margins must be well over 100 points or would it be 200?!
The only competitïve province is Connacht.
The only qualifer to come up against a real challenge was Kildare in #Newbridgeornowhere imo.
There aren't 8 super teams anyway .

Connacht was hardly competitive.

It had two competitive games.
Out of 6. Ulster had 0. Same for the other 2.

It had the same amount of them as Connacht, Tyrone-Monaghan and Monaghan-Fermanagh. The difference between them was we had a high quality contest between Tyrone and Monaghan whereas the two games Galway won were awful with scores at a minimum.


Galway won their Connacht title by an aggregate score of 28 points where they faced the other three best teams in the province. Donegal won their Ulster title by an aggregate score of 31 points without having to face the other two best teams in the province.


I think what you're trying to say flies in the face of facts.

Ah now, would you stop. The Monaghan Fermanagh game was competitive in the same way a constipated man is battling with his arse - one party has shut in shop and not a lot of movement is possible in either direction.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 12:26:52 PM
Quote from: weareros on July 08, 2018, 12:16:45 PM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:56:15 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 11:52:21 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 11:46:17 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 11:42:48 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 08, 2018, 10:44:33 AM
Of the Provincial Champions only Galway from CONNACHT had 2 serious games.
The other 3 won turkey shoots and their combined winning margins must be well over 100 points or would it be 200?!
The only competitïve province is Connacht.
The only qualifer to come up against a real challenge was Kildare in #Newbridgeornowhere imo.
There aren't 8 super teams anyway .

Connacht was hardly competitive.

It had two competitive games.
Out of 6. Ulster had 0. Same for the other 2.

It had the same amount of them as Connacht, Tyrone-Monaghan and Monaghan-Fermanagh. The difference between them was we had a high quality contest between Tyrone and Monaghan whereas the two games Galway won were awful with scores at a minimum.


Galway won their Connacht title by an aggregate score of 28 points where they faced the other three best teams in the province. Donegal won their Ulster title by an aggregate score of 31 points without having to face the other two best teams in the province.


I think what you're trying to say flies in the face of facts.

Ah now, would you stop. The Monaghan Fermanagh game was competitive in the same way a constipated man is battling with his arse - one party has shut in shop and not a lot of movement is possible in either direction.

Pretty similar to the horrible spectacle that was the Connacht final where one side failed to score from play in the second half.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on July 08, 2018, 12:27:09 PM
If Roscommon show up they could give Donegal and Tyrone a good game, the first group is very interesting though.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 08, 2018, 12:36:45 PM
And can everyone from Ros and Connacht ignore the new pest who has arisen on the Board.
Anyone know what sort of prices they'll be charging.
€35? For seats?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 12:41:39 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 08, 2018, 12:36:45 PM
And can everyone from Ros and Connacht ignore the new pest who has arisen on the Board.
Anyone know what sort of prices they'll be charging.
€35? For seats?

Ironic that you want people to ignore facts.

I didn't know this was a messageboard for Connacht Football Propaganda.

I've only put forward rational points backed up by a body of empirical evidence.

The Connacht Football Championship is no more competitive than the Ulster Championship, there were no 21 point victories in Ulster this year.

Mayo have been flying the flag for Connacht Football solo for the last 16 years and are the only Connacht side to win Championship matches at Croke Park in that time.

If that upsets you, then I'm sorry you find reality upsetting.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: PadraicHenryPearse on July 08, 2018, 12:43:39 PM
This isn't a new pest. It's an old pest back. As you said best ignored.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 12:46:05 PM
Ignore the facts so guys.  8)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 01:09:37 PM
Let's see who gets to the semi's.  It does look as though the standard in Ulster is not as good as in the past. Everyone expected Tyrone and to a lesser extent Monaghan to kick on and it didn't happen for whatever reasons.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 01:25:30 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 01:09:37 PM
Let's see who gets to the semi's.  It does look as though the standard in Ulster is not as good as in the past. Everyone expected Tyrone and to a lesser extent Monaghan to kick on and it didn't happen for whatever reasons.

If it's not as good as it was for Ulster when they still have the highest proportion of the last 12 teams (5/12) and will likely have the highest proportion of the last 8 teams (3/8) then I think it says it all for the high standards that are expected in Ulster. Even in our supposed demise, we still top the other provinces.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: straightred on July 08, 2018, 03:40:16 PM
so there you have it.

The 8 teams that make up the super 8 come from this years div 1 or the teams that will be promoted to next years div 1. Of those 10 only Cavan and Mayo  miss out and they were beaten by Donegal & Tyrone and Galway & Kildare (teams from this top 10). Confirms that the league is really good barometer of how things stand
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 04:48:16 PM
3 Ulster, 2 Connacht, 2 Leinster, and 1 Munster. Sin é :)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 05:27:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 04:48:16 PM
3 Ulster, 2 Connacht, 2 Leinster, and 1 Munster. Sin é :)

And everyone says Ulster football is finished.

Just shows the critical lens Ulster gets in comparison to the other provinces.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 08, 2018, 05:54:52 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 08, 2018, 12:36:45 PM
And can everyone from Ros and Connacht ignore the new pest who has arisen on the Board.
Anyone know what sort of prices they'll be charging.
€35? For seats?
30 i hear. A lot of money for supporters of the last 8 teams to fork out over the next 4 weeks especially if they have young familes and are traveling long distances.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Throw ball on July 08, 2018, 06:05:44 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 08, 2018, 05:54:52 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 08, 2018, 12:36:45 PM
And can everyone from Ros and Connacht ignore the new pest who has arisen on the Board.
Anyone know what sort of prices they'll be charging.
€35? For seats?
30 i hear. A lot of money for supporters of the last 8 teams to fork out over the next 4 weeks especially if they have young familes and are traveling long distances.

Roscommon did us a favour yesterday then.  ;D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 06:10:51 PM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 05:27:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 04:48:16 PM
3 Ulster, 2 Connacht, 2 Leinster, and 1 Munster. Sin é :)

And everyone says Ulster football is finished.

Just shows the critical lens Ulster gets in comparison to the other provinces.
I dunno if any will be in the semis.
There is an elite and it isn't 8 strong.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 06:12:12 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 06:10:51 PM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 05:27:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 04:48:16 PM
3 Ulster, 2 Connacht, 2 Leinster, and 1 Munster. Sin é :)

And everyone says Ulster football is finished.

Just shows the critical lens Ulster gets in comparison to the other provinces.
I dunno if any will be in the semis.
There is an elite and it isn't 8 strong.

Probably a better chance than the Connacht sides though.

17 years since a Connacht side outside Mayo reached an All Ireland semi final and there's no Mayo this year.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 08, 2018, 06:32:18 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 06:10:51 PM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 05:27:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 04:48:16 PM
3 Ulster, 2 Connacht, 2 Leinster, and 1 Munster. Sin é :)

And everyone says Ulster football is finished.

Just shows the critical lens Ulster gets in comparison to the other provinces.
I dunno if any will be in the semis.
There is an elite and it isn't 8 strong.
Haven't we 6 teams making the last 8 2 years in a row
Kerry
Galway
Ros
Dublin
Tyrone
Monaghan.
Is that elite enough Seafóidín?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 07:09:50 PM
Charlie Redmond believes that Dublin playing their league games at Croke Park is good for 'clubs and counties all over the country'.

The Hill 16 legend has had his say on the debate about Jim Gavin's team's familiarity with GAA HQ giving them an unfair advantage over their opponents.

He argues that the money raised from Dublin's Croke Park outings benefits the wider GAA community.

"Dublin will be the team in the Super 8s without a home game," the 1995 All-Ireland winner writes in his Sunday World column today.

"Your home ground is the one where the county board maintains the pitch, tries to improve the facilities for players and supporters, where all the county's inter-county teams can train if they want to.

"None of that applies to Croke Park. All of the above applies to Parnell Park.

"Dublin choose to play their league matches in Croke Park to get extra money for everyone. The Allianz League receipts are divided by 32.

"Most of their championship games are fixed for Croker so that the thousands of people who want to see them and their opponents play can do so in comfort.

"And so that clubs and counties all over the country can get grants from GAA HQ to improve their own pitches, clubhouses and coaching programmes."





I wonder if Charlie could say this with a straight face when being asked.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GalwayBayBoy on July 08, 2018, 07:14:14 PM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 07:09:50 PM
Charlie Redmond believes that Dublin playing their league games at Croke Park is good for 'clubs and counties all over the country'.

The Hill 16 legend has had his say on the debate about Jim Gavin's team's familiarity with GAA HQ giving them an unfair advantage over their opponents.

He argues that the money raised from Dublin's Croke Park outings benefits the wider GAA community.

"Dublin will be the team in the Super 8s without a home game," the 1995 All-Ireland winner writes in his Sunday World column today.

"Your home ground is the one where the county board maintains the pitch, tries to improve the facilities for players and supporters, where all the county's inter-county teams can train if they want to.

"None of that applies to Croke Park. All of the above applies to Parnell Park.

"Dublin choose to play their league matches in Croke Park to get extra money for everyone. The Allianz League receipts are divided by 32.

"Most of their championship games are fixed for Croker so that the thousands of people who want to see them and their opponents play can do so in comfort.

"And so that clubs and counties all over the country can get grants from GAA HQ to improve their own pitches, clubhouses and coaching programmes."





I wonder if Charlie could say this with a straight face when being asked.

If The Onion covered GAA I imagine they would come up with something liks this. ;D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Orchard park on July 08, 2018, 07:32:57 PM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 05:27:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 04:48:16 PM
3 Ulster, 2 Connacht, 2 Leinster, and 1 Munster. Sin é :)

And everyone says Ulster football is finished.

Just shows the critical lens Ulster gets in comparison to the other provinces.

How Many  will be in the last 4 ??
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 07:34:18 PM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 08, 2018, 07:32:57 PM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 05:27:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 04:48:16 PM
3 Ulster, 2 Connacht, 2 Leinster, and 1 Munster. Sin é :)

And everyone says Ulster football is finished.

Just shows the critical lens Ulster gets in comparison to the other provinces.

How Many  will be in the last 4 ??

Erm... isn't that what the Super 8s are about, d'oh!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: longballin on July 08, 2018, 07:37:38 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 07:34:18 PM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 08, 2018, 07:32:57 PM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 05:27:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 04:48:16 PM
3 Ulster, 2 Connacht, 2 Leinster, and 1 Munster. Sin é :)

And everyone says Ulster football is finished.

Just shows the critical lens Ulster gets in comparison to the other provinces.

How Many  will be in the last 4 ??

Erm... isn't that what the Super 8s are about, d'oh!

wont be an Ulster team in the final that's for sure.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 07:58:45 PM
If it was as per last year and the r4 winners were paired against the provincial winners, which of the qualifiers would have a chance and against whom?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Orchard park on July 08, 2018, 08:02:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 07:34:18 PM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 08, 2018, 07:32:57 PM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 05:27:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 04:48:16 PM
3 Ulster, 2 Connacht, 2 Leinster, and 1 Munster. Sin é :)

And everyone says Ulster football is finished.

Just shows the critical lens Ulster gets in comparison to the other provinces.

How Many  will be in the last 4 ??

Erm... isn't that what the Super 8s are about, d'oh!

Doh sraith ban... how many does an intellectual like you expect to be in the last 4 ????
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 08:02:54 PM
Quote from: longballin on July 08, 2018, 07:37:38 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 07:34:18 PM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 08, 2018, 07:32:57 PM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 05:27:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 04:48:16 PM
3 Ulster, 2 Connacht, 2 Leinster, and 1 Munster. Sin é :)

And everyone says Ulster football is finished.

Just shows the critical lens Ulster gets in comparison to the other provinces.

How Many  will be in the last 4 ??

Erm... isn't that what the Super 8s are about, d'oh!

wont be an Ulster team in the final that's for sure.

This is the sort of nonsense that gives a discussion board a bad name -- so what do you suggest, just pack up and accept the 'inevitable'? Or actually strive to alter the established narrative, and do a 2003 on it?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 08:05:11 PM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 08, 2018, 08:02:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 07:34:18 PM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 08, 2018, 07:32:57 PM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 05:27:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 04:48:16 PM
3 Ulster, 2 Connacht, 2 Leinster, and 1 Munster. Sin é :)

And everyone says Ulster football is finished.

Just shows the critical lens Ulster gets in comparison to the other provinces.

How Many  will be in the last 4 ??

Erm... isn't that what the Super 8s are about, d'oh!

Doh sraith ban... how many does an intellectual like you expect to be in the last 4 ????

Huh, like 2017? Albeit we'll need to step up markedly to make a final, and not looking too likely right now.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: PadraicHenryPearse on July 08, 2018, 08:07:57 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 08:02:54 PM
Quote from: longballin on July 08, 2018, 07:37:38 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 07:34:18 PM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 08, 2018, 07:32:57 PM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 08, 2018, 05:27:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 04:48:16 PM
3 Ulster, 2 Connacht, 2 Leinster, and 1 Munster. Sin é :)

And everyone says Ulster football is finished.

Just shows the critical lens Ulster gets in comparison to the other provinces.

How Many  will be in the last 4 ??

Erm... isn't that what the Super 8s are about, d'oh!

wont be an Ulster team in the final that's for sure.

This is the sort of nonsense that gives a discussion board a bad name -- so what do you suggest, just pack up and accept the 'inevitable'? Or actually strive to alter the established narrative, and do a 2003 on it?

definitely the sort of nonsense that give a discussion forum a bad name.

on: Today at 01:45:54 PM »
Paddy Power has Tír Eoghain @ 4-9, and Ros @ 9-4, which isn't too far away I'd say. Sure knock yourselves out Rossies.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Orchard park on July 08, 2018, 08:08:30 PM
Sraith,

I asked how many Ulster counties in the last  4, not a myopic  Tyrone question....


But fair dues for not denying hisgory of 2017........ genuine question,  do you think you are now stronger than you were prior to Dublin teaching mickey a lesson  in football.... what has changed ???
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 08:11:18 PM
Quote from: PadraicHenryPearse on July 08, 2018, 08:07:57 PM

definitely the sort of nonsense that give a discussion forum a bad name.

on: Today at 01:45:54 PM »
Paddy Power has Tír Eoghain @ 4-9, and Ros @ 9-4, which isn't too far away I'd say. Sure knock yourselves out Rossies.


So have you bet your house, or are you happy to take pot shots at the messenger?  :P
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: PadraicHenryPearse on July 08, 2018, 08:15:57 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 08:11:18 PM
Quote from: PadraicHenryPearse on July 08, 2018, 08:07:57 PM

definitely the sort of nonsense that give a discussion forum a bad name.

on: Today at 01:45:54 PM »
Paddy Power has Tír Eoghain @ 4-9, and Ros @ 9-4, which isn't too far away I'd say. Sure knock yourselves out Rossies.


So have you bet your house, or are you happy to take pot shots at the messenger?  :P

what makes  you believe I think the rossies will win?

I just think that comment and the above give a forum a bad name. its the type of discussion that goes on in soccer threads.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 08:20:55 PM
Quote from: PadraicHenryPearse on July 08, 2018, 08:15:57 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 08:11:18 PM
Quote from: PadraicHenryPearse on July 08, 2018, 08:07:57 PM

definitely the sort of nonsense that give a discussion forum a bad name.

on: Today at 01:45:54 PM »
Paddy Power has Tír Eoghain @ 4-9, and Ros @ 9-4, which isn't too far away I'd say. Sure knock yourselves out Rossies.


So have you bet your house, or are you happy to take pot shots at the messenger?  :P

what makes  you believe I think the rossies will win?

I just think that comment and the above give a forum a bad name. its the type of discussion that goes on in soccer threads.

If you have an issue with Paddy Power and the odds they've set, take it up with them, and cease with parading your insecurities hereon, are you really from Meath? :P
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: PadraicHenryPearse on July 08, 2018, 08:25:44 PM
And you continue with the condescending... which is my issue.

I have no issues with odds if anything I think they over estimate Roscommon but then again Tyrone didn't look great  against Meath or Cavan. Mayo had a similar wobble last year so you never know.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 08:32:08 PM
"Condescension" - sure isn't that what it's all about? And am I not entitled to question meek submission?

If we lose next weekend, then up my hole, once again. Leán ar aghaidh. :)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: PadraicHenryPearse on July 08, 2018, 08:35:23 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 08:32:08 PM
"Condescension" - sure isn't that what it's all about? And am I not entitled to question meek submission?

If we lose next weekend, then up my hole, once again. Leán ar aghaidh. :)

Obviously for you but not for most gaa people I know.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 08:40:52 PM
It's funny, sort of, just to point out the (relative) strength of Ulster in the last 8, and how it unleashes all sorts of prejudices and preconceptions. Feck it!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: PadraicHenryPearse on July 08, 2018, 08:43:46 PM
If that's all you were doing I'd have no issue with it. Now you are the victim. Well played.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 08:48:00 PM
Quote from: PadraicHenryPearse on July 08, 2018, 08:43:46 PM
If that's all you were doing I'd have no issue with it. Now you are the victim. Well played.

So what's your particular problem, that I quoted Paddy Power odds? Or is there something less Padraic Pearsesque at play?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on July 08, 2018, 09:01:32 PM
Tyrone's form going into the Super 8 means nothing. It's all about being here. This is were the season starts. Sure we even didn't bother about the McKenna cup this year.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 09:25:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 08:48:00 PM
Quote from: PadraicHenryPearse on July 08, 2018, 08:43:46 PM
If that's all you were doing I'd have no issue with it. Now you are the victim. Well played.

So what's your particular problem, that I quoted Paddy Power odds? Or is there something less Padraic Pearsesque at play?

Tone it down a tad.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 08, 2018, 09:29:17 PM
Roll on next week. All 8 teams arrive having put up a very good performance. The first week will be great and the second week will be even better, with all four provincial champions playing away from home. Let's hope there's plenty to play for come the third round.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 09:36:56 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 08, 2018, 09:25:04 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 08:48:00 PM
Quote from: PadraicHenryPearse on July 08, 2018, 08:43:46 PM
If that's all you were doing I'd have no issue with it. Now you are the victim. Well played.

So what's your particular problem, that I quoted Paddy Power odds? Or is there something less Padraic Pearsesque at play?

Tone it down a tad.

Thanks man, no better source of advice, truly :P ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Orchard park on July 08, 2018, 09:41:36 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2018, 08:40:52 PM
It's funny, sort of, just to point out the (relative) strength of Ulster in the last 8, and how it unleashes all sorts of prejudices and preconceptions. Feck it!

The actual strength will be much clearer in e weeks time
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 08, 2018, 09:51:53 PM
Quote from: hardstation on July 08, 2018, 08:10:22 PM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 08, 2018, 08:08:30 PM
Sraith,

I asked how many Ulster counties in the last  4, not a myopic  Tyrone question....


But fair dues for not denying hisgory of 2017........ genuine question,  do you think you are now stronger than you were prior to Dublin teaching mickey a lesson  in football.... what has changed ???
Definitely 1, maybe 2.

Will be bad for Ulster football if one of Donegal or Tyrone don't reach the last 4. Monaghan have probably gone as far as they will go but I hope I'm proven wrong.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: An Watcher on July 08, 2018, 10:34:31 PM
Monaghan home to Kerry and away to Galway.  They will fear neither.  Can't help but feel home advantage will be massive in these games and wouldn't be surprised to see Kerry eliminated.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on July 08, 2018, 10:37:11 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 08, 2018, 09:29:17 PM
Roll on next week. All 8 teams arrive having put up a very good performance. The first week will be great and the second week will be even better, with all four provincial champions playing away from home. Let's hope there's plenty to play for come the third round.
Are the provincial champions not at home in week 2?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 08, 2018, 10:51:18 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on July 08, 2018, 10:37:11 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 08, 2018, 09:29:17 PM
Roll on next week. All 8 teams arrive having put up a very good performance. The first week will be great and the second week will be even better, with all four provincial champions playing away from home. Let's hope there's plenty to play for come the third round.
Are the provincial champions not at home in week 2?
No provincial champs not at home until Round 3.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on July 08, 2018, 10:55:08 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on July 08, 2018, 10:37:11 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 08, 2018, 09:29:17 PM
Roll on next week. All 8 teams arrive having put up a very good performance. The first week will be great and the second week will be even better, with all four provincial champions playing away from home. Let's hope there's plenty to play for come the third round.
Are the provincial champions not at home in week 2?

No, home game in the final round. This is something that I'd like to see changed as it seems to disadvantage the provincial winners. On the other hand, I think the qualifiers should have a week break before the super 8s begin
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on July 08, 2018, 11:02:40 PM
Quote from: hardstation on July 08, 2018, 10:58:44 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 08, 2018, 10:55:08 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on July 08, 2018, 10:37:11 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 08, 2018, 09:29:17 PM
Roll on next week. All 8 teams arrive having put up a very good performance. The first week will be great and the second week will be even better, with all four provincial champions playing away from home. Let's hope there's plenty to play for come the third round.
Are the provincial champions not at home in week 2?

No, home game in the final round. This is something that I'd like to see changed as it seems to disadvantage the provincial winners. On the other hand, I think the qualifiers should have a week break before the super 8s begin
How does it disadvantage them?

For the two teams that lose the first game, the qualifier has a home game next while the provincial winner has to play away (potentially) looking to keep their season alive. Small enough thing but still a disadvantage imo
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 11:08:22 PM
Ros are 3/1 against Tyrone which looks attractive
The aim of the competition is to go further than the Super 8 .
Odds in order are Dubs, Kerry, Galway, Donegal , Tyrone, Monaghan, Kildare and Roscommon
It will be interesting to see how the qualifiers  get on
for Kildare and Ros getting to the super 8 is already an achievement.
Tyrone and Monaghan would presumably be hoping for a semifinal.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on July 08, 2018, 11:09:59 PM
Quote from: hardstation on July 08, 2018, 10:58:44 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 08, 2018, 10:55:08 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on July 08, 2018, 10:37:11 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 08, 2018, 09:29:17 PM
Roll on next week. All 8 teams arrive having put up a very good performance. The first week will be great and the second week will be even better, with all four provincial champions playing away from home. Let's hope there's plenty to play for come the third round.
Are the provincial champions not at home in week 2?

No, home game in the final round. This is something that I'd like to see changed as it seems to disadvantage the provincial winners. On the other hand, I think the qualifiers should have a week break before the super 8s begin
How does it disadvantage them?

Put yourself in Galway or Donegal's shoes.

Both are expected to lose first time out against Kerry and Dublin respectively.

Galway would then be facing into the bear pit of Newbridge while Donegal then have a losable game in Roscommon.

For me Galway are on a really sticky wicket as regards the fixture schedule.

I think Kildare could take Monaghan next week and if they do, they could put Galway out in Newbridge.

Tyrone's schedule is a good one with a view to them contending for an All-Ireland final place.

They'll beat Roscommon and then have what is effectively a free shot at Dublin in Omagh.

If they come through the group, I feel that free shot at Dublin will benefit them hugely in a semi-final and/or final.



Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 08, 2018, 11:29:27 PM
http://hoganstand.com/Article/Index/287562 (http://hoganstand.com/Article/Index/287562)

"Dublin will be the team in the Super 8s without a home game"


July 08, 2018

Charlie Redmond believes that Dublin playing their league games at Croke Park is good for 'clubs and counties all over the country'.

The Hill 16 legend has had his say on the debate about Jim Gavin's team's familiarity with GAA HQ giving them an unfair advantage over their opponents.

He argues that the money raised from Dublin's Croke Park outings benefits the wider GAA community.

"Dublin will be the team in the Super 8s without a home game," the 1995 All-Ireland winner writes in his Sunday World column today.

"Your home ground is the one where the county board maintains the pitch, tries to improve the facilities for players and supporters, where all the county's inter-county teams can train if they want to.

"None of that applies to Croke Park. All of the above applies to Parnell Park.

"Dublin choose to play their league matches in Croke Park to get extra money for everyone. The Allianz League receipts are divided by 32.

"Most of their championship games are fixed for Croker so that the thousands of people who want to see them and their opponents play can do so in comfort.

"And so that clubs and counties all over the country can get grants from GAA HQ to improve their own pitches, clubhouses and coaching programmes."
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 08, 2018, 11:45:26 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 08, 2018, 11:29:27 PM
http://hoganstand.com/Article/Index/287562 (http://hoganstand.com/Article/Index/287562)

"Dublin will be the team in the Super 8s without a home game"


July 08, 2018

Charlie Redmond believes that Dublin playing their league games at Croke Park is good for 'clubs and counties all over the country'.

The Hill 16 legend has had his say on the debate about Jim Gavin's team's familiarity with GAA HQ giving them an unfair advantage over their opponents.

He argues that the money raised from Dublin's Croke Park outings benefits the wider GAA community.

"Dublin will be the team in the Super 8s without a home game," the 1995 All-Ireland winner writes in his Sunday World column today.

"Your home ground is the one where the county board maintains the pitch, tries to improve the facilities for players and supporters, where all the county's inter-county teams can train if they want to.

"None of that applies to Croke Park. All of the above applies to Parnell Park.

"Dublin choose to play their league matches in Croke Park to get extra money for everyone. The Allianz League receipts are divided by 32.

"Most of their championship games are fixed for Croker so that the thousands of people who want to see them and their opponents play can do so in comfort.

"And so that clubs and counties all over the country can get grants from GAA HQ to improve their own pitches, clubhouses and coaching programmes."

Don't know whether to laugh or to cry. Such a serious load of bollix that article. Can't have a straight face writing that.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 08, 2018, 11:55:00 PM
Quote from: sid waddell on July 08, 2018, 11:09:59 PM

Put yourself in Galway or Donegal's shoes.

Both are expected to lose first time out against Kerry and Dublin respectively.

Galway would then be facing into the bear pit of Newbridge while Donegal then have a losable game in Roscommon.

For me Galway are on a really sticky wicket as regards the fixture schedule.

I think Kildare could take Monaghan next week and if they do, they could put Galway out in Newbridge.

Tyrone's schedule is a good one with a view to them contending for an All-Ireland final place.

They'll beat Roscommon and then have what is effectively a free shot at Dublin in Omagh.

If they come through the group, I feel that free shot at Dublin will benefit them hugely in a semi-final and/or final.

Putting myself in Galway shoes i would have 4 week break while the time round 2 comes around Kildare will be playing in their 5th game in 5 weeks and a fresher Galway should be prevailing there. They then have Monaghan at home to reach the semi final. You can see why the bookies have Galway favourties to finish in the top two in this group.

Tyrone will probably need to win two games i can't see them beating Dublin and Ballybofey is one of the toughest places to pick up a victory
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baggio90 on July 09, 2018, 12:04:55 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 11:08:22 PM
Ros are 3/1 against Tyrone which looks attractive
The aim of the competition is to go further than the Super 8 .
Odds in order are Dubs, Kerry, Galway, Donegal , Tyrone, Monaghan, Kildare and Roscommon
It will be interesting to see how the qualifiers  get on
for Kildare and Ros getting to the super 8 is already an achievement.
Tyrone and Monaghan would presumably be hoping for a semifinal.

Are Galway hoping for a semi final? You'd imagine they'd have to be having failed to make one for the past 16 years.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 09, 2018, 12:05:03 AM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 08, 2018, 11:55:00 PM
...

Tyrone will probably need to win two games i can't see them beating Dublin and Ballybofey is one of the toughest places to pick up a victory

Agreed. 

Best we can hope for, realistically, is a draw in both Omagh and Ballybofey, but sure all to play, and go all out, for. :)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: joemamas on July 09, 2018, 12:19:15 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 08, 2018, 11:45:26 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 08, 2018, 11:29:27 PM
http://hoganstand.com/Article/Index/287562 (http://hoganstand.com/Article/Index/287562)

"Dublin will be the team in the Super 8s without a home game"


July 08, 2018

Charlie Redmond believes that Dublin playing their league games at Croke Park is good for 'clubs and counties all over the country'.

The Hill 16 legend has had his say on the debate about Jim Gavin's team's familiarity with GAA HQ giving them an unfair advantage over their opponents.

He argues that the money raised from Dublin's Croke Park outings benefits the wider GAA community.

"Dublin will be the team in the Super 8s without a home game," the 1995 All-Ireland winner writes in his Sunday World column today.

"Your home ground is the one where the county board maintains the pitch, tries to improve the facilities for players and supporters, where all the county's inter-county teams can train if they want to.

"None of that applies to Croke Park. All of the above applies to Parnell Park.

"Dublin choose to play their league matches in Croke Park to get extra money for everyone. The Allianz League receipts are divided by 32.

"Most of their championship games are fixed for Croker so that the thousands of people who want to see them and their opponents play can do so in comfort.

"And so that clubs and counties all over the country can get grants from GAA HQ to improve their own pitches, clubhouses and coaching programmes."

Don't know whether to laugh or to cry. Such a serious load of bollix that article. Can't have a straight face writing that.

+1

Does not come across as the sharpest tool in the shed
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 09, 2018, 05:18:41 AM
Quote from: Baggio90 on July 09, 2018, 12:04:55 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 08, 2018, 11:08:22 PM
Ros are 3/1 against Tyrone which looks attractive
The aim of the competition is to go further than the Super 8 .
Odds in order are Dubs, Kerry, Galway, Donegal , Tyrone, Monaghan, Kildare and Roscommon
It will be interesting to see how the qualifiers  get on
for Kildare and Ros getting to the super 8 is already an achievement.
Tyrone and Monaghan would presumably be hoping for a semifinal.

Are Galway hoping for a semi final? You'd imagine they'd have to be having failed to make one for the past 16 years.
You would alright. 2016 and 2017 ended very disappointingly
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 09, 2018, 07:07:49 AM
A lot of things can change in a month

https://youtu.be/bkg8FQl7TXI
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on July 09, 2018, 07:57:03 AM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 08, 2018, 10:51:18 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on July 08, 2018, 10:37:11 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 08, 2018, 09:29:17 PM
Roll on next week. All 8 teams arrive having put up a very good performance. The first week will be great and the second week will be even better, with all four provincial champions playing away from home. Let's hope there's plenty to play for come the third round.
Are the provincial champions not at home in week 2?
No provincial champs not at home until Round 3.
From The Bunker, in light of the above, are you still confident the Dubs won't play a non-dead rubber game outside Croke Park? ;D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 09, 2018, 08:01:28 AM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 08, 2018, 10:55:08 PM
Quote from: Esmarelda on July 08, 2018, 10:37:11 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 08, 2018, 09:29:17 PM
Roll on next week. All 8 teams arrive having put up a very good performance. The first week will be great and the second week will be even better, with all four provincial champions playing away from home. Let's hope there's plenty to play for come the third round.
Are the provincial champions not at home in week 2?

No, home game in the final round. This is something that I'd like to see changed as it seems to disadvantage the provincial winners. On the other hand, I think the qualifiers should have a week break before the super 8s begin

I think it's much better the way it is.

The provincial champions have home advantage in the final game, which can be crucial. If provincial winners don't have their away game until the last game, they may already be qualified before their away game. There'd be [even more] uproar if Dublin's last game was away, as it could potentially be meaningless
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 09, 2018, 08:04:05 AM
Just realised that the hurling quarter-finals (Clare v Wex and KK v Lim) are on next weekend also.

They'll both be live presumably, so probably means one or two of the football games won't be covered live.

Looking at the expected TV coverage, it looks like RTE may be covering 3 games on Sunday, with coverage starting at 1230.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: blewuporstuffed on July 09, 2018, 08:29:04 AM
Quote from: Hound on July 09, 2018, 08:04:05 AM
Just realised that the hurling quarter-finals (Clare v Wex and KK v Lim) are on next weekend also.

They'll both be live presumably, so probably means one or two of the football games won't be covered live.

Looking at the expected TV coverage, it looks like RTE may be covering 3 games on Sunday, with coverage starting at 1230.

The TV coverage seems to be a complete shambles this year to be honest. It its split over far to many broadcasters and online services and its hard to keep track of who is showing what /when.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 09, 2018, 10:04:51 AM
I see Brolly has tweeted that RTE covering Dublin v Donegal live.

Lee Keegan on the panel, along with himself and T O'Se.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 09, 2018, 10:10:05 AM
Quote from: Hound on July 09, 2018, 08:04:05 AM
Just realised that the hurling quarter-finals (Clare v Wex and KK v Lim) are on next weekend also.

They'll both be live presumably, so probably means one or two of the football games won't be covered live.

Looking at the expected TV coverage, it looks like RTE may be covering 3 games on Sunday, with coverage starting at 1230.
The schedule is compacted because they have moved the all Irelands into August despite having more games between the Super 8 and round robin in hurling.
There is no margin for replays. They have to have another look at this for next week.
It's not fair on Kilkenny to have to play a quarter final a week after a very intensive Leinster final replay, for example.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 09, 2018, 10:40:08 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 09, 2018, 10:10:05 AM
Quote from: Hound on July 09, 2018, 08:04:05 AM
Just realised that the hurling quarter-finals (Clare v Wex and KK v Lim) are on next weekend also.

They'll both be live presumably, so probably means one or two of the football games won't be covered live.

Looking at the expected TV coverage, it looks like RTE may be covering 3 games on Sunday, with coverage starting at 1230.
The schedule is compacted because they have moved the all Irelands into August despite having more games between the Super 8 and round robin in hurling.
There is no margin for replays. They have to have another look at this for next week.
It's not fair on Kilkenny to have to play a quarter final a week after a very intensive Leinster final replay, for example.
It was a mistake not allowing Galway and Kilkenny play extra time the first day.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: JoG2 on July 09, 2018, 10:58:19 AM
Quote from: blewuporstuffed on July 09, 2018, 08:29:04 AM
Quote from: Hound on July 09, 2018, 08:04:05 AM
Just realised that the hurling quarter-finals (Clare v Wex and KK v Lim) are on next weekend also.

They'll both be live presumably, so probably means one or two of the football games won't be covered live.

Looking at the expected TV coverage, it looks like RTE may be covering 3 games on Sunday, with coverage starting at 1230.

The TV coverage seems to be a complete shambles this year to be honest. It its split over far to many broadcasters and online services and its hard to keep track of who is showing what /when.

the Hoganstand fixtures section is good for keeping an eye on who is broadcasting what games BUOS
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 09, 2018, 01:26:50 PM
I could swear sky mentioned they were covering roscommon v Tyrone on Saturday at 5. Did anyone else see this?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 09, 2018, 01:31:57 PM
Just confirmed this minute by the GAA. As expected, 5pm and 7pm for group2 on Saturday. 2 and 4 on Sunday for group 1.
Sky show first game, RTE show second on both days.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 09, 2018, 01:37:49 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 09, 2018, 01:31:57 PM
Just confirmed this minute by the GAA. As expected, 5pm and 7pm for group2 on Saturday. 2 and 4 on Sunday for group 1.
Sky show first game, RTE show second on both days.

6 live games this weekend. Kildare v Monaghan (Sky) and Kilkenny v Limerick (RTE) both on Sunday at 2pm
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: JoG2 on July 09, 2018, 01:50:49 PM
Saturday 14 July

All-Ireland SFC quarter-final phase 1
Donegal v Dublin, Croke Park, 7pm - RTE
Tyrone v Roscommon, Croke Park, 5pm - Sky


Sunday 15 July

All-Ireland SFC quarter-final phase 1
Kerry v Galway, Croke Park, 4pm - RTE
Kildare v Monaghan, Croke Park, 2pm - Sky
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: WT4E on July 09, 2018, 03:11:33 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 08, 2018, 11:55:00 PM
Tyrone will probably need to win two games i can't see them beating Dublin and Ballybofey is one of the toughest places to pick up a victory

Interesting that so many people are putting alot of weight behind Donegals home record. I would discount the league as you just never know who have there best team out or experimenting at that time of the year.

When you look at their record over the last 10 years in championship They have played 14 losing 4 and winning 10. Of those 10 they have beaten:

Antrim x 2
Derry x 2
Fermanagh
08 Roscommon
Carlow
09 Clare
Cavan
Tyrone

Its a mixed bag of talent in there so not as if they have been beaten top teams all along. The day they beat Tyrone there there was a nasty atmosphere at the game from memory with Donegal really hyped up to beat Tyrone - I don't think that will be matched this time around. Tyrone have had the better of Donegal in the last seaon or two.

I am confident that Tyrone can turn them over when they meet.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Norf Tyrone on July 09, 2018, 03:56:19 PM
When will they announce dates and times for R2 and R3?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 04:48:48 PM
Probably Monday 16th and Monday 30th?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 09, 2018, 04:52:42 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 04:48:48 PM
Probably Monday 16th and Monday 30th?

They really should be able to announce all these fixtures today.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: shark on July 09, 2018, 04:53:37 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 09, 2018, 04:52:42 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 04:48:48 PM
Probably Monday 16th and Monday 30th?

They really should be able to announce all these fixtures today.

They should, it's a nonsense.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: An Fhairche Abu on July 09, 2018, 05:06:37 PM
It would be absolutely right that all the fixtures/dates/times for the 3 rounds should be announced now, are they waiting to see how the matches go this weekend first so that TV can pick out what might be better match ups based on the 1st round results?
One thing to watch out for is the second round of games, are Galway and Kildare going to be put out on the following Saturday in Newbridge if TV scheduling dictates that, despite both having played on the previous Sunday?
If right was right then those playing this Saturday should be out the following Saturday again, with Group 1 games played on Sunday the 22nd to give 7 days to all teams but given how some fixtures have been made by the CCCC this summer who knows what will happen.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 09, 2018, 05:10:13 PM
Quote from: shark on July 09, 2018, 04:53:37 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 09, 2018, 04:52:42 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 04:48:48 PM
Probably Monday 16th and Monday 30th?

They really should be able to announce all these fixtures today.

They should, it's a nonsense.

Yep, makes you think.

I wonder might Tyrone, Kildare and/or Roscommon be incentivised to volunteer to move their home game to Clones, Portlaoise, Castlebar, so more fans can see it?

Can't remember what the second round games in Group 1 are. But for Kildare, in particular, it might make a lot of sense, as they'd fill Portlaoise and maybe have 70%+ of the crowd, whereas in Newbridge they'd only have 50%. Would Rossies share of the crowd would increase in Castlebar? Not much benefit for Tyrone as it'd probably still be 50/50 (not sure if Sean Cav's claim they play better in Clones than Omagh holds any water?)

Probably depend on results, but be interesting to hear thoughts of respective fans of the three teams to see if they'd have a strong feeling either way.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 09, 2018, 05:13:37 PM
I'd have better memories of Tyrone in Clones than in Omagh but I can't see Tyrone handing that home advantage away at all. I'd be a bit disappointed if any team did tbh because I think that the smaller venues getting these big games is one of the highlights of the Super 8.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: J70 on July 09, 2018, 05:18:59 PM
Big time. Omagh, Hyde Park and Ballybofey is where these games belong.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 09, 2018, 05:22:37 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 09, 2018, 05:13:37 PM
I'd have better memories of Tyrone in Clones than in Omagh but I can't see Tyrone handing that home advantage away at all. I'd be a bit disappointed if any team did tbh because I think that the smaller venues getting these big games is one of the highlights of the Super 8.
Yeah, agreed
Kildare is probably the only one worth a second thought.
If 20,000 Kildare people turn up on Sunday and then are told only 4,000 of you can come next week, it does cause at least a pause. But maybe best if it does stay in Newbridge
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 05:24:01 PM
Hyde for us.
Anyway as the Qtr Finals are a 3 games series you won't have as big a travelling support as for knock out games.
I wouldn't see us v Donegal going much over 12k.
I too suspect not making the Phase 2 and 3 fixtures is to leave room for venue manoeuvres.
If results follow popular expectations Dublin will have qualified and we'll be gone by the time our trip to play them comes around.
20k in Croker with a Dublin B selection playing a disinterested Ros won't be much of a spectacle.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: J70 on July 09, 2018, 05:25:55 PM
Quote from: WT4E on July 09, 2018, 03:11:33 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 08, 2018, 11:55:00 PM
Tyrone will probably need to win two games i can't see them beating Dublin and Ballybofey is one of the toughest places to pick up a victory

Interesting that so many people are putting alot of weight behind Donegals home record. I would discount the league as you just never know who have there best team out or experimenting at that time of the year.

When you look at their record over the last 10 years in championship They have played 14 losing 4 and winning 10. Of those 10 they have beaten:

Antrim x 2
Derry x 2
Fermanagh
08 Roscommon
Carlow
09 Clare
Cavan
Tyrone

Its a mixed bag of talent in there so not as if they have been beaten top teams all along. The day they beat Tyrone there there was a nasty atmosphere at the game from memory with Donegal really hyped up to beat Tyrone - I don't think that will be matched this time around. Tyrone have had the better of Donegal in the last seaon or two.

I am confident that Tyrone can turn them over when they meet.

Donegal haven't lost ANY game in Ballybofey since 2010. In the two years before that they lost there to Derry, Antrim and Monaghan in championship. Shows you the change McGuinness precipitated.

BTW Tyrone were beaten there in the championship in 2013 AND 2015. Not that I think that matters much this year. Tyrone did hammer us last year (2016 was a toss up), while we have lost our primary attacker going into the Super 8s.

But I still fancy a nice hostile welcome for the Tyronies, assuming there is anything to play for on our part.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 09, 2018, 05:43:07 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 05:24:01 PM
Hyde for us.
Anyway as the Qtr Finals are a 3 games series you won't have as big a travelling support as for knock out games.
I wouldn't see us v Donegal going much over 12k.
I too suspect not making the Phase 2 and 3 fixtures is to leave room for venue manoeuvres.
If results follow popular expectations Dublin will have qualified and we'll be gone by the time our trip to play them comes around.
20k in Croker with a Dublin B selection playing a disinterested Ros won't be much of a spectacle.

Yeah I don't see any way Tyrone or Ross will give up home advantage. No I'm not sure of the accuracy of it but Wiki has Omagh at 26.5k and the Hyde at 25k. Not sure what the actual capacity of either is but there was just under 19k at the Connacht final there. It may have been resticted to that but wasn't there still showing plenty of room behind the goals for more people??
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 05:45:22 PM
Hyde can comfortably hold well over 25k but it's only licensed for 18,870 until a load of work is done.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 09, 2018, 05:57:11 PM
Thought that alright.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 09, 2018, 06:05:38 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 05:45:22 PM
Hyde can comfortably hold well over 25k but it's only licensed for 18,870 until a load of work is done.

Reaching the AISFs by winning a match at the Hyde would be even sweeter than doing it in Croke Park..
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Aughafad on July 09, 2018, 06:15:47 PM
With Tyrone's record at Healy park so abysmal, I can see Harte asking the county board to move it to clones. A venue dublin wouldn't have any history with and it has a good surface compared to the burnt bog that is Healy park
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 09, 2018, 06:17:12 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 09, 2018, 06:05:38 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 05:45:22 PM
Hyde can comfortably hold well over 25k but it's only licensed for 18,870 until a load of work is done.

Reaching the AISFs by winning a match at the Hyde would be even sweeter than doing it in Croke Park..
sure Syf didn't plenty of Ros teams do that in the past when there was no super 8?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 06:32:28 PM
1977, 1980, 1990, 1991.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: longballin on July 09, 2018, 06:36:57 PM
Quote from: Aughafad on July 09, 2018, 06:15:47 PM
With Tyrone's record at Healy park so abysmal, I can see Harte asking the county board to move it to clones. A venue dublin wouldn't have any history with and it has a good surface compared to the burnt bog that is Healy park

Dubs beat Derry in a backdoor championship game in Clones in 2003. Was thousands of Dublin supporters there and a great atmosphere.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 06:42:45 PM
Just wondering how do people in the 17 Football Counties that haven't made the last 8 feel about it now?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 09, 2018, 06:50:14 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 06:42:45 PM
Just wondering how do people in the 17 Football Counties that haven't made the last 8 feel about it now?

Inferior to Roscommon.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: lenny on July 09, 2018, 06:53:00 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 06:42:45 PM
Just wondering how do people in the 17 Football Counties that haven't made the last 8 feel about it now?

8 + 17 = 25. Maths not your strong point. As a gaa fan from one of the crap 24s I'm a bit ambivalent about the super 8s. Just patiently waiting for the real action to start in the AI semifinals.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Kuwabatake Sanjuro on July 09, 2018, 06:53:58 PM
He did mention footballing counties.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ck on July 09, 2018, 07:09:00 PM
Any sign of Super 8 fixtures for next 3 wks??? Why the delay?
CCCC get the finger out
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on July 09, 2018, 07:11:17 PM
Do they not sell juvenile hill tickets?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 09, 2018, 07:13:01 PM
Quote from: ck on July 09, 2018, 07:09:00 PM
Any sign of Super 8 fixtures for next 3 wks??? Why the delay?
CCCC get the finger out

I'd imagine they're going to see which teams win this weekend from the qualifiers playing each other and decide where to stick TV cameras next week. That will decide the day/time of the games. They certainly won't show all 4 games again next weekend.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 09, 2018, 07:14:07 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 09, 2018, 07:13:01 PM
Quote from: ck on July 09, 2018, 07:09:00 PM
Any sign of Super 8 fixtures for next 3 wks??? Why the delay?
CCCC get the finger out

I'd imagine they're going to see which teams win this weekend from the qualifiers playing each other and decide where to stick TV cameras next week. That will decide the day/time of the games. They certainly won't show all 4 games again next weekend.

Both rights owners literally saved up games just to be able to do that.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 09, 2018, 07:48:05 PM
I thought they were still a few games short of having the ability to show all twelve games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 09, 2018, 07:49:26 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 09, 2018, 07:48:05 PM
I thought they were still a few games short of having the ability to show all twelve games.

If they don't it will be potential dead rubbers next week more than ones next weekend that are likely to miss the cut. No one will be eliminated by next weekend.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 07:55:30 PM
Quote from: lenny on July 09, 2018, 06:53:00 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 06:42:45 PM
Just wondering how do people in the 17 Football Counties that haven't made the last 8 feel about it now?

8 + 17 = 25. Maths not your strong point. As a gaa fan from one of the crap 24s I'm a bit ambivalent about the super 8s. Just patiently waiting for the real action to start in the AI semifinals.
Reading obviously not your strong point.
I said FOOTBALL COUNTIES.
The hurley counties couldn't give 2 hoots.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on July 09, 2018, 07:57:38 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 06:42:45 PM
Just wondering how do people in the 17 Football Counties that haven't made the last 8 feel about it now?

This whole super 8s thing seems very commercial, not to mention unmanly; tbh, I'm glad we're out of it now
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 09, 2018, 08:34:55 PM
I don't like a lot of what the Super 8 stands for and it could have been achieved in a much more equitable manner but by God now we're here I just can't wait. I don't see one game that couldn't potentially be a clinker and few enough games even week 4 that could be 100% dead rubbers. Bring it on baby!!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on July 09, 2018, 09:13:21 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 06:42:45 PM
Just wondering how do people in the 17 Football Counties that haven't made the last 8 feel about it now?

Of course you'd like your county to be there in the thick of it but from a Mayo perspective as the days have rolled in since defeat in newbridge , it's like ahh sure we as a county need a break . Genuinely need a break , it's been an absolutely crazy intesive eight years of constant battles and of course the heartbreak in the end . But like I said genuinely now looking forward to just watching it all unfold. 

Best of luck to yerselves and Galway , I'm not sure either are at the stage to challenge properly for Sam Maguire but deservingly in the last eight on merit.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 09, 2018, 09:33:57 PM
We're going to give the Super 8s a couple of years to iron out any teething problems before we get involved.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 09, 2018, 09:35:31 PM
It'll certainly save the Mayo wans a few euro after all you've had to spend on trips around the country the last few years.

I've a holiday booked at the end of August and the big problem now is trying to decide what games I can afford to go to. Will try to get to two of the Super 8 games anyway and I'm thinking the game in Omagh and the game in Ballybofey will be the ones to go to. Of course them being exciting depends a lot on getting something at the weekend.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 09, 2018, 09:45:07 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 06:42:45 PM
Just wondering how do people in the 17 Football Counties that haven't made the last 8 feel about it now?

The super 17 is where it's at.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: WT4E on July 09, 2018, 11:25:47 PM
Quote from: J70 on July 09, 2018, 05:25:55 PM
Quote from: WT4E on July 09, 2018, 03:11:33 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 08, 2018, 11:55:00 PM
Tyrone will probably need to win two games i can't see them beating Dublin and Ballybofey is one of the toughest places to pick up a victory

Interesting that so many people are putting alot of weight behind Donegals home record. I would discount the league as you just never know who have there best team out or experimenting at that time of the year.

When you look at their record over the last 10 years in championship They have played 14 losing 4 and winning 10. Of those 10 they have beaten:

Antrim x 2
Derry x 2
Fermanagh
08 Roscommon
Carlow
09 Clare
Cavan
Tyrone

Its a mixed bag of talent in there so not as if they have been beaten top teams all along. The day they beat Tyrone there there was a nasty atmosphere at the game from memory with Donegal really hyped up to beat Tyrone - I don't think that will be matched this time around. Tyrone have had the better of Donegal in the last seaon or two.

I am confident that Tyrone can turn them over when they meet.

Donegal haven't lost ANY game in Ballybofey since 2010. In the two years before that they lost there to Derry, Antrim and Monaghan in championship. Shows you the change McGuinness precipitated.

BTW Tyrone were beaten there in the championship in 2013 AND 2015. Not that I think that matters much this year. Tyrone did hammer us last year (2016 was a toss up), while we have lost our primary attacker going into the Super 8s.

But I still fancy a nice hostile welcome for the Tyronies, assuming there is anything to play for on our part.

I stand corrected so I missed the 2013 game. Should be a bit of spice alright considering Bonners history with Tyrone! Hopefully both teams go into the game with something to play for then it should be a cracker!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: maigheo on July 10, 2018, 03:18:51 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 09, 2018, 06:42:45 PM
Just wondering how do people in the 17 Football Counties that haven't made the last 8 feel about it now?
. For me it has been brutal being knocked out so early.Finding  myself wishing the whole damm thing was over already and could not care less right now who wins the All Ireland.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 10, 2018, 09:17:20 AM
And if you were from a County that's gone early every year?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 10, 2018, 09:23:19 AM
The examiner article that Jinxy linked to yesterday is well worth a  read

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/eight-super-heroes-battle-for-control-of-the-football-universe-853841.html

Some points keep on recurring eg possible Tyrone fatigue, Donegal without McBrearty, Kerry reformulated 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: mup on July 10, 2018, 09:28:58 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 10, 2018, 09:23:19 AM
The examiner article that Jinxy linked to yesterday is well worth a  read

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/eight-super-heroes-battle-for-control-of-the-football-universe-853841.html

Some points keep on recurring eg possible Tyrone fatigue, Donegal without McBrearty, Kerry reformulated

The examiner were contradicting themselves yesterday. They usually do a summary of each game. While the journalists were different one mentioned fatigue would be a factor for Kildare and the other never mentioned fatigue for Monaghan. Both have played 5 games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 10, 2018, 09:31:33 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 10, 2018, 09:17:20 AM
And if you were from a County that's gone early every year?

Should you not be fully focusing on calming Syf and his anti-Tyrone agenda than worrying about the rest of us?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on July 10, 2018, 09:33:17 AM
Quote from: mup on July 10, 2018, 09:28:58 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 10, 2018, 09:23:19 AM
The examiner article that Jinxy linked to yesterday is well worth a  read

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/eight-super-heroes-battle-for-control-of-the-football-universe-853841.html

Some points keep on recurring eg possible Tyrone fatigue, Donegal without McBrearty, Kerry reformulated

The examiner were contradicting themselves yesterday. They usually do a summary of each game. While the journalists were different one mentioned fatigue would be a factor for Kildare and the other never mentioned fatigue for Monaghan. Both have played 5 games.

Monaghan have had a handy last four games though
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 10, 2018, 09:49:39 AM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 10, 2018, 09:31:33 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 10, 2018, 09:17:20 AM
And if you were from a County that's gone early every year?

Should you not be fully focusing on calming Syf and his anti-Tyrone agenda than worrying about the rest of us?
One should always be concerned for the poorer and weaker among us.
We could be rejoining them again.

Th'other clown us a total lost cause and is way too serious a case for me to help.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Owenmoresider on July 10, 2018, 09:54:20 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 10, 2018, 09:17:20 AM
And if you were from a County that's gone early every year?
Will doubtless watch a good deal of it anyway but am rather indifferent to the whole hoopla about it, the constant "Super 8's" talk that's been unrelenting throughout the media and elsewhere is off putting as it only serves to reinforce the view that the rest of us who aren't ever likely to be part of the big club don't matter and are a nuisance to be barely tolerated until the elite competition begins. I expect in the next few years that the already sizeable gap between that core group and those of us outside the handful of other teams that might get into the last 8 will increase further. But sure Croke Park and the media have their elite competition now so who needs the minnows any more?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 10, 2018, 10:31:50 AM
If the same 8 teams were just in the quarter-finals, as opposed to the Super 8s, would that be any different?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 10, 2018, 10:51:01 AM
Technically they are in the Quarter Finals as the "Super 8" is a media term.
6 of the 8 were in last year's Quarter Finals too.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: StephenC on July 10, 2018, 10:51:47 AM
We won one game in Division 1 and needed a lad getting sent off for not having a gum-shield in order to do that. We beat 4 teams in Ulster helped by wasteful shooting and eventual throwing in of the towel by our opposition.

There's no doubt that the team have improved but this idea that we are highly likely to finish 2nd in the group is a load of bull.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on July 10, 2018, 04:47:04 PM
Quote from: StephenC on July 10, 2018, 10:51:47 AM
We won one game in Division 1 and needed a lad getting sent off for not having a gum-shield in order to do that. We beat 4 teams in Ulster helped by wasteful shooting and eventual throwing in of the towel by our opposition.

There's no doubt that the team have improved but this idea that we are highly likely to finish 2nd in the group is a load of bull.

Still think Donegal are slight favourites ahead of Tyrone for second place but the stock being placed in them for securing a handy Ulster is unreal. Especially with Paddy gone.

Donegal will not only lose his scoring prowess but more importantly the fear factor in the FF line has taken a serious hit.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: J70 on July 10, 2018, 05:38:23 PM
Quote from: StephenC on July 10, 2018, 10:51:47 AM
We won one game in Division 1 and needed a lad getting sent off for not having a gum-shield in order to do that. We beat 4 teams in Ulster helped by wasteful shooting and eventual throwing in of the towel by our opposition.

There's no doubt that the team have improved but this idea that we are highly likely to finish 2nd in the group is a load of bull.

If McBrearty were fit, I'd fancy us for second. However, even if he was fit, we still have not been tested by a top level team so, strange as it might seem as Ulster champions, there is still an element on not knowing where we are at about us. Probably similar to Tyrone last year. It is very much a case of "to be determined" as to whether we are better than Tyrone and Roscommon, even with Paddy. And with the schedule of the matches, we could easily lose all three. But I suppose you could say that about any "coming" team.

Summary: I don't know how good Donegal really are or where we rank.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 10, 2018, 06:01:08 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 10, 2018, 10:51:01 AM
Technically they are in the Quarter Finals as the "Super 8" is a media term.
6 of the 8 were in last year's Quarter Finals too.

Yeah... that's kind of the point.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 10, 2018, 06:03:50 PM
Bang on assessment there J70. With McB you'd be a strong favourite to come second. You'd be fresher despite having only played one less game than Tyrone and more confident. But without him it's anyone's guess as to who will leave the group in the second place. Very exciting.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: longballin on July 10, 2018, 06:10:56 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 10, 2018, 06:01:08 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 10, 2018, 10:51:01 AM
Technically they are in the Quarter Finals as the "Super 8" is a media term.
6 of the 8 were in last year's Quarter Finals too.

Yeah... that's kind of the point.

Super 8 sounds more like it was inspired by SKY... super Sunday and all that
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 10, 2018, 06:16:41 PM
Anyone who spends any brain power trying to not call it the Super 8s are pedantic fools.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: shawshank on July 10, 2018, 06:19:33 PM
Did I read someone was using the word pedantic 😂😂🤡 Irony etc etc etc 🙈
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 10, 2018, 06:48:11 PM
Watched the recording of Armagh/Ros.
The number of times Morrissey used the incorrect term "Soooper 8s" was ridiculous.
He also got in his " they love their football in Roscommon"
The penalty wasn't a penalty and neither was the first minute block of Cathal's shot.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Throw ball on July 10, 2018, 06:57:39 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 10, 2018, 06:48:11 PM
Watched the recording of Armagh/Ros.
The number of times Morrissey used the incorrect term "Soooper 8s" was ridiculous.
He also got in his " they love their football in Roscommon"
The penalty wasn't a penalty and neither was the first minute block of Cathal's shot.

Bloody Joe McQuillan. Why did he have to give us a penalty! Your keeper filled the goals and Grugan had no chance. Grimley would have scored the 45 easy and we would have cruised to super 8. Instead Roscommon got the impetus!  ;D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Whishtup on July 10, 2018, 07:23:02 PM
What odds would you get on neither dublin or kerry qualifying?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: longballin on July 10, 2018, 07:25:33 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 10, 2018, 06:16:41 PM
Anyone who spends any brain power trying to not call it the Super 8s are pedantic fools.

Roscommon man buys into last eight hype... been a long time  8)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on July 10, 2018, 07:52:35 PM
Quote from: longballin on July 10, 2018, 07:25:33 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 10, 2018, 06:16:41 PM
Anyone who spends any brain power trying to not call it the Super 8s are pedantic fools.

Roscommon man buys into last eight hype... been a long time  8)
Since 2017, maybe?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: inthrough on July 10, 2018, 07:59:19 PM
Quote from: StephenC on July 10, 2018, 10:51:47 AM
We won one game in Division 1 and needed a lad getting sent off for not having a gum-shield in order to do that. We beat 4 teams in Ulster helped by wasteful shooting and eventual throwing in of the towel by our opposition.

There's no doubt that the team have improved but this idea that we are highly likely to finish 2nd in the group is a load of bull.
And the reason the opposition threw in the towel was.........
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: longballin on July 10, 2018, 08:01:07 PM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on July 10, 2018, 07:52:35 PM
Quote from: longballin on July 10, 2018, 07:25:33 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 10, 2018, 06:16:41 PM
Anyone who spends any brain power trying to not call it the Super 8s are pedantic fools.

Roscommon man buys into last eight hype... been a long time  8)
Since 2017, maybe?
well done... no-one noticed ; )
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on July 10, 2018, 08:04:37 PM
The super 8s will be interesting this year and for the next 2-3 years but it'll become repetitive after that and we'll realise that like the qualifiers before it, it mainly benefits the stronger counties
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: inthrough on July 10, 2018, 08:41:39 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 10, 2018, 08:04:37 PM
The super 8s will be interesting this year and for the next 2-3 years but it'll become repetitive after that and we'll realise that like the qualifiers before it, it mainly benefits the stronger counties
If we get good games & a bit of drama we will be as happy as sand boys & won't care less about the divide between the best & the rest which always has existed & always will.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 10, 2018, 09:07:59 PM
Competitive sport always benefits the strongest teams because...........
As I asked long time ago -are we to bring in handicaps or what?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 10, 2018, 09:18:07 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 10, 2018, 09:07:59 PM
Competitive sport always benefits the strongest teams because...........
As I asked long time ago -are we to bring in handicaps or what?

Rossfan with his usual disingenuous routine as if he hasn't been told a hundred ways to improve parity in the sport the other hundred times he made this exact same post.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 10, 2018, 09:42:57 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 10, 2018, 08:04:37 PM
The super 8s will be interesting this year and for the next 2-3 years but it'll become repetitive after that and we'll realise that like the qualifiers before it, it mainly benefits the stronger counties

The reason we won't get as bored with this is because unlike the Qualifiers there shouldn't be as many complete mismatches. The chaff should be out by then and you'd expect most years 6+ of the teams in the super 8 are the best teams in the country. While I certainly see an argument that this now makes Dublin not winning even more unlikely as if they do get caught they need to be beat twice or three times in one year to lose out, I actually think the reverse is more true and perhaps the teams from 3-8 might get stronger from having more huge games at this time of the year.

The reality for the last 4 years has been everyone apart from Dublin, Kerry and Mayo can look brilliant all summer but then get one game against a really top side and they're caught like rabbits in the headlights. Look at Tyrone, Monaghan and Galway last year FFS. All 3 teams looked to be going somewhere, met teams that level ahead of them and that set them back big time, who knows what damage that might have done had the Super 8 not been here as a carrot this summer. At least this time those type of teams will have their game against a really top side (generally Kerry or Dublin depending on which group they're in) and then two games against sides that they should be competitive in while being really tough games. My hope is that this process will bring on those aforementioned teams as well as Donegal, Kildare and the Rossies this year.

The big question is for the foreseeable future how likely is it that Dublin will lose two games in a Championship season of eight??
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 11, 2018, 09:03:24 AM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 10, 2018, 08:04:37 PM
The super 8s will be interesting this year and for the next 2-3 years but it'll become repetitive after that and we'll realise that like the qualifiers before it, it mainly benefits the stronger counties

Hopefully it will not be ratified for more than 3 years.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on July 11, 2018, 10:08:11 AM
Quote from: Jayop on July 10, 2018, 09:42:57 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 10, 2018, 08:04:37 PM
The super 8s will be interesting this year and for the next 2-3 years but it'll become repetitive after that and we'll realise that like the qualifiers before it, it mainly benefits the stronger counties

The reason we won't get as bored with this is because unlike the Qualifiers there shouldn't be as many complete mismatches. The chaff should be out by then and you'd expect most years 6+ of the teams in the super 8 are the best teams in the country. While I certainly see an argument that this now makes Dublin not winning even more unlikely as if they do get caught they need to be beat twice or three times in one year to lose out, I actually think the reverse is more true and perhaps the teams from 3-8 might get stronger from having more huge games at this time of the year.

The reality for the last 4 years has been everyone apart from Dublin, Kerry and Mayo can look brilliant all summer but then get one game against a really top side and they're caught like rabbits in the headlights. Look at Tyrone, Monaghan and Galway last year FFS. All 3 teams looked to be going somewhere, met teams that level ahead of them and that set them back big time, who knows what damage that might have done had the Super 8 not been here as a carrot this summer. At least this time those type of teams will have their game against a really top side (generally Kerry or Dublin depending on which group they're in) and then two games against sides that they should be competitive in while being really tough games. My hope is that this process will bring on those aforementioned teams as well as Donegal, Kildare and the Rossies this year.

The big question is for the foreseeable future how likely is it that Dublin will lose two games in a Championship season of eight??
Well put. An obvious alternative view to it's all about money etc etc.

It might well be that the new structure is for all the wrong reasons, but it doesn't mean that teams won't benefit from it.

Would Tipperary have been better having three games at this stage two (?) years ago and not progressing, or winning one quarter final and losing in the semi-final as they did? Open to debate I would say.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: tippabu on July 11, 2018, 10:32:15 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on July 11, 2018, 10:08:11 AM
Quote from: Jayop on July 10, 2018, 09:42:57 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 10, 2018, 08:04:37 PM
The super 8s will be interesting this year and for the next 2-3 years but it'll become repetitive after that and we'll realise that like the qualifiers before it, it mainly benefits the stronger counties

The reason we won't get as bored with this is because unlike the Qualifiers there shouldn't be as many complete mismatches. The chaff should be out by then and you'd expect most years 6+ of the teams in the super 8 are the best teams in the country. While I certainly see an argument that this now makes Dublin not winning even more unlikely as if they do get caught they need to be beat twice or three times in one year to lose out, I actually think the reverse is more true and perhaps the teams from 3-8 might get stronger from having more huge games at this time of the year.

The reality for the last 4 years has been everyone apart from Dublin, Kerry and Mayo can look brilliant all summer but then get one game against a really top side and they're caught like rabbits in the headlights. Look at Tyrone, Monaghan and Galway last year FFS. All 3 teams looked to be going somewhere, met teams that level ahead of them and that set them back big time, who knows what damage that might have done had the Super 8 not been here as a carrot this summer. At least this time those type of teams will have their game against a really top side (generally Kerry or Dublin depending on which group they're in) and then two games against sides that they should be competitive in while being really tough games. My hope is that this process will bring on those aforementioned teams as well as Donegal, Kildare and the Rossies this year.

The big question is for the foreseeable future how likely is it that Dublin will lose two games in a Championship season of eight??
Well put. An obvious alternative view to it's all about money etc etc.

It might well be that the new structure is for all the wrong reasons, but it doesn't mean that teams won't benefit from it.

Would Tipperary have been better having three games at this stage two (?) years ago and not progressing, or winning one quarter final and losing in the semi-final as they did? Open to debate I would say.

No we wouldn't have been better due to the fact we had the bare 15 players that year and nothing on the bench who could make any sort of improvement and impact.

I'm really looking forward to the super 8s, this weekend looks brilliant in hurling and football but I would prefer earlier group stages and a longer knockout competition before the all Ireland.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 11, 2018, 11:25:05 AM
Quote from: Jayop on July 10, 2018, 09:42:57 PM
The big question is for the foreseeable future how likely is it that Dublin will lose two games in a Championship season of eight??
Yep, technically Dublin could even lose two games and still become All Ireland champions. But it's an odd way to look at things. Dublin don't have to be beaten twice. Like any other team, we just have to be beaten at the right time.

Look at the last time we were beaten in championship, it was a semi final v Donegal. One defeat and out.

If we top our S8 group but, say, Galway catch us in a semi this year, we'd have lost one game and be out. Whereas Galway would have lost one (or maybe even two) games and be in an All Ireland final. It works both ways!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on July 11, 2018, 11:47:23 AM
Quote from: tippabu on July 11, 2018, 10:32:15 AM
Quote from: Esmarelda on July 11, 2018, 10:08:11 AM
Quote from: Jayop on July 10, 2018, 09:42:57 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 10, 2018, 08:04:37 PM
The super 8s will be interesting this year and for the next 2-3 years but it'll become repetitive after that and we'll realise that like the qualifiers before it, it mainly benefits the stronger counties

The reason we won't get as bored with this is because unlike the Qualifiers there shouldn't be as many complete mismatches. The chaff should be out by then and you'd expect most years 6+ of the teams in the super 8 are the best teams in the country. While I certainly see an argument that this now makes Dublin not winning even more unlikely as if they do get caught they need to be beat twice or three times in one year to lose out, I actually think the reverse is more true and perhaps the teams from 3-8 might get stronger from having more huge games at this time of the year.

The reality for the last 4 years has been everyone apart from Dublin, Kerry and Mayo can look brilliant all summer but then get one game against a really top side and they're caught like rabbits in the headlights. Look at Tyrone, Monaghan and Galway last year FFS. All 3 teams looked to be going somewhere, met teams that level ahead of them and that set them back big time, who knows what damage that might have done had the Super 8 not been here as a carrot this summer. At least this time those type of teams will have their game against a really top side (generally Kerry or Dublin depending on which group they're in) and then two games against sides that they should be competitive in while being really tough games. My hope is that this process will bring on those aforementioned teams as well as Donegal, Kildare and the Rossies this year.

The big question is for the foreseeable future how likely is it that Dublin will lose two games in a Championship season of eight??
Well put. An obvious alternative view to it's all about money etc etc.

It might well be that the new structure is for all the wrong reasons, but it doesn't mean that teams won't benefit from it.

Would Tipperary have been better having three games at this stage two (?) years ago and not progressing, or winning one quarter final and losing in the semi-final as they did? Open to debate I would say.

No we wouldn't have been better due to the fact we had the bare 15 players that year and nothing on the bench who could make any sort of improvement and impact.

I'm really looking forward to the super 8s, this weekend looks brilliant in hurling and football but I would prefer earlier group stages and a longer knockout competition before the all Ireland.
Fair enough, but you understand my general point.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 11, 2018, 03:15:35 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 11, 2018, 11:25:05 AM
Quote from: Jayop on July 10, 2018, 09:42:57 PM
The big question is for the foreseeable future how likely is it that Dublin will lose two games in a Championship season of eight??
Yep, technically Dublin could even lose two games and still become All Ireland champions. But it's an odd way to look at things. Dublin don't have to be beaten twice. Like any other team, we just have to be beaten at the right time.

Look at the last time we were beaten in championship, it was a semi final v Donegal. One defeat and out.

If we top our S8 group but, say, Galway catch us in a semi this year, we'd have lost one game and be out. Whereas Galway would have lost one (or maybe even two) games and be in an All Ireland final. It works both ways!

:-X :-X

I'm an edjit. Of course yeah you only have to lose a semi or a final to get beat, so yep, one game still only required to dethrone ye.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: An Fhairche Abu on July 11, 2018, 03:31:03 PM
Rest of the fixture times are out:

All-Ireland SFC Quarter-Final Group Stage Phase 2

Saturday, July 21
Roscommon v Donegal, Dr. Hyde Park, 5pm (Sky Sports)
Tyrone v Dublin, Healy Park Omagh, 7pm (Sky Sports)

Sunday, July 22
Kildare v Galway St. Conleth's Park, Newbridge, 2pm (RTE)
Monaghan v Kerry, St. Tiernach's Park, Clones, 4pm (RTE)

All-Ireland SFC Quarter-Final Group Stage Phase 3

Saturday, August 4:
Kerry v Kildare, Fitzgerald Stadium, Killarney, 6pm (Sky Sports)
Galway v Monaghan, Pearse Stadium, 6pm (Sky Sports)

Sunday, August 5:
Dublin v Roscommon, Croke Park, 3.30pm (RTE)
Donegal v Tyrone, MacCumhaill Park, Ballybofey 3.30pm (RTE)

Saturday of race weekend in Galway for the final match, hopefully we're still in with a shout of a SF place, the city will be hopping.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 11, 2018, 03:35:46 PM
Quote from: An Fhairche Abu on July 11, 2018, 03:31:03 PM
Rest of the fixture times are out:

All-Ireland SFC Quarter-Final Group Stage Phase 2

Saturday, July 21
Roscommon v Donegal, Dr. Hyde Park, 5pm (Sky Sports)
Tyrone v Dublin, Healy Park Omagh, 7pm (Sky Sports)

Sunday, July 22
Kildare v Galway St. Conleth's Park, Newbridge, 2pm (RTE)
Monaghan v Kerry, St. Tiernach's Park, Clones, 4pm (RTE)

All-Ireland SFC Quarter-Final Group Stage Phase 3

Saturday, August 4:
Kerry v Kildare, Fitzgerald Stadium, Killarney, 6pm (Sky Sports)
Galway v Monaghan, Pearse Stadium, 6pm (Sky Sports)

Sunday, August 5:
Dublin v Roscommon, Croke Park, 3.30pm (RTE)
Donegal v Tyrone, MacCumhaill Park, Ballybofey 3.30pm (RTE)

Saturday of race weekend in Galway for the final match, hopefully we're still in with a shout of a SF place, the city will be hopping.

Happy enough with those. The Hyde should be buzzing of a Saturday evening for an AIQF that both teams need to win and against a team that will bring a big travelling support.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GalwayBayBoy on July 11, 2018, 03:41:34 PM
Quote from: An Fhairche Abu on July 11, 2018, 03:31:03 PM
Saturday of race weekend in Galway for the final match, hopefully we're still in with a shout of a SF place, the city will be hopping.

Already getting palpitations thinking about the traffic.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 11, 2018, 03:46:02 PM
Feck I assumed we'd be playing in Donegal on the Saturday and I had a great day planned with a nice round of golf in the morning in Sligo and then up to Ballybofey. Will have to have a rethink.

Apart from that it's all mad exciting to see them fixtures and look forward to this festival of football for a month.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Orchard park on July 11, 2018, 03:47:57 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 10, 2018, 09:42:57 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 10, 2018, 08:04:37 PM
The super 8s will be interesting this year and for the next 2-3 years but it'll become repetitive after that and we'll realise that like the qualifiers before it, it mainly benefits the stronger counties

The reason we won't get as bored with this is because unlike the Qualifiers there shouldn't be as many complete mismatches. The chaff should be out by then and you'd expect most years 6+ of the teams in the super 8 are the best teams in the country. While I certainly see an argument that this now makes Dublin not winning even more unlikely as if they do get caught they need to be beat twice or three times in one year to lose out, I actually think the reverse is more true and perhaps the teams from 3-8 might get stronger from having more huge games at this time of the year.

The reality for the last 4 years has been everyone apart from Dublin, Kerry and Mayo can look brilliant all summer but then get one game against a really top side and they're caught like rabbits in the headlights. Look at Tyrone, Monaghan and Galway last year FFS. All 3 teams looked to be going somewhere, met teams that level ahead of them and that set them back big time, who knows what damage that might have done had the Super 8 not been here as a carrot this summer. At least this time those type of teams will have their game against a really top side (generally Kerry or Dublin depending on which group they're in) and then two games against sides that they should be competitive in while being really tough games. My hope is that this process will bring on those aforementioned teams as well as Donegal, Kildare and the Rossies this year.

The big question is for the foreseeable future how likely is it that Dublin will lose two games in a Championship season of eight??


Time will tell but one coukd see a situation where the weakest team in each group  takes  3 tankings..... guess only one way to find out how evenly balanced the final 8 teams are
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on July 11, 2018, 04:14:58 PM
Quote from: An Fhairche Abu on July 11, 2018, 03:31:03 PM
Rest of the fixture times are out:

All-Ireland SFC Quarter-Final Group Stage Phase 2

Saturday, July 21
Roscommon v Donegal, Dr. Hyde Park, 5pm (Sky Sports)
Tyrone v Dublin, Healy Park Omagh, 7pm (Sky Sports)

Sunday, July 22
Kildare v Galway St. Conleth's Park, Newbridge, 2pm (RTE)
Monaghan v Kerry, St. Tiernach's Park, Clones, 4pm (RTE)

All-Ireland SFC Quarter-Final Group Stage Phase 3

Saturday, August 4:
Kerry v Kildare, Fitzgerald Stadium, Killarney, 6pm (Sky Sports)
Galway v Monaghan, Pearse Stadium, 6pm (Sky Sports)

Sunday, August 5:
Dublin v Roscommon, Croke Park, 3.30pm (RTE)
Donegal v Tyrone, MacCumhaill Park, Ballybofey 3.30pm (RTE)

Saturday of race weekend in Galway for the final match, hopefully we're still in with a shout of a SF place, the city will be hopping.
Ah lads, where is From The Bunker, he swore it would never happen. ;D ;D
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trueblue1234 on July 11, 2018, 04:21:22 PM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 11, 2018, 03:47:57 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 10, 2018, 09:42:57 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on July 10, 2018, 08:04:37 PM
The super 8s will be interesting this year and for the next 2-3 years but it'll become repetitive after that and we'll realise that like the qualifiers before it, it mainly benefits the stronger counties

The reason we won't get as bored with this is because unlike the Qualifiers there shouldn't be as many complete mismatches. The chaff should be out by then and you'd expect most years 6+ of the teams in the super 8 are the best teams in the country. While I certainly see an argument that this now makes Dublin not winning even more unlikely as if they do get caught they need to be beat twice or three times in one year to lose out, I actually think the reverse is more true and perhaps the teams from 3-8 might get stronger from having more huge games at this time of the year.

The reality for the last 4 years has been everyone apart from Dublin, Kerry and Mayo can look brilliant all summer but then get one game against a really top side and they're caught like rabbits in the headlights. Look at Tyrone, Monaghan and Galway last year FFS. All 3 teams looked to be going somewhere, met teams that level ahead of them and that set them back big time, who knows what damage that might have done had the Super 8 not been here as a carrot this summer. At least this time those type of teams will have their game against a really top side (generally Kerry or Dublin depending on which group they're in) and then two games against sides that they should be competitive in while being really tough games. My hope is that this process will bring on those aforementioned teams as well as Donegal, Kildare and the Rossies this year.

The big question is for the foreseeable future how likely is it that Dublin will lose two games in a Championship season of eight??


Time will tell but one coukd see a situation where the weakest team in each group  takes  3 tankings..... guess only one way to find out how evenly balanced the final 8 teams are

I can't see any of the teams taking a tanking unless from Dublin. Not convinced Kerry are as good as they are being made out (Still the next best tho). And the rest I think could beat or be beat on any given day.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 11, 2018, 04:22:55 PM
So Dublin have made official what we all knew all along.
Croke Park IS their home ground.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on July 11, 2018, 04:34:15 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 11, 2018, 04:22:55 PM
So Dublin have made official what we all knew all along.
Croke Park IS their home ground.
That or Roscommon not wanting to cause any hassle.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Orchard park on July 11, 2018, 04:34:16 PM
Look st the tanking we took , 20 points a week after a draw, in lat years 1/4 final.

Without going back to the scores I feel most years 2 teams took bad pastings each year in the 1/4 final stage, guess my fear is it could happen 3 times now for a team rather than once
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 11, 2018, 04:40:12 PM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 11, 2018, 04:34:16 PM
Look st the tanking we took , 20 points a week after a draw, in lat years 1/4 final.

Without going back to the scores I feel most years 2 teams took bad pastings each year in the 1/4 final stage, guess my fear is it could happen 3 times now for a team rather than once

I probably will happen once every few years that a team that's just not ready for this stage will come in and get three pastings, but the one things I'd say is that the 4 provincial winners are always unlikely to take three heavy beatings and the other two teams in each group are qualifiers that play each other first time out. Even if that score could be kept respectable and one of them takes a hiding off the two provincial winners in the group it wouldn't be too bad.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Oldira on July 11, 2018, 04:47:10 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 11, 2018, 04:34:15 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 11, 2018, 04:22:55 PM
So Dublin have made official what we all knew all along.
Croke Park IS their home ground.
That or Roscommon not wanting to cause any hassle.

In fairness if Roscommon lose their first two games and Dublin win theirs then I could see that game being moved to Parnell Park. Rossies wont travel with nothing at stake and Dublin will have qualified so no attraction for Dublin fans either. Would make sense to move to PP.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Orchard park on July 11, 2018, 04:50:02 PM
Quote from: Oldira on July 11, 2018, 04:47:10 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 11, 2018, 04:34:15 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 11, 2018, 04:22:55 PM
So Dublin have made official what we all knew all along.
Croke Park IS their home ground.
That or Roscommon not wanting to cause any hassle.

In fairness if Roscommon lose their first two games and Dublin win theirs then I could see that game being moved to Parnell Park. Rossies wont travel with nothing at stake and Dublin will have qualified so no attraction for Dublin fans either. Would make sense to move to PP.

It's a double header with the u20 final sol i'd say it stays  put
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 11, 2018, 05:06:04 PM
Quote from: Oldira on July 11, 2018, 04:47:10 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 11, 2018, 04:34:15 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 11, 2018, 04:22:55 PM
So Dublin have made official what we all knew all along.
Croke Park IS their home ground.
That or Roscommon not wanting to cause any hassle.

In fairness if Roscommon lose their first two games and Dublin win theirs then I could see that game being moved to Parnell Park. Rossies wont travel with nothing at stake and Dublin will have qualified so no attraction for Dublin fans either. Would make sense to move to PP.

This wasn't even worth typing.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 11, 2018, 05:18:02 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 11, 2018, 04:34:15 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 11, 2018, 04:22:55 PM
So Dublin have made official what we all knew all along.
Croke Park IS their home ground.
That or Roscommon not wanting to cause any hassle.
We'd have no say in it as the away team.
Time to add an addendum to the Rule book at next Congress that no County can use Croke Park as a home venue in the Quarter Finals.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 11, 2018, 05:29:52 PM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 11, 2018, 04:50:02 PM
Quote from: Oldira on July 11, 2018, 04:47:10 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 11, 2018, 04:34:15 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 11, 2018, 04:22:55 PM
So Dublin have made official what we all knew all along.
Croke Park IS their home ground.
That or Roscommon not wanting to cause any hassle.

In fairness if Roscommon lose their first two games and Dublin win theirs then I could see that game being moved to Parnell Park. Rossies wont travel with nothing at stake and Dublin will have qualified so no attraction for Dublin fans either. Would make sense to move to PP.

It's a double header with the u20 final sol i'd say it stays  put

Hopefully there'll be 2 Connacht counties with prizes at stake.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: giveballaghback on July 11, 2018, 06:03:22 PM
I see they are trying to sanitise the u20 championship by playing the final at headquarters, they have made some haymes  of this competition, most counties had to field weakened teams because they had lads doing exams, after years of commitment to development panels what would be a last chance to represent their county for a lot of lads goes up in smoke, I would particularly mention our own Connacht council in this regard, brainless whatevers.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 11, 2018, 06:14:09 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 11, 2018, 05:29:52 PM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 11, 2018, 04:50:02 PM
Quote from: Oldira on July 11, 2018, 04:47:10 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 11, 2018, 04:34:15 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 11, 2018, 04:22:55 PM
So Dublin have made official what we all knew all along.
Croke Park IS their home ground.
That or Roscommon not wanting to cause any hassle.

In fairness if Roscommon lose their first two games and Dublin win theirs then I could see that game being moved to Parnell Park. Rossies wont travel with nothing at stake and Dublin will have qualified so no attraction for Dublin fans either. Would make sense to move to PP.

It's a double header with the u20 final sol i'd say it stays  put

Hopefully there'll be 2 Connacht counties with prizes at stake.

We'll already be qualified for the AISF by then, Farr.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on July 12, 2018, 10:48:46 AM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 11, 2018, 04:50:02 PM
Quote from: Oldira on July 11, 2018, 04:47:10 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 11, 2018, 04:34:15 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 11, 2018, 04:22:55 PM
So Dublin have made official what we all knew all along.
Croke Park IS their home ground.
That or Roscommon not wanting to cause any hassle.

In fairness if Roscommon lose their first two games and Dublin win theirs then I could see that game being moved to Parnell Park. Rossies wont travel with nothing at stake and Dublin will have qualified so no attraction for Dublin fans either. Would make sense to move to PP.

It's a double header with the u20 final sol i'd say it stays  put

That u20 final will feature probably Kerry or Kildare both are out the day before in Killarney at 6pm in the S8 R3 game. Surely the weekend before is the time to play it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on July 12, 2018, 11:01:25 AM
Quote from: Oldira on July 11, 2018, 04:47:10 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 11, 2018, 04:34:15 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 11, 2018, 04:22:55 PM
So Dublin have made official what we all knew all along.
Croke Park IS their home ground.
That or Roscommon not wanting to cause any hassle.

In fairness if Roscommon lose their first two games and Dublin win theirs then I could see that game being moved to Parnell Park. Rossies wont travel with nothing at stake and Dublin will have qualified so no attraction for Dublin fans either. Would make sense to move to PP.
Dublin could be out too
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 12, 2018, 11:09:00 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 11, 2018, 06:14:09 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 11, 2018, 05:29:52 PM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 11, 2018, 04:50:02 PM
Quote from: Oldira on July 11, 2018, 04:47:10 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 11, 2018, 04:34:15 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 11, 2018, 04:22:55 PM
So Dublin have made official what we all knew all along.
Croke Park IS their home ground.
That or Roscommon not wanting to cause any hassle.

In fairness if Roscommon lose their first two games and Dublin win theirs then I could see that game being moved to Parnell Park. Rossies wont travel with nothing at stake and Dublin will have qualified so no attraction for Dublin fans either. Would make sense to move to PP.

It's a double header with the u20 final sol i'd say it stays  put

Hopefully there'll be 2 Connacht counties with prizes at stake.

We'll already be qualified for the AISF by then, Farr.

Le cúnamh Dé. And wouldn't it be nice to get revenge over Galway if ye were in the semi?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 12, 2018, 12:24:14 PM
Quote from: giveballaghback on July 11, 2018, 06:03:22 PM
I see they are trying to sanitise the u20 championship by playing the final at headquarters, they have made some haymes  of this competition, most counties had to field weakened teams because they had lads doing exams, after years of commitment to development panels what would be a last chance to represent their county for a lot of lads goes up in smoke, I would particularly mention our own Connacht council in this regard, brainless whatevers.

Agree with all that and i would be hopefully the 2019 U20 championship will be much improved as the powers to be learn from all the errors they made. Playing the semi final and final during the super 8s is more nonsense scheduling and as Dinny said supporters are expected to be in Fitzgerald Stadium Saturday evening then Croke Park Sunday for a 1pm throw in.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 12, 2018, 12:44:53 PM
When do you play it?
May -3rd level exams, June Leaving Cert.
No County games in April so it's Feb/March or October/ November??
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on July 12, 2018, 02:36:17 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 12, 2018, 12:44:53 PM
When do you play it?
May -3rd level exams, June Leaving Cert.
No County games in April so it's Feb/March or October/ November??
Your team Roscommon playing 3 games in 3 weeks did them no favours at all in that Connacht final and U20s aren't conditioned like seniors footballers are for that amount of games. Both AI semi finals on in different venues at the same time is a bit odd surely a double header would have made more sense?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on July 13, 2018, 02:24:39 PM
Perfect scenario, Tyrone beat Roscommon whilst Donegal grab a point v Dublin. In a crazy game in Omagh, Tyrone get a last min goal to take all three points and Donegal win at the Hyde. Donegal and Tyrone play out a nil nil draw in Ballybofey to send the Dubs packing.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 13, 2018, 02:49:01 PM
Could you just imagine if Dublin somehow didn't get through to the semi finals? Bets busted all over the country.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 13, 2018, 02:59:22 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 13, 2018, 02:49:01 PM
Could you just imagine if Dublin somehow didn't get through to the semi finals? Bets busted all over the country.

It's as likely as Tyrone winning the AI.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trileacman on July 13, 2018, 03:12:47 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 13, 2018, 02:24:39 PM
Perfect scenario, Tyrone beat Roscommon whilst Donegal grab a point v Dublin. In a crazy game in Omagh, Tyrone get a last min goal to take all three points and Donegal win at the Hyde. Donegal and Tyrone play out a nil nil draw in Ballybofey to send the Dubs packing.

Jesus that would be a dream come true, especially the nil nil draw in a hurricane force wind and rain in Ballybofey.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 14, 2018, 12:33:44 PM
Anyone else think the Super 8s should culminate with the Croke Park games instead of starting with them?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 14, 2018, 12:36:11 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 14, 2018, 12:33:44 PM
Anyone else think the Super 8s should culminate with the Croke Park games instead of starting with them?

They do for Roscommon.

I assume it's to ensure the champion v champion matches aren't dead rubbers, there's a high likelihood that those two teams can win both their first group matches and only have positioning to play for in the final match.. I'd agree with the GAA on playing them first TBH. Make the Croke Park matches matter.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ardtole on July 14, 2018, 12:36:51 PM
Would the final two games in each group not have to throw in at the same time, or else the teams in the second game would have an advantage, knowing what they need to go through.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on July 14, 2018, 02:49:34 PM
Quote from: ardtole on July 14, 2018, 12:36:51 PM
Would the final two games in each group not have to throw in at the same time, or else the teams in the second game would have an advantage, knowing what they need to go through.

They do throw in at the same time.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GrandMasterFlash on July 14, 2018, 03:07:02 PM
Sorry for the repetition lads, what channels are today's games on and are there any streams? I have Mobdro and a biteen of WiFi. GRMA.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Solo_run on July 14, 2018, 05:01:28 PM
Sky sports Arena

The super 8s don't have a super attendance
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rois on July 14, 2018, 05:44:55 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 14, 2018, 05:01:28 PM
Sky sports Arena

The super 8s don't have a super attendance
The steward here says they are expecting 55-60k
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Solo_run on July 14, 2018, 05:49:49 PM
Quote from: Rois on July 14, 2018, 05:44:55 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 14, 2018, 05:01:28 PM
Sky sports Arena

The super 8s don't have a super attendance
The steward here says they are expecting 55-60k

There's literally no atmosphere at that game. Not having a go at the fans but it's so quiet
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 14, 2018, 06:28:13 PM
Home, away and neutral is the way to go for the Super 8s.
Let Dublin play their home game in Croke Park, every other game is fixed for somewhere else.
Leinster semi-finals & final plus Dublin home Super 8 game and All-Ireland semi-finals and final should be the only games played there.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rrhf on July 14, 2018, 06:32:05 PM
It's coming home...
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: blewuporstuffed on July 14, 2018, 06:46:18 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 14, 2018, 06:28:13 PM
Home, away and neutral is the way to go for the Super 8s.
Let Dublin play their home game in Croke Park, every other game is fixed for somewhere else.
Leinster semi-finals & final plus Dublin home Super 8 game and All-Ireland semi-finals and final should be the only games played there.
Agree with you there
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on July 14, 2018, 08:44:46 PM
Shite 8s so far

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 14, 2018, 08:45:36 PM
Stupor 8s.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: SHEEDY on July 14, 2018, 08:48:18 PM
Knock out football is what people want to see. Boring stuff so far.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sid waddell on July 14, 2018, 09:02:50 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 14, 2018, 05:49:49 PM
Quote from: Rois on July 14, 2018, 05:44:55 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 14, 2018, 05:01:28 PM
Sky sports Arena

The super 8s don't have a super attendance
The steward here says they are expecting 55-60k

There's literally no atmosphere at that game. Not having a go at the fans but it's so quiet
Pretty much all Dublin games are like that now.

The semi-final against Tyrone last year had a funeral atmosphere.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 14, 2018, 09:03:34 PM
Both games would have been very different from an entertainment/atmosphere perspective if they were held elsewhere.
Not saying the results would have been any different, but I'm just sick of Croke Park.
I'm looking forward to the novelty value alone of the remaining games in smaller venues with partisan crowds.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 14, 2018, 09:47:57 PM
Preach Jinxy. That's a big part of it. Croke Park used to be a novelty for teams but it's being over used these days.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: redzone on July 14, 2018, 09:58:16 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 14, 2018, 09:03:34 PM
Both games would have been very different from an entertainment/atmosphere perspective if they were held elsewhere.
Not saying the results would have been any different, but I'm just sick of Croke Park.
I'm looking forward to the novelty value alone of the remaining games in smaller venues with partisan crowds.
Monaghan v Kerry in clones should bring a massive crowd. A lot of neutrals will go to it
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Laoiseabu on July 14, 2018, 10:00:47 PM
Ye may change the thread name to super 7s after that Roscommon display lads
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Kuwabatake Sanjuro on July 14, 2018, 10:01:28 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 14, 2018, 09:03:34 PM
Both games would have been very different from an entertainment/atmosphere perspective if they were held elsewhere.
Not saying the results would have been any different, but I'm just sick of Croke Park.
I'm looking forward to the novelty value alone of the remaining games in smaller venues with partisan crowds.

I got tickets for the Hill for the 1st time in a good while for tomorrow, hopefully there will be some sort of atmosphere there. At least I won't be having to get up every 5 minutes in the second half while people come in for the second game but there is rain forecasted.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 14, 2018, 10:13:11 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 14, 2018, 09:03:34 PM
Both games would have been very different from an entertainment/atmosphere perspective if they were held elsewhere.
Not saying the results would have been any different, but I'm just sick of Croke Park.
I'm looking forward to the novelty value alone of the remaining games in smaller venues with partisan crowds.

Agreed. Late July/early August has become the month of watching walkovers in a 25% full croke park. It's tedious.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on July 14, 2018, 10:43:49 PM
That display tonight confirmed to me that Gaelic football is dead as a spectacle.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: longballin on July 14, 2018, 10:56:54 PM
it's in dire state at county level. Club football can be very good though... we have a great championship in Tyrone. Can't wait
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Kuwabatake Sanjuro on July 14, 2018, 10:58:52 PM
Great game between Kildare and Kerry at u20 level while Mayo and Derry was meant to be good too.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on July 14, 2018, 11:15:02 PM
Simply too many games at county level and fans will pick and choose when to attend. The league structure dilutes the 'do or sie' feel of a match and the sight of thousands of empty seats doesn't do anything for the spectacle.

The attendance tomorrow will be very poor I feel and by the time the super 8s is completed the 4 qualifier teams will have been in action for 6 consecutive weeks. That's a serious expense for anyone thinking of following a county team week on week. It's not like the spectacle has been brilliant to date, once the novelty of these super 8s wear off I think there will be another discussion around their future.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: straightred on July 14, 2018, 11:16:03 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 14, 2018, 09:03:34 PM
Both games would have been very different from an entertainment/atmosphere perspective if they were held elsewhere.
Not saying the results would have been any different, but I'm just sick of Croke Park.
I'm looking forward to the novelty value alone of the remaining games in smaller venues with partisan crowds.

i was in this evening and while there was some good scoring both games cruised to inevitable outcomes. Dublin in particular are becoming boring to watch in Croker. Its not the players fault - they just try to win but everything is stacked in their favour in Croke Park. I'll go in again tomorrow and hope for better
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on July 14, 2018, 11:56:35 PM
For me the value in the super 8 is when the games move out of Croke Park. The Dubs in Omagh, Kerry in Clones etc will be great occasions. Then possible winner takes all games in regional grounds like Tyrone v Donegal in Ballybofey. I wouldn't be writing off the Super 8s just yet.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 15, 2018, 12:04:06 AM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 14, 2018, 11:56:35 PM
For me the value in the super 8 is when the games move out of Croke Park. The Dubs in Omagh, Kerry in Clones etc will be great occasions. Then possible winner takes all games like Tyrone v Donegal in Ballybofey. I wouldn't be writing off the Super 8s just yet.

That's it exactly: tbe value cannot be judged on a single weekend, the first weekend. Let's see how the whole thing unravels, then we can call it, though we have three years of it to make a 'proper' assessment.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 15, 2018, 12:32:50 AM
I think there's this notion at a high level that cramming a load of games into Croke Park over a weekend creates a kind of festival of football.
It's the exact opposite.
People are generally only really interested in their own game, and the fact that some fans have to travel long distances means they need to get on the road.
I've often hung around for the 1st half of the 2nd game, but I don't think I've ever stayed for the full thing.
We need more standalone games in appropriate venues.
Generate some buzz ffs.
I genuinely don't care about the quality of the coffee, or the state of the toilets, just give me an atmosphere!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 15, 2018, 12:35:37 AM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 15, 2018, 12:32:50 AM
I think there's this notion at a high level that cramming a load of games into Croke Park over a weekend creates a kind of festival of football.
It's the exact opposite.
People are generally only really interested in their own game, and the fact that some fans have to travel long distances means they need to get on the road.
I've often hung around for the 1st half of the 2nd game, but I don't think I've ever stayed for the full thing.
We need more standalone games in appropriate venues.
Generate some buzz ffs.
I genuinely don't care about the quality of the coffee, or the state of the toilets, just give me an atmosphere!

It was telling that the Tyrone sections were empty shortly after the second game starred. As you say most people were on the road.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 15, 2018, 01:11:19 AM
I left after our game for obvious reasons.
Most neutrals now watch games on TV and the slack jawed peasant looking in awe at a Croke Park is a thing of the past.
These quarter finals are a 3 games series so people will go to their home game and might or might not choose to go to the other 2 games.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 15, 2018, 01:40:39 AM
Tyrone are pretty lucky for the next two games in relation to locations and the hype of the games. Both will be packed out and there's very little travel to get to ballybofey for a game.

Both games are huge for us regardless of the result in the next week. If we beat Dublin and donegal beat Roscommon then we can still go out if we lose to donegal and Dublin beat roscommon on score difference (although we're in good shape there.)if we lose to Dublin then it doesn't matter what donegal do next weekend as the final game there is a winner takes all.

It's strange really that at this stage it doesn't really matter for donegal of they win or lose next week so long as we lose to Dublin.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 15, 2018, 07:11:45 PM
I'll reserve overall judgement until the remaining two rounds are played, but as it stands, you'd have to say the opening weekend was the very definition of a damp squib.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 15, 2018, 07:17:43 PM
Yeah without doubt. Our game was a non contest and for everyone bar Tyrone fans it wouldn't have been good watching. The second game was never really that competitive despite the close scoreline and the two games today were close but pretty poor stuff quality wise. Hopefully we'll see some clinkers of games next weekend.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: sambostar on July 15, 2018, 07:57:49 PM
But if Roscommon beat Donegal next week Tyrone should be as good as through on score difference as long as they avoided a big defeat in either of last 2 games. That was the value of pummelling Roscommon yesterday
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 15, 2018, 08:06:29 PM
Aye a Ross or Tyrone win next week sees us as good as through.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: greatpoint on July 15, 2018, 10:13:03 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 15, 2018, 07:17:43 PM
Yeah without doubt. Our game was a non contest and for everyone bar Tyrone fans it wouldn't have been good watching. The second game was never really that competitive despite the close scoreline and the two games today were close but pretty poor stuff quality wise. Hopefully we'll see some clinkers of games next weekend.

The second game was pretty competitive until Dublin scored their first goal before half time, I think Donegal led 3 times and the game was level until the goal. Dublin controlled the second half though.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rrhf on July 15, 2018, 10:43:42 PM
1) Very disappointed in Roscommon. Are they a team that gives up easy?
2) well done Tyrone. Have given themselves a decent chance
3) Donegal are good and still are more than capable of getting through.
4) dubs have so many options and won pulling up. Great team and champions elect.
5) Kildare might have plenty to say yet. Still capable
6) Monaghan - dark horse for the all Ireland final
7) Kerry - perhaps not quite matching up to hype - a year too early?
8) Galway - most likely team to eventually bate the dubs - are they better than mayo last year?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rrhf on July 15, 2018, 10:50:06 PM
Prediction after next week.
4 teams on 2 points in 1 section.
Dub on 4. Tyrone and Donegal on 2 and ros pointless.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: tooolonggg on July 16, 2018, 10:50:11 AM
Return to the All Ireland 1/4 final straight knock out itinerary for 2019.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on July 16, 2018, 10:53:45 AM
Quote from: tooolonggg on July 16, 2018, 10:50:11 AM
Return to the All Ireland 1/4 final straight knock out itinerary for 2019.

Super 8s already set in stone for 2018, 19 and 20. Would take a further motion to end it for next year which isn't going to happen. The first weekend has been a total bust but I'd say it'll be much better next weekend as teams will really have to start going for it.

If there is a change I can see them getting rid of the Croke Park games at the start and, perhaps, move them to provincial grounds. Have Croker full of concerts until August!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: 6th sam on July 16, 2018, 11:21:13 AM
1. We've heard it all before several times. Does anyone else feel that there is always excessive negativity around the quality of Gaelic  football. There are always bad games in any sport, but the media, backed up by every disgruntled losing supporter gets the boot into Gaelic football every time we don't have a 4:18 to 5:15 classic. There were some superb pieces of skill yesterday : evasion skills, goal and point finishing , superb tackling , fielding , kick outs . The GAA fails to promote this but instead tolerates negative portrayal of our games epitomised by Rourke, Brolly, Spillane , who are GAA equivalent of the 2 old boys on the balcony in the muppets. I worry about the influence and accessibility of Sky but Canavan and McGuinness excellence compared to RTE is like day and night.
2. The super 8s concept is beyond farcical and I can't believe that this concept was passed by the vast majority of counties who have no chance of involvement, talk about turkeys voting for Christmas . Where do I start? 75% of counties not involved, built around an unfair provincial and qualifier structure, reinforcing inequalities , The negative PR of an empty Croke Park, Croke Park being Dublin's "neutral" venue😂, possibility of dead rubber games, "keeping the score down as opposed to trying to win , potential safety issues around packed inadequate home venues , cumulative prices for punters particularly families, more exposure for the Naysayers led by the 3 muppets.
3. Time for a 2 tiered championship structure , Gradings on the basis of league status, revitalising the league, with an alternative route to latter stages via provincial championships.
4. More compact county season , with all teams extended involvement until the last 8. More county games, lower prices.
5. Distinct Club competitions with or without county players to allow club competitions to proceed without county players but then have loads of games with their county players back.
6. GAA payoff the 3 RTE muppets (only half joking) and insist on a more positive promotion of our national games by our national broadcaster
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 11:28:04 AM
Quote from: omagh_gael on July 16, 2018, 10:53:45 AM
Quote from: tooolonggg on July 16, 2018, 10:50:11 AM
Return to the All Ireland 1/4 final straight knock out itinerary for 2019.

Super 8s already set in stone for 2018, 19 and 20. Would take a further motion to end it for next year which isn't going to happen. The first weekend has been a total bust but I'd say it'll be much better next weekend as teams will really have to start going for it.

If there is a change I can see them getting rid of the Croke Park games at the start and, perhaps, move them to provincial grounds. Have Croker full of concerts until August!

Nothing is set in stone. No matter what happens next the first round has been a total disaster both in the fare and in how well it promotes the game. One of the most interesting weekends on the calendar has become a glorified NFL round.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on July 16, 2018, 11:34:27 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 11:28:04 AM
Quote from: omagh_gael on July 16, 2018, 10:53:45 AM
Quote from: tooolonggg on July 16, 2018, 10:50:11 AM
Return to the All Ireland 1/4 final straight knock out itinerary for 2019.

Super 8s already set in stone for 2018, 19 and 20. Would take a further motion to end it for next year which isn't going to happen. The first weekend has been a total bust but I'd say it'll be much better next weekend as teams will really have to start going for it.

If there is a change I can see them getting rid of the Croke Park games at the start and, perhaps, move them to provincial grounds. Have Croker full of concerts until August!

Nothing is set in stone. No matter what happens next the first round has been a total disaster both in the fare and in how well it promotes the game. One of the most interesting weekends on the calendar has become a glorified NFL round.

Still think you're jumping the gun. I'd at least wait until the whole process has been completed to give a proper analysis. For example, the hurling change this year didn't start off with fireworks, it was pretty low key and built to a crescendo. 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 01:05:49 PM
Quote from: omagh_gael on July 16, 2018, 11:34:27 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 11:28:04 AM
Quote from: omagh_gael on July 16, 2018, 10:53:45 AM
Quote from: tooolonggg on July 16, 2018, 10:50:11 AM
Return to the All Ireland 1/4 final straight knock out itinerary for 2019.

Super 8s already set in stone for 2018, 19 and 20. Would take a further motion to end it for next year which isn't going to happen. The first weekend has been a total bust but I'd say it'll be much better next weekend as teams will really have to start going for it.

If there is a change I can see them getting rid of the Croke Park games at the start and, perhaps, move them to provincial grounds. Have Croker full of concerts until August!

Nothing is set in stone. No matter what happens next the first round has been a total disaster both in the fare and in how well it promotes the game. One of the most interesting weekends on the calendar has become a glorified NFL round.

Still think you're jumping the gun. I'd at least wait until the whole process has been completed to give a proper analysis. For example, the hurling change this year didn't start off with fireworks, it was pretty low key and built to a crescendo.

I have barely paid attention to the hurling exactly because it's a glorified league with the same five teams playing each other over and over just as they did in the spring. If that's your idea of success I don't want to see what failure looks like.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: omagh_gael on July 16, 2018, 01:14:46 PM
So what's the alternative? Bearing in mind your team has a significantly easier path to either a straight knock out QF or the super8s compared to most of the country.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 01:41:48 PM
Quote from: omagh_gael on July 16, 2018, 01:14:46 PM
So what's the alternative? Bearing in mind your team has a significantly easier path to either a straight knock out QF or the super8s compared to most of the country.

Kerry had a far easier route and got embarrassed by a team we should have bet yesterday. Roscommon could have drawn two D1 teams in their province this year by the way, much tougher than what Dublin or any Ulster team faced into. People whining about random draws being random is one of the sillier aspects of this sport.

The problem in senior IC has always been finance. It's about money, and who gets it. Money means better coaching, better facilities and more player retention. If the GAA wants a Super 8 it needs to be subsiding smaller counties that actually try to compete like Tyrone, Roscommon, Monaghan, Cavan and Armagh far more than they currently are. The GAA desperately needs counties like that to be competitive simply to make the premier competition a decent spectacle. Likewise a cap on senior IC spending to prevent Dublin buying AIs or Mayo/Kerry trying to buy them, a centralised travel expenses fund and having some real oversight over how senior IC money is spent would go a long way towards fostering a better game at the top level rather than trying to wedge in an extra eight games at the AIQF stage.

But sure what do I know, I just witnessed my team be embarrassed by a team who will probably be embarrassed themselves this weekend. That will do wonders for the promotion of the game.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on July 16, 2018, 01:45:41 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 01:41:48 PM
Quote from: omagh_gael on July 16, 2018, 01:14:46 PM
So what's the alternative? Bearing in mind your team has a significantly easier path to either a straight knock out QF or the super8s compared to most of the country.

Kerry had a far easier route and got embarrassed by a team we should have bet yesterday. Roscommon could have drawn two D1 teams in their province this year by the way, much tougher than what Dublin or any Ulster team faced into. People whining about random draws being random is one of the sillier aspects of this sport.

The problem in senior IC has always been finance. It's about money, and who gets it. Money means better coaching, better facilities and more player retention. If the GAA wants a Super 8 it needs to be subsiding smaller counties that actually try to compete like Tyrone, Roscommon, Monaghan, Cavan and Armagh far more than they currently are. The GAA desperately needs counties like that to be competitive simply to make the premier competition a decent spectacle. Likewise a cap on senior IC spending to prevent Dublin buying AIs or Mayo/Kerry trying to buy them and a centralised travel expenses fund and having some real oversight over how senior IC money is spent would go a long way towards fostering a better game at the top level rather than trying to wedge in an extra eight games at the AIQF stage.

But sure what do I know, I just witnessed my team be embarrassed by a team who will probably be embarrassed themselves this weekend. That will do wonders for the promotion of the game.

Pretty obvious is it not?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on July 16, 2018, 01:48:47 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 01:41:48 PM
Quote from: omagh_gael on July 16, 2018, 01:14:46 PM
So what's the alternative? Bearing in mind your team has a significantly easier path to either a straight knock out QF or the super8s compared to most of the country.

Kerry had a far easier route and got embarrassed by a team we should have bet yesterday. Roscommon could have drawn two D1 teams in their province this year by the way, much tougher than what Dublin or any Ulster team faced into. People whining about random draws being random is one of the sillier aspects of this sport.

The problem in senior IC has always been finance. It's about money, and who gets it. Money means better coaching, better facilities and more player retention. If the GAA wants a Super 8 it needs to be subsiding smaller counties that actually try to compete like Tyrone, Roscommon, Monaghan, Cavan and Armagh far more than they currently are. The GAA desperately needs counties like that to be competitive simply to make the premier competition a decent spectacle. Likewise a cap on senior IC spending to prevent Dublin buying AIs or Mayo/Kerry trying to buy them and a centralised travel expenses fund and having some real oversight over how senior IC money is spent would go a long way towards fostering a better game at the top level rather than trying to wedge in an extra eight games at the AIQF stage.

But sure what do I know, I just witnessed my team be embarrassed by a team who will probably be embarrassed themselves this weekend. That will do wonders for the promotion of the game.

"The grudge" is still strong.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trailer on July 16, 2018, 01:53:42 PM
The Super 8's isn't perfect, but it's better than what we had before.
Weaker / smaller counties should help themselves before they start crying to croke park. This is a voluntary organisation. You go to any club in Tyrone and see the amount of volunteers helping out with coaching at underage. These counties constantly want someone to blame. They should sort themselves out first then look to Croke park for help.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: joemamas on July 16, 2018, 02:01:01 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on July 16, 2018, 01:45:41 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 01:41:48 PM
Quote from: omagh_gael on July 16, 2018, 01:14:46 PM
So what's the alternative? Bearing in mind your team has a significantly easier path to either a straight knock out QF or the super8s compared to most of the country.

Kerry had a far easier route and got embarrassed by a team we should have bet yesterday. Roscommon could have drawn two D1 teams in their province this year by the way, much tougher than what Dublin or any Ulster team faced into. People whining about random draws being random is one of the sillier aspects of this sport.

The problem in senior IC has always been finance. It's about money, and who gets it. Money means better coaching, better facilities and more player retention. If the GAA wants a Super 8 it needs to be subsiding smaller counties that actually try to compete like Tyrone, Roscommon, Monaghan, Cavan and Armagh far more than they currently are. The GAA desperately needs counties like that to be competitive simply to make the premier competition a decent spectacle. Likewise a cap on senior IC spending to prevent Dublin buying AIs or Mayo/Kerry trying to buy them and a centralised travel expenses fund and having some real oversight over how senior IC money is spent would go a long way towards fostering a better game at the top level rather than trying to wedge in an extra eight games at the AIQF stage.

But sure what do I know, I just witnessed my team be embarrassed by a team who will probably be embarrassed themselves this weekend. That will do wonders for the promotion of the game.

Pretty obvious is it not?

Rarely agree with my Roscommon neighbor, but that is the bottom line. The GAA need to pump money coaching into weaker counties ASAP.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 03:26:03 PM
Where is this arms race going to end, lads?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trailer on July 16, 2018, 03:30:08 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 03:26:03 PM
Where is this arms race going to end, lads?

Hopefully in the destruction of North Korea (That's Meath in this scenario)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on July 16, 2018, 03:31:33 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 03:26:03 PM
Where is this arms race going to end, lads?

(https://m0.sportsjoe.ie/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/14141656/McGeeney-bicep.jpg)

That's over years.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 04:00:44 PM
We're pouring more and more money into the game and it's getting worse by the year.
What's the solution?
MORE MONEY!
Lets flood the weaker counties with cash so they can bring in sports scientists, statisticians, nutritionists etc. and then we can happily watch every inter-county team hand-passing each other to death while the crowd on the terraces loses the will to live.
Money has got us here, so explain to me how money will get us out of here.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 04:04:01 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 04:00:44 PM
We're pouring more and more money into the game and it's getting worse by the year.
What's the solution?
MORE MONEY!
Lets flood the weaker counties with cash so they can bring in sports scientists, statisticians, nutritionists etc. and then we can happily watch every inter-county team hand-passing each other to death while the crowd on the terraces loses the will to live.
Money has got us here, so explain to me how money will get us out of here.

You missed the line about a spending cap Jinxy. If everyone is literally working from the same numbers there is much less incentive to overspend, particularly if the penalties were harsh. Meaning overall costs would go down. It works in many professional sports so the idea that amateur gaelic football is a special case I cannot buy.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rodney trotter on July 16, 2018, 05:20:19 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 04:00:44 PM
We're pouring more and more money into the game and it's getting worse by the year.
What's the solution?
MORE MONEY!
Lets flood the weaker counties with cash so they can bring in sports scientists, statisticians, nutritionists etc. and then we can happily watch every inter-county team hand-passing each other to death while the crowd on the terraces loses the will to live.
Money has got us here, so explain to me how money will get us out of here.

It's getting worse if your from Meath anyway. Done nothing in years. Roscommon and Monaghan combined wouldn't have the population of Meath, and they're in the Super 8s.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 16, 2018, 06:02:40 PM
Meath 195k.
Ros 65k,  Monaghan 64k.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: joemamas on July 16, 2018, 06:18:57 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 04:00:44 PM
We're pouring more and more money into the game and it's getting worse by the year.
What's the solution?
MORE MONEY!
Lets flood the weaker counties with cash so they can bring in sports scientists, statisticians, nutritionists etc. and then we can happily watch every inter-county team hand-passing each other to death while the crowd on the terraces loses the will to live.
Money has got us here, so explain to me how money will get us out of here.

I find it difficult to believe that five or six underage coach's in Leitrim or name one of ten other counties, would not develop skills of kids say 8-12 and continue it on from that.
Now I am not stupid and don't believe things will change overnight, but the divergence right now is alarming.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 06:28:30 PM
Quote from: rodney trotter on July 16, 2018, 05:20:19 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 04:00:44 PM
We're pouring more and more money into the game and it's getting worse by the year.
What's the solution?
MORE MONEY!
Lets flood the weaker counties with cash so they can bring in sports scientists, statisticians, nutritionists etc. and then we can happily watch every inter-county team hand-passing each other to death while the crowd on the terraces loses the will to live.
Money has got us here, so explain to me how money will get us out of here.

It's getting worse if your from Meath anyway. Done nothing in years. Roscommon and Monaghan combined wouldn't have the population of Meath, and they're in the Super 8s.

We're too busy harvesting crops from our rich, fertile land.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Lar Naparka on July 16, 2018, 06:57:11 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 04:00:44 PM
We're pouring more and more money into the game and it's getting worse by the year.
What's the solution?
MORE MONEY!
Lets flood the weaker counties with cash so they can bring in sports scientists, statisticians, nutritionists etc. and then we can happily watch every inter-county team hand-passing each other to death while the crowd on the terraces loses the will to live.
Money has got us here, so explain to me how money will get us out of here.
Scrap the ridiculous round robinny stuff, aka super 8s, and cop on to reality.
The whole intercounty model needs radical overhaul and the sooner, the better while we still have a semblance of a 32 county game.
The first thing that struck me when I sat back to consider my impressions after the first round this weekend.
First and foremost, there were almost literally acres of empty seats in every venue and the same can be said of the hurling fixtures as well. Next round will see even more spaces on the terraces and seats  and God help us but the concluding round will throw up a number of  even more meaningless games as the results will be forgone conclusions. Either both teams involved won't proceed any further or there may well be a number of total mismatches. 
If you consider the costs involved by both teams and the expenses of opening each stadium for a mickey mouse game, the odds are that the overall exercise will cost more than it will bring in.
Apart from all of that, the players involved have to give up even more of their time and run the increased risk of getting injured and of curtailing their free time even more.
This mickey mouse competition is a dead man walking....!!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: LilySavage on July 16, 2018, 07:04:06 PM
'Every venue..'
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on July 16, 2018, 07:06:30 PM
Quote from: Lar Naparka on July 16, 2018, 06:57:11 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 04:00:44 PM
We're pouring more and more money into the game and it's getting worse by the year.
What's the solution?
MORE MONEY!
Lets flood the weaker counties with cash so they can bring in sports scientists, statisticians, nutritionists etc. and then we can happily watch every inter-county team hand-passing each other to death while the crowd on the terraces loses the will to live.
Money has got us here, so explain to me how money will get us out of here.
Scrap the ridiculous round robinny stuff, aka super 8s, and cop on to reality.
The whole intercounty model needs radical overhaul and the sooner, the better while we still have a semblance of a 32 county game.
The first thing that struck me when I sat back to consider my impressions after the first round this weekend.
First and foremost, there were almost literally acres of empty seats in every venue and the same can be said of the hurling fixtures as well. Next round will see even more spaces on the terraces and seats  and God help us but the concluding round will throw up a number of  even more meaningless games as the results will be forgone conclusions. Either both teams involved won't proceed any further or there may well be a number of total mismatches. 
If you consider the costs involved by both teams and the expenses of opening each stadium for a mickey mouse game, the odds are that the overall exercise will cost more than it will bring in.
Apart from all of that, the players involved have to give up even more of their time and run the increased risk of getting injured and of curtailing their free time even more.
This mickey mouse competition is a dead man walking....!!

I'd be very surprised if there are many empty spaces on the terraces in Omagh, Newbridge or the Hyde this weekend and the whole of Monaghan will be in Clones to see a possible execution of Kerry. I still think we need to see how this pans out before jumping to judgements. Although I do think provincial venues should be used for all the neutral venues. Or possibly even all games could be at smaller neutral venues. There's nothing better than a packed out venue in a county town like Tullamore or Carlow for a championship match.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: straightred on July 16, 2018, 07:29:46 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 16, 2018, 07:06:30 PM
Quote from: Lar Naparka on July 16, 2018, 06:57:11 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 04:00:44 PM
We're pouring more and more money into the game and it's getting worse by the year.
What's the solution?
MORE MONEY!
Lets flood the weaker counties with cash so they can bring in sports scientists, statisticians, nutritionists etc. and then we can happily watch every inter-county team hand-passing each other to death while the crowd on the terraces loses the will to live.
Money has got us here, so explain to me how money will get us out of here.
Scrap the ridiculous round robinny stuff, aka super 8s, and cop on to reality.
The whole intercounty model needs radical overhaul and the sooner, the better while we still have a semblance of a 32 county game.
The first thing that struck me when I sat back to consider my impressions after the first round this weekend.
First and foremost, there were almost literally acres of empty seats in every venue and the same can be said of the hurling fixtures as well. Next round will see even more spaces on the terraces and seats  and God help us but the concluding round will throw up a number of  even more meaningless games as the results will be forgone conclusions. Either both teams involved won't proceed any further or there may well be a number of total mismatches. 
If you consider the costs involved by both teams and the expenses of opening each stadium for a mickey mouse game, the odds are that the overall exercise will cost more than it will bring in.
Apart from all of that, the players involved have to give up even more of their time and run the increased risk of getting injured and of curtailing their free time even more.
This mickey mouse competition is a dead man walking....!!

I'd be very surprised if there are many empty spaces on the terraces in Omagh, Newbridge or the Hyde this weekend and the whole of Monaghan will be in Clones to see a possible execution of Kerry. I still think we need to see how this pans out before jumping to judgements. Although I do think provincial venues should be used for all the neutral venues. Or possibly even all games could be at smaller neutral venues. There's nothing better than a packed out venue in a county town like Tullamore or Carlow for a championship match.

Can i jump in to defend the current order of games. The provincial winners that played each other were all coming off a few weeks of rest. The qualifiers that played each other have been playing for the last 3 weeks i think so i think in that context the scheduling was correct. Croke park does seem to be a problem though. I was there on saturday and sunday and i don't think i've ever seen it as flat. There was probably more at the 1st game yesterday than the 2nd. That wasn't supposed to happen.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 07:32:26 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 16, 2018, 07:06:30 PM
Quote from: Lar Naparka on July 16, 2018, 06:57:11 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 04:00:44 PM
We're pouring more and more money into the game and it's getting worse by the year.
What's the solution?
MORE MONEY!
Lets flood the weaker counties with cash so they can bring in sports scientists, statisticians, nutritionists etc. and then we can happily watch every inter-county team hand-passing each other to death while the crowd on the terraces loses the will to live.
Money has got us here, so explain to me how money will get us out of here.
Scrap the ridiculous round robinny stuff, aka super 8s, and cop on to reality.
The whole intercounty model needs radical overhaul and the sooner, the better while we still have a semblance of a 32 county game.
The first thing that struck me when I sat back to consider my impressions after the first round this weekend.
First and foremost, there were almost literally acres of empty seats in every venue and the same can be said of the hurling fixtures as well. Next round will see even more spaces on the terraces and seats  and God help us but the concluding round will throw up a number of  even more meaningless games as the results will be forgone conclusions. Either both teams involved won't proceed any further or there may well be a number of total mismatches. 
If you consider the costs involved by both teams and the expenses of opening each stadium for a mickey mouse game, the odds are that the overall exercise will cost more than it will bring in.
Apart from all of that, the players involved have to give up even more of their time and run the increased risk of getting injured and of curtailing their free time even more.
This mickey mouse competition is a dead man walking....!!

I'd be very surprised if there are many empty spaces on the terraces in Omagh, Newbridge or the Hyde this weekend and the whole of Monaghan will be in Clones to see a possible execution of Kerry. I still think we need to see how this pans out before jumping to judgements. Although I do think provincial venues should be used for all the neutral venues. Or possibly even all games could be at smaller neutral venues. There's nothing better than a packed out venue in a county town like Tullamore or Carlow for a championship match.

Lol.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on July 16, 2018, 07:37:35 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 07:32:26 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 16, 2018, 07:06:30 PM
Quote from: Lar Naparka on July 16, 2018, 06:57:11 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 04:00:44 PM
We're pouring more and more money into the game and it's getting worse by the year.
What's the solution?
MORE MONEY!
Lets flood the weaker counties with cash so they can bring in sports scientists, statisticians, nutritionists etc. and then we can happily watch every inter-county team hand-passing each other to death while the crowd on the terraces loses the will to live.
Money has got us here, so explain to me how money will get us out of here.
Scrap the ridiculous round robinny stuff, aka super 8s, and cop on to reality.
The whole intercounty model needs radical overhaul and the sooner, the better while we still have a semblance of a 32 county game.
The first thing that struck me when I sat back to consider my impressions after the first round this weekend.
First and foremost, there were almost literally acres of empty seats in every venue and the same can be said of the hurling fixtures as well. Next round will see even more spaces on the terraces and seats  and God help us but the concluding round will throw up a number of  even more meaningless games as the results will be forgone conclusions. Either both teams involved won't proceed any further or there may well be a number of total mismatches. 
If you consider the costs involved by both teams and the expenses of opening each stadium for a mickey mouse game, the odds are that the overall exercise will cost more than it will bring in.
Apart from all of that, the players involved have to give up even more of their time and run the increased risk of getting injured and of curtailing their free time even more.
This mickey mouse competition is a dead man walking....!!

I'd be very surprised if there are many empty spaces on the terraces in Omagh, Newbridge or the Hyde this weekend and the whole of Monaghan will be in Clones to see a possible execution of Kerry. I still think we need to see how this pans out before jumping to judgements. Although I do think provincial venues should be used for all the neutral venues. Or possibly even all games could be at smaller neutral venues. There's nothing better than a packed out venue in a county town like Tullamore or Carlow for a championship match.

Lol.

I'm surprised you have the face to lol at anything this week.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Therealdonald on July 16, 2018, 07:37:59 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 04:04:01 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 04:00:44 PM
We're pouring more and more money into the game and it's getting worse by the year.
What's the solution?
MORE MONEY!
Lets flood the weaker counties with cash so they can bring in sports scientists, statisticians, nutritionists etc. and then we can happily watch every inter-county team hand-passing each other to death while the crowd on the terraces loses the will to live.
Money has got us here, so explain to me how money will get us out of here.

You missed the line about a spending cap Jinxy. If everyone is literally working from the same numbers there is much less incentive to overspend, particularly if the penalties were harsh. Meaning overall costs would go down. It works in many professional sports so the idea that amateur gaelic football is a special case I cannot buy.

Syferus, of all the issues discussed on this board, money and county spending is definitely 1 in which you should be saying nothing. It's common knowledge that outside of the Dubs, the Rossies have the single biggest sponsor in the country. Don't listen to his drivel.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 07:38:45 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 16, 2018, 07:37:35 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 07:32:26 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 16, 2018, 07:06:30 PM
Quote from: Lar Naparka on July 16, 2018, 06:57:11 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 04:00:44 PM
We're pouring more and more money into the game and it's getting worse by the year.
What's the solution?
MORE MONEY!
Lets flood the weaker counties with cash so they can bring in sports scientists, statisticians, nutritionists etc. and then we can happily watch every inter-county team hand-passing each other to death while the crowd on the terraces loses the will to live.
Money has got us here, so explain to me how money will get us out of here.
Scrap the ridiculous round robinny stuff, aka super 8s, and cop on to reality.
The whole intercounty model needs radical overhaul and the sooner, the better while we still have a semblance of a 32 county game.
The first thing that struck me when I sat back to consider my impressions after the first round this weekend.
First and foremost, there were almost literally acres of empty seats in every venue and the same can be said of the hurling fixtures as well. Next round will see even more spaces on the terraces and seats  and God help us but the concluding round will throw up a number of  even more meaningless games as the results will be forgone conclusions. Either both teams involved won't proceed any further or there may well be a number of total mismatches. 
If you consider the costs involved by both teams and the expenses of opening each stadium for a mickey mouse game, the odds are that the overall exercise will cost more than it will bring in.
Apart from all of that, the players involved have to give up even more of their time and run the increased risk of getting injured and of curtailing their free time even more.
This mickey mouse competition is a dead man walking....!!

I'd be very surprised if there are many empty spaces on the terraces in Omagh, Newbridge or the Hyde this weekend and the whole of Monaghan will be in Clones to see a possible execution of Kerry. I still think we need to see how this pans out before jumping to judgements. Although I do think provincial venues should be used for all the neutral venues. Or possibly even all games could be at smaller neutral venues. There's nothing better than a packed out venue in a county town like Tullamore or Carlow for a championship match.

Lol.

I'm surprised you have the face to lol at anything this week.

Only a fantasist would think tickets for those two games aren't going to be very easy to come by.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Lar Naparka on July 16, 2018, 08:24:55 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 16, 2018, 07:06:30 PM
Quote from: Lar Naparka on July 16, 2018, 06:57:11 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 04:00:44 PM
We're pouring more and more money into the game and it's getting worse by the year.
What's the solution?
MORE MONEY!
Lets flood the weaker counties with cash so they can bring in sports scientists, statisticians, nutritionists etc. and then we can happily watch every inter-county team hand-passing each other to death while the crowd on the terraces loses the will to live.
Money has got us here, so explain to me how money will get us out of here.
Scrap the ridiculous round robinny stuff, aka super 8s, and cop on to reality.
The whole intercounty model needs radical overhaul and the sooner, the better while we still have a semblance of a 32 county game.
The first thing that struck me when I sat back to consider my impressions after the first round this weekend.
First and foremost, there were almost literally acres of empty seats in every venue and the same can be said of the hurling fixtures as well. Next round will see even more spaces on the terraces and seats  and God help us but the concluding round will throw up a number of  even more meaningless games as the results will be forgone conclusions. Either both teams involved won't proceed any further or there may well be a number of total mismatches. 
If you consider the costs involved by both teams and the expenses of opening each stadium for a mickey mouse game, the odds are that the overall exercise will cost more than it will bring in.
Apart from all of that, the players involved have to give up even more of their time and run the increased risk of getting injured and of curtailing their free time even more.
This mickey mouse competition is a dead man walking....!!

I'd be very surprised if there are many empty spaces on the terraces in Omagh, Newbridge or the Hyde this weekend and the whole of Monaghan will be in Clones to see a possible execution of Kerry. I still think we need to see how this pans out before jumping to judgements. Although I do think provincial venues should be used for all the neutral venues. Or possibly even all games could be at smaller neutral venues. There's nothing better than a packed out venue in a county town like Tullamore or Carlow for a championship match.
You may be dead right but we are talking about the purpose of the exercise which is to generate income for HQ, for want of a better term.
Now if Newbridge is filled to capacity, we are talking about possibly 10,000 at max. I can't see the Hyde attracting even that amount as I do't think many will give the Rossies a chance. No insult to the team or the county but I can't see a sellout there.
There could be a great carnival atmosphere at games in venues like Tullamore or Carlow but after expenses are taken care of, there won't be much for central funds.
The third round will see matches where one or both teams haven''t a hope of qualifying for a semi spot and where followers of those teams have to shell out for tickets and other expenses for the third time in as many weeks.
Say a team gets hammered in the first two games and the third involves a long return  journey for the county supporters, I can't see a sellout under the circumstances.
I may be prejudiced but I system is weighed in favour of the stronger teams. Before the first round, I imagine any punter with savvy could have picked the eventual qualifiers. With the exception of the Kerry/Galway game, I picked the winner in all other games and I'd imagine many others did the same. Next round should be even more predictable and the ultimate round should be even easier.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trailer on July 17, 2018, 08:44:54 AM
The Super 8's is obviously a work in progress. It's been one weekend and people have already got it in for the GAA. Give it a chance. Next year perhaps a round of home games first to build anticipation followed on by neutral games either in CP or at neutral provincial grounds. This is better than we had before. It's not perfect and of course Roscommon are going to take 3 heavy tankings but it's better than what went before. We should give it a fair chance. 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 17, 2018, 10:24:20 AM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 16, 2018, 07:37:35 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 16, 2018, 07:32:26 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 16, 2018, 07:06:30 PM
Quote from: Lar Naparka on July 16, 2018, 06:57:11 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 16, 2018, 04:00:44 PM
We're pouring more and more money into the game and it's getting worse by the year.
What's the solution?
MORE MONEY!
Lets flood the weaker counties with cash so they can bring in sports scientists, statisticians, nutritionists etc. and then we can happily watch every inter-county team hand-passing each other to death while the crowd on the terraces loses the will to live.
Money has got us here, so explain to me how money will get us out of here.
Scrap the ridiculous round robinny stuff, aka super 8s, and cop on to reality.
The whole intercounty model needs radical overhaul and the sooner, the better while we still have a semblance of a 32 county game.
The first thing that struck me when I sat back to consider my impressions after the first round this weekend.
First and foremost, there were almost literally acres of empty seats in every venue and the same can be said of the hurling fixtures as well. Next round will see even more spaces on the terraces and seats  and God help us but the concluding round will throw up a number of  even more meaningless games as the results will be forgone conclusions. Either both teams involved won't proceed any further or there may well be a number of total mismatches. 
If you consider the costs involved by both teams and the expenses of opening each stadium for a mickey mouse game, the odds are that the overall exercise will cost more than it will bring in.
Apart from all of that, the players involved have to give up even more of their time and run the increased risk of getting injured and of curtailing their free time even more.
This mickey mouse competition is a dead man walking....!!

I'd be very surprised if there are many empty spaces on the terraces in Omagh, Newbridge or the Hyde this weekend and the whole of Monaghan will be in Clones to see a possible execution of Kerry. I still think we need to see how this pans out before jumping to judgements. Although I do think provincial venues should be used for all the neutral venues. Or possibly even all games could be at smaller neutral venues. There's nothing better than a packed out venue in a county town like Tullamore or Carlow for a championship match.

Lol.

I'm surprised you have the face to lol at anything this week.

He who lols last, lols the loudest.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 17, 2018, 10:46:15 AM
A lot of fans would not be flúirseach enough to fork out say €100 per match if bringing a few of the kids to see the county. Kildare will have played 7 or 8 matches by the end of the Super 8 and it still won't be finishe'd.    Every team bar maybe the Dubs will have to come face to face with the systemic imbalances in the sport and their own mediocrity.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Puckoon on July 17, 2018, 04:30:48 PM
How do the Semi Finals work out

Group A team 1 Vs Group B team 2?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 17, 2018, 04:43:58 PM
Quote from: Puckoon on July 17, 2018, 04:30:48 PM
How do the Semi Finals work out

Group A team 1 Vs Group B team 2?

Yep that's it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: straightred on July 17, 2018, 04:59:39 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 17, 2018, 10:46:15 AM
A lot of fans would not be flúirseach enough to fork out say €100 per match if bringing a few of the kids to see the county. Kildare will have played 7 or 8 matches by the end of the Super 8 and it still won't be finishe'd.    Every team bar maybe the Dubs will have to come face to face with the systemic imbalances in the sport and their own mediocrity.

Agree - at the very least they should be allowing at least 1 extra opt out on season tickets on account of all the extra games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 17, 2018, 05:11:57 PM
If there are dead rubbers I wonder will there be an appetite for the fans to go? Or just the hardcore supporters.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 17, 2018, 05:18:05 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 17, 2018, 05:11:57 PM
If there are dead rubbers I wonder will there be an appetite for the fans to go? Or just the hardcore supporters.

Are you actually wondering or do you already know the obvious answer?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 17, 2018, 05:20:48 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 17, 2018, 05:11:57 PM
If there are dead rubbers I wonder will there be an appetite for the fans to go? Or just the hardcore supporters.
Those at head office will probably still think things are wonderful regardless and may even bring in a Super 4 for the last 4 with the top two in the group reaching the All Ireland final imagine that..
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 17, 2018, 05:27:15 PM
The first tweak is play 1st round at Neutral venues ( Not Croker).
After that ...?
83k Phase 1.
50/55k at most this weekend
Last weekend depends on how many real matches are on.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Lar Naparka on July 17, 2018, 06:01:11 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 17, 2018, 05:20:48 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 17, 2018, 05:11:57 PM
If there are dead rubbers I wonder will there be an appetite for the fans to go? Or just the hardcore supporters.
Those at head office will probably still think things are wonderful regardless and may even bring in a Super 4 for the last 4 with the top two in the group reaching the All Ireland final imagine that..
I hate peeing on anybody's parade and I'd love to see see some merit in the present series of matches but round robin games don't fit easily into a championship structure and the Super 8s are no exception.
This weekend Kerry will play Monaghan in Clones. How many Kerry fans will make the long trek northwards? I can't see hordes of Donegal fans converging on the Hyde either and I feel that most Roscommon supporters will be afraid to turn up and pay good money to see their hopes annihilated. No insult intended to the Rossies here but it will be the shock of the century if they manage to beat a team that has to win to stay in the race for Sam.
Kildare and Galway may get a fair crowd but that's relative since the ground isn't up to intercounty standard and a sell out crowd will mean less than 10,000.
I know I'm  nitpicking here but the issues I am talking about should have been obvious to all before a ball was thrown in in any game.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 17, 2018, 06:03:58 PM
Quote from: Lar Naparka on July 17, 2018, 06:01:11 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 17, 2018, 05:20:48 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 17, 2018, 05:11:57 PM
If there are dead rubbers I wonder will there be an appetite for the fans to go? Or just the hardcore supporters.
Those at head office will probably still think things are wonderful regardless and may even bring in a Super 4 for the last 4 with the top two in the group reaching the All Ireland final imagine that..
I hate peeing on anybody's parade and I'd love to see see some merit in the present series of matches but round robin games don't fit easily into a championship structure and the Super 8s are no exception.
This weekend Kerry will play Monaghan in Clones. How many Kerry fans will make the long trek northwards? I can't see hordes of Donegal fans converging on the Hyde either and I feel that most Roscommon supporters will be afraid to turn up and pay good money to see their hopes annihilated. No insult intended to the Rossies here but it will be the shock of the century if they manage to beat a team that has to win to stay in the race for Sam.
Kildare and Galway may get a fair crowd but that's relative since the ground isn't up to intercounty standard and a sell out crowd will mean less than 10,000.
I know I'm  nitpicking here but the issues I am talking about should have been obvious to all before a ball was thrown in in any game.

Go back to your armchair psychoanalysis of posters and leave the football talk to the counties still in the championship.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on July 17, 2018, 06:14:29 PM
Quote from: Lar Naparka on July 17, 2018, 06:01:11 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 17, 2018, 05:20:48 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 17, 2018, 05:11:57 PM
If there are dead rubbers I wonder will there be an appetite for the fans to go? Or just the hardcore supporters.
Those at head office will probably still think things are wonderful regardless and may even bring in a Super 4 for the last 4 with the top two in the group reaching the All Ireland final imagine that..
I hate peeing on anybody's parade and I'd love to see see some merit in the present series of matches but round robin games don't fit easily into a championship structure and the Super 8s are no exception.
This weekend Kerry will play Monaghan in Clones. How many Kerry fans will make the long trek northwards? I can't see hordes of Donegal fans converging on the Hyde either and I feel that most Roscommon supporters will be afraid to turn up and pay good money to see their hopes annihilated. No insult intended to the Rossies here but it will be the shock of the century if they manage to beat a team that has to win to stay in the race for Sam.
Kildare and Galway may get a fair crowd but that's relative since the ground isn't up to intercounty standard and a sell out crowd will mean less than 10,000.
I know I'm  nitpicking here but the issues I am talking about should have been obvious to all before a ball was thrown in in any game.

As i said on the attendance thread a much lower crowd than was expected for Saturday's double header and this is off the back of the "super 8s" getting hyped to the hills for months but that hype didn't work as they couldn't even get 60k with the Dubs involved.

Maybe supporters see it as it is. Group games are not for the last eight stage while knock out football is far more interesting and draws in bigger crowds.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Kuwabatake Sanjuro on July 17, 2018, 07:10:02 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 17, 2018, 05:11:57 PM
If there are dead rubbers I wonder will there be an appetite for the fans to go? Or just the hardcore supporters.

I'll have to pay in to a likely dead rubber but I won't be hanging around to watch it. I'm sure Mayo supporters will be the same.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 17, 2018, 10:25:33 PM
Quote from: Kuwabatake Sanjuro on July 17, 2018, 07:10:02 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 17, 2018, 05:11:57 PM
If there are dead rubbers I wonder will there be an appetite for the fans to go? Or just the hardcore supporters.

I'll have to pay in to a likely dead rubber but I won't be hanging around to watch it. I'm sure Mayo supporters will be the same.

I defo won't anyway.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 18, 2018, 01:04:52 AM
Not something Rhus have to fret about in 2018 ;)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 18, 2018, 08:45:42 AM
Dead right Lar. For me, I was always against round robin in championship because there will inevitably be dead rubbers and more controversially games that are dead for one team but crucial for the opponent. If not this year, then some year. But "champions league" format was the big cry from the masses so we got what we wanted and now it's here we should make the best of it.

If Galway and Monaghan win this week, it'll make a right balls of that group.  But if Kildare and Kerry win (which I certainly wouldn't rule out), then the final round will be set up perfectly
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 18, 2018, 09:08:02 AM
Quote from: Syferus on July 17, 2018, 06:03:58 PM
Quote from: Lar Naparka on July 17, 2018, 06:01:11 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 17, 2018, 05:20:48 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 17, 2018, 05:11:57 PM
If there are dead rubbers I wonder will there be an appetite for the fans to go? Or just the hardcore supporters.
Those at head office will probably still think things are wonderful regardless and may even bring in a Super 4 for the last 4 with the top two in the group reaching the All Ireland final imagine that..
I hate peeing on anybody's parade and I'd love to see see some merit in the present series of matches but round robin games don't fit easily into a championship structure and the Super 8s are no exception.
This weekend Kerry will play Monaghan in Clones. How many Kerry fans will make the long trek northwards? I can't see hordes of Donegal fans converging on the Hyde either and I feel that most Roscommon supporters will be afraid to turn up and pay good money to see their hopes annihilated. No insult intended to the Rossies here but it will be the shock of the century if they manage to beat a team that has to win to stay in the race for Sam.
Kildare and Galway may get a fair crowd but that's relative since the ground isn't up to intercounty standard and a sell out crowd will mean less than 10,000.
I know I'm  nitpicking here but the issues I am talking about should have been obvious to all before a ball was thrown in in any game.

Go back to your armchair psychoanalysis of posters and leave the football talk to the counties still in the championship.

What a pathetic condescending post. Then agsin, I shouldn't expect anything higher than this from you.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on July 18, 2018, 09:11:07 AM
Round robin format should always be at the start of a competition

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on July 18, 2018, 11:02:42 AM
Can they tweak the super 8 or even scrap them for next year or is it set in stone for a set trial period?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: JoG2 on July 18, 2018, 11:12:08 AM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on July 18, 2018, 09:11:07 AM
Round robin format should always be at the start of a competition

But looking through the eyes of the GAA top brass, this is the start of the (elite) competition.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: straightred on July 18, 2018, 11:24:52 AM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on July 18, 2018, 09:11:07 AM
Round robin format should always be at the start of a competition

They messed about with the one part of the competition that actually worked very well (1/4 final knockouts). Everyone knows the real issues are the competition before that, i.e. the inequity across provinces and the lack of competition within provinces.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 18, 2018, 11:27:21 AM
Quote from: larryin89 on July 18, 2018, 11:02:42 AM
Can they tweak the super 8 or even scrap them for next year or is it set in stone for a set trial period?

3 years minimum.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Solo_run on July 18, 2018, 11:38:09 AM
If the GAA wanted to generate more revenue they should have introduced a league system at the start of the championship, perhaps even create conferences so fans can actually afford to go to games. This would mean that weaker county teams can develop their squads, everyone plays an equal amount of games

Instead we have a system that to me only benefits the top 4 teams in Ireland. Qualifier teams can play every weekend form round 1 all the way through to the super 8s without having a rest while the top teams have a few weeks in between games. Not only is it unfair on teams but the supporters to.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: straightred on July 18, 2018, 11:47:56 AM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 18, 2018, 11:38:09 AM
If the GAA wanted to generate more revenue they should have introduced a league system at the start of the championship, perhaps even create conferences so fans can actually afford to go to games. This would mean that weaker county teams can develop their squads, everyone plays an equal amount of games

Instead we have a system that to me only benefits the top 4 teams in Ireland. Qualifier teams can play every weekend form round 1 all the way through to the super 8s without having a rest while the top teams have a few weeks in between games. Not only is it unfair on teams but the supporters to.

The dice is totally loaded.

Tyrone, monaghan and kildare are facing into their 5 weekend in a row. Their respective opposition are on their 2nd. Roscommon isn't quote as bad (3rd in a row)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 18, 2018, 11:54:28 AM
That's the punishment you get for you losing in  your Provincial.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Solo_run on July 18, 2018, 12:04:44 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 18, 2018, 11:54:28 AM
That's the punishment you get for you losing in  your Provincial.

The likes of Antrim, Leitrim, Wicklow etc shouldn't be punished for being beaten by teams that are much stronger than them. They should be given more of an opportunity to develop rather than being given 2 games a season. If they are given the chance to develop, who knows, in a few years they could challenge and bring in bigger crowds
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 18, 2018, 01:00:06 PM
We were talking about Tyrone, Kildare etc.
So what's your plan for Antrim and Leitrim?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Solo_run on July 18, 2018, 01:01:57 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 18, 2018, 01:00:06 PM
We were talking about Tyrone, Kildare etc.
So what's your plan for Antrim and Leitrim?

The likes of Tyrone, Kildare, Roscommon etc shouldn't be punished for losing their provincial games.

As for the likes of Antrim and Leitirm, it is simple, give them more games to develop.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 18, 2018, 01:40:34 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 17, 2018, 06:03:58 PM
Quote from: Lar Naparka on July 17, 2018, 06:01:11 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 17, 2018, 05:20:48 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 17, 2018, 05:11:57 PM
If there are dead rubbers I wonder will there be an appetite for the fans to go? Or just the hardcore supporters.
Those at head office will probably still think things are wonderful regardless and may even bring in a Super 4 for the last 4 with the top two in the group reaching the All Ireland final imagine that..
I hate peeing on anybody's parade and I'd love to see see some merit in the present series of matches but round robin games don't fit easily into a championship structure and the Super 8s are no exception.
This weekend Kerry will play Monaghan in Clones. How many Kerry fans will make the long trek northwards? I can't see hordes of Donegal fans converging on the Hyde either and I feel that most Roscommon supporters will be afraid to turn up and pay good money to see their hopes annihilated. No insult intended to the Rossies here but it will be the shock of the century if they manage to beat a team that has to win to stay in the race for Sam.
Kildare and Galway may get a fair crowd but that's relative since the ground isn't up to intercounty standard and a sell out crowd will mean less than 10,000.
I know I'm  nitpicking here but the issues I am talking about should have been obvious to all before a ball was thrown in in any game.

Go back to your armchair psychoanalysis of posters and leave the football talk to the counties still in the championship.

Do you think roscommon are actually still in the championship???
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 18, 2018, 01:54:03 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 18, 2018, 01:40:34 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 17, 2018, 06:03:58 PM
Quote from: Lar Naparka on July 17, 2018, 06:01:11 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 17, 2018, 05:20:48 PM
Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 17, 2018, 05:11:57 PM
If there are dead rubbers I wonder will there be an appetite for the fans to go? Or just the hardcore supporters.
Those at head office will probably still think things are wonderful regardless and may even bring in a Super 4 for the last 4 with the top two in the group reaching the All Ireland final imagine that..
I hate peeing on anybody's parade and I'd love to see see some merit in the present series of matches but round robin games don't fit easily into a championship structure and the Super 8s are no exception.
This weekend Kerry will play Monaghan in Clones. How many Kerry fans will make the long trek northwards? I can't see hordes of Donegal fans converging on the Hyde either and I feel that most Roscommon supporters will be afraid to turn up and pay good money to see their hopes annihilated. No insult intended to the Rossies here but it will be the shock of the century if they manage to beat a team that has to win to stay in the race for Sam.
Kildare and Galway may get a fair crowd but that's relative since the ground isn't up to intercounty standard and a sell out crowd will mean less than 10,000.
I know I'm  nitpicking here but the issues I am talking about should have been obvious to all before a ball was thrown in in any game.

Go back to your armchair psychoanalysis of posters and leave the football talk to the counties still in the championship.

Do you think roscommon are actually still in the championship???

:o

This wasn't as much of a zinger as you clearly thought it was in your head.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trailer on July 18, 2018, 02:04:40 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 18, 2018, 12:04:44 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 18, 2018, 11:54:28 AM
That's the punishment you get for you losing in  your Provincial.

The likes of Antrim, Leitrim, Wicklow etc shouldn't be punished for being beaten by teams that are much stronger than them. They should be given more of an opportunity to develop rather than being given 2 games a season. If they are given the chance to develop, who knows, in a few years they could challenge and bring in bigger crowds

Antrim have had 100 years or more to develop. They've a huge population. Giving them more games is not the silver bullet you think it is. Perhaps if they put a bit of work in at youth level and had some sort of plan they might then develop. Giving them more games and them taking huge tankings won't solve underlying fundamental issues that they have.
Leitrim granted are suffocated due to it's size, but barring a huge population surge they will also struggle. Games won't help.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Solo_run on July 18, 2018, 02:20:07 PM
Quote from: trailer on July 18, 2018, 02:04:40 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 18, 2018, 12:04:44 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 18, 2018, 11:54:28 AM
That's the punishment you get for you losing in  your Provincial.

The likes of Antrim, Leitrim, Wicklow etc shouldn't be punished for being beaten by teams that are much stronger than them. They should be given more of an opportunity to develop rather than being given 2 games a season. If they are given the chance to develop, who knows, in a few years they could challenge and bring in bigger crowds

Antrim have had 100 years or more to develop. They've a huge population. Giving them more games is not the silver bullet you think it is. Perhaps if they put a bit of work in at youth level and had some sort of plan they might then develop. Giving them more games and them taking huge tankings won't solve underlying fundamental issues that they have.
Leitrim granted are suffocated due to it's size, but barring a huge population surge they will also struggle. Games won't help.

You are right it will no solve it. However, having more than 2 games will be of more benefit to them.

The whole structure needs to change from the league all the way through to the super 8's.


Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 18, 2018, 02:22:27 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 18, 2018, 02:20:07 PM
Quote from: trailer on July 18, 2018, 02:04:40 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 18, 2018, 12:04:44 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 18, 2018, 11:54:28 AM
That's the punishment you get for you losing in  your Provincial.

The likes of Antrim, Leitrim, Wicklow etc shouldn't be punished for being beaten by teams that are much stronger than them. They should be given more of an opportunity to develop rather than being given 2 games a season. If they are given the chance to develop, who knows, in a few years they could challenge and bring in bigger crowds

Antrim have had 100 years or more to develop. They've a huge population. Giving them more games is not the silver bullet you think it is. Perhaps if they put a bit of work in at youth level and had some sort of plan they might then develop. Giving them more games and them taking huge tankings won't solve underlying fundamental issues that they have.
Leitrim granted are suffocated due to it's size, but barring a huge population surge they will also struggle. Games won't help.

You are right it will no solve it. However, having more than 2 games will be of more benefit to them.

The whole structure needs to change from the league all the way through to the super 8's.

Deck chairs on the fúcking Titanic.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 18, 2018, 02:26:11 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 18, 2018, 02:20:07 PM
Quote from: trailer on July 18, 2018, 02:04:40 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 18, 2018, 12:04:44 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 18, 2018, 11:54:28 AM
That's the punishment you get for you losing in  your Provincial.

The likes of Antrim, Leitrim, Wicklow etc shouldn't be punished for being beaten by teams that are much stronger than them. They should be given more of an opportunity to develop rather than being given 2 games a season. If they are given the chance to develop, who knows, in a few years they could challenge and bring in bigger crowds

Antrim have had 100 years or more to develop. They've a huge population. Giving them more games is not the silver bullet you think it is. Perhaps if they put a bit of work in at youth level and had some sort of plan they might then develop. Giving them more games and them taking huge tankings won't solve underlying fundamental issues that they have.
Leitrim granted are suffocated due to it's size, but barring a huge population surge they will also struggle. Games won't help.

You are right it will no solve it. However, having more than 2 games will be of more benefit to them.

The whole structure needs to change from the league all the way through to the super 8's.

The league is fine the best format the GAA have but it needs to be promoted better and made more important.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Solo_run on July 18, 2018, 02:49:12 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 18, 2018, 02:26:11 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 18, 2018, 02:20:07 PM
Quote from: trailer on July 18, 2018, 02:04:40 PM
Quote from: Solo_run on July 18, 2018, 12:04:44 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 18, 2018, 11:54:28 AM
That's the punishment you get for you losing in  your Provincial.

The likes of Antrim, Leitrim, Wicklow etc shouldn't be punished for being beaten by teams that are much stronger than them. They should be given more of an opportunity to develop rather than being given 2 games a season. If they are given the chance to develop, who knows, in a few years they could challenge and bring in bigger crowds

Antrim have had 100 years or more to develop. They've a huge population. Giving them more games is not the silver bullet you think it is. Perhaps if they put a bit of work in at youth level and had some sort of plan they might then develop. Giving them more games and them taking huge tankings won't solve underlying fundamental issues that they have.
Leitrim granted are suffocated due to it's size, but barring a huge population surge they will also struggle. Games won't help.

You are right it will no solve it. However, having more than 2 games will be of more benefit to them.

The whole structure needs to change from the league all the way through to the super 8's.

The league is fine the best format the GAA have but it needs to be promoted better and made more important.


But instead of the league being based on performance it should be on regional location.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 18, 2018, 04:06:35 PM
The League us a pre the real season competition plated by teams in varied stages if preparation,  trying out new lads,  missing club championship players etc.
The Championship is the real thing.
And from the Quarter Finals on it's the even more real thing.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 22, 2018, 02:03:36 AM
Ok, two more glorified league matches in the tank - has the penny dropped? Even the official program today was talking about how 'critics panned the first weekend'..
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 22, 2018, 02:35:34 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 18, 2018, 04:06:35 PM
The League us a pre the real season competition plated by teams in varied stages if preparation,  trying out new lads,  missing club championship players etc.
The Championship is the real thing.
And from the Quarter Finals on it's the even more real thing.
Every sport should have at least two top tournaments and that would provide more "real" stuff then for the players and supporters to enjoy. The league is the best format the GAA have and should be made more important. The championship is a cup competition where the story of the underdog going on a run to remember for many years to come should be as important as the team that wins the cup. A round robin for the last eight that will now include dead rubbers is one of the many daft things GAA HQ has brought in and they will now probably try to fix this daftness with more daftness in the years ahead.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 22, 2018, 03:31:26 PM
This super 8 system is throwing up some classics.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: balladmaker on July 22, 2018, 05:29:32 PM
If Super 8's had been introduced 100 yrs ago, Kerry wouldn't have won 37 All Irelands.  At least the new format is exposing the unfairness of playing a couple of easy games to get to an All Ireland semi, those days are now over thankfully.

Edit: well done Kerry, still stand by the above :-)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 22, 2018, 05:50:51 PM
Keep all three rounds away from Croke Park (excluding Dublin home game) and this could work really well.
Is there any way of eliminating dead rubbers?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 22, 2018, 05:53:51 PM
Two good matches in eight tells its own story.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trileacman on July 22, 2018, 05:57:47 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 22, 2018, 05:50:51 PM
Keep all three rounds away from Croke Park (excluding Dublin home game) and this could work really well.
Is there any way of eliminating dead rubbers?

We could get apres match to do the analysis at half time in the dead rubbers?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: twohands!!! on July 22, 2018, 06:01:42 PM
We could yet get a Monaghan v Kerry play-off

Galway beat Monaghan by a point.
Kerry beat Kildare by 4 points.

This would leave both Kerry and Monaghan on 3 points and a score difference of +1
Both sides highest score so far is the 1-17 both scored today (so Kerry and Monaghan would both have to score less than this in their games)
Kerry have scored 2 goals so far and Monaghan have scored 1, so Monaghan would have to get one goal in their loss to Galway and Kerry to get none.

Then play-off.

It's unlikely but not impossible.


QuoteIn the event of teams finishing on equal points in a
Quarter-Final Group, the tie shall be decided by the
following means and in the order specified:
(i) Where two Teams only are involved – the
outcome of the meeting of the two Teams in the
Group
(ii) Score difference – subtracting the total Scores
against from the Scores for.
(iii) Highest Total Score For
(iv) Highest Total Goals For
(v) A Play-Off.


http://res.cloudinary.com/dvrbaruzq/image/upload/ludlpjt6lq1ywtpsy4zn.pdf

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 22, 2018, 06:04:38 PM
Fair Play Index?  :)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 22, 2018, 06:27:45 PM
If we had Mayo instead of Roscommon in the Super 8s there would have been some craic.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 06:39:54 PM
It's proving it's worth and will be a success. You'll have bad games in any format but this format pits most of the best teams against each other and winning (or a draw) is vital in, at least, two of the three rounds.


I don't see an issue with the odd dead rubber, nobody complains that premiership games in the last few weeks may not matter when there are 3 or 4 teams in with a shout of the title. Roscommon against Dublin is not important but Donegal v Tyrone is do or die. Kildare may not be overly pushed in two weeks and Galway are through but both games will matter as nobody wants the Dublin semi final. Until someone can come up with a magical format that provides loads of competitive games that all matter then the super 8's are as good as we are likely to get in the near future.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on July 22, 2018, 06:46:40 PM
When is the best time to play Dublin, semi final or final? Something to ponder for Kevin Walsh?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 22, 2018, 06:50:10 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 22, 2018, 06:27:45 PM
If we had Mayo instead of Roscommon in the Super 8s there would have been some craic.
Would have been Mayo instead of Kildare though. If Galway had lost the Connacht final would they have reached the last 4 with a game to spare if they were in a group with Donegal,Tyrone and Dublin?

More games should be done before the last eight not during it. Last eight should be an old fashion knock out championship football.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on July 22, 2018, 06:55:03 PM
Funny enough if the Galway Monaghan games a draw then Monaghan are definitely through and Galway stay top
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 06:57:58 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 22, 2018, 06:50:10 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 22, 2018, 06:27:45 PM
If we had Mayo instead of Roscommon in the Super 8s there would have been some craic.
Would have been Mayo instead of Kildare though. If Galway had lost the Connacht final would they have reached the last 4 with a game to spare if they were in a group with Donegal,Tyrone and Dublin?

More games should be done before the last eight not during it. Last eight should be an old fashion knock out championship football.

Why?? Before the last 8 we've division 1 and division 4 teams in play so groups would largely be irrelevant and you'd definitely have dead rubbers. This way we have the best teams (by and large) playing each other in small groups which (as best you can) guarantees close competitive matches between teams with realistic ambitions of success. The quality of games is always going top vary in any format but at least we have potentially good games to look forward to and a fairer system for getting to an All Ireland semi final.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 06:59:22 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 22, 2018, 06:27:45 PM
If we had Mayo instead of Roscommon in the Super 8s there would have been some craic.

Oh thanks be to God we are not there! It would be an incredible waste of money and time! This process it just dragging out the inevitable.

You have 6 teams who may be on the same level. You have one a few levels below and one a few levels above. Why we need 12 games instead of 4 to tell us this is a crime!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 22, 2018, 07:00:24 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on July 22, 2018, 06:46:40 PM
When is the best time to play Dublin, semi final or final? Something to ponder for Kevin Walsh?
Past years I would say the final as they haven't performed to the best of their ability in a finals since the 70s however I have a strong feeling that this year Dublin will win the All Ireland final by a bit to spare.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 07:04:10 PM
Sure why don't we just hand the trophy to Dublin in January each year until you and Syferus decide someone can compete with Dublin again?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 07:06:03 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 07:04:10 PM
Sure why don't we just hand the trophy to Dublin in January each year until you and Syferus decide someone can compete with Dublin again?

Well at the moment it'd be better than this dragged out rubbish!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 22, 2018, 07:11:48 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 07:04:10 PM
Sure why don't we just hand the trophy to Dublin in January each year until you and Syferus decide someone can compete with Dublin again?
Did my opinion hit a nerve? Tyrone and Donegal have already competed well with Dublin this year. Now yourself and Syferus probably need to get a room as it would save the rest of us reading through that tiresome bickering. 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 07:17:55 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 07:06:03 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 07:04:10 PM
Sure why don't we just hand the trophy to Dublin in January each year until you and Syferus decide someone can compete with Dublin again?

Well at the moment it'd be better than this dragged out rubbish!

Errr, no it's not. Jesus wept, we've just had 3 out of 4 games be good to very good and we've football fans bemoaning the fact we've football games. Only in the GAA could that happen.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 07:22:12 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 22, 2018, 07:11:48 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 07:04:10 PM
Sure why don't we just hand the trophy to Dublin in January each year until you and Syferus decide someone can compete with Dublin again?
Did my opinion hit a nerve? Tyrone and Donegal have already competed well with Dublin this year. Now yourself and Syferus probably need to get a room as it would save the rest of us reading through that tiresome bickering.

I wasn't responding to you. You may well be right about Dublin winning the All Ireland handy but as a supporter of football I will enjoy good games as they happen and would prefer if the doom merchants like Syferus and From the Bunker found something else to occupy their time if they feel every game is pointless because they think Dublin will win the All Ireland anyway.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 07:35:09 PM
If Monaghan and Galway are level going into the last 10 minutes, who is to bet if one team plays keep ball the other team will say grand keep the ball for 10 minutes?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GalwayBayBoy on July 22, 2018, 07:37:10 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 07:35:09 PM
If Monaghan and Galway are level going into the last 10 minutes, who is to bet if one team plays keep ball the other team will say grand keep the ball for 10 minutes?

I remember a few World Cup games like that back in the day.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 07:39:35 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 22, 2018, 07:37:10 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 07:35:09 PM
If Monaghan and Galway are level going into the last 10 minutes, who is to bet if one team plays keep ball the other team will say grand keep the ball for 10 minutes?

I remember a few World Cup games like that back in the day.

West Germany/Austria 1982 world cup they played for 1-0! Ireland Holland 1990!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 07:41:35 PM
Will Monaghan be happy to be playing Dublin rather than Donegal or Tyrone? I'd say Monaghan will be very keen to win and not be happy with the draw. We get this all the time from posters around here, suggest something and the worst case scenario is brought up. The super 8's have left us with three out of four games that have something to play for. Why not just enjoy the games? If they are poor spectacles go for a walk instead and if they are riveting viewing enjoy them for the bit of sporting entertainment they are.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 22, 2018, 08:45:31 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 07:41:35 PM
Will Monaghan be happy to be playing Dublin rather than Donegal or Tyrone? I'd say Monaghan will be very keen to win and not be happy with the draw. We get this all the time from posters around here, suggest something and the worst case scenario is brought up. The super 8's have left us with three out of four games that have something to play for. Why not just enjoy the games? If they are poor spectacles go for a walk instead and if they are riveting viewing enjoy them for the bit of sporting entertainment they are.

Thanks for your input, Mr. Duffy.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 09:02:19 PM
I don't know whether to advise you to give up the drink or to take it up. You need something to brighten you up anyway.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 09:15:58 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 09:02:19 PM
I don't know whether to advise you to give up the drink or to take it up. You need something to brighten you up anyway.

He has lost hope Zulu! One of many! Hope has gone!

Watching the games at the weekend was like watching Kilmarnock v St. Mirren and saying one of these will put it up to Celtic!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Kuwabatake Sanjuro on July 22, 2018, 09:20:52 PM
Celtic are playing like they were under Ronny Deila though at the moment.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 22, 2018, 09:34:45 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 09:15:58 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 09:02:19 PM
I don't know whether to advise you to give up the drink or to take it up. You need something to brighten you up anyway.

He has lost hope Zulu! One of many! Hope has gone!

Watching the games at the weekend was like watching Kilmarnock v St. Mirren and saying one of these will put it up to Celtic!

Each to their own but I've never really understood the prevalence of this attitude in the GAA.
How can your enjoyment of a game be contingent on how good either team are relative to another team they aren't actually playing?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 22, 2018, 10:28:54 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 22, 2018, 09:34:45 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 09:15:58 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 09:02:19 PM
I don't know whether to advise you to give up the drink or to take it up. You need something to brighten you up anyway.

He has lost hope Zulu! One of many! Hope has gone!

Watching the games at the weekend was like watching Kilmarnock v St. Mirren and saying one of these will put it up to Celtic!

Each to their own but I've never really understood the prevalence of this attitude in the GAA.
How can your enjoyment of a game be contingent on how good either team are relative to another team they aren't actually playing?

..because it's a tournament explicitly played to determine which team is the best, and for at least half a decade the team that is going to win is obvious to absolutely everyone? It's not unnatural being unable to be excited at the prospect of Galway making a run to an AISF or final and then having little hope of actually competing.

Imagine the World Cup where every match was a third place-off. That's what we have.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Orchard park on July 22, 2018, 10:36:13 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 22, 2018, 10:28:54 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 22, 2018, 09:34:45 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 09:15:58 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 09:02:19 PM
I don't know whether to advise you to give up the drink or to take it up. You need something to brighten you up anyway.

He has lost hope Zulu! One of many! Hope has gone!

Watching the games at the weekend was like watching Kilmarnock v St. Mirren and saying one of these will put it up to Celtic!

Each to their own but I've never really understood the prevalence of this attitude in the GAA.
How can your enjoyment of a game be contingent on how good either team are relative to another team they aren't actually playing?

..because it's a tournament explicitly played to determine which team is the best, and for at least half a decade the team that is going to win is obvious to absolutely everyone? It's not unnatural being unable to be excited at the prospect of Galway making a run to an AISF or final and then having little hope of actually competing.

Imagine the World Cup where every match was a third place-off. That's what we have.

What do you propose. Bar Dublin ???
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 11:08:59 PM
Quote from: Orchard park on July 22, 2018, 10:36:13 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 22, 2018, 10:28:54 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 22, 2018, 09:34:45 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 09:15:58 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 09:02:19 PM
I don't know whether to advise you to give up the drink or to take it up. You need something to brighten you up anyway.

He has lost hope Zulu! One of many! Hope has gone!

Watching the games at the weekend was like watching Kilmarnock v St. Mirren and saying one of these will put it up to Celtic!

Each to their own but I've never really understood the prevalence of this attitude in the GAA.
How can your enjoyment of a game be contingent on how good either team are relative to another team they aren't actually playing?

..because it's a tournament explicitly played to determine which team is the best, and for at least half a decade the team that is going to win is obvious to absolutely everyone? It's not unnatural being unable to be excited at the prospect of Galway making a run to an AISF or final and then having little hope of actually competing.

Imagine the World Cup where every match was a third place-off. That's what we have.

What do you propose. Bar Dublin ???

Well I don't propose having a useless round robin league at the Business end! Feck sake how many games do you need to get to an AI final!

On the Dublin issue, I just don't have the time or the patience to list again the unfair advantages they have!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on July 22, 2018, 11:23:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 07:41:35 PM
Will Monaghan be happy to be playing Dublin rather than Donegal or Tyrone? I'd say Monaghan will be very keen to win and not be happy with the draw. We get this all the time from posters around here, suggest something and the worst case scenario is brought up. The super 8's have left us with three out of four games that have something to play for. Why not just enjoy the games? If they are poor spectacles go for a walk instead and if they are riveting viewing enjoy them for the bit of sporting entertainment they are.

I think they'd rather get through than not
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 11:25:56 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on July 22, 2018, 11:23:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 07:41:35 PM
Will Monaghan be happy to be playing Dublin rather than Donegal or Tyrone? I'd say Monaghan will be very keen to win and not be happy with the draw. We get this all the time from posters around here, suggest something and the worst case scenario is brought up. The super 8's have left us with three out of four games that have something to play for. Why not just enjoy the games? If they are poor spectacles go for a walk instead and if they are riveting viewing enjoy them for the bit of sporting entertainment they are.

I think they'd rather get through than not

+1
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 23, 2018, 08:28:32 AM
There are some people determined to give out about the super 8s no matter what. We had a great weekend of football which showed the true potential of the new format. More good games between good teams at this time of year should be welcomed. It's good to see more games from the likes of Kerry who in the past we saw them involved in few competitive games before the semi finals. Group stages at an earlier stage wouldn't work as there currently isn't enough good teams to make them competitive and interest would quickly drop.

I can't believe that anyone is making an argument against the format based on the fact we should try to play the championship of as quickly as possible because Dublin are too good. That is so short sighted and a ridiculous argument. The thing is they didn't exactly cruise to a win at the weekend either. If Ronan O'Neill had converted a relatively straight forward free the game easily could have finished a draw.

Under the new format we will have some dead rubber games but we will also have more very good games than previously. I'd easily say that this weeks games were more entertaining than the quarter final weekends most years over the last 15 years. And we have set up two more cracking games in two weeks times.

Moving the games around the country was also a great success yesterday with excellent atmospheres. It was a great evening out on Saturday in Omagh and plenty of craic about with the Dubs afterwards.

The opening weekend in croke park didn't go to plan and it probably needs reviewed. I think they should leave the neutral games to the last round. And if there is big games then play them in croke park. For example this year based on the tables Donegal tyrone and monaghan galway could have gone there. A minimum number of games will be played there so we might as well make them the important ones.  In order to keep attendances up given everyone travelling in the final round they could drop the prices for it. Ten or fifteen euro tickets for it and a bit of promotion could ensure healthy attendances.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 23, 2018, 11:22:12 AM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 22, 2018, 05:50:51 PM
Is there any way of eliminating dead rubbers?
No way of eliminating them, but you could guarantee the group isn't over after 2 games by having the winners from R1 playing each other in R2.

If Kerry had not got that goal, that group would be over (bar deciding who tops the group). Now at least there'll be excitement in R3.

Quote from: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 07:41:35 PM
Will Monaghan be happy to be playing Dublin rather than Donegal or Tyrone? I'd say Monaghan will be very keen to win and not be happy with the draw.
Don't know if he's an outlier, but my Monaghan mate's order of preference for a potential semi final is Donegal, Dublin, Tyrone! But yeah, I think Monaghan just need to get there regardless of who they'll be playing. No way can you risk playing for a draw.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 12:57:04 PM
If we were to have the exact same teams involved for next year (for the sake of argument), I would put the NEUTRAL round (fairly confident this change will happen) as round 2.
The first round should get the ball rolling and build interest as one side won't have to travel, however, there should be some reward for the provincial champions so I would suggest that they get home advantage in Round 1.
Obviously, they would start against a qualifier team, unlike the current system which had all the provincial champs facing off in the first round.
The fixtures for Round 2 would look something like the following:

Tyrone/Roscommon - Markievicz Park
Dublin/Donegal - Clones
Kerry/Galway - Gaelic Grounds
Monaghan/Kildare - Pairc Tailteann

I actually think there is an argument for including as many grounds as possible from counties who don't have a team in the Super 8s, as neutral options.
So maybe instead of having a neutral game in Clones, which will be hosting a home game for Monaghan anyway, stick the game in Breffni.
Reading reports from Omagh, it seems that the town got a nice boost from the Dubs visit.
It would be great to spread that effect around as much as possible, within reason.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Trap on July 23, 2018, 01:30:12 PM
Good idea Jinxy - like that.

One thing that has annoyed me from the weekend is the criticism of the refs.

Donegal v Roscommon - McStay had a point with one of the incidents being a free but this didn't have any bearing on the game really

Kildare v Galway - Flynn deserved to be sent off - if the ref had let it go and Kildare had won he would have got a hiding from Galway and pundits. It was a great game up to that and not bad afterwards and when a game is good I always feel the ref plays a good part in that

Tyrone v Dublin - a decent game with only 1 card - refs get criticised for too many cards, and now he got it for not giving enough. Yes he made a few dodgy calls but he also added to the game

Monaghan v Kerry - again a good game in which the ref maybe got a couple of things wrong but overall did ok

Who would want to do this when they get it in the neck from everyone even when do ok?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on July 23, 2018, 01:48:31 PM
Quote from: The Trap on July 23, 2018, 01:30:12 PM
Good idea Jinxy - like that.

One thing that has annoyed me from the weekend is the criticism of the refs.

Donegal v Roscommon - McStay had a point with one of the incidents being a free but this didn't have any bearing on the game really

Kildare v Galway - Flynn deserved to be sent off - if the ref had let it go and Kildare had won he would have got a hiding from Galway and pundits. It was a great game up to that and not bad afterwards and when a game is good I always feel the ref plays a good part in that

Tyrone v Dublin - a decent game with only 1 card - refs get criticised for too many cards, and now he got it for not giving enough. Yes he made a few dodgy calls but he also added to the game

Monaghan v Kerry - again a good game in which the ref maybe got a couple of things wrong but overall did ok

Who would want to do this when they get it in the neck from everyone even when do ok?

The ref was good, it was Dublin Joe who wanted to be in the limelight. O'Neill was dead right to call that useless p***k out. He obviously has issues with Kildare.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Main Street on July 23, 2018, 01:57:28 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2018, 11:25:56 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam14 on July 22, 2018, 11:23:41 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 22, 2018, 07:41:35 PM
Will Monaghan be happy to be playing Dublin rather than Donegal or Tyrone? I'd say Monaghan will be very keen to win and not be happy with the draw. We get this all the time from posters around here, suggest something and the worst case scenario is brought up. The super 8's have left us with three out of four games that have something to play for. Why not just enjoy the games? If they are poor spectacles go for a walk instead and if they are riveting viewing enjoy them for the bit of sporting entertainment they are.

I think they'd rather get through than not

+1
How can a team play for a draw  except that the scores are level with a minute or so left to play? If that's what transpires, then the question of being content with that and holding onto it fits for both teams. I suppose a parley of sorts would be needed to work out the terms of a truce for the closing minutes of play.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 02:28:57 PM
Actually, if we are looking to make the Super 8s as competitive as possible, maybe the first round should be a home game for the teams that come through the qualifiers.
Not very fair on the provincial winners I suppose, but screw those guys.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 23, 2018, 02:33:01 PM
I suppose the Provincial winners playing each other first and likewise the Qualifiers means like is playing like.
2nd round should be the 2 winners play each other and the 2 losers likewise. Toss for home venues.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 03:37:01 PM
Also, cut the price of the shagging tickets.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 23, 2018, 03:37:49 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 12:57:04 PM
If we were to have the exact same teams involved for next year (for the sake of argument), I would put the NEUTRAL round (fairly confident this change will happen) as round 2.
The first round should get the ball rolling and build interest as one side won't have to travel, however, there should be some reward for the provincial champions so I would suggest that they get home advantage in Round 1.
Obviously, they would start against a qualifier team, unlike the current system which had all the provincial champs facing off in the first round.
The fixtures for Round 2 would look something like the following:

Tyrone/Roscommon - Markievicz Park
Dublin/Donegal - Clones
Kerry/Galway - Gaelic Grounds
Monaghan/Kildare - Pairc Tailteann

I actually think there is an argument for including as many grounds as possible from counties who don't have a team in the Super 8s, as neutral options.
So maybe instead of having a neutral game in Clones, which will be hosting a home game for Monaghan anyway, stick the game in Breffni.
Reading reports from Omagh, it seems that the town got a nice boost from the Dubs visit.
It would be great to spread that effect around as much as possible, within reason.
I read on RTE that the Mayo match was worth €400k to Newbridge
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 23, 2018, 03:39:41 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 23, 2018, 03:37:49 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 12:57:04 PM
If we were to have the exact same teams involved for next year (for the sake of argument), I would put the NEUTRAL round (fairly confident this change will happen) as round 2.
The first round should get the ball rolling and build interest as one side won't have to travel, however, there should be some reward for the provincial champions so I would suggest that they get home advantage in Round 1.
Obviously, they would start against a qualifier team, unlike the current system which had all the provincial champs facing off in the first round.
The fixtures for Round 2 would look something like the following:

Tyrone/Roscommon - Markievicz Park
Dublin/Donegal - Clones
Kerry/Galway - Gaelic Grounds
Monaghan/Kildare - Pairc Tailteann

I actually think there is an argument for including as many grounds as possible from counties who don't have a team in the Super 8s, as neutral options.
So maybe instead of having a neutral game in Clones, which will be hosting a home game for Monaghan anyway, stick the game in Breffni.
Reading reports from Omagh, it seems that the town got a nice boost from the Dubs visit.
It would be great to spread that effect around as much as possible, within reason.
I read on RTE that the Mayo match was worth €400k to Newbridge

I read on the news that the economy is in great shape.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on July 23, 2018, 03:40:06 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 23, 2018, 02:33:01 PM
I suppose the Provincial winners playing each other first and likewise the Qualifiers means like is playing like.
2nd round should be the 2 winners play each other and the 2 losers likewise. Toss for home venues.
Good thinking only there was giving out that the dates and venues weren't known for round 2 this year two weeks before throw-in.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Bord na Mona man on July 23, 2018, 03:43:25 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 23, 2018, 03:37:49 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 12:57:04 PM
If we were to have the exact same teams involved for next year (for the sake of argument), I would put the NEUTRAL round (fairly confident this change will happen) as round 2.
The first round should get the ball rolling and build interest as one side won't have to travel, however, there should be some reward for the provincial champions so I would suggest that they get home advantage in Round 1.
Obviously, they would start against a qualifier team, unlike the current system which had all the provincial champs facing off in the first round.
The fixtures for Round 2 would look something like the following:

Tyrone/Roscommon - Markievicz Park
Dublin/Donegal - Clones
Kerry/Galway - Gaelic Grounds
Monaghan/Kildare - Pairc Tailteann

I actually think there is an argument for including as many grounds as possible from counties who don't have a team in the Super 8s, as neutral options.
So maybe instead of having a neutral game in Clones, which will be hosting a home game for Monaghan anyway, stick the game in Breffni.
Reading reports from Omagh, it seems that the town got a nice boost from the Dubs visit.
It would be great to spread that effect around as much as possible, within reason.
I read on RTE that the Mayo match was worth €400k to Newbridge
I'd love to know what metrics they use for these calculations.
They always come across as massively inflated and to push an agenda of some sort.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 23, 2018, 03:56:19 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 02:28:57 PM
Actually, if we are looking to make the Super 8s as competitive as possible, maybe the first round should be a home game for the teams that come through the qualifiers.
Not very fair on the provincial winners I suppose, but screw those guys.

Quote from: Rossfan on July 23, 2018, 02:33:01 PM
I suppose the Provincial winners playing each other first and likewise the Qualifiers means like is playing like.
2nd round should be the 2 winners play each other and the 2 losers likewise. Toss for home venues.

Yep.

There was a lot of bleating about the Super 8 schedule being somehow unfair to provincial champions (although I don't think any of the provincial champions themselves complained, it was the great Irish trait of complaining on behalf of others!). And more stuff on "what's the point of winning the province" etc.

The easiest way to get to the Super 8 is by winning your province. So that's the benefit you get (along with your medal!). Straight in, no messing. Whereas the likes of Tyrone and Kildare are playing 4 and 5 matches on the trot. Changing the format to somehow give the provincial champions an added advantage when they get there would be a load of nonsense.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: westbound on July 23, 2018, 03:59:05 PM
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on July 23, 2018, 03:43:25 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 23, 2018, 03:37:49 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 12:57:04 PM
If we were to have the exact same teams involved for next year (for the sake of argument), I would put the NEUTRAL round (fairly confident this change will happen) as round 2.
The first round should get the ball rolling and build interest as one side won't have to travel, however, there should be some reward for the provincial champions so I would suggest that they get home advantage in Round 1.
Obviously, they would start against a qualifier team, unlike the current system which had all the provincial champs facing off in the first round.
The fixtures for Round 2 would look something like the following:

Tyrone/Roscommon - Markievicz Park
Dublin/Donegal - Clones
Kerry/Galway - Gaelic Grounds
Monaghan/Kildare - Pairc Tailteann

I actually think there is an argument for including as many grounds as possible from counties who don't have a team in the Super 8s, as neutral options.
So maybe instead of having a neutral game in Clones, which will be hosting a home game for Monaghan anyway, stick the game in Breffni.
Reading reports from Omagh, it seems that the town got a nice boost from the Dubs visit.
It would be great to spread that effect around as much as possible, within reason.
I read on RTE that the Mayo match was worth €400k to Newbridge
I'd love to know what metrics they use for these calculations.
They always come across as massively inflated and to push an agenda of some sort.

€400K doesn't seem inflated to me.

Say 10,000 attendance (I know it was a bit less but 10K is easier to do the calculations!)
That's only €40 per person to be left in Newbridge. Between food/parking/accommodation/pubs/Diesel/petrol and the bit of shopping that might be done by a few of the fans (or spouses of fans who won't bother going into the game), €40 per person doesn't seem too inflated.
I'd guess the €400K includes money spent inside the ground as well?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: westbound on July 23, 2018, 04:01:12 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 23, 2018, 03:56:19 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 02:28:57 PM
Actually, if we are looking to make the Super 8s as competitive as possible, maybe the first round should be a home game for the teams that come through the qualifiers.
Not very fair on the provincial winners I suppose, but screw those guys.

Quote from: Rossfan on July 23, 2018, 02:33:01 PM
I suppose the Provincial winners playing each other first and likewise the Qualifiers means like is playing like.
2nd round should be the 2 winners play each other and the 2 losers likewise. Toss for home venues.

Yep.

There was a lot of bleating about the Super 8 schedule being somehow unfair to provincial champions (although I don't think any of the provincial champions themselves complained, it was the great Irish trait of complaining on behalf of others!). And more stuff on "what's the point of winning the province" etc.

The easiest way to get to the Super 8 is by winning your province. So that's the benefit you get (along with your medal!). Straight in, no messing. Whereas the likes of Tyrone and Kildare are playing 4 and 5 matches on the trot. Changing the format to somehow give the provincial champions an added advantage when they get there would be a load of nonsense.

The other advantage the provincial champs have is that they get the final deciding game at home. Donegal at home V tyrone could be a big advantage and Kerry will have home advantage for their final must win game v kidare.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: LeoMc on July 23, 2018, 04:09:19 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 12:57:04 PM
If we were to have the exact same teams involved for next year (for the sake of argument), I would put the NEUTRAL round (fairly confident this change will happen) as round 2.
The first round should get the ball rolling and build interest as one side won't have to travel, however, there should be some reward for the provincial champions so I would suggest that they get home advantage in Round 1.
Obviously, they would start against a qualifier team, unlike the current system which had all the provincial champs facing off in the first round.
The fixtures for Round 2 would look something like the following:

Tyrone/Roscommon - Markievicz Park
Dublin/Donegal - Clones
Kerry/Galway - Gaelic Grounds
Monaghan/Kildare - Pairc Tailteann

I actually think there is an argument for including as many grounds as possible from counties who don't have a team in the Super 8s, as neutral options.
So maybe instead of having a neutral game in Clones, which will be hosting a home game for Monaghan anyway, stick the game in Breffni.
Reading reports from Omagh, it seems that the town got a nice boost from the Dubs visit.
It would be great to spread that effect around as much as possible, within reason.

I would put the neutral venue matches at the end, If you want to give the Provincial champions a slight advantage let them get home advantage in the first games so they get off to a good start. Home advantage for the last match may or may not be of benefit.
Kerry and Donegal both have a slight advantage in playing their final match at home, however if Kerry had lost yesterday home advantage next week would have been of no benefit.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on July 23, 2018, 04:22:20 PM
Quote from: westbound on July 23, 2018, 03:59:05 PM
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on July 23, 2018, 03:43:25 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 23, 2018, 03:37:49 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 12:57:04 PM
If we were to have the exact same teams involved for next year (for the sake of argument), I would put the NEUTRAL round (fairly confident this change will happen) as round 2.
The first round should get the ball rolling and build interest as one side won't have to travel, however, there should be some reward for the provincial champions so I would suggest that they get home advantage in Round 1.
Obviously, they would start against a qualifier team, unlike the current system which had all the provincial champs facing off in the first round.
The fixtures for Round 2 would look something like the following:

Tyrone/Roscommon - Markievicz Park
Dublin/Donegal - Clones
Kerry/Galway - Gaelic Grounds
Monaghan/Kildare - Pairc Tailteann

I actually think there is an argument for including as many grounds as possible from counties who don't have a team in the Super 8s, as neutral options.
So maybe instead of having a neutral game in Clones, which will be hosting a home game for Monaghan anyway, stick the game in Breffni.
Reading reports from Omagh, it seems that the town got a nice boost from the Dubs visit.
It would be great to spread that effect around as much as possible, within reason.
I read on RTE that the Mayo match was worth €400k to Newbridge
I'd love to know what metrics they use for these calculations.
They always come across as massively inflated and to push an agenda of some sort.

€400K doesn't seem inflated to me.

Say 10,000 attendance (I know it was a bit less but 10K is easier to do the calculations!)
That's only €40 per person to be left in Newbridge. Between food/parking/accommodation/pubs/Diesel/petrol and the bit of shopping that might be done by a few of the fans (or spouses of fans who won't bother going into the game), €40 per person doesn't seem too inflated.
I'd guess the €400K includes money spent inside the ground as well?

Exactly and that is pretty modest estimate considering I spent ten Euro on water inside the ground, 60 euro food and pints in newbridge, left a few quid in Paddy power in the town too. The pubs were wedged before and after the game .

I don't think people put enough thought into how well small towns do for a decent crowd championship game . In saying that not every country is like our lot, we bring some crowds even for league games to the different towns and there's always a buzz around  when Mayo are in town ,like it or loathe it , that's the truth.

Hopefully people will see sense and put the Dublin v Roscommon game as a curtain raiser to our under 20 lads instead of other way around.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 04:34:56 PM
Quote from: LeoMc on July 23, 2018, 04:09:19 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 12:57:04 PM
If we were to have the exact same teams involved for next year (for the sake of argument), I would put the NEUTRAL round (fairly confident this change will happen) as round 2.
The first round should get the ball rolling and build interest as one side won't have to travel, however, there should be some reward for the provincial champions so I would suggest that they get home advantage in Round 1.
Obviously, they would start against a qualifier team, unlike the current system which had all the provincial champs facing off in the first round.
The fixtures for Round 2 would look something like the following:

Tyrone/Roscommon - Markievicz Park
Dublin/Donegal - Clones
Kerry/Galway - Gaelic Grounds
Monaghan/Kildare - Pairc Tailteann

I actually think there is an argument for including as many grounds as possible from counties who don't have a team in the Super 8s, as neutral options.
So maybe instead of having a neutral game in Clones, which will be hosting a home game for Monaghan anyway, stick the game in Breffni.
Reading reports from Omagh, it seems that the town got a nice boost from the Dubs visit.
It would be great to spread that effect around as much as possible, within reason.

I would put the neutral venue matches at the end, If you want to give the Provincial champions a slight advantage let them get home advantage in the first games so they get off to a good start. Home advantage for the last match may or may not be of benefit.
Kerry and Donegal both have a slight advantage in playing their final match at home, however if Kerry had lost yesterday home advantage next week would have been of no benefit.

You risk having dead rubbers in a neutral venue then.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 23, 2018, 04:53:26 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on July 23, 2018, 04:22:20 PM
Quote from: westbound on July 23, 2018, 03:59:05 PM
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on July 23, 2018, 03:43:25 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 23, 2018, 03:37:49 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 12:57:04 PM
If we were to have the exact same teams involved for next year (for the sake of argument), I would put the NEUTRAL round (fairly confident this change will happen) as round 2.
The first round should get the ball rolling and build interest as one side won't have to travel, however, there should be some reward for the provincial champions so I would suggest that they get home advantage in Round 1.
Obviously, they would start against a qualifier team, unlike the current system which had all the provincial champs facing off in the first round.
The fixtures for Round 2 would look something like the following:

Tyrone/Roscommon - Markievicz Park
Dublin/Donegal - Clones
Kerry/Galway - Gaelic Grounds
Monaghan/Kildare - Pairc Tailteann

I actually think there is an argument for including as many grounds as possible from counties who don't have a team in the Super 8s, as neutral options.
So maybe instead of having a neutral game in Clones, which will be hosting a home game for Monaghan anyway, stick the game in Breffni.
Reading reports from Omagh, it seems that the town got a nice boost from the Dubs visit.
It would be great to spread that effect around as much as possible, within reason.
I read on RTE that the Mayo match was worth €400k to Newbridge
I'd love to know what metrics they use for these calculations.
They always come across as massively inflated and to push an agenda of some sort.

€400K doesn't seem inflated to me.

Say 10,000 attendance (I know it was a bit less but 10K is easier to do the calculations!)
That's only €40 per person to be left in Newbridge. Between food/parking/accommodation/pubs/Diesel/petrol and the bit of shopping that might be done by a few of the fans (or spouses of fans who won't bother going into the game), €40 per person doesn't seem too inflated.
I'd guess the €400K includes money spent inside the ground as well?

Exactly and that is pretty modest estimate considering I spent ten Euro on water inside the ground, 60 euro food and pints in newbridge, left a few quid in Paddy power in the town too. The pubs were wedged before and after the game .

I don't think people put enough thought into how well small towns do for a decent crowd championship game . In saying that not every country is like our lot, we bring some crowds even for league games to the different towns and there's always a buzz around  when Mayo are in town ,like it or loathe it , that's the truth.

Hopefully people will see sense and put the Dublin v Roscommon game as a curtain raiser to our under 20 lads instead of other way around.

LOL
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: straightred on July 23, 2018, 05:09:49 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 04:34:56 PM
Quote from: LeoMc on July 23, 2018, 04:09:19 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 12:57:04 PM
If we were to have the exact same teams involved for next year (for the sake of argument), I would put the NEUTRAL round (fairly confident this change will happen) as round 2.
The first round should get the ball rolling and build interest as one side won't have to travel, however, there should be some reward for the provincial champions so I would suggest that they get home advantage in Round 1.
Obviously, they would start against a qualifier team, unlike the current system which had all the provincial champs facing off in the first round.
The fixtures for Round 2 would look something like the following:

Tyrone/Roscommon - Markievicz Park
Dublin/Donegal - Clones
Kerry/Galway - Gaelic Grounds
Monaghan/Kildare - Pairc Tailteann

I actually think there is an argument for including as many grounds as possible from counties who don't have a team in the Super 8s, as neutral options.
So maybe instead of having a neutral game in Clones, which will be hosting a home game for Monaghan anyway, stick the game in Breffni.
Reading reports from Omagh, it seems that the town got a nice boost from the Dubs visit.
It would be great to spread that effect around as much as possible, within reason.

I would put the neutral venue matches at the end, If you want to give the Provincial champions a slight advantage let them get home advantage in the first games so they get off to a good start. Home advantage for the last match may or may not be of benefit.
Kerry and Donegal both have a slight advantage in playing their final match at home, however if Kerry had lost yesterday home advantage next week would have been of no benefit.

You risk having dead rubbers in a neutral venue then.

A dead rubber is a dead rubber. No matter what way they are ordered there is a risk of it happening. Even though its in Croke Park i'm finding it very hard to pluck up the enthusiasm to go to the Dublin Roscommon game even though I know I'll be charged for the tickets regardless (season ticket). I'm probably going to let it slide as I don't need the attendance and I'll see can I give the tickets to neighbours or something.

I like the way qualifiers play each other first as they are both coming off a series of weekly games and the provincial winners aren't. There's arguments to be made for all options - I happen to like the way it is with the only exception being that Dublin only play one game in Dublin (and I don't care were in Dublin that is)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 23, 2018, 05:12:33 PM
It has to change from a Croke Park game to "Neutral ".
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Bord na Mona man on July 23, 2018, 05:14:09 PM
Quote from: westbound on July 23, 2018, 03:59:05 PM
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on July 23, 2018, 03:43:25 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 23, 2018, 03:37:49 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 12:57:04 PM
If we were to have the exact same teams involved for next year (for the sake of argument), I would put the NEUTRAL round (fairly confident this change will happen) as round 2.
The first round should get the ball rolling and build interest as one side won't have to travel, however, there should be some reward for the provincial champions so I would suggest that they get home advantage in Round 1.
Obviously, they would start against a qualifier team, unlike the current system which had all the provincial champs facing off in the first round.
The fixtures for Round 2 would look something like the following:

Tyrone/Roscommon - Markievicz Park
Dublin/Donegal - Clones
Kerry/Galway - Gaelic Grounds
Monaghan/Kildare - Pairc Tailteann

I actually think there is an argument for including as many grounds as possible from counties who don't have a team in the Super 8s, as neutral options.
So maybe instead of having a neutral game in Clones, which will be hosting a home game for Monaghan anyway, stick the game in Breffni.
Reading reports from Omagh, it seems that the town got a nice boost from the Dubs visit.
It would be great to spread that effect around as much as possible, within reason.
I read on RTE that the Mayo match was worth €400k to Newbridge
I'd love to know what metrics they use for these calculations.
They always come across as massively inflated and to push an agenda of some sort.

€400K doesn't seem inflated to me.

Say 10,000 attendance (I know it was a bit less but 10K is easier to do the calculations!)
That's only €40 per person to be left in Newbridge. Between food/parking/accommodation/pubs/Diesel/petrol and the bit of shopping that might be done by a few of the fans (or spouses of fans who won't bother going into the game), €40 per person doesn't seem too inflated.
I'd guess the €400K includes money spent inside the ground as well?
In a family of 4 or 5, I doubt they're going to spend €40 each.
Things like petrol/diesel assumes you fill up in Newbridge and not so many miles out the road.
I have a feeling the local hotels only saw a slight uptick in bookings as well.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: OgraAnDun on July 23, 2018, 05:18:57 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 23, 2018, 05:12:33 PM
It has to change from a Croke Park game to "Neutral ".

Were Premium Level tickets and corporate boxes not sold with the guarantee of 4 quarter finals being held in Croker? I don't think the neutral games will be taken out of Croke Park.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on July 23, 2018, 05:30:28 PM
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on July 23, 2018, 05:14:09 PM
Quote from: westbound on July 23, 2018, 03:59:05 PM
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on July 23, 2018, 03:43:25 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 23, 2018, 03:37:49 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 12:57:04 PM
If we were to have the exact same teams involved for next year (for the sake of argument), I would put the NEUTRAL round (fairly confident this change will happen) as round 2.
The first round should get the ball rolling and build interest as one side won't have to travel, however, there should be some reward for the provincial champions so I would suggest that they get home advantage in Round 1.
Obviously, they would start against a qualifier team, unlike the current system which had all the provincial champs facing off in the first round.
The fixtures for Round 2 would look something like the following:

Tyrone/Roscommon - Markievicz Park
Dublin/Donegal - Clones
Kerry/Galway - Gaelic Grounds
Monaghan/Kildare - Pairc Tailteann

I actually think there is an argument for including as many grounds as possible from counties who don't have a team in the Super 8s, as neutral options.
So maybe instead of having a neutral game in Clones, which will be hosting a home game for Monaghan anyway, stick the game in Breffni.
Reading reports from Omagh, it seems that the town got a nice boost from the Dubs visit.
It would be great to spread that effect around as much as possible, within reason.
I read on RTE that the Mayo match was worth €400k to Newbridge
I'd love to know what metrics they use for these calculations.
They always come across as massively inflated and to push an agenda of some sort.

€400K doesn't seem inflated to me.

Say 10,000 attendance (I know it was a bit less but 10K is easier to do the calculations!)
That's only €40 per person to be left in Newbridge. Between food/parking/accommodation/pubs/Diesel/petrol and the bit of shopping that might be done by a few of the fans (or spouses of fans who won't bother going into the game), €40 per person doesn't seem too inflated.
I'd guess the €400K includes money spent inside the ground as well?
In a family of 4 or 5, I doubt they're going to spend €40 each.
Things like petrol/diesel assumes you fill up in Newbridge and not so many miles out the road.
I have a feeling the local hotels only saw a slight uptick in bookings as well.

Zero uptake, Derby was on for the Mayo game, The Oaks for Roscommon game.

400K is pie in the sky. I drove over yesterday, 2 mates and junior. Free parking. We went for 1 drink before hand €20. Junior spent a fiver on rubbish in the ground. Drove home immediately afterwards. 4 supporters spending on average €7.  Probably at best worth €150k to the local economy which is decent.

One of the worst grounds in the country, and it's not as bad as we or other people make out will probably provide two of the top 5 football games and occasions of the season.

Which is why playing the u20 AI final in Tullamore should have been a no brainer, CP is a terrible venue choice for it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 23, 2018, 05:33:01 PM
Quote from: OgraAnDun on July 23, 2018, 05:18:57 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 23, 2018, 05:12:33 PM
It has to change from a Croke Park game to "Neutral ".

Were Premium Level tickets and corporate boxes not sold with the guarantee of 4 quarter finals being held in Croker? I don't think the neutral games will be taken out of Croke Park.
If Congress votes to change the wording of 6 28 they'll have to.
As it is Dublin get 2 games at home while everyone else has to play 2 away.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trailer on July 23, 2018, 07:17:57 PM
Was at the Tyrone game in Omagh and have to say the Dubs should be on the road more often. They bring a great crowd and create a wonderful atmosphere both in and outside the ground. I also reckon they like travelling too.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: J70 on July 23, 2018, 07:21:09 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 23, 2018, 05:33:01 PM
Quote from: OgraAnDun on July 23, 2018, 05:18:57 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 23, 2018, 05:12:33 PM
It has to change from a Croke Park game to "Neutral ".

Were Premium Level tickets and corporate boxes not sold with the guarantee of 4 quarter finals being held in Croker? I don't think the neutral games will be taken out of Croke Park.
If Congress votes to change the wording of 6 28 they'll have to.
As it is Dublin get 2 games at home while everyone else has to play 2 away.

Donegal got stuck with two away. At least the Croke Park game was neutral for the other six.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 24, 2018, 09:29:05 AM
This made me laugh, they'll do anything now to try a sell a few extra tickets for the last weekend of the Super (h)8!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xU7t4oAaMcU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xU7t4oAaMcU)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 24, 2018, 01:11:25 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 23, 2018, 07:37:16 PM
Just listened to the GAA Hour on the drive home there and was surprised to hear that they were pretty much in agreement that Galway should rest players against Monaghan with an All-Ireland semi-final the following weekend. Their logic being that they are in the semi-finals already and shouldn't be bothered about avoiding Dublin as you're going to have to play them in either the semis or final anyway.

Why risk all your top players in what is sure to be a hard hitting physical game against Monaghan with such a quick turnaround after. They compared it to having a league game with your club the weekend before a big championship match. Worst case scenario is Galway play their best side, lose the game to Monaghan anyway, pick up a few knocks and still have to face the Dubs who will likely have a low intensity glorified training session with Roscommon.
Haven't heard the podcast, but some good points in there. The week turnaround makes this (Galway playing a weakened team) a commonsense approach.

Galway do have plenty of lads who could do with a start anyway, and will be busting a gut to either get into the starting team for the semi or move higher up the subs list.

On the downside it'll hurt the image of the Super 8, especially as it's Kerry who might be impacted. Can you imagine how Pat Spillane will react!

Of course if Walsh views this as a stepping stone year, with the aim of getting to an All Ireland final, then their best chance of reaching that target would be to go all out to win v Monaghan. But their best chance of winning an All Ireland would be to rest their best players v Monaghan.

Dublin in a more obvious situation, with the added point that their semi final opponents are getting an extra rest day. Dublin do have the benefit of a large squad, so we've plenty of options if someone gets injured. But Fenton and Rock would be huge losses, so it would be madness to play them in a meaningless game 6 days before an All Ireland semi. And you could make a good case that we should be making 15 changes.   

Goina be interesting to see how this plays out.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: galwayman on July 24, 2018, 01:37:16 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 24, 2018, 01:11:25 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 23, 2018, 07:37:16 PM
Just listened to the GAA Hour on the drive home there and was surprised to hear that they were pretty much in agreement that Galway should rest players against Monaghan with an All-Ireland semi-final the following weekend. Their logic being that they are in the semi-finals already and shouldn't be bothered about avoiding Dublin as you're going to have to play them in either the semis or final anyway.

Why risk all your top players in what is sure to be a hard hitting physical game against Monaghan with such a quick turnaround after. They compared it to having a league game with your club the weekend before a big championship match. Worst case scenario is Galway play their best side, lose the game to Monaghan anyway, pick up a few knocks and still have to face the Dubs who will likely have a low intensity glorified training session with Roscommon.
Haven't heard the podcast, but some good points in there. The week turnaround makes this (Galway playing a weakened team) a commonsense approach.

Galway do have plenty of lads who could do with a start anyway, and will be busting a gut to either get into the starting team for the semi or move higher up the subs list.

On the downside it'll hurt the image of the Super 8, especially as it's Kerry who might be impacted. Can you imagine how Pat Spillane will react!

Of course if Walsh views this as a stepping stone year, with the aim of getting to an All Ireland final, then their best chance of reaching that target would be to go all out to win v Monaghan. But their best chance of winning an All Ireland would be to rest their best players v Monaghan.

Dublin in a more obvious situation, with the added point that their semi final opponents are getting an extra rest day. Dublin do have the benefit of a large squad, so we've plenty of options if someone gets injured. But Fenton and Rock would be huge losses, so it would be madness to play them in a meaningless game 6 days before an All Ireland semi. And you could make a good case that we should be making 15 changes.   

Goina be interesting to see how this plays out.
Absolutely Dublin have leeway to make wholesale changes given they are guaranteed top spot regardless, whereas our lads are in a different position.
It's a tough one to be honest.
With the short turnaround - any niggle picked up has the potential to rule somebody out of the game the following week.
Anybody carrying any sort of knock won't be risked obviously but outside of that I don't honestly know how our management will approach this.
If the opposition were to be anybody but Dublin they would sacrifice the game and rest key players without doubt but the Dubs are so good it will be hard to do that.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: shark on July 24, 2018, 01:47:08 PM
Quote from: galwayman on July 24, 2018, 01:37:16 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 24, 2018, 01:11:25 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 23, 2018, 07:37:16 PM
Just listened to the GAA Hour on the drive home there and was surprised to hear that they were pretty much in agreement that Galway should rest players against Monaghan with an All-Ireland semi-final the following weekend. Their logic being that they are in the semi-finals already and shouldn't be bothered about avoiding Dublin as you're going to have to play them in either the semis or final anyway.

Why risk all your top players in what is sure to be a hard hitting physical game against Monaghan with such a quick turnaround after. They compared it to having a league game with your club the weekend before a big championship match. Worst case scenario is Galway play their best side, lose the game to Monaghan anyway, pick up a few knocks and still have to face the Dubs who will likely have a low intensity glorified training session with Roscommon.
Haven't heard the podcast, but some good points in there. The week turnaround makes this (Galway playing a weakened team) a commonsense approach.

Galway do have plenty of lads who could do with a start anyway, and will be busting a gut to either get into the starting team for the semi or move higher up the subs list.

On the downside it'll hurt the image of the Super 8, especially as it's Kerry who might be impacted. Can you imagine how Pat Spillane will react!

Of course if Walsh views this as a stepping stone year, with the aim of getting to an All Ireland final, then their best chance of reaching that target would be to go all out to win v Monaghan. But their best chance of winning an All Ireland would be to rest their best players v Monaghan.

Dublin in a more obvious situation, with the added point that their semi final opponents are getting an extra rest day. Dublin do have the benefit of a large squad, so we've plenty of options if someone gets injured. But Fenton and Rock would be huge losses, so it would be madness to play them in a meaningless game 6 days before an All Ireland semi. And you could make a good case that we should be making 15 changes.   

Goina be interesting to see how this plays out.
Absolutely Dublin have leeway to make wholesale changes given they are guaranteed top spot regardless, whereas our lads are in a different position.
It's a tough one to be honest.
With the short turnaround - any niggle picked up has the potential to rule somebody out of the game the following week.
Anybody carrying any sort of knock won't be risked obviously but outside of that I don't honestly know how our management will approach this.
If the opposition were to be anybody but Dublin they would sacrifice the game and rest key players without doubt but the Dubs are so good it will be hard to do that.

From the outside looking in, it seems a no brainer for Galway. 4/5 changes from their current first 15. Armstrong, Varley, O'Donnell, Duane, O'Currain. They could make these changes and still win, although it would be less likely.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trueblue1234 on July 24, 2018, 01:54:56 PM
Quote from: shark on July 24, 2018, 01:47:08 PM
Quote from: galwayman on July 24, 2018, 01:37:16 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 24, 2018, 01:11:25 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 23, 2018, 07:37:16 PM
Just listened to the GAA Hour on the drive home there and was surprised to hear that they were pretty much in agreement that Galway should rest players against Monaghan with an All-Ireland semi-final the following weekend. Their logic being that they are in the semi-finals already and shouldn't be bothered about avoiding Dublin as you're going to have to play them in either the semis or final anyway.

Why risk all your top players in what is sure to be a hard hitting physical game against Monaghan with such a quick turnaround after. They compared it to having a league game with your club the weekend before a big championship match. Worst case scenario is Galway play their best side, lose the game to Monaghan anyway, pick up a few knocks and still have to face the Dubs who will likely have a low intensity glorified training session with Roscommon.
Haven't heard the podcast, but some good points in there. The week turnaround makes this (Galway playing a weakened team) a commonsense approach.

Galway do have plenty of lads who could do with a start anyway, and will be busting a gut to either get into the starting team for the semi or move higher up the subs list.

On the downside it'll hurt the image of the Super 8, especially as it's Kerry who might be impacted. Can you imagine how Pat Spillane will react!

Of course if Walsh views this as a stepping stone year, with the aim of getting to an All Ireland final, then their best chance of reaching that target would be to go all out to win v Monaghan. But their best chance of winning an All Ireland would be to rest their best players v Monaghan.

Dublin in a more obvious situation, with the added point that their semi final opponents are getting an extra rest day. Dublin do have the benefit of a large squad, so we've plenty of options if someone gets injured. But Fenton and Rock would be huge losses, so it would be madness to play them in a meaningless game 6 days before an All Ireland semi. And you could make a good case that we should be making 15 changes.   

Goina be interesting to see how this plays out.
Absolutely Dublin have leeway to make wholesale changes given they are guaranteed top spot regardless, whereas our lads are in a different position.
It's a tough one to be honest.
With the short turnaround - any niggle picked up has the potential to rule somebody out of the game the following week.
Anybody carrying any sort of knock won't be risked obviously but outside of that I don't honestly know how our management will approach this.
If the opposition were to be anybody but Dublin they would sacrifice the game and rest key players without doubt but the Dubs are so good it will be hard to do that.

From the outside looking in, it seems a no brainer for Galway. 4/5 changes from their current first 15. Armstrong, Varley, O'Donnell, Duane, O'Currain. They could make these changes and still win, although it would be less likely.

Monaghan Galway could go either way with full teams. I doubt Galway would win with making 5 changes.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GalwayBayBoy on July 24, 2018, 02:02:53 PM
Another tweak needed for next year is a 2 week break before the semi-finals. One week turnaround before such a big game for any county seems a bit mad.

Plus I have no doubt that if Galway had a 2 week break before the semi-final they would 100% put out their best side against Monaghan but with only one week there is a definite possibility that certain players will be rotated in and out of the starting team. And if that happens Kerry will go mad but Galway as a team that have already qualified have to look after their own interests.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thebackbar1 on July 24, 2018, 02:58:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on July 23, 2018, 07:17:57 PM
Was at the Tyrone game in Omagh and have to say the Dubs should be on the road more often. They bring a great crowd and create a wonderful atmosphere both in and outside the ground. I also reckon they like travelling too.
100% they brought a large and vocal support to Galway this year in the league
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 24, 2018, 04:53:00 PM
Quote from: Syferus on July 23, 2018, 04:53:26 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on July 23, 2018, 04:22:20 PM
Quote from: westbound on July 23, 2018, 03:59:05 PM
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on July 23, 2018, 03:43:25 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 23, 2018, 03:37:49 PM
Quote from: Jinxy on July 23, 2018, 12:57:04 PM
If we were to have the exact same teams involved for next year (for the sake of argument), I would put the NEUTRAL round (fairly confident this change will happen) as round 2.
The first round should get the ball rolling and build interest as one side won't have to travel, however, there should be some reward for the provincial champions so I would suggest that they get home advantage in Round 1.
Obviously, they would start against a qualifier team, unlike the current system which had all the provincial champs facing off in the first round.
The fixtures for Round 2 would look something like the following:

Tyrone/Roscommon - Markievicz Park
Dublin/Donegal - Clones
Kerry/Galway - Gaelic Grounds
Monaghan/Kildare - Pairc Tailteann

I actually think there is an argument for including as many grounds as possible from counties who don't have a team in the Super 8s, as neutral options.
So maybe instead of having a neutral game in Clones, which will be hosting a home game for Monaghan anyway, stick the game in Breffni.
Reading reports from Omagh, it seems that the town got a nice boost from the Dubs visit.
It would be great to spread that effect around as much as possible, within reason.
I read on RTE that the Mayo match was worth €400k to Newbridge
I'd love to know what metrics they use for these calculations.
They always come across as massively inflated and to push an agenda of some sort.

€400K doesn't seem inflated to me.

Say 10,000 attendance (I know it was a bit less but 10K is easier to do the calculations!)
That's only €40 per person to be left in Newbridge. Between food/parking/accommodation/pubs/Diesel/petrol and the bit of shopping that might be done by a few of the fans (or spouses of fans who won't bother going into the game), €40 per person doesn't seem too inflated.
I'd guess the €400K includes money spent inside the ground as well?

Exactly and that is pretty modest estimate considering I spent ten Euro on water inside the ground, 60 euro food and pints in newbridge, left a few quid in Paddy power in the town too. The pubs were wedged before and after the game .

I don't think people put enough thought into how well small towns do for a decent crowd championship game . In saying that not every country is like our lot, we bring some crowds even for league games to the different towns and there's always a buzz around  when Mayo are in town ,like it or loathe it , that's the truth.

Hopefully people will see sense and put the Dublin v Roscommon game as a curtain raiser to our under 20 lads instead of other way around.

LOL

What's so funny? The Dublin Ros game has nothing riding on it, apart from the Dubs getting injured by the non-strength-and-conditioned Roscommon players. If I go, I won't be hanging around for it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 24, 2018, 05:01:27 PM
I don't expect anyou Rhubarbs or flourbags to hang around for our non event.
The U20 game and presentation etc will be all done and dusted by 2. 40 ( barring extra time and free kicking off course).
I'm sure both lots are gone past the slack jawed peasant gaping at "this magnificent Stadium" stage.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: blewuporstuffed on July 24, 2018, 05:02:50 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 24, 2018, 02:02:53 PM
Another tweak needed for next year is a 2 week break before the semi-finals. One week turnaround before such a big game for any county seems a bit mad.

Plus I have no doubt that if Galway had a 2 week break before the semi-final they would 100% put out their best side against Monaghan but with only one week there is a definite possibility that certain players will be rotated in and out of the starting team. And if that happens Kerry will go mad but Galway as a team that have already qualified have to look after their own interests.
Why is the break this weekend and not after the group stage has been completed?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 24, 2018, 05:13:55 PM
So the hurley crowd can have their Semi Finals.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Syferus on July 24, 2018, 05:16:46 PM
Quote from: blewuporstuffed on July 24, 2018, 05:02:50 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 24, 2018, 02:02:53 PM
Another tweak needed for next year is a 2 week break before the semi-finals. One week turnaround before such a big game for any county seems a bit mad.

Plus I have no doubt that if Galway had a 2 week break before the semi-final they would 100% put out their best side against Monaghan but with only one week there is a definite possibility that certain players will be rotated in and out of the starting team. And if that happens Kerry will go mad but Galway as a team that have already qualified have to look after their own interests.
Why is the break this weekend and not after the group stage has been completed?

The whole thing is already being played off at a ridculous pace. Kildare would be playing their seventh game in eight weeks if there was more of this shïte at the weekend.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 24, 2018, 05:19:06 PM
If they had got the finger out earlier and bet Carlow they wouldn't.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 06, 2018, 06:39:11 PM
Now that the Quarter Finals Phases 1,2 and 3 are overy - thoughts? (" It's shite" - doesn't count😀)
Pluses - big games at Provincial venues,  Supporters can see their team at home in a Qtr Final, team has a chance to redeem itself if 1 bad game ( Ros excepted), extra excitement especially the last round, 
Minuses - Less winner take all games, what about the other 24 Counties? , Dublin getting 2 home games, dead rubbers.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on August 06, 2018, 06:47:27 PM
What about the other 24 counties? Pretty much sums it up. This is the new cash cow and the c'ship will now resemble this sort of thing, with the other 24 totally disregarded.

Super 8 benefits counties with big squads and big resources. And gives yet another chance to the big guns in case of a slip up.

It's disrespectful to fans expecting them to fork out for 4 games in 4 weeks (inc semi next week).

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 06, 2018, 07:20:29 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on August 06, 2018, 06:47:27 PM
What about the other 24 counties? Pretty much sums it up. This is the new cash cow and the c'ship will now resemble this sort of thing, with the other 24 totally disregarded.

Super 8 benefits counties with big squads and big resources. And gives yet another chance to the big guns in case of a slip up.

It's disrespectful to fans expecting them to fork out for 4 games in 4 weeks (inc semi next week).
The other 24's position is unchanged from last year; exited at the stage prior to the quarter finals or earlier.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on August 06, 2018, 08:30:12 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on August 06, 2018, 06:47:27 PM
What about the other 24 counties? Pretty much sums it up. This is the new cash cow and the c'ship will now resemble this sort of thing, with the other 24 totally disregarded.

Super 8 benefits counties with big squads and big resources. And gives yet another chance to the big guns in case of a slip up.

It's disrespectful to fans expecting them to fork out for 4 games in 4 weeks (inc semi next week).

And yet this is the first time in how long that one of Mayo or Kerry haven't made the semi finals.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on August 06, 2018, 08:41:19 PM
Quote from: Jayop on August 06, 2018, 08:30:12 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on August 06, 2018, 06:47:27 PM
What about the other 24 counties? Pretty much sums it up. This is the new cash cow and the c'ship will now resemble this sort of thing, with the other 24 totally disregarded.

Super 8 benefits counties with big squads and big resources. And gives yet another chance to the big guns in case of a slip up.

It's disrespectful to fans expecting them to fork out for 4 games in 4 weeks (inc semi next week).

And yet this is the first time in how long that one of Mayo or Kerry haven't made the semi finals.
2010 for both and I don't think the new format is the reason why both haven't reached the semi finals more to do with the fact that both are in transition.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on August 06, 2018, 08:48:19 PM
Yeah but if Bennys assertion was correct then the super 8 format would have afforded them a slip up.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on August 06, 2018, 09:13:44 PM
Quote from: Jayop on August 06, 2018, 08:48:19 PM
Yeah but if Bennys assertion was correct then the super 8 format would have afforded them a slip up.

Transition yes.  Kerry waltz through Munster anyway, yet still could've got through with 2 slip ups in the Super 8.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on August 07, 2018, 05:15:35 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 06, 2018, 06:39:11 PM
Now that the Quarter Finals Phases 1,2 and 3 are overy - thoughts? (" It's shite" - doesn't count😀)
Pluses - big games at Provincial venues,  Supporters can see their team at home in a Qtr Final, team has a chance to redeem itself if 1 bad game ( Ros excepted), extra excitement especially the last round, 
Minuses - Less winner take all games, what about the other 24 Counties? , Dublin getting 2 home games, dead rubbers.
Minus : There aren't 8 top teams so the format is unfair/ demoralising to at least 2 , timing is too compressed, doesn't address the gap between top and the rest.

Plus : tactically defeating Kerry is possible,  makes a change from one sided quarter finals
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 07, 2018, 08:28:03 AM
12 games where 4 would have sufficed.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on August 07, 2018, 09:07:25 AM
Minus: counties without big squads could pick up injuries. Dead rubber between Dublin/Ros in Croke Park. Not straight knockout. Counties like Ros this yr embarrassed 3 times instead of once last year.

Plus: more money for clubs, with all the extra revenue that goes with it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: trailer on August 07, 2018, 09:07:46 AM
Is this better than what we had before? I would say yes. Every county regardless if they had a handy trip through their province or qualifier route is tested. No more handy AISF's for Kerry for example.
Could it be improved? Definitely. Less games in Croke Park, perhaps having them all in Neutral county grounds? Perhaps another weeks break between this stage and AISF stage.
Dubs definitely need to be on the road more.

A good first effort.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 07, 2018, 10:02:38 AM
I think I read somewhere that Michael Murphy was happy to be playing every week rather than sitting around waiting for games.

Plus, don't the club games get played earlier this way and as we all know, that's the most important thing.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dire Ear on August 07, 2018, 10:08:38 AM
There are 6 top teams,  there-in lies any issues
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Stall the Bailer on August 07, 2018, 10:14:16 AM
Quote from: Dire Ear on August 07, 2018, 10:08:38 AM
There are 6 top teams,  there-in lies any issues
This number changes every year. Could be 8 teams of similar standard next year or could be less than 6. Tyrone, Monaghan, Kildare, Galway and Donegal have all improved on their 2017 form. While Dublin have maintained theirs.  Mayo and Kerry are probably the only top teams that have regressed a bit.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on August 07, 2018, 10:28:03 AM
From the Super 8 to now the Fantastic 4 its been labelled by some. With extra revenue so important maybe in time a group stage will be introduced for the last 4?

On a scale of one to ten i'd wonder how confident Dublin supporters are to winning four in row All Ireland titles. In their way is Galway who have reached their first All Ireland semi final since 2001, Monaghan who have reached their first semi final since 1988 and Tyrone who they beat by 12 point in their last championship meeting in Croke park.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: LeoMc on August 07, 2018, 10:37:03 AM
Unrelated to the format but the compressed schedule and the matches out of Croke Park have helped to build a momentum, create an atmosphere and get the IC season out of the way for clubs.
KO QF's, SF's and final could have been played over 5 weeks in the old format and kept the above benefits.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: nrico2006 on August 07, 2018, 10:39:31 AM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on August 07, 2018, 10:28:03 AM
From the Super 8 to now the Fantastic 4 its been labelled by some. With extra revenue so important maybe in time a group stage will be introduced for the last 4?

On a scale of one to ten i'd wonder how confident Dublin supporters are to winning four in row All Ireland titles. In their way is Galway who have reached their first All Ireland semi final since 2001, Monaghan who have reached their first semi final since 1988 and Tyrone who they beat by 12 point in their last championship meeting in Croke park.

Why ignore the fact they have played Tyrone in this years championship and it was closer?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: haranguerer on August 07, 2018, 10:42:36 AM
Quote from: nrico2006 on August 07, 2018, 10:39:31 AM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on August 07, 2018, 10:28:03 AM
From the Super 8 to now the Fantastic 4 its been labelled by some. With extra revenue so important maybe in time a group stage will be introduced for the last 4?

On a scale of one to ten i'd wonder how confident Dublin supporters are to winning four in row All Ireland titles. In their way is Galway who have reached their first All Ireland semi final since 2001, Monaghan who have reached their first semi final since 1988 and Tyrone who they beat by 12 point in their last championship meeting in Croke park.


Why ignore the fact they have played Tyrone in this years championship and it was closer?

They haven't
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Esmarelda on August 07, 2018, 10:53:30 AM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on August 07, 2018, 10:28:03 AM
From the Super 8 to now the Fantastic 4 its been labelled by some. With extra revenue so important maybe in time a group stage will be introduced for the last 4?

On a scale of one to ten i'd wonder how confident Dublin supporters are to winning four in row All Ireland titles. In their way is Galway who have reached their first All Ireland semi final since 2001, Monaghan who have reached their first semi final since 1988 and Tyrone who they beat by 12 point in their last championship meeting in Croke park.
And the immediate solution to Dublin's strength is what with regards to championship structure?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on August 07, 2018, 11:29:00 AM
Quote from: nrico2006 on August 07, 2018, 10:39:31 AM

Why ignore the fact they have played Tyrone in this years championship and it was closer?
Ignored because that was Tyrone's chance to beat Dublin. A rare sight of a team having home advantage against them with the opportunity of gaining revenge instead Tyrone failed in a game that Dublin controlled and never looked like losing.


Quote from: Esmarelda on August 07, 2018, 10:53:30 AM
And the immediate solution to Dublin's strength is what with regards to championship structure?
No solution at this moment in time as Dublin's competition isn't as strong as it should be if anything its got weaker with Kerry and Mayo in transition and maybe in time that competition will become stronger.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on August 07, 2018, 12:00:19 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on August 06, 2018, 06:47:27 PM
What about the other 24 counties? Pretty much sums it up. This is the new cash cow and the c'ship will now resemble this sort of thing, with the other 24 totally disregarded.

Super 8 benefits counties with big squads and big resources. And gives yet another chance to the big guns in case of a slip up.

It's disrespectful to fans expecting them to fork out for 4 games in 4 weeks (inc semi next week).

Kildare played 7 games in 9 weeks and only 2 games were at home.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on August 07, 2018, 12:40:18 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 07, 2018, 12:00:19 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on August 06, 2018, 06:47:27 PM
What about the other 24 counties? Pretty much sums it up. This is the new cash cow and the c'ship will now resemble this sort of thing, with the other 24 totally disregarded.

Super 8 benefits counties with big squads and big resources. And gives yet another chance to the big guns in case of a slip up.

It's disrespectful to fans expecting them to fork out for 4 games in 4 weeks (inc semi next week).

Kildare played 7 games in 9 weeks and only 2 games were at home.

Yes I've said before the qualifiers are disrespectful to fans too. Armagh had 4 or 5 straight games last year and this, fans getting a couple days notice. To plan a trip to the other end of the country.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on August 07, 2018, 01:24:42 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on August 07, 2018, 10:28:03 AM
From the Super 8 to now the Fantastic 4 its been labelled by some. With extra revenue so important maybe in time a group stage will be introduced for the last 4?

On a scale of one to ten i'd wonder how confident Dublin supporters are to winning four in row All Ireland titles. In their way is Galway who have reached their first All Ireland semi final since 2001, Monaghan who have reached their first semi final since 1988 and Tyrone who they beat by 12 point in their last championship meeting in Croke park.

Wait until the Titanic Two meet. First to 3 wins the final?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on August 07, 2018, 01:41:59 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on August 07, 2018, 10:28:03 AM
From the Super 8 to now the Fantastic 4 its been labelled by some. With extra revenue so important maybe in time a group stage will be introduced for the last 4?

On a scale of one to ten i'd wonder how confident Dublin supporters are to winning four in row All Ireland titles. In their way is Galway who have reached their first All Ireland semi final since 2001, Monaghan who have reached their first semi final since 1988 and Tyrone who they beat by 12 point in their last championship meeting in Croke park.

It was funny to hear RTE use this phrase the day after sky sports coined it.

I think what we need for the super 4 is 2 groups of 2. Each team in the group plays the other team 3 times. Once at home, away and once in croke park. The winners of the two groups then go through to the final where the 2 teams play home, away, and in croke park again. All Ireland final to be scheduled for the 3rd Sunday in December.

We could even market it as a "festive feast of football".
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on August 07, 2018, 01:47:03 PM
And after forking out for all these extra games £40 is very steep for a semi final ticket.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on August 07, 2018, 03:26:33 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on August 07, 2018, 01:47:03 PM
And after forking out for all these extra games £40 is very steep for a semi final ticket.

Yea bit of a jump up in fairness.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 07, 2018, 06:59:36 PM
https://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/super-8-lessons-home-truths-classy-clifford-blackcard-lull-farney-depth-and-goalshy-galway-37191349.html
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: giveherlong on July 08, 2019, 12:45:43 PM
Has the TV schedule been confirmed for this years Super 8s?
What's the split between RTE and Sky? All games will be shown live somewhere?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Owenmoresider on July 08, 2019, 01:04:42 PM
Who came up with that bloody name for this nonsense anyway?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 08, 2019, 01:33:21 PM
Feeling left out Sligo?
Probably be renamed "Super 7 + Meath" this year.
Ros/Tyrone and Donegal/Meath on Sky anyway.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on July 08, 2019, 01:35:14 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 08, 2019, 01:33:21 PM
Feeling left out Sligo?
Probably be renamed "Super 7 + Meath" this year.
Ros/Tyrone and Donegal/Meath on Sky anyway.

The Mayo game is on RTE1 on Sunday

Quote from: Farrandeelin on July 08, 2019, 01:34:16 PM
Quote from: Owenmoresider on July 08, 2019, 01:04:42 PM
Who came up with that bloody name for this nonsense anyway?


Clerkin. Anyway, are the football semi finals on the weekend of 10th/11th August or 17th/18th?

10/11th
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 08, 2019, 01:36:54 PM
Yea just after seeing it now. Hence the removed post.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: weareros on July 08, 2019, 01:40:36 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 08, 2019, 01:33:21 PM
Feeling left out Sligo?
Probably be renamed "Super 7 + Meath" this year.
Ros/Tyrone and Donegal/Meath on Sky anyway.

Rossfan, are you trying to be the new Syferus. When we win a qtr final for the first time in our history, we can talk. Sligo once beat a fancied Tyrone team. Time for us to do it outside Connacht too.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 08, 2019, 02:01:55 PM
Just gallows humour :D
We're back with the big boys again where hopefully we'll be competitive in all 3 games and see what that results in.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 08, 2019, 02:53:04 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 08, 2019, 02:01:55 PM
Just gallows humour :D
We're back with the big boys again where hopefully we'll be competitive in all 3 games and see what that results in.

https://youtu.be/QWT90HzLF3U
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 08, 2019, 03:20:30 PM
Quote from: Owenmoresider on July 08, 2019, 01:04:42 PM
Who came up with that bloody name for this nonsense anyway?

Someone in the media did on the Indo i think and it has sadly stuck.  All Ireland quarter final group stage is the official name. The problem with "super 8" name is that some people think the 8 must be 8 super teams when matter of fact some of the best 8 don't even reach the last eight as was the case in 2001 to 2017 under the old quarter final format.

HQ to make even more money could come up with a group stage for the last 4 in the years ahead and someone in the media will call it the fantastic four  ::)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on July 08, 2019, 03:31:17 PM
So only 5 teams made it back to the "Super 8" from last year - Dublin, Kerry, Tyrone, Donegal and Roscommon. Is there maybe only really a super 5? Or super 4 + Roscommon?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 08, 2019, 03:47:55 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 08, 2019, 03:31:17 PM
So only 5 teams made it back to the "Super 8" from last year - Dublin, Kerry, Tyrone, Donegal and Roscommon. Is there maybe only really a super 5? Or super 4 + Roscommon?

It's the super 1 + Donegal, Tyrone, Dublin, Meath, Kerry, Cork and Mayo.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 08, 2019, 04:12:26 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 08, 2019, 03:31:17 PM
So only 5 teams made it back to the "Super 8" from last year - Dublin, Kerry, Tyrone, Donegal and Roscommon. Is there maybe only really a super 5? Or super 4 + Roscommon?

One of the arguments against the super 8s was that it would lead to the teams qualifying getting stronger and pulling away from the rest. Their have been 3 changes this year which already shows that argument to be weak.

This weekend will hopefully be very enjoyable. Fixtures like Kerry v Mayo in Killarney and Roscommon after a shock Connaught win getting a home game are the best thing about the new group stage.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: SouthDublinBro on July 08, 2019, 04:39:16 PM
Still not convinced by Donegal. Their only win of note so far has been against an off-colour Tyrone. Would not be surprised to see Kerry and Mayo qualify from this group.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: twohands!!! on July 08, 2019, 04:56:05 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 08, 2019, 04:12:26 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 08, 2019, 03:31:17 PM
So only 5 teams made it back to the "Super 8" from last year - Dublin, Kerry, Tyrone, Donegal and Roscommon. Is there maybe only really a super 5? Or super 4 + Roscommon?

One of the arguments against the super 8s was that it would lead to the teams qualifying getting stronger and pulling away from the rest. Their have been 3 changes this year which already shows that argument to be weak.

This weekend will hopefully be very enjoyable. Fixtures like Kerry v Mayo in Killarney and Roscommon after a shock Connaught win getting a home game are the best thing about the new group stage.

2 years is a tiny sample size to be drawing any sort of conclusions in relation to this.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 08, 2019, 05:01:10 PM
What is the story with general admission tickets to so many of these games? It seems to be the case for all super 8 games this weekend except the croke park match.

You'd think it would be a health and safety issue where there are big crowds. Take for example Killarney where over 30,000 could easily attend. The stand I'm sure only holds 7/8,000 max, you could have issues with far more than that trying to get into that side of the ground at the same time. I'm sure in both Donegal and Roscommon there will also be a good few more there than the stands will hold, though not in the same numbers as Killarney.

Is it to make a few more pounds by not having a separate terrace rate?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyHarp on July 08, 2019, 05:54:55 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on July 08, 2019, 04:56:05 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 08, 2019, 04:12:26 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 08, 2019, 03:31:17 PM
So only 5 teams made it back to the "Super 8" from last year - Dublin, Kerry, Tyrone, Donegal and Roscommon. Is there maybe only really a super 5? Or super 4 + Roscommon?

One of the arguments against the super 8s was that it would lead to the teams qualifying getting stronger and pulling away from the rest. Their have been 3 changes this year which already shows that argument to be weak.

This weekend will hopefully be very enjoyable. Fixtures like Kerry v Mayo in Killarney and Roscommon after a shock Connaught win getting a home game are the best thing about the new group stage.

2 years is a tiny sample size to be drawing any sort of conclusions in relation to this.

You are right, It is a tiny sample to be drawing any conclusions but if Roscommon can come back to the Super 8 after finding it difficult last year and improve their level of competitiveness then I think it is a good sign for the format.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 08, 2019, 05:58:18 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 08, 2019, 03:31:17 PM
So only 5 teams made it back to the "Super 8" from last year - Dublin, Kerry, Tyrone, Donegal and Roscommon. Is there maybe only really a super 5? Or super 4 + Roscommon?

This was tweeted yesterday. The only counties who has reached the last 8 for the last 3 years in a row are Dublin,Tyrone,Kerry and Roscommon. 

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2019, 06:01:22 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 08, 2019, 05:01:10 PM
What is the story with general admission tickets to so many of these games? It seems to be the case for all super 8 games this weekend except the croke park match.

You'd think it would be a health and safety issue where there are big crowds. Take for example Killarney where over 30,000 could easily attend. The stand I'm sure only holds 7/8,000 max, you could have issues with far more than that trying to get into that side of the ground at the same time. I'm sure in both Donegal and Roscommon there will also be a good few more there than the stands will hold, though not in the same numbers as Killarney.

Is it to make a few more pounds by not having a separate terrace rate?

Yes, but they closed off the Gerry Arthur Stand in Clones at the weekend before it was anything like full -- erring on the side of caution perhaps, though it would seem to be a penny-pinching exercise.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rudi on July 08, 2019, 06:15:21 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 08, 2019, 05:58:18 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 08, 2019, 03:31:17 PM
So only 5 teams made it back to the "Super 8" from last year - Dublin, Kerry, Tyrone, Donegal and Roscommon. Is there maybe only really a super 5? Or super 4 + Roscommon?

This was tweeted yesterday. The only counties who has reached the last 8 for the last 3 years in a row are Dublin,Tyrone,Kerry and Roscommon.

The Rossies in fairness have been in tough groups. Tyrone and Dublin are the 2 best sides in the country, plus Mayo were the second best side in 2017.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 08, 2019, 07:08:58 PM
So we're part of the "Fab 4".....
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 08, 2019, 08:34:35 PM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on July 08, 2019, 06:01:22 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 08, 2019, 05:01:10 PM
What is the story with general admission tickets to so many of these games? It seems to be the case for all super 8 games this weekend except the croke park match.

You'd think it would be a health and safety issue where there are big crowds. Take for example Killarney where over 30,000 could easily attend. The stand I'm sure only holds 7/8,000 max, you could have issues with far more than that trying to get into that side of the ground at the same time. I'm sure in both Donegal and Roscommon there will also be a good few more there than the stands will hold, though not in the same numbers as Killarney.

Is it to make a few more pounds by not having a separate terrace rate?

Yes, but they closed off the Gerry Arthur Stand in Clones at the weekend before it was anything like full -- erring on the side of caution perhaps, though it would seem to be a penny-pinching exercise.

It was lot easier in clones because a lot of the crowd came in early as both teams involved in curtain raiser. And also seats on both sides so people didn't mind where they went. Plus 11,000 at game competed to maybe 30,000 plus in Killarney. Hard to control that kind of numbers when everyone in theory entitled to go to the stand.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on July 09, 2019, 05:19:02 AM
Super 8's sounds like a McDonalds meal. I like to call it the last 8 or just quarter finals instead.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 09, 2019, 09:39:21 AM
It was used by one of the rubby codes a few years ago when they split their League into a top 8 and the rest during the season.
Some journo applied the name to our Qtr Finals when Congress passed it and we're now stuck with it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GetOverTheBar on July 09, 2019, 11:21:23 AM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 08, 2019, 05:01:10 PM
What is the story with general admission tickets to so many of these games? It seems to be the case for all super 8 games this weekend except the croke park match.

You'd think it would be a health and safety issue where there are big crowds. Take for example Killarney where over 30,000 could easily attend. The stand I'm sure only holds 7/8,000 max, you could have issues with far more than that trying to get into that side of the ground at the same time. I'm sure in both Donegal and Roscommon there will also be a good few more there than the stands will hold, though not in the same numbers as Killarney.

Is it to make a few more pounds by not having a separate terrace rate?

The Roscommon/Tyrone fixture is going to be preceeded by two other games so I'd assume that's the reason in that case.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: imtommygunn on July 09, 2019, 11:53:11 AM
Quote from: SouthDublinBro on July 08, 2019, 04:39:16 PM
Still not convinced by Donegal. Their only win of note so far has been against an off-colour Tyrone. Would not be surprised to see Kerry and Mayo qualify from this group.

Yeah I would agree. Still a lot to prove yet though heading the right direction.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: greatpoint on July 09, 2019, 01:05:54 PM
Quote from: Rudi on July 08, 2019, 06:15:21 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 08, 2019, 05:58:18 PM
Quote from: BennyHarp on July 08, 2019, 03:31:17 PM
So only 5 teams made it back to the "Super 8" from last year - Dublin, Kerry, Tyrone, Donegal and Roscommon. Is there maybe only really a super 5? Or super 4 + Roscommon?

This was tweeted yesterday. The only counties who has reached the last 8 for the last 3 years in a row are Dublin,Tyrone,Kerry and Roscommon.

The Rossies in fairness have been in tough groups. Tyrone and Dublin are the 2 best sides in the country, plus Mayo were the second best side in 2017.

It's a bit insulting to Dublin to put them on the same level as Tyrone.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: meathie on July 09, 2019, 07:19:20 PM
What is the story with drawing in super 8s, since it seems to change all the time! Is it ten mins then 5 mins each half if still drawn then penalties?? Or is a Draw a draw? Point a piece
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on July 09, 2019, 07:26:15 PM
Quote from: meathie on July 09, 2019, 07:19:20 PM
What is the story with drawing in super 8s, since it seems to change all the time! Is it ten mins then 5 mins each half if still drawn then penalties?? Or is a Draw a draw? Point a piece

Welcome to the big time.

Point a piece for a draw in All-Ireland Quarter Final Series.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Mayo4Sam14 on July 09, 2019, 07:26:44 PM
Quote from: meathie on July 09, 2019, 07:19:20 PM
What is the story with drawing in super 8s, since it seems to change all the time! Is it ten mins then 5 mins each half if still drawn then penalties?? Or is a Draw a draw? Point a piece

One point for a draw, Kerry and Monaghan drew last year
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on July 09, 2019, 07:40:41 PM
From the GAA website 2019 Senior Football Championship Explainer:

In the event of teams finishing on equal points in a Quarter Final Group, the tie shall be decided by the following means and in the order specified:

(i) Where two Teams only are involved - the outcome of the meeting of the two Teams in the Group

(ii) Score difference - subtracting the total Scores against from the total Scores for

(iii) Highest Total Score For

(iv) Highest Total Goals For

(v) A Play-off
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on July 15, 2019, 04:34:37 PM
After round 1:

All-Ireland Quarter-Finals - Group 1

Team P W D L +/- Pts.
1 Kerry 1 1 0 0 10 2
2 Donegal 1 1 0 0 9 2
3 Meath 1 0 0 1 -9 0
4 Mayo 1 0 0 1 -10 0

All-Ireland Quarter-Finals - Group 2

Team P W D L +/- Pts.
1 Dublin 1 1 0 0 13 2
2 Tyrone 1 1 0 0 4 2
3 Roscommon 1 0 0 1 -4 0
4 Cork 1 0 0 1 -13 0

It looks like group 2 will be all but wrapped up after next weekend with both Dublin (1/50) and Tyrone (2/7) expected to win leaving only the matter of 1st/2nd to be decided in Omagh on the final day (Dublin 3/10 favourites).

In group 1, the GAA will be hoping that either Kerry & Mayo win or Donegal & Meath so that there'll be something to play for on the last day. Any other results will mean it comes down to scoring difference and Mayo & Meath are already well behind on that.

Not looking like a great 2nd year for the super 8s
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rudi on July 15, 2019, 04:51:07 PM
Roscommon are unlucky having the best team and probably the second best team in the group.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 15, 2019, 04:56:57 PM
2 bloody years running!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 15, 2019, 10:23:35 PM
It'd be great craic if there was tankings galore next year. Afterall it was only brought in for three years right? 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 16, 2019, 04:24:25 PM
Phase 3 fixtures
Meath/Kerry and Mayowestros/Donegal 6pm Sat 3rd August.
2 games in our group Sunday 4th at 4 PM.
Our game v Cork in Páirc Ui Rinn as they have to lay a new pitch in Páirc Fhrank.
I'll never get to see a game in it at this rate.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: The Boy Wonder on July 16, 2019, 11:49:08 PM
Were the "Super 8s" introduced on a 2-3 year trial basis or is it a permanent feature ?

If favourites Dublin and Tyrone win next weekend it would obviously make Cork-Roscommon in Round 3 meaningless.
A dead rubber match, should it arise, surely serves no purpose.
Players won't want to go through the motions and supporters should not have their loyalty tested given the costs associated with supporting your county.



Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on July 17, 2019, 12:05:02 AM
Quote from: The Boy Wonder on July 16, 2019, 11:49:08 PM
Were the "Super 8s" introduced on a 2-3 year trial basis or is it a permanent feature ?

If favourites Dublin and Tyrone win next weekend it would obviously make Cork-Roscommon in Round 3 meaningless.
A dead rubber match, should it arise, surely serves no purpose.
Players won't want to go through the motions and supporters should not have their loyalty tested given the costs associated with supporting your county.

Three-year trial period.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: StephenC on July 19, 2019, 01:43:30 PM
Don't know that there's any point in setting up a thread for the Donegal-Kerry game this weekend ....

Main news from Donegal is that Eoin Ban Gallagher is out for the rest of the year with a broken ankle sustained in training. Bitterly disappointing for a young man that was showing all-star form, as well as being very damaging to our prospects in the Super-8's.

Similar to last year when the loss of Paddy McBrearty made our Super-8 challenge even bigger.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: J70 on July 19, 2019, 01:52:00 PM
Quote from: StephenC on July 19, 2019, 01:43:30 PM
Don't know that there's any point in setting up a thread for the Donegal-Kerry game this weekend ....

Main news from Donegal is that Eoin Ban Gallagher is out for the rest of the year with a broken ankle sustained in training. Bitterly disappointing for a young man that was showing all-star form, as well as being very damaging to our prospects in the Super-8's.

Similar to last year when the loss of Paddy McBrearty made our Super-8 challenge even bigger.

I don't think he's as big a loss as Paddy was though.

McBrearty is irreplaceable. At least we have other men, albeit much less accomplished, who can come in and use speed and ball-carrying ability to try to break lines. This is a big chance for the likes of O'Baoill or Eoin McHugh.

Can't wait for this game. We'll know where we stand after this!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: inthrough on July 19, 2019, 02:58:28 PM
Quote from: StephenC on July 19, 2019, 01:43:30 PM
Don't know that there's any point in setting up a thread for the Donegal-Kerry game this weekend ....

Main news from Donegal is that Eoin Ban Gallagher is out for the rest of the year with a broken ankle sustained in training. Bitterly disappointing for a young man that was showing all-star form, as well as being very damaging to our prospects in the Super-8's.

Similar to last year when the loss of Paddy McBrearty made our Super-8 challenge even bigger.

Can't understand that attitude. We have a lot of cover in the half back department & while Eoghan Ban is a big loss I would be a lot more worried if we lost Patton, Murphy, Jamie or Paddy.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: StephenC on July 19, 2019, 03:34:43 PM
Quote from: J70 on July 19, 2019, 01:52:00 PM
Quote from: StephenC on July 19, 2019, 01:43:30 PM
Don't know that there's any point in setting up a thread for the Donegal-Kerry game this weekend ....

Main news from Donegal is that Eoin Ban Gallagher is out for the rest of the year with a broken ankle sustained in training. Bitterly disappointing for a young man that was showing all-star form, as well as being very damaging to our prospects in the Super-8's.

Similar to last year when the loss of Paddy McBrearty made our Super-8 challenge even bigger.

I don't think he's as big a loss as Paddy was though.

McBrearty is irreplaceable. At least we have other men, albeit much less accomplished, who can come in and use speed and ball-carrying ability to try to break lines. This is a big chance for the likes of O'Baoill or Eoin McHugh.

Can't wait for this game. We'll know where we stand after this!

Not, not as big a loss as Paddy but still ... our pattern of attacking play is patient lateral movement of the ball looking for someone to break the line at pace - this is usually Ryan or Ban and I think we'll miss him greatly because of that. Eoin has the pace but his decision making can be poor, while O'Baoill hasn't lived up to expectations this summer.

Agree that this will be the game that tells us where we're at. Should be a good one.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: StephenC on July 19, 2019, 03:36:35 PM
Quote from: inthrough on July 19, 2019, 02:58:28 PM
Quote from: StephenC on July 19, 2019, 01:43:30 PM
Don't know that there's any point in setting up a thread for the Donegal-Kerry game this weekend ....

Main news from Donegal is that Eoin Ban Gallagher is out for the rest of the year with a broken ankle sustained in training. Bitterly disappointing for a young man that was showing all-star form, as well as being very damaging to our prospects in the Super-8's.

Similar to last year when the loss of Paddy McBrearty made our Super-8 challenge even bigger.

Can't understand that attitude. We have a lot of cover in the half back department & while Eoghan Ban is a big loss I would be a lot more worried if we lost Patton, Murphy, Jamie or Paddy.

As I mentioned to J70, I don't see the cover being able to contribute as Ban had this year.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on July 21, 2019, 01:22:37 PM
Time to scrap this league format in the middle of a championship. Was never a fan to begin with but it's even worse than I thought no matter how hard the media tries to hype the games up.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 21, 2019, 01:30:48 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on July 21, 2019, 01:22:37 PM
Time to scrap this league format in the middle of a championship. Was never a fan to begin with but it's even worse than I thought no matter how hard the media tries to hype the games up.

Wonder would Tyrone take second place now if they could skip the Dublin game. Can't see any incentive to winning it, there's no preference between Kerry and Donegal.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GalwayBayBoy on July 21, 2019, 01:32:03 PM
The hurling has the right system. Round robin at the beginning followed by straight knock out games.

The football has this bolted on round robin system at the latter end of the championship.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 21, 2019, 01:37:12 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on July 21, 2019, 01:32:03 PM
The hurling has the right system. Round robin at the beginning followed by straight knock out games.

The football has this bolted on round robin system at the latter end of the championship.

Hurling has 6-8 teams who could win and a fresh set of semi finalists
every year. Football has one Paris St Germain with a few maybes and the rest straggling
It does not have 8 teams who can compete
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 22, 2019, 08:51:50 AM
funny that when asked to change the Croke Park round to a Neutral round for Year 2, they said: Can't do that, it's a 3 year trial and can't make any changes before then.

When asked to change the first round of Super 8 from the Croke Park round to the Provincial Winners at home round they said: Yep, no problem.

Not sure whether there's any hope of changing the Croke Park round to a neutral round next year, but they should also make the change that if 2 teams from the same group win in Week 1, then they should play each other in Week 2. Will mean that the group will definitely be alive for Week 3.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 22, 2019, 09:01:37 AM
Quote from: Hound on July 22, 2019, 08:51:50 AM
if 2 teams from the same group win in Week 1, then they should play each other in Week 2. Will mean that the group will definitely be alive for Week 3.
That makes sense.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 22, 2019, 09:41:42 AM
Quote from: yellowcard on July 21, 2019, 01:22:37 PM
Time to scrap this league format in the middle of a championship. Was never a fan to begin with but it's even worse than I thought no matter how hard the media tries to hype the games up.

I think people want to give out about these games no matter what. There has been a lot of good football played over the last few weeks and more entertainment than the quarter finals provided in a lot of the years previously. Yes there will be some dead rubber games in the last round under the format but there is more good games than previously to make up for it. Kerry Donegal yesterday was a brilliant match and although Cork and Meath haven't caused any upsets they have competed a lot better than was expected of them. Set up nicely for a great finish in Castlebar in two weeks time.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Tubberman on July 22, 2019, 09:47:09 AM
Super 8s need to be restructured or scrapped. The scheduling is terrible - teams coming through qualifiers playing up to 5 weeks in a row (not allowing for replays), then the semi-final is the weekend following the last round. There should be at least a week off before the semi-final.
It's also unfair and demeaning that provincial champions like Roscommon, who had to beat two Div 1 sides away from home to win their province, can end their season having to play out a meaningless game in Pairc Ui Rinn.
At this stage, I'd favour the knock-out QFs in a provincial ground.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 22, 2019, 10:12:36 AM
Move the QFs to Clones, portlaoise, Salthill, Killarney etc. I am sick to the back teeth of double headers infront of a quarter full croke park with zero atmosphere. It makes the sport look so bad.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 22, 2019, 10:33:23 AM
Quote from: Tubberman on July 22, 2019, 09:47:09 AM
Super 8s need to be restructured or scrapped. The scheduling is terrible - teams coming through qualifiers playing up to 5 weeks in a row (not allowing for replays), then the semi-final is the weekend following the last round. There should be at least a week off before the semi-final.
It's also unfair and demeaning that provincial champions like Roscommon, who had to beat two Div 1 sides away from home to win their province, can end their season having to play out a meaningless game in Pairc Ui Rinn.
At this stage, I'd favour the knock-out QFs in a provincial ground.

The format this year actually probably gave Roscommon a better chance of making a semi final than the old format. The key game in the group for them was against Tyrone and they got it as a home match as opposed to Croke Park. They then got a second chance that they wouldn't previously have gotten. Unfortunately it was against the Dubs but their dominance is more of an issue than the format.

Dublin should not be getting two games in Croke Park though, that bit is a farce. Croke Park was the right venue for yesterdays double header but there was a poor crowd in on Saturday. Though no matter where Tyrone Cork was played it would have been a poor crowd (Portlaois was empty for the second half of the game last year with no atmosphere) and Croke Park was fairly neutral distance wise.

I think people are forgetting that there was regularly quarter final double headers with poor crowds depending on the pairings and there was regular hammerings. There have been big winning margins in this years super 8s but most games have been very competitive right up until the last 10 minutes. And the football on offer has been much more attacking than a few years back.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 22, 2019, 10:42:49 AM
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/dublin-flex-muscle-to-guide-roscommon-towards-exit-door-1.3963065
"Has the GAA spawned a monster? It's a question will become more pressing as Dublin's unbeaten streak continues.

Just over a decade ago, Dublin and Tyrone drew a crowd of 81,000 for a league game which marked the first game under floodlights at Croke Park. Both counties featured here in an All-Ireland quarter final series which attracted just 36,000. Those figures aren't encouraging and deepen the conviction that if this Super 8s concept is to become permanent, the games need to be held in more compact grounds"

Revenues will kill Dub funding
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on July 22, 2019, 11:06:28 AM
Tyrone have played 5 weeks in a row. Fans would have had to travel to Longford, Kildare, Clones, Roscommon and then Dublin. That's a lot of expense to put on fans. Plus ticket prices are too high.

Expecting fans to travel 5 weeks in a row (plus 2 more in the next 2 weeks) is taking the piss.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rudi on July 22, 2019, 11:25:22 AM
Agree with the above, Tyrone supporters can't just jump on the 46a to make a game. Dublin  need to be taken out of Croke Park, they also need to be split in 4.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 22, 2019, 11:29:26 AM
Agree with you Benny :o :D
These new tighter schedules (and expanded Quarter  Finals) were bound to impact on people's pockets and attendances.
Mind you if  the proposed Tier 2 comes in Tyrone will only have 2 Qualifier Rounds to play next year......
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: TheGreatest on July 22, 2019, 11:33:27 AM
Agree. I was there on Saturday and it was a poor attendence, at half time of the Dublin match a lot of the neutrals left, big gaps in the stands.

The concept of the Super 8s is good, We we need to introduce back the QF Knockouts.

Provional winners straight to QF, Qualifier route put into groups, top 2 each group plays the quarters against the provional winners.

There wont be 500 people at Cork V Roscommon.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 22, 2019, 11:51:14 AM
Why is this game being played?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rudi on July 22, 2019, 12:11:27 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2019, 11:51:14 AM
Why is this game being played?

Valid Question.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 22, 2019, 12:18:21 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2019, 11:51:14 AM
Why is this game being played?

I really pity the two squads for having to delay holidays for another two weeks for a nothing game. Are the two club leagues going to be back in operation now or are they delayed?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on July 22, 2019, 12:18:52 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2019, 11:51:14 AM
Why is this game being played?

Money for the Cork county board.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: dublin7 on July 22, 2019, 12:22:01 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2019, 11:51:14 AM
Why is this game being played?
You can't not play the game even though the result won't affect the league table. If a teams win the league in ANY sport before the season finishes do they just cancel all the remaining matches as the title has been won reagardless?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 22, 2019, 12:26:08 PM
If it's a percentage of the gate Cork wont get the price of heating the water.
Billy Keane makes a good point in the Independent --
Cost €25 to stand in the Provincial grounds plus long costly round trips for the visitors.
Meanwhile the cost for Dubs on Hill 16 was €20 plus maybe €2 or €3 travel.
Assuming 4k Dubs went on the Terrace it's a subsidy of €20,000 to Dublin per game.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rudi on July 22, 2019, 12:28:10 PM
Quote from: dublin7 on July 22, 2019, 12:22:01 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2019, 11:51:14 AM
Why is this game being played?
You can't not play the game even though the result won't affect the league table. If a teams win the league in ANY sport before the season finishes do they just cancel all the remaining matches as the title has been won reagardless?

Promotion and relagation reasons, this one does not apply here.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Owenmoresider on July 22, 2019, 12:38:33 PM
Quote from: dublin7 on July 22, 2019, 12:22:01 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2019, 11:51:14 AM
Why is this game being played?
You can't not play the game even though the result won't affect the league table. If a teams win the league in ANY sport before the season finishes do they just cancel all the remaining matches as the title has been won reagardless?
Most of those leagues will still have something riding on them, be it relegation issues or prize money (Premier League etc.) or draft placings and so on. Granted in the likes of the World Cup you might get this scenario but then the tickets for those games would have been long since sold and possibly sold out, so there's going to be a large crowd at it even if there's nothing to play for in reality. That's not exactly going to be an issue in Cork on Saturday week.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: TheGreatest on July 22, 2019, 12:50:07 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 22, 2019, 12:26:08 PM
If it's a percentage of the gate Cork wont get the price of heating the water.
Billy Keane makes a good point in the Independent --
Cost €25 to stand in the Provincial grounds plus long costly round trips for the visitors.
Meanwhile the cost for Dubs on Hill 16 was €20 plus maybe €2 or €3 travel.
Assuming 4k Dubs went on the Terrace it's a subsidy of €20,000 to Dublin per game.

It is a good point.

On the flip side, there is a load of country folk living in Dublin from all counties, and when your team comes to town its good for them also, if not that often, but the likes of Mayo, Tyrone and Kerry fans get a lot of games in Croker yearly in championship. I never hear this being mentioned.


Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 22, 2019, 02:13:33 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 22, 2019, 11:06:28 AM
Tyrone have played 5 weeks in a row. Fans would have had to travel to Longford, Kildare, Clones, Roscommon and then Dublin. That's a lot of expense to put on fans. Plus ticket prices are too high.

Expecting fans to travel 5 weeks in a row (plus 2 more in the next 2 weeks) is taking the piss.
do you want the GAA to win the war against rugby in Cherrywood or not ?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 22, 2019, 03:56:34 PM
It's sad to say it but going to Croker for a game used to be an experience, something to savour, to look forward to and really soak up. Now it's a slog for all but the biggest games. Even Dublin fans used to only get playing in it for Leinster finals, AI semis and finals. Now it's week in and week out even for them to go watch a team that they already know in 95% of games will win at a canter. What's special about that?

For me the Super8 can be good but it really has to be made fairer. A good start this year was having the teams that won their province playing at home in the first leg. he next obvious thing is to take all the neutral games out of Corker, do away with the double headers and have them in neutral county grounds which will make a massive difference to those towns across the country and get use from all these white elephant grounds that are rarely if ever used at the moment.

The timing of them also needs to be looked at. Using Tyrone as an example here but the schedule for our players and fans has been really tough this year. If we make the AI then that's 11 games of championship football this summer. We've played 5 weeks in a row all games on the road, Longford, Kildare, Clones, Roscommon and Dublin. If I was going to each of those games with the wife and 2 kids then that would have cost me €300 in tickets, about €200 in diesel, and you'd easily say another €300 odd in incidentals, programs, bite to eat etc. That's a lot of money and too much for a lot of people to justify especially with another 2 games guaranteed now in another 2 weeks. Not sure much can be done there but if neutral grounds half way between the two counties were used then travel costs would be split.

Finally  proposal to make the groups a bit fairer would be to use a seeding system for the 2 qualifers in the groups..

This could work as follows. Dublin in one group and Roscommon are in one group. They would get the 1st and 3rd ranked teams through round four.

That would give a group of.
Dubs,
Rossies
Tyrone
Meath

And another group of.
Kerry
Donegal
Mayo
Cork

With the qualifiers this year it doesn't make much difference to the groups but over time I think this would be fairer.

Nb I used this ranking table which I find great from the end of the R4 qualifiers. https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110650184&postcount=923
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 22, 2019, 04:11:19 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 22, 2019, 03:56:34 PM
It's sad to say it but going to Croker for a game used to be an experience, something to savour, to look forward to and really soak up. Now it's a slog for all but the biggest games. Even Dublin fans used to only get playing in it for Leinster finals, AI semis and finals. Now it's week in and week out even for them to go watch a team that they already know in 95% of games will win at a canter. What's special about that?

For me the Super8 can be good but it really has to be made fairer. A good start this year was having the teams that won their province playing at home in the first leg. he next obvious thing is to take all the neutral games out of Corker, do away with the double headers and have them in neutral county grounds which will make a massive difference to those towns across the country and get use from all these white elephant grounds that are rarely if ever used at the moment.

The timing of them also needs to be looked at. Using Tyrone as an example here but the schedule for our players and fans has been really tough this year. If we make the AI then that's 11 games of championship football this summer. We've played 5 weeks in a row all games on the road, Longford, Kildare, Clones, Roscommon and Dublin. If I was going to each of those games with the wife and 2 kids then that would have cost me €300 in tickets, about €200 in diesel, and you'd easily say another €300 odd in incidentals, programs, bite to eat etc. That's a lot of money and too much for a lot of people to justify especially with another 2 games guaranteed now in another 2 weeks. Not sure much can be done there but if neutral grounds half way between the two counties were used then travel costs would be split.

Finally  proposal to make the groups a bit fairer would be to use a seeding system for the 2 qualifers in the groups..

This could work as follows. Dublin in one group and Roscommon are in one group. They would get the 1st and 3rd ranked teams through round four.

That would give a group of.
Dubs,
Rossies
Tyrone
Meath

And another group of.
Kerry
Donegal
Mayo
Cork

With the qualifiers this year it doesn't make much difference to the groups but over time I think this would be fairer.

Nb I used this ranking table which I find great from the end of the R4 qualifiers. https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110650184&postcount=923

Would Dublin not be fairly half way/neutral for Tyrone/Cork and Kerry/Donegal? It would have been a logical enough choice for Mayo Meath too given a lot of Mayo people are based in Dublin. The Tyrone Cork game would have attracted a poor crowd wherever it was played. And I don't think the other two games I mentioned would have got as many people if played as two stand alone games somewhere outside Croke Park.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 22, 2019, 04:15:00 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 22, 2019, 04:11:19 PM
Would Dublin not be fairly half way/neutral for Tyrone/Cork and Kerry/Donegal? It would have been a logical enough choice for Mayo Meath too given a lot of Mayo people are based in Dublin. The Tyrone Cork game would have attracted a poor crowd wherever it was played. And I don't think the other two games I mentioned would have got as many people if played as two stand alone games somewhere outside Croke Park.

Yes in terms of distance absolutely it's a great location for ease of transport for those games you mentioned. But imagine that Tyrone/cork game was played in a 20000 ground with a full house, you'd have had a completely different atmosphere at the game. I just think days like that where you can hear everything the players are saying on the pitch for what should be a massive occasion is ruinous for the sport.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 22, 2019, 04:28:15 PM
There was probably only a maximum of 3/4,000 there between Tyrone and Cork. There was even less there last year from the two counties when they played in Portlaois (around 10,000 there that day and mostly all in for the Armagh Roscommon game). Do you think more people from Tyrone would have travelled to somewhere like Portlaois that is harder to get to on Saturday past than Croke Park?

The only way you'd have got a half decent crowd was if one of the counties was at home. If you wanted to fill a neutral stadium it would have had to have been in a club ground.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 22, 2019, 04:33:28 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 22, 2019, 04:28:15 PM
There was probably only a maximum of 3/4,000 there between Tyrone and Cork. There was even less there last year from the two counties when they played in Portlaois (around 10,000 there that day and mostly all in for the Armagh Roscommon game). Do you think more people from Tyrone would have travelled to somewhere like Portlaois that is harder to get to on Saturday past than Croke Park?

The only way you'd have got a half decent crowd was if one of the counties was at home. If you wanted to fill a neutral stadium it would have had to have been in a club ground.

Fair point.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Owenmoresider on July 22, 2019, 04:37:13 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 22, 2019, 04:11:19 PM
Would Dublin not be fairly half way/neutral for Tyrone/Cork and Kerry/Donegal? It would have been a logical enough choice for Mayo Meath too given a lot of Mayo people are based in Dublin. The Tyrone Cork game would have attracted a poor crowd wherever it was played. And I don't think the other two games I mentioned would have got as many people if played as two stand alone games somewhere outside Croke Park.
An awful lot more of them are based in Mayo though. I know the outlook of those running the country is pretty much Dublin-centric, but surely that's taking it a bit far that we go putting on games in Dublin for the convenience of the relatively small number of ex-pats based there?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on July 22, 2019, 04:45:35 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 22, 2019, 10:33:23 AM
Quote from: Tubberman on July 22, 2019, 09:47:09 AM
Super 8s need to be restructured or scrapped. The scheduling is terrible - teams coming through qualifiers playing up to 5 weeks in a row (not allowing for replays), then the semi-final is the weekend following the last round. There should be at least a week off before the semi-final.
It's also unfair and demeaning that provincial champions like Roscommon, who had to beat two Div 1 sides away from home to win their province, can end their season having to play out a meaningless game in Pairc Ui Rinn.
At this stage, I'd favour the knock-out QFs in a provincial ground.

The format this year actually probably gave Roscommon a better chance of making a semi final than the old format. The key game in the group for them was against Tyrone and they got it as a home match as opposed to Croke Park. They then got a second chance that they wouldn't previously have gotten. Unfortunately it was against the Dubs but their dominance is more of an issue than the format.

Dublin should not be getting two games in Croke Park though, that bit is a farce. Croke Park was the right venue for yesterdays double header but there was a poor crowd in on Saturday. Though no matter where Tyrone Cork was played it would have been a poor crowd (Portlaois was empty for the second half of the game last year with no atmosphere) and Croke Park was fairly neutral distance wise.

I think people are forgetting that there was regularly quarter final double headers with poor crowds depending on the pairings and there was regular hammerings. There have been big winning margins in this years super 8s but most games have been very competitive right up until the last 10 minutes. And the football on offer has been much more attacking than a few years back.

I don't think Roscommon were given a better chance especially with last years two All Ireland finalists in the group.

In the old format as Connacht champions they would have played one of Meath,Cork,Tyrone and i don't think they could have played Mayo again because of repeat pairing (open to correction there)

Even getting a the short straw in Tyrone and lost after a competitive display they could have gone off for the summer and be happy enough with their lot instead they had to face into the lions den last Saturday after a defeat and now have to finish the year off with a dead rubber game.  I agree like every other team in the super 8s Dublin should only get one game in Croke park.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 22, 2019, 04:57:30 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 22, 2019, 04:45:35 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 22, 2019, 10:33:23 AM
Quote from: Tubberman on July 22, 2019, 09:47:09 AM
Super 8s need to be restructured or scrapped. The scheduling is terrible - teams coming through qualifiers playing up to 5 weeks in a row (not allowing for replays), then the semi-final is the weekend following the last round. There should be at least a week off before the semi-final.
It's also unfair and demeaning that provincial champions like Roscommon, who had to beat two Div 1 sides away from home to win their province, can end their season having to play out a meaningless game in Pairc Ui Rinn.
At this stage, I'd favour the knock-out QFs in a provincial ground.

The format this year actually probably gave Roscommon a better chance of making a semi final than the old format. The key game in the group for them was against Tyrone and they got it as a home match as opposed to Croke Park. They then got a second chance that they wouldn't previously have gotten. Unfortunately it was against the Dubs but their dominance is more of an issue than the format.

Dublin should not be getting two games in Croke Park though, that bit is a farce. Croke Park was the right venue for yesterdays double header but there was a poor crowd in on Saturday. Though no matter where Tyrone Cork was played it would have been a poor crowd (Portlaois was empty for the second half of the game last year with no atmosphere) and Croke Park was fairly neutral distance wise.

I think people are forgetting that there was regularly quarter final double headers with poor crowds depending on the pairings and there was regular hammerings. There have been big winning margins in this years super 8s but most games have been very competitive right up until the last 10 minutes. And the football on offer has been much more attacking than a few years back.

I don't think Roscommon were given a better chance especially with last years two All Ireland finalists in the group.

In the old format as Connacht champions they would have played one of Meath,Cork,Tyrone and i don't think they could have played Mayo again because of repeat pairing (open to correction there)

Even getting a the short straw in Tyrone and lost after a competitive display they could have gone off for the summer and be happy enough with their lot instead they had to face into the lions den last Saturday after a defeat and now have to finish the year off with a dead rubber game.  I agree like every other team in the super 8s Dublin should only get one game in Croke park.

Roscommon were unlucky with the draw this year but under the old format they could have been equally as unlucky and drew Tyrone. I think it's fair to say they had a better chance of beating Tyrone in Hyde Park than Croke Park. If they'd done that they would have been odds on favourites to make the semi finals as a win v a knocked out Cork team in round 3 would have put them through.

One of the complaints about the old system was that every team in the country got a second chance except the provincial champions and the new format has solved that. Unfortunately ending up facing Dublin in croke park meant Roscommon more or less didn't have a second chance this year. The fact it was Dublin was probably a bigger factor in that than the venue.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 22, 2019, 04:57:57 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 22, 2019, 04:45:35 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 22, 2019, 10:33:23 AM
Quote from: Tubberman on July 22, 2019, 09:47:09 AM
Super 8s need to be restructured or scrapped. The scheduling is terrible - teams coming through qualifiers playing up to 5 weeks in a row (not allowing for replays), then the semi-final is the weekend following the last round. There should be at least a week off before the semi-final.
It's also unfair and demeaning that provincial champions like Roscommon, who had to beat two Div 1 sides away from home to win their province, can end their season having to play out a meaningless game in Pairc Ui Rinn.
At this stage, I'd favour the knock-out QFs in a provincial ground.

The format this year actually probably gave Roscommon a better chance of making a semi final than the old format. The key game in the group for them was against Tyrone and they got it as a home match as opposed to Croke Park. They then got a second chance that they wouldn't previously have gotten. Unfortunately it was against the Dubs but their dominance is more of an issue than the format.

Dublin should not be getting two games in Croke Park though, that bit is a farce. Croke Park was the right venue for yesterdays double header but there was a poor crowd in on Saturday. Though no matter where Tyrone Cork was played it would have been a poor crowd (Portlaois was empty for the second half of the game last year with no atmosphere) and Croke Park was fairly neutral distance wise.

I think people are forgetting that there was regularly quarter final double headers with poor crowds depending on the pairings and there was regular hammerings. There have been big winning margins in this years super 8s but most games have been very competitive right up until the last 10 minutes. And the football on offer has been much more attacking than a few years back.

I don't think Roscommon were given a better chance especially with last years two All Ireland finalists in the group.

In the old format as Connacht champions they would have played one of Meath,Cork,Tyrone and i don't think they could have played Mayo again because of repeat pairing (open to correction there)

Even getting a the short straw in Tyrone and lost after a competitive display they could have gone off for the summer and be happy enough with their lot instead they had to face into the lions den last Saturday after a defeat and now have to finish the year off with a dead rubber game.  I agree like every other team in the super 8s Dublin should only get one game in Croke park.

The fact is that no matter what group Roscommon went into the odds on them getting to a semi-final are very small anyway. There's going to be a Kerry/Dublin/Donegal in their group no matter how it falls and all three of those teams are beating this Roscommon side every time. Then you're going to have one strong qualifier, Tyrone or mayo and a team that they could potentially beat in Cork or Meath. Having their first game at home against a team they really needed to beat in Tyrone this time gave them the best possible chance. Win that and win away against Cork and they'd be through.

Fact is that the 4 best teams in the country will be in the semi-final with this format 9/10 now. Roscommon at the moment are not one of the four best teams in the country and can't feel butthurt about being in one group or the other because they wouldn't have qualified from either group imo.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Armagh18 on July 22, 2019, 06:08:10 PM
Wonder what odds you would get for Mayo to beat the Dubs in a semi then lose the final.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 22, 2019, 06:28:05 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on July 22, 2019, 06:08:10 PM
Wonder what odds you would get for Mayo to beat the Dubs in a semi then lose the final.

can't get odds on that but you can get odds of these finals taking place...

Mayo V Kerry 16/1
Mayo V Tyrone 28/1
Mayo V Donegal 200/1


Mayo V Tyrone can only happen with Mayo beating Dublin in the semifinal so 28/1 on that game happening, but odds would be wider again if you were to include Mayo losing that. Probably about 50/1.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ed Ricketts on July 22, 2019, 09:10:03 PM
Roscommon vs Cork will be the first senior intercounty football championship match in the 130 odd years of the GAA where neither team has any prospect of advancement in the competition.

Is the above statement correct?

If so, then this alone is sufficient cause to do away with the Super 8 shitshow.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 22, 2019, 09:13:54 PM
Quote from: Ed Ricketts on July 22, 2019, 09:10:03 PM
Roscommon vs Cork will be the first senior intercounty football championship match in the 130 odd years of the GAA where neither team has any prospect of advancement in the competition.

Is the above statement correct?

If so, then this alone is sufficient cause to do away with the Super 8 shitshow.

Or have an option to scrap the third game if they mean nothing. If they were producing 4/5 good games I'm not sure why you'd scrap that due to one meaningless game.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ed Ricketts on July 22, 2019, 09:24:32 PM
Why do we need a rake of 'good' games?

If having a loads of 'good' games is the goal, then go the whole hog and have fully tiered, leagued championships, where evenly matched teams line out against each other every week of the summer.

The current situation is a shite halfway house that satisfies no one. The standard GAA solution to a GAA problem.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 22, 2019, 09:48:21 PM
Quote from: Owenmoresider on July 22, 2019, 04:37:13 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 22, 2019, 04:11:19 PM
Would Dublin not be fairly half way/neutral for Tyrone/Cork and Kerry/Donegal? It would have been a logical enough choice for Mayo Meath too given a lot of Mayo people are based in Dublin. The Tyrone Cork game would have attracted a poor crowd wherever it was played. And I don't think the other two games I mentioned would have got as many people if played as two stand alone games somewhere outside Croke Park.
An awful lot more of them are based in Mayo though. I know the outlook of those running the country is pretty much Dublin-centric, but surely that's taking it a bit far that we go putting on games in Dublin for the convenience of the relatively small number of ex-pats based there?
Indeed it is, but if Horan and co are reading this anything is possible...
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: highorlow on July 22, 2019, 09:52:48 PM
QuoteView Profile  Personal Message (Online)

Re: Super 8s
« Reply #1661 on: Today at 09:24:32 PM »
Quote
Why do we need a rake of 'good' games?

If having a loads of 'good' games is the goal, then go the whole hog and have fully tiered, leagued championships, where evenly matched teams line out against each other every week of the summer.

The current situation is a shite halfway house that satisfies no one. The standard GAA solution to a GAA problem.

Well said
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: MayoBuck on July 22, 2019, 10:05:12 PM
I would make the following changes to the Super 8s for next year...

Make the Croke Park round a neutral round. Croker may make sense as a neutral ground in some cases however.

There should be a weekend off before the start of Super 8s to allow a build up and stop some teams playing 5 weeks in a row. The 3 rounds should then be played on consecutive weekends and allow another break week in the lead up to the semi-finals.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thewobbler on July 22, 2019, 10:08:38 PM
Personally I'd make the following changes.

The 4 provincial champions are randomly drawn to play the 4 qualifiers.

The winners of those ties go through to the semi finals.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: kerryforsam19 on July 22, 2019, 10:16:13 PM
Got rid of provincial. 8 groups with 4 teams .Teams play each other twice. Top 2 teams go to A championship. Bottom 2 to B championship. All knockout. A & B to be played same day.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on July 22, 2019, 10:33:39 PM
Quote from: kerryforsam19 on July 22, 2019, 10:16:13 PM
Got rid of provincial. 8 groups with 4 teams .Teams play each other twice. Top 2 teams go to A championship. Bottom 2 to B championship. All knockout. A & B to be played same day.

Sure that's the Tommy Cannon cup again.

How about 32 teams, open draw? No second chance.

I'll see myself out.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Baile Brigín 2 on July 22, 2019, 10:35:17 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 22, 2019, 10:33:39 PM
Quote from: kerryforsam19 on July 22, 2019, 10:16:13 PMI agree with this. This hybrid of league and cup is neither one or the other. Teams are half arsed knowing they get another shot.
Got rid of provincial. 8 groups with 4 teams .Teams play each other twice. Top 2 teams go to A championship. Bottom 2 to B championship. All knockout. A & B to be played same day.

Sure that's the Tommy Cannon cup again.

How about 32 teams, open draw? No second chance.

I'll see myself out.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thewobbler on July 22, 2019, 10:36:09 PM
Quote from: kerryforsam19 on July 22, 2019, 10:16:13 PM
Got rid of provincial. 8 groups with 4 teams .Teams play each other twice. Top 2 teams go to A championship. Bottom 2 to B championship. All knockout. A & B to be played same day.

Think about this lad.

You are recommending a solution whereby it will take us 48 games to find out what we know already: that d1 teams are stronger than d2, who are stronger than d3, who are in turn stronger than d4.

It would be the most pointless and boring stage of any tournament in history.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: irish345 on July 22, 2019, 10:53:45 PM
if they went back to a knockout quarter final they could wrap the all ireland up by august have the quarter finals played over two days
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: irish345 on July 22, 2019, 10:56:48 PM
i think the super 8s are too long and drawing out get rid  of them unless you play them over the space of a week but the gaa wont do midweek games
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 22, 2019, 10:58:45 PM
Jez lads ye are looking at doing this and that! The reality is that you can have all the systems, Leagues, round robins, back-door, front door, straight knock-out, whatever - the problem is really is a financially doped Dublin football team!

Take Dublin out of the equation and you have good competitive inter-county football. Teams on a slight rise and teams on a slight decline.

Super 8's, All Ireland Championship and Leinster Championships would all be competitive without Financially Doped Dublin! 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: irish345 on July 22, 2019, 11:04:42 PM
another system i thought of was the 4 provincial champions play each other in a preliminary quarter finals the 2 winners into semi finals 2 losers meet two teams from the qualifiers in the quarter finals that would mean an extra qualifier round to cut the 4 teams to two teams
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: giveballaghback on July 22, 2019, 11:11:45 PM
The way to avoid a dead rubber in the last game is for the winners of round 1 to play each other in round 2 and the same for the losers. If there is a draw in round one then there can be no dead rubber.
Anyway while the dubs are at the level they are at the competition is a joke.
If I had a preference it would be back to the old straight knockout system and no back door. Nothing like Russian roulette to sharpen the mind. Currently Mayo are still in it having lost 2 games, the whole thing is farcical and signs on it people are voting with their feet.
Change is needed and quick.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on July 22, 2019, 11:21:42 PM
Change is needed. But it won't happen. The suits will continue with this nonsense.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Armagh18 on July 22, 2019, 11:49:35 PM
Quote from: Ed Ricketts on July 22, 2019, 09:10:03 PM
Roscommon vs Cork will be the first senior intercounty football championship match in the 130 odd years of the GAA where neither team has any prospect of advancement in the competition.

Is the above statement correct?

If so, then this alone is sufficient cause to do away with the Super 8 shitshow.

Well tbf any team facing Dublin in Leinster this decade has pretty much had zero chance of advancing in that particular competition...
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Armagh18 on July 22, 2019, 11:53:47 PM
Quote from: kerryforsam19 on July 22, 2019, 10:16:13 PM
Got rid of provincial. 8 groups with 4 teams .Teams play each other twice. Top 2 teams go to A championship. Bottom 2 to B championship. All knockout. A & B to be played same day.
I like that idea but the Ulster championship was absolutely superb this year so no way should it be scrapped. Connacht is competitive as well and if Cork can keep improving they'll give Kerry their fill of it down there too. Could maybe kick them other huers out of Leinster and let them play club football or something so we might see competitive games there too.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: TheGreatest on July 23, 2019, 09:05:09 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2019, 10:58:45 PM
Jez lads ye are looking at doing this and that! The reality is that you can have all the systems, Leagues, round robins, back-door, front door, straight knock-out, whatever - the problem is really is a financially doped Dublin football team!

Take Dublin out of the equation and you have good competitive inter-county football. Teams on a slight rise and teams on a slight decline.

Super 8's, All Ireland Championship and Leinster Championships would all be competitive without Financially Doped Dublin!

Thats just an opinion, if it was the truth, Dublin would be winning all completions, in all codes, at all age levels and both genders, not happening, only in Football from U-20.  So thoughtful opinion, but an incorrect one.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 23, 2019, 09:45:41 AM
Quote from: TheGreatest on July 23, 2019, 09:05:09 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2019, 10:58:45 PM
Jez lads ye are looking at doing this and that! The reality is that you can have all the systems, Leagues, round robins, back-door, front door, straight knock-out, whatever - the problem is really is a financially doped Dublin football team!

Take Dublin out of the equation and you have good competitive inter-county football. Teams on a slight rise and teams on a slight decline.

Super 8's, All Ireland Championship and Leinster Championships would all be competitive without Financially Doped Dublin!

Thats just an opinion, if it was the truth, Dublin would be winning all completions, in all codes, at all age levels and both genders, not happening, only in Football from U-20.  So thoughtful opinion, but an incorrect one.
Despite the fact that the Games Development Officers don't go near any of the elite players, there is this great myth how these GDOs are doing incredible work turning Dublin youngsters into superstars. And amazingly this training they don't get from the GDOs doesn't kick in until they're over 19! 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dire Ear on July 23, 2019, 09:47:04 AM
Quote from: thewobbler on July 22, 2019, 10:08:38 PM
Personally I'd make the following changes.

The 4 provincial champions are randomly drawn to play the 4 qualifiers.

The winners of those ties go through to the semi finals.
This
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 23, 2019, 09:47:46 AM
According to Sean Moran in the Times, it looks certain that the Croke Park Round will be replaced by the Neutral Round for 2020.

Hopefully someone has the cop on to ensure they also charge the format so two winners from S8 Round 1 play each other in S8 Round 2, to avoid the nonsense we have with Dublin, Tyrone, Cork, Ros
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: TheGreatest on July 23, 2019, 09:54:08 AM
Quote from: Hound on July 23, 2019, 09:47:46 AM
According to Sean Moran in the Times, it looks certain that the Croke Park Round will be replaced by the Neutral Round for 2020.

Hopefully someone has the cop on to ensure they also charge the format so two winners from S8 Round 1 play each other in S8 Round 2, to avoid the nonsense we have with Dublin, Tyrone, Cork, Ros

Hopefully, or provincial winners at home the last game, first game away etc.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Tubberman on July 23, 2019, 10:29:34 AM
Quote from: TheGreatest on July 23, 2019, 09:54:08 AM
Quote from: Hound on July 23, 2019, 09:47:46 AM
According to Sean Moran in the Times, it looks certain that the Croke Park Round will be replaced by the Neutral Round for 2020.

Hopefully someone has the cop on to ensure they also charge the format so two winners from S8 Round 1 play each other in S8 Round 2, to avoid the nonsense we have with Dublin, Tyrone, Cork, Ros

Hopefully, or provincial winners at home the last game, first game away etc.

That would put provincial winners at an immediate disadvantage,  they could be out before they play their home game.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on July 23, 2019, 10:32:36 AM
The most important thing at this stage is the trend in attendance figures

https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gate-receipts-and-attendances-for-football-championship-slid-alarmingly-in-2018-despite-the-introduction-of-the-super-8s-37788169.html

"Attendances figures for the All-Ireland football championship dropped by nearly a fifth last year resulting in a twenty three percent reduction in gate receipts, even though there were six more games played.Overall, the average attendances figures at the 39 games in the All-Ireland series – which includes the qualifiers, the Super 8s and the All-Ireland semi-final and final – was 13,225.
In 2017 when there were 33 games played in the football series the average attendance was 19,049."

If this continues change is more likely 
You can't fool all of the culchies all of the time
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: inthrough on July 23, 2019, 10:39:57 AM
Quote from: Hound on July 23, 2019, 09:45:41 AM
Quote from: TheGreatest on July 23, 2019, 09:05:09 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 22, 2019, 10:58:45 PM
Jez lads ye are looking at doing this and that! The reality is that you can have all the systems, Leagues, round robins, back-door, front door, straight knock-out, whatever - the problem is really is a financially doped Dublin football team!

Take Dublin out of the equation and you have good competitive inter-county football. Teams on a slight rise and teams on a slight decline.

Super 8's, All Ireland Championship and Leinster Championships would all be competitive without Financially Doped Dublin!
What the money has done is made GAA respectable in middle class areas & schools thereby vastly increasing the overall participation & giving the county a much larger pool of talented players to pick from.

The fact of the matter is that the Dublin dominance is basically down to the huge numbers they have to pick from plus a very well organised structure & a superb management team. Throw the fairy dust that is Stephen Cluxton into the mix & you have the perfect storm for other counties.

My complaint with the GAA in all this would be that seeing this as a fact of life they should be redistributing their resources away from Dublin, who clearly don't need it anymore, towards replicating the formula everywhere else & levelling the playing field to a certain degree.

Dublin will always have an advantage in numbers & in having Croke Park as their home ground, nothing much can be done about that. The financial side of things can hoiwever be tweaked & it should be.

Thats just an opinion, if it was the truth, Dublin would be winning all completions, in all codes, at all age levels and both genders, not happening, only in Football from U-20.  So thoughtful opinion, but an incorrect one.
Despite the fact that the Games Development Officers don't go near any of the elite players, there is this great myth how these GDOs are doing incredible work turning Dublin youngsters into superstars. And amazingly this training they don't get from the GDOs doesn't kick in until they're over 19!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 23, 2019, 11:12:55 AM
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/super-8s-croke-park-round-to-be-reviewed-1.3964137?mode=amp
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Milltown Row2 on July 23, 2019, 05:34:54 PM
What happened to the Kerry Donegal thread?

the last thing being discussed was the 'square ball' thrown ball into the net by McHugh?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on July 23, 2019, 05:42:04 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 23, 2019, 05:34:54 PM
What happened to the Kerry Donegal thread?

the last thing being discussed was the 'square ball' thrown ball into the net by McHugh?

I asked that myself. Can't figure out why it's gone  :o
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Ball Hopper on July 23, 2019, 06:55:47 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 23, 2019, 05:42:04 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 23, 2019, 05:34:54 PM
What happened to the Kerry Donegal thread?

the last thing being discussed was the 'square ball' thrown ball into the net by McHugh?

I asked that myself. Can't figure out why it's gone  :o

The poster that opened the thread deleted it?  Can't remember who that was though.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on July 23, 2019, 07:06:47 PM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on July 23, 2019, 06:55:47 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 23, 2019, 05:42:04 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 23, 2019, 05:34:54 PM
What happened to the Kerry Donegal thread?

the last thing being discussed was the 'square ball' thrown ball into the net by McHugh?

I asked that myself. Can't figure out why it's gone  :o

The poster that opened the thread deleted it?  Can't remember who that was though.
kerryforsam19 I believe and he deleted a number of threads already.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: twohands!!! on July 23, 2019, 07:48:47 PM
Quote from: seafoid on July 23, 2019, 10:32:36 AM
The most important thing at this stage is the trend in attendance figures

https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gate-receipts-and-attendances-for-football-championship-slid-alarmingly-in-2018-despite-the-introduction-of-the-super-8s-37788169.html

"Attendances figures for the All-Ireland football championship dropped by nearly a fifth last year resulting in a twenty three percent reduction in gate receipts, even though there were six more games played.Overall, the average attendances figures at the 39 games in the All-Ireland series – which includes the qualifiers, the Super 8s and the All-Ireland semi-final and final – was 13,225.
In 2017 when there were 33 games played in the football series the average attendance was 19,049."

If this continues change is more likely 
You can't fool all of the culchies all of the time

The quarter-finals in 2017 were 5 games (due to the Mayo-Roscommon replay)and the total attendance was 186,900 - average attendance of 37,380

The quarter-finals in 2018 was 12 games and the total attendance was 217,824 - average attendance of 18,152

So far this year in the 8 games the attendance has been 176,541 - average attendance of 29,423

Only need 41,283 in the final ground of games to match last year's quarter-finals number.
Hard not to see that being beaten.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 23, 2019, 07:51:21 PM
There will be 1,000 at most in Páirc Uí Rinn, 16k in Omagh, 10 or 12k on the green grassy slopes and 29k in McHale.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: irish345 on July 23, 2019, 07:51:41 PM
Quote from: giveballaghback on July 22, 2019, 11:11:45 PM
The way to avoid a dead rubber in the last game is for the winners of round 1 to play each other in round 2 and the same for the losers. If there is a draw in round one then there can be no dead rubber.
Anyway while the dubs are at the level they are at the competition is a joke.
If I had a preference it would be back to the old straight knockout system and no back door. Nothing like Russian roulette to sharpen the mind. Currently Mayo are still in it having lost 2 games, the whole thing is farcical and signs on it people are voting with their feet.
Change is needed and quick.


That would be a good idea and probably the best solution if there going to continue with super 8 group stage you can still get half dead rubbers tho with a team already qualified and might play a weak team but they might come 2nd in group if they get beat but a lot of the time it does not matter if you come 1st or 2nd in group
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: TheGreatest on July 24, 2019, 09:13:50 AM
Quote from: Tubberman on July 23, 2019, 10:29:34 AM
Quote from: TheGreatest on July 23, 2019, 09:54:08 AM
Quote from: Hound on July 23, 2019, 09:47:46 AM
According to Sean Moran in the Times, it looks certain that the Croke Park Round will be replaced by the Neutral Round for 2020.

Hopefully someone has the cop on to ensure they also charge the format so two winners from S8 Round 1 play each other in S8 Round 2, to avoid the nonsense we have with Dublin, Tyrone, Cork, Ros

Hopefully, or provincial winners at home the last game, first game away etc.

That would put provincial winners at an immediate disadvantage,  they could be out before they play their home game.

I suppose thats true, i am thinking with my Dublin hat on.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: blanketattack on July 24, 2019, 11:39:46 AM
There's a major disadvantage to playing the weakest team at home as you have 2 tough opponents in neutral and away fixtures.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: StephenC on July 24, 2019, 11:46:35 AM
Quote from: blanketattack on July 24, 2019, 11:39:46 AM
There's a major disadvantage to playing the weakest team at home as you have 2 tough opponents in neutral and away fixtures.

Yeah, as we are experiencing right now.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: twohands!!! on July 24, 2019, 04:11:14 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 23, 2019, 07:51:21 PM
There will be 1,000 at most in Páirc Uí Rinn, 16k in Omagh, 10 or 12k on the green grassy slopes and 29k in McHale.

You think only 999 will travel from Ros?  ;)

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on July 25, 2019, 03:23:06 PM
The fixture arrangement for the fantastic four

Saturday August 10th 5pm

Group 2 winner v Group 1 runner up

Sunday August 11th 3:30 pm

Group 1 winner v Group 2 runner up
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: MayoBuck on July 25, 2019, 03:32:42 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 25, 2019, 03:23:06 PM
The fixture arrangement for the fantastic four

Saturday August 10th 5pm

Group 2 winner v Group 1 runner up

Sunday August 11th 3:30 pm

Group 1 winner v Group 2 runner up

So the reward for the winner of Tyrone v Dublin is a 6 day turnaround to a semi-final?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 25, 2019, 03:38:05 PM
Honestly the loser of the Tyrone game is the winner. 7 day turnaround instead of a 6 day.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 25, 2019, 03:52:42 PM
Quote from: MayoBuck on July 25, 2019, 03:32:42 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 25, 2019, 03:23:06 PM
The fixture arrangement for the fantastic four

Saturday August 10th 5pm

Group 2 winner v Group 1 runner up

Sunday August 11th 3:30 pm

Group 1 winner v Group 2 runner up

So the reward for the winner of Tyrone v Dublin is a 6 day turnaround to a semi-final?

I think the winner of Donegal v Mayo will be hoping Tyrone can win that round 3 tie at home against a likely 2nd string Dublin team as 7 day turnaround against that juggernaut is not enough time to prepare.  Needs to be at least a two week break before the All Ireland semi finals, why wasn't that flaw adjusted last year?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 25, 2019, 04:07:46 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 25, 2019, 03:52:42 PM
Quote from: MayoBuck on July 25, 2019, 03:32:42 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 25, 2019, 03:23:06 PM
The fixture arrangement for the fantastic four

Saturday August 10th 5pm

Group 2 winner v Group 1 runner up

Sunday August 11th 3:30 pm

Group 1 winner v Group 2 runner up

So the reward for the winner of Tyrone v Dublin is a 6 day turnaround to a semi-final?

I think the winner of Donegal v Mayo will be hoping Tyrone can win that round 3 tie at home against a likely 2nd string Dublin team as 7 day turnaround against that juggernaut is not enough time to prepare.  Needs to be at least a two week break before the All Ireland semi finals, why wasn't that flaw adjusted last year?

Of course everyone in group 1 will be hoping to face Tyrone in the semi final. Dublin are already a much scarier prospect but Tyrone will also be playing their 7th game in 8 weeks with 6 of those games all being played away from Tyrone. The stress on the players of that cannot be understated.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rashCharacter on July 25, 2019, 04:13:57 PM
I think the super 8 experiment has failed - I can't see any advantages over the old knockout quarter finals.
'Champions league style' groups stages just aren't appealing in my opinion - knockout games are what people want to see
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 25, 2019, 04:22:47 PM
Quote from: rashCharacter on July 25, 2019, 04:13:57 PM
I think the super 8 experiment has failed - I can't see any advantages over the old knockout quarter finals.
'Champions league style' groups stages just aren't appealing in my opinion - knockout games are what people want to see

Group 2 has been a flop this year with 2 dead rubbers now in the final week, but group 1 has been very entertaining so far with good tight games and 3 teams still able to qualify on the final day.

The 2017 quarter finals were all blow outs apart from the drawn Mayo/Rossie game which Mayo hammered them in the replay.
In 2016 only the Tyrone/Mayo game was close.
In 2015 Tyrone/Monaghan was the closest with a 4 point win.
In 2014 there was 2 close games.
In 2013 only 1 game, Tyrone and Monaghan was close again.
In 2012 There was 2 close games.
In 2011 1 close game
In 2010 no close games at all.

So in the final 7 years of the All Ireland quarter finals knockout there was 28 games played and only 8/9 close games that weren't comfortable wins.

The fact is that there's not 8 teams that can put it up to each other.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 25, 2019, 04:36:06 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 25, 2019, 04:22:47 PM
Quote from: rashCharacter on July 25, 2019, 04:13:57 PM
I think the super 8 experiment has failed - I can't see any advantages over the old knockout quarter finals.
'Champions league style' groups stages just aren't appealing in my opinion - knockout games are what people want to see

Group 2 has been a flop this year with 2 dead rubbers now in the final week, but group 1 has been very entertaining so far with good tight games and 3 teams still able to qualify on the final day.

The 2017 quarter finals were all blow outs apart from the drawn Mayo/Rossie game which Mayo hammered them in the replay.
In 2016 only the Tyrone/Mayo game was close.
In 2015 Tyrone/Monaghan was the closest with a 4 point win.
In 2014 there was 2 close games.
In 2013 only 1 game, Tyrone and Monaghan was close again.
In 2012 There was 2 close games.
In 2011 1 close game
In 2010 no close games at all.

So in the final 7 years of the All Ireland quarter finals knockout there was 28 games played and only 8/9 close games that weren't comfortable wins.

The fact is that there's not 8 teams that can put it up to each other.

Regardless of past results I think the last two years has proved that we don't need the last eight to dragged out with a group stage. For as good as Kerry v Donegal was last week it was silly missing that knock out element to it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on July 25, 2019, 04:41:10 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 25, 2019, 04:07:46 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on July 25, 2019, 03:52:42 PM
Quote from: MayoBuck on July 25, 2019, 03:32:42 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 25, 2019, 03:23:06 PM
The fixture arrangement for the fantastic four

Saturday August 10th 5pm

Group 2 winner v Group 1 runner up

Sunday August 11th 3:30 pm

Group 1 winner v Group 2 runner up

So the reward for the winner of Tyrone v Dublin is a 6 day turnaround to a semi-final?

I think the winner of Donegal v Mayo will be hoping Tyrone can win that round 3 tie at home against a likely 2nd string Dublin team as 7 day turnaround against that juggernaut is not enough time to prepare.  Needs to be at least a two week break before the All Ireland semi finals, why wasn't that flaw adjusted last year?

Of course everyone in group 1 will be hoping to face Tyrone in the semi final. Dublin are already a much scarier prospect but Tyrone will also be playing their 7th game in 8 weeks with 6 of those games all being played away from Tyrone. The stress on the players of that cannot be understated.
My point is its best to avoid Dublin until you have a few weeks to prepare for such a challenge.

A lot of games for Tyrone in a short space of time but lets be fair Tyrone are one of the few teams that can cope with a situation like that due to the serious conditioning level they have (the departing Peter Donnelly to thank for that) and are fairly lucky when it comes to injuries.  The two week break currently has come at a good time to iron out any fatigue in place and Mickey is unlikely to go will a full strength team for that round 3 dead rubber game either.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 25, 2019, 04:48:52 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 25, 2019, 04:07:46 PM

Of course everyone in group 1 will be hoping to face Tyrone in the semi final. Dublin are already a much scarier prospect but Tyrone will also be playing their 7th game in 8 weeks with 6 of those games all being played away from Tyrone. The stress on the players of that cannot be understated.

Apart from the few first teamers who need the gametime, the above is the reason why I expect Harte will play virtually a second 15 v Dublin.

Dublin have played less games, so there's less need for rest, but playing first teamers 6 days before a semi in a dead rubber is a bit of an unnecessary risk.
This time last year, we had just got a good test off Tyrone and thus rested 10 for the game v Roscommon (2 defenders, 2 midfielders and 6 forwards). This year, we haven't been pushed as hard, so maybe Gavin will decide lads need more games. Still I reckon we'll make at least 10 changes from last week.

Quote from: rashCharacter on July 25, 2019, 04:13:57 PM
I think the super 8 experiment has failed - I can't see any advantages over the old knockout quarter finals.
'Champions league style' groups stages just aren't appealing in my opinion - knockout games are what people want to see

The games in the S8 have pretty good this year in my view, Rossies probably the only ones genuinely disappointed with their performances. The big weakness was that Tyrone v Dublin wasn't in Round 2, it would have prolonged interest in the group.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on July 25, 2019, 04:55:34 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 25, 2019, 04:22:47 PM

Group 2 has been a flop this year with 2 dead rubbers now in the final week, but group 1 has been very entertaining so far with good tight games and 3 teams still able to qualify on the final day.


Group 2 went as expected with last year's All Ireland finalists reaching the last 4 with a game to spare.

Group 1 had one very entertaining game but what ran through my head while watching it was what will Dublin will score against loose marking defences like that?  Kerry beat Mayo by 10 and Donegal,Mayo beat Meath by 9 points. Tyrone's two games v Cork and Roscommon was tighter games as they only won by 3 and 4 points. 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: irish345 on July 26, 2019, 01:47:50 PM
The super 8s are a drag if they played the quarter finals and semis over 1 weekend each  like two quarter finals on saturday then the other two on a sunday then the semi finals a week or two earlier as either a double header on a sunday or one on saturday and sunday they could have the all ireland all wrapped up by august

Unless they play the summer 8s a week with midweek games on a tuesday and wednesday but that would never happen
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: irish345 on July 26, 2019, 01:54:52 PM
The summer 8s  ;D i meant to say the super 8s
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: JoeSoap on July 26, 2019, 03:05:54 PM
The best thing about the Super 8s has been bringing big championship matches out to grounds that don't usually get them later in the summer. As disappointing as last year was, having Ballybofey host a massive championship match in July with an All-Ireland semi-final at stake was magic for the town.

I'm not sure on the format myself and think it drags things a little bit, but if there's one thing the GAA should take from it, it's to bring more big games out around the country.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on July 26, 2019, 03:16:20 PM
Quote from: JoeSoap on July 26, 2019, 03:05:54 PM
The best thing about the Super 8s has been bringing big championship matches out to grounds that don't usually get them later in the summer. As disappointing as last year was, having Ballybofey host a massive championship match in July with an All-Ireland semi-final at stake was magic for the town.

I'm not sure on the format myself and think it drags things a little bit, but if there's one thing the GAA should take from it, it's to bring more big games out around the country.

One way of keeping that and to stop the current dragged out system would be to go back to stand alone knock out All Ireland quarter finals and give home advantage to the provincial winner. (For Dublin Parnell park and if deemed not big enough they can choose a neutral venue other than Croke Park)



Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on July 26, 2019, 06:18:03 PM
The current system is in response to an in-depth review of the game and was an attempt to give people what they wanted.

The reason there's groups at the QF stage is because people wanted to keep the provincials but also make the run in to an All Ireland final fairer (amongst other issues).


Nobody, not even Pauric Duffy, claimed they were the perfect solution but they are definitely far better than the old QF format. We've already had two massive games of national interest, Kerry v Mayo and Kerry v Donegal and we have another one to look forward to in Mayo v Donegal.


There is literially nothing about knockout QF's that beat this system in my opinion.


Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: irish345 on July 26, 2019, 06:22:09 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 26, 2019, 03:16:20 PM
Quote from: JoeSoap on July 26, 2019, 03:05:54 PM
The best thing about the Super 8s has been bringing big championship matches out to grounds that don't usually get them later in the summer. As disappointing as last year was, having Ballybofey host a massive championship match in July with an All-Ireland semi-final at stake was magic for the town.

I'm not sure on the format myself and think it drags things a little bit, but if there's one thing the GAA should take from it, it's to bring more big games out around the country.

One way of keeping that and to stop the current dragged out system would be to go back to stand alone knock out All Ireland quarter finals and give home advantage to the provincial winner. (For Dublin Parnell park and if deemed not big enough they can choose a neutral venue other than Croke Park)

i always that should have been the rule home advantage to provincial champions made more sense and gives another reason to win provincial title
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 26, 2019, 06:28:22 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 26, 2019, 06:18:03 PM
The current system is in response to an in-depth review of the game and was an attempt to give people what they wanted.

The reason there's groups at the QF stage is because people wanted to keep the provincials but also make the run in to an All Ireland final fairer (amongst other issues).


Nobody, not even Pauric Duffy, claimed they were the perfect solution but they are definitely far better than the old QF format. We've already had two massive games of national interest, Kerry v Mayo and Kerry v Donegal and we have another one to look forward to in Mayo v Donegal.


There is literially nothing about knockout QF's that beat this system in my opinion.

There was also great occasions in Ballybofey and Roscommon. There's been far more about the super 8s this year than most of the quarter final line ups this decade. People seem to have their minds made up on the games and format before they give it a go. The football has also been much more attacking
With very little low scoring.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 26, 2019, 06:37:53 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 25, 2019, 04:48:52 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 25, 2019, 04:07:46 PM

Of course everyone in group 1 will be hoping to face Tyrone in the semi final. Dublin are already a much scarier prospect but Tyrone will also be playing their 7th game in 8 weeks with 6 of those games all being played away from Tyrone. The stress on the players of that cannot be understated.

Apart from the few first teamers who need the gametime, the above is the reason why I expect Harte will play virtually a second 15 v Dublin.

Dublin have played less games, so there's less need for rest, but playing first teamers 6 days before a semi in a dead rubber is a bit of an unnecessary risk.
This time last year, we had just got a good test off Tyrone and thus rested 10 for the game v Roscommon (2 defenders, 2 midfielders and 6 forwards). This year, we haven't been pushed as hard, so maybe Gavin will decide lads need more games. Still I reckon we'll make at least 10 changes from last week.

Quote from: rashCharacter on July 25, 2019, 04:13:57 PM
I think the super 8 experiment has failed - I can't see any advantages over the old knockout quarter finals.
'Champions league style' groups stages just aren't appealing in my opinion - knockout games are what people want to see

The games in the S8 have pretty good this year in my view, Rossies probably the only ones genuinely disappointed with their performances. The big weakness was that Tyrone v Dublin wasn't in Round 2, it would have prolonged interest in the group.

Ye can rest 10 or more players and still probably be the best team in the country such is the strength in depth.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 26, 2019, 06:41:05 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 25, 2019, 04:55:34 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 25, 2019, 04:22:47 PM

Group 2 has been a flop this year with 2 dead rubbers now in the final week, but group 1 has been very entertaining so far with good tight games and 3 teams still able to qualify on the final day.


Group 2 went as expected with last year's All Ireland finalists reaching the last 4 with a game to spare.

Group 1 had one very entertaining game but what ran through my head while watching it was what will Dublin will score against loose marking defences like that?  Kerry beat Mayo by 10 and Donegal,Mayo beat Meath by 9 points. Tyrone's two games v Cork and Roscommon was tighter games as they only won by 3 and 4 points.

I didn't see much of the Mayo Kerry game but the Donegal game against Meath was a really good contest until fairly late on. The final scoreline doesn't reflect the game itself.

Kerry and donegal was a cracker this week and I'd expect Donegal and Mayo to be a fine game too. So that's 3 good games out of 6 which is a good return.


As for the Tyrone games against the Rossies and Cork. I'm blind to the entertainment quality or othewise of Tyrone. I simply can't tell and going by everything I read about us it doesn't matter if we hammer a team, get hammered or have a 1 point narrow game we're still shite to watch by all accounts so going by that Group 2 was a flop for the neutral.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on July 26, 2019, 07:01:23 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 26, 2019, 06:18:03 PM
The current system is in response to an in-depth review of the game and was an attempt to give people what they wanted.

The reason there's groups at the QF stage is because people wanted to keep the provincials but also make the run in to an All Ireland final fairer (amongst other issues).


Nobody, not even Pauric Duffy, claimed they were the perfect solution but they are definitely far better than the old QF format. We've already had two massive games of national interest, Kerry v Mayo and Kerry v Donegal and we have another one to look forward to in Mayo v Donegal.


There is literially nothing about knockout QF's that beat this system in my opinion.

People as in players or general public who are going to these games? as i doubt the majority of those people wanted this format.  Groups for the last 8 was mainly brought in by HQ with gate receipt revenue in mind and they will have their own little review on that after this 3 year trial period.

One of those "massive" games was over as a contest in the 1st half and Donegal v Mayo will have a massive interest because it happens to be a knock out game.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on July 26, 2019, 07:19:03 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 26, 2019, 06:41:05 PM
I didn't see much of the Mayo Kerry game but the Donegal game against Meath was a really good contest until fairly late on. The final scoreline doesn't reflect the game itself.

Kerry and donegal was a cracker this week and I'd expect Donegal and Mayo to be a fine game too. So that's 3 good games out of 6 which is a good return.


As for the Tyrone games against the Rossies and Cork. I'm blind to the entertainment quality or othewise of Tyrone. I simply can't tell and going by everything I read about us it doesn't matter if we hammer a team, get hammered or have a 1 point narrow game we're still shite to watch by all accounts so going by that Group 2 was a flop for the neutral.

Meath did put it up to Donegal but ran out of steam or didn't have the bench to keep it going, similar to how Cork performed v Dublin.

Tyrone were given two good tests in their group the last game they showed what they were made of by coming back from 7 points down to win by 3 points. More is learnt in a wins like that than winning by 10+ points.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Armagh18 on July 26, 2019, 07:38:56 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 26, 2019, 07:01:23 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 26, 2019, 06:18:03 PM
The current system is in response to an in-depth review of the game and was an attempt to give people what they wanted.

The reason there's groups at the QF stage is because people wanted to keep the provincials but also make the run in to an All Ireland final fairer (amongst other issues).


Nobody, not even Pauric Duffy, claimed they were the perfect solution but they are definitely far better than the old QF format. We've already had two massive games of national interest, Kerry v Mayo and Kerry v Donegal and we have another one to look forward to in Mayo v Donegal.


There is literially nothing about knockout QF's that beat this system in my opinion.

People as in players or general public who are going to these games? as i doubt the majority of those people wanted this format.  Groups for the last 8 was mainly brought in by HQ with gate receipt revenue in mind and they will have their own little review on that after this 3 year trial period.

One of those "massive" games was over as a contest in the 1st half and Donegal v Mayo will have a massive interest because it happens to be a knock out game.
Kerry vs Mayo is always going to be a massive game that will get the neutrals interested. For all the GAA's faults you can't blame them for Mayo not showing up that day and for Kerry putting in a super performance.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 26, 2019, 07:43:51 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 26, 2019, 07:19:03 PM
Quote from: Jayop on July 26, 2019, 06:41:05 PM
I didn't see much of the Mayo Kerry game but the Donegal game against Meath was a really good contest until fairly late on. The final scoreline doesn't reflect the game itself.

Kerry and donegal was a cracker this week and I'd expect Donegal and Mayo to be a fine game too. So that's 3 good games out of 6 which is a good return.


As for the Tyrone games against the Rossies and Cork. I'm blind to the entertainment quality or othewise of Tyrone. I simply can't tell and going by everything I read about us it doesn't matter if we hammer a team, get hammered or have a 1 point narrow game we're still shite to watch by all accounts so going by that Group 2 was a flop for the neutral.

Meath did put it up to Donegal but ran out of steam or didn't have the bench to keep it going, similar to how Cork performed v Dublin.

Tyrone were given two good tests in their group the last game they showed what they were made of by coming back from 7 points down to win by 3 points. More is learnt in a wins like that than winning by 10+ points.

Ah yeah no doubt at all those two games are much better for Tyrone than the hammerings they dished out to both teams last year but I'm asking would those games have been seen as entertaining for a neutral? The Cork game certainly had everyone in the pub I was watching in in Sligo (so pure neutral but all shouting for Cork) following it closely.

I do think the GAA brought this in with duel intentions.

1) Revenue, both from TV which they managed to f**k up by bringing it in during an existing deal term so all we ended up with was no football on TV until June, and gate receipts which are down afaik from a few years ago when it was knock out. Gate receipts are harder to quantify cause and effect though.

2) Having seen the success of the hurling they wanted to have the top teams playing off against each other in the football more often too in a round robin. I think this was a fairly pure aspiration but it's not really worked out. That's largely down to the gulf between Dublin and everyone else. Even during and after a great game like the one last weekend you have people still saying, ya but the Dubs will hammer them. Until Dublin are reined in a bit by everyone else it's all going to be a damp squib.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Jayop on July 26, 2019, 07:45:39 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on July 26, 2019, 07:38:56 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 26, 2019, 07:01:23 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 26, 2019, 06:18:03 PM
The current system is in response to an in-depth review of the game and was an attempt to give people what they wanted.

The reason there's groups at the QF stage is because people wanted to keep the provincials but also make the run in to an All Ireland final fairer (amongst other issues).


Nobody, not even Pauric Duffy, claimed they were the perfect solution but they are definitely far better than the old QF format. We've already had two massive games of national interest, Kerry v Mayo and Kerry v Donegal and we have another one to look forward to in Mayo v Donegal.


There is literially nothing about knockout QF's that beat this system in my opinion.

People as in players or general public who are going to these games? as i doubt the majority of those people wanted this format.  Groups for the last 8 was mainly brought in by HQ with gate receipt revenue in mind and they will have their own little review on that after this 3 year trial period.

One of those "massive" games was over as a contest in the 1st half and Donegal v Mayo will have a massive interest because it happens to be a knock out game.
Kerry vs Mayo is always going to be a massive game that will get the neutrals interested. For all the GAA's faults you can't blame them for Mayo not showing up that day and for Kerry putting in a super performance.

Yep. You'd love to have seen Armagh and Roscommon getting another rattle at each other this year too at some point and everyone would have been tuned in for that.  Could have ended up a crappy game but you can't blame the GAA for everything.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 26, 2019, 08:27:36 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on July 26, 2019, 07:38:56 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 26, 2019, 07:01:23 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 26, 2019, 06:18:03 PM
The current system is in response to an in-depth review of the game and was an attempt to give people what they wanted.

The reason there's groups at the QF stage is because people wanted to keep the provincials but also make the run in to an All Ireland final fairer (amongst other issues).


Nobody, not even Pauric Duffy, claimed they were the perfect solution but they are definitely far better than the old QF format. We've already had two massive games of national interest, Kerry v Mayo and Kerry v Donegal and we have another one to look forward to in Mayo v Donegal.


There is literially nothing about knockout QF's that beat this system in my opinion.

People as in players or general public who are going to these games? as i doubt the majority of those people wanted this format.  Groups for the last 8 was mainly brought in by HQ with gate receipt revenue in mind and they will have their own little review on that after this 3 year trial period.

One of those "massive" games was over as a contest in the 1st half and Donegal v Mayo will have a massive interest because it happens to be a knock out game.
Kerry vs Mayo is always going to be a massive game that will get the neutrals interested. For all the GAA's faults you can't blame them for Mayo not showing up that day and for Kerry putting in a super performance.

Plenty of journalists and pundits have blamed the GAA for it though.  A weary and injury hit Mayo v a well rested Kerry with home advantage had the recipe for a mismatch.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on July 26, 2019, 08:36:09 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 26, 2019, 07:01:23 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 26, 2019, 06:18:03 PM
The current system is in response to an in-depth review of the game and was an attempt to give people what they wanted.

The reason there's groups at the QF stage is because people wanted to keep the provincials but also make the run in to an All Ireland final fairer (amongst other issues).


Nobody, not even Pauric Duffy, claimed they were the perfect solution but they are definitely far better than the old QF format. We've already had two massive games of national interest, Kerry v Mayo and Kerry v Donegal and we have another one to look forward to in Mayo v Donegal.


There is literially nothing about knockout QF's that beat this system in my opinion.

People as in players or general public who are going to these games? as i doubt the majority of those people wanted this format.  Groups for the last 8 was mainly brought in by HQ with gate receipt revenue in mind and they will have their own little review on that after this 3 year trial period.

One of those "massive" games was over as a contest in the 1st half and Donegal v Mayo will have a massive interest because it happens to be a knock out game.


Everyone was able to have their say so if they expressed that view then it was included in the overall assessment. There isn't any format that will please everybody anyway and trying to balance all the interests of the GAA community is extremely difficult.


As for your point about the Kerry/Mayo game, so what? That can and will happen in any format so has no relevance to the merit of the super 8's. the point is this format throws up a lot of potentially great games. The dominance of Dublin almost certainly means one group won't go down to the wire but again, in any other format it would be no different.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Halfquarter on July 26, 2019, 11:35:47 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 26, 2019, 08:36:09 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 26, 2019, 07:01:23 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 26, 2019, 06:18:03 PM
The current system is in response to an in-depth review of the game and was an attempt to give people what they wanted.

The reason there's groups at the QF stage is because people wanted to keep the provincials but also make the run in to an All Ireland final fairer (amongst other issues).


Nobody, not even Pauric Duffy, claimed they were the perfect solution but they are definitely far better than the old QF format. We've already had two massive games of national interest, Kerry v Mayo and Kerry v Donegal and we have another one to look forward to in Mayo v Donegal.


There is literially nothing about knockout QF's that beat this system in my opinion.

People as in players or general public who are going to these games? as i doubt the majority of those people wanted this format.  Groups for the last 8 was mainly brought in by HQ with gate receipt revenue in mind and they will have their own little review on that after this 3 year trial period.

One of those "massive" games was over as a contest in the 1st half and Donegal v Mayo will have a massive interest because it happens to be a knock out game.


Everyone was able to have their say so if they expressed that view then it was included in the overall assessment. There isn't any format that will please everybody anyway and trying to balance all the interests of the GAA community is extremely difficult.


As for your point about the Kerry/Mayo game, so what? That can and will happen in any format so has no relevance to the merit of the super 8's. the point is this format throws up a lot of potentially great games. The dominance of Dublin almost certainly means one group won't go down to the wire but again, in any other format it would be no different.

Dublin have 3 weeks to prepare for their All Ireland semi final ( at home ) !, how is that fair ?
Mayo and Donegal have to kick the Sh!t out of each other and go again in six days time .
Mayo have already played 5 weeks on the trot, the whole thing is a farce in my opinion.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 26, 2019, 11:51:50 PM
Quote from: Halfquarter on July 26, 2019, 11:35:47 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 26, 2019, 08:36:09 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on July 26, 2019, 07:01:23 PM
Quote from: Zulu on July 26, 2019, 06:18:03 PM
The current system is in response to an in-depth review of the game and was an attempt to give people what they wanted.

The reason there's groups at the QF stage is because people wanted to keep the provincials but also make the run in to an All Ireland final fairer (amongst other issues).


Nobody, not even Pauric Duffy, claimed they were the perfect solution but they are definitely far better than the old QF format. We've already had two massive games of national interest, Kerry v Mayo and Kerry v Donegal and we have another one to look forward to in Mayo v Donegal.


There is literially nothing about knockout QF's that beat this system in my opinion.

People as in players or general public who are going to these games? as i doubt the majority of those people wanted this format.  Groups for the last 8 was mainly brought in by HQ with gate receipt revenue in mind and they will have their own little review on that after this 3 year trial period.

One of those "massive" games was over as a contest in the 1st half and Donegal v Mayo will have a massive interest because it happens to be a knock out game.


Everyone was able to have their say so if they expressed that view then it was included in the overall assessment. There isn't any format that will please everybody anyway and trying to balance all the interests of the GAA community is extremely difficult.


As for your point about the Kerry/Mayo game, so what? That can and will happen in any format so has no relevance to the merit of the super 8's. the point is this format throws up a lot of potentially great games. The dominance of Dublin almost certainly means one group won't go down to the wire but again, in any other format it would be no different.

Dublin have 3 weeks to prepare for their All Ireland semi final ( at home ) !, how is that fair ?
Mayo and Donegal have to kick the Sh!t out of each other and go again in six days time .
Mayo have already played 5 weeks on the trot, the whole thing is a farce in my opinion.

Comments like that are mean spirited and divisive!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: bannside on July 27, 2019, 07:12:38 AM
Halfquarter hits the nail on the head 100%. Whoever decided that a turnaround time of 6 days is sufficient for players in the modern game should hold their head in shame. They obviously have no idea what it takes to mentally or physically prepare a team. This 6 day turnaround is singularly the biggest flaw in the structure of the "super 8's" and hands Dublin yet another massive psychological advantage...on top of home advantage and all the others.

Twoweeksornothing!

Otherwise it will be like going in like lambs to the slaughter.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 27, 2019, 04:27:46 PM
Quote from: bannside on July 27, 2019, 07:12:38 AM
Halfquarter hits the nail on the head 100%. Whoever decided that a turnaround time of 6 days is sufficient for players in the modern game should hold their head in shame. They obviously have no idea what it takes to mentally or physically prepare a team. This 6 day turnaround is singularly the biggest flaw in the structure of the "super 8's" and hands Dublin yet another massive psychological advantage...on top of home advantage and all the others.

Twoweeksornothing!

Otherwise it will be like going in like lambs to the slaughter.

Are Dublin not set to have a 6 day turnaround themselves if they beat Tyrone?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 27, 2019, 09:50:09 PM
Quote from: hardstation on July 27, 2019, 05:30:49 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 27, 2019, 04:27:46 PM
Quote from: bannside on July 27, 2019, 07:12:38 AM
Halfquarter hits the nail on the head 100%. Whoever decided that a turnaround time of 6 days is sufficient for players in the modern game should hold their head in shame. They obviously have no idea what it takes to mentally or physically prepare a team. This 6 day turnaround is singularly the biggest flaw in the structure of the "super 8's" and hands Dublin yet another massive psychological advantage...on top of home advantage and all the others.

Twoweeksornothing!

Otherwise it will be like going in like lambs to the slaughter.

Are Dublin not set to have a 6 day turnaround themselves if they beat Tyrone?
I think the point is that the Tyrone v Dublin game is a dead rubber which allows both teams to rest players, play the B team or whatever.
The games in the other group are do or die.
So what you're saying is that Tyrone have the very same advantage Dublin have and that Bannside is talking through his hole?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 27, 2019, 10:15:38 PM
Quote from: hardstation on July 27, 2019, 10:02:15 PM
He should have said Dublin & Tyrone.
Should have said it benefits any team who wins their first 2 games.

There are many Dublin advantages. Population, everyone living in the county, no distance to training, great sponsorship deals, etc etc.

But saying the one week break between last game of S8 and AI semi is designed to advantage Dublin is moronic
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on July 27, 2019, 10:19:45 PM
It's a load of bollix is what it is , why bother anyway , why is the all Ireland so early , what club championship has benefited?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: moysider on July 27, 2019, 10:30:26 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on July 27, 2019, 10:19:45 PM
It's a load of bollix is what it is , why bother anyway , why is the all Ireland so early , what club championship has benefited?

Ssssh Larry. You will get in trouble for saying things like that! You can think things like that but you can't say them.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 27, 2019, 10:30:54 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on July 27, 2019, 10:19:45 PM
It's a load of bollix is what it is , why bother anyway , why is the all Ireland so early , what club championship has benefited?
Why did McLoughlin kick it wide?

Surely, if anyone has benefited from the new system, it's Mayo. Shite all championship, but finally looking like having a near enough first team, and still just one win away from the semi final. It's amazing really.
You might be scared of your life of Dublin, but Keegan, Higgins, O'Connor, Boyle, Durkan, etc aren't.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 27, 2019, 10:48:28 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 27, 2019, 10:30:54 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on July 27, 2019, 10:19:45 PM
It's a load of bollix is what it is , why bother anyway , why is the all Ireland so early , what club championship has benefited?
Why did McLoughlin kick it wide?

Surely, if anyone has benefited from the new system, it's Mayo. Shite all championship, but finally looking like having a near enough first team, and still just one win away from the semi final. It's amazing really.
You might be scared of your life of Dublin, but Keegan, Higgins, O'Connor, Boyle, Durkan, etc aren't.

Well I would be scared. At our peak from 2013 to 2017 we never crossed that bridge! We are two years on from that now. If anything Dublin must know at this stage they have Dads Army's number no matter how bad they play. Which is not the end of the world because they have everybody's number.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on July 27, 2019, 11:04:00 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 27, 2019, 10:30:54 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on July 27, 2019, 10:19:45 PM
It's a load of bollix is what it is , why bother anyway , why is the all Ireland so early , what club championship has benefited?
Why did McLoughlin kick it wide?

Surely, if anyone has benefited from the new system, it's Mayo. Shite all championship, but finally looking like having a near enough first team, and still just one win away from the semi final. It's amazing really.
You might be scared of your life of Dublin, but Keegan, Higgins, O'Connor, Boyle, Durkan, etc aren't.

Haha you sound like you have a biteen of fear of little old Mayo
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 27, 2019, 11:36:50 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on July 27, 2019, 11:04:00 PM
Quote from: Hound on July 27, 2019, 10:30:54 PM
Quote from: larryin89 on July 27, 2019, 10:19:45 PM
It's a load of bollix is what it is , why bother anyway , why is the all Ireland so early , what club championship has benefited?
Why did McLoughlin kick it wide?

Surely, if anyone has benefited from the new system, it's Mayo. Shite all championship, but finally looking like having a near enough first team, and still just one win away from the semi final. It's amazing really.
You might be scared of your life of Dublin, but Keegan, Higgins, O'Connor, Boyle, Durkan, etc aren't.

Haha you sound like you have a biteen of fear of little old Mayo
Fear, no.

Respect, for sure.

As all my posts down through the years would testify.

More respect for them than you, if your posts are a true reflection.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: larryin89 on July 28, 2019, 12:00:44 AM
Respect them all ya want they are not within an asses roar of putting it up to Dublin , won't even beat donegal anyway .
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Armagh18 on July 28, 2019, 08:36:27 AM
Quote from: Hound on July 27, 2019, 10:15:38 PM
Quote from: hardstation on July 27, 2019, 10:02:15 PM
He should have said Dublin & Tyrone.
Should have said it benefits any team who wins their first 2 games.

There are many Dublin advantages. Population, everyone living in the county, no distance to training, great sponsorship deals, etc etc.

But saying the one week break between last game of S8 and AI semi is designed to advantage Dublin is moronic
Its not designed to be an advantage to anyone specifically, its just stupid fixture planning. Should definitely be a 2 week gap til the semi.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 28, 2019, 08:50:06 AM
Quote from: larryin89 on July 28, 2019, 12:00:44 AM
Respect them all ya want they are not within an asses roar of putting it up to Dublin , won't even beat donegal anyway .

Yea, but no but yea but no etc.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Halfquarter on July 28, 2019, 11:39:37 AM
Quote from: Hound on July 27, 2019, 09:50:09 PM
Quote from: hardstation on July 27, 2019, 05:30:49 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 27, 2019, 04:27:46 PM
Quote from: bannside on July 27, 2019, 07:12:38 AM
Halfquarter hits the nail on the head 100%. Whoever decided that a turnaround time of 6 days is sufficient for players in the modern game should hold their head in shame. They obviously have no idea what it takes to mentally or physically prepare a team. This 6 day turnaround is singularly the biggest flaw in the structure of the "super 8's" and hands Dublin yet another massive psychological advantage...on top of home advantage and all the others.

Twoweeksornothing!

Otherwise it will be like going in like lambs to the slaughter.

Are Dublin not set to have a 6 day turnaround themselves if they beat Tyrone?
I think the point is that the Tyrone v Dublin game is a dead rubber which allows both teams to rest players, play the B team or whatever.
The games in the other group are do or die.
So what you're saying is that Tyrone have the very same advantage Dublin have and that Bannside is talking through his hole?

No,Tyrone do not have the same advantages as Dublin.

Tyrone did not have two home games against Cork and Roscommon to qualify for the Semi's .

Tyrone had to negotiate the minefield of the Ulster Championship and the quagmire of the backdoor
System.

All Dublin had to do was sail through the wasteland of the Leinster Championship.

Yes ,both Dublin and Tyrone are lucky enough to have a dead rubber next weekend but it was always
likely  to happen for Dublin as they started with two home matches anyway.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: imtommygunn on July 28, 2019, 12:34:35 PM
Dublin would have sailed through Ulster though...
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on July 29, 2019, 11:05:43 PM
Which games are on RTE this weekend?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: under the bar on July 30, 2019, 12:01:10 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 28, 2019, 12:34:35 PM
Dublin would have sailed through Ulster though...

Dublin could probably sail through the Tour de France..
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on July 30, 2019, 12:42:32 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 29, 2019, 11:05:43 PM
Which games are on RTE this weekend?

Matches on Sunday.

Tyrone v Dublin on RTE 2
Cork v Roscommon on RTE player.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on July 30, 2019, 07:00:12 PM
Mayo Donegal on Sky then? FFS!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 30, 2019, 08:39:02 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 30, 2019, 12:42:32 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 29, 2019, 11:05:43 PM
Which games are on RTE this weekend?

Matches on Sunday.

Tyrone v Dublin on RTE 2
Cork v Roscommon on RTE player.

Fair dues to RTE on pulling out all the stops in covering the Cork v Roscommon game on the RTE Player.
There should be a large audience for this game.
Should be the highlight game of the Super Duper 8's.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Clinker on July 30, 2019, 08:55:05 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 30, 2019, 07:00:12 PM

Mayo Donegal on Sky then? FFS!


For most if not nearly all acquaintances - this translates as - "The match is on the radio."


As stated before - GAA Clubs calling to the door no longer get their tickets bought.

They must have lots of the SKY Money in their accounts never mind adding even more to it by torturing ordinary people.

Lou Reed/Corporate GAA - You're going to reap just what you sow
You're going to reap just what you sow
You're going to reap just what you sow
You're going to reap just what you sow

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wxI4KK9ZYo

It's just a perfect day.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on July 30, 2019, 09:35:16 PM
1,000 watched one of the super 8 games on Sky

How can the GAA justify selling the games to Sky when that's the viewing figures?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on July 30, 2019, 09:46:06 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 30, 2019, 08:39:02 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 30, 2019, 12:42:32 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 29, 2019, 11:05:43 PM
Which games are on RTE this weekend?

Matches on Sunday.

Tyrone v Dublin on RTE 2
Cork v Roscommon on RTE player.

Fair dues to RTE on pulling out all the stops in covering the Cork v Roscommon game on the RTE Player.
There should be a large audience for this game.
Should be the highlight game of the Super Duper 8's.
Go and stew yer rhubarb and remember 25th May.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on July 30, 2019, 10:24:48 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 30, 2019, 09:35:16 PM
1,000 watched one of the super 8 games on Sky

How can the GAA justify selling the games to Sky when that's the viewing figures?

A very misleading figure. It excludes Ireland, people watching in pubs or on now tv and also sky sports would be used in Irish bars across Europe.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on July 30, 2019, 10:31:44 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 30, 2019, 09:46:06 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 30, 2019, 08:39:02 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on July 30, 2019, 12:42:32 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 29, 2019, 11:05:43 PM
Which games are on RTE this weekend?

Matches on Sunday.

Tyrone v Dublin on RTE 2
Cork v Roscommon on RTE player.

Fair dues to RTE on pulling out all the stops in covering the Cork v Roscommon game on the RTE Player.
There should be a large audience for this game.
Should be the highlight game of the Super Duper 8's.
Go and stew yer rhubarb and remember 25th May.

Ah I'm not hitting out at the Rossies/Cork! Just there have been loads of games this year that were relevant or had a purpose that were not covered by RTE.

(No issue with the Rossies beating us fair and square. Better team on the day!)
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on July 30, 2019, 10:44:01 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 30, 2019, 07:00:12 PM
Mayo Donegal on Sky then? FFS!

Will be nice to have decent punditry for a change!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Hound on July 31, 2019, 08:39:58 AM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 30, 2019, 10:24:48 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 30, 2019, 09:35:16 PM
1,000 watched one of the super 8 games on Sky

How can the GAA justify selling the games to Sky when that's the viewing figures?

A very misleading figure. It excludes Ireland, people watching in pubs or on now tv and also sky sports would be used in Irish bars across Europe.
These figures as often represented as actual figures rather than a statistical estimate.

Wooly had a great laugh on his podcast about this. He said that while the average audience was 1,000, and I think they said it went as "high" as 8,000, there was a period of time when there were zero people watching this particular match according to the figures given! Wooly did defend it as saying that the Wimbledon final, cricket world cup final and British Grand Prix were all on at the same time as the GAA match, so of course the figures would be extremely low (especially when it excludes Ireland, pubs, etc.).

There are 27 million homes with TVs or other TV viewing devices in the UK (population over 60m). BARB (who collect the viewing figures) have systems in 5,300 homes (containing 12,000 people) where they collect data as to what is being watched and by whom. They use this to extrapolate viewing figures. So when "zero" were watching the GAA, it was zero out of 12,000 rather than zero out of 60 million.

Probably like political opinion polls, it's reasonably accurate for estimating larger numbers, but not great at estimating the small numbers given there will be a +/- margin of error
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: clarshack on July 31, 2019, 09:20:32 AM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on July 30, 2019, 10:24:48 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on July 30, 2019, 09:35:16 PM
1,000 watched one of the super 8 games on Sky

How can the GAA justify selling the games to Sky when that's the viewing figures?

A very misleading figure. It excludes Ireland, people watching in pubs or on now tv and also sky sports would be used in Irish bars across Europe.

and also those with dodgy Sky.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: kerryforsam19 on August 01, 2019, 10:43:23 PM
https://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2019/0801/1066549-gaa-team-news-moran-returns-for-kerrys-trip-to-navan/
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 01, 2019, 11:03:56 PM
So here we are in the Super Duper 8's with 4 games on the weekend.

And only one meaningful game of the 4 on offer!

A real success story this Super Duper 8's!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:35:48 PM
Better than the old QF's anyway.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: From the Bunker on August 01, 2019, 11:39:36 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:35:48 PM
Better than the old QF's anyway.

You think?

Can you imagine if these games were the QF's.

All 4 games would be of decent value!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 01, 2019, 11:44:41 PM
There were a fair few mismatches in 2016 and 2017 QFs.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on August 01, 2019, 11:47:22 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 01, 2019, 11:39:36 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:35:48 PM
Better than the old QF's anyway.

You think?

Can you imagine if these games were the QF's.

All 4 games would be of decent value!

And a decent break for the 4 winners as they prepare for All Ireland semi final.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:49:57 PM
Someone posted up how many of the QF's were actually close over the last 4 or 5 years and none of them had anymore than 2 of the 4 competitive in any year. The super 8's provided us with one of the games of the decade, a massive occasion in Killarney and another one this weekend in Castlebar as well as good games between Cork/Dublin, Mayo/Meath, Cork/Tyrone and Meath/Donegal. What's more, of those games, Cork/Tyrone and Mayo/Meath were more or less do or die, lose and you couldn't make the All Ireland SF's. That's far better than what we had.


Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:58:55 PM
Quote from: hardstation on August 01, 2019, 11:51:16 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:35:48 PM
Better than the old QF's anyway.
It's not. It is boring and unnecessary. Get on with the competition and cease the cumbersome foreplay please.

Are the Munster and Leinster hurling championships boring? Are the premiership, champions league or World Cup boring? Olympic heats? Casual observers of pretty much any sport could tell you the likely winners of most competitions but they still all avoid strict knock out competitions.


Why is it boring anyway? In one group three teams out of four can still qualify and they all want to top it to avoid playing Dublin.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on August 02, 2019, 12:02:34 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:58:55 PM
...
Why is it boring anyway? In one group three teams out of four can still qualify and they all want to top it to avoid playing Dublin.

You really think that Donegal want to meet us again at this juncture of this year's Championship? And it only applies to Group 1 (we can't meet them in the Semi regardless).
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 02, 2019, 12:06:19 AM
Unlike the Hurley stuff which has 9 reasonably well matched teams football has one Superteam and maybe 3 others who are excellent teams.
5 or 6 who'd come after that.
Hurling had the Round Robin (restricted) first and the K O after.
Football has knockout Provincials, knockout Qualifiers, then Round Robin and then more knockout.
One plus though was big games in Provincial venues.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:10:47 AM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on August 02, 2019, 12:02:34 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:58:55 PM
...
Why is it boring anyway? In one group three teams out of four can still qualify and they all want to top it to avoid playing Dublin.

You really think that Donegal want to meet us again at this juncture of this year's Championship? And it only applies to Group 1 (we can't meet them in the Semi regardless).

If given the choice of the Dubs or Tyrone I'd say they'd pick Tyrone every day of the week.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:13:41 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 02, 2019, 12:06:19 AM
Unlike the Hurley stuff which has 9 reasonably well matched teams football has one Superteam and maybe 3 others who are excellent teams.
5 or 6 who'd come after that.
Hurling had the Round Robin (restricted) first and the K O after.
Football has knockout Provincials, knockout Qualifiers, then Round Robin and then more knockout.
One plus though was big games in Provincial venues.

Dublin are making any system in football seem defunct but the super 8's are better than the alternative knockout QF's. Why any fan of football wouldn't like to see more football games between the best teams is beyond me.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Fear ón Srath Bán on August 02, 2019, 12:19:48 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:10:47 AM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on August 02, 2019, 12:02:34 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:58:55 PM
...
Why is it boring anyway? In one group three teams out of four can still qualify and they all want to top it to avoid playing Dublin.

You really think that Donegal want to meet us again at this juncture of this year's Championship? And it only applies to Group 1 (we can't meet them in the Semi regardless).

If given the choice of the Dubs or Tyrone I'd say they'd pick Tyrone every day of the week.

With respect, I'd let wans from Donegal actually assert that *, since pure speculation is rarely worthy of expression.

* Stand to be corrected, though if Dublin are going to be thwarted in their 'drive for five', it's probably more likely to happen in the Semi than the Final, I'd say, in that whatever 'vulnerability' exists with them, will have been truly banished by the first weekend in September in Croke.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:36:50 AM
Fair enough though I only gave my opinion. If there are Donegal folk out there who'd prefer to meet Dublin then fair enough.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on August 02, 2019, 12:57:06 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:49:57 PM
What's more, of those games, Cork/Tyrone and Mayo/Meath were more or less do or die, lose and you couldn't make the All Ireland SF's. That's far better than what we had.
I think most would agree that Meath,Cork having dead rubbers to play after losing their do or die matches is not better than what we had.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Never beat the deeler on August 02, 2019, 05:32:09 AM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on August 02, 2019, 12:19:48 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:10:47 AM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on August 02, 2019, 12:02:34 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:58:55 PM
...
Why is it boring anyway? In one group three teams out of four can still qualify and they all want to top it to avoid playing Dublin.

You really think that Donegal want to meet us again at this juncture of this year's Championship? And it only applies to Group 1 (we can't meet them in the Semi regardless).

If given the choice of the Dubs or Tyrone I'd say they'd pick Tyrone every day of the week.

With respect, I'd let wans from Donegal actually assert that *, since pure speculation is rarely worthy of expression.

* Stand to be corrected, though if Dublin are going to be thwarted in their 'drive for five', it's probably more likely to happen in the Semi than the Final, I'd say, in that whatever 'vulnerability' exists with them, will have been truly banished by the first weekend in September in Croke.

You asked him what he thought and when you didnt like it, you want it to come from someone else!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: inthrough on August 02, 2019, 08:02:03 AM
Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on August 02, 2019, 12:02:34 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:58:55 PM
...
Why is it boring anyway? In one group three teams out of four can still qualify and they all want to top it to avoid playing Dublin.

You really think that Donegal want to meet us again at this juncture of this year's Championship? And it only applies to Group 1 (we can't meet them in the Semi regardless).

Absolutely delighted to meet you in the semi final.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on August 02, 2019, 08:27:02 AM

Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:58:55 PM
...
Why is it boring anyway? In one group three teams out of four can still qualify and they all want to top it to avoid playing Dublin.

I'd be interested in hearing from some of the kerry lads, would ye prefer to play Dublin in semi or the final? I'd say if Dublin are to do 5 in a row (odds are currently 4/9), kerry might prefer not to play them in the final and have their shot in a semi instead
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:09:18 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on August 02, 2019, 12:57:06 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:49:57 PM
What's more, of those games, Cork/Tyrone and Mayo/Meath were more or less do or die, lose and you couldn't make the All Ireland SF's. That's far better than what we had.
I think most would agree that Meath,Cork having dead rubbers to play after losing their do or die matches is not better than what we had.

Ronan McCarthy has already come out stating their game isn't a deadrubber as far as he's concerned. I'm certain the Meath management feel the same about Kerry coming to Navan in a game Kerry will want to win.

If you compare the old knockout QF format to the super 8's then the super 8's would be the preferred option of most I'd say.

Managers and players want more games and less training so it's the super 8's

Administrators want more revenue and a higher profile for the game so it's the super 8's

County boards like the home game element as do local businesses and getting rid of the Croke Park game will spread that business wider.

Fans get more games, more oppportunities to get kids to games which is what helps fuel the passion in the next generation.

Clubs won't get anymore games played if you went back to the QF's so I see little or no advantage to the old system over the current one. It's not perfect but it's still better IMO.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on August 02, 2019, 12:29:38 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:09:18 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on August 02, 2019, 12:57:06 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:49:57 PM
What's more, of those games, Cork/Tyrone and Mayo/Meath were more or less do or die, lose and you couldn't make the All Ireland SF's. That's far better than what we had.
I think most would agree that Meath,Cork having dead rubbers to play after losing their do or die matches is not better than what we had.

Ronan McCarthy has already come out stating their game isn't a deadrubber as far as he's concerned. I'm certain the Meath management feel the same about Kerry coming to Navan in a game Kerry will want to win.

If you compare the old knockout QF format to the super 8's then the super 8's would be the preferred option of most I'd say.

Managers and players want more games and less training so it's the super 8's

Administrators want more revenue and a higher profile for the game so it's the super 8's

County boards like the home game element as do local businesses and getting rid of the Croke Park game will spread that business wider.

Fans get more games, more oppportunities to get kids to games which is what helps fuel the passion in the next generation.

Clubs won't get anymore games played if you went back to the QF's so I see little or no advantage to the old system over the current one. It's not perfect but it's still better IMO.

Regardless of how they feel it's dead rubber and certainly not championship do or die football. It's irrelevant no matter how they dress it up. The u20 game should be the only game that matters to Cork this weekend.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:39:29 PM
I think the value of it is a matter of opinion and I certainly think that management will like the extra two weeks with the players and the additional game. However, that's not really important in the context of the discussion. Are the super 8's better, even if there are some dead rubbers, than the old QF knockout? For me they are and I suspect all managers and players would agree.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on August 02, 2019, 12:52:20 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:39:29 PM
I think the value of it is a matter of opinion and I certainly think that management will like the extra two weeks with the players and the additional game. However, that's not really important in the context of the discussion. Are the super 8's better, even if there are some dead rubbers, than the old QF knockout? For me they are and I suspect all managers and players would agree.

Yea it's a bullshit opinion coming from managers, players aren't stupid and pretty much know they are no consequences coming from defeat or victory. The logical thing would have been to not train let the the players back to their clubs and meet up again the morning of the match and give fringe players some game time. My opinion is that the players think it's complete and utter bullshit having to play the game.

As for your question I think the Super 8s are a joke, Cork had to beat Limerick & Laois to get there. Meath beat Offaly, Laois & Clare to get there. It's nothing to do with meritocracy, a lucky draw is all you need. What other competition on the planet has knock-out then league then knockout to decide it's winners. It's not about fairness, it's not about meritocracy it's about money and money only.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on August 02, 2019, 12:55:43 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:39:29 PM
I think the value of it is a matter of opinion and I certainly think that management will like the extra two weeks with the players and the additional game. However, that's not really important in the context of the discussion. Are the super 8's better, even if there are some dead rubbers, than the old QF knockout? For me they are and I suspect all managers and players would agree.

I think the system is better for sure, but it could be improved by moving the week break to after the 3rd game, befire semi finals, and also by moving the neutral games to provincial grounds.
Dead rubber games are an inevitable side effect of any sort of league system unfortunately.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on August 02, 2019, 12:56:33 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 02, 2019, 12:52:20 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:39:29 PM
I think the value of it is a matter of opinion and I certainly think that management will like the extra two weeks with the players and the additional game. However, that's not really important in the context of the discussion. Are the super 8's better, even if there are some dead rubbers, than the old QF knockout? For me they are and I suspect all managers and players would agree.

Yea it's a bullshit opinion coming from managers, players aren't stupid and pretty much know they are no consequences coming from defeat or victory. The logical thing would have been to not train let the the players back to their clubs and meet up again the morning of the match and give fringe players some game time. My opinion is that the players think it's complete and utter bullshit having to play the game.

As for your question I think the Super 8s are a joke, Cork had to beat Limerick & Laois to get there. Meath beat Offaly, Laois & Clare to get there. It's nothing to do with meritocracy, a lucky draw is all you need. What other competition on the planet has knock-out then league then knockout to decide it's winners. It's not about fairness, it's not about meritocracy it's about money and money only.

Champions league, Europa league to name two.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thewobbler on August 02, 2019, 01:02:57 PM
I don't like the Super 8s. If anything I despise the concept.

But show me any knockout competition played over several months, in any sport, that doesn't involve luck of the draw. Even when seedlings are used there is always a group of death. Of last year's CL semifinalists, 2 of those were third seeds, and 1 was a second seed. It's virtually impossible to recognise which teams are on the rise and which teams are on the fall, in a seeding system.

So comments like "Cork only had to beat Limerick & Laois to get there" really don't help your argument at all. You might believe there is a perfectly balanced and fair knockout format out there. But if you do, you're  mistaken.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on August 02, 2019, 01:12:50 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:09:18 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on August 02, 2019, 12:57:06 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:49:57 PM
What's more, of those games, Cork/Tyrone and Mayo/Meath were more or less do or die, lose and you couldn't make the All Ireland SF's. That's far better than what we had.
I think most would agree that Meath,Cork having dead rubbers to play after losing their do or die matches is not better than what we had.

Ronan McCarthy has already come out stating their game isn't a deadrubber as far as he's concerned. I'm certain the Meath management feel the same about Kerry coming to Navan in a game Kerry will want to win.

If you compare the old knockout QF format to the super 8's then the super 8's would be the preferred option of most I'd say.

Managers and players want more games and less training so it's the super 8's

Administrators want more revenue and a higher profile for the game so it's the super 8's

County boards like the home game element as do local businesses and getting rid of the Croke Park game will spread that business wider.

Fans get more games, more oppportunities to get kids to games which is what helps fuel the passion in the next generation.

Clubs won't get anymore games played if you went back to the QF's so I see little or no advantage to the old system over the current one. It's not perfect but it's still better IMO.

Ah come on now Zulu what do you expect a manager to say about these games? Leaving counties to hang on after they can't progress is not better no matter way you try to dress it up.  The players i'm sure would prefer to be back with their clubs than playing those dead rubber games this weekend.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on August 02, 2019, 01:27:50 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 02, 2019, 12:52:20 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:39:29 PM
I think the value of it is a matter of opinion and I certainly think that management will like the extra two weeks with the players and the additional game. However, that's not really important in the context of the discussion. Are the super 8's better, even if there are some dead rubbers, than the old QF knockout? For me they are and I suspect all managers and players would agree.

Yea it's a bullshit opinion coming from managers, players aren't stupid and pretty much know they are no consequences coming from defeat or victory. The logical thing would have been to not train let the the players back to their clubs and meet up again the morning of the match and give fringe players some game time. My opinion is that the players think it's complete and utter bullshit having to play the game.

As for your question I think the Super 8s are a joke, Cork had to beat Limerick & Laois to get there. Meath beat Offaly, Laois & Clare to get there. It's nothing to do with meritocracy, a lucky draw is all you need. What other competition on the planet has knock-out then league then knockout to decide it's winners. It's not about fairness, it's not about meritocracy it's about money and money only.

But sure under the old format Cork could still have got that easy draw and been in the quarter finals (and there was less complaints then). In that scenario they could potentially catch a provincial champion coming of the back of a 4 week break and be in a semi final after 1 decent game. At least this way they'd have to get through a potentially tough group.

I do think there should be an option to call of games in the last round if they mean nothing. But at the same time I think the people complaining about these matches are only looking a reason to complain about the format. If the match has nothing to do with you its pretty easy to ignore.

Last year I thought Kildare gave a good account of themselves in Kerry and looked to take it pretty serious and they had nothing to play for. That goes against some of the arguments above.

You might have less actual knockout games in the super 8 games but there is a lot more meaningful games. I'd classify all these games as being very important in this years series:

Tyrone v Roscommon
Tyrone v Cork
Donegal v Meath
Kerry v Mayo
Donegal v Kerry
Mayo v Meath
Donegal v Mayo
Meath v Kerry (albeit only for Kerry who need a big win to get top and probably avoid the Dubs)

All the games already were competitive for a large period of the match with the exception of Kerry v Mayo which was still a great occasion. In the old system you often had one decent quarter final and 3 hammerings. There was also years with double headers and crowds of under 30,000. The other big benefit of the new system has been bringing games around the country with benefits for towns and good atmospheres.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on August 02, 2019, 01:48:13 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on August 02, 2019, 01:27:50 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 02, 2019, 12:52:20 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:39:29 PM
I think the value of it is a matter of opinion and I certainly think that management will like the extra two weeks with the players and the additional game. However, that's not really important in the context of the discussion. Are the super 8's better, even if there are some dead rubbers, than the old QF knockout? For me they are and I suspect all managers and players would agree.

Yea it's a bullshit opinion coming from managers, players aren't stupid and pretty much know they are no consequences coming from defeat or victory. The logical thing would have been to not train let the the players back to their clubs and meet up again the morning of the match and give fringe players some game time. My opinion is that the players think it's complete and utter bullshit having to play the game.

As for your question I think the Super 8s are a joke, Cork had to beat Limerick & Laois to get there. Meath beat Offaly, Laois & Clare to get there. It's nothing to do with meritocracy, a lucky draw is all you need. What other competition on the planet has knock-out then league then knockout to decide it's winners. It's not about fairness, it's not about meritocracy it's about money and money only.

But sure under the old format Cork could still have got that easy draw and been in the quarter finals (and there was less complaints then). In that scenario they could potentially catch a provincial champion coming of the back of a 4 week break and be in a semi final after 1 decent game. At least this way they'd have to get through a potentially tough group.

I do think there should be an option to call of games in the last round if they mean nothing. But at the same time I think the people complaining about these matches are only looking a reason to complain about the format. If the match has nothing to do with you its pretty easy to ignore.

Last year I thought Kildare gave a good account of themselves in Kerry and looked to take it pretty serious and they had nothing to play for. That goes against some of the arguments above.

You might have less actual knockout games in the super 8 games but there is a lot more meaningful games. I'd classify all these games as being very important in this years series:

Tyrone v Roscommon
Tyrone v Cork
Donegal v Meath
Kerry v Mayo
Donegal v Kerry
Mayo v Meath
Donegal v Mayo
Meath v Kerry (albeit only for Kerry who need a big win to get top and probably avoid the Dubs)

All the games already were competitive for a large period of the match with the exception of Kerry v Mayo which was still a great occasion. In the old system you often had one decent quarter final and 3 hammerings. There was also years with double headers and crowds of under 30,000. The other big benefit of the new system has been bringing games around the country with benefits for towns and good atmospheres.

Losing by 12 points in conceding 3-25 is giving a good account of oneself now? and that was Kerry's only win in the group last year.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Redhand Santa on August 02, 2019, 02:10:11 PM
Kildare were well on top in the first half but did fade away badly to be fair. It was a smaller defeat than one suffered in the quarter finals a few years ago.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 02:30:31 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 02, 2019, 12:52:20 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:39:29 PM
I think the value of it is a matter of opinion and I certainly think that management will like the extra two weeks with the players and the additional game. However, that's not really important in the context of the discussion. Are the super 8's better, even if there are some dead rubbers, than the old QF knockout? For me they are and I suspect all managers and players would agree.

Yea it's a bullshit opinion coming from managers, players aren't stupid and pretty much know they are no consequences coming from defeat or victory. The logical thing would have been to not train let the the players back to their clubs and meet up again the morning of the match and give fringe players some game time. My opinion is that the players think it's complete and utter bullshit having to play the game.

As for your question I think the Super 8s are a joke, Cork had to beat Limerick & Laois to get there. Meath beat Offaly, Laois & Clare to get there. It's nothing to do with meritocracy, a lucky draw is all you need. What other competition on the planet has knock-out then league then knockout to decide it's winners. It's not about fairness, it's not about meritocracy it's about money and money only.

I'd disagree with that. At county level the extra time with the players and the extra game is valuable. Besides, there's only one game this weekend that won't impact the SF situation so while we could around in circles on the Cork/Roscommon game none of the rest are pointless.

People saying it's only about money won't make it anymore true. It isn't and was never only about money though I'm sure the GAA appreciate it and so should any member of the GAA.

The season is like this because people wanted more games but retain the provincials. As for luck of the draw sure that's still there in the QF set up. The discussion isn't whether the super 8's are the best system the discussion is whether they are better than the only alternative we've been offered and, IMO, they are miles better.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 02:33:37 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on August 02, 2019, 01:12:50 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:09:18 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on August 02, 2019, 12:57:06 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:49:57 PM
What's more, of those games, Cork/Tyrone and Mayo/Meath were more or less do or die, lose and you couldn't make the All Ireland SF's. That's far better than what we had.
I think most would agree that Meath,Cork having dead rubbers to play after losing their do or die matches is not better than what we had.

Ronan McCarthy has already come out stating their game isn't a deadrubber as far as he's concerned. I'm certain the Meath management feel the same about Kerry coming to Navan in a game Kerry will want to win.

If you compare the old knockout QF format to the super 8's then the super 8's would be the preferred option of most I'd say.

Managers and players want more games and less training so it's the super 8's

Administrators want more revenue and a higher profile for the game so it's the super 8's

County boards like the home game element as do local businesses and getting rid of the Croke Park game will spread that business wider.

Fans get more games, more oppportunities to get kids to games which is what helps fuel the passion in the next generation.

Clubs won't get anymore games played if you went back to the QF's so I see little or no advantage to the old system over the current one. It's not perfect but it's still better IMO.

Ah come on now Zulu what do you expect a manager to say about these games? Leaving counties to hang on after they can't progress is not better no matter way you try to dress it up.  The players i'm sure would prefer to be back with their clubs than playing those dead rubber games this weekend.

Again, I can accept you could be right but I don't accept it's better to go back to the knockout QF's to avoid 1 game out of all the games played in the super 8's being pointless. Basically, there are far more good things about the super 8's than bad when the only other thing on the table is the knockout QF.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on August 02, 2019, 02:58:33 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 02:33:37 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on August 02, 2019, 01:12:50 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:09:18 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on August 02, 2019, 12:57:06 AM
Quote from: Zulu on August 01, 2019, 11:49:57 PM
What's more, of those games, Cork/Tyrone and Mayo/Meath were more or less do or die, lose and you couldn't make the All Ireland SF's. That's far better than what we had.
I think most would agree that Meath,Cork having dead rubbers to play after losing their do or die matches is not better than what we had.

Ronan McCarthy has already come out stating their game isn't a deadrubber as far as he's concerned. I'm certain the Meath management feel the same about Kerry coming to Navan in a game Kerry will want to win.

If you compare the old knockout QF format to the super 8's then the super 8's would be the preferred option of most I'd say.

Managers and players want more games and less training so it's the super 8's

Administrators want more revenue and a higher profile for the game so it's the super 8's

County boards like the home game element as do local businesses and getting rid of the Croke Park game will spread that business wider.

Fans get more games, more oppportunities to get kids to games which is what helps fuel the passion in the next generation.

Clubs won't get anymore games played if you went back to the QF's so I see little or no advantage to the old system over the current one. It's not perfect but it's still better IMO.

Ah come on now Zulu what do you expect a manager to say about these games? Leaving counties to hang on after they can't progress is not better no matter way you try to dress it up.  The players i'm sure would prefer to be back with their clubs than playing those dead rubber games this weekend.

Again, I can accept you could be right but I don't accept it's better to go back to the knockout QF's to avoid 1 game out of all the games played in the super 8's being pointless. Basically, there are far more good things about the super 8's than bad when the only other thing on the table is the knockout QF.

Out of the 4 games this weekend we have one really important game that has a big interest for all and the reason for that importance is because it's old fashion knock out game.

If as you say players want more games then fine and have a group system for the qualifiers or provincial championship.

The last eight of any competition should be knock out and if needs be the provincial winners gets home advantage. Round 4 qualifier winners should get at least a two week break before playing a quarter final and a similar break to AI semi finals but we can't expect common sense to part of our championship nowadays can we?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 03:07:04 PM
While that's true this year if Cork had beaten Tyrone then we'd have Tyrone at home against the Dubs having to win while Cork would have Roscommon at home having to win. Tyrone against Dublin in Omagh in a must win game would be a massive occasion. The super 8's can deliver more than they have so far and that's with a number of very good and one great game played already. That's good for the sport.

You can't have group games in the provincial championships IMO as they are uneven and I see little point in Leitrim, Waterford, Limerick, Wicklow, Antrim having to play, and lose, numerous games to get knocked out a championship. Perhaps groups could be used instead of qualifiers but map that out. No point saying what we have is no good unless you've something better. The qualifiers and knockout QF's isn't better IMO.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on August 02, 2019, 04:26:33 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on August 02, 2019, 12:56:33 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 02, 2019, 12:52:20 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 12:39:29 PM
I think the value of it is a matter of opinion and I certainly think that management will like the extra two weeks with the players and the additional game. However, that's not really important in the context of the discussion. Are the super 8's better, even if there are some dead rubbers, than the old QF knockout? For me they are and I suspect all managers and players would agree.

Yea it's a bullshit opinion coming from managers, players aren't stupid and pretty much know they are no consequences coming from defeat or victory. The logical thing would have been to not train let the the players back to their clubs and meet up again the morning of the match and give fringe players some game time. My opinion is that the players think it's complete and utter bullshit having to play the game.

As for your question I think the Super 8s are a joke, Cork had to beat Limerick & Laois to get there. Meath beat Offaly, Laois & Clare to get there. It's nothing to do with meritocracy, a lucky draw is all you need. What other competition on the planet has knock-out then league then knockout to decide it's winners. It's not about fairness, it's not about meritocracy it's about money and money only.

Champions league, Europa league to name two.

Teams get seeded straight into the group stage do they not? So a different format. Any other competition?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 02, 2019, 04:48:55 PM
Three  tweaks needed for next year
1- Phase 2 to have the 2 winners the first day play each other and the 2 losers likewise. It would help with the dead rubber problem.
2- No more 2 away games/Dublin 2 home games. Change the Rule from Croke Park round to " Suitable venue in a Neutral County".
3-  Break between Quarters and Semi Finals. Mad having a Semi Dinal 6 days after a Quarter Final game.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 05:08:33 PM
I think they are good tweaks Rossfan.

For me, it's simple. Are the super 8's the best realistic format we have? We can post various formats here all we like but they aren't being considered so if the super 8's are scrapped after next year and we return to the qualifiers and knockout QF's will we have a better format? For me, we wouldn't.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 02, 2019, 05:34:21 PM
Jury's still out for me.
However " my tweaks" would give it another chance to convince
My gut instinct is a Round Robin should be for everyone and then the best teams contest the knock out stages with every team having got 3 chances to prove their worthiness.

If and that's a big the Tier 2 comes in and another big IF it works then there might be scope for a Top 16 in 4 Groups of 4 each headed by a Provincial Champion.....
Sin scéal eile.....
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 02, 2019, 05:44:09 PM
Well that's it. There are certainly better formats IMO but we can only deal with the options in front of us. I wouldn't favour getting rid of the super 8's to go back to the old format.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on August 02, 2019, 06:06:09 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on August 02, 2019, 02:10:11 PM
Kildare were well on top in the first half but did fade away badly to be fair. It was a smaller defeat than one suffered in the quarter finals a few years ago.

Kildare had a mathematical chance of qualifying. A ridiculous red card followed by another ridiculous black from a referee responding to the baying animals did for us in the end.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: kerryforsam19 on August 02, 2019, 06:20:01 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 02, 2019, 06:06:09 PM
Quote from: Redhand Santa on August 02, 2019, 02:10:11 PM
Kildare were well on top in the first half but did fade away badly to be fair. It was a smaller defeat than one suffered in the quarter finals a few years ago.

Kildare had a mathematical chance of qualifying. A ridiculous red card followed by another ridiculous black from a referee responding to the baying animals did for us in the end.

The black card was harsh but Neil Flynn deserved to get the line.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on August 02, 2019, 11:35:52 PM
Tyrone naming a B team for Sunday. Super 8s meh!.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: GalwayBayBoy on August 03, 2019, 12:43:33 AM
Any system that leads to pre season sides being named in August is not long for this world.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: themac_23 on August 03, 2019, 02:54:28 PM
the tyrone team thats been named for tomorrow is enough reason to bin the super 8s, championship is about winning not fulfilling fixtures, its the business time of the season
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on August 03, 2019, 04:16:38 PM
The Super 8's were never 'super' to begin with. Despite the best attempts to hype these league games up by of a whole host of media pundits who rely on more games for more work, the public have become totally disengaged by them. When ultra establishment man Dick Clerkin steadfastly defends them he is really defending his own interests. More games = more work for these pundits. The public are not fools though. They are flat, often predictable and boring. The best weekend of the year used to be the quarter finals over the August bank holiday with real cut and thrust games.

The inter county game is no longer of any great interest to a lot of good club people and I can only see this getting worse as the bean counters in HQ appear to measure success by the amount of revenue generated. 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: ardtole on August 03, 2019, 05:59:51 PM
Very hard to disagree with any of that yellow card
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on August 03, 2019, 06:07:28 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on August 03, 2019, 04:16:38 PM
The Super 8's were never 'super' to begin with. Despite the best attempts to hype these league games up by of a whole host of media pundits who rely on more games for more work, the public have become totally disengaged by them. When ultra establishment man Dick Clerkin steadfastly defends them he is really defending his own interests. More games = more work for these pundits. The public are not fools though. They are flat, often predictable and boring. The best weekend of the year used to be the quarter finals over the August bank holiday with real cut and thrust games.

The inter county game is no longer of any great interest to a lot of good club people and I can only see this getting worse as the bean counters in HQ appear to measure success by the amount of revenue generated.

Hard to disagree with any of that.

The qualifiers diluted the knockout nature of c'ship football, and the Super 8 has diluted it further. Yes, you might get the odd good game like Kerry Donegal, but all it is, is a cynical money-spinning exercise. Fans, players, managers, club players and managers don't matter here - it's all about money.

But the GAA will not get rid of their summer cash cow. It's here to stay.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 03, 2019, 06:15:07 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on August 03, 2019, 06:07:28 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on August 03, 2019, 04:16:38 PM
The Super 8's were never 'super' to begin with. Despite the best attempts to hype these league games up by of a whole host of media pundits who rely on more games for more work, the public have become totally disengaged by them. When ultra establishment man Dick Clerkin steadfastly defends them he is really defending his own interests. More games = more work for these pundits. The public are not fools though. They are flat, often predictable and boring. The best weekend of the year used to be the quarter finals over the August bank holiday with real cut and thrust games.

The inter county game is no longer of any great interest to a lot of good club people and I can only see this getting worse as the bean counters in HQ appear to measure success by the amount of revenue generated.

Hard to disagree with any of that.

The qualifiers diluted the knockout nature of c'ship football, and the Super 8 has diluted it further. Yes, you might get the odd good game like Kerry Donegal, but all it is, is a cynical money-spinning exercise. Fans, players, managers, club players and managers don't matter here - it's all about money.

But the GAA will not get rid of their summer cash cow. It's here to stay.

What a load of nonsense in fairness. Managers, players and fans don't want more games? Has the super 8's negatively impacted upon club players or managers. According to some posters here there are loads of league games going on in counties. You're an odd bunch to be complaining about more games.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 06:15:36 PM
Meath 0-05
Kerry 0-05

15 mins
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 06:17:11 PM
Meath 0-05
Kerry 1-05

Goal Kerry
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 06:24:21 PM
Meath 1-06
Kerry 1-05

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 06:27:02 PM
Meath 1-06
Kerry 1-07
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 06:30:30 PM
Meath 1-07
Kerry 1-07
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 06:31:45 PM
Meath 1-07
Kerry 1-08
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 06:37:20 PM
Meath 1-07
Kerry 1-10

35mins
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 06:37:59 PM
Meath 1-08
Kerry 1-10
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 06:38:25 PM
Meath 1-09
Kerry 1-10
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 06:39:43 PM
Meath 1-09
Kerry 1-10

Half time
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 03, 2019, 06:51:01 PM
C'mon the Royals :o
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 06:58:03 PM
Meath 1-10
Kerry 1-10
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 07:09:20 PM
Meath 1-11
Kerry 2-10
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 07:16:43 PM
Meath 1-11
Kerry 2-12
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 07:19:58 PM
Meath 1-12
Kerry 2-12
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 07:22:51 PM
Meath 1-12
Kerry 2-13
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 07:30:36 PM
Meath 1-13
Kerry 2-15
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 07:34:00 PM
Meath 1-13
Kerry 2-17
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 07:34:48 PM
We've stalled again with 10 to 15 minutes to go. No bench
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: BennyCake on August 03, 2019, 07:43:00 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 03, 2019, 06:15:07 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on August 03, 2019, 06:07:28 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on August 03, 2019, 04:16:38 PM
The Super 8's were never 'super' to begin with. Despite the best attempts to hype these league games up by of a whole host of media pundits who rely on more games for more work, the public have become totally disengaged by them. When ultra establishment man Dick Clerkin steadfastly defends them he is really defending his own interests. More games = more work for these pundits. The public are not fools though. They are flat, often predictable and boring. The best weekend of the year used to be the quarter finals over the August bank holiday with real cut and thrust games.

The inter county game is no longer of any great interest to a lot of good club people and I can only see this getting worse as the bean counters in HQ appear to measure success by the amount of revenue generated.

Hard to disagree with any of that.

The qualifiers diluted the knockout nature of c'ship football, and the Super 8 has diluted it further. Yes, you might get the odd good game like Kerry Donegal, but all it is, is a cynical money-spinning exercise. Fans, players, managers, club players and managers don't matter here - it's all about money.

But the GAA will not get rid of their summer cash cow. It's here to stay.

What a load of nonsense in fairness. Managers, players and fans don't want more games? Has the super 8's negatively impacted upon club players or managers. According to some posters here there are loads of league games going on in counties. You're an odd bunch to be complaining about more games.

Not unless you have a massive squad. Teams going week in, week out. Prolonging the club c'ships. More expenses week on week for fans.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 07:51:29 PM
Once we figure a way of maintaining that intensity for another 10 to 15 minutes we'll be there or thereabouts but that requires a stronger bench, a kicking game and more intelligent use of the ball.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Zulu on August 03, 2019, 08:02:51 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on August 03, 2019, 07:43:00 PM
Quote from: Zulu on August 03, 2019, 06:15:07 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on August 03, 2019, 06:07:28 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on August 03, 2019, 04:16:38 PM
The Super 8's were never 'super' to begin with. Despite the best attempts to hype these league games up by of a whole host of media pundits who rely on more games for more work, the public have become totally disengaged by them. When ultra establishment man Dick Clerkin steadfastly defends them he is really defending his own interests. More games = more work for these pundits. The public are not fools though. They are flat, often predictable and boring. The best weekend of the year used to be the quarter finals over the August bank holiday with real cut and thrust games.

The inter county game is no longer of any great interest to a lot of good club people and I can only see this getting worse as the bean counters in HQ appear to measure success by the amount of revenue generated.

Hard to disagree with any of that.

The qualifiers diluted the knockout nature of c'ship football, and the Super 8 has diluted it further. Yes, you might get the odd good game like Kerry Donegal, but all it is, is a cynical money-spinning exercise. Fans, players, managers, club players and managers don't matter here - it's all about money.

But the GAA will not get rid of their summer cash cow. It's here to stay.

What a load of nonsense in fairness. Managers, players and fans don't want more games? Has the super 8's negatively impacted upon club players or managers. According to some posters here there are loads of league games going on in counties. You're an odd bunch to be complaining about more games.

Not unless you have a massive squad. Teams going week in, week out. Prolonging the club c'ships. More expenses week on week for fans.

Ah here. There's not a manager or player in Ireland that would pick knockout QF's over the super 8's I'd say. They all want more games, big occasions and less training. The super 8's are far from perfect but they are way better than the QF's.

As for fans, all the games Mayo are playing is sowing the seeds for the next generation of footballers. When I see the amount of kids at all their games roaring on their heroes it can only inspire them to greater heights. Do GAA fans spend more money following their team than soccer, NFL, Aussie rules fans? You can always choose to watch some games on TV.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on August 03, 2019, 08:45:29 PM
Quote from: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 07:34:48 PM
We've stalled again with 10 to 15 minutes to go. No bench

Be interesting to see how Meath now fare in Div 1 as fitness and conditioning doesn't decide games in the manner they do during the championship.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 03, 2019, 08:52:34 PM
I'd suspect like us in 2016 they'll burst themselves to stay in it.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on August 03, 2019, 09:01:22 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 03, 2019, 08:52:34 PM
I'd suspect like us in 2016 they'll burst themselves to stay in it.

Pretty much this but they are a level below Roscommon, in and around Cavan/Kildare's level. Will be surprised if they win a game, don't have Division one standard forwards.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 09:20:43 PM
Yeah it'll need a few more players of a top quality to stay up as well as few other improvements. I just wonder if a huge effort to stay in div 1 works against us in the summer.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: twohands!!! on August 03, 2019, 10:07:49 PM
Quote from: thejuice on August 03, 2019, 09:20:43 PM
Yeah it'll need a few more players of a top quality to stay up as well as few other improvements. I just wonder if a huge effort to stay in div 1 works against us in the summer.

A fair bit depends on what way the Leinster Championship draw shakes out for Meath - would be a massive help to them next season if they could get a favourable Leinster Championship draw after their first Division 1 campaign in a long-while.
Assuming their is no change to the Leinster championship, they will be entering the Leinster championship at the quarter-final stage and will avoid the preliminary round as one of the 4 semi-finalists this year along with Dublin, Kildare, Laois.
Carlow, Longford, Louth, Offaly, Westmeath, Wexford, Wicklow are the 7 teams they can face in the quarter-final.
Even if things go wrong for them in the league and they get relegated, knowing that they will be playing one of those 7 to start of their championship isn't exactly the worst scenario.
They have a 1 in 3 chance of being on the same side as Dublin which would mean playing them in a Leinster semi-final as opposed to a Leinster final.

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: manfromdelmonte on August 04, 2019, 09:53:04 AM
It's scandalous that rte are showing the Dublin game on two different channels
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: rodney trotter on August 04, 2019, 10:27:14 AM
It was of no benefit Donegal winning Ulster when it came down to a winner takes all game in  Super 8s in McHalr Park. Mayo lost 2 games in championship  but a home game to reach an All Ireland Semi.
Deserving winner, s but maybe the Provincial champions should have 2 home games in Super 8 instead..
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Milltown Row2 on August 04, 2019, 11:40:37 AM
I know it's s dead rubber game but no chat on the Cork v Roscommon game?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: LilySavage on August 04, 2019, 12:04:07 PM
Was big advantage to whoever got Meath away in a group with 3 evenly matched big teams. 2 home games for Provincial winner better thsn current system, the Dubs already getting that.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on August 04, 2019, 12:07:05 PM
Quote from: rodney trotter on August 04, 2019, 10:27:14 AM
It was of no benefit Donegal winning Ulster when it came down to a winner takes all game in  Super 8s in McHalr Park. Mayo lost 2 games in championship  but a home game to reach an All Ireland Semi.
Deserving winner, s but maybe the Provincial champions should have 2 home games in Super 8 instead..

Nooooooo!!!!!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: J70 on August 04, 2019, 12:08:40 PM
Quote from: rodney trotter on August 04, 2019, 10:27:14 AM
It was of no benefit Donegal winning Ulster when it came down to a winner takes all game in  Super 8s in McHalr Park. Mayo lost 2 games in championship  but a home game to reach an All Ireland Semi.
Deserving winner, s but maybe the Provincial champions should have 2 home games in Super 8 instead..

One of them currently does...
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 04, 2019, 12:22:29 PM
And one had 2 away games >:(
Today's game in Cirk will be lucky to get 1500 people and will likely be of Chalkenge intensity.
I'm on the way anyway so let's try and win the feckin thing.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on August 04, 2019, 12:42:58 PM
I am not a fan of the Super 8s but I am a fan of fairness so given any more advantages to the winners of the already unbalanced provincial championships is just wrong.

1. 2 week break from last round of qualifiers to start of Super 8s.
2. Play the Super 8 games 3 weeks on the trot
3. Winners of round 1 play each other in round 2, neutral venue. Ensures at least 3 teams per group have something to play for last round.
4. Have 1 venue set aside for neutral round Sat/Sun - Limerick or Cork. A festival of football both cities would embrace it. 8 counties 1 game.
5. 2 week break to semi-finals
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: RedHand88 on August 04, 2019, 12:53:25 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 04, 2019, 12:42:58 PM
I am not a fan of the Super 8s but I am a fan of fairness so given any more advantages to the winners of the already unbalanced provincial championships is just wrong.

1. 2 week break from last round of qualifiers to start of Super 8s.
2. Play the Super 8 games 3 weeks on the trot
3. Winners of round 1 play each other in round 2, neutral venue. Ensures at least 3 teams per group have something to play for last round.
4. Have 1 venue set aside for neutral round Sat/Sun - Limerick or Cork. A festival of football both cities would embrace it. 8 counties 1 game.
5. 2 week break to semi-finals

What if theres a draw?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Dinny Breen on August 04, 2019, 12:58:52 PM
Good point, a toss of a coin but the premise still stands, draws are good for ensuring no dead rubbers.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Cunny Funt on August 04, 2019, 01:35:36 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 04, 2019, 12:42:58 PM
I am not a fan of the Super 8s but I am a fan of fairness so given any more advantages to the winners of the already unbalanced provincial championships is just wrong.

1. 2 week break from last round of qualifiers to start of Super 8s.
2. Play the Super 8 games 3 weeks on the trot
3. Winners of round 1 play each other in round 2, neutral venue. Ensures at least 3 teams per group have something to play for last round.
4. Have 1 venue set aside for neutral round Sat/Sun - Limerick or Cork. A festival of football both cities would embrace it. 8 counties 1 game.
5. 2 week break to semi-finals

I don't think that would suit the likes Meath,Roscommon,Kildare,Cavan etc as to play that amount of high intensity championship games in a short shape of time requires serious conditioning. 
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: 6th sam on August 04, 2019, 01:55:32 PM
Haven't looked back on this thread but this may already have been suggested.
Last 8 play in prelimary qfinal, neutral equidistant venue.4 winners play each other in qfinals , winners of that through to semis. 4 prelim qf losers play each other , 2 winners play the 2 qf  losers to qualify for semis.
This system works really well in Down championship .
It would mean 2 less games overall compared to super 8 but no dead rubbers at all. 4 teams will get at least 3 games and 4 teams get at least 2 games. Lose 2 games , and you're out and back to clubs rather than wait 2 weeks on a dead rubber ( eg cork Roscommon Meath ) no shadow boxing games such as Tyrone Dublin today.
Every team gets a second chance, but nobody gets a third chance , two losses and you're out. Games must be played to a finish.
No games in Croke park
Until semis.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Armagh18 on August 04, 2019, 03:45:20 PM
No harm to ya Joe but Roscommon and definitely Cork could have beaten Tyrone this year!
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Armagh18 on August 04, 2019, 03:49:53 PM
Quote from: hardstation on August 04, 2019, 03:48:19 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on August 04, 2019, 03:45:20 PM
No harm to ya Joe but Roscommon and definitely Cork could have beaten Tyrone this year!
Very unlikely.
Cork threw it away and the Rossies missed goal chances too.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: tippabu on August 04, 2019, 05:29:44 PM
Should we change the thread title to "the meh 8s"?

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on August 04, 2019, 06:21:14 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on August 04, 2019, 03:45:20 PM
No harm to ya Joe but Roscommon and definitely Cork could have beaten Tyrone this year!
Wasn't watching but don't tell me Joe Brolly said some daft once again?
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Blowitupref on August 04, 2019, 08:18:09 PM
Quote from: hardstation on August 04, 2019, 06:44:17 PM
Quote from: Blowitupref on August 04, 2019, 06:21:14 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on August 04, 2019, 03:45:20 PM
No harm to ya Joe but Roscommon and definitely Cork could have beaten Tyrone this year!
Wasn't watching but don't tell me Joe Brolly said some daft once again?
He didn't. He said it was obvious that Tyrone & Dublin would come out of the group. It was.

Last years two AI finalists were clear favourties to get out of that group but it wasn't that obvious as Roscommon had Tyrone at home in round 1 and went into that game off the back of beating two Div 1 teams away.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: macdanger2 on August 04, 2019, 08:44:16 PM
Mayo 9/2 Dublin 1/5
Tyrone 6/4 kerry 8/11
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Farrandeelin on August 04, 2019, 09:36:00 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on August 04, 2019, 08:44:16 PM
Mayo 9/2 Dublin 1/5
Tyrone 6/4 kerry 8/11

Funny old game. Had Donegal beaten us, not a chance would Dublin be that price.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: yellowcard on August 04, 2019, 09:51:30 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on August 04, 2019, 08:44:16 PM
Mayo 9/2 Dublin 1/5
Tyrone 6/4 kerry 8/11

Thought the Tyrone game would be evens both sides, genuinely surprised that Kerry are such a short price.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: weareros on August 04, 2019, 10:54:40 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 04, 2019, 11:40:37 AM
I know it's s dead rubber game but no chat on the Cork v Roscommon game?

Glad to have made the trip to Páirc UI Rinn today, to thank lads for a great season and ended up getting a very enjoyable game, seven goals, in very poor playing conditions. Well done to both teams for going for it. While it was a dead rubber, still a shame that RTÉ did not show live for older folk who could not travel as it was still a qtr Final and have often seen them show challenge soccer and rugby games. Great little pitch and decent atmosphere. I think with likes of Ciaran and Ultan back and rising stars like Heneghan, I remain confident for future. Well done to Anthony and the lads. Beating Mayo and Galway on their own patches is always a great year. Only last years finalists beat us. #3. Onwards.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Captain Obvious on August 04, 2019, 11:05:38 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on August 04, 2019, 08:44:16 PM
Mayo 9/2 Dublin 1/5
Tyrone 6/4 kerry 8/11

Very tempting odds on Tyrone. Kerry's loose marking defence could be exploited by Tyrone.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 05, 2019, 03:03:40 AM
Quote from: weareros on August 04, 2019, 10:54:40 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 04, 2019, 11:40:37 AM
I know it's s dead rubber game but no chat on the Cork v Roscommon game?

Glad to have made the trip to Páirc UI Rinn today, to thank lads for a great season and ended up getting a very enjoyable game, seven goals, in very poor playing conditions. Well done to both teams for going for it. While it was a dead rubber, still a shame that RTÉ did not show live for older folk who could not travel as it was still a qtr Final and have often seen them show challenge soccer and rugby games. Great little pitch and decent atmosphere. I think with likes of Ciaran and Ultan back and rising stars like Heneghan, I remain confident for future. Well done to Anthony and the lads. Beating Mayo and Galway on their own patches is always a great year. Only last years finalists beat us. #3. Onwards.
Glad I too like 7 or 800 more made the trip
Met some lovely Cork folks too who were appreciative of us making such a long trip.
We mixed the bad, the ridiculous, the good, the ugly and the magnificent at various stage on a horrible day for football.
We got there in the end and the win topped off a good season for us even though we still failed to reach the Tyrone/ Dublin status.
Hope the folks staying over in Cork enjoyed the night and hope the players enjoy the well earned break in the Sun.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: giveballaghback on August 05, 2019, 12:09:42 PM
I was delighted to make the trip to Cork in appreciation of the teams achievements this year. It was a good competitive game played in horrible conditions. Ros missed Mullooly badly and may have prevented both those Cork fisted goals if he was playing.
That said Cork were 1-2 up before a roscommon outfield player kicked the ball but we settled down well and played some brilliant football at times.
The super 8 set up as it stands is not working. Donegal who lost no game lose to Mayo who lost 2 games and Mayo get the semi spot. This also happened when the knockout quarter finals were the thing. It has to be changed and there has to be a reward for winning the province. So what about the following suggestion.
The 4 provincial champions in group 1 and the 4 qualifiers in group 2.
The top 2 teams in group 1 qualify for the semi- finals, the bottom 2 teams in group 1 play the top 2 teams in group 2 for the other 2 semi spots. Dont shoot the messenger.
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: seafoid on August 05, 2019, 12:15:41 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 05, 2019, 03:03:40 AM
Quote from: weareros on August 04, 2019, 10:54:40 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 04, 2019, 11:40:37 AM
I know it's s dead rubber game but no chat on the Cork v Roscommon game?

Glad to have made the trip to Páirc UI Rinn today, to thank lads for a great season and ended up getting a very enjoyable game, seven goals, in very poor playing conditions. Well done to both teams for going for it. While it was a dead rubber, still a shame that RTÉ did not show live for older folk who could not travel as it was still a qtr Final and have often seen them show challenge soccer and rugby games. Great little pitch and decent atmosphere. I think with likes of Ciaran and Ultan back and rising stars like Heneghan, I remain confident for future. Well done to Anthony and the lads. Beating Mayo and Galway on their own patches is always a great year. Only last years finalists beat us. #3. Onwards.

Glad I toi like 7 or 800 more made the trip
Met some lovely Cork folks too who were appreciative of us making such a long trip.
We mixed the bad, the ridiculous, the good, the ugly and the magnificent at various stage on a horrible day for football.
We got there in the end and the win topped off a good season for us even though we still failed to reach the Tyrone/ Dublin status.
Hope the folks staying over in Cork enjoyed the night and hope the players enjoy the well earned break in the Sun.

Great to see Ros ending on a high
Cunningham has done a decent job this year
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: 6th sam on August 05, 2019, 01:42:36 PM
Quote from: giveballaghback on August 05, 2019, 12:09:42 PM
I was delighted to make the trip to Cork in appreciation of the teams achievements this year. It was a good competitive game played in horrible conditions. Ros missed Mullooly badly and may have prevented both those Cork fisted goals if he was playing.
That said Cork were 1-2 up before a roscommon outfield player kicked the ball but we settled down well and played some brilliant football at times.
The super 8 set up as it stands is not working. Donegal who lost no game lose to Mayo who lost 2 games and Mayo get the semi spot. This also happened when the knockout quarter finals were the thing. It has to be changed and there has to be a reward for winning the province. So what about the following suggestion.
The 4 provincial champions in group 1 and the 4 qualifiers in group 2.
The top 2 teams in group 1 qualify for the semi- finals, the bottom 2 teams in group 1 play the top 2 teams in group 2 for the other 2 semi spots. Dont shoot the messenger.
Fair suggestion but would mean an extra week of games, still chance of shadow boxing/dead rubber games, and unfairness of score difference comes in, a team could theoretically lose 4 games in a season and still end up in a prelimary all ireland semi.

The suggestion I made though not perfect , works well in Down championship and there are no dead rubbers, no score difference and  every game has meAning. Anyone getting to the last 8 will have only lost a maximum of 1 game, they Are only allowed 1 further slip up in last 8.

To clarify:
Round 1: 8 teams playoff.
Round 2:4 winners play off in a winners group, 4 losers playoff in a losers group eliminating 2 teams
Round 3:2 winners in winners group Are rewarded with a rest, 2 losers in winners group playoff against the two teams who have won their losers group matches, losers in those matches eliminated
Week 4: Round 2 winners play round 3 winners.

All but 2 teams get at least 3 games, every game is meaningful , score difference doesn't apply

Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: Rossfan on August 05, 2019, 02:34:48 PM
That was the system in the Christy Ring for a few years.
One thing it does is eliminate dead rubbers.
I expect they will give the Round Robin QFs their 3rd year as planned though with some tweaks.
Unless of course this Review Committee comes up with some radical new proposal which catches everyone's imaginations...
Title: Re: Super 8s
Post by: 6th sam on August 05, 2019, 05:02:58 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on August 05, 2019, 02:34:48 PM
That was the system in the Christy Ring for a few years.
One thing it does is eliminate dead rubbers.
I expect they will give the Round Robin QFs their 3rd year as planned though with some tweaks.
Unless of course this Review Committee comes up with some radical new proposal which catches everyone's imaginations...
It's a simple system and would solve most of the problems we've had with super 8s. For the money men-The loss of 2 games overall will be counteracted by the fact that every game has meaning and should attract bigger crowds. The Cork Roscommon and Meath Kerry games this weekend were hardly money spinners and were probably run at an overall loss especially for competing counties. Croke park should not be involved until semi stage, keep it special for full houses only, and bring the super 8 games down the country neutral venues