Climate change

[J70]

Climate change is a fact.

Climates have always changed and will change.  That is a fact. The theory that current climate change is wholly or predominantly man-made and will have catastrophic results most certainly is not.

Meanwhile, I await an answer to my question.

So CO2 is NOT a greenhouse gas? Methane is NOT a greenhouse gas? Human activities are NOT pumping up the levels of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere? The climate is NOT undergoing a long term warming trend? Records are NOT being set every year now? The more extreme weather and rising seas are NOT having and will not have any effect on the natural or human world?

What specifically are you claiming?

[J70]

Is this the boul' Foxkkkommander back under another account??

Or Dolph, although I think he was also foxcommander.

[five points]

Is this the boul' Foxkkkommander back under another account??

Me? I've been here, posting reasonably consistently, since 2009.

[five points]

So CO2 is NOT a greenhouse gas? Methane is NOT a greenhouse gas? Human activities are NOT pumping up the levels of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere? The climate is NOT undergoing a long term warming trend? Records are NOT being set every year now? The more extreme weather and rising seas are NOT having and will not have any effect on the natural or human world?

What specifically are you claiming?

I'm claiming what I have said: that climates have always changed and will continue to change. For example we have had well-documented cooling and warming periods throughout history.

There is widespread but not universal suspicion that CO2, methane etc are greenhouse gases but their actual effects in what are complex to the point of chaotic climatic systems are still a matter of debate.

The theory of a long term warming trend is also a matter of debate. 40 years ago the scientists thought the earth was cooling. 40 years is a not even a nanosecond in terms of previous long term cooling and warming trends.

And there is a fair degree of selective bias in the "records being broken every year" stories. Not to mention the danger of apples-and-oranges comparisons between primitively-measured temps even a few decades ago and more accurately measured temps these days.

[trailer]

Or maybe you just don't think a 16 year old girl should speak truth to power - a position I find as repellent as climate change denial. We won't get a solution without a functioning global democratic system. Her stand renews faith in the power of free speech, protest and democracy on the ground. The tragedy is that a 16 year old girl is displaying more maturity than the majority of lawmakers in Western societies.

She's a troubled child with special needs. If you think that fronting a huge political campaign is a safe and appropriate activity for her, fair enough but I beg to differ.

This is simply not true.
Climate change is a global emergency that we all must work together to solve. We are literally facing a mass extinction.

[magpie seanie]

Or maybe you just don't think a 16 year old girl should speak truth to power - a position I find as repellent as climate change denial. We won't get a solution without a functioning global democratic system. Her stand renews faith in the power of free speech, protest and democracy on the ground. The tragedy is that a 16 year old girl is displaying more maturity than the majority of lawmakers in Western societies.

She's a troubled child with special needs. If you think that fronting a huge political campaign is a safe and appropriate activity for her, fair enough but I beg to differ.

Disgusting lies. It's clear you are looking to cause trouble.

[Gabriel_Hurl]

Is this the boul' Foxkkkommander back under another account??

Or Dolph, although I think he was also foxcommander.

Christ - I forgot about Dolph 

[five points]

She's a troubled child with special needs. If you think that fronting a huge political campaign is a safe and appropriate activity for her, fair enough but I beg to differ.

Disgusting lies. It's clear you are looking to cause trouble.

Not lies. Her diagnosis is well known. And I'm not looking to cause trouble.

[RadioGAAGAA]

I know a guy who works in the handling of aviation of fuel on planes frightfully dangerous stuff when you consider the pressure changes, movement of the fuel and the evaporation rate and the fact that one spark could be 300 corpses, and has a number of times.
Considering how volatile a relatively stable fuel like aviation fuel can become in a plane I would not like to be on a plane using something as unstable as hydrogen especially cryogenicaly which looks like the only feasible way to use it.
There would be so many deaths with this before they got it to an acceptable level that it would never get of the ground.... in a democracy at least .

No no no - a hydrogen fuelled plane would be much safer than kerosene. It is a misguided fallacy that hydrogen is more dangerous.

Consider this - hydrogen is lighter than air - so you crash land and one of your tanks starts to leak - where does that fuel go? Not on the ground where all the passengers are like kerosene, but quickly up into the air where it becomes so diffuse that its relatively safe from ignition.

There has been studies done on this and the conclusion was quite categorical - H2 is much safer than JetA!

[RadioGAAGAA]

Climates have always changed and will change.  That is a fact. The theory that current climate change is wholly or predominantly man-made and will have catastrophic results most certainly is not.

It is an accepted fact to everyone except those with mental faculties equal to flat-earth believers.

[BennyCake]

Climate change is a fact.

Climates have always changed and will change.  That is a fact. The theory that current climate change is wholly or predominantly man-made and will have catastrophic results most certainly is not.

Meanwhile, I await an answer to my question.

So CO2 is NOT a greenhouse gas? Methane is NOT a greenhouse gas? Human activities are NOT pumping up the levels of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere? The climate is NOT undergoing a long term warming trend? Records are NOT being set every year now? The more extreme weather and rising seas are NOT having and will not have any effect on the natural or human world?

What specifically are you claiming?

Any time there's a bit of a gale, heavy rain or an Indian summer, it's all lumped in with "climate change". Conveniently, the term moved from "global warming" to further push the agenda.

[J70]

So CO2 is NOT a greenhouse gas? Methane is NOT a greenhouse gas? Human activities are NOT pumping up the levels of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere? The climate is NOT undergoing a long term warming trend? Records are NOT being set every year now? The more extreme weather and rising seas are NOT having and will not have any effect on the natural or human world?

What specifically are you claiming?

I'm claiming what I have said: that climates have always changed and will continue to change. For example we have had well-documented cooling and warming periods throughout history.

There is widespread but not universal suspicion that CO2, methane etc are greenhouse gases but their actual effects in what are complex to the point of chaotic climatic systems are still a matter of debate.

There is no debate about whether they are greenhouse gases. It was demonstrated for CO2 by an Irish physicist 150 years ago.

Nor is anyone denying that the climate has changed in the past. People have always died in the past, including of natural causes, but that does not mean that society should dismiss disease and war and crime as things we should do nothing about.

The science is pretty robust at this stage. If it wasn't, right wingers would not be wheeling out the same few people to give the denialist "perspective " every time, just like the tobacco and asbestos companies used to do. And never mind that their "perspective " variously includes complete denial that greenhouse gases are real, are rising, are having an effect on the climate, are having an effect on societies to it's happening but let's just adapt.

And even if climate change wasn't real, we are still leaving a terrible legacy for future generations as we carelessly and ignorantly destroy the natural world.

[five points]

Climates have always changed and will change.  That is a fact. The theory that current climate change is wholly or predominantly man-made and will have catastrophic results most certainly is not.

It is an accepted fact to everyone except those with mental faculties equal to flat-earth believers.

I don't argue with personal insults.

[RadioGAAGAA]

If you think that fronting a huge political campaign is a safe and appropriate activity for her, fair enough but I beg to differ.

Its not safe or appropriate - as the right wing nutcases are proving.

But she seems to have the ear of the world and rightly or wrongly is in the position she is in - and (as she is aware) this is rapidly growing far more important than any one person.

[RadioGAAGAA]

Climates have always changed and will change.  That is a fact. The theory that current climate change is wholly or predominantly man-made and will have catastrophic results most certainly is not.

It is an accepted fact to everyone except those with mental faculties equal to flat-earth believers.

I don't argue with personal insults.

Says the man that decided to target a 16 year old.