FAI...New Manager Hunt continues

[6th sam]

Only stupid fans will think Martin's whole time as manager of the ROI team will be remembered for putting on subs at halftime of a playoff for the World Cup with that squad!

Fair point

[BennyCake]

Only stupid fans will think Martin's whole time as manager of the ROI team will be remembered for putting on subs at halftime of a playoff for the World Cup with that squad!

That wasn't implied. Not by me anyway.

[macdanger2]

From my perspective, I think of our emigrants and their kids. I would never say someone born to Irish parents is not Irish.  So I wouldn't bat an eyelid at someone who considers themselves Irish, and who has a close blood tie, declaring for Ireland.

With the rugby, in many cases it's a business decision/career advancement decision, and the players who sail under a flag of convenience do not seem to me to have any real affinity with Ireland or identify as Irish.

Completely agree

[seafoid]

I think expectations are unrealistic. Soccer is not the national sport. Coaching levels would not be cutting edge. Ireland doesn't have the discipline either. 
Other countries with sporting focus other than soccer ,such as Austria, are also mediocre.
Enjoy the good days when they happen.

[Main Street]

Only stupid fans will think Martin's whole time as manager of the ROI team will be remembered for putting on subs at halftime of a playoff for the World Cup with that squad!

You think it was about 2 subs at half time?
Among many things, he will be remembered for this, the most inept tactical performance by an Irish manager in a competitive game (arguably)  ever. Basic player mistakes for the most part are also down to O'Neill.
O'Neill's plan for this game was destined to lose (even after we scored) and then to compound the errors, he made those substitutions which sabotaged any minute chance that the game could be salvaged.
There was mention that it was the worse since Cyprus,  but Stan was a complete rookie for that game when he like O'Neill made errors with midfield and tactics in general, O'Neill has no such excuse for that shambles.

[imtommygunn]

You have some valid points but basic player mistakes- e.g. Ward's mistakes- were not down to mistakes. Individual errors happen but managers don't make them!

[Bord na Mona man]

I think expectations are unrealistic. Soccer is not the national sport. Coaching levels would not be cutting edge. Ireland doesn't have the discipline either. 
Other countries with sporting focus other than soccer ,such as Austria, are also mediocre.
Enjoy the good days when they happen.

In a lot of parts of the country, soccer is the only show in town. The participation numbers are big. There should be enough to work with. Though maybe the GAA gets first dibs on tougher rural lads and soccer gets the scaldy townies.

The bigger issue is why are players produced in Ireland so technically poor compared to their counterparts? You could blame the the weather and pitches to a certain degree, but Scandanavian countries have bigger issues here.

I think the bigger problem is that, similar to Britain, Irish culture is very risk averse and this feeds into how sport is played. The mentality boils down to 'if in doubt, get rid of it'. Latin cultures are more open to players taking a bit of risk and less down on those who might get caught out trying to be inventive.

[Bord na Mona man]

You have some valid points but basic player mistakes- e.g. Ward's mistakes- were not down to mistakes. Individual errors happen but managers don't make them!

True, but every other day for club and country, Ward would have lamped the ball forward. When he was forced to try something a bit more inventive, it wasn't in his locker.

When I saw Ward in his early days, I couldn't believe how poor his balance was. When trying to trap a ball, his standing foot would be planted firmly in the ground and he'd look like he was teetering to topple over. To be fair to him, he has built a decent career for himself and has done well for Burnley in the Autumn of his career.
Unfortunately, his inability to adjust his feet lead to the second Eriksen goal.

Ireland is simply producing players with limited technical ability. England have been having the hand-wringing sessions and identifying the same problems since the early 90s and still haven't solved it.

[seafoid]

I think expectations are unrealistic. Soccer is not the national sport. Coaching levels would not be cutting edge. Ireland doesn't have the discipline either. 
Other countries with sporting focus other than soccer ,such as Austria, are also mediocre.
Enjoy the good days when they happen.

In a lot of parts of the country, soccer is the only show in town. The participation numbers are big. There should be enough to work with. Though maybe the GAA gets first dibs on tougher rural lads and soccer gets the scaldy townies.

The bigger issue is why are players produced in Ireland so technically poor compared to their counterparts? You could blame the the weather and pitches to a certain degree, but Scandanavian countries have bigger issues here.

I think the bigger problem is that, similar to Britain, Irish culture is very risk averse and this feeds into how sport is played. The mentality boils down to 'if in doubt, get rid of it'. Latin cultures are more open to players taking a bit of risk and less down on those who might get caught out trying to be inventive.

I have lived in the UK and on the Continent and there is a huge difference in how sports technique is taught. I was doing tennis lessons in Switzerland and the coach had played at Wimbledon. He was English. We spent 6 months doing the basics. How to position yourself, the swing, the follow through.
It takes time to get the body to adhust to the correct procedure.

I couldn't believe how detailed it was.  A lot of people play tennis by moving their wrist. Nobody who is properly coached does that. Tennis in the UK is very hit and miss.

I think in Ireland and the UK things tend towards the haphazard. People learn techniques independently . Continental countries tend to have a  much more systematic approach. If Germany had the GAA and Bavaria was Mayo there is no way that the Bavaria forwards would only be able to kick points off one foot.

GAA coaching is very trina cheile. Managers have very different styles. Then you have all the chopping and changing.

The technical levels of the soccer team would vary a lot. Normally the deficiencies are covered up by a defiant attitude but when you come across a team in the groove that doesn't work.

In the Olympics for example you have to be accurate. That is why we win so few medals. Ireland wouldn't have a notion in sports like gymnastics, archery, pentathlon, diving . It is not really part of the culture to do things properly.  England is similar.

The English premier league has a lot of highly talented players but the culture of the game is not very sophisticated.
The 2011 Champions league final is like a demonstration of the difference. Man U were destroyed.   

RoI and Holland are staying at home. The Irish are bitching about the manager. The Dutch are wondering if they need to adjust 4-3-3.  Jaysus.

[Milltown Row2]

Only stupid fans will think Martin's whole time as manager of the ROI team will be remembered for putting on subs at halftime of a playoff for the World Cup with that squad!

You think it was about 2 subs at half time?
Among many things, he will be remembered for this, the most inept tactical performance by an Irish manager in a competitive game (arguably)  ever. Basic player mistakes for the most part are also down to O'Neill.
O'Neill's plan for this game was destined to lose (even after we scored) and then to compound the errors, he made those substitutions which sabotaged any minute chance that the game could be salvaged.
There was mention that it was the worse since Cyprus,  but Stan was a complete rookie for that game when he like O'Neill made errors with midfield and tactics in general, O'Neill has no such excuse for that shambles.

No I never said that! Some other plonker did though! But you actually think if the best manager in the world was in charge of Ireland he would have got this team to the finals!  As he'd have not made those substitutions and the other things you've failed to mention..next you'll be telling me Ireland can play attractive attacking football if Brendan Rogers was in charge!

Martin was the best man for the job, took a shit team to the Euros and one game away from Qualification for World Cup! Was nil nil away to Denmark and one up after 5 mins! The players went to shit, arguing and lost the run of themselves and were hyped up and nervous, the occasion got to them .. but hey it was the manager, had they not even have got close to qualification id say yeah move on Martin but I can't see the quality manager your have in mind coming in

[manfromdelmonte]

I think expectations are unrealistic. Soccer is not the national sport. Coaching levels would not be cutting edge. Ireland doesn't have the discipline either. 
Other countries with sporting focus other than soccer ,such as Austria, are also mediocre.
Enjoy the good days when they happen.

In a lot of parts of the country, soccer is the only show in town. The participation numbers are big. There should be enough to work with. Though maybe the GAA gets first dibs on tougher rural lads and soccer gets the scaldy townies.

The bigger issue is why are players produced in Ireland so technically poor compared to their counterparts? You could blame the the weather and pitches to a certain degree, but Scandanavian countries have bigger issues here.

I think the bigger problem is that, similar to Britain, Irish culture is very risk averse and this feeds into how sport is played. The mentality boils down to 'if in doubt, get rid of it'. Latin cultures are more open to players taking a bit of risk and less down on those who might get caught out trying to be inventive.

I have lived in the UK and on the Continent and there is a huge difference in how sports technique is taught. I was doing tennis lessons in Switzerland and the coach had played at Wimbledon. He was English. We spent 6 months doing the basics. How to position yourself, the swing, the follow through.
It takes time to get the body to adhust to the correct procedure.

I couldn't believe how detailed it was.  A lot of people play tennis by moving their wrist. Nobody who is properly coached does that. Tennis in the UK is very hit and miss.

I think in Ireland and the UK things tend towards the haphazard. People learn techniques independently . Continental countries tend to have a  much more systematic approach. If Germany had the GAA and Bavaria was Mayo there is no way that the Bavaria forwards would only be able to kick points off one foot.

GAA coaching is very trina cheile. Managers have very different styles. Then you have all the chopping and changing.

The technical levels of the soccer team would vary a lot. Normally the deficiencies are covered up by a defiant attitude but when you come across a team in the groove that doesn't work.

In the Olympics for example you have to be accurate. That is why we win so few medals. Ireland wouldn't have a notion in sports like gymnastics, archery, pentathlon, diving . It is not really part of the culture to do things properly.  England is similar.

The English premier league has a lot of highly talented players but the culture of the game is not very sophisticated.
The 2011 Champions league final is like a demonstration of the difference. Man U were destroyed.   

RoI and Holland are staying at home. The Irish are bitching about the manager. The Dutch are wondering if they need to adjust 4-3-3.  Jaysus.

same with american sports
very technical coaching

it comes back to the status of PE coaching in Ireland. PE is not mandatory, is not an exam subject, schools have terrible facilities generally, you get no credit for participation

there are very few full time sports coaches in Ireland. Most are volunteers. the chance for upskilling and learning is limited

almost every country in europe has more technical footballers than Ireland

[Milltown Row2]

Nope you're wrong it's the managers fault!! Main Street is convinced

[BennyCake]

Lack of areas in modern housing developments hinder the skills development of todays childer. Years ago kids played on street, but few cars were about, or on big green areas.

As kids, we were out every opportunity we got, at school too. Kids play organised football but its all structured and stifles creativity.

It's not the whole reason Ireland produce less technical players but it's definitely a factor.

[Avondhu star]

Lack of areas in modern housing developments hinder the skills development of todays childer. Years ago kids played on street, but few cars were about, or on big green areas.

As kids, we were out every opportunity we got, at school too. Kids play organised football but its all structured and stifles creativity.

It's not the whole reason Ireland produce less technical players but it's definitely a factor.

Reminds me of the show where Johnny Giles returned to the square where he lived as a young lad. All he could see was "No ball playing allowed" signs.

[Esmarelda]

Nope you're wrong it's the managers fault!! Main Street is convinced

It's not the manager's fault. It's everyone and everything else that's to blame. Black and white and that's that.