Topics - ONeill

#41

General discussion / Hatchet Men In Soccer

December 11, 2015, 10:57:52 PM

Are there any players in world football who'd keep you looking over your shoulder if you were good enough to play at that level?

Remember Julian Dicks, Vinnie Jones, Souness, Steve McMahon, Keane. Hard to think of any now.

#42

General discussion / Adele

November 21, 2015, 12:04:38 AM

What do yiz think?

#43

General discussion / Official Hockey Thread.

October 25, 2015, 07:20:07 PM

We're off to Rio, lads.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/hockey/34627325

Good pic of Justy McMahon.

#44

General discussion / Where have all the sporting artists gone?

September 22, 2015, 10:42:19 PM

Who would you pay money to see? In any sport. Even natural phenomenons like Lomu seem scarce now - or are they still out there?

COLOURLESS COHESION

Is football losing its artists? If we look just at the 'last generation' of players, we see the 90s/00s were full of individualists: Baggio, Bergkamp, Zidane, Romario, Laudrup, Stoichkov, Weah, Gascoigne, Edmundo, Zola, Savicevic, Totti, Del Piero, Rivaldo, Denilson, Rui Costa, Le Tissier, Batistuta, Okocha, Cantona, Valeron, Romario, Salas, Figo, Hagi, Djorkaeff, Giggs, Kluivert, Ronaldo, Recoba..

What happened to the self taught individualists like these? They're not extinct but endangered, especially at the top clubs. We're not flooded any more with players we'd jump to call 'artists'. I think there's been a rapid decline in such players, the question is why.

The players above had each honed their own idiosyncratic technique. They each looked at the game in their own way, and they all played it differently. They hadn't taken much notice of advice on how to play, non of them off any type of factory line. Players that made you want to play. Not players whose athleticism you were in awe of. Players whose tricks, feints, and flicks you wanted to go out and copy. You likely didn't grow up admiring systems, but players. It was a player's magic that sparked your interest in the sport.

Coaching and artistic preferences

The coaches didn't always like it, but they didn't have much choice than to accommodate them. Sometimes they tried hard not to. Some examples from the last gen:

Roberto Baggio is to me one of the most gifted and certainly most productive of number 10s in the history of the game, but couldn't get in Arrigo Sacchi's teams.

Rivaldo didn't fit kindly into Louis Van Gaal's and his systems, where Rivaldo wanted to play as a creative 10, LVG wanted him on the left wing (we're seeing LVG clash today with another individualist,Angel Di Maria)

Alvaro Recoba was allowed to drift, loaned out after two seasons to relegation threatened Venezia, came back but struggled for playing time.

Capello didn't seem to fancy Savicevic much despite being one of the most exciting 10s of the decade,

Dennis Bergkamp was shipped out of Italy with nothing but bad memories,

Eric Cantona was tossed around before finally being rescued by Ferguson.

Michael Laudrup's time at Juventus was mostly a failure. Coaches didn't favour them but they were still abundant because the game wasn't as it is right now, athletes hadn't completely taken over the game.

We can see that players who go against convention don't always curry the favour of coaches, unable to bend to their whims, on and off the pitch.

But when we talk about artists, in any field, we call them that because they are liberated from convention and eccentric. They take us for a while out of conventionality into a place we (and coaches) couldn't perceive ourselves. We see the world from their point of view for a spell, like when Dennis Bergkamp took the ball and himself on a parabolic arc around Nikos Dabizas, he took everyone watching with him too.

The process to reach the stage of an artist requires a suspension of our usual perception with how something should be or is usually perceived as being. If a football player is brought up from a young age in a rigid system of group think precepts, not being allowed to stray into his own whims for risk of not playing at all, there is the problem of the ability to think outside of convention. This is not a problem players of the past, playing and learning in dust fields, parks, streets with friends probably encountered much.

We hear a lot less of the stories today of the player who learnt to play in the street, with a ball of rolled up socks or something, that were still pretty common tropes even up to the 00s. They're far more likely now to have been brought up playing exclusively in club's academies from an early age.

What space is left for the eccentric in these systems, of improvisation and beautiful absurdity? The focus is on fitting in, and above all else, the team. In a coaches eyes this is rightly progression.

The transition

The progression in football has come in terms of professionalism, driven by economic imperatives and contingencies. This in turn has increased the culture of competition and performance. No player on the field is any longer allowed to saunter through a game without the ultra self-responsibility required to be a competent contributor to the team ethic. The team ethic is now predominately focused upon physical athletic performance of a type you wouldn't have stumbled upon had you not been honing your body for this moment for considerable time before.

Therefore, if you're not an athletic high performer, it's unlikely you will find yourself at this level of the game with the privilege of such a decision not to saunter in the first place. You've already been weeded out. The modern footballer now can be seen as less of something that has arrived at his destination through idle experimentation and early imaginative foolery and more as a thing of obligation. The lack of freedom of the modern player is something inherent in the obligations of the high-performance ultra-responsibility systems of professional clubs. It's also precisely in such highly competitive systems (not only sport, also in higher education) we see the rise of performance enhancing drugs.

No doubt coaches have been waiting for this era of academies, athletic domination, systems over individuals for a long time. But it has come to them by chance and irony thanks to the improvised, individual skills of the above players from carving a path to the attentions and imaginations of people around the world, big business quickly followed the phenomenon. The business has quickly and eventually demanded new guarantees.

Two of my favourite players arrived soon after this generation, Juan Riquelme and Ronaldinho, where between 2000-2010 the true individualists were already starting to fade from the top of the game. But we really didn't know that at the time. It wasn't easy for either of them though, most were saying Ronaldinho wouldn't make it at Barcelona, not reliable or serious enough, they said. Alex Ferguson, a man defined by obsession with the collective but a coach with lots of time and space for an individual, saw it another way, as he often did, but his coach at PSG, Luis Fernandez, didn't fancy him much (where have we heard that before?). Riquelme incredibly had to make do with Villareal after impatience and intolerance to deal with his whims at Barcelona. Thankfully Ronaldinho began life at Barca a bit better. Riquelme's failure at a top club was perhaps the biggest warning sign.

2015, and football has already largely moved on from the likes of Riquelme and Ronaldinho, two players considered at the top of the sport in 2005/6. In such a short space of time these types of strangely unique almost artisan players are almost completely absent (relative to the past) from the top level of football.

Cristiano Ronaldo began as a flair player but that's long lost history, he's now not much more than a stat production machine, rarely even going past players. The stats back this up. Messi took over from Ronaldinho the ultimate expressionist but the two couldn't be much further apart in many ways. Messi's a realist. Messi plays like an engineer would design as the perfect, effective, efficient attacker. One of the greatest dribblers of all time but unmistakeably an academy product. It's mixed into his no-nonsense personality though. Nothing needless usually happens, as mesmerising as he can be. Messi, unlike Maradona, won't knowingly play to the crowd, like Maradona would. Ronaldinho played like no one could've thought it up. He played like a million people were watching and he knew it. Messi leaves you in awe of his inhuman proficiency, acceleration, quickness and focus. He takes the ball, and he puts it in your net. But there's something almost too perfect about him. Doesn't have the abundance of flair of Ronaldinho, doesn't have the unpredictable unorthodox trickery of a Zidane, doesn't have the unusual touch of a Baggio or Bergkamp. He's not unpredictable, he's unstoppable.

Back to Cristiano Ronaldo. The most interesting example ever of a footballer metamorphosis since Ryan Giggs. 2003, he began full of flair, impish, an individualist, a trickster, street player, the new George Best. His life seemed to revolve around the desire to not only beat a player, but to humiliate them. In 2015 he's a industrial machine, a bulldozer, single tracked to goals. The dribbling has long gone, the power has taken over. The ultimate modern player. Hasn't lost all of the flair though, just a lot of it.

His colleague Gareth Bale, a great player, but a long way from the memory of Luis Figo in the white shirt, who'd shuffle, feint and nutmeg you to oblivion. Real Madrid fans seem to be torn and adjusting on their opinion of him, clearly an effective, exciting player at his best, but not exactly with the magic touch of players of past they're used to.

Athletic domination

Obviously football has objectively changed from what it was in the 20th Century. A big bang of athletes. In 1970 the average player ran 4km a game. Today it's 10km. The pace and athleticism of the game has totally ballooned. There's little time now to accommodate any player who isn't an athlete, regardless of how well he can open up a defence. The speed of the game also limits creative players in ways that it didn't so much previously.

This has been driven by the professionalism that big business demands. Between 1952 and 1992 15 of the 17 transfer fee records were paid by Italian clubs (the other 2 by Spanish).

Italy was far ahead of other nations in terms of money, and in turn, levels of professionalism expected.

In his autobiography, Gianluca Vialli said when he came to play in England in the 90s, he was shocked by how Premier League players still seemed view the game through amateur eyes. Like it was "just a game". He thought players didn't think football was all that serious, it wasn't to be taken too seriously. He couldn't believe professionals could view the game this way, and not care about their diet, on the booze after each game. This was the mid 90s. This is the game Arsene Wenger arrived into, and single-handedly revolutionized.

Academies

Looking at the modern ascent of the academy, Barca's La Masia being the benchmark of all. Factory line of players all designed to play more or less the same way. It's not a bad way, either. It directly produced one of the best club teams of all time, and it's desperately being copied all around Europe. But contrast Fergie's fledglings. His 'Class of '92': Giggs, Scholes, Beckham, Butt, Neville. They couldn't be 4 more different midfielders. One a dribbler, one a crosser, one a goalscorer and passer, one a tough tackling defensive midfielder. Bound more by a psychology than a skill set.

The current belief is that young players need advice on how to play. They need coaching. Pep Guardiola is the uber-coach, Alex Ferguson rarely got too involved in that. But in reality at Barca they're just being industrialised to fit into a certain and demanding system that requires a certain kind of player.

Today's game is increasingly based upon pressing, speed, fitness and organisation. Pioneered by Van Gaal, the grind is no longer limited to the central midfielders, the strikers are equally expected to put in as much of the hard running. In contrast, the previous famous revolutionary system from Holland, Total Football, featured a chain-smoking individualist, Johann Cruyff, controlling it all. Not based on athletic prowess, but rounded ability and positional fluidity.

Some players born on the cusp are getting trapped in the current. Mesut Ozil, and Shinji Kagawa often look at a loss. Big teams are struggling to fit them in more than ever. Someone like Ozil is so good is production and chance creation is still high, yet he's operating on the very limit, at extreme pressure. Kagawa is an example of a player with a speed of thought and turn on the ball almost unmatched, but his lack of physical presence ultimately ended his chance at a top club. Zlatan is another individual pushed around clubs, never settled, widely debated and mistrusted. Most notably, by Mr Masia, Guardiola, the system obsessive.

Is there hope?

Will the artists ever return? The risk is that the individualist free thinker has been forever humbled in the face of overwhelming corporate fiscal and professional pressures on the game. Even the most gifted of players (see Ozil) are now aware of himself/herself merely a fractional part of a greater force, no longer is the brave risk taking individual desired to win the game. And who could argue this is not the optimum state for a team sport obsessed with the returns of winning?

https://thegiggsboson.wordpress.com/2015/06/02/colourless-cohesion/

#45

GAA Discussion / Your County's Supersub

September 06, 2015, 11:37:48 AM

Kevin McManamon seems to promise a score or two when he's brought on.

Any others out there who regularly hit the onion bag but rarely start?

#46

GAA Discussion / 2015 All Stars

August 10, 2015, 11:45:56 AM

Of the 4 semi finalists who are the certs.

Not sure if any Tyrone player has nailed one yet.

Big Quigley a chance?

#47

General discussion / 2015/2016 Premier League

August 03, 2015, 07:18:32 PM

Last year nearly everyone called it moreorless correctly (apart from the Delusional Brendans) - http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?topic=24764.0

Any changes this year? I think Utd will be challenging this year. Any from Chelsea, Arsenal or Utd to win it. City might fall away. A sneaky 4th - Southampton?

#48

GAA Discussion / Who can stop Larry Reilly's Cavan Minors?

May 25, 2015, 12:37:54 AM

It's a bit like Maradona managing Argentina.

#49

General discussion / Shakespeare

April 30, 2015, 09:33:25 PM

Not sure about the Mexican syllabus but up in Alaska here it's compulsory.

What do yiz make of him? A must-read or a bollocks we're force-fed?

#50

GAA Discussion / The State Of Gaelic Football

March 28, 2015, 10:00:31 PM

Honest opinions

Do the rules need to be changed?

Or should we just ride out this period of ultra defensive tactics by mediocre sides (bar Kerry)?

Do forwards need to improve their shooting with men hanging off them?

Or do these tactics make sense if you have players capable of breaking at speed?

#51

GAA Discussion / Who can stop Mayo 2015?

March 27, 2015, 07:32:39 PM

I was doing a bit of number stuff and it turns out Mayo have never lost an All-Ireland Final on September 20th. This year's final is on..........September 20th.

For the record, Mayo have been pipped on:

December 17th
June 17th
September 17th, 17th, 22nd, 23rd, 25th, 26th, 26th, 28th, 29th.

#52

General discussion / Pub Quiz Questions That Can't Be Answered By Googling?

February 19, 2015, 10:53:42 PM

And not how many fingers am I holding up.

From BBC:

Which pop song is summarised thus: "A man stands in a severely dilapidated dwelling and realises he won't have the chance to do the necessary DIY before he dies"?

And: "In an area of low pressure and high humidity, a series of bodies falls from the sky at approximately 22:30"?

What connects... a single by the Pogues, an Italian island resort and a unit of electrical current?

Which film features dialogue which has been mistranslated as follows: "No Christ - this is an imp"?

And: "Thoroughfares? Where we shall be, we are not wanting thoroughfares"?

Which TV show begins as follows: "A man peruses a selection of leather-bound books, rejecting a couple, finally choosing one with a cheaper book hidden inside"?

And: "A bus causes an ironic wardrobe malfunction"?

#53