Antrim Football Thread

[haranguerer]

St Micks enniskillen have been having macrory success for a good while, and this has filtered through to contribute to fermanaghs senior success, but parallell fermanagh minors with antrim seniors. St micks enniskillen is the most prestigious underage team in fermanagh, to the detriment of the county minors, which have very limited success. yet the county minors has available the same players. The county minors always play second fiddle.
St Galls anyone?

Would Fermanagh Minors have the same players available to them as St Michaels?  Would it not be the case that over the past few years of success that the St Michaels teams have had a decent number of key players from Tyrone?  In comparison with St Galls, they would be in the same boat in the regard that not all their players are Antrim men. 

You're right in that St Micks usually have a few players (i dont ever remember there being more than 2 on any st micks team) from trillick or thereabouts, but while all players are key, they never have been any of the 'main men' so to speak. (I cant speak for this yr however, and mattie donnelly- i havent seen them play)

What I'm saying is, Fermanagh minors have available all the key players and obviously theres other players to come in - eg just briefly off the top of my head, eamon maguire and mark little never went to st micks, - and so should be doing better. When one team becomes more prestigious than another, its gonna be to the detriment of the second. If players aren't turning out for Antrim, and they represent a team which gets much praise, and are seen as good players, then the attitude is soon gonna be that its not 'cool' to turn out for Antrim, the players that are turning out are second-rate, etc.

I dont mean to slate st galls, though i realise the above sounds it, i'm just saying that st galls success and subsequent attitude of players to the county, whether right or wrong in their stance, is massively detrimental.

Exiled Gael, i agree completely. ONeill, you seem to know a bit, but I cant understand how you and others rate monaghan so highly? They were never going to beat Kerry - they're simply no good.

[imtommygunn]

Not everyone who can play McRory can play minor as well which would be a contributing factor...

[ONeill]

Well, I didn't want to sound cocky so I threw Monaghan in that bracket. If I was being honest:

Tyrone
Armagh (falling despite their Ulsters)
Monaghan (slightly steelier than the three below)
Derry - Donegal -  Fermanagh (capable of a decent run)
Down (still not convinced)
Cavan
Antrim

[ONeill]

The Leitrim and Clare provincial football titles in the 90s would be an equivalent to Antrim winning Ulster.

In Leitrim's case (1994), it was preceded by a minor final defeat in Connacht in 1991. That year they also won the U21 title.

As for Clare (1992) their only pedigree was reaching the U21 Munster finals of '88 and '89, losing both.

For Antrim to reach an U21 final in Ulster would be a decent season for a start. They haven't managed that for 20 years (1989). Their minors last appeared in a final in 2006 - that represents some pedigree so perhaps Bannside has a case here. The 2009 U21 team's progress will make interesting watching. Who do they have?

[imtommygunn]

Trying very hard to prove a point here O'Neill

Let's be honest - success breeds success. We've not had enough, ok any, so won't breed success overnight. The successes we need are the getting out of division 4, winning a match in ulster and then once beaten winning a couple in qualifiers. That would breed further success in subsequent years.

Priority number 1 - pride in the jersey.

Bannside a wise man once told me when he played under you that you were nuts - I now know where he was coming from 

[ONeill]

Other things as well, including the experience St Mary's gain in the MacRory and Antrim sides winning the McLarnon as well as involvement with successful universities adds to that winning mentality. I'd love to know how much St Mary's are providing their players in preparation for the quarter finals.

Do Antrim provide a service whereby current/past players visit schools to give some coaching or the like? Moves like that go a long way to gaining and maintaining the interest of young lads in the game.

[bannside]

You dont have to be mad to be an Antrim Supporter, but it helps!

There are 3 options open to me.

1. Make a clear case that we have a terrific group of players coming through, and demand that the county officers responsible recognise this, and leave no stone unturned to make sure they get every necessary level of proper support to allow this group to fulfil their potential over the next few years. Sorry if I havent got the right signals from the co leadership that this is likely to happen.

2. Take a largely apathetic, passive, remote interest in the affairs of our county footballers - because thats what the vast majority of gaels in our county have been doing for years. (Cant beat them, join them)

3. Get a life and take up golf, gardening, cooking, lawn bowling......and give Antrim football up as a lost cause.

For the meantime, I will stick to No 1. Maybe thats because I have great belief in the emerging players. And if this can help in any small way to raise the bar, then it is worth doing. If it gives co officials a bit of a jolt to get the finger out, then it will have served as a useful exercise.

Then again we know that our County officers dont read or recognise this medium.........not!

Finally, I post on here in the assumption that 90% of regular posters on this thread know my identity. So ITG if you wish to post on the details of the really "wise" man you know, maybe we could all have an opinion to see if he is as wise as you make him out to be.

Either that, or stop trying to get personal!

To be called mad, or nuts because I have the audacity to suggest we should be trying to win an Ulster title in the next few years is ludicrous. If you believe we have a chance of doing it - you MAY be right. If you believe we definitely wont win it - then you definitely WILL be right. To be honest I`ve never heard so much negativity. I just hope the players dont read this thread!

[imtommygunn]

Bannside I was making a joke there but I was told that! Many years ago though.

Two years is too much - be positive yes but what happens if we don't win an ulster in 2 years? Have we, in your opinion, failed?

We have some good players coming through no doubt. Much better than in years gone by. Let them get their feet on the ground first though.

[lynchbhoy]

ok if we take all the other contentious examples out of it and leave in just the one - dublin (with sherlock and maybe keith galvin from the minor side that got to /won the leinster championship final)

Walsh, Stynes and Clarke all had All-Ireland minor medals as well. Maybe others if I look hard enough.

great
now how does this go about proving that any successful minor or u21 side MAKE or go a long way towards creating a successful senior side.

a couple of players of a minor or u21 team certainly does not look like that underage side gave great impetus towards a senior side...

Now I am not questioning the value of these players to their senior team, but if your point was valid surely there shoul dbe a large number of these underage teams en masse within the starting XV

no there isnt, therefore the underage success isnt necessarily of any huge consequence....ask Derry , or westmeath or laois or mayo......

I dont disagree that you need some good (some great woul dbe better) players, but a manager can formulate a lot if he's good enough.

eg tyrone havent had a 'standard' midfielder since plunkett, mcclure or kilpatrick...yet using alternative tactical methods still clean up round the middle of the park...

[haranguerer]

Well, I didn't want to sound cocky so I threw Monaghan in that bracket. If I was being honest:

Tyrone
Armagh (falling despite their Ulsters)
Monaghan (slightly steelier than the three below)
Derry - Donegal -  Fermanagh (capable of a decent run)
Down (still not convinced)
Cavan
Antrim

I'm aware this isn't the place to debate this, but briefly, Derry, Donegal, Fermanagh would beat monaghan 3 times out of 4, and Down would beat them 2 times out of 4. Losing valiantly to Kerry or Tyrone isn't an endorsement of a good team.

[bannside]

Fair enough ITG. Whats the old saying. "You dont have to be nuts to do this job - but it helps!" Anyway, I took Max`s advice and went to see the Doctor yesterday.

Bit ignorant he was. Sat with his back to me the whole time.

He asked me "whats wrong?". I said my head wasnt right.

"So you are the "mad" Antrim Football supporter then" said the doctor. "How long have you had this problem?".

"Afraid so", says I. "For almost forty years".

"Thats a long time" said the doctor. "Im not sure if there is anything I can do for you".

"Please Doctor, there must be something - anything at all that will lift the depression" I asked.

It was then he swung around in his chair. I could see he had a steely look in his eye.

" For christs sake man, havent we the hurling to sort out first. Have you no wit?" he retorted, in a gruff glens of Antrim accent.

"But what about the Football Doctor?", I proferred.

"Next", shouted the Doctor. "Theres no cure for that football disease. If you dont wise up, I`ll be getting you certified. Now off you go, and stop wasting my time!"

"Ok Doctor. Could you at least point me in the direction of the bowling club", I weakly proferred.

"With great pleasure", replied the smiling Doctor! "Sure I`ll take you there myself".

I was filled with great anticipation as we approached the gates of Hollywell.

"Is there a lawn bowling club here, kind Doctor" I whispered meekly.

" No, but its full of mad Antrim Football Supporters like yourself. Now get out and dont let me hear about you upsetting the patients with silly talk about winning championships. Do you hear me, ye stupid eejit ye", said the cross Doctor. "Now off with ye".

I was a little bit taken aback.

A rather pretty nurse with nice legs was the first to speak to me. She was about 19.

"You`re the new man", she said. "Is there anything at all I could do for you?"

"Yes Nurse. You wouldnt happen to have a computer handy" I asked.

"No problem at all " came the reply.

It didnt take long to google up "GAABOARD" - ANTRIM FOOTBALL THREAD"

So here we are. Now heres a question for youse all.

"How many years will it take to for Antrim to win an Ulster Football C`ship?".

[lynchbhoy]

"How many years will it take to for Antrim to win an Ulster Football C`ship?".

Years it will take to have Antrim winning Ulster championship = Amount of years before Hell freezes over x 4.5
(according to most on here seemingly!)


Very good Bannside !

[ONeill]

I'm aware this isn't the place to debate this, but briefly, Derry, Donegal, Fermanagh would beat monaghan 3 times out of 4, and Down would beat them 2 times out of 4. Losing valiantly to Kerry or Tyrone isn't an endorsement of a good team.

Really? I wouldn't agree. Monaghan defeated both Derry and Donegal in last year's championship. The year before they defeated Derry, Donegal and Down. Your opinion doesn't have any evidence of being credible. I think that in itself earns respect as a formidable side in that company.

[imtommygunn]

In answer to your question BS 6/7 years on the basis we have some good minor teams coming through.

LB you say it like it's easy. This is not a dig but I don't even think Derry have won it this century?!

[lynchbhoy]

In answer to your question BS 6/7 years on the basis we have some good minor teams coming through.

LB you say it like it's easy. This is not a dig but I don't even think Derry have won it this century?!

no I certainly dont mean its easy, Derry are a fantastic example of how mismanagement have caused a side with decent players to not only be uncompetitive in the Ulster championship (in semi or final) but how also to play way below a level what many think they should easily be capable of.

To be honest, of the current intercounty managers out there, imo there are only a few who are smart tacticians that could get the most out of an average crowd of lads with a few stars thrown in.
Harte being the most obv one. Mcenaney, and contentiously ODwyer being two more. I also think Jack OConnor woul dbe in that category, but Kerry have a lot of star players so its hard to use him as an example other than to mention his turning Kerry around to be more hard edged and changing the method of play after suffering a bit of a tanking against tyrone in 2005.

There seems to be a few more 'new age' managers who are arriving on the county scene or are doing very well in Club scene.
Yer man jason Ryan in wexford, then folks like Antrims Madden and even Bannside is showing great potential (did wonders for a club close to my black heart who most of us thought were complete useless), In Derry theres Eugene Kelly, Cassidy and the McIvers.
I wont go on as there are undoubtedly more,  but all these have potential to be as good (not difficult) than a lot of intercounty managers of the past few years.

It is spotting men who can do this, plus giving them the Boardroom backing (as people mention) that gives a great platform to start off with.
then the players have to be there. You have to have some star men, but men with the right attitude. If you had 9 midfielders on the starting XV you most likely wont win, no matter how great they are for their clubs (am thinking of kildare in the championship in 1987 or 87 where they had 9 established club midfielders playing and they ovc lost but were shambolic in doing so - first round game in tullamore I think it was).

None of this is easy, but you can make it a lot easier on yourselves by selecting a good man, then backing them by putting no barriers in their way and facilitating their training and development rather than hindering them (eg Derry hurling).