Tyrone County Football and Hurling

[clarshack]

There needs to be a change but definitely not McGleenan. The problem is that there aren't a lot of viable candidates to choose from. 

[BennyHarp]

There needs to be a change but definitely not McGleenan. The problem is that there aren't a lot of viable candidates to choose from.

I agree and that's the issue I have with the "Mickey out" brigade. If there was an outstanding candidate waiting in the wings I think I'd be more comfortable with Mickey stepping aside. I just worry that a wrong choice would send us spiraling into Armagh and Derry territory. Personally I'd quite like to keep Mickey with Peter alongside. I think Peter would be a big enough character to influence a very stubborn Mickey. Plus he'd be an inspirational personality to have around. I also think Peter could do with Mickey's experience and steady hand with a view to future progression.

[sam03/05]

How do you get rid of a man that has just won back to back Ulster titles and kept us playing Div 1 football. A lot of people in Tyrone are spoilt brats on the back of success that was delivered by Harte himself. 
They should be careful for what they wish for - just look around
Derry - no Ulster senior title in 20 years. Armagh no Ulster title this decade - both playing in Div 3. Down pretty much the same. Don't think the same thing can't happen to Tyrone - who could have predicted for example Derry not to win an Ulster title for 20 years in the late 1990s

Now if Mickey had us playing in Div 3 with no prospects in Ulster then I would be calling for him to go.
If a manager in any other Ulster county had just won back to back Ulster titles and delivered Div 1 status he would be hailed as some sort of Messiah.
The problem that we have is that Tyrone have a good team but Dublin are the best team ever to play the game in my opinion. No change of management can do much about that.

[BennyHarp]

How do you get rid of a man that has just won back to back Ulster titles and kept us playing Div 1 football. A lot of people in Tyrone are spoilt brats on the back of success that was delivered by Harte himself. 
They should be careful for what they wish for - just look around
Derry - no Ulster senior title in 20 years. Armagh no Ulster title this decade - both playing in Div 3. Down pretty much the same. Don't think the same thing can't happen to Tyrone - who could have predicted for example Derry not to win an Ulster title for 20 years in the late 1990s

Now if Mickey had us playing in Div 3 with no prospects in Ulster then I would be calling for him to go.
If a manager in any other Ulster county had just won back to back Ulster titles and delivered Div 1 status he would be hailed as some sort of Messiah.
The problem that we have is that Tyrone have a good team but Dublin are the best team ever to play the game in my opinion. No change of management can do much about that.

A decent club team would have beat those Ulster teams. Not that long ago Tyrone were in the business of challenging for All Ireland titles and Phillip Jordan has said winning Ulster only meant a stepping stone to that. Last Sunday showed tactically Harte is now way behind Gavin and other managers... apparently it was the lowest tackle count against this Dublin team in recent years. If that is satisfactary we've back to the 1970s when winning Ulster was the height of our ambition. At least Mayo and Kerry would have a go...

In the 70s Ulster was shite and we still weren't winning it. Point me to back to back Ulster titles back then? I suspect you weren't around in those days to realise what it actually was like. Tyrone played Derry in Lurgan, I think circa 1979 and the talk before hand was if we'd actually field a team. We came up against a great Dublin team who knew not to engage in the tackle, fair play to them they outfoxed us. Hopefully it is the sign to come up with a new plan but I'm not sure anyone is better equipped to do that than the guy we have, maybe with a few additions to the back room team. The reality is that we don't have the players at the moment to compete with Dublin and anyone who thinks we have is blinded by previous successes. We went man to man on Kerry in the league, as a trial I suppose, and they utterly hammered us by half time. Hopefully there is a new wave of talent coming through at underage but unfortunately (or fortunately) our current tactics, although not pretty has probably kept us relatively competitive. I don't think Matty McGleenan (mental choice for a new manager) or anyone else will have a magic wand to change things. Someone mentioned Paddy Tally - did you see the tactics he employed with St Mary's in the Sigerson??

[longballin]

How do you get rid of a man that has just won back to back Ulster titles and kept us playing Div 1 football. A lot of people in Tyrone are spoilt brats on the back of success that was delivered by Harte himself. 
They should be careful for what they wish for - just look around
Derry - no Ulster senior title in 20 years. Armagh no Ulster title this decade - both playing in Div 3. Down pretty much the same. Don't think the same thing can't happen to Tyrone - who could have predicted for example Derry not to win an Ulster title for 20 years in the late 1990s

Now if Mickey had us playing in Div 3 with no prospects in Ulster then I would be calling for him to go.
If a manager in any other Ulster county had just won back to back Ulster titles and delivered Div 1 status he would be hailed as some sort of Messiah.
The problem that we have is that Tyrone have a good team but Dublin are the best team ever to play the game in my opinion. No change of management can do much about that.

A decent club team would have beat those Ulster teams. Not that long ago Tyrone were in the business of challenging for All Ireland titles and Phillip Jordan has said winning Ulster only meant a stepping stone to that. Last Sunday showed tactically Harte is now way behind Gavin and other managers... apparently it was the lowest tackle count against this Dublin team in recent years. If that is satisfactary we've back to the 1970s when winning Ulster was the height of our ambition. At least Mayo and Kerry would have a go...

In the 70s Ulster was shite and we still weren't winning it. Point me to back to back Ulster titles back then? I suspect you weren't around in those days to realise what it actually was like. Tyrone played Derry in Lurgan, I think circa 1979 and the talk before hand was if we'd actually field a team. We came up against a great Dublin team who knew not to engage in the tackle, fair play to them they outfoxed us. Hopefully it is the sign to come up with a new plan but I'm not sure anyone is better equipped to do that than the guy we have, maybe with a few additions to the back room team. The reality is that we don't have the players at the moment to compete with Dublin and anyone who thinks we have is blinded by previous successes. We went man to man on Kerry in the league, as a trial I suppose, and they utterly hammered us by half time. Hopefully there is a new wave of talent coming through at underage but unfortunately (or fortunately) our current tactics, although not pretty has probably kept us relatively competitive. I don't think Matty McGleenan (mental choice for a new manager) or anyone else will have a magic wand to change things. Someone mentioned Paddy Tally - did you see the tactics he employed with St Mary's in the Sigerson??

That is absolute nonsense that there was talk Tyrone would not have the players to field a team and them fielding teams for decades. Did St Mary's not win the Sigerson this year? 

[BennyHarp]

How do you get rid of a man that has just won back to back Ulster titles and kept us playing Div 1 football. A lot of people in Tyrone are spoilt brats on the back of success that was delivered by Harte himself. 
They should be careful for what they wish for - just look around
Derry - no Ulster senior title in 20 years. Armagh no Ulster title this decade - both playing in Div 3. Down pretty much the same. Don't think the same thing can't happen to Tyrone - who could have predicted for example Derry not to win an Ulster title for 20 years in the late 1990s

Now if Mickey had us playing in Div 3 with no prospects in Ulster then I would be calling for him to go.
If a manager in any other Ulster county had just won back to back Ulster titles and delivered Div 1 status he would be hailed as some sort of Messiah.
The problem that we have is that Tyrone have a good team but Dublin are the best team ever to play the game in my opinion. No change of management can do much about that.

A decent club team would have beat those Ulster teams. Not that long ago Tyrone were in the business of challenging for All Ireland titles and Phillip Jordan has said winning Ulster only meant a stepping stone to that. Last Sunday showed tactically Harte is now way behind Gavin and other managers... apparently it was the lowest tackle count against this Dublin team in recent years. If that is satisfactary we've back to the 1970s when winning Ulster was the height of our ambition. At least Mayo and Kerry would have a go...

In the 70s Ulster was shite and we still weren't winning it. Point me to back to back Ulster titles back then? I suspect you weren't around in those days to realise what it actually was like. Tyrone played Derry in Lurgan, I think circa 1979 and the talk before hand was if we'd actually field a team. We came up against a great Dublin team who knew not to engage in the tackle, fair play to them they outfoxed us. Hopefully it is the sign to come up with a new plan but I'm not sure anyone is better equipped to do that than the guy we have, maybe with a few additions to the back room team. The reality is that we don't have the players at the moment to compete with Dublin and anyone who thinks we have is blinded by previous successes. We went man to man on Kerry in the league, as a trial I suppose, and they utterly hammered us by half time. Hopefully there is a new wave of talent coming through at underage but unfortunately (or fortunately) our current tactics, although not pretty has probably kept us relatively competitive. I don't think Matty McGleenan (mental choice for a new manager) or anyone else will have a magic wand to change things. Someone mentioned Paddy Tally - did you see the tactics he employed with St Mary's in the Sigerson??

That is absolute nonsense that there was talk Tyrone would not have the players to field a team and them fielding teams for decades. Did St Mary's not win the Sigerson this year? 

The same tactics though. Your argument is that it'll win you lesser competitions like Ulster and Sigersons but it won't beat Dublin and the better county teams. More of the same with Paddy but I'm not criticisung that. A good manager will come in, look at our squad and most likely decide that our style of play suits them best.

Re. The 70s, of course we fielded. But at times with 17/18 men squads and late additions. Anyone who thinks we are anyway close to where we where in the 70s is deluded.

[The Trap]

To hear some on here you would think mickey took over Tyrone in division 3 and turned them from also rans to all Ireland winners. Tyrone won the national league in 2002 and were one of the best teams in Ireland and he inherited the most magnificent squad of players who gave us 5 wonderful years. Nobody is disputing that he did a great job and will be held in the highest regard forever but his legacy is already tarnished by staying too long and becoming a dictator.
If he wants to stay in county football I am sure he could get plenty of offers to prove himself again in another county. And you know what that may be good for him too.
As for next year it is a good time for someone to take over as the team are good enough to stay in division one and win ulster which is what they did this year so that would be a relatively stable transition. A new voice and regime may also give the whole thing a lift.
Forget about winning the ofiach cup and the drive for six to whatver crap appears on here when the McKenna cup comes around and develop a better style of play and give players a chance as we need a couple of backs and a couple of forwards to step up.
But for now let's enjoy the business end of the club season.

[Redhand Santa]

well from what i hear from the monaghan camp is that malachy o rourke may not be with them next year so he has to be high up the list. i still think mattie mc gleenan could be worth a punt, mayo took a punt on rochford with no county experience and its worked well for them. canavan, logan ,dooher would have to be in the running at some stage but wont happen if mickey leaves badly. paddy tally could come back in some shape or form. why not even link up mc gleenan with paddy tally? or o rourke/ tally?

I'm convinced you are a wind up. What exactly would be the point in replacing harte with orourke? Tyrone met Monaghan twice in quarte finals in recent years and harte completely out witted them on the line. Also at a time when Monaghan have won of their best teams ever they got knocked out at home to Longford and lost this year to down. Despite a strong squad and at times the best forward in Ireland they haven't made it past a quarter final.

I don't even know if I want to comment on mcgleenan. He seems like a great guy who does his best but Cavan hardly won a game all year and most supporters seem to want him gone. He had no other inter county experience.

I've no idea who people think will do a better job than harte. We have been unsuccessful at u21 for ten years other than one year. We maybe need to focus as much on this and bringing younger players through than on the manager of the seniors. I think I'd be more than happy with harte staying and a strong number 2 like canavan coming in.

If we change I just hope it's for the right reasons and we are actually bringing in someone who will make a difference. We could easily end up like Armagh.

[sam03/05]

Tyrone had won a NationalLeague title with players that he developed at u21 and minor level
He inherited a team that had got beaten by Sligo in theQF in a county that had won 0 All Ireland's in 100 years.

quote author=The Trap link=topic=2312.msg1732592#msg1732592 date=1504346123]
To hear some on here you would think mickey took over Tyrone in division 3 and turned them from also rans to all Ireland winners. Tyrone won the national league in 2002 and were one of the best teams in Ireland and he inherited the most magnificent squad of players who gave us 5 wonderful years. Nobody is disputing that he did a great job and will be held in the highest regard forever but his legacy is already tarnished by staying too long and becoming a dictator.
If he wants to stay in county football I am sure he could get plenty of offers to prove himself again in another county. And you know what that may be good for him too.
As for next year it is a good time for someone to take over as the team are good enough to stay in division one and win ulster which is what they did this year so that would be a relatively stable transition. A new voice and regime may also give the whole thing a lift.
Forget about winning the ofiach cup and the drive for six to whatver crap appears on here when the McKenna cup comes around and develop a better style of play and give players a chance as we need a couple of backs and a couple of forwards to step up.
But for now let's enjoy the business end of the club season.
[/quote]

[BennyHarp]

To hear some on here you would think mickey took over Tyrone in division 3 and turned them from also rans to all Ireland winners. Tyrone won the national league in 2002 and were one of the best teams in Ireland and he inherited the most magnificent squad of players who gave us 5 wonderful years. Nobody is disputing that he did a great job and will be held in the highest regard forever but his legacy is already tarnished by staying too long and becoming a dictator.
If he wants to stay in county football I am sure he could get plenty of offers to prove himself again in another county. And you know what that may be good for him too.
As for next year it is a good time for someone to take over as the team are good enough to stay in division one and win ulster which is what they did this year so that would be a relatively stable transition. A new voice and regime may also give the whole thing a lift.
Forget about winning the ofiach cup and the drive for six to whatver crap appears on here when the McKenna cup comes around and develop a better style of play and give players a chance as we need a couple of backs and a couple of forwards to step up.
But for now let's enjoy the business end of the club season.

So the new manager just needs to develop better style of play (that wins the AI as clearly that's the minimum requirement) and unearth a couple of forwards and a couple of backs (who will need to be better than what Dublin have if we are to win that AI). It's fairly easy then. So who's your magic man for the job?

[GaelTheGael]

In terms of the defenders issue. Giving opportunities to HP McGeary and Michael Cassidy and see how they fair rather than give McCrory and McCarron game after game. Think McGeary never seen a second all year and Cassidy played about 15 minutes in the McKenna cup. Don't see how anyone would be willing to hang around for that, added in missing out of 5 club games.
In terms of call ups, Danny Gorman, Michael McKernan and Shea Hamill are the players I would like to see get a chance. By chance i mean play in league games and see how they fair against top level players, not McKenna cup and then sit in the stand rest of the year.

[GaelTheGael]

Regarding the forward issue. Dont see any forwards outside of the county panel worth a look at. Ruairi Sludden from Dromore and Kyle Coney from Ardboe maybe but I dont see either as an improvement on what the current panel has to offer.
In the AISF 2015 against Kerry we played with Mark Bradley at 11 and McCurry and McAliskey inside and played with some adventure and played well and should have won the game. However from this the adventure shown that day hasn't been seen since. I think the players are there if they play with more adventure and have a go, rather than this percentage safety first approach.
Same as the defenders, Lee Brennan, Cahir McCullagh and Ronan McHugh need to play league games to see if they are going to be good enough come championship time, playing against U21 teams and Universities isn't showing us what they can actually do.

[The Trap]

Right Sam so Micky developed all of the players that won in 03 05 and 08...not the clubs or schools etc. What about the players that won all ireland minors under different management? How come he can't develop them in to all ireland winners?
As i said before the man is a legend but you can't say anyone who would like a change is wrong.

[Club boi]

Bringing Canavan in wouldn't improve anything. Great ballers don't always make great managers, his club and County record are poor and I believe that's why he takes an easy pound from Sky

It's the lack of adventure and plan B that has annoyed the supporters. Anyone who wants Harte gone are not doubting his trophies or what he has done but it's been 9 years now. Nobody else would have lasted that long in any Club/County anywere in any sport

Realistically, Tyrone now find themselves in a similar position to Man Utd. Following Harte is going to be a poisoned chalice, hard to know who would actually want it. Yes you may win Ulster but unless they put it up to the Big 3 then it's no improvement and that's what the County Board need to work out. It's most likely the manager after the manager who follows Harte who may bring the good days back

[rodney trotter]

He was part of the Tyrone u21 backroom team, not the manager. He was lucky to win a Cavan title,  and fckd up in Ulster club with his tactics.  Didn't win a championship game with Fermanagh. And considering the money he was on... that's poor.