The 4 youngsters marked for AFL?

[orangeman]

The Aussies are here to stay - my point all along is make them pay or get something in  return !

[Bogball XV]

Could someone explain to me how reintroducing the compromise rules would stop the Aussies taking players as this is what some people seem to believe.

Because then the AFL and GAA would put a structure in place to ensure that only x amount of players could be recruited from ireland and so on.....  Basically, the few million they'd make from the international rules far outweighs the chance of recruiting a few irish lads who probably won't make it.  They could also perhaps work out a compensation scheme, although personally I think that'd be totally unfair on the players.

[imtommygunn]

I'm not so sure that would happen Bogball.

The perception always was before that there was a "gentlemans agreement" when the compromise rules were in place the aussies wouldn't steal our players. I don't think this was ever the case.

Realistically no-one owns any of "our" players and therefore no-one can stop them going. Some people reckon that money should be paid. Who should it be paid to? The county/ the club/ the GAA itself?

Realistically with this "ownership" thing money can never change hands and no-one can cap how many players can go to Oz.

[Bogball XV]

I'm not so sure that would happen Bogball.

The perception always was before that there was a "gentlemans agreement" when the compromise rules were in place the aussies wouldn't steal our players. I don't think this was ever the case.

Realistically no-one owns any of "our" players and therefore no-one can stop them going. Some people reckon that money should be paid. Who should it be paid to? The county/ the club/ the GAA itself?

Realistically with this "ownership" thing money can never change hands and no-one can cap how many players can go to Oz.

I agree Tommygunn, but, I think the GAA and AFL would/could come to an agreement that only x amount of players max could be taken who had a gaa background.

[stephenite]

Realistically with this "ownership" thing money can never change hands and no-one can cap how many players can go to Oz.

Exactly, the notion that the Aussies will pay somebody some money for somthing when they don't have to is just ludicrous, it's stupid, unrealistic and frankly those that keep banging on about it are becoming triesome.
AFL clubs are businesses and anyone who agreed to give an Irish club a cent for a player they could have got for free would be sacked on the spot.

[imtommygunn]

If they cap it then how do they cap it? First come first served on that x number among clubs? I can't see how they can cap things either to be honest.

Money can never change hands on any of this - never. No one has any rites whatsoever to any player so like stephenite says it's luidcrous.

It's like a soccer player playing for something like an u14 soccer club and manchester united coming in for the player. Would man united give the money? No and why the hell should they because that u14 club would not have the rites to that player - it is entirely voluntary.

[darbyo]

I think Man United do have to pay for that 14 year old.

[Bogball XV]

Realistically with this "ownership" thing money can never change hands and no-one can cap how many players can go to Oz.

Exactly, the notion that the Aussies will pay somebody some money for somthing when they don't have to is just ludicrous, it's stupid, unrealistic and frankly those that keep banging on about it are becoming triesome.
AFL clubs are businesses and anyone who agreed to give an Irish club a cent for a player they could have got for free would be sacked on the spot.

I'm not suggesting that wold agree to pay clubs, simply that if the AFL and GAA were back in contact re the international rules, it would be quite easy to have the AFL include a proviso in their own rules that they can only recruit 'x' amount of irish players over 'x' time period.  They already have something along those lines in their rules regarding 'international rookies', so it wouldn't be much effort to extend it.  The carrot for the AFL would be the international rules restarting and the several million of profit p.a from that - as I've stated earlier, that's money in the bank and worth a helluva lot more than recruiting some young lad who might turn out to the next Kennelly or Clarke.  What's the success ratio at present - 10% max?

[stephenite]

Realistically with this "ownership" thing money can never change hands and no-one can cap how many players can go to Oz.

Exactly, the notion that the Aussies will pay somebody some money for somthing when they don't have to is just ludicrous, it's stupid, unrealistic and frankly those that keep banging on about it are becoming triesome.
AFL clubs are businesses and anyone who agreed to give an Irish club a cent for a player they could have got for free would be sacked on the spot.

I'm not suggesting that wold agree to pay clubs, simply that if the AFL and GAA were back in contact re the international rules, it would be quite easy to have the AFL include a proviso in their own rules that they can only recruit 'x' amount of irish players over 'x' time period.  They already have something along those lines in their rules regarding 'international rookies', so it wouldn't be much effort to extend it.  The carrot for the AFL would be the international rules restarting and the several million of profit p.a from that - as I've stated earlier, that's money in the bank and worth a helluva lot more than recruiting some young lad who might turn out to the next Kennelly or Clarke.  What's the success ratio at present - 10% max?

The International Rules, is, in my opinion a dead duck, and I am a supporter of the concept. The Aussies look on it as a junket and a chance to beat up on some Irish boys, the clubs and players will never be willing to have any disciplinary issues or bans to carry over into their own competitions. Even if the Rules series is played again, surely any agreement between the AFL and GAA is a 'gentlemans agreement' and not legally binding, so what's to stop the AFL clubs coming out of their own back and snapping up who they want?

There is no solution to this issue in my opinion and that's unfortunate - but unless we can compete with the AFL in terms of payments to players then we will always have a situation where some of the best of our talent disappears to play AFL. These lads, almost to a man want the opportunity to be full time professional athletes. Recent events in the GAA show that the majority of our members will be very reluctant to change our games to allow young Irish footballers this opportunity at home.

To sum up - we either go full time pro or let a handful each year try their luck at AFL and hope they come back eventually. A sad scenario but realistic in my opinon.

But can we please stop demanding that AFL pay the GAA some form of compensation, it ain't ever gonna happen.

[zoyler]

Stememite is right to say that there is no way a club or county can erxpect money to change hands when a youngster goes to Aussie Rules but Bogball is also right to say that a resumption of International Rules would help the situation in so far as it would enable the GAA & AFL to establish gidelines covering the recruitment of these lads. 

The AFL are both anxious to have an international outlet and maintain a good public image.  Enormous damage has been done to this image by the behaviour of many of their leading players and particularly thr drug culture that existed in Perth with the Eagles.  The last thing they need are accusations about exploiting vunerable young lads thousands of miles from home which is why they would be keen to have a code of conduct in place.  Surely this would also suit the GAA,

[ykickamoocow]

Irish invasion headed for AFL

SYDNEY SWANS import Tadhg Kennelly expects the number of Irish AFL players to treble in the next few years, but would like to see compensation for the Gaelic Athletic Association (GAA).

Kennelly's trailblazing efforts in the Swans 2005 premiership and the remarkable debut season by Collingwood's Martin Clarke in 2007 has reignited the influx of Irish footballers to Australia with another four drafted to AFL clubs earlier this week.

But this is just the tip of the iceberg, according to the Sydney defender, as most of those targeted by AFL talent scouts resist the advances to move to Australia.

Some fear being labelled a traitor for leaving their County sides, while most of the better players are offered incentives by the GAA to stay in Ireland.

"People probably don't know it but there's probably been 20 people offered in the last eight years that I've been here and a lot haven't taken up on it," said Kennelly.

"A lot of the guys in the better Countys decide not to come because they want to win an Ireland medal, which is something they've always dreamed about.

"It's not a flood of players coming out (yet) - there's 10 players here now but in two or three years time there could be 30 and that's a flood.

"I say to any player in Ireland who has an opportunity to come out here that it's a win-win situation and there's no way you can lose."

Gaelic footballers in Ireland are not paid professionals, however recent strike action has led to a $5 million fund set up to compensate the amateurs for their time each season.

Kennelly said the AFL's attempts to recruit Irish players should not come at the expense of the Gaelic competition and supported calls for monetary compensation for the local teams.

"The last thing I want is to see the GAA or the game itself suffer," he said.

"We're taking the best players so it's obviously going to affect the game. Being an amateur association and sport there is always the lure for players to go and play more professional sport.

"Some agreement or policy is going to have to come to terms with the GAA and AFL."

He also urged the AFL and GAA to put aside the bitterness from the violent 2006 International Rules series and resurrect the competition.

Kennelly said almost all of Ireland's players want the annual fixture against Australia to return.

"There was a survey sent out to the 31 players (from the last game) and it was 85 per cent who would do it again," said Kennelly.

"What we need is to get a relationship back going between the GAA and the AFL. The relationship is sour at the moment because of International Rules.

"At home a lot of it was the media went berserk, absolutely crazy and there was a lot of heated reaction. I think the players have always wanted it in Ireland.

"It's a great opportunity, but if anything it's all been taken too serious. At the end of the day it's just two exhibition games."

http://www.foxsports.com.au/story/0,8659,22919508-23211,00.html

[orangeman]

Kennelly recognises that the GAA / clubs / county board shopuld be compensated for the AFL taking Ireland's best talent - I've maintained this all along and a lot of people laughed at it - fair play to Kennelly - he can see what a loss Ireland's best players are to the clubs etc.

[Bogball XV]

I feel your pain Orangeman, but seriously it's a non-runner really - the question is, would money in any way would recompense Ardboe for the loss of Kyle Coney?  If Frank McGuigan had been signed up by Sydney Swans in 1973, but Ardboe were paid a few quid, would that ever have made up for the loss?  Of course not, I would argue that money couldn't recompense at all, it's what the GAA is about, pride in the parish etc, the fact that one of your own has went on to become a legend.  I reckon if he's playing in a grand final in 3/4 years time, sure the whole of Ardboe will be bedecked in team colours and you'll all be up all night long waiting for the game and all that goes with it.
Just be glad for the lad and sure if he doesn't make it, he come back as twice the footballer, look at big Tohill.

[orangeman]

I know exactly what you're saying and I agree with you almost 100 % - it would be great to see him succeed out there and we'd all be behind him - but my point is that the AFL are taking our best talent for nothing.

Tadgh Kennelly concedes that the AFL should pay some compensation and I agree.

[robertemmet]

So who are the Irish Lads being targeted this year

Carlow - Brendan Murphy
Galway - Michael Martyn
Laois - Zac Tuohy
Cork - Michael Shields, Ciaran Sheehan
Tyrone - Karl Coney
Armagh - Kevin Dyas

Is there any more?