Orange Order Museum in Belfast and Loughgall

[Rossfan]

William was partial to sharing his bed with young lads.
Historical fact.
2 relations of mine are married to C of I people 1 from Leitrim 1 from Sligo.

[michaelg]

I think we can safely say none in Ros, Mayo or Galway.
Wouldn't think there's any in Sligo but it is rumoured there's one in Laythrum.
Good few Protestants round Mohill but I suspect they're too busy making a living to be bothered with bigotry or disrespecting their neighbours.
There was a statue of paedophile king Billy up in Boyle but he was removed in the 30s. The pillar is still there though.

No hatred or bigotry evident in this post then?

The only reason I can find you considering that statement as bigotry is his referring to King Billy in such a way but I'm sure you'll be happy to elaborate further as to why?

The statement in bold above implies that all Orangemen are bigots and disrespect their neighbours.  Do you not think that that's a bit of a broad brush?  This is particularly tenuous assertion when presumably the poster lives nowhere near NI and is unlikely to know any Orangemen personally.  Therefore, I would contend that the poster is displaying bigotry by labelling all Orangemen as bigots who disrespect ther neighbours.

[T Fearon]

My assessment of a Orangeism is a brotherhood rooted in community,which does a lot of good in that community.I do not think generally it parades to give offence,its more to demonstrate the strength of the brotherhood,and I accept these parades can be colourful and enjoyable for those who participate and attend.A bit like the GAA,membership is handed on at a very early age to each generation.

However its overtly political stance,equating to hardline unionism,and its frequent utterances against Catholicism,and other activities like conspiring in instances to ensure lands and property do not fall into the hands of Catholics is distasteful to say the least.For these reasons I would say the Order does not appeal to the vast majority of moderate Protestants even (its membership has dwindled from a six figure sum to a mere 30,000 today) and I have not witnessed any positive activity or statements even from it which have contributed in any way to peace and reconciliation.

In short its contribution to overall society here must be objectively regarded as negative.

[seafoid]

The thing that is striking up North is what Protestant political culture is made up of. King Billy is really important. There is no equivalent for catholic Irish. There can't be. Because there is no period of history that is definitive. Ní uasal agus íseal ach thuas seal agus thíos seal . An icon who represents Protestant domination is out of touch now.

Then the symbols. The Queen . The poppy. The Somme.
War.

Nobody in England cares about the Somme. Society has moved on and become more inclusive. Nobody cares about hating Fenians either.

People in the London elite think the DUP are fruitcakes.

[Rossfan]

As far as I'm aware I don't know any members of the Ku  Klux Klan but I'd hazard a fairly accurate guess that all it's members are racists.

[seafoid]

I think we can safely say none in Ros, Mayo or Galway.
Wouldn't think there's any in Sligo but it is rumoured there's one in Laythrum.
Good few Protestants round Mohill but I suspect they're too busy making a living to be bothered with bigotry or disrespecting their neighbours.
There was a statue of paedophile king Billy up in Boyle but he was removed in the 30s. The pillar is still there though.

No hatred or bigotry evident in this post then?

The only reason I can find you considering that statement as bigotry is his referring to King Billy in such a way but I'm sure you'll be happy to elaborate further as to why?

The statement in bold above implies that all Orangemen are bigots and disrespect their neighbours.  Do you not think that that's a bit of a broad brush?  This is particularly tenuous assertion when presumably the poster lives nowhere near NI and is unlikely to know any Orangemen personally.  Therefore, I would contend that the poster is displaying bigotry by labelling all Orangemen as bigots who disrespect ther neighbours.

The OO is probably transphobic as well.

[michaelg]

As far as I'm aware I don't know any members of the Ku  Klux Klan but I'd hazard a fairly accurate guess that all it's members are racists.

You are the 2nd poster to compare the OO with the KKK, yet you still contend that "we don't do hatred and bigotry very well".
Your post above implies that you can "accurately guess" that all OO members are bigots.  Can you not see how holding such a prejudicial view means that you are the one who could be accused of bigotry?

[Rossfan]

When the OO issues statements
condemning the placing of their neighbours' National flag on illegal bonfires,
Condemning burning photos of their neighbours' political representatives on illegal bonfires
Condemning bands who take part in their parades playing offensive
music outside Catholic Churches 
Condemning the louts who attach themselves to Orange parades
And requesting that all of the above disgraceful activities cease.
Telling us they've terminated the membership of the terrorist who drove a car into a crowd of people

I might well start to view them somewhat more favourably.
Until then I will hold the view that the OO is a bigoted anti Catholic organisation and reasonably believe that obviously the males who belong to it must share those views.

[michaelg]

When the OO issues statements
condemning the placing of their neighbours' National flag on illegal bonfires,
Condemning burning photos of their neighbours' political representatives on illegal bonfires
Condemning bands who take part in their parades playing offensive
music outside Catholic Churches 
Condemning the louts who attach themselves to Orange parades
And requesting that all of the above disgraceful activities cease.
Telling us they've terminated the membership of the terrorist who drove a car into a crowd of people

I might well start to view them somewhat more favourably.
Until then I will hold the view that the OO is a bigoted anti Catholic organisation and reasonably prejudicially believe that obviously the males who belong to it must share those views.

Fixed that there for you.

[Tonto]

The thing that is striking up North is what Protestant political culture is made up of. King Billy is really important. There is no equivalent for catholic Irish. There can't be. Because there is no period of history that is definitive. Ní uasal agus íseal ach thuas seal agus thíos seal . An icon who represents Protestant domination is out of touch now.

Then the symbols. The Queen . The poppy. The Somme.
War.

Nobody in England cares about the Somme. Society has moved on and become more inclusive. Nobody cares about hating Fenians either.

People in the London elite think the DUP are fruitcakes.

You refer to symbols of unionism and suggest nationalists have no equivalent as they are not needed?

Surely all national groups have their founding myths?

For nationalists, the blood sacrifice is the Easter Rising. Unionists, the Somme.

Nationalists have founding fathers like Pearse and Connolly. Unionists have Carson and Craig.

Nationalists have founding documents like the Proclamation. Unionists have the Covenant.

Nationalists have historic figures like Tone and Emmett. Unionists have King William.

I personally don't see anything particularly desperate or anachronistic about it. I'm sure if I had sufficient knowledge of other nations I'd be able to point to the same sorts of things.

[Hardy]

When the OO issues statements
condemning the placing of their neighbours' National flag on illegal bonfires,
Condemning burning photos of their neighbours' political representatives on illegal bonfires
Condemning bands who take part in their parades playing offensive
music outside Catholic Churches 
Condemning the louts who attach themselves to Orange parades
And requesting that all of the above disgraceful activities cease.
Telling us they've terminated the membership of the terrorist who drove a car into a crowd of people

I might well start to view them somewhat more favourably.
Until then I will hold the view that the OO is a bigoted anti Catholic organisation and reasonably prejudicially believe that obviously the males who belong to it must share those views.

Fixed that there for you.

A further revision.

[Orior]

When the OO issues statements
condemning the placing of their neighbours' National flag on illegal bonfires,
Condemning burning photos of their neighbours' political representatives on illegal bonfires
Condemning bands who take part in their parades playing offensive
music outside Catholic Churches 
Condemning the louts who attach themselves to Orange parades
And requesting that all of the above disgraceful activities cease.
Telling us they've terminated the membership of the terrorist who drove a car into a crowd of people

I might well start to view them somewhat more favourably.
Until then I will hold the view that the OO is a bigoted anti Catholic organisation and reasonably prejudicially believe that obviously the males who belong to it must share those views.

Fixed that there for you.

A further revision.

How can the OO be anything except sectarian when their aim is protestant ascendancy?

[Eamonnca1]

Nobody in England cares about the Somme.

Not sure if I agree with this part. I lived in England for long enough to feel that they're obsessed with the two world wars. Other than the Falklands and 1966 World Cup there's not a lot else in recent history that they can point to as a victory, hence the obsession with the Germans.

[Tonto]

When the OO issues statements
condemning the placing of their neighbours' National flag on illegal bonfires,
Condemning burning photos of their neighbours' political representatives on illegal bonfires
Condemning bands who take part in their parades playing offensive
music outside Catholic Churches 
Condemning the louts who attach themselves to Orange parades
And requesting that all of the above disgraceful activities cease.
Telling us they've terminated the membership of the terrorist who drove a car into a crowd of people

I might well start to view them somewhat more favourably.
Until then I will hold the view that the OO is a bigoted anti Catholic organisation and reasonably prejudicially believe that obviously the males who belong to it must share those views.

Fixed that there for you.

A further revision.

How can the OO be anything except sectarian when their aim is protestant ascendancy?

Is the Catholic Church sectarian for wanting to promote Catholicism?

[Eamonnca1]

The protestant ascendency is not the same as protestantism.